yea but thats only pve
#pvp
potent pivot
grave basin
hes been this way since forever lol
fathom crag
i used to prefer sub but i swear now theres too many stops, piss micro cc or w/e
ppl do everything to stop you on dance
its so boring
potent pivot
hes been this way since forever lol
The game just hasn’t had “pvp specs” in like a decade
We’ve had multiple seasons where almost every spec in the game was good/viable
There’s no reason/excuse for balance to be this bad etc
quick temple
feel like they shifted stuff around cus a bad ADR/Cloud cover was too punishing
in pve, so they spread reduced fazed stacks and baked in 5% and said ah ez pvp nerf here
oh and idk bte i guess
all done
gusty hedge
quick temple
there really arent any pvp devs, just combat mech devs that look at the game holistically
are they interpretting data with any nuance
how can anyone that actually plays see what devouer does and put in the patch notes their burst is "a little" too high
gusty hedge
nahj
harsh kiln
I have a sneaky suspicion that this is blizzards scuffed take on trying to get more midseason participation, since alot of ppl get their rating and sit there untill the end of the season. With not inflating the mmr they might think "ppl cant sit their glad rank if they never reach it, so they have to keep playing to try get it"..
severe helm
LOL nahj
Epitome of a filthy sub main
Nahj can't conceptualize the idea of having to do a rotation while still doing pvp
topaz musk
@potent pivot - Sorry mate. I've had my days.
potent pivot
<@629463378250956810> - Sorry mate. I've had my days.
?
topaz musk
horse & water~
stoic spruce
Can't make em drink
gusty hedge
dark moon
Epitome of a filthy sub main
You make it sound like it's a bad thing
harsh kiln
Fast😅
analog tapir
well fast and fast
but i do need advice caus im loosing my shit when im going 1 vs 1 agasint a lock
harsh kiln
I dont think you win that 1v1 unless you have got all his cds and still have your trinket and cooldowns
But im no sub main either so dont take it as facts
mystic tundra
Pvpers can't type that coherently
stoic spruce
What we rerolling to?
UWoW Legion x100
gusty hedge
Pvpers can't type that coherently
also true
stoic spruce
We need someone like zac who got law aura buffed, but In Pvp
<:dead:93288839631...
You can't have a conversation about rogues on the forums
gusty hedge
You can't have a conversation about rogues on the forums
facts!
need a post like zacs with complied data and a crowd who agrees.
last part aint gonna happen
rough rock
UWoW Legion x100
I have fallen back into the dark side of Valorant
gusty hedge
i tried getting back into LOL, its not the same as it was 7 + years ago had to uninstall
dark moon
or how do i track enemy cds and defs?
minicc
dark moon
do u have a string import ?
no, im using the default one, just adjusted the icon size
there are addons here #pvp message
analog tapir
okok
spring bough
Can't make em drink
That dude forever scarred by notrickz comments 😂
stoic spruce
What did he say earlier?
I'm missing context. As far as I know, he just came out of the blue and said that lol
OH HES THE UNCLE
spring bough
I'm missing context. As far as I know, he just came out of the blue and said tha...
He is the dude trickz made the horse to water comment to the other day
stoic spruce
I missed that part
outer sky
but i do need advice caus im loosing my shit when im going 1 vs 1 agasint a lock
The most annoying thing is that sleep their pet can do every time you stun them
analog tapir
The most annoying thing is that sleep their pet can do every time you stun them
yeah pisses me off
analog tapir
The most annoying thing is that sleep their pet can do every time you stun them
yet they have the fucking audacity to complain about being focused in arena
vocal surge
but i do need advice caus im loosing my shit when im going 1 vs 1 agasint a lock
Just kill em faster than they can kill you
It sounds like a "git gud" response but no, that's the only way actually lol
dark kernel
It sounds like a "git gud" response but no, that's the only way actually lol
Actually true. 1v1 with lock is mash your damage and get it out ASAP and don't pump into defensives unless you already have to
Other than that it's just chicken with cooldowns and interrupts
spring bough
Just kill em faster than they can kill you
Git gud
hybrid palm
Midnight strategist done, I'm over for the season 😄
hybrid palm
Just in time for nerfs
Did on feral , no nerfs
quaint cedar
I didn't even get to do a last minute push before nerfs because I had family visiting all weekend
Praying outlaw is still playable after today
abstract stratus
im all about the dh hate train but is havoc underplayed only because devo is so broken or is havoc actually just not as good as other melee period?
quaint cedar
Idk. Maybe a bit of both?
dark kernel
I didn't even get to do a last minute push before nerfs because I had family vis...
I honestly don't think the nerf today is that massive
It's less than the last buffs that's for sure
quaint cedar
I honestly don't think the nerf today is that massive
Yeah. We were strong before the trickster buff. Just unsure about the bte nerf. Might struggle to kill stuff. But I don't think outlaw will be awful. It might still be strong, or might be very mid. Hard to tell rn.
warm fern
Why do most pvp people play full mastery when it says you have between 600-700 haste ? (As Sub Rogue)
glass isle
Why do most pvp people play full mastery when it says you have between 600-700 h...
its diff in pvp
dark kernel
Why do most pvp people play full mastery when it says you have between 600-700 h...
