assassination

[lethal heart]

we can reinvent p1 wipes now

for entire 4 hours

[marble hemlock]

ye exactly

[lethal heart]

[spice surge]

Its almost surely more worth to craft anything else

[earnest remnant]

you know what would be really cool

if we killed gally in 1 night

[lethal heart]

not that unlikely tbh

[earnest remnant]

(i dont wanna play anymore)

[subtle tundra]

its totally possible. but it requires everyone to actually fucking prepare for the boss

[lethal heart]

my moti for tier is gone

my alt got house of cards faster

than my main

[subtle tundra]

we could've, we hardgriefed the first day and then killed it in 10 pulls the 2nd

and it was actually just a prep thing, cause we had the wrong strat for the hardest overlap

(but we also just played insane, ngl, we killed the boss the first time we got to p3)

[boreal pike]

Is it best to run the mega bleed build pinned in here or the build that uses kingsbane? For mythic plus I’m hoping to be doinf 10-12s

[subtle kiln]

Ditch KB

It’s shit

[pallid goblet]

do we cast ct in single target with the bleed build?

[iron ivy]

Yes

But make sure you're not removing a higher 'stack' ct when switching for aoe to st

[deep gyro]

It’s all in the pins

[pallid goblet]

ye makes sense

sucks i have negative haste gear since i mainly play sub

[spice surge]

Doesnt matter that much

[pallid goblet]

does haste have a big impact on energy regen? i feel like i get energy starved way more often even in aoe compared to season 1 assa, or is this just normal with the bleed build?

[golden loom]

if ur energy starved in AoE somethings going terribly wrong

[subtle tundra]

you literally cant be energy starved in aoe

[granite leaf]

If you're keeping up rupture you are flooded

[golden loom]

only way is like if u dont have poisons on

[pallid goblet]

might be me being lazy about refreshing ruptures sometimes

[analog field]

most of the times it's not even needed to refresh , pack just dies

[main plover]

what target count do we use FoK with blindside + thrown precision and Follow the blood instead of momentum of despair

still 3 as long as ruptures are up for ftb?

[deep gyro]

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[main plover]

says specifically for momentum, but not for ftb which buffs fok too

[balmy condor]

yeah that counts too

3 for ftb too

[main plover]

okay tyvm

[toxic whale]

So with 6 cp and darkest night up, what button do I press next?

[royal lantern]

mutilate ofc?

[swift bluff]

That CT weakaura is nice

[balmy condor]

depends on your talents

it is, lisonna did great work

[swift bluff]

You guys both did. Thank you!

[hollow saddle]

Cant wait for them to release strongaura

[swift bluff]

That’s for WoW 2

[iron vapor]

I'm still running quite an old WA set, what does it do?

[noble void]

Anyone else running into issues with deathstalkers's mark on raid bosses? A few times last night I vanished to ambush it doesn't reapply the mark.

I assume I'm just getting hit with something that pulls me out of stealth before I mash the ambush key

[subtle tundra]

not sure what youre talking about, but when you vanish you have 1 second of stealth that cant be broken

[golden loom]

well vanish has a 3 second grace period where stealth doesnt break, maybe you didnt have energy for ambush tho and just broke it by autoing or something

also why was your mark gone?

[subtle tundra]

https://tenor.com/view/invincible-fortnite-black-suit-mark-black-suit-invincible-invincible-fortnite-gif-16905263006134794079

he went to fortnite

[warm vortex]

Some dude in hunter discord is going on about how more buttons = difficulty

I'm tired boss

Also its fucking hunter there are like 6 buttons

[golden loom]

Do u look like omni man irl varas

[thin dew]

BM uses like 4 lol

[noble void]

mechanics can be cruel

or i died 😄

[subtle tundra]

no cause i aint got that badass fucking mustache, nor am i built like a fucking unit

[golden loom]

Gg...

[subtle tundra]

bad rng genetics

sometimes i fucking lose

[royal lantern]

no you dont

[golden loom]

Sometimes lose always win

My life motto

[noble void]

I'll go with PEBCAC

[warm vortex]

Yea, he is trying to argue how MM is a lot harder than BM as it has more buttons
Few people are saying MM is easier
and everyone is thinking "They are both easy"
i mean how many buttons does assa have again

[tough trail]

does shiv dispel also work with arterial precision?

[subtle tundra]

yes

[plucky canopy]

I know three buttons..
Garrote, rupture and ct
Everything we need
Amen

[final star]

@marble hemlock

[marble hemlock]

real

[dawn seal]

@spice spire could you maybe check my log king

On ur free tiem

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/RWCmw7YyV4vKkjTz?fight=89&type=damage-done&source=1613

[subtle tundra]

rupture kb cant be 5+ cp, right?

[spice surge]

If you have IC up and get the refreshes from bonespike, but if its ST na

[neon drift]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[subtle tundra]

its the log above

[spice surge]

Mb

[dawn seal]

👀

are there omega major mistakes

I thought it was big skill issues cuz I was a green one but can it be gear

[spice surge]

Most of your gear is unenchanted or enchanted with bad enchants

[iron vapor]

Omega level mistakes don't give green parses

Green isn't BAD necessarily, it's just not good.

What's the minimum for a green parse? 25%?

49% is 1% below the hard average, which is.... OK.

[idle vine]

so, is bleed build better than current one

kingsbane one

or na

for m+

[balmy condor]

ye

[idle vine]

oh sorry its in the pins lol

[iron vapor]

Bleed is king, until the inevitable CT nerf

Because we're not allowed to have fun.

[dawn kelp]

Yeah they’ll nerf CT for sure! It’s so op it blows UH Dk bloodbeast out of the water

[idle vine]

sorry whats CT?

[deep gyro]

Crimson tempest

[idle vine]

can someone clarify what "Avoid refreshing a multi-target CT in single target" exactly means?

[normal mist]

Read CT

Understand CT

[radiant raven]

Become the CT?

[normal mist]

... Become a counter-terrorist!

https://tenor.com/view/unlost-unlosttv-cantug-ozsoy-unlost-tv-tkt-gif-10898544778903090582

[granite leaf]

Counter-terrorists win

[idle vine]

so if I am fighting 3 mobs and put a CT on all 3, and then 2 die and its 1 left, I should avoid refreshing CT until the prev one wears off?

[normal mist]

Yes

[crude helm]

Yes

[granite leaf]

100%

[idle vine]

ty

[granite leaf]

He got it

[idle vine]

i read the ct, i am now ct

[inland escarp]

You’ve won

[normal mist]

https://tenor.com/view/crowd-goes-wild-viagra-boys-coachella-hype-jump-gif-25499637

[idle vine]

CT would do so much dmg there holy shit

[normal mist]

AHAHAHAHAHAH

[crude helm]

So what would happen if you did refresh it?

[idle vine]

nothing cause theres so many people left

[normal mist]

XD

I'm laughing my ass off in silence while in The WC at the job

[crude helm]

Like are you just burning the last < 3 seconds of the extra damage on it?

