assassination

[runic hinge]

Time to play bleed kitty

[winged sun]

crazy that feral is already stronger than sub

[runic hinge]

[winged sun]

and its getting buffs

[uneven plume]

sub is shit

[midnight mist]

Crazy that feral is already stronger than udk

[nova aspen]

feral is only bad in raid

in keys its solid

[runic hinge]

I want to run 1 minute convoke is that okay with you guys?

[midnight mist]

No

[winged sun]

ye my bad sub is op in raid thats why it isn't getting a buff

[midnight mist]

Sub doesn't deserve a buff because it was once again the prog spec

So we keeping it shitty

Till next prog

[winged sun]

as a matter of fact

can we actually get a sub nerf

i'd really like to see one

[midnight mist]

Real

Fuck sub

[winged sun]

i really dont want to consider playing sub in rookery last boss

like

[midnight mist]

Buff spatter

[winged sun]

if its already annoying

[uneven plume]

sub gets nerfed with no skyfury anyways

[winged sun]

make it completely gone

[coral ibex]

-2

[midnight mist]

-2 targets cap?

[winged sun]

zac is still mad i gapped him in our last rookery key

[midnight mist]

Hard cap spatter at 2

[winged sun]

brb gonna make coffee

[winged sun]

spoiler alert chat

we depleted too

[midnight mist]

Cause zeross did too low DPS

[nova aspen]

[sick mantle]

I see top rogues going back to KB build - is it performing better than full bleed build now ??

[uneven plume]

cause in high keys you actually need to kill a target

bleed has 0 prio

[jaunty warren]

@winged sun when you do a patchwerk quick sim with default settings is your actual DPS higher,lower or roughly the same ?

[winged sun]

no

bleed build better

play that

[midnight mist]

Lower than outlaw dps that's for sure

[nova aspen]

[winged sun]

higher/lower than the subterfuge builds or wdym

[sick mantle]

Why are many going with KB then in higher keys ?

[winged sun]

because its only better in high keys

[coral ibex]

because you actually need prio damage in very high keys

[winged sun]

and people are copying me because they think a 19 key is like a +12

[coral ibex]

in reality it likely doesn't matter what build you play in the keys you are doing

[jaunty warren]

Trying to determine what skill level = sim dps . Is the sim assume a skill level closer to @winged sun or closer to average?

[barren zenith]

when does hybrid start being relevant again? +16s? +17s? or higher

[winged sun]

idk how much i sim on pure st i can check now but with bl i consistently do 1.9-2.1m

never below 1.9m with lust

even with downtime

[cyan trellis]

Does playing with a physical comp change this at high keys?

[winged sun]

unless downtime is big

i'll sim now and see if its the same

about lower than how much dps i do but thats because the fight is 5 mins in sims maybe

oh nvm even in 19s bosses last 5 mins

well

looks the same yeah

[jaunty warren]

And you typically parse orange yes ?

[winged sun]

wdym

in raids or

[nova aspen]

hes the only rogue doing 19's

[jaunty warren]

Raid

[winged sun]

99-100s

parses are fake tho u can still get way lower than a 99 if u have bad luck

[jaunty warren]

Yeah parses are meh…just trying to get a ref point for good play vs what the sim says my toon could do.

Tyvm for checking and the answer

[winged sun]

for example heres kujo with the insane downtime on the fight

on +19

no lust

how much do i sim without lust lets see

[uneven plume]

can do more with funnel

on that boss

[winged sun]

u arent gonna push shit on that boss are u crazy

[uneven plume]

we did on 18

[uneven plume]

get slimes and the other one for kujo pull

when you skip drill

[winged sun]

u pulled a dog

with kujo?

[uneven plume]

can LoS the slime aoe behind box

no

the slimes

[winged sun]

ah

[uneven plume]

next to the drill you skip

[winged sun]

doesnt look like its needed tho

[uneven plume]

shroud

[winged sun]

actually

i like that

will steal

[uneven plume]

xD

[winged sun]

because slimes with the small dogs is way worse

[uneven plume]

also in rookery

you can cracklin jade ascendeant

and not pull little guys

[winged sun]

we did 2 big slimes with 5 dogs on +19

idk how we lived that

[uneven plume]

can have funnel for shield and burn phase

shroud little guys after killing the two ascendeants

[winged sun]

whats that

[uneven plume]

ohh yoiu dont run with monk

nvm

[winged sun]

whats the ascendant

[uneven plume]

the dude that shoots our 4 orbs

when you parasale down

you pull two of them

you can pull the second one without his little ads around him

[winged sun]

wait

[uneven plume]

can use those for funnel for shield

[winged sun]

u keep the smallies there?

[uneven plume]

yah

[winged sun]

ah

[uneven plume]

and then use the second set of little guys for burn

[winged sun]

might be cool if i play sin but i dont

[uneven plume]

dont need to swap sub

yah

i dont have cards

so i cant swap -.-

[winged sun]

sub is just way safer to play so ye

i think we had 2 mins left with a brewmaster

so thats not bad

ye

[uneven plume]

yah brew is good on that boss

how do you guys do first boss

in rook

you guys pull in ads?

while rotating?

[winged sun]

ngl thats not the point its just sub that solo's the boss

[winged sun]

we didd 1 pack

just for safety

could've done way more i feel like

[uneven plume]

we pull in a pack after every phase he does with beams

[winged sun]

can u show route

[uneven plume]

we pull 6 first]

then the corner one in 5

then corner one in 3

[winged sun]

wait can we do this then

2 pulls then boss LOL

[uneven plume]

we skip the three thunderers

in pull 4

[winged sun]

u dont play them

[uneven plume]

yah that works but we skip the three in pull 4

[winged sun]

at all ye?

[uneven plume]

yah we just hug

whiule rotating

[winged sun]

wtf wait

holy shit

imagine

this route

legit 5-7 mins left route

[uneven plume]

yah thats what we do

[winged sun]

crushers yea?

