▫️Doom: The Dark Ages

[wide pawn]

Patch 1 added an additional Contrast Slider that messes with the previous setup we had pinned here, use the new message from Polly that I linked

Hotfix 1 for Patch 1 isnt doing anything to address HDR

[simple ivy]

I really hope they eventually implement an ability to toggle the post-parry slowmo.

[gaunt light]

its not just that contrast slider they also changed the brightness slider which is not paperwhite any more so another useless slider

[eager hare]

oh shame. Thanks anyway guys Love yall

[simple ivy]

Not to sound like one of those /r/FUCKTAA neo-luddites, but there are a few moments, especially during cutscenes, when id's denoiser isn't doing a good job, resulting in shadows looking significantly worse than Eternal's rasterized helpings.

[covert shard]

ray reconstruction is coming soon

[simple ivy]

I hope we have the option of switching out the denoiser without having to enable path tracing.

For us plebs with mid-range GPUs

[steady gate]

There's no option for that in Indiana Jones, doubt it will be in this one
Would love to be wrong though

[covert shard]

they did say they were adding them seperately so its possible

[gaunt light]

590.10 preview driver seems boost the performance a bit

its 144 fps on 576.40

[karmic thicket]

preview driver?

[wild osprey]

https://buzzheavier.com/1jkaq631w47q

Have to own a dev account to get it straight from Nvidia 😁

[karmic thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/i-dont-want-it-i-never-have-i-dont-want-it-game-of-thrones-jon-snow-do-not-want-it-gif-25111926

[gaunt light]

ya i get it from one of my friends that works for amd (no kidding)

@wide pawn this one fixed 32bit dxvk

if you want to play dx9 games you can try it

[wide pawn]

590 driver?

Nice

[gaunt light]

preview driver for devs

[covert shard]

So who’s gonna send it to me?

[covert shard]

i didnt see the link lmao

[gaunt light]

fucking release it

[dark wharf]

tomorrow

[wide pawn]

Just finished Gooner blade

Time to rip and tear again

[gaunt light]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BR3c9lyV5as

wow is this is least demanding pt game ?

[wet pasture]

Probably, but also the least visual difference I can remember

Think I'll probably be leaving it off on my 5090

[gaunt light]

i think the diff is big

but not in every scene

[wet pasture]

Sure. Worth the cost in gameplay do you think? Certainly cool for just looking round and appreciate world though

[gaunt light]

i havent tried that so idk

[wide pawn]

Ghosting on leaves,

bad... terrible..... worst game ever /s

[median fractal]

https://youtu.be/BR3c9lyV5as

Hnnn i wasnt fast enough

[wet pasture]

I've watched the full video now, you're right - some locations look awesome

[waxen marsh]

For a game like doom I personally wouldn’t use it

When I’m running around during a battle no way I can tell the difference

[karmic thicket]

40m in jon mentions the HDR isn't dialed in right with no elaboration, rare correct jon take

[sterile stag]

with the path tracing update coming out tomorrow I might give this a whirl...is there any recommend settings for HDR?

[karmic thicket]

see pinned but could change tomorrow i guess in theory

[runic crow]

wow, but that is still a pretty low frame rate for doom

[simple ivy]

I'm surprised the performance penalty isn't greater.
We're still talking about thousands of rays per pixel with who knows how many bounces.

Still though, seems like an inherently silly idea to enable in a Doom game unless you own a 4090/5090

[gaunt light]

@wide pawn my cpu mounting was borked, so it was actually running at pcie x8

this is the actual fps i get with 590.10 driver

it was 147-148 fps at pcie 5.0 x8

previous driver was 144 fps iirc

and i bought a new 9800x3d lol, which can do 5.55ghz or even 5.6ghz

[gaunt light]

PT pulls way more power

LOL 4K MAX FG require 21GB vram

[wide pawn]

600W wtf, are you PL and undervolting? Doom was running at 300w for me with MFG 4x ultra settings

[gaunt light]

PT requires 20% more power

[wide pawn]

This is no FG?

[gaunt light]

ya

no FG

doom is not power hungry without PT

but with PT its mostly the same as indi

this is with FG and dlss performance mode and my uv profile

[gaunt light]

standard RT / PT

[white talon]

@gaunt light did you overclock your 9800X3D or using PBO?

[gaunt light]

manual oc

the max clock speed you can get from PBO is 5425 mhz

unless you play with ECLK

this is my memory setup btw

[karmic thicket]

the update is out?

or no update

[gaunt light]

ya

[wild osprey]

@gaunt light have you guys tried “hydra” app for oc ? 😁

[gaunt light]

i use manual oc so its useless for me

[wild osprey]

Actually it’s amazing with automating whole oc/uv per core process, so after 3 hours you’ve got best and stable values u can use later on 😁

[sterile stag]

is there much of a benefit from OC the 9800X3D?

[wild osprey]

For gaming probably not much of a difference if any, it’s rather for some heavy workloads

[covert shard]

@gaunt light is ray reconstruction totally fucked for you too?

its makes horrible noise on transparency

[sterile stag]

just to clarify you install reshade with DX12 not vulkan for DTDA?

[gaunt light]

sometimes

PT does look noisier than RT

[gaunt light]

my current setup is 10% faster than "my stock"

my stock is paired with 6000c26 memory

and set to expo tweaked on asus mb which tightens some timing for you

this only average fps

im also using a custom power plan that increases the performance in some games by a few percent

[covert shard]

Load up the beginning of sentinel command station

The elevator is horrible

Doesn’t seem to happen with the regular denoiser but ray reconstruction is obviously better everywhere other than transparency

[white talon]

I just have PBO and AMD EXPO enabled. Regardless I feel like nothing is taxing the 9800X3D. Whatever i throw at it seems like its not even trying. My 9070 XT on the other hand gets a workout.

[gaunt light]

my factorio Flame_Sla's 50k SPM belt map (50x1000SPM) v3 score is 80 ups

if you own that game you can try how much you get

powershell -command ". { Set-Variable -Name 'URL' -Value 'https://factoriobox.1au.us/map/download/9927606ff6aae3bb0943105e5738a05382d79f36f221ca8ef1c45ba72be8620b.zip'; [Net.ServicePointManager]::SecurityProtocol = 'tls12, tls11, tls'; iwr -useb https://factoriobox.1au.us/scripts/benchmark.ps1 } | iex"

[sterile stag]

anyone getting crashes?