[inland escarp]

It’s like refreshing an empowered garrote with a normal one

[river cradle]

Ok stupid question, in m+ how do I decide how many combo points I want to build for abilities, I generally try and do max points for rupture and CT, but I’m not sure about envenom and if it’s worth using low combo point ruptures to spread ruptures without indiscriminate carnage

[swift bluff]

It’s snapshotting. You applied a strong bleed with a damage modifier, and if you overwrite that bleed, you’re losing out on the difference

[balmy condor]

5 for everything, 7 for darkest night envenoms

[normal mist]

5+

Whispyr

[river cradle]

Perfect

[balmy condor]

royal

[normal mist]

You have that on Ctrl V

[balmy condor]

I do not

[normal mist]

Dang it yesterday we answered the same way

[river cradle]

Ty chat

[normal mist]

Around this time

[balmy condor]

<div class="news-post-image" style="background-image: url(https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/blog/images/47980-leaderboards-back-by-popular-demand-in-diablo-4s-next-expansion.jpg)"></div>

I have this on my ctrl v

[normal mist]

O.o

[balmy condor]

in case you were wondering I guess

[normal mist]

We're 5+ besties

[dawn seal]

5+

[river cradle]

Also playing bleed build during bosses in m+ is it normal to feel starved for energy? Unsure if thats normal or if im mutilating too much or something

[balmy condor]

!design

[prisma monolith]

Running out of energy in single target is completely normal, intended design of Assassination. As a burst spec our damage is mainly loaded into Deathmark/Shiv and massive Envenoms through stacking multiple nature damage buffs such as Lingering Darkness, Shiv, Darkest Night, Amplifying Poison, and more. This comes with the natural downside of our damage suffering outside of these windows, in part due to the designed lack of energy slowing us down.

Because of this, there is only one minor (0.3%) min-max with energy, which is pooling 3-4 seconds into an upcoming Kingsbane. Ideally this would put you at around 50-60% energy before you enter your Kingsbane, which is more than enough energy alongside thistle tea. Outside of that, spam Envenom and just accept that you will run out of energy. There is nothing you can do to not run out of energy. Playing around Envenom uptime also is not relevant anymore, as Twist the knife allows for two stacks at a time, which reduces wasted uptime dramatically. Without twist the knife, wasting uptime is unavoidable.

[normal mist]

Yes

[crude helm]

I used my potion on pull during vexie last night, ama

[normal mist]

How have you been lately? How's life

[balmy condor]

does your brain look like your pfp

[crude helm]

Yes

[river cradle]

LMAO Ty sorry for asking questions I’m sure have been asked 10 billion times

[balmy condor]

that's why we got commands homie

[normal mist]

11 but who's counting

[balmy condor]

makes it easy on us

[normal mist]

Can we actually check how many times a command has been typed, whispyr?

[bright tartan]

!rogue

[balmy condor]

don't think so

[river cradle]

Do I need to avoid dropping below 30 so I don’t automatically pop a thistle tea

[balmy condor]

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[balmy condor]

use that

[hollow saddle]

When I sim it says my best stat is vers, seems strange wasnt it all the time the worst?

[river cradle]

Mother FUCKER

[balmy condor]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

There are no "recommended stat levels" or "breakpoint of X stat" or "required" amount of any stats. This is an outdated way to think about stats and simply is not relevant to the spec. If you're looking for a quick recommendation: Agi >> Crit = Mastery >= Haste > VersatilityIt's always more accurate to simulate your own character, as stat procs from trinkets/enchants can often de-value their stat relative to others. Stats are not a rigid construct, their values change constantly in relation to each other depending on your character.

• Signet of the Priory will require you have Mastery as your highest RATING (the actual number, not the %). Having Crit and Mastery close to one another will cause procs from Flask or Seaforium Pacemaker to cause your Signet to give you Crit. This is generally worse and will cause Signet to sim poorly.
• Compared to each other, Deathstalker wants more Mastery/Haste than Fatebound, and Fatebound wants more Crit than Deathstalker
• Always Always ALWAYS sim yourself through Top Gear and Droptimizer for accurate results

[balmy condor]

I'm on a roll

[buoyant pumice]

Hii, Everytime I see a rouge they're always zooming around at high speeds, But when i got onto mine i only have "spring" available as "mobility" besides Shadowstep

[normal mist]

Yes

[royal lantern]

nothing

[balmy condor]

I don't have a command for that one

my streak has ended

[royal lantern]

L

[normal mist]

You run really fast every 1 minute, and get to be a ninja every 25-30 secs

[river cradle]

Wait thats not what I meant I think

i meant dodging this

[swift bluff]

I can restart that streak?

[royal lantern]

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[normal mist]

Yeah you'll always have a tea for shiv+kb

[swift bluff]

Something something fan of knives

[normal mist]

Since they both on the same CD

[hollow saddle]

oh I think it might be the trinket synergi perhaps

[river cradle]

Ok cool

[hollow saddle]

Time to go sim topgear with all crafted with all diffrent stats

[old socket]

why do people prefer mag orc over night elf and does it matter which one i go?

[normal mist]

No

What matters is the drip

[old socket]

based but like if i go higher keys is the loss of shadowmeld gonna be a game changer

[normal mist]

No

[old socket]

ok ty

[normal mist]

Absolutely not

Play your game homie, look cool, beat others in dps

Way of life

[granite leaf]

Racial decision is all about the drip

[red schooner]

Just play troll, that's what I keep doing.

Every character? Troll. Class can't be a troll? Not playing it

[royal lantern]

sooooo

paladin/dh/evoker?

trolls can be the rest right

[red schooner]

I dunno I haven't made a new character in a while

Fuck knows what has happened with race class combos

[stuck knoll]

[thorny fog]

this is an extremely dumb question I am sure, please be gentle, I am brand new to wow (level 54 rogue assassination spec playing cata)

If I have the choice of two daggers, and one has +5 agility, but the other has slightly higher DPS (difference in 30-60 and 40-80 between the two daggers) which one is better?

The one with + agility or the one with higher dps?

[subtle kiln]

@balmy condor petition for a !richard bot command for stats

[balmy condor]

You always want the highest item level dagger possible in the left slot, as that is the one used for damage calculation

The other slot isnt important

[thorny fog]

So disregard everything but item weapon level?

[balmy condor]

Yeh, weapon item level = weapon dps = big chunk of ability damage

[thorny fog]

Okay thank you

Sorry for dumb question, games super overwhelming lol

[balmy condor]

It’s not as bad as it looks

[halcyon latch]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6id55NKuaP4aY5kgkTgJVm
is that a bugged sim ? Stiletto + ascencion dagger in offhand + writhing armor banding ?

[balmy condor]

If you’re under 665 item level, get item level

[balmy condor]

Droptimizer doesn’t account for embellishment cap

[halcyon latch]

ahh ok

[swift bluff]

Take it at your pace! You’re ahead of the curve by stopping in here to learn.

[balmy condor]

Stiletto is insano dogshit for what it’s worth

And crafting a second dagger is also insano dogshit

So double ignore on stiletto

[halcyon latch]

good point

[static glacier]

didn't take you for a diablo andy

or are you the wowhead

[balmy condor]

I’m John wowhead

[half tartan]

any advice on my ST opener;

[balmy condor]

Crit harder

[static glacier]

looks fine

[royal lantern]

yes, John Wowhead does Assassination Rogue and some D4 stuff

[subtle kiln]

so you’re saying stack crit?

[swift bluff]

I knew it was named after you

[worthy fable]

guys for bleed build, do you prio envenom or crimson for ST?

[royal lantern]

ct

[static glacier]

frederick noxxic

[royal lantern]

if no ct active, ct

if ct active, envenom

[balmy condor]

John Wowhead of Assassination Rogue and like 90% of D4 news and also barbarian D4 guides and also some seasonal guides

[subtle kiln]

Alexander Mrrobot

[royal lantern]

Jannik Raidroboter

[static glacier]

Abdul icy veins

[subtle kiln]

Jenna Feelycraft

[normal mist]

No idea if it was Answered or not but this is mostly a retail discord server. You can try #classic-discussion or the servers in the pins in said channel

[balmy condor]

Mit ck

[royal lantern]

ck wie cock

[balmy condor]

Genau

Jannick mit cock

[worthy fable]

do u send ct at 5 cp or only 6+?

