assassination

[vestal wren]

to be fair

subtlety is hard to understand

and there is a lot of outdated knowlage out there

e.g. idk if you followed the sub chat yesterday but we had a discussion about the difficulty of execution on arcane vs. subtlety

[static glacier]

he gets the basics, it's just the degree to which things work that people don't read into, people will understand a + b > c, but not by how much

[vestal wren]

because a big majority of the playerbase assumes sub is not that hard but arcane is rocket science phd degree of difficulty

[static glacier]

]like that if you send an extra dance you better PRAY for some crazy unseen blade rng or ur blades are bricked

[grim jay]

I mean there is a reason he is the healing officer and not the dps one

[static glacier]

he's a good dps player (just don't watch the sub gameplay) granted the spec isn't super alt friendly

[grim jay]

There is a WA for arcane that basically trivializes all of it, we dont have that for sub

And the CD management on arcane isnt even comparable

[static glacier]

macro EVERYTHING

[vestal wren]

stealthi asked a friend who plays both in top 30 or so for a detailed breakdown

[static glacier]

can't fuck up the opener if it's already cooked

[vestal wren]

#subtlety message

[static glacier]

there isn't any really, you just send stuff on cds and it lines up

[vestal wren]

and i think thats the best way to get a more precise answer

without perosnal bias

[grim jay]

It tells you when to consume precision stacks, when to barrage and when to arcane missile

So basically everything

[static glacier]

id argue sub is more punished for poor offensive play than arcane even

[vestal wren]

it is

but he mentioned it

[static glacier]

defensively sure mage is harder

and movement wise too

[vestal wren]

i would not even say that

but its a very good discussion point

[static glacier]

i say it in the sense that they have no cheat to save them if they fuck up

[vestal wren]

it applies to both sin/sub equally

[static glacier]

both classes have proactive defensives exclusively

[vestal wren]

but e.g. shadowstep is a insane cooldown but also extremely difficult to use

mage blink is noticably easier to use as it has less conditionals

[static glacier]

i find it a lot simpler than some of the stuff you can do on mage if you take displacement

alter + blink + displacement

all together

can lead to some insane movement

[grim jay]

Ranged movement/gameplay also is generally easier than melee imo

Except for very few situations

[static glacier]

simply having the vision of how it all fits together is difficult imo

[vestal wren]

then there is feint/cloak/etc

as mage you can blink or iceblock out of many things

[static glacier]

also if mage is improperly positioned fixing it can be bad since the class doesn't have great movement speed

[vestal wren]

feint for rogue costs energy, so you trade off damage by using it

[static glacier]

while we can sprint

tbh the one thing id say defensively mage has an easy time with

[vestal wren]

just some things you can easy fuck up on rogue

using step on dimensius p3

[static glacier]

would be mirror images and shield lasting actually forever

like 1 min on shield and 40s on clones

[vestal wren]

can easy kill you

[static glacier]

blink > step for sure

[vestal wren]

its easier to use and blink is stronger

[static glacier]

not even close imo

I hope blizzard revists our wider non damage kit as a class for midnight

we've fallen behind utility and defensive-wise it feels like

[vestal wren]

i think feint needs to get the energy costs removed

even if it means having a higher cooldown

[static glacier]

macro feint to backstab

kekw

[red schooner]

Rogue utility would be nice in raid

[static glacier]

nevermind raid, our cc in keys is just

a joke nowadays

[red schooner]

Smoke bomb back acting as a darkness effect

I'd like that

[vestal wren]

feint and cheat death is why you would argue rogue is easy defensive wise

especially on assassiantion

if you have multiple targets

[static glacier]

sin is the hardest rogue spec defensively

[vestal wren]

your energy costs of feint don't matter much

[static glacier]

squishiest by a good margin

that also should be looked at

[vestal wren]

i don't know if the diffrence is that big

all have cheat

and as mentioned, feint is easier to keep up on assassiantion

the diffrence does not feel as dramatic as you make it sound

[grizzled geyser]

idk why we cant even use smokebomb in pve at all, would at least be nice in some keys so you dont have to los some caster heavy pulls as much

[vestal wren]

smokebomb was removed

once dh was introduced

which got a almost 1:1 replica of smoke bomb with diffrent visuals

similar, warlock lost their transformation too

[oak tangle]

i'm glad you clarified rogue spec, with feint around XD

[vestal wren]

not saying its related^^

[static glacier]

would you rather a tiny bit more leech on leeching poison or emphemeral bond / exhilirating execution and much higher soothing darkness uptime?

sin is easier than sub yet is higher on death statistics for every tier since the rework iirc

clearly it dies more so is harder defensively

provided reasoning, theory and data

[golden loom]

playing fatebound instead of deathstalker does make it squishier aswell but

[vestal wren]

does not make my point wrong

feint is our strongest defensive and sin has lower oppotunity costs to use it

[static glacier]

is this actually the case? could we sim this

since while sub is more energy starved im fairly sure the value of energy to sub is lower too

due to backstab hitting as hard as a garotte tick, if that

while sin does ok dps outside of cds

and has a much bigger energy pool

[golden loom]

well press a backstab and whoops now u cant feint

[static glacier]

so the impact of energy spent remains longer than sub

[vestal wren]

energy generation increases with more targets on sin, no?

[static glacier]

and sin can run out of energy on kingsbane cds, sub i don't think ever goes out of energy in dance

[static glacier]

yes on even 3t energy becomes a non issue

was thinking st

since even in aoe we dont get to spread a lot of ruptures

[vestal wren]

but surviviability is mostly a topic of m+

[static glacier]

due to opportunity cost of spatter env

in m+ idk if sin is even worse defensively, mainly talking raid

[vestal wren]

you never took sub over sin because of survivability this xpac

[static glacier]

don't have m+ death statistics

[vestal wren]

raids also have adds on multiple fights

so its not only pure st

in fact pure st is rly bad on subtlety currently, and rogue in general isn't that good at it

[golden loom]

the one place where you kinda spam feint and it feels bad is loomithar p2

[static glacier]

it just all depends how long lived the adds are and if it's feasable to rupture or not

btw why is sub tuned so poorly on st

[vestal wren]

the main reason you see sub plaed is op trinekts

you would not see it played at all else

[static glacier]

i've said it's the trinkets and dmg amps carrying the spec

[vestal wren]

its just poorly tuned

but thats a very common pattern

[static glacier]

did it get nerfed on ptr or something?