[uneven plume]

yah

[winged sun]

ok ok ok

[uneven plume]

pull 2 we save the corner one to pull in

during fight

[winged sun]

i feel like 3 packs is ok

[nova aspen]

how u skip that

[winged sun]

shroud

or meld from tank

[humble verge]

how the fuck would you skip 3pack on first boss

[uneven plume]

hug

[humble verge]

most of the time i know stupid ass people just pull them

[winged sun]

brb making coffee and shit

[royal lantern]

isnt it normaly coffee->wait 30min->shit?

[ebon glen]

Sometimes less than 30 !

[nova aspen]

do u pull the corner in 6 with boss?

then after every beam set?

[gusty mirage]

Don’t put creamer/milk and you won’t have to shit

[uneven plume]

we start with the thunderers in pull 6 with boss

then the other corner with bird thats in pull 6

then the corner bird in pull 3

[nova aspen]

ahh i see

[runic hinge]

It’s too late. I’ve been Pavlov’ed into it

[barren yarrow]

Anyone on mythic sprocket?

I just need some help with knowing when you’re using CDs / burst.

[royal lantern]

just use on cd? there is nothing to wait for

i mean, ofc dont use cds 3seconds before the knockback intermission

[eternal nacelle]

Is 20mil kingsbane decent in one use ?

[unborn wharf]

Yo for the first pull of cinderbrew 16+ what's better at those super high target counts bleed or hybrid

[tropic jewel]

I think hybrid maybe Talking over here

[uneven plume]

I play hybrid because we triple muscle first pull and one needs to die asap

[unborn wharf]

Yeah same we do triple muscle

[nova aspen]

standard hybrid or dashing?

[tropic jewel]

I really Like the dashing one

[uneven plume]

standard with double vanish

[nova aspen]

ive been trying to time 16 with the dashing one

but ill try standard

[winged sun]

why not before and after

sims higher for me

like

taking 2 shits is better than 1

imagine doing a +5 key and a +5 key

would u rather just do a +10 once

u may get 4 items in a +5

but on a +10

u may get none

[crimson cargo]

Why do some forced induction build go crit/vers instead of crit/mast? Just wondering what the reasoning is behind it. I know that you should just sim, but, wondering 🙂

[runic hinge]

Probably cause it simmed higher for them

[nova aspen]

zeross said he does it to live in a 19

[barren zenith]

smoking a cig while drinking my coffee also sims higher for the upcoming shit

[crimson cargo]

Ok so just def benefit?

[nova aspen]

oi

def benefit?

[crimson cargo]

Or offensive :p

[nova aspen]

idk he prob simmed and even if it simmed a slight dps loss

the survivability is valued higher

in 18s/19s

if ur doing 12s just sim whats best for damage

[winged sun]

0.2% loss ish

0.1-0.2% on each craft

[nova aspen]

yea

[velvet vault]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[crimson cargo]

Seems like quality of life even on lower keys haha. To live easier for .2 loss. Should be more ST though? Or no?

[royal lantern]

i can gurantee you that it wont make you survive stuff more easy

[silk sundial]

I can't speak for 18s. Highest I've done is 14s. In a 14 rookery the last boss slams for about 5.4 unmitigated, with feint it's laughable.

[coral ibex]

guys if i completely shift my stats to vers, i'll be able to live damage that i'd live just with a feint

[royal lantern]

i mean, the absolute mega giga high keys where you survive mechanics with deff cds up at 3% hp

sure

[silk sundial]

I imagine you need the vers to live hits through defensives in 18s

[royal lantern]

but outside of that, vers is a cope stat "for deffensives"

just use your shit

[coral ibex]

i think its likely that bro is not doing the same level of keys as zeross

[ebon glen]

Sounds like a healer problem to me

defensives..psh

[inland escarp]

Run super duper high vers and save feint energy, duh

[chrome mirage]

How does sin play on OAB, are we just ruptering the assistants and then just back to boss?

[coral ibex]

hit boss rupture snipe adds

[chrome mirage]

Figured, thank you.

[fresh mica]

is there any dmg loss for taking of crippling because the slow is sometimes annyoning

[pseudo brook]

is there any macro to avoid to feint when you are already on feint ?

[coral ibex]

yes make a cast sequence macro

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[coral ibex]

use this but replace thistle tea with feint

and dont include shiv

and adjust the reset= to the duration of feint

[hoary mist]

Panic Double feint overlap

[nova aspen]

-1 lethal dose stack

so yes

[pseudo brook]

not working, I can't launch the second feint

after 10sec

[nova aspen]

but its minimal so take it off if it helps the group

[fresh mica]

ye floodgate my tank gets mad at me

[nova aspen]

could also just not FoK until tank gathers the pull

[pseudo brook]

with this macro I can launch feint 1 time and then can't

[coral ibex]

remove the null

oh that just still spams it

hm idk why this works differently to the tea macro

[pseudo brook]

yeah I tried to remove and it's just spamming

[royal lantern]

but feint has a internal GCD?

like, unless you are literally giga spamming it multiple times for like 3seconds, you should not use 2 at once

[strange tundra]

ok this worked

💀

[inland dirge]

this is so unfathomably based

m+ mains have been a consistent source of headaches for my guild as of late

[warm lantern]

what rank is your guild?

