assassination

[thin imp]

Is there an straight forward way to simulate crafting a third piece?

[sonic zinc]

add it in top gear directly

or droptimizer crafted

[thin imp]

oh droptimizer works

ty

[night vessel]

!poison

[prisma monolith]

You should always be using poisons you talent into, which means the following:

Lethals:

• Deadly always + Amplifying if you're talented into it with DTB, Instant only as a final option
  Non-Lethals:
• Atrophic/Numbing, crippling if you're talented into DTB

Wound poison damage in PvE is atrocious and should never be used

[spring stream]

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Assassination uses no other macros aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial

#showtooltip Deathmark
/cast Deathmark
/use Light's Potential
```You **cannot** macro puzzle box or kingsbane to deathmark, as they are both on the GCD

[shell kraken]

Next question on dragons-mythic: Will caustic spatter spread between them? If so always (during p1) or only if I stand between them?

[balmy condor]

it will always spread

[weary shoal]

!ui

[prisma monolith]

Resources:

• ArcUI - Common UI Replacement
  BetterCDM - Enhancements to the Cooldown Manager
• MSUF - Common Unit Frame replacement
• Platynator - Recommended Nameplate Addon (Plater is not recommended)
  (Jundies Profile)
  (Whispyr's Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - Poison Reminder
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator and cursor replacement

[pure blaze]

when a talent says "weapon poisons" does that include both lethal and non lethal, and can your non-lethal poisons crit for dashing scoundral

[balmy condor]

things need to do damage to crit, so no

[humble rose]

When we get the 298 upgrade next week, we send it on MH dagger right?

[indigo mulch]

I did normal dragons with Sudden demise. Worked out a lot better than i thought it would 😄

Goto get that pad in

[balmy condor]

yes

[deft vault]

Do we know anything about how thatn upgrade thing will work ?

[normal mist]

max upgraded hero/myth weapons/trinkets (and crafted weapons too) will be upgradable to 298 or something (no idea if that number applies to hero pieces, probably not)

[balmy condor]

+9 ilvl to hero/myth maxed weapon/trinket

+10 ilvl to crafted

and you get one every sometimes

it says it just drops from raid/m+ like the dawnflux

but there's no way

[deft vault]

so its just an item we drop and use it on an item and gg it gets upgraded?

[balmy condor]

yep

[hybrid snow]

Newb question, currently setting up my UI for the first time (been using mostly default until now). How do I import UI settings? or should I just reset everything to default

Because after installing some Addons I have, for example, a floating combo point bar (default blizz ui)

[subtle tundra]

wtf evolve is on 10% p3 so close to a kill!!!

[visual sun]

Is it a drop item for the item upgrade or will we need to send myth crest again like in tww

[shy axle]

so if i have an hero track dagger i can upgrade it to myth and that myth again to that +9 ilvl?

[balmy condor]

no

[shy axle]

i read it but i do not get it totally

[balmy condor]

you can go from hero 6/6 to hero 8/6

[shy axle]

okay, but i could bonusroll a mythdagger from a 10 and +9 ilvl that one (?)

[balmy condor]

yep

[shy axle]

okay

thanks whisp

[balmy condor]

you would bonus roll a dungeon, get a random drop

if it's a trinket/weapon

you upgrade to 6/6 myth

then you voidcore to 8/6

and if you bonus roll raid then you are probably kind of deranged or it's july

[shy axle]

why is bonusrolling raid worse?

[balmy condor]

Costs twice and much and the pool of items will generally be kinda shit

Like if you’re rolling for a singular item, there’s just nothing but ass on raid drop tables except that one item

[shy axle]

ok makes sense, thank you

[balmy condor]

If you roll on a dungeon, you’re going to get something usable most of the time

And you get to try twice as often

So it’s just win win

[deft vault]

how many bonus roll we get a week?

[balmy condor]

2

we think

Who knows!

[shy axle]

is it planned to add something to the guide about bonusrolls?

[balmy condor]

Ofc

Wowhead would probably fire my ass if I didn’t assign that

[spare kayak]

We dont want anything to happen to your ass

At least nothing that you don't want ofc

[balmy condor]

Would you cold my ass or fire my ass

Given the opportunity to do either

[spare kayak]

Cold sounds good on a hot day

But im not sure what it means, hopefully something positive

[balmy condor]

Yeah but imagine if you fired my ass you could get my cheeks to a perfect medium rare

That might be tempting depending on the demographic you’re feeding

Angry youtube commenters perhaps

Or just horny gay men

Idk, there’s potential there

[spare kayak]

I'm more of a well done kind of a guy

[balmy condor]

Yes waiter I’ll take your finest hockey puck

[spare kayak]

It is what it is

[spice surge]

Slow cooked shit is where its at

[balmy condor]

Me when I get you

[spice surge]

[spare kayak]

I had couple of pretty bad food poisoning cases and legit cannot eat anything that's juicy. I like it lean and dry

[subtle tundra]

fuck your ass

ofc

[balmy condor]

I’m afraid that wasn’t an option

[subtle tundra]

hahaha blud thinks i aint got a pass

😼

[twilit flower]

hey lads, im hitting the 18's now, swapping from sub to assa. how much crit do we want? i see top players run around 38-40%

[spare kayak]

Sim yourself, but around that much crit

[twilit flower]

okay, fair nough

will do

[spare kayak]

Dungeonslice

[twilit flower]

latest or nightly?

[spare kayak]

I'm doing latest

[runic hinge]

latest always

unless you're scared

[brave gyro]

4th crafts pretty mild at this point (not that i have myth crests to spare)

[spare kayak]

I sent a ring this week and prolly upping items next one

Was more than 1k dps upgrade on my end

[brave gyro]

makes sense

i'll just upgrade tier and weaps and whatnot

already have 289x2 trinkets, so IF I get myth gaze in vault, its free upgrade

[spare kayak]

I've been simming a lot cause I got second myth weapon from vora and i cant get to have it as an upgrade. It always picks the created offhand with hunt embellishment

[brave gyro]

don't you just MH Vora / OH crafted?

what are you trying to get?

[runic hinge]

i think hunt is just our best embellish by a bit

[brave gyro]

believe so

[spare kayak]

Ye but having higher weapon in the bags and not using it makes me twitch a bit

[brave gyro]

oh, you havent upgraded vora dagger yet?

[spare kayak]

I did 289 and oh 285 crafted

Just have second vora dagger in bags

[wary reef]

For mythic dragons, is there some special technique to ensure that you can funnel boss and caustic will hit the other dragon and orbs? Mine seems to hardly hit anything

[cunning needle]

@balmy condor i saved a rogue from crafting the fishhook today. are you proud of me?

[spare kayak]

Should be hitting cause they made some changes to it last expack and I believe it hits enemies around you and around your target

[normal mist]

FUNNILY ENOUGH i saved a rogue yesterday from spending further crests into his fishhook that he already had 259

[cunning needle]

[spare kayak]

Ouch those 2 sparks gone

[cunning needle]

blessed mods saving rogues from their failings

[abstract thunder]

Is ther an addon that help to track spreading dots all targets ?

Or that can track how many adds in 10 yards ?

[wary reef]

Ah thank you, I will try this next time

[high dust]

In my servers some assholes were trying to sell that dagger saying it was "rogue's bis". so everytime they said it on trade chat, I was there to let them know they're scammers.