It's kind of a mixed bag. Haste lines up your secret tech with dance cooldown perfectly giving you a tech every single dance, but some people opt to for raw finisher damage
dark kernel
Oh holy shit I didn't realize outlaw did eat that bte nerf
That's a shit. Too bad they won't fix the bte talent lmao
quaint cedar
It’ll be fine
I think so too but I coped so hard in DF and TWW that I don't trust my own judgement anymore lol
warm fern
It's kind of a mixed bag. Haste lines up your secret tech with dance cooldown pe...
so its better to go full mastery in blitz RBG ?
quaint cedar
That's a shit. Too bad they won't fix the bte talent lmao
Yup and won't fix 0.8 modifier on cdr from restless blades either. Or preemptive manuaver still being nerfed for outlaw only
dark kernel
so its better to go full mastery in blitz RBG ?
People agree that it is
maiden gull
250k bte´s is to much for blizzard
so they hammer it
outlaw wont have near the pressure they had before and warris will get buffed
warm fern
People agree that it is
so i go full mastery, thx for answering
maiden gull
so it will become unplayable
and fatebound will be even worse
cant compete with trickster as it is
dark kernel
Yeah I think the largest crime coming is that with outlaw nerfs and the warrior buffs and after midnight these classes are interchangeable
They have identical cc now
maiden gull
every warrior lobby will eatr you alive
dark kernel
Only separating factor is damage
maiden gull
doesnt matter arms or fury
mages are even harder to kill now
game will be awful for rogues
sadly, had a good time for a few weeks
but the 15% bte nerf is completly over the rop
maiden gull
yeah
quick temple
during adr lol
maiden gull
but if u stack 2 of them u can do 100k dmg if both of them crit
u just have to be lucky that u get enough stacks before you die
quick temple
nvm jus landed a 70k idk pvp aura is weird
maiden gull
Yup and won't fix 0.8 modifier on cdr from restless blades either. Or preemptive...
even unnerfing that would not help much, since vanish and evasion are not on it anymorwe
maiden gull
nvm jus landed a 70k idk pvp aura is weird
70k is nothing
you cant even go full crit because energy regen is so fucked
quaint cedar
Yeah I think the largest crime coming is that with outlaw nerfs and the warrior ...
This is such a huge problem for Midnight in general. Every class is very samey and fills the same role. So everyone just plays whatever does the most damage. There's no unique utility anymore, every damage profile is the same. Why play something that is 5% worse?
maiden gull
This is such a huge problem for Midnight in general. Every class is very samey a...
ture and only mages have everthing
more invis than a rogue on lower cd
makes no sense
quaint cedar
Yeah
What's crazy is they bitched so much before Midnight came out
I legit thought mages got gutted from all their complaining
maiden gull
cloud cover nerf and 5% aura nerf would have been completly enoiugh
quaint cedar
Nope! Same OP kit as ever
maiden gull
but we can thank the people who play double outlaw in awc
maiden gull
fatebound will lack dps now
quaint cedar
Yeah legit fuck AWC. I hate it so much. It only exists for people to complain more
maiden gull
yeah and no one watches the shiwshow
it isnt even enjoyable
just gets classes nerfed for the normal players
funny thing ist now outlaw is nerfed and sub is shit, i have 2 geared rogues but cant play assa
because now i need mastery
quaint cedar
Right? I heard it had like 2k active viewers. But sure let's gut a spec for the 20 people that play in this tournament, playing 3v3 which no one cares about anymore, and with no one even watching anyways
maiden gull
2k viewers :D:D:D:D
so sad really, but blizzard will get it done that all people who enjoy the pvp in this game will quit
sometimes it seems they are even trying to force it
quaint cedar
Yeah pvp only gets worse and worse every expansion
maiden gull
because their shit kpi´s say so
quaint cedar
They keep trying to dumb it down to appeal to newbies while ruining what made it enjoyable to all of us in the first place
hybrid sapphire
good morning rogues what's the good news
maiden gull
thing is, midnight is done for the most devs and qa at blizz, they are doing the next addon already
just few AI generated balances changes here and there and thaths it
numbrs tuning won´t help much longer
quaint cedar
They've really put themselves in a hole because with current pvp and class design and kits being so similar the only thing that matters is defensives and damage so it's now literally impossible to have a healthy meta with lots of specs being played. It will always be largely one spec dominating
maiden gull
yeah but it not everyone has an ms effect and an stun and an incap, people start whining
gusty hedge
Alot of Rogue on Rogue hate too
quaint cedar
Burst always gets nerfed because it stomps noobs that can't press so every melee is a glorified warrior sustain bot. Or just shit like sub is now
spring bough
https://discord.com/channels/124169701881282560/316923682607857685/1501255182158...
Fuccckkkk
maiden gull
Just put cc back on 18 sec dr and shadow dance on a 30 sec cd problems solved
maiden gull
Burst always gets nerfed because it stomps noobs that can't press so every melee...
warri will be s tier now again, like always
easy to play
hybrid sapphire
whatever gives me cheap shot back 🥺
maiden gull
even crackshot was more fun than this shit
maiden gull
now we are just worse warriors
quaint cedar
warri will be s tier now again, like always
Idk how blizz thought warriors needed a buff their damage was already crazy. Going to be World of Warriorcraft now
spring bough
Still might play trick 🤷♂️
gusty hedge
even crackshot was more fun than this shit
molten hedge
Some test outlaw servers up go whack a dummy or sum shit 😂
maiden gull
28% less damage on your main dps ability during burst windows, not much to be tested 😄
ded
gusty hedge
just gotta play harder Apm hitting 1K+ today
quaint cedar
Well boys we had an amazing 2 weeks. Back to the bin we go.
