beta-ptr-spoilers

[elfin eagle]

anastarian tells a good story: he stood up to the litch king and didnt make the people fall apart to addiction

[fathom fulcrum]

after i have seen what happened to the high elves... i am lowkey grateful how little screen time the gnomes have 😭

[fathom fulcrum]

https://fxtwitter.com/Portergauge/status/2036610287768653889 @jade basalt
I think mister Portergauge summarized it pretty well 😭

[fathom fulcrum]

the retconning is kraaaazy in this one ngl

[rain cave]

Is it actually a retcon or is it just not your fanfiction 😭

[tulip sun]

It isnt just the high elf stuff either

All overall is oof

[fathom fulcrum]

what u mean fanfiction

[fathom fulcrum]

Vereesa carrying Anasterian's stuff around and being his biggest fangirl is fanfiction

Nightborne being addicted again for some reason 🤔

I thought it got cured

[glass flicker]

Arcan'dor being a plot device the entirety of Suramar was built around:

Nightborne: "OK BHUT ARCKWYNE TASTE GUD."

[royal sigil]

Hopefully we can get a ragnaros return that would be awesome

[fathom fulcrum]

I wonder if there is a single Vereesa fan

💔

[glass flicker]

Probably those who like her for being a tattoo artist.

I mean, she did give Arator his tattoos.

[rain cave]

I am

she's been dealt such a rough hand

[fathom fulcrum]

yeah such as wanting to join the Forsaken 💔

ruff hand

I wish they commited to Blood Elves joining the Alliance and Vereesa joining the Forsaken, that would've been so hilarious

i am not gonna lie

[glass flicker]

A rough hand? She's literally the youngest of a great warrior dynasty. She has heritage speaking for her and more money than she knows what to do with. She's also been married to the friggin' leader of the Kirin Tor.

[fathom fulcrum]

well its more like Sylvanas proposed shed join her, but the fact Vereesa even thought about it is insane

[glass flicker]

Don't give me that "she's been dealt a rough hand."
Vereesa is super privileged.

It's kind of the same issue I have with Anduin. You're gonna tell me he lives as a lone wanderer in a raggedy-ass cloak? He's a king. Even if he self-exiled for a while.

[fathom fulcrum]

Well... not till Turalyon dies 😔

bet bros gonna come bacc, cuz HIS PEOPLE NEED HIM!!!

dont like Anduin ngl if anything they should have killed him off in Shadowlands

💔

[fathom fulcrum]

actually no, that would also suck

[rain cave]

she didn't?

[fathom fulcrum]

^ she did

[rain cave]

ah yes, raising her sisters kid after her sister disappeared, her OTHER sister dying but then also becoming a murderous warchief who commits warcrimes before being banished to the afterlife, her husband DYING her city BLOWN UP

[rain cave]

yeah doesn't mean she wanted to join forsaken

she was just considering getting back on the side with her sister

[fathom fulcrum]

she considered it 🙄

[fathom fulcrum]

well... the sister that disappearerd fought demons and voids for billions of years and her other sister is literally dead

she still had it better than them

[rain cave]

you're not helping your case 😭

she had it better than them sure

but she's never had much agency

responsibilities have been thrust upon her

[upper pasture]

And losing her only brother to war too

[rain cave]

yeah that as well 😭

[fathom fulcrum]

what even is this conversation about

pity contest or

[rain cave]

you asked if vereesa had any fans

[fathom fulcrum]

yeah she doesnt

[rain cave]

I said I am

it's rancid that she doesn't have a new model yet

hoping she becomes more prevalent in the story as things go on

and gets one

[fathom fulcrum]

i thought she did

also why would high elves even be a thing past midnight 💔

[glass flicker]

Yeah, she has it soooo hard compared to her peers. And I'm not talking just about her sisters. Let's see, what about Liadrin? 'Cause I'm pretty sure her backstory is worse. But nobody is complaining on her behalf.

Oh, your sister got a booboo and became a genocidal warlord? How about having to beat your undead father to death.

Oh, your sister spent a thousand years in space fighting demons while in reality it was like forty for us? Tell me again, how much is forty in elven years?

[pulsar minnow]

Idk why we’re comparing characters here

Basically all elves in wow have experienced some kinda genocide 😭

They’re all traumatized in some way

[glass flicker]

I agree. Vereesa, though, has little right to complain when she's been mostly successful in every aspect.

[rain cave]

and liadrin gets the spotlight, a new model, focus

recognition

[glass flicker]

Good. Hell yeah. Vereesa doesn't deserve it.

[rain cave]

so rude 😭

[glass flicker]

The most boring Windrunner sister for a reason.

They're gonna have to put in more work than a newer model with a prettier face and a cinematic to redeem her in my eyes.

[rain cave]

she's the reason arator is who he is

[rain cave]

gang what did she do to you

if she actually had spotlight time in the story she can cook

[glass flicker]

NOTHING. THAT'S THE PROBLEM!

[rain cave]

yeah that's why I feel bad for her

[glass flicker]

Build her up a little if you want her to have these things.

[rain cave]

she's had like 0 agency on things directly affecting her

[glass flicker]

Don't just give them to her all of a sudden.

[rain cave]

yet she's still there, still chugging on

I want her to get more spotlight

[glass flicker]

That said, I want all Windrunners to just be out of the story for a while.

[rain cave]

after midnight definetly

but this is sort of their expansion atp

amongst other elves

[glass flicker]

They've been cramming the Windrunners down our throats since Legion.

[rain cave]

have elves had too much focus in recent years? yes

[glass flicker]

They're not that interesting, you guys.

[rain cave]

but atleast let the blood elves have their stuff, they're cool

blood elves are imo

[glass flicker]

I meant the Windrunners.

[rain cave]

sylvanas was very interesting before her retcon

and bfa

I think they are trying to steady her character a bit back to that

but honestly I do think things are a bit more interesting when the faction leaders stay behind things more

and the story focuses more on a certain few more ground level characters

so that when the bigger ones are wheeled out, it's more impactful

[glass flicker]

See, I was trying to say that. And some dipstick was saying "THEY'RE MAKING THE STORY BORING!"

[rain cave]

an example being: Sylvanas was playable in WC3 so she had reverance to her in earlier WoW, and so when the whole wrathgate stuff happened, and we play hall of reflection with her, and we bring her the music box, etc

it's such an interesting moment because we can't know whats going on in her head

since she's in her own world as the forssaken leader most of the time

and it's interesting to get a glimpse into her mind

and whilst I do LOVE character moments, such as her betrayal of the jailer (in a vacuum, the storyline is whack) it's also weird how we then also have a cinematic that literally shows her inner mind conflict 😭

like it would be more interesting to me if we were stood next to her whils the two halves of her soul were talking to eachother, so there's still a level of "what are they thinking behind those eyes"

[fathom fulcrum]

another reason to hate her

[deep pawn]

So do we know when Xal picked up the black blade?

I guess that's also where shade of N'zoth is involved

[rain cave]

I assume she was just lurking watching us in nyalotha

wouldn't surprise me if we get a cinematic showing her making a deal with nzoth in his last moments

basically saying "I made a deal with you to save me from the dagger, I can make a deal to save you by putting you in it"

also I'd like to point out something interesting that somebody else has pointed out

interesting parallel

[dense plover]

It’s just a gate. I very much do not think they’re actually related considering they’re created by 3 different groups who are totally disconnected

[rain cave]

The first 2 are definitely intentional

Sargeras is a titan.

The design reflects a corrupted version of the design on the right

[glass fulcrum]

Now imagine if voidspire did the shattered sky like glass for the void to fall to silver moon instead of shadowlands doing it then doing nothing with it

Giant rift in sky but we need to use helm of domination to make a portal (please don’t mind the death knights with portals to capital city in oribos)

[royal sigil]

We need the screen sparklies that came with tww about last year or so

[remote shuttle]

The shade is a mount summon special effect, seemingly. No lore implications. Probably shop or trading post. To go with the new set?

It’s possible for another reason sure; that N’zoth the Corruptor model has none of his former animations and solely “MountSummon” hooked up, but I don’t think the evidence is quite there yet

[remote shuttle]

Just gave the model a new check to see if any changes;
File ID: 7734979 if people wish to check themselves.

