Doesnt losing the 3x SS make me that much weaker for PvP and PvE?
#assassination
abstract crescent
alpine lodge
well for pvp if im correct 3x SS isnt bis
abstract crescent
I was told drops scaled with bag iLvL
alpine lodge
its fine if bags scale with ilvl but idk if people would take you with ilvl being that low or your dps being that low at 305 as is
abstract crescent
It's not BiS anymore? :0
abstract crescent
Whaa
alpine lodge
the extra dmg is only from stealth
abstract crescent
Which you can vanish yo reapply
abstract crescent
Thats 32k free damage though
abstract crescent
Any place where I can find the best traits for pvp and pve
alpine lodge
umm best traist for pve would be hero dmg
abstract crescent
Is that the name?
abstract crescent
Uhhh i do not understand that link, new to wow been 1 week
Preraid as in gear or before release?
alpine lodge
preraid as in pre today
abstract crescent
So its outdated?
abstract crescent
Did they release new traits?
alpine lodge
bc your probs not going to be running uldir this week or next maybe depending on tyhe gear you get
i think there is some uldir traits
but you can check those out under the azerite T22(uldir raid) sections
abstract crescent
Which come from uldir gear right
abstract crescent
@alpine lodge so by that site you sent ... SS still the best? I am so confused
alpine lodge
for pve
and idk about al of the traits and stuff and how to get them
from uldir that is
autumn bloom
reorig is a buff from uldir traits
active in uldir
increases your highest secondary stat
small at start
overtime as you run uldir more it becomes more powerful
dont think you'll run uldir traits outside of it tho
maybe lazer matrix cos its big dick
fleet whale
lazer matrix ain't too bad
violet sonnet
or would be getting a mythic 5 galecaller and spyglass be better?
autumn bloom
sim yourself
abstract crescent
Oh so SS is only the best for PvE right
strange python
what assassination stat priority?
nocturne gate
!pins
strange python
thanks i didnt think about it
elder cypress
how does they not fix the ss trait?
strange python
ok gotta ask does that single target stilla pply to wpvp
warm parcel
Feel free to ask in pvp
coral cosmos
It seems like assassination could be pretty competitive against sub/outlaw in Uldir?
jovial kite
ill be tryharding the fuck out of normal and hc 
autumn bloom
i like assa in uldir so far
there are a lot of add phases
and it's nice refreshing garrote+rupture on the boss and then doing the same to all the adds
blissful crown
So did any of u on US raid with sub/outlaw rogues and compared?
I know its early to say
I just cant wait for tonight, theres a sub and a outlaw and me as assa in raid today
coral cosmos
I was able to stick fairly close to our Outlaw rogue on a few of the fights
violet sonnet
I was neck and neck with the outlaw the entire time
only on certain fights i dropped back
blissful crown
and that was because of adds or?
And you say dropped back, is it like 500dps behind?
coral cosmos
I would say that when my Outlaw was further ahead, it was about 500-800dps
blissful crown
Alright 😃
fair rain
I beat both sub rogue and outlaw rogue
coral cosmos
Also was stuck using a blue dagger =/
fair rain
@blissful crown
dense yarrow
That's what I wanna hear Tumna
fair rain
Also blue dagger feelsbadman
void pecan
That's because @fair rain is an OG rogue
from the good days
who knows how to play rogue
coral cosmos
Do y'all think it will scale pretty nicely as the gear comes in throughout Uldir?
fair rain
MONAKS
autumn bloom
i am the only rogue in my guild :[
blissful crown
If you look at tonights logs it looks like sub/outlaw
but yeah to early to say anything
fair rain
Someone who knows who I am @void pecan pogchamp
void pecan
👋
strange python
Watching trash clear heroic doesnt really give a good sample
fair rain
But yeah I beat both of them except on mother I died and needed to afk so I said not to Rez me
blissful crown
@strange python i was just looking logs for bosses
fair rain
I wish I had SS traits but I didn’t feelsbad
strange python
#Easy btw
fair rain
You full clean tisumi
coral cosmos
SS is Shrouded Suffocation yeah?
fair rain
Yeah
blissful crown
Aye
coral cosmos
Nie
fair rain
You watch your tank get face fucked by ghuun yet
coral cosmos
I am trying to find new azerite pieces with that
fair rain
Even on normal
coral cosmos
we cleared up to Vectis so far
fair rain
Normal or heroic?
coral cosmos
Just normal, pretty casual friend group
fair rain
Yeah I gotcha
strange python
fair rain
I left my old guild to be casual but my competitive nature is kicking in
coral cosmos
We usually end up Heroic after the first few weeks and then just try and skate at Heroic level through the expac
fair rain
And I’m becoming toxic
blissful crown
We are starting on heroic and do normal run on friday for those who wanna come.
Im just excited to see how assa feels.
strange python
Nothing wrong in that
blissful crown
Something in me says i have to try one of the other speccs, but then again sin4life
😄
fair rain
Well I’m not that bad when I played with people who aren’t lost
But when I notice people doing dumb shit I get triggered
coral cosmos
Tonight was a bit rough - just felt energy starved. But still, letting that feeling go and just slowing down felt nice, still competitive dmg
I can sure as hell say it was much more enjoyable than outlaw
fair rain
I think my highest one the night was fetid or the garalon thing
strange python
Outlaw is just a bad meme at this point
coral cosmos
And sub tbh...I love the idea of it for pvp
But anything outside of assass just doesn't give me that rogue feel ya know
stark folio
Is it decent to have more than 1 SS azerite trait?
jovial kite
its optimal to have 3
stark folio
excellent. Thank you. Been reading thru stuff here and there but couldn't feel sure about it.
untold snow
which prepots are better for us? agi or bursting bloods?
untold snow
bursting bloods sim better tho
stark folio
I haven't tried sims yet just saw in the guide.
lone junco
I blew my vendetta vanish cd like 4 times tonight.