quaint cedar
Time for warrior to be OP for the next 2 months
gusty hedge
i heard they wont do anymore tunin!? if true thats bs
quaint cedar
outlaw was good beforce 12.05
Yeah but wasn't that only like a week before 12.0.5? So we got 3 weeks lol
quaint cedar
Yeah I don't remember
I was still catching up on gear at the time because I was sick with a really bad flu for the entire start of the season
But yeah it felt good and we didn't need the trickster buff at all. And it ended up fucking us
quick temple
meh oh well, not being oppresive anymore doesnt mean dead imo
quaint cedar
Being "oppressive" was purely blizzard's own incompetence buffing a spec that was already good and then they nerfed it to worse than before said unnecessary buff
Outlaw probably not dead but certainly worse than it was before 12.0.5
gusty hedge
sub can be oppressive for weeks on end tho
quaint cedar
And mage which still hasn't received a single meaningful nerf since launch
How has mass invis still not gotten a cd increase?
gusty hedge
mass invis been tilting in ss
rough rock
How has mass invis still not gotten a cd increase?
Because we all agree it should be a arcane only thing
But they insist us arcane players should not exist.
Dumb ass orb build needs to die
quaint cedar
Yeah it should be. Arcane is so neglected. Haven't seen one in pvp in so long
Only mage spec that actually gets punished for eating a kick
rough rock
Nobody wants to play orb and why even bother when fire does burst better on a 45 second cooldown compared to 2
And frost does all the damage without cooldowns
rough rock
Bro what
maiden gull
just played against one who went 6:0 at 2,1k
quaint cedar
they dont need buffs
I think it's a design problem, not a damage problem
rough rock
That’s massively a you issue
maiden gull
killed the warri in 3 secs
rough rock
Losing 6-0 to a arcane mage should put you on a Que cooldown 😭
quaint cedar
Not an arcane player so idk but if you kick their poly they can't do shit. Frost you kick poly and they can still damage. Kick ray of frost and they can still blink/poly.
Arcane mainly has 1 spell school to work with and no additional utility over the other specs so yeah it might not be unplayable but it sucks in comparison to frost/fire
rough rock
Not an arcane player so idk but if you kick their poly they can't do shit. Frost...
Yup
That’s true
maiden gull
but blizzard acknowledged that and they got a dmg buff
thats how it works nowadays 😄
your class sucks: heres some more dmg
rough rock
Loool true
maiden gull
just lazy design
rough rock
15% of 0 is still 0
maiden gull
game is doomed
quaint cedar
lol yeah because fixing design problems is hard
rough rock
It’s kinda like how some sub and outlaw players prefer more buttons
quaint cedar
Way harder than telling Claude code to randomly assign % buffs and nerfs every week
maiden gull
because they dont care
maiden gull
they are at most 2 people working in classes rn
maybe just 1
its a pure cashcow busines
rough rock
This is what happens when you allow 1 millions positions for project managers and zero coders
quaint cedar
100% they have to be vibe coding with AI
quaint cedar
I work in the software dev industry and trust me it's everywhere right now and it's utter shit. But no one cares. Execs just want products pushed out faster
maiden gull
midnight is vibe coded
yeah me 2
working just fine is good eniugh because its cheap
sad
hybrid sapphire
didnt they replace all their french voice actors w AI lol
quaint cedar
Yeah it's going to be a maintenance nightmare for the entire industry in a few years
rough rock
Look I’m totally against ai in a lot of ways but I understand it was going to get rid of the cheap jobs anybody could do with a bootcamp
But the over reliance on it is killing so much shit now
quaint cedar
Yeah
maiden gull
especially when claude and the others will raise their prices to the moon
quaint cedar
AI being used as a tool is fine imo
But it's excessive rn
And being used with 0 regard for long term health of the project
rough rock
“Why do you have a 4gb memory leak”
“Why does your code have zero cpu cycle functions”
“Why do you need // for this simple function that anybody would know what it does”
maiden gull
you can clearly see in the patchnotes that know ones thinks a second thought about the changes
"balance the game - make no mistakes"
rough rock
I think I agree with what people were saying above
Just get rid of AWC at this point
hybrid sapphire
Computa, make is so rogue is less OP
maiden gull
they dont even take into consideration, that classes are op in certain setups
outlaw ist just oprresive with a mage
rough rock
That’s what I try to tell people
maiden gull
mages are the problem, not rogues
quaint cedar
“Why do you have a 4gb memory leak”
“Why does your code have zero cpu cycle fun...
My company makes us use AI now to dev faster and the amount of nonsense Claude will generate is insane. It will spit out 30 lines for something that I could fix with 10 lines
rough rock
My company makes us use AI now to dev faster and the amount of nonsense Claude w...
I’d be scared to see what it does with C++ or hell if it touched any assembly
spring bough
Yeah it's going to be a maintenance nightmare for the entire industry in a few y...
“Hey we know we fired you for AI but you need to come back and fix the AI”
maiden gull
but you need to work for less then the ai
quaint cedar
“Hey we know we fired you for AI but you need to come back and fix the AI”
My company just gutted the test department while also encouraging devs to use more AI 🫠
I'm sure that won't have any lasting consequences
hybrid sapphire
🫧 🪡
quaint cedar
I think I agree with what people were saying above
Just get rid of AWC at this...
It's so pointless because the same teams win anyways. I saw Kasu crying for weeks on X about RMP as if his team wouldn't get stomped by Echo regardless of the meta. Either delete AWC or make it a shuffle format since that's what 90% of pvp players play
outer sky
Anyone played? How bad does outlawl feel?
spring bough
Anyone played? How bad does outlawl feel?