[balmy condor]

5

Everything 5

[subtle kiln]

https://tenor.com/view/london-boys-cockney-walk-gif-24182127

[balmy condor]

Always 5

[royal lantern]

5+ is everything

outside of DN

[bright tartan]

Do I reenter dungeon if I have 6 cp

[worthy fable]

DN?

ah fk

[little tulip]

https://tenor.com/view/moonkin-moonfire-balance-druid-world-of-warcraft-gif-15267146

[royal lantern]

Darkest Night

[worthy fable]

ah ok

[royal lantern]

i would never do a Deez Nuts joke

[worthy fable]

wait rlly?

[royal lantern]

never

[worthy fable]

xDDDD

[balmy condor]

Darkest night says maximum combo points

[royal lantern]

yes, DN is the deathstalker capstone

[balmy condor]

7 is max

[worthy fable]

yeah ofc then we do max

[balmy condor]

Math is mathing

[worthy fable]

but do we send even on ST at 5+?

i thought it was 6+

[balmy condor]

Every single finisher you ever cast that is not DN

In any situation

Is 5+

[worthy fable]

really?

[balmy condor]

Doesn’t matter if you have 1 target or 1 trillion

5+

[worthy fable]

xD

I have been playing it wrong

[balmy condor]

Would seem that way yes

[little tulip]

dum question how does key not deplete work

[worthy fable]

that makes it so much easier to keep up envenom uptime

[shy axle]

1 trillion is a juicy masspull

[little tulip]

do you need all 12s to not experience the loss

[worthy fable]

yeah

and then all 13s all 14s etc.

[little tulip]

https://tenor.com/view/tbls-the-big-lez-show-sassy-sassy-the-sasquatch-fucken-hmm-gif-5623820927370261708

[royal lantern]

if you time all keys on +12, your key doesnt depelete under 12 anymore

if you time all keys on +13, your key doesnt deplete under 13 anymore

repeat for all key levels after 12

[balmy condor]

Well… hate to break it to you but envenom uptime is linear with combo points so unless you’re overcapping like dozens of cp, not actually helping

[royal lantern]

can still manually lower it

[broken chasm]

!rik

[prisma monolith]

Rik Reverb Barrels (and similar spread cleave in raid)

• Not your problem.
• Assassination is the worst target swapping spec in the game, and we have no tools available to deal with the situation of priority spread cleave. Caustic can reach sometimes but similar to fire mage, the boss needs to be on top of the adds, causing caustic to often be out of range.
• If you're truly hellbent on swapping to barrels, hold your nearest darkest night and just slam a darkest night envenom into them and pray. If you're quick enough you can also pool combo points/energy and cast a rupture on a barrel to try and caustic off of them. This still will not do good barrel damage, again, the spec is doomed for it
• Another possible option would be talenting into Crimson Tempest by untalenting Bone Spike and Doomblade. This CAN TECHNICALLY provide a bit of barrel damage, but the spawns need to be immaculate and any difficult spawns will just result in no barrel damage again.
  With all that, the best advice we have for swapping barrels:
• Swap to Subtletly.

[lost wharf]

How is Sanguine Blades consumption calculated? Does it eat 2 energy per tick for each of the dots on each target? That seems kind of a lot

[royal lantern]

!richard

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923750073499648/1356363029951938700/image.png?ex=67ec4b02&is=67eaf982&hm=0780c2bf8a3eda7b622f455daac5267c32f3074f79ab55d181e8de68faf2a64e&=&format=webp&quality=lossless

[balmy condor]

Yes

[little tulip]

um the talent at the top venomous wounds i think

offsets it? if you logic it

[broken chasm]

!ricardo

[lost wharf]

Ah true

[cerulean walrus]

!dick

[broken chasm]

!yourmom

[lost wharf]

What was your highest sudden demise thus far? I think I'm kind of capped on 30mio, because I only run 10s

[little tulip]

still kinda shook up that the non cd rotation for sub is backstab > eviscerate

[lost wharf]

Gotta refresh Rupture aswell!

[worthy fable]

? is this real?

is it to maintain the winstreak stacks?

[nova aspen]

thats in cd's as well though, with 2 sectec's

[cerulean walrus]

Subtlety talk

[nova aspen]

[balmy condor]

I saw 33 in an 8

[worthy fable]

@little tulip

[cerulean walrus]

Yeah biggest was 30m so far

[humble verge]

WHAT

HES DOING KEYS AS ASSA

[nova aspen]

based

[little tulip]

@worthy fable

[cerulean walrus]

Still gooning over the 3 yes men execute I pulled off last week

[little tulip]

[lost wharf]

I was rather sure somebody posted 50mio last ID on Floodgate. Idk who was it tho.

[royal lantern]

who

[humble verge]

the #1 outlaw

Sadge

doesnt even know woxtoxic

[red schooner]

Still happy about sudden demising last boss in rookery through his shield last week

[humble verge]

the most based outlaw rogue

actually

[royal lantern]

ofc thats the name a outlaw main uses

[balmy condor]

That seems unrealistic

[worthy fable]

@little tulip Is the backstab > evis because of winstreak stacks? and actually legit?

[little tulip]

boomie was lost in the sauce today and a crystal got out for 12 rookery last still timed it with a minute left instead of 3ish

[cerulean walrus]

No it’s cause they do jack shit outside of their CD windows

[muted sparrow]

Why is fatebound so under represented? is it because of tuning or just people don't like the way it's played (with the RNG involved)

[cerulean walrus]

It’s awful

[little tulip]

petpet the mob til cds

[lost wharf]

It was with a screenshot tho and I think it was @spice surge, but not sure

[balmy condor]

It’s 26% behind in m+ and like 2.5% behind in raw single target

[muted sparrow]

Could you explain why? im curious

[royal lantern]

its dogshit in everything that is not 100% st

people hate rng coinflips

[red schooner]

Bad numbers, nobody wants to flip coins

[cerulean walrus]

Oi me loose change be spillin out me pockets when I swing me daggers

[muted sparrow]

alright guys, thanks!

[balmy condor]

Turns out a hero talent that isn’t competitive in single target and then also self-nerfs itself as more targets appear

Not a winning combo

[royal lantern]

oh and desthstalker has a good deffensive talent

fatebound has really bad ones

[spice surge]

I havent posted it, i think its hard to get more than like 35-40m

[spice surge]

It sims slightly higher than deathstalker last i checked

on pure ST that is

[balmy condor]

I simmed it for sprocket last week and it was behind for me dunno

[lost wharf]

Oh then my bad. I just remember you being a vivid bleed build promoter and kind of associated it with you

[spice surge]

But theres something thats getting overvalued in sims, because its way behind when im trying ingame

[balmy condor]

Skill issue

Just flip better idiot

[spice surge]

[balmy condor]

Maybe if you just got 40 heads flips in a row

It wouldn’t be so shit

Ever think of that

[little tulip]

well signet of the priory is gonna interact with vers on outlaw at least i didn totally grief myself this week

[royal lantern]

damm skill issue when i played a full run fatebound on mythic reclear and didnt even get the capstone on 4 fights

we love no consistency in WoW afteralll

[little tulip]

mistakes into miracles

[balmy condor]

Yeah just get the capstone??

What are you doing

[royal lantern]

mixing up heads and tails

[turbid sandal]

Given how much cleave there is in this raid, is Radiant a better choice than Depths? I'm poor and don't want to have to buy another enchant if I get it wrong

[royal lantern]

why is it called heads and tails, its a coin

[spice surge]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7KLXef8yVA7nvd3LehHqUj

[balmy condor]

Also if fatebound is oversimming, it’s possible that fatebound might be even worse than -26% in m+? I can’t stop winning holy hell what an insanely well thought out hero talent tree that is super engaging and epic

[red schooner]

Just rename it to topside and bottom side, that way you always get the topside and get capstone quickly

[golden loom]

Fatebound probably plays MA still right?