[austere gazelle]

Blizzard should increase the number of crest required to upgrade a 2h crafted weapon with crest , it's very unfair

if you dual wield , upgrading your two weapon will cost you 160 crest, meanwhile if you have a 2h, it cost you only 80, wtf

[fathom fulcrum]

what if i have two twohanders

only for genius

😭

[upper pasture]

I mean hasn’t it always functioned like this? The limiting thing is the sparks not the crests?

[deep pawn]

That's why most people craft staffs if they can as casters

[worn crown]

That's disappointing

[austere gazelle]

Wondering if the Astalor storyline will lead to a new class in the future

[dense plover]

probably not

the astalor stuff is being written extremely vaguely so that prey can be carried forward into future expansions

which is now essentially a guarantee - though I assume theyll have to keep adding a BUNCH of prey targets with each patch or it will get a bit boring

[uncut vault]

thankfully the actual mechanics are pretty cookie cutter

and Astalor already has generic dialogue for groups like ethereals, DKs, ogres, etc.

so its just a matter of making unique NPCs and fitting them with the right abilities

[deep pawn]

I'll admit I'm not as impressed by Prey as I'd hoped

it's no delves.

maybe Torment affixes in s2 will help

or two prey at once

[rain cave]

I wonder how and if it'll continue though

like will we get a prey representative that isn't astalor

will they even tie it to the main story ever? there's a lot of theorizing around this being connected to denathrius in some way

[dense plover]

i do think they need to add a lot more torment variety

it should rotate weekly to new torments instead of just being the same ones

[ember blaze]

maybe if reception about the idea is good 🤔

[elder meteor]

You discovered our secret we've been hiding for a VERY VERY VERY (x a lot) long time! Thank you so much for the post!

[worn crown]

I think the Astalor storyline is going somewhere
The setting, quests and Astalor quotes seem to be too deliberate to be just an excuse for an open world activity

One of his quotes when we click on him is (as I understand it) something like "The Sunwell soon will be obsolete", hahah

Personally, with the Sunwell gone and this new Dawnwell (whatever it is) coming, I hope it could lead to a more edgy Blood Elves (like TBC), because I think the Holy Elves trope is kinda bland - but maybe it is just me

[ember blaze]

painter class confirmed

just like that dalaran painter

[rain cave]

So, I’m seeing world build to support an “Azeroth” magic type class. With either normal or hero specs for visions, (the radiant visions and ghosts we see, could be like a painter) song (radiant song like bard) and one other thing that I can’t think of

And I fully expect to see some kind of shadow hunter integration for the troll/haranir version of it, whilst Tauren are probably going to be related to the earthmother, earthen already sort of have this set up

I imagine that the main thing they’ll want to stick to to keep the fantasy more unique is making them fill out the “spirit” on the cosmology chart for playable classes

[rain cave]

Also since they seemingly want to add new mechanics of play to classes instead of just adding things with themes, such as evokers with charging their spells, augmentation is entirely unique in its playstyle, and devourer has some melee weaving built in

I’d expect them to add something new like that with a new class again

I fully expect it to have another support dos spec

Maybe they’ll bring back the stance swapping idea or have keys you hold down? Could be an accessibility issue there though

[noble mica]

Sanguine babes 👌

[royal sigil]

Dont forget the berserker, beastslaying, and blood draining enchants

[rain cave]

Those seem unrelated

Since they’re just visual components to a player profession thing going back before the whole conspiracy plot and cosmology thing was fleshed out

Because blood magic is separate from this aesthetic

[ember blaze]

i never considered hero trees tbh

but i like ur idea there

this reminds me of that one book the giver 🤔

[rain cave]

It’s something we can potentially use to predict class fantasies and if one’s viable for a playable class atp

Unless they do something unheard of and make the Azeroth class a spec every class can use a bit like switching jobs in ff14

Which I think would make sense and there’s a precedent for that within the characters we’ve seen exhibiting traits of it

[ember blaze]

i doubt we see that in wow tbh

[rain cave]

Orweyna shifts like a Druid
Verseesa is a ranger (hunter)
Magni is a warrior
Anduin a priest
Thrall a shaman
(Last two are a bit tenuous but the idea of everyone seeing the radiant visions, is important)

Plus the earthen it’s baked into their race

[ember blaze]

perhaps that means it's not locked to one race

[rain cave]

I mean I think it’s a pretty natural addition, since adding to the armour and tier would make things even more awkward for rolling. Plus it would give people a new class on characters they already have

And because it’s something everyone has access to, it means if you have too many X class you can swap some off to provide some unique utility

Especially if it was a healer or support spec

[ember blaze]

thats not something ppl want to do

and it also brings up the issue of... is your spec/class in a bad state, now everyone is forcing you to play something u dont want

cause it's just an easy press n and swap

or how blizzard is sometimes okay with leaving something trash because u technically have other options in your class....

and that class choice/identity seems to be important for a lot of players too

[rain cave]

People want shorter queues

If you give every class access to tank/healer, they can do that

[ember blaze]

you say that, but u still got people who would rather wait 30 minutes for a tank when they could just press N

and a lot of feedback i see is players wanting class halls back

and that class identity in the game

[rain cave]

Not everyone though!

[ember blaze]

a magic summoner class would be cool lol

with nature and stuff

[upper pasture]

i pretty much agree with tobi, being able to swap classes on a whim would be terrible for the game and seems very anti-"what the playerbase wants"

[rain cave]

I’m just saying for this one specific class/spec

Not broadly as a feature to swap between all classes

[upper pasture]

then why would anyone play any of class if you could just play this one class that can be any class?

[pulsar minnow]

Blizz cares a lot about class fantasy I just don’t see them giving every class an Azeroth ability tree or whatever

And I mean

We did already have the heart of Azeroth

[deep pawn]

I still wouldn't be shocked to see new artifact weapons

Holly today kinda soft confirmed we're going in another direction after TLT

also, add another song to the pile lol

new secret is all song related and to Beledar

[pulsar minnow]

Kinda praying we’re going back to 4 tier expansions and maybe giving the content cadence more time to breathe and develop more

[deep pawn]

Box sales look too good.

If there's room for 4 tiers its this expansion.

[pulsar minnow]

Agreed but I think because of the content cadence we’re gonna have everything packed into some big finale in TLT

[royal sigil]

I wanna use my ashbringer again, or apocalypse. It was the best

[pulsar minnow]

Like we’re gonna have Xal, Iridikron, Illidan, the Titans, Azeroth, and Silithus as the big focus and that’s just a lot of different things to focus on that makes me feel the world soul saga is gonna be backloaded

[ember blaze]

really? 👀

[upper pasture]

I think Xal is gonna be wrapped up this expansion and TLT will be on the fallout she created

[deep pawn]

https://www.wowhead.com/achievement=61516/radiant-singer

[deep pawn]

yeah, haha

[pulsar minnow]

In an interview a while back they said she’d still be around in TLT

[deep pawn]

I don't believe they said that exactly, just that she would be there past TWW

[upper pasture]

Also, dealing with the fallout of what she’s done is another way that she could still be considered “part of” an expansion or not. Like yeah we stopped her but now we have to clean up the void mess she’s created

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah that’s true too

My feeling is that either Xal actually does breach the containment of Azeroth and consumes her becoming a truly cosmic threat

Or we kill Xal and in her final moments she corrupts Azeroth somehow (maybe rather than consuming, merging)

Either way void corrupted Azeroth, and the titans come back to just completely order the planet again

[ember blaze]

they pull a ff14 and they transfer all the champions to an alternate timeline

[pulsar minnow]

I mean Aman’thul is the titan of time. How sick would it be if he starts trying to reverse shit

I still wholeheartedly believe if he’s the final boss his fight will involve us literally chasing him through time as he tries to literally write us out of existence

Would be nostalgic, themes and such blah blah

[ember blaze]

i like your ideas

i could see nozdormu helping us out in that situation

[pulsar minnow]

Then he finally becomes murozond then too

[ember blaze]

if the dragons come back for tlt, would be cool to just see the standoff between them and the titans

[pulsar minnow]

I forgot if they made it so Noz won’t actually turn into murozond in 10.1.5? But if that’s still on the table would be a perfect time to make it happen

[ember blaze]

i think we dealt with that

in that one dungeon

i cant remember

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah. They were just kinda vague with it so I forgot

Maybe I lack media literacy but even as much as I love that expansion a lot of DF plot lines just kinda ended with a weird “idk maybe it’s over maybe it’s not?” Or just rang hollow

Either way if they ever wanted to actually make Noz become murozond this is the time.

