beta-ptr-spoilers

[clear apex]

the outside limit is to not melt servers

if theres 50-55 plots? and each has 200 budget, i think the points are server load

thats 10,000 item point budget not including the set pieces

outdoor lights are currently disabled due to causes issues

you can make really nice stuff if you budget

[deep pawn]

I don't know if I have the visualization skills or patience for it but I'll mess around with it

[clear apex]

i feel like my builds are so boring compared to some people but i also dont have a plan and just go with it

[dense plover]

im certain theyll be working to increase the outside limit

it used to be higher and they had to cut it because it wasnt feasible

they want to have the best housing in an mmo - they will be working to fix this somehow

[thin warren]

New npc behaviour, cool

I wonder if it's also about mobs

And what they did with the fishes

[dense plover]

the fish have the same avoidance/active move ai

but there are a lot more of them

and they end up responding to players more often than other npc types

thats why the fish are a problem

my guess is theyll just switch it off for fish

b/c tbh fish dont need it and if it fixes the problem, thats good

[thin warren]

You mean fishing pools move?

[dense plover]

no i mean fish

like in the water

npc mobs

[thin warren]

Fishmobs

Ahah

[dense plover]

the ai isnt just for fish

its for most mobs

[thin warren]

Cool

[dense plover]

so like, a deer will wander an area instead of walking in a circle

and it may actively move up towards you or actively avoid you

[thin warren]

So they do more than wander around at the same place

Cool!

[dense plover]

yes

but the issue with fish is there are a lot of them

b/c theyre in a 3d space instead of essentially 2d

[thin warren]

Hmm, but mobs are mostly at the surface no?

[dense plover]

and they would activate their ai when you are a certain distance from water, even if you arent at the water

[dense plover]

fish are distributed throughout the depth of the area

this is not a river issue

this is an ocean issue and the radius for this being too large

i cant explain it any better

[thin warren]

I don't get why they need to spawn more fishmobs than landmobs

[dense plover]

they dont

thats not

oy read what im writing plz - this is hard to explain b/c im tired and about to go to bed

[thin warren]

Haha ^^ ok

[dense plover]

the amount of mobs you encounter over an area is equal to the amount of space available on average

in water, you have more space because you dont just have North, South, East, and West, but up and down as well

so the 'amount' of space is technically higher

as a result when players are walking close enough to oceans to activate this new AI in midnight content, it is bogging down the server

[thin warren]

Truetrue, but you can just spawn them at the top of the ocean

[dense plover]

which again, fish probably arent even supposed to have this AI

[dense plover]

that would look like shit

and it wouldnt fix the problem

even with less fish, the fish AI calculations are more expensive

[thin warren]

I see

[dense plover]

because the fish have those additional directions as potential move locations

the potential location points go from a flattish blanket, to the cloud

its exponentially more locations

which means much higher calculation cost for the server

which is why this might be part of the issue

[thin warren]

I see

[dense plover]

my guess is theyre going to reduce the player radius where the AI activates across the board and probably just fully remove fish from it all together

probably gonna make sure birds dont have it either just in case because they have the same potential 3d cloud thing assuming theyre allowed to change altitude like fish are

does that make sense now?

[thin warren]

But not so many areas with flying mobs I think

Yeah, I get it

[dense plover]

again, its not the number

its that one 3d cloud > multiple flat blankets

think about covering a table with marbles, vs filling a sphere with the radius of the table with marbles

[thin warren]

So one area is enough to cause it

[dense plover]

the sphere has so many more marbles than the flat table

[thin warren]

Yes I see that, but I can't imagine an area with that many birds

[dense plover]

thats whats going on - the data calculation for the 3d area is expensive

and thats for EACH mob

so 6 fish = like 30 normal mobs of math

[thin warren]

We will see

[dense plover]

i dont think this will fix everything

but im sure it will help

[thin warren]

I can't wait to see it in action

[cerulean patrol]

how do you make a new character on Midnight beta that's level 80+?

[pure wave]

U have at the bottom this small window where u can import your retail characters, otherwise u have to level

other questions, are there any some kinds of talent tree builds already out? oo

[dull sage]

Imagine getting lagged by fish when Murlocs are RIGHT there.

They can sort the problem out.

[supple comet]

PLS ADD "BIG DEBUFF" TO YOUR MAIN GOALS! @tiny granite ITS SUPER IMPRTANT FOR PVP!

[rain cave]

Did bro just ping a bot 😭

[lone mantle]

[strange umbra]

He did indeed

[cursive python]

Guys, I found some gears named like Augur's Lucent Helmet in the data but no screenshot or model in wowhead. Anyone can find it?

[lone mantle]

Perhaps it might be part of the Ensemble: Augur's Lucent Garments.

[cursive python]

Ohh, let me check

It's yes, but no specific items now I think

I don't know why or maybe just it's totally newest item?

[lone mantle]

Yes, it was added in patch 12.0.0 "Midnight."

[cursive python]

Thanks guy!

[fathom fulcrum]

https://fxtwitter.com/MrGMYT/status/1989321939207299074

MrGM (@MrGMYT)

In the Midnight Pre-Patch Warriors will be able to transmog their two-handed weapons into one-handed appearances

**💬 16 🔁 11 ❤️ 143 👁️ 7.0K **

FxTwitter · Nov 14, 2025, 1:18 PM

yaaay

I am so excited for Midnight... my Gnome will be able to use one handed toy swords

yippee

[austere gazelle]

somehow the blood elves managde to heal and rebuild all of their city and forest from the scourge taint, but somehow, the Plaguelands next to it are still not healed fully... mmm

[clear apex]

Could be a thing to revisit in tlt

[autumn dagger]

I think it's more of a "we're not completely revisiting this zone yet therefore no remake" but also quelthalas had the help of the sunwell

and the eastern plaguelands is also sort of the ground zero for undead corruption spreading to the EK

even with everything they went through, lordaeron/silverpine/western plaguelands are relatively ok

[clear apex]

I do think after 20 years or more, plaguelands could be relatively healed. They even have paladins there with lights chapel that could have been working on it.

[rain cave]

I mean who wants to live there it’s a bit of a fixer upper

[upper pasture]

I mean wasn’t the scourge there being fought off for awhile? Also worth noting that while the paladins were based out of there they were constantly being pulled off to help with other things too. We will never see real changes until a PC has to come in and do something there

I don’t think something gets named “plaguelands” with just a light touch of plague

[uncut vault]

the Sunwell is also a lot stronger of a force tbf

[glass flicker]

I do think the Plaguelands could be renamed to Northern Lordaeron, eventually.

Tirisfal, Silverpine, and Hillsbrad could be Southern Lordaeron.

[austere gazelle]

the sunwell is now explanation as to why paladins are still building that wall around lights hope and never finished in all those years and why all the building in the area are still under construction or in ruins

I understand the " we remake zone as expansion goes " but they could have passed a lift on those one especially when it's a leveling campaign

[glass flicker]

With The Last Titan taking place in Northrend, for the most part, I can see the expansions afterwards being a world revamp like Cataclysm, where zones would be merged, like what they did with Eversong and Ghostlands, and make a leveling campaign that is evergreen, taking players through the story of the game while seeing the entire world for its beauty.

