pvp

[wintry dew]

especially comp

[waxen meteor]

Describe the universe to me, now

@wintry dew

[wintry dew]

Wdym ? 😦

[scarlet shell]

stun the pets idk

nah jk just take the pain.

[cosmic thistle]

won 2 round -25 rating fun

healer couldnt handle the focus on me

[wintry dew]

you're doing the same as many new pvpers do when they start doing shuffle

Instead of looking for where you could have done better, you are looking at what other didn't do for you

Early today or yesterday you said you use cloak of shadows so you can burst.

[cosmic thistle]

i dont do now

there was a 8milion healing gap

beetwen them

[wintry dew]

Again you play 3 times with each healer

did you go 3-3?

[cosmic thistle]

2 wins

but i feel like i cant burst like at all

[wintry dew]

Have you watched guides on youtube aswell?

[cosmic thistle]

i use rotation addon

[jolly sierra]

fucking leavers

[wintry dew]

??????????????????????????????????????????????

[cosmic thistle]

yes

[wintry dew]

bro

[scarlet shell]

rotation addons are fine, but you cant follow them every single time

[wintry dew]

rotation

in

[scarlet shell]

your plan will change as will your rotation

[wintry dew]

pvp?!

[jolly sierra]

oh boy

HOW

MANY

TIMES

WE

WILL

TELL

U

DONT

THINK

ROTATIONS

IN

PVP

CMON

[cosmic thistle]

yes pvp

it istn for pvp?

[wintry dew]

NO

xDDDDDDDDDDDDD

[cosmic thistle]

what?

[jolly sierra]

a

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[wintry dew]

You've been pveing this whole time in pvp? xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

[jolly sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/ree-pepe-triggered-angry-ahhhh-gif-13627544

[cosmic thistle]

what XD

[wintry dew]

Rotation addon, i bet is hekili or whatever

its for PvE

[cosmic thistle]

YES

[wintry dew]

how did i know.......

[cosmic thistle]

i tought it was op

[wintry dew]

its

wait

let me find it

https://tenor.com/view/dumping-trash-daniel-labelle-frustrated-garbage-trash-gif-27186872

[gleaming pawn]

To be fair, knowing the core rotation to get the most out of your damage windows is important. But yeah, following a pve rotation is a good way to lose

[cosmic thistle]

okey i deleted it

[wintry dew]

okay

[jolly sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/banging-head-ouch-frustrated-gif-13835737

[wintry dew]

you're 30 or 40% better

right now

[cosmic thistle]

idk

[wintry dew]

i'll be kind

[surreal barn]

Hit a pvp dummy for an hour

[wintry dew]

and i'll link you some guide videos

[cosmic thistle]

i never look at my points brand new game now

[surreal barn]

Bingo bango

[jolly sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/evangelion-facepalm-headbang-ugh-mad-gif-17881849

[wintry dew]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVCAeqzB1oo

[cosmic thistle]

iam so bad omg

[wintry dew]

Evasion is an amazing pvper, i've been following for a HUGE while, check this video

[cosmic thistle]

ok papi

[wintry dew]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWGP_YFh5JU here's another video of him, solo shuffle queues where he comments about whats going on, give it a look and get some insight

[waxen meteor]

lol you still haven’t figured out it’s more person specific ?

[cosmic thistle]

sure

[wintry dew]

In this channel, i've seen a huge amount of people complain about what others are doing wrong instead of looking at themselves, i was also like that so i speak for myself aswell

[white gazelle]

can some1 explain why whaaz is playing critlaw?

[cosmic thistle]

i will drop too 500 rarting now

[gleaming pawn]

Crit is the best secondary for Outlaw right now

[white gazelle]

why tho thats crazy

[gleaming pawn]

Why is it crazy. Haste is not good and Mastery has pretty much always been bad. It worked last season because crit was so bad due to nerfs and the spec design

[tribal badger]

mastery got "nerfed" with the rework

as in, realz removed 10% proc chance from mastery from the talent tree and didnt give it back anywhere

so the whole secondary got like 12% worse

its a race to the bottom for secondaries for law tbh

[cosmic thistle]

@wintry dew can u send a better rotatian guide idk even what he pressed

idk what iam doing iam so slow

[waxen meteor]

Think we have been focusing on crit here for outlaw since late first week of season

You might have missed those conversations

[radiant shuttle]

Bruh

[waxen meteor]

Need to tag panda now

[radiant shuttle]

was it good?

[wintry dew]

how did you go from being a god to not knowing anything xD

[cosmic thistle]

idk :/

cause now i need to know what the fuck iam doin

[wintry dew]

My man all i can do is point you to pvpers with commentary, it isnt like PvP has "guides"

[waxen meteor]

Rotation value in pvp is fairly low, you need to make better decisions on higher levels, but not focusing only on how to hit dummy with higher dmg

Your enemy is not dummy

[cosmic thistle]

ok

will try a game

[waxen meteor]

And when they out bursting you, whatever you do as perfect rotation doesn’t matter at all

Defense, move, avoid dmg

Wait for your window like next kidney

If you talk about rotation for dmg you should remove kidney from your keyboard

Focus on what really is happening in arena over the detail breakdown of rotation

It seems you are lacking a lot on higher level which makes the detail matters less

And sin doesn’t really have much rotation, only 2-3 skills that generates cp, and ambush with trigger condition only, bone with cd and you hit one per person in most cases, so there’s basically only one cp generator

You can read Icy vein pvp guide

Dated and not perfect

But it could be a starting point

[wintry dew]

Yo @waxen meteor i dm'ed you

[cosmic thistle]

Iknew i would need too delete it anyway idc how much effort i need too put in anyways i will get 2k rating

This is nothing compared too what i did before

[wintry dew]

https://tenor.com/view/right-yeah-right-yeah-oh-yeah-ohh-gif-14553729619893238098

[radiant shuttle]

you mean you couldn’t handle the focus on you

[fiery gorge]

In PvP ?

[radiant shuttle]

yeah it’s cracked

[waxen meteor]

jokes aside, in a way, it's not very easy to handle bm's focus on you

they send 1324830284208 pets to you and stay 12038120838120 miles away

only comes closer to throw a trap on healer every 25 sec

then doing 183041328403821 dmg from 120413802381 miles away again

[cosmic thistle]

Assasin mobility is trash

[waxen meteor]

not the best but not the worst too

and charm of sin is you don't have to hit them forever

one of the key in pvp is that you can't be focusing only on yourself

you try to max your dmg, fine

but others can be maxing their dmg on you at the same time

if their dmg > yours in certain time window

what you need to do in that time window is probably to avoid dmg, other than thinking how do i make 10% dmg when you are dying

Let me make an example, let's say you have 3 dots on main killing target, a frost mage, then, kill target Mage blinked away and started Icy Veins and the the ice ball thing, and warrior started offensive cd at your back. This is the time you do not need to worry about your mobility and how to chase the mage, but to turnaround to your healer and pillar, tripple dots the warrior and back to pillar.
if you just sprint to mage and took 5 seconds to reach him and got stunned by warrior and die, not healer issue nor mobility issue.