[vestal wren]

i mean sub was bad in s1

in s2

[static glacier]

where's that 3% assassination buff

kekw

[vestal wren]

we ended up the worse performing spec in the game

before getting a super small buff

which still made us worse than the other rogue specs

[static glacier]

idk why sub was so hyped on release of undermine

i guess rwf?

[vestal wren]

yes

subtlety was basically good for the first 2 weeks to month each tier

which is where all the play rate comes from

[zenith elm]

i think our tanks are way too slow on soulhunters

damn

[static glacier]

all this optimisation and we're still behind a fury warrior pressing rb rb rb > rampage > rb rb rb rb > rampage

[spice surge]

It was also nerfed right before

[red schooner]

I got benched on soulhunters and I'm living my best life

[vestal wren]

^

[static glacier]

the tierset right

[spice surge]

And sectech

[static glacier]

owch

[vestal wren]

yes, they nerfed the tier and secret and buffed the baseline

[static glacier]

baseline backstab

[vestal wren]

having a strong baseline does help you initially

[static glacier]

this has to be the most worthless filler in the game

[spice surge]

But its really the same as now, if undermine had dimensius sub wouldve been really good

[vestal wren]

but you don't scale as good as others with better tier sets

[static glacier]

surely no one else is spending this many globals doing less damage

[spice surge]

Sub just pads and bursts every 90s, if that lines up with what you need to do sub is good, otherwise its garbage

[static glacier]

lowkey biggest niche sub has over sin and vice versa is spatter hitbox vs flurry hitbox

[vestal wren]

if you look at the wcl statistic, you also see the top 5 specs do like 10% more than the rest

[static glacier]

its normally gonna be in sub's favour but mugzee was the reverse

[vestal wren]

you could argue for sub on mugzee

the raidwide no parry was possibly worth it

[static glacier]

fair

[vestal wren]

with that gone tho, there wasn't rly a fight for sub

[red schooner]

Rip raidwide parry

[static glacier]

bandit was sub favoured imo

[red schooner]

Killed too young

[static glacier]

halondrus is tht u

[vestal wren]

sub trivialized the barrels on a early fight

[golden loom]

every raid that our other rogue wasnt in was so depressing, going from no parries to envenom getting parried perma (atleast it felt like that)

[vestal wren]

but that quickly became irrelevant with more gear

[static glacier]

i pray they never repeat richard ricardo reverb again

dogshit fight

actually crap

and also i got r1 on my sv alt on myth richard

kekw

[vestal wren]

gally was possibly a sub fight

[static glacier]

one point in favour of sin is the aoe shiv soothe on early adds

[golden loom]

gally was just a non-rogue fight imo

[vestal wren]

but the fight was also in character for gally

and the difficulty actually made mugzee the endboss

[static glacier]

for what it's worth I thought mugzee was a good fightt

challenging without being wa cringe

[golden loom]

mugzee is probably still my favorite fight even though we had to re-prog it every week

[vestal wren]

https://tenor.com/view/timon-eat-disney-the-lion-king-gif-17411823

[golden loom]

just felt good playing sin on mugzee

[red schooner]

Mugzee was fun but reprog killed me

89 pull rekill

Wtaf

[vestal wren]

i did not liek mugzee

[red schooner]

[vestal wren]

i liked silken court more

[zenith elm]

so true, loved that fight

[vestal wren]

but the execute of sin made you blast if you played it

[static glacier]

my mugzee was like 99 on kill and rekills were all 99 unless i got rng screwed by that stun shit twice in the same pull, then it was s87 or so

[golden loom]

I only pugged first 4 in nerubar so never got to do the later mythic fights, heroic court and ansurek were giga bangers tho

[static glacier]

i had every single dn envenom optimised for add cleave in the parts of the fight that had any concievable adds

[red schooner]

Issue with silken court sin was the mark management was painful

[vestal wren]

i think mark is juts poorly designed

but it is what it is

[red schooner]

Sat there holding a DN for like 10 seconds because a boss swap is soon

Thanks

[static glacier]

would be tragic if you lost your mark for p3 on the kill pull right?

https://tenor.com/view/crying-gif-27540008

[red schooner]

[static glacier]

right guys

🙂

[vestal wren]

i mean, i found the fight deisgn wise not that interessting

[static glacier]

ill say this, that fight was wildly different depending on which team you were

i was on the mechanics sand do no dmg team kekw

[red schooner]

I was red team. On webs.

[static glacier]

🤝

webbing the big guy then walking away

when we had cds ready

hurt me

on a deeper level

[red schooner]

It was my second ever mythic boss after getting tricked into mythic raiding

And they put me ON WEBS

HELLO?

[vestal wren]

you need to take one for the team

[static glacier]

i wonder why rogues were put on webs generallyh

[vestal wren]

team player

[static glacier]

ye ofc, im just memeing it

we had rivalry bettween the two teams in my raidgroup at the time

each side flamed the other xd

the lore of the fight actually came true

[red schooner]

I was still figuring out what the fuck was going on and they're like, 'hey goat, I know you're new here but you're now handling the pass fail raidwipe mechanic'

[red schooner]

nah for us it was purely blue team

Being bad at moving

[static glacier]

to be fair i did like how scripted the fight was, i hear it feels like ff 14 fightss

[golden loom]

cant wait for dimensius left or right side gang

[red schooner]

I'm a ff14 fight enjoyer

[static glacier]

one blue team warrior was a certified terrorist

[vestal wren]

i think the current raid was the best this xpac

[static glacier]

miss him xx

[vestal wren]

can't say much about DF

as the entire xpac was so forgettable

haha

[red schooner]

We kept joking that the kill pull would be the one where the blue team never got pulled in first

[golden loom]

even outside of the fights, the vibe, the setting and the music in this raid is just standout

[red schooner]

Lo and behold

[static glacier]

i think it's a tossusp between undermine and this

[vestal wren]

(tho s3 raid was best too)

[red schooner]

It was

[static glacier]

1st raid had a bad difficulty curve, ovinax and court

cringe fights

[golden loom]

like I feel so bad for people that play with music turned off, manaforge is straight bangers that fit with the fights

[static glacier]

ansurek was also ridiculous tbh

[vestal wren]

i rly did not like undemine

it felt like such a bad tier to me

[golden loom]

was my first tier guild raiding in retail so I liked it

[static glacier]

any specific bosses or was it the theme?