[upper pasture]

light's hope has been changed over the years tho?

[austere gazelle]

well that wall aint building itself it seems

[glass flicker]

Arthas probably knew what's below Light's Hope Chapel in the DK intro, hence why every paladin and Argent Dawner came to defend it.

The paladin order hall is cool.

So, if in Legion, we had every paladin stationed there, and they stayed there with other things not going on, the wall could be built but we wouldn't know it, 'cause the player didn't do it.

[proper palm]

I realy love human (Silverhand) paladin graphic and representation, when i see silvermoon, i so want more paladin / light stuff in stormwind

[deep pawn]

There's still a chance EPL is our 12.2 zone if we have a 4 raid expansion and get Denathrius from the red mist

There's at least a couple signs pointing to 4 seasons

[elfin eagle]

What’s epl

Oh

Yeah

[deep pawn]

If we have a three raid expansion then 12.2 has to be Xalatath. If it's a 4 raid expansion we have more room to deal with whatever is happening in Stratholme.

But there is 4 vantus rune icons and 4 gladiator mounts

[austere gazelle]

mm maybe they need to redraw the flight map a bit

[upper pasture]

Iirc that’s one of the last things they will changed, that or it’s low priority rn

[deep pawn]

The map has lots of issues like quests spawning at 0,0 near Dalaran

[austere gazelle]

indeed

[upper pasture]

That’s even a thing in live

[glass fulcrum]

The boat from boralus to stormwind still puts you at 0,0 in Hillsbrad since shadowlands on occasion

[cursive sun]

may I ask how to open the new transmog UI page?

[upper pasture]

I believe it’s still disabled on the beta

[rustic cliff]

Has the allied race mount for haranir been found out yet?

[clear apex]

i think its the whip tail cat

[upper pasture]

The haranir lynx yeah?

[hard pagoda]

do we have option to get reputations capped in beta? automatically

[dense plover]

no

thats not what they care to test

[hard pagoda]

okay was interested to some of the engineering housing items

[dense plover]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

oh well

[hard pagoda]

some of them seemed to be behind Undermine reputations I think

[clear apex]

this is now the BM hunter rotation???

wtf blizzard

[clear apex]

8|

even ff14 lets you use 20 abilites if you want

and it has controller support

[upper pasture]

Well, tbf you have 6 more abilities on screen too

[clear apex]

sure but i dont really need those as much

[upper pasture]

shrug

[clear apex]

1-4 are my 'use every time' , traps are sometimes and bestial wrath is when i feel like i need it

and counter shot

[upper pasture]

I think bestial rage is kinda important no?

And interrupts/defensives are also important.

I hope we can return to a wow where traps/ccs are commonly used in dungeons too

[dense plover]

pretty sure you are missing burst buttons - the ones with the cooldowns

also all of the utility buttons?

more buttons =/= better

it also doesnt necessarily simplify it since a lot of the buttons before were - i need to press AB and C before pressing D but A and B are now passives because they did literally fuck all

[deep pawn]

Bestial Wrath is the CD

I don't believe BM has any long ones in Midnight

[tropic trail]

Man, I hate what they did with lowering the stats for the midnight expansion. It's making everything so mucher harder and unplayable now with simple slay type quests, etc.

[thin warren]

Shouldn't be caused by the stats

[tropic trail]

I hope they change it back to how it was with TWW, but idk its just damn near impossible to kill anything

not sure if this is a bug

[thin warren]

Most likely a bug, stats are squished for mobs to, so your relative power should be the same

[tropic trail]

I see yea, it ahs to be a bug, I keep dyign so much comapred to TWW

[thin warren]

What level are you?

[dense plover]

scaling isnt different - numbers are lowered on both player and enemy sides

what level and what ilvl?

[tropic trail]

80

[dense plover]

ilvl?

[tropic trail]

87

[dense plover]

yeah thats low

[thin warren]

In the beginning of tww there was also a power issue to fresh 70's, mobs were very hard

[tropic trail]

was a template characer

[dense plover]

do the intro quests, pull less enemies

get gear

strong ilvl at 80 is 120+

template is intentionally weaker

you are weaker than a live 80 because a live 80 is like ilvl 120-140 equivalent

[tropic trail]

i see, my main characters I use are around 670-680 ilvl. Hopefully that'll be ok for midnihgt

[dense plover]

stop trying to attack 5 enemies at once

this is how going to a new expac ALWAYS is

[tropic trail]

i see

[thin warren]

They did smooth it out a bit at the beginning of TWW

It was really hard

Not for endgame mains, but for new characters

[tropic trail]

what sucks is I can't copy my characters from the live build

that is also probablty why its so hard, having to stick with the crap template level 80 ones

[dense plover]

try again - they shouldve improved it by now - you copy account data then copy character

it may take a LONG time

like 10-15 min

for each half

[tropic trail]

yea I press copy charcater and click copy account data and I've waiting hours and nothing appears

nvm got it to work, didn't see the copy button to the left LOL

im such an idiot 😂

yep now at ilvl 122. much better now

[deep pawn]

Blizzard deliberately tries to test what a character coming fresh from levelling through TWW will have and that's closer to 80 than 140.

[dense plover]

yes but players who are coming from TWW endgame are used to pulling 5 enemies and you cant do that as a fresh 80

[deep pawn]

Well duh, it's always an issue since Blizzard tunes the first zone way high for what players first getting there will have cause of the expansion jump

[upper pasture]

I don’t think of it as an issue, more of a “retraining” of our brains because we are geared to the teeth and stuff is actually a challenge for a bit

If only each large content patch had the same feeling. world content after the first patch would feel fun and challenging

[deep pawn]

Few people want challenging world content

[pure wave]

can somebody help me who uses Dominos? So at the normal BlizzUI the dragonflight spells getting replaced in the Hotbar 1 as soon i go on a mount, with dominos thats not happening, any help how i can change that? Thats the only reason atm to not use this addon. (was the wrong screenshot before oo)

[deep pawn]

We'll see if Nightmare hunts are a success

[upper pasture]

if "few" people want harder world content i don't understand why blizzard is doing what they are doing then

we see them dabbling with heroic world tier in remix and then prey in midnight, seems like their surveys are saying differently

[dense plover]

youre not gonna get much help here with addons for beta - i suggest seeing if the addon has their own discord or a github

[pure wave]

thought maybe somebody uses that addon too, but got it already, super dumb complicated that i just deleted the addon again 😄

[deep pawn]

Bold to call HWT hard

Nightmare hunts stopping you from flying and putting unending dots on you are going to tick people off

They've tied a power reward to it so might be enough

[dense plover]

wait - do they ALWAYS stop you flying or only when being ambushed?

