assassination

[jaunty gulch]

yeah

I didnt Vanish on the opener

cause I started stealth

But I see what it means

you would want to Vanish the last 6 seconds of Dmark or so

[gaunt moat]

after your exsang'd garrote runs out, you vanish to reapply another empowered garrote

[balmy condor]

Whenever the original garrotes drop yeh

[jaunty gulch]

yeye

[teal iris]

hmm looking at some top logs of similar ilvl their deathmark and garrote did nearly twice as much in the opener for reference

[jaunty gulch]

I suppose I should note I don't have 4 set

Idk if you should have it at 405 ILVL

[teal iris]

at this point kinda but bad luck happens

[jaunty gulch]

sure sure

[teal iris]

did you use both the tier set tokens already?

[jaunty gulch]

again its not the objective numerics

yes so

I passed all my loot to WoW Mains

[feral rivet]

That doesn’t really mean anything, I had 4p long before 405 from us doing normal raids too first 2weeks

[jaunty gulch]

because this is not my main game

I'm 2/4 now

I'll get the 4/4 next week probably

[runic hinge]

Imagine not dedicating your life and sanity to wow. Couldn’t be me.

[jaunty gulch]

😛

New ultimate is out brother

[runic hinge]

I’m out here tryna stab literal gods in the ankles with sticky knives alright?

[jaunty gulch]

bet bet

I think I just have to remember to press shiv more is all

and Vanish as an offense CD

[gaunt moat]

And spend some money 😛

[jaunty gulch]

hehehehehehe mayb

we'll see

[magic vine]

even getting poverty consumables is a decent amount of stats

[jaunty gulch]

yeah sure I'll start using 2 star stuff

[magic vine]

sharpening stones and crit food are like 3g each on my server for example

[jaunty gulch]

oh sharpening stones huh

[magic vine]

verse phials are cheap and good

[jaunty gulch]

I didnt know that was a cheap options

I saw buzzing runes in the spreadsheet

[magic vine]

they're objectively worse than buzzing

[jaunty gulch]

well yeah but cheap and buyable is better than passing all together ey

thanks for that

[balmy condor]

Yeh we aren’t in the business of recommending bad options sadly

[dreamy gull]

How big of a deal is it to miss 2-3 reprimands in a dungeon

[balmy condor]

Across an entire dungeon probably not much but should definitely try to avoid that

[jaunty gulch]

nah its all good its just a culture difference

as long as actual button pressing is fine Im not too worried

[balmy condor]

Yeh

Good attitude to have

[jaunty gulch]

very familiar with general "PVE" grinding

[magic vine]

like buzzing is a .7% gain over whetstone off of whispyr's sheets, but i'm unsure of the base gain of whetstone

[spice condor]

do we ever pool energy for ST or just blast asap

[jaunty gulch]

well if its just 5g then its value

[magic vine]

.7% is a pretty decent chunk and worth it on anything you're being serious about

[jaunty gulch]

but when do you use puzzlebox?

https://tenor.com/view/nct127-jaehyun-gif-20438598

[tacit otter]

the gain from pooling perfectly is not worth the hassle so just dont mind

[gaunt moat]

it's the most fun ability we have, how can you miss it!
i'm throwing a celebration every time it's off cooldown

(I really love ER)

i think it's amazingly designed

except the part they took away one charged CP

[dreamy gull]

Idk I'm worried about missing other cooldowns and it slips my mind

[tacit otter]

missing casts in dungeon is not that big of a deal because spread out over 30 mins it happens. dot uptime etc is way more important

[balmy condor]

Yeh

I hold cds too long in dungeons personally

I miss like 3 deathmarks

No good

[spice condor]

gotcha, on m brood and they put me on boss so sin > law and i haven't touched it in a long while lol

[balmy condor]

Pooling kinda dead now that sin is so fast

Nothing to pool for

[brazen zodiac]

fast

[spice condor]

nice, ezpz

[dreamy gull]

I like that sin feels like it's less frantic

Than sub or outlaw

Sub really feels that way lol

Tho outlaw cds come back so fast it's easy to miss one

[gaunt moat]

Other than the opener and cleaving
sin is smooth sail

[dreamy gull]

I'm bad at like

Groups of enemies

[gaunt moat]

that's cause sin is bad at groups of enemies

[dreamy gull]

Like am I supposed to vanish and try to get garrote on everything

[lethal mortar]

sin's dslice is so abysmal sadge

[gaunt moat]

but it really depends on how good you are at switching targets. aka, pressing tab.

[dreamy gull]

Make IC into a permanently active passive effect

[gaunt moat]

only if IC is up and they will live to its duration

[dreamy gull]

[gaunt moat]

sure, if arcane mage is allowed to do 350k or more in aoe, why not 😂

[dreamy gull]

I want sin to be allowed to do 100k st but it will never happen

[tacit otter]

its literally the most fun class in aoe/m+ 100%

[balmy condor]

Dslice numbers don’t really reflect how the damage should look at the end of a dungeon

It’s never been kind to Assassination because of how it’s set up

Is what it is

[nocturne heath]

hey, apologies if this is not allowed or whatever, but could someone help me out with opener and stuff in call? i recently switched from outlaw to sin cause i was tired of the luck reliance of outlaw.... but i get confused a bit with the opener and in general

like i constantly find myself running out of energy and don't have a tea, and just sitting there with nothing to do, and ik i can do something different, but idk

i have looked for guides on youtube, but haven't really been able to find anything up to date given the updates, and i'm fairly new to rogue in general

[balmy condor]