[inland dirge]

[fallen arch]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[inland dirge]

we were US 46/World 172 per WCL, pretty stinky tier for us in general

[warm lantern]

suprised that people would be m+ griefing at that rank

[coral ibex]

the emplus disease doesn't discriminate

[inland dirge]

i mean they didn't grief specifically due to m+

just saying that they were self-proclaimed m+ mains

coincidence? i think not

[coral ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/i-think-not-coincidence-coincidence-i-think-not-i-dont-think-so-gif-22491031

[spice spire]

Extremely based

[shy creek]

Anybody know if zoldyck recipe is accounted for in sims at all

[coral ibex]

[red schooner]

It is

[coral ibex]

our execute talent?

it would be a major issue if it wasn't accounted for

[shy creek]

It would be, but I wonder how its even accounted for

[spice spire]

You’re fighting a patchwerk boss

It accounts for boss health as well

That’s why it’s not on target dummy simms

[stuck knoll]

The boss health goes down steadily

so starts at 100% and ends at 0%

[humble verge]

man

i almost crashed on a frontal, streaming aint it

[strange tundra]

let zac do the streaming

[humble verge]

nah im streaming mugzee

need to kill it before another guild we compete with

[strange tundra]

good luck mate

[rotund oak]

u compete with yourself,no one else

now go kill it b4 i slap u

[humble verge]

u cant tell me what to do when we're wiping

[rotund oak]

https://tenor.com/sHPgMZAe2Ft.gif

[slim geyser]

what's going on with my char ?

[warm lantern]

int dagger?

[humble verge]

💀

[slim geyser]

serious answers only XD

[rotund oak]

💀

first of all u are a female panda

Mathias Shaw would throw u into the stockades

lock u up

[normal mist]

wdym with going on?

[rotund oak]

https://tenor.com/iVHfOCSb4ph.gif

[coral ibex]

i dont see anything wrong with that picture

[normal mist]

me neither, no raid buffs, 5 min patch

seems fine

[coral ibex]

you simmed without buffs

[rotund oak]

u dont see a panda

maybe an opthalmologist

[slim geyser]

right, didn't notice no buffs

my damage just seems abysmally low, wow analyzer isn't saying anything too wrong

thought my stats are fucked or something

[normal mist]

stats are never fucked

with assa

[strange tundra]

wtf did i just walk in to

[normal mist]

Sims without raid buffs

[rotund oak]

we basicly need to see the sim

judging from a photo is just wrong

[strange tundra]

ok back to struggle

[normal mist]

Good luck Yeat

[strange tundra]

2 15s so far both brick by fucked routes and deaths

why is outlaw top again

[zenith plank]

do we use enchants on weapons or sharpening stones?

or whetstones*

[hollow river]

wowhead has lists of all enchants/consumables

https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/rogue/assassination/enchants-gems-pve-dps

[zenith plank]

i literally am blind because i did not see the whetstone XD thanks

[empty quartz]

in theory if i had 4k crit, would i need more targets to change from mut to FoK

👀

[normal mist]

https://tenor.com/view/james-franco-wait-what-wut-wtf-nani-gif-25479769

[hollow river]

[normal mist]

Rewrite that question in a way a newbie can understand

[empty quartz]

i feel like getting 1 CP half the time with FoK on 5t is kinda int

bc of my crit

[fallow canopy]

Crit is a skill diff stat, just crit bro xd

[normal mist]

FoK also deals damage

it isnt JUST for the CPs

[empty quartz]

right, i'm just curious is there's any equation for unusually low crit

[normal mist]

And just sim you character in Dslice and see what it says

if you need more crit or not

[viscid spear]

[empty quartz]

i do in fact want and need more crit, but it's my sub gear cba to recraft etc

[hollow river]

you should be fine just following the normal rotation

[empty quartz]

cool, thanks

[hollow river]

but prioritize changing some stuff around when you can ofc

gear wise i mean

[normal mist]

(IF THE SIMS SAYS SO!)

how much crit is 4k?

[hollow river]

it definitely says so

[empty quartz]

aye, one day i will have good rings to swap

[hollow river]

like 1 ring

[normal mist]

LOL

[sacred schooner]

[empty quartz]

that much

[hollow river]

but assa is kinda known for being able to use sub gear just fine

[normal mist]

Normagi avoiding crit like i avoid taxes (For legal reasons, this is a joke!)

Who said that

[fallow canopy]

Cauldron ring gives like 6k

[spice surge]

Sub doesnt care that much about stats either, as long as youre not going all out on haste its fine

[empty quartz]

i guess if you wanna multispec sin/sub you'd just craft crit/mastery yeah

but that's for later

[humble verge]

fuck

[hollow river]

[humble verge]

i want to post mp4

but i post spotify inv

[hollow river]

Nande?

なんで？

[rotund oak]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[rotund oak]

wowhead

prio list on aoe rotation

(you are welcome)

[near valley]

bro has 20% tax avoidance tertiaries

[wooden timber]

https://tenor.com/view/kurimanju-happy-chiikawa-kurimanju-kurimanju-kurimanju-smile-gif-8750623333879293113

[lavish wing]

soo, what do we drop for IW in bleed build?

[hollow river]

shiv charge

[hidden bay]

Nothing

You just don’t play it

[hollow river]

the loss wasn't too terrible last i heard

IW is just comfy in pugs

[lavish wing]

i heard its 2% overall, no?

[hidden bay]

I need accurate sims for this. Cook some crazy API shit @balmy condor

[hollow river]

idr exact numbers

i mean

you can just sim it

[hidden bay]

I have no hands

[hollow river]

i know you have hands

[lavish wing]

we need one button sims

[spice surge]

Its going to be shit

Dw about it

[lavish wing]

no i mean sims that u do with pressing just one button

[hollow river]

in-game API button

"CLICK HERE TO SIM"

and it just automatically tells you:

1. your best gear combination of what you have/whats in vault
2. your best crest upgrades/crafts
3. droptimizer items to farm

[haughty flicker]

[hollow river]

simc is almost as popular as hekili

blizzard should implement

[lavish wing]

im surprised they aint doing anything about nameplates

ppl r using plater tidy/threat plates for like decade or more

[hollow river]

better plates would be nice

even if they just opened them up so we can customize them better with addons

[buoyant mauve]

trueeeee

[hollow river]

there's a couple annoying limitations

[lavish wing]

im not entirely happy with threat plates, but whenever i tried swappin to Plater I got overwhelmed by the amount of settings

[near valley]

pretty sure they said they are working on that too

[lilac hare]

Hi guys, i am kinda confused, siming raidbots, suggesting to replace Culminating Blasphemite with mastery/vers gem

should i follow?