[deep pawn]

I'm not sure but watching Towellie they seemed frustrating

[upper pasture]

i mean, it's HARDER than normal....so....

[deep pawn]

Beyond a brief period at level 70-73 on my first remix character it's an irrelevant marker

[upper pasture]

Your experience isn’t everyone’s experience, the point is it IS harder even if slightly for you. It’s more of a challenge than the normal world tier

[uncut vault]

Nightmare prey being ground mount only would be pretty cool tbh

game misses that option for gameplay nowadays

[upper pasture]

Pretty sure it’s only when your in the final fight but I could definitely be wrong

[dense plover]

then people complaining are dumb

you arent meant to escape

[deep pawn]

It seemed like it was the prey still running away multiple times at that phase with the negatives happening

Like Towellie dying to a dot he couldn't cleanse

I'm not levelling on beta so haven't tried it myself

[dense plover]

as far as i can tell, you cant take prey while leveling

its endgame only

[deep pawn]

I know, that's why I said that

[deep pawn]

The legacy of the 20th anniversary and 11.0.5

[noble mica]

It lasted 6 months?

[upper pasture]

it felt like 6 months for sure

[fading lintel]

will we be level 90 today on bet

beta

[tropic trail]

Wonder if we're getting a midnight beta update today

[blazing arch]

Anyone know how long this downtime will be for mid beta

[tropic trail]

Idk they haven't said anything about when they'll be back

[deep pawn]

M+ testing starts at 3pm PST tonight I believe

[tropic trail]

Then I guess 6pm est is when the realms open back up

[deep pawn]

New realm on the list

[tropic trail]

Hopefully at the top of the hour in 5 minutes the realms will be back up.

[upper pasture]

i wouldn't hold your breath

[tropic trail]

Yep still down

Don't understand why they haven't updated the post of when it would go back up

[dense plover]

b/c they dont know

its beta

it comes up when it comes up

their goal is to fix the lag

[clear apex]

workin on the feesh

[dense plover]

valeera's voice lines are in

new mog interface

can even set it to specific talent builds or just the spec in general

current appearance

unrelated - new 'special' trophies with a fancy glow effect

haranir female hair highlight is fixed though theyre all kinda dull :/

[clear apex]

the outfit slots costing money feels kind of bad since we already had them in Live

[dense plover]

i agree

i also agree with them costing too much, and not being accountwide unlocks also sucking

[clear apex]

We already have paid so much for tmog, and now theyre taking that away and slapping another cost, which fine we wont be using it as often maybe since we're going by item slot but I dont like it. and nearly 1mil is quite rich, really screws with rpers

oh that's expensiiiiive

500 to buy slot 4 and 2400g on top .....cmon blizzard

[dense plover]

yeah its ludicrous

and locks out people who dont have crap tons of gold

[clear apex]

didnt they walk back on charging a ton for the bank slots?

[upper pasture]

eh, i feel like at the end of midnight we're all gonna be swimming in gold

[clear apex]

when you account for every character you might play, that is a lot of gold

housing items arent like super cheap either depending what youre making and adding on tmog costs

[upper pasture]

i mean, not really. 10 transmog outfits across 70 characters would only be 350k which is about how much a single wow token is rn now

and that's so extra, who plays 70 characters AND would have 10 different outfits for each of them. i'm sure people who transmog a lot are still gonna come out on top because what's the average cost to mog an outfit right now on live?

you're paying once and being able to swap to it for free forever

[clear apex]

i dont buy tokens, i dont engage with that part of wow, that isnt an option for everyone

this is stupid high in cost

[upper pasture]

that's not the point tho

500g for a "free" outfit slot and never having to pay again will always come out on top

[clear apex]

the cost raises

first is 100, 500, 1000

etc

[upper pasture]

still gonna be cheaper over the course of mogging

[clear apex]

you have a lot of gold. got it

[upper pasture]

you would spend MORE money on the old system

leaps and bounds more

a full mog swap rn costs me 1203g if i swap three times that's 3609g the new system i pay 1600g for 3 different outfits, i'm already saving 2k.

new systems asks for more gold frontloaded but less over time.

[clear apex]

444 for one item change, is that really cheaper?

[upper pasture]

AND this is still the beta version we could even see enough push back that it becomes warbound

you don't get it

[clear apex]

well so far most people in the mid chat where i am are saying its too expensive

Lehr, I get the overall idea, im not that dense. I dont like it

[upper pasture]

you're not buying an outfit slot to swap a single item

[clear apex]

And 400g for a helm change is stupid

[upper pasture]

if you are then you don't deserve your gold

[clear apex]

thats certainly a take

love the eliteist attitude

[upper pasture]

sure

nice trigger words, enjoy your stay.

[dense plover]

except that everytime you DO change its really expensive'

a single slot is nearly 3k - thats crazy

[upper pasture]

when you change the outfit but not swapping between them

[dense plover]

thats not what we are talking about

if i set up an outfit

and then decide it should have a different weapon, thats 3k gold

thats insane

stop defending this

its bad

i dont need another gold sink - i dont have crazy amounts of gold

turning a normally affordable feature into a gold sink fucking sucks

[upper pasture]

i suspect those costs are not in line with what they should be but the over all system is gonna be good

[dense plover]

i spent nearly 30k setting up the 4 outfits i wanted on ptr - thats too much

the way the system works is good

the UI is way too big

[upper pasture]

like the helm cost on live more mail isn't close to 400g, it's like 85g i'd swap to midnight and check but i'm lazt

[dense plover]

and is actually kinda hard to use

[upper pasture]

the way the system works now is infinitely more expensive

especially for people who mog a lot

[uncut vault]

Is there a way to change your outfit manually other than going to a transmogrifier?

I cant find that UI inthe regular appearance tab anywhere

[dense plover]

no, you have to use the buttons

but you MIGHT be able to drag them onto a bar?

[uncut vault]

yeah you can

[dense plover]

they seemed like the kind of thing you might be able to do that to

[dense plover]

then yeah thats how you can change outfits without being at the npc

thats it

as i said - its kinda clunky

its definitely an improvement in how you can use transmog but its not easier to use

[uncut vault]

there def needs to be some kind of area in the appearance tab to let you find your Outfit Slots

[upper pasture]

as someone has said before, "it's a beta"

this is what the beta is for, feedback and such

[uncut vault]

1.8k gold for two weapons is crazy

[upper pasture]

i set up 10 outfits completely different then the next so they would be full cost, and bought 8 extra slots and it spent just a little under 110k

i will say the only thing that feels bad is the upfront cost of the outfit slots, everything seems okay if you consider how much gold you are currently throwing away when swapping between mogs on retail, this is a good system for people who know what they want their mogs to be and want 10 different sets, this isn't as great when you are a person that wakes up and wants to change your outfits every week.

if this was live sure that 110k is about 100 swaps, but if i was a person who say has a raid set, a chilling set, an rp set, a dailies set, and the likes i'd quickly burn through all those swaps pretty quickly. the new system just asks for you to pay for it up front and if you don't change the set from it's paid saved outfit you will in time save gold. personally i probably wont be using this all that much outside of the few free outfits and maybe 2-3 more on my main but who knows

i think they should put a cap on the cost of outfit slots maybe at like 5k? but again i probably wont hit that on live, of course unless they make it some sort of achievement

[dense plover]

cap and warband wide

[upper pasture]

i feel like if they cap it low, it wont have a chance to be warband. i'm fine with either tho

[upper pasture]

4000 solo delve slots for the HoF, geesh, 1k was way too low, 10k felt right but 4k still feels too low

I guess without knowing how many people actually are earning the achievement during its season 4k could be enough but it definitely doesn’t sound like it

[deep pawn]

the debuff effect on bars needs to go away immediately.