The gcd is killing my f
Fingers.
lone junco
But I got a good peak at the tail of mother. During vuln phase.
I have trinket bound to vendetta. Seems to be working.
As /use /use.
lilac coral
nice, gotta do that
lilac coral
i'm happy with the RNG of bomb and just quick-dotting everything for now
lilac coral
stayed close to the outlaws on the cleave-happy fights
lone junco
Our warrior is like 350ish. Steals all my cleave.
I'm 335 still. Blue weps
Oh well. Will finish normy tomorrow and reset for a few heroic bosses.
main blaze
Yeah 3-4 of the bosses are pretty easy on heroic
lone junco
We ran 28 people. Expecting the mother fight to get harder. But it was all petty smooth
lilac coral
was in no hurry to move between those rooms lol
abstract crescent
pvp traits ya'll been using?
opaque tree
Has anyone tried Gale force enchant, I'm just curious how it stacks up against the quick/deadly navigation enchants
strange python
Sim it
autumn bloom
i would be very surprised if it was worth it
seeing as haste and crit both affect our resource gain
strange python
@lilac coral what kinda numbers on m0 bosses were you pulling? I am watching people stream etc and it seems like there are alot of dps numbers i wouldnt expect to see.
lilac coral
feels like it was around 8-10k depending on adds/movement
also got one of the dps orbs a little late on that fight
patent tide
......
General Information:
Weapon Enchants: Use your first and second highest weighted stats for weapon enchantments. You have diminished returns if you double up on one, so only do this if that one stat is much better than the rest.
and same for rings
open basin
ik thats pinned but I wasnt sure if it changed at all
minor prawn
and in our case would be haste/crit ya?
open basin
yeah
candid kayak
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
nocturne gate
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pPEDpYaa8UTxrEbpJTHe7X balanced stat weights :D
stone briar
Do you spam crimson tempest at all? Or do you only want to apply it for the dot and only refresh it? And do I want to garrote and rupture my targets first or can I use it after garrote at 4+ CP?
civic palm
no
opaque tree
This Electromental Trinket that has a socket and warforged barely pulls ahead of the dead-eye spyglass.. and it takes forever to build up those damn charges, Would you take the -.04 loss?
winter gale
Guys, are we performing well in Uldir? Any pros and cons?
opaque tree
it's slightly better than the spyglass, but I hate the trinket so much. lol
hidden fulcrum
So the SS bug, if im correct is... If you cast 3 garrotes and then outside of stealth, cast another garotte on a 4th mob. All of the current garrotes drop to normal garrotes?
so you should not do more than the 3 SS garrotes?
opaque tree
not normal
they're still buffed by Subterfuge
however, they lose the SS buff
yeah that's correct
hidden fulcrum
Ahh, boo 😦 Thanks 😃
unkempt rover
Hello guys, Can you confirm that ss stack ? I have 3 pièce with it :) thanks !
opaque tree
it stacks
winter gale
Did anyone played Uldir yet? Are we on a good spot atm?
opaque tree
no one knows
on some fights with short lived adds we suffer a bit i've heard
single target we're good
winter gale
I have raid at 20 tonight, I hope to perform ok. Are 2 other specs better?
opaque tree
they're all pretty close atm, so just play whatever you're most comfortable with
Outlaw is slightly ahead
opaque tree
but if you play Assassin flawlessly, then you'll probably do better as assassination
i'm sure they'll tune specs before Mythic Uldir
pliant wing
outlaw and sub are ahead
tender walrus
Yikes
pliant wing
i think actually the only way to make better than outlaw/sub is mass poison bomb proc
winter gale
But its just 1st week, I think It it will go better very soon
Sub is only option for wich I can go instead of this
pliant wing
yea outlaw's scale is shit, sub will always stay first i think, and right behind assa
pliant wing
i don't like sub 😄
hidden fulcrum
Has there been any buffs/nerfs to rogues this patch at all?
or is that coming next week?
pliant wing
next week for mm i suppose
stark token
If anything next week
pliant wing
goodbye SS 😄
pliant wing
sub is gonna get nerf i think, but dunno for OL
vestal wren
the only reason to nerf sub would be m+
or ppl in #assassination who ask for it every day multiple times bc. sin does not sim highest
blissful crown
Still early to say
ppl forget that in the next couple of weeks ppl will get alot higher ilvl + class tuning.
vestal wren
ppl forget that sin will probably #1 spec for progression
strange python
Ye its not like blade just destroys other traits
blissful crown
Im gonna stay sin for tonights raid just to see how i do against the sub and ol rogue in guild.
tepid frost
how many targets should there be for crimson tempest to be worth using?
blissful crown
😄
pastel bough
are assasination really that far behind sub? Im having a hard time learning sub xD
opaque tree
seems like everyone parsing well has the darkmoon Fathoms trinket. Sigh, i need to buy one
i just don't wanna be replacing it anytime soon
blissful crown
If you look at charts right now Darkmoon is doing well even against HC trinkets from Uldir.
opaque tree
do you think i'ts going to perform well against mythic trinkets?
i mean, very soon we'll be pushing through mythic. I'm just worried about buying it and it being replaced in like 3 weeks 😛
tender walrus
How much is it?