[jaunty sky]

It would be if it it didnt take an embellishment slot tbh

[cunning needle]

based

[high dust]

but it does take an embellishment slot, so it sucks

[royal lantern]

+2 keys are brutal

holy fuck

[spare kayak]

Can't say this more enough. I almost depleted +2 nexus the other day on my alt, cause somebody was mass interrupting lothraxion's fake copies

Insta wipe

Guys were pretty chill tho

[royal lantern]

i DID deplete my AA +2 2x in a row

cus the healers both literally could not heal the 3rd and 4th boss

like, everyone just dying from the minor passive dot dmg

[runic hinge]

what are you playing in a 2

also why did discord make it when i click "reply" it doesnt auto let me start typing

why did they change that

[royal lantern]

season is dogshit and after 2 weeks allready nothing to do anymore but i wanna play wow

so i actually made a alt for once

and wanted to push my key up quickly

the +2 redditors decided that "quickly" is not allowed

[runic hinge]

wow is fun but the season is weird

my sleep schedule is so wack the only keys are OCE so i just looking forever and then dont get taken bc dps things

[rocky sundial]

hello guys why does crimson tempest sometimes give 2 combo points and sometimes gives full combo points is it because of seal fate or is there something i am missing

[normal mist]

same logic as Fok

[spice surge]

It is because of seal fate yes

[runic hinge]

its because of seal fate

[spare kayak]

If nobody answered it's 🦭 fate

[rocky sundial]

ty guys

https://tenor.com/view/monke-gif-4007877678756330230

[glad vessel]

tYO BOIS teeny tiny question u want an envenom active before every KB yea?

mainly for the implac proc?

[astral pine]

(I think) I remember reading that you shouldn’t prioritise building 5cp before kb if it’s going to stop you using it as close to on cooldown as possible

But what do I know I’m the guy that thought our 2 set was giving us poison proc chance on every garrote tick

[coral pivot]

Yea, it isn't worth to wait to have envenom on, if KB is coming off CD

But if you have envenom up and ready for KB coming off CD, then nice

[brave gyro]

https://giphy.com/gifs/captain-america-chris-evans-gif-eeGp0S98LR1io

Prot Pally

he did his best

[spare kayak]

I think it's mainly for the increased poison application chance, so you start stacking KB as you press it

[spare kayak]

He was the only one alive after that fiasco

With 5 debuffs

[glad vessel]

thanks for th help bois

appreciate it

[gritty laurel]

That used to be the rationale and still kinda is but the apex stacks it up fast already and guarantees your next global is envenom anyway

[spare kayak]

Seems okay. Hopefully I'm not entirely wrong by building like around 4-5 cp into vanish garrote to refresh pandemic then envenom into cds

[trim cairn]

Healers in shambles reading this

[crisp pine]

Just got randomly invited by someone
accepted and got greeted by a raid goup of 15 rogues

alright hang on
We got a mission here boys

[subtle tundra]

half the rogue population in one group

[spare kayak]

stornwind

[amber shadow]

help with stats for assassination

is it good

[spare kayak]

im guessing more crit a tad less mastery and haste, but simming it would be the best option

also vers

dont think you need 9 vers

[normal mist]

www.raidbots.com --> top gear

[amber shadow]

thanks that helps a lot

[normal mist]

If you think it doesn't, in case you're being sarcastic, it just shows you've no idea what you're doing.

[runic hinge]

https://tenor.com/view/nice-stats-rcl-tps-clanner-clan-gif-4905258224773680505

[coarse summit]

Im trying to sim wound poison. Have tried editing line 2 of the apl and ive tried footer in expert mode as well. nothing seems to have any effect. Do any of you know how to do this?

[normal mist]

I don't but I also don't see the value of wasting your time getting useless information

[spare kayak]

wound poison?

https://klipy.com/gifs/why-huh-1

[coarse summit]

its not useless, people are using wound poison on sub/law for berserkers in caverns, then swapping back before first boss

wanted to see how much of a loss it would be for assa

[primal parrot]

wound poison?
why would anyone do such a terrible thing!

[coarse summit]

rank 1 key

[primal parrot]

https://tenor.com/view/superman-joke-gif-7319521

[amber shadow]

I have premium raidbots, of course I use it. Have been simulating a lot. I just wanted to ask which stats are better or around the average so I can sort out my items and simulate xD

[normal mist]

You have premium so you don't even need to sort out items, you just pick them all

[amber shadow]

Good idea

lmao

will do that right now

[latent kernel]

@amber shadow

!stats

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Stats
You will always get more accurate results using Raidbots Top Gear, as stat values will flucuate depending on gear and situation.

Agility (Item level) > Crit > Haste > Mastery >>>> Vers
The ratio between secondaries ends up being roughly 40/33/26/1

[latent kernel]

But still probably better to just sim all gear in inventory if you have premium

Or run droptimizer to see if there’s any farmable dungeons for big upgrades

[coarse summit]

my bad, put you in the 0 thought yap box too quickly

[oblique flume]

Hey, just quick question
do we want implacable before kingsbane or we want envenom stacks ?

[latent kernel]

Just want to make sure you have envenom buff up while you kingsbane, implacable buff does nothing dmg wise it’s just stacking energy regen

[silent lily]

So anybody has an answer on how to do this in raidbots ?

Im also very curious

And i have enough time on my hands so idc about getting useless info

[shy creek]

@vestal wren Do you know how to sim wound poison in the APL? I'm also curious how to do it

[digital elk]

https://github.com/simulationcraft/simc/wiki/Rogues

[rugged basalt]

try actions.precombat += instead of =

[marble hemlock]

Unless they changed it from TWW, Wound Poison does exactly half the instant damage of Instant/Deadly Poison, so you're missing out on half the instant damage of your Poison, and all the DoT.

But you're not gonna get an adequate theoretical answer as to whether that's worth doing to provide the MS (if no one else in the party can), because you'd have to weigh it against the amount of healing you negate with it, and that differs from keylevel to keylevel, or even group to group

Keep in mind that less DoT on all targets in AoE, also means less prio if you're playing DS

[lunar hazel]

Fellas just because we use poison doesnt mean we have to be toxic! 🤣

[rugged basalt]

i was able to sim wound just fine

[marble hemlock]

Using or not using Wound is kind of a practical thing to figure out. You just do it and see if it feels better, because mathing it out is nigh impossible.
The only thing you can math out somewhat is how it affects your own DPS.

But whether that's actually a gain for the group? That's much harder to math.

[coarse summit]

can you link?

[candid token]

Quick question, Paladin boss.. Patchwerk 2 targets 5 minutes? Something else?

[lunar hazel]

Fine. No one appreciated my dad joke...

[rugged basalt]

hold on

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2YzcTFso9CF7yMFrYrfYsa

Did it not work here?

[vestal wren]

don't think wound poison is supported, the apl wiki is sadly not up to date with options around poisons

[rugged basalt]

I guess it didn't

[shy creek]

No worries, thank you fuu

[marble hemlock]

instant poison is, iirc, and wound does exactly half of IPs damage

[coarse summit]

