[ any reason ? ]
#assassination
fallen sandal
gonna check 😄
dire spoke
[ without changing anything ]
safe relic
u should use enchants on what sims u better and what stat still sims better?
!
even if u think u have "alot" of it
civic palm
Pardon?
safe relic
what ? 😄
civic palm
Your stat weights are your stat weights, so how is one sim different than the other?
fallen sandal
oh yah wepon enchant
safe relic
depending the gear mate
safe relic
ye same im on zul so im using mastery on my weapon 😄
civic palm
If it's that close your weapon enchants are messing with your stat weights more than ring enchants might be.
safe relic
no its not that i wanted to ask
well we are 4 rogues and 1 is social :/
but
the dmg it seems to me so random
i mean sometimes im on 55k dps
civic palm
Well crits are pretty random.
safe relic
and others at same time im on 35
safe relic
im on 76 mastery :/
dire spoke
if you have 20 evis crits while cooldown or outside of cooldown will structure your output
safe relic
i have useless hastee on my gear and cant replace it
fallen sandal
i run 11% on zul
cunning needle
what are you running on zul?
wait
nvm
my brain read zul as zekhov
for some reason
though... what do people run on zekhov as rogue
fallen sandal
i run Ct
safe relic
if adds are dying fast
Pb
if the dmg on adds is low
CT
i mean pb does 3-4% of ur dmg
cunning needle
nah i mean spec wise, though i assume thats also a 'what does your raid need'
safe relic
CT can do 10%
patent topaz
I run outlaw on zekvoz
safe relic
outlaw has more value and more dps on zekvox
fallen sandal
i was running outlaw on progress
safe relic
but lower ST
safe relic
obviously
patent topaz
depends on what you need
patent topaz
prey on the weak on big adds is pretty nice
dire spoke
being on bench and gaining gold instead of loosing is nice
safe relic
kappa
patent topaz
why only on 2 adds out of 3
cunning needle
how do you solo void weavers as sub? wat
patent topaz
we kill them 1 by one
safe relic
cause the third is always immune on stuns and ccs
patent topaz
you are taking too long to kill them then
fallen sandal
fight on zul as rogue is two spell
alpine cave
With CT it is good without CT is also good
safe relic
but the fight kinda is 2 spells
he is saying that on zekvoz its not a big difference either u play pb or ct
but always depends on the speed adds dying
if all focus adds hard then ur ct is kinda useless
dire spoke
who cares about logs, either you have AoE job or you don't
patent topaz
What we do is melee kills the big add near the boss, then moves to the next one in the back. Small adds are still alive at this point and ranged finish them off while they are in ring of peace
What I do is stun the first big add and killing spree, then move right away
safe relic
yes
i dont use it
well actually i dont use it cause i replace my chest
with 370
for the crit trait
fallen sandal
first dance ?
safe relic
y
fallen sandal
im running one of them on helmet
fallen sandal
yes
safe relic
i guess zul is down tonight
long osprey
Anyone else noticing that subterfuge isn't working properly?
safe relic
its easy boss
safe relic
what u mean @long osprey
fallen sandal
will be easier
long osprey
I'm rocking subterfuge and ss. Not getting the empowered garrotes from stealth, and it's incurring a cooldown after first use
Been happening all day
Works as intended about half the time, the other time I'm tossing one garrote out and getting 1 cp and a cooldown
safe relic
u sure? check again ur traits
long osprey
Looking at them right now
fallen sandal
you should be stealth
quiet axle
That happened to me when I swapped to SS yesterday.
long osprey
3 SS and subterfuge
fallen sandal
to work
long osprey
I was in stealth
long osprey
And Bam just happened again on a random mob in tiragarde
alpine cave
Exsan and haste
safe relic
ur bleeds depending on haste
alpine cave
haste is a must
safe relic
on how fast they proc
civic palm
@long osprey Make sure you're not using a trinket in stealth.
safe relic
🤔
alpine cave
It is rhetorical since every class needs haste nowadays.
dire spoke
you can't generalize stat weights
long osprey
Ahhhh that's what it is. Turns out I'm just a total dingus. Thanks @civic palm was using an old garrotes macro with use 14 in it
civic palm
👌
long osprey
I'm lazy and have tricks macrod into all of my abilities lol
safe relic
the only macro im using on rogue is for tricks
quartz rune
Mouseover bleeds are useful sometimes aswell / were in Legion
safe relic
specially when im playing MA and its bored af
dire spoke
keybinds 
civic palm
quiet axle
When is the best time to utilize galecallers during opener?
long osprey
When you pop vendetta yeah?