opaque tree
my server 200k
fiery sage
winter gale
Yes, I am sad as fuck atm
autumn bloom
rankings arent even working yet are they?
real night
Are top sin rogues playing exsanguinate?
opaque tree
no
night cypress
just Noobe
strange python
But its better than TB 🤔
pastel bough
Do we expect a sub nerf or sin buff?
dense yarrow
SS got nerfed?
strange python
Sure
limber dew
?
sick atlas
@Reprobate is talking about a 30sec fight I imagine, maybe 1min
limber dew
probably like 1 min because things die way to fast
sick atlas
Sin*
limber dew
even at m5 i was finishing on 19-20
sin with 3 x SS is very strong on this weaker content
sick atlas
Our ST is amazing anyway, and this is where our strenght is. Sure, our MT is not bad, but clearly.. other classes/specs do it better
Look at some outlaw pulls on 8-10 targets, and enjoy our high-end fight at 25k, while he is at 40+
pastel bough
how the hell do you guys get the SS traits, Ive not gotten one since the first i300 gear xD
strange python
Maybe you should have done m0
strange python
Maybe you shouldnt run them with randoms
M0 full leather group and you are pretty much guaranteed to get some
pastel bough
I dont, I run them with a healer monk, enh shammy, dk tank and fury warrior. Probably shitty comp but whatever 😛
thin ingot
tfw your disc priest guildies burst 22k
pastel bough
ah yeah, we are only 2 leather users
thin ingot
and you barely hit 20k
pastel bough
xD
just get 4 disc priests and a tank and the dungeon is solved then
they do way to much dps
thin ingot
yeah
winter gale
Guys
I just got boon trinket last night. Can anyone tell me when and how to use it
I logged of right after I got it in that dungeon.
thin ingot
in my personal experience from tonights raiding
that trinket isnt worth that much
theres so much movement
that you barely can make good use of it
and worse trying to use it on cd
i just switched it for the loaded dice one from freehold
idk for others, but at least for me it sucked balls
winter gale
I have both Boon and Dice
I will raid tonight and we will go Normal 1st. I am dissapointed a bit since assa is far behind other 2 specs
Looking what to do, I have wrong stats totally to play sub tonight and also didnt practice that much sub in bfa
thin ingot
sin isnt in a bad place
i managed to end with 13-14k dps in most of the bosses
in normal though
which is pretty acceptable imo
lament dove
where is it far behind? according to what?
winter gale
I hope I will do good.
@lament dove on cureent logs on Wow Logs both sub and outlaw are dominating charts in comparison to sin
Current*
pastel bough
are outlaw almost as good as sub in ST? outlaw are way easier to learn 😄
winter gale
I dgaf
thin ingot
just play what you enjoy, specially if youre going to raid normal
lament dove
keep in mind a lot of people don't play assa because everywhere you keep hearing that it's worse, so people flock to the other specs
thin ingot
if by any case youre doing mythic and keep getting 1% wipes, yah switch to the fotm spec
winter gale
I was thinking that also, I was listening to them shitting on assa alot. Maybe alot of ppl went other 2 for that
thin ingot
but if thats not the case fuck it play what you enjoy
lament dove
even 1% wipes are not necessarily because of dps
pastel bough
im mainly doing m+. Are assa bad for that?
lament dove
at least in my experience my guild raids never wipe because of lack of dps:)
winter gale
My guild is raiding mythic. Serious but we are not rushing or anything. Grabbed few edges in Legion.
But its not like we are some top notch grp so I guess ill just play assa and change if it will be really needed
thin ingot
even then sin should be better, cause you can help doing mechs and not suffer a huge dps loss
i bet that 99% of the ppl that you see in logs didnt even care to move from the boss hitbox during the entire fight
winter gale
Yes, thats a huge benefit from playing assa comparing to sub
It also forgives mistakes
While with sub its hard to get back in if u fail a bit
Outlaw is not an option for me, I will play my alt rather
strange python
Subs not punishing
How can you even fuck up subs rota so bad that it would actually show?
Press dance and AFK?
Dance and lag 
winter gale
Can I sim my both specs from my phone? Like talents for both with my current gear?
I am at work atm
thin ingot
being honest doing X amount of mistakes on sub is way more painful than doing the same mistakes on sin or OL
dense yarrow
true^
winter gale
Yes, thats what I meant
strange python
What mistakes?
thin ingot
wasting a shadow dance v/s mutilating with 4 combo points during vendetta for example, idk
just an example
strange python
How can you even compare that lol
winter gale
No need to precise mistakes
dense yarrow
xD
winter gale
That was just an example that ppl are doing. When u fail in sub its worse than when u fail in assa. Simple as that.
strange python
Thats like saying using exsang with 2s left on garrote and no rupt vs backstabbing at 6cp
Ye it was a shit example
winter gale
But u understand the point, dont u?
strange python
The point that all classes get punished if u AFK during CD's?
blissful saddle
He just wants to make you feel inferior because mistakes makes people uncomfortable
Next topic
blissful saddle
Get a sammich
winter gale
Hajduk Split!
thin ingot
idk about others, but im happy all 3 rogues specs are doing fine cause at least i got a backup plan just in case
i played dk during early legion and we were complete shit until end of NH
blissful saddle
Yeah I've had no dagger drops to even play sin
thin ingot
that really sucked, having all your specs do shit dmg
blissful saddle
But my outlaw is sick
blissful crown
I just dont get why sub has a higher apm than sin, i mean dont you alot of the time just wait for ur cooldowns to get rdy before u go full ham?
