outlaw

[lapis forge]

also keep popping finishers at 4/7 instead of 5+

[storm drum]

qd up into an outlaw group and the fuck didnt invite me sham shame

he went windwalker demo lock lmao

what a scrub

[jade abyss]

@glass mortar works well thanks

[vivid vessel]

np

[craggy barn]

this just means to wait to use the free roll before vanish right

[vivid vessel]

well the opposite

[glass mortar]

^

[vivid vessel]

cause you dont lose cdr on vanish

but also its not as doable with trickster

[glass mortar]

it means hold vanish to be able to do the free kir roll so u have supercharger

[vivid vessel]

altough if you have a 6 buff you can do it a bit

[glass mortar]

well sure the whole supercharger to vanish rule is fatebound thingy

trickster just vanishes when its not at the coup/kspree conditions

[craggy barn]

yea im talking about fb only here

[vivid vessel]

this one you can do as trickster if you have a 6 buff kired

but ye

[lapis forge]

anyone know if there is a WA option to check against current number of CP?

[tawny shuttle]

havent played outlaw in a while. we really dont play deft maneuvers anymore?

[glass mortar]

not as HO

[tawny shuttle]

does that feel like ass

[glass mortar]

eh

not rlly

HO already has so much CP generation during subterfuge

tbh, deft was also a "loss" in sims over the non deft builds last expac for HO builds

just not as much, and people liked deft

so it was still recommended

[gaunt phoenix]

it was time for enforce it

[glass mortar]

ye

[tawny shuttle]

so how are we regenerating cps

[glass mortar]

pressing ambush

[tawny shuttle]

yuck

i think

idl

so ho is the play?

[glass mortar]

HO is the easier build and strong

[vivid vessel]

just play kir

[glass mortar]

u can play either

[runic bough]

Yo guys do you think you could play while cp is visually a number 1-7 instead of 7 dots?

[glass mortar]

they r both viable

very similar strengths

[runic bough]

Lol that would feel so weird

[glass mortar]

in sims kir builds do better at higher target counts, HO at lower

in actual keys i think kir lends itself better to dungeons because it has higher consistency

HO feels like a slot machine with this seasons tier playstyle

and going into an important pack and rolling 4 1 buffs in a row can feel like a disaster

[gaunt phoenix]

play them both try them both

[runic bough]

If cp was a number display, wouldn't that be more gambler feely

[glass mortar]

why

[gaunt phoenix]

what

[glass mortar]

ive played with CP as just a number before, made no difference to me

[runic bough]

Ye see u guys even think it's weird too

[glass mortar]

not rlly

[gaunt phoenix]

the question you just posited is weird

[patent mirage]

lets not re invent the wheel

with extra steps

[runic bough]

That was my master in English coming out

That's no extra steps lol just different format for cp

[patent mirage]

"hey guys lets do what we already do but different for no reason "

[runic bough]

Yeah I mean it's just for fun anyway

[glass mortar]

ye i mean u can try it and see if you like it

it doesnt make any difference

[runic bough]

You might not be able to tell if your overlapping tho

[glass mortar]

overlapping?

[runic bough]

Overcapping

[vivid vessel]

its just worse

why would you do that

[runic bough]

Yeah

[vivid vessel]

you know waht you can do

you can play without cps

[glass mortar]

idk some people like seeing a number

[vivid vessel]

actually not that hard

[glass mortar]

i mean HO u can literally play without a CP indicator

probably do 98% of dps potential

[vivid vessel]

I can almost play without cps

[glass mortar]

u should already be able to tell how many cp ur next finisher is gunna be able to give u

[vivid vessel]

only thing you actually need to see is how much cps you gained from the cp refund

[glass mortar]

its not like there multiple layers of rng to it

[runic bough]

Yeah refund too

[glass mortar]

for kir maybe

[runic bough]

The orb visual is best now that I think of these things

[glass mortar]

imo if u just had a WA that lit up when u were at 5+ cp

u could probably play HO at 99% dps capacity

ive thought about trying it before but id need to make it and ive been lazy

i need to make a bunch of WA for my monk and change some on my rogue

i just wanna do delves tho

💅

[runic bough]

When I made dh I had to make so many mouseover macros

Outlaw is pretty lucky we only need to mouseover 2 things

Hook and distract

Although some outlaws mouseover ps and bte too

[glass mortar]

oh @cursor macros

[runic bough]

To do dmg on ranged

[glass mortar]

i mean i have a lot of mouseovers

PS, bte, blind, kidney cheap kick

oh god i still have mouseover shadowstep bound on my bar because i never got anything to replace it

its just been a ? on my bar since s2

☠️

[runic bough]

My kick is mouseover but no ranged talent for it like dh so kind of blah

[daring oxide]

anyone know the fastest way to unlock the 200 world quests achievement for thunderfury outlaw appearance

brown colour

[frank finch]

mouseover bte?

[glass mortar]

yes

[frank finch]

oh u have already

my bad

[runic bough]

You can have your target selected and your mouse on a ranged add to fire ps and bte.

[frank finch]

mouse over ks?

[runic bough]

Yeah

[dawn tundra]

How does one manage their energy as an Outlaw Rogue? I'm doing around 1.1 Million DPS in raids, but I can't seem to keep my energy together. Am I missing a component?

[runic bough]

That helps too if your target I'd low hp

[glass mortar]

energy management is downwind of doing the whole rotation kinda

there is no real direct energy management like pooling or using abilities to generate

[gaunt phoenix]

ur energy is from gear and the culmination of doing everything right

[glass mortar]

if you are running out of energy its usually just a sign of core rotational problems

^

[dawn tundra]

GOD DAMN IT!