quiet axle
I have it macrod with vendetta atm
Wasn't sure if there was a more optimal use timing
safe relic
well maybe i could use macro to cast vendetta then vanish 🤔
but thats -1 bind so its gonna be even more boring
quartz rune
U cant do that can u
safe relic
idk
quartz rune
Vendetta is GCD
safe relic
never tries
alpine cave
When you drink 2nd potion
safe relic
rofl
long osprey
Macros were much more useful in legion. Bring back the no gcd cooldowns
alpine cave
I think Vendetta CD is not much different with Trinket
safe relic
Kappa
civic palm
Hit yer fuckin buttonz.
quiet axle
Yeah the vendetta timing helps with tracking the internal on gcb for me
long osprey
Lol. It doesn't make my rotation any more engaging imo, just wastes time on my buff
civic palm
Yeah that ONE GCD, ouch.
long osprey
/Shrug
safe relic
Swag
safe matrix
or #wow-general
civic palm
safe matrix
anyways, assassination topix only
safe relic
btw
im using 395 dice trinket + fathoms what u thiink would be good trinket to replace fathoms ? im MA no ss trait so i dont use exsan only toxic blade
civic palm
strange python
That new 8.1 trait, echo blades looks cool for aoe
quartz rune
395 dice i hate u
quartz rune
Like get an on Use - Kings rest trinket / Shrine trinket / or Pvp trinket i think
quartz rune
Its just like 375 with socket xD feelsbad
stiff niche
Im using galecallers and dice
safe relic
well boon is good
long osprey
Rough life. Now if you'll excuse me I'll go back to looking at my 355 galecallers QQ
alpine cave
Off topic be like " Why did you use your cloak of shadow before the boss AOE spell?" My answer is "I am fucking dying and that shite DPS (Discipline priest) is not healing me, so I heal myself with cloak(traits)+vial, you idiot mind your own business and STFU, I can dodge boss AOE with feint" , His reply is " I think feint is to reduce threat" Me" Dude STFU or play rogue"
civic palm
...
safe relic
but idk if its so good for my current talent tree
quartz rune
I have 385 Dread Gladiator Badge with Socket and Galecalllers 380 but cant drop anything higher than 360 socket Dice.
quartz rune
Galecaller is still fine with TB
long osprey
Haste for daaaayysss
quartz rune
Way stronger with EXSG but yea
long osprey
Obligatory sim though. Raidbots gear compare would be good to see what you need to farm
dire spoke
fathoms is generally worth a 380 trinket but highly depends on comp and situation
safe relic
fathoms is rng though
dire spoke
just like every proc trinket
dire spoke
lol
quartz rune
Wait what
safe relic
use dice go outlaw and have 124312312 buffs Kappa
long osprey
A fate worse than death
quartz rune
What even is that Argument .. Boon is not proc xD
quartz rune
He just saying Fathoms is really good trinket for ilvl and pretty decent overall
alpine cave
Boon is not very good with movement.
alpine cave
Lion's is better I think
safe relic
but im looking for an upgrade now if it is
any
btw
370 boon sims better than fathoms
on me
quartz rune
Yea cause boon is pretty strong but u have to keep in mind if u move out of circle = dps loss
safe relic
well ofc ik that 😄
alpine cave
Sims usually means stable single target without movement, if you a change the sims status to actual boss fight that will be dps loss.
quartz rune
So it really depends on situation.
dire spoke
Zempai some nam Today at 09:24
fathoms is generally worth a 380 trinket but highly depends on comp and situation
quartz rune
And Boon needs some practice, if you want 4 perfect uses in 5min fight
safe relic
well lets see the bosses 1 by on taloc u dont have to move if u get debuff u can use cos and keep doing ur dps,on mother u dont have to move if flares coming out of floor use cos...zekvoz there are times that u dont have to move for 10-12 secs,same for vectis...The only movement boss is fetid..
quartz rune
.. or is pretty impossible for some bosses
safe relic
im always talking for mythic
nah u dont have to use cds on adds
2mins cds always on pull
quartz rune
Yea but i mean theres a difference of lining up Boon with cds / getting max use and just using it on cd
alpine cave
if you talk about mythic taloc is with arteries and buffs, but I know what you mean, you will skip your 1st unfortunate encounter with COS
So you can tunnel the boss within 8 sec
safe relic
yes
alpine cave
Arathi WB trinket with, Taloc Mythic haste is better I guess 😛
well it depends on personal preference
quartz rune
What do u mean u dont use cds on adds on fetid
quartz rune
There is more than 1 add xD
quartz rune
"Nah u dont have to use cds on adds"
dire spoke
fetid is one of the most static fights, nothing moves
safe relic
i ment u dont have to keep ur cds for first adds
dire spoke
you can use boon whenever
quartz rune
Then u dont play Fetid xD
dire spoke
well that's a dumb raidlead
civic palm
If you have 7-8 you motherfuckers better not be moving.