Or did i miss something 😄
lament dove
I dont get why people always claim to fall asleep on assa and not on sub, there's not much difference tbh, ss-ss-evis-ss-ss is sure much more entertaining
calm barn
I can answer that
strange python
Probably shouldnt care what the average lfr Joe thinks
calm barn
they dont have enough sleep
tight nimbus
Many whelps left side
strange python
THATS A 50DKP MINUS
thorn crater
mhm i think something might be wrong with the PB procc chances
i get at least 2-3 at every mob pull
its too much
strange python
Is my attack damage really supposed to be more than my deadly poison damage? Freshly dinged, around 300 ilvl. Outlaw feels a lot more potent, will this change with gear?
lone junco
White dmg is higher in the profile than it was in legion. I think that it to push Item level over secondaries.
strange python
Mmmh, I see. Thanks.
grizzled harness
Logs aren't looking too goods for us :(
lone junco
You mean they are looking perfect.
main blaze
^
lone junco
This is how we got the Mut crit buff.
grizzled harness
Ahaha :D
night cypress
noice, where's that from?
main blaze
Area 52 US
lofty sand
Aren't they? So far I've been doing pretty well every group I'm in
main blaze
Loots been okay for me, heroic PL wasnt as kind but m+ is doing its job
strange python
4 bosses and not a single item
but hea
entire guild had rank 1's
^ not enough data for rankings btw
Wow you so good
grizzled harness
Yeah you're prolly right
strange python
Actually better players than method
i know
god and i cant even get accepted to method
Smh
i know
Maybe Easy will take you
i dont even recognize that name
must not be good enough for me
Top NA guild
Omegalul
not good enough to seep into casul's vocabulary
NA? lol
night cypress
entire continent is casual
strange python
^
fair vault
Hey guys! Want to start playing my lvl 100 rogue I haven't touched in like 3 years, what are the three specs essentially about?
like what are the differences
royal lantern
assassination= dot dmg, small burst windows with toxicblade and vendetta, sustained aoe
sub=burst/combo windows with shadowdance/burst aoe/high priority dmg
outlaw=high burst aoe/can do high st dmg with good rools
all specs are viable right now
fair vault
oh sweet, thanks dude
and which would you recommend for
open world questing
wm off
strange python
Outlaw
fair vault
ty man
strange python
Iron Stomach gives a lot of healing, and if you roll Grand Melee you get a lot of leech. Also has Riposte which is better than Evasion.
glossy galleon
does construct overcharger just have a low proc rate or something?
like it looks like it would be good if it procced often enough to maintain stacks
night cypress
i was thinking that myself, on paper it looks great
glossy galleon
well
maybe
at 350
its only 280 haste
and you'd never have that on your burst
not your starting burst atleast, and i've been bursting a pretty massive chunk of my total dps so far
lone junco
Yeah. Unless you are bad like me. And vanish right after garrote.
main blaze
^
urban storm
Best first vanish is just as opener garrote is gonna drop right
urban storm
Habit
lone junco
My legion fingers still fucking me up
urban storm
Cuz shoulders
lone junco
Nah. The 2p4p exsang. Reset garrote before the vanish rupture.
urban storm
Oh I never played ensang
lone junco
And also. My vanish is too tight. So it's not even going off.
Gcd on vanish is killing me.
I need a bunk sound for every time an action goes off I think.
Like a typewriter click.
brisk forge
or a nice girl moaning!
lone junco
Seriously looked up after rotation and. Exsang ticking without vanish on cd.
But that would be really annoying.
night cypress
yyyo what the hell is wrong with disc priests i couldn't even get that dude to hald
main blaze
welcome to disc pvp
night cypress
it was not a warm welcome
strange python
idk if it would actually help but maybe the mind numbing poison would help to counter it
somber egret
Blue parse normal ftw last night. Feelsokman
sick yoke
is the conquest progress bugged for anyone else? did like 3 quests that were supposed to give some but still 0/500
lone junco
@somber egret extreme meh.
somber egret
So much movement I planned poorly and wasted so much energy last night ugh
mystic charm
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
lament dove
knowing the fight and learning the tricks to it is the biggest dps gain
somber egret
I was doing better with DP over EP this last night for sure.
lament dove
our mythic first kills usually involve some grey logs:D
somber egret
I got some purples last night but those were on bosses they let me tunnel.
Had me go thru first third on mother which sucks
mossy hazel
I'm expecting Zul to be a decent fight for us. Lots of cleave oppertunity it looks like
somber egret
Zul you mean don’t bring melee at all fight? Lol
mossy hazel
That bad?
We only got up to FD last night in our heroic run, pushing next 3 tonight hopefully
somber egret
Yeah it’s pretty shitty running to kill adds every where get there put a dot up and then it’s dead. That fight they let me just tunnel to help phase quicker at 40^
main blaze
Mother is a terrible fight lol
mossy hazel
I think we had 15+ wipes on mother last night. It was rough
I think it's a great fight but god damn it's a pain the balls. Lol
somber egret
Mother is gonna be garbage on Mythic
mossy hazel
Lol, yea, after we had like 5 people in second room adds literally just exploded on spawn
mossy hazel
Damn
somber egret
I don’t know opner for exang otherwise I would have tried
somber egret
You run subterfuge still with exang?
opaque grotto
Yeah everything is the same
somber egret
Ah ok
opaque grotto
You just swap TB for exsang
blissful crown
and how is ur rot then?
