o
#assassination
iron valve
grizzled jay
wide ridge
unless wowhead's shadowlands talent calculator is not updated, is blindside the best single target talent now?
that's a surprise for sure
wide ridge
you think we'll move to EP or MP as expansion goes on? since they scale better (or at least i think they do)
grizzled jay
@balmy condor is that without Flagellation
balmy condor
says sims
dire spoke
xd
grizzled jay
will scale better as expansion goes on, SBS won't scale as hard 🙂
wide ridge
thanks for that link whispyr
balmy condor
np
raw pecan
hey guys, looking for the best trait setup for mythic nzoth, I've been playing classic 3x ss 2x hod 1x bi but wanted to try something else, I've tried 3x ss 3x hod one kill but it went slightly worse. Was thinking about playing either 3x ss 2x np 1x bi or 3x ss 3x np. Any ideas?
balmy condor
clock is good if you push at okay times
NP is pretty awful though
wouldn't do that
raw pecan
I dont take clock into consideration at all, dont like this trait
balmy condor
then hod and bbi it is
raw pecan
I was thinking about pure boss burst windows
and NP looks fine in that situation
but loosing a lot of crit, when I want to backfill crit changing gems I am loosing 20% haste
balmy condor
yeah, if you're only wanting damage in that window, np is fine
really it's just a sim, and maybe change if you really really want that boss damage
everything else is just feely
raw pecan
differences in sim are 1-3k
balmy condor
3k is a ton
cerulean kernel
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
cerulean kernel
Damn i was hoping for a sin pre-patch guide like sub has
cerulean kernel
3XSS?
raw pecan
yeah @fallow otter bigger parse xd
balmy condor
ye
grizzled jay
back to Lucid Major like God intended
balmy condor
minor
cerulean kernel
meh my sub set i think over powers my sin then
fallow otter
yeah @fallow otter bigger parse xd
@raw pecan what's your parsing atm
balmy condor
sub will most likely overpower sin with a decent set, yeah
raw pecan
65%
fallow otter
meh my sub set i think over powers my sin then
@cerulean kernel even with NB trait dead?
And no hod?
raw pecan
this parse is with classic 3x ss 2x hod 1x bi
cerulean kernel
@fallow otter yea i have a 2nd set i had a feeling i would need one for prepatch and took into account the dead traits
fallow otter
this parse is with classic 3x ss 2x hod 1x bi
@raw pecan is not your Azerite, it's fine - you will be able to squeeze dps in many spots most likely, are you psy1?
raw pecan
yes
but I am not the one who use CDs there
I am the one called "boss killer" 😄 top damage on nzoth but sucks on other targets
fallow otter
Me either, you don't benefit from the dmg boost for log so it's fine
Clockwork is good, you shouldnt discount it
raw pecan
yeah but I dont like it tho, also dont have azerite with this
fallow otter
BBI is fine anyway just use that
fallow otter
Nah, our gear is so fine tuned now, I think it's just worse
balmy condor
(logs and sims reflect that as well)
raw pecan
true, I dont use it much
fallow otter
Parsing at this point is about stealing enemy health pools from your raid friends, either that or they give them up willingly. But it's more likely that you are just having a war with them for who can pad better because we have been killing the boss for months
And just want to parse for entertainment factor
raw pecan
you are playing 500 more mastery than me, sacrificing 500 haste, whats the reason behind?
isnt haste main factor?
fallow otter
Well think of it like this
fallow otter
The more adds there are in a fight, the less haste you want because you are gaining more energy from bleeds
balmy condor
should also note you're under 40 corruption
so you're already gimping yourself to people running 60
raw pecan
yeah, we're not allowed to go over 40
fallow otter
But yeh essentially I follow the sim, it wants me to use like 2 haste gems but I know I will gain that energy from cleave
Yeah I run 45
I cbf running 55 for 400dps and break up the flat expedient fiesta 😜
raw pecan
If I would be able to play over 40 I would sacrifice one exp 3 for honed mind 3
fallow otter
Exp every spot massages my OCD bone
Honestly you would gain more from just padding more with CT than swapping gear
raw pecan
yeah but what I can CT, bashers, corruptors and spikes right?
little adds doesnt count
fallow otter
This ^
grizzled jay
Psychophages count for logs don't they
i thought they were only filtered on Carapace
fallow otter
And you scuffed your pull, didn't triple gar and you blew blood and weren't in stealth so you had to vanish to open, that's like 5s into the fight with many big spots to gain dps
balmy condor
Psycho’s count on n’zoth yes
grizzled jay
i thought so
balmy condor
That’s the only way outlaw parses
grizzled jay
3x EB parse let's go
raw pecan
but you cant start nzoth from stealth
raw pecan
on mythic
grizzled jay
?