[lavish wing]

and never cared just taking someones

[near valley]

nameplates is like the only thing holding me back from going default

[lavish wing]

if they did I missed it

[hollow river]

Just use someone else’s profile. It’s very easy

[sick marsh]

Hello sorry to disturb, i'm progressing on mugzee I heard rogue can get out of jails, anyone know if this is step or hook from outlaw ? or something else ?

[marble hemlock]

they cannot, unless they play voidelf

assa can cleave off of the boss and it still hits the goons tho

[buoyant mauve]

quazii has pretty good plater profile imo

[sick marsh]

ok ty !

[hollow river]

Jundies plater is better imo

Quazii’s is good and I still use it on some characters, but I’m starting to prefer Jundies after trying it this season

[buoyant herald]

i keep seeing people with jundies and it looks real nice, usually use quazii but maybe i'll give it a shot

[hollow river]

I would def recommend at least trying it

[marsh ferry]

i'm still using cev's plates 😭

[hollow river]

You might have to add/remove some debuff tracking

That’s about it tho

[tame charm]

what is the weakaura that tracks uptime and cds in the middle of the screen called

[buoyant herald]

oof yeah

that's the one thing i had to spend time doing with quazii

[hollow river]

Yeah

[buoyant herald]

remove 80% of the assass debuffrs

[hollow river]

Any plater profile you get is going to require that

Idk about Atrocity’s

[worn geyser]

its just a weak aura pack/ try type !wa for a few options

atority’s uses a good bit of jundies stuff, but has weird colors in the newest version but its pretty clean i use it

[lavish wing]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[buoyant herald]

i think jundies red plates for default npcs is gonna throw me lol

but the rest of the features, wew lad ok

we try that after work today

[hollow river]

Iirc the big difference for me

[humble verge]

last pull

[hollow river]

Was Quazii’s had no pandemic indicators on plates

[buoyant herald]

yeah thats a huge appeal

[hollow river]

But Jundies does have a default pandemic script

[buoyant herald]

should just be able to snip my debuff blacklist actually

[velvet cairn]

please dont go assa on mugzee friends

let me have this

[ripe rapids]

Do we use the CtW proc on ST?

[velvet cairn]

not with VV

its only on 3 targets if i remember right with current raid build

[ripe rapids]

ok ty

[velvet cairn]

with lingering darkness i think

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[bronze pike]

@ whipsy whispy

sim sim NOAW

is twlight dev still on top?

[marble hemlock]

it never was

void ritual was on top and it wasnt even close

[spice spire]

GM

[bronze pike]

gm

or afternoon i suppose

[spice spire]

I said what I said

[bronze pike]

i didnt sleep till 5am

[bronze pike]

it was top in my heart

[uneven plume]

@balmy condor we got corruption sims yet?

[warm mulch]

Hey lads, I was sub, looking to move over to assa, just because of it seeming that much better. Though in my sims, sin sims about 100k less? Is this just a stat issue or is it something else?
Sub:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ocwezsPDphp5Z7RSSejerG
Sin:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2kuKV6KmVYzZft6cTpcBvF

[coral ibex]

well sub gets another cd usage on a 5m fight vs assa

since sub is a 90s spec

[red schooner]

130 pulls in on sprocket

release me

from this nightmare

[spice spire]

No

[lusty kraken]

I start to enjoy the low apm

I am turning into one of you boomers

[midnight scroll]

has anyone done the underpin as sin?

[spice spire]

Yes

[spice spire]

Always have been

[lusty kraken]

No

[pliant remnant]

https://simulationcraft.org/reports/TWW2_Raid.html

[lusty kraken]

I still play outlaw

But assa is relaxing

[pliant remnant]

buff assa, nerf sub

👍🏿

[red schooner]

Please

[midnight scroll]

what curios were you using?

[spice spire]

Gonna be real

I don’t even remember @runic hinge didn’t you do it recently

[nova fractal]

I terrified I’ll end the same way started sprocket Thursday second night tomorrow prayge

[red schooner]

It depends on how much you bribe your ranged players

[strange tundra]

@red schooner @nova fractal not too late to be a m+ gamer

[spice spire]

Idk if you can say slurs like that yeat

[velvet cairn]

just commit what you like, both good. assa usually better in execute if u live long ig

[spice spire]

[red schooner]

Nah I really don't enjoy key pushing

[static glacier]

if u get a single mechanic during sub cds it bricks ur damage, simwise sub is better but in realistic situations sin tends to do better on average

[spice spire]

Whatcha pushing bud

[red schooner]

Keys

[spice spire]

Bud you just said you don’t enjoy it

Make up your mind!

[red schooner]

I occasionally get dragged into it

And I regret it

Every time

[velvet cairn]

relateable af

[spice spire]

Homie keys are nice

[coral ibex]

https://d.fixupx.com/AceanFronk/status/1860509763714339074

[grand trail]

first kill of gallywix :))

[velvet cairn]

giga gratz

[grand trail]

aswell 😄

easy life

damn that boss is actually fun after p1

[velvet cairn]

wait is that mythic

[grand trail]

ye

[velvet cairn]

how is my log 49 T_T

[spice spire]

Ty

[runic hinge]

as spriest LOL

[spice spire]

Lmfao

Ain’t no way dog

[humble verge]

@rotund oak im gonna go dig a hole

[coral ibex]

i think the boomkin gromnak clip is better than muh push week

[winged quail]

boomkins are not people

[inland dirge]

eagerly awaiting the next professor gromnak compilation

[runic hinge]

Yeah Assa just felt weird breaking the shield. Needed kb for it which kinda lines up but the boss kinda sucks for melee up time so I went spriest cause void weaver does extra shield

[spice spire]

I mean you just kinda sent and it worked

But the easier one was far and away Warrior

[coral ibex]

https://www.twitch.tv/method/clip/ColorfulCuteKeyboardOSsloth-c1jrBiFcA53dV5sa

i love how he catches himself at the end

"hmm."