Ima pretend like nothing happened
And just go about my day 😭
quick temple
yea fr lol
severe helm
Def no reason to play trickster
molten hedge
It's so pointless because the same teams win anyways. I saw Kasu crying for week...
Seeing him swap rmp and get rolled was cinema
Thinking you can fotm on the best rog in the game lmao
quaint cedar
Seeing him swap rmp and get rolled was cinema
Oh I want to see that now. Was it last cup?
spring bough
Def no reason to play trickster
🤷♂️
quick temple
bigger bullets
molten hedge
Oh I want to see that now. Was it last cup?
Yeahh
graceful ravine
maiden gull
can level a thrid to play assa
spring bough
Pistol shot build dead as hell
You hitting the dummy?
rough rock
Yeah
severe helm
fatebound is even worse
fatebound is def better than trickster now
by a lot
the bte nerf hurts trickster more
maiden gull
u lost 8% dmg on trickster
severe helm
and the cloud coverage nerf alone is a 12% directed nerf
its way more than 8 bro
trickster lost 17% damage total
maiden gull
in burst windows
maiden gull
overall yeah because of the duration
maiden gull
but its 1 stack less of 8% or?
severe helm
no
its the crit damage bonus
PS used to have 150% bonus crit damage
that is now only 50%
the flat damage bonus of cloud cover went from 18% to 12%
and the duration is shorter
AND bte nerf by 15%
AND
flat 5% nerf on top
maiden gull
wair what
maiden gull
where does it say taht with ps?
severe helm
probably like 20-25% in burst
severe helm
where does it say taht with ps?
fazed increases crit damage bonus of builders by 50%
rough rock
You hitting the dummy?
spring bough
Looks like a fatebound 2/2 dispatcher angle
vocal surge
was that supposed to be like that?
the crit damage was tied to the Fazed stack
spring bough
And back to double vanish
vocal surge
hence why with 3 Fazed debuffs, it became 150% crit damage
maiden gull
aaah understand
ty
k
k we wa are fucked
fatebound with 15% less bte dmg will be horrible
maiden gull
outlaw is giga fucked
spring bough
fatebound with 15% less bte dmg will be horrible
Fatebound likes dispatch more
severe helm
^
spring bough
2/2 dispatchers Inc
rough rock
Looks like a fatebound 2/2 dispatcher angle
yeah most im hitting with pistol is 25k
maiden gull
but you dispatch at 5 cp
severe helm
im aware
spring bough
coins go brrrtttt
severe helm
the dispatch itself doesnt hit that hard
vocal surge
Head Coins go brrrr
spring bough
We gambling today boys
gleaming sentinel
severe helm
war is going to be S+ tier noww I bet
spring bough
Fury could already dump dmg
spring bough
I’m kinda scared to go against fury now
maiden gull
after evasion its gg
rough rock
2/2 dispatcher. No KIR. No KS. Prob sleight. Rock that shit
not sure what to drop for slieght tbh
spring bough
Feel like the dmg gonna be unstoppable
gleaming sentinel
war is going to be S+ tier noww I bet
They would be pretty stoked if they knew how to read
rough rock
besides maybe acrobatic
maiden gull
imho acrobatic strikes sucks ass for pvp
spring bough
not sure what to drop for slieght tbh
Hook? lol
rough rock
my hook :(
maiden gull
auto attacks do shit
spring bough
my hook :(
Can u drop that for sleight or do u get point locked
gleaming sentinel
not sure what to drop for slieght tbh
Prob that 20% chance to refund talent i forgor
severe helm
imho acrobatic strikes sucks ass for pvp
they do like 10% of your overall
more as fatebound actually
and acro is a 30% buff to it
but its hard to drop anything else
1pt SD is prob close to acro
in value
vocal surge
idk why fb always felt like i get more refunds
Better combo point economy
spring bough
AUTO ATTACK KINGS
rough rock
sorry i meant 1000k
spring bough
thats without acrobatic too
You buggin…. Acro clears >>>>
rough rock
i cant lose my hook cd loool
wait we dont need prep now
i mean we werent running it with fb before
maiden gull
idk auto attacks are cool, but you want burst
vocal surge
Coup de Grace --> Pistol Shot --> Coup de Grace
maiden gull
the crit damage was tied to the Fazed stack
where ist this stated btw?
severe helm
oh gotcha
so you just held dispatch for how long
were you just spamming builders at max cp
rofl
the fuck
vocal surge
I actually didn't hold
main agate
Hey guys. I give shit damage in solo que. Is there some trick to manage combo points. I've tried follow the 6+combo points in shadowdance, but is it different outside og shadowdance?
#subtlety
vocal surge
I just Killing Spree'd before my 1st Coup
to get it on CD
Coup'd, pistol shot proc'd Flashing Steel (Trickster talent)
and got Coup back immediately
spring bough
i cant lose my hook cd loool
Are u able to drop it or does it lock u to higher up in the tree?
rough rock
Are u able to drop it or does it lock u to higher up in the tree?
locks me
cause i dont use deft
severe helm
I never run hook cd
rough rock
so i just dumped prep
severe helm
always short blind
spring bough
Guess 1/2 dispatcher if we want sleight then
rough rock
severe helm
ye
rough rock
doing this rn
spring bough
Feel like with fatebound fuck the rolls ima just do 2/2 dispatcher for dmg
rough rock
we all ran no prep with fb before
spring bough
No we didn’t lol
rough rock
WHAT
spring bough
I wanna test out some degen stacking
Are u tryna make trickster work
molten hedge
Apparently warr buffs didn’t go in. Maybe outlaw nerfs didn’t idk
spring bough
Apparently warr buffs didn’t go in. Maybe outlaw nerfs didn’t idk
That’ll get hotfixed rq
molten hedge
I’m sure
Was just letting you know in case you’re testing and shit seems better than expected 💀
maiden gull
the crit damage was tied to the Fazed stack
where was stated that they change this?
rough rock
Was just letting you know in case you’re testing and shit seems better than expe...
its def nerfed
potent pivot
where was stated that they change this?