[scarlet shell]

rogue is the fastest character in the game what

fleetfooted just got added

[cosmic thistle]

Still a jumping hunter and a mage ni chance

No

[waxen meteor]

You don't need to connect to them ALL the time

if rogue has no mobility

then warrior and ret just delete account

[radiant shuttle]

y’all can’t tell he’s a troll baiting

[waxen meteor]

got a quiet channel anyway today

[radiant shuttle]

you’ve been sharing excellent information I just feel like it’s wasted

[waxen meteor]

it's fine, just a quiet day

and i am at office today no wow anyway

[wintry dew]

It isnt, honestly i like his insights

[radiant shuttle]

me too

[steel scarab]

Weird question:

Anyone know how to get rid of this extra combo point bar display? I think it's in the base UI but I don't see a setting to nuke it. I also checked to see if anyone had made a WA to get rid of it, but I didn't see one

[shadow creek]

Are you running Shadowed Unit Frames?

[steel scarab]

I don't believe so, no

[shadow creek]

Is that the default unit frame, or an addon?

[radiant shuttle]

That’s blizzard frame

[shadow creek]

If it’s default, you should be able to remove it via the options menu in the interface panel, or in edit mode

Not at my computer atm otherwise I’d confirm

You could also use a unit frame add-on that’s more configurable if that doesn’t work. I use SUF for the customizability

[waxen meteor]

doesn't default UI put cp at middle of the screen?

[radiant shuttle]

that’s the personal resource display option

[waxen meteor]

i think my UI is pretty default

[waxen meteor]

ah okay

[wary moss]

Not that we should but use Amp poison, but with it I hit 308k envemon lol

*on dummy

[steel scarab]

I do have Personal Resource Display off

That option, if selected, I believe, puts it under your actual character

[waxen meteor]

yeah i feel it's quite helpful

[jolly sierra]

dont

ill skin him alive at this step

lol

[last jasper]

You can move it from under ur character to enemy nameplate.

[waxen meteor]

am very used to where it is now

[quaint cedar]

So if you're outlaw, is it possible to win against a competent hpal + arms in 2s? I do 0 damage to either of them

Why did we remove armor pen again???

[shadow creek]

Nope, got smoked over and over by a ret pally the other day, it’s like we’re tickling them

I guess outlaw just isn’t supposed to be powerless against anything wearing plate

Such a poor design decision

[quaint cedar]

Yeah, ret is also a problem. The only hope I have is to kill their healer. Ret is invincible to me

I honestly think hitting into plate now feels worse than playing outlaw last season before the buffs

At least back then I could take sepsis if they don't have a dispel and do some damage every once in a while

Now, I just have nothing

[jolly sierra]

i will get the fyrakk lego

to grief ppl

in arena

[shadow creek]

Completely agree, it’s honestly pretty demoralizing…never thought I’d say this, but outlaw feels increasingly useless as the season progresses

Still no explanation why sub got armor pen but outlaw, the only purely physical rogue spec, did not

[waxen meteor]

Join blue or red, and drop yellow

Solution

[quaint cedar]

Yeah....maybe if the meta shifted away from the plate classes we'd be dominating, but right now it's just a tossup whether you get a good or bad matchup. Moreso than ever. It's just too extreme

Hitting cloth? Feel like a god. Hitting plate? Might as well /afk

[shadow creek]

Sad thing is all it would take is giving outlaw armor pen back to solve it…it’s not a complicated issue

Instead my favorite spec gets to feel increasingly irrelevant as the season goes on

[quaint cedar]

Right. I don't even care if our damage needs to be nerfed a little to compensate.

I just hate having these awful matchups where I feel like I can't do anything to win no matter how hard I try

[shadow creek]

Yep exactly

[quaint cedar]

Especially when assa and sub don't have to care

[jolly sierra]

imagine a frost dk wise nerf

[quaint cedar]

I don't have to imagine it. I played outlaw in the beginning of S2

Completely useless spec

Still managed 2.1k with it before the buffs came in but it took away my entire will to play the game and I basically stopped bothering for the rest of the season

And honestly, outlaw's problems are so easy to solve, it makes me mad. At least FDK, I understand why it sucks so bad. It really needs a design overhaul. Still terrible for it to be left in that state and I feel bad for FDK players. Hoping they get a rework some day.

[jolly sierra]

maybe u will have one for next xp

w recent rework

[quaint cedar]

A FDK rework? Yeah, maybe

[shadow creek]

If not ArPen, then at least change pistol shot and BtE to fire damage

[quaint cedar]

Yeah, I loved that idea

[shadow creek]

Not mine originally, think maybe Popo suggested it

[waxen meteor]

Not trying to be a bitch, but i personally feel if there's one of our specs work super well against clothes and doesn't do well against big armor, it sounds okay from lore stand point. and if there are solution from other specs of same class, it seems also acceptable in game design stand point?

I am still in very old school way of thinking

three specs are all part of rogue

[surreal barn]

Wow has never been balanced around 2s either

[quaint cedar]

Well frankly I think that's bull

The game isn't designed like it was in 2004

The expectation now is that every spec should be able to participate in content and have a reasonable chance of success

[surreal barn]

Outlaw could get a non physical attack and it still work fine tho

Something to respec into in those circumstances

Get this give up that type of thing

[quaint cedar]

That doesn't mean every spec has to be the best at everything

Yeah, I'd even be fine with something like that. I could just not take whatever the non physical damage is unless I needed it

[stoic spruce]

omg samsies

[stoic spruce]

a classic

[jolly sierra]

yre

ye

[stoic spruce]

fire damage pistol shot and BtE wouldnt effect pvp that much either

I think its better than general armor pen tbh

however I wouldnt mind either/or

hell if I could design outlaw, I'd give us both lolol

something would be nice

[shadow creek]

Not looking to be good at everything, just realistically want to have a chance at winning instead of basically being powerless against 9 specs in the game

[quaint cedar]

Even more silly when you consider that outlaw, back in SL, was redesigned to be the anti-melee rogue spec that goes "toe-to-toe" with other melee, and yet we are weak to half of melee specs simply because of armor

[shadow creek]

Agreed. That’s literally in the official WoW spec description, ffs

[shadow creek]

I know this isn’t gospel, but if the spec concept has changed I wish they’d let us know

[last jasper]

dafuq they are smoking? wher is this from, couldn't find it

[stoic spruce]

From earlier season 2

[last jasper]

oh, okay. I recall that

[stoic spruce]

When dev/fdk was a thing

[last jasper]

yea, I remember. Both were f tier and got nerfed cuz of right situation/ meme comp

[peak agate]

This is also says master of poison but the majority of my damage is bleeds. 😭

[shadow creek]

Yeah, the problem is if the player experience expectation is not based upon the official class and spec themes then they should try to align those better

Saying outlaw goes “toe-to-toe” with melee is clearly incorrect at this point

[stoic spruce]

Okay but Assassins Creed 4 Black Flag?

[peak agate]

For sure. I learned that the hard way when I played it on an alt.

[shadow creek]

I mean, at this point survival hunters and enhancement shaman fit that description better than outlaw

[peak agate]

Bring back exposed armor.

