assassination

[soft shale]

yea that is interesting because i heard the opposite

[dim yacht]

maybe? but if its not intended, whats the point in ever crafting with r3 mats to start?

because then youd just always craft with r2, and then recraft with r3

[soft shale]

recommend to craft with low mats then recraft but kinda makes sense in a way

[dim yacht]

and itd be cheaper basically everytime

also, is lariat still worth after nerf?

[royal lantern]

dude, nothing in the entire game tells you about that "interaction" its clearly not intended

[dim yacht]

true, thats a fair point

id rather be safe than sorry though

whats an extra 15-20k

[warm canopy]

If I do a recraft to change an embellishment is there a risk of my item no longer being 5 star?

[burnt latch]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[burnt star]

If u look at embelishment power. They are almost all 1%

So even that nerf to lariat..

[royal lantern]

yes, recrafting can make ilvl lower

t5 is mostly inspiration proc fising, you do multiple re-crafts until it fits

[tacit otter]

(Not sure if it was mentioned before, but the new graphics about opener shows in the dtb m+ opener that you use kingsbane.) never mind, saw whispyr already noticed :)

[thorn crater]

Seli how much do you charge for the rank 5 dagger?

[oblique kiln]

Which poisons when running dtb for single target/raid

[quasi osprey]

all of them

[trim zinc]

Amp deadly

[solid mica]

what's everyone spending their sparks on

[cobalt hemlock]

based growl sub

[stiff geode]

I just now went looking for said font.
https://www.google.com/search?q="naowths"+font

Did you typo it?

[gleaming geyser]

including missive & fang?

getting mine crafted right before raid once spark is acquired because servers will totally be up in time

[barren osprey]

I think he just meant naowh's

[verbal mantle]

he probably meant Naowh, Echo player and streamer. The font in his UI is usually Gotham Narrow Ultra

[stiff geode]

Ohhh I see, sorry was unfamiliar, y'all are champs ty for the quick replies.

[steel sorrel]

I did yes! Sorry, at work 😐

[quasi osprey]

i think typing !font or !fonts in naowhs chat links the fonts he uses in his UI

at least it used to

[dim yacht]

is lariat still worth after nerf?

i believe whispyrs sheet is prenerf

[tacit otter]

The nerf came 12 hours ago, of course it's prenerf. Whispyr probably needs to sleep sometimes lol

[hexed root]

wrathion neck still bugged 😦

[dim yacht]

im not implying that whispyr needs to update things immediately. im simply stating the fact so that people linking the sheet realise its still pre nerf

[tacit otter]

All good, some people have stated their opinion when the nerf dropped. If you scroll up you should find some 'resources' about the nerf :)

[dim yacht]

gotcha. know roughly how far i might need to scroll?

like how many hours ago

[tacit otter]

Around here (only answering because of time stamp:))

[dim yacht]

thanks!

[burnt star]

So what lariat 1.5% is now gonna be 0.9%

Whats strong is having a high lvl crafted piece. The embelishment is just a very small bonus along the road

[ruby lotus]

people like to overreact because everyone is in a world first guild obviously

[tacit otter]

Ye the nerf is not that big, also as stated before every class receives that nerf. So no overall change in perspective to other classes

[burnt star]

But... as oppose to a weapon craft what suck with the lariat is that u cant remove the embelishment

[rare jackal]

lmao thats me

[lethal magnet]

same

[strange python]

The number of BS going swords even though sword isn't bis for anyone is crazy

[true pelican]

dh?

[rare jackal]

holy shit
i was wondering yesterday why my skill level was varying drastically between original craft and recrafts

[lethal magnet]

thing is that going daggers also gets you a fist, wich works for most sword users..

[rare jackal]

as soon as i figured that i knew i wanted to get into that tree

only thing that sucks is you are lacking 2 handed options

however with enough inspiration it might not even matter

[granite widget]

wait how does going daggers get you fist?

[normal mist]

Also hi dotzz, thanks for the dagger yesterday LOL

[rare jackal]

the short blade specialization for blacksmiths applies to fist weapons too

[granite widget]

oh it gives you skill but not the recipe?

(the primal molten)

[rare jackal]

correct

you get the recipe from valdrakken renown 13

or was it centaurs?

[granite widget]

very cool ty

[rare jackal]

either one of those two

[opaque sigil]

It is maruuk pretty sure

[slim hamlet]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[thorn fjord]

Morning sinners

It’s finally raid day

[subtle tundra]

No it aint

It's do everything for the week day so I can solely play wow

[spice spire]

Gentleman, it is m+ day

[thorn fjord]

I go on vaca tomorrow till next Tues

Pretty stoked

[thorn fjord]

Its we have things to do now that aint rep grind day

[spice spire]

Amen

(I wasn’t doing it anyway)

[flint tusk]

no

it's american beta test day for the EU players

find those issues for us 😉

[thorn fjord]

Will do!

I'll link my AOTC

😛

[flint tusk]

i wanna see the raszageth mount. or not impressed

[spice spire]

Nah I think raz will be an issue early

Saw the dungeon journal

5 phases

[thorn fjord]

We'll see how hard it is

We did a run through of all the bosses yesterday minus the last one... Only 2 seem really bad

[spice spire]

Nah raid looks piss easy. Inb4 slow prog

[royal lantern]

you mean people forget that fire on the ground is bad again?

[thorn fjord]

Just gotta get the bosses hp to 0

ezpz

[royal lantern]

just dont die

[spice spire]

Nah it’s when a 30 man heroic team crashes half the comps because lag week one

It’s gonna be the azure span all over again

[thorn fjord]

think we have 29 raiders for tonight with trials and new people coming back -_-

That bench gonna be lit

[spice spire]

We have 39 now

[royal lantern]

why would you recruit until 29 or fking 39 people

like what the fuck

[thorn fjord]

We didnt recruit that many

[royal lantern]

if i would see that as a trial, i would just go

[spice spire]

Did not recruit

[thorn fjord]

Old members came back

[spice spire]

People just kinda

Came back yeah

[royal lantern]

fuck them, they can do a trial again

[thorn fjord]

New expansion so people come out the woodwork

Oh trust the older cats have to trial again

[spice spire]

So I apparently recruited a ton (4) of old GMs of heroic/casual mythic guilds. So when their raiders came back; they wanted to join

[royal lantern]

oof

[spice spire]

Which is just a headache because now I have to track performance across two teams, one not even set up

[drifting cloud]

is it another classic scenario where 15 people will have quit by february

[royal lantern]

just do what most "raidleaders" do

track performance by checking the number of purple/orange parses

"uh yeha, you did good, your parse showed me that" (never actually clicked on it)

[spice spire]

February?
Buddy. I got Christmas on this list

[karmic scaffold]

still dont have a guild

[spice spire]

Sick parse, but you wiped the group on six pulls by not doing the mechanic

[karmic scaffold]

if rest of group was doing more damage we would simply skip the mechanic

[spice spire]

Been there, done that. Over it.
I’ll take blue andys that function over purple/orange target dummies

[drifting cloud]

trial passed

[royal lantern]

oh god

that sentence

every shity rl ever

[copper hazel]

"ey, yo, why is your cloak not enchanted? You might have parsed orange but I want to see an enchant on that cloak now or you benched"

[spice spire]

Week one enchantments

[royal lantern]

we had a healer that didnt had a weapon enchant for the entire nzoth progress

[subtle tundra]

Bench this 🖕

[royal lantern]

cus he got a weapon from weekly m+ chest and forgot it

[spice spire]

Bench this

[copper hazel]

understandable

[royal lantern]

and after the kill the RL just said "well, now that nzoth is dead, can you enchant your weapon?"