Having him sacrifice himself in the final fight to break the timeline and give us the upper hand against Aman’thul would be so sick

[ember blaze]

if we do go against the titans, i hope they nail the confrontation well and give us a sick raid

like the visuals for dimmy were great and his massive scale

[pulsar minnow]

I almost wonder if dimmy was partially a test run to see if raid bosses that big could be done well

I think they had to make a bunch of new backend stuff to make it even possible

[upper pasture]

not that he wouldn't become Murozond but he's made peace wit hthat fact that he does become him at some point

cause up until that point he's lived in fear of "the moment"

[rain cave]

If we get a time travel raid I pray for the council of guldans fight

Our timeline and au draenor fighting over the skull of guldan

[upper pasture]

best i can do is council of chromie

[rain cave]

There was a theory that TLT will kick off with an event that makes us basically “stuck" out of the main story for a bit

Like if iridikron does successfully kill them in the first raid or campaign bit and we go back to try undo it

But then realise they might be a mistake since they’re not our allies

[pulsar minnow]

Council of Vol'jins

They're just trash mobs that you gotta kill for the actual boss to appear 🙂

[uncut vault]

Unfortunately the actual story is much more lame, and Blizzard has confirmed that, at least at the time of writing in Dragonflight, the intent was that we full on prevented Murozond from coming into being

They can (and I hope they will) rewrite it into still being inevitable down the line, but in Dragonflight itself we just straight up removed Murozond from the timeline

[upper pasture]

oh huh, strange.

[uncut vault]

it would be so easy to do so, by having it basically be the long game of slow corruption

[upper pasture]

i always assumed he meant "inevitable" as in right then not inevitable inevitable

[uncut vault]

he starts out with just "well you can change time if you're compassionate about it" with Eternus and her friends, and then slowly delves deeper into questioning why the timeline has to be preserved as the Titans require

[uncut vault]

Nah he straight up says all the worries about Murozond are in the past now

[upper pasture]

oh that's pretty lame

[uncut vault]

and Dragonflight basically removed all the agency from him becoming Murozond, instead it was just "the future infinites corrupt him with evil time juice" lol

[glass flicker]

Why do they even need him? The Aspects aren't that powerful when confronted. Hell, we killed Malygos without a mystical artifact that requires all the power of the other Aspects.

The Infinites don't need Murozond. They just want to have him for marketing reasons.

"But Malygos was killed in the Nexus, we used the Eye of Eternity!"
Are you sure we did? 'Cause I don't remember us doing so.

[pulsar minnow]

they can probably still make it work. Its not inevitable but maybe he can still make it happen in a different sense

[pulsar minnow]

wow damn

||they are seriously leaning into the Shadowlands being fake plotline||

not what i expected from the quel danas finale at all

[deep pawn]

I don't raid til tomorrow. 🙁

[warm topaz]

i liked the cutscene

[deep pawn]

I wanna experience it in game, I may pug the bosses today for the hell of it

[pulsar minnow]

Agreed

I know porter is probably happy

||I really love how they’ve been handling Sylvanas since the end of SL||

[warm topaz]

the fight is also really cool so yeah, wait for it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_N6jbquCmQ&t=154s

[fading lintel]

OMGG sylvanas

[crude sigil]

kind weird cinematic ...

Some good points, some really bad points, need more (next major patch and after) to really conclude

[pulsar minnow]

I like that they actually remembered that death and the void have a unique relationship

[upper pasture]

So THATS why she didn’t have an orb in that one screenshot

[pulsar minnow]

I really wonder if anyone’s gonna tell the Windrunners to stop shooting arrows at Xal’Atath

[upper pasture]

Why? It’s been pretty successful so far

The key is she needs to be distracted by something else first then a Windrunner needs to take a shot

Maybe if we distract her and all 3 shoot at her we will win

[pulsar minnow]

I’m joking

The point is the arrow never hits her lol

[upper pasture]

Xal’atath is a pretty smart villain, once some thing doesn’t go to plan she dips, unlike most other villains who go “oh well I’ll take you all on” or something similar

[zealous sedge]

So 12.1 is gonna be the troll raid and 12.2 must have something to do with shadowlands that catapults us into TLT imo

I just hope the setting of 12.2 isn’t completely in the shadowlands.

[pulsar minnow]

There’s dialogue after the raid saying that the void forces traveled through the sunwell deep underground

Could be world-core or maybe Beledar

[zealous sedge]

Oh ok I’ve only seen the cutscene

Well that would be cool

[pulsar minnow]

Ur good. But we’re definitely gonna have something going on with the shadowlands

They’re fully setting up the Shadowlands being a fake plane of existence like the Firelands or Halls of Valor

[zealous sedge]

This is totally unimportant but I’m curious if they turn off the voidstorm

For immersion reasons

In the outside world

[zealous sedge]

Yeah Metzen is definitely retconning it. I wouldn’t be surprised if a .7 patch is all about the retcon. Potentially even tied to the one boss raid?

Like what if one of the mini raids is the primus 👀

[pulsar minnow]

I 110% am certain the Primus will be an unexpected villain of the Last Titan

[zealous sedge]

The first ones being robotic versions of the pantheon?

[worn crown]

I almost screamed "my queen!" in my most fanboysh voice when Sylvanas appeared, hahah
Now I just need Sylvanas and Illidan having screen time together in TLT - come on Blizz, I never asked you for any other fan service, heheh

[pulsar minnow]

I more so think the Primus is a Titan

He’s just been acting

[zealous sedge]

I could see that too

I mean we don’t really know how many titans there are

[pulsar minnow]

I mean we know for a fact he got his powers from Aman’thul

[zealous sedge]

Also the pantheon could just be the biggest and baddest titans

There could be lesser tiers

Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t zereth morris point towards beings even more ancient than the first ones? Forgot what they are called.

Maybe that is the off-ramp for them just being the titans

[pulsar minnow]

They’re called the First Ones. The Eternal Ones were the beings from SL

[zealous sedge]

Oh that’s where I got confused

[pulsar minnow]

Great naming schemes blizz lmao

[zealous sedge]

I didn’t play SL so I’m not super steeped in all the terms lol

I wonder how they will explain why the titans came up with the shadowlands in the first place. Was it an engine or resource for their grand scheme? Or a prison?

[pulsar minnow]

Here’s my crackpot theory and it’s a bit long so I’m sorry.

I think Azeroth is essentially a “First One” as in she’s a source of a lot of creation in the wow universe, but not responsible for the creation of the Shadowlands. I think she was overthrown/killed by maybe the titans or someone else, but she escaped in her soul state to regenerate.

The titans then searched across the universe for her. Found her and locked her up on Azeroth. This is because Aman’thul can see the future, probably saw his own death or something and wants to maintain his control on the “Grand timeline”

The Shadowlands are a way to keep True Death weak. Souls are plucked away by Kyrian and taken to the Shadowlands so that true death doesn’t get more powerful. (Isn’t it interesting souls need to be ferried there unlike every other cosmic plane?) and idk maybe anima is being fed back into Azeroth via the manifold to convert her into order idk 🤷‍♂️

The Primus is Aman’thuls brother/lackey and makes sure the shadowlands operates as intended.