[shadow creek]

Just need something

[peak agate]

I don't think an extra button is the place unless it becomes another buff during roll the bone.

Or your mastery

[stoic spruce]

Exposed armor but bte extends duration

[shadow creek]

I made the mastery argument during ptr

[stoic spruce]

Now you're rewarded for bte uptime

[tribal badger]

wdym doesnt fit

we are the tankiest rogue spec

thats how we go toe to toe

it doesnt mean we do equal damage to them

we have the most hp DR and lowest CD on feint/evasion

[peak agate]

They won't change mastery until an expansion.

[tribal badger]

evasion is like a 45s effective CD

thats pretty big vs melee

i feel extremely tanky when being trained as law and playing defensivly

[shadow creek]

Again, Not looking to be good at everything, just realistically want to have a chance at winning instead of basically being powerless against 9 specs in the game

[tribal badger]

try that as sin

huh ive never felt powerless vs melee

only sub rogue really

maybe i missed the context of this convo

[peak agate]

I'm a sin main. I'm all here to be a glass cannon fam.

[stoic spruce]

Tankiness doesn't equal spec identity. Playing around vanish isn't outlaw, no matter how you cut it.

[tribal badger]

well thats not really related tho

the toe to toe part means u smack them while they smack u

thats what we do

[stoic spruce]

Which is why I responded

[tribal badger]

we dont vanish defensivly to run away

we use other tools defensivly

that part really just reads as being the tankiest rogue spec to me anyway

which is true

[stoic spruce]

No one is saying it's not the tankiest lol

[tribal badger]

well then how is it not standing toe to toe with the enemy

[shadow creek]

Because you still die 99% of the time against ret and warra

[tribal badger]

u do?

[stoic spruce]

Because vanish, regardless how you use it, makes you do just that. Vanish.

[tribal badger]

later then other specs would

idk i feel extremely tanky if im being trained like its a bad choice by the enemy team

[shadow creek]

Doesn’t matter how tanky you are if they can just outlast you because your damage is so poor

[tribal badger]

theres rarely a lobby where im the optimal train target

ok i mean, outlaw damage is still ok. not amazing in all plate lobbies i'll give you but hardly unwinnable. we arent fully zug zug for sure

i still feel like i do enough damage to land kills in plate lobbies but idef cant just overwhelm healer with unhealable damage like i can do in cloth lobbies

need to rely on setup way more

man i had a lobby with 2 priests 1 lock 1 mage the other day and i felt like a DH

i was doing 120-130k sustain each round if they ever stacked 2 people

destro lock too, no pet pad

it was wild

[stoic spruce]

I took a druid down to 30% without even targeting him.

His fault for staying in

[peak agate]

Damn, I just read blizzard just updated one of their internal servers to 11.0. Hoping for the best with our hero talents w.e this shit gets datamined.

[shadow creek]

I mostly run rated BGs, the cleave is real, probably the best cleave talent in PvP

[stoic spruce]

I'm hoping for hero talents that get us out of vanish gameplay

Trickster will 100% not help

[shadow creek]

Would really like a choice away from shadowdance/vanish play

[quaint cedar]

Also doesn't matter at all if we're tanky if we aren't effective

[stoic spruce]

You do now. It's just bad.

[shadow creek]

Yeah, meant viable choice, haha

[stoic spruce]

Ik just giving you a hard time lol

[quaint cedar]

Sure, warriors will struggle to kill me, but I can't kill them either

[shadow creek]

Arms will literally bleed you out while you sit in MS

After vanish and cloak are gone, you’re pretty screwed unless you can sprint far enough to outlast the bleeds

But you’re still not killing them

[quaint cedar]

Man

I was finally climbing a bit in 2s again

And then I just get fucked

by plate classes over and over

I've fought DKs or warriors like 5 games in a row now

Lost all my progress

This rework legit made outlaw workse

worse

[peak agate]

An arms war crit me for 300k once but I'm assassination. I'm already running less HP and cdr

[shadow creek]

Yeah it really is demoralizing

[peak agate]

Even overpowers hurt

[stoic spruce]

When I see a frost dk :)
When I see an unholy dk :(

[peak agate]

My experience with frost dk is if I see one. They are probably good and that's usually the case from my experience lol

[stoic spruce]

I've yet to lose to fdk and mark my words. I will NEVER lose to one.

[quaint cedar]

lmao it legit took me like 15 seconds to kill an afk paladin after his teammate died

[shadow creek]

Yeah we’re zero threat to them right now #feelsbadman

[spring bough]

bracer, ring or medallion this week

also see a few outlaw using the haste trinket... maybe swap my crit one to haste

[spring bough]

1 minute long 2s match and i had evasion up twice LMAO

[waxen meteor]

Don’t worry it takes 15 seconds for a sub to kill a random mob on world map without dance

[inner tartan]

omg it was sooo bad last season before buff

[shadow creek]

With main gauche being nerfed pretty significantly this season, does it still make sense that enduring brawler is necessary? Or am I conflating 2 things?

[tribal badger]

not sure how the two are related

[shadow creek]

I think I'm confusing myself, ignore me

[mortal jay]

apparently this is sufficient to kill a war 🙂 https://gyazo.com/ab4778e34dd2d38d501abeff9a79894d

i honestly havent had much trouble with war ...at my rank.. aka 1600 hard stuck. I'm sure at 1800 and beyond they know how to use their kit better.

but right now.. the only time I struggle with wars is when its that double melee dps brain dead zerg they do sometimes.

i find that at low mmr, wars tend to underestimate our bleeds. they dont see half of their health dissapear at once so they just keep zug zugging.. if i'm not brain afk that round, I find I can dot them up, step to their healer and kick/cheapshot etc.. and the war doesnt realize he's losing health.

i've had trouble killing ele this season

[worthy crag]

crushing enemy rogue is the most fun thing to do on an alt class

because i know what they are going to do at every moment

this rogue popped blades in stealth, got the cheap shot faded into a full fear + tendril

blades gone

[mortal jay]

thats why you play like me.. be trash, dont understand what you're doing..makes you unpredictable!

dismantle that mage and he will stop , dumbfounded at your stupidity

[lucid citrus]

Guys is it smart to get Mast/Crit rings and shoot for 30% verse min?

[radiant shuttle]

bro YES

the amount of times I’ve been disarmed as a caster and I’m just so dumbfounded I stop playing

📠

[radiant shuttle]

sounds solid

[shadow creek]

https://images.app.goo.gl/LK8U31ZMJsSwPh7L8

[radiant shuttle]

I do not remember that scene

[mortal jay]

why does omnibar constantly "blocked a ui event" error on me

[radiant shuttle]

bc blizzard gatekeeps their game

[worthy crag]

Does the pvp dummy in valdrakken work just like hitting an actual player?

or if theres a difference does anyone know

[peak agate]

I don't think the dummy has any migiations

[stoic spruce]

It has no vers

[halcyon timber]

It takes into effect pvp modifiers , has no versatility but does have armor. It “should “respect the -25% critical damage 150 instead of pve 175) with that as well.

[stoic spruce]

I really wish it had around 30% vers

~30% vers and different targets with different armor values.