In the patch notes..
spring bough
magnitude of secondary effects?
Yes
maiden gull
lmao
spring bough
That means no more 5% dmg reduction stacks either
spring bough
So we just get 5% no more 15% or 10 if they left it
For PvP. Yes probably
Definitely*
rough rock
i will say the bte nerf doesnt seem like it did anything so maybe that didnt go through?
maiden gull
fine it what matchups?
spring bough
Idk anything?
rough rock
i will say the bte nerf doesnt seem like it did anything so maybe that didnt go ...
okay this time i got like 2 refunds so maybe it did
potent pivot
Fatebound will be fine
rough rock
no reason to play outlaw over assa
gun
spring bough
<:COPIUM:876489704663564298>
Leave me alone 😭
maiden gull
but loosing all the time is not fun
spring bough
okay this time i got like 2 refunds so maybe it did
BTE ded. Dispatch 👑
rough rock
i feel like losing sleight will hurt
so ig drop acro for prep?
the auto attack damage was pretty close
thats not counting having to chase people around
quick temple
you will not notice no acrobatic
rough rock
feel like ive always ran it but yeah the auto overall wasnt that much different
ill rock without it for a bit
spring bough
Acro for fatebound >>>>>
rough rock
hey at least we can go double vanish again
spring bough
Maybe they are in and the buffs were just shit
potent pivot
Unfortunately warriors would have to do math in order to know if they were in or not
spring bough
Guess the world will never know
potent pivot
hey at least we can go double vanish again
You always could though 
molten hedge
They’re saying the warrior buffs “aren’t in”?
mild lynx
bliz intern prob forgot to add 'does not affect pvp' for warr buffs
spring bough
@cobalt pewter can you confirm warriors were forgotten
halcyon timber
Unfortunately warriors would have to do math in order to know if they were in or...
Warriors when asked about math
potent pivot
Why do most pvp people play full mastery when it says you have between 600-700 h...
It depends on what bracket you focus on playing
spring bough
The math maths itself
cobalt pewter
<@269709440146604032> can you confirm warriors were forgotten
i think they in now
potent pivot
so its better to go full mastery in blitz RBG ?
You still want a bit over 200 haste bare minimum
warm fern
You still want a bit over 200 haste bare minimum
thx
abstract stratus
these crate farms for conq are fucking mind numbing
outer sky
idk if outlaw changes are even in either
Shhh
maiden gull
shhh
maiden gull
is pistol shot nerfed by 100%?
potent pivot
the crit damage talent isn't stacking anymore
maiden gull
no more 150k pistol shots? 🙁
maiden gull
idk if this was intended in the first way tbh 😄
abstract stratus
rip my granny she got hit by a bazooka
maiden gull
i mean 150% additonal crit damage
potent pivot
maiden gull
comon
potent pivot
fatebound is def the play now
potent pivot
boreal briar
Good. 4 hooks was way more fun anyways
severe helm
Fatebound only like 6
severe helm
4 hooks is huge yeah
boreal briar
No need for KS with fatebound yeah?
rough rock
shhhhh
potent pivot
potent pivot
maiden gull
exactly the build im running
spring bough
Imp BTE 🤮
potent pivot
SC with fb...
supercharger always been the best pick
maiden gull
why wouldnt u run imp bte? :D:D
potent pivot
especially without the crit dmg multiplier from trickster
maiden gull
with supercharge rits the only burst we have
spring bough
Bro don’t get us hotfixed on day one of nerfs god damnit
cobalt pewter
Hey outlaw mains if you ever want to become a grown man and achieve a godlike physique consider playing Arms Warrior.
maiden gull
i hit 250k bte´s on mages
spring bough
Hey outlaw mains if you ever want to become a grown man and achieve a godlike ph...
I heard fury is better
rough rock
Hey outlaw mains if you ever want to become a grown man and achieve a godlike ph...
no thanks i like doing more than pve in mid all day
maiden gull
just stack 20 zero in and send them
potent pivot
Hey outlaw mains if you ever want to become a grown man and achieve a godlike ph...
i already am so plz kindly i request that u stfu :)
gusty hedge
shoulda got that menacing rush nerf reverted too
potent pivot
rough rock
supercharger always been the best pick
idk double vanish since we lost tankiness is too hard to pass up
in shuffle at least
potent pivot
idk double vanish since we lost tankiness is too hard to pass up
we can play vers talent
as fb
if we want
proven kayak
Why every melee streamer was leveling fury warrior 🤔
spring bough
we can play vers talent
Def the play
quaint cedar
No double vanish seems crazy to me idk how you guys play without that and subterfuge
spring bough
I got myself close to 20% crit
spring bough
Changed my gems and enchants to crit 
maiden gull
no
potent pivot
giga trolling
gusty hedge
Sounds horrific tbh
i will test for ya on davy when i swap from trickster 
proven kayak
Daaaamn man outlaw is dead ☠️ (I play in Eu)
maiden gull
0.1 ms less gcd does a shit
molten hedge
spring bough
0.1 ms less gcd does a shit
What about 0.8s GCD with ADR??