Running out of energy is normal on Assassination

Openers are in the faq, just gotta get it to muscle memory

[nocturne heath]

my rogue isn't super super geared yet, so i'm not tryna hold 40k dps, but like in lfr i can do almost 27k ST throughough the fight at 369, but can't recreate that with dummies, i can really only hit like 21k, and ik buffs have a play with it, but probably not that much, right?

i looked in the faq a little earlier, but for some reason i don't do well taking from text into gameplay

[strange python]

Losing buffs is big

[drifting cloud]

well you can sim target dummy but yes raid buffs are alot of dmg

[strange python]

Battle shout, touch, brand, windfury (possibly), etc

Honestly I'm surprised you didn't drop off more

[nocturne heath]

why? cause i'm new or cause of my ilvl?

all good if it's cause i'm new... i know lmao

[balmy condor]

Nah just cause raid buffs are a ton

[nocturne heath]

ahh

[balmy condor]

They’re close to a third of your damage

[nocturne heath]

damn

[balmy condor]

Do you know how to simulate your character

[nocturne heath]

with raidbots? yea, i literally just did it cause i was curious, and it's saying i could theoretically hit 41k rn lmfao

[magic vine]

you can sim it w/o buffs

[balmy condor]

Sim a target dummy fight type

Instead of patchwerk

And then compare to what you do on a dummy

[nocturne heath]

alright, i found it, doing it now

and then when that's done, i'll try to recreate that number

i have noticed the aoe is abysmal, especially cause my main (which i'll be changing to this), is a dh lol.... so from great aoe to like none lmao

but decent?

though i should probably focus on ST atm and get good with the class in general

so, simc is saying i could do 29k on a training dummy, i can try and hit that real quick

[strange python]

No I meant more DPS loss from LFR to dummy because of losing buffs

[nocturne heath]

yea, that's what they were saying

[strange python]

Monk and DH will make you do 3% more damage outright. Or maybe 5? I forget. Battle shout is a lot of attack power. Mark of the wild is a lot of vers

[nocturne heath]

damn, it's been a bit since i've paid attention to raid buffs, like what they do

i'm just used to having them

[distant mesa]

any weakauras for teh mage tower?

[gusty mirage]

https://wago.io/NkOgaunhM

[distant mesa]

is this ok?

[gusty mirage]

[balmy condor]

Boss Mod for the god-queen’s furry

[viscid spear]

[distant mesa]

im just trying to get it

[balmy condor]

Bigwigs has built in timers

That’s what I used at least

[distant mesa]

keep entering and 2 hrs buffs disappear for no reason

[thorn fjord]

How’s brood coming @gusty mirage

[distant mesa]

gonna throw my monitor across the room

gotta love KINDEY SHOTTING the "Blood of the Father" and this shit still randomly going off

[gusty mirage]

check DMs

[balmy condor]

Save blind for that one, and kidney for jarl

Much more consistent

[distant mesa]

umm....

might try it tomorrow when im not tilted that I do no dmg to it and that I have a keyboard that isn't split in half

[runic hinge]

It took me 42 tries. You’ll get it

[distant mesa]

I stopped dying to the enrage guy, killed the circles and the ability above just 1 shot me because there was no cast bar with it after I kidney'ed

[runic hinge]

I just made the macro to blind boss 1 and whenever she says her line about it, you hit that

Enrage guy I kidney to start then evasion after.

[sudden rivet]

Hey all, if I wanted to play sub AND sin, what stats should I craft on daggers?

[frozen turtle]

Crit mastery I think. Curious to hear others weigh in tho

[prisma cypress]

yeah, crit mastery

[distant mesa]

thats what I did

[sudden rivet]

nice

I can finally be less madge at my alts with the new primal chaos change

only had 2100 primal chaos collecting dust

[cloud tide]

what primal chaos change?

[thorny pond]

You can trade 60 to other toons

Costs 80 per 60

[cloud tide]

that's nice

[fleet coral]

Hello,
i've been looking guides about assa and didn't get 2 things?
+where and when to use trinkets on rotations like algethar puzzle box and manic grieftorch (on raid)
+and what is animacharged combo points it's equal normal combo points or smth else ?

[oak sky]

animacharged points count as 7 combo points

so you land on 2 which is animacharged

and it gives you a 7cp envenom instead of a 2cp envenom

and then its consumed

you use puzzle box and grieftorch before deathmark

if you check faq theres an infographic with the opener rotation

[balmy condor]

Yeah that’s actually what faq stands for

Frequently asked graphics

Some people say the Q stands for questions

But we still get questions from there all the time

So how could that be

[ionic fox]

THE PULL BEFORE THE KILL ☠️ https://gyazo.com/12b93c211f4ae85dd1084c7236765143

[polar tundra]

whats the best flask for terros

[sterile pilot]

Hey all I'm look to play Sin an bit and remember in the past there was discussion around how you should pool energy, but I'm not seeing anything about this now. Is this just an outdated concept?

[royal lantern]

always vers for all encounters

[balmy condor]

Yep

[royal lantern]

you dont use a different phial

[balmy condor]

It’s still exists but it’s super whatever

[royal lantern]

1% more envenom uptime

[dawn kelp]

Corrupting rage

[polar tundra]

if you have manic grieftorch, at what point during the opener do yall use it

[distant fog]

is it ok to be literally perma starved in single target ?

[slow marsh]

Press tea?

You def have windows of being starved but they shouldn't last long

[gusty mirage]

either before or after deathmark

I'm just going to make a bot to run my account and answer these questions

[slow marsh]

Do it

[polar tundra]

is there an addon like tellmewhen that can display the opener/change the opener?