fallow otter
You can
balmy condor
Yikers
grizzled jay
that's a you problem
raw pecan
yikes
fallow otter
It's all execution at this point
raw pecan
I need to test this but I am more than sure that I was loosing stealth on pull
grizzled jay
garrote basher/corrupter then shadowstep garrote a spike then normal rotation into exsang on the spike ez clap
fallow otter
The amount of dmg gained there is so small that you don't even need to do that, just don't vanish haha
But tmb is right, that's the goal
raw pecan
alright, will do like that
grizzled jay
i just dont vanish the 2nd basher anymore we kill psychus too fast
raw pecan
we have arms who lucid execute psy1
grizzled jay
we have an arms in each psychus
fallow otter
Yup
raw pecan
let me check todays kill
fallow otter
Either way you still want the kill timer to be right
raw pecan
we leave psy1 2:25
so if I vanish 2nd bashers, I will have ~12s cd on vanish
after leaving
fallow otter
Gl bud
slim pebble
Does anyone have an updated link to the best covenants for rogues in SL?
balmy condor
pins are updated
frank nebula
How far behind is Kyrian? Really just not a fan of the others..
icy ember
somber hill
prisma monolithBOT
regal cloud
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
outer lotus
That’s the only way outlaw parses
@balmy condor
balmy condor
oof
outer lotus
#notalloutlaws
balmy condor
grizzled jay
my synapse damage lol
balmy condor
ye if you look at chinese outlaw logs they got like 5-8mil psycho damage and crazy thought damage
shits insane
outer lotus
this my overall breakdown, im a good boye 
grizzled jay
balmy condor
whispyr100parse.png
patent topaz
4m on thots 4m on psychopages 🤔
fallow otter
fading wigeon
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
tawny flicker
Is the bleed build even viable without expediant?
delicate bone
not really
graceful vale
Looking at Shivs AP coefficient of 20% I wonder why they didnt just match it toToxic Blade's 53% coefficient.
Hmm lets make this worse than what we're replacing
astral sundial
well, you have two conduits that might explain this
lethal poisons and well placed steel
balmy condor
Shiv also adds utility back
grizzled orbit
" I NEED A SOOTHE. ROGUE, SOOTHE!??! 
WHAT ARE YOU DOING?? YOU LET ME DIE FROM ENRAGE"
steep obsidian
just be like me and remember when it was actually a button so its nbd to use it again
wtb dismantle and smokebomb in pve back now
crimson palm
NO
strange python
" I NEED A SOOTHE. ROGUE, SOOTHE!??!
@grizzled orbit whoever thought, that tying our utility to our dps CD was a good idea, deserves a hardcore titty-twister (unless they like it)
i mean i am all up for having back the dispel, but i just hate having to gimp my dps and break my rotation for the added utility
quasi ledge
It is full-on stupid. Although to be fair there hasn't been much, or if any, thought going into Assassination for Shadowlands.
fleet whale
Assassination has barely gotten any attention
meanwhile balance has gotten 4 re-works
delicate bone
@strange python did you play outlaw at all for BFA? lmfao
bte was a stun, and part of our main dps rotation
quasi ledge
90% of the time it wasn't used as utility though, it just helped sometimes when you used it. And i think the difference between holding BtE and TB's for extended periods is fairly large
fleet whale
honestly the soothe part is going be pretty niche either way, and frost dks burn a utility button for dps too
problem with shiv is that it just feels shit to press
it would be like if symbols was put on the GCD
strange python
@strange python did you play outlaw at all for BFA? lmfao
@delicate bone i am aware of that, and yes i did (though i did as much as possible to avoid playing it)...still it doesn't justify to introduce more of that sh-stuff
quasi ledge
Going into Shadowlands as Assass is just depressing tbh. Only things added are old spells/talents which are shit to use :p
fleet whale
blindside is good
sand pewter
blindside is okay but kinda boring
fleet whale
should be baseline honestly
vestal wren
soulbinds:
vestal wren
soulbinds:
lunar whale
So Ik balancing isn’t done but what Cov is in the best spot for sin atm
outer condor
isn't blindside pretty much execute
low girder
there's an execute component where it procs more but no
frigid kestrel
@lunar whale Son far it’s looking like Necro. You can also check the pins. Fuu has been doing a great job at keeping them updated.
sand pewter
from what i understand necro is doing the best but thats largely because of sbp being overtuned, and the 3rd conduit being a little too strong
marrowed gemstone is going to be a balance problem
grizzled jay
@vestal wren Have sims confirmed that the Mastery from Theotar is better than your combat potion lasting, on average, 40% longer?