[thorn fjord]

You can tell who's not simming and who is with enchants lol

[copper hazel]

the vault excitement gets all of us

[royal lantern]

it was a healer

[spice spire]

Healer sims

[royal lantern]

healers dont sim

[verbal mantle]

[royal lantern]

cus healer sims dont exist

[thorn fjord]

Oh true

derp

[obtuse ruin]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[spice spire]

[verbal mantle]

[subtle tundra]

What's a healer

[thorn fjord]

fodder for the dps

[spice spire]

That thing that keeps your monkey ass alive

[subtle tundra]

Ah the guy I bully

Not sorry

[royal lantern]

thats why you play Floor PoV

[spice spire]

I know that mf has his cd hovering your name

[subtle tundra]

Me screaming 1 heal on discord

1 fucking heal

[thorn fjord]

https://tenor.com/view/noob-olydri-mmorpg-mmo-mega-heal-gif-17159710

[karmic scaffold]

healers you mean pi bot?

[royal lantern]

talks about PI

as a rogue

[hexed root]

where's our consumable info? Is wowhead up to date?

[royal lantern]

[spice spire]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[karmic scaffold]

im mage player

hehe

[royal lantern]

out

ranged dps

ew

[karmic scaffold]

if fire sucks i play my rogue

thats my logic for choosing main for the expac

[verbal mantle]

whispyr spreadsheet

[royal lantern]

mage players acting as if fire ever sucks

lol

[hexed root]

he has phial and weap rune. What about food, potion, etc?

[royal lantern]

there is a chance frost or arcane are better for once? just wait 2 weeks and fire gets +20%dmg on all abilitys again

[karmic scaffold]

i rlly hate arcane

that spec can die tbh

[subtle tundra]

Arcane players plugging in the correct formula for the exact number of mobs and type of dmg they wanna do

[strange python]

Should be in the actual sim if you open the html

[subtle tundra]

[thorn fjord]

Dropped 80k on phials and pots last night before I decided it might be a good idea to farm my own mats 😑

[strange python]

Just have 40million gold I don't understand

[thorn fjord]

Shit why didn’t I think of that

[strange python]

Dummy

[thorn fjord]

[subtle tundra]

I ain't gonna have a Christmas vacation. It's Christmas boosting season

[strange python]

Okay I go Cuba now you kids behave yourselves for the next week until I can come back and be angry again

[gusty mirage]

Primary stat potion from cauldron, and primary stat food either feast or fortune cookies

[thorn fjord]

Spit on a Castro for me while you’re out there @strange python

[loud silo]

for fights like primal council, do i rupture all of them? or?

[thorny pond]

bleed them up, daddy

[thorn fjord]

IC

[gusty mirage]

Bleed me up

[thorny pond]

A whole new meaning to "knocking up"

[slim hamlet]

So is maintenance for NA over in an hour?

[thorn fjord]

Someone said 11 pst

Not sure if it was true

[thorny pond]

12/14/22 - captains log, new encryption system encrypted all character data

[kind walrus]

quick question, when you play ST with DT when you do the opener you dont wanna do high CP Rupture before using DM, feels like 1 mut/ambush isn't max combopoints

[hexed root]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/iWaNj7GkPdnoYvvtrwmWvn highest I was able to get before server down

[slim hamlet]

huh

Just woke up

dont understand

[pine grove]

Oh. SBS has overtaken Exsang. Good thing I checked before raid.

[thorny pond]

Was I the only one who read the blue post they put

[thorn fjord]

Which one

[thorny pond]

about why launch was a shit show

[bitter compass]

Sometimes my primary bar will switch to my stealth bar, and its not a 'Hidden Opportunity' proc. It just gives me a single GCD to use stealth abilities. The buff icon looks similar to Sepsis. Anyone know?

[slim hamlet]

"just" being an hour ago

[thorny pond]

Sepsis 😄

[thorn fjord]

Are you using imo adr

Oh right sepsis does that too

And this is sin channel

Rip

Forgive me brothers

[bitter compass]

I was not aware that Sepsis sometimes gave that proc.

ty!

[thorn fjord]

Off to my only meeting for the day

[thorn fjord]

It does if your target with sepsis stays alive when it falls off

[bitter compass]

Ohhh, I must have skimmed through the tooltip too much, or probably just forgot. Thanks guys!

[next edge]

Fire is dead

confiremed

EMbrace the arcane gang

[sour hinge]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[hearty junco]

anyone have a WA for when garrote is improved?

[bold lodge]

So do we craft the snowball set or neck and something else?

Or fang adornments

[spice spire]

Hold for a day

Whispyr was doing embellishments and there’s some fucky logic

That changed things

Current numbers are in !whispyr and the FAQ iirc

[fathom nest]

does Deathmark directly buffs kingsbane dmg due double poison?

[subtle tundra]

Yes

But it doesn't duplicate kb

You just get more kb stacks

[fathom nest]

ok so if they are ever desynced for whatever reason by like 5 sec i justhold till both are ready

[subtle tundra]

I think so yea

You want the shiv in dm too

[fathom nest]

thats for sure. thx

[dense herald]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[granite widget]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[dense herald]

Can someone explain me why we always want to align deathmark and vanish?

Or roughly always

[gusty mirage]

imp garrote + duplicated bleeds

[dense herald]

There's no need to strictly cast garrote from stealth, since it will work the same way 3 seconds after, right?

[oblique tangle]

20% increased damage?

[gusty mirage]

yeppers

[dense herald]

The thing i don't get is why deathmark from stealth

[urban minnow]

fortified or Tyrannical first?

[dense herald]

yep

[ruby lotus]

you get two extra combo points with garrote from stealth though if you spec into Shrouded suff

[oblique tangle]

The idea is you cast it

And reapply it before stealth skills end

[dense herald]

From the ST builds I have been reading, I think that there are no other benefits on casting from stealth rather than the improved garrote

that's why I am getting confused

[light garnet]

shrouded suffocation as well

[fallow tendon]

Apologies if this an obvious question but when playing dreadblades build what poisons are best to use?