Sargeras, Denathrius, and Zovaal are the only ones to find out the truth of what’s going on and two of them have been punished for that. Severely. Zovaal was dominated all throughout Shadowlands and we had no idea (I mean his domination runes were literally active the whole time :P)

Also I don’t think every cosmological force has a pantheon. I think that’s just a Titan thing. But my thought is the big reveal at the end of the last Titan is that there are hundreds of thousands of worlds out there dominated by Titan influence just like Azeroth, and the few good-natured left of the pantheon will go to save those worlds and free them. Maybe Azeroth too

[zealous sedge]

That’s honestly not even crackpot that makes alot of sense

The shadowlands are basically purgatory

And we really haven’t explored true death

Which might not really be anything but a vast darkness that consumes all

Even more than the void

[pulsar minnow]

I would also explain why in the alternate timeline where Azeroth was completely Titan influenced it was overgrown with abundant life

There’s just no death at all

Oh I also think An’she and Elune are Azeroth’s literal biological kids but I haven’t really thought through how that works especially with Elune and the Winter Queen being siblings. Maybe she’s being kept prisoner like a bargaining chip for An’she and Elune’s complacency

[zealous sedge]

Also Eonar is a titan but she’s all about life, right? But I don’t think she is true life, but titan ordered life.

Perhaps she helped tamed Azeroth’s true life

[pulsar minnow]

Supposedly she has a (potentially romantic?) relationship with Elune according to some books in the emerald dream

So maybe that’s how she learned?

[zealous sedge]

Also I think the maw was a manifestation of true death in response to the creation of the shadowlands. It’s really powerful and I think souls who discover the truth are sent there as well.

[pulsar minnow]

I’ve always really loved this piece of concept art from shadowlands

True death looking like this would be so awesome

[zealous sedge]

I’ve never seen those before. That’s so cool

[crisp steeple]

why'd they have to bring up shadowlands again, just forget it happened

[crude sigil]

this cinematic have Jailer's end vibe

she need to find the truth before the end begins ...
WHAT ? Why so mysterious ?!

[crisp steeple]

it's so dumb

[deep pawn]

BEST NORMAL END BOSS IN YEARS

it was an easier fight than Belo'ren but so fun

[deep pawn]

Another week to finish the story though lol

[royal sigil]

I do think we might explore true death soon, because iirc there was no void in the shadowlands, just domination and death magic right?

[pulsar minnow]

Well there was Light in Revendreth, and there was a void incursion into bastion but it was supposedly a long time ago

I am really curious if we’ll explore any new real cosmic dimensions any time soon though. It seems the creatives at Blizz are avoiding it like the plague. Voidstorm is just a planet that’s at the meeting point between void and reality, Harandar is the same but with life, etc etc

[fading lintel]

Could you elaborate on this very interesting i didnt know halls of valor and firelands were "fake" , What does it mean exactly?

[deep pawn]

Firelands were created as a prison for Ragnaros

[pulsar minnow]

So during the ordering of Azeroth the elementals were a big problem for the keepers. They made the Elemental Plane, basically a pocket dimension and imprisoned all four elements within it, with different domains for each. Firelands and Deepholm are two of them for example

The keeper Helya used the same magic for Helheim and the Halls of Valor

[deep pawn]

Skyhold and Throne of the Tides for the other two

[fading lintel]

ohhh wow cool

Wait i thought deepholm was like in the earth ? Is it not then

[pulsar minnow]

It’s technically not. There’s just a portal in the Maelstrom to Deepholm

Ngl didn’t know that was their explanation as to why we got there via the maelstrom til I looked it up like 5 min ago

[fading lintel]

ohhh cool ;D

thx for expliaining

[pulsar minnow]

The “World Pillar” in the zone is what keeps the Elemental Plane from collapsing basically

[fading lintel]

ohhhh oki i understand

does anyone know if the void storm above quelthalas is gone after finishing the raid bc I’m tired of silvermoon being dark 27/4 ;-;

[deep pawn]

for now, we don't know what the new well will do

but it's a lot brighter

[fading lintel]

yay oki

[fading lintel]

could u send a screenshot maybeif u have the time

Is it like completely clear sky now

btw did we basicaly loose or is it just neutral now or something¨does anyone know

im eu so i havent reallyy completed anything from the new raid and things

[deep pawn]

mid raid, I'll send something soon

[fading lintel]

np gl and thx ^^

[deep pawn]

||Very sunrise/sunset coded and I think this is how the city looks if you somehow get here without doing the intro.||

[fading lintel]

OMG wow😍 It is like old eversong woods now , so gorgeous i cant wait

The voidstorm and sunwell battle in the distance was definetly cool though

[deep pawn]

We also have next week's story to finish the "Midnight" plot

and then we got nothing until August

[fading lintel]

oh right!

[rain cave]

something I like to point out is that Elune, despite being in the "life" domain and being tied to that whole system such as the dream, wild gods, etc. Doesn't ACTUALLY have any life magic associated with her direct influence

the three things we've seen her direct involvment in are, Light, Arcane, and DEATH

which form a convenient ordered triangle on the cosmology chart..

in fact the moon is the symbol of death on the shadowlands chart

and the sun is the life one

(specifically the eclipses, sun eclipsing the moon is life, moon eclipsing the sun is death. They match the oroborous serpent on the chart as well)

and it makes perfect sense to me if we anaylse the relationship and interactions between winter queen and elune

Winter queen takes souls that should be dead, and directly returns them to life. There's even a direct link to the emerald dream and other LIFE entities such as wild gods

but Elune, despite being in the life domain, when using tyrande as an avatar, mentions how she didn't intervene in BfA because she wanted to send souls to the winter queen. She let them DIE

not to mention the night warrior being very "deathy"

plus elune's spec, balance

[dense plover]

12.0.5 is before august

and so is 12.0.7

[rain cave]

Winter queen is life in death, Elune is death in life

[dense plover]

there will be story before august

[deep pawn]

Except we know there's no story in 12.0.5

and minimal in 12.0.7

it's the same deal we had in 11.0-11.1

[dense plover]

doesnt 12.0.5 have the void assaults? pretty sure we will need story for that

[deep pawn]

About as much story as the hallowfall crap had

[rain cave]

I mean we've been assaulted by the void since prepatch

no sunwell to hold em back I'm sure they'll funnel out

also on future story and potential ties to the troll raid

the giant snake we saw in zulfarrak which people are assuming might be connected would imply a deep underground cavern for said snake

and the raid entrance on isle of fangs is underwater

so could maybe be that the loa has been affected by the void influence?

[deep pawn]

12.0.7 will have some story in June, my bad, but that's still months away.

[rain cave]

and we need a way to get underground

[deep pawn]

https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/screenshots/normal/1267799.jpg

Notably the .5 patches don't mention story and quests

[dense plover]

fair

but 12.0.7 does

and also i suspect 12.1 is july, not august

[autumn dagger]

well tbf summer begins in june so

.5 and .7 should take place before that

[deep pawn]

July wouldn't leave enough time for Turbulent Timeways

8 week cadence says August

[deep pawn]

oh, 12.0.5 could be a week earlier than I expected

at least MrGM believes in April 21st

[little hound]

It is 2st. Now is the 3rd of 6th week of Voidforge Quests. 3 more weeks = 21st.

[deep pawn]

that's a big assumption we'll be able to use it that week

[glass flicker]

Speaking of MrGM.

https://x.com/i/status/2039236325778260070

MrGM (@MrGMYT)

In the latest build of the Patch 12.0.5 PTR, it looks like new eye customisation options have been added for Death Knights across all races

▶ Play video

X · Apr 1, 2026, 7:00 AM

It's cruel of him to tease us like this.

I hate everything today.

[little hound]

Same.

[deep pawn]

it's April 1st, don't believe anything today

I kinda miss blue toned Silvermoon

[royal sigil]

Cant u use the date simulator thingy?

[royal sigil]

Is this actually fr tho or nah? And when does sylvanas become a vehicle…. For lack of udder words

[deep pawn]

remember what day it is

[royal sigil]

Ik but video evidence plus references 12.0.5 instead of 12.0.9

[deep pawn]

it's still a joke

[upper pasture]

It’s just MrGM’s April fools “joke”

[royal sigil]

Rip me i shared so many places lol

[fierce sparrow]

we wouldnt get new eye coulous becuse its blizzard

[subtle oar]

We wouldn't because it wouldn't make sense within the Lore.