solid nova
If you're running 8 melee on fetid your trinket choices isn't the main issue 
alpine cave
Malo something buff
dire spoke
just use cannon then, because it's ranged AMIRITE
quartz rune
Seems like you dont have a very good roster
safe relic
yep
only 4 rogues on zul
and 1 is social
if we had a better roster
not players but roster
we would be progressing mythrax now
but is kinda hard to find cause its not international
dire spoke
more rogues don't make bad crusher timings better
quartz rune
But you can blast boss faster
royal lantern
0,5% could be a kill with good procs/crits on 1-2people lul
quartz rune
First dance trait op
quartz rune
2x dance = easy
quartz rune
Blaming it on roster when playing badly 
safe relic
poor u :<
im not playing bad 😡
its just that comes with instict
when ur target is out of nb
dire spoke
Tryan probably 2day 6h btw
royal lantern
nah, can only raid sunday/monday cus of work
safe relic
well at least u are not going at all other days
we start 19:30 server time and im home 20:30 server time 😡
and im always losing mother taloc..
rip dagger-ring
dire spoke
just account share
quartz rune
How do u even get a raidspot if ur 1 hour lste Every raid
royal lantern
rolling for dagger on hc/mythic mother since the raid is out and still no ring or dagger lul
safe relic
Im Greek lol
regal snow
Thats better than a Raidlead who doesnt care about clean roaster for serveral bosses and Roaster who doesnt care about specc and talent change
alpine cave
For Sparta 😛
safe relic
😄
quartz rune
When i see half my raid with budget ring enchants literally tilts me every raidday
royal lantern
i can SOMEWHAT understand no specc change if you really cant play other specs?
but no talent change? wtf man
safe relic
well currently i played all specs on rogue
started with outlaw then gets nerfed-switched sub,but got bored-switched to assa now
that is the best obviously
regal snow
Yeah did the same
alpine cave
Sub is annoying
alpine cave
With assassination , we can do lot of Mechs
quartz rune
If youre in a Guild that wants to make good progress they know that
And if they dont they dont belong in taht guild
But theres a difference between like 1% dps gain from other spec than like Ass vs sub on zul
royal lantern
^
safe relic
well obviously
royal lantern
if you play sin instead of sub on zul you are an idiot, sorry but.....sub is MADE for that fight
quartz rune
I mean if u gain that 1% dmg if u play perfect its not worth for non hardcore raiders
regal snow
Nah most of them say ..“we are not a progress guild“ ...why u even want to run mythic content lel
royal lantern
on mythic ofc
quartz rune
As they dont know their 2nd specc perfectly
safe relic
rank 1 assa 30k dps rank 1 sub 51k dps..
quartz rune
Optimal specc is most of the times also based on equal performance on both speccs
quartz rune
Thats not the case for most raiders id say
Ye zul was bad example
Its just a difference of X spec is better in general than Player x is worse on spec x than he is on spec y and will do more dps on y eventhough Spec x is favored on this boss ye
royal lantern
thats 90%of all mythic bosses in a nutshell
quartz rune
Yeah but like
U need crs at end and stuff
For dps especially on progress
On fetid its more of a coordination and Timing thing for example
safe relic
the last nerf on fetid was huge
quartz rune
You just practice CDs / best timings for urself and once u done taht get good spawns gg
safe relic
so its so easy now
quartz rune
On Zek if u die to debuff ur fucked cuz u cant be cred
Or u will spawn add sometimes
Most people dont know how to handle surging darkness + deceit without immunity
Or panic on Eye-Beam - Dance
royal lantern
tbf, eyebeam+darkness is a bit bullshit sometimes
stable oxide
Cloak of Shadows or External cooldown
daring imp
fml, never got pwned so hard by another rouge https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/yacwr4FBGY72zhKA/ Ç_Ç
quartz rune
I rather get the eyebeam every time than my raidmembers not knowing what to do ik some situations / not having immunity
I mean he has 7 ilvl more than u
daring imp
7 ilvl making that much difference makes me sick Ç_Ç
high siren
or skill 🤔
scarlet urchin
@daring imp one thing that sticks out is that you have 9% uptime on CT while the other rogue has 79% uptime, might be the majority of the discrepancy?
solid nova
Yeah he smashed you in CT damage + prepots
timber pewter
!weakaura
solid nova
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
timber pewter
thanks
solid nova
No sweat
keen urchin
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/jRD97BdAHFphXaWC#fight=1&type=damage-done anyone bored enough to skim through this? felt like I didn't make any huge mistake but parse is straight trash
very new to rogue so probably something I'm completely missing
snow orchid
wrong talents
daring imp
i don't understand how, i ct'ed literally every pack, even on the ones with only 2 mobs
how in the holy fuck does he have so much more uptime
i do understand he casted it way more than me
solid nova
Death would have been a tiny setback too
But as its only 1 doubt it's a significant difference, but certainly adds to it
marsh bloom
whicih set of orbs would probably get you to die right as the boss dies
like the 4th?