[frank finch]

keyword usally

[runic bough]

[frank finch]

sometimes rng just fucks you

[glass mortar]

it could also be gear, if you dont have the proper amounts of haste

[runic bough]

Calm down broski

[glass mortar]

and yes, its also possible to just get rng so bad u run out of energy and cant press buttons

[vague cape]

what do I do when my energy comes from energy drinks

[glass mortar]

its rare tho so if you notice it happening frequently, its likely a rotation issue

[vague cape]

memes aside im gonna have to drop haste

[runic bough]

Also outlaw in general goes dry sometimes, nothing we can do. What we can do is differentiate that it's from rng or rotation mistake.

[glass mortar]

!haste

[ornate heath]

Total stat volume will look like Vers > Haste* > Crit > Mastery.

*But Haste has a **requirement ** because Adrenaline Rush lowers your GCD based on it, down to 0.8s at 25% haste.

The KIR build wants 18-20% haste from rating, because its only haste buff is from Alacrity.

The HO build meets this requirement with 8-10% haste from rating because of Take 'em by Surprise, but the new HO + Supercharger build continues to like Haste just because of energy, so you will have to sim. Your sim may settle for KIR-levels of haste (~18%) or slightly lower.

You need to use Raidbots Top Gear to determine what haste pieces to use.
You can also get ~4.2% haste from a flask. This can be equal or better than Vers flask if you need it for either build.

[gaunt phoenix]

you become zeross

[runic bough]

Zeross blood must be redbull by now

[vivid vessel]

WTF

[vague cape]

https://tenor.com/view/bad-ending-bad-end-ending-vhs-gif-5458110692104668687

[dawn tundra]

!log

[craggy barn]

zac

how much dps is it if everyone has jastors

[lime lake]

7

probably

[tranquil hemlock]

actually its 12

[rotund halo]

Lol WoW is so bad now a days like this whole tier feels like a .5 tier like

[runic bough]

Its a .1 tier raid

And

[gaunt phoenix]

this tier is dogshit (i play every day)

[runic bough]

M+ is the real contents this season

[glass mortar]

i didnt like OaB or initial stix prog but everything else has been fine idk

only thing that sucks about this tier is killing spree

like 90% of the bosses i dislike too i only dislike because of killing spree

[runic bough]

Killingspree is our bane of existence.

Regardless, the raid is like 10 attempts and you should be familiar with every boss.

[storm drum]

yeah if you have a brain or are in a good guild

[runic bough]

The only real mythic boss imo is mugzee

You have so much going on

That's a good mythic level play

I am not sure how long my guild will take to get there.

They just started we on Stix now

[glass mortar]

its not like an amazing tier, i think i liked most of the bosses from last season more

but idk how much of that is just me playing killing spree

vs actual fight design

[runic bough]

It could also be we hate ks 95% and the raid is actually okay. It's hard to determines.

[north lintel]

So i was doing some weeklies with guildies, and some rolls happened in the key (+10 PSF) Shitty key but damn juicy overall

[glass mortar]

very nice

honestly all 3 of those overalls are rediculious for a +10

idk how a shadowpriest manages to do that much

packs must have lived 4 seconds for u guys

stuff does not have much hp in a +10

[storm drum]

I think its fight design and this tier is way more easy and the last raid was fresh and tied in with the lore andnot just greedy goblins lmao

ALso the M+ dungeons are pretty damn decent this season

[glass mortar]

well this one is tied in with lore but yea the goblin vibe can be very hit or miss with people, and last tier definitly felt harder

its kinda crazy how much damage we will be getting over the next month or so

gally is gunna be insanely easy by the end of the season

everyone is gunna be doing like 20% more dps in a months time

[storm drum]

lol Good i came back 2 weeks ago i need all the catchup i can get

[glass mortar]

☠️

[keen belfry]

guys

12 minutes of floodgate

[gaunt phoenix]

[keen belfry]

HELLO?

[gaunt phoenix]

rigged

[keen belfry]

i swear my tier doesnt work in flodogate

[vivid vessel]

try rolling

[tender wedge]

I depleted a 14ToP the other day with 2 deaths, spriest chilling at 1.9m overall

[keen belfry]

is there any more rtb tech i can muster up

maybe change its keybind

[tulip jewel]

gm higher than hearty well fed, rough

[keen belfry]

80% adrenaline rush uptime btw

[keen belfry]

how tf

[vivid vessel]

bufs with 100% uptime are bugged

on details

[tulip jewel]

xd

[keen belfry]

im 90% sure this one was accurate

[tulip jewel]

probs expired

[vivid vessel]

hope not

[keen belfry]

XD those look wrong hehe

[vivid vessel]

also its hearty

[glass mortar]

awang im ngl

sometimes i redo my whole talent page

and take off all my gear and put it back on

because im convinced either the talent or tier isnt working

xd

[dawn talon]

HAHAHAHAH ive done the same

[glass mortar]

when u go a dungeon and u get like 3 5 buffs the whole dungeon

[dawn talon]

i had

[glass mortar]

and then u just do the math in ur head

[dawn talon]

11 pulls in a row last night

with 1 buff

[glass mortar]

im rolling every 10s

[dawn talon]

and it was gm or bt

every time

[glass mortar]

ive gotten 15 1 buffs and 2 5 buffs this dungeon

surely its not possible to be that unlucky

these things r 1% chance apart

but this is just vibes im sure its fine

wow item effects or talents are not known for sometimes being able to just turn off/break with no explanation historically

and how would u even be able to tell if this did break other then vibes

[north lintel]

we played a push route so big packs allowed everyone to hit "decently". But yeah the key was a +3 fiesta. Almost 6M shocked me