shrewd grail
is TB better?
somber egret
EP is technically better but with all the cleave I found MP better🤷♂️
thorn crater
what i mean to say taht on aoe trash packs PB actually proccs really really often
opaque grotto
I’m pretty sure EP gets better with aoe
somber egret
Wet noodle, pointless PB, give me a better 110 talent PB, hot garbage
somber egret
It is but I was running around dotting adds a lot of the fights so ep uptime was poop
mossy hazel
Lmao, top 10 parses for mother are literally all sub rogues and bm hunters
opaque grotto
My raid leader made me go through the walls with the second group on mother
So I didn’t even get to hit the boss
somber egret
Ouch
opaque grotto
I had 60% uptime on boss
Like BRUH I have our highest boss dmg and you’re making an ASSASS rogue go kill adds
blissful crown
We still have to wait after class tuning and better gear, so i guess we need a few more weeks to get the bigger picture
mossy hazel
Yea, I was in like the middle group to go through and I was just sitting in the other room twiddling my thumbs
mossy hazel
Almost asked my rl to put me through at the end but it was my first raid with this guild. Lol
hollow stone
Yea but mother isnt a dps race until the last room..
mossy hazel
Yea but damage is better than not damage in any room
hollow stone
And sin can triple garrote silence the adds if you go first group. Into and aoe stun. Its very strong
mossy hazel
Our first group was 3 monks
hollow stone
Eh, im our top dps and went in group 1 and we still got it
urban storm
Once there are two groups in second room the adds die before they cast
main blaze
triple garrote adds in mother and then they die before the first tick goes off
just wasted vanish
hollow stone
Again, that boss is not a dps race. But i get what you mean
opaque grotto
My group had 3 demon hunters and an arms warrior
hollow stone
Is it a waste if you down the boss?
main blaze
Sure
opaque grotto
I did legit 0 damage to the adds
main blaze
You could have downed the boss faster with optimized dps usage
hollow stone
Probably
mossy hazel
Yea, in 5th/10 group I was lucky to get more than 1 FoK off
hollow stone
Yea. After g2 goes through. The adds die pretty much instantly
mossy hazel
And after 15 attempts, that's all I was doing becasue they did not need me there
urban storm
When typically was the boss brought over? Last group? Or before
hollow stone
Last group
mossy hazel
Always last for us
opaque grotto
Did anyone try doing fetid on heroic with 30 people?
main blaze
Yeah we had 30 people
mossy hazel
We had 23 in ours
opaque grotto
The blobs had SO much hp
main blaze
It was pretty easy
hollow stone
Yea. It hit like a fucking truck lol
opaque grotto
Yeah also our tanks for demolished
main blaze
Fetid took us 3 pulls on heroic
opaque grotto
I feel like the scaling is fucked up on that boss
mossy hazel
Yea even at 23 our tanks were struggling, and we could only get 1 egg down, there was no way in hell we were going to be able to split dps for both
main blaze
You can
hollow stone
I think it'll be fine w a bit more gear. Most of us are 10-15 ilvl below "where you should be" for heroic
Need that stam on the tanks lol
opaque grotto
Kill both blobs in a 30 man?
mossy hazel
I'm only 337 and when I was able to tunnel for a bit (like on fetid) I was usually near the top dps in my group. It was nice
opaque grotto
We have our entire raid swap to it and it takes like 15 seconds to kill it
hollow stone
Also most guilds are saving him til last of the 3 because its such a harsh dps check
main blaze
We split our ranged and our melee to their own blobs
hollow stone
We did too caeriss melee close ranged far
mossy hazel
@main blaze That's what we tried, not a chance
opaque grotto
We tried that
main blaze
We saved all CDs
opaque grotto
But we could only half kill them
main blaze
We used CDs for the first egg and Lust + pots for the second egg
Then we ignored the 3rd egg
hollow stone
Need more sub rogues. Dance op 🙃
opaque grotto
And then just tunnel boss with the 50% dmg buff?
main blaze
One 1 sub rogue, 1 outlaw rogue and 1 Assn
cerulean walrus
Lol the people linking meters on MOTHER when they were the last group to go through smh
I got sent through first with another rogue in my group cause we could CC the mobs
hollow stone
Haha
opaque grotto
Yea man fuck that boss LOL
cerulean walrus
I mean I like the unique nature of it
main blaze
Maybe on mythic those extra adds might make it more fun
cerulean walrus
But the meters are fuckin' skewed m8
strange python
as bad as eonar?
cerulean walrus
Worse tbh
Cause whoever has more boss time wins on meters
So later groups win everytime
Granted, I ended the fight fourth in DPS despite being in the first group
main blaze
Ooh fancy 100 percentile on Zekvoz
strange python
best take prisms with ya to raids then, if you look like a tank you might not get called out for being on the boss all the time 😄
opaque grotto
I got a 355 weapon tho
cerulean walrus
lmfao
cerulean walrus
WTF are we doing wrong on Zekvoz? The mobs that spawn stay up for waaay too long
And then our healers OOM
opaque grotto
Uhh kill them
main blaze
DK grip helps and ursols
opaque grotto
Idk my group has 3 demon hunters so adds don’t exist to us
main blaze
We gripped the second set of adds cause it kept lining up with surging darkness
so it made running out of shit annoying
Yeah gorefiend
It was a really nice fight for Assn
thorn crater
call it sin and be done with it 😛
main blaze
Ive always used Assn
cerulean walrus
Until Blizz drops a BAT
true ingot
Yeah sub ain't surviving the tuning pass.
cerulean walrus
tfw you never swap sub because you know in the end sin will reign supreme
latent agate
anyone feeling strong as sin in raids?
true ingot
I'd probably switch to sub if I could figure out how to do aoe properly. :L
cerulean walrus
I felt real damn good on Taloc
cerulean walrus
Isn't sub AoE just spam Storm until 5, evis, tab, repeat?
lone junco
Dance Storm. Eviscerate. Storm eviscerate.
lone junco
It's been a while tho.
true ingot
That's what I do, Noobe. It just doesn't produce results for me. :L
latent agate
but looking at logs it looks like sub is pretty savage
kindred cedar
Ur being at the top in dps meters as assa or u struggling not to be average/bortom dps?