yeah, will have to make a guess. I wanted the number to get an idea of how much damage losing. calculating it with 100% uptime would be relatively easy, but calculating the actual uptime / stacks sounds unrealistic.

[vestal wren]

oh ye, thats true

[marble hemlock]

wait, they no longer do it seems

used to be the case

[coarse summit]

this?

[marble hemlock]

wound is 4.07% AP, and IP is 7.40% AP

[spice surge]

Nah it definitely works, im just not sure how the syntax for it works with dragon tempered blades

[vestal wren]

yes, but this syntax is not working anymore. I am unsure if there is a new syntax

[spice surge]

actions.precombat=apply_poison,nonlethal=none,lethal=wound

Works fine for sub

[vestal wren]

ahh, thats the new syntax, nice

[marble hemlock]

its just one of those things where theres too many variables, especially if its not a one-time heal on enemies, btu a ticking one. then you suddenly gotta consider TTK (time to kill) as part of how much healing you negate, etc.

the best way, really, would be to run a key or two, check the healing the enemy did in logs, and then how much damage you did on that pull with poisons.

then you can napkin math it a bit, i.e. if your poisons did 500k damage on a pull where enemies did 2.5mil healing, then wound is probably worth. that sorta thing.

[coarse summit]

i tried using that here, but it didnt seem to have any effect

responding to what Eleem said

[spice surge]

That is not the same as whats in your post no

[primal parrot]

afaik the reason why you'd see wound poison in maisara is because the berserkers have an undispellable regen
get into high enough key levels and that shit will be a dps increase on those mfs

unless u got some1 else with a consistent mortal strike

[coarse summit]

oh mb, yours says lethal / non lethal

[royal lantern]

the thing is, many classes have that

[spice surge]

Not that many do in pve

[drifting cloud]

does assa not have talent anymore that stop working without deadly on target

[marble hemlock]

caustic doesnt need it anymore

so its fine

[drifting cloud]

Ig those zerkers heal so much prob still worth

[coarse summit]

yeah no halls situation anymore

[marble hemlock]

old caustic required DP, so you could never swap

[spice surge]

dp or amp*

Tooltip just didnt mention it

[drifting cloud]

Zac had some data on it iirc you can prob ask him but it was obv always worth on otl

[marble hemlock]

[coarse summit]

is there a loss on dashing scoundrel with deadly vs instant?

[spice surge]

Very slightly ye as you wont have the ticks

[marble hemlock]

ye, outlaw/sub comparisons dont really help much for assa, since so much more of our kit is built around not using bozo poisons

[coarse summit]

does this work with multiple values?

like 2 lethal

[spice surge]

#assassination message

[coarse summit]

im blind

[pastel mesa]

yo guys trying to get into rogue a bit what spec is the best atm seen highest m+ rn is doing outlaw tierlist says ass and % of players says sub?

[frosty cedar]

assa is op

[pastel mesa]

oke i see thanks

why is top player playing outlaw tho

[frosty cedar]

he cant switch back until he becomes a law abiding citizen

[royal lantern]

thats a BOLD claim

[coarse summit]

hes him

[pastel mesa]

@coarse summit hahaha it really is like that

[royal lantern]

sub is good in lower stuff cus stuff dies just so quickly, and sub has frontloaded burst

and sub was also kinda decent at expansion launch and wow players are notorious for being very slow at noticing change if people dont tell them about it

[pastel mesa]

okay

[royal lantern]

in higher keys assa tends to get a bit better because things actually stay alive long enough for it to do dmg while at the same time sub can strat to fall behind when stuff stays alive for a longer time

but also

bruh

unless you do title range shit play what you want really

[pastel mesa]

okay im most in about sub and assa rly dont like combat that much wich should i start with

[frosty cedar]

assa cause its op, sub is for noobs

[obtuse ruin]

Wait for next reset and see how both are going to be faring. Sub is getting some buffs last I heard

[royal lantern]

like, im gonna be direct there

if you care about the meta, you aint playing rogue unless it is meta

(and same is real for all classes)

[pastel mesa]

dont care rly

going for it as fun its my alt

im brew main : P

[whole wind]

Do we use all 4 posions in M+ ?

[humble condor]

you might skip crippling because it slows down mob gathering

[runic hinge]

Need math man to tell me if that’s true

[pastel mesa]

what is the best lvl spec combat or sub

always thought it was combat but icy weins says sub

[odd bloom]

all of them are good for leveling

pick the one u find more fun

[pastel mesa]

dont know that till i played em all any tips

im thinking sub

cause dont find outlaw funny i believe

its sub or assa

[odd bloom]

pick one and go with it instead of taking internet advise if you have not tried them out yourself first

[static glacier]

Sub is the better levelling spec ye

[eager flint]

What is the better M+ melee atm between Sin and Feral? Enjoying both a lot

[runic hinge]

Probably Assa but I have been having a lot of fun playing feral and they can have a lot of build diversity

[static glacier]

Sin does more dps but brings worse utility / group buff

[pastel mesa]

u usally have resto druid either way

[lunar hazel]

Now that im getting into assa I prefer it. I like the ramping dps

Its more fun than spamming ss and bp

I just gotta gain the muscle memory

[latent kernel]

Just wait until your KB DM target dies in 5 seconds because mob health is undertuned and some other funnel class is also focusing the same mob

Feels bad

[rich remnant]

playing with MM hunter is so rough#

[sick oyster]

All the crown mythic killers - is there any reason that favours assa over sub on the fight? Seems like assa can handle the mechanical clutter a bit better and brings nice boss dmg ? Or am I missing anything important?

[bright turret]

sin just has the edge on 1-3 target fights...until next week

[lusty kraken]

what would be the best spec for cleave next week? outlaw?

[bright turret]

outlaw is going to be propelled to one of the top melee specs straight up

[lusty kraken]

no shot

[bright turret]

except on big downtime fights like crown

also im saying that in the context of melee in general is trash this tier so

not saying its suddenly going to beat good range

[lusty kraken]

fair enough

[bright turret]

will get to hang out in the middle with the other "good" melee specs probably

[radiant aspen]

so our offset is pants right and they fkin wont drop for me is it okay if craft it ?

[spice surge]

Yep its absolutely fine to craft it

Or you can splurge on a BoE

[rich remnant]

how come? sorry im not really aware of outlaw changes next week, i thought rogue just had some deathstalker changes

i may be cooked tho

[spice surge]

Theres a new talent in the trickster tree

It is very very strong

[rich remnant]

the smoke bomb one?

[spice surge]

Yes

[rich remnant]

damn

[severe meadow]

Outlaw tier?

[rich remnant]

yeah may have to swap to it perma

for raid at least

[bright turret]

need a recraft that changes daggers to 1-handers

[mystic hornet]

Sin will probably get better in raid as people get more gear and adds die instantly no?

fb law is a lot harder than sin or sub tho imo. Apparently trickster makes it a little easier but we’ll see!

[warm vortex]

Oh damn
wait how good do you think outlaw would be then?
Started gearing a rogue for assa for m+ but might go harder if outlaw is getting good

[spice surge]

Outlaw pins say +10%

But im not really an outlaw guy so probably better of heading into #outlaw

[digital void]

