assassination

[grim jay]

Yeah, nelth is a really good dungeon for sin. Had 538k last time without pi/aug. I think the pulls just naturally match well

[grand trail]

hm not really

i was holding vendeta all the time

[royal lantern]

semi-high targets with often more beefy guys that dont die instantly

[grim jay]

Okey, I think I didnt hold much

[grand trail]

becasue on first pull

my beefy primar target pop in 10sec

so i desync my cd with SP

and was hodling for bosses a lot

[true condor]

brothers i win again

13 hollow

[clever sapphire]

but how did you beat those specs, the tierlist video i watched today said assa is D tier and sp/frost mage are S tier unbeatable

[gusty mirage]

Because D stands for Dick and he gave them the Dick

[true condor]

no PI skill

yes oxi lord is right

[gusty mirage]

[true condor]

all u need to do is kingsbane then everything ruin in a moment

with KINGSBANE even not the first overall

[quiet oar]

[potent raven]

Ur font is so ugly

[normal mist]

I actually love it

[vestal wren]

try the harry potter font from details

[true condor]

[cursive owl]

whats that damage meter font and style, i want also owo

[rotund oak]

was i right or was i right when i was saying sin pumps 😉

and not only it pumps,its very fun to play

[grim bison]

good morning, yes assa after buffs does good dmg in keys, specially with sp, even better if paired with tank big cds every 2 mins.
BUT, in higher keys you’ll die alot, you don’t get evaision every 30 sec like outlaw, your vers is lower and can’t spam faint..
Side note it’s pretty meh with aggro if you use tricks at the beginning of the pull, you most likely will get meleed.

[keen spruce]

yes

[potent raven]

too bad im close to 40% vers

[normal mist]

Yes

[buoyant pewter]

hello guys , what can i give up to take acrobatic strikes for m+ ?

[potent raven]

do not, get used w.o

[gusty mirage]

deeper stratagem and alacrity

slap the extra point into lethality

[buoyant pewter]

ok thanks

[gusty mirage]

[dark token]

Acro is not recommended for sin for a couple reasons tho:

1. big DPS loss to take it (losing DS/alacrity)
2. acro does not extend your IC or caustic spatter range so it does not affect how well you can aoe targets. In fact it can be detrimental as if you are ICing from max acro range as your IC is centered around you, not your target. This can result in bleeds not spreading to nearby targets if you are not centered around mobs.

It really only helps you land kicks in keys; while important, not worth giving up the other stuff imo

[potent raven]

id love to take it in bracken

but evasion +elu is kinda nice there

and locking in

[buoyant pewter]

alrght thanks for the precious informations

ill get used to play w/o

[dark token]

What is elusiveness even good for in bracken

1st boss gashtooth?

[tacit scroll]

if i only have swords from outlaw and want to swap to sin or sub do i need 2 daggers

or can my off hand be a sword

[split cipher]

mut takes 2 daggers

[tacit scroll]

i see

[junior aurora]

would you need elusive?

evasion / stoneform / vanish should be enough right?

[spice surge]

You need 2 daggers for assa and for sub you technically dont need 2 daggers, but a lvl 1 dagger is better than any 528 non-dagger in offhand so

You effectively need 2 daggers for both

[tacit scroll]

okay

thanks friends

[gusty mirage]

IC actually has a range check around your target and yourself

it makes absolutely zero fucking sense

there was a graphic about it floating around

idk if the rework in 10.2.5 changed it

[true condor]

yes sap ur right

[wide ferry]

How does zerocool put up 700k as sin? Tf!? Thats insane

[normal mist]

Because he is cool, obviously

[pseudo hamlet]

Good gear, good skill, coordinated group, some luck

[keen spruce]

screams in french at his team to simp for his CDs, and he has the power of nicotine

each cigarette is +25k dps per dungeon

but seriously, very good coordinated group that play around the strengths of their specs

[wide ferry]

just started touching 450koverall as outlaw but that puglife is keepin a brotha down.

must be

[keen spruce]

he's actually from Jordan not france

but EU

is all french to me

700k was also with Aug

but if you go watch the youtube VoD you can see how much they're communicating and how much value they're getting out of the pulls

[dark token]

You mean the 10.2 rework? Or did something change in 10.2.5

Cause I remember at start of 10.2 it was only around yourself

[keen spruce]

it got fixed

changed

[dark token]

Stealth hotfixed

[keen spruce]

now it's 2 circles

one around target one around yourself

neither affected by acro

[dark token]

What is the range of 2nd circle

[keen spruce]

i can't remember i tested before

but

acro does still technically increase the range

[dark token]

I guess RS behaves similarly?

[keen spruce]

because you can garrote your target from further away

which means the back side of the circle around you

can reach further

but like in practice it doesn't do anything

[dark token]

Ye but that's not super relevant for keys

[gusty mirage]

completely ass

lmfao

either way acro doesn't affect it either iirc

[keen spruce]

yeah

[dark token]

I need some radius displays for caustic/IC sad

[keen spruce]

i might have some screenshots somewhere

on target dummies

[dark token]

Have a WA draw circles on my screen

[gusty mirage]

if I can find it I'll DM it to you

[keen spruce]

i think it was like 8 yards?

[gusty mirage]

sounds about right

and the circle around the target was like

slightly bigger

[keen spruce]

certainly no bigger than 12, probably more like 10

I can't fkin remember

[gusty mirage]

ye def wasn't bigger than 12

that I remember for sure

[subtle tundra]

@gusty mirage my right trap is bigger than my left one and it's bothering me

[gusty mirage]

death grip jerk off more with your left arm now

ez fix

[subtle tundra]

I was thinking steroids

[gusty mirage]

oh

[subtle tundra]

But that might work

[gusty mirage]

minalba can help you out with which gear to juice with

[subtle tundra]

I have a friend that started taking...