Having first raid tonight so didnt raid yet
thorn crater
sin is doing more aoe dmg than outlaw for me at over 5
3 bleeds on everything is ay karamba
hollow stone
I was topping as sin in my raid. Including 2 sub rogues as well
cerulean walrus
Yeah sub is gonna get hit really hard come nerf day
hollow stone
So its definitely viable
cerulean walrus
feelsgoodman
kindred cedar
Nerf Day on mythic release?
cerulean walrus
Probs
kindred cedar
Or what u think?
thorn crater
if anyone has done the raid already
which are the best fights for sin and which for outlaw
cerulean walrus
Even if they nerf sub, guilds like Method and shit won't be phased
lone junco
Why would they.
true ingot
I mean I could see rogues being dropped flat out
kindred cedar
Any cloak mechanics we can cheese to make us important in new raids? That shit always saves us
main blaze
I felt pretty strong last night as Assn
Mother was the only one I felt weak on but that fight is dumb so it doesnt matter
hollow stone
Depends on your raid comp sang. If you have 3 frost mages and 3 dks then you dont need to go outlaw on vectis but if you dont have massive cleave then it would be a good fight for outlaw (just as an example). All the rogue specs are really close so whichever one you can execute best is the best one for you
main blaze
lol
lone junco
I pick groups.
main blaze
Everyone in the last group says the same thing
latent agate
yeah my guild let me stay as long as possible on mother
hollow stone
Theres no "super cheese" from what ive seen w cloak. But
latent agate
i did well also
main blaze
"mother wasnt so bad" says the person in the last group
hollow stone
It is still useful for mitigation
main blaze
Mother and Fetid for me
hollow stone
Weapon bosses
main blaze
or Mother and Zul
thorn crater
@hollow stone tbh i have max gear for both i just want to know what would be the most effective way to help guil;d. im a trial here
real night
Why fetid?
opaque grotto
@kindred cedar I was top dps in my raid if that makes you feel better
hollow stone
But i have 2x 325s still sooo
kindred cedar
@opaque grotto cool, how much ilvl and haste u got?
lone junco
In a slot I already had SS.
lone junco
Got 35g and 500ap from world boss.
opaque grotto
Uhh at the beginning of the night I was 343 with like 9% haste @kindred cedar
hollow stone
NICE
main blaze
ouch
kindred cedar
Oh, im 347 ilvl with 19% haste and balecaller
thorn crater
world boss doesnt drop SS piece?
true ingot
you took a 315 ilvl dh?
opaque grotto
Damn, he took the loot elevator
true ingot
That's some balls.
opaque grotto
DH is super good tho so if he knows how to play his class it’s a good investment
lone junco
Fuck personal loot.
opaque grotto
O
lone junco
One Druid got 3 rings.
royal lantern
just a question, why is glaive a special dh only drop now if it is like every other 1h weapon ingame without any differences?
lone junco
Zekvos dropped 8 rings tho.
lone junco
Was a flood of the same fucking thing.
hollow stone
Attack speed means nothing in today's meta. Weapon dps is balanced around it
But really, the answer is class fantasy
royal lantern
..what? sub rogue wants 2 daggers BECAUSE of attack speed
hollow stone
If dh couldnt use glaives, the rage would be extreme
lone junco
@main blaze next time. It's going to be me and 4affliction in the boss room.
royal lantern
sooo...there are some cases where attack speed matters
lone junco
Wind is irrelevant.
main blaze
lol
lone junco
If I didn't fuck up my 6min vanish I would have peaked at like 60k
thorn crater
btw how are u opening as sin?
delicate crater
I'm only simming about 75dps behind running 3x Sharpened Blades VS 3x SS. Is that normal?
main blaze
sharpened blades is a good trait
lone junco
SB is raw st. Could throw at an egg or something.
main blaze
I think SS is more valuable because its waay better for every situation
deft locust
and sb with ns and tb is hella fun. i was getting 60-70k crits in pvp
lone junco
M+ triple g is what keeps me going.
main blaze
SS: ST Good, 2T Good, 3T GOOD, AoE Good
jovial kite
13k+ sim inc
lone junco
Nice. 355weps?
lone junco
God I'm in the dumpster still.
main blaze
Yeah thats what Im at too Bisjack 13.3k
deft locust
i got a 355 off my ten. only sim at 12344, but I spec for dungeon
lone junco
M+ hanging in there at 10k averages. But my st is mid block.