How can i track implacable stacks in arcui? it never shows stacks, only duration of either versions of buff

[humble verge]

i mean casual said 15% on his stream lol

[frosty cedar]

!implac

[prisma monolith]

Implacable is bugged in Blizzard's Cooldown Manager, there is no way to "fix" it.

Until blizzard fixes it, you just have to either count your envenoms or glance at your buff bar if you're trying to be optimal. Ignoring it when it bugs is <1% loss.

[lunar hazel]

Lol yeah thats happened to me 🤣

[royal lantern]

you dont tell people to go into #outlaw wtf

[digital void]

So i should just dont ignore it and just drop it automatically?

[spice surge]

[vivid elm]

oh ty, i didn't even know

[heavy sentinel]

so cloud cover is going to be strong then

[severe meadow]

Ye

[onyx veldt]

NODDERS

we hate outlaw here

[wicked scaffold]

need to test outlaw atleast

[elder agate]

bro, wht is this pic

lol

[vital flicker]

doesn't "actions.precombat=apply_poison,lethal=wound" work in sims?

[rugged basalt]

i got averzian down

[vestal wren]

it seems to work

just don't know how you add a 2nd lethal option to it

[vital flicker]

ah yeah that makes sense

[vestal wren]

so you can sim it for subtlety/outlaw using what you mentioned

tho what you can do is compare instant vs. wund, it seems like the diffrence is 1.7%

(unless i made a mistake in the sim)

ofc thats relative diffrcence and is lower once you add more gear or deadly poison too

[solar flicker]

idt this is true if you compare egg dmg on logs

but with the cloud cover shit it will be prob

[vestal wren]

subtlety in 12.0.5 loves to do egg damage

[solar flicker]

that mf will get scrambled

[trim cairn]

Rn as Assa I am doing like 210-230k on egg phase depending on procs

with 270 ilvl

[vestal wren]

we just need more people to start using puzzle box

[trim cairn]

Isn't the 2ndary stat pot better than Lights Potential for this too?

[vestal wren]

probably ye

can combine both

tho it also means you need to use puzzle box

[trim cairn]

Yea if not you get crit 😛

[vestal wren]

crit is rly good too

so its not bad

[trim cairn]

With 60%+ crit the spec feels super smooth and fluid

@vestal wren how representative is dungeon slice to actual m+ results?

[vital flicker]

I found that doing "actions.precombat=apply_poison,lethal=deadly
actions.precombat=apply_poison,lethal=wound"

works

doing the other order does not though

idk why

[spice surge]

Not really no

[trim cairn]

Maybe not for ST I guess, but for M+ it has to be?

[mystic hornet]

Hardcore outlaw players refer to it as “fart cloud”.

[spice surge]

Not really no

[potent raven]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1372158613312897036/1376317636249518170/speechmeme.com_25_05_2025_23_54_45.gif?ex=69e5f7ef&is=69e4a66f&hm=dd557872f7918e29c4230445fcd4a9e07d510c363bfad6e6874e09d089863702&

[vital flicker]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gbitjgfhtT9FLoEeuUq8YR ~5% loss in dslice for using deadly+wound while still talented into amp poison

[potent raven]

open the server to post this gif cya in 1 year

[normal mist]

Guys i need some advice:

• i'll be raiding spire with my guild for the first time and i've already been told most bosses where cleave exists, mobs are blowing up (first 3 p.e), should i spec into full ST or go cleave anyway?

[severe meadow]

Heroic, yeah?

[normal mist]

(heroic)

yeah

[severe meadow]

Can prob just do ST, unless you run into any issues

These fights are big pad slop

If you're worried about a lil cleave you can always take spatter at the least

[normal mist]

hmmm ic

btw big 1 week dad gaming update

[vital flicker]

big pad slop? did somebody say sudden demise??

[severe meadow]

Unethical SD on Dragons

[severe meadow]

R4 on dragons

[onyx veldt]

do you guys only play 1 char?

[neon viper]

what's the best why to track the implacable buff i'm using cdm and it keep going away after i let the envenom buff drop down

[severe meadow]

Via Blizzards CDM, you can't really

But someone posted an addon they cooked up

so far it's worked fine for me

[trim cairn]

SD is the only ethical choice

[severe meadow]

For tracking both at the same time

[vital flicker]

crazy for not running internal bleeding, but maybe the math works out, and having to take amp poison even though I assume they aren't using it

[neon viper]

what's the addon ?

[severe meadow]

Sorry, I have to gatekeep it (One second)

[trim cairn]

Why does it sim lower then?

[severe meadow]

I didn't tinker with it much at all yet, couldn't find a way to resize the buff icons

[radiant aspen]

erm is this safe

?

[neon viper]

thx i'll give it a try

[severe meadow]

I mean, it's on CurseForge

if your PC explodes, find that guy

[vital flicker]

it's safe except for the part where it mails all your gold to Jay, but that won't hurt you

[severe meadow]

https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/nooka-implacable

I could've just send it like this

[trim cairn]

I meant the other way around, why does Lights Potential sim lower than Recklessness?

[vital flicker]

I would think that would all depend on your stats and trinkets, I believe it won't sim higher for majority of sin players. it definitely doesn't for me

[trim cairn]

I mean not by a huge margin but thats on dungeonslice sim and that isn't remotely accurate to m+ results

In m+ I'd expect the difference to be massive

[coarse summit]

ty

maybe you go wound + amp

[spice surge]

Idk this is with the standard m+ build

[vital flicker]

I highly doubt that amp would be better

[severe meadow]

You need deadly

[trim cairn]

But a 30% agi increase should only be a 30% dps increase no? or am I trolling

[spice surge]

Slightly less but yes

[warm vortex]

Gigachad gamer

[severe meadow]

you

is leak the TC?

or is he just a demon

[vital flicker]

if you were dying to only run wound and not just swap to it when you need it, you would just take the talent point out of amp poison and run something else

[obsidian coral]

May I ask why SD is recommended until +12 and afterwards not anymore (besides that its fake dmg and it gets more important on higher keys) - but does it lose value aswell bc monsters have more hp?

[warm vortex]

Both Afaik

[trim cairn]

Does puzzle box get used before the secondary pot in the params here?

Because I don't see how for me a 47% increase in mastery isnt just better than a 30% overall dps increase on big pulls

Or for instance 70% mastery as sub

[vital flicker]

SD is just damage recovery and not extra damage, the regular M+ build just does more dps, but only when mobs live long enough, so as soon as targets live you want to go with the regular build

[spice surge]

A. Mastery doesnt affect everything
B. Its not 47% mastery because of diminishing returns

[severe meadow]

Secondary scaling, prob

[frosty cedar]

prolly cause agi then gets modified by mastery you already have + puzzlebox

[severe meadow]

You can get giga of a stat, but it starts losing value

[trim cairn]

It is 47% mastery with DR

For me

[obsidian coral]

I see its about duration and TTK , thanks

[trim cairn]

and on big aoe I am only spamming envenom and CT

[spice surge]

Ok but 47% additional mastery does not translate to exactly 47% more damage

[vital flicker]

if you are dying to run SD above 12s I am sure you will be fin but it will be limiting at a certain point

[obsidian coral]

In case you have alot of frontload damage and ur running something like a +14 , u got ret pala and enhance or warri , to keep up you just go SD right?

[spice surge]

Say you already have 50% mastery right, then your spells are doing 1.5x the damage.
Then you get 50% more from a pot to 100% total, now your spells are doing 2x the damage.