[gaunt light]

after playing this game with PT on for 3 hours

i would say this is probably most demanding game ever made

my 5090 can drop to mid 50s during some combat encounters

fps outside combat is a lie

this is with dlss performance mode

[faint bison]

Any issues with this game and SK?

[olive solar]

time to upgrade to rtx pro 6000, 5090 outdated

[simple ivy]

Anybody else getting reduced performance with like for like settings compared to pre-patch? I was averaging around 60-63 FPS in most scenarios and am now routinely dipping to the mid 50s.

Using 576.80 btw

[wide pawn]

Your pc blows up and the IRS comes after you

This update merged Indiana's window management into Doom

Kal is having an aneurysm at the problem it is causing and is trying to fix it

[spring mulch]

anyone else getting horrible noise with PT and ray reconstruction enabled?

this is a good example

is it cause i updated the streamline to 2.8.0?

another example

[gaunt light]

looks like dof

[gaunt light]

i was playing at 150% game speed though

maybe its more demanding than regular game speed

[spring mulch]

i think its only in cutscenes

i disabled dof tho to be sure

is the black level fix still required from reshade or did they fix it

[gaunt light]

guys i found what destroys the performance with PT on

shredder ricochet upgrade

avoid that if you are using PT

😅

instantly drops to the mid 40s

[gaunt light]

ya hdr remains untouched

[spring mulch]

does having reshade also crash your game?

i tried dx12

instant crash in load

[gaunt light]

no

installing as dxgi works for me

[spring mulch]

i reinstalled and it worked for me

are the cutscenes also super grainy for you?

[covert shard]

For me it’s glass that’s really noisy

But I haven’t checked many cutscenes actually

[spring mulch]

yes the glass looks horrible

or anything transparent like water

just unbelivable amount of noise

im also using rcas sharpening at 4k dlss balanced

[gaunt light]

reminds me of spiderman 2

same issue with RR

[gaunt light]

lol they literally recommend 5090 for 4k pt

[karmic thicket]

well yeah, shit is heavy af and needs 24GB VRAM, funny how they didnt change CPU between Min and Ultra though, despite RT being heavy as fuck on the CPU

[faint bison]

soooo is that a no SK causes issues?

not sure what your answer was there 🙂 you just said Kal is trying to fix it

[faint bison]

you need 24gb vram for PT at 4k? Even with DLSS performance?

[karmic thicket]

that's what it says

i havent tested it myself

[faint bison]

i'll test it eventually

Spec requirement sheets are often complete made up bullshit

lol

[karmic thicket]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdaEqTZg3jY

[faint bison]

Is that 4k PT? Cause it's showing 14-15gb vram usage, not 24

[karmic thicket]

idk dude

dlss balanced, pt is on

[faint bison]

it's possible other areas of the game use more vram

[karmic thicket]

yeah

[faint bison]

But this video looks promising

i have a 4080 and i'd like to play at 4K PT, if that's possible

using DLSS performance

but idk

[karmic thicket]

i dont know if bro pressed apply though 👀

[faint bison]

wait i'll just watch the DF video later

they made one a day or two ago about the PT

i had started watching it but didn't finish it

i'm sure they'll go over performance

[gaunt light]

not possible

drop to mid 70s or even 60s with 5090

Dlss performance mode

[waxen marsh]

Yeah that is really bad for a fast paced game

That’s worse than indy

[gaunt light]

ya more demanding than indy in combat

And shredder ricochet upgrade absolutely destroys performance

Can drop to mid 40s

[faint bison]

Ok cool i guess I won't be playing this game until the future lol

[gaunt light]

they literally recommend 5080 for 1440p dlss balanced and 5090 for 4k dlss performance

i guess even a 4090 will struggle at 4k pt

[faint bison]

Well on the one hand I'm glad they're pushing graphical boundaries. On the other hand, no way in hell I'm getting a 50xx gpu

[dark wharf]

inb4 "unoptimized garbage" on socials

[gaunt light]

game is very chaotic in some late game combats

so it kinda makes sense that it is so demanding

[steady gate]

I have, 5070ti, which is pretty close
only way to get constantly above 60 with PT is to run the game at 2560x1080 with DLSS Performance lol
Tested in the opening of the siege level
TL;DR if you don't have at 4090 or 5090 don't enable PT

[faint bison]

Haha do the visuals with PT justify the performance hit?

[steady gate]

not really

TBH outside of CP2077 none of the games that have PT on PC really needed it
AW2, IJ and TDA already have a very competent global illumination

So you are cutting the frame rate by 2/3 for a more or less minor refinment

It also doesn't help with the perception that PT is a meme

Something like FF7 Rebirth would giga benefit from PT, because the game has pretty garbage GI

I don't understand why NV doesn't focus getting PT working with the titles that really benefit from it

Because TDA is very much not one of those games

Especially since the game is designed around high frame rates and low input lag

[wide pawn]

This but in every open world game were the GI is dodo

Doom doesnt have dynamic weather or ToD to allow PT to shine

It is why 2077 will remain the defacto PT example probably until W4

[steady gate]

I don't think W4 will look that much better with PT over HW lumen + VSM

Or HW lumen + megalights if they go production ready this year

[dark wharf]

this in every open world*

[gaunt light]

imo doom tda benefits more from pt than aw2

but the difference is not always noticeable

[wide pawn]

Have there been any announcements for upcoming titles using PT?

Crimson Desert exists but Pearl Abyss were showing off their own RT implementations

They are sponsered by Nvidia but thats only for DLSS/FG unless... Maybe a future PT implementation?