[copper hazel]

dreadblades

sin

[oblique tangle]

Uh

[copper hazel]

:WUT:

[spice spire]

[copper hazel]

[dense herald]

I don't have it talented, i took the spike instead

So the point is to align deathmark and vanish, just to maintain the imp garrote while deathmark buff is up, right?

Thank you so much beforehand 🙂

[light garnet]

ah dtb, yeah

[proper tapir]

Sin doesn't have dreadblades.

[spice spire]

Yes

[compact nest]

how is assassin looking for m+ or raid compare to other 2 spec? i play outlaw

[spice spire]

Fine

Just fine

[dense herald]

that way you make sure deathmark buff is up with an improved garrote instead of the normal dmg one, right? I feel its the only reason

[fallow tendon]

Sorry dragon tempered blades! Been also playing outlaw 😅

[dense herald]

I believe its amplifying + deadly

[hexed root]

i hope today fixes the sockets on wrathion neck

[dense herald]

and I have been playing atrophic only for M+, since the slow one can be annoying for big pulls when you have to los

[dense herald]

for the non-lethal poisons I mean 🙂

[hexed root]

having 4 poisons available is pretty hype

[proper tapir]

In M+ crippling can be nice on spiteful weeks.

[dense herald]

that is right

[sand elm]

Crippling will be a good pick in S2 when we get brackenhide

[bold lodge]

Ty

[misty holly]

The best part about crippling poison is if you can get it on the mobs before the tank rounds up a big pull it will keep things spread out letting us beat the more AoE focused classes on the meter.

They will be waiting for things to group while we pump single target on everything

[earnest imp]

Personally il just prank call my m+ team mates during m+ runs to beat them in DPS as assa

[final dirge]

Do you actually run DTB in basically all content now?

[earnest imp]

And tell their wife's to turn off their pcs

[granite widget]

since we don't have good gear yet, is it normal that whetstone sims higher than buzzing & howling?

[misty holly]

I would think Kingsbane/Carnage is better in M+, and for single target Kingsbane is much better for execute.

But it sounds like DTB is competitive

[unkempt fern]

Pretty sure the FAQ says to use KB over DtB for ST at least, but they’re close

[weak plover]

Is the 424 dagger unique? (can only equip one)

[limber lion]

No it is not.

[thorny pond]

Very festive Cev

[novel arrow]

who is ready for 3 days of splits. before the Mythic race officially begins

[grizzled jay]

I think they go into the raid and just prod it to see if it's a pushover.

[hexed root]

im so hyped for today

[novel arrow]

Do we expect this to be a challenging raid? I ahven't raid tested or heard anything yet.

I dont expect Sanctum obviously, but usually first raids in the expac are pushovers

[hexed root]

i've heard some EN expectations due to how "hard" sofo was

[thorny pond]

O/U under 2 hours at 2:1 odds

[granite widget]

vague recollection blizzard said the intention is not for it to be hard

i iamgine an EN situation is unlikely though that was an outlier

[hexed root]

im curious when the streams will go live. Someone on liquid said it well, that they're going to overcorrect from the difficulty of sofo

[novel arrow]

EN? so we talking like a 1 day race?

Omegalul?

[grizzled jay]

Nathria and Uldir were two very hard first tiers. Don't think 1 day.

[hexed root]

I don't think day 1. Maybe not THAT easy.

Was xavius 1 day?

guess so, that's crazy

[granite widget]

cenarius was harder, at least for my guild

ilgynoth maybe even

[hexed root]

i think it was that for a lot of people

[granite widget]

xavius itself was a joke

[hexed root]

50 pulls for 2nd to last boss and like 10 for last

lmao

[granite widget]

i still literally don't know what difference heroic and mythic is

[hexed root]

all i remember was beating it within 30 days of release which if world did it within 18 hours isn't that great lmao

[granite widget]

ilgynoth mythic was a killer for low mythic giulds

[hexed root]

hate that eye boss

ilgynoth harder than anduin

[fair marsh]

is amp/deadly or deadly/instant the best poison combo for dtb

[hexed root]

can you do deadly/instant?

[fair marsh]

yeah with dtb its 2 lethal and 2 non lethal

i think

[novel arrow]

Xavius was hours the last time I remember

[royal lantern]

if you had 3-4 shadowpriests

[hexed root]

cataclysm raids were cool and good difficulty, 2 weeks to 5 weeks.

[hexed root]

yea, 18 hours apparently

[royal lantern]

they had their god moment on xavious

[copper hazel]

never use instant

if youre going dtb, amp/deadly

[fair marsh]

@copper hazel ty

[hexed root]

forever trust sims right? I'm surprised my sim has me using blazing signet 379 over shell 379.

[gusty mirage]

from raid testing on beta

it seems like they kinda did

nothing felt super difficult

[hexed root]

time will tell

[gusty mirage]

depends on how the last boss is

[proud viper]

Trying out the kingsbane stuff for the first time, am I thinking correctly when opening with it, I wanna do as an example;
MFD - Kidney
Garrote
Mutilate
Rupture
Kingsbane

Then go on to keep shiv up during the duration and throw envenoms into the target? Or shoudl kingsbane go first after kidney?

[gusty mirage]

but the first 5-6 I actually tested seemed super fair

[hexed root]

base off vault of pineapples( ) it'll be interesting.

I like fair

[ruby lotus]

i mean raid testing on beta was with BiS gear also right? VS now we are in 380 gear

[gusty mirage]

nothing like halondrus

where you oopsie daisy wipe everyone

lmao

[hexed root]

halondrus is a cluster fck

i liked anduin tbh

[gusty mirage]

it just scaled up your ilvl

and not all trinkets were available at first

[ruby lotus]

true

[gusty mirage]

so people were rolling around with pvp trinkets

lmao

[ruby lotus]

that took alot of time

xD

[gusty mirage]

but yeah it'll for sure be a bit harder now

rolling in at 380ish ilvl

[thorny pond]

Easier papi

[gusty mirage]

vs 402 or whatever it was scaled up to

will be very noticeable

[hexed root]

i assume we'll see people go straight into mythic or heroic. Or maybe into m+?