2/1.5 = 1.33. You are doing ~33% more damage, not 50%

[trim cairn]

I have 34% mastery tho

I hit 103% mastery with puzzlebox and secondary pot

[vital flicker]

in theory you could if you are trying to compete with the massive pad but at the same time it might be worth it to use the regular build for more prio damage since the paladin and you both do funnel damage

[trim cairn]

For me I can never peak above 1m dps on aoe pulls with lights potential

[obsidian coral]

Gotcha, thx mate

[severe meadow]

get an aug

gg

[vital flicker]

tbf in pugs overall is king

[trim cairn]

Or use secondary pot

and SD

xD

[severe meadow]

What are your overalls with SD typically

[trim cairn]

150-200k

With suboptimal pulls

[obsidian coral]

sorry whats tbf

[severe meadow]

to be fair

[royal lantern]

tbf my nuts

[trim cairn]

and wipes

[obsidian coral]

ahhh omg i thought about talents

[trim cairn]

:p

[royal lantern]

[obsidian coral]

xDD

[severe meadow]

in 12+?

[trim cairn]

ye

15s

[royal lantern]

if tank does some big pulls and its stuff like AA, yeha sure why not

[severe meadow]

I mean thats just

giga padding

xd

[obsidian coral]

Everyone padding i want to pad to! 🙁

too*

[trim cairn]

Tbf with the way I play it it isnt

SD just makes it worth to reapply dots when it normally wouldnt

A single rupture is 400k damage

[obsidian coral]

Can tracking of Implaceable talent fix my ST? I feel like im a bit low sometimes

[analog field]

yeah but you need a mob to be at 600k hp which is very low and it doesn't matter

[obsidian coral]

or is it not that important

[trim cairn]

Would you rather envenom for 100k or rupture and SD procs for 250k instantly?

When mobs are low

[severe meadow]

Well yeah, that's the pad part

[analog field]

when mobs are low it doesn't matter just go next pack

[severe meadow]

on a mob that doesn't really matter

[trim cairn]

Did you ever see the tanks in my keys?

[analog field]

why are we on this pack and not having pulled already

[severe meadow]

you're just coping on big number

[trim cairn]

You think they chain pull?

Most of the time they afk on the last mob of the pack

Me running SD speeds up the keys by a stupid amount

Because it usually ticks for 400k ish

upwards of 800k

[analog field]

you are loisng too much ST which is usually the problem

pugs never wipe on trash

[trim cairn]

Pugs wipe mostly on trash

[analog field]

I have never wiped on trash

[trim cairn]

Tank just dies to mob damage

Auto attacks

[analog field]

this has never happened the whole season

apart from WR first pull

[trim cairn]

This happens regularily

In my 15 keys

[analog field]

yeah I am doing 15's too

[vital flicker]

depending on the build you don't actually lose that much ST

[analog field]

we are just depleting keys on bosses

[trim cairn]

I just abandoned a 15 alkgethar academy

The tank aoe stunned the pack before veximus

And when they came out of the stun they all sync their autos

and 100-0 him in 0.2s

[analog field]

how much is the loss ? because the gain doesn't matter in practice

[trim cairn]

The gain only doesnt matter in practice if your circumstances are ideal and you dont change your playstyle to take advantage of its strengths

but honestly that is a skill issue and not an issue with SD build

[vital flicker]

as I said it depends on the build I can't just say all bleed builds do more or less ST damage

[analog field]

all bleed builds do less than builds with SD

[analog field]

It is dmg that doesn't matter

you dont deplete keys for the 5 sec you gained from SD

that is coping

I would like for a bleed build to exist but it does not

[trim cairn]

The damage matters in the circumstances my keys are in

[analog field]

did you wipe in the last 5% of mobs' health ?

this is never a realistic case

[trim cairn]

Did I ever fail a key because of lack of dps? no

that is never a realistic case either on 15s

[analog field]

it is when the boss in AA takes 5 min and your healer can't keep you up

or first boss WR

[trim cairn]

lol

[analog field]

where it is a healing check mostly

and every pug dies there

[trim cairn]

What do you think the ST damage is

of SD build

[analog field]

yeah like 6 % less or something

usually these keys are bricked on bosses

you doing useless pad will not save it

[static glacier]

not great in my experience, your envenoms are fake

temu envenoms

[trim cairn]

Bro this is with a troll build withotu apex talents

[spice surge]

Why we dropping apex talents if were demisemaxxing

[trim cairn]

I meant r4

[trim cairn]

It's not useless pad in the way keys are run at this level, idk how that is so hard for you to understand

If I wasn't pugging and played with a competent tank I wouldn't unironically be running SD

[brave gyro]

What's the difference between ironically and unironically running SD?

[vital flicker]

how funny they think it is

[trim cairn]

Ironically is doing the hannah montana build

or the redsuck60sbang build

or maybe this meme build I am running now

Courtesy of @primal parrot

Because dps doesnt matter at this key level anyways, all my keys fail because people die

[loud light]

I'm not sure "nothing matters" is a good argument for why SD isn't pad, but sure

[trim cairn]

Nothing matters isn't the argument for why SD isn't pad but feel free to continue on the strawman path

[brave gyro]

As long as everyone consents and has fun, it's all g

[severe meadow]

Yeah man you can die on the SD hill, I don't think anyone actually cares that much but you xd

Keep running what works for you

[trim cairn]

I'd never have it any other way

[brave gyro]

Is the Crimson Vial CDR on reset this week? That's the real game changer

[trim cairn]

[balmy condor]

Yes

[gray raven]

The issue with SD is where it lives in the tree. It’s a meme capstone it would be great to take it earlier

[strange onyx]

Chain slurping vials?

[brave gyro]

We're so back

[balmy condor]

If you get the killing blow, sure

[severe meadow]

I'll chain slurp you, buddy

[balmy condor]

Only realistically matters in delves I don’t think it’s that strong in m+

[severe meadow]

Pause

SD gives killing blow..

You get more slurp

[balmy condor]

Yeah that’s the tech

[brave gyro]

Next they just need to bring back deadly throw finisher and we might as well get a nerf, so we're not too op

[severe meadow]

Healmaxxing

[balmy condor]

Run SD for heal parse

Huge

[severe meadow]

Real

[strange onyx]

you called?

[trim cairn]

Giga chad in the house holy

[severe meadow]

bro is pressing vial on cd

[strange onyx]

Unloved by the healing team

it is what it is

[severe meadow]

Rogue life

[brave gyro]

They just want you to parse well

[onyx veldt]

whats the deal with parses? is it really that important or as a new player i shouldnt focus on that

[severe meadow]

I have much to learn

[balmy condor]

Depends what kind of idiots you deal with

[onyx veldt]

LOL

[balmy condor]

They’re a way to quickly compare how good you are

[brave gyro]

The much better thing is to find a group you enjoy playing with

[trim cairn]

Parsing is mostly padding and playing in a sub-optimal way for killing the boss but an optimal way for big numbers

[onyx veldt]

oh

[balmy condor]

Parses are just damage

So a lot of the time bad Strats in your guild, things being out of range, not padding adds, etc

Can lead to your parse being lower

[verbal sable]

first paladin kill ❤️ did some good for rogues 😄

[balmy condor]

Grats

[onyx veldt]

does it scale with ilvl?

[balmy condor]

There are ilvl parses but those are just entirely bait

[storm forum]

ilvl parses make me feel better about myself