[glass mortar]

yea u pumped, im gunna be honest im super impressed with that shadow tho

shadow is not good in dungeons rn

[daring oxide]

blaster

[north lintel]

He's a good SP main but still yeah, hitting a good overall in such a low key on a ramping spec is impressive

[glass mortar]

yea i mean, if ur outlaw doing that much dps in a 10 stuff is just dying like someone used a cd on every pack

nightmare for a ramping cd spec

[daring oxide]

did you pull overcount btw lafrench

cos i did a 10 PSF last week and did this:

and overall damage is lower than yours

maybe i cant do maths

[north lintel]

i have 5.55B

you have 6.55

ah you added all the numbers

[daring oxide]

i had to carry some kind of demon warlock

[north lintel]

lemme show you the route

We played that:

[daring oxide]

ah ok

thats just the usual route

hmm

[shut lichen]

https://tenor.com/view/krill-issue-skill-issue-krill-issue-gif-25572478

[daring oxide]

krill issue lol

[frank finch]

damn how ya pumping so hard teach me

please

[vivid vessel]

hekillih

[frank finch]

[tulip jewel]

having bad teammates helps a lot for overalls

[daring oxide]

carried by KIR RNG

literally had two dps doing no dps

and had insane uptime on 6buffs

so naturally

just sustaining absurd dps

[glass mortar]

if ur pullin like that kir is just the play

kir is ahead at high target counts

[daring oxide]

yeah

[glass mortar]

and also just has less variance then HO

[north lintel]

playing KIR ?

[daring oxide]

deft is so good now

[glass mortar]

u have 4-6 buffs on almost every pack

[daring oxide]

HO KIR? how is that possible

[north lintel]

i'm playing HO on that key

[glass mortar]

especially the important big ones

[frank finch]

HO GANG

[daring oxide]

i play KIR 1FTH

trickster

[hasty warren]

kir trick uwu

[north lintel]

haven't played KIR for a while

[daring oxide]

KIR is the best

[north lintel]

since like the first 3 weeks i guess

[daring oxide]

try it

its so fun

[north lintel]

yeah i'll give it a try

[daring oxide]

KIR 1FTH

take PC

[north lintel]

took time to get used to HO supercharger

felt weird at start

[daring oxide]

only downside is ST can occasionally be slightly rough in small windows

with bad rtb buffs etc

but

is always blasting aoe

[north lintel]

had that for KIR precise cuts

[daring oxide]

deft goes hard

yup

[north lintel]

yeah i really like deft

[daring oxide]

deft got fixed as well

finally does damage as it supposed to

[north lintel]

you KIR at 4+ buffs ?

[daring oxide]

nope

6 buffs

[north lintel]

only 6

okay

[daring oxide]

well theres more to it

but i usually hard fish for 6 buffs

[red zinc]

stop misinformation spreading

cuh

[daring oxide]

unless im super desperate

[vivid vessel]

wdym only 6

you are mental

[daring oxide]

no misinfo

[hasty warren]

only 7 for me

[daring oxide]

if i get 5 natty

i will keep fishing until 6 then KIR

[north lintel]

haha

[hasty warren]

below it's not worth

[vivid vessel]

ye i only press kir on a 8 buff myself

[red zinc]

#1276308344813916261 message

and the one above

[daring oxide]

i only press KIR on 1 buff

[red zinc]

read those

[tulip jewel]

i spec KiR and don't even press it tbh

[daring oxide]

I press KIR when 0 buffs

[red zinc]

anyone here press KIR when they get BT 1 buff?

[safe pasture]

Try keeping KIR off cd for aesthetic

[hollow temple]

[vivid vessel]

https://tenor.com/view/pipotam-baby-hippo-hippo-wash-shower-gif-3406421565683572068

[red zinc]

literally me

[north lintel]

i mean a good rtb of Broad+Bearing with Ruthless+Skull in Count the odds can be worth KIR ?

[daring oxide]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-angry-no-talk-quiet-annoyed-gif-18249656535133585589

[daring oxide]

theres a rule to KIR if u get 3 buffs (RP+BS+TB)

thats fine too

but sometimes u can cheeky fish

if u got time

why not

CTO good

right @vivid vessel ?

master fisherman

[vivid vessel]

i press kir by feeling so

sometimes its good to force it

for an important pack

[daring oxide]

i see

[vivid vessel]

what good does it do delaying kir for the trash pack after you know

idk

[daring oxide]

ye

[vivid vessel]

i press kir when i feel like it

[daring oxide]

i was just being vague generally

[vivid vessel]

if you do it any other way you are wrong

[north lintel]

welp thx for the info, i'll have fun with that later. Off to bed, byebye guys

[daring oxide]

no time for bed

time for KIR key now

[daring oxide]

outlaw is a feel spec

[glass mortar]

kirs ability to force is really something that u dont see in sims imo

because like

[daring oxide]

if it feels good or right

do it

[glass mortar]

there are packs in dungeons you "need" cds for

and outlaw doesnt have cds

[daring oxide]

KIR can be like a cd though

[glass mortar]

but theres a difference between "no cds" and "5 1 buff rolls in a row"

[daring oxide]

if you lock in the right buffs

[glass mortar]

having that happen on an important pack that needs to die can be a disaster

[daring oxide]

like big pack (8 targets and u got GM+RP+BS)

LOCK IT IN

[glass mortar]

but kir can at least snapshot its good buffs with as few as 2 cto procs

[daring oxide]