That's what I get for being 336 tho.
main blaze
Yeah its just about luck and amount of time
deft locust
I've beaten a 346 sub and 344 outlaw in m7+ so far
delicate crater
I'm sitting at 13.4 as outlaw with 3x Deadshot, but only 12.5 as Sin with 3x SS. does that sound normal (single target)
deft locust
12-13k overall in dungeons
lone junco
Our lord of war. Arms is a god on trash.
main blaze
Probably somewhat normal Xavory. It just depends on a bunch of factors
deft locust
meanwhile I can barely sustain 11k as triple ds outlaw
lone junco
If I don't get a 340 SS hat soon, I'm gonna go punch a cat or something.
deft locust
D:
lone junco
325/320 blue weps aren't helping tho
true ingot
Still never managed to find an SS azerite piece
lament depot
What would you guys consider "acceptable DPS" like, what numbers should I aim for to not be kicked from raids or mythics once I hit 120; as a sin rogue :^)
delicate crater
13.4 outlaw, 13.3 Sub with 3x SB and 12.5 as Sin with 3x SS
lone junco
Those are sim values. Not actual.
main blaze
Probably around 10k+ Valentine
lament depot
Thanks!
lament depot
Yeah gotcha, just wanna keep my eye on the prize while I am messing with my spec can't compromise numbers too much for class fantasy 😛
fair hill
Can anyone tell me if this is a good opener in pvp: g>r>cs>vend>tb>mut>mut>env>mut>mut>ks..? Ty
main blaze
Thats probably good, with prey on the weak Darkstalker
fair hill
Yes
lament depot
Wouldn't you wanna Env before mut spam if you TB?
fair hill
Yes true also env before mut after tb
main blaze
Maaaybe switching the KS and the Env would make a nice chain stun
also that would be good with SS
lament depot
Vend > TB > Env > Mut > Mut > Env > so on
fair hill
Then vanish - g - cs again?
main blaze
Just having t he guy sit there stunned for 7s with garrote chunking the health
fair hill
He will trinket something
lament depot
True
tawdry pulsar
This question would have been asked a million times, how are we in terms of DPS in ST. I know sub is gonna be king for that, but I love sin gameplay
main blaze
bfa crafting sucks
weak flame
ST is the only thing ass is good for
main blaze
370 pants crafted and cant equip because they arent better than a 360 because of the stats
ST, 2T and 3T cleave is what Assn is good for
main blaze
no lol not 2T and 3T cleave
weak flame
def 3T
main blaze
100% will beat a sub and outlaw rogue at those two
weak flame
not so sure about 2
tawdry pulsar
I've heard Sub is much easier to play nowadays, but it still looks mindboggling to me, especially when it comes to keep shadow dancing/vanishing etc
lone junco
Sap for auto trinket.
weak flame
yea thats the only reason i havent made the swap
lone junco
3t garrote god.
main blaze
Yeah 3T garrote does so much damage
fair hill
Yes I try to sap if not in combat fishing Adaptation or a bad player trinket
lone junco
But 1t and bulk.
lone junco
That zing.
weak flame
the only luck i had was a wep dropping on normal
lone junco
Xing.
weak flame
woulda been sweet if it was heroic =(
true ingot
So any idea why there's no cinematic after G'huun?
weak flame
he is just a worm
supple compass
Doctor worm
lone junco
Ayyyyy. Exsang over Tb now.
lament depot
At low levels, it seems like the only thing that outdoes me is Arcane Mages (And I am sure DH's once I get to them) but, from what I've seen on rankings, that isn't too strange. How do you guys feel sin rogue is comparing to other class/specs?
lone junco
weak flame
the only people consistently destroying bosses in my raid was the sub rogue / warriors
I could almost keep up but warriors execute t00 strong
and sub just pulls ahead from the start
lone junco
Our warrior has like 14 ilvl on me so. No keeping up there.
weak flame
ass feels alot more gear dependent
weak flame
pb?
gleaming geyser
Poison bomb???? Hello????
lone junco
Peanut butter.
weak flame
sorry just woke up._.
but yea if you can pull it off consistently you are much better off being sub until you get more raid gear
granted our rogues pretty good he made me regret not focusing on sub
jovial kite
just simmed
exsang is 40dps over tb for my profile
the burst is insane with lust and galecallers tbh
spice surge
With the new things in #tc-updates ? IE nightly?
Wasnt there a bug where galecaller disabled Shrouded or something?
jovial kite
galecaller doesnt disable ss
lament depot
Experimenting with the specs as I level, I feel like Sin is easily the most consistent. I feel like Sub offers nice instances of burst and I feel like Outlaw is the more reactive spec.
lament depot
Is there any reason people here prefer sin to sub? Or is it just the consistency or playstyle? Looking for personal opinions.
jovial kite
sub excsels in prio target damage
there are several bosses in uldir that sub is flat out great
lament depot
Ah true... That shuriken storm...
hollow rose
I dont really like change
sin is all I know how to play to a decent degree
and I have fun with it 😃
jovial kite
sometimes you have to play specs you dont like
lament depot
I don't dislike outlaw or sub.... But I definitely find Sin strangely more gratifying
I feel like in Sub I can just blow things up on demand with shadowstrike spam rn
Feels less engaging almost?
kindred cedar
I Play sub for m+, assa in raids and usually outlaw for WQ
lament depot
That sounds like a nice blend
kindred cedar
Yeah works good actually lol
lament depot
Well when running around and questing now, Outlaw is unquestionably more expeditious
But the burst and AOE from Sub seems well placed in a M+
Nonetheless I like the playstyle and reliability of Sin so far so, for a raid boss, I would feel right at home
lament depot
We gotta do werk
umbral crescent
I currently play sub in open world, but I don't find it nearly as fun as Sin in dungeons/raids
I like the methodical strategic gameplay of Sin and managing dots
lament depot
Yeah I plan on running Haste > Mastery > Crit > Vers I think because I wanna do my poison thing and, now that I check stat priorities, it looks like Crit is a big part of both Sub and Outlaw so, I may be running Sin more often than I think lol
That's okay though Shrugs I like it.