[keen spruce]

so before the change

this used to only garrote the closest mob

and the IC circle around you was too small to hit the other dummies

and this is after the change

i think that is max range garrote with acro?

this was back in November

[gusty mirage]

ye seems about the max range for gar

and you'd just be sad

:)))

cause it wouldn't cleave the furthest mobs

[keen spruce]

yeah but they stealth fixed it

this was my old explaination

before the fix

[gusty mirage]

beautiful visuals per usual

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923750073499648/1237082408969572362/FragmentYeet.gif

[spice surge]

Actually getting ready to use my fragment next week

The zaqali speed kill cook

[keen spruce]

fragment bug fixed

[true condor]

should we drop this oxi lord

i use my bronze for it

[keen spruce]

Also pretty sure IC can still get LoS'd

#assassination message

unless this got fixed too

#assassination message

this was also pre-fix IC

very cringe

[gusty mirage]

why would you drop it

[true condor]

bc its too powerful?

like its the orange wep for us

[normal mist]

Drop it as in get it?

[keen spruce]

i think language barrier

yes spend bullion, yes get it

[normal mist]

Yeah absolutely

[true condor]

i feel like when the ashes come we become god

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923682607857685/1181335994256064623/dagger.webp

[true condor]

which one is the best?

[spice surge]

It doesnt really matter, none of them do anything spectacular

[quiet oar]

There is no "best"

[spice surge]

Speed is prob the most useful though

10% movespeed pretty good

[quiet oar]

Does Giant work?

Finally?

[spice surge]

[gusty mirage]

define work

if by work you mean "it makes you bigger" it always worked

[quiet oar]

Ye i mean the stamina obv

[lime edge]

I use leech

I'm big brain

And I'm immune to fall damage

[gaunt sigil]

I used cheat when I had it

Especially cause it was bugged and could multiproc

I had pulls where it was like 200k hps or something insane

[spice surge]

That was fixed like week 3

Now its awful

[dark token]

Wasn't demon good cause it was 6% shadow dmg Dr without any holy dmg increase

[spice surge]

Without the phys damage increase*, the holy increase works

But yes, it was good but theres not that much shadow damage this season

Sark and nelth ig

[slate crown]

Doesn't shadowflame count as shadow?

Or was that found to be not true

[spice surge]

Not for this effect no

[slate crown]

ah

[spice surge]

Or atleast it didnt on fyrakk

If you get fire dr on humanoid it can be good too, but eh

10% speed always decent

[royal lantern]

critter

the only way

[tulip heron]

Does this mean I can open/shadow dance and just spam garrote on one target to spread it? Likewise with rupture?

[dark token]

Yes but you get -1 target

[tulip heron]

so just garrote, tab targ,

then split it up with a rupture with cp

[dark token]

Scenario: 6t:
You garrote main target 2x. That's 3 + 2 ruptures (one duplicated on main target)
You garrote 2 diff targets, the 2nd one without garrote. you get 6 bleeds (3+3)

[tulip heron]

I'm already getting solid results out of this

[dark token]

But for example 1-5t it doesn't matter

At 5t garrote main target 2x that's 5 bleeds, same if you tabbed

At 7t you need 3 garrotes regardless, even if you did main target 3x

[tulip heron]

ah so 5 or less targets, I can just garrote twice and rupture twice for the same effect?

[dark token]

Ye

[tulip heron]

and then I get my prio target for caustic spatter

[dark token]

At 8-9t however you should be tabbing

[tulip heron]

sorry, seems like stupid questions, I only went assass on Wednesday

[dark token]

Or 6t

If that makes sense

Because 3 garrotes same targets is 3,5,7 bleeds respectively

Seperate targets is 3, 6, 9

[tulip heron]

and prio those bleeds over crimson tempest?

Gotcha, makes sense

[dark token]

CT should be your first finisher but yes if you have 7-9t you should garrote 3x overcapping cp

[tulip heron]

I guess it's pull dependent, if you've got a chain pulling tank and a ret pala spamming storm, not much point

[dark token]

CT should be even before snd if you don't have it up

[tulip heron]

Oh shit, I've been neglecting CT

I'm using it as a filler after the main bleeds

[dark token]

Nah it's your main finisher always have it up on 4t+

[tulip heron]

Sweet, will give that a go then

[dark token]

Just don't override the dot, maintain it

Don't spam

If 2-4 more targets join a pull u can refresh early

If that makes sense

[tulip heron]

yeah, let that dot sit on all targets, and use envenom spam for splatter?

[dark token]

Ye

[tulip heron]

Aye makes sense, thank you 🙂

[dark token]

My opener in aoe is usually garrote 3x (3 diff targets), CT, fok, rupture, mut, deathmark shiv kb, envenom

[tulip heron]

sweet will give this a go

[dark token]

Then more garrotes (spreading to more targets or refreshing) during shadow dance, adding 1 more ruoture during dance for scent of vlood

Rather than muts or foks

[tulip heron]

aaaand my first queue with this advice, 521 ret pala with legendary wep.. XD

[dark token]

All this doesn't matter in low keys where pack dies instantly anyway

You start skipping stuff

[tulip heron]

can you imagine the pala discord discussion? "Press the shiny button"

[slate crown]

Yeah esp in lower keys just garrote stuff CT stuff rupture stuff it'll all demise pop and you'll move on

[tulip heron]