[red schooner]

Easy. Can't flip it so that the bottom side is on top

[balmy condor]

Won’t make a difference either way really

[red schooner]

Just how it be

[balmy condor]

Power is fine

[turbid sandal]

Alright, cheers

[spice surge]

Although i would appreciate if we had dummies that didnt get into execute the millisecond you touched them

[balmy condor]

Best we can do is putting 2 dummies 10 yards apart in the laggiest capitol city since 2013

[spice surge]

Ye and shiv hits every dummy within a 100 mile radius

So you enable pvp scaling by hitting pvp dummies

[haughty flicker]

dummies on top of the tower ftw

still go into execute immediately though

[nova aspen]

execute makes me feel good

[spice surge]

Unfortunately those are in dornogal so they get some of the open world bugs sometimes

Like when blades and nimble was doing the wrong damage for sub

Stormwind and Orgrimmar are the safe ones

[haughty flicker]

surely one day they turn proving grounds into something actually useful with dummies and cd resets

surely

[tepid meadow]

when do you guys typically use cds on mythic cauldron? is it during clash to get the cleave damage? I can't figure out how to get a great parse on it

[grand trail]

damn nobody was playing fucking DK and from nowhere it have bigger pop than we do 😄

how is that real

[spice surge]

fotm in m+

So people play it in raid to get gear

[grand trail]

like actually doabling us

yeah but the spec even doing better than us in raid

dont it

[haughty flicker]

idk we're pretty good

[grand trail]

yea its fine

[haughty flicker]

i saw that

[placid adder]

San layn will see its demise soon

[lost wharf]

Does Sudden Demise execute scale with enemy damage taken increases like last boss in Rookery?

[tall atlas]

What yous think the best key to break 5m overall is?

[spice surge]

It should, but i have no idea if it does

[spice surge]

Floodgate, priory or meadery

[tepid meadow]

floodgate imo

[tall atlas]

ye floodgate probs tbh meadery is too dependant on the first pull imo

and its too hectic for my wee brain

[spice surge]

I mean it depends on how you pull the rest of the instance too

[tall atlas]

yeah true

this new bleed build is so fun tbh no wonder wox is on it, its nice

[solar wyvern]

Its lowkey just as good as UHDK

[fervent willow]

how much % dmg sudden demise should be doing? I'm getting between 5-7%, is that right?

[tall atlas]

better

imo

[solar wyvern]

No we dont carry amz with us

[tall atlas]

true and grip n shit

[solar wyvern]

Tragically

[tall atlas]

once again back to my original point, bring back smokebomb

[solar wyvern]

Dps wise bleed assa is better than uh unless they mega proc tbh

I've beaten many an UHDK in these 15/16/17s

[lost wharf]

It depends on key lvl and your mates aswell as how you play around it. Mine is ususally twice as much, so 10-14%

[little tulip]

bleed is prly gonna get nerfed

[tall atlas]

yeah it will get nerfed unfort

[little tulip]

[solar wyvern]

Probably fun detectes

Back to envenom you stinky assa rogues

[fervent willow]

do you have any logs?

[lost wharf]

Do you really think so?

[tall atlas]

they will nerf sudden demise dam in execute probs

[white dew]

Would it be okay to post logs in here for help?

[lost wharf]

No, just my last 3 dungeons in details xd

[solar wyvern]

Yes just do !logs and post

[tall atlas]

!logs

[prisma monolith]

Wowanalyzer now has good initial support for Assassination. We suggest using it to quickly see any big rotational mistakes and analyze your ability usage

Link: https://wowanalyzer.com/

[little tulip]

i shouldn't be outrunning boomies every pull

[solar wyvern]

Err !log

!log

[prisma monolith]

Wowanalyzer now has good initial support for Assassination. We suggest using it to quickly see any big rotational mistakes and analyze your ability usage

Link: https://wowanalyzer.com/

[solar wyvern]

Wait

Moroes is broken???

[little tulip]

or 200-300k behind a feral drood with 4 item levels on me

fun detected lmao

[white dew]

Awesome thanks guys!

[spice surge]

Not to mention the prio damage from assa is insane

[white dew]

Just seeing the spec hasnt been updated through Wowanalyzer

[haughty flicker]

yeah moroes is trolling

you can see very basic stuff ig but uh

[little tulip]

hybrid

[haughty flicker]

i wouldnt use it lmao

[dawn anchor]

I've been pulling off vdh this week in big pulls because of it

[golden loom]

you dont have to do anything special, just send log

like here in chat

[white dew]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/6yTCWnQd94XMxzBV?fight=9&type=damage-done&source=35

[grand trail]

if rogue was better than dk i would assume kush would play iot

for mdi

[ionic pumice]

anyone got bugged in stix when you dont have multilate?

[gray hazel]

You guys playing around sudden demise in 12+ keys? Or are you just doing usual rotational stuff

[bitter imp]

hey guys may i ask at what % is the cap of mastery ? i rerolled from subtlety and here it says im way over the stat cap is this correct?

[spice spire]

There’s no cap

[grand trail]

no cap

[bitter imp]

great

[toxic whale]

No cap fr fr?

[gilded shale]

when coming out of stealth into a high target count pull, does anyone have any advice for target swapping effectively to get bleeds on new targets that are missing bleeds? tab targeting is not working very well for me and i'm finding too many nameplates hard to functionally manage

[cedar elm]

bleed is for chumps

[little tulip]

sometimes tab targeting is better but mouseover and grab edge of the pack

tank grabbed a second group just mouse over and rupture onto that group

indiscriminate carnage will get ruptures up so if new pack gets tabbed to caustic is easily reapplied etc

mouseover def sucks when they're all clumped up though

[gilded shale]

alright I can give that a try

[bright tartan]

In practice I doubt it’s worth it to try to optimize individual bleeds

[little tulip]

ye definitely not

[tall atlas]

call me chumparella

[gilded shale]

yeah that's my other question, is it something worth trying to optimize for

[little tulip]

off chance anyone know how to get plater to only show 2-3 buffs per row

[bright tartan]

If you die because of that or delay other things then not. But mathematically that’s a gain, although small

[nova aspen]

buff tracking tab

blacklist what u don't want

like deadly poison

[candid narwhal]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[fervent willow]

anyone got have some insight on why my dmg is so garbage? I'm comparing with similar log, but the dude is destroying, every single skill is doing more avg dmg, is it just skill issues?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/compare/m1Qb8Dyf3aWh2gJP/gPqNvnYzDjLFafGR?fight=last&type=damage-done&source=7%2C5

[gilded shale]

heard, thank you for the advice

[muted sparrow]

noob question: why exactly is it better to use fan of knives in single target? is it just because Clear the Witnesses hero talent?

[little tulip]

oh okay i just had to uncheck automatic

[bright moth]

@muted sparrow It’s only better for clear the witness if you are not running vicious venom talent

[little tulip]

nice 2x2 presentation n_n

[muted sparrow]

yeah, assuming I'm not running it, ofc

[bright moth]

You should be running vicious venoms in your single target build. If not, yes use fan of knives in ST for clear the witness

[muted sparrow]

yes, I'm running this build:

[coral ibex]

that is

a build

i wouldn't call it a single target build

[muted sparrow]

it's not a single target build

it's a m+ build

the question was in the context of single target in m+

[spice surge]

Clear the witnesses makes fok do more damage and generate an extra combo point

[muted sparrow]

sorry i didn't specify

[spice surge]

So its just more worth than mutilate

[muted sparrow]

yeah but just once after mark

[spice surge]

Yes

[muted sparrow]

alright thank you! was just making sure

[drifting cedar]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[night vessel]

can anyone give me a really quick rundown on this new bleed build?

glad to get rid of kingsbane

[oblique jackal]

Watch whispyr's video on YT

[night vessel]

k will do that. thanks!