open compass
Hi all, how much haste should I be aiming for?
vivid umbra
For opening should I use battle pot or bursting blood ?
kindred cedar
Battle pot
umbral crescent
I've been focusing on Haste > Crit > Mastery > Vers just because most of my gear does double duty for Sub/Sin
prime quail
guys what talents your running in m+
opaque grotto
The only talents that ever change is the last row
If my group needs aoe I go CT, otherwise PB
I’m not a fan of CT at all though
strange python
how you using CT in rotation? replace envenom on aoe?
prime quail
you prefer poison bomb?
strange python
no, i was just curious how ppl were using it
tender walrus
how do i transition from sin to sub?
lone junco
Ct in trash is used as a group rupture. It is way expensive tho.
Want to be starved, Toss out 2x Ct.
strange python
Anybody have some insight as to whether I should be running CT or PB on Zul?
lone junco
Good q. Probably outlaw.
strange python
ah, is that a level 30 talent? 😄
Thats what I was afraid to hear. Guild hit the wall last night on zul but I don wanna swap specs.
opaque grotto
I run PB because CT doesn’t work with venomous wounds
And it feels like ass having zero energy in aoe
I’d rather put out ruptures than press CT
daring imp
did raidbots change API recently?
daring imp
apl mb
daring imp
crit took a drop and got overrun by mastery
lone junco
It gives me something to do in 6t while SS is ticking.
lone junco
@daring imp Weights are fickle. Plus/minus a ring worth of stat.
tender walrus
do you guys reccomend ST setup or MT for uldir? what's been performing best?
lone junco
Scent is for '+
opaque grotto
Yurken I’ve used PB on every boss
tender walrus
so single target?
opaque grotto
Yes since that’s the only talent we ever change
elder cypress
can u guys too dont use tot?
somber egret
Zul is easy. Don’t leave zul. Just tunnel him
fresh ginkgo
but you gotta kill the adds
somber egret
Not you.
fresh ginkgo
somber egret
You wanna runall over the platform and waste time putting dots for 2 seconds?
fresh ginkgo
true but i dont wanna get yelled at for not dps the adds
somber egret
Tunnel zul if tank pulls grogs like he should you can fan of knives them
fresh ginkgo
maybe i wont focus the hex
silk sundial
CC one hexer, pull other on boss. Tank crawgs near boss
fresh ginkgo
and wait for the crushers to pulled towards zul
somber egret
Yep. You don’t leave zul
silk sundial
You should be able to cleave most of the adds if done properly
Well, we would cleave onto zul and focus adds
fresh ginkgo
hmm yea we didnt cc the hex
we just killed them when they spawn
i just ended up waiting for them to spawn which sucks
somber egret
Fuck that I’ll cleave crusher. And dps zul get him to phase as fast as possible = less hexers
fresh ginkgo
hmm ok ill do that on heroic tonight
warm parcel
https://i.imgur.com/xzgTBfn.png
@jovial kite
warm parcel
sick exs dmg tho
jovial kite
yup
lament depot
Mastery overtook Crit?
quaint sequoia
rip that the CoA exalted chest got shit traits
elder cypress
can u guys use tricks of the trade??
vestal wren
yes
strange python
umm is that exsang with 3x SS
lone junco
Exs is best with 3x.
strange python
maybe i'll try that on zul
cerulean walrus
Tricks and Feint are what separate a good rogue from a dead rogue
fair hill
I think salbe asked if you CAN use it not if you use it :) I had a problem in a mythic where it kept saying invalid target when i tried to tot the tank
cerulean walrus
LOL Who uses Tricks on the tank? Obviously use it on the healer and blow all the CDs
fair hill
😁
glass cairn
not sure if this is the right place to ask this but does anyone know any addon that keeps track of my bleeds/poisons on multiple targets?
cerulean walrus
There's a WA for that I believe
glass cairn
Mind sharing?
cerulean walrus
I think its in the pins
I actually don't use WA cause I'm a total hipster like that
glass cairn
i'm fine with using whatever addon i can but i didn't manage to find a good one
maybe tidyplates its the best but i couldn't manage to make it show them on the targets
not even on the main one
cerulean walrus
lmao just use Hero Rotation omegalul
Seriously though, I think the WA link is in one of the pins
solid nova
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
glass cairn
cheers
hollow stone
You cant trix a mounted target. Your tank was probably mounting if you cant trix
umbral crescent
it usually specifically says that in the error message - "can't cast that on a mounted target"
So do the same azerite power on different pieces stack?
I was under the impression they didn't
hollow stone
From what ive seen, the dmg aspects stack but any extra effect does not
umbral crescent
ah, I guess that makes sense
hollow stone
For example: ss dmg stacks but you dont get 7cp from 1 garrote if you use 3pc ss
umbral crescent
I have still never seen a single piece with ss on it
does it come from a specific place?
hollow stone
Yea. They arent super common. A lot of them are luck w wq rewards. But im pretty certain there's 1 azerite piece per slot with ss that can be obtained from mythics
Check out bloodmallet. It will help
cinder palm
SS is so incredibly strong right now, do you think it’ll get nerfed more?
Like I’m doing ridiculous dmg
hollow stone
I think its unlikely to get nerfed. But tuning next week so we'll see
river quarry
cinder palm
22k on a +5 boss yesterday