keen urchin
Oh yeah forgot to change CT before going into raid lol, kill time is also probably a factor but I usually get 99% anyway with my other chars since I'm overgeared for normal so I thought I was probably doing something wrong
strange python
Hey all. I'm new to WoW and just started my first character 9 days ago. I was hoping to get some help with a link to what you guys consider the best "combo/rotation" or whatever it's called here for a this class when fighting PvP. Or your own personal moves that you recommend to use. I play on war mode and have beat everyone I fought up to 107 and I'm at 104, but I keep using the same moves with hard attacks and don't know how to chain my attacks to stun lock or start a fight with a good combo. I've read a few sites on tips, but I wanna get a recommendation from someone here if possible. Any help is appreciated
solid nova
@strange python For PVE, you'll want to head to the link in the header and also the pinned messages in the top right 📌
PvP wise you'll need to head down to #pvp and checkout the information in the same locations.
Any questions after that, please feel free to ask in the respective channels
strange python
Thank you! 😁
dry wing
Is assa rogue good for MOTHER adds? I mean, i feel like i dont have enought AoE burst for that
spring chasm
on how many targets do you rupture on big pulls @daring imp
keen urchin
@dry wing No I don't think they're good and there's like 5 classes that do it better
dry wing
that was what i though, but my RL insist : /
at the end i ll have to run subtlety with sectec lmao
(i dont know how to play outlaw)
hot flume
@dry wing you are on the first group ?
dry wing
yep
bronze kelp
hey guys, has someone an opener example for MA talent?
better said, when to pull vanish in opener
hot flume
@dry wing sectec might help you with first adds, but therefore it's useless, adds will be nuked
dry wing
yeah, i know
spring chasm
@bronze kelp pins
dry wing
that's why im trying to convince my RL for not going in group 1
i think rogue is only useful if you are running outlaw
hot flume
The same for me, both assa go in 2nd group while we should stay in first room to dps... but whatever
since it dies...
Is there someone that can analyze my log here and tell me what am I doing wrong to be so low on parses https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/1fG4AMWDjqr9vnxQ#fight=5&type=damage-done
Besides that I wasn't fully buffed, just if my rotation is good and if I'm messing something while switching for the add
bronze kelp
@spring chasm you mean the ravenholdt guide? there is no opener example for MA as far as i see
spring chasm
?
spring chasm
are you looking at the sin guide
bronze kelp
then there are 4 sections for exsang/tb with or without SS trait
cant see it :/ ill search later again
dont know whats goin on
lone junco
spring chasm
wet condor
How do you sim your character för m+?
visual token
@bronze kelp when I use your link it doesn’t show the ma opener. I only see 4 different openers and there should be 5. In the upper right I reselected the Assassination guide and it appeared in the list.
wet condor
Well you move a LOT tho
wet condor
Is 1.1% dmg worth switching trinket? Or does sim lie
brisk forge
Ofc its a uppgrade so dont see the point why you wouldnt
wet condor
I use atm lustrous plumage 365 ilvl & fathom 355 ilvl. I have azerok 375 + socker and harlon dice trinket 360
In my bag
What do you recommend?
spring chasm
for what situation
spring chasm
dice plumage probably
wet condor
And for raid?
spring chasm
thats what you can sim yourself easily
wet condor
Yeah but u answered for m+ so why not raid
spring chasm
i answered both?
stable oxide
@marsh bloom Don't know why you want tips? you have a 95% for your ilvl, which is nice. The only thing I see is that you didnt use a second pot, which would be nice during the bloodlust in your fight.
wet condor
No you answered for m+
spring chasm
he potted infight @stable oxide he also used his first vanish to early and didnt combine his second one with TB
i clearly answered it, you wont get much more here.
wet condor
So you dont know for raid only m+ ok
Ty
How do you increase % parse
Or what is it basse off
Damage taken?
Based*
brisk forge
You should sim for both M+ and raid
We can only tell you what looks best but you need to Sim to know which 2s are best
You increase parses by playing better and have a fast kill time and dont do so much outside doing dmg. To rank high you cant have orb soaking duty for exampel
wet condor
@brisk forge How do you sim for m+ though? And should I use top gear sim or? Better how exactly? Less dmg taken? More dmg done? Focus on adds more?
brisk forge
6patchwork, 40 sec, no buffs
wet condor
Thx And the rest? @brisk forge
brisk forge
Just do your rotation, maximize the mechanics to your benifits. Use Cds on adds if you can cheese dmg etc. Biggest part is to know the fight to optimize dmg done
wet condor
@brisk forge okey thx, should i always Quick sim or top gear and then stat weight
lost sundial
so is Shrouded Suffocation still worth stacking? or do i look for other traits
young swan
hot flume
No one to give me a hand with my logs above ? 😢
zinc zephyr
at how many targets should i replace envenom finish with crimson tempest spam? (m+)
royal lantern
5-6+
brisk forge
@wet condor i am only using stat sim
visual token
I’m not skilled a log analysis so I can’t exactly help with that.