[slow marsh]

Just make a bot that auto detects #assassination-faq questions that directs to #assassination-faq

[burnt latch]

Do i keep up CT on st with the DTB m+ build

oh nvm FAQ has that

my b

[polar gull]

if people stopped asking the frequently asked questions that are in the FAQ wouldnt you have to eventually remove them because they arent frequently asked?

[balmy condor]

Damn, kinda true

[slow marsh]

Or would the overall quality of the faq just improve that much more

[vestal wren]

but you don't know if they are not asked anymore because people read the faq, so you are in a dilemma

[spare crow]

I think I have noticed a couple of inconsistencies on the wowhead topic.

1. It never suggests tepid versatility phial, it doesn't even mention it
2. Doesn't even mention fated fortune cookies as personal food

[polar tundra]

does anyone have a hekili import code for the FTB/exsanguinate opener?

[polar gull]

I'm a selfless rogue, I'll make sure to ask something from each topic so you guys can answer "check FAQ omg" and keep it legit

[royal lantern]

[glacial badge]

To me then the real question is; spec in the profs yourself or buy the goods?

[grim jay]

!GUIDE

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[tender kelp]

acc. to my realm, e.g. alchemy isn't very efficient in terms of saving gold if you don't have the multicraft and inspiration on phials already // or you don't want to spend xy time to herb and then craft it

however, r3 glacial fury is still around 1k gold so maybe

depends on how expensive it is on your realm imo

• alch is also useful for longer phials

[glacial badge]

My thoughts too. Alch is so “cheap” I’ve just been dual gathering spec to make gold and buy the pots which are inexpensive.

[tender kelp]

so you dont have to spend too many, i've always had alch on my rogue

[glacial badge]

Yeah I did too previously. First time I went dual gathering.

[tender kelp]

yeah, is it still good? I mean, at the start it was a goldmine

but I bet that mining is still decent

[glacial badge]

Well… I haven’t paid for a month of playtime yet, if that tells you anything.

[tender kelp]

lovely

[grim jay]

I mean

You could get a month playtime in like 3 hours

[glacial badge]

To be fair; I do find more money made in mining than herbing.

[grim jay]

Without profs

[tender kelp]

but yeah, I have alch on my rogue, not sure with the cooking since I haven't done that since like panda expac

[glacial badge]

Really? How? I like the casual material farm but I’d not mind something faster.

[tender kelp]

ye I sell myself in goldshire

[tender kelp]

there are guides on yt too

[grim jay]

Boosting. Depends on ability but I'm pretty sure most people that make their way to a discord for serious improvement are capable of boosting atleast 15s

[glacial badge]

Hm ok I’ll check it. More efficient pots if I can make money in less time seems to mean alch has greater value for power creep. Is there any goodness from pickpocket by chance?

[royal lantern]

eeeeehhhhh.........

[grim jay]

Many people dont consider it, but you get gold while having fun in m+. Getting into a com isnt hard and if you dont like strangers talking in english you can open a thread and look for/build a group

[grim jay]

You dont think so? 😁

[tender kelp]

Boostin is fine, just coms tend to be like a hunt for key

Also with the prices dropping as well, I think that it’s effic to do 15s +, not lower

So you need a bit of rio for that
But yeah boosting is fine, but I reckon it’s not for everyone

[grim jay]

It sure isnt, some people dont enjoy m+ anyways, they just do it for gear

But its something to consider

If you can

[balmy condor]

Boosting is the worst thing to happen to the game since LFR, entitled casuals am I right guys

[grim jay]

I dont like profs for example, so its my Option

[balmy condor]

I’m 55 years old and already paid off the mortgage on my house just work a 9-5 like me

[tender kelp]

Ye + u dont have to boost m+ only, raids or levelling are options too

[grim jay]

Same

[strange python]

If only they didn’t nerf cobalt assembly

[tender kelp]

or boost pvp

i think that's where the real golds are

[balmy condor]

No longer done via cobalt assembly

Painge

[grim jay]

Think prices went up through that

[tender kelp]

ye

[grim jay]

[tender kelp]

cuz it takes more time

[grim jay]

Yeah but still insane

Actually

[strange python]

Use to be 250k from 60-70 pepesad

[grim jay]

650 - adv in 3 hours is probably more than m+ 15s

[tender kelp]

it is

well depends on what u boost

[strange python]

What server even is that?😂 I’ll pay from 1-70

[tender kelp]

i think it's com

so whatever serv u need

but idk if we can talk about existing coms rn, let's just say it's "a group of friends"

[strange python]

Gotchaaa

[grim jay]

Yeah its a com

#wowheadnews message

Holy

Prayers answered

[balmy condor]

Not true, kingsbane still unplayable

[grim jay]

True tho

Back to being sad

[royal lantern]

outlaw still exists

exsang still a thing

[grim jay]

Gave up on this

[tender kelp]

costs 80 Primal Chaos and grants 60 Primal Chaos when opened.

zzz

but at least smth

[royal lantern]

why is that a Problem lol

not like we are sitting on 700+ right?

[grim jay]

Yeah seems good

Cant imagine the amount I'm sitting on

[tender kelp]

i think my bag is just full of them

im actually glad they implemented it that fast tbh

thought it would take more time

[grim jay]

But.... raidpotions

[tender kelp]

there won't be a cap on it right

[grim jay]

Unlikely

[tender kelp]

perfect

[balmy condor]

The only cap will be valor

Because

[grim jay]

Would still only give alts enough to craft some since you need to farm for the ilvl upgrades anyways

[grim jay]

You shouldnt take Ehre lightly. Some never have any their entire life.