BLAST

[glass mortar]

and then use RtB to force additional buffs

to make sure u do ok damage

[daring oxide]

I love GM now

feels BLASTER

is GM like the strongest AOE buff now that its been fixed

well because BF+PC has been fixed too

or is it still RP

[glass mortar]

think its still RP

but GM might be second

probably something like RP > GM > broadside > TB if I had to guess

TB and SnC im not sure

without RP ur variance is kinda crazy

[daring oxide]

TB value is mostly in the CDR

but i defo think TB is beast

helps with ADR uptime the most

alongside BS

[glass mortar]

yea

and adr needs the extra cdr

[daring oxide]

ya

[glass mortar]

trickster is a bit expensive for cdr

it doesnt have as much as fatebound

so its adr uptime is a bit lower

[daring oxide]

i always found that low uptime on TB reflects very welll

in raid fights

especially as KIR

trickster

[tulip jewel]

HO TB in your 5 buff rolls is one of the biggest differences

[daring oxide]

@vivid vessel i forgot to ask you, on mugzee do you find yourself delaying KS (for mines part, and blue circles (stun)) or are you just full yoloing, i cant tell in your logs lol

[vivid vessel]

ye you dont have a choice

cant send during mines

[daring oxide]

ok

sound ty

[vivid vessel]

for the intermission

[daring oxide]

cos i was hoping its not gonna be full gamba stytle

style

[vivid vessel]

i will press it at low cp if its fishy

kinda pray

[daring oxide]

ah ok

makes sense

[glass mortar]

zac is a lunatic farming it tho

grain of salt

😠

[runic bough]

1cp ks on rookery first boss or just hold

I havnt tried 1cp yet. More will definitely instantly stun

[tender wedge]

press n for rookery imo

[glass mortar]

it will instantly tick u

u can kspree while hes running into center and as the beam ends when he starts to charge out

sometimes it works out naturally but sometimes its

[runic bough]

Yes I've notices that

[glass mortar]

i try to save cloak for when it doesnt line up naturally

so i can send one during interm

[earnest solar]

is it better to play HO builds on lower keys than keep it rolling?

[glass mortar]

key level doesnt rlly matter

both builds work in both, i think kir gets a little better towards the higher end but HO is still fine

doesnt wox play HO

[frank finch]

he plays kir now but played ho for a while

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel we're 1 key away from being the best team on eu

?

[hasty warren]

realy ?

pic or fake

[vivid vessel]

big

[runic bough]

Zeross help Zac make team

Cmon

Zac needs a team

Can't push

[vivid vessel]

im good

[frank finch]

zac wont push until ks is fixed

[runic bough]

You retired zac?

[vivid vessel]

My spec is non functional

I keep bricking keys from dying to ks

[hasty pasture]

Have you thought about not dying?

Just say no

[vivid vessel]

Also I have finished the lfg game rn

Cannot push higher

Will just wait next week

[proven ocean]

wdym pic lol

im 3722

[vivid vessel]

Low io

[proven ocean]

actually i think we were r1 eu team at some point before

[hasty warren]

nah I mean for ur team with zac

[vivid vessel]

What

[proven ocean]

what

[frank finch]

what

[proven ocean]

btw zac is outlaw good on 3rd boss DFC

sub does alot on it tho idk what to play

[vivid vessel]

Ye insane very good

Perma stunned

[hasty warren]

am I drunk ?

[proven ocean]

pure st

thoughts?

actually thats like

week 1 dps

isnt it

like

dps didnt change

its crazy or

?

@vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

Wdym

[proven ocean]

feels like sub always did this ST dps

or?

[vivid vessel]

I mean that's what outlaw does if it high roll with 100% uptime

Won't be this boss cause you get stunned you know

[slate plaza]

Demo lock is so fun

And min maxy

[proven ocean]

ngl zac

like

that boss

is legit not livable as assa

[safe pasture]

hey im noticing instant poison being a lot higher in my sim than in my real rotation what am I doing wrong

[proven ocean]

no clue cuh

could just be you simming with bl

idk

how much higher

can u show both

[safe pasture]

wait think its just me doing too long of a sim maybe nvm nvm

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel did u see reacher season 3

its rly good so far im at episode 2 i think

@rancid ledge SOUP SELLER IS BACK

SELLING CAT SOUP

[shut lichen]

you good?

[proven ocean]

ye cuh

sup G

[runic bough]

Zeross

[proven ocean]

cuh

[runic bough]

Will u play triple outlaw with zac

[proven ocean]

idk

[runic bough]

We starting it on NA

[proven ocean]

zac isnt on NA

[shut lichen]

NA

[runic bough]

you guys need to do it on EU

[proven ocean]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4gQun957pM&t=1176s

we did it in DF

[runic bough]

Make triple outlaw EU I know

[glass silo]

why is geargridner spare key so good on outlaw?

[dawn talon]

we have lots of vers and it has mainstat

[proven ocean]

[fathom bramble]

it's actually not especially good on outlaw

we just can't leverage stat trinkets at all so generic damage trinkets end up winning

[dawn talon]

that is also true, trinkets are just generally weak

and this is especially true for outlaw

[late swallow]

Legion remix? Pog?