spring chasm
Top gear for comparing your gear with each other, gear compare for gear you dont have and stat weight for stat weights
undone sandal
Is it worth using Subterfuge (and normal rotation) without any SS traits in single target?
unique depot
I sim a few hundred dps higher with master assassin without any SS than subterfuge
bronze kelp
@spring chasm thx for you help, after deleting cookies, i finally got the correct page ^^
pallid spruce
What u guys think about Doom's Wake trinket on assasin ?
mossy hazel
Which one's that?
mossy hazel
Hero Damage has it rated top right now
vague patrol
mossy hazel
Couldn't say for pvp
pallid spruce
Okey
strong sundial
lets forget sim for a second... what stat weights u r using in m+? i'm using 25/10/40 and it feels good with trash but not with bosses. feels like i would miss haste in boss fights
north crane
crit>mastery>haste>vers
strong sundial
know that but its not the answer to my question
north crane
right now for m+ i hav 1257 crit 842 haste 1070 mastery 72 vers
pallid spruce
I use haste/crit/mastery/versa , good sustain boss fight dps. But not always top of in aoe. With a lot of haste u have sick burst but then u go down in single fight, and stay somewhere 12-13.5k dps. With mastery i prob could do more in mythic, more bleed dps on trash and on boss prob, if need move a lot
mossy flicker
do you guys still play 3ss in mm+ ? even if I have 385/370 other pieces I should equip 340ss ?
vague patrol
probably not 340 over a 385 no
pallid spruce
But the bloodmallet says haste is best for single target but also you need have what 40% ? Haste
pallid spruce
But i am not sure haste is best if u have like 16% haste
vague patrol
sim it
pallid spruce
My sim dps is 15K
north crane
i have 20% haste and it's still the best stat for me
strong sundial
my problem is that i miss haste in boss fights in m+
pallid spruce
But it is lie i do only 13.5k around
Rotatio is 100% correct there is no way do 15k dps. For sure i do 20k dps for 20sec but then go down like bungeejump
I am not sure the simpage is 100% correct not before i see some fact on paper and videos
north crane
i'm simming 11,863 DPS without raidbuff/pot/flask ecc.. on dummy i'm doing 11300 dps more or less
vague patrol
i mean it depends on how you sim but it's not supposed to be 100% reflective of what you have in raid
because each fight isn't going to be a perfect patchwerk/target dummy type situation
it's not lying, you just have to know how to interpret it
pallid spruce
Thats why i sont think haste is best for this meta, cos u need run all the time. Uber hard do perfect patchwerk on like freehold last boss or third. Thats or in mythic raid. My guild mate uses mastery as his main stats and he does more dps cos the dots are running and running when my dota are doing not that much and i am.moving all the time. But for sure when we stand still as statue i do more.
Dots*
So baisicly it is so hard do perfect patchwerk cos of running that i think mastery and haste shouod be equil on single but what i know LOL
crisp hollow
for M+ id run Galecallers (370+socket) and harlan's (370) over having fathoms on right?
candid thorn
Is 355 fathoms that good to be run over other trinkets at 370+?
wheat zealot
For single target yeah, especially raid trinkets they are just garbage
candid thorn
Well, gues I'll stick to fathoms and plumage then
dapper moat
plumage sims quite high for me too
wheat zealot
for sure, but fathoms beat a lot unless its 375-380 and a good trinket
candid thorn
355 plumage sims 20 dps higher than my 345 dice
dapper moat
got one 380 and using it atm, sims higher than dooms and harlands 370s
crisp hollow
yeah fathoms is a slight ST increase to my 370 dice, 370 socketed gallercaller's beats it by a fair margin but raidbots loves that trinket
i'm just iffy using gcb in dungeons because of how much kiting and adjustment is involved at 15+
but i guess it's better than a patchwerk trinket
candid thorn
It also depends on the dungeon and on whether it's tyrannical or fortified
crisp hollow
ehh i don't agree
warm sable
For my ilvl its shit because i took more haste than i need 😄
crisp hollow
well to an extent this xpac because there's actual enrage mechanics to cut bosses short
warm sable
23% crit 22% haste 21% mastery
crisp hollow
but in general prioritizing whatever kills trash faster is more beneficial in M+ regardless of tyrannical v fortified
candid thorn
As someone who mainly puggs, i've come to appreciate whatever kills the weekly affix-boosted thing more
Cutting down on boss kill timers means there's less of a chance dumb people die to them
But then again I don't go over +10 yet
so what do i know
crisp hollow
ahh yeah you start to notice how long trash takes after 12 i feel
sturdy python
Nah it's worth noting that even if aoe saves more time bosses may be more dangerous an fail the key at a higher rate on tyrannical, just depends on group and key I think
crisp hollow
but honestly my role when i push is keys is don't die and listen to tank's calls
i do very little actual thinking myself
my tank is just a god
livid cave
My tank is a prot warrior
crisp hollow
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/zuljin/tyrone
mine competes for top overall damage some keys
topaz junco
He he he, us servers 🤗
livid cave
So guys, is it hard to pick up rogue for pve? Mostly worried bout energy mamagement
unborn barn
Hard? I would argue against that, but of course it has its own subtleties
hybrid thicket
I did mythic raid yesterday and I was 13th in dps :/ perfect rotation also. In m+ top dps
crisp hollow
without legendary shoulders the openers are a lot more simplistic
sturdy python
I doubt you had a perfect rotation
lofty sand
maybe your group was just great?