They should make me a dev

We'll be buccaneering in no time bois

[mortal jay]

is undulating spore with pvp thingie added to the crafting a good choice for back

[waxen meteor]

My sub open burst does roughly 2M in stun lock on pvp dummy

[halcyon timber]

Yeah that aint adding up

So something is off

[waxen meteor]

Yeah I am sure I am not doing 2M burst at open in arena although it’s very deadly

[halcyon timber]

So either things aren’t reducing properly on that pvp dummy

Talents and such will be reduced properly but yeah

[worthy crag]

yeah no verse and no mitigation i expected as such. It does take into account pvp specific modifiers so it should be fairly accurate

[stoic spruce]

That's into a target with no vers and no armor whatsoever

[halcyon timber]

Classes wall, team members of enemies walling , versatility subtracing another 15% damage etc

[waxen meteor]

Think there is armor on dummy

Just no vers

[halcyon timber]

The dummy “should” have 30% physical damage reduction i think

Compare physical damage hits only among all of them and do the math

[waxen meteor]

If vers takes out 30% it’s 1.4m it’s probably still higher but a lot closer to reality

[worthy crag]

So you guys still happy with the dark brew build? feels like dmg falls off so hard when blades is on cd

[halcyon timber]

I don’t mess with it as it aint my style

[waxen meteor]

I use brew but no tea

[halcyon timber]

Tea can get nerfed

F touching core stuff

Or silly bfa tuning like 25% mastery reduction and shit

[waxen meteor]

And I don’t use thief’s bargain

Although I feel I probably should

[halcyon timber]

Yeah thieves can die off too

Im all for cool talents , im not down for getting a bad rap because someone trinkets at 15% life

[waxen meteor]

This week has no tuning right?

Haven’t checked any news today

[halcyon timber]

Correct

Other classes are still hitting harder anyway so eff em

The archaic rogue hate has gotta come to an end

[waxen meteor]

We have one of best burst when we have all CDs

[halcyon timber]

As we should

[waxen meteor]

But some other specs are bursting very close range and the CDs are quite short

[halcyon timber]

We also trade a lot mechanically

Others don’t

Amd they do comparable or more damage

[waxen meteor]

Like DH is basically bursting every 30second for eyebeam now and a bit longer get essence break

Destro lock can throw two bolts like any time and kill

[halcyon timber]

Dev can do 500ishk with disintegration

Its fine and all but stripping rogues due to whining isnt cool

Outlaw didn’t need to be touched either

[waxen meteor]

I think they do need to buff sin

Either buff the dmg and leave survival low as today, to make it a glass cannon

Or add a new defensive like any other spec already has

but it seems already nobody playing pvp now

Why cares balance

[halcyon timber]

Their hands are full atm. I dunno man

Assassination “can” get atrophic at least with DTB.multi dotting targets especially with SB may do a “fair “bit of healing. I dunno. Probably hard to find a middle point .

Def could of gotten a shield of some sorts though

Just prob difficult when we get talked down on a lot in the pve channels when important discussions came up

[worthy crag]

This stat penalty addon is pretty useful

hit 20% penalty breakpoint on vers so pushing every extra stat into mastery

[wanton breach]

wait what

[halcyon timber]

Sounds like a bug V

Yeah im thinking on messing w stats once i get more conquest. Made a lot of crafts early on .

[wanton breach]

happened to all my characters once I opened the vault

[lucid citrus]

yeah its a bug, im getting the same thing

[jolly sierra]

same lol

[calm tree]

is this a good spot to ask questions about SoD pvp?

[gleaming pawn]

no, you can try #classic-discussion but this server as a whole doesn't talk much Classic

[calm tree]

TYVM

[buoyant prism]

best conquest gear to buy after weps?

[marsh ridge]

hey guys, a qq very quick. can we transform hellbloom to tier with catalyst?

[steel scarab]

@marsh ridge yes

You definitely can

[marsh ridge]

thnk you

big decision now, -500~mastery vs 4 tier set on sub, what do you guys think?

[steel scarab]

Hard choice, not sure

What's sub's 4 piece do again?

[marsh ridge]

clones does extra 20% dmg and award 2 cp

[steel scarab]

What percentage is your mastery at if you lose 500

And what stat are you gaining

[marsh ridge]

85%->80%

gaining crit and a bit more vers

mastery coming from 5000->4500

[steel scarab]

I'd take that trade but I'm not a pro

2 piece bonus and crih and vers and losing 10% on finishers

If you're using Dark Brew I imagine the set bonus alone makes up for the loss

5% on finishers*

[marsh ridge]

yea using it

[steel scarab]

Cuz I assume Dark Brew affects the shadow clones

[marsh ridge]

it does

[steel scarab]

It's really, really shitty that the entire right side of the sub tree synergizes with the tier set bonus and the mastery stat, and the entire left side of the sub tree does not synergize with the tier set bonus and mastery does basically nothing for that side of the tree

Would it have killed them to make mastery also slightly buff CP builders as a stat

I really like The Rotten talent but like, goddamn, how do you use that in a build that's viable

And why is the only way to pick up the -5 second cooldown reduction on Symbols of Death require pathing to take a Shroud of Concealment talent

[normal hull]

Getting into rbgs on the rogue, usually play heals or boomy/lock. What maps are sub and which are assa? And does assa just play aoe build? Thanks!! ❤️

[mortal jay]

what?

"what maps are sub..."

are .. are you switching specs per map?

might be just because I don't like sub, people who play sub, and don't view them as human.. but that seems like unnecessary min maxing

but I suppose if you take into account which spec is good at what, you could apply that to what each map needs

need spread pressure with decent occassional burst go assass.. need heavy instant burst like orb map.. killing orb carriers go sub/?

[chrome schooner]

Well for instance Assa is amazing in Kotmogu, but if you get a base map Sub does a much better job than Assa at defending/attacking bases. It's not really min maxing, it's trying to win (if you can play both specs).

It's the same as Vengeance/Guardian swapping to Havoc/Balance on maps where a tank isn't required, because the DPS spec is more valuable

Assa can play AoE if you're going to teamfight on any map, and can also play single target on flag maps to kill the tank. Assa is a fantastic tank killer at the moment

Sub is better on base maps, as you usually will be on base duty and will not teamfight and will never attack a tank with stacks

Sub is also really good on flag maps to kill tanks, I suppose that's the situation in which both specs are good, although different

[wintry dew]

🫡

[mortal jay]

hence the caveat that I only felt the way I did because I didnt see sub players as people 😉

i know sub is the better spec but Im too stupid to play it 🙂 thus i refuse to acknowledge it

in my defense, i've tried. try to follow youtube guides and such but every streamer/youtuber I could find spends 90 percent of the video blowing themselves about how good they are

on a side note. isn't there some way to set a focus target by mousing over them or something. I've started trying to have haler on focus in solo.

and I reallly dont umnderstand how people have enough keybinds for step/kick step/gouge etc etc etc macros

[mortal jay]

why do i have such a hard time with monks 😦

i would rather fight a war than a ww

oh. ok.

i'm sorry

[cosmic thistle]

anyone know what the socket item i called?

ah found it

i have 3 sockets what should i put in them for pvp already have socket on a another item with only mastery

what sould i pick now

[plucky sage]

I really wanted to try sub for pvp but after copying the builds and trying to fit everything on my action bars i'm pretty put off..

button bloat is a problem imo;

• already for danse macabre can't share gloomblade and shadowstrike on the same key to save space.
• sepsis, flag, goremaw's; 3 extra buttons to push to do damage on top of the normal CDs like blades, symbols, sectec, trink Not too mention all the cc we need to manage.