521 ret beats a 512 assass overall in m+, but on single target it's a cakewalk

arterial shock I think it's called

[subtle tundra]

how long was that boss lol

[lime edge]

Why do fire mages always do no damage

In my keys

[tulip heron]

49 seconds haha

[indigo epoch]

Lmao

[subtle tundra]

yea ofc youre top

and its not even pure st

any ret dumps on assa

in normal scenarios

[indigo epoch]

Sadge

[tulip heron]

but they do have a big advantage, they're a spooned class with a few shiny buttons 😦

[lime edge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1129966845160603698/1240766100392640553/image.png?ex=664869ba&is=6647183a&hm=e0a0dec589067e448be512833c399f86a3156baafacd3487dbc898cd7a647bf6&

Like what is this man

[subtle tundra]

well it doesnt matter how simple or hard a spec is

its the numbers that matter at the end of the day

[azure basalt]

The numbers mason

[slate crown]

cuteness, I think u mean cuteness

[tulip heron]

I'd say unless you're going hardcore, it's how much fun you have that matters

[slate crown]

[lime edge]

Demo doing less than tank

[indigo epoch]

Wish bliz would reward harder to master specs with higher damage

[tulip heron]

I've got a ret, I find it dull, even with big numbers

[indigo epoch]

Bm and ret vs rogue Feelsbadman

[subtle tundra]

well i wasnt expecting someone linking details to be from a +2

[tulip heron]

I only went assass on Wednesday 😦 I'm learning!

[subtle tundra]

thats fine

[tulip heron]

no point jumping into high keys learning a spec, I'll just get squished 😄

I'm still toying with sub for raid bosses though

[subtle tundra]

yea my point is that objectively speaking ret is just better than assa

[indigo epoch]

[tulip heron]

oh 100%, it's like S tier for all situations

[misty holly]

does raidbots support MOP Remix characters?

[spice surge]

Not fully, but a little bit

All gems arent in

[spice spire]

[slate crown]

https://tenor.com/view/folding-ideas-dan-olson-this-is-financial-advice-savage-wrecked-gif-11736227189233390956

[lime edge]

How's assa in mop

Never played mop

[thorn fjord]

Its DF sin

DF rogue

All 3 specs really suck for leveling early on lol

[glacial relic]

it really depends on the key and how good they playing the padding game

[glacial relic]

assa is sooo back

[lime edge]

Oh wait what

Wtf is the point of going back to mop then

[royal lantern]

who the fuck are those paladins

srsly

[glacial relic]

just pugs who dont know how to press 5 buttons 🤷🏻‍♂️

[royal lantern]

[broken ibex]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lime edge]

Since I started playing assa again

On like monday

I've been pretty much top every key

People really suck in low keys

[royal lantern]

yeha, and trust me thats not a new thing

top dps as assa? what the fuck are they doing??

and then you see the ret using wings against 3 enemys at 20% hp and thats the answer

[lime edge]

Kind of annoying to kingsbane

And then the target dies in 5 seconds

[rotund oak]

i actually find more satisfying to KB w/o DM

if i do both the mob dies so fast its not even funny 😅

[lime edge]

[rotund oak]

e.g the big tree pulls on BRH

tank pulls some slimes and stuff on top of those trees

good targets to spatter from

if u dm a tree ,it dies so freaking fast it barely feels worth

but anyway ye

sin feels amazing

all the way

[royal lantern]

https://tenor.com/view/always-has-been-among-us-astronaut-space-betrayal-gif-23836476

[tulip heron]

what do you guys think of this build? This is from the apparent M+ leader for assass rogue

[runic hinge]

Looks like cleave

[slate crown]

That's the typical build used for "I am a single targeter, but there is light aoe"

and is used a lot for very high-end M+

[subtle tundra]

there really isnt an assa pusher

[slate crown]

typically in very coordinated groups

[subtle tundra]

nobody is playing it in high keys

[slate crown]

but it's not something that's very helpful in lower uncoordinated keys

[tulip heron]

so.. for someone learning the build in mid keys, don't bother?

spec*

[slate crown]

If you're learning the spec in keys I would just use arterial always

[subtle tundra]

just play it

have the fun

[slate crown]

Arterial is very flexible and strong

(Arterial shock)

[tulip heron]

I'm loving art shock tbh

most fun I've had on wow for years

[slate crown]

[tulip heron]

kinda get sidelined a bit getting into keys though I feel, we don't really have any utility to bring to the table apart from dps

[clever sapphire]

iw/aoe blind which is also aoe dmg reduction/deleting 1 mob that people hate so it makes things easier

[balmy condor]

Iron wire is one of the strongest utilities in the game for m+

[lime edge]

Iron wire op

Fr fr

And uh

[runic hinge]

Aoe blind with blackjack is also huge lol

[slate crown]

Sin has great utility and good damage and is an asset to keys

[lime edge]

Atrophic poison

[slate crown]

Just

[lime edge]

The cast time one

I forgor

[runic hinge]

Shroud is there

[slate crown]

Good luck finding a group that agrees with that statement

[balmy condor]

It’s just the same problem it always is

[slate crown]

Yup

[balmy condor]

M+ meta is dictated by damage

If you aren’t top cock dps

You’re not meta

Regardless of what you bring

You’d have to bring Augvoker levels of utility for that to not be the case

[potent raven]

good in dungeons like RLP

[balmy condor]

And even in the case of Aug people still argue that the utility ain’t worth the damage loss

[runic hinge]

Does numbing work that well this season? I haven’t really been running it

I feel like half of everything is just immune

[potent raven]

for mobs I think? but for bosses atrophic is 3.x% dr

forgot the numba

[lime edge]

3%dr for everyone

Not just you

[true condor]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[true condor]

i am trying to get a plater to notice me that i got all mobs on bleed ty whispyr

[limber lion]

🧐

[normal otter]

yo does anyone know how the addon is called where the dmg numbers for each skill drop from the enemy npc?
kinda like scrolling battle textes but its numbers with the skill icon

[sudden hound]

nameplate scrolling combat text maybe?