vestal wren
the sim uses potions, so it should consider the longer durations
grizzled jay
hmm
vestal wren
but i can re-check on that
moment
there we go, its not implemented yet.
so possible that its better
ther eare in essence 2 soulbinds that are not implemented yet, this and serrated spaulders
but you don't want to sacrafice a potency conduit for serrated (given you already do so in the tree)
this makes the issue with that rather low
chilly viper
gushin wound or full vers for pvp corruptions?
chilly viper
good to know thx
balmy condor
np
vestal wren
theodar would need to be ~3-5%(depending on spec) stronger to beat nadija, so it probably won't catch up. (so ~4.5-6.5% damage from the trait)
but ill re-evaluate once its implemented @grizzled jay
tired apex
what would be the dps loss in raid of picking the Marileth M+ path in necrolord compared to Heirmir?
assuming it's not gonna be possible to change conduits every other day
any idea like 1% or more like 10% ?
shut garnet
balmy condor
I can rerun with 5
since maim and lethal poisons are on both, the only thing that changes is sudden fractures
and sudden fractures 5 is the same as sudden fractures 10
so
just move the numbers down gg
at least that's how its implemented
I think the scaling is jank
vestal wren
@tired apex probably around 4%, the problem with marileth is that it has no dps win if you can't proc the consume buffs but a lot of value if you can
balmy condor
^
the only point that adds damage is volatile solvent, which requires you to fleshcraft on corpses
everything else is dps neutral
grizzled jay
Marileth is op in M+
Spires of Ascension where there's nothing but beast and humanoids kreygasm
vestal wren
well there is a reason i mark him for m+ ^^
tired apex
well thanks for the insight, overall marileth seems the best since i mostly do m+ and it has the cc immunity for pvp aswell
vestal granite
Exsang Rog built close to the ravenholdt guide - Do I equip 490 Nzoth shoulders when I get them or not?
vestal granite
thats the only reason I was asking:d thanks
frigid kestrel
@vestal wren you have the sim showing the DPS gaps between covenants for Sin and Sub? I remember you posting them before and cant find them anywhere.
grizzled jay
pins
frigid kestrel
not there
frigid kestrel
Thanks @balmy condor
balmy condor
np
grim jay
isnt that still with the old venthyr ability?
balmy condor
yeah but the new venthyr ability isn't very good and doesn't have a conduit yet
so we don't have newer info
grim jay
fair enough, gotta wait for a covenant balance pass anyways I guess
oblique lark
@frigid kestrel 5307 sub vs 4363 sin ..
same gear/ench etc
there is an even greater difference for covenants
royal lantern
balmy condor
soulbind
main blaze
Oh yeah
pliant fractal
You will know him very well in a few months
fallow otter
@balmy condor we takin same traits with or we going back to DD and 1x np style?
balmy condor
what did I say?
balmy condor
is it not dead?
fallow otter
Yeah they took off the corruption requirement
steep obsidian
it would be dumb if they didn't fix it
fallow otter
fleet whale
yeah it's fixed now. who knows if it will still be bis though in pre patch
with all the wonky scaling
fallow otter
Yeah not sure if it changes things but was wondering if you had checked it out
steep obsidian
12 on a 475
balmy condor
I have not
fallow otter
What about 490 😜
steep obsidian
16
fallow otter
Fat 16 im guessing
Ye
It's quite alot I think
Post squish
Im gonna miss current sin
Going back to being ST andy
warm olive
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
warm olive
is someone using Afenar's WA? im getting strange interface error when i skill deeper strat.
balmy condor
whats the error
warm olive
its obviously for shadowlands, which is fine (stuff like poisons warning for sub), but this error is only with deeper strat
let me screen it
all the buttons are gone in the bars and also in the talent screen, everything with symbols
balmy condor
and you've tried re-importing a new version?
warm olive
yes, it only appeared when i specced assa, i thought it has something to do with a missing ability or so, but after i reimported it today, i accidently found out it was linked to deeper strat
i can switch it on and off by just speccing vigor/marked for death
im running 100% standard ui
balmy condor
okay can you try to disable Rogue_CP_6
just load never
and then see if that works?
warm olive
its the same
balmy condor
hm
ye idk, it works on live
so its probably some weird mismatch with beta/ptr branches
fallow otter
Does it only happen with afenars loaded
warm olive
im on live, so it works for you there?
balmy condor
yeah it 100% works on live
if you're on live and it doesn't work, then its either some other weakaura
or your import is weird
considering you don't have any other addons
it doesn't look like a problem with the weakauras persay, but more like its messing up your bars, so that would be the next place to check
do you use default bars?
warm olive
I have other addons just to be clear, but nothing for UI (stuff like boss mods, details etc.)