[balmy condor]

Not enough people in brackets and many ways to get to a certain ilvl, makes the gear comparisons really awkward

So like yeah you might’ve parsed a 90 in item level

But you did it against 9 other schmucks that have whacko gear

Instead of comparing against 3000 other assa rogues

[storm forum]

Having a max myth in impactful slots (mainhand, trinket, etc) increases ur ilvl parse by like 15% it's great

[trim cairn]

I feel called out

[golden loom]

ilvl parses are a way better metric

(not biased)

[trim cairn]

I crafted murder row set cuz it sounded cool

And got hard stuck with a 263 dagger for 2 weeks

[balmy condor]

Yeah you make a lot of interesting decisions

[trim cairn]

I don't play to min max because that got me burnt out previously

It's why I quit wow in SL and didnt pick it up until now

[runic hinge]

Thanks for the cope

[honest mantle]

anyone else finding it impossible to get invited to m+ groups? or is it just me being OCE

[balmy condor]

That is the life of a dps that isn’t named augmentation, devourer, unholy, or demonology

[vital flicker]

Rogues are just masters of stealth especially in lfg

[honest mantle]

its insane. got so bored of waiting i leveled an augmentation

[golden loom]

then you dont have score or ilvl

[honest mantle]

274 ilvl 3.1k score but i cant keep pushing bc no invites. listing key takes literal hours to get half decent people

[frosty cedar]

ilvl prolly too low

[honest mantle]

in OCE anyway. playing with NA its forsure quicker but i get constant 300ping

[frosty cedar]

I get invited to keys now im 281 but im like the only guy on the list that high when I eventually get in lmao

[runic hinge]

my hours are cursed and i wake up and queue for hours only seeing oce people

[golden loom]

yeah I meant just leveling a new fotm class

will leave you with no score and no ilvl

so then it ends up being the same thing

[honest mantle]

i like the gearing part ngl, its fun for me

[golden loom]

agreed

[honest mantle]

but man i really want to play my main, i just cant

[golden loom]

thats why I play 4 alts myself

[frigid void]

Just double checking but it looks like death mark just increases the damage of dots now rather than applying a second one, is this snapshot or retroactive? Do I need to press imp garrote after I death mark?

[spice surge]

You do not need to reapply your bleeds afterwards no

[frigid void]

Ty I knew every class had been simplified but that takes a lot of snap shooting and prep out of the way. Appreciate the info!

[spice surge]

Yeah that kinda of snapshotting hasnt been a thing for ages now

(except a bug recently, but that got fixed)

[sick sail]

Hi! Any chance of a possible Ass m+ updated guide? been playing sub, don’t feel like it’s that much of a transition

[hazy sundial]

Wowhead is up to date

[onyx veldt]

https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/rogue/assassination/overview-pve-dps

this one is still valid

[frigid void]

Might be showing my age with this question lol

[coral ibex]

it definitely used to be a much more prevalent mechanic

but they’ve long since realized it’s kinda shitty to balance around

[humble verge]

@thorn thorn theres a new girl at the gym

[frigid void]

No arguments, made feral feel ridiculous

[waxen oyster]

Snapshotting is more recent than weapon speed.

By a long shot.

[royal lantern]

dating girls is gay

[high dust]

ok guys, ty for the tips and help, got mythic chim pugging :')

first time I do a mythic boss on the current patch lmao

[humble verge]

rox didnt even bat an eye

[high dust]

I mean...its alright?

[obsidian coral]

do u have to play SD overall differently from the usual build ? Im refreshing buffs and reapply with CT towards the end of the pack (35%) to get the max dmg out of it in aoe?

[split veldt]

are yall killing adds on M Vor if you dont have one tethered on you?

[frosty cedar]

aw hell nah

nuke boss

[split veldt]

🫡

[onyx veldt]

i think i hate raids

LMAO

[balmy condor]

why

[trim cairn]

That's a big aspect, also you mostly ignore FoK unless the pack is small

[warm vortex]

I didn't see the healing part and was really confused
saw those numbers and assumed it was dps and thought "how fucking bad is rogue atm"

[onyx veldt]

idk maybe bc i pug

[royal lantern]

well yeha

pugging makes everything horrible

[balmy condor]

yeh

pugging

[high dust]

but having to play with the same 19 people scares me

[golden loom]

pugging is based and fun

[onyx veldt]

idk any1 that plays the game so id have to join a random guild

[balmy condor]

wait are you actually refreshing bleeds pre-pandemic to try and snipe bigger sd hits

[balmy condor]

that's how you make friends, it's great

met my best friends that way

[trim cairn]

Ye 100% padding I try to be as useless as possible

[wicked scaffold]

joining random guild works can confirm

[trim cairn]

..Is what you want to hear

[frosty cedar]

yep just join a random guild from chat and go from there

banger decision

[strange onyx]

Been in the same goofeer guild since NH and been to several guild meets together

[balmy condor]

I couldn't care less how you play your keys

[severe meadow]

Hold vanish for tether

[trim cairn]

x to doubt

[severe meadow]

Fuck your team

[trim cairn]

I'm on top of your interests these days

Hours spend pondering how my keys are doing

[balmy condor]

yeah surely

[trim cairn]

[balmy condor]

definitely not popping into a chat and seeing you do some weird tech and asking a question

rent free in my head for hours cause I have nothing better to do

you got me

[golden loom]

bleed build is back????????????????????

[frosty cedar]

bleed build sashay left

[trim cairn]

definitely not

[warped moon]

at least i got chicken

[severe meadow]

for the class?

[warped moon]

um

[storm forum]

I went to my ex-gm's wedding last year, joining random guilds is great

[chilly nimbus]

guys, venomous wounds is bugged for secondary targets?

[warped moon]

when u rly need to win the loot council

[balmy condor]

nop, it's working

[chilly nimbus]

thx

[strange onyx]

Triggering my paladins PTSD

[warped moon]

hpal buffs soon yay

[trim cairn]

What I am wondering is where tf you guys are finding tanks that chain pull

[warped moon]

i feel like every tank ive pugged with chain pulls

[strange onyx]

The flying orbs that augs send out on paladins look like something you don’t wanna get hit by

[trim cairn]

My tanks are 3.2k rated and still don't know the voidwalkers in Seat have to be tanked near the rifts

Ups r word my bad

[warped moon]

i dont really get the chain pulling especially the chain pull with the mob alive at like 2% hp

but maybe thats just because i play rogue

would it be ok to just let the mob die idk

[trim cairn]

Trust me, the alternative is everyone standing afk holding cds while the pack dies slowly

[strange onyx]

Yeah, most tanks just aren’t aware. If you give them a heads up b4 key start they are happy to oblige

[warped moon]

i guess so but i feel like chain pulls make more sense when the pack you're on is like 20%

but if the mob's at like 2% it's like cmonnn

[strange onyx]

You’re correct

[trim cairn]

Can't relate

[warped moon]

it's so awkward cause yknow it's like "cant restealth" but it's also like "makes no sense to reapply bleed and also if theres a long bleed on this mob i probably cant spread it with CT in time" 🥴 anyway im preaching to the choir i bet

so im just sittin there losing damage

[trim cairn]

Convert to SD now

[quaint dragon]

wat are some good keybinds i need more

[warped moon]

what is the SD build? i might do it for skinning

[trim cairn]

Skinning some time off your keys