[fading lintel]

How can i be level 90

[deep pawn]

Xalatath's Endgame server or level on the other 3

[fading lintel]

oki thx

[austere gazelle]

can you modify those outfits?

I mean I'll need maybe four different and while change them whenever I want , I don't need more

[fathom fulcrum]

bet they wont even remaster Windchanneller's set 🥱

[upper pasture]

Yes, but anytime you change the outfit there’s a gold cost, changing between them doesn’t cost gold, changing the outfit’s saved appearance cost gold

[trim zinc]

there's a bug or something with fury warrior i think i tried to tmog 2h into 1h weapons and it stays the original mog

[austere gazelle]

in short they transferred the original gold cost of each slot on the outfits... so much for " free transmog " lol

[upper pasture]

"free" transmog was a misunderstanding of the change in the system when it was first announced, if you are someone who has a handful of sets that you like to use and swap between them you will save money in the long run, if you are someone constantly swapping things all the time from your "preset" outfits you are gonna be spending a lot of money

[deep pawn]

They said most players would save money

[upper pasture]

if most players make 1/2 sets and swap between those two yes they will save thousands of gold

like for example, my guilds MT. she has used the same "outfit" since MoP under this new system she will save so much gold. the intial cost of ~4.4k then she will never need to spend gold on transmogging anything whenever she gets an upgrade as the new system does it automatically for her. i know this isn't always the case

the way i see it is the only people who are gonna lose on this new system are people who are constantly tweaking their outfits

[zealous sedge]

I feel like it should be once you transmog an item in this new system that item is free for you to swap with no further cost.

So you’re paying the initial fee on that specific item, and the cost of having an outfit slot.

[upper pasture]

it is if it's part of the outfit, swapping between outfits doesn't cost gold

[zealous sedge]

Right

I agree it does screw over people who constantly tweak their outfits

[upper pasture]

idk like i said before i think the new system is okay IF they lower the cost of the outfit slots and cap them at something more reasonable, or make them warband wide

[zealous sedge]

I wonder if they could add a system like “valued customer” where the more gold you spend on tmog, you get discounts over time. That could help those that really go hard with tmog.

I couldn’t agree more, the outfit cost is pretty steep especially without Warband

[upper pasture]

warband wide but also individual

like as crazy as it sounds if spending 800k got ALL my characters 20 outfit slots that's...painful but okay ig

but 800k for one characters 20 slots is....unreasonable

[zealous sedge]

Yeah it’s a little surprising given the costs of Warband bank tabs

[deep pawn]

She would after like 40 upgrades vs the current system, but for someone who likes to swap things around every week or two is going to pay out the rear unless they want to swap between just a few all the time.

I want to see saving an outfit costs drop by 90%

That's how far they missed the mark in my eyes

[upper pasture]

she would save money after 4 total outfit swaps. probably even less, it costs 4.4k in the new system to set a whole outfit, it costs me as a mail wearer 1203g to mog my entire set, plate is probably more? idk

[deep pawn]

5700g

[clear apex]

someone posted the maths

[deep pawn]

A full set for me on live is like 700g

[upper pasture]

crazy, a whole set is 1203g for a mail wearer

and that's 1hd/offhand not stave

[deep pawn]

Hmm, I just swapped a entire set on my hunter, but maybe because it's a 2hander and I hid helm and cloak then.

We're also losing free for hidden slots

[upper pasture]

hiding stuff is zero cost

[deep pawn]

Not what I was told on beta

[upper pasture]

i just checked last night

it doesn't cost anything to hide a slot

and yes that's why your retail mog is cheaper because you aren't mogging those slots, so again a full swap on retail is 1203g

[deep pawn]

The fact you'd have to mog 44 items on live to make up the cost of what one saved outfit on beta is still a horrible god damn decision.

Blizzard is price gouging on a system they said would offer most players cheaper transmog. Unless they freaking meant over 30 years like a mortgage

[upper pasture]

i do think these numbers aren't the final ones, i'd atleast hope so

[deep pawn]

They better not be lol. I give Blizzard more leeway than most but the current beta pricing is atrocious

[lavish raptor]

I wonder if mog costs still scale by level

At low level, mogging armor is cheaper than at high level

Or I guess more specifically, mogging low ilvl items is less expensive than mogging high ilvl items

[upper pasture]

i think on the beta right now, each slot has it's own specific vaule

[lavish raptor]

Can someone make a low level character on beta and double check

[deep pawn]

They have

It's like 2k at level 10

[lavish raptor]

For a full set?

That's not terrible

[deep pawn]

If you were a totally different new player and wanted to try it while levelling?

Not everyone has a main to transfer gold

[upper pasture]

i would never recommend a new player to try out transmogging

especially how it functions now

[lavish raptor]

I'm more interested about how twinks are affected

But yeah it'll be super annoying for people on trial accounts

And pretty opaque for new players

Unless they included a transmogging tutorial that includes free usage

Oh yeah - I forgot Trial of Style lowers mog costs. Wonder how that's going to impact the system.

[upper pasture]

ToS doesn’t lower the cost it just makes it free, it would be pretty funny if they forgot about that and during the first ToS outfit slots are coded as mogging and we’re free lol

[rain cave]

it's kind of weird to me that they are pricing outfit slots while also removing addon funcitonality that would allow you to do it with an addon anyway

I could understand gold walling something like "change transmog in x circumstance" as a feature though, and having outfit slots for that

e.g. a fire mage changing their outfit when they combust to look way more fiery whilst still a normal mage look out of combustion

[upper pasture]

I don’t think outfits function like that but it would be pretty cool to see mog changing while in your burst window

[elfin eagle]

Question

Let’s say you’ve never played wow with addons and just stuck to base ui how does it feel

Like just in comparison to regular ui

[deep pawn]

Which part?

[elfin eagle]

Combat mainly

[elder seal]

Seems blizzard finally broke both of these...
Gl taking any screenshots now without pulling my hair out due to it. Might just retire for good.

the IDs for vendor items are gone for good now too which in turn just makes you to hope you hit a right item in WoWhead search when posting screenshots. back to stoneage it is i suppose

[glass fulcrum]

cost is based on vendor price of armor, with a minimum of 1g

Plate classes suffer

[novel zodiac]

no way there was a quick link addon and i been typing links for years lmao

[elder seal]

That was me few years ago when i realized. But now. oh well 😂 ....