yes default bars
and its not only bars hold on:
balmy condor
and it goes away when you disable afenars?
fallow otter
It didn't look WeakAura related to me
balmy condor
that looks like game data loss
warm olive
yes, it goes away when i disable afenar and it goes away when i have afenar loaded and skill away from deeper strat
balmy condor
have you tried a repair?
that's kinda wild then
weakauras doesn't have control over any of those graphics
fallow otter
Did you import a shadowlands version of afenars?
warm olive
yes
warm olive
is there a non shadowlands version i could take?
fallow otter
Regular
balmy condor
you could go back a couple versions
and try that
go there
and then choose like 3.0.1
and try that
balmy condor
jesus
errant cloak
I played assa in bfa with luxthos WA they are awesome and after some slight modification perferct for me.
He also offers them for all classes already for SL. I used the sub one on PTR and works fine.
but you only get them via his discord.
warm olive
this is where it gets broken
warm olive
yes
warm olive
i tried, not changing
crimson palm
It's a position issue, disable the WAs one by one and see which one is causing it
for me it was CP_6, I had to change Y offset by 0.6 and it fixed itself
warm olive
i can do a repair and disable every other addon, just to be sure we are looking at the wrong stuff, if that helps
ok i will try it
vestal wren
@frigid kestrel i posted between outlaw/sin because those are close. I didn't post sub because its ahead in pure st and people seem to interpret to much into that
balmy condor
cause I'm just guessing
warm olive
its CP 4 and 5, both individually cause that error
i will try changing offset now
i can confirm its something with the position, it works if i place 4/5 far away
fallow otter
Whisp did you end up simming hod lol
warm olive
alright, got it, the distribution is not 100% symmetrical, but no errors. thanks for the help.
balmy condor
no I've been lazy lul
fallow otter
Me2
devout hedge
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
grand elbow
@balmy condor don't you know if Luxthos will update his WAs to SL or not?
Because didn't find any info about it on his streams or site
Played 2 years with it and they are soooo good
balmy condor
he's going to update them probably yeah
quaint sequoia
He has working ones for beta on his discord
grand elbow
He has working ones for beta on his discord
@quaint sequoia oh, didn't check discord, just site and streams)
scarlet hinge
@warm olive had the exact same issue yesterday, updated everything with WA companion, and saw the very same missing textures, etc. Glad to see you got it working, once I realised it was Afenars, I just deleted and grabed Devlins, was the fix easy? I've grown to like Afenars, if only they would add an empowered garotte tracker!
balmy condor
yes
snow hamlet
balmy condor
snow hamlet
Maybe a nice improvement
snow hamlet
i wish that geting a passive skill like wod to refresh SnD
snow hamlet
hope so
balmy condor
I would hope that the set bonuses are a little more interesting than "you now don't have to use snd"
but I'll take what I can get tbh
beggars can't be choosers
and man do rogues beg XD
sick scarab
so flagellation is going to be better than sepsis..
balmy condor
then you should be more worried about sbs
sick scarab
sbs ?
balmy condor
I personally prefer sbs
I don't like sepsis because it creates a greater reliance on stealth
and I don't like flag because it provides no gameplay
a lot of people like it
but hit button on cd, then continue normal rotation
is not interesting to me
so imo, overhyped nonsense
sick scarab
agree on flagellation
on sepsis instead i think is more rogue like skill.
i mean.. it fit well wiht our skill.. instead of a infinite dot or a coral 2.0
balmy condor
yeah I can see the RP value
but gameplay wise, especially for the m+ people, and the casuals that want to do more open world, etc
its a disaster
sick scarab
welll in m+ you can re apply garrote many times . i mean not so bad
all is damage dependant.. sbs is just too powerfull
balmy condor
yeah but its still strictly less damage than sbs right now, and significantly harder to use
sick scarab
tbh there is no reason to go other coventnat
exaclty
it should be more rewarding
rmore difficult
rmore reward
instead.. more difficult.. less reward
blizz sucks 🙂
balmy condor
those empowered garrotes also aren't very pog anymore
without SS, they lose a LOT of value
sick scarab
yep
blizz sucks 2 times for that also.. we are fucking assa rogue we use dots..
bha
😛
we will see
final saffron
that feel when you don't have a 4th essence for your neck 
balmy condor
final saffron
I know you love it!
final saffron
I'm just too pro at the game, a good player don't need essences ;D
final saffron
ofc, that goes without saying
fading wigeon
Damnnnnnn so green
Whispyr will the assasination guide be updated for pre-patch like the sub one has?
balmy condor
the guide?
fading wigeon
Sorry fixed it lol
balmy condor
yeah
fading wigeon
Ah ok
balmy condor
the wowhead guide from mystler already has prepatch notes
fading wigeon
Ooo perfect thank you!
warm olive
@warm olive had the exact same issue yesterday, updated everything with WA companion, and saw the very same missing textures, etc. Glad to see you got it working, once I realised it was Afenars, I just deleted and grabed Devlins, was the fix easy? I've grown to like Afenars, if only they would add an empowered garotte tracker!