spring bough
……
rough rock
mastery the move guys
maiden gull
Zero in + imp BTE
maiden gull
kk
teal plank
If I want to have all 3 specs viable on my rogue alt, can I get 1 sword and 1 dagger when I get the conquest weapon achievment? or do I need double daggers?
potent pivot
If I want to have all 3 specs viable on my rogue alt, can I get 1 sword and 1 da...
thats fine but you won't really be able to gear all 3 until conquest is uncapped
you will also have to use an honor dagger offhand
for sub/assa
you can't use a sword offhand for them
teal plank
sub needs double dagger too?
quaint cedar
You're gonna struggle with stats because assa wants mastery
teal plank
that's sad
potent pivot
sub needs double dagger too?
yes
playing sub without double dagger is giga omega trolling nowadays
proven kayak
i think this guy might like panda female hunters
pastel burrow
Legend
molten hedge
Magnus just got gapped
spring bough
venruki playing assa rn
Why isn’t he playing WW or mage
spring bough
Magnus just got gapped
Outlaw saved 🙌
spring bough
What an epic name
main agate
Guys do you always go to 6 combo points before eviscerate? In pvp
potent pivot
Guys do you always go to 6 combo points before eviscerate? In pvp
yes
molten hedge
<:COPIUM:876489704663564298>
I think that guy is playing trickster too he just KS’d
spring bough
I think that guy is playing trickster too he just KS’d
Damn so fatebound gonna be doing even more dmg than that 👀
WE ARE SO BACK
molten hedge
They’re at 2300 mmr lol he’s trolling
potent pivot
Damn so fatebound gonna be doing even more dmg than that 👀
no
molten hedge
The disarms are very questionable
runic laurel
Confirmed outlaw not ticklemonster <@629463378250956810>
That details screenshot is all the evidence I need, I’ll be sure to ping warcraftdevs right away and let them know
molten hedge
@fathom crag Trickz wanted to apologize and let yk outlaw is insane 🤣
potent pivot
<@1382782685864398908> Trickz wanted to apologize and let yk outlaw is insane 🤣
misinformation and trolling are against the rules
molten hedge
That details screenshot is all the evidence I need, I’ll be sure to ping warcraf...
All the games before mag was doing 58k dps lol
potent pivot
boreal briar
I feel like this rogue is purposely ragebaiting him
quick temple
lmao
quick temple
killed him the most BM fashion poss lol
runic laurel
All the games before mag was doing 58k dps lol
Warrior must have gotten a 50% nerf between those games then it’s the only answer
spring bough
17% OVERALL damage nerf to trickster
How is fatebound gonna be doing less overall when it got 5% and trick got 17%???
potent pivot
any streams
nah
just magnusz losing in 2s
and broadcasting that outlaw is still the best melee in the game
cuz he's butthurt a 30k dps outlaw beat him
potent pivot
How is fatebound gonna be doing less overall when it got 5% and trick got 17%???
because that is just incorrect information you numbskull
the -17% dps comes from us going back fatebound
trickster is only down 7-8%
quaint cedar
So is outlaw not ded?
rough rock
hes about to fight another outlaw
potent pivot
fatebound was 10% behind trickster
so now its more like 1.5-2% behind
add in the -7% from the -5% aura and bte nerfs
trickster is down like 15% and fatebound puts us around -17% from where we WERE yesterday
spring bough
Too much math
outer sky
trickster is down like 15% and fatebound puts us around -17% from where we WERE ...
Wait trickster is still better?
severe helm
How is fatebound gonna be doing less overall when it got 5% and trick got 17%???
It won't
potent pivot
Wait trickster is still better?
by like 1-2% if you take KS and play perfectly
its just not worth playing
outer sky
K so fatebound it is
outer sky
Plus fatebound had quad hook
rough rock
"outlaw is not a fair class"
rough rock
LOOOOL
finite widget
outlaw always counters war in 2s lol
quaint cedar
Lmao why is this guy whining about 2s balance
outer sky
So is outlaw bad or what?
spring bough
So is outlaw bad or what?
No
molten hedge
Giga S+ tier
potent pivot
So is outlaw bad or what?
yep
rough rock
Warrior players when pressing 1-2 1-2 1-2 doesnt win him the game: 
gleaming sentinel
No hamstring or howl: “this guy can just outrun my stun”
quick temple
rogue is sprinting for free too
molten hedge
Ppl in AWC doing 20-30k dps a lot
quaint cedar
lol this guy is crazy butthurt
molten hedge
Maybe it’s a Trimaz angle outlaw only melee that can catch mage
potent pivot
Ppl in AWC doing 20-30k dps a lot
what
molten hedge
what
I watched all of the AWC and there was lots of games ppl did 20-30k dps full geared granted a lot of it was rmp mirrors
A lot was 30-35k dps
spring bough
rough rock
lol this guy is crazy butthurt
between this guy and omnivore idk whos a bigger cry baby
omnivore giga cringe tho
quaint cedar
between this guy and omnivore idk whos a bigger cry baby
Yeah tbh this guy is hard to listen to
rough rock
alright who is this
potent pivot
A lot was 30-35k dps
quaint cedar
He presses shockwave while still disarmed for 3 seconds then complains that he can't connect to anything 5 seconds later 🤣
spring bough
Trickz can u stream outlaw later so we can get a feel for what the avg dps should be in solo / 3s
rough rock
i love how hes bitching about pres....while playing with a pres
gleaming sentinel
i love how hes bitching about pres....while playing with a pres
Wow is complaining about the game at any given time
That is the meta
rough rock
spring bough
It’s so over 😭
quaint cedar
Idk why he's taking 2s so seriously anyways bracket has been a joke for years
potent pivot
Trickz can u stream outlaw later so we can get a feel for what the avg dps shoul...