[ruby lotus]

Mythic plus gonna be harder then the raid xD

[hexed root]

i have no idea

[gusty mirage]

we'll see a bunch of keys run before splits I think

[thorny pond]

RWF will be over before the first +20

[gusty mirage]

but they for sure run splits

[grim tangle]

you do normal first for tier sets

[gusty mirage]

I think it'll be about a 3 day ordeal

yeah normal for any tier pieces

[royal lantern]

i mean, you wanna do normal for tier+trinkets aswell

[hexed root]

i keep forgetting about tier

[gusty mirage]

esp considering most of thedungeon trinkets are straight up ass

[granite widget]

for people that raided before legion, were raids historically less cleave and more ST?

or is it just a raid to raid thing

[hexed root]

blazing signet bis for prog because movement speed? Kappa

[gusty mirage]

depended on the fight

[hexed root]

raid to raid thing

100%

[gusty mirage]

friends tried it out, the move speed on that thing is apparently either not working

or so heavily DR'd byother move speed shit

[granite widget]

like sanctum was particularly single target and that's not just how things usually are right

[hexed root]

last time I raided a full expansion was cata, all those fights to my memory were solid.

[gusty mirage]

that it doesn't do anything

lmao

[granite widget]

sfo more cleave/aoe

[hexed root]

more ST then AoE in raids imo/bosses in general unless there's specific mechanics which is generally more tied to adds then bosses themselves

excluding pantheon and malganis or whoever in sfo

[gusty mirage]

yeah historically a lot of ST fights

[hexed root]

where you were 100% aoe on two bosses

[gusty mirage]

very few with adds that need to die

seems to have shifted in seppy

this new one has a ton of cleave as well

[hexed root]

that's like the theme of bosses, ST the boss, aoe the adds unless adds and boss can take damage. etcetcetc. Variables. Like I'd say Dasugne is ST fight

[gusty mirage]

which makes that wowhead article of why "outlaw is better" even funnier

(which btw they did not consult whispyr, fuu, or guy on that article at all)

[supple dove]

i see some people say you should still wait with crafting gear. what do you think about it? go for it? or wait? but wait for what? 😄

[hexed root]

is vault aoe heavy?

[gusty mirage]

a ton of cleave

[hexed root]

@supple dove go for it. we get two more sparks today

[hexed root]

https://tenor.com/view/sweating-nervous-paranoid-gif-4974019

[gusty mirage]

and that's why a lot of people are told to just play outlaw

cause it's better in cleave

[restive sparrow]

Do we delay 2nd exsang for deathmark or nah?

[hexed root]

yea.. hm.. I've been gearing both for the most part.. was hoping to jam sin but if outlaw better because of the fight layouts gotta do what i gotta do

whatever it takes, just no sub = bis plz

[gusty mirage]

after PB nerfs it's pretty close to assassination's ST

realz has done a fantastic job balancing all 3 specs tbh

carved out niches where each one shines

pretty cool to see tbh

[hexed root]

https://tenor.com/view/he-man-skeleton-angry-mad-rage-gif-17304570

[gusty mirage]

it's essentially a play what you want kinda choice

[royal lantern]

play outlaw for cleave, cleave is the only important thing, ignore the 2dh, 1ww monk, 30warlocks and 2000warriors in your group

[viscid spear]

[royal lantern]

[granite widget]

how would you approach a fight like sennarth as sin, where its boss + 1 add for a bit

do you apply bleeds before, during or after burst?

[gusty mirage]

slap up some bleeds on the add

and focus boss

[granite widget]

and do you maintain

[royal lantern]

assa could use a small aoe bump up, but the rest is good yeha

[granite widget]

during burst

[gusty mirage]

you'd get the bleeds up and then blast boss

[copper hazel]

youre not bursting if youre trying to maintain on another add

[distant birch]

How much haste assa need guys?

[gusty mirage]

however much topgear on raidbots says you need

you don't need any stat

just topgear yo stuff

and wear what it says to wear

[distant birch]

I feel like haste is a bit important

Whatever build and stuff

[royal lantern]

haste is not even that great rn lol

[supple dove]

is bronzed grip wrappings not available yet, or why cant i find it in the AH?

[copper hazel]

raid drop

[royal lantern]

why do people always bring up haste

[gusty mirage]

you'd feel incorrectly

current general guidlines is crit > mastery > haste > vers

[royal lantern]

haste for energy classes is popo most of the time

[viscid spear]

Expedient 3 PTSD

[royal lantern]

well yes, if you get 40000% of a stat its strong

[viscid spear]

They just want that back

[gusty mirage]

probably the placebo of more haste = more energy

same reason people think we ever played vigor for the energy regen bump

even though it was for the extra max energy

[royal lantern]

10%haste = 1more mutilate in ~1min

[gusty mirage]

woah woah woah is that factoring in venom rush buddy?

it's 1.5 mutilates

[fair marsh]

you guys taking both indiscrim carn and crim tempest for cleave or just 1

[gusty mirage]

[peak bobcat]

With dtb is it shiv on CD hold one for DM?

[royal lantern]

on cd

[gusty mirage]

it'll essentially play like that yea, cuz you want shiv for DM

[peak bobcat]

With 2 charges you can hold one for DM everytime

[gusty mirage]

for fights like primal council or whatever you'd play IC

[gusty mirage]

you don't the help you silly goose

I've seen your work

CERTIFIED GAMER

[peak bobcat]

What do you mean by that

[gusty mirage]

I'm always watching the homies

[peak bobcat]

I’m just excited sin is good

[gusty mirage]

me too man

I'm actually so fucking pumped

[plain flax]

loving it guys 🙂

[peak bobcat]

I just remember pressing vendetta on jailer and then getting a bomb and wanting to die

[plain flax]

not sure if its ok but at 382 and did 51k overall there so not sure what that is like to other classes but felt nice

i enjoy p bomb

[peak bobcat]

And now you press DM and happy music plays

[gusty mirage]

[royal lantern]

the only bad part about DM

[plain flax]

all the music 🙂

[royal lantern]

you NEVER see the full animation

[gusty mirage]

I also remember one of our warriors dropping torments on me during prog

[royal lantern]

cus it takes ages

[gusty mirage]

[royal lantern]

and the GCD is over and you use a new ability

[gusty mirage]

I stood in the same fucking spot, for 200 pulls

and this man managed to drop torments on me

every single pull

[peak bobcat]

Our DK died on the pull every other pull because he didn’t want to move

[gusty mirage]

yeah I started just feinting

unlucky I can feint more often than he can spell reflect

[distant birch]

whats ur best st build guys? kingsbane or tempered atm?

[peak bobcat]

DTB

[gusty mirage]

no

[prisma cypress]

kingsbane sims a little higher for me

[plain flax]

all about the big pb

[royal lantern]

DTB is the overall pick, KB when the boss has nasty 30% hp phases

[gusty mirage]

ye pre-tier its entirely gear dependent

[royal lantern]

tierset favors dtb

[distant birch]

Set fav dtb ?