[winged quail]

caught himself a bit late lmao

[wise plume]

man every time i try and pug a +13, it's like all common sense was deleted from their brains as soon as the key dropped

[worn geyser]

the same things occurs in 14s also, it does not get better

[stable cove]

does any one know how much of a dmg increase maghar orc is? debating swapping off dwarf

[royal lantern]

0

racials are a meme

[worn geyser]

likely occurs at top level keys also, just gotta grind it since ur only 1/5 of the picture but with enough tries if u perform consistent u’ll get it

[royal lantern]

you wont do more or less dmg cus of your frking race

[dusk fox]

lol 184 for my guild i want to kill everyone who keeps fucking up simple swaps or drill baits.

[humble verge]

from experience

took me a bit time in paint sorry

[near valley]

this graph is a incorrect unfortunately

common sense starts low then goes into negative as you scale

and toxicity starts high and ends off the graph

[humble verge]

real

something like this

10s are quite toxic

from what people say here

[haughty flicker]

10s are chill

9s are fucked

9s are where hope goes to die

[humble verge]

10s are chill if ure doing keys with 3.2k sure

[haughty flicker]

nah even pugging 10s

ive not had many issues

[near valley]

pugging ur 9 means u likely failed ur 10

[humble verge]

maybe youre just the lucky one

[near valley]

hence why it's so toxic

[haughty flicker]

9s are people who are too bad to do 10s

[humble verge]

thats why its peaked on 9

[near valley]

ur already starting on a bad

[humble verge]

amirite

[haughty flicker]

and it doesnt have the advantage of 7s where sometimes people farm them for crests or items

[humble verge]

nah people still get pissed in 7s

cause people are slow

[haughty flicker]

i meant more about skill level

people doing 7s are better than people doing 9s

[humble verge]

if you have a 9

you just pug

cba doing 9s

[haughty flicker]

genuinely better off dropping it to an 8 and 2 chesting it

than trying to pug the 9

[nova fractal]

I full crashed out on them after like 30 pulls of fucking up bombs lmao

[nova fractal]

I actually just started playing bleed build assassinstion in keys and fuck me is it stupid but somehow fun lmao

[hidden bay]

@balmy condor raid today?

[red schooner]

at this point I have the fight down so I'm just like... music on, vibing

But also I'd like prog on him to end now

[nova fractal]

I’m playing my warrior for prog since I’m our token warrior now and like just hit buttons

I feel like this boss dies this week if we aren’t dumb

[red schooner]

Yeah same for us

[spice spire]

Warrior main

[humble verge]

im the only rogue

😎

[nova fractal]

Like we rip lust on pull and the boss is like sub 70

[spice spire]

🤮

[humble verge]

we have 3 locks and 3 mages tho

💀

[nova fractal]

It’s the cycle

I was stuck playing rogue forever

[humble verge]

stuck?

[nova fractal]

And couldn’t even bring alts to reclear

[humble verge]

brother doesnt wanna play rogue

[nova fractal]

Nanana

[red schooner]

I'm one of two rogues so I must fight the other rogue for supremacy

[nova fractal]

I got bored of waiting for others to learn their shit

[spice spire]

It’s fine my guild is trying to transition me to warrior main for the buff

[nova fractal]

Play arms and vibe

[humble verge]

well

[nova fractal]

If they make you switch

[humble verge]

shout is big

[spice spire]

I play prot

Derogatory

[humble verge]

you WANT all raid buffs

: D

[nova fractal]

I’m gonna reclear as arms this week, shit the bed on my parses, and cry

[winged sun]

what is zac doing here

oh

thats quake nvm

[spice spire]

I also play arms but I’m the tank since our warrior is gone every other week

Ye

I’m actually gaslighting him as we speak

Girlbossing even

[nova fractal]

Lmao

[stable cove]

why do i see rogues in top logs using mast flask instead of alchemical

is it a stats/gear thing

[humble verge]

well you wanna be as close to mastery cap as possible

if you already arent

its the only thing you kinda wanna priotizie

even tho

!stats

[prisma monolith]

There are no "recommended stat levels" or "breakpoint of X stat" or "required" amount of any stats. This is an outdated way to think about stats and simply is not relevant to the spec. If you're looking for a quick recommendation: Agi >> Crit = Mastery >= Haste > VersatilityIt's always more accurate to simulate your own character, as stat procs from trinkets/enchants can often de-value their stat relative to others. Stats are not a rigid construct, their values change constantly in relation to each other depending on your character.

• Signet of the Priory will require you have Mastery as your highest RATING (the actual number, not the %). Having Crit and Mastery close to one another will cause procs from Flask or Seaforium Pacemaker to cause your Signet to give you Crit. This is generally worse and will cause Signet to sim poorly.
• Compared to each other, Deathstalker wants more Mastery/Haste than Fatebound, and Fatebound wants more Crit than Deathstalker
• Always Always ALWAYS sim yourself through Top Gear and Droptimizer for accurate results

[humble verge]

but also

the signet note

[stable cove]

oh shoooot i did not think ab that i need to check into that on my guy

tyvm

is there a list of commands you can look at in order to check for this stuff?

im discord illiterate

[humble verge]

no, its just a know basis, icl

i dont even know all of them

since whispyr just makes them

[stable cove]

ok well tyvm for the info! makes sense

[humble verge]

like

!richard

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923750073499648/1356363029951938700/image.png?ex=67ec4b02&is=67eaf982&hm=0780c2bf8a3eda7b622f455daac5267c32f3074f79ab55d181e8de68faf2a64e&=&format=webp&quality=lossless

[stable cove]

nice xd

[spice spire]

Rik fok uh logs is kinda pointless

He did post a small list

[humble verge]

go sub

[spice spire]

Fok is a good one tho

[balmy condor]

Yeh but it literally just got tuned

[rotund oak]

[humble verge]

me on tuesday night knowing we will SURELY kill mugzee

[bronze pike]

chop chop

[burnt star]