@scarlet hinge I fixed it fore deeper strat with 6 CPs, but now its the same thing with 5 CPs. I guess I will have to keep trying to get it to work for both.
scarlet hinge
@warm olive From Afenar disc : 2 options - scale group to 0.99, or scale your elvui to 0.71 and place auras to 0.5 coords like it should be - https://i.imgur.com/hrXDDsM.png
scarlet hinge
good shit bro!
vapid epoch
so.. how does Ma leggy and talent work with each other?
iron valve
150% crit
vapid epoch
can my crits crit?
raw pecan
@balmy condor what do you think about playing 1x gushing wounds on nzoth fight?
I can see that some guys play it, but I dont feel it
wet ruin
@raw pecan whoever you saw running it is most likely the lack of exp 2, or it might just sim better, but its not because of n'zoth specifically
vestal wren
yes, the red border(highlight) should make it more obviouse
i hope this helps with confusion
wet ruin
the log is nearly 2 months old
lunar whale
Okay awesome I want to play sin because I’m not a fan of sub so I’m happy your here lmao
Because I was so lost
Trying to give rogue a try for the first time since cata
wet ruin
I would say don't just look at the rank 1 log, but you can just ask the guy @crimson palm
sick scarab
@vestal wren why in night fae you choose the path to the Nya tool Burrs and dont go Nya tools Poisons to have another dps conduit ? or i miss something ?
vestal wren
because the poison trait is worth less than burrs
its also bound to your interrupt so not consistently usable
sick scarab
well but it is enoiught to loose 1 more dps conduit ?
i mean te burr damage is good ?
crimson palm
Gw sims better than exp2 on 485
vestal wren
also keep in mind that sin only has 2 strong dps conduits, what means the 3rd pick decides between the 2 weak sin conduits, the covenant conduit or the soulbind
its very easy to forget that the relative strengh of the soulbind picks depends on the strengh of the 3rd potency slot
ashen solar
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
vestal wren
the 3rd potency conduit is ~0.8% dps increase iirc, what means a soulbind does only need to be slightly higher than that to make it worth the pick
ofc it needs to be higher if you have a dps soulbind and a conduit.
as an additional note, i rly want to emphasize that even if both would be equally strong that it might be better to go the burrs path because you gain a additional conduit
haing defensive/utility conduits without losing damage is a nice addition in some paths
meager arch
rogue defensive conduits are pretty legit also. Recuperator and the damage absorb when you stealth seems really nice to have
young vessel
hai lads, what build is gonna be best for prepatch?
back to toxic blade vanish vendetta crit blast?
crimson palm
🔮
subtle drift
untold belfry
How do you counter DH as sin?
strange python
I found that lowering HP of your enemy to 0 before he lowers yours is usually the way to go
(sorry couldn't resits, i don't really pvp)
knotty kestrel
Where's the lie though?
crimson palm
@balmy condor hello new rogue here wahat is best covenant
balmy condor
jagged ibex
Hopefully next build includes a conduit for Flagellation
grizzled jay
@balmy condor We can ditch SBS now 😎
fleet whale
I wonder how ER will sim now
it's possible that we could have 3 solid options for ST
just looking at the abilities alone
and not soulbinds
grizzled jay
i'd wait for Sims as well, cause ER does affect AoE
if you proc Crimson Tempest or Shadow Vault with it
SBS seems really bad in dungeons with the nerfs. ER + CT might be better in M+ straight up.
balmy condor
ye the sbs nerf is pretty heavy
crimson palm
100% dmg nerf kek
grizzled jay
It will still be decent, I think, in multi-target boss fights. Like Council, Stone Generals, Sire.
But outside of that, idk.
balmy condor
more than 100% if I'm reading it right
grizzled jay
10% AP every 3s. ER is 45s cd for comparison. On Sire that means in 45s you get 15 ticks for 300% AP. ER at max Conduit rank is 297% AP. So SBS is better in that instance.
balmy condor
the instant damage got cut in half, but the dot does way less
grizzled jay
The DoT was reduced by 84%
balmy condor
unless the tooltips are janked, I'm reading 60% every 3 to 10% every 3
fleet whale
yeah it's dead
balmy condor
from what I'm seeing
yeah
mega dead
lmao
instant damage cut in half, dot hammered hard
like this is probably more than 2/3rd of the damage gone
meager arch
the new soulbind they added to necrolord is kind of insane with SBS being a short CD though. You get a 15% primary stat buff for 10 sec out of every 30 sec
crimson palm
Which path is it on
meager arch
Emeni
balmy condor
rip
fleet whale
that's a long time from now
meager arch
yeah...
crimson palm
Ye
meager arch
I like night fae for that reason, you get some nice buffs in the first few weeks
grizzled jay
Pelagos and Kleia are both super nice.