crisp hollow
and rotations for sub and sin can be broken down into two phases (maintenance vs spending)
outlaw's braindead but it's also really fun
sometimes rng blows tho
sturdy python
Outlaw can be broken down the same way
livid cave
In WOD i played pve rogue for a couple raids and i hated it
Because i couldnt manage energy
sturdy python
I mean you still have to manage it
crisp hollow
well higher stats (HASTE) help that a bit but it's a fundamental part of being a rogue
sub especially feels like shit outside of shadow dance windows
livid cave
Im willing to commit into learning and stuff
But i heard alot of ppl saying DH can do similar but is quite easier, wich is prolly true
livid cave
Ill have a rogue for pvp anyways prolly, my question is the learning curve “worth” for pve?
pearl meteor
It’s not hard
sturdy python
You're asking that in a rogue discord so yes
pearl meteor
At all
Like
Rogue rn is so dumbed down of how it used to be lol
P sure any1 cld figure it out
solid nova
Especially sin, you'll be fine
lament dove
managing energy is just simply waiting for energy sometimes and not mashing buttons all the time
livid cave
Mythic it is
livid cave
So should l spec sub or just swap on xzul
pearl meteor
Swap on zul
inner pecan
the entire meta strategy on M Zul revolves around sub
solar bramble
what's the best wa to get daggers? i've had the same 345's for roughly 3 weeks. i've done more underrots and tol dagors than i care to count, and still no daggers. . . . . it's holding me back rpetty heavily
pearl meteor
And then see who has a high apm :^)
inner pecan
you have to play sub unless you feel like inting your raid team
solar bramble
sub rogue in mythic zul for certain. outlaw for normal, and you can do outlaw on heroic as well depending on how long the adds live
inner pecan
:^)
crisp hollow
even 3 sub rogues was enough to make the push, i wonder if anyone's killed him with none yet
spice frost
I played sub for fetid also to help burst small adds. Rest I’ve been sin for. Really all 3 specs are viable, play what you like. Just be ready to be sub on m zul.
solar bramble
if adds die, sub rogue has literally no dmg output with that setup. so it depends on how long the adds are alive
livid cave
Sorry if im in the wrong channel btw but thx everyone
north crane
you can play sin with 2 finger and no keyboard rly
livid cave
I got 1 finger 😦
sturdy python
And people call outlaw brain dead 
crisp hollow
sub also requires no thought beyond "make sure to get 4 shadowstrikes in each dance"
buoyant coyote
anyone know when wow analyzer is supporting rogues?
pearl meteor
If you think rogue is hard i think you need to rethink your life choices
Wow analyzer is shit kty
🙃
buoyant coyote
i like to see what i can improve no matter the class
pearl meteor
Yes but it is wrong half the time lmao
crisp hollow
what you can do is turn off buffs on raidbots
and see what you sim like with no lust/raid buffs etc
and try to replicate as close to that on a dummy
north crane
ass is not easy in m+
pearl meteor
L o l
pearl meteor
Please explain how its not hard wut
crisp hollow
ass*
pearl meteor
Is*
sturdy python
Easy is subjective but when comparing to other specs on the game nothing is really hard anymore
pearl meteor
Exactly lol
sturdy python
Survival was also dumbed down
pearl meteor
Everything is a joke rn
sturdy python
Was easily the hardest spec in legion but for no benefit lol
pearl meteor
If your struggling you need to rethink your choices n put a few minutes into learning your shit
sturdy python
But hard isn't always a good thing though
crisp hollow
just vomitting dots onto a trashpack isn't complicated gameplay imo
and CT doesnt impact ST rotation for bosses at all cuz its alternative is a proc
sturdy python
Also, some people find different things hard, to include this game. It happens
pearl meteor
M+ is literally just your knowledge of the class, its not hard to execute by any means
sturdy python
Used to know a boomy who just couldn't figure it out, idk why
ancient tangle
Idk about you guys ill be glad to see the back of this weeks m+, done 14's but im feeling a lil behind on a few of these ST bosses
crisp hollow
you shouldn't be
serene basin
NA affixes this week were actually a joke
ancient tangle
See aoe is where i shine, im losing st to a dh which is fair enough