Not surprising. Rogue ia the 2nd least played 😆

[candid jasper]

I accept that in m+ with the bleed build, rogue single target damage will be low, but I feel my damage is too low. Would anyone be kind enough to take a look at me trying to rotate on a dummy to see if I'm doing anything obvious? I'm doing keys around ~14-15 and it's getting noticeable now that my single target is appalling. Some things I'm trying to do:

• always keep energy above 150 for sanguine
• shiv with thistle tea
  -maintain all 3 bleeds

I can definitely see gaps of the envenom buff on my logs - I can see a very very small amount of energy wasted and I managed to waste 2 combo points, but I would still not expect to be doing this kind of abysmal damage on a dummy standing still

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/zVL4mc3QvBPwg6Jp

[balmy condor]

That is a concerningly high amount of sanguine blades damage

When you say ”ALWAYS” keep energy above 150

[candid jasper]

😄

[balmy condor]

Describe what that means

[candid jasper]

I wait until I have 150+ the 50 energy I need to cast mutilate before casting 😛

[balmy condor]

Okay that’s not quite the part I’m hung up on

What is “always”

[candid jasper]

Sorry, I might be misunderstanding or being confusing - I mean I actively avoid letting energy drop below 150 and pool consistently to try to ensure this

[vast shuttle]

u need to be over 150 energy on single target?

[balmy condor]

Yeah but are you doing it during shivs?

During darkest night?

Literally ALWAYS?

[candid jasper]

Yeah lol

😂

[near valley]

ah

[balmy condor]

[candid jasper]

I think from your reactions here, that's not supposed to be the case 😛

[near valley]

bro is holding back the dmg windows

[candid jasper]

Whilst it's funny, I'm glad of it for the learning haha

[balmy condor]

The whole idea behind pooling is energy during low damage windows being bad, and energy during high damage windows being good

If you press your cooldowns your obviously want to be doing damage

And you’d be a fool to not press buttons

[hidden bay]

@balmy condor dont ignore my ping you slut

[balmy condor]

That’s the point of cooldowns

[balmy condor]

Yes, 2:30

[hidden bay]

[candid jasper]

My assumption was that during the damage window, sanguine was amplifying the bleed damage by 30% and it would be worth more during the 40% window of shiv

[balmy condor]

30% window

But no

[lean plover]

Is staying above 50% energy for bleed still like .3% dmg or something?

[balmy condor]

That’s when you want to press envenoms

[balmy condor]

Yes but not the way this guys doing it lmao

It’s above 50% during downtime when nothing else is happening

[near valley]

he is a sanguine specialist

[balmy condor]

Hold on

[candid jasper]

😂

[balmy condor]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[lean plover]

.3% more dps of an already dogshit st is not worth the headache

[candid jasper]

Is pooling still a no no even for ST during deathmark?

or is the assumption here that you drown in it because of the 4x venemous wounds ticks

[worn geyser]

assuming ur pressing dm, that means ur probably in a Kb /shiv window so probably u wanna be clicking buttons

[near valley]

u mean like pooling inside DM itself?

[near valley]

or towards a DM

[stable cove]

im watching woxtoxic do 17/18s and he hardly prioritizes garrote and it has low ish uptime, is this correct gameplay?

[spice surge]

If you dont have improved garrote sure

[polar rampart]

depends on build

[buoyant herald]

The no-garrote build has been popularised a bit I high keys lately

[stable cove]

ah thats prob why

[buoyant herald]

No subterfuge, no MA, garrote low value

It ONLY works in high keys though

[near valley]

for the sake of fun

why does it only work in high keys?

[polar rampart]

targets live long enough for fat envenoms?

[buoyant herald]

Higher keys require chain pulling so you can’t get into stealth as much so MA loses value etc etc

Targets live long enough for full KB value

And that build gets higher ST damage which is literally required to even kill bosses

So trying to be all like “well I’m gonna play what the best rogues play because I’m a gamer” is actually just an idiot move

It’s a niche build for very specific requirements and conditions which just don’t exist in lower keys

[stable cove]

ty for explanation

[buoyant herald]

It looks quite cool, I only wish I did keys high enough for it to be good so I could try it 😂

[obsidian marlin]

it was a fun spec to run at the beginning of the season when everyone was undergeared

[buoyant herald]

Yeah that could work too, although really a lot of it derives from the lack of restealths from chain pulling leading you to lean into maximising what you can do when not relying on stealth

[worn geyser]

the chain pulling part i think is less important , its more just solely the higher prio damage / st it has but thats just my opinion in why high keys players like it.

restealth outside of vanish is just qol for ic , i mean the improved garrote does like not that much damage compared to ur ct/rupture, can chain pull all day on bleed with only minor losses

at worst u lose a few globals fok rupture spreading

[buoyant herald]

Yeah getting full KB value also very important of course, but it’s still weak compared to where it’s been in the past. I think most comps have pretty reasonable prio these days, but ultimately yeah if your prio target dies before end of Kb that’s big sad

Which is what like 20+ seconds into the pull by the time you’ve got dots and envenom(s) up

[candid jasper]

Well.. a 200dps increase, although I guess I was hoping to see a tad more to be fair 😦

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/xn7mJ4dLZCt81PqB

It certainly feels very starved during the burst windows and sanguine has now taken a real back seat on the damage

[worn geyser]

why are u mutilating the kelps

[buoyant herald]

Yeah aren’t they mutilated enough already

[worn geyser]

fan of knives is op bro

i am dumb

ignore

[candid jasper]

I think you've got a point though, I'm not throwing in my clear the witness proc

[worn geyser]

for some reason my brain immediately went to floodgate kelps, i didnt know the training dummy showed as kelpfist lmfao my b

[candid jasper]

All good, it's single target only, there's only one here but I think you're right to call out that I'm not pressing FoK

[lean plover]

remember to fok with clesr the witness buff

[worn geyser]

also, for st bleed, since subterfuge is ran, i believe u can just open with ambush for dsm, then garrote then at 5+ cp (throw another ambush if needed) hit rupture

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[fervent fractal]

Should I use a rotation assist when first getting started w/ assassination rogue? Or just jump right in and forget that

[balmy condor]

It’s really not that complicated

[fervent fractal]

alright for sure

[true tapir]

yo, on bleed build, are you guys staying above 50% in ST?