[steel ridge]

whispyr

i killed terros yesterday and forgot to put poison on

and i was wondering the entire fight why my dps is utter garbage

and after the fight, my RL said he was in AoE talents

and i said i had no poisons on

and we had a laugh

and it was wholesome

and my life is miserable

[tender kelp]

you need the flashing WA, that way you wont ever forget

[grim jay]

Duh

Someone brought his dog with him to work

Guess I now have a dog

[balmy condor]

You’re in here

Happy people don’t talk in class discords

[steel ridge]

true

[grim jay]

True

I'm mostly in here to remind myself that its not THAT bad

[royal lantern]

thats called a coping mechanism

[balmy condor]

I thought hentai is a coping mechanism

[winter moss]

https://wago.io/XGzTEhLwU

[grim jay]

For what tho

[balmy condor]

For me

And my depression

[grim jay]

Kinda deep today in here

[steel ridge]

i have a WA that tells me, but i was coming from council where i dont play DTB and i only had deadly applied.... was lacking amp poison

big hurts

not my proudest grey log

[winter moss]

i mean i could give you my wa, with a nice little text in the middle of the screen, checks if you in tbh or nah

all that jazz

but i can link it otherwise i will be banned

or atleast muted

[balmy condor]

If I’m in what

[winter moss]

*dtb

had a stroke

[balmy condor]

Same, it’s the hentai

I get it

[grim jay]

Nah noone is looking, just do it

[balmy condor]

Mods asleep

[winter moss]

[balmy condor]

[grim jay]

Whispyr says worse things than whatever you have in your WA

[winter moss]

i like weak auras the crush my selfesteem into millions of little pieces with words

[grim jay]

They are often true but worse

[royal lantern]

Heck

[balmy condor]

[grim jay]

[winter moss]

i wish sbs wasnt as strong

for an extra point in zold

#hottakes

[balmy condor]

Kinda real

But rotation would actually just be mut -> envenom for 5 minutes straight

[grim jay]

Whats with garrote and rupture

[winter moss]

i mean weaving in sbs before capping isnt that exciting either

[grim jay]

Dont make it sound so simple!

[winter moss]

you never played aff wl did you

[balmy condor]

Yeah but it’s something!

[grim jay]

It was a joke

But yes I did

[earnest remnant]

[winter moss]

best times track 5 debuffs

[balmy condor]

I’m a knowledgable man what can I say

[earnest remnant]

based

[winter moss]

honest question whispyrkitten: do you know how likely the exsang removal is

[balmy condor]

Pretty likely

[winter moss]

man

i wish exsang was still 45 sec

actually made it fun

[balmy condor]

I don’t

[winter moss]

did you play uldir

[balmy condor]

I did

[winter moss]

with galecallers

big numbers

exsang goes brrr

[balmy condor]

I played exsang in emerald nightmare too

And I hated it then as well

[earnest remnant]

big numbers =/= fun

[balmy condor]

Yeah, like subtlety

[earnest remnant]

[winter moss]

[earnest remnant]

8.3 assa was big numbers, but it was boring af

[balmy condor]

I agree

[earnest remnant]

8.3 sub did 0 dmg, but was fun af

[balmy condor]

8.3 was the worst Assassination patch I’ve ever played

[winter moss]

wdym

8.3 was the !raz build

or just do what raz did

[balmy condor]

8.3 was an insult to god

[winter moss]

[earnest remnant]

fr

[lament warren]

i played dh

so you're kinda just wrong

[balmy condor]

If you gave me a gun, and locked me in a room with 8.3 assa and 10.0 sub

[winter moss]

just expedient r3s

[balmy condor]

I would kill myself

[winter moss]

all the way

[agile geode]

agonizing poison kekw

[winter moss]

fucking thing from belond

[agile geode]

ah the good old days

[lament warren]

why do we hate sub

other than gloomblade feels really bad

[winter moss]

i just cant play sub

[earnest remnant]

its just whispyr not liking DF sub

[lament warren]

ya i value his opinion i wanna know it

[winter moss]

my mind is not able to comprehend the complex rotations of sub

[lament warren]

he doesn't know it yet but we're friends

and i value my friends

[balmy condor]

I want Legion sub back

[winter moss]

yo legion sub was sick frfrnocap

[lament warren]

that's fair

[balmy condor]

Df sub is just

[lament warren]

i played rogue once in bod

and now

[balmy condor]

Jank

[lament warren]

this patch

and in bod i only played outlaw and sin so i guess idk what i'm missing

[balmy condor]

Like I get how it works, I can play it

It’s not that I haven’t practiced it or something

It just feels wrong

[grim jay]

I want the DFA sub back

That was fun

[winter moss]

that was legion sub

[lament warren]

i think

[earnest remnant]

only thing i dont like, is how strict it is

[balmy condor]

Too much on cooldown shit

[lament warren]

the most fun part of sub

is spreading ruptures

after dance

dance is the worst part of sub

[earnest remnant]

big agree on this

[lament warren]

and that's probably not a good thing

[earnest remnant]

you dont line up anything anymore

[balmy condor]

I want a sub that lines up cooldowns and giga bursts

[lament warren]

i like that

[grim jay]

But specified

[lament warren]

that's based

[earnest remnant]

i think its fun to play

[balmy condor]

And right now it’s like

[lament warren]

it feels fluid

and i hate rigid specs sm

[balmy condor]

Slam CDs and secret tech does damage

[earnest remnant]

but id prefer some flair to it

[balmy condor]

And I’m like

Okay?0

[lament warren]

i'd prefer if the 2 active cds in our spec tree werent 500 dps

[balmy condor]

Also the fact that rupture does so much fucking damage

Is ridiculous

What the fuck is that

[lament warren]

i think its really cool

spreading rupture is actually the most fun part

if sin had double rupture id play it

and if its rupture did damage

[balmy condor]

Yeah, that’s the thing

[earnest remnant]

back to the old days of Sub rupture cranking

[balmy condor]

Why is sub the rupture spreading spec

Hello?