I honestly don't have any comfy binds to use for sepsis flag and goremaws without having to change keybinds gloablly on all rogue specs to not fuck with my muscle memory..

how do you guys manage it??

[mortal jay]

not sub. but as assass with my current build I have lots of spells to manage too. some ideas.. make sure you are using ~for something. consider using caps lock for something, shift e, shift x, shift t, middle mouse and shift middle mouse I have found to be comfy keys to hit

sorry.. not shift x. i took that one off

[cosmic thistle]

I have 2 poisons what should i use?

[mortal jay]

also.. while strafing is absolutely necessary to have good movement, "turn left and turn right" are not. I have strafe on a and d. I have used q and e for spells

are you sub or assass?

as assass, I have specced into 4 poisons. with dragon tempered blades. but if You havent, then wound poison, and crippling poison would be the go to . with mind numbing replacing crippling if you are facing only casters.. and deadly poison replacing wound if anyone on your team has a mortal strike ability

as sub.. I dont know

shade was in here a while ago. he's a smarter person and could give you a more precise answer

[mortal jay]

I talk a lot.

I’m sorry

Just looked back at this room and realize the whole screen is me

[wintry dew]

No worries

[cosmic thistle]

@wintry dew iam doing so little dmg lol

forgetting too use my tea all the time

and ending up with low energie

first game went good won 4 and now 2

[mortal jay]

consider macroing tea with say..shadow dance or kings

dont forget how important spreading your bleeds is

1...two players bleeding to rupture/garrote is > 1 player

2...more bleeds ticking = more energy

[pastel burrow]

don't apologise for this man, people can scroll, if you wanna waffle then waffle away 😉

[wintry dew]

What @mortal jay said

[cosmic thistle]

@wintry dew is it more worth playign with cold blood then echoing reprimad

[mortal jay]

i run neither. but I dont think very many are running echoing these days.

[cosmic thistle]

should i always play with acrobatic strikes?

[plucky sage]

I use all those binds already, it's just since flag, sepsis, duel, sectec, goremaws are used often they require decent keybinds which I no longer have. I use alt modifiers, shift modifiers, some ctrl modifiers too. And of course q and e (a and d are strafe).. etc. Just too much bloat :/ I hate using caps lock as a bind because of how it's a toggle for all caps as well., plus I don't find it that comfy to press.

Oh, and tea

[mortal jay]

I BELIeve that most do. it keeps us from feeling clunky.. the extra range works for spells like kick. as well

[cosmic thistle]

can u send me a good rogue build?

cause if i wanna play cold blood i will have too give that up

[mortal jay]

i'll let someone above 1600 answer that 🙂

[sharp sierra]

guys 4sets or 2sets for sub which one is best?

[mortal jay]

and i dont run coldblood so my build wouldnt work for ya

[minor cape]

that shit is super cracked

[cosmic thistle]

yha but cold blood kb is aslo so op

[minor cape]

cause you can just shiv a melee and start beating him from range

[cosmic thistle]

will try the diffrent build and see what fits be best

[minor cape]

idk how it is now cause i havent played since last season in terms of skill trees

and on assa ever xd

but as sub it is a sick skill for making warriors rage

[wintry dew]

Murlok.io

[cosmic thistle]

ok the rot helps me alot iam not doing evryhing its says just a bit

will turnf off when i memorise more

[wintry dew]

The rot?

[cosmic thistle]

Nah i suck this is just insane idk what iam even pressing

[wintry dew]

Bro are you feeling ok? You've been a roller coaster of emotions ever since you joined this channel

[mortal jay]

dont let it get to you merek. take a break from min maxing. play some random bgs..nothing helps more than experience.. and that experience is more valuable if you were having fun

rogue is a tough class to be a master at.. but its a rewarding and fun class even as you're learning. all of us took a while to get the feel for it

[cosmic thistle]

NO

i taught i was doing ok now back too square 1

swtiched too this is it good?

[minor cape]

merek has kaneki ken as pfp, he is in his oshiye teo phase

😏

[cosmic thistle]

fr

[wintry dew]

S1 was good

Should have ended there

[jolly sierra]

XDDD

unravel moment

[jolly sierra]

lololololol

just 0%?

[wary spire]

Even rival 1 is basically 0.

[wintry dew]

I'm so glad I got rival day 1

And just chilled with PvE after that

[cosmic thistle]

whats this?

[waxen meteor]

I think this data refers to rival1 from 3s

but i am not certain

i mean there are plenty of rivals from solo

myself got like 4 chars

elite probably all DHs

[wintry dew]

Farming that sweet tmog

[cosmic thistle]

is pikaboo a good rogue i can watch too learn stuff?

[waxen meteor]

pikaboo is probably one of the best pvpers in the world now

[cosmic thistle]

damn lol

[waxen meteor]

sometimes he is not the best theory crafter in details, and sometime he picks some rare talents

but he has super good vision in arena

knows what's happening, what will happen, what to do, what not to do at super elite level

that essentially helped him to jump on all different classes and ranked r1 ish in DF

[wintry dew]

Pikaboo + xaryu

❤️

Those two together made such good content

[cosmic thistle]

what is a good opener?

[wintry dew]

Sap healer

Now it's a fiesta of what do you want

You could garr + rup 1 target and garr the other dps

[cosmic thistle]

i always try too get all bleeds on all in the opner that bad of me?

[wintry dew]

Not in theory

But in practice, are you sapping the healer when it is possible?

[cosmic thistle]

yes

try too sap all xd

[mortal jay]

every vid I see from pikaboo is him finding the greatest one shot combo known to man and calling me stupid for not using it.. only to change his mind two matches later

[wintry dew]

?

Sap all?

[wintry dew]

That's why we watch till the end xD

[cosmic thistle]

nah but like we say if the healer stand there and a dps i sap both

[scarlet shell]

So like only 2 people are glads

blizz can save arena if they put in more effort.

[wintry dew]

You ... Can't have more than 1 sapped target

[scarlet shell]

You can sap one and blind one if that helps

[cosmic thistle]

[wintry dew]

As soon as you sap a 2nd target, the 1st one comes out of sap...

[cosmic thistle]

oh

[mortal jay]

blackjack

[scarlet shell]

But you can’t sap more than 1 target and the effect remains etc unless they invent a new talent

[wintry dew]

Merek

Have you stopped and read your abilities descriptions?

[cosmic thistle]

yes

[wintry dew]

Are you absolutely sure you READ them?

[cosmic thistle]

yes knowyes

only sap i forget

[scarlet shell]

don’t be hard on him, we all were terrabad when we first started wow.