[normal otter]

yep thanks!

[muted ridge]

Anyone having issues with spatter not working in keys?

Friends overall in key so far, spatter nowhere to be found

(Yes its specced)

[lime edge]

[potent raven]

wow lol

[shy pecan]

Check the debuffs uptime in auras to see if it was actually up

[proven jasper]

Bro never mutilated to actually start spatter

is what it looks like

[red wolf]

not pressing mutilate somehow?

[abstract cargo]

😂

[lime edge]

He has 0 mutilate damage

So yea

[proven jasper]

Tell him to read the spatter ability 👍

[lime edge]

Oh

Wait

Isn't that the wrong poison

?

[shy pecan]

Yup

[muted ridge]

Oh lmao

[proven jasper]

Lol

[lime edge]

Spatter needs deadly

[muted ridge]

Hahahahaha

[shy pecan]

RIP damage

[proven jasper]

RIP massively

2024 and people are still putting instant on their weapons as assa

[muted ridge]

Tfw outlaw otp touches assa

[proven jasper]

Fr

[subtle tundra]

you dont have poison

[muted ridge]

Case closed

Tbf all of us pepegas not noticing 0 poison dmg

[proven jasper]

Its so second nature just didnt even think about it

[tropic jewel]

hey guys

is raidbots kinda buggy regarding kingsbane ?

it feels like the sim doesnt do enough dmage

[clever sapphire]

show sim

[abstract cargo]

Like in a dungeon slice or? Show the sim

[balmy condor]

[tropic jewel]

i just saw that the iteration endet to early

but nevertheless i had no critluck on that try now ... here is the sim

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/xASjUuuDZC9e579brWFwZH

[balmy condor]

no buffs over 2mil a cast on kb

seems pretty reasonable

[tropic jewel]

Was also 3:43 on the puppet with 61,3 % crit on kb

but before it was like 11 million and that was why i was wondering because the difference between sim and reality was so high

[balmy condor]

okay so while the sample is 3:43, that's not what these numbers are showing

that's why this banner is here

the numbers are the averages

[tropic jewel]

but btw. its a pleasure Mr. Whispyr i just watched ur vids 🙂

[balmy condor]

of all 46,416 iterations

and there's variance

so a 4 min sim

is actually uh

math

hard

3:12 to 4:48

so it's just not really a good comparison point

kingsbane will highroll and lowroll

that's just life

[subtle tundra]

also thats 8.3mil kb dmg

compared to 9.38

not a HUGE diff

in details envenom and tier set dmg arent added

like in sim

[balmy condor]

here, I actually have a great example

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nuWYByuhBEhFtZ7EdgDvM6

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pokEbqZXmB93v1XgJML23H

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bTx5b9S1pkLDaJBUtzyrtt

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/1oENQD6zCkzAjTybDzNpxU

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9vXstpk8Jcz3oKodJzLqwn

these are 5 simulations

and they're all exactly 3:43

and they're all exactly 1 iteration

the first has 11.4mil kb damage

but as you look at the other ones, it fluctuates a bunch

the fourth one barely broke 10

that's like a 15% swing in just 5 pulls

[shy pecan]

Hooray variance

[tropic jewel]

hm k

wild things

[dark token]

When are remix gems implemented in raidbots I need whispyr sims

[subtle tundra]

i swear to god i hear one more thing about remix

imma kms

! ! !

[dark token]

Remix urself out of this channel bud

Fated is dead

[subtle tundra]

And remix won't be in 2 days 😭

[balmy condor]

it's just a million things coming together that you can't control. Poison procs are random, your combo points are semi-random for envenom uptime, your kb crit is random, the actual tick of kb that crits is important too, can't just crit the first half and then not crit the back half. You got wafting devotion, that might proc or not

we love kingsbane

[runic hinge]

We love kb

[tropic jewel]

but assa is nice to play

i agree we love kb

[boreal whale]

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923682607857685/1181335994256064623/dagger.webp

[desert inlet]

I hate kingsbane

I wanna kick kingsbane in the ribs

[balmy condor]

may I interest you in the war within, the 10th expansion for world of warcraft

[runic hinge]

10th?

Holy shit I’m old

[desert inlet]

although I did see some coin flips

[runic hinge]

I’m gonna log into my xfire account to see what my friends are up to

[balmy condor]

we know

[gilded oasis]

gang gang

[dull flax]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[spice spire]

You better learn outlaw pal in that one meme format

[ripe rapids]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[runic hinge]

[slate crown]

Shock and crank bleeds on council yeah?