[fathom bramble]

if you look at how strong keys actually are they are only slightly ahead of keys for sub/sin for example

[latent oak]

https://www.twitch.tv/yodatv/clip/FragileStylishGazelleDancingBaby-Qyt_642cLAdWxoCA can u do this with grapple

[fathom bramble]

but sub/sin have trinkets that are significantly better for them than any trinket is for us

[runic bough]

Yes it's part of the shareholder suppression on outlaw

[proven ocean]

ye

gonna play that shit out alot

[late swallow]

Mop remix was really fun

[fathom bramble]

I haven't tried in years

[late swallow]

Legion remix will go hard

[fathom bramble]

I know it didn't work in legion and heroic leap visually takes you higher

so it probably still doesn't work

[proven ocean]

btw somnius

u will play gta 6

or

[fathom bramble]

or BFA?

whenever workshop was

[proven ocean]

u seem like a big gta 6 fan

[latent oak]

bfa

[proven ocean]

[late swallow]

Yeah I’ll play gta 6

[proven ocean]

u have a ps5

or

[late swallow]

Gta v was fun

[latent oak]

ill try it in this 16 and report back

[proven ocean]

i'll literally buy a ps5 just to play gta 6

[late swallow]

I just have pc atm

But yeah idk I might get one for gta

We’ll see

[proven ocean]

gta like

is so crazy

i'll not be able to not buy a ps5

i'll literally ddo it dday 1

lmao

[late swallow]

Yeah it’s endless fun

Based

[proven ocean]

man

i love wow

like

man

this game is good

[tender wedge]

positivity about the game? well i never

[late swallow]

Zero owns lots of blizz stock

He’s legally required to say that as a shareholder

[proven ocean]

i cannot comment on that for legal purposes

[late swallow]

[ornate kernel]

I have 60 crest left, do u recommend me craft something or wait until next week to upgrade things? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/cpERhMqiV8m95bGoc3Gxpr

[wintry solar]

Game is good when they have room for creativity

[fathom bramble]

crests are uncapped next week so you can always farm more and more

might as well send it now imo

unless you want to save on recraft costs for upgrading it with another 30 crests

[frank finch]

wait that means crafted peieces go back to costing 90 crests

sneaky blizz

[trail cape]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[woeful jackal]

Brand new to Outlaw and after 40 minutes wailing on the target dummy I just had this moment and it clicked

[long barn]

Any chance they fix this crap animation for KS

Anyone heard rumors?

[glass mortar]

ive heard a rumor its not coming in 11.1.7

the rumor was ptr

pray for next season

[bright crane]

i meanj

theres still another month

[haughty lagoon]

Is there a sim some where of Outlaw High rolling vs low rolling?

for KIR

[stray star]

i new to rogue.. this shit (ks) always been like this ?

[haughty lagoon]

no its better now

lol

[haughty moat]

yes

[stray star]

this is just fucking unplayable in m+

[haughty lagoon]

thats not true

[haughty moat]

its fun

[stray star]

tell me, how i use this in the lich boss at teather ?

just press and pray ?

[haughty moat]

yes

you got cloak faint and a healer^^

[stray star]

lul

[haughty moat]

also cheat death without usage is just a dead talent

[fair charm]

I enjoy the mini game of killing spree, but yeah you gotta know the fights.

[craggy quiver]

weapon swap still works in m+?

[haughty moat]

yeah

[craggy quiver]

i couldnt swap

for somereason

[haughty moat]

out of combat ofc

[hollow temple]

Pretty sure you can swap in combat

It’s just bad to do so

[craggy quiver]

wouldnt let me for some reason

[haughty moat]

oh really? but why is it bad in combat then? loosing global?

[hollow temple]

Costs a global and resets auto attack icd stuff

Afaik

[haughty moat]

ah i see, good i didnt know 😄

[hollow temple]

Were you on gcd or something

[craggy quiver]

dont think so

[hollow temple]

Does your macro work usually?

Other than that idk

[jade abyss]

Gally weapon?

you cannot swap Gallywix weapon in m+

so I learned today

[craggy quiver]

oh shit

ya

[peak dock]

guys is ks fixed to be always in gallywix's back?

[fathom bramble]

it's on his back if available

otherwise it puts you on his front

[peak dock]

ty

[wintry solar]

turns out KS only applies on single target without BF

[haughty moat]

why would you use it without bf ?

[wintry solar]

to see if it would apply in aoe without it

[haughty moat]

fair enough

[runic bough]

Bladdflurry now isn't useless on single target. Activates an execute damage modifier by x% to your abilities after target reaches 35%

[haughty moat]

he is dreaming again

[runic bough]

[wintry solar]

try again

maybe something fun

[runic bough]

Wtf

They don't give us fun

It totally works

[wintry solar]

they take away fun

and theres nothing left to take away

thats fun

[runic bough]

I mean what do you want

[wintry solar]

ohh

[runic bough]

It can't be fun according to thuer design team for outlaw

So

Bf is no change in gameplay

[wintry solar]

what I find fun and what you find fun are 2 incredibly different "funs"

[runic bough]

Explain

[wintry solar]

I dont want to react to ace procs and have a subt loop in my gameplay. Other than that, the world is my oyster

[runic bough]

So why is bf execute boring

[wintry solar]

baseline effecient building and spending

[runic bough]

It changes nothing

[wintry solar]

because there was a time where we bf in single target and it wasnt fun

didnt last long

[runic bough]

Why you comparing my change to the previous blizzard change

[haughty moat]

we just dont need execute, we are flat damage and thats fine as high apm spec...no burst, no execute

[wintry solar]

because youd still do it in ST

[runic bough]

We can have bf active all the time what do you mean

Its not always gonna need to press it

[wintry solar]

idk I guess

im just genreally unhappy with the spec i guess

[runic bough]

[polar kelp]

Depends on build, kir you press it almost on cd in aoe

[runic bough]

Yeah but execute is for single target

[fathom bramble]

Lethal Flurry: After dealing damage to an enemy below 35% life your Blade Flurry additionally strikes all nearby enemies for 25% of singletarget damage dealt for 3 seconds.