[wintry dew]

I'm not being hard on anyone, I'm actually being quite helpful

[cosmic thistle]

why does my kidney shot sometimes work in like 1 sec then they cancel out

[wintry dew]

As @waxen meteor was last night

[scarlet shell]

The amount of flash bangs and “OH” moments I had when I learned things myself since legion haha

I was a crap outlaw main and probably still am

[wintry dew]

It's because of 3(?) reasons:
. They use the pvp trinket to remove CC (2mins CD);
. It's a dk and he used icebound fortitude (a defensive)
. A paladin bubble/bop
. And human racial ability

There might be more reasons

[cosmic thistle]

alright

[wintry dew]

Assuming you're not casting kidney on their DRs

Dr= diminishing returns

[last jasper]

Until xaruy went classic

[cosmic thistle]

is sap garr ambush kidney mutlitate 2x rupture good opner?

[mortal jay]

here is my solo shuffle opener, assuming a..warlock kill target

sap healer. switch to lock and garrote, cheap shot, shiv, rupture, muti once slice and dice, muti to 5 combo and envenom to get full sliceandice rolling..

most of time I am not trying to burst here, so I switch to secnd dps and garrote rupture

[cosmic thistle]

is see soemthign peekaboo often does lets say he goes for a burst they become very low and survive and if he dosent get the kill secured he switch the target whys that?

[mortal jay]

once lock has blown his trinket I will full kidney shot, drop smoke, full garotte, rupture, dance, tea, shiv, deathmark kingsbane

[wintry dew]

He mostly plays sub, are you talking about sub or assa?

[cosmic thistle]

assa

[wintry dew]

As assa we don't kill on the opener, we set up the game from there

[cosmic thistle]

man that guy is insane he knows exatcly when too 1 shot tem

them

[wintry dew]

Well yes

[cosmic thistle]

how do iknow when too use kick?

[wintry dew]

Experience

In order to kick, you must know what the enemy is casting

[cosmic thistle]

true

[mortal jay]

and game knowledge

knowing the major spells for each class is a huge part of being a rogue. don't waste your time kicking an arcane mages channel when the balance druid hasnt cast cyclone and your healer has used his trinket

[cosmic thistle]

feels like i always have 0 energie

[stoic spruce]

Not such what he's casting, but what he's casting after that as well

Warlock fears are bait

For example

[steel scarab]

For Subtlety, is there any build where the rotten would be viable? Or do I pretty much have to play the cookie cutter build the top people use

[jolly sierra]

unless is an aff, so u cockblock shadow

but usually when i mess the interrupt i just gouge or shadowstep the lock to avoid the chaos bolt

[tired lagoon]

Is it better crafting the boots or cloak first for assas pvp?

[wintry dew]

No cloak

Craft boots

[tired lagoon]

Cloak no good?

Or just not as good as boots

[stoic spruce]

Cloak sucks

[jolly sierra]

cloak was born dead this patch

in the first build for s3 in PTR was disgustingly good

but after that they just ruined it

xd

[tired lagoon]

Oh really!

Just stick to conquest cloak?

Anything else worth crafting?

[jolly sierra]

u wanna a crafted?

try the verdant conduit or the azure shit for mastery

[wintry dew]

You can in theory get crafted head + infurious boots with the first pvp quest you do

So you're saving 1500(?) Cps

[jolly sierra]

(personally i use the verdant conduit, the uptime is fucking shit for assa for the azure embellish)

[wintry dew]

Crafted as in lifebound, not infurious

[tired lagoon]

I was gonna do the infurious footwraps of indemnity

[wintry dew]

Yes

Infurious boots / lifebound head it's a pretty good start. But as panda said, verdant conduit might be good but idk if it can be put on headpiece

@jolly sierra can you confirm?

[chrome schooner]

It can

[wintry dew]

Thx shadenox, yesterday I used your videos as a learning tool for peeps here, hope you don't mind free publicity

Oh actually I didn't, i opened them and didn't send because conversation was getting rough

Kill me

[jolly sierra]

u can

100%

the only slot u cant use it

is in jewelry

dunno why

[cosmic thistle]

13min queue this is starting too get very boring

[wintry dew]

That's the usual queu

Can go up to 1h

[cosmic thistle]

at what rank?

[wintry dew]

Yours

What rank you at rn?

1400?

[wintry dew]

[cosmic thistle]

1200 rating going down without rotation help

[wintry dew]

Rotation help is for PvE, but if you're telling me you're doing better with it, use it

It's your gameplay after all

[cosmic thistle]

But it will not make me better

[wintry dew]

Not really no

[jolly sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/evangelion-facepalm-headbang-ugh-mad-gif-17881849

[wintry dew]

I advise you to check skillcap guides on pvp in general aswell

[gleaming pawn]

@jolly sierra have you lost your mind yet? Every morning now I get to check and see if you’ve cracked and lost it

[wintry dew]

He's about to

We gotta save our boy

[jolly sierra]

im insane irl since long time ago

but im growing a vein in the neck

rn

[wintry dew]

Breath

[jolly sierra]

[wintry dew]

@cosmic thistle you're too green to pvp as you are now, spend your time watching YouTube guides for rogue and pvp in general

Then ask us better structured questions

Other than that we can't help you

Hyper return to us please.

[cosmic thistle]

there is one question tho i can only use 2 poisons and what should i use for pvp iam a bit lost there

iam playign wound and crippling

[wintry dew]

You're using them right

You only replace wound poison for deadly poison If you have a teammate that can apply "mortal strike" effect to the target

Aka reduced healing received (that's what wound poison does)

[cosmic thistle]

ty

a

[gleaming pawn]

Hmmm I think @wintry dew and/or @jolly sierra need to take Marek out dueling and coaching and hands on. This is clearly the way to resolve all of this

[wintry dew]

I refuse! I did 10 shuffles the first day of the season, reached 1800, logged out

No more pvp for the rest of the season

[gleaming pawn]

But you must grind for the 2100 weapon enchant!

[wintry dew]

Did in S1, I think I'm done for the expansion xD

In s1 I ALMOST reached 2400...

Someone slap me

[cosmic thistle]

whats considered good rank in wow?

[gleaming pawn]

Oooph not even s2 when the enchant was actually worth it, that’s rough 🙂

[wintry dew]

Ikr, but I have short temper, with life and all, I lose it really quickly

So I wanna save my wife some drama over losing Arenas BCS I'm an idiot

[cosmic thistle]

why is evryone in wow so old lol

[gleaming pawn]

That’s fair, I was doing BGs as outlaw last night to blow off steam and was raging whenever some random CC’d my dance before my global was back

[wintry dew]

Are you 13?

[cosmic thistle]

16

[wintry dew]

@gleaming pawn That's why I usually set my objectives at 1800, because at least I know I'll get it. 2100 I reached S1 for the first time

[wintry dew]

Not that far actually

People were playing this game when you were only a project

[cosmic thistle]

XD

[teal imp]

hello hello. is crackshot the only viable build for outlaw?