[winter moss]

the dot spec with the dots that do no dam

[grim jay]

I mean rupture is a finisher and sub is the finisher spec

[royal lantern]

SL launch?

[grim jay]

You still deal more dmg with bleeds and poisons on sin

[balmy condor]

Shadowlands sin was more fun than 8.3

[lament warren]

dont know

but its really fun

[agile geode]

SL launch assa was unavaible

sanctum assa was pretty good

[earnest remnant]

Assa playstyle was still there

it just did 0 dam

[balmy condor]

Yeh the damage was horrendous

But man

Good spec

[royal lantern]

bettwen re-applying SnD all the time?

[earnest remnant]

idm SnD

at all

[agile geode]

assa + necro = perfection

[balmy condor]

I’d rather re-apply snd than play a 65apm sin

[lament warren]

leveling healer in dungeons is actually just being afk

[earnest remnant]

tbh i dont get peoples hate towards SnD

[winter moss]

its "new"

[lament warren]

its on the gcd

[earnest remnant]

to me its just like rupture

press it

makes u do dam

[lament warren]

it's a feeling thing

same reason people hate mana tea on gcd

[winter moss]

you press snd 1 times per fight

rest is taken care of by cttc

[lament warren]

all i know is

[balmy condor]

Because rupture says it does damage and you can see the damage number and snd you just Stab faster and that’s not good

[lament warren]

whenever i tried rogue

[balmy condor]

Idk

[lament warren]

snd is my least favorite global

[balmy condor]

I’ve made the argument many times

[lament warren]

it's the only thign about any spec that made me not want to play it

[kind forge]

remember how we maiden with dfa ?

[balmy condor]

And people just go “yeah but it feels bad”

And I’m like okay well

Can’t argue with that

If that’s how you feel

What am I arguing for

[winter moss]

zoom across the room

[lament warren]

i think u just enjoy arguing

[earnest remnant]

im numb, dont feel a thing

[balmy condor]

I really don’t, I just enjoy bad opinions even less

[winter moss]

Feelycraft > Simcraft

[lament warren]

evidently that's how warlock tcs feel too

[balmy condor]

Warlock TC’s don’t enjoy doing their job

That’s different

[lament warren]

they play warlock

it's their choice to play warlock

[balmy condor]

Warlocks could sim for a tenth of every spec in the game and you’d still take 4 in a raid comp

Fucking dumb class

[lament warren]

i think that is not true

[earnest remnant]

we played 3 on Rasz 🙂

[balmy condor]

Warlocks didn’t have functional sims for most of shadowlands and you stacked them on every fight in every raid, for the entire expansion

I think it’s very true

Warlocks don’t care to optimize their sims

Cause they deadass don’t have to

Destro locks playing fae in dungeons for season 3 because they didn’t have a theorycrafter for destro

[lament warren]

limit only played 1 warlock this tier

[balmy condor]

Sims just straight up not using venthyr ability

[lament warren]

i think

[winter moss]

whispyr imagine what you could achieve if youd become a wl tc

[earnest remnant]

heard liquid only played one cuz THD's gear was dog

[balmy condor]

I fucking did for season 3

[lament warren]

unsure

seems reasonable

and anyway

[balmy condor]

I had to go in there and tell them that venthyr was a better dungeon covenant because their sims were giga fucked

And they’re like

Oh

Yeah true

[lament warren]

i don't think more than one warlock is that good on raszageth

[balmy condor]

Don’t care though destro brrrrrrr

[earnest remnant]

Locks pipe boss dmg

[winter moss]

do they?

[lament warren]

lots of specs pipe boss dmg

[earnest remnant]

they do the same as Rogues. on boss almost

[lament warren]

3min cd not great

[vestal wren]

we actually run into the issue that our warlocks don't perform well

[winter moss]

Same

[vestal wren]

problem is, gate + hs makes a good argument to at least keep one in

[balmy condor]

We run into the issue that we have 2 warlocks and the officers go “okay but what if we recruit a third”

[vestal wren]

for us it is
"how bad is it"
"well they do like 40k on terros mythic"

[earnest remnant]

[lament warren]

i honestly think

p1 intermission is probably the hardest part of raszageth prog now

[earnest remnant]

yeh

probably

[lament warren]

p1 nuked

and p1 was hardest

but zealot shields are still kinda tight

but that's why i think warlock is not so good

3min cds are not great for that

grieftorch whetstone is insane for that

because it's like you havea 2min cd AND a 2:30 cd

they just both line up with everything

it's insane

[earnest remnant]

you just dont send them on red

[lament warren]

ya

i think you dont press nether portal there ever

[earnest remnant]

no you do not

[lament warren]

so you're kind of dead weight

xd

[earnest remnant]

we had a lock being 4th on intermission dmg

[lament warren]

do they play the dreadstalker damage amp talent

[earnest remnant]

but he is on blue with me

[lament warren]

cuz if so

the play there is to just stack that

oh you probably do

maybe that's why limit lock was sending hands on immune boss

so he had dreadstalker stacks for first herald

ya you never portal there u just game dreadstalkers

only press it on heralds

i think if you send as soon as you land into p2

you have pit lord for most of first shield

[balmy condor]

every fight

always suspiciously near the top

"bad warlock tier"