[oblique jackal]

Ofc!! Super helpful

[frosty nebula]

im testing this new bleed build and i like it alot , but question is why those high rogues dont run it yet? or didint raid io not update yet?

[night vessel]

played outlaw until yesterday because my group is struggling with dmg (balance, arms, outlaw, bear, resto sham) so i'll pick up sin now. got the rik mythic dagger yesterday

[night vessel]

woxtoxic is running it already

[frosty nebula]

lol i also switched yesterday i was outlaw myself , and im switching cuz of damn aoe cap and Killing spree kiloling me way to oftern 😄

[night vessel]

yeah same for me. hate it. have to hold KS so much. especially in floodgate and rookery that its no fun anymore

[oblique jackal]

I would play w/e you enjoy/good at

[night vessel]

yeah i enjoy outlaw but the output isnt enough sometimes. we are going into the +16's and our comp is not perfect so we are dependent on more aoe dmg

[frosty nebula]

im testing assa for now but in heart im outlaw haha , will see when i get 4 set

[steel ridge]

then you will have a really bad time with the slow pace of the spec

[gusty mirage]

Imagine playing a game to have fun

Smh

[zenith elm]

Couldnt be me lol

I'm here to sleep while i do raids as ass

[dusky folio]

hi someone have a plater for track garrote and rupture?

[granite leaf]

I am now the suprior mog race

[viral linden]

Absolutely filthy mog 😎😎

[lyric crater]

oo nice armor where u find those item

[low thicket]

not my mog*

[granite leaf]

It's a mix of mag'har heritage, Antrous tier, plunderlords, artifact weapons, vanilla eyepatch

[lyric crater]

nuts im a green orc and there heritage armor cool to

[west orbit]

So looking at the stat priority in whispyrs guide on wowhead it shows crit above mastery but I know mastery is still super important. As my stats currently stand though my crit rating is highest so windsingers is giving me crit. I tried simming with a recrafted ring to make mastery my highest stat but raid bots recommended I keep the current gear. Is this actually right, or should mastery be my highest secondary?

[spice surge]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[oblique jackal]

sim yourself

[west orbit]

I did? That's the point of my question.

[granite leaf]

Stat priority is a pretty dated way to look at gearing in the game

It was important when expertise and hit, etc... existed

If you sim higher, you use that

[gusty mirage]

Link the sim if you still have the link

[west orbit]

Fair enough, I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't vital that windsingers be granting mastery over crit

[low thicket]

My crit and mastery are pretty close to each other. I prefer having more mastery so when I use my signet it procs mastery.

[gusty mirage]

Sometimes the robot does weird shit when it comes to procs/trinkets that give “the highest/lowest secondary”

[granite leaf]

If you're carrying like 24k mastery then maybe

[dusky folio]

THANKSSS

[vague raft]

As boring of an answer “sim yourself”is, it’s the best one we have. Stats are fake anyway

[granite leaf]

I have a copy pasta about stat weights and bis lists but I'm not going to spam the channel

[barren yew]

should i watch both the bleed build yapper videos by Whispyr if i've never played it or can i get by with just the newest?

[west orbit]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/fRjeT6VqVk9T55oWHZxCm5

[drifting cloud]

are you sure mastery isnt your highest stat, swapping stats on a ring should never be -22k unless its somehow fucking with circlet

since it cant be priory when you have hoc

circlet also has some ingame "bug" depending how you equip stuff

[granite leaf]

Does anyone have a tricks macro that just auto uses it on the tank?

I've been manually casting it but that feels like a poor way to do it nowadays

[night vessel]

Focus?

[granite leaf]

Nah I use focus macros for prio kicks

[low kernel]

!tricks

[prisma monolith]

Smart tricks WA on tank, this require the following macro:

/click SmartMisdirect LeftButton 1
/click SmartMisdirect LeftButton 0

[granite leaf]

I'm pretty sure they have specific [@x] functions for tanks now

[west orbit]

I believe there's a WA that auto targets someone designated as a tank in frames

[granite leaf]

I wonder if you can bake that into random other abilities 🤔 . It doesn't inccur a GCD so I don't see why not

[gusty mirage]

seems like mastery is his highest stat until dif procs throw it out of whack (seaforium charge, flask/enchant procs)

[little relic]

Do you send Kodos to space?

[thin dew]

If its for M+ , I use

/cast [@party1]

[gusty mirage]

because the sim report is showing both crit/mastery procs in the buff section

[barren yew]

how does this work?

[gusty mirage]

they unfortunately have no figured that out yet (small indie company), so you either do a focus or a @party1 and hope that in the dungeon they give the tank lead

you'd think after 20 years they'd make a targetable macro for roles in dungeons

but ya know

[little tulip]

i miss when tricks
would give a damage buff to its target

[coral ibex]

do you?

[gusty mirage]

trading tricks with the boys

so it's a zero sum gain for threat

[coral ibex]

do you miss when the other rogue in your raid was a fucking MONKEY

[west orbit]

Here's a snip from logs in raid last night. I'm not at home so I can't pull up my actual character stats for a screenshot. I'm just not gonna overthink it though. I'll stop spamming the channel with stat questions 😛

[coral ibex]

and never pressed the button

[gusty mirage]

but you give your rogue friends a dps buff

[thin dew]

I so envy Subs for having 1hr trick

[coral ibex]

so you just never got the buff

[west orbit]

No, they send me to space

[vast shuttle]

what head peice u get from the token on one armid bandit?

[gusty mirage]

yeah it's the flasks/enchant proc/ring proc for mastery that's changing it up. fwiw it's less important it hits mastery when your on use isn't priory

[coral ibex]

trying to convince the other rogue in my guild that trading tricks was a dps gain for ICC was truly my jonkler moment

bro simply did not get it

[gusty mirage]

cause your HoC is always giving you mastery

[west orbit]

Cool beans, thanks oxi

[gusty mirage]

vs priory where it'll give you a fuck ton of crit

and you're like oh okay

[tall atlas]

yeah i had this

fucking annoying tbh

[granite leaf]

I have a focus macro bound to my mousewheel. Then I have a kick macro that looks for a focus target and if there isn't one it kicks my target

[tall atlas]

ah a non-combat enjoyer

[thin dew]

What I think is messin with your Circlet is the Pacemaker buff

I aim to go with 20000+ Mastery with circlet

Or you could use Mastery flask instead

[coral ibex]

mutilate spec was based in wotlk

[gusty mirage]

I was a combat arpen gamer in icc

[granite leaf]