[gaunt light]

has a lot of dynamic objects though

in combat

[dark wharf]

i think FBC Firebreak has pt? released just yesterday

[gaunt light]

And id tech is forward+ rendered

PT actually adds a lot of emissive lights

[wide pawn]

GTA 6 PT mode

[gaunt light]

probably the only engine thats not deferred rendered

[gaunt light]

the thing is cyberpunk doesnt even have a proper rtgi (only one bounce gi from the sun)

its worse than the witcher 3 which has a probe based rtgi

[karmic thicket]

there's no option in the menu for it if it does have it so i doubt it

[dark wharf]

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/fbc-firebreak-doom-the-dark-ages-path-tracing-dlss-4-multi-frame-gen/ idk nvidia says it has full ray tracing

aw2 didn't label its pt mode as pt either

[steady gate]

It's the same engine as AW2
It does have RT low/medium/ultra modes
but it doesn't explain what they are doing

[karmic thicket]

"full ray tracing" to nvidia is not path tracing

[dark wharf]

they just renamed the "path traced indirect lighting" setting

[faint bison]

And this applies even with FG?

[dark wharf]

fbc and aw2 have the same chart with diff names

[steady gate]

It is, they use the term interchangeably

[karmic thicket]

hmm

well you tell me if it has PT then

[steady gate]

FG will reduce performance even more + add input lag

[faint bison]

Why is FG reducing performance?? Is it broken?

[karmic thicket]

they specifically mention dooms path tracing so i doubt fbc has it

[waxen marsh]

It lowers ur base frame rate inherently

That’s how fg works

[steady gate]

FG does not improve performance, in improves frame rate
It does reduce performance because it's not free to run

[faint bison]

I know that, but the output is more frames. Yes i understand it adds lag

My question was if it's possible to run 4K dlss performance on a 4080 with FG enabled

I understand base frame rate will be bad

[karmic thicket]

you aint doing PT on a 4080, not at acceptable framerates

[wide pawn]

Its possible to play a game at 20FPS, I guess the question is will you personally enjoy it

[waxen marsh]

If u are ok with the latency of a native 30-40fps

Possibly lower

[steady gate]

You can, but the game will run at around 45fps anyway pre interpolation

[faint bison]

So base framerste will really be that low? Meh ok

[waxen marsh]

During demanding fights yeah

Can drop that badly

[faint bison]

I guess i played cp77 that way and it was okay sorta. But the lag would be more noticeable in Doom since it's twitchier

I can always try it

[waxen marsh]

Yeah cyberpunk it’s mostly fine slower pace

[faint bison]

Yea

[karmic thicket]

doom feels bad at 60fps tbh

120 plz

[waxen marsh]

Yep

[faint bison]

Fair enough

It is a very twitchy game

I assume performance is okay on a 4080 at 4K just doing normal RT and not PT? That might be the play here.

[gaunt light]

i finished dark souls prepare to die edition at 15 fps

😅

[wide pawn]

[waxen marsh]

RT is always on so yeah it runs fine without full pt

[faint bison]

What about PT but just don't jack it up to ultra nightmare?

Haha

[waxen marsh]

The game is very limited in performance scaling

From low to ultra nightmare the difference isn’t very big

https://youtu.be/oEC3G9GOZAA?si=faPVRcGS9_BcawkZ

[dark wharf]

this was before path tracing

settings stopped scaling after High

now that pt has been added they scale beyond and to UN

[karmic thicket]

the heavy get heavier

[waxen marsh]

I think even the non path traced settings all got heavier compared to pre update even the low medium high settings

Or could be the new driver causing lower perf

[karmic thicket]

nice

[karmic thicket]

probably just this

[gaunt light]

nah it doesnt

i tested pt with UN vs high

margin of errror

lol

[waxen marsh]

Yeah I was pretty sure somewhere in the new digital foundry video they mentioned high to ultra nightmare still does nothing

[faint bison]

What is the performance impact from high to UN?

[waxen marsh]

No performance or visual impact

[faint bison]

Interesting

[gaunt light]

nothing

[waxen marsh]

In the video I linked he goes through each setting individually

[gaunt light]

literally

[steady gate]

Going form ultra to medium still barely affects the performance tho

[uncut lion]

I tried PT last night on my 5080 with dlss performance and fg at 4x, it looked beautiful but the performance hit is real.

Went back to FG 3x and regular RT and game feels much better.

[steady gate]

https://youtu.be/KOg5wjkhJBs?t=476

[uncut lion]

Indiana Jones is not fast paced so I could lower the texture pool and beat the game with PT on but for TDA the higher frame rate feels vital to the gameplay.

[waxen marsh]

That’s not great

[vivid sandal]

Which is fine tbh, PT is futureproofing anyway

[vivid sandal]

It is just Nvidia’s marketing term

Completely invented likely to justify why the RT before as “real deal” is not necessarily the “realest of deals” and that there’s something better lol

And I absolutely hate it everytime they use that term 😄

[gaunt light]

guys there are built in benchmarks now

[gaunt light]

ya mid 40s during combat

this is the most demanding game now

[karmic thicket]

9090 will be ok with it

[faint bison]

I'm gonna play this game with normal RT lol

https://youtu.be/BR3c9lyV5as?si=pM3KC-fMthVbO5SB&t=416****

ummm why is DF saying this is one of the "lightest PT titles released"

did they not test in the right spots?

very confused

lightest in terms of performance

[karmic thicket]

Because it’s amazing you’re getting 72fps at all

[faint bison]

Is that 72 without FG? They didn't say

[karmic thicket]

They would state if it was with fg

[covert shard]

It’s without

[faint bison]

Polly above is saying he's getting in the 40s with a 5090

so did DF just not test a heavy combat scene?

[karmic thicket]

I didn’t see them test one no

[covert shard]

Because most PT games have a much larger hit on vs off

[faint bison]

hmm ok

curious why they didn't test a more demanding scene

[karmic thicket]

They were doing a live comparison

[faint bison]

But even if it's 72 with a 5090, that means much worse with a 4080

so yea

[karmic thicket]

You ain’t doing pt with a 4080

Not a chance

[faint bison]

oh i know

lol

unless i'd be okay with like 25 fps base at times rofl

probably would feel terrible

[finite kite]

just depends how low you're willing to drop dlss res lol

[faint bison]

well performance is the lowest unless you made a custom dlss res in SK or dlsstweaks or something

or if there's ultra performance

i assume it uses transformer model?