[near valley]

Kinda have too

[lean plover]

Same with every spec, ooen wowhead guide, read opener, practice on dummies, repeat until its clear. then same with normal rotation

[true tapir]

better to stay above 50 and get some Tempest downtime or do tempest and be below 50% sometimes?

[lean plover]

Assa is stupidly easy specialy raid, couole of hours at most and u will hage 0 issues

[balmy condor]

#assassination message

Read from there

[vapid sierra]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/assassination-rogue-mid-expansion-retrospective-hero-talents-current-issues-and-376713?utm_source=discord-webhook

[balmy condor]

Oh mines early this expac

[vapid sierra]

#1 whisp fan ong

[balmy condor]

I was expecting it like 2 weeks from now

[vapid sierra]

haha

[balmy condor]

Rogues usually at the end of the chain

[inland dirge]

The easiest way to fix this is to make the Deathstalker's Mark not a debuff attached to a single enemy.

i'm swelling up

[candid jasper]

The 50% energy thing still feels really weird, I find that if I'm sending burst during shiv (still not entirely sure how many envenoms into it) - I get to this place where I can't pool energy because I'm back to having a darkest night proc that I should use ASAP

[balmy condor]

Yes

You’re under 50% way more than you are over

Because there’s constantly stuff to react to

Sanguine optimization is legit the last thing you do

[worn geyser]

prolly why its only a .3% gain , its only when ur legit doing nothing lmao

[balmy condor]

Ye

[clever sparrow]

any tip for mage tower?

which build to go?

hybrid or bleed?

[balmy condor]

Shouldn’t really matter much either way, just take healing gems in your circlet or something idk

It’s not a dps race

As long as you have enough to beat the shields, which are pretty easy

You just gotta do the mechanics

And they’ll fall over

Basically impossible to hit the enrage unless you’re fully afk for like 45 seconds

[buoyant herald]

Universally real

[inland dirge]

[clever sparrow]

is it easy?

im scared 😦

[lean plover]

Whispyr post makes me happy

[gusty mirage]

once you figure out how to counter the mechanics it's pretty straight forward

[clever sparrow]

ahh nice

[gusty mirage]

be prepared to be frustrated because you really do have to use your entire kit iirc

[humble verge]

guys what do you think, should i replace my earpads

[onyx scroll]

That rogue article was great

[pliant remnant]

Nah, those look cozy

[onyx scroll]

definitely conveyed all the feelings on the class right now.

[buoyant herald]

Well written retrospective, very cool

[winged sun]

you can garrote at 1-6 targets

7-8 starts to become useless unless u can fit it with IC

(no imp garrote)

[worn geyser]

goated article for sure, the dashing scoundrel tooltip part is so good

[onyx scroll]

and I think most of us could live with the rogue tree if any of the rogue hero trees were interesting

[west crown]

Is Hybrid or Bleed better for funnel if our tank would be pulling packs into the boss

[winged sun]

often i see people ignoring garrote in aoe but thats wrong

garrote is not bad lol

[west crown]

Feels craft tells be hybrid

[clever sparrow]

ive died to greed 😄

20% 😄

[gusty mirage]

see you got this

[balmy condor]

Ty

@inland dirge when are we interlocking toes I need the energy for oab

You give me the toe energy and I’ll loot council you the dagger when it drops

[winged sun]

99.999% of the players should play bleed

in m+

i mean

bleed

sorry

[balmy condor]

Just slide it throw the mailbox

[winged sun]

u wont have to touch hybrid unless u run into higher keys and ur probably not gonna play it better than bleed either

[humble verge]

are you having fun on oab whisp

[inland dirge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/747561446539395205/1225450138269519923/4x.gif

meet me in dorn rn

[clever sparrow]

done

[spice surge]

Demisemaxxing is way more fun than envenom

[west crown]

I'm doing higher* keys and just wondering based on team damage profile if hybrid would give me better prio damage than bleed. I'm only caring about prio here

[spice surge]

Atleast to me

[balmy condor]

God bless I’m omw king

[inland dirge]

[balmy condor]

I had fun 100 pulls ago

It’s getting old

[humble verge]

like every raid encounter

[worn geyser]

slapping a max cp rupture on low health mob is like swatting a fly out of the air

[spice surge]

Being able to feel like you contribute to stuff like failed batch or the cart in DFC is also nice

[balmy condor]

Brother we’re 230 pulls into a boss where the most impactful mechanic I face is “wait for ranged to stop dying”

[spice surge]

Besides just spattering

[balmy condor]

[humble verge]

230 pulls jesus

[static glacier]

lowkey imagine if there was some big payoff for chaining x envenoms together

[humble verge]

have you guys even gotten to p2

[balmy condor]

Ye

13%

Should die

But Jesus man

[humble verge]

after 230 pulls

[balmy condor]

It’s not even like strat problems or whatever

[inland dirge]

230

[humble verge]

yeah

atleast you didnt get made fun of cause you dont know what the fuck is middle left on mugzee

[static glacier]

bandit is kinda afk for melee ngl

[balmy condor]

All our wipes are just like first 2 min ranged die no add dam wipe go next

Next pull tank gets smacked

[static glacier]

bait coins in the right direction, don't die

[balmy condor]

Next pull no coin

[static glacier]

voila thats the fight

[humble verge]

you guys do have a dedicated coin thrower?

