pvp

[jaunty osprey]

and fan of knives

enough

[outer sky]

I highly doubt that's the problem I press that almost every global but maybe

[jaunty osprey]

Idk man

It likely is

Not much I can say without watching a vod

[outer sky]

I played a lobby with Val yesterday and he said I was doing everything right

[jaunty osprey]

Singular Focus pumps, idk what to say

does more than SBS or close to it

[outer sky]

Not for me

[jaunty osprey]

Yeah, like I said

you're doing something wrong

Whether you want to believe it or not

you're playing wrong

[outer sky]

I don't ever let CT fall off

[jaunty osprey]

that doesn't mean you're not playing wrong

get me a vod of you winning a shuffle

and I might be able to spot

a lot of things done wrong

[outer sky]

The whole lobby?

[jaunty osprey]

yes

[outer sky]

Ok

[jaunty osprey]

don't get a losing lobby

in a losing lobby, it's so easy to point out how things could be done different

in a winning lobby, I can point out how things could be done BETTER

[outer sky]

Yeah good point

[loud ember]

we got any idea when the season ends?

[jaunty osprey]

some time in feb

[loud ember]

fair

[potent pivot]

couple months away for sure

nothing concrete

[loud ember]

2100 rn really want to break 2400

thats like a long term goal of mine

[potent pivot]

we know we're getting plunderstorm start/end before s2

[loud ember]

got my first 2100 last season

[jaunty osprey]

what rating are you at now?

This season is quite good to get it

ahh just saw 2100

[loud ember]

yeah 2118

[spring bough]

gotta log on all the chars and get all the gifts and hopefully get these illusions lol

[jaunty osprey]

also @outer sky every time u consume a stack of mark, step CD is reduced by 3s and the mark damage itself

so still beneficial to just press ur ambush once

even if ur singular focus damage isnt pumping

[outer sky]

yes that's honestly why I keep doing it

the step CDR is nice

still think we need a 3rd charge though

@jaunty osprey when you say a "winning lobby" do you mean 4-2 or better?

or do you want like a 6-0 or 5-1

[jaunty osprey]

any

5-1 is probably best

4-2 IF it isn't a dps 0-6 works

[wet crown]

How bad would it be if I dived into rbgs with crafted gear, a 639 vers weapon and pvp trinkets

[potent pivot]

like 613 ilvl crafted gear?

you'll probably get stomped in most cases

[jaunty osprey]

@outer sky

im watching ur current lobby

[potent pivot]

why are you watching that asshole

[fiery gorge]

Why was it so bad (skipped Legion so idk what was there)

[potent pivot]

[fiery gorge]

But many ppl I know praise Legion for some reason

[jaunty osprey]

f

[potent pivot]

(i'm not talking about zicore)

[jaunty osprey]

i know

[potent pivot]

ofc

[jaunty osprey]

cause meep stopped streaming

and i dont wanna watch foxy

[potent pivot]

i can't stand this guy fr

[jaunty osprey]

rather him than supatease

this is perfect game

see

1000000 things

that can be done differently despite winning

[outer sky]

Of course you watched that one

I recorded it

[jaunty osprey]

@outer sky deathstalker's mark - not applied every round and when it falls off - you dont even press it when you vanish, you also never press blind

also your opener is sketch

double cheap shot both dps and garrote rupture them both

then kidney and garrote the healer

[outer sky]

metaphors?

[jaunty osprey]

ya

[outer sky]

any advice for when the match actually gets going

[potent pivot]

yeh

[jaunty osprey]

press blind

your vanishes are getting such low value

because

you vanish to get damage on dps

and still have a blind up

but arent sending on healer

if he trinkets blind

[potent pivot]

i'd 1000% rather watch supa

[jaunty osprey]

you can kidney shot him

[potent pivot]

i can't stand meta lmao

[jaunty osprey]

since you vanish, you're cheap shotting dps anyway

[outer sky]

So here's my thought process

Tell me why it's wrong

Vanish=big DoTs, blind=remove DoTs. So I dont like to pair the 2 since blinding the healer clears the big DoTs I could get on him from a vanish

[jaunty osprey]

well

95% of the game

you didnt even have dots on the healers

just the two dps

lol

and that's also partly because

your opener is rough

[outer sky]

I used to have a WA that tracked that shit maybe I need to find it again

[jaunty osprey]

you cheapshot -> ambush or garrote -> and then you KIDNEY the other dps

why not just double cheapshot both dps when they're stacked

and dot them both

and then send a garrote x2 -> rupture -> garrote -> whatever -> kidney

on the healer

[outer sky]

So you sap heals, double cheap dps, DoT them, kindye healer, dot healer?

[jaunty osprey]

yeah

get ramping on everyone

0 point in

[outer sky]

Ok so fix the opener and blind more, anything else?

[jaunty osprey]

that's mainly it, and your mark

priority isnt there yet

vs bm hunter when u vanished u never pressed ambush at all

that's 10% damage vs bm hunter

you can press through turtle

[outer sky]

I thought i didnt need to if mark is already on someone else

[jaunty osprey]

too

it wasnt

on others

i dont think

but yeah the reason why i keep mentioning the cloak while healer isnt CCd thing is similar to your openers

you're wasting your opener if the healer isnt CCd

they can outheal assa rogue damage if you dont cc them

and also they can keep you up if they arent cc'd (no need to cloak)

[outer sky]

idk man i've legit died with my healer free a disgusting amount of times and not even in late dampening.

[jaunty osprey]

like you were sending your garrote on healer near the end of your kindey on the 2nd dps

[outer sky]

what if you don't get the sap in the opener

warrior leaps in

etc

[jaunty osprey]

double cheap dps always

get your bleeds up on them

garrote and kidney the enemy healer

[outer sky]

arite

[jaunty osprey]

send blinds early, force trinkets or CDs

that way if u kidney healer on later stages of the game if u vanish cheap other dps u can just win

[wet crown]

Naw, mythic rocking 636 minimum every slot

[potent pivot]

probably fine then but if you're lacking vers you're gonna feel it

idk if you'll even get invited to actual rbg's

with that

[outer sky]

It literally just occurred to me that it was Metaphors in the last lobby I did

Like I knew that but I didn't internalize it or whatever

Why was he so trash

Bro trinketed a pet stun then got trapped anyway and our DH just died while he sat a trap

Like trinket>grounding

[wet crown]

I said rbgs but I really meant just blitz.