[golden loom]

but by the end of the tier only mugzee was fun re-clearing

[vestal wren]

queen was funny

i wonder if you would have palyed sub on the fight even

without dust

and double vanish

[red schooner]

Sprocket was fun seeing how many people I could kill when a wipe was called

[static glacier]

queen made me learn that we have the most op defensive in the game

that being calling for externals over comms

[red schooner]

Extreme bumper car time boys

[vestal wren]

you should try dk

^^

[static glacier]

since my shadowstep targets for p3 were idiots

[static glacier]

dk wouldn't live the wave dot on ansurek

you just call for externals

and your healing team will immediately sac, g spirit you

and pump ungodly amounts of healing

[red schooner]

Our dks just dropped poison in bad places

[static glacier]

incredibly i lived this multiple times consistently withtout even proccing cheat

healers are so broken

i then eventually gave up trying to step mage / lock and decided to use portal

this was son reclear i gave up even xd

[vestal wren]

there is a secret tech

for shadow stepping

we can still summon a toy in raid and step to it

[static glacier]

OMG

OMG

WHICH TOY

[vestal wren]

box of rocks

unless they fixed it very recent

[static glacier]

tbh my raidteam now is more reliable for this skinda thing

but im down to have this too

[vestal wren]

but its a bit scuffed

[golden loom]

I do hate how shadowstep has been on recent bosses like gally and dimensius

[cunning needle]

this?

[vestal wren]

because it spawns some green mobs that run around

ye

you can buy it from the ah as non toy too

its from s1 df

[static glacier]

what was up with it on gally, i barely remember

[golden loom]

it just put you in narnia

[static glacier]

do you mean when it could put you in different positions

ah ye

[vestal wren]

https://www.wowhead.com/item=199216/a-box-of-rocks

[static glacier]

thankyfully myth gally was stationary later in the fight

ill be getting that toy

[golden loom]

yeah but thats not the point of the fight where u want to step

[static glacier]

will also likely try it on dimmy

if stepping other players is inconsistent

[vestal wren]

your raiders can troll you tho

you can yeet around the summend npcs

[static glacier]

hopefully saladbar dies next raid then we get to crash our heads against dimmy for a while

[vestal wren]

dimmy looks like a great fight

to progress

just a bit long

[golden loom]

cant wait to die while dragonriding on the kill pull

can already forsee it

[strange onyx]

I think 150 pulls is the sweet spot for prog

[static glacier]

im leaning more towards 100

super high pull bosses just breed resentment for the boss, blizzard, your class, your fellow raiders, leadership

[golden loom]

I think this is a perfectly balanced and correct difficulty curve

[red sonnet]

shall we start a vote for which class yeluo would reroll?

[static glacier]

i think araz p3 shoulda took more pulls but we did do it nerfed technically

[static glacier]

who's yeluo

[red sonnet]

叶落小红手

[static glacier]

also I need to decide on my next alt, mage is finished pretty much

famous eastern rogue?

[red sonnet]

the 1st rogue player of CN, probably one of the best rogue player around the world

[static glacier]

surely he doesn't reroll

[golden loom]

dh and fury

like havoc and fury are super fun atm

[static glacier]

im leaning fury, played dh relatively recently in df s3

not played fury since wod kekw

when i played warr in df it was arms only

[golden loom]

im so happy I decided to keep up the gearing on them this season

very fun

but a lot of wow to be played

[static glacier]

for me it was sv top prio alt as always

after that I was curious to try the dk rework and i already had a dk bis geared from last season, ended up settling on unholy

frost felt off on first try, will try it again soon though

after that went mage since i was curious what happened to this class that got reworked 17 times since df

[golden loom]

frost is the 4th char I am currently playing, just for a weekly key for extra vault dopmaine pretty much but its pretty fun

[static glacier]

it's op im fairly sure

miracle it hasn't been nerfed

[golden loom]

rogue/dh/warrior are just more fun imo cause I like the quick mobility adhd classes

[static glacier]

that'ss fair

dh was some of the most fun I ever had in this game, im sad to hear its nomover season

[golden loom]

is it?

[static glacier]

unsure

ik it's played though

[golden loom]

I am a aldrachi reaver 1 trick so I am running exergy atleast

[static glacier]

what happened to inertia

[red sonnet]

he claimed in last day's streaming

[static glacier]

exergy is lame by comparison

[golden loom]

inertia is like 0.5-1% better in sims but also not recommended cause its harder

[static glacier]

honestly, with his skills he should play range

lock or mage

probably mage

[red sonnet]

11.1 he played DK

[static glacier]

perhaps druid if he wants similarity to rogue

i guess frost dk is most likely reroll

jpc 2.0 kekw

[red sonnet]

i dont know, the cn rogue community is also wondering

in the last 2 days streaming, he barely play M+ and RAID, just watch causaladdict and yarrgi playing

• and some other chinese streamers

[static glacier]

is he a key pusher mainly

or raid focused?

[red sonnet]

9.1 MDI champion lol

Aster.Y

we always say Aster.Y = Aster.Yeluo

[static glacier]

i guess he just plays whatever class his comp lacks meta-wise

assuming he was sub fdk probably best replacement

if he was sin then maybe arcane

[red sonnet]

US server

weekly reset is tonight?

or?