[fierce sparrow]

Mmhm

[fierce sparrow]

It would have been good i. Shadowlands

[subtle oar]

Not really

[fierce sparrow]

It wouldnt have made scwnce but it woulld have futted with the whole red bolvar

Like red eyes

[subtle oar]

No. Bolvar is special, as he has the fires of Life magic from Alexstraza coursing through him. That's where the red comes from with Bolvar.

[fierce sparrow]

Oh i thought it was from when he was burnt to a crsip

[rain cave]

There are other DKs with differently coloured eyes

And not every DK is from the “old” batch

Also honestly I think they could just add new eye colours for DKs in the lore the same way they’ve expanded skin tones were it’s just a retcon of “they’ve always been able to do that”

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/wowpedia/images/2/2a/Lady_Alistra.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20220704154709

Plus if getting a new spec to DH is enough reason to give them eyes to match that fantasy despite it not being the “original” fantasy, I think they should add the eyes to DK

Id get it if there was a readability issue but its just eyes

[subtle oar]

That's because it is. That fire was not normal. It was the Life-Binders fire, that is pure life magic in raw form. If you go on youtube and watch the Death Gate cinematic, you'll see that. So yeah, the red in his body has nothing to do with him being essentially a Death Knight.

[fierce sparrow]

he did it to stop the scorge

[subtle oar]

That is never an acceptable way to do lore. And I to this day wish they would have given us lore for the dark skinned Blood Elves. I would have accepted that they were Reliquary from Uldum. The "It's always been that way" shit is lazy and contrite

[subtle oar]

? He?

No?

Have you seen the Wrathgate before?

[fierce sparrow]

started in mop

[subtle oar]

https://youtu.be/Ch4rc5W4dKY

Here

It was WoWs first in-game cinematic

[fierce sparrow]

oh wow

so lichy fights them

sylvanas was pi$$ed

and forsaken gassed them ]

life binderssed magic fire to kill them

[subtle oar]

Not Sylvanas

It was entirely orchestrated by Grand Apothecary Putress and Varimathras to usurp Sylvanas for control of the Undercity and attempt to wipe out the Horde and Alliance And Lich King all in one fell swoop

[fierce sparrow]

oh wow

and then she joins them

comical

[subtle oar]

No?

[pulsar minnow]

Has there every really been an explicit reason as to why the eyes have to be blue?

Like Sylvanas and her dark rangers have red eyes, some liches have green eyes

It was really just a design idea they took back in wrath and we just kind accepted “yeah that’s death knight’s thing”

There’s really no lore it would break if they changed it

And it would still fit the class identity because it’s blood and unholy

[fierce sparrow]

Blue simbolises the good

Red simbolises the dark

How does that make scence

We may never knoe

[subtle oar]

Im so confused how you've come to these conclusions

[elfin eagle]

If I’m being honest

Considering that battle for undercity got taken out this honestly should be considered canon

If you want to play wows story start to finish

[fierce sparrow]

mmhm

[fierce sparrow]

ye

[rain cave]

I think they chose blue eyes for DKs so people could be like arthas, and that was back before they could easily change eyes since the DK eyes sat on top of the other customisation options as a vfx

[fierce sparrow]

what from warcaft 1 to wow reatil

[rain cave]

Like I understand why we only had blue eyes due dk before

[elfin eagle]

Like there’s no fallout from inter betrayal it was just an attack gone bad which causes Cataclysm war it makes complete sense in game context that way

[rain cave]

But there’s plenty of support for new DKs to be multicoloured eye wise

[elfin eagle]

The battle for undercity never gets mentioned in the game just war back in the menu

[rain cave]

Even if we never get bolvar style eyes which I don’t think anyone’s asking for

[elfin eagle]

Yes

Or just the start of wow to the end

[fierce sparrow]

oh7

[elfin eagle]

If you wanted ti do entire game in order

The only thing that’s essential that the players miss is battle for undercity and the escalation build up

[fierce sparrow]

uve gotta think due to charomie time u could make the expaintions in diffent orders

wo

[elfin eagle]

Yeah but you shouldn’t

[fierce sparrow]

wont make scence but you could

[elfin eagle]

They all connect and characters come back

[rain cave]

We don’t even need full on green if it clashes with the green fel eye aesthetic, I think red, blue and the maldraxxus greenish blue would be fine

[fierce sparrow]

like cata happens 12hrs after mop

[rain cave]

Alternatively, new eyes for every shadowlands faction

[elfin eagle]

Can’t happen: need Cata to explain war on resources

[rain cave]

But that’s a bit of an aesthetic clash

[elfin eagle]

And also tackles garrosh

[fierce sparrow]

mmhm

no soory

not cata

[elfin eagle]

all of garroshs heroic moments are in Cata (stonetalon, speech in the twilight highlands, Carine)

[fierce sparrow]

wod

[elfin eagle]

Oh and war crimes

But you can get that in a book

And it’s an engaging read

[fierce sparrow]

like mop goes from his trail to going back in time to dranor in wod ned even a ingame day aftet

[elfin eagle]

That could work

[fierce sparrow]

mmhm

[elfin eagle]

But gong start to finish is just too good

Seeing everyone come back

[fierce sparrow]

ye i might do 5 to 10 lvs in each

[elfin eagle]

Even side characters like socrethar or shadris the spider loa

They make random comebacks

[fierce sparrow]

cus after 70 u cant chromie

[elfin eagle]

It’s great

[fierce sparrow]

man df was great when it happend but now its shiz

[rain cave]

Socrethar is still the main voice i hear when i hear that voice actor

[fierce sparrow]

cus ur forced into it

[elfin eagle]

I stop the experience grind

[rain cave]

Like reinhardt is socrethar voice to me, not vice versa

[elfin eagle]

So I can do the raids and give a lil challenge

But soloable

But makes the experience so complete

[fierce sparrow]

how ]#

also

[elfin eagle]

There’s an npc

[fierce sparrow]

random

[elfin eagle]

So for burning crusade I stop at 36

[fierce sparrow]

gimme a race and class to lvl

throught the thing

[fierce sparrow]

noy bad lvl pick

[elfin eagle]

Because dmg isn’t strong enough where bosses take at least 3 minutes but I’m too high level for the boss to hurt

[elfin eagle]

Go in order imo

So start with blood elves/dreanai

Then dk as your prologue

Then goblin/worgen

Then panda

[fierce sparrow]

magahr orc

[elfin eagle]

Anything post bc

[fierce sparrow]

void elf

kul taran

human idk

evoker

haranir waw and mid

[elfin eagle]

You could just pick a main and treat the other race intros as the prologue

Man tbcs story is so good

Blood elves are so fun

[fierce sparrow]

thats expensive

190 for the race changes

[elfin eagle]

No I mean like

Individually

Just end after the starting stone

[fierce sparrow]

ohhh

ok

makes scence

[elfin eagle]

Let’s say tbc you main an elf

You do dk story at the start of wrath

To explain why dks join, then just be like “oh ok now back to my story

[fierce sparrow]

wait

arnt all human dk forsaken

[elfin eagle]

No

[fierce sparrow]

cus there undead

[elfin eagle]

Dk empowered by the litch king

[fierce sparrow]

depends on how lonk theve been there for

[elfin eagle]

Forsaken just falling apart

They were raised with no care

[fierce sparrow]

forsakenn dk all the way

[elfin eagle]

Litch king raised dk with care

I also think death knights were all soldiers before while forsaken were civilians

[rain cave]

I think the main difference is that forsaken are animated corpses while death knights and other healthy looking undead are more directly raised into undeath with their personalities

Even if they were bound

Tbf I could see an argument in lore that domination of any kind makes your physical body deteriorate more. Since undead who’ve had more free will from the start tend to look better than ones who were literally animated purely as puppets

Though that’s not provable and I doubt they’d incorporate that into story

It would line up with the themes of us being free will avatars though

[subtle oar]

Battle for Undercity is still canon

[subtle oar]

No, they are blue because it was the power of the Frozen Throne that raised them into undeath

[subtle oar]

It does

[elfin eagle]

Oh word when

[elfin eagle]

I know: just from a complete playhrough perspective it could make sense from that interpretation

Cause you can’t rlly play it

[tepid fiber]

But it still happened, events in the game reference it, characters reference it, storylines directly reference it and only exist to continue that story. Just because you didn't play it doesn't mean it didn't happen

[upper pasture]

Vol’jin’s rebellion can’t be played anymore but we still know that they fought back against garrosh.