[wintry dew]

Let me tag the outlaw guy I know

[gleaming pawn]

Also very fair. Tbh I only ever bother with 1800 anymore as well. CBA to grind the rest of the way to 2100 anymore

[gleaming pawn]

Yes

[teal imp]

unlucky

[wintry dew]

@spring bough

[gleaming pawn]

KiR requires a lot of things to lineup to get those rolls going, time you don’t generally have in pvp

[wintry dew]

Would I love to have the weapons enchants? Yes. Will I exchange my sanity for it? No

[gleaming pawn]

Also KiR is about high sustain, the current Crackshot offers good burst

[gleaming pawn]

You’re more than welcome to try and make it work, it’ll be lobby dependent but you could take the ST KiR build and tweak it for the pvp lifestyle and give it a go

[teal imp]

sometimes i forget its a videogame! ur right i ill give it a go

[gleaming pawn]

I’m all about the experimenting and challenging the current builds. If nothing else you come out of it a slightly better playing understanding your spec and its limits better, and maybe you’ll come up with some good tech people were sleeping on

Personally though, I hope it ends badly because I hate KiR and refuse to play it

🙂

[teal imp]

i dont mind playing crackshot, but im mastery heavy cause assa/sub and sometimes i feel like my dance window is poopoo

[gleaming pawn]

Crit isn’t that far ahead of Mastery in pvp, it is definitely better right now but having a mastery set that you use to play multiple specs won’t kill you and won’t be an issue until you’re trying to push past 1800

[jolly sierra]

i can in PTR

im sure he is from US

[teal imp]

oh and 4set worth for outlaw?

[gleaming pawn]

Yeah those extra rolls can be huge

[jolly sierra]

lemme update this shit

[teal imp]

alright appreciate the help!

[jolly sierra]

its already done

so if he wanna some lessons can come here

[wintry dew]

Careful tho

We are old

[jolly sierra]

i feel im in my peak age

XD

[wintry dew]

I'm 28 and I'm old

[cosmic thistle]

what is the best cloak too use for pvp?

[wintry dew]

Mastery versa

[cosmic thistle]

its named that?

dream crafted+

?

[wintry dew]

From conquest point. If I point out others you're just gonna get more confused

[spring bough]

Second this. KIR in arena would be a nightmare lol

[jolly sierra]

i have 1 less year

XD

[wintry dew]

No bro, you're old with me now

XD

[jolly sierra]

OOF

[jolly sierra]

tbh i use the malicia one

with a huge chunk of mastery

is just excessive

[cosmic thistle]

@wintry dew whats the name of the cloak

[wintry dew]

That's why I said mastery vers

[wintry dew]

Bro could you respect your elders and be a little more polite

[cosmic thistle]

found it

[cosmic thistle]

what

[wintry dew]

I gave you the answer here

[jolly sierra]

:l

[cosmic thistle]

i taught u ment it was the name of it xd

i have lesser mastery on it then my other cloak tho

but i get more vers

[wintry dew]

In theory the best you can get is the wpvp one from the vendor with trophy of strifes

Gives more mastery than vers,

And it's 3 ilvl weaker than the conquest one

[gleaming pawn]

I take offense to this, we don’t want any claim over this

[wintry dew]

Shut up you're probably old aswell

[cosmic thistle]

🤓

[gleaming pawn]

Oh I am, probably one of the oldest farts here. But I’ve still got it where it counts!

[scarlet shell]

so whats up with sub rogues suddenly using sepsis

what changed etc

[wintry dew]

I'm clueless but would love to know as well

[scarlet shell]

imma assuming its to get out an extra stealth window

not the damage part

[jolly sierra]

nah is not for that, its enough to see when u ask for the weekly reset to guess the region lol

[gleaming pawn]

[jolly sierra]

tuesday = US
wednesday = EU

🤓

[cosmic thistle]

what is the update?

[strange stag]

Is IT me or assa rogs in 2s have huge problems with energy ?

[jolly sierra]

nope

[last jasper]

how the fkc to turn off all this pets shit. Its drives me crazy ffs

[tired lagoon]

Sub or assas pvp?

Sub seems nutty again

[stoic spruce]

Turn off enemy minion nameplates in settings

[jolly sierra]

i had a demo

the guy spammed the shit out my interface

and almost won 6-0

[last jasper]

it turned off. Plus betterblizz namepletes. Still i see all the shit from dks, hunts etc

[stoic spruce]

Ooooo idk then

[last jasper]

I just had a game with hunt + dk. jeez I couldn't see shit

[waxen meteor]

not huge, but there is

in late games

[jolly sierra]

lemme see

my match was

BM + ret + demo

the demo was demolishing everyone

the time he lose

was because he afk and appeared in half round

[soft dust]

Are u going to 4 set pieces?

[wintry dew]

me personally?

nah, im not

[waxen meteor]

Damn, teleport ss a mob in world map

then i seem to teleport to some void space

now i cannot log in anymore

rogue is dead

[wintry dew]

Reroll

[waxen meteor]

other chars are compeltely fine

[wintry dew]

https://tenor.com/view/krill-issue-skill-issue-krill-issue-gif-25572478

[jolly sierra]

just did a 5-1 after that crappy bullshit happened before

will send vid, and tag merek

so he can see wtf can possibly do lol

[gleaming pawn]

Did you do an unstuck from one of those other chars? Should be an easy fix

[waxen meteor]

do a unstuck?

[gleaming pawn]

In the support menus, there’s an unstuck command you can initiate for a character you cannot log in. It essentially hearths your character out of whatever void they are stuck in

[waxen meteor]

Trying now, thanks!

fail to find...

lots of similar topic but nothing really unstuck

[steel scarab]

Is there any Subtlety build that's viable with The Rotten talent?

[jolly sierra]

@cosmic thistle pay attention

[cosmic thistle]

Tyyy, is that jjk?

[jolly sierra]

op 4

yes

[jolly sierra]

@cosmic thistle part 2

[waxen meteor]

yeah plenty

basically the beginning of season build

dust + rotten + vein + bite

Guys, we are dead, enjoy last week of rogue pvp at semiprime

[jolly sierra]

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

[waxen meteor]

imagine 3 rogue specs as top3 at raid

[steel scarab]

Unreal

Unprecedented

We're gonna be absolutely worthless after the next round of nerfs

I'm already having trouble killing people because my secondary stats are suboptimal

If we get nerfs I am absolutely doomed

[jolly sierra]

nah rogue never dies

[steel scarab]

@waxen meteor where can I see an example build that uses The Rotten? I wanna compare it to what I'm using

[waxen meteor]

Like this, i think you can trade dup rupture to something else

[stoic spruce]

My apoc into double death coil says otherwise B)

[waxen meteor]

Sub 2s is not easy

[jolly sierra]

i say in nerfs

XD

[waxen meteor]

If you are not an expert don't really try that direction too hard

[steel scarab]

Yeah sub in 2v2 feels difficult to play, but I felt I needed more survivability and control because I play with my gf and she is not a tryhard pvper and I felt I needed more survivability than Assassination offers

She's holy pal and when she gets cc'ed I die incredibly fast if I'm out of cds

[waxen meteor]

then don't play sub lol

sub requires a lot of planning while playing

your kill window is short

[steel scarab]

I feel like as sub I can kinda kill people by myself better than I can as Assassination though

[waxen meteor]

the games like, ah i don't what happened, but he died, doesn't really happen in sub game

and it requires your partner to know when to attack when to def more precisly

[waxen meteor]

Survival in 2s can be linked to your general dmg and quality of GOs a lot.
Since there are only 2 people, when you are able to push them down, and create very good go, they will be forced to defense and do limited dmg for longer, which means you fulfill the time gap between kidney CDs more easily. Eventually you save a lot of CDs.