[golden loom]

think so

[static glacier]

it's already reset for us right?

im eu so im still in past reset

[red sonnet]

i dont know

[static glacier]

us reset is monday night / early tuesday

ah still 5 hrs

i forget the us lives in the past

[red sonnet]

okay, good

let me take a cigar

and then nap

[static glacier]

take care

[red sonnet]

since last week my fury never stops

for this borderlized rogue class

but now it's okay

[balmy condor]

what happened last week to make you mad

[shrewd night]

borderlized

[red sonnet]

i said before, borderlized

[balmy condor]

that's not a word

[red sonnet]

by CN-retail LFG

[static glacier]

clearly he's eng 2nd lang man

cmon

[balmy condor]

I understand that

but I don't know what that word is supposed to mean

I'm trying to understand

[red sonnet]

not only me, but also for all rogue players in CN-retail LFG

[static glacier]

i am too, it explains all the cooked shit i write, right

[balmy condor]

rite

[static glacier]

I think he means marginalised aka ignored

[red sonnet]

for sure, eng is my... 4th language?

[static glacier]

respect

[red sonnet]

my eng is quite bad, that's true

[static glacier]

good enough to talk here np

[balmy condor]

we've seen worse

[golden loom]

dw I cant even speak or write my countries main language

(I am cooked)

[balmy condor]

aren't you dutch or some shit

[shrewd night]

If anyone brings up owl, Im straight up yeeting

[golden loom]

finnish but I am swedishspeaking

[shrewd night]

perkele

[red sonnet]

今浪人の現状が凄く悪いですね

[balmy condor]

I wouldn't want to learn either of those either

[red sonnet]

lol

[static glacier]

what is my delve group saying whispyr

[red sonnet]

seems dutch?

[golden loom]

DELVE GROUP?

[balmy condor]

they're saying now they only need a tank to show up

[static glacier]

i need a quartz from somewhere kekw

[golden loom]

a what

[static glacier]

bro doesns't even know

[balmy condor]

quartz

[red sonnet]

or german?

[balmy condor]

the rare earth mineral

german

[static glacier]

its the only way to get a crit mast ring that isn't cooked

[shrewd night]

do you mean raw earth

[static glacier]

the shrieking version that screams sin agony

[balmy condor]

why is it always raw with you

[golden loom]

oh wait u mean the item to summon kyveza

[shrewd night]

better raw than rare amirite fellas

[golden loom]

why do u have to join a group for that

[balmy condor]

this is about steak... right?

[static glacier]

kinda would rather use other people's and boost them than use my own

[shrewd night]

Just minmaxxing innit. Dont have to spend your own or buy one if someone in the group uses one

[static glacier]

which i keep for my friends rats

[golden loom]

I guess

[red sonnet]

i've got a quite good research post of coin-assa tier mechanic

i don't know how to translate to english

[golden loom]

I just do my 4 delve maps instantly on resets

[red sonnet]

but let me try

[balmy condor]

the tier set bug?

[shrewd night]

[red sonnet]

yes, double cd reduce

[static glacier]

u do 4?

[balmy condor]

I see

[golden loom]

on 4 chars

[static glacier]

i only do it on stuff that has upgrades there

[red sonnet]

CN rogue community newest post

[static glacier]

aka like 2 chars

[red schooner]

I do it on one just for the early gildeds

[golden loom]

@static glacier this is now a delve checkpoint, papers please

[static glacier]

whisp can you learn mandarin and cantonese so you can share the sauce from cn here for us in pinss

[red schooner]

I don't wanna run m+ post work so I just smash out 3 11s including a map delve

[static glacier]

ive given up on bugfix pins, my body is ready for some cn cooks

[red schooner]

For easy 30 gildeds before raid

[golden loom]

yeah same and then I only need 2 or 3 keys to cap

[static glacier]

delve group died 🙁

my german friends

[red schooner]

Also means I get a headstart on lower crests

[static glacier]

never found a tank gg

[red schooner]

I'm stockpiling for turboweek

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1338807060837433365/1417256446118203463/image.png?ex=68ca7b2c&is=68c929ac&hm=b7984c36806ba73345eb7b4ea132b2b6d88032db4884ccc64bca263bbd6d564f&

[balmy condor]

yi, er, san, si, wu, liu, qi, ba, jiu, shi

done

[golden loom]

I am not stockpiling, I am already transmuting

[balmy condor]

that's my mandarin knowledge

[red sonnet]

Conclusion: Due to the Lucky Star Coin not triggering instantly upon collecting seven identical coins (with roughly a one-second delay), if you manage to collect another type of seven-layer coin within this one-second window, the seventh identical coin you throw will fly back to you after landing. Before it reaches you and grants the Lucky Coin effect (you can slightly extend the coin’s flight time by positioning yourself, which is easy to observe on a training dummy but harder in chaotic combat, requiring predictive movement—damage-boosting coins are thrown to your left, direct-damage coins to your right, and vertical coins behind you), triggering another seven-layer coin or a vertical coin can activate a second cooldown reduction. If you use the WeakAura I provided, run left if you first collect seven red coins, or run right if you first collect seven green coins.

perfect number naming

[balmy condor]

yeah

[red schooner]

Enjoy being in the m+ mines when turbo week drops

[balmy condor]

that's the bug indeed

[golden loom]

was the most fun I had last season

[balmy condor]

it's all based around the fact that the capstone is a projectile

[red schooner]

I'm just gonna slam 400 crests into gilded day 1

And be done

[golden loom]

I like grinding M+ when its for gear or crests

[shrewd night]

Em dash

[red schooner]

And not touch m+ again

[balmy condor]

doesn't really explain why it doesn't proc sometimes

but yeh

[golden loom]

the movement part sounds interesting

[balmy condor]

I mean yeh, it's to extend the travel time of the coin

basically the opposite of what I was recommending people to do to avoid the bug

where you just wait a second

moving away from the coin would be how you try and abuse it on purpose

[red schooner]

This bug could have been avoided but nope, we gotta be thematic

[shrewd night]

Goat out here saying flipping coins is rogue theme

[red schooner]

I'm just pointing and gesticulating wildly at the dark ranger 2 set bonus

[red sonnet]

true

[shrewd night]

Stop that, I enjoy bm alting

[red schooner]

They can keep it, I just want the flat CDR without any of the weird conditional nonsense that causes the bugs

[static glacier]

tbh they coulda given us scalecommander style goons that show up, throw a brick and run away

[shrewd night]

[static glacier]

but i guess they decided gamba

[shrewd night]

Dfa clones, but nah flip coin better

[golden loom]

I mean coin stuff is very thematic to hearthstone rogue

[shrewd night]

I thought hearthstone was supposed to be based on the different franchies, not the other way around

[static glacier]

IM PLAYING HEARTHSTONE ROGUE GG

are druids still ramping btw? they seem kinda low on dpss

[golden loom]

thats why I picked rogue when I started wow (havent played hs in like 7 years )

[golden loom]

my druid didnt draw wild growth on pull.. gg!!!