[covert shard]

Ultra performance is not worth it

Just turn off pt at that point

[finite kite]

ID's RT setup seems like the right perf/quality compromise really

especially while actually playing the game

[faint bison]

Well one day when I have a 9080 I'll play this game with full PT

[wide pawn]

brothers brothers, You dont need to play with PT straight away

too late, Br4t already mentioned it

It is nice for games to come with future proofing settings to revisit

[indigo wing]

this is my mentality, recently had a blast playing control with 200 fps with smooth motion on my 5080

[faint bison]

That game still looks really good

[indigo wing]

it do

[faint bison]

especially with the HDR

[indigo wing]

but hella noisy

[faint bison]

haha eya

yea

just imagine it's part of the "ghosts"

[indigo wing]

[bitter flint]

Even in PT?

[simple ivy]

Cracks me up that I struggled to beat Eternal's DLCs on I'm Too Young.. yet I'm barreling through this game on Nightmare.

[cyan canopy]

So this looks great, but like.. how far off is it from like a true properly implemented HDR? Just curious.

[dark ravine]

So if I'm running TB400 mode, should I skip scaling the paper white to stay at 100 nits?

[swift bridge]

i kept it at 100

[gaunt light]

ya they tested the second level

this game is very chaotic in combat later

plus they were playing at lowest fov lowest difficulty and default game speed

which potentially saved a lot of performance

[olive solar]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4_qvBxf3s0

[silent saddle]

the regular rt

[gaunt light]

PT definitely has gi, the standard rt doesnt have rtgi except that one bounce from the sun (and cyberpunk has so many lights) thats part of the reason why PT on/off is night and day difference in cyberpunk

[silent saddle]

it's also not per pixel GI, it's bolted on top of the rasterized probe system

[gaunt light]

there were no feasible per pixel RTGI solutions in 2020

metro exodus, which was the first game to integrate RTGI, also only had single diffuse global illumination from the sun

[runic crow]

the game is running like how it does on my 2070 super lol

[waxen marsh]

Yeah path tracing is still so far off from being playable for mainstream

Standard Ray tracing is finally now being playable for mainstream and it was first introduced in 2018 lol

[somber slate]

1000 has insane ABL, why not use TB 400

[covert shard]

Cause if you want 203 paper white 400 is just not bright enough highlights

I honestly don’t even notice the abl anymore

[somber slate]

What is paper white acc

Is it 100% white

Like the max brightness of your screen if the entire screen is white

[covert shard]

its the value of 100%

thing of it as a regular brightness slider

just a general picture brighter or dimmer

[swift bridge]

100% doesn’t mean max here

HDR is over 100%

100% is sdr peak

[covert shard]

^^

it kinda doesnt make any sense if all you know about hdr is from ads

cause hdr below paperwhite value should look the same as sdr

[ashen bloom]

Play oblivion remastered and it will hit you like a truck

[covert shard]

i have and it doesnt lol

[ashen bloom]

What’s your monitor?

[covert shard]

alienware aw3225qf

32 inch 4k 240hz qdoled

[ashen bloom]

Same

[somber slate]

no i meant

100% brightness value

like HDR peak brightness is 2% window

for highlights

paper white would be 100% window brightness

am i getting it right

[swift bridge]

no its unrelated to that

paper white is just a value you set to whatever you like

only rule is that it's obviously lower than peak

otherwise you'd have less dynamic range than sdr

[frank pewter]

not sure if anyone here watches vincent over on HDTVTest on the utubs every now and then - tho given we're in a HDR discord id be shocked if nobody did - but he used to have way more gaming related HDR content around, i wanna say, PS5 and Series X launch period and Ampere NV cards?

my actual point being he has had a vid in the last few days going over how to properly set up HDR on the nintendo switch 2 and it reminds me of this Doom TDA discussion so much

he actually has to include formulas/calculations for peeps to do based on their display's capabilities to work out what they should set stuff to in the switch 2 calibration menu

so fucking funny, and so deeply depressing at the same time 🙃

link to vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X84e14oe6gs

sorry, i know not doom related, but i hate it when others mention videos or articles and then dont include the link so... once i said it i had to add it 😅

[ashen bloom]

I remember Vincent back when I was setting up my hdr for when I got the series X. Found him really funny that he would just include random humor in the middle of his videos.

He had to do the formula stuff for ps5 calibration but for the Xbox series, Microsoft thankfully included a “debug” to see the values you’re setting the calibration for

press bumpers and triggers at the same time

[frank pewter]

dude - no joke - i guess theres really no such thing as "spoiling" a technical focused youtube video but he LITERALLY comes back to the series X debug display in its HDR calibration thing IN THIS VIDEO ABOUT THE SWITCH 2, because the easiest way to get the values right for switch 2 involves using an xbox

on the one hand, my brain's going, if even the manufacturer of the most popular gaming device on the planet cant figure out how to do this properly, i guess i shouldnt expect devs to be able to either

but then the other part of my brain is like, wtaf how tf is it possible that the hardware manufacturer of the most popular gaming device on the planet cant fucking get HDR right

its not like its "new" tech at this point

we've had almost a decade of HDR in games now jfc

[ashen bloom]

Because they’re lazy

[ashen bloom]

A lot though have mid implementations

[frank pewter]

it is really "funny" to me that every example i can point to of a great HDR implementation is either (1) a PC game that's been fixed by RenoDX, or (2) something like Horizon Forbidden West or TLOU2 where the technical implementation of it is wrong in like every relevant technical aspect, but the devs are just lucky that the default values when used on common "good HDR" screens end up looking good just bc it suits the art style of those games, even if the implementation is extremely questionable

[waxen marsh]

Iron galaxy hdr is slap 10000 nits peak and call it a day

[swift bridge]

its the same on console

naughty dog's fault

no idea why they wouldn't just slap on a simple display mapper

[wide pawn]

They made Uncharted tonemapper and said what if for the lolz we didnt do a tonemapper this time in HDR

[swift bridge]

There’s tonemapping cause otherwise the image would be extremely flat

Just no display mapping

Idk about last of us but in uncharted 4 it’s built into the LUT

[wide pawn]

so they made a whoopsie?

why would you not have display mapping

[swift bridge]

No idea

It’s extremely simple

[gaunt light]

no TV supported hgig in 2016

[karmic thicket]

last of us 2 came out in 2020

[gaunt light]

uncharted 4 in 2016

[karmic thicket]

So is every game just not going to have a tonemapper then

[gaunt light]

99% games since ps4 era

i believe this game is untonemapped

you can see how bad it looks in sdr

also this

[sterile stag]

anyone getting crashes in DTDA with path tracing enabled?