[gusty mirage]

yuppers

[peak bobcat]

DTB better on low target cleave

[gusty mirage]

2pc makes dtb's double lethal poison bigly

[vale field]

Damn dtb no exsang is so much less to think about too

[peak bobcat]

DTB probably better in almost every raid fight

[gusty mirage]

makes me sad

cuz I love KB 😦

[peak bobcat]

I like KB too

[dense cedar]

dtb real snoozy

[gusty mirage]

but I mean it's a 2% swing

for way more execute damage

[peak bobcat]

But not at the cost of having to play exsang

[royal lantern]

3min exsang is not bad

and im the biggest exsang hater here lol

just ask oxi

[peak bobcat]

Bro exsang could have a once per day cooldown and I would still hate that shit

[royal lantern]

press KB

watch yellow number get bigger

KB High on details

brain sends out Happy happy signals

[peak bobcat]

I would be happy if DTB had shadow dance instead of ER

[dense cedar]

SD cringo compared to ER

[peak bobcat]

Shadow dance grew on me

Small burst windows are fun

[shrewd night]

But you want to make me happy, so I know why you asked ion to change it

[restive falcon]

whys that?

[peak bobcat]

Better on low target cleave and ST

[amber sand]

Does anyone have a weakaura for the 35% execute phase?

[restive falcon]

really over kb?

[dense cedar]

wdym?

[copper hazel]

you dont do the maths when looking at boss hp?

wtf

[hexed root]

@gusty mirage you said lots of cleave. How many targets we talking?

[peak bobcat]

Brood keeper and council probably are only KB IC fights

[amber sand]

LOL I was just wondering if there was something out there once it get close to maybe hold your Cds

[pale plank]

which build are you guys taking for raiding? heard there is alot of cleave fights, not sure if KB or DtB build is better for cleave fights

[restive falcon]

im prob going outlaw for cleave and the few st fights imma just stick to assass unless assass aoe is fun to play again

[pale plank]

i see whispr guide in wowhead is taking DtB for almost all fight

[gusty mirage]

[peak bobcat]

DTB good

Now if I could just loot a fucking dagger today

[kind walrus]

do you always wanna save 1 shiv for DM?

or just use on cd

[rain oyster]

only weebs save cds

[peak bobcat]

Save 1 shiv for dm

Don’t overcap ever

[plain onyx]

guys, for the Primal Ritual Shell trinket, does anyone know which is the buff i need to go with ?

[halcyon arch]

Whats the reason for not using all charges of bone spikes instead of just not letting it cap to 3 charges?

Can't find anything about it in faq

[gusty mirage]

you can sim the dif if you want but it's pretty close either way (mastery v fire dam proc)

[balmy condor]

I don’t get the question what’s the difference here exactly?

[tacit otter]

fire buff is way ahead on my sim rn, but havent simmed in a while

[hexed root]

do you need to manually add the fire buff on the sim?

[gusty mirage]

there's a drop down on raidbots

[halcyon arch]

The faq says "Serrated Bone Spike: Use to get the DoT on a target, then use to avoid overcapping charges of the ability." In a ST-situation are we supposed to use it once and just let it sit? Or use it as filler?

[gusty mirage]

or if you want to just run one sim, toss this at the end of your simc input in an advanced sim on raidbots

copy="Turtle Fire"
dragonflight.primal_ritual_shell_blessing=flame

[rare owl]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[gusty mirage]

default is wind

[balmy condor]

Well not letting it overcap charges would mean using it as a filler

[shrewd night]

[halcyon arch]

So it's worth using all 3 charges as filler in ST instead of lets say pooling energi for muti?

[shrewd night]

Brother

[trim dirge]

just dont let it cap

and ur fine

[balmy condor]

Sure

[halcyon arch]

Thanks 🙂

[gleaming geyser]

or save a couple charges for when you are outta range

[halcyon arch]

Very true

[rigid comet]

guys KB is simming 400 dps more than DtB for me, do i just go full monkey less buttons with DtB for that small diference? Gonna have to play that when we got tier anyways

[marble hemlock]

you dont "have to" play KB now, same as you dont "have to" play DTB once you get tier

[gleaming geyser]

if you feel like your group is lacking burst prio on a target you could do KB but like they are so close to each other it doesnt really matter

[royal lantern]

you use it to prevent capping, when you dont have enough energy for mut, and it somewhat helps hittig charged CP cus it gives less cp(2-3 instead of 2-4)

[thorn crater]

@marble hemlock yo soz for the tag, how much do u charge for the dagger craft 😛 have 3 hunts left and kinda want it before tmrw if u have a bit of time

[marble hemlock]

1k for every post youve made in outlaw

http://puu.sh/Ju1zr/f6fd64f72d.png

uh oh

[royal lantern]

[unkempt fern]

Holyyyy

[thorn crater]

wait what

most of them are trolling though

[unkempt fern]

[thorn crater]

from legion days

what is this expose

[marble hemlock]

just send order and put whatever you want as fee, dont really care. not doing it for the gold, and am happy for everybody who asks me to craft a dagger instead of a sword or fist

[thorn crater]

i mean i already have it

i need the recraft

[weak horizon]

What server are you on seliathan?

[royal lantern]

learn fist weapon recipee

dh brains still ask "can you make glaive or swords???"

every time

[thorn crater]

oh ye

for sure

LIKE THEY ARE NOT GONNA MOG ILLIDANS WARGLAIVES OVER WHATEVER WEP THEY USE

[gleaming geyser]

Do you guys know which of Vicious Venoms & Venom Rush has biggest impact on dps? Might need to drop a point for double step on some fights on DTB talent build and can't sim right now

[marble hemlock]

sim it

[gleaming geyser]

shit you got me

[gusty mirage]

lmao

that enhancement gamba

[tacit crystal]

wow that enhance gamba

[shut owl]

Enhance gamba? Lol wat

[upper frigate]

here it is boys

[tacit crystal]

ez 120k

[teal bloom]

Enha rolling the bones?

[thorn crater]

what the fuck is enha gamba

[gleaming geyser]

gamba

[gusty mirage]

could also be ez 79k

[thorn crater]

?

[marble hemlock]

you dont like the potential 128k st enhance build?

[gusty mirage]

[limber lion]

70k minimum, 140k maximum btw

[tacit crystal]

scared money dont make money

[limber lion]

A variance of 100%

[vale field]

I knew I should have played enhance.

That level of gamba speaks to the soul

[tacit crystal]

that sim looks like legion launch outlaw

[limber lion]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[marble hemlock]

best part about it all

is that even the lowest performing iteration at 79k

is still better than boomkin

[weak horizon]

What server are you on?