pearl meteor
🙃
ancient tangle
I beat the boomie generally, but maintaining 15k+ is rough on st atm
pearl meteor
What you sim at
ancient tangle
Raid gear etc 16.8
But im having to drop archive chest to Ss and run ss shoulders instead of 385 tok
340 shoulders (ss)
pearl meteor
Fair enough
buoyant coyote
https://wowanalyzer.com/report/dhBYZaFfyjpqGkr3/5-Normal+Taloc+-+Kill+(4:43)/64-Brightlíght Did a test as sin
ancient tangle
Rough but has to be done i fear
pearl meteor
Ye
buoyant coyote
not sure how accurate it is, rahter not use vendetta on ads during elevator phase
sturdy python
It's not accurate usually
ancient tangle
Saving grace i have a 385 dd head
pearl meteor
Most bosses assuming u have scrolls pots etc u shld b able to do 15k but i guess it depends
sturdy python
In legion it was decent on high uptime bosses but probably hasn't been updated since
ancient tangle
If i was tb bomb easy, but ofc going exsang ct
ancient tangle
Tb is creeping for me, though i need to juggle my haste abit for more crit
Like 22 18 35+
pearl meteor
14s bosses shldnt b over 3m at most n u shld sim significantly higher at 3m
🤷♀️
With ss
ancient tangle
Need 30% crit imo
ancient tangle
Yea is a tad annoying the 14 bosses tbh, they generally die before everything comes back up
crisp hollow
ive juggled my stats around constantly and have yet to have exsang>TB for me in my entire time playing a rogue this xpac
pearl meteor
Ye it depends i guess
ancient tangle
Or like 20s before vanish
crisp hollow
which means im fucked when i finally have to use exsang because i have no clue how to use it lmao
pearl meteor
In that case u shld just offset i mean
Another use over holding n dying its just better
Its not hard
🤷♀️
Exsang
crisp hollow
just never taken it
pearl meteor
Press it on cd
crisp hollow
im sure it'd take 5min to learn
wheat zealot
Its ez
pearl meteor
🤷♀️
ancient tangle
Exsang is awesome
wheat zealot
Great for dungeons
ancient tangle
Tbh i prefer the rotation to tb
crisp hollow
is it a purely St ability or does it hit everything bleeding?
pearl meteor
St
ancient tangle
St
wheat zealot
It provides extra regen tho so still helps your aoe in a way
pearl meteor
🤷♀️
crisp hollow
i have 2 385 DD pieces, only H fetid chest for SS
but if i get SS shoulders from chest tomorrow
i will nut
pearl meteor
I wld take 340 ss over 385 dd any day
strange python
Rofl
wheat zealot
Agreed, i would never take dd to m+ regardless of ilvl
pearl meteor
Archive is fine for m+
elder cypress
use gonk runner rolled to 340 and im fine for m+
crisp hollow
its DD helm, archive shoulders and SS chest
pearl meteor
It sims lower on everyones 40s bs cuz it won’t even b half stacked
crisp hollow
for now
pearl meteor
But in m+ u can maintain 18+ throughout entire thing lol
Throw a ss helm on at 340 n u will b fine
pearl meteor
Omegalul
pearl meteor
You do what u want
crisp hollow
im sure at some point the agi just takes over but SS effect probably shines anyway
strange python
yup
crisp hollow
we're not at the point in the xpac where stam is life or death in M+
strange python
SS also falls off on higher keys
crisp hollow
but that will be a consideration going forward
pearl meteor
Go watch flawless n ask him why he has 2 340s and a 355 over any of his others then lmao
pearl meteor
Lol....
crisp hollow
he also did say 2 340's
livid cave
Ass for m+?
crisp hollow
nah titties
wheat zealot
Why not both
pearl meteor
Lol n then u mentioned ilvl for higher keys
strange python
I said SS falls off on higher keys
pearl meteor
Ok n i said go ask
strange python
Rank 1 rogue
calm grail
I do.
livid cave
Lol
strange python
rofl
pearl meteor
Im aware
lofty sand
A lot of people do 🤔
pearl meteor
And hes running ss
strange python
Yeah 1
calm grail
370 Archive and 370/385 SS are what I run.
strange python
^
lofty sand
btw a lot of the really high key pushers can't afford to use 340ilvl because of their HP pool. Even if the traits are good, you need hp to survive mechanics
so it all depends on the key
strange python
No
pearl meteor
As a rogue if ur dying ur a monkey lol
strange python
They just have good 370 pieces
calm grail
One piece isn't make or break for most mechanics Stam wise. Even Tyrannical.
pearl meteor
And flawless is doing +18 with 2 340s and a 355 🤔
lofty sand
Yeah
pearl meteor
🤔🤔🤔
strange python
so?