/run if not GetRaidTargetIndex("focus") then SetRaidTarget("focus",7) end```
It marks my focus as well so my party know which mob I'm kicking

```#showtooltip Kick
/cast [@focus,harm,exists,nodead][harm,exists,nodead][@target] Kick```

[gusty mirage]

back when killing spree actually did damage

[granite leaf]

Combat > oUtLaW

[royal lantern]

it still does

thats the problem with outlaw rn

[coral ibex]

i was in a dad guild so i was not getting gear funneled for the arpen stacking

[halcyon saddle]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[gusty mirage]

killing spree would kill the mob you cast it on though, not yourself

that's the dif

[royal lantern]

in true outlaw fashion killing spree is good now

not because it does dmg

but because you use it every 3 seconds

[gusty mirage]

I love that for them

[royal lantern]

endless CDR on every single ability is a good mechanic btw

[gusty mirage]

good gameplay loop

10/10

[granite leaf]

KS has saved me about half as much as it's killed me so far this tier

😄

[gusty mirage]

honestly tho

bring back combat daggers mr. blizzard

plz

[granite leaf]

I was them to bring back Death from Above and not this shit pvp talent garbage

[gusty mirage]

yeah that'll unfortunately never happen

best we're gonna get is a shittier version of goremaw's

[tawdry root]

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[gusty mirage]

DFA was the coolest ability in the game

no one @ me

[granite leaf]

No one gives a shit about pvp. I wish they'd just split pvp out from pve entirely and have a separate tuning for it. Pvpers ruin everything

[royal lantern]

the thing is like

DfA was mostly a sub thing

and the hole that DfA left was filled by Secret Tech in design

[gusty mirage]

they really should've just plunderstormed arena already

[royal lantern]

i do, because you are right

[gusty mirage]

make it so people can just log in, go to a vendor, buy pvp gear, and just arena all day without daily chores

[granite leaf]

I'll @ you

Because I agree

🤝

[gusty mirage]

pvpers would be happier, and then they can just balance both separately

[proven jasper]

I might actually play arena then so cant let that happen

[gusty mirage]

true, we wouldn't want MORE player engagement

that would be silly

[proven jasper]

[gusty mirage]

why make it fun to play dif parts of the game when we can make it an annoying ass grind

[proven jasper]

you get it

[gusty mirage]

[proven jasper]

[royal lantern]

bro, what if we bring back lazy ass % dmg and healing done buffs inside raids

but hear me out

you have to kill 4 raid bosses each week to get them

[gusty mirage]

because everyone who's ever done anything in wow surely remember the grinding part to make it so you can participate in the proper end game as the "fun part"

[royal lantern]

would that not be so cool?????????????

[gusty mirage]

I HECKING LOVE RUNNING LFR FOR TIER

remember when they removed the free heroic tier piece for KSM/AOTC

and replaced it with a catalyst charge for no reason?

lmfao

[royal lantern]

and then you had the 20 people that benefit from that change because they can clear half a mythic raid week 1 say its good for them

and all the very smart wow players parrot it

:3

[little tulip]

my seaforium has speed on it

:3

[gusty mirage]

you're fast af boy

[royal lantern]

my has avoidance

we are besties now

[little tulip]

thinking about 15 percent lmao

[gusty mirage]

I have the delve candle trinket

because I can't get seaforium to drop

AMA

it's not the greatest trinket but sometimes I get a candle on my head

and you know what

that's pretty neat

[nimble vector]

NO I STILL THINK THIS SUCKS DON'T BLAME THIS ON ME

[gusty mirage]

I just wanna know what they thought it solved

[jaunty sparrow]

my guild's progress is basically over so I'm looking at switching from sub to assassin for better m+ results. I'm trying to understand the pros/cons and current numbers of the different builds. the information is pretty seriously scattered over guides and videos because of the tuning updates and new discoveries. is there a most up-to-date text about them I can read?

[gusty mirage]

The bleed build is the go to for m+, whispyr just put out a video for it

lemme find the link

[jaunty sparrow]

thanks

I can check the channel no worries

[gusty mirage]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHB3zxwBuQE

but I found it for you already

because I love you

:3

[jaunty sparrow]

should I be worried about boss damage vs pack damage, or should I not concern myself about that and just dive into bleed

[gusty mirage]

your boss damage is gonna be kinda shit either build tbh

[jaunty sparrow]

understood thanks

[gusty mirage]

well not shit, but underwhelming

[jaunty sparrow]

guess if it's boss damage that matters I should just stick w/ subtlty

[gusty mirage]

you won't do tank damage

ye sub will def do better in ST in keys

but the bleed build is very fun

[jaunty sparrow]

thank you

[cerulean walrus]

Big Bleeda

[gusty mirage]

okay I love you all gonna go back to watching the masters while "working"

[near apex]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[toxic whale]

Bleed build is fun until you reach a boss

Then you think to yourself, that boomy and dk did just as much aoe as me but now they won't be useless on the boss

[little tulip]

idk having deathmark at the start of the fight seems to determine how that goes

[toxic whale]

Maybe if you have it both on pull and in execute phase

[little tulip]

kinda grief also to not get footballs or kill the add for motherlode bosses

rik reverb issue

[thin dew]

For raid. Haste is comming up very high on my sim after last weeks patch,

But I dont think haste makes a big difference in terms of energy regen,

Whats ya’lls thoughts on haste?
Would you go as what sim says or would you still keep it low as possible?

[low thicket]

windsinger only checks stat on log in or equip

[little tulip]

what does that mean

cause sometimes my stats move around with that thing istg

[inner citrus]

!mouseover

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[low thicket]

windsinger gem will only check what your highest stat is when you log in or when you equip it

[inner citrus]

do we have the rupture and garrote mouseover macro?

[little tulip]

oooh okay that's why my mastery stat is kinda wonky sometimes i only move thunderlord/stormbringer

[dreamy rover]

#showtooltip
/cast [@mouseover, exists] Rupture; Rupture

[low thicket]

so if you want to force it to be like mastery just make sure your mastery is highest when you equip it.

just note you will have to do this every time you log out and back in

[little tulip]

what if i flip ring 1 / 2

would that also count

[inner citrus]

if no mouseover exists, it casts on my current target?

[low thicket]

Not sure didn't check that

[dreamy rover]

exactly

[little tulip]

https://tenor.com/view/hmm-mmm-regular-show-gif-12297455

[low thicket]

I just checked if zoning or if activating a boss might trigger checks

[little tulip]

no that explains so much lol

[inner citrus]

thanks a lot

[dreamy rover]

np 🙂 if you need the garrote macro just replace rupture with garrote and youre good to go

[inner citrus]

just did 😄

[low thicket]

My understanding is haste makes bleeds do more damage

[inner citrus]

works wonders

[dreamy rover]

nice

[near valley]

Would you if they were a worm though.?

[thin dew]

Sure does, but with envenom doing the majority of the damage, It just doesnt feel right.

Should I just shut the f up and follow whatever sim says?

Lack of faith is the real issue

[royal lantern]

all secondarys are "more dmg"

no haste has close to 0 effect on energy, its not about energy

its just that haste is kinda good if most of your dmg comes from dots

and because a BIG chunk of people have this weird mindset that assa is "mastery+crit and nothing else" which was never true, they now get a bit sprised when sims want them to get more haste after the sim update

[gusty mirage]

Yes

[royal lantern]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/392807916543017000/1359887545349177465/Gntwjt9WQAAxVDp.png?ex=67f91d78&is=67f7cbf8&hm=77112638c615b3f2acdae0821a8fb4ece0c9ebd93d513dcd071a65b042c0a70d&

[gusty mirage]

Lmao

[near valley]

Reasonable response

[low thicket]

If the sim says its good then go for it. That tends to be the general vibe here. I'm at about 10% atm and feels good there.

[buoyant pumice]