[potent pivot]

yeah idk, you can give it a shot

it's pretty easy to get full bloody token gear for 636 ilvl with vers on it

from wpvp, WQs, sparks of war weekly, etc

[wet crown]

ye, I'll just work on that

kinda just wanna get 1800 and bounce lol

[potent pivot]

i think shuffle or 2s is the fastest way

blitz is really slow for rating, can be easy tho

[upbeat plaza]

I need this one

right?

[lean cloud]

I’ll continue this here. On Murlok.io, you can filter your search based on your spec, your hero spec, what game mode, and if you are looking at a specific player or what a majority of players at a certain rating use. It will show talents, stat priority, gear, enchants, embellishments and gems I think

There might be better resources, but that’s what I use

[potent pivot]

yes, for the most part. something that has to be kept in mind when using a site like murlok, is that it's only showing you those players' Armories. so not everything will always be 100% correct, especially regarding brackets and whatnot.

you might see someone that happens to be in the top 50 of outlaw, in full vers/mastery gear just because they logged out after queuing some sub or assa.

[potent pivot]

if you're spending your 2 free conquest weapon tokens, yes

[upbeat plaza]

ty ❤️

[potent pivot]

one of the last things we do is replace those crit/vers daggers with crafted vers/mastery daggers

but since you have to spend conquest to buy the heraldries to do that, it's best saved for one of you very last upgrades

[lean cloud]

Good information

[upbeat plaza]

what if i have 9/10 heraldries?

[potent pivot]

it's mostly more important to upgrade the ilvl of all of your gear to 639 before crafting new daggers

[potent pivot]

the free 9 heraldries are typically better spent on other stuff first

rings and neck, or other crafted pieces we use

so you can also get embellishments and sockets going

[upbeat plaza]

rings are the best?

for start

[potent pivot]

what i usually do when gearing a fresh char

is craft rings and neck

and i use bloody token gear for all my armor slots

then replace that with conquest gear/crafted conq gear as i go

gotta make sure you put Focusing Lens embellishment x2 on whatever you craft

then work on getting at least 2 sockets

1 socket for your -5% damage in stuns pvp gem

1 socket for a mastery gem so your Lens will proc

[upbeat plaza]

tysm!

[waxen meteor]

SP stealing pvp skill talent is so good against mage lol

[upbeat plaza]

kinda naked

🤏

[potent pivot]

yeah, its all good

everyone starts at some point

make sure you do the Sparks of War weekly quest

[potent pivot]

any world quests that reward 500 bloody tokens

etc

[upbeat plaza]

almost done

[potent pivot]

check murlok.io

[waxen meteor]

blood tokens are fastest way to gear up now

[potent pivot]

to see what items to buy or craft with conquest

[upbeat plaza]

but i dont understand, do i need to wait till daily quests reset?

[waxen meteor]

and some pieces like boot, you can use tier convert

so it goes to a really good piece

[potent pivot]

if there's no bloody token world quests, then yeah you have to wait

they don't spawn everyday

google Sparks of War quest

make sure you do that every week

[potent pivot]

yerrr

[upbeat plaza]

i mean local quests

[waxen meteor]

not only this

this is weekly

[upbeat plaza]

i dont have quests in r. deeps anymore

[waxen meteor]

there are random world pvp quests pop at daily basis

some one of them have reward = 500 blood token

it fasten your process by a lot

[potent pivot]

the world pvp world quests rotate daily

they don't always reward 500 bloody tokens

[waxen meteor]

yeah like this one, if you are in NA, it's a 500 bloody token one

[upbeat plaza]

ok

[waxen meteor]

don't limit only at single map

it's the weekly map

[potent pivot]

the one at the bottom is a pvp world quest

[waxen meteor]

but pvp quests are NOT only there

[upbeat plaza]

but what about quests like this

[potent pivot]

they literally have swords

on the icon

[upbeat plaza]

not only there?

[potent pivot]

those will give 100 bloody tokens

[waxen meteor]

This one is also 500 blood token

[upbeat plaza]

but i need ringing deeps

[waxen meteor]

you can go to other maps, like notrickz just showed

[potent pivot]

any world quest

will complete Sparks

if you're in war mode

[waxen meteor]

that is just a weekly quest.....

[potent pivot]

you can also loot the purple dirt piles

[waxen meteor]

you earn blood token NOT ONLY from weekly

[upbeat plaza]

on any location?

sheesh

[potent pivot]

in ringing deeps

[upbeat plaza]

my brain is melting already

I can get 500 tokens with daily quest

[waxen meteor]

too much eating

[potent pivot]

yes you're getting confused because there's 2 discussions going on at once

...

[upbeat plaza]

Yesss

This quest is only for tokens

[potent pivot]

there is 1 weekly quest per week

[upbeat plaza]

but i need 100 sparks

[potent pivot]

ye

world quests are daily

[potent pivot]

that's a world quest

[upbeat plaza]

i just need to wait for reset?

right?

[potent pivot]

no

why would you wait

go do that world quest

[upbeat plaza]

because i have only 1 quest left

[potent pivot]

for the 500 tokens

[upbeat plaza]

ye ye

understood

i mean quest for sparks

[potent pivot]

that will also give you like 25 sparks

since it's in ringing deeps zone

then after that

you can do ANY world quest in ringing deeps

they will give sparks and 100 bloody tokens

just because you're in war mode

you can also get sparks

from pvp kills

or the dirt piles in the zone that glow purple

[upbeat plaza]

what if i have only 1 quest left?

[potent pivot]

but you should check all 4 zones for world quests that reward 500 bloody tokens, everyday

[potent pivot]

then fly around grabbing the purple dirt piles

there's 2 there

[upbeat plaza]

this one

[potent pivot]

ya

[upbeat plaza]

and this ?

[potent pivot]

that one will take too long

compared to what it gives u

[upbeat plaza]

and this for insta tokens

[potent pivot]

yeah thats dogshit

[upbeat plaza]

just skip it then?