[shrewd night]

When are we playing miracle rogue in wow

[balmy condor]

mill rogue in wow

but you just RP as a farmer

[golden loom]

need the murloc raid to make mill rogue

[static glacier]

respect your dedication to the class

I was a mage player back in the day, nowadays I primarily play dk though I havn't played since spaceship expac

[golden loom]

my dedication was seeing valeera and thinking well she is hot

[shrewd night]

Uuuuh.. Legion?

[static glacier]

you'll be seeing a whole lot of her 😳

[red schooner]

I swear if valeera is as annoying as brann is I'm going to be sad

I hate that little bastard

With a passion

[golden loom]

its kinda funny tho, I loved hearthstone and loved the lore that it made me interested in, but always said I didnt wanna try wow cause it looked cringe and then I suddenly did last year and now here we are

[jolly stirrup]

Anyone have a good Poison reminder WA?

[static glacier]

it's wierd that I don't really like how rogue panned out in hs gameplay wise

[red sonnet]

if opening with double cd reduce, and at now, kinsbane solo or wait for death mark?

[lavish wing]

https://tenor.com/view/wait-that-thats-is-illegal-gif-18393263

[humble verge]

jaha.

[humble verge]

what in the fuck is this wa

[midnight scroll]

am i a psychopath if i wanna make a new character just to play a different spec?

[humble verge]

not really

but i have 3 assa rogues

[midnight scroll]

yea man i find it kinda weird having to collect two separate item loadouts on a single character idk

and also leveling a rogue - horrible experience.

[buoyant pumice]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[potent lintel]

Does each ambush add 3 stacks of deathmark?

Is the goal to get as much ambush in a single window?

[midnight scroll]

if you mean deathstalker's mark then yes

[midnight scroll]

and i don't understand what you meant by this

[shrewd night]

I relevelled a class to learn a spec. Somehow it helped my brain connect the dots on skills and how to play them better than just reading a guide did

Did it with subtlety, did it with disc, also did it with marksman I think

[humble verge]

is it time to commit full sub

[shrewd night]

Stats that matter > stats that doesnt matter

[midnight scroll]

do you mean while leveling or after getting to max level?

[shrewd night]

I mean, I had a max level rogue, levelled a second rogue as the spec I was trying to "learn"

[midnight scroll]

oh yeah definitely, that's why i'm hellbent on leveling as sub even though it's basically spectator mode as some points in dungeons

[red schooner]

I started that with an outlaw rogue before going, wait, why would I want to play outlaw

[dawn seal]

how do u guys do good in dungeons

[vestal wren]

See there are people who play the game for fun

[dawn seal]

I feel like I suck at dungeons

is it normal to lose to a hunter or frost on 1st pull of ara kara

[blazing tulip]

Send KB. Waiting 15 sec for it to align again is better than waiting 30 sec to send it with mark

[red schooner]

Outlaw sounds like the opposite of fun for me

[vestal wren]

Think everyone has different preferences, e.g I think subtlety is the most fun but it's in terms of effort/result also "why would you"

[red schooner]

If I show any inclination or knowledge of outlaw my RL will go, 'hey, can you swap to outlaw for this fight'

And I'm not giving him the option

I have an elesham main who got asked 'hey can you heal for one boss ', he's now full time healer.

I know how these traps work

[vestal wren]

Only fight outlaw is ahead is probably council

[red schooner]

Which is what we're on

And I hate that fight anyhow

[jaunty notch]

yo for fatebound opener, I was doing shiv(+macro tea)>deathmark(+ trincket and potion macro)>vanish>kingsbane

but I see that some people on lorrgs do shiv>deathmark>kingsbane>vanish, is there a difference at all or the output is the same ?

[normal prairie]

https://tenor.com/view/math-zach-galifianakis-mathematics-maths-equations-gif-11093327

[normal mist]

Guide does say kb+cb into vanish, so that's what I do

[analog field]

not 100% sure as KB without CB is shit but could be the case

[late magnet]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[cyan lily]

No rogue fix, insane lol

[red sonnet]

that's normal

rogue fix? nonexist

[weary stump]

Rogue doesn't get fixes, we get copium

If you want bug fixes you have to go play paladin and use discord shutdown tactics

[jaunty notch]

@balmy condor

[balmy condor]

Reload

[oak tangle]

anyone a poe2 fan?

cause i feel like looking up modifiers will get me into trouble

[frank vector]

anyone else lowkey pray for a gem slot in their vault so they can justify quitting rogue?

[earnest remnant]

cant say that i do

[red schooner]

Nah

I don't know how to play any other class

[frank vector]

do we spend our spark on a sword this week

[waxen oyster]

i mean if you want

sparks are not required to spend

[pure moth]

can always ask the outlaw channel.

[frank vector]

we dont spend sparks after dagger and wrist combo ascension combo?

[red schooner]

We can do depending on what drops we get

[frank vector]

are people actually holding sparks?

[royal lantern]

yeha?

im not throwing crests on a crafted item when i can upgrade a mythic item lol

[red schooner]

I am at the moment, had other items to spend crests on

Got an offhand dagger I need to dump crests into next week so it'll replace the MH

So my crests are accounted for for a bit

[frank vector]

what about a nice necklace

[royal lantern]

idk, as long as you can upgrade slots, using crests can feel kinda waste

exception is stuff like offhand or rings tbh

[crude helm]

Random thought, but you know how there’s dungeon slice sims or whatever. Has anyone thought of making sim profiles that mimic raid fights of the tier? Or is the juice not worth the squeeze?

[royal lantern]

thats a LOT of effort for something that borderline cant be done because of how killtimers and mechanic participation changes stuff

[normal mist]

These "perfect scenario sims" sound so stupid to me

My cat jumps on my keyboard, uses vanish or cloak or potion and GG, sim ruined

[cyan dew]

Just saw now. Tyvm Whispyr!