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[digital stirrup]

Should you send out multiple normal garrotes in bleed build aoe or just keep one on your prio target and use the globals for fok for generating instead

[golden loom]

keep on main target

[thin dew]

I do understand haste and vers is very underrated and I was okay with sim results, untill it wanted me to have 10000+ haste

Thats the point where it got my mind blown

But I get your point and prolly should stick with what sim say. Thanks

[golden loom]

you only spread garrotes during IC

[thin dew]

Thx my man gainin my faith again

[gaunt quiver]

Get as many improved garrotes out as possible during subterfuge window. Normal garrote only after they fall off and only worth it on your prio target.

[radiant raven]

they couldn't see they were a ret through the window?? not very good game knowledge imo

[wind flume]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[digital stirrup]

Awesome ty, when you get a free ambush proc is it worth pressing it in aoe or still just fok every time above like 4 targets

[low thicket]

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[gaunt quiver]

Good to use it to refresh caustic spatter or when you're down to the last two or single add of a pack.

[thin dew]

@gusty mirage yo sorry for what happend in SOD
I was looking for the message I wrote and read those messages from shadowlands lol

[coral ibex]

bro just felt guilt over events from 4 years ago

[golden loom]

The upside of the blindspide proc is that its free, but in AoE you have infinite energy anyways, but yeah use it to refresh caustic

[thin dew]

I was pretty hated for what it seems

My bad thou that shit was garbage anyways

[strange sleet]

I was not expecting so much SD dmg in ToP (it was only level 11 but still). I played kinda bad too so

I'm actually loving the CT snapshotting gameplay

I missed that mechanic so much omg

[gray hazel]

I tried bleed in a bunch of 13 Brews last night. felt ok. Def liked it more on ST for sure, blindsides made it feel better even though not the best ST damage

Still not sure if its best to use Vanish to spread even more Gar and Rups to all of the other adds, or just to the inital 6-7 adds and caustic it like hybrid did

[empty adder]

Is assa doing better than sub and outlaw in MM+ or is it even ?

[kindred breach]

caustic does way less without poisons so i would send on reapplying as much bleeds as you can

but the overlap of MA may make it not worth i dont know

[dapper halo]

i cant sim heroic version of house of cards for some reason, is it an upgrade if i have priory and seaforium trinky

raidbots allows me to sim only normal version of trinket, annoying

[coral ibex]

[thin dew]

It depends really, on key level and comp. I aint bid M+ player, so Im not sure if Im the one to say it. But Id say sub has slight advantages on single target.

[dapper halo]

trying to figure out if i should even need for it since its the next boss

[hot flicker]

I mean i think myth pacemaker and signet are better then hc HoC

[empty adder]

Thank you

[coral ibex]

just add the item and change the ilvl

?

does this not work for you

[gusty mirage]

Homie I forgive you but ngl I do t remember shit from those days. I blocked out most of that entire expac

What even happened?

[thin dew]

Shit ton of externals lol

Me havin fun with ma homies

[gusty mirage]

also how the fuck was SL release 5 years ago

[gusty mirage]

honestly based

[placid adder]

Are you ready for SL classic?

[gusty mirage]

why would you say those words

don't put that into the universe man

[placid adder]

😂😂

[gusty mirage]

hopefully we get the original conduit energy back too!

I loved being limited into changing conduits

honestly I hope they go back to SL beta conduits where replacing them just deleted them from existence

[cerulean walrus]

Yoooo I can be Venthyr gang again let’s go

[gusty mirage]

so you had to refarm them

that would've been so sick

[cerulean walrus]

Just like the first time around

[gusty mirage]

OG flagellation?

that was a dps loss to press?

[cerulean walrus]

Venthyr gang from day one

[gusty mirage]

[cerulean walrus]

DAY ONE BABY

[gusty mirage]

YES SIR

[cerulean walrus]

[gusty mirage]

door of shadows was sick

[dapper halo]

oh, you have to manually define the itemlevel

[cerulean walrus]

All these goofy goobers out here while I’m sipping tea with my main man Theotar

[gusty mirage]

those night fae fools

[cerulean walrus]

Night Fae fools

Kyrian? More like blind

Zone’s too bright

L

[gusty mirage]

remember pvp in shadow lands

when rogues were one shotting people with echoing reprimand?

[cerulean walrus]

Ah yes

Echoing Reprimand funny button

[sharp viper]

then it got nerfed tot he ground

[gusty mirage]

or when ret pallies would press divine toll and one shot the entire team?

or when boomkins would press whatever the fuck their button was

and just hit 8 full moons

and you just died

that was cool

[sharp viper]

convoke

[gusty mirage]

that one

[strange python]

What do you mean by this? Asked about bleed build rotation / priority optimisation the other day but didn't get response

[shy axle]

which keys weakaura do you use for the overview/time/deaths on the righthand side? i tested 3 from wago but all have so many luas, maybe i just did not find the one, that is prefered, idk.

[cerulean walrus]

Convoke is the reason I have unbridled hatred for Boomkins

And always will

[granite leaf]

The only PvP I do is when I get taken down during Xav and have to clap some cheeks

[merry tapir]

how many haste are we pointing for in bleed build?

[cerulean walrus]

Whatever your sim says bud

[granite leaf]

More than 0, less than all

[hollow river]

https://tenor.com/view/pour-drink-pouring-alcohol-respect-gif-5359107

[lucid silo]

Multiple hastes

[cerulean walrus]

An amount

[strange python]

Guess the answer is sim, mine is still heavy crit mastery with a bit of vers thrown in

[gusty mirage]

the amount the robot at raidbots tells you to go at

[split willow]

How do you tell on wcl the number of CPs spent on a finisher?

[gusty mirage]

just top gear and trust it

[dapper halo]

looks like heroic kevin spacey is not upgrade, even if i fully upgrade it

[gusty mirage]

turn brain off, unga bunga robot, press buttons, kill stuff, get loot, be happy

[dapper halo]

its +42 dps upgrade

[cerulean walrus]

So called “free thinkers” SMH

[hollow river]

Resources tab -> combo points

[gusty mirage]

falenews

-fere's dad 2k16-2k25

[cerulean walrus]

My dad would never trust the sims

[granite leaf]

If it's less than 0.5% gain I cba

[lucid silo]

Remember when we downloaded a desktop application to sim

[hollow river]

Oxi you’ve been playing again right

[lucid silo]

Like neanderthals

[gusty mirage]

ye I do a bit of keying every now and then

bring me to your guild's aotc so I can properly quit after getting 3k io

[hollow river]

I’ve been trying pve again

[gusty mirage]

I do

[hollow river]

No guild tho

[gusty mirage]

I also remember the excel spreadsheet

dark times

now we download an addon, copy and paste into a website, and it pulls blizzard's data to give us every item in the game instead of items having to be added manually every update

https://tenor.com/view/abe-simpson-abe-simpson-cloud-yelling-cloud-angry-gif-12558964

[gray hazel]

Yeah, i usually waited until the IC ended, then vanished and spread more followed by shiv.

[lucid silo]

Simpler times

[gusty mirage]

in some ways they were better times

but then I remember grinding dailies for a month and a half to buy epic flying

and I don't miss it anymore

[lucid silo]

We pretend that wasn't a thing

like getting the wrong legendary in legion

[gusty mirage]

true

when we remember legion, we remember the gamba vendor which made it so you could still play your character when you inevitably got the feint-heal legendary as your first drop

[cerulean walrus]

Hey at least mage tower was free if you got that one

Mantle was one of the last legendaries I got

[jaunty warren]

At what key level is bleed build generally better then hybrid ?

[cerulean walrus]

All

[strange python]

OK I have a further question, sorry if its a simple one - I always use Raidbots and tweak the settings as required although is there a specific sim string that I need to use in there (for bleed, or historically others) I have just assumed, stupidly I guess, that the default APL is fine but now I think I have been doing it fundamentally wrong for years?