[somber slate]

Elden ring

[gaunt light]

TLOU2 did nothing wrong technically

its sliders being bad

Horizon Forbidden West default settings are pretty bad though

[sterile stag]

what's this on the steam forums, a thread claiming HDR is broken unless you enable colour blind mode?

[dreamy flame]

pre-patch people not knowing what gamma mismatch is

[dark wharf]

steam forums

[runic crow]

eh I don't know really

Metro Exodus didn't run that badly on my 2060 back in the day

[frank pewter]

I think that's a perfect example of why the starting point of these projects and what they want to achieve is so important - I have no doubt that if a dev studio wanted to build an RT only game for current gen consoles, they could, and do it performantly, if that is an initial design goal and the entire workflow of the project then supports that outcome

imho (noting im a layman so take it for what you will), a lot of the reason that RT, even PT, games are so expensive atm is because its an after thought add-on

they already built the game, accounting for a certain frame time budget using rasterisation

ofc thats gonna make it much more difficult to performantly add RT later on, unless you just throw a top end PCs horsepower at it

this is also part of the reason that im not really of the mindset that the current gen consoles need a refresh/next gen consoles earlier than past console cycles bc PCs have already surpassed them by so much

that's always been the case

look at a game from the 360's launch year and a game from its last year and the visual advancements without compromising performance are insane as devs got to a point where they built stuff properly for that platform

itll be the same here

we've yet to see many games on current gen that were designed RT-only from the onset - it's only juuuuust starting to happen

i bet as time goes on and more projects come out that were built with RT in mind from the beginning, the results devs can get out of the launch PS5 or Series X will surprise peeps

[gaunt light]

the original Metro Exodus had very limited RT feature

[calm shadow]

is this the updated ?

[gaunt light]

yes they didnt change hdr with the PT patch

its much worse than the launch version and you cant get a perfect match now

it was only gamma mismatch + bad sliders before

[somber slate]

Damn, but didn’t the launch version have raised black levels

[gaunt light]

it still does and its worse

its crushed and raised the same time with their cursed default settings

[sterile stag]

steam just downloaded another patch for this...208mb in size

[karmic thicket]

after the PT update?

[sterile stag]

yeah

[karmic thicket]

[dark wharf]

patching out denuvo already

[sterile stag]

denvuo removed, starforce installed

[karmic thicket]

https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/3017860/view/509583751892697638?l=english

womp womp

they trying to make people update drivers lol

[gaunt light]

lmao

PT options are really just on/off toggles

medium + PT shadows off gives you 10% performance over everything maxed out

such a meme lol

[vocal rivet]

What is the in-game paperwhite setting supposed to be set to when using the lilium reshade fixes?

[finite kite]

it's a UI slider so whatever you want

[vocal rivet]

Ok 100 looks good

[sterile stag]

man if it isn't doom crashing, its nvidia black screen

how long has the 5000 series been out and they still haven't fixed it

[gaunt light]

are you using FG

FG is not compatible with vulkan reshade (and you get a black screen by doing this）

[sterile stag]

not using frame gen

just screen randomly going black

[half junco]

The pinned settings no longer work with the current version?

[covert shard]

they do. what probalem are you having?

[half junco]

.

[gaunt light]

it is still working

but its not perfect

[half junco]

ok thanks

[covert shard]

i have figured it out

ray reconstuction overrides for some reason force reset d

when this version of ray reconstruction needs preset e to look right

manually set this game to use ray reconstruction preset e and the noise in cutscenes and a lot of the noise in game is gone

for some reason the nvidia use latest doenst seem to know about the actual latest

[bitter flint]

No that's not the problem. RR presets are funky - in 310.2.1, preset K was latest and E was the more stable and preferred. Now preset K is updated to forward to Preset D which is the latest but less stable preset E. So E is more stable but ghosts more and preset D/K boils more but has less ghosting.

[covert shard]

i mean regardless, Preset D is fucked in this game and preset E works great

preset e launched 3 months ago a good bit after dlss model j and k

The game actually applies preset E if you override everything except ray reconstruciton or northing at all

[finite kite]

ray reconstruction stuff confuses me, I hate the naming/preset combinations

[bitter flint]

Yeah I know, but I was pretty sure that preset K was updated to forward to Preset D now which is updated with 310.3

[covert shard]

they are not dependent on each other

310.3 was just vram optimzation and dropping the old presets

[bitter flint]

For SR, but for RE D and E are very current presets

[covert shard]

assuming you meant RR

not the hit franchise resident evil

and yes i agree

E being the newest

thats what im getting at

is the doom update is so new that its using E but the driver override still seems to think D is the newest and forces it back to that

thats why people were seeing horrible horrible noise in cutscenes and transperenct to the point of it looking broken

E includes more info for DOF and SSS that doom must be relying on

[silent saddle]

RR never used K, that's for SR. D was the new default for RR transformer, E is the newest for it

[bitter flint]

Thanks

[covert shard]

@swift bridge ight so when are you making the Reno mod? :D

[regal oriole]

man, this game dropped off hard. it was released, played and digested by a fraction of the same people that played 2016 and eternal, and now it's barely mentioned.

as someone who has played doom since i was a little boy, that's quite sad.

[torpid steeple]

i was going to replay it when the PT patch hit but then i was like... nah

definitely my least favorite of the 3

[regal oriole]

i do feel like it's missing a sense of charm that carried the previous two games, and that it takes itself way too seriously.

[torpid steeple]

yeah i dono. i just found it way less engaging and fun overall

[steady gate]

It's a good game that failed to reach the heights of the last two
2016 had a lot of hype because it blind sided people and was a breath of fresh air in the genre dominated by the military shooters at the time
Eternal pushed the formula to the love/hate point, so you have people arguing to this day about it
TDA is just... there

[torpid steeple]

yeah. it's just kind of bland?