[tacit crystal]

[marble hemlock]

twisting nether

but yeha i mean

will still see

4 or 5 boomkins on broodmommy

[tacit crystal]

at least druids other three specs seem cool

[marble hemlock]

and 3+ DKs

[tacit crystal]

ya

[dense yoke]

excited

[gleaming geyser]

@balmy condor are you helping with warlock sims? they're missing

[gusty mirage]

brother

the warlock APL has been missing since nathria

[gleaming geyser]

CHOP CHOP

[gusty mirage]

perma NYI

[gleaming geyser]

[balmy condor]

I can’t even keep up with Assassination

Haven’t done any tc’ing in weeks

Well that’s not true

But less than I’d like to have done

[gusty mirage]

have you slept

or am I going to have to fly out there and tuck you in

[royal lantern]

its whisp

closing his eyes and then hears the discord ping sound

just to see "uhm, should i use amp poison?" as the question

[ancient rain]

randomly seeing master poisoner buffs atrophic poison. i think i remember it not working before

[barren lintel]

when will Bronzed Grip Wrappings be available?

[balmy condor]

Brother on Friday I slept till 4pm, on Saturday I slept till 3pm, then I slept Sunday 11am to 7pm, then I went to bed at midnight and slept till 9am

I have slept

So fucking much

[gusty mirage]

good

you fuck

[balmy condor]

It’s always worked with master poisoner

[pale plank]

need more sleep

[thorny pond]

could have slept an entire week if you wantede

[balmy condor]

You know I can’t

Channel in shambles

[thorny pond]

I can't condone illegal behaviour

but OTC meds work well

[gusty mirage]

when isn't it in shambles?

[royal lantern]

thats how this channel turns into #outlaw

[balmy condor]

Slow mode

[gusty mirage]

?????

what am I chopped liver?

[balmy condor]

Chopped tabbouleh habibi

[royal lantern]

you are not strong enough to keep order oxi, sorry

[gusty mirage]

I'll just go back to being unhinged and shady in general to people with mma fighter profile pictures

[peak bobcat]

[gusty mirage]

[balmy condor]

Super halal mode

[teal bloom]

How big was the elemental lariat nerf?

[gusty mirage]

roughly 5% to its secondary stats if I had to guess

[balmy condor]

No way

[outer marten]

Can someone explain to me why people like WoWhead are putting outlaw above sub for m+? Same utility, and sub is simming higher on more targets

[gusty mirage]

because tier lists are a joke

[balmy condor]

Because m+ isn’t a degenerate aoe spam

[gusty mirage]

and it generates clicks

[balmy condor]

Sub wins on like 8+ targets

[barren lintel]

Bronze Grip Wrappings will be available once Raid opens, right?

[balmy condor]

And you’re doing that once every 10 pulls

[gusty mirage]

ask whispyr how much input he had on their latest tier list where they put outlaw as the go-to for raid

[balmy condor]

Huge

[gusty mirage]

[outer marten]

That’s what I thought. That shit is a problem though, because the plebes follow that shit as “meta”

[balmy condor]

Yes

[shrewd night]

Let them

Then just say you are an omegachad if they ask you in whispers why you are doing so much dam

[thorny pond]

Sin is 4th/3 for rogue raid specs

[outer marten]

400 ilvl sub sorry bro, can’t take you to my +10. You’re not meta

[balmy condor]

What are they asking in me?

[gusty mirage]

they NEED their meta comp for their +20 weekly no leavers

[thorny pond]

I'll leave

[gusty mirage]

oh I know you will

[thorny pond]

I'll leave my own key

[shrewd night]

How much to bathe your gonads

[gusty mirage]

you toxic lil starfish you

[thorny pond]

I'm reformed

[gusty mirage]

[outer marten]

I’m sorry to hear that. Is it terminal?

[balmy condor]

I try to get them washed weekly

[thorny pond]

If people are bad, though. I'll Irish goodbye the hell outta a key

I've lost life long friends via ghosting keys

[outer marten]

I just froth over the meta chasing and rating mongers.
Three times since this shit started I’ve had issues getting in after season starts because of RL.
Full cleared aotc, have mythic kills. And I can’t get groups to +10 pugs in ilvl above what drops.
And these people have like 1k IO

[spice spire]

On it boss

[teal bloom]

I remember applying to a +8 in shadowlands season 1 and the one that made the group pm:d me and asked if I'm outlaw. I told him no and he answered "have a nice day! :)"

[thorn crater]

whats a gonad?

[gusty mirage]

lmfao

[misty holly]

Dude, just help your friend with the key. Not everyone is pro at this game.

[gusty mirage]

I don't think I've ever messaged anyone asking what spec they play

ever

ran into some interesting pumpers playing off meta over the years

[lofty gazelle]

Bro people were doing that for m0s last week. They even had a 370 ilvl requirement in their description

[gusty mirage]

had a frost mage in 8.3 that fucking slapped bro

feral druids that crushed it

[scenic kelp]

for the primal ritual shell trinket do i use wind turtle or flame turtle?

[peak bobcat]

there’s this guy in my guild who only plays arcane mage ever, for the last 17 years

[gusty mirage]

we don't invite ret pallies though

that's just a rule

not even because ret sucks

[spice spire]

Flame

[peak bobcat]

And he’s the best player I’ve ever seen

[gusty mirage]

but because people who main ret aren't okay in the head

[thorny pond]

[scenic kelp]

gracias mate

[spice spire]

@gusty mirage my frostmage needs some keys today you down ?

[gusty mirage]

sorry guild group

[bleak sky]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[gusty mirage]

try again next week

or this weekend

[spice spire]

I ain’t playing frost mage again homie

That shit was boring as hell, sorry mick.

[gusty mirage]

play whatever your heart desires

you can play shadowpriest if you want

[spice spire]

I always do

[viscid spear]

[spice spire]

Necrolord sin supremacy xD

[thorny pond]

boomkin in key

[viscid spear]

I need some damn pants I s2g

[cobalt hemlock]

so we are currently not recommended to craft the bronze wrappings

[outer marten]

Don’t think so, because it can be procced off healing and be wasted on leeching from my understanding

On that topic, haven’t seen anything about fixing embellishments with crafting in any of the hotfix notes. Have they acknowledged the problem at all?

[teal bloom]

Not wasted if I'm going for rank 1 healing parse

[quartz willow]

bruh assa rogue with 4% haste feels like a pain to play

[distant birch]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/LuxthosRogueDragonflight (Luxthos's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[peak bobcat]

Assa rogue with 4% haste

Feels almost the same as Assa rogue with 20% haste!

[west swallow]

which WA group does everyone prefer?

[novel arrow]

Guys.... I'm gonna miss China in the race to world first. Imagine one day. Blizzards like "yeah we shutting down" GL

😦

They had a good assa rogue, he was a chinese guy

[earnest imp]

one good assa rogue in china?

[novel arrow]

I mean he still is a chinese guy, that hasn't changed. But he isn't a rogue anymore... because he can't play wow....

[raven light]

anyone knows if rthe mastery buff or the fire damage buff from the ritual shell is better for ST?

[viscid spear]

[limber lion]

Fire, always.