It's less than a month before launch and we still have +5% vers. I think it's staying lol
fleet whale
i heard the night fae storyline is really cool
fleet whale
night fae doesn't look that bad though
low girder
less about liking sepsis and more about liking night fae
surreal solar
sigh Necrolord dead.... Flagellation change good/bad? it looks like it dropped in dmg
fleet whale
they are peeing themselves now
flag i'm 99% sure was just cleaning up data
no nerf or buff
surreal solar
Oh, it was just a tooltip fix?
fleet whale
yeah looks like it
balmy condor
yeak
fleet whale
old tooltip was what 68% ap a lash
balmy condor
cleaning up the slaughter stuff
fleet whale
it was def not that
surreal solar
fuck my arse, it's either Night Fae or Venthyr now >.<
balmy condor
and changing tooltip
grizzled jay
ER train hell yeah
fleet whale
ER has a mixed response
balmy condor
numerically usable
grizzled jay
I haven't used it in so long, I forget if they added SnD to it
fleet whale
foreverguy really likes the concept
balmy condor
its a fucking disaster of a design
fleet whale
of it
balmy condor
I like the core idea of empowered finishers and stuff
and combo point interesting stuff
whatever
grizzled jay
I was on ER day 1 alpha. But numerically you couldn't justify it
meager arch
it feels so impossible to consistantly get a 1 combo point finisher off for ER
balmy condor
but its so fucking jank
fleet whale
just use poison knife
grizzled jay
ER is 2/3/4
fleet whale
can force finishers with PK
meager arch
what if it crits though
fleet whale
pk doesn't work
grizzled jay
Garrote
fleet whale
with seal fate
grizzled jay
Garrote is 1CP
fleet whale
if your knife throw crits
balmy condor
yeah
balmy condor
poison knife always gives 1
surreal solar
is Flag actually good enough to not go Night Fae Master Trash?
fleet whale
there are other things to consider like
soulbinds
if were lucky ER, Flag, and Sepsis
will sim close in ST
balmy condor
pull out your magic healing crystal and whisper into the mirror with the soul of a Victorian child
they'll tell you if its better
fleet whale
and then you won't be punished as hard if you make the "wrong" choice
surreal solar
they did find that flag target does get slapped if you spend cp on a different target right?
balmy condor
its just neutral in m+
idk
night fae looking real saucy all of a sudden
was always just in the shadow of sbs for m+
but now that sbs isn't sbs
lookin kinda nice
surreal solar
I just don't want to travel down the master assassin road again
balmy condor
zoldyck is way too strong for that
we're scaling poison damage so hard
and in m+ you would use the vanish for garrotes anyway
so that's half of ma's value gone basically
surreal solar
Theoretical timing for sepsis usage in the rotation?
tawny shell
Did they change ER?
balmy condor
buffed it super hard
surreal solar
hugely boosted its raw dmg and its energy cost got trimmed
balmy condor
sepsis was used single target like 8-9 seconds in
to refresh the garrote I'm pretty sure
in m+ probably similar
surreal solar
and then just, again on CD?
grizzled jay
if you are using MA you would Sepsis right after your Garrotes, then Vanish right when you Sepsis
balmy condor
on cd like anything else
quaint sequoia
what changed with sbs? trying to find anything in the datamine but cant
balmy condor
sbs got nuked
surreal solar
60% AP / Bleed -> 30% AP/10% Bleed
balmy condor
grizzled jay
The active got reduced from 60% to 30%. The Bleed got reduced from 60% to 10%. It no longer fractures.
tawny shell
I like ER but hate that it’s gotta be a certain amount of combo points each time
grizzled jay
Energy went from 10 to 15.
surreal solar
oh they stabbed the fracture too? fuck, Bone Spike really is dead
quaint sequoia
So completly dead then?
quaint sequoia
yes ofc
balmy condor
we're all just throwing out hot takes until that happens XD
grizzled jay
In a 45s period on 2 targets the bleed is still doing 300% AP. 450% AP on 3 targets.
It's still good just not horrendously overtuned
But it's assuredly dead in ST
quaint sequoia
So will night fae or venthyr be go to then?
grizzled jay
We don't know.