[potent pivot]

unless u want those bronze tokens or pve gear from chest

i always skip, but i have all the 20th anniversary rewards from bronze tokens

just cosmetic shit

[upbeat plaza]

I think i can't get better gear from this chest

[potent pivot]

idk we don't discuss pve here xd

prolly not

[upbeat plaza]

)))

[potent pivot]

i saw you tried to ask a pvp question in #assassination

[upbeat plaza]

xD

[potent pivot]

sometimes you just have to be patient when asking here :d

especially on christmas

sheeesh

[upbeat plaza]

i had no patience today

[potent pivot]

btw

basically all of this information

[upbeat plaza]

i was playing 3 hrs to get fucking 60 conq points

[potent pivot]

can be found on websites or youtube

wowhead.com

search youtube for "the war within pvp gearing"

n stuff like that

usually helps to have visual guides

this game has a lot of currency and ways to acquire those currencies, gets confusing at first

[upbeat plaza]

But they don't tell me what kind of gear I need

[potent pivot]

that's what murlok.io is for

[upbeat plaza]

They say “do this, buy this, now you’re cool, bye!”

[potent pivot]

shows you what pieces are most popular

[upbeat plaza]

xD

[potent pivot]

you're playing assa right

https://murlok.io/rogue/assassination/3v3#gear

[potent pivot]

that will show you the most popular pieces for assa

yep

[upbeat plaza]

yep

[potent pivot]

sometimes you just have to make an educated decision

like in the process of going from full greens to BiS

[severe helm]

Just sim your character and take whatever is an upgrade

[potent pivot]

you can't always go for each BiS item 1 by 1, sometimes you have to supplement the process, like with bloody tokens

[potent pivot]

[upbeat plaza]

im new in game

i have no idea how it works

i tried

[potent pivot]

he's fucking around

[upbeat plaza]

but i have no clue

[potent pivot]

we can't sim for pvp

that's a pve thing

[upbeat plaza]

xD

sooo

[potent pivot]

imo

take it slow and learn all the systems

this season only has a couple months left

get used to the game, have fun with it and then go hard when next season starts

just saying don't feel rushed basically

[upbeat plaza]

Im playing M+ and pvp

trying to get some gear for pvp and pve

[potent pivot]

got lots to learn then

[potent pivot]

one step at a time

[severe helm]

Oh I thought he was asking pve questions haha

[potent pivot]

naw

[upbeat plaza]

Is Rogue meta now? When im playing dungeons or m+ I'm almost always first on the damage ladder

I was in +10 ara-kara

582 ilvl

i was 1-2 dps/overall

my teammates were 616+

[wet crown]

It's been top tier for dungeons, also wrong channel I think

[waxen meteor]

Wrong channel

[upbeat plaza]

oh

[waxen meteor]

Anyway you are overthinking

[upbeat plaza]

right

my bad

[waxen meteor]

if you just start, focus on the basics

create a great fundamental, will get you longer and faster in long term

[upbeat plaza]

yeah im new in general

like 150 hrs may be?

[waxen meteor]

those blood token, is very important to farm gear this deep in season

the weekly is like 20% of blood token income, if you focus on farming blood token

each world quest you do (with pvp on), no matter which map you are at, grant you 100 blood token

there are specific ones that may give you 500

always finish the pvp world request with priority, and especially those 500s

[upbeat plaza]

Tysm for teaching me guys!

[jaunty osprey]

7 rogue bgb

is the dumbest thing ever

[outer sky]

I had one like that last night

Man I really wish deathmark actually fucking did something

I feel like the PvE version of it is not strong enough to warrant a 50% nerf in PvP

[glass hazel]

it should give truesight imho

would be op vs other rogues

[outer sky]

Vendetta used to do that

[outer sky]

Fucking crimal

[verbal field]

You should requeue after 20 min

[outer sky]

regardless of average wait time? Is that a well known thing? Why?

[glass hazel]

world of bugs ;x

[verbal field]

Sometimes matchmaking breaks

[severe helm]

Hahahaha

[still river]

You guys know how many r1 Solo Shuffle Slots are there in average per Spec? Pending around Place 150 disc priest and wondering if its actually reachable

[outer sky]

Average is like 7-9 but Disc priest has a shit ton of slots. Currently 23 which is the most of any spec. Your cutoff is 2504 rating

[outer sky]

Y'all ever notice how

if your kill target gets BoPd

no matter how low they are

they never die

even if your teammate is a caster

i dont think i've ever once seen my teammate kill through BoP

[outer sky]

@jaunty osprey you around?

[jaunty osprey]

Hi

[severe helm]

disc has usually the most

theres 1 spot per 1000 players above 1000 cr

spots get added if theres alts within the cutoff

[languid ravine]

-join blitz
-cool this is fun we win by over 700 points
-two guys in my chat have a psychotic break and spam and flame for 300 lines of text

whathefuck

they didnt even realize half the enemy team was afk lmao

[grizzled basin]

Hi there,
Just got back in the game after hitting 2k+ on SS a few weeks ago.
0-12 after 2 SS. 2 pals and 1 lock in each lobby, I felt as sin the succession of BoP / DS completly nulified me. Am I missing something ?

[still river]

Thank you so much !

[hexed pollen]

Did it Bois! Finally upgrade all my pvp gear to 619! Going to try some dungs with this 25% vers lmao

[last jasper]

can some1 explain how did he managed to build full cp with 1 ss w\o blades or premed?

[languid ravine]

150 blitz BG later and I STILL get frigging fresh characters in green gear every single round so lame

at 2300 mmr

what the heck

[jaunty osprey]

First SS from stealth or after breaking stealth or dance

Gives full cp

Forgot the talent name

[severe helm]

yeah

what a lot of sub rogues will do on their opener is actually gouge->KS

in blitz/1v1s especially

so you dont gap your opener and you dont have to cheap shot as first gcd

[last jasper]

premeditation. First combo generating ability, he used cheap after dance so he doesn't have it anymore

[wise sequoia]

Can outlaw rogues use pistol shot/BtE when disarmed? Are there any other abilities we can target people with besides Blind?

[hazy monolith]

ring OP now? which gems do we use?

[potent pivot]

Nope

[wet crown]

yeah it's kinda silly. the deathmark itself isn't even like a factor. It's all the stuff it triggers.

[potent pivot]

Ye it’s not worth using

You lose like 11% of stats to use it

Just to get 8-10% damage on details

@hazy monolith

[potent pivot]

Yes

What do you mean target people with?