[balmy condor]

yes but swap blindside for tiny toxic

cause you will only be pressing mut for caustic

so

blindside is pointless

[slate crown]

Only doing normal just getting bearings but went pretty well, didn't see this till after

I got PI like in my down phases beacuse this is a pug and they have no idea what they're doing ig

So had bs

[balmy condor]

unlucku

[silk bane]

nice nice wp

[true rapids]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[rotund oak]

isnt it crazy how many sin rogues are around this time around

pre-buff you wouldnt even see one in keys,now like 4-5 out of 10 are sin rogues

[balmy condor]

were you always that color

you look weird

[rotund oak]

no ive changed it coz i love all 3 specs equally

i love rogue

usually changing it to match what im playing

[balmy condor]

I honestly think there's a lot of people that would love assassination but just can't be fucked because it's been bad in m+ basically since m+ has come out

it was okay in legion and then bad until last patch of bfa where it was kinda okay, and then bad again forever

[rotund oak]

idk man,ppl are meta-whoring

[balmy condor]

bunch of people just not even trying it out to see if they'd like it

[rotund oak]

rly hard

[balmy condor]

metaslaving in m+?

can't be

[silk bane]

sin legit feels fun to play in keys

youre not fighting against your own spec

if it can live and does damage, people like palying it

[rotund oak]

i loved it even before the buffs man

[silk bane]

which is now

[rotund oak]

sin is legit

[silk bane]

its not about the buff or pre buff, its more like subs unplayable, and is unfun in keys

so its either outlaw or sin

but sin wasny really a real spec

so youd be griefing

[rotund oak]

gets a buff=>becomes a thing 😉

disgusting community rly

[silk bane]

thats how M+ works though. your goal is to time the key.

zero was playing outlaw

but hes back to sin now

because sin is good

also it helps that spriest is meta so u can just get PI + aug on DM

[balmy condor]

damage is kinda the last thing you need to time a key though

[rotund oak]

habibi is iconic to sin eitherway the man plays the spec,i respect that

[balmy condor]

m+ hasn't been balanced around dps checks in years

[silk bane]

eh, i think keys are weird now. like you need to pull really really really masive to time the keys right now (leading to it being a timer issue , so u need more damage kinda)

but also pulling this big, makes it harder to live

like on my spriest, we did a 16, pulled like bitches and +2d

then on an 18 we pulled masive and barley timed

weird scaling on keys tbh

its also why youre seeing 1+M overalls. because the pulls are becoming gigantic to allow u to time.

[balmy condor]

yeh

idk

it just always feels like blizzard can't decide what they want m+ to be

in legion you pulled legit half the dungeon and kited it back to the start and pulled everything into bosses to try to time a key

there were some scary pulls

but it was legit just pump harder and you win

then they tried to add some stuff in bfa but it ended up being the same thing, just stun everything as well

then they capped things and shadowlands had mini bosses and dogshit mobs that forced you to not pull big

then they made m+ into a survival mini-game where you either die or you live

and now we're sorta back to pull big

they've tried making bosses crazy hard, mobs crazy hard

like just stick to something

you got affixes to make the dungeons varied

why do you change up what the tuning design is as well

[silk bane]

I havent really seen M+ before DF, but based on your description it looks like they want you to interat with each pack more, thats why theyre adding multile important mechanics to multiple mobs in each pack.

which kinda supports that they only care about portal range

maybe a bit higher

[balmy condor]

I mean of course they only care about portal range

they gotta tune for some breakpoint

same thing as raid

they tune for mid-high heroic and lower end mythic

portal range is probably their marker for specs, unless something just destroys like the aug comp

[silk bane]

this new re numbering the keys was most likely to get more people who normally wouldnt evne do 15-20s, to want to experience 0-10 and get their portals.

which kinda supports what u said

they want more people to interat with portal range

but the scaling beyond that is getting out of control

like keys get a lot harder a lot faster than they used to i feel like (this season)

and it makes the meta a lot more impactful

[balmy condor]

for me personally it's just not fun to struggle with Fuckface Archer of Unnamed Clan or Caster Mage #9

like I get that there's gotta be mechanics on trash, sometimes impactful

add a mini boss or something

but not every pack needs to have 4 important mechanics to kick and 3 mobs to perma stun and 2 ground aoes and a frontal

I just can't give a shit about that

[silk bane]

yeah its getting a little out of control ngl. like this week with raging feels so disgusting. youre pulling like 5 packs at a time, your vdh is supposed to control it, but if your aug cant get a good soothe keys done

like thats gotta be the worst way to play the game

[balmy condor]

I wanna crank, be a gamer on a couple of nasty pulls, have some routes that aren't just press W, make the boss fights interesting

beat the timer

get loot

move on

[silk bane]

yeah idk why they moved away from that.

[balmy condor]

now it's press W and also fight for your fucking life every pack

and it's just too much

at least for me

I'm sure some people enjoy 40 minutes of straight anxiety

[silk bane]

like idk if my logic is right, but it seems like they want to not over homogonize every class. so they have classes that are good at 5/8/8+ targets.

then they need to make dungeons so that u need to pull in diffferent sizes

so that theres a reason for those specs to exist

but then they fuck up tuning

[balmy condor]

or even just make different dungeons different sizes so it spreads out the meta a little

like I don't give a shit if destro lock is insane in academy if I get to be insane in brackenhide or whatever

it doesn't have to be crazy bad

and vault/portals are still easy-ish obviously

but there should be some reason to not spriest every dungeon every week

[silk bane]

thats the problem they have though. if destro is tuned to be crazy at 12 targets, and youre crazy at 6. then they need to add mechanics that stops groups from combinging 2 6 mob pulls.

[balmy condor]

yeh

idk

[silk bane]

but players are good enough that they say fuck it, im gonna deal with all this bs, combine the 2 packs, have my destro delete it

[balmy condor]

they just gotta rethink the formula at this point

[silk bane]

and now enhance is fucked, those players are fucked cuz they gotta deal with 2x the intended mechanics

but also, u cant time the key if u dont do that

which is also why I think they went for the "things are gonna one shot you before damage becomes a problem"

so that u CAN pull the 2 x 6 mob pulls because the isssue isnt damage or timer

but then that introduces another issue. now classes withdifferent defensives/utility can live and its just aids

[balmy condor]

yeah exactly

[honest goblet]

trinks: ashes + torch for m+?