But if the ER conduit stays as is, it will sim pretty high.
(it's also very hard to sim ER due to the Anima CP mechanic)
balmy condor
says who
frail birch
at this rate ion wants kyrian rogues to be a thing so bad he'll keep buffing it til it is
grizzled jay
it's gotten 1 buff in 8 months lmao
meager arch
luckily from a flavor standpoint, all covenants make sense for rogues
unlike night fae death knights
quaint sequoia
er is kyrian ability right?
balmy condor
yes
aha
so we can't even take the SBS nerf seriously
aight pack it up boys
we're still in the dark
subtle drift
Okay you were faster
quaint sequoia
teach me master
balmy condor
fleet anchor
We can take the SBS nerf seriously yes. Might be a little too far, but hard to say quite yet.
Will have some feedback by the end of the night
balmy condor
well we can take it seriously
grizzled jay
As long as the fracture never comes back, I am happy.
balmy condor
but that sounds a lot like "these numbers are gonna change"
fleet anchor
They might change sure
balmy condor
so yes, right now, believe numbers
grizzled jay
The bleed at 20% AP would be perfectly fine. Makes it the best in multi-target that live longer than 30s~ or so
balmy condor
but don't go crazy
fleet anchor
I'm sure Fuu will have all the answers some time in the morning 😛
grizzled jay
Fank you thuu
fleet anchor
If the servers ever come back up and I can test stuff tonight anyway!
balmy condor
push all the changes to github so I can make messy sims that fuu will have to correct
near pilot
from this point on ima play beta as if covenants will be such a small % margins such as race and pick what i like
until launch week
then its w/e fuu tells me lol
balmy condor
I don't really get the hype around being optimal in beta anyway
its meant to test things
but that's just me I guess
deft vault
balmy condor
I don't pvp, and no I'm not the night elf rogue that played against pikaboo
I play BE on NA horde
and I'm like 1500 in 2's and 300 in 3's
and that's it
grim jay
I respect the 300 in 3s
balmy condor
thanks I really had to sweat for those 4 matches
grim jay
yw, gotta give credit
just got to the point where the only thing I hope for is that the same covenant is the best for sub and sin
balmy condor
yeah same tbh
grim jay
appreciated the rework of the venthyr ability for that alone already. everything else is just whatever. on second thought even the transmog doesnt matter since we all wanna feel like a special snowflake instead of running with something everyone has mogged
so we most likely end up using what we usually do 😄
balmy condor
ye
subtle drift
Does someone know how much DPS a socket in Prepatch gives?
balmy condor
pff
subtle drift
I'm 3 sockets behind but i kinda don't want to do visions
balmy condor
let me check
probably not a lot
I think gems are like 9 haste
could probably count the dps in the 'dozens'
grizzled jay
ive always wanted to go kyrian but the numbers of ER would be inting. if ER is now within a few % of the other 3 i'll go Kyrian
balmy condor
1 socket simmed within margin
balmy condor
giga
grim jay
duh why do you wanna go kyrian tho
balmy condor
tmb a weirdo
you learn to accept it
everyone a lil different
tmb's thing is kyrian
subtle drift
Lol
balmy condor
subtle drift
These set bonuses are a joke
subtle drift
grim jay
I mean if it would always empower your next 5 cp finisher or something, that would be a different story, but ... 😄
balmy condor
I mean
subtle drift
balmy condor
can you tell me what the legion class set was
cause I can't remember that either
they're supposed to be flavor
not BiS
grizzled jay
the legion class hall sets were not as good as these
it was like.. out-of-combat regen, movement speed, and reduction to crowd control
but 100 primary stat is a lot
balmy condor
yeah
that's what I vaguely remember
I saw actual damage on these sets and was a little impressed
grim jay
ok venthyr has the best set. venthyr it is boys
3 piece: Soul Replenishment - Increases your out-of-combat regeneration in outdoor Shadowland zones. While in your Covenant's realm, the regeneration amount is increased.
5 piece: Penance Brand - Your spells and abilities have a chance to inflict Penance Brand on your target dealing 660 Shadow damage over 6 sec and healing you for the same amount.