[rain cave]

yeah I'm saying that would be an interesting feature

and would help justify some of the "unlocking" they want to add to it

[upper pasture]

If they come down from the insane outfit slot cost, paying ~5k to have an outfit saved that I get to switch to and from for free is pretty good

[deep pawn]

I'd rather have saving outfits cost less because those are purchases you will keep doing over time vs outfit slots being one time fees per character

[upper pasture]

Outfit slots cost less and we can have unlimited not just 20, personally I’m gonna be hard pressed to even make up 10 different enough outfits on one character, like I get why they want to charge more to change that outfit slot but it doesn’t make it feel better

[rain cave]

I swear this is how guild wars does it, or something similar

except tmog in that game is more expensive since gear is more permanent

but if you have a saved outfit I think you can just switch to it

[upper pasture]

That’s how the new system will work, the price to save the outfit is more expensive but once you have them you can freely change to them, the only time you will spend gold on transmog is when you change the saved outfit or when buying a new outfit slot

You make 5 outfit slots, you can freely swap between them zero cost

[rain cave]

but is transmog itself free?

if so why the cost of saving outfits

all that does is save you time clicking through a few pages of stuff to manually apply it all

[upper pasture]

Once you pay the cost of the outfit slot and whatever mog you apply to it, switching between that one and any other one is indeed “free” as you’ve already paid the cost

[rain cave]

so it still costs gold to transmog individual pieces?

[upper pasture]

I’m not sure how transmogging individual pieces works on the beta, I’d have to check later

Not even sure if you can transmog outside of the new system anymore

[rain cave]

strange

[upper pasture]

I would assume no, because everyone gets their first two outfit slots for free

[rain cave]

just feels weird to me that they're overhauling transmog so much when it was fine as it was xD

a bit of reinventing the wheel imo

[upper pasture]

Yeah it’s strange, I feel like they could’ve just kept the pricing as it is and then added the new situation stuff and everyone would’ve been happy

But it now seems a little overwhelming and very costly upfront, people will be able to blow through a lot of gold if they aren’t paying attention

[rain cave]

hope they put easier gold production in to compensate

which I think they are doing with professions

[upper pasture]

We were getting 800-1100 gold in WQs at the end of TWW I wonder what midnight will have

Speaking of which do they normally test out WQs in the beta or no? I hope skyriding WQs come back I kinda hated how they just had them in 11.0 and left them to rot

[rain cave]

wonder if they'll even bother putting skyriding glyphs around

and desiging such a flat world around skyriding WQ's or vice versa might be apain

though I do enjoy them

would be interesting if they instead of trying to condense them into new areas exclusively, allowed the other races around the world to pop up as more rewarding WQ's to compensate for the time spent travelling there

[upper pasture]

I think I saw some achievements for glyphs in the beta

[rain cave]

so maybe you get the chance to fly off to idk, feralas or something for a more rewarding race WQ

a little reward for going back and seeing the old world

[upper pasture]

I mean they also have a few races already in each zone

[rain cave]

yes

that's what I mean, they could use those

[deep pawn]

given repair costs are going down I bet they drop rewards

[upper pasture]

Are repair costs going down?

[deep pawn]

they're based on vendor cost and vendor cost is based on ilvl.

[austere gazelle]

I've love three free outfits . One for login screen, one for raid and dungeon and one for outside / housing to begin with.

And a cost divided by two or three for when you change the transmog of your outfit, too

if they do that, the system will be good

[tropic trail]

is this a bug. Can't seem to figure out how to remove this display

[rain cave]

if they don't end up giving nightborne DH as well, I wonder if they have any plans to add something cool for the horde

[pulsar minnow]

Orc DH…

[rain cave]

nah nah I mean like something new

like if they could do the "new spec to go with a new race class combo" thing for a different class and race on horde side

like maybe a new paladin or shaman spec for a new race

[hard pollen]

Undead paladins

[rain cave]

maybe, with calia as their head?

but then again it's looking like they want to give paladins to everyone this xpac

[surreal vigil]

void elf and highborn

dh when blizzard

WHEN

u gave dh void power

[rain cave]

Another spec and race to DH
Arcane spell blades

tbf maybe they view the void elf DH thing as basically the "equalizer" for having this expansion take place in a horde area

but even then for people who seem to actually care about the nitty gritty of faction balance like that, they don't seem appeased

[pulsar minnow]

Some folks will just never be happy tbh

I’m horde and genuinely the only complaint I really have from TWW in terms of faction crap is that Thrall did nothing

But we also had an entire patch dedicated to Goblins- which while yes only Bilgewater are horde- it’s still a goblin/horde aesthetic by association

[deep pawn]

That's the new boss timeline. You can make it only show in combat. You may have accidentally changed it to always show.

[austere gazelle]

no, it has to make sense lorewise.
I think that given the Voidwell will be a thing Thalyssra will probably want to protect Silvermoon and her husband and unleash void Nightborne DH to help the Blood elves

for the moment it makes little sense

I think it'll be a desperate time, desperate mesure, and she will free some felborne and ask them to become DH and wield the void to protect Azeroth

It might also be tied with the return of the Legion that is slated to appears back soon

Btw thalyssra is already in silvermoon apparently , from what I could saw as alliance, couldn't enter further in I was being watched for elimination xD

[deep pawn]

She has her own floating place in the city where she lives sometimes.

[upper pasture]

Oh look outfit unlocks are accountwide

[deep pawn]

And maybe dirt cheap depending on what they mean by costs not increasing

[rain cave]

well yeah but they can make anything make sense lorewise when they add stuff

[upper pasture]

They likely mean the cost we already saw on beta aren’t gonna be changing to be higher because it’s accountwide, because it was intended to be accountwide all along and that’s why it was so expensive

[rain cave]

like they could just turn around tomorrow and say there's a new group of goblin druids who make their money from growing and selling plants and being in circus acts in animal form

[deep pawn]

Oh, booo

800k account wide is still nuts

[upper pasture]

Considering how much of warbank cost not really

[deep pawn]

I still only have like two slots of that

[zealous sedge]

Glad they changed it to Warband

[little hound]

It was obvious that they would

[upper pasture]

welp, i just tested live verses beta and it's actually MORE expensive to repair on beta in my current gear than on live

live

beta

maybe there's some sort of hidden scaling based on level but the only difference is my beta character is lvl 81

so unless the scaling for that isn't right for launch repairing doesn't scale with itmlvl anymore

[dense plover]

yep - theyve just made shit expensive af

its really pissed me off

not everyone farms crap loads of gold

and the gold rewards in midnight are less because gear is worth less gold

feels shitty right now

[upper pasture]

Do we know this for sure? Have they tested world quest and rewards yet?