[balmy condor]

yep

[honest goblet]

if i have 473 ashes and dont get torch in vault fingers crossed should i grab torch now?

[balmy condor]

if you have a 473 ashes I would suggest equipping a trinket

[honest goblet]

lol

i know i know.. unfortunately i got a late start on the season blizz planned the new season the same week my wife planned popping out a kid

[balmy condor]

that damned wife

couldn't have just held it in

[honest goblet]

i swear

[rotund oak]

congratulations my man

[honest goblet]

i told her

thanks lol

[balmy condor]

boy or girl?

[honest goblet]

gal

[balmy condor]

congratulations

but yeh if you got the bullions

[runic hinge]

My life is just 24/7 anxiety so it can’t get worse

[balmy condor]

would probably grab either a torch and then figure out your ashes

or grab your ashes and then equip something else

[rotund oak]

women..

[balmy condor]

this thingy in the pins might help

the second slot is a bit more open-ended

[honest goblet]

i had to spend my first 2 on wep my weps were ass... so i got dreamcarver so i have 2 im waiting till vault before i spend the second 2, the tempostone and the mark of mastery (thank you friends guild for the H carry)

[balmy condor]

mhm'

[honest goblet]

i did get seal ring though so that was coo

@balmy condor if my second wep is bad am i better off spending bullion on that vs trinks?

[balmy condor]

trinks

[honest goblet]

kk

[balmy condor]

offhands are pretty pointless

just a bit of melee damage and some stats

really weird

[runic hinge]

I sharpen mine so I bet it’s pretty pointy

[rocky sluice]

fuu

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[runic hinge]

Not the current cause at this point in my life

[rotund oak]

waiting room huh?

[runic hinge]

[rotund oak]

[runic hinge]

What am I waiting on

Oh pooling probably

[rotund oak]

baby

little tonynugz

[runic hinge]

No thanks

[onyx gulch]

Anyone have a good WA for audio callout for M+?

[slate crown]

why no nicholas from bunyons

[potent raven]

asking the right questions

[rotund oak]

too stronk,cant risk the caster season

[true condor]

tank is noob

[rotund oak]

i think u are too obsessed with details

whatever the tank is

outside all that

outlaw has carved too much bad stuff in ur brain

be free of that

[quiet oar]

I mean this Kind off something Different, but i would have been hyped if you could buy sylvie dagger

Ngl

[true condor]

yes i would

[formal harness]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[potent raven]

assa so hard in m+ wow

[fallen arch]

No it’s not

It fucking slaps

I think it’s a sleeper pick for sure

[potent raven]

the sb build is kinda hard

maintaing dots and all that on big pulls

[fallen arch]

I don’t think it is

[potent raven]

How come

[ivory flower]

If you do a good opener you'll just need to refresh CT and maybe 2-3 rupture then it's envenom spam

[fallen arch]

^

Maybe restealth once to reapply a bunch of bleeds

But you wanna rely on huge caustic damage as well

In your cds

[potent raven]

ok ic

maybe its ez then

[junior aurora]

assa just feels bad in low keys

high keys it feels fine

[potent raven]

i was doing 13-14s i just get lost a lot

[ivory flower]

What build do you play ? Arterial cleave or hybrid ?

[potent raven]

arterial ye

ct/sb build

i go cleave (no ct) for keys taht dont have massive pulls

i.e rlp/av

[fallen arch]

Even there it feels fine I think

[ivory flower]

Yeah you can go cleave for ulda too

[fallen arch]

Cause you got pretty big sudden demise dam

[ivory flower]

With the cleave build you can just 2 garrotes rup and go for DM KB

[potent raven]

i might be wrong but the way i do it is

[ivory flower]

With arterial you need to spread bleeds a lot

[potent raven]

i garrote/rupture cuz of ic as much as i can then pick a target and dm+kb or kb if dm is on cd then i use my ct

[ivory flower]

Like you do 3 garrotes, even if you overcap combo points

[junior aurora]

feels bad to not be able to press my cds

[ivory flower]

Apply 5 rupture

Do CT then you go DM KB

You ll have to reapply CT during that windows

[fallen arch]

Just press em

Blow up packs

And hope theyre up for bosses

[junior aurora]

the only thing you blow up is a single mob lol

[fallen arch]

U provide solid funnel

So it’s fine I guess

[strange python]

Which spatters

[junior aurora]

the speed in which you blow the mob up is the problem lol

i had the big rock elemental at start of RLP on a 10 die 3 seconds into kingsbane

[ivory flower]

In 13 14 mobs will live

[ivory flower]

You was playing with SP and fire mago ? Xd

[junior aurora]

sp also ramps

[potent raven]

ngl sub felt

x100 easier

to do shit on than assa

but assa just does more damage

[ivory flower]

I agree

[fallen arch]

Then play sub

Idk what you want

[potent raven]

nah its bad

[fallen arch]

Ye exactly

[potent raven]

its so undertuned it feels pointless

[fallen arch]

If u want ez play BM hunter I guess

[potent raven]

lmfao

or u can just play outlaw

tunnel vision on bte

[true condor]

its better than Torch? how

is it a sim trap

[potent raven]

damnn

i need ur neck for my sin

[junior aurora]

are you simming with all 3 buffs bac

[fallen arch]

Or that

No one says u have to play sin

[true condor]

no buff

[junior aurora]

no i mean

[true condor]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/cxHscG6RS7Lxw9VAoK1W1J

[junior aurora]

this one

[potent raven]

well just wanna learn it tho

[true condor]

uh

[junior aurora]

itll still probably show as better with not all buffs but not by as much

[true condor]

i see

it looks like i need a good crit/mastey chest

[true condor]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[potent raven]

guess the dungeon

[normal mist]

BH?