[warped moon]

haha

[coral ibex]

QERTFGVCXZ 12345

[warped moon]

ya and bind function keys to ur mouse buttons if u have that going on 🙂

i duplicate my interrupts and cc to my mouse keys, as mouseovers, and then the keybinds on the keyboard are current target

so my shiv is 4 and also f4

etc

[strange onyx]

X R T V Z F G C F1 F2 F3 F4

A D

[storm forum]

My keyboard has a big chasm between the numbers and the f keys, so before the great pruning I was stretching over to Y if your hands can do that

[trim cairn]

At the point where you use f1 buttons wouldnt you instead just start duplicating binds with CTRL

[quaint dragon]

ye f keys are far

[storm forum]

Yeah shift and ctrl are great too

[quaint dragon]

im just trying to get mouseover and focus extra

[warped moon]

i try not to use modifier keys unless it is a hard cast

[trim cairn]

Ok but honest question back

Even if I subtract SD damage

This build still deals more damage than DTB

wtf am I doing wrong when playing DTB lol

[strange onyx]

Putting on a 2nd poison?

[trim cairn]

✅

[winged python]

Is there a minmax to do with kingsbane besides casting envenom before? I'm comparing some logs to other rogues and my KB is doing less for the sameish gear

[trim cairn]

Do you always pool on high heads count?

[storm forum]

Staying in melee range is pretty important

[trim cairn]

I auto attack telepathically usually but I'll try

[storm forum]

Sometimes the boss drifts and I'm focusing on something else and miss a couple globals during KB and it sucks

[winged python]

Haven;t been paying a lot of attention to it, should I be spending more aggressively during?

[trim cairn]

add some RP macros

[trim cairn]

Nonono bro don't take advice from me I was talking about something different

[balmy condor]

no clue

[trim cairn]

Couldn't it be that DTB is handicapped by the target cap on the extra damage it gives but the 30% increased rupture damage and 10% increased garrote damage is not?

[obsidian coral]

Ahh i see u just want to keep the dot uptime high , but isnt it only useful when the pack is low? so i fok until they reach roughly 35% ?

[storm forum]

Are our poisons target capped?

[trim cairn]

Caustic deals reduced beyond 5

so the extra damage you get from the envenom amp is technically also

[coral ibex]

no our poisons are not capped

[trim cairn]

and the amp poison deals ass damage in itself anyways

[coral ibex]

you can have infinite instances of deadly and amplifying poison

[storm forum]

Ok great

[trim cairn]

The reason you cast CT more is to keep Internal Bleeding uptime

Only use FoK if you need energy

[balmy condor]

Sure, but that’s accounted for by all theorycrafting

[trim cairn]

So there isn't any target count where the bleed improvement will outpace caustic splatter damage from the increased envenom damage?

[obsidian coral]

could u link me a good build u would recommend or are there differents for SD?

[hybrid snow]

!ui

[prisma monolith]

Resources:

• ArcUI - Common UI Replacement
  BetterCDM - Enhancements to the Cooldown Manager
• MSUF - Common Unit Frame replacement
• Platynator - Recommended Nameplate Addon (Plater is not recommended)
  (Jundies Profile)
  (Whispyr's Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - Poison Reminder
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator and cursor replacement

[obsidian coral]

been running this*

[trim cairn]

In keys??

[obsidian coral]

ye only for keys

[trim cairn]

I'm still testing different builds

[vital flicker]

I mean a lot of the time the regular M+ build actually pulls ahead in high target counts over the bleed builds in sims

[trim cairn]

I just feelcraft depending on what make the keys go smoother/faster

[balmy condor]

Nah cause bleed stuff is inherently capped, you’re only getting +2, caustic is the same time investment but it just does keeps doing more damage

It’s just capped vs uncapped aoe

[trim cairn]

Idk what else explains the 200-300k dps gap on big pulls

before SD even triggers

[balmy condor]

Burst is much higher with dtb builds obviously with kb stacking and amp and stuff

Maybe your prio target dies too fast dunno

[remote grail]

I have dreams where I play zoldyck and SD

[vital flicker]

it could be your reality

[trim cairn]

How high target count are we talking

[severe meadow]

Lock in

[onyx veldt]

https://tenor.com/view/cute-blinking-blinking-eyes-eyes-blinking-cute-face-gif-17335643218552398559

[severe meadow]

(Full slop for 10s)

[onyx veldt]

imma try it

[remote grail]

I can`t do damage with dtb, I'll fight the tank for 4th dps spot

[trim cairn]

Just wait till you see this abomination

[runic hinge]

Surely there’s a better point than blindside

[severe meadow]

probably

[balmy condor]

blindside carries st

[runic hinge]

True

But are we playing for ST with no dtb

[onyx veldt]

?

[runic hinge]

No amp

[trim cairn]

#assassination message my build btw but I'd probably just copy the one off of the pins if I were you

[balmy condor]

have we considered supercharged ruptures

[trim cairn]

Yes

[strange onyx]

Supercharged kidney?

[trim cairn]

thats the redsuck60sbang build

[strange onyx]

There was a weapon enchant in WoD(?) that put a bleed on targets

Maybe that is good after the prune

[trim cairn]

Still is

Halazzi

[vital flicker]

there is one this expansion that puts a bleed on

and a weapon embellishment

[strange onyx]

You guys know so much, love it

Ty gang

[trim cairn]

That's the redneck tech I used to pull 2.1m SD hit

[balmy condor]

they don't work with SD or any of the bleed stuff

but they are bleeds I guess

[vital flicker]

that's not the point

[balmy condor]

based

[strange onyx]

At this point the cook is so stupid anything goes in the pot

[spice surge]

Ye unfortunately that doesnt supercharge the internal bleeds you spread with CT. Theyre all pissweak 3 cp damage bleeds regardless of what you do

[remote grail]

I miss crimson tempest dot damage

[strange onyx]

It still does DoT

Damage on target

[trim cairn]

Cursed damage distribution

@balmy condor notice the major contribution of murder row set please

[strange onyx]

Frixx, you eu?

[balmy condor]

[strange onyx]

We gonna have another flamethrower moment

[balmy condor]

no bugs on this spec

[trim cairn]

Flamethrowers cant hurt me when I am already on fire

[spice surge]

Blizzard is trying to keep us demisemaxxers down, thats why they locked +rupture damage behind amp poison

Smh my head

[strange onyx]

Inb4 outlaw is the best spec after the smoke bomb on Wednesday and I get gkicked for playing it on bird

[vital flicker]

this spec is so full of bugs it should be renamed Ahn'Qiraj Rogue

[strange onyx]

Some curious Carlo came in here asking about the flamethrower embellishment so @balmy condor got sent to the sim mines

[balmy condor]

yeh luckily that shit is fully ass

[trim cairn]

lore like this is why i love this discord

[vital flicker]

but what about the 5 big booms

[severe meadow]

🏄‍♂️ 🏄‍♀️

[balmy condor]

worse actually

[trim cairn]

The only reason why @balmy condor won't calculate maximum possible SD damage is because he is afraid what the revelation might do

[strange onyx]

Haste breakpoint for 5 big booms zandalari rogue with Kimbul’s bleed racial?

[balmy condor]

true

[strange onyx]

Oh yeah Frixx, Zandalaris get a bleed racial

Have fun

[vital flicker]

the fact they call them "big booms" is actually a disgrace to the meme

[trim cairn]

If only I cared

[strange onyx]

https://www.wowhead.com/spell=292473/embrace-of-kimbul

Surely that adds to your Sudden Demise cope

[trim cairn]

Surely

I'll change my mind when dungeonslice is a reliable sim