[viscid spear]

All that's left is a timed Cinderbrew

[royal lantern]

not really?

[dreamy rover]

afaik APL is kept up to date and the default one is perfect

[iron ivy]

Do we use Numbing Poison & Deadly Poison in bleeds build?

[strange python]

Thats ok, if so - just seen discussion on here about the SIM logic being updated and didn't know if that was one I should import rather than default on raidbots! 🙂 Thats great to know, I assumed that the talent choices taken from simc would translate into the defined logic but wasn't sure if I had misunderstood and I needed to take an APL from here to better sim

[spiral vapor]

!macros

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[dreamy rover]

nyanmoroes you fucking liar

what about my shiv thistle macro

[hollow saddle]

Honestly dont get assa ST, doing bleedbuild. playing as guide says doing 12-15 keys. ending up around 2.6-3m overall. but on bosses im just hoovering around 1m dps lol.

[royal lantern]

always use latest and you ARE up to date

[royal lantern]

assa does low boss dmg

in m+

just how it is

[hollow saddle]

going bipolar. swapping between sub and assa, Since the ST feels so bad

[jolly vault]

depends on bosses yea, but pure ST pulls 1M more or less is about what you gon get

[lean plover]

1M pure st is not it on 15s what

[errant trail]

guys

i just wanna say

the bleed build

might be it

[royal lantern]

dog?

[lean plover]

If u start kyrioss with Dm and use next one on execute you get around 1.3-1.6M

[errant trail]

for 12s and lower

like IDK WHY but i feel way more useful

in 12s and lower using bleed build don’t get me wrong

i love KB by dayum

[royal lantern]

"if you kill a boss with cds running, your boss dmg is higher" is a take for sure lol

like, ofc it is

[lean plover]

?

[royal lantern]

its literally better everywhere

thats not a "12 or lower" angle

[errant trail]

you think KB is a meme now?

[lean plover]

deathmark is what 16 seconds

[royal lantern]

kingsbane does almost nothing right now lol

[errant trail]

yeah i swear KB is doodoo

[royal lantern]

darkest night envenom does more dmg then kingsbane

[lean plover]

u telling me u take kyrioss from execute range to dead in 30 seconds?

[royal lantern]

every 4th finisher, you do more dmg by pressing envenom once, then you do with kingsbane lol

[cloud basin]

what is counted as "poison damage" for the use of spatter? trying to see what all splashes

[royal lantern]

no, but yo say "boss dmg is not low if you kill a boss with cds running or used shortly before that"

which is like

yes ofc? lol

[royal lantern]

more or less everything that is nature dmg on assa

envenom, your weapon poisons, kingsbane, vicous venom bonus dmg from mutilate, singular focus, poison bomb ticks etc.....

[lean plover]

No, im saying bleed build has rly good execute, paired with deathmark window it makes st less bad

Ik not saying use dm when boss at 5% hp

[tall atlas]

has bloodmallet 5tar been updated for the bleed build?

[gusty mirage]

P sure it just uses the submitted raid simc build for all their charts

So it’s probably running the ST set up

Can double check under character profile drop down

[lucid silo]

Do our trinkets even change with bleed build

Dinar can't come soon enough

[gusty mirage]

Outside of like eye of kezan, hoc, priory, and seaforoum everything else kinda sucks tbh

[lucid silo]

Can we bring back withered Jim

[royal lantern]

can you go back into solitary confinement

[coral ibex]

i like mega magnet tbh

[lucid silo]

only if i get a 30x titanforged arcano crystal like god intended

[crystal nymph]

how can i hide button glows

on classic ui not elvui

[lucid silo]

titanforging what a good mechanic

[spring stream]

!pooling

[prisma monolith]

• Energy just is low on the spec there's nothing to do about it, you will run out
• Only one pooling condition exists (pool around 4 seconds before non-deathmark kingsbanes until 150ish energy). This is worth 0.3%
• Other optimizations are simply not impactful enough to show a benefit in sims, but pooling before quick-dying add spawns could in theory be a practical gain to pad.

[prime hull]

Thanks for the bleed build research by the way it is insanely fun, i did 5m overall in a floodgate 10 and i dont even have 4set yet!

[hollow river]

would prolly require an addon i would assume

[wild star]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[slim copper]

Wrt to the pooling stuff. Why do we pool before quick dying adds? Don’t we get the energy back regardless of how fast they die?

[coral ibex]

its about having energy available to do damage to them before they die quickly

hence "gain to pad"

[slim copper]

https://tenor.com/view/think-about-it-use-your-brain-use-the-brain-think-brain-gif-7914082

[grim jay]

1m sounds pretty low

I never end up at 1m

[past bobcat]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[jolly vault]

Honestly higher is of course possible, but in my case that depends what mechanics are thrown at me during the process of trying to deal damage

[cerulean burrow]

Is the bleed build important string updated onto wowhead guide ?

So I can easily grab it ?

[grim jay]

wowhead is always updated

[cerulean burrow]

Okay

[fathom crown]

Do people play nightelf in m+ to avoid mechanics with shadowmeld or can you somehow stealth out of it?

[tepid hearth]

you can vanish out of some things

[modest apex]

whats the play if i get mythic boots from raid when i have 675 nerubian crafted boots crafted neck and dagger?

[tepid hearth]

use boots and craft wrists or cloak with the embellishment

[modest apex]

and use another 60 gilded for the cloak/wrists or just 658

[tepid hearth]

just save up for 675 or convert crests upwards if you can for it

[buoyant pumice]

I feel like i run out of energy on ST Alot

[tepid hearth]

yep

[modest apex]

aight still got 90 but capped for the week

[hoary mist]

So tru

[fast phoenix]

interesting, didnt see funhouse lens being 8k dps upgrade over my Mechano-core

[slate crown]

!design

[prisma monolith]

Running out of energy in single target is completely normal, intended design of Assassination. As a burst spec our damage is mainly loaded into Deathmark/Shiv and massive Envenoms through stacking multiple nature damage buffs such as Lingering Darkness, Shiv, Darkest Night, Amplifying Poison, and more. This comes with the natural downside of our damage suffering outside of these windows, in part due to the designed lack of energy slowing us down.

Because of this, there is only one minor (0.3%) min-max with energy, which is pooling 3-4 seconds into an upcoming Kingsbane. Ideally this would put you at around 50-60% energy before you enter your Kingsbane, which is more than enough energy alongside thistle tea. Outside of that, spam Envenom and just accept that you will run out of energy. There is nothing you can do to not run out of energy. Playing around Envenom uptime also is not relevant anymore, as Twist the knife allows for two stacks at a time, which reduces wasted uptime dramatically. Without twist the knife, wasting uptime is unavoidable.

[vagrant lagoon]

why are my sims saying my mast/vers neck is better than my mast/crit neck i only have 10k crit

[keen spruce]

Cuz numbers

[ornate igloo]

Are we still doing FoK at 6CP to get the last CP with Darkness Night up, even in single target?

[iron vapor]

I tend to just refresh a garotte at that point if there's only one CP left to get

but if you're FoK spamming anyway it's probably moot in terms of damage

[hidden bay]

mutilate

[strange sleet]

If you're on 6cp with darkest night, you should mutilate in single target with vicious venoms, fan of knives on 2+ targets.

pins

[ornate igloo]

I forgot to mention this is with bleed build in M+

[strange sleet]

the info there is pretty much everything you need

[strange python]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[crystal vault]

pow

[ornate igloo]

Yeah, I did read the pins, I was just confused because this used to be something that was mentioned in one of the Whispyr videos

Will do mutilate

[gusty mirage]

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[gusty mirage]

[abstract warren]

so with bleed build, when do we ever push envenom?

[strange sleet]

kind of as a filler if you know what I mean

in ST

in AoE you just send it with spatter

after you dot

[abstract warren]

So we still just press crimson for dot then switch to envonem?