Note that it says All nearby enemies and not all other nearby enemies*

[runic bough]

[polar kelp]

Honestly just make feint costs no energy and ADR last 2 additional seconds

Spec perfected

We don't need execute shit

[fathom bramble]

well we don't need it

but it would be nice to have some kind of relevant damage profile for raid encounters

[polar kelp]

I'd prefer not having to press killing spree ever

[fathom bramble]

for sure

[polar kelp]

Lol

[fathom bramble]

it's a more immediate issue lol

KS has got to go

[polar kelp]

Loktark I have a bone to pick with you btw

[fathom bramble]

what's up

[timid shoal]

preach

[polar kelp]

All season you've been almost exactly 40io ahead of me

I hate it

:p

[fathom bramble]

my bad

I was rank 1 outlaw rogue for a second there at the start lol

[polar kelp]

Yea I was in top 10 day 1 it was pretty neat

[fathom bramble]

not a lot of people doing keys for 8 hours a day for the first 4 days

[runic bough]

Loktark suggestion would give us more aoe and single target.. okay okay I like it I understand now.

[polar kelp]

But then us normies with jobs fall behind

[fathom bramble]

yeah I can't keep up that key rate

for multiple reasons

[runic bough]

Fuck that would actually make us good at target capped

Fr fr

[tender wedge]

do i remember someone saying cudgel was getting implemented into sims?

[gaunt phoenix]

It is in simc now

[tender wedge]

beautiful

[gaunt phoenix]

but only for dslice droute

and no weapon swapping

[tender wedge]

got a guildy convinced that 390 agi and 77 secondary stat > proc that does 2% of overall in keys

need sims to prove wrong

[gaunt phoenix]

nice

[tender wedge]

you'd think 0.5 < 2 would be a pretty strong case but

[fathom bramble]

390 agi is like 0.5% of our total agi

but also the wep has weapon damage on it that's worth more so it's not quite that simple

[tender wedge]

i know

but also

[long barn]

Say you have mythic 7/8 and obviously all 12s done. What do you spend the coins on. Really haven’t got any luck on drops so consider everything is needed. I do however have 678 MH and OH.

any suggestions

[tender wedge]

if you don't have mugzee fist, probably take that

[long barn]

I have a hero

But no myth track

[gaunt phoenix]

capo and then idk

not much else that is actually important

geargrinder/magnet if they didnt drop

[tender wedge]

maybe a pacemaker for passive trink

[long barn]

Maybe vers haste ring from one arm?

[gaunt phoenix]

mythic pacemaker is fine

you cant purchase the roulette ring

[long barn]

Boooo

[tender wedge]

we're on mugzee now so i think pacemaker is my first pickup, then probs capo, then idk

[long barn]

I have a gear grinder. Is gally MH worth saving a coin for?

[long barn]

That’s the crit one right from M+

[tender wedge]

yeah

[gaunt phoenix]

gally weapon is technically raid bis but its trivial

[long barn]

I have a hero one. It’s nice. I thought the mug trinket was worth

[gaunt phoenix]

might not even be on lower duration fights

[late swallow]

trivial

[tender wedge]

really need the extra ST dps to bring gally down...wait

might be good for your sprocket parsing

[long barn]

Really prefer the magnet over the grinder. One less thing to worry about missing

[tender wedge]

i assume theyre pretty close, keys can be fun ti snipe stuff from range tho

[long barn]

Yea we struggle at the phase 2/3 intermission trying to push him. We end up blowing bloodlust early and screws up over later

[gaunt phoenix]

use them both !

[long barn]

No shit? Like that’s the play?!

[tender wedge]

my point is that you need to kill mythic gally to buy his weapon so its kinda redundant

[gaunt phoenix]

i use them both

but there are ofc a bunch of combinations of good trinket s

[long barn]

Yea but I think I’ll have him down in a few weeks. All these extra myth tracks and % bonus on dmg is going to make it easy

Well not easy

But easier

[long barn]

Are you not using the mugzee trinket. I think it sim’s good in raid. I suppose for M+ it’s probs grinder and mag

[tender wedge]

but then hes dead and why need the weapon? 😛

[long barn]

Oh

I get you now

Nice nice

[gaunt phoenix]

i dont have it, but mugzee trinket is merely the same as those two on ST

[tender wedge]

yeah, just passive instead

[gaunt phoenix]

might be minorly inflated on shorter fights with more lust uptime

[long barn]

Once gally dead I would just M+ for title and quit raiding so your right

[tender wedge]

could take hoc for sub

if you wanted to try another spec

jastor is bis for sub and assass

[long barn]

Yea I have a heroic version. And I’ve seen some people take it for KIR

Pacemaker might be nice too. It’s nice in M+

I run it now in HO

[tender wedge]

yeah im grabbing that since i play outlaw and assass and it'll be an upgrade for both

and dont have it yet at all

[tough mural]

I’ve only ever played assa and sub. Is outlaw hard to learn? And I’m hearing your movement speed is pretty fast?