[raven light]

thank you

[viscid spear]

"still chinese"

[astral wraith]

according to sims, fire proc

[pale plank]

the moment when you dont use WA

[west swallow]

i dont :/

thats why i was asking

[stiff geode]

Yeah I don't have one yet either, thinking of giving Afenar a go. Just pick one of the three above that looks most desirable to you I'd reckon.

[spice spire]

Can until January buddy

[thorny pond]

Can we make a poll for how long after 11am PST this maintenance will go?

[distant birch]

Someone have the macro for mutilate/ambush?

pls

[novel arrow]

yeah but none of them are raiding right

[spice spire]

[dapper zodiac]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[storm onyx]

!bug

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Bug tracker: https://github.com/SimCMinMax/WoW-BugTracker/labels/Rogue

[plucky thistle]

Does anyone know how to filter out poisons from plater basicaly i want to see only mine bleeds Garrote/Rapture/Cs and other debuffs except Deadly Poison and NP now i see everything and i woud like to have priority like 1. Garrote 2. Rupture and others is it possible?

[storm onyx]

Any of you guys losing ShadowStep funtionality since last nights global crash?

[odd heath]

Go on buff tracking > blacklist by name or spell id

I believe it's buff tracking, I'm on my phone

Can't check rn

[delicate berry]

Finally finding myself here - hello everyone

[novel arrow]

I wanna confirm something, it seems about our weapon enchants proc at the same time now right? Im having enchants proc for like 1.4k agi

[kindred flare]

Having the enchant on both weapons increases the amount, not chance to proc, so that's right

[novel arrow]

Oh interesting ok

thx

So when it procs it's a banger

So is the proc stronger on 2h weapons?

[red tinsel]

Wait so it's good to have two of the same enchants on both weapons?

[red tinsel]

Sir, this is a Wendys

For assassination rogues at least. How do we know?

[kindred flare]

Depends on what you want, not better or worse necessarily, but double the proc amount is always nice

[sand elm]

watching the echo stream talking about council, what build are u guys going to be trying on that fight?

[red tinsel]

I was thinking Assa, I mean, aren't they far enough apart that we can't cleave?

[sand elm]

i meant between dtb or IC

[red tinsel]

better question is, which fight you think is so bad for assa that it'd warrant to swap specs even without the correct secondary stat gear

[alpine latch]

Per the IV guide:

Eranog: AoE to pad, ST to burst boss and let the plebs kill the adds
Terros: Pure ST
Prime Council: 4T fight, AoE build
Sennarth: ST build, dot the adds
Dathea: ST but if assigned to adds go AoE
Kurog: ST build
Diura: AoE/Cleave build
Raszageth: Probably ST but no one knows since it wasn't tested

[red tinsel]

I'm sorry, I totally read Build as Spec. My bad

[sand elm]

i did say spec first to be fair then edited haha

[delicate berry]

Ive never played any rogue spec but assassination since bc onset..but with mythic plus looming i find myself considering going rogue to the outlaw side to give it a try. Is anyone here playing both specs? Thoughts

[sand elm]

and "aoe build" could be either dtb with ct or IC

curious as what u guys are going to be trying of those 2

[red tinsel]

I do!

[alpine latch]

Ah, fair enough. I'm probably just running my m+ build on that with IC and CT

[red tinsel]

I've played all specs for a while, but only in Shadowlands came back to Assa. Always been a big Outlaw player though.

[alpine latch]

I expect to bounce around with talents a bit as I learn the fights

[red tinsel]

I think Outlaw might have the edge on every M+ scenario, it's hard to see Assa being better, especially after some nerfs like PB.

BUT that said, Assa does seem to be in a great spot, the best it has ever been for M+, definitely viable and will shine on Fortified weeks

[visual slate]

Are there any sims in more realistic gear, like full normal raid ilvl or something?

[grim briar]

Is there any DTB + IC combo that anyone's investigated / found viable?

[red tinsel]

I'll be trying to main Assa on M+ until it either proves unviable or Outlaw is way ahead. Trying to stick it as long as I can

[spice spire]

You cannot get both capstones

[grim briar]

Do we have any data on how far ahead the outlaw DPS edge might be?

[spice spire]

Dtb is not takable with any other capstone

[red tinsel]

Yeah, you can get KB and IC, but you can't get DTB and other capstones

[delicate berry]

thanks I haven't tried IC talent yet...just feels like im giving up too much ST to make it worth while

[red tinsel]

... unfortunatelt

[visual slate]

Imagine dtb with kb

[grim briar]

Oh I didn't realize that...is that documented somewhere? I figured since we could do IC + KB, why not DTB + X

[visual slate]

You're getting insane aoe though

[silk bane]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[red tinsel]

Both DTB and IC builds don't actually lose that much damage. DTB applying your poisons on aoe is actually pretty good and FoK/CT are decent

[sand elm]

just cos of the amount of talents needed to get to capstone. theres more in the middle than the sides

[spice spire]

Yeah, the document is in the tree.
It was done specifically because of the DTB+kb synergy

There was always that issue in mind

[red tinsel]

Because DTB is kinda OP. I mean, I wish we could take DTB with other capstones, it's really bad we can't.

But it'd be broken as hell

[delicate berry]

yea i like DTB

[red tinsel]

I love DTB, BUT I -really- Love Kingsbane

[balmy condor]

There could be, is there a theory behind this, or some piece of information you would want to know?

[red tinsel]

Maybe one day damage will be adjusted so we actually can

[delicate berry]

do both well at the same time?

haha

[red tinsel]

Yeah, I mean why not. Lots of classes can take multiple capstones

[delicate berry]

yea i noticed (also run a prot pally as my main alt)

[vestal cliff]

Im so hyped for raid

Still not sure which build to go

[red tinsel]

The Tier Set REALLY makes a case for DTB

but until then, KB is really competitive

[delicate berry]

so for fortified weeks in M+ I assume IC is the way to go for higher keys? Will have to tool around with it since i havent yet

[visual slate]

Its just that all sims are made with best gear possible and some classes scale better, and also not many people will actually reach bis gear so I want to get a metric for like full normal and full heroic ilvl thresholds as well

[bronze hinge]

is setting my damage meter to "damage against skull" and only STing for Eranog copium

[raven light]

when do i use instant poison over deadly? in short fights?

[visual slate]

Never

[sand elm]

never

[raven light]

ahh kk 😄

[visual slate]

Deadly is instant but with dot attached

[balmy condor]

Oh I see. Yeah I’m not wasting my time on that then

[gleaming geyser]

nah, sin ST is most likely the way

[sand elm]

only time u use instant is if ur using dtb and not using amp for whatever reason

[raven light]

was wondering why it exists

[gleaming geyser]

dont think the adds will be durable enough

[visual slate]

Did not ask you to, just asked if those exist.