[normal mist]

I'm not a robot to be doing that kind of gameplay

[crude helm]

Yeah I guess kill times would be a little hard to work around. Along with like how fast adds are dying or certain phases are pushed

[normal mist]

Or even If you have to do mechanica

[crude helm]

Yeah

[jade abyss]

You see it wrong sims calculated that bcs they know thats cats improved our dps

[normal mist]

The cat in question

@jade abyss

[fast mural]

Wouldnt be cool to Give Rogue Smoke Bomb 30% Damage Reduction to all Group?

[waxen oyster]

what

that’d be grossly op

[fast mural]

for M_

[waxen oyster]

doesnt matter determining factor of that is damage

[coral ibex]

just give us whatever the effect for darkness is

who cares

i want utility

[waxen oyster]

minigamers need to stop with dumb cooks

[jade abyss]

It would be cool to create line of sight with it. Would be cool for some pulls

[waxen oyster]

[coral ibex]

dumb cooks

that literally existed

[waxen oyster]

30% dr

[coral ibex]

for like all of legion

[waxen oyster]

for whole group

nah bomb dr got removed after wod

[coral ibex]

was it 20% ?

[jade abyss]

Would that happen in game it would be a increase from 1000^

[waxen oyster]

10

[wooden timber]

big fan

[spice surge]

AMZ was 20% for a long while and only got nerfed to 15% this patch

So yeah its ofc better but not grossly overpowered

[waxen oyster]

waant amz cappd

at the dk’s hp

after cn

[spice surge]

Yeah but that never mattered in dungeons

It was only for raid

[waxen oyster]

yeah 30% all damage

would be lowkey gross

[quiet oriole]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6qnAFdVk4s2zD66Gr1kutJ

@balmy condor dude ty just changing weapon chant, fiber and gems gave me +110,807

[unborn rain]

does any class have atrophying poisons effect

[spice surge]

Theres no other class that brings atrophic poison no

[merry sparrow]

rogue

[oak tangle]

rogue has it

[unborn rain]

thats kinda important to raid comp isnt it

[oak tangle]

ehhhh

[spice surge]

Its fine

[unborn rain]

im a noob so iono

[merry sparrow]

thats what i keep telling my RL

[unborn rain]

i dont wanna reclear soulbinder bros

[oak tangle]

depends if your group is dying to too much damage or enrages

[royal lantern]

thats tthe point of raidbuffs? every class has a unique one

[zealous moth]

what about hunter

[oak tangle]

that mark for my parse

[zealous moth]

do they have anything?

[royal lantern]

hunters mark + great class for doing the ranged mechanics that all other ranged ignore while complaining about ranged mechanics

[unborn rain]

anyone know way to cheese trust rep

[royal lantern]

play the game

[unborn rain]

eww boring

[zealous moth]

oh yeah! i forgot about that

[unborn rain]

what the fuck bro

[zealous moth]

ngl i didn't know what hunters mark did until i googled it just now lol

i only knew what it does in hearthstone

[unborn rain]

yall see the new reddit sin post lol

[zealous moth]

no

link it

[royal lantern]

reddit + wow + rogue is the tripple cursed combo

[unborn rain]

yeah ik

[zealous moth]

+assassination

doomed

[royal lantern]

mfs that dont play the game telling you whats wrong about it

[unborn rain]

its titled week 1 vs week 5 rogue

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/s/6l1Y1Fhb5X

[zealous moth]

the fucking

[oak tangle]

welcome to week 1 720 daggers

[zealous moth]

tier2 armor

every time

[unborn rain]

not being able to westealth

is weawwy bad fow wogue

[spice surge]

They continue to add buttons to rogue, and nerfing them lol. It hurts to have such rotations and get nothing in return
This expac theyve removed 2 or 3 buttons, and added nothing

[zealous moth]

um ackshually

they added cold blood

[royal lantern]

BUTTON BLOAT

BRO THE BUTTON BLOAT

[zealous moth]

and i dont like macros

[royal lantern]

I CANT HOLD ALL THESE BUTTONS

[zealous moth]

https://tenor.com/view/nerd-emoji-nerdge-gif-23738139

[waxen oyster]

yeah tryan

[winged sun]

?

[waxen oyster]

how else am i supposed to bind toys

to half my bars

what the helly

[winged sun]

Its mostly outlaw

[unborn rain]

fuck i hate my 4 button rotation

[winged sun]

Not assa and sub lol

[spice surge]

Well even if you consider cold blood as an added button (which you absolutely shouldnt), its still net loss compared to before

[zealous moth]

i dont

[winged sun]

Not even rogues in rwf know how to play half decent outlaw

[coral ibex]

i mean idk about assa button bloat but i cant figure out why flag and shadow blades are separate abilities when you always press them together

[zealous moth]

just memeing

[winged sun]

No offense to any of them

[waxen oyster]

i only have cb on bars as sin

to look at the cd

when the dumb bug happens

[zealous moth]

so they can use them seaparately to do rik barrels

[waxen oyster]

and by that i really mean

[zealous moth]

work the rogue harder, not smarter

[waxen oyster]

i have it on showtooltip

for my control shard macro bind

[wanton spear]

only reason i keep a majority of buttons on unbound keys is to track incase they bug out lol.

[dense willow]

it's ok @balmy condor will close the sub and then when all 12 of us take to reddit blizzard will have to listen to us

[spice surge]

Like if you compare current assa to early dragonflgith youve lost Echoing Reprimand, Sepsis, Exsang, Bonespike and Shadow Dance as buttons

[spice surge]

And arguably tea

How is that adding more buttons

[oak tangle]

i would post this 100 times

[wanton spear]

so now that we are dead last on wowheads charts, think we will get any tuneing or just the normal blizz gives zero fk's about rogues.