[balmy condor]

Yes bro

[humble verge]

ahok

had to be sure

[balmy condor]

It’s agony

My emotions, not the name of the guy throwing coins

His name is Mike

[winged sun]

i dont think hybrid does enough st

[humble verge]

kinda cope before we got kill

[winged sun]

play bleed

unless u play double shiv for 17-19s

brb keys

[humble verge]

huh

[winged sun]

doesnt do more st for it to be worth playing

both subterfuge buildds suck on st anyway

[humble verge]

well i guess

[hidden bay]

Based

[tall atlas]

@balmy condor B-

[haughty flicker]

isnt that every boss

[balmy condor]

whats a B-

[tall atlas]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/assassination-rogue-mid-expansion-retrospective-hero-talents-current-issues-and-376713

[balmy condor]

the article or the spec or what

[haughty flicker]

wait new whippy article dropped

[humble verge]

it actually taking you

170 pulls to get to p2

is insane to me

[balmy condor]

[haughty flicker]

why is rogue article so early

[balmy condor]

that's what I'm sayin

[tall atlas]

cos whis is a g

and hes bored of bowling balls

[balmy condor]

dude I got a new one and shot 788 on wednesday

I need more

[tall atlas]

nah article is good man v insightful

[balmy condor]

[tall atlas]

https://tenor.com/view/home-simpson-the-simpsons-bowling-strike-master-gif-5607500

does atrophic stack multiplicatively or additively

[balmy condor]

all things in wow are multipliers

[tall atlas]

so 2 rogues 3.2x2 DR?

3.6*

[tired girder]

google is trolling me, anyone link me a quick mouseover macro that will only use the mouseover if your mousing over something

for rupture

[humble verge]

no it gets reduced

doesnt it

[humble verge]

yeah but, im 100% it wont be 7,2*

[balmy condor]

100 x 96.4 x 96.4 x 96.4 x 96.x

[humble verge]

^

[tall atlas]

ah so there is a DR

but its still kinda sick

[balmy condor]

I mean I wouldn't really call it a DR

[humble verge]

theres a DR for everything

[balmy condor]

that's just how math works

[tall atlas]

yeah i get that its not internally a dr in the game but there is a DR for stacking it

[balmy condor]

yeh yeh sure

[tall atlas]

cos math

[haughty flicker]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-math-garbage-trash-i-hate-math-gif-21654450

[tall atlas]

@balmy condor taw we love u too

[gusty mirage]

[tall atlas]

whis how does it feel to be the actual irl master of poisons

[solar wyvern]

Hes the irl master of white monster energy

[tall atlas]

idk i have like 4 empty cans on my desk rn

[worn geyser]

so if u stack like 12 rogues u can get a 100mil hit down to a 60ish mil hit? like 100x96.4 = Z then Z x96.4 then repeat 10 more times? edit: math illiterate

[balmy condor]

correct

[solar wyvern]

Actual photo of whisp's trashcan

[haughty flicker]

thats his room

[gilded oasis]

@balmy condor ily

[balmy condor]

would technically be like 70%

[gusty mirage]

hi @gilded oasis

[balmy condor]

but yeh

[gilded oasis]

hi buddy how are you

[gusty mirage]

im doing well how are you

[balmy condor]

idk I did the math quickly in my head

but should be around 70

[gilded oasis]

im good. had my first dress fitting/alteration today

[balmy condor]

20 rouges would be 50% dr

[gusty mirage]

[balmy condor]

rouges yep

[tall atlas]

we should try this

[worn geyser]

login, 20 rogue evasion tank swapping cycle 50% dr

[tall atlas]

Mythic gally with 16 rogues

what would feint do there then

[balmy condor]

DR on top of that

[tall atlas]

and the deathstalker evi aoe reduction

fuck me

[balmy condor]

DR on top of that

they're all just multipliers

[gusty mirage]

are you asking us? or just thinking outloud?

[tall atlas]

thinking aloud soz

[haughty flicker]

well

if he insists

[gilded oasis]

what a tease

[stable cove]

does anyone know exactly how much mast u need vs crit to ensure signet always gives mast? cuz i have 4.5k more mast than crit but idk if thats enough with seaform+alchemical

[balmy condor]

like run elusiveness, and bait and switch, press evasion + feint you got 20% x 20% x 20% magic dr

with 10 rogues you then got 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% x 3.6% on top of that

just keeps going

[haughty flicker]

[tall atlas]

so there is a world where you could probs 2 heal M gally with 16 rogues

[balmy condor]

well how much does your seaformium say it gives

[solar wyvern]

Double rogue keys actually lowkey go hard cause u get so much DR from atrophic (im coping and just wanna play with my rogue friends)

[tall atlas]

what race are you

[stable cove]

3122

dwarf

[balmy condor]

okay and then chaos flask is like 3500

so if they both line up it's 6600ish

[stable cove]

ah so i should use mast flask

[tall atlas]

no

[balmy condor]

I probably wouldn't suggest that

[stable cove]

oh ok

[tall atlas]

when you use the mast flask, when you potion you get all stats except mast

[stable cove]

but then if i get crit from flask signet would give crit?

[tall atlas]

so thats making your crit problem worse, i had and still have this issue sometimes

[worn geyser]

having not good math, what is like the max dr u can have like that, is feint or evasion like applied first in the formula or is the poison dr or does it matter

like say u get the hit down to 70% : then is feint 20% applied? or is the feint/eva dr applied first

[balmy condor]

they're multipliers, doesn't matter in what order you apply them in

like with one rogue right, lets say you have evasion, feint, and atrophic

doesn't matter if you take 100 damage, reduce it by 3.6%, then reduce it by 20%, then reduce it by 20%

or you flip the order

it's still x20x20x3.6 no matter what

[tall atlas]

Which is insane tbh

[balmy condor]

it's all the same

[tall atlas]

Ye that’s fucking dumb

[balmy condor]

is it?

[tall atlas]

It’s a 40 % dr

[worn geyser]

math very cool

[balmy condor]

I mean it would unironically be stronger if it didn't work like this

[tall atlas]

It’s v cool

Not dumb in a bad way in a cool way

[balmy condor]

if it was additive instead you would just be reducing by 20+20+3.6

which is 43.6%

so you'd be taking 56.4% damage