[dense plover]

idk about world quest gold

but i know they still havent fixed ilvl = gold value for gear

and ive reported that 10+ times

[little hound]

Neat

[elder seal]

Now if there was toggle to hide pets by default . impossible to take a screenshot for a Q with so many hunters etc ruining the takes xD

im assuming this is primary turnin spot for major of quests based on the amount of pets this area always has. and some people apparently spend hours here... Would been done otherwise but this guy with a pig pets been afking here for several hours now.

[austere gazelle]

@elder seal yes this is the main hub, the mission map is behind lorthemar ^^

[deep pawn]

eh?

[austere gazelle]

Dunno why it quoted you lol

[rugged coral]

WARNING! New feature i just found. If you grab an item from your bag and drop it on a vendor it AUTO-SELLS it. This is a VERY dangerous thing. Be aware of trading with anyone on a vendor mount or near a vendor.

You can still buy the item back from any vendor but its still going to cause a LOT of missing item tickets.

[upper pasture]

even if you can buy it back you'd no longer be able to trade it lol

hopefully they make this a toggle option

[opaque pewter]

I mean, by doing that operation, most people probably intended to delete it anyway lol

[rugged coral]

i made a bunch of smithing aprons to skill upo LW and tride to give one away to someone at the forges on an expedition yak, clicked and it just poofed. I clicked trheir vendor by mistake (who can even tell where the heck the hitboxes are?)

Its still adding an unnecessary layer of 'ways to screw up'

[crude sigil]

When I want to trade something to someone, I just right click > trade on him

[upper pasture]

some people drag and drop tho

less clicks

[elder seal]

It seems like Murder Row screenshots are on hold for now 😂

was there zone specific report button in the beta?

Crashed 5 times in a row now when trying to use the toy i use for my screenshots in murder now. so i can say its pretty consistent

[upper pasture]

rip prelaunch test delayed again 🙁

[sturdy stream]

Are we only allowed one house? I was under the impression we could have one in each neighborhood. However, today I logged in to my alliance character and her house is gone.

[upper pasture]

you get one of each

probably just a beta bug

to be more specific, you get one horde and one alliance, either can be visited by anyone in your warband but must be bought on the respected faction

[sturdy stream]

Oh, so my alliance homeowner may have just traveled to the wrong house? Ok. I'll go back and see. Thanks!

[upper pasture]

once you buy the horde plot your alliance characters can freely go there

[rugged coral]

housing has been spotty all day. Took me 15 mins to teleport to my house.

[upper pasture]

i'm saying if you bought the house and it's no longer in the plot. it could just be the beta decided to just delete it

because "just beta things"

[rugged coral]

it shouldnt disappear. Does your housing info not show where your house is located? (neighborhood and plot#?)\

babble is probably not reading any more

[sturdy stream]

Thanks all. My mistake. I see the drop down now.

[rugged coral]

oops lol

[deep pawn]

You need separate outfits for different weapon types. That's insanity

[upper lantern]

any new Hearthstones in Midnight so far?

[austere gazelle]

I'll fill a feedback when you places stuff on the ground in your housing there should be a red line showing limitation of where your plot is not your plot anymore lol

[elder seal]

Hmm was there a macro which i could use to check for Q IDs? Had one quest that is not in beta database yet but wanted to be sure i got the right ID once it gets uploaded

[clear apex]

for the most part, when working right, the overgrown grass/foliage is gone and gives indication and when you move an item to the bound it turns red on the grid

[dense plover]

just the wowhead addon i think and i think that just captures and uploads

b/c i think the quest ids are server side and only sent briefly

[elder seal]

Oh well. was hoping i still had a way but just without addons now

[austere gazelle]

I'm wondering if they should not spice things up for the void storm campaign*. Make us choose between Alleria's or Lothraxxion's quest to pick a side if you don't trust the void elves, and rejoign both questline after the Arena event

[fathom fulcrum]

Thalyssra dead 🫵 😂

[little hound]

All gnomes re-irradiated an dead

[fathom fulcrum]

nah watch Thalyssra either die or get pregnant

[rain cave]

Please God no

[fathom fulcrum]

please god YES

[rain cave]

She’s the only nightborne rep

We have

[fathom fulcrum]

irrelevant charakter, next 🥱

[rain cave]

And she has actually interesting character development

Plus player history

[fathom fulcrum]

one chapter in one expansion

next

[rain cave]

So, just like faerin?

And akama

Etc

[fathom fulcrum]

current expansion xd

[rain cave]

Nightborne are criminally underutilised

Considering how related to the elves that are used in the lore they are

[fathom fulcrum]

Night Elves arent a thing anymore though

replaced by Haranir gg

its joever

W poster

[upper pasture]

not in the current expansion so....

[little hound]

Every gnome NPC Ever.
0% Relevant in Midnight.

[fathom fulcrum]

still W poster

[little hound]

[fathom fulcrum]

no u

[fathom fulcrum]

what u mean, mine did all the work in TWW

while Jaina and co afked somewhere idk

Gnomes are peak

[little hound]

Gnomes didn't do Squat Magni, Moira and Nerd JR Did all the lifting.
Jaina, Kalec and Aethas & Khadgar went and salvaged what they could of Dalaran, also major lore development.

Which also builds ground for any future major lore development for Mages and the future Kirin Tor.

[fathom fulcrum]

Aethas invades Dalaran again and it explodes, coincidence?

i think not

should have been executed during Pandaria idk

[little hound]

I swear having a serious conversation with you is like catching air with your hands..

[fathom fulcrum]

what u mean

bro literally betrayed the Kirin Tor 😭

[little hound]

Defending his people against a pissed Jaina >> Invading.

[fathom fulcrum]

u mean helping Garrosh smuggle the bell thingy

veri defending

[little hound]

He also protected Innocent blood elves and sunreavers who had nothing to do with it.

[fathom fulcrum]

"innocent"

Theramore 🥱

[little hound]

And the topic was: Gnomes were Irrelevant in in TWW, and will be in Midnight too.

Just because you are a Belf or Part of the Sunreavers, doesn't mean ALL Of them were involved..

[fathom fulcrum]

unfortunately yeah, which is fnnuy, cuz they literally have nukes, bomber planes and tanks

they should have been kicked idk

[little hound]

[fathom fulcrum]

thank Jaina for that

she wanted to keep them there for some reason

even though it was an Alliance city till like Legion 🫵 😂

enough off topic bruh

Blood Elves worst race btw

[rain cave]

Gnomes were made up to give the alliance more races in WoW because Chad horde had more races

[fathom fulcrum]

"chad horde" 😭

[rain cave]

I’m just matching your energy

[fathom fulcrum]

notice how their strongest charakters are former Alliance races

[rain cave]

Don’t hate the player

[fathom fulcrum]

🤔

[rain cave]

Like?