[steady gate]

It doesn't really stand out in any way
It's just more of the same, with some parts reconfigured

It's a good formula and at the end of the day I liked it more than Eternal, but it just doesn't have the "it" factor

[regal oriole]

i just hope hugo martin's writing and grand design is significantly rolled back on their next game. i think he might've gotten a bit drunk off of recent successes.

[steady gate]

It feels like the rizz 2016 had is almost completely gone

No Mick Gordon plays a huge part in it

[torpid steeple]

yeah

[regal oriole]

absolutely. that pissed off a lot of their fanbase, swearing they'd never touch the game

[torpid steeple]

soundtrack was very underwhelming

story was dumb as hell

[regal oriole]

who is princess thira? why the fuck should I care about her?

[steady gate]

Actually, the OST is the perfect encapsulation of this game: It's fine, good even, but made entirely from the pre-existing parts, and you forget about almost immediately

[torpid steeple]

yeah

[regal oriole]

I hope whatever DLC they have planned is something stripped down and gameplay loop focused, without any faux open world trappings

and some fucking color, PLEASE

[steady gate]

The handling of the lore in this and Eternal might be the worst I've seen since FFXIII
Literally nothing makes any sense unless you keep track of the various lore documents across three different games

[regal oriole]

it's so up it's own ass, and an insane misreading of what doom fans value

again, hugo martin seriously needs to be reigned in

[bitter flint]

There are a lot of elements of Eternal and TDA that I don't think belong in Doom. The biggest things being the presence of fodder enemies and being punished for not playing the "right" way (like some enemies taking 1000 hits to die unless you hit their weak spot, or not getting health because you chose to shoot an enemy instead of go for a glory kill.)

[pale isle]

Are these edited now for the latest patches?

Jumping back in now to finish the last wo levels. 🙂

I know some updates changed some sliders or how they work etc

[swift bridge]

I’m tweaking my Indiana jones code rn, gonna check out doom soon

[gaunt light]

they havent changed anything hdr related since that patch

[pale isle]

Awesome, thanks.

[covert shard]

reno indianan jones with framegen?

[swift bridge]

up to crosire to fix it

idk how that stuff works

it's vulkan reshade in general that doesn't work with fg

[covert shard]

why is it possible to just use the dx12 reshade here but not with indiana jones?

here being doom

[swift bridge]

renodx needs vk reshade

[covert shard]

ah

[swift bridge]

cause its hooking into vk

to replace the vulkan shaders

[covert shard]

i see i see

[crude star]

It seems that I have the same glitch with Indiana Jones and the Great Circle, where the HDR levels in the system are lowered when the game is launched, which started to happen for me with The Dark Ages update. But the Indiana Jones and the Great Circle RenoDX mod fixed it in that game. Or it could just be because of the reshade itself

[swift bridge]

what do you mean hdr levels

[crude star]

nits

[swift bridge]

oh

ya

i replaced the tonemapper in indiana jones

highlights generally are brighter

[silent saddle]

Can you still use FG if you install Reshade locally as dxgi?

[finite kite]

Won’t work as dxgi

[covert shard]

im using reshade through specialK. is there a way to get that to load as the vulkan version? it defaults to the dx version

[finite kite]

Not that I know of

[covert shard]

damn thats lame

[finite kite]

needs to replace the vulkan shaders, nothing we can do about that

[covert shard]

is there not a reno menu for this one?

also it seems installing vulkan reshade alongside specialK doesn't make specialK freak out about compatibility mode so that's good

[finite kite]

idk haven't tried it yet (musas mod since that apparently isn't very clear with a forward)

[covert shard]

oh shit i didnt see it was a foward

my fault lol

[finite kite]

nah discord doesn't let you know shit about who posted the original message lol

not without clicking the link anyway

[onyx girder]

I enjoyed it but it is quite boring, especially coming off the high that is eternal. some reviewer said after a couple of hours your eyes just sort of glaze over as you parry another green light. its a complete opposite of eternal on nightmare where it's sweats 100% of the time. which turns off some people.

i went back to eternal right after DA and i find more engaging like on steriods sometimes.

[regal oriole]

my brother in law compared its schlock to Duke Nukem Forever, and I haven’t forgotten that

That’s obviously an insane thing to say, but also not completely inaccurate

[pale isle]

Is that something on his list to fix, or ever talked about?

It'd be real nice to be able to use Reno mods for these games, but no FG just kills it

[swift bridge]

Idk if renodx supports that for vulkan. DOOM has native hdr so I’m just hooking into that and replacing the tonemapper

[swift bridge]

No idea

I mentioned it once on the server

No response

[pale isle]

I finished the last 3 missions of DOOM yesterday, finally after I got away from playing Dune for a minute.

And would move to use RenoDX with PT once DLCs hit.

But no FG is just gonna kill that plan.

[night plover]

not sure if it gets fg fixed but there's some vulkan support improvements 😄

[faint bison]

I watched a 1.5 hour video on youtube that goes through every piece of lore, in order, and I can tell you it still made absolutely zero sense after 2016

completely nonsensical and incoherent

reminded me of Halo lore post Halo 3

just absolute nonsense

Doom 3 = best doom game. Prove me wrong.

[covert shard]

I’m not really sure what to say other than skill issue

What doesn’t make sense

It’s complicated but it is lore that makes sense

Or do you just mean that you don’t like it?

[faint bison]

You can't tell people they have "skill issues" just because they say something you disagree with.......

and what i'm saying is it gets really boring and random

it's like beating a dead horse lore

just slop on top of slop "then this happened. then this happened. then this happened."

uninteresting lore for the sake of lore

just like Halo. After halo 3 the lore goes from really cool to zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[covert shard]

I said skill issue because I thought you meant you couldn’t understand it

Not that you just didn’t like it

I thought you just didn’t get it lol

[regal oriole]

I’m just waiting for Hugo Martin’s inevitable announcement that he’s “moving on”.

then Peter Molyneux takes over as creative director, and we can have a Doom game with moral choice systems. - “Every demon has a simulated life before you meet them!”

“You can transform hell itself into heaven!”