[wise sequoia]

Just wondering how valuable it is to dispel disarms, and what abilities work during disarm 🙂

[potent pivot]

oh you were still referring to things we can do while disarmed when you mentioned blind

ic

[lime oar]

So wait if they’re removing duel and veil. They gotta be replacing them with new pvp talents right?

[potent pivot]

we don't know yet, but hopefully

they are adding the Feint pvp talent

[lime oar]

Oh yeah forgot about that.

Guess that’s pretty decent considering how often we can have feint up

[wise sequoia]

They are still adding to the notes. Rdruid lost their 2 core pvp talents but have received a handful interesting ones, many of which seem useful.

So far there are alnost no notes on rogue for 11.1 - its likely that they will add more

[jolly sierra]

had a guy on a bg

who told to don't go to the enemy base w the flag in eots

did it anyways

died

left

[waxen meteor]

Did DH get some buff lately?

I have been basically one shotted by a stun and single eye beam in blitz...

[outer sky]

@potent pivot I DM'd you some feelycraft

[halcyon timber]

Yes , twice now.

[potent pivot]

also got slightly buffed a few weeks ago

[outer sky]

They did some kind of stealth tuning in the last week as well

[potent pivot]

pretty sure all they did was fix some stuff

[outer sky]

nah they tuned

[potent pivot]

some 11.0.5 changes got undone when they launched 11.0.7

so they had to re-add those changes

[outer sky]

i went from trucking people to barely tickling them pretty much overnight

almost all of my lobies have been 1-5 or 0-6s

I'm talking like

15 lobbies

so something changed

[potent pivot]

nothing's changed

[outer sky]

well it's not like I forgot how to play the game

[potent pivot]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/patch-11-0-7-class-tuning-affliction-warlock-unholy-dk-holy-paladin-holy-priest-353865

these are the only changes that have gone live tho

[outer sky]

sometimes they stealth change shit

I cant think of any other explanation

if it were a few lobbies or just one or two days okay yeah maybe its me

but I cant win a lobby to save my life anymore

basically happened over night

[potent pivot]

they rarely ever stealth nerf stuff on live

[outer sky]

which means they do it sometimes

[potent pivot]

if they added any unannounced pvp modifiers we'd be able to see them in game

[potent pivot]

on ptr/beta sure

[outer sky]

the alternative explanation is I forgot how to play WoW from over the course of one day

[potent pivot]

i can't even remember the last time something was "stealth nerfed" on live

[outer sky]

about a week ago

[potent pivot]

because i don't think it's happened since i came back in SL tbh

[potent pivot]

other classes got buffed

[outer sky]

that wouldnt make me do no damage

I'll literally stack full bleeds onto a group of 3 vs a melee cleave and they just dont care

I dont even force CDs

like here look

2 other melee in this lobbu

I'm under 400k overall

thats unheard of

[potent pivot]

idk i haven't noticed anything different

or heard of anyone else noticing anything

[outer sky]

Well I have

and it's very frustrating

[potent pivot]

yeah but like

20 others would have said something

[outer sky]

yeah but

I have verifiable proof that sudden demise is bugged

and nobody but me is saying anything either

[potent pivot]

wdym bugged

if you mean procs that aren't the killing blow

that's been the case forever afaik

[outer sky]

it didnt even move his health

same %

[potent pivot]

on details?

[outer sky]

ye

[potent pivot]

could just be details being funky

[jolly sierra]

dude dont make me melt

[potent pivot]

and thats coming from a High Warlord lol

[jolly sierra]

XD

[jaunty osprey]

YAWNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

oh shit #2 overall NA

[waxen meteor]

4 honor

time to buy the red stone for gold

[jaunty osprey]

oh fuck, was capped oops

[azure shoal]

Why most ppl use forged warmongers cape instead of algari back?

[potent pivot]

Lazy

[azure shoal]

And chest most use kareeshi

And boots algari

I have the other way

[azure shoal]

Which embellishments should I add to the gear as sub?

[jaunty osprey]

Elemental focusing lens is best for most people

[rare vector]

I know I am late but still...
Veil of Midnight (PvP Talent) has been removed.
Shadowy Duel (PvP Talent) has been removed.
RIP, it was fun while it lasted

[jaunty osprey]

o7

[potent pivot]

We still have them

For a couple months to come

[last jasper]

Damn. Gz. Sub?

[jaunty osprey]

Assa!!

[rare vector]

yeah but still. Hate it when they take from classes instead of adding new cool stuff

[last jasper]

sadge

[potent pivot]

yeh, they added a feint pvp talent, but hopefully they add more before the patch

[languid ravine]

I swear stealth is bugged sometimes after patch, and shadowmeld restealth doesnt work sometimes and I m mashing the macro of course

sudden demise working for me at least

[potent pivot]

meld->stealth has always been finnicky unfort

[languid ravine]

but like this is after 123948 hours of shadowmeld not failing on me

and me randomly dropping stealth only after this aptch

[potent pivot]

i don't think it's behaving any differently than it has since DF

[languid ravine]

yes except for the part where when I mash shadowmeld it doesnt correctly drop combat and gives restealths, and it randomly drops me off stealth

which also was a thing for like one patch in dragonflight if you remember

lmao

maybe I drank too much Glühwein who knows

[potent pivot]

nah i remember it always being finnicky

in combat it's not always a guaranteed restealth

never has been

[candid tide]

guys is it better to use Ambush or Opportunity procs to get to 7cp BTE?

during subterfuge u know

[languid ravine]

its like 99,999% guaranteed and now its failing me 50% of the time but okay bro its behaving exactly the same as always

whatever you say

[potent pivot]

it's literally never been guaranteed like that

ever

[languid ravine]

like I said you are so right its exactly like you said

[potent pivot]

if you have DoTs on you, or if you get hit by any errant AoE it won't work

[languid ravine]

I am not arguing with you

[potent pivot]

ask someone else with proper knowledge of the game

see what they say

[potent pivot]

you can use both, same priority as usual

[jaunty osprey]

It’s weird because, if you’re pressing your macro and singular focus puts u in combat between ur presses

[candid tide]

gotcha, ye was wondering because opportunity pistol shots take multiple hits before reaching the cp required for max BTE, while ambush is one hit and ur there u know

[jaunty osprey]

best solution is to bind to scroll wheel

[candid tide]

but seems like ambush is prio from this guide

[jaunty osprey]

yes

you ambush when you can to build, always

[candid tide]

good to know tyvm

[jaunty osprey]

cause you’d rather save your pistol shot procs for when you’re not in subterfuge

so it’s easier to build/spend

[candid tide]

yeah it felt slow during subterfuge to use opportunity

[jaunty osprey]

In pvp obviously a bit different

cause if you’re being kited

or get rooted

then spend those opportunity procs

[potent pivot]

[candid tide]

good tip there idd thanks again

[potent pivot]

yeh i just don't get why they think all of a sudden it isn't working properly

as of this latest patch

[jaunty osprey]

well

there is just some bugs with global combat because of dots and random stuff atm

but it isn’t meld specific

but im not gonna lie, i had 0 issues with meld in DF

issues now, but not since rebinding meld to scroll wheel

[potent pivot]

maybe people using ring procs are breaking stealth more?