8 piece: One With Shadows - While Door of Shadows is off cooldown your <Primary Stat> is increased by 80 and its range is increased by 5 while in outdoor Shadowland zones.
balmy condor
grim jay
subtle drift
Replaced by heroic gear on Day 1
fleet whale
"Blizz can we have tier set?"
fleet whale
"but you already have tier sets at home"
balmy condor
pogg
grim jay
prolly even replaced by normal mythic dungeon gear if not heroic
fleet whale
tier sets at home: these covenant sets
fleet whale
Whisp did you get beta
subtle drift
Still no beta for me
balmy condor
lul no
balmy condor
the only beta I get is beta simcraft
subtle drift
I don't want to watch 16 hours to see how the quests are going.
balmy condor
cause its open source
grim jay
wouldve payed for prepatch so that I can finally play a bit
grizzled jay
how about you test this dik
grim jay
@grizzled jay test how hard kyrian hits
balmy condor
that'll really fuck me up
subtle drift
Blade Flurry hits can now apply poisons to any enemies hit.
balmy condor
subtle drift
Laughing so hard
grizzled jay
this dude is here instead of Draka
subtle drift
Draka is a strong indepented woman who don't need no frostwolfs
grim jay
only pvp with rogue then
balmy condor
as long as this channel stays wholesome and comfy
idc what people do
make ER bis for all I care
lol
quaint sequoia
Zoldyck from Torghast
grim jay
it cant possibly get worse than back when they introduced the sin changes with tb n stuff and people fotm'ed sin
quaint sequoia
hopefully not timegated
balmy condor
yeah
I like helping people
but I remember when exsang became meta
it was pretty tiring
grim jay
yeah same, sometimes it just becomes a bit too much
kinda meh that dashing scoundrel is from raid tho
surreal solar
ZolDICK in torghast... now thats hawt
outer condor
hi, just reached 120, i'm seeing "expedient" builds everywhere and I have not got the slightest clue as to what that means. should I even bother reading up?
or will it be swept on sl
grizzled jay
grizzled jay
as strong as an Ambush
outer condor
corruption is?
grim jay
@grizzled jay whats finisher damage at 5cp on tooltip?
balmy condor
the 8.3 mechanic
surreal solar
dead, and meaningless in 1-2weeks
grim jay
uh ye wrong spell
outer condor
the 8.3 mechanic
yes, is it being yeeted as well?
balmy condor
yes
grim jay
I corrected my mistake and I humbly ask for your forgiveness sire
balmy condor
that's what's getting removed
outer condor
ah well
balmy condor
essences and traits survive till shadowlands
corruption goes away in prepatch next week
outer condor
also no news on release date right?
prisma monolithBOT
Shadowlands release: 25 days 22 hours 26 minutes 19 seconds
balmy condor
prepatch no
outer condor
that's what i meant
grim jay
I dont think they wanna live through all the hate if they dont release it next week tho
surreal solar
it's only logical options are the 6th or maybe the 13th but a 2week prepatch is pretty.... oof
balmy condor
there's stress testing, pvp season was said to finish soon
they already released all their "do this before it leaves" shit
I don't see the 13th happening without a giga blowback
outer condor
I dont think they wanna live through all the hate if they dont release it next week tho
i think it's preferable to get hate for delaying
quaint sequoia
Isn't it like 2 weeks of content in pre-patch tho?
outer condor
rather than releasing shit that will get hate
balmy condor
prepatch has always been at least 4 weeks
grizzled jay
ah i must need new Details. it isn't picking up ER lol
grim jay
@outer condor I dont think they can do much wrong. people know by now that prepatch is one hell of an unbalanced clownfiesta every time
people just wanna play with whats new
get some fresh air
and enjoy not having corruptions
and I dont think many people even care for the event
surreal solar
given there's no mount, IDC
outer condor
i mean
balmy condor
new path season started last week so people playing that too
outer condor
unbalanced clownfiesta sounds like a bit of an understatement
balmy condor
rocket league free to play
balmy condor
prepatch is always like that
outer condor
there was this one astronomically large monk bugs thread
balmy condor
sub has a ton of bugs too
subtle drift
balmy condor
and its always had them
they'll tune heroic week
and it'll be fine
it won't be perfect
but it'll be fine
surreal solar
is okay, spend 2 weeks sucking Mummy-mans sandy chode and doing WQ's to switch
balmy condor
that's what happened to sub
people farmed azerite for it and mastery gear
and it got nuked
these things happen
outer condor
meh, can't care enough, i'm probably gonna do the catch up questline and go farm achieves
balmy condor
that's what we all do in prepatch
outer condor
glad to know
outer condor
can't say i've done either
grizzled jay
ER works with Rupture now
balmy condor
you haven't done m+ or raids
grizzled jay
SnD consumes ER but does not give a 7CP SnD still
outer condor
its a mess :P
honestly, the only thing I can bitch about
is the number scaling
despise that
balmy condor
wdym the number scaling?
outer condor
y'know like
fleet whale
so i made a 60 pre made
outer condor
mobs' level catch up to yours
fleet whale
where do i find the covenant abilities?
outer condor
and you don't even see the same numbers as other people do
balmy condor
oh the leveling changes