[faint bison]

No you thought correct. That's how I worded the post, haha. Sorry, I guess it was like - I felt it was so boring that it all blended together into some nonsensical storyline that takes a shit after 2016

but you know, that's my opinion

if you enjoyed it then that's solid

honestly i kinda thought it got boring after like doom 2

is dark ages a prequel?

or a sequel?

i dont even know

[covert shard]

dark ages is a prequil

its a lead up into 2016

well theres a still a bit of a gap but theres dlc and such still

[faint bison]

to be fair Doom was about the atmosphere, music, gameplay. The story was never its selling point

i mean the story was always interesting

but it was about the gameplay

[covert shard]

the dark ages is also easily the best stroy of the games

in a vacum is for sure the strongest

eternal was really good but you had to stop and read codex to get all the detail so

[faint bison]

i honestly really enjoyed eternal

it was really fun

[covert shard]

the gameplay is amazing yeah

[faint bison]

no real complaints. not a huge fan of the story becoming more like aliens/fantasy though but whatever. like i said, it's all nonsense

[covert shard]

i also enjoyed eternal :)

i was talking about the story specifcally

eternals story is really good if you actually know all the detials

you just have to stop and read the codex

its a delivery issue

[steady gate]

It has the best presentation of the story

but the story itself is kinda nothing burger

[covert shard]

its just fun action stroy

story

its exactly what it wants to be

imo

i think a well executed similier stroy in doom is the ideal

[daring gulch]

Personally Eternal is my all-time fav shooter, absolute peak nothing touches that gameplay loop for me it's almost perfect.

I really love the melee + shield addition in Dark Ages tho. Punching on with the big guys I just love it. Really excited to see the indie shooters that iterate on it

Eternal ruined a lot of earlier shooters for me, and Dark Ages had to hard pivot. I'm glad they took a chance and really enjoy what we got (gameplay wise, lore is fine I don't care either way about it)

[open pine]

theyre really good games if you just ignore the stupid lore

doom 3 is okay but i wouldnt take it over the newer ones

[somber slate]

It would e been so good had they gotten Trent reznor

[daring gulch]

I do like the music a lot, but after Mick's magic it is a step down

I especially love punching Mancubii, I've been killing them since 1994 and it feels cool having this new way of fighting them

[regal oriole]

the game is so much more enjoyable without slomo, keeping a steady gameplay flow throughout. definitely worth trying if you felt like the gameplay loop wasn't really working for you.
https://www.nexusmods.com/doomthedarkages/mods/4

[swift bridge]

one thing that makes sekiro so much better than god of war, jedi survivor, and the various other clones is the lack of slow mo

def gonna try that out

[daring gulch]

They are looking to implement this as an option officially, I was gonna wait for that

[gaunt light]

have you played metal gear rising

[swift bridge]

a long time ago

great game

[gaunt light]

ya i like that game too

[gaunt light]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSC3ZWs6eR0

Highly recommend those mods if anyone interested in a second playthrough

[regal oriole]

Nobody likes the mech missions, not even any stray contrarians.

Having now played it with the slow-mo mod, I really have to wonder why that wasn't offered as a toggle in the initial release. Seems strange for id.

[white talon]

Will Doom get XeSS 2.1?

[dark wharf]

ask id 🤷🏻‍♂️

[gaunt light]

does xess even support vulkan

[dark wharf]

2.0.1 added support for it

and 2.1.0 mentions bug fixes for the vulkan backend

[covert shard]

There is a massive update coming for quakecon

It’s likely this Thursday

Reworking some of the mech stuff, balancing changes, blocking/parrying while switching weapons, allegedly a master level

Could be xess too but that’s speculative

[eager hare]

its coming officially in the next update

[gaunt light]

game is dead for me after the update

cant launch at all

[gaunt light]

well actually i cant launch any Denuvo game now

wtf

[daring gulch]

No problem launching it here

[oak kite]

Did you change some hardware in your PC?

[gaunt light]

it was my network

havent played those for more than one month so they required online verification

[daring gulch]

The changes to slo mo and the death loading screen are awesome, such an improvement

[worn scroll]

This is driving me crazy! Can someone please check if forcing DLSS K preset on Doom: The Dark Ages work? Neither this driver nor the previous one works. Only up to E preset with either the nvidia app or profile inspector. Before it was working fine!!! Greatly appreciated.

[covert shard]

it does

do you have rr on?

[worn scroll]

yes rr is on

I think i found the solution. I disabled the nvidia app and now it shows D preset for rr and if that is disabled it shows the K preset. Definitely uinstalling the drivers to get rid of the app and staying with nvidiainspector.

[gaunt light]

game uses preset k by default

no reason to force that at all

[covert shard]

It shows the rr preset instead of the dlss preset when rr is enabled

If you swap rr to real time denoiser option it will show K

It’s just an issue with the debug overlay

Also you want to swap to rr override for this game to E or off

Because the latest force reverts it to D and causes issues

The game was built for E

[worn scroll]

Thanks

[covert shard]

Of course

[wide jacinth]

▫️Doom: The Dark Ages

[plucky sparrow]

fuck... the newest update reset all my settings, how do i fix the hdr again?

also when i try to load reshade the game crashes

okay, going back to 6.5.1 worked... 6.6.0 was crashing

@gaunt light

Is this still correct

[runic crow]

idk, but I'm using that too

are you using path tracing darktalon

[plucky sparrow]

Yes

I had to redo all my settings though, the new patch wiped them

[runic crow]

yea same

tbf

it didn't have hdr contrast back in the day

hence why you have to go through this circus nowadays

[plucky sparrow]

Neat, when did rtss add that

[runic crow]

I assume you're using 4x fg?

[plucky sparrow]

Yes

The games heavy af

[runic crow]

and I think they updated presentmon or smth

cool I was trying to go for 2x fg at 226fps, but its too demanding

[plucky sparrow]

I've got preset E rr forced now too

And 310.4.0 rr and df

E seems to be less noisy

[runic crow]

j rr is worse?

[plucky sparrow]

rr only goes to E

when using RR, you dont have the DLSS presets like E,J,K etc

RR D is diamond wallaby, E is truthful shrimp

[plucky sparrow]

hmm using the anlysis, i should put the hdr paper white to 100

[gaunt light]

why is your cpu so hot

[plucky sparrow]

you consider 74c hot?