Like if you play sub and constantly creating no pressure for other party, you will be foreced to use CD continously and those CDs will run out probably faster

[steel scarab]

Can you describe how I can create pressure better?

[waxen meteor]

I don't know, maybe @jolly sierra for rotation guide

[steel scarab]

I only have 40% mastery, but I do have like 484 PvP ilev

So I definitely don't have the ideal stats

[waxen meteor]

jokes aside, first go is a bit hard nowadays, depends on conditions you can throw deathmark, but in most cases probably not

but first go is basically setup your slice and dice, dots and etc.

[jolly sierra]

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

[waxen meteor]

i perfer to do even a stun DR kidney

[jolly sierra]

so u wanna learn assa james?

[waxen meteor]

second go is basically
5 seconds before your stun is off DR,

1. Make sure your DoTs are on
2. Try to lead kill target to pillar
3. Ask your healer to move aggresively to other healer ready for cc combo

When stun off DR, send kidney,
Shiv
Dance+KB
Garrot
Finishers

I read from some pve guides, they say the rupture from stealth period has better tiks even after dance/stealth is over

I am not sure if it worth it to do a fresh rupture in your PvP Go

but regardless we are talking about one gcd

[jolly sierra]

@steel scarab watch here

i have all dots tracked

so u can see what im doing

[steel scarab]

Yes, I like assassination

[waxen meteor]

I am not sure she tracks everything or she makes everything unwatchable on UI, but idea is that

[steel scarab]

@jolly sierra I will watch the video after work and see what I can learn

I just feel like I do absolutely no damage, I guess because it's just impossible to kill people through heals, even with 5 stacks of wound poison

I think I'm used to the older versions of the game

[waxen meteor]

5 stacks of wound is just a standard MS

[jolly sierra]

ye

[jolly sierra]

lets see if makes the effort

in watch tf im doing

lol

ur other option

is use hemotoxin

w deadly

[steel scarab]

Hemotoxin with Deadly, that could be interesting

Is it basically just impossible to kill someone without cc'ing the healer in 2v2 though? Just to clarify?

I was in world PVP the other day and with me AND a hunter both on a Disc priest, it took us like 5 straight minutes to kill him

Which seems insane

Is healing just THAT strong ATM?

[jolly sierra]

u kill by rot

not insta

when u have a window

kill with DM

bah

kingsbane

[steel scarab]

Should I be able to 100-0 someone in a window?

[jolly sierra]

sometimes

[steel scarab]

Or do they already need to be at like half hp?

[jolly sierra]

just watch the vid

i did 5-1 and most kills were from me

[steel scarab]

Okay, I'm at work so I can't watch it right now

But after work I will

[last jasper]

is badge >> other conq pieces or not so much. for sub

[restive hemlock]

Without dampening yea. Healers in the world are nightmares.

[steel scarab]

Okay, just making sure it's not just me

It was crazy, surviving two people attacking him like that

Like holy shit lol

[restive hemlock]

Nah it's usually why when you're farming tokens they don't die till they oom

[jolly sierra]

healers in world are like

[steel scarab]

I get that they wanna incentivize people to play healers and making them insanely hard to kill might draw people to do the healing classes, but Jesus Christ it feels like fighting a raid boss, and player power feels super unequal when my damage is literally just ignorable

[jolly sierra]

bah i wont bother cya

and u run

[steel scarab]

Like with 5 stacks of improved wound poison on and my damage is still just ignorable

That's some weird "balance"

[jolly sierra]

u hit do a KB window

u fail, u wait 30 sec and try w death mark

then if u dont try again w KB 30 sec later

else u will win by dot pressure

[gilded gulch]

sub generally is more reliant on having a healer that knows how to create kill windows with you imo

rather than a healer who kinda just hangs back and pve heals

Not sure how much the status quo changed generally never liked playing sub healer 2s unless with a priest.

[steel scarab]

@jolly sierra it seems like my DOTs just don't create much pressure, is that because my mastery is too low?

[jolly sierra]

mmmm i have around 60 percentRN

[waxen meteor]

LOL

I just gave him a 60 lobby and he came like this to me

[surreal barn]

Lollll

[gilded gulch]

doesnt the average warrior player leap out the gates

then die 30 secs in

[waxen meteor]

he actually did that

he leap

i sapped priest

[gilded gulch]

....how has the game not changed

[waxen meteor]

and i went back and one shot him

[gilded gulch]

in 3 seasons

leap out the gates

bladestorm next global

[worthy crag]

you mean you gave him a 06 lobby?

60 lobby sounds like he won all 6

[waxen meteor]

@surreal barn i didn't know it was you haha

so it's me and zeiss and that zug war

and that war still pming me saying we trash 1700 player

[surreal barn]

Good lobby tho our second match was close

[waxen meteor]

lol, that's why we got wins with double rogue

[surreal barn]

Ofc

[waxen meteor]

i like double rogues lobbies now cause at least we won't get random stun dr

[surreal barn]

As assa I hate

A good sub is too slippery

[waxen meteor]

I am reporting that war now

he still goes on

I am not even sure why he wants to just trash talk me

but i like my response

[surreal barn]

lol two of my matches I tried creating some healer pressure and you killed them at the start

[waxen meteor]

me war me leap me die

[surreal barn]

I think the priest may have been 😴 💤

[waxen meteor]

if no one peals me at open they die

probably only mage can avoid

maybe war lock with all shields can be, but i don't know

[gilded gulch]

caster lobbies are usually the most chill on rogue

[waxen meteor]

yeah

i love caster lobbies

[surreal barn]

Warr can trink defensive and sham can trink burrow

[gilded gulch]

s1 getting a full melee lobby with dk warrior dh

made me question my sanity

[surreal barn]

I mean this is the shuffle life though

[waxen meteor]

s1 melee blend is fucking shit

nothing worse than that

[gilded gulch]

i stopped playing s1 before ret became

[waxen meteor]

literally

[gilded gulch]

the most broken spec ever

[waxen meteor]

yeah but they would choose not to or too late

[surreal barn]

Wasn’t fun hope we don’t get sent back

[waxen meteor]

but signle trinket is not enough

[waxen meteor]

but i was at my ret char just before rogue game

[gilded gulch]

oh ret if you get a lobby with a mage that has 1 braincell

[waxen meteor]

and i run into arcane mage, evoker, destro lock and double priest healer lobby

guess what happened in the end

[gilded gulch]

you are going to have 0 fun

[waxen meteor]

yeah play like literally ball-less

nobody gets me out of pillar

yeah i don't have ball, i pillar andy

[gilded gulch]

that reminds me of bfa corrupted season

anytime i got mage lock on tolviron

"yeah im never leaving this pillar"