[jaunty osprey]

i just scroll faster than the singular focus tick puts me back in combat

cause double pressing would be too slow

[potent pivot]

idk it's felt the exact same to me as it did in DF

[jaunty osprey]

also, i’ve been dropping combat randomly when i get coiled or stunned sometimes

like coming out a stormbolt, im not in combat

[languid ravine]

nobody is thinking that everyone knows it behaves exactly as always, if anyone says differently they are trying to gaslight you

best not listen to anyone saying that

[jaunty osprey]

So I started binding stealth to every ability

[potent pivot]

if you can't discuss something without getting weird then don't discuss

[languid ravine]

yea I totally agree

it is as you say

I mean think logically why would there be any bugs in the game of course there arent any bugs and it all works perfectly as it always has

[potent pivot]

meld has legit never worked perfectly

[languid ravine]

yes like I said its the same as it has been since they made the ability 20 years ago

[potent pivot]

[candid tide]

just bring bak vanish cc instead

[potent pivot]

thing is, meld-stealth isn't protected like vanish

if you get off the stealth and the stealth breaks, that's not even meld related

if meld doesn't even drop combat in the first place, afaik that's a bug that's been around forever

so

[candid tide]

yeah it is what it is at this point regarding wow pvp

[jaunty osprey]

no

meld ALWAYS drops combat

as of right now

it ALWAYS drops it

it’s if you can enter stealth fast enough before you get put back into combat

[potent pivot]

how do you explain melding casts not working sometimes then

[jaunty osprey]

should have the entering/leaving combat scrolling battle text enabled

and you can see it for yourself

[potent pivot]

the meld bugs during AWC etc

[jaunty osprey]

what do you mean melding casts not working? Like melding an ability

like melding coil to immune?

[potent pivot]

not just coil or cc but yes basically

[jaunty osprey]

Melding casts works, you have to do it as the cast bar is finished or the insta cast is pressed

many people think it’s bugged because they can’t time it

if you watch my vods, every time i press meld, my scrolling text that says leaving combat appears

and the reason why some people might think meld doesn’t work is because they are trying to meld and stealth, so if they meld stealth, the meld immunity is gone

[tranquil siren]

anyone else dislike qing into dev as outlaw

[candid tide]

u have 4x hook

plus its cd reduced with each cp spend

[severe helm]

Not in pve

There are mobs who keep combat through meld and all bosses keep combat through meld as well

There are no bosses you can meld stealth on

Even the meld immunity part doesn't work in pve on lots of effects

I've never had meld stealth fail in pvp though unless I made a mistake on my end, it does always require a double press so the opportunity for something to hit you in between the two presses can cause the stealth to fail

[jaunty osprey]

We aren’t talkin about PVE though

lol

so

But yes, certain mobs and all bosses have a global combat aura so meld and vanish doesn’t drop combat

And ya, that’s exactly what I said too! That’s why it’s best to bind meld stealth macro to scroll wheel

would be really hard for something to hit you between the presses/scroll

[severe helm]

Yeah but I think not putting a /cancelaura shadowmeld in your meld macro makes it a lot slower

the "immunity" part of meld also prevents you from stealthing over it for some reason

so it adds a 0.5s ish delay to your stealth

and makes it a lot more common to get hit while you drop combat

you can also just meld->move->stealth

does the same thing

but I prefer to just put /cancelaura in the macro

as outlaw it triggers the subterfuge bug though so you cant open with BtE after that or it will go on cd which is annoying

[candid tide]

wont canceling the aura mess up with immuning cc or stuffs?

[jaunty osprey]

Yes

[candid tide]

insane

ill add it in my current meld macro now
#showtooltip shadowmeld
/stopattack
/use [combat] Shadowmeld
/use [nocombat] !stealth
/cancelaura shadowmeld

tho the succes rate of this macro alr 80% without adding cancelaura

[hazy monolith]

!stats

[lethal roost]

These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.

Subtlety: Vers>Mastery>Crit>Haste
Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Crit=/=Haste
Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
You likely want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw for an extra GCD during ADR/Crackshot windows. Take 'em by Surprise gives you 10% during CS windows, so you only need 10-15% from gear.

[spring bough]

that aoe against pets LMAO

[jaunty osprey]

Look at the singular focus pump because of pet aoe though

!!

sheeesh

[spring bough]

was only a 90 second round too lol

[severe helm]

Yep

I use it for a restealth

Not for immune

On other classes I don't use cancelaura

If you press it once it won't cancelaura

So you can still use it to immune stuff if you want

[candid tide]

what about immuning stuff on rogue u dont need it that much?