[lament belfry]

Hey guys, on my plater profile I have rupture and garrote with a highlighted border when they enter pandemic

[potent raven]

aa

[lament belfry]

I forget how to change the colour of the border

[potent raven]

aa is a dungeon where u can end up 800k+ overall

[tulip heron]

Cruel dreamcaver is BIS apparently, but does anyone actually use the effect? I always forget it

[potent raven]

yeah lol

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923682607857685/1181335994256064623/dagger.webp

[potent raven]

last szn i was using it on w/e

[tulip heron]

I've tried to bind it to moves like mutilate, but not had any luck with it proccing

[potent raven]

u dont bind it to anything

/use Cruel Dreamcarver on a separate button

use it once on the mob u want the buff from, then forget about it

[true condor]

there always some bird or bugs in Valk could provide u leach for survival

[normal mist]

The dagger is only on the bis list because it has an additional effect

[true condor]

dont forget to use it when u going to a dg

[normal mist]

Because any dagger 528 is as good as carver

[gusty mirage]

You only need to use it once unless you unequip the dagger

[potent raven]

i was doing 1m

each pull

in aa

w. pi on 2m

[true condor]

idky when i offline it also expried

[potent raven]

i love assasination rogue

i hope in tww its gonna be as good

[true condor]

so when i online i usually running around valk to find a little animal to kill

[potent raven]

wai arent they gonna remove snapshot completely?

[potent raven]

wow cruel

[true condor]

they could provide me 10% leech

so cruel is mercy

[potent raven]

is uldaman like a ct dung orn ah

[true condor]

and its a cruel dagger

or if u want cheatdeath u can use dagger on dummy

they will give u cheatdeath

the frog in AV is dragon so its speed

[potent raven]

damn not bad ok

[gusty mirage]

Yep

[slate crown]

!wa @lament belfry Ceverion’s profile here

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[limber lion]

🤭

[rotund oak]

well well well,look who's here

[earnest remnant]

wish they would remove me completely

[gusty mirage]

Nope

[potent raven]

noo 😭

[lament belfry]

What's the most common mythic + build for 10-12s these days

[junior aurora]

arterial shock prob

[strange python]

has anyone ever written up a clarification for the wording ambiguity in the spec tree? like which talents affect which sources of nature damage

the way things like caustic spatter & zoldyck recipe, for a couple of examples, are worded is a bit confusing for an ass noob

[gusty mirage]

I think whispyr may have covered it in the past in his many many rants

but dw it's confusing for people who aren't assassination noobs either

[junior aurora]

i'd imagine zoldyck recipe works on caustic spatter thru the poison damage thats being cleaved

i dont know if it double dips or not

[strange python]

so, like, if i might. does poison bomb proc spatter? i tried checking it on dummies bu-

well that answers that

lmao

[junior aurora]

poison bomb will proc spatter

spatter is just poison damage your target takes being replicated on nearby targets

[strange python]

man i love that

i love this poison build

i'm never going CT

[junior aurora]

huhh

you should still take CT

[gusty mirage]

for the longest time zoldyck didn't work with envenom

because it was "nature damage"

[strange python]

i went digging through top rio rogues and some guides and this build had good representation

and i absolutely love it thematically and how it feels to play

[junior aurora]

so the thing there

[gusty mirage]

it's honestly a shit show every expac

[junior aurora]

you can drop ct and run the poison cleave build in high keys

if you're just doing like 10-14 range i would not advise you to do that

[strange python]

i'm getting very good damage out of this build with shit gear, gearing in low keys

so ima just

stick with it

because i really enjoy it

[junior aurora]

yeah i mean you do you

[strange python]

glad to know i'm not alone in scratching my head over it 😄

[fallen arch]

On Tyrannical weeks there’s a case to be made not to take CT I think

And go for more boss damage

I saw Zerocool last week running a build without it

But I think on Fortified weeks CT is 100% the play

But ofc you can do without

[strange python]

that's initially why I chose this build before reset, I wanted to get to 8s asap and farm hero gear, but I didn't want to be hard boosted with no boss damage because i had shit gear

[lime edge]

In low keys mobs die too fast no

For poison build

[strange python]

and then i really really really enjoyed how it played

[lime edge]

Like I'm pretty sure the mob u kingsbane will die in 5 seconds

[strange python]

i always pick the highest hp mob 😄 it's mostly fine .. most of the time

[fallen arch]

Depends on the group/key level

[lime edge]

I mean

I'm still doing low keys

And the mob dies instantly even without poison build

xd

Especially with deathmark

[fallen arch]

Which is good because mobs need to die

[lime edge]

Well no

[fallen arch]

I don’t get what’s wrong here

Just make sure u have cds for boss

[lime edge]

It would be good if there was 1 mob with significantly higher hp than the rest

[strange python]

i'm not being boosted or carried with the dps i'm getting out of this, so i'm not going to cut a chunk of my own enjoyment off just so i can be a bit further ahead of the rest of the group

[lime edge]

I'm just saying going more into st

When u already kill the mob really fast

Seems like a waste

[strange python]

at fort +8 it feels kinda rare that i can't find something beefy enough to get full value

[fallen arch]

At higher levels itms the bosses that cause more of an issue though

[strange python]

i'm not trying to argue that i'm doing the right thing or anything 😄 just that i'm not that egregiously wrong with the content i'm doing and how i'm doing in it

[fallen arch]

So more st damage is actually good

[fallen arch]

That’s true

You can play that any week and do fine

[strange python]

i played assa a bit in season one and wept every time i pressed CT over envenom, because there's just something about poison bomb damage that squeezes my dopamine buttons

so now that there's an actual build that lets me mash envenom and get bombs

hell yes

[fallen arch]

Then we’re wired differently I think

Get that rng proc bs away from me 😂

[strange python]

i just arbitrarily obsess over some bars in details

bomba for assa, verdancy for rdruid, glimmer for hpal

seeing them do big numbers makes me happy

[thin furnace]

On AoE with high energy and everilything doted should i still wait until 1sec envenom buff or just spam?