[rain cave]

I suppose, but then how does that explain the newer DK's that don't have blue eyes?

e.g. inquisitor whitemane

[tepid fiber]

Raised through a different process. The Horsemen are more powerful than standard Death Knights

So not a fair comparison

[rain cave]

plus we have the original horsemen who have purple, green eyes

[tepid fiber]

Again, different process that made different kinds of Death Knights

[upper pasture]

Horsemen are exceptions

Because they are “special”

[rain cave]

but not all deathknights are risen by the same process

is my point

[tepid fiber]

They're wholly unique, imbued with power specifically for them and tailored to their own power and abilities

[tepid fiber]

Yes, which is why different DKs are different

[rain cave]

not all DK's are from the frozen throne

[tepid fiber]

Correct

There's more than one way to make a Death Knight

And more than one kind of Death Knight

Same for all of the other classes, too

[rain cave]

so why not more eye colours for DK's

if the answer of "playable DK's aren't the type of dk's with the different eyes" then just, change that so that playable Dk's also include that

we had the before

with belf/velf

andthe human elf ears

and even things like adding troll druids, tauren paladins, etc

more troll skin tones

more nelf skin tones..

[subtle oar]

Because the playable DKs are not special

They are the rank and file DK

[rain cave]

canonically we are the deathlord no?

but also there are rank and file DK's who are not frozen throne based

or have blue eyes

[subtle oar]

No

[elfin eagle]

Italicizing things dosent make you smart

I asked what refs mention it

I didn’t see any

Also: making up lies really isn’t good look yk

Like I get people like you get fired up over your game but there was no reason to get all defensive I never said it didn’t happen I just said you could play the story and try to fit things to frame a vision cause content got removed 💀

[rain cave]

there's a WoD NPC who's a pandaren death knight and I believe she mentions teaching herself

or atleast she's evidence of DK's still being made not by the lich king before the BfA fourth war

[elfin eagle]

Different context

Cause you visibly see the rebellion in 5.4 raid plus you get the escalation questline which includes the emperor

And you get the scenarios

[upper pasture]

Not really, they are both events that happened in the past. Both are still referenced throughout quests and npcs

[elfin eagle]

You could do the scenarios be like “oh shit garrosh the dark heart” go to the emperor questline Learn about pride then 5.4 cinematic

It all fits

BfU has nothing

Ik gilneas bring up the plague

Ahd its affects

[upper pasture]

Isn’t the battle of undercity still part of the BfA intro?

[elfin eagle]

And of course you get sylvanas speech in silver pine but it’s just

[elfin eagle]

No I’m talking about wrath

[upper pasture]

Ah

[elfin eagle]

If you do wolkt timewalking it goes wrath gate then nothing

With no continuation

[upper pasture]

That’s just decades old writing at this point

[elfin eagle]

From what I can reminder there’s no ref to it in cataclysm

[upper pasture]

Where we were still just in the “rule of cool” story telling

[elfin eagle]

Just harmful affects of the plague

And no real mention of putees and varimathras

Vari yes putress no

[elfin eagle]

Idk tbc was extremely well written

The blood elf’s in particular

[tepid fiber]

It was used for sparing emphasis, stop projecting. I was explaining, not defensively arguing

It's also referenced throughout BFA, as well as both the Forsaken heritage questline and reclamation of the Ruins of Lordaeron questline

[tepid fiber]

What "lies" did I make up?

[elfin eagle]

Suffering through the addiction - then try to find the prince - then find a rebellion - then betrayal and reveal through sicrethar - then pact with kil at shadow moon

[elfin eagle]

I don’t think anything can be gained from this so I’m not gonna communicate I’m sorry: I’m moving on

[tepid fiber]

Right...

My original point still stands. Even if you didn't play an event, the event still happened and is still canon and is referenced in canon and later storylines

I'd still like to know where I was "making up lies" but sure

[pulsar minnow]

We literally had two cinematics based around the battle for lordaeron

its very canon lol even if not playable anymore

[subtle oar]

Yeah no possible

[elfin eagle]

Wait which cinematics

[tepid fiber]

He's refering to the recruitable follower Gravewalker Gie

[elfin eagle]

Genuinely I’m asking

[pulsar minnow]

Saurfang

BFA cinematic

Jaina's return

[tepid fiber]

https://youtu.be/jSJr3dXZfcg?si=hDwUwpiat4pw_lcB

The intro cinematic for BFA

Turn The Tide: https://youtu.be/3CGBLVNpoKo?si=nwPLelHi5SWlHKz0

[elfin eagle]

Wrong one

Wrath gate

I think that one is still playable

[pulsar minnow]

?

[tepid fiber]

https://youtu.be/Ch4rc5W4dKY?si=7qTYLoUxJH4cOQCt

[pulsar minnow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aW_h0qf9vpA&pp=ygUIc2F1cmZhbmc%3D

This is battle for lordaeron man

[elfin eagle]

https://youtu.be/thvM9fd-pJA?si=ipr3_JxMTt7fkETm

Please

I’ve said this 3 times

[pulsar minnow]

thats still canon dawg

all of these are canon

[elfin eagle]

Please read

[tepid fiber]

Also still a canon event

[elfin eagle]

You don’t even know what you’re talking about you’ve been under the impression I’ve been talking about bfa

The whole time

[pulsar minnow]

Either way all of this stuff is canon i dont know what your point is

are cinematic intros not canon now bc you cant play them?

[elfin eagle]

Scrolling up my point was that the battle for undercity in wrath does not necessarily need to hr understood to know the events of cataclysm

Which I said

[tepid fiber]

Even the battle for the Undercity in Wrath is still canon

[dense plover]

#beta-ptr-spoilers message thats because you were tho dude

[elfin eagle]

Do you not know lore?

[tepid fiber]

It's referenced multiple times in Cata too

[dense plover]

battle for undercity i think was referenced in shadowlands too

[elfin eagle]

Where?

No one has found a ref yet

[tepid fiber]

Hell, we even fight Varimathras multiple times

[dense plover]

hold on - gotta double check

[elfin eagle]

The only ref is varimathas vaguely referencing betraying syl

And there’s also at 3.2 ulduar cinematic

[tepid fiber]

Sorry, most of us actually played the content or are capable of accepting previous content we haven't played as canon

[elfin eagle]

That’s the only ones at the top of my head

[pulsar minnow]

yeah so we're just leapfrogging from topics now lol

[elfin eagle]

Still waiting

Ok so

[pulsar minnow]

for what

[elfin eagle]

When you guys do time walking lmk

[tepid fiber]

...

[pulsar minnow]

?

[elfin eagle]

Or check out the lore

[tepid fiber]

Oh so you're just like that

[pulsar minnow]

im so lost lmao

[elfin eagle]

You thought I was talking about bcs I’m not shocked

Battle for undercity is canon

[tepid fiber]

Idk Akira thinks he won because he's incapable of conveying his point

[elfin eagle]

A new player wouldn’t need to read about it to understand overarching tension

[dense plover]

plz dude - what is your point

[elfin eagle]

I’ve alrdy said it I don’t need to say it again

[dense plover]

im confused what you are even trying to say

[dense plover]

then link it from earlier

[elfin eagle]

I think yall trying to impress at this point - the energy is too much

[dense plover]

b/c - afaict, no you havent

[tepid fiber]

Yeah, it's not our fault you're not conveying your point across clearly

[elfin eagle]

It’s too much energy

[dense plover]

to scroll back?

[tepid fiber]

Akira, stop for one moment

[dense plover]

and post a link?

[rain cave]

but also my point generally is that we've had the definition of what a playable race or class is change over time

[tepid fiber]

You're the only one here right now on your side

[elfin eagle]

No, you’re trying to impress me by showing you know more when you don’t

[dense plover]

wut

no im not

[elfin eagle]

Stop.

[tepid fiber]

Multiple people--many of whom can't stand each other and constantly argue with each other--are also all in agreement

[dense plover]

im genuinely asking you to explain your point

[elfin eagle]

I already did.