[long barn]

Just a lot going on

You end up learning how to play it by like muscle memory lol

And KS is just good and bad days

Some days I’m like a 3600IO rogue and some I’m like 2000io troll

[gaunt phoenix]

Outlaw is arguably one of the hardest specs because it has the highest APM of all dps, and has lots of buffs/procs to track at a given moment and react accordingly every global

And right now you have to use killing spree which has some overhead to using it without dying

[long barn]

It’s really fun tho. Give it a whirl

[gaunt phoenix]

that said, it does not have cd management quite like sin/sub

[tender wedge]

mm outlaw difficulty is in making snap prio calls on a very short GCD

[gaunt phoenix]

because we dont have cds we are just zooming at all times

[tender wedge]

never having to think about cd use is pretty nice

except like ripping ADR before a down phase

like rik or stix

[long barn]

So Solo… I’ve been writing up a complaint to blizzard telling them all the KS bouncing around is causing me headaches and my doctor is requesting me to disable the effects. They’ve (blizzard) have added things to help people that have severe symptoms to like shaking and stuff. Any chance maybe they will give us like a button to disable the animation?

[tender wedge]

just turn your head away

[long barn]

Haha

[tender wedge]

make a WA that does a PING when KS aura ends

now you too are an accessibility expert

[gaunt phoenix]

there is a weakaura that will turn your screen black while it's active

[long barn]

No way

I mean I don’t want it cause I usually can track some of what’s going on and I’ll usually hook somewhere safe if I detect something that’s gonna kill me

Or pop cloak

[gaunt phoenix]

there is probably a point to be made about ks being an accessibility concern but i think it's unlikely they will do something to address that specifically

it's an open secret that they are probably working on ks rn

[tender wedge]

"they" might be a bit ambitious 😉

[long barn]

You think they will like redo it altogether

[gaunt phoenix]

who knows

[long barn]

Too bad they just won’t make use immune during it. But then we would just use it as an advantage for mechanics lol

[tender wedge]

making us immune would be incredibly powerful

im a fan of wox solution personally

[gaunt phoenix]

i'd rather be immune for like 1 second after it ends

[tender wedge]

that could work, would allow for some pretty insane timing cheese

[long barn]

Which is just have us slap target and give slight movement?

[tender wedge]

remove the teleport part

[long barn]

Yea

Same

[gaunt phoenix]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/killing-spree-fix-concept/2088489

[tender wedge]

ultimately it just needs to not be a risk of death when using it without having to hold it indeterminably

[shell fossil]

i like the gap closer aspect of it tbh

[fathom bramble]

is it really a gap closer when it teleports you back to where you started ?

it's more like a ranged skill that roots you

[shell fossil]

no but you did just get 7 seconds on rb for using it

ranged bte and all that

[fathom bramble]

I do miss when it use to actually be a gap closer sometimes

and you could glyph it for whichever version you wanted

miss it for pvp*

[shell fossil]

weird but if they just remove killing spree im gonna miss the extra gameplay loop

[fathom bramble]

ideally they replace it with another medium cooldown finisher of a similar strength

[frail veldt]

I remember this being talked about earlier but this is definitely not a silence

@vivid vessel

Is this what you were talking about about?

[shut lichen]

aoe interrupt no?

[frail veldt]

That's not a silence

A silence prevents any spell from being cast for X seconds regardless of whether the mob is casting when you press it

An interrupt is an entirely different mechanic

Aoe silence is remarkably more powerful

[shell fossil]

you have to talent into it, and my buddy was saying it's not a quick silence

[frail veldt]

It's not a silence at all

[latent oak]

i think the discussion was that given it kicks a spell, its functionally rhe same as a silence

[frail veldt]

It's an interrupt

[shell fossil]

afair, it does silence the spell tree

[frail veldt]

That's not even remotely true

A silence prevents any school

[shell fossil]

no there's a talent for it, even on method.gg

[latent oak]

since mobs only have 1 school typically

[frail veldt]

An interrupt is literally for one school and it has to be used while casting

[frail veldt]

Still has to be used while casting

[latent oak]

yaya

[frail veldt]

An interrupt and a silence are rarely interchangeable

It's like comparing a stun to an incap

Not even close

[latent oak]

for alot of use cases they are functionally similar

[frail veldt]

That's just an interrupt

Interrupts aren't affected by dr

Silence is

[shell fossil]

are you comparing it to solar beam? im using language weirdly

[frail veldt]

Y'all non pvpers don't know how different these two things are

[frail veldt]

Beam does both

It interrupts then applies a silence

Same with the "silence" spell from shadow priest

Garrote for example is just a silence

Sometimes called a "blanket silence"

[random stirrup]

only in pvp

[frail veldt]

That's not true it's the same on mobs

Silence has a Dr on mobs too

[random stirrup]

it does not

[frail veldt]

You can't garrote infinitely

It does

10000%

[random stirrup]

i have iron wire garroted mobs

[frail veldt]

Interior doesn't

[random stirrup]

it's full 6s

every time

[frail veldt]

Yep

No what

You can't regarrote

For the same duration

[random stirrup]

ye u can

in pve

[frail veldt]

You can't just vanish garrote 3 times for 18 seconds of silence

[random stirrup]

ya u can lmao it's broken

[frail veldt]

Unless they changed it

[shell fossil]

i dunno it feels like some spells are on different trees like you kick fireball for the lol and they throw a cinderblast

[random stirrup]

with 2x vanish you can silence for up to like 54s

[shell fossil]

on priory

[frail veldt]

Yeah that's how interrupts work

[latent oak]

ya

[random stirrup]

i did it in grimba last season

[latent oak]

vast majority of mobs are 1 school tho

that 1 mob in ara wasnt

[random stirrup]

just chain silence a caster or two

[shell fossil]

so why is that spell tree line in there

[latent oak]

very annoying

[frail veldt]

Interrupts don't have dr

[shell fossil]

sounds like not working as intended ?_?