[vital flicker]

I mean, define reliable

[trim cairn]

I mean, within a 100% margin of error of my M+ runs I guess

Only reason I say that is like I say because even with DtB my bleeds are contributing so much that it didnt seem like the extra envenom damage was worth in comparison

[vast shuttle]

will i see big dps when i get puzzle box?

[balmy condor]

it's one of the biggest single upgrades you can get

[pine crater]

Is adamantite sharpening stone good for assa aswell? Like it is for sub on main hand

[runic hinge]

Have you tried dungeon route sims instead

[vast shuttle]

how do u want to use puzzle get bleeds on many targets first or just add it to the regular aoe rot

[trim cairn]

No but that sounds a lot better than dungeonslice

How/where can you do those?

[runic hinge]

Dungeon slice is just a general sim to help you evaluate gear and talents in a generic scenario it’s not like playing a whole dungeon

[trim cairn]

I'm aware I just didn't know there existed a dungeon route sim tool?

[vital flicker]

keystone guru has the option to get a sim string for a route, I know there used to be a weak aura to do it with MDT

[deft vault]

DO we open with ambush from stealth or just garrote

[trim cairn]

I usually open on the mobs from stealth by explaining how SD is actually the meta build

Depending on their mental fortitude it can oneshot

[strange onyx]

Garrote

[strange onyx]

You are starting to sound a bit sour

[trim cairn]

Coming from the guy sending dickpics in DMs that sounds like a compliment

[vital flicker]

in DMs? man is holding out from the rest of us

[strange onyx]

Glad to see you are overall delusional and not just when it comes to wow

[trim cairn]

It's a joke

you wrote "Check DMs" in the theorycrafting channel as a reply to my SD meme question

[vast shuttle]

what bonus in algeth academy

[trim cairn]

Crit

[quiet star]

Hey, so for m+ 15 and above which hero spec recommended? I see from guides that it should be drathstalker, but top assa rogue use fatebound which is strange

[coral ibex]

fatebound

you might eventually get to a point where deathstalker prio damage matters

but fatebound is just more overall

[trim cairn]

Where would I be putting this string?

[vital flicker]

the footer iirc

[glad mica]

Hello gamers is there a way to make caustic splatter debuff show in plater nameplates

[balmy condor]

no

you either use the blizzard debuffs or you show everything

[glad mica]

suffering

[balmy condor]

there isn't really a reason to track it though

it's just passive

[glad mica]

[coral ibex]

you can track it in your cdm with an addon

[vital flicker]

You can always track it on the cooldown manager

[coral ibex]

thats about it

[vital flicker]

I don't think you need an addon

[balmy condor]

yeah that's just baseline

[frigid lagoon]

I wait for empowered garrote to fall off before reapplying right?

[coral ibex]

you'd need an addon to move the icon around tho

unless you use a buff bar

i hate bars tho

[trim cairn]

Does it matter which simulation options I select below?

[vital flicker]

As far as dslice vs patchwerk no

[trim cairn]

number of bosses doesnt matter either?

[vital flicker]

Nope it overrides that

[trim cairn]

Still wildly inaccurate idk

[thorn thorn]

[trim cairn]

but roughly congruent with dungeonslice

[balmy condor]

what is your measure of accuracy

[trim cairn]

+-100% I guess

[thorn thorn]

Uber dont get any funny ideas

[balmy condor]

....what

[trim cairn]

Sim says less than 100k dps

[balmy condor]

+-100% would mean anywhere from zero dps to double the mean

[trim cairn]

Yeah ignore the minus

[warped moon]

no!

[thorn thorn]

Time for math lessons with whispyr

[balmy condor]

no, I don't think so

[warped moon]

do imp garrote, wait for the timer to go down to like 1 sec, then imp garrote again

before the timer runs out

[trim cairn]

It's more like 50% though honestly

but still I'd consider that way off

[warped moon]

like i often do imp garrote -> builder -> rupture -> imp garrote -> ct etc

[trim cairn]

There is no scenario where I am doing less than 100k overall even with multiple wipes

[warped moon]

i guess i could ct sooner but idk

[balmy condor]

are you measuring the 100k from logs?

[trim cairn]

Yeah not the dps meter in game

Which cuts out downtime

[balmy condor]

yeh idk guess the dungeonroute has too much downtime

[trim cairn]

How accurate should it be usually?

[vital flicker]

I mean I don't think anyone said it would be accurate, Dslice is literally reliable though as it gives consistent and repeatable results, it may not be true to a dungeon but it has a good spread of target counts

[balmy condor]

droute shouldn't really be accurate

it's a zero variance simulation

it's kinda statistically unviable by definition unless you are running a perfect route where there's no one in your party to speed up or slow down any of the pulls

[thorn thorn]

@fallow canopy

[fallow canopy]

[trim cairn]

Which is kinda the opposite of my m+ runs in reality I guess lol

[balmy condor]

thats why we use dslice ye

[vital flicker]

At the end of the day Sudden Demise is hard to sim, I have not found a bleed build that sims higher than the regular M+ build in Dslice or anywhere close enough to note. Going too far into demisemaxxing is probably not worth it at the cost of significant ST, Funnel, or 2-target cleave (since there are multiple fights in the m+ pool). None of this makes SD builds unusable, but it definitely makes them not reccomended. You can play whatever you want though and be fine

[urban heart]

So in 12.0.5 the best still fatebound or death?

[balmy condor]

fatebound

there's no tuning changes for the hero talents

[trim cairn]

Really appreciate this response mate

[wild bane]

Hey guys, is there a way to track both parts of Implacable buff at the same time? blizz CDM just deletes the stacking part in favor of the energy regen part

[balmy condor]

no

[deft vault]

i believe sopmeone linked an addon that does that yesterday? no clue if its good tho

[balmy condor]

yeh haven't tried it

[wild bane]

I'll look into that thanks

[edgy flicker]

Does someone mind doing a log review for me? I was pushing keys as sub and having some success. I just can't seem to figure out Assa yet. I would appreciate any insight you all have. Thank you advance!
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/4mCZnpK8Rb9zYDxW?fight=18&type=damage-done

[deft vault]

it was this @wild bane

[wild bane]

thank you

Seems to be working well

[viscid spear]

[buoyant herald]

I tried it and it seemed pretty good

[severe meadow]

I've had none issue with it outside of not being able to resize the icons (unless you can)

[trim cairn]

The reason I am asking so much about it

Is that it just doesn't match up with the results I am getting in game

Even by removing the SD damage completely

It just outperforms DtB build by so much

Especially on high target counts

Skill issue I guess

[balmy condor]

I don't really see that being true though

like you can side by side the first pull of algethar and compare lust window vs lust window

they're the same pulls

if you remove sudden demise, it's legit >100k behind

the dtb player here wasn't even playing well, didn't spread bleeds past scent cap

was playing canny instead of internal bleeding

dtb player is even behind on ilvl and is using a crafted main hand

idk

unless there's some bug no one has discovered yet, I don't understand how it's possible

[hazy sundial]

Any new way to track how many targets i have dotted? This was a WA from TWW that showed every mob in combat

[balmy condor]

nop, they locked down any nameplate counting