[golden loom]

And slice and dice

[oak tangle]

but i will not get server banned for those pink dogs

[spice surge]

Oh ye snd too

[waxen oyster]

wowhead is so desperate for clicks

that they post anything

[oak tangle]

people see spells, don't read it's automated, and cry "too many spells"

[waxen oyster]

thats why i instantly decline when they tell me

to turn off my adblockers

[oak tangle]

AMBUSH AND MUTILATE TOO MANY GENERATORS

[waxen oyster]

fuck them

[wanton spear]

well so far every class that has gone to the bottom of "wowheads expert opinion list" has gotten tuneing lol

[zealous moth]

we'll get 2% buff to singular focus (it's not even working)

[waxen oyster]

you said rogues

the entire class isnt at the bottom

so...

[wanton spear]

i wonder how much damage all 3 of our specs would gain if they fixed all our bugs, not even tuneing litterly just fix our bugs.

[waxen oyster]

idk outlaw needs jesus

[wanton spear]

outlaw needs to be just reworked into a support bard spec for midnight

[royal lantern]

do you think rogue is losing dmg based on bugs, and is not just tuned kinda bad rn and is plagued by weird design choices?

[oak tangle]

nah, fuck em

[onyx pond]

this is the worst thing i ever heard about outlaw

[waxen oyster]

all the boomers will pretend how hard their leather fury warrior was

"Back in my day"

https://tenor.com/view/abe-simpson-abe-simpson-cloud-yelling-cloud-angry-gif-12558964

[wanton spear]

bring back "combat daggers"

[royal lantern]

bro i had to like

press sinester strike

and then eviscerare when CP full

and sometimes apply SnD again

#bringbackcombat

[waxen oyster]

[unborn rain]

lol

[waxen oyster]

i tried combat a few times

most braindead spec

ever

[unborn rain]

it was so hard putting heroic strike on scroll
wheel

and pressing ur 3 button opener

[royal lantern]

and thats why all the reddit brains say they want combat back btw

[waxen oyster]

too hard

let me play mage

and frostbolt

for 10 minutes

[royal lantern]

"the FANTASY behind Combat!!!"

what fantasy

like srsly

[wanton spear]

at least it was 60% oh boy i hope i flip the right coin this time

[unborn rain]

sinister strike

had the best audio effect

[waxen oyster]

nah game muted

raid leader 30%

music 200%

true vibing

[pliant remnant]

That is the way

[little tulip]

shiv's lil plonk noise was a classic

actually that's gonne be my refund sound for sub

cause it's not used anymore

[wanton spear]

i want swirly ball back

[spice surge]

Today is NA reset so we get another set of people coming in here asking if the bugs are fixed

[waxen oyster]

it still exists

[main bridge]

Don’t forget the screenshots of vault and character asking what to pick!

[long oak]

hi guys, haven't they fixed the assa yet?

[normal mist]

I enjoy seeing other people have luck in their vaults, I do not enjoy feelscraft

They did

Check the pins

[zealous moth]

guys what do i pick

[little tulip]

lizard 🦎

[normal mist]

The trinket

[coral ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/bongo-cat-rogue-gif-24661232

[wanton spear]

I wanna see netherprism get nerfed into the ground, thats what i wanna see

[coral ibex]

the good ol days

[little tulip]

boots should have been a craftable recipe

[spice surge]

[desert crest]

They will never do that tho

Would be crazy

[zealous moth]

they should jus

[main bridge]

That would be cool

[coral ibex]

why would they do that

[zealous moth]

remove ALL gear except daggers

so only rogues can play the game

[coral ibex]

are you mad that hunters are doing big damage

[wanton spear]

just make a pug raid and have yourself as the only leather, ez profit

[coral ibex]

or something

lol

[zealous moth]

except outlaws bc fuck outlaws apparently

[little tulip]

they want the game to be more comp focused and rogue is low prio for balancing

cause we're so check+

[desert crest]

Wow players will have the most insane takes and pretend like it is not dumb af

[little tulip]

we had a mm hunter yesterday doing gonga trash and boss damage with 5 interrupts on an eco 13 by 2nd boss

[royal lantern]

Gamers are just braindead in general

[little tulip]

we did not time the key

[main bridge]

You mean like you are doing now?

[desert crest]

Atleast the vocal part of every player base

I have hope that there is a sane quiet part out there

[royal lantern]

"uhm, if you have trouble fixing bugs, just SWAP THE ENGINE"

every very smart playerbase ever

[desert crest]

This guy gets it

[main bridge]

A BM hunter doin 5k overall in my key last night started backseating the tank so the tank told them to STFU and they made salty comments the whole key lmao

[waxen oyster]

i went into lfr on a 668 pally

and was 3rd on dps using obr

wtf are people doing

[wanton spear]

had a bm friend of mine proove a point to another hunter who said black arrow was bad, proceeded to do 11 mil overall in a 10 lol

[little tulip]

hunter..is bloated..

[royal lantern]

in lfr, most are kinda afk

[main bridge]

I think it’s ok for people to be bad in LFR. That’s the point of LFR

[onyx pond]

i would never trust blizzard doin that

[spice lagoon]

yoo vault coming up in 13 min?

[main bridge]

Yes

[waxen oyster]

you'll know when this channel is flooded with

"what do i pick"

[unborn rain]

chat

[royal lantern]

that has nothing to do with "trust"

"swap enginges" is literally a buzzword for "i have no clue how games work at all, heared the word once and now act smart"

[unborn rain]

am i cooked if i dont feel like asking why my trials been going on 200% longer than everyone elses

[spice lagoon]

i swear every tuesday is like chrismas

[unborn rain]

better than christmas

[wanton spear]

except your the kid your parents don't like, and you get to watch your siblings open up what they wanted to get lol

[royal lantern]

nah

if tuesday is like christmas, it means you are from NA

[little tulip]

tuesday is a good day

[severe meadow]

Mythic antenna in vault the week we killed it, I’m the liked kid

[little tulip]

the weekend is over and thursday is like right there

[spice lagoon]

yeah vault stupid sometimes .

[oak tangle]

yeah it's wednesday

[zealous moth]

guys what's the pick

[severe meadow]

Pant

[analog field]

is this from midnight vault?

[zealous moth]

thank

[onyx pond]

new camera

[analog field]

squish incoming

[zealous moth]

no it's my current vault

[oak tangle]

is midnight on ptr yet

[severe meadow]

Castle Nathria in midnight?