[severe helm]

Wdym

As outlaw/assa the restelath is worth way more imo

[candid tide]

yeah exactly thats what im asking

yeah guess thats right

but the macro works 70-80% of the time without cancel aura from my exp

[severe helm]

Works 99% of the time with cancelaura

[candid tide]

but i guess at high cr ull need everything u can have

[severe helm]

Most of the time people who dont have cancelaura just move to cancel it

So you can get used to meld move stealth

Works reasonably well

[candid tide]

ah ye that works too idd

[spring bough]

so this siren ring in arena

just did 10% of my dmg

[potent pivot]

Ye the nerfs didn’t properly apply with the patch

It MIGHT be okay for outlaw

But it’s bad for sub/assa

Either way expecting it to get fixed soon prayge

[delicate patrol]

hey guys - is there a specifc conquest piece that i need to turn into tier? or can it be either chest, as an example?

for assa in case that makes a difference

[potent pivot]

Like out of the 2 different chests on the vendor? Nope

The stats will change to tier set stats either way

[delicate patrol]

ty

[spring bough]

thunderlord gem is so cracked

[jaunty osprey]

Wish it was good for Assa

tested it in a shuffle yday

and it was doing like combined 5-8% overall dam

but I lose 6% mast and 5% vers

[potent pivot]

it looked decent on your 30 second round

anything longer than that it was pretty garbo

[jaunty osprey]

But even when it LOOKED decent, elemental focusing lens did more 😭

[potent pivot]

5 days til nerfs

[severe helm]

Yeah annoyed they fucked that up

dh abusing it last game

anotehr gem for 2.1%

so overall almost 10% of his damage

[potent pivot]

yeh i think a lot of DH are running it

either their stats are dogshit or they see number on details and follow the leader

[severe helm]

I mean his overall damage was pretty good

[potent pivot]

ye they got buffed again

doing good regardless tbh

[severe helm]

im def not farming it

[potent pivot]

same

i haven't seen enough of a difference for any spec in the game to consider farming it just to use it for a few days

[jaunty osprey]

Looking at it here, this seems very mild

low rolled

compared to other people

so imagine he high rolled

[severe helm]

10% of your overall damage for a ring is insane what

the stats on a ring are barely with 3% otherwise

actually our secondaries are pretty low so maybe more likr 5-6%

but still its literally free damage haha idk

seems strong to me

[potent pivot]

pretty sure it's more than that

especially for assa/sub

[severe helm]

yeah 5-6% seems more correct

but still

so this ring is almost double the value of a regular ring

lol

thats like the ring being 700 ilvl

[potent pivot]

ivan was saying it's like 11% total

6% mast 5% vers or something

i haven't looked myself

compared to the dmg procs doing 8-10% of your dmg

that wouldn't be worth losing for assa/sub

basically dropping the DR of your vers to do the same amount of damage

[severe helm]

ah yeah could just be outlaw that has horrrrible secondary scaling

[potent pivot]

yeh

[severe helm]

when vers is your best stat all it means is the other secondaries just suck lol

[potent pivot]

i think it probably net gains outlaw 1-2% dps

[severe helm]

cuz vers is just as good for every spec technically

[spring bough]

ring takes less than 15 minutes to get all the gems

and upgrade it

its too ez lol

[wise sequoia]

Who are good outlaw streamers to watch?

[potent pivot]

valthepirate, whaazz, nahj, pikaboo

kalvish

some of them are just playing classic atm

[wise sequoia]

Sweet. Gonna try soem fotm rerolling when I return home, so watching some good streamers will help!

[wet crown]

all this from three buttons lol

[severe helm]

outlaw def isnt a spec you want to fotm reroll haha

[severe helm]

Dh actually got a decent amount more complicated in the DF s3 rework

Its got far more going on than a lot of specs like ret/BM/war

[wet crown]

I played DH in s3 and I cannot emphasize enough how it's still braindead af.

[severe helm]

I played it too haha

You should really play ret or BM

[wet crown]

That's just shit dh players say to feel better about it lolol

[severe helm]

Nah

[wet crown]

I mean those are definitely worse

but it's still bad

[severe helm]

Pre rework it was beyond braindead

[wet crown]

No doubt.

[severe helm]

Gotta speak in relative terms here

It got substantially more complicated from the rework

[wet crown]

I just remember hearing that line before I played DH because I like to make fun of them with my guild all the time

and then I played one to like 3.4k (M+)and still felt exactly the same about havoc lol

Vengeance is cool though. I like vengeance.

[spring bough]

been having some fun swapping from keys to rated on outlaw today lol

i feel like there are days blizz flips a switch and its like outlaws luck is gonna be good or real bad lmao

solo lobby... i did 74mil overall more dmg than the next lol

siren ring did 12.4% overall of my dmg lol

[proper burrow]

hi, where can I get this red wolf companion for warmode?

[potent pivot]

the who for what

[proper burrow]

I dueled with an enhancement shaman and he had permanent red wolf, I thought it's some kind of buff like azkahet cheat death

[spring bough]

is Waazzup, one of Waz's rogues?

[potent pivot]

nop

[spring bough]

someone was claiming that before this blitz just started. temple went nuts with the siren ring. 8.3% from thunderlord and 7.7% from undersea overall lol

[wise sequoia]

I know…

I have seen a lot of rogue mains try it out and fail miserably! Half the outlaw videos on youtube are people “showing off” the spec with terrible rotations/grappling hook usage.

But it just looks so damn fun! And all the CDR is insane … like if I can pull of the rotation I can vanish almost every 30s, have infinite mobility and tons of sustained damage.

My goal is for sure not to try and become a master outlaw rogue … but it feels like there are a lot of people completely misplaying it, so if I can just:
1: do the rotation
2: avoid CC/damage with preemptive cooldowns
I will be like top 5%?
So I will put my focus into doing just those 2 things … and hope for the best 😉

[severe helm]

It is deeeeefinitely super fun

My favorite spec by far

It's a rewarding spec at least so that's good

Always feels like you can improve on something

[wise sequoia]

I have felt that on my main for sure (rdruid) but the rotation on outlaw is something else … 0.8s gcd and tons of procs to react to and buffs to maintain - AND your defensives are preemptive and you get punished extra by CC as your buffs fall off.

It seems like a theoretically utterly broken spec … but playing it correct is like playing normal PvP (hard) while also playing guitar hero on hard simultaneously.

[potent pivot]

shaman has wolves that come out and buff them or do dmg i don't remember which

don't think it has anything to do with the immunity

you can get some sort of immunity thing from azj kahet if you make a pact with the proper faction i think, no idea

[jaunty osprey]

ya just checked again 6% mastery and 5% vers

[potent pivot]

ye

did you see my last dm

btw

[gilded gulch]

You rng summon a wolf when you cast damage abilities.

Increases damage of the school it was summoned from.