why don't u just q
rough rock
throw a dev dh in there and that rogue doing half damage xD
molten hedge
Gonna send you guys a clipped SS of my dps showing with only my dps after cleaving dk and bm
spring bough
I’m at work 😭
potent pivot
Gonna send you guys a clipped SS of my dps showing with only my dps after cleavi...
i will ban
u
pwomise
molten hedge
🤣
rough rock
i imagine trickster is still better in 2s
potent pivot
i imagine trickster is still better in 2s
prob
spring bough
According to the napkin math trickster is better still
potent pivot
depending on what u face
rough rock
FB def feels so much better
spring bough
According to Mewo fatebound is better
potent pivot
According to Mewo fatebound is better
mewo is dumb
rough rock
well time to do crates
potent pivot
idk why he said that absolute bs
potent pivot
doesn't even play rogue
spring bough
oh wait shit we have to do trinket
Already did
potent pivot
molten hedge
According to Mewo fatebound is better
Pls don’t say mewos name unless you have 2+ R1s
molten hedge
Pls put some respect on my name Im a multi elite
rough rock
Already did
damn im only missing feet and trinket
spring bough
Wait does strategist count as a multi holder
molten hedge
Probably but I don’t BG
spring bough
Cool got two of those. Gonna get a third this weekend
potent pivot
nothing about the changes would make that different in pvp
outer sky
I think if you play the 1 hour tricks hero talent then Thick as Thieves should also last 1 hour
potent pivot
Yeah gl with that one bud
spring bough
I think if you play the 1 hour tricks hero talent then Thick as Thieves should a...
That doesn’t work like that lol
potent pivot
Let’s just make rogue bring a free zen spheres
Surely no one will cry about that right
spring bough
While they are at it. Can they separate cheap and kidney’s DRs like it was back in vanilla
Picturing the tears of people being locked for 9 seconds 😂
outer sky
While they are at it. Can they separate cheap and kidney’s DRs like it was back ...
Rogue stuns just shouldn't DR at all. I mean its the "control" class come on
fathom crag
apparently rogue still doing good damage
thats good to hear
but 2s kinda irrelevant
lime oar
cringe from a cringe spec
potent pivot
Is this rage bait? lol
Maybe not
I think playing it perfectly at a very high level has its intricacies
spring bough
Ik the post about pve but got damn it’s 3 buttons lol
fathom crag
i feel like they lost to that outlaw pres team cus the pres is just pumping everyone
potent pivot
I think with the way it’s meta works it’s hard to play it “perfectly”
fathom crag
pres dmg is crazy
spring bough
I think ima go straight to trickster when I get home
spring bough
I think with the way it’s meta works it’s hard to play it “perfectly”
Yeah mechanics can fuck a star and boom 5 sec cooldown and ur hurting lol
spring bough
pres dmg is crazy
Their CC is crazier
Flying stuns. Flying roots
CC protection too
potent pivot
I think it genuinely just looks good in 2s cuz KS does decent in pure ST
and warr can't exactly use cc to stop KS
sub vs law in 2s law prolly just flops
etc
spring bough
Sub Aent got nothing on law
gilded gulch
lowkey feel like rogue v rogue outlaw has it the worst
😭
me kidney kbing fotm outlaws last week and watching them trinket vanish and die to sd
has been funny
outer sky
Assa buffs when
spring bough
Bro why we hating on outlaw rn 😭
potent pivot
Bro why we hating on outlaw rn 😭
not hating
i just can't stand to see people try and say "its fine guys! the spec is still good!"
lets all eat shit and tell each other it tastes good going down
like cmon
spring bough
lets all eat shit and tell each other it tastes good going down
We play outlaw we always eat shit lmao
quaint cedar
i just can't stand to see people try and say "its fine guys! the spec is still g...
Well as someone else said earlier not being the best =/= bad
Personally idc if outlaw isn't the #1 melee I just want it to feel good and fun to play. Which means not being shit of course. But doesn't have to be OP either
potent pivot
Well as someone else said earlier not being the best =/= bad
ye i mean i agree
but when nerfs are too big
i'm not going to pretend everything is fine
quaint cedar
Yeah that's fair
potent pivot
i was 100% expecting trickster/cloud cover to get fixed
and that would've been fine
but adding on -5% and -15% bte is ridiculous imo
iirc this is the biggest nerf to any spec all season
besides the random ass MM emergency hotfix
quaint cedar
Agreed. The trickster buff wasn't needed to begin with. Nerfing bte feels like overkill. And just weird, like why bte specifically?
quaint cedar
Yeah that was the biggest insult
potent pivot
Agreed. The trickster buff wasn't needed to begin with. Nerfing bte feels like o...
i think because they finally "FIXED" imp bte
imp bte now adds .5 crit dmg
quaint cedar
Idk man MW was played in like 90% of games for the first two months and was getting lighter nerfs than outlaw did, feels bad
potent pivot
yep
quaint cedar
i think because they finally "FIXED" imp bte
Oh fr? It got fixed today?