[lament warren]

he gets pi

pretty sure my guild pis the evoker

[balmy condor]

our evoker gets pi too

[lament warren]

i think

these screenshots have nothing to do with warlock being good

this kinda

xd

[balmy condor]

yeh I mean

[lament warren]

that is definitely council

[balmy condor]

same shit

[earnest remnant]

first shield in p2

[grim jay]

UH dk gets it on pull and ret else. Ret is the BF of our guildlead. Its enough that we have a ret at all already

[earnest remnant]

little before shield and a little after

[lament warren]

im so smart

that's why i'm benched, so i can use my brain power to theorycraft what warlocks were doing a month ago

[vestal wren]

hoping to get pi

[lament warren]

real

[earnest remnant]

only shield

[lament warren]

ok

so that guy is using a potion there

for sure

[earnest remnant]

everybody is

to have it up for p3

lust

[lament warren]

ya

p2 starts at about 5:30

so its fine

[normal mist]

Half my guild got kicked out due to drama and boy although the vibe is much better, we do miss dps now xD

[lament warren]

this was more responding to a comment i made but didn't say out loud

that if you got to p2 before 5 minutes you don't potion on pull

[earnest remnant]

we are gonna do the push strat tonight i think

[lament warren]

?

[earnest remnant]

no holding

all gas

no brakes

[lament warren]

holding is so that ur in p1 intermission at 4mins

right

for 2mins

cancel 6th knock for it

[earnest remnant]

yeh

might have to hold some 2 mins for this to be possible, but will have to wait and see

[lament warren]

i tihnk you push at 3 mins

if you full send

[earnest remnant]

we hold for a long long time on prog

so honestly ive got no idea

[lament warren]

ye

[earnest remnant]

thankfully sub has no cds

[lament warren]

i'm just approximating based on my guild's logs

[earnest remnant]

so im not the one, that has to worry about it

[lament warren]

it looks like the damage is normal until about 2:45

where it hard declines

so i can only infer that they are slowing down damage to hold there

so my estimate is 3mins

it's actually

push strat is kind of insane

for arcane mages

because they have 1.5mins

so if you're full sending

on first zealot you'll have surge

third you'll have totm

cuz arcane holds third surge anyway so it's

so if the 2nd ruiner is 3:30 how do we win

grieftorch it ez

[grim jay]

@balmy condor #subtlety message
Your favorite word

[balmy condor]

wrong channel

not my circus, not my clown

[grim jay]

[toxic burrow]

My guild finally beat H Raz tonight. But I know it's only because of the 10% stormsurge nerf. There's no way in hell we'd beat it without the nerf, especially given the absolute dead weight we had on our kill.

1 DPS below both tanks in dmg, another DPS inbetweeen the two tanks and several ranged DPS tied for damage with our blood DK. . _. I just don't understand what the hell they're doing.

[grim jay]

Definitely no dmg tho

[toxic burrow]

At least they're doing me a favor and contributing to my Grieftorch resets.

[grim jay]

I'm already pissed if there are people 15k lower than what they should potentially do

[raven knoll]

I thought his fav words are "BIS list"

[grim jay]

Nah simbait and scaling

[trail tree]

isnt simbait just a made up word created by braintlets?

[lament warren]

no

sim bait trinkets are real

[trail tree]

yeah but who actually uses them with the idea of "this is actually the best"

[lament warren]

i mean

that's why they're called sim bait

they sim the highest

and people are told to press top gear always

[toxic burrow]

What's a good example of a modern simbait trinket? The darkmoon deck?

[lament warren]

no

there aren't any

i'd have to think of previous expansions

[trail tree]

last one i remember was from sl right?

[balmy condor]

yes

[lament warren]

"sim bait" trinkets are like

very rare edge cases

where simc takes spell data and it just does something completely wrong and has to be manually accounted for

[toxic burrow]

Haven't heard of such a thing so the idea eludes me.

[trail tree]

wasnt shadowgrasp totem basically "good sim trinket but pratically not that great unless patchwerk?"

[lament warren]

no

shadowgrasp was just good

[balmy condor]

yeah

shadowgrasp was good

iqd was good

[lament warren]

i genuinely cannot think of a trinket in shadowlands that was sim bait

they all were exactly as presented

[balmy condor]

people just like calling things simbait so they seem intellectual for beating the computer

[lament warren]

except soul igniter which undersimmed without manual work for fire mage

but

that happens with stat trinkets too so

¯_(ツ)_/¯

eye of skovald

for example

is sim bait

for some specs

because it actually does not proc

[balmy condor]

it does though

[lament warren]

^^^

unless they hotfixed it recently

it straight up does not proc for sub rogue

[balmy condor]

spell data says it should

else it wouldn't sim

[lament warren]

yeah but ingame it is bugged to not

[balmy condor]

unlucky I guess

ratio'd by game

[lament warren]

that's the only single example i can think of

in the last 2 expansions

just a buzzword

"sim bait" 99.99% is analogous to pebkac

and honestly

i change my mind

eye of skovald cannot count as sim bait because the sims are the ones who are correct

that's ingame bait

[balmy condor]

yeah except pebkac is funny boomer tech support speech from 90's dilbert comics

[rapid forum]

Totem from other side maybe

[toxic burrow]

Bring back Ashvane's Razor Coral, please.