[proper burrow]

they dont summon red wolves

[gilded gulch]

is the fire wolf not red

[potent pivot]

pretty positive they do

blue and red

[proper burrow]

it was called carnage something, doesn't sound fire themed

[potent pivot]

the immunity and the wolf are likely unrelated entirely

[proper burrow]

I didn't say that they are

[potent pivot]

idk

[gusty hedge]

every battle is diff so each fight becomes situational imo. usually never the same rotation except for mini burst, some variations of same depending on what class your fighting/ if u started the battle/fight with cds or half on cd
its very fun👀 so many diff ways to play Law(stat builds/talents) really is no wrong way. Imo it really depends on your reaction time/thinking ahead bcuz of cdr uptime. Super charged build dnt even need to worry about ehat buffs you have unless u get a 5 or 4+ rtb. If u can get a good rotation with adr/crackshot vanish(that rotation) the uptime is insane. Can practically burst back to back to back.(mainly if opponent is bad or misses cc/doesn't stop your go).
alr nuff yappin from me back to work i go

[wise sequoia]

Thanks for the perspective!

As a complete noob I will most likely not get to a point where I dare experimenting with many different builds. So far I have felt drawn to the vigor/hidden opportunity style, as it seems to have fewest moving parts and changes.

Your comment makes me wanna take a look at supercharged and KiR as well! I'm probably gonna end up choosing just one build and run with it.

[grim sequoia]

I have 9 forged gladiator heraldry, 1.7k blood tokens, and 252 conquest. Whats the best bang for my buck as far as getting better gear? (im in full honor gear playing outlaw at 1k blitz mmr)

I was thinking crafting neck/rings with the heraldry, and bloody tokens for my off pieces, wait to get free tier set from 1.6k rating and then weapons at 2.5k conquest

[grim sequoia]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50g7iWbGrys
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ziuCZTvlHM

This guy helped me out soooo much

i carried some of my games doing his hook fast caps/FCing with his tips

such an in depth outlaw guide, reminds me of Bicmex with survival hunter

[candid tide]

outlaw is king in capture flag

[mystic pasture]

A good plan.

[mystic pasture]

Start farming those warmode supply crates. 60 conquest each. If you time it right, you can get all 4 zones of them every 20 min.

[grim sequoia]

is there a rotation or just random?

fly around until one pops or stay in one and then go to the others?

gearing up with blitz has been so nice, trying to get elite set tmogs on classes i like them on so far have druid and lock at 1800

[jaunty osprey]

I can’t wait for plunderstorm

[mystic pasture]

There is a warcrate timer addon. Also the dragon Isles ones still work if you are having a hard time capping the TWW zones (if you are horde)

[candid tide]

gearing up with blitz takes aeons

[mystic pasture]

Get the crates while you wait in queue.

Once you have the addon just go from zone to zone and wait for a crate to pop. That will start the timer for that zone.

[grim sequoia]

I meant the tmogs

[candid tide]

i need them too

[mystic pasture]

Any way to consistently beat a ret 1v1 as assassination?

[viscid dagger]

Brand new to Sin rogue in TWW but been a long time rogue player, want to get into shuffles/BGB. any YouTube guides/up to date builds on how to do dmg/rotation etc?

[potent pivot]

Use murlok.io to see what builds or gear to use

You can look up a guide on youtube to learn the basics prolly but you don’t want to follow most of them word for word usually

[viscid dagger]

Yup using Murkok IO looks like seeing some people use Fatebound, is there a consensus for which is better?

[potent pivot]

Deathstalker is better

Fatebound is probably a little easier for beginners

[hazy monolith]

do we know if Vicious Bloodstones will persist to be of use in next season?

[potent pivot]

i think they will but there's no way to know 100% for sure

they're a big part of the crafting rn so it's likely they will be used

[wise sequoia]

They have yet to add the source/cost: https://www.wowhead.com/ptr-2/item=230425/prized-jewelers-setting

But we should know before the patch

[candid tide]

when they add dampening to duels

[glass hazel]

100% there will be new stones

since they need us to farm again

[mystic pasture]

What makes fatebound easier? Never tried it an now am wondering if i am missing something while playing deathstalker

[potent pivot]

to play deathstalker properly you need to be using ambush during your subterfuge window

and cycling through finishers to consume your Marks

then using max combo point envenom to consume Darkest Night, which refreshes your Marks stacks on the enemy

[mystic pasture]

And fatebound?

[potent pivot]

what about it

fatebound just exists

[mystic pasture]

Just do dmg

[potent pivot]

i wouldn't be so sure

[jaunty osprey]

You also need to make sure you mark the right target if Deathstalker

[potent pivot]

they could just use the same stones with the same cost

[jaunty osprey]

And swap it around

if you mark the healer, you can’t ever blind them

[glass hazel]

i mean they will use same stones with "s2" on it

[potent pivot]

dunno

[jaunty osprey]

Maybe for the actual socket, but the gems

[potent pivot]

they're used in a lot of the base crafting

[jaunty osprey]

likely not

algari seems like it’s gonna be xpac wide recipe too

and you just use updated heraldrys

and some of the algari requires bloodstones

[potent pivot]

ye there will be a new socketing item for sure

[glass hazel]

means we can get sockets directly? with like 5k honor only?

[jaunty osprey]

just save all your honour

on 100000 level 1s

[severe helm]

have to run on every immunity

[severe helm]

yeah im leaning towards there not being new stones

but youll still have to buy the setting again

so 5k honor per gem slot

[spring bough]

people really hate outlaw

went 6-0....... warrior and ret from the lobby are whispering me that the priest healer who i went 3-0 with was trolling for the last three rounds and win trading... LMAO

[languid ravine]

I get alliance assassin the very second I jump off a tower

and it disables flying

xd

[severe helm]

yeah it has a lot of control so people def dont like playing against it

[stoic spruce]

People really hate rogue*

[spring bough]

topped the overall damage that lobby too. was me, ret, fury, boomy with a disc and resto druid healing

[wise sequoia]

How are resto druids atm?

[spring bough]

Pretty sure they are good. The resto went 3-0 with me and did 50mil overall more than the disc priest

[severe helm]

theyre not great

theyre always gona do more hps than disc

cuz they dont have DR cds

also healer hps is more a function of how much damage the enemy is doing haha

so its hard to gauge performance on that

also have to consider the disc is also doing significant damage while healing as well

the rdruid most likely is not

[wise sequoia]

Makes sense

[wise sequoia]

Yeah this is something that most people miss when looking at stats. At low ranking healers have low hps, but thats usually because hps is capped by how much damage is done, with 25%+ overhealing.