[dense plover]

then link it plz

i missed it

[elfin eagle]

No.

[dense plover]

i just got here like 5 min ago

[elfin eagle]

I don’t want to do what you say

[dense plover]

🙄

[tepid fiber]

The burden of proof is on you for posing the argument or raising the point

[pulsar minnow]

nobody is here to insult your character dawg we're just trying to understand you

[tepid fiber]

Exactly

[pulsar minnow]

god forbid we dont want to read 3 hours of messages to know which battle of undercity you're talking about

[tepid fiber]

I feel like you think we're fighting you. We just want to understand your point

[elfin eagle]

I don’t think that’s been insulted, im just not gonna answer when people automatically assume a wrong thing

[dense plover]

https://tenor.com/view/confused-confused-look-confused-face-funny-funny-look-gif-4850532509577233362

[tepid fiber]

Akira, please, you're the disruptive one right now in the conversation. We're trying to engage and discuss this with you

But you're acting like a pidgeon shitting all over the chessboard knocking over the pieces

We're really trying to understand your point

[elfin eagle]

I don’t want to engage with you

I don’t think you’re fun to talk too

[tepid fiber]

I don't think you want to engage period

[elfin eagle]

You automatically assumed I was saying something was an objective fact

[tepid fiber]

What??

Where??

And you're the one accusing me of lying and making stuff up?

[upper pasture]

https://tenor.com/view/wtf-what-the-fuck-the-fuck-is-this-wth-gif-17571836

[elfin eagle]

Saying a subjective opinion “oh you can interpret this for your enjoyment because that’s how I did it trying to understand” does not = “I think this and It’s objective”

[elfin eagle]

Yes

[tepid fiber]

... What?

[upper pasture]

I’m just checking back in and now I’m confused even more

[tepid fiber]

Yeah I have no idea what he's on about

[elfin eagle]

Then stop engaging with me I don’t want to talk to you

[tepid fiber]

Anywho--how about them Warcrafts, fellas?

[upper pasture]

But you’re engaging with me every you say something like this. You wanted to make a point and many people don’t understand and want you to clarify it. And you refuse

[tepid fiber]

Negative attention is still attention, let it go, lets talk about Warcraft and canon events

[dense plover]

just stop engaging with them

dont even talk to them

they dont want to talk to us

[elfin eagle]

That’s what I want

[upper pasture]

It’s very very confusing

[elfin eagle]

Stop pinging me leave me alone

I don’t want to talk to anyone rn

[upper pasture]

Who’s pinging you?

[dense plover]

then walk away dude

[tepid fiber]

[dense plover]

jesus christ

[elfin eagle]

Eh

I can type

Just don’t respond

[upper pasture]

But I can’t? Got it

[dense plover]

"I dont want to engage but im gonna keep engaging"

[elfin eagle]

[dense plover]

you dont own the channel, people are gonna respond

[upper pasture]

Interesting

[dense plover]

if you dont want to engage its on YOU to walk away

[tepid fiber]

"I'm going to say what I want to say but nobody is allowed to respond to it in this public forum"

[dense plover]

not to just repeatedly scream about how you dont want to talk to anyone

[elfin eagle]

I can still share my thoughts to the world I just don’t care if people respond

[dense plover]

thats not how a forum works

lol

[upper pasture]

Honestly if you want to type your thoughts out and not get responses you should think about journaling

[dense plover]

you dont get to choose who responds

[elfin eagle]

That can’t go away

[tepid fiber]

Literally start a blog

[dense plover]

you literally cant stop people responding

sorry bro

its a public forum

[elfin eagle]

You can respond if you want

[dense plover]

you just said we cant

[elfin eagle]

It dosent really matter to me tho

[tepid fiber]

Except it does

[upper pasture]

The last 30 or so mins says otherwise

[elfin eagle]

It bothers you what I think? From canon events to engaging?

[dense plover]

dude you are the one who was bothered

[tulip sun]

If u dont wanna talk then dont post? Like??

[tulip sun]

Talk to yourself in your own mind

[tepid fiber]

Listen, you had a moment online and you feel embarassed about it. That's okay. There's no need to lash out, just take a break and step away for a bit. It's okay Akira (Now Taken). Just take a break and engage later when you feel better able to communicate your point

[upper pasture]

I don’t usually say this but uhhh….turn the computer/phone off and go do something else

[tepid fiber]

Unironically and full sincerity with all of the kindness in my heart: Please log off and touch grass

[elfin eagle]

Yall care way to much about me 💀

I leave and it keeps going

I’m sorry that I’ve put myself in your head like that: I didn’t mean it

[dense plover]

dude - not even 5 mins

[elfin eagle]

But it’s not necessary, forget about me and move on

[dense plover]

thats not 'leaving'

[elfin eagle]

I don’t need to exist like that in your mind

[dense plover]

you dont

i dont care

[elfin eagle]

You clearly do

[dense plover]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-rainbow-imagination-meme-idc-gif-17331659

[elfin eagle]

Peace

Should all be embarrassed

[dense plover]

dont respond @upper pasture

[upper pasture]

Correct, I am embarrassed for you

[dense plover]

just dont

[lone mantle]

[upper pasture]

Hello starman! How’s the future lookin?

[lone mantle]

Very bright, I suppose.

I read the entire thing carefully, and I’m pretty confident my brain turned into a screensaver halfway through.

[upper pasture]

Glad to see you’ve rebooted safely

[subtle oar]

All this because they dont know anything about Wrath or Death Knight lore and what their headcanon to be taken as canon kekw

[elfin eagle]

still going on

[upper pasture]

I can’t wait for more data mining stuff

I’m pretty excited for prop hunt too

[dense plover]

i hope they end up making changes to abundance - it would work better as a small group activity that gave more points with maybe a bit more time and higher rewards. Would also fix the lag

[upper pasture]

Have you engaged with it in the last week or so? They made some changes and it’s pretty smooth now. It’s not the chaos it once was but it’s smooth now and you can easily solo to the top rewards

[dense plover]

it still sucks tho

like, you have to do this boring activity 8 times a week

why is it not like 2 times a week for slightly longer and a more engaging activity

[upper pasture]

It’s not the chaos of collecting thousands of orbs in a fun little mini game

[dense plover]

it stops being fun after the first time each week

[upper pasture]

But now it’s “hit the 1000 mark get the upgraded level and afk for 2 mins”

[dense plover]

thats still shit tho

[upper pasture]

I do sorta wish we could do more than one shard at a time and multiply the rewards or something to save time

Even if it capped out at 4 shards that would reduce the amount of times to just two a week per character

[dense plover]

that would help a lot

[upper pasture]

Yeah doing it 8 times a week to get half your vitality for crafting stuff sucks

I probably won’t engage with it much after hitting renown cap

[uncut vault]

https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Bragor_Bloodfist

What is it? I've got a lot to see around here now that the demon's gone. Someone has to shuffle the paperwork and make sure we don't see another lapse like the one with Putress. Lucky me.

https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Overseer_Kraggosh

This pit stinks and I'm surrounded by snakes, but I'm here to do a job. Ever since Putress pulled his stunt at the Wrath Gate, the Warchief doesn't trust these people as far as he can throw them. That's why we're here. The Apothecaries can't do a thing without me.

Overseer Kraggosh says: I've got my eye on you, Faranell.
Overseer Kraggosh says: No abominations protecting you. No secrecy. No plotting in the dark.
Overseer Kraggosh says: If you so much as spit without my permission, this place shuts down. Forcefully.
Master Apothecary Faranell says: I assure you, overseer, the Royal Apothecary Society dearly wishes to make up for the tragic misguidance which ended so many lives.
Master Apothecary Faranell says: We will cause you no trouble. We seek only to continue our research in peace.
Overseer Kraggosh says: We'll see about that.
Apothecary Keever talks to himself in a nearby room.
Overseer Kraggosh says: Get that rotten nut to shut his trap!
Kor'kron Overseer says: Shut your face, you gibbering idiot!