[balmy condor]

and sim bait actively erodes trust in sims

[balmy condor]

we already discussed that

[lament warren]

it was hasted

u got resets sometimes

good trinket

[grim jay]

But its a totem

Am a rogue

Not a shaman

-3/10

[lament warren]

shamans get puppies

that makes them cooler than rogues

you should be honored to get to cosplay them

+5/10

[grim jay]

Need to play a rogue so I can do ig whats illegal irl

[kind forge]

assassinate people?

[timber basalt]

The hell is pebkac

[rapid forum]

Welcome to Paris 47

[grim jay]

Stab things

[earnest remnant]

you can stab bread

thats fine

[grim jay]

Based

[lament warren]

why

bread is for tearing

not stabbing

[kind forge]

stab your food

[earnest remnant]

i was angry this morning okay

bread had to die

[lament warren]

D:

[grim jay]

Shadowstrike'd his bread

[earnest remnant]

more like i Eviscerated it

not alot left

[grim jay]

[toxic burrow]

Wrong. You should have Mutilated it.

[kind forge]

eviscerating his bread is his secret technique to calm his anger

[earnest remnant]

didn't have two knifes, so not possible

[toxic burrow]

My last comment was too arrogant an unwholesome. My apologies.

[lament warren]

I would have dispatched it

but i'm built different

i'm that guy

[grim jay]

#outlaw

[trail tree]

Shiv it more like it

[burnt latch]

this spec is absolutely bonkers on overgrown ancient

how is it legal to do 75k dps to the boss while doing 280k dps

wasnt even spreading CT

disgusting

[royal lantern]

if other people can do the adds alone ye

IC rupture and go hit that bosy with agility bonus

[burnt latch]

well the thing is

[royal lantern]

Problem:actually doing that in higher keys

[burnt latch]

assa kinda deletes those adds with poison bomb too

[royal lantern]

eeeehhhh big doubt

pb is no insane dmg

[burnt latch]

big doubt?

thats all envenom spam

there arent many classes that can do that much overall dps whilst maintaining 75k ST on the boss

on that boss

thats with one deathmark too

a few key levels higher and u get a 2nd one towards the end

so it probably bumps that 75k st by quite a bit

[royal lantern]

[burnt latch]

kinda wanna try assa again in like a 24 with a cordinated group

cuz the mfs were killing my small eagles be4 crawth

[lament warren]

ya

i think sin is good in algethar

i think

you can't run eu melee cleave comp

if you want to play sin effectively

at high key levels

unless you are literally 420 ilvl fullstack

[burnt latch]

yeah possibly, i mean u just need the small adds to live and this spec will do some work honestly

[lament warren]

idk

[burnt latch]

it feels really efficent for speed in that dungeon

[lament warren]

andy group

timed

26 nokhud

fort bolstering

so i dont believe i have any gauge on what is or is not possible anymore

[burnt latch]

lowkey

assa kinda sounds like a sick mdi spec rn

[rapid forum]

Assa as a MDI spec

[lament warren]

i dont think thats real

[rapid forum]

That's true delusion

[lament warren]

udk is though

i found out that if you trigger the whelps

in azure vault

and then vanish

they snap to the tank

like

if you are running back to the circles

[royal lantern]

nah, thats sub by far

[lament warren]

and you trigger whelp

and it spawns 4 furies

if you vanish

they will snap to the tank

so maybe there's a udk lust play

[burnt latch]

well perplexed have played a feral for what id assume is funnel

[lament warren]

where you just have a speed guy

sin funnel is not that good

[burnt latch]

what

[lament warren]

it doesnt scale very high

75k is a lot yes but thats like

10k more than what youd be doing normally

thats barely funnel

[burnt latch]

yes but its more than ud do on sub

and you're actually doing aoe at the same time

[lament warren]

it only goes up to 21

[burnt latch]

what do you mean

[lament warren]

mdi

it's capped at 21

you just drag everything on boss and press epidemic

[burnt latch]

yeah and u have your rogue and feral use those adds for funnel (I assume)

idk im not saying assa is the best spec for that type of content

[lament warren]

its playable

but i think

[burnt latch]

but it seems like it could be very good in certain scenarios

[lament warren]

warrior/monk evoker feral udk dh

idk honestly

in mdi

you can run all kinds of shit

sin is for sur eplayable

[burnt latch]

yeah u kinda do want tricks tho

[little light]

I struggle to do as much as sin, but im 411 no sure if it would be big dif if I was 415+

[lament warren]

yeah

[burnt latch]

divinefields 11 minute RLP is uhdk feral sub

[little light]

my 19s-20s im like around 75k overalls (on details)

[lament warren]

yeah

that makes sense

i havent looked at any comps or anything

just inference

i think

feral aoe sucks

[burnt latch]

what

no it doesnt

[lament warren]

that's what scritch was telling me

st and aoe are not great but funnel is insane

unless i misunderstood her

[burnt latch]

feral is literally the #1 damage spec for Academy which is just mass aoe

its aoe damage is bonkers

[lament warren]

rly

that's pog

[burnt latch]

it struggles with pure ST and low target cleave

[lament warren]

i probably misunderstood what she meant

my bad

[burnt latch]

specs ridic

[lament warren]

rofl

[burnt latch]

this is 75k ST dps on the side too

scratching the tree real hard

[lament warren]

365k..