[fathom fulcrum]

Sylvanas

[rain cave]

She isn’t part of the horde

[fathom fulcrum]

she is till Shadowlands

kinda wish Warcraft was about Warcraft again though

[upper pasture]

i'd hardly call her a blood elf

[fathom fulcrum]

cuz she a High Elf correct

[upper pasture]

she's forsaken

[fathom fulcrum]

nuh uh

High Elf

[upper pasture]

okie

[fathom fulcrum]

even more High Elf post Shadowlands

also off topic

[upper pasture]

is this your new bit? just claiming things then saying "also off topic"?

[fathom fulcrum]

yes

[upper pasture]

cool

[rain cave]

They’re just rage baiting

[fathom fulcrum]

this channel is about #beta-ptr-spoilers

[little hound]

Comes from the person who shit talks EVERY Other race but Gnomes, and when someone else talks back, you turn into a kid and do your best to turn the topic. Nah. As one-sided as it gets

[rain cave]

It’s rage bait you’re playing their game when you reply like this

[little hound]

I know, i just had to vent abit, having to deal with Niko's cringeposts for so damn long.

[dense plover]

just block them

[little hound]

Did.

[pulsar minnow]

Don’t remember if this has already been covered but do zekhan and/or talanji make any appearance in Zul Aman?

for some reason i have missed any and all details of the Zul Aman story and want to just test endgame stuff on beta for now. Just curious if they show up anywhere

[little hound]

Don’t think so

[dense plover]

no - no reason for them to do so

theyre zandalari

this is the amani

[pulsar minnow]

Well Talanji is. Zekhan is an Ambassador, so I hoped maybe at least he’d show up

Thanks tho. Maybe it’ll be saved for Ula Tek shenanigans

[dense plover]

probably not showing up at all

theyre not relevant

[tulip sun]

I think itd be neat if they showed up eventually to help with Horde-Amani relations

[agile token]

Nice

[rain cave]

Not relevant to a troll + horde plot?

😭

[worn crown]

I do hope Zekhan shows up eventually

[fathom fulcrum]

huh?

certainly more relevant than fanfic night elves 💔

[dense plover]

this one? yeah not relevant

this is about fixing relationships between the amani and the sindorei, and the amani finding out who they are as a people WITHOUT the context of the non-amani

[uncut vault]

the immediate story isn't even really between the Amani and Sin'dorei quite yet, its really just Liadrin and Zul'jarra finding friendship despite the past

I suspect 12.1 will be a lot more about both the blood elves and the Horde and how they interact with the Amani

[tulip sun]

Im hoping for this- alongside Horde reinforcements.

[rain cave]

yeah but the trolls would have a part in that surely? especially with the haranir around

it just makes sense to have "our" trolls at the peace talks between the blood elves and the amani

especially because they're adding amani skin tones to our troll race as a reward

also with the patch zone being most likely more troll content, I'd be shocked if we don't see voljin or some of the other troll characters as a part of that story

[austere gazelle]

They are missing big lore opportunity several time so I don't know if they will commit to that fully.

They keep their " we have 4 heroes in the main storyline for this expac, the other will not or be barely featured "

And when I say four, sometime it's less. Thrall was sidelined hard in TWW

[deep pawn]

I mean Atal'Ulek looks like it has a strong Bwonsamdi presence, or at least death.

[worn crown]

Agree completely!!!

[cerulean patrol]

are the shield walls in Nexus-Point Xenas still a problem?

[austere gazelle]

True. We'll see what it ll be about.

Ive a strong feeling that Xal is playing us all by making us awakening Azeroth instead of trying to corrupt her.

" their glorious fury will be mine " she said in TWW... if she uses this fury to make us perform some necessary rituals to stirr Azeroth from her slumbers... everything would make sense

[little hound]

Atel’ulek is another Loa’s den. Bwonsamdi’s territory is in Nazmir.

[austere gazelle]

Ah I nearly got it !

Let it represent the moment where night becomes day, and the moon meats the sun.
Where Light and Shadow exist in perfect balance.```

I knew it would come to something like this. 

**Amirdrassil, the Crown of Harmony**, represent the perfect balance between *Life* And *Death*

** The Dawnwell ** represent the perfect balance between *light* and *shadow*

Now up to Order and Disorder. Wonder what it will  be. Probably some kind of construct

Oh. No. The union of Order and Disorder will probably revolve around...

The Sword of Sargeras.

It may be a reach, but the last Zone of TLT will probably be Silithus, Sword of Sargeras, chamber of the Heart and stuff

[austere gazelle]

Imagine the cool shot if we somehow fight Amanthul and other while being on the hilt of the sword

[rain cave]

My personal head canon is that sarg sword looks like it’s full of revendreth anima because it kind of is. And it’s more to do with the dreadlords plan, probably including the primus

So I don’t see his sword as being “disorder”

[rain cave]

honestly the seat/union of order/disorder will probably be azeroth herself

she is free will, and all the structure and freedom that comes with it

[pulsar minnow]

My wacky headcanon is that we fight aman thul on a platform/ series of platforms that travel through time

I also hope we get some reveal that we aren’t the first champions to rise up against Aman’thul, and he’s erased every timeline in which it has happened

[little hound]

Okay so..

Midnight in a Nutshell:

1. Housing (Probably only GOOD Thing)
2. Blizzard Murders Addons
3. Based on Story Spoilers, we get a Shadowlands-GRade Campaign, disgusting "Rainbow Well Carebear shit"
4. Horrific Lore.

Damn, and here i almost hoped Blizzard had a BRAIN After they did DF and TWW So decently.

[tulip sun]

Uh

Calling it shadiwlands grade is crazy

[dense plover]

yeah uh - that no 3 is based on one datamined thing that doesnt appear to be supported by the actual story at all

4 is also definitely not true

people wanting 'everyone fights each other because warcraft' are being stupid

its a world ending threat - ofc factions are working together'

also theyre not murdering addons - theyre murdering weak auras

and people are already working on ui customization replacements

[little hound]

Fair

[dense plover]

https://fixupx.com/PeralexIRL/status/1992704081270321564?t=2VtuQcPANb_9bt20QKK6Hw&s=19

Peralex ☄️ (@PeralexIRL)

BREAKING: INSANE Midnight addon inbound! Fully modular, full range customization, built in "weak auras" for tracking items, trinkets, consumables and more. Icon/cast bar themes, textures for everything.. animation customization, fine tune pin point accuracy placements for everything. Shade UI coming soon to Midnight/Beta. Thanks to @xerwo for helping me forge the path for PVE players (still more to do) for the cooldown manager section. Shade UI does SO MUCH more than this, I have been working on Shade UI for MONTHS on end and countless hours, making adjustments for Midnight and can't wait for people to experience this. It is an all in one addon for everyone (entire UI modding, not just the cooldown manager)
︀︀Please join the discord for my addons if you would like to give input, beta test it before the public and suggestions. www.AcDiscord.com

**💬 17 🔁 40 ❤️ 769 👁️ 62.4K **

FixupX · Nov 23, 2025, 9:17 PM

literally ui customization addons are being worked on

just because the weakauras dev doesnt want to rewrite doesnt mean it isnt possible

[rain cave]

Wrong on multiple counts

[little hound]

Fiiiine, i'll wait and see.