[fallen arch]

Spam

Don’t let globals go to waste

[glossy lagoon]

Is there a good video guide for assasination rotation

[fallen arch]

Check out Whispyrs channel

https://youtu.be/pUCMW1aJUZs?si=8o9roFLsnbAagSNS

[digital venture]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[boreal lark]

To simulate the assassin, do you use the dungeon slice, or patchwerk +5 or +8 Target at 1 minute or 5 minutes?

[glossy lagoon]

I saw this is it still relevant

[fallen arch]

Yes it is

[fallen arch]

I guess it depends on what you want to know

[boreal lark]

M+

[misty holly]

typically use dungeon slice, as single target on the bosses is still an important part of the dungeon

unless maybe you are doing keys where people pull trash packs onto the boss, then maybe things are different for your group

[boreal lark]

Nice

TY

[fallen arch]

Dslice then gives the best representation yes

[grand trail]

What you guys play in 14+ keys anyway

becasue that CT build with demise feel like pure pad to me

if you look at logs at higher assa keys everyrone play smg else

[obtuse ruin]

I play this game to pad

[grand trail]

kinda funny

its just that not acro for assa

is kinda magnet to cleave

[visual hemlock]

I think whispyr is cute

[cursive owl]

i occured a weird problem guys

how is this happening that i run a +2 in Halls of Infusion , deal aprox. 400k each trash pull without torch, and now today run a +2 halls of infusion with same trash size and deal only 190k O_O ? , and YES .... i did check if i have posion on my weapons

[lime edge]

Do u have the right poison

[cursive owl]

uhhh

[lime edge]

Deadly poison is the right one

Instant poison bad

[cursive owl]

yes yes

let me post my details

looks normal right O-o ?

[lime edge]

I haven't played that build yet so no idea

👍

[cursive owl]

gg

[lime edge]

Grieftorch is usually way lower for me

In bleed build

[ivory flower]

If grieftorch is that high

That's a problem

[lime edge]

Or all his teammates are dying

[ivory flower]

No

[cursive owl]

we had

[ivory flower]

14M his like 10 uses

[cursive owl]

5 deaths in the whole dungeon

it hit 88 times btw

[ivory flower]

Arterialbuild

[cursive owl]

i have ... uhhh

[ivory flower]

On BH

[cursive owl]

i gues the hybrid build

[ivory flower]

Died one time

Grief torch is like 2,6

Don't have the details right now

Bh 13

[cursive owl]

mine was 14 million KEKW

[rotund oak]

u boys dont do the torch tech

u press torch when mobs are packed and move

u press sprint and move as they do

to proc the bug

my torch had 65mil on an 11rlp

[cursive owl]

wtf did i do wrong ? like i do press the buttons right like i should i gues O_O , i press garrot and rupture for multittarget stacking, finish of 4-6cp crimson and then mutilate /FoK into envenoms and hit in between torch

[cursive owl]

thats not my problem ... its more that i deal somehow 0 damage from over night

[rotund oak]

im confused

[cursive owl]

so am i

[rotund oak]

like it doesnt proc more hits?

[cursive owl]

nooo

its not about torch

[rotund oak]

then what

[cursive owl]

this

[rotund oak]

idk,do u press ur cds?

i did 400k+ on my last hoi

[cursive owl]

i always do

[lime edge]

Isn't 8mil kingsbane low

How many times did u use

[cursive owl]

ready if possible

but i skipped it on trash that was dieng tooo fast

oh wait .-.

w>

[rotund oak]

[lime edge]

How many uses

Lol

[cursive owl]

w>

[rotund oak]

[lime edge]

[cursive owl]

imagine a trash group stands for 8 sec cause our monk destroyed every pull with 800k

how am i supposed to deal dmg

[proven jasper]

yeah theres ur reason

[cursive owl]

i forgot the obvious

[proven jasper]

for way less overall right there

[cursive owl]

im sorry, thanks for the heads up

[lime edge]

Did u only kingsbane boss

[cursive owl]

yes seems like

[rotund oak]

i press it on cd

literally

even if mobs about to die

[cursive owl]

KB 8 Uses KEKW

[rotund oak]

the minimun possible spatter is a gain overall

[lime edge]

8

[cursive owl]

I cant

[rotund oak]

i pressed it like 21

[lime edge]

Should be over double that

[cursive owl]

is alright i got it

thanks for mental help

[rotund oak]

[ivory flower]

Didn't heard about it, I'll try next time

[rotund oak]

🤝

can hit up to 90 times in 1 use

[glossy lagoon]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[fallen arch]

Is grieftorch the way to go?

I have a couple of trinkets that sim way higher for me

Or is that a lie

[glossy lagoon]

what is pooling?

[fallen arch]

Not casting anything to get energy stored for your next burst window