[spice lagoon]

whats this from years ago lol?

[zealous moth]

haven't played in a while

[coral ibex]

i mean you can look at the labels on the boxes

[zealous moth]

yeah idk a random screenshot i found on google lol

[fresh kelp]

10 raid boss vault

[coral ibex]

its from castle nathria in shadowlands

[zealous moth]

i'm just shitposting bc im bored

[oak tangle]

if you wanna see some crazy shit i just had a motor racing short https://www.youtube.com/shorts/_Cz4Sb6GKIE

[spice lagoon]

i hoping soon i would like to try it out

[unborn rain]

if i get myth antenna ib my vault ima gquit

[waxen oyster]

what pick

[spice lagoon]

augury

[blazing kayak]

ima need some help team

is this an obvious lily pick?

chest with bis stats

[hoary mist]

yay antenna

[unborn rain]

the trial goes on

[magic fossil]

what is the best set piece to drop?

gloves?

[oak tangle]

idk to be happy or not

[coral ibex]

first potentially dead vault, but i think im taking the ring

really dont like how much haste is in my vault when im trying to also play sub

nothing really notable on the alt either

[forest nacelle]

what stats are on that neck?

[fallow canopy]

Crit vers

I lied

[coral ibex]

no its big haste small mast

[forest nacelle]

gross

[coral ibex]

chest is haste mast

ring is haste mast

[forest nacelle]

super gross

if trying to play sub

[coral ibex]

sorry chest is crit haste

even worse

[forest nacelle]

still

[static glacier]

I wanna see netherprism Sub rogue get nerfed into the ground, thats what i wanna see - ftfy

[forest nacelle]

https://tenor.com/view/getout-gif-16327023334064302194

[static glacier]

they nerf nether prism sub dies

[forest nacelle]

😄

[cunning needle]

join us

[forest nacelle]

idk im playing sin atm

can't get into sub

otherwise would join

[cunning needle]

why would you say something so hurtful and mean

[oak tangle]

lily does an 'okay' back up job

[spice surge]

This not low enough for you?

[forest nacelle]

its that low? sheeeeeeeeeeesh!

[static glacier]

im not saying I want it nerfed

but asking prism nerfs is just asking for sub to be murdered

[forest nacelle]

wait who asking for that?

[static glacier]

also no one who is mentally stable will play sub on frac

[static glacier]

look who my original message responded to

[minor dagger]

!gear

!gear

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1405681489470951594/sin_.webp

[static glacier]

also fury out here pressing 2 buttons

[forest nacelle]

?

oh

[static glacier]

bro do you understand the whole ftfy meme?

[forest nacelle]

nvm

carry on

im just out here being silly.

[static glacier]

tbh if we're being real

they need to give sub dmg outside of cds

it's too bad actually

[main bobcat]

Yeah sure buddy put the wildfire bomb in the bag

[static glacier]

bro isn't even subbed and stalks here

[spice spire]

Damn tell that fraud

[static glacier]

😔

[spice spire]

I can respect a real hater

[main bobcat]

I am subbed

Just not playing

[static glacier]

gg

scammed

[forest nacelle]

i play survival hunter so....

or used too.

[static glacier]

are you eu?

[spice spire]

says he’s subbed
outlaw role

[forest nacelle]

nah

[spice spire]

[static glacier]

he's just a sub

and im the top

🙂

[main bobcat]

Top bald meter

[spice spire]

Damn Mo a freak FR

[static glacier]

but ye i play with this guy, or used to

[spice spire]

I figured

[static glacier]

and he somehow always dms me for other games EXACTLY when raid starts

it's unreal

[main bobcat]

It's just unlucky

[spice spire]

No one just starts hating on one person in particular if they’re randos

[main bobcat]

Nah bro I just hate

[static glacier]

ye, we've been friends for years and he has always hated

[zealous moth]

still can't connect

i want to yell at my vault

[spice spire]

So when are you guys gonna kiss

I’m tryna watch

[main bobcat]

We did several times

[spice spire]

[fallow canopy]

Save your energy so you yell louder at it later

[main bobcat]

You just weren't there

[static glacier]

y'know what the most criminal thing about sub's frac performance is

[spice spire]

Without me?

Wtf

[main bobcat]

Uhuh

[static glacier]

the kill timer is really good for 90s specs

[spice surge]

Not anymore, but yes used to be

[static glacier]

people killing before 4:30 now?

or like 4:46

[spice surge]

Yes but even like 4:35

Doesnt let you use your cds

And theres another 3% this week

[static glacier]

not too bad yet, this week might ruin it

[fallow canopy]

I'm just counting on people dying so the fight goes longer

[static glacier]

real

[fallow canopy]

[static glacier]

if you die you can guarantee the fight is a good killtimer for you

[dense willow]

Dead vault what do

[static glacier]

give me a % of how much you play all the rogue specs

adding up to 100

[oak tangle]

signet isn't ass

[dense willow]

sin 80% sub 20%

Have mythic lilly and hero forge

[oak tangle]

it's no netherprism though

[static glacier]

oof

belt or socket then unless you are missing myth legs

[oak tangle]

socket ur shit fam

[dense willow]

myth tier legs already

[oak tangle]

dont sleep on sockets

[dense willow]

gg

[static glacier]

socket or belt then, sim it

check catalyst belt if ur done with myth cata pieces

[oak tangle]

this is the week i get a heroic netherprism

[shut coral]

It was my week to get a h netherprism

[static glacier]

maybe this week's 3x myth vault has prism

[shut coral]

maybe

[static glacier]

to replace normal prism / luily

(cope)

[zealous moth]

what is this garbage

[shut coral]

Tbh, i have a H Prism and Myth Lily atm 😐

[zealous moth]

i thought this was a healer trinket lmao

[static glacier]

its not that bad

worse than antenna / pace / crystal

but servicable

can show you top logs running it if you like

[zealous moth]

i very much doubt it will beat H antena and prism/lily

[zealous moth]

fr?

[oak tangle]

depends how selfish you are

[static glacier]

probably not h antenna ye

[zealous moth]

damn

[static glacier]

ye gimmie a moment

[zealous moth]

A RING I JUST NOTICED