[frail veldt]

Cuz interrupt is used in pvp

And technically is relevant for some mobs

[random stirrup]

#assassination message

[frail veldt]

That's very new to me cuz I thought dh silence dred itself when you reset it in time

[latent oak]

bait kick with flash heal into full void torrent ez

although nowadays i suppose u just precog fish

[frail veldt]

So if you run triple assa you can do a whole key with no mobs ever casting

[random stirrup]

yes, but lieutenants are not silencable

[frail veldt]

Sure yeah

That seems underutilized

[random stirrup]

but no iron wire is turbo busted

spell is insane

[frail veldt]

I've seen people drop it

Are they just fucking dumb?

Idgi

[random stirrup]

it's a pretty big dmg loss and most of the time ur not gonna die to casts anway

just play vdh and silence sigil xd

[frail veldt]

Porque no los dos though

Oh shit I just realized I got a change my flair now that I'm a kir gamer again

How do I do that again lol

[runic bough]

any NA outlaws wanna come to guild +12 DFC?

need dps

[celest stratus]

haven't played in ages, how annoying is KS to use in keys

[zealous plinth]

does the cudgel reset with vanish in boss fights too? or only for trash?

[tender wedge]

Only trash

[tender wedge]

There are a few bosses that it’s tough on

First boss rookery it’s borderline unplayable

[zealous plinth]

so like for momma its better to swap to capos?^^

[tender wedge]

Third boss workshop

[runic bough]

DAMNIT THESE TRINKETS DONT HAVE ANY PROC CHANCE THIS EXPANSION

[bold sphinx]

https://youtu.be/r75zBEonIro?si=gtqOk7YVvbqqU9oY&t=298 Nice ks, wp!

[tender wedge]

Yeah you’d swap to another weapon for any boss if optimising

[runic bough]

so tilting

[tender wedge]

That’s why I only have on use 😎

[celest stratus]

i like that the video is in 1080p but the clip is in 144p

i haven't read what the new tier does but im assuming these supercharger builds require it to work

also is muropaketti's RTB WA still good?

[flat needle]

Morning guys, whats the call for m+ atm, ho or kir? Feeling comfortable with both builds

[cinder relic]

Kir more aoe ho more st

kir harder to play, and requires ramp, chain pulls, not to die

Ho to me is just better based on those facts but if u wanna play KiR its also fine

[celest stratus]

hos unmad

[flat needle]

Thanks a lot

[runic bough]

i dont know how much longer i can do this

im about to go sin

cant stand ks

then I go fate and dmg handicapped

[remote pike]

xD

yeah ks got me fucked up

the amount of stress i put on healer "i might die here" "woops im gonna die" oh wait im fine

[flat needle]

I tried sin and for aoe its fine but in ST situations i was about to go full mental. giga boring

[runic bough]

should be better than ks at least

[flat needle]

Thats what i thought but it wasnt

[remote pike]

hekili just works so good for outlaw

used hekili whole expansion

the thought of playing without it is scary xD

[flat needle]

i was rolling to sin and had raid the next day. it was so overwhelmingly boring that i recrafted all my gear pieces in the break so i didnt have to suffer the second half of the raid at least

[storm drum]

assa is chill

outlaw is like a furry war or ret pala but more fun with less group utility lmao

havent tried sub since mop

[celest stratus]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[runic bough]

cinderbrew wipe

[blissful idol]

you used the forbidden ability

[vapid sundial]

I wonder how many months outlaw chat will nonstop complain about KS before the devs get the hint

Like I've said. Literally every time that ability is used chat here whines about it

[wintry solar]

We have to continually complain even during tiers we don't use it

[vapid sundial]

It's just interesting.

It's been attempted 4 times now since I've started playing.

And it was whined about each and every time.

You'd think someone would get the hint

[fathom bramble]

you can search killing spree in this discord and look at the oldest messages

the complaints are very similar to something you might've read in the past week

[runic bough]

They should rename this channel to removeks

[vapid sundial]

The only Time I enjoyed using ks was during prideful when the orbs came out

Bc I was trying to hit my teammates

[runic bough]

There is no benefit to using ks besides not dying

[vapid sundial]

To troll with mechanics.

[wintry solar]

Blizz is probably okay with how it is

[vapid sundial]

Use it during the charge in the mine dungeon

Rng where he goes

Maybe if we start trolling with it

Other people will start complaining

And bc it's other classes they'll see and understand

[fathom bramble]

this guy right here knew the future

[vapid sundial]

Crazy

I bet u they just saw that message

[leaden folio]

get deleted

[vapid sundial]

And were like

U know what

That's a good ass idea

[wintry solar]

I don't really have a preference over it being a finisher or not

[vapid sundial]

I want my buttons to feel nice to press.

That's all

[fathom bramble]

making it a finisher came with the random downside of making it last longer

and making the duration inconsistent

[vivid vessel]

That's solo I think

[vapid sundial]

Is it

Did he delete again

Got a bit

[vivid vessel]

Old solo

[vapid sundial]

Ahhh

I wanan see the messages I typed on my old discord here man

I had like

300k msg

in 2 years

LOL

[fathom bramble]

some of these older comments wanted KS to just be a finisher

no CD or anything

[vapid sundial]

[fathom bramble]

imagine being in KS like 40% of the fight

[vapid sundial]

[wintry solar]

That's funny

[vapid sundial]

Hey u could make breakfast

Mid raid

What's not to like

[fathom bramble]

the ancient suggestion

[vapid sundial]

I know one sex

Sec

Oh no

[wintry solar]

Gross

[fathom bramble]

here's a good one

[vapid sundial]

Why did it type it was fun

I*

I must've been trolling literally

Hmm.

I'm pretty sure it's bc I would use it and freak my group out with mechanics.

[runic bough]

trolling spree is a good name for it