[bronze hinge]

default poison / other specs

[raven light]

true

[balmy condor]

Yeah but I’m the one who makes those usually :P I don’t know of anyone who’s made those comparisons

[bronze hinge]

@ocean bear #assassination message

I was gonna go outlaw for the multitarget fights because ass aoe is too big brain 4 me

[thorn fjord]

Servers up

[delicate berry]

well appreciate the input, and will tool around today see how things go in M+

[odd heath]

Fuu's spreadsheet has it

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[visual slate]

Ye most people will be stuck somewhere between normal and heroic item level but will take bis sims as a metric for class evaluation and that can be wrong

Oh well

[delicate berry]

my game just came u p fyi

[odd heath]

@visual slate

[flint pond]

!Whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[balmy condor]

What would change aside from the number being higher/lower

[balmy condor]

Has what exactly

[odd heath]

395 - 408 - 421 sims

[balmy condor]

lmao

[visual slate]

Ye those exist for rouge, but I wanted to see if those exist for all classes

[visual slate]

Some classes scale faster/slower with ilvl

[tame slate]

I'd probably check their discords first if you haven't

[balmy condor]

it's completely irrelevant over a single patch

[odd heath]

Some classes don't even have Sims lol

[slim hamlet]

Seems like a lot of info only exist for rogues

Because BIS mods ❤️

[balmy condor]

"scaling" is just fearmongering for casuals

like over an entire expansions worth of ilvl?

sure

yeah

big issue

but they also tune every single patch

and introduce new tier sets

but from heroic to mythic?

irrelevant difference

[visual slate]

Ye but people blindly follow sims and tier lists like fucking sheep

[thorn crater]

How long till live in na?

[visual slate]

So that cancels out

[balmy condor]

what

[slim hamlet]

If you follow tier lists youre on crack

[visual slate]

I dont care lol I played frost mage all SL

[balmy condor]

how does an irrelevant made up issue cancel out a tier list?

lmao

[slim hamlet]

I refuse to believe anyone that raids even AOTC thinks tier lists are a thing

[visual slate]

I've been kicked many times for being a frost instead of fire even though I parsed 100s by ilvl

[visual slate]

I think we misunderstood eachother

[slim hamlet]

parsing by ilvl is suspect

Specially for low played specs

[merry cypress]

mh can you change embellishment when recrafting?

[remote heath]

guild issue

[visual slate]

Wasn't in a guild then

Pugged my way into aotc s1 s2 and s4

[remote heath]

i mean pugs arent known for the most level headed thoughts or approaches so i dont really have an opinion

[grim briar]

Do we have any data on the relative DPS difference between specs right now? I see all this "outlaw best" discussion online, but no hard data

[remote heath]

i dont pug

[tame slate]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[visual slate]

ANYWAY what i'm saying is:

1. Sims and tier lists are made simming BIS gear available for the season
2. BIS gear is not achieveable by an average fuckboi from lfg
3. Average fuckboi from lfg will still use sims and tier lists to fuel their monkey brain decision making
4. Relative power of classes and specs might change with less item level because some specs scale at different speeds making these average fuckboi decisions fucking stupid

Notably, I don't give a fuck about tier lists because I've proven time and time to myself that I will perform better on a spec/class I like over spec/class that is considered best. The only reason I started this topic is because I fucking love information, even if it is pretty irrelevant. So, if there are no sims and info like that, bummer but whatever.

[balmy condor]

Tier lists aren't made from bis sims

tier lists aren't even made from logic

the wowhead tier list swapped outlaw and assassination after exsang nerf

even though outlaw got no buffs

[umbral rapids]

Lmao

That was so funny

[tame slate]

We can't control if LFG pugs don't do their own research

[strange comet]

sin blast so hard 😄

[balmy condor]

I mean if we all sim using heroic gear instead

[umbral rapids]

The reason was « people will play more outlaw » like what?

[balmy condor]

it doesn't actually change anything

like

[umbral rapids]

If anything i’m more likely than ever to play sin after exsang nerf

[balmy condor]

it's just lower ilvl, lower damage

but the specs relative to each other

are still the same

[alpine latch]

but scaling... i'm kidding don't hit me

[umbral rapids]

Are they all in heroic gear btw ?

I saw devastation’s were full 392 gear for some reason even

Last week or so

[storm onyx]

Tier lists are forced content creation tbh

[visual slate]

There is a small chance specs positions relative to eachother will swap. It is possible, lmao

[balmy condor]

yeah okay so one spec goes from 0.2% better to 0.2% worse

[visual slate]

Yes

[balmy condor]

and you think that's important?

[visual slate]

Not really?

I just like data and curiosities in it

[balmy condor]

aight

[alpine latch]

3. Average fuckboi from lfg will still use sims and tier lists to fuel their monkey brain decision making

Out of curiousity, if you're not using sims what are you using for decision making?

[visual slate]

Logs

At least logs are real world data

[shrewd night]

Oh no

Oh noooooo

[alpine latch]

Sure, but logs are also skewed, unless you get extremely specific with your data points

[storm onyx]

Position is irrelevant if you perform 1% worse with the new .2% better spec...

[visual slate]

And even then, I don't use relative power of specs in my decisions who to take into my group

[uncut flicker]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1037333062083678268/1052027746815070260/Mplus-Dragon-TB-Rota.png?width=810&height=252
Anyone can explain me why on this opener we use KB but isn't taking on the tree build ? x)

[storm onyx]

Also logs will differ if your MT stands 10 yards further compared to my MT in a fight

[uncut flicker]

please*

[storm onyx]

nothing is isolated

[thorn crater]

Needs to be corrected

It’s an oopsie

[uncut flicker]

ah ok

[thorn crater]

Whispyr overworked

[uncut flicker]

ty dude

[thorn crater]

Np

[uncut flicker]

i imagine we do the same opener but without KB

[thorn crater]

Ye

[uncut flicker]

ty bro

[thorn crater]

Uhm

What is the order of raid bosses

Cause echo is on spider?

Didn’t the servers reset like half an@hour ago?

But they playing 2 sin rogues

So that’s good

[ruby lotus]

they in heroic im guessing

[hexed root]

neck fixed:

[night delta]

I think there's a few branching paths after boss 1 or 2

[thorn crater]

But still that’s fast

[limber lion]

?

It's literally there

You're looking at the M+ opener

And that is the m+ opener for the Kingsbane/IC build

which is literally listed first in the FAQ

[balmy condor]

it's tuesday

[limber lion]

There's KB/IC and DTB

I'm sure you can guess which one that opener is for

[thorn crater]

I don’t understand what that means :p

[ruby lotus]

They are a EU guild and server reset isnt til Wednesday for them i think?

But obviouslty they streaming the raid

[limber lion]

Yeah server reset is tomorrow lol.

[thorn crater]

Oh they are eu?