potent pivot
i think they should have fixed trickster and left it there for a week
potent pivot
Oh fr? It got fixed today?
last week i think
they fixed it on TR first
from what whaazz said
quaint cedar
Oh interesting. So do we take it again now?
quaint cedar
Tbh I'm hoping to not play supercharger. I think rogue feels bad without subterfuge and 2 vanishes. Especially with vanish off CDR for outlaw
potent pivot
i mean you can play vanish if you want
ik i won't unless i specifically need it for a comp
charger feels p good
severe helm
outlaw always counters war in 2s lol
Def not lol
Just a matter of tuning and what healer the rogue has
molten hedge
18k dps
I just watched my friend at 2100 with an outlaw in lobby all melee lobby and he did 20k dps I stg he didnt press blade flurry once
potent pivot
I just watched my friend at 2100 with an outlaw in lobby all melee lobby and he ...
even if he didn't 20k dps ST is pretty horrid
potent pivot
<@629463378250956810> WHAT AM I READING
bro the wow community is fucking clueless about specs they don't play lmao
fathom crag
isnt parry same as evasion but even better
potent pivot
potent pivot
isnt parry same as evasion but even better
think so
spring bough
Why the F is everyone hating on rogues lately
Twitch streamers just stoking nonexistent fires
quick temple
isnt parry same as evasion but even better
you cant parry ranged attacks
quaint cedar
From watching that guy for a bit I'm convinced he bought his rating dude seems so clueless
fathom crag
and u cant evasion ranged attack either
potent pivot
yes you can
?
fathom crag
you can press it vs casters as a defensive thats my point
fathom crag
😂
quick temple
my bad for not bein clear
quick temple
i think its hard to compare 1v1 because of feint
fathom crag
feint op for sure
quick temple
and you can't disarm to prevent evasion
fathom crag
not that much on outlaw tho but still good y
proven kayak
Why the F is everyone hating on rogues lately
That’s always happening especially first season of each exp
rugged jewel
Have they considered giving outlaw a buff if you have the Bloodsail Admiral title?
quick temple
yea preemptive maneuvers shouldnt be nerfed for outlaw without float
but ppl would lose their minds
rugged jewel
https://tenor.com/view/excited-listening-go-on-jon-stewart-gif-11365765162220807...
It just seems like it should have already been done
gusty hedge
It just seems like it should have already been done
now we're leaning toward cowboys
potent pivot
Wait do the other specs have a bigger preemptive maneuvers DR????
how do you not know this what
gusty hedge
wait till trade post cowboy mog comes in, tumbleweeds gonna be the new trend
quaint cedar
Yup another leftover TWW nerf that doesn't make sense anymore but will never ever be removed
rugged jewel
now we're leaning toward cowboys<:garf_sit:1334889429449314456>
I’m your huckleberry
fathom crag
Wait do the other specs have a bigger preemptive maneuvers DR????
sub / assa are literally immortal if they pre feint a stun
molten hedge
Laros lobby
With an outlaw
2 Warrs and frost mage
Had to let Laros know outlaw least tanky
He scoffed
severe helm
sub / assa are literally immortal if they pre feint a stun
Well that's fucking dumb
fathom crag
this was needed back in war within because outlaw used to CDR feint
severe helm
Blizz is so fucking dumb I swear to God
severe helm
Shit tier developers I swear
silent linden
So which spec should I focus on after reset? (Im EU)
molten hedge
2 for lumberjack lmaooo
outer sky
Wait do the other specs have a bigger preemptive maneuvers DR????
This has been pointed out a number of times even during conversations you were an active participant in
potent pivot
So which spec should I focus on after reset? (Im EU)
just pick one
silent linden
just pick one
Frost mage 😂
potent pivot
ok
severe helm
This has been pointed out a number of times even during conversations you were a...
Who are you
potent pivot
Who are you
he's not lying
i stg
idk how u could possibly not know about this
because i stg we've talked about it
unless ur just trolling
outer sky
<:garf_sit:1334889429449314456>
F
molten hedge
Me, a 2100 outlaw reroller, will show bootyguru how to pump on outlaw
potent pivot
outlaw went 1-5 and was bottom dps almost every round
spring bough
Who are you
U were arguing w some dude about feint last night ?? 
molten hedge
U were arguing w some dude about feint last night ?? <a:waitwhatspin:48008065179...
Mewo is right he’s a poly
outer sky
The outlaw nerfs were actually bigger than the buffs it got to make their damage what it was until this morning lmao
And they didnt even revert the Menacing Rush nerf to compensate
What a meme
severe helm
Mewo is right he’s a poly
'see he gets it
molten hedge
The outlaw nerfs were actually bigger than the buffs it got to make their damage...
Those buffs were PvE only or you talking about something else
severe helm
U were arguing w some dude about feint last night ?? <a:waitwhatspin:48008065179...
yeah that was about the outlaw level of it, I thought they nerfed the other two to match outlaw
ngl nerf assa/sub preemptive maneuvers
extra 40% is dummy broken
spring bough
They should just revert it and make outlaw a god again
molten hedge
That’s what he was talking about
molten hedge
extra 40% is dummy broken
Pls don’t make me @ him
spring bough
We don’t need those two agreeing on rogue nerfs 🤦♂️
molten hedge
His ears are burning rn
He’s looking at discord channels
Wondering who is shitting on him
spring bough
still slappin in bgs
Those dev nerfs really hit them hard huh
molten hedge
I watched a dev just do 40-50k dps
spring bough
It’s “fine”