[elfin eagle]

he dosent say this line anymore

i checked in the game

[elfin eagle]

this quote also says its been removed

regardless, i dont think a new player would click on the npc and think "whos varimathras" and get too conufsed on how events led up to cataclysm even though theres no way of knowing without google

[subtle oar]

Dude, you are literally trying to argue with a Lore Expert lmfao

[elfin eagle]

im not, they showed me a quote, i showed the quote was removed in the game

[dense plover]

removed doesnt mean not canon

[elfin eagle]

sigh

[dense plover]

we werent ever arguing it wasnt canon

[elfin eagle]

this again, look, i really dont wanna do this again

[dense plover]

so we are confused why you are upset

[elfin eagle]

just talk about changes to abundance

[dense plover]

its 1000% canon

[elfin eagle]

i only responded because of the ping

[dense plover]

we all know that

[elfin eagle]

^^

sorry

i didnt mena to respost the sigh

i meant that would repost the "is cannon"

[dense plover]

we know its canon

[elfin eagle]

im glad, i agree with you!

[dense plover]

no one disagrees those events happened

not a one

[tulip sun]

What's even the argument Akira is trying to make

[elfin eagle]

im trying to play wow i got pinged an hour later

really

im really Really trying to walk away

i didnt respond, lets just leave it at that

why dont we talk about a dungeon we like, or you two go back to talking about datamining, or our favorite quest

[tulip sun]

Stop trying to act better here dude. If you dont wanna engage just dont respond.

[elfin eagle]

ok so this kind of thing just kind of shows

lmao

i dont wanna argue and you keep bringing it up

were you all waiting just to see if i respond??

none of you werent talking till i did and i didnt wanna start again, so lets just move on

i wont talk about the battle for undercity anymore

[upper pasture]

We truly don’t know and they don’t want to explain

[tulip sun]

And they continue to talk despite complaining they dont want to

[elfin eagle]

i wasnt speaking till i got pinged

i didnt talk for over an hour

look yall just wanna argue

and i dont want too

[subtle oar]

Battle for Undercity was only removed because it was an absolute buggy mess, btw.

[elfin eagle]

yeah i know, it sucks i saw the kosack interivew

tbh i dont really like his take of "who would wanna see a solo scenario all these years later"

like...i would lol

wows story is dope and its would be extrememly extremely dope if we could go from defias chain or whever you start all the way till now

and have escalation/battle for undercity/war on tendrasill back

tbh war on tedrasill is a bigger crime then removing undercity its like a huge chunk of the elf story

[lone mantle]

Did you just apologize to yourself?

[elfin eagle]

sure

[lone mantle]

Don’t feel discouraged, I do it every day in the shower. It’s part of the routine, you know: shampoo, conditioner, question every life decision, rinse, and repeat.

[elfin eagle]

i dont

i take scolding hot showers though

like really really hot till my skin is red

i find the temperature oddly soothing

ig cold showers i do something kind of similar

[upper pasture]

https://tenor.com/view/grinch-self-loathing-gif-4779200

[lone mantle]

Oh, so you like it rough. I see.

[elfin eagle]

when i was in my late teens i would take extremely ice cold showers with my clothes off then peel them off then get into bed

[elfin eagle]

ig, the innuendo is a bit odd

but idk ive always liked certain senses, ive always been weird with it when people complain its hot it dosent feel hot to me

same as super cold

[ember blaze]

the heck

[upper pasture]

tiny AH dino

[ember blaze]

have they done this for a pet before?

[upper pasture]

yes

last time was the "bronze" murloc iirc. it's a "buy something from the shop, get ingame pet" type deal thing

[lone mantle]

He is aproaching!

[noble mica]

Is this real? 👀

[upper pasture]

Yes, it’s on the gear shop

[noble mica]

Where man? I checked blizzard shop there is nothing

[deep pawn]

https://www.wowhead.com/item=262881/lil-staropod

it'll probably be this

[noble mica]

Cute 🥰

[elfin eagle]

I wonder what the pet will be

Aww wait Dino star cute

[ember blaze]

@deep pawncould see a support spec for this magic

then its got a couple debuffs

[glass flicker]

Yeah, I can see a hemomancer class. Two damage specs and a healer.

It'll use cloth, though. Yuck.

[pulsar minnow]

Something I haven’t really seen talked about is speculation as to how the hell we’re gonna get to the WorldCore in 12.2

I almost wonder if they’ll make Beledar useful again, and have us commune with it to take us to the WorldCore

Or are they just gonna go “hey the earthen fixed up the Coreway, go ahead!”

[deep pawn]

They generally don't like making you go to old stuff like that, so even if we use it to start there'll be a portal from Silveroon

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah but isn’t the whole point of the world soul saga that we would revisit areas from previous expansions

Like I’m definitely sure they said we would do that

[deep pawn]

Maybe, but I'm still not sure they'ld make you teleport to Dornogal in Midnight

[pulsar minnow]

I imagine the portal for every day gameplay would be in silvermoon, but for getting there initially I could see them make us go to Beledar

Kinda like how for Argus we went back to Azuremyst to grab a spaceship

[ember blaze]

if wow were to get an arcane like series, would yall want the player character to be on there? 🤔

and what class would make sense 🤔

[upper pasture]

it would be funny if it was just like a bit, and every now and then there was an "adventurer" but not as a main character of the show

like picking up a quest or doing some odd player like activity

[ember blaze]

could also be like on some anime where the OP character is more of a side character

like they could end every problem on their own, but theyre not always involved in all the problems

but i think i would prefer just focusing on the game characters over a player one

maybe we just see them when the raid comes along

[rain cave]

What about ungoro?

Or perhaps even sargeras sword

We could also just, potentially try to use the sunwell in the same way

Maybe there’ll be a moment of realisation that they don’t have enough light users, but with all the elves assembled they could give it all their own type of magic

Nature, arcane, light, void, maybe even death depending on sylvanas’s presence. Even fel if we get demon hunters in

Then the sunwell is no longer a font of just one type of energy, it could be a combination of all of them

And that could even be an avenue to give Belfs Druid

[elfin eagle]

Aren’t we going underground in 12.1 anyway?

And the delve artwork was also underground for the mega ones: I’m sure it’ll tie in eventually

[rain cave]

I’m assuming there might be a link to the snake loa with that

If it’s the same snake loa that’s in that old dungeon where people got the idea it’s a really long snake slithering around underground

[elfin eagle]

Maybe snake caverns lead us to world core

[rain cave]

Maybe the “small” raid is proving ourselves to that loa, so it’ll take us deep underground

[elfin eagle]

Zul Jan + loa team up the snake takes us underground

[rain cave]

Would also mean it’s the trolls helping the elves

[elfin eagle]

Maybe that’s how it all ties in

[rain cave]

Liadrin calling in a favour

[elfin eagle]

Maybe the story is zul Jan tried to get back zuljin but then fucks up and redeems himself by working with a loa he hates

The thememing of midnight and zul Jan’s relationship with loa…it’s perfect set up for it to come together

[pulsar minnow]

Genuinely so weird to see Legion-era weapons getting remastered. My guess is one of their 3d modelers is a big fan of the weapon and just remodeled it for fun

I forget legion was almost 10 years ago

[ember blaze]

@deep pawn another one on the launcher

[rain cave]

To be fair, even though Legion is considered “recent” it’s been 10 years

Some of those models look a bit crunchy texture wise

Fun fact: we’ve had the remastered playable race models longer than the originals

[ember blaze]

and they could use another pass

[glass flicker]

I never did like the Night Elf models. Their abs have no texture, their hips are just wrong, and their proportions are off.

[rain cave]

They’ve added to them over the years tbf

[glass flicker]

Haranir look better. Pity their lore ain't better.

[rain cave]

But I do agree that races do need a look at

[glass flicker]

😂

[ember blaze]

haranir and dracthyr visage look 10000000x better than every other model

[rain cave]

Because atm new races are either “good and deep lore but 0 hype because they’re too similar to an existing race” or “ass pull lore but unique race with more interest in them”

[glass flicker]

To put it plainly, it's been 21 years without human braids. Vrykul have them, dwarves have them, elves have them, dracthyr have them, somehow they skipped it on humans.

"But you can have cornrows though!"

[deep pawn]

Interesting

[ember blaze]

the disgusting proportions on human male lol

[glass flicker]

Not the same thing.