lofty sand
it depends on the key though, flawless also changes from sub to sin depending on the dungeon
pearl meteor
So clearly ilvl isnt that impt for surv
Ofc lol
If your not switching specs why r u trying to push
What
crisp hollow
our other rogue is rocking 3 385's with SS/SS/archive and it's actually gross how hard his gcb windows go
guy tunnels on vectis and still does more add damage than me lmao
one day rng will smile down on me
calm grail
I play MA TB for raid. Still need GCB.
crisp hollow
probably a week after i get benched but one day
strange python
do what i did - stop giving a fuck about traits and just use whatever sims higher
crisp hollow
yeah i'm MA+TB with 2 385 DD traits so my patchwerk is really good
strange python
current system sucks dick and theres nothing you can do about it
north crane
just drop a 385 piece 😄
strange python
azerite gear is the worst system in wow history period
pearl meteor
You wont b sat if you play better than he does lol (not dmg)
crisp hollow
yeah im not getting sat that was a joke
crisp hollow
my guild prioritizes mechanics way more than damage and i'm still parsing orange/purple
so it's all good
just wish i was that optimized
strange python
remember when most of people in legion cried about legendaries? the same people would take legendaries over azerite gear any day
crisp hollow
grass is greener and whatnot
strange python
At least u can "target" azerite armor
pearl meteor
O.O
wheat zealot
Lol
strange python
You cant read can you 😄
calm grail
Isn't MA/TB still better than SS assuming equal ilvl and optimization?
Don't get me wrong, I prefer SS gameplay.
wheat zealot
For st, yes i would assume
pearl meteor
Optimized in both yea but not in raid
strange python
we'll see what they do with azerite in 8.1
pearl meteor
Nothing
pearl meteor
Yup
wheat zealot
Crucible 2.0 lets gooo
strange python
there are some changes planned, mostly about being able to "target" specific azerite
and thats good
pearl meteor
They said at start of expansion if its a broken system to deal with it
strange python
And punish for reforging even more
calm grail
I don't have a GCB but I have a Dread gladiators medallion 370 works pretty juicy during exsang.
strange python
They've even said that in Q&A
pearl meteor
Small indie company
strange python
add to that the fact about bfa beta being longer than any other beta before, and people gave A LOT of negative feedback about gcd, azerite and pvp rewards
they ignored all of it
literally all
add to that fact that they REMOVED beta forums
mossy flicker
Is SS really necessary for mm+ or ? I have 3 ss (340-340-370) but I suck on ST if I do that
strange python
with all the feedback
mossy flicker
on tyrannical I feel like my damages aren't as high as if I put my higher azerite pieces
calm grail
I run double SS and 1 archive for Mythic Plus and my opener is only marginally behind my Raiding set.
mossy flicker
ofc
strange python
Ofc ur opener is going to be lower
Array buff
scent of blood is probably better than archive for m+
unless your archive is higher ilvl
pearl meteor
Yes
strange python
not necessarily
pearl meteor
Maybe depends
strange python
depends on pulls
calm grail
I was pointing out that his shouldn't be bad.
calm grail
Obviously it's going to be lower
strange python
lol
I will pick SoB over archive any day when I run with my guild group
But would rather get stable agility in a pug since some tanks like to pull packs of 2-3
pearl meteor
2-3 sob is better tho
pearl meteor
2 ruptures u get more agi than archive
calm grail
Unfortunately my only scent of blood is on a shoulder that I have SS, both 370
Archive is Vectis helm
strange python
i feel you
acoustic tinsel
Im running m+ with 1 ss 1 archive and 1 whatever uh... glory something. PRetty decent so far
jaunty arrow
Guys i need halp run someone high key freehold?
pearl meteor
Lol
jaunty arrow
how to do, like let m explain 😄 that fkin dog break my stealth
strange python
Dogs break ur stealth?
pearl meteor
Consider me confused
jaunty arrow
yep that mini q
unborn knot
You got too close to some mobs
pearl meteor
Oh lol
strange python
Why would he break ur stealth
unborn knot
You can sap + distract
strange python
If u want to walk into a mob, sap him
visual token
If you click on the dog does it remove stealth?
visual token
Do you have to clicky dog?
strange python
I dont think so
visual token
I don’t actually know
jaunty arrow
no u need to be near
strange python
Yeah u just follow him around
fluid sail
If I post a Warcraft Log, can someone give some insight on why I am parsing so low?
indigo verge
sure
pearl meteor
😃
jaunty arrow
Sherlock Anarchy inc 😄
strange python
Tradewinds
pearl meteor
Always glad to help!
strange python
ur traits are bad
jaunty arrow
U are like "i need halp with my pc" yeah thats your problem your pc didnt work. thx cpt anarchy 😄
fluid sail
i thought lazer matrix and archive were top tier?
indigo verge
the azerite traits are really hurting you
pearl meteor
LM is shit