But the days are kong gone when druid hots could keep people topped (max hps with full hots is something like 250k hps)

I just wish things were different ^^

[severe helm]

yeah rdruid is a spec that scales heavily with secondary stats

this happens every xpac

rdruid sucks early on cuz its hps cant keep up

then they give it slight buffs

then since their mastery/haste are multiplicatively scaling towards the later seasons they are god tier

[wise sequoia]

I wonder how the reworked mastery in 11.1 will affect this.

Mig very well be the same, but it will be interesting to see how they set mastery scaling

[severe helm]

Oh I didnt see they were reworking it I gotta check that out

aaah I see

kinda nice I think itll help to balance them

so they can heal with fewer hots but their healing doesnt become broken with tons of hots

[mystic pasture]

Running from ret seems to be harder than it used to be!

[severe helm]

Yeah they got a lot more mobility

but if you have los you can get away

its the only thing you can do tbh

theyre literally immune to everything haha

[mystic pasture]

On top of their mobility they have 20yrd ranged attacks

Arent they also getting a stealth breaker?

[severe helm]

they are but they already have one

templar will cancel your stealth if you go near them

[mystic pasture]

Passively?

How do I check for this?

Seems overkill for a spec that already shuts rogues down pretty hard

[severe helm]

its just a bug

[mystic pasture]

Oh

[severe helm]

started happening in the 0.7 patch

very annoying in blitz

[mystic pasture]

At least I can kill bad rets

I take out my frustration on those ones

[potent pivot]

They’ve had a stealth break bug since TWW launch

Unless you’re talking about something specifically new

[mystic pasture]

So…just avoid them all the time?

[wise sequoia]

Its yet another step towards making them simpler to pick up. Also it adds to their already decent purge protection.

They are buffing their consistency, but also nerfing their defensives.

The new pvp talents look fun though - I especially adore the offensive casting buffing their hots talent

I feel like rogue is just going to counter rdruids super hard. Without tranq bubble … guess they will have to sit bear

[languid ravine]

look guys I am not saying blitz is a joke but in my 2500 mmr lobby half of my team is 1400 or less in shuffle

I fucking checked

coz holy shit

[waxen meteor]

yeah it's quite mixed

you got some really solid players, and some lucky noob

[severe helm]

Considering top lobbies rn are 3400mmr + it's just inflated

You can never compare rating across brackets

[waxen meteor]

it's too easy to be carried or dragged to lose in blitz

you are just 1/16

instead 1/6

[severe helm]

Yeah it's a lot easier to win consistently in shuffle comppared to blitz

But if you duo in blitz it's actually op

[languid ravine]

wait you can win in blitz?

no way

[severe helm]

Cuz you guarantee one of your healers isn't a troll

I've only solo queued in blitz though and I've been able to climb

It's def not impossible

But you will lose a lot without having any control over it

[languid ravine]

I will lose WITH having a lot of control over it

[waxen meteor]

if you duo, yeah you can easily win

when you can ensure two can actually play, including 50% of healer

you are very close to win

if you jump into complete randomness

just hope you good luck

[languid ravine]

so you guys are saying its a joke

thats not at all what I have been saying

[waxen meteor]

I won a 2800mmr blitz in complete outdated pve gear and outdated pve talent

without even trinket lol

[spring bough]

so an outlaw and a sub walk into a bar with a preso to face a frost, fire, and a disc priest

[waxen meteor]

it was a coincident i was doing some transmog

and forgot to switch

and i can also do 19-1 kill/death game, with 3 nodes stealth and 2 nodes return, and still lose

it's really random

[languid ravine]

you guys are doing a terrible job at defending blitz

[severe helm]

Yeah there's plenty of people at high rating who don't deserve to be there cuz the rng into high mmr then just queue sync and hope to 50/50

[waxen meteor]

as said, in the end, you are 1 out of 16 players

[languid ravine]

I m starting to think its a joke

[waxen meteor]

the impact is just not enough

it's not really joke or not

[languid ravine]

and I m the only guy not in on it

[severe helm]

But still I'm on my second outlaw queueing only solo and I've been able to climb

[waxen meteor]

1/16 is like 6%

[severe helm]

Some specs are easier to carry on than others

[waxen meteor]

no matter how good you are as 6%

[severe helm]

Rogue is def very very good for carrying blitz

[waxen meteor]

the impact is just to a degree

[severe helm]

Sub is prob the best of anything

[waxen meteor]

yeah and rogue can be a much big impact already

when i play my sp

lol

[severe helm]

Sp is pain

[waxen meteor]

i think i am just rolling dice

[severe helm]

Duo or don't bother imo

[waxen meteor]

(just to farm honor)

and also, it's kinda funny

your title can be transformed to alt, for blitz

but it cannot for solo arena

[severe helm]

Nah it's character specific for blitz

[waxen meteor]

nuh, i ensure you

[severe helm]

Can't go to an alt

Nope

[waxen meteor]

my alt is running it

[severe helm]

The r1 title...

Not the strategist bs

[waxen meteor]

oh i am not talking about r1

just grand mashal or whatever

[severe helm]

That's the "title" generally

Grand Marshal isn't even blitz specific

That's also rbgs

That's always been acc wide

[waxen meteor]

yeah

but things like elite xxx is not acc wide

it's char only

[severe helm]

Yeah it's a very very old title

From like cata

When that shit came out

[spring bough]

finally hit 2405 in solo shuffle as outlaw. retired for the season lmao

[languid ravine]

yeap I cant wait for Season 2 where we get the sickest Sets ever

only to show them off to nobody because the game is dead and people who still play it are insane

maybe put one on my instagram or something

thatll show them

wait nevermind I cant even show off the current transmog I earned because its bugged Blizz hasnt fixed the main reward for the current season 3 months later

[waxen meteor]

i want to try outlaw for a bit too, need guidance!

[spring bough]

trust me you dont want my smash buttons maybe CC guidance lmaooo. i have like 1200 rounds XD

[spring bough]

how is it bugged? i can mog the current seasons

[potent pivot]

the thing you get for extra shoulder glow

has been bugged for a lot of people

[spring bough]

oh damn that sucks got it for all my classes lol

6/9 on the mythic set too lol

[waxen meteor]

i dont even know how it suppose to work tbh pff

i opened it and somehow get a plate head

or plate head mog