[little light]

nuts

[burnt latch]

that spec is heavily slept on rn it does crazy aoe while funneling at the same time

[lament warren]

i am not sleeping on it

i invite feral to all my keys

even when it's bad

cuz my best friend plays feral

[burnt latch]

boomie feral + some melee

would be pretty pog

altho boomie has kinda anti feral synergy

so mby u dont want that

[lament warren]

i think feral udk sub

or feral udk sin

i dont think your rogue's spec matters at that point

u kinda just win

when u have the 1 feral druid in the world doing 160k overall

[burnt latch]

Tuomaskoo is very good too

finnish feral kitty

but maystine is mr feral

mans been trying to make that spec work for 5 years

[lament warren]

feral and enhance good at the same time

something in the timeline shifted

chemicals in the water

[loud silo]

aff lock is cringe

[burnt latch]

truth

[lament warren]

if they bring back legion aff

aff would no longer be cringe

do you guys ever think it's weird that like

good versions of every class exist

and they don't just make that again

there exists a version of every single spec in wow that is almost universally loved

and shadow priest now has 4 filler globals

[timber basalt]

There's such a thing as too much of a good thing

Plus blizz needs to keep balance team employed

[lament warren]

99% sure warlock tcs are the balance team

sandbagging sims to prevent nerfs

[loud silo]

what raid was 8.3 again?

[lament warren]

nyalotha

[loud silo]

oh god yes

although hitting 600% haste gave me a weird amount of dopamine

has blizzard ever cared how much a spec is universally loved or hated tho?

like

icefury continues to be untouched even tho almost everyone hates it

[lament warren]

nobody knows what blizzard cares about because historically they shit on everyone who gave meaningful and thoughtful feedback

[loud silo]

give us prime zul sub back

although sub is kinda poppin rn

[hot fulcrum]

Can someone help me with stats amount understanding?
I know, that I can sim myself and this is the best way to see if I'll receive additional dps or not. But it's based on the gear that I have. Stat weight sim is deprecated, as I understood.
Also I know that we don't have a caps on stats, but we have diminishing returns.
So how should I understand at which point I should stop searching for a specific stat and start looking for another one? For example our main crit and mastery. Is it ok to have 40% of crit and mast? How to understand that I already should switch to haste/vers and what is the best amout of those lower prio stats?
How to understand if it's still better to get stats even if it's already in diminishing return values?

[balmy condor]

you just use droptimizer and top gear

if droptimizer says item good, you take item

we don't really care about the diminishing return at all

[hot fulcrum]

Well, yeah, it's a good point since I have a sim premium) And I'm using it, but I still was wonder if I should care about stats

[balmy condor]

no

I have no idea how much I have stat wise

haven't all expansion'

I actually could care less what those numbers are

[winter moss]

you awake me from my food induced coma to comment on something that was 3hrs ago

brooo

[loud silo]

my bad brother

[winter moss]

Dw cant sleep at work anyway

To noisy

[royal lantern]

dont feel bad

red/orange/Green names deserve to be pinged

[loud silo]

i just saw it while catching up and it made me think of playing aff in CN

absolute misery

[winter moss]

What have i ever done to you?

[loud silo]

i want a special colour :c

do i have to actually be good at the game for it or what

[trail tree]

you could pretend you're good, that's what i like to do

[loud silo]

my parses say otherwise

[fathom cove]

what are the best rogue specs for raid and m+? looks like mainly assa for raid, sub for m+?

[loud silo]

all 3 are viable

[fathom cove]

viable sure

[trail tree]

Be creative, grey parses doesnt mean bad play it means creative mechanical ability

[loud silo]

i mean my rl asks why im forever getting pulled off the edge on sennarth

shadowstep my guy

gotta make use of my kit ya feel?

[trail tree]

same

or step to half way up the stairs to keep hitting dps but still get pulled off because brainlag

creative mechanical ability is what i call that

[loud silo]

sometimes my own genius is my downfall

"sometimes"

kek

[trail tree]

precisely

[loud silo]

i just wanna go back to my peak and hit all orange parses again

[trail tree]

that is illegal

[loud silo]

but i got a job and cant sweat 24/7 now

[trail tree]

i feel that

[winter moss]

you can have red color for being a patron, you can have blue if you work on the website, you can have green if you are helpful to the community and orange if you have a big fucking hammer and bonk wrong doers

[loud silo]

ayo hand me a hammer asap

[winter moss]

thats not how it works

[trail tree]

i think you're gonna get bonked instead of being the bonker noot

[winter moss]

you gotta earn your hammer

[loud silo]

sadge

[trail tree]

bro i would hate to be a hammer wielder

[nocturne current]

Only few can lift the Mjolnir

[loud silo]

your words cut me mikku

[winter moss]

you must be worthy of the hammer

[loud silo]

deeply

[winter moss]

like whispyr

he spent countless hours

sifting through messages in spec channels

he has seen it all

[loud silo]

whispyr is just build diff

[winter moss]

he is

[trail tree]

you never know if its insanity or dedication

[winter moss]

a bit weird but definitely diff

[balmy condor]

send armpits maccie

[winter moss]

where is the difference

[knotty schooner]

does anyone have a screenshot of their binds so i can see what spells are priority? im tryna learn assa

[loud silo]

bro what

mans out here binding by priority

galaxy brain

[balmy condor]

how do you bind

[loud silo]

me?

[earnest remnant]

i kinda just threw them on random stuff, while leveling back in the day

and now they stay

[loud silo]

[winter moss]

bindings should be comfy

[trail tree]

my binds are all messed up

[winter moss]

not by pro

[knotty schooner]

thats what i mean

[balmy condor]

these are mine

[vestal wren]

vanish on alt + f4

[nocturne current]

Haha

[trail tree]

i dont even have alt f4 on my kb

[knotty schooner]

so i can set my binds as comfy while still being prio

[trail tree]

60% keyboard moment

[loud silo]

prio shouldnt have an impact