[gaunt light]

ya super hot

[plucky sparrow]

well my 9800x3d is overclocked

and i dont think 74c is hot

[gaunt light]

mine is oced more than yours

[plucky sparrow]

idk, its always been about that, my water coolers getting up in years 🤷‍♂️

[gaunt light]

ya thats it

aio will degrade over time

74c is the temperature when i do shader compilation in a 24c room

[plucky sparrow]

its a ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 280

probably 6 or 7 years old by now?

not sure

[gaunt light]

you should change it lol

[plucky sparrow]

eventually. i dont have any money currently

[gaunt light]

any cheap latest ones are better literally

[plucky sparrow]

https://github.com/clshortfuse/renodx/releases/download/snapshot/renodx-doom-tda.addon64

how come this isnt on the github page

[dark wharf]

ask musa

[plucky sparrow]

@swift bridge how come this isnt on the github page

[gaunt light]

its not a fully finished mod

the contrast slider was left untouched

[swift bridge]

Too lazy to add to GitHub

[calm shadow]

u monkey

[wicked patio]

u should undervolt it lol

[plucky sparrow]

It is

-10 I think? Been too long to remember

[eager hare]

the game crashes now after i installed the latest reshade

#WhatsGoingOn

[gaunt light]

game is heavily borked rn

PT doesnt work and you need to downgrade reshade to 6.5.1

[eager hare]

whats PT

[gaunt light]

path tracing

its completely missing indirect lightings rn

[eager hare]

wtf

whats going on breauh

[gaunt light]

no idea it looks completely broken rn

pitch black shadows everywhere

this was how it looks before

same location now

brightness is different because i changed my tv just check the shadows

[covert shard]

@gaunt light is non PT still working fine?

[gaunt light]

reflex is ultra broken on the lastest driver

your gpu usage will randomly drop to 80%

and no sk wont fix that either

[covert shard]

It was always broken but that’s unfortunate that it’s even worse

Is that only when hitting cap or is that all the time

[gaunt light]

before the reflex just doesnt work at all

it didnt hurt your performance

[gaunt light]

later

all the time

[covert shard]

Yikes

[gaunt light]

its completely unusable

[covert shard]

It doesn’t hurt your performance but it drops usage?

[gaunt light]

and it also breaks the SK dlss-g limiter

[gaunt light]

mb

didnt

i meant the old driver

[covert shard]

Oh I see

[gaunt light]

on old driver the reflex just behaved as not existing at all

[covert shard]

I see I see

I’ll have to take a peak when I’m home

[gaunt light]

with FG on

it doesnt seem to lower your gpu usage

but theres no way to limit your fps

[gaunt light]

well i think i didnt make it clear

thats what happened when you try to fix it with SK (thats the only way to fix vulkan reflex afaik)

if you dont use SK

its the same

reflex just doesnt exist

nvidia changed something related to vulkan in this driver

[desert kraken]

Can anyone tell me if the Reno mod from the pin still works with DOOM TDA, even after the HDR fix patch?

[gaunt light]

it only works after the patch

(didnt need a mod at launch, their fix made things worse)

[desert kraken]

Thanks - so just install the mod as per instructions in the pin. Do I have to change any in game settings or leave all at default?

[gaunt light]

mod isnt necessary with settings from the pins

they are literally the same

its not a "full" renodx mod

musa stopped playing this game

[desert kraken]

Sorry for being dim, but let me see if I’ve got the right - no mod / Reno. Use the in game settings that are pinned. I see the example looks at an 800 bit display. Mine is 1000 nits - what settings would you suggest.

Xeneon 27qhd240.

Thanks and again apologies for being dim lol

[dark wharf]

the last pin is for 1000 nits

and your monitor seems to max out at 800 anyway

also has massive undertracking and black crush
https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/corsair/xeneon-27qhd240#test_1560

[desert kraken]

Would you suggest not using HDR with this monitor?

[dark wharf]

it's OLED so it should be nice still

but you'll probably have to raise shadows to be able to see near-black detail

[desert kraken]

Thanks. I wish HDR was more plug and play. I honestly have no idea how to dial these settings in and usually just either use SDR or mess with sliders until it looks decent.

[desert kraken]

One more stupid question: do I need ReShade with add on support or regular ReShade?

[dark wharf]

with reno? addon support
without reno? either will work

[desert kraken]

It looks like I don’t need the Reno mod based on the pin - just the HDR shaders. Is that correct for DOOM TDA?

[dark wharf]

yes

[desert kraken]

Thanks for the help 🙂

[covert shard]

why do you use the brightness adjustment shader instead of tweaking the birghtness slider in game? i thought the ingame option was just linear gain? also, did we determine that midpoint isnt actually paperwhite?

[gaunt light]

the in game one is not paper white anymore

it messes with contrast

[covert shard]

was this an answer to the brightness shader question?

[gaunt light]

yes

midpoint is exposure

Brightness used to be paper white but they broke it with that update

[silent saddle]

is this fixed?

[covert shard]

Yeah

[silent saddle]

the last update to the game predates his posts

[covert shard]

Driver fix

[indigo wing]

got this game on sale and am surprised how responsive it feels with 4x fg

[steady gate]

https://c10.patreonusercontent.com/4/patreon-media/p/post/149272937/bf52be60983647fabff81542b22e9698/eyJxIjoxMDAsIndlYnAiOjB9/1.png?token-hash=-cttYGwOPAxirAf-RnSQlxfowYPaWgs-_INl-mamoKg%3D&token-time=1771891200

Reflex is putting in work

Though the high input lag might be an NV driver issue to being with

[indigo wing]

41ms is huge at 4x

[pale isle]

Yeah, I was glazing that shit to no end with Ersh when the game came out.

no FG and 2x FG feels pretty much same, tbh.

[steady gate]

Apparently AMD has less lag even without any lag mitigation

[pale isle]

4x fg you can tell there's a difference, but it's nowhere near as bad as you'd have thought in a game like this

[steady gate]

in CP2077 at least

[indigo wing]

yeah FSR3 is surprisingly good

[pale isle]

I was 100% ready to hate FG in DOOM cause of how the game is, but was pleasantly surprised.