I've never relied on WAs or UI Addons, i feel like utility addons like Hekili and such will be harder without.

[upper pasture]

Hekili was a terrible addon anyways tho, if you don’t want to learn your class just use OBR.

[little hound]

It was in no way terrible. And its not "Not wanting to learn", some people have learning difficulties and disabilities, which makes "Learning" alot harder. That addon is the reason why i've been able to raid, do high keys and enjoy the game for years.

But seeing the way you put it, i assume you're lucky enough to not have that problem. Good for you i guess.

[upper pasture]

It’s almost as if blizzard has developed things in place of it

[little hound]

Yeah, things that are far worse than the addon

[upper pasture]

With OBR and combat tracking assistance, you’ll be fine

All hekili did was give you the “best” rotation

[little hound]

Hekili let me purple/orange parse in raids. Blizzard's shit tools will let me Blue parse if i'm lucky.

[upper pasture]

And literally no one is asking you to play perfectly outside of RWF raiders

[little hound]

Blizzard is just mastering the art of "Closing their ears, thinking they know better".. Office rats most of them these days who don't even play.

[upper pasture]

And yes it was “terrible” because it taught you how to dps but often that leads to people not knowing or understanding the game outside of their own dps rotation that they are being fed.

Sure it tells you to interrupt something but only when it’s your current target and if they are casting something that can be interrupted, not if it’s something important to interrupt

I’d rather not have my teammates tunnel vision on dpsing

[little hound]

In my case it was remembering my DPS Rotation, i did not rely on the addon for interrupts or anything else. I knew my target prio and what had prio on interrupts.

New cow models are hype though, lmao

[deep pawn]

It's not the only place he can show up. He can have a shrine elsewhere as the Loa of Death. He was worshipped in Stranglethorn and has long been the patron of the Darkspear.

[little hound]

Considering how the zone looks based on far sight shamans looking at it? It doesn't look remotely close to Bwonsamdi's style at all

[deep pawn]

The swirly spirit stuff?

[elder seal]

https://www.wowhead.com/beta/quest=90546/missing-paladins
Ive seen it mentioned few times that this seems to be buggy as frick? Anyone went far enough with quests and could confirm if Taelia actually appears later? I'm only done 2/17 with the campaign atm due to screenshots

She isnt on the location shes supposed to be in for me atleast, yet.

On another note it seems that the game still crashes instantly if you try to use toy in dungeons rn.

[rain cave]

https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/feedback-combat-approachability/590287

Tell them then

[little hound]

Half the community and more already did, don't think i'd make a difference

[rain cave]

Then nothing to worry about, they’ll address it if they follow the feedback of such a large group

I can acknowledge there’s things going away that might be frustrating. But the whole design goal of the prunes is so you don’t NEED those addons to parse well

The addon prune influences encounter design influences UI design influences class design

They even highlight the next recommended ability by default on live servers right now

We can give feedback, we should give feedback. But if you can’t trust blizzard to act on it before they even try then why do you trust them with your money

[deep pawn]

Blizzard clearly saw stuff as Hekili as a problem, they see it as "if they need it to play, we designed the spec wrong."

[worn crown]

I prefer Shadowlands cohesive (if divisive) narrative over patches a thousand times over TWW 11.1 and 11.2

After a strong opening, in 11.1 we go to Undermine aid goblins (and stay for a whole patch) because of reasons tangentially related to 11.0 (or, tbh, because Blizz wanted sooo much to include Undermine)
In 11.2 we go to outer space in a xpac that Blizz called since the beginning "the underground xpac", that is called "The War Within"

11.2 is an excuse to ressurect/show again another villain*, in this case Dimensius
*Just like SL did with Kel'thuzad, for example, hahahahah

And what a boring zone K'aresh is. Even Korthia and Zereth Mortis were a lot more interesting to explore and had more to do

[pulsar minnow]

I mean that’s largely due to the fact that K’aresh was a (mostly) last minute change

TWW versus Shadowlands isn’t really a good comparison

That said I’m very very scared about this Dawnwell storyline

Because creating a new hyper powerful well of magic with a few shitty throwaway items makes like zero sense

Unless they’re planning to retcon the sunwell into being powered by Azeroth

[upper pasture]

Tbf as a long term player I quite enjoyed seeing K’aresh and drew a lot of parallels with it and netherstorm

Then finding out what Ve’nari was up to that whole time was pretty cool too

[austere gazelle]

not sure if it was last minute since ethereal assets were already there in beta ( or alpha ? )

[austere gazelle]

I think that'll be the case. Exactly like the Aspects stuff. Or we'll understand a new stuff about Light VS Shadow, once united in harmony, can create a new kind of effect

For the moment light and shadow were always opposed and in strife, or we know that one cant survive without the others.
On the other side we have Elune and her Brother, An'she, who doesn't seem to be that nasty and more harmonious

[pulsar minnow]

I liked K’aresh too. That said I feel like the ending with the Soul Scribe just trading lives with K’aresh was kinda weird

[austere gazelle]

I think it was just a plot point placed by blizzard here to show us that it can be done to Azeroth ( and I think Azshara will do it somehow )

it was too convenient

[pulsar minnow]

I just don’t think it’s a good plot point to introduce in general. It seems way too easy

A world soul is this being of incomprehensible power- and while yeah K’aresh was barely even alive… it just being healed by a simple ritual? It’s giving vibes of crown of wills from shadowlands

Genuinely the only thing I really had issue with in K’aresh. Everything else was great

[upper pasture]

I wouldn’t call it a simple ritual tho right?
Wasn’t she like the speaker of K’aresh? So this couldn’t just be performed by anyone

Could be Orweyna’s fate

[dense plover]

it was not a simple ritual

it required a specific item that we managed to recover

and the ritual had to be performed by a person of a specific bloodline

this was a series of very lucky coincidences

[upper pasture]

Heck, I’d go as far as saying the crown of wills was also not a simple ritual, we just happen to have nearly everything to complete the forging process

We just lucked out that the Lich king was on our side at this time

And we basically demoted him and lost a valuable power to fix something else

[uncut vault]

Crown of Wills isn't stupid because of complexity or simplicity, it's just a really ugly crown with a bunch of characters who have basically no investment in this plot lol

this might be the funniest line in the entire xpac

[upper pasture]

And from baine no less lol

His what, second line of the expansion?

[pulsar minnow]

Maybe simple was poor wording. I said simple mainly because Venari tells us with no prior hint prior that oh, the soul scribe can revive the world soul through a sacrifice, and then suddenly K’aresh is just saved in the span of a single cinematic

A thing with that weight and gravity in the universe isn’t really given time to breathe in my opinion

I don’t hate the idea of the dawnwell personally, I’m just worried if it really ends up being as simple as throwing a few elvish trinkets into the pool that restores it.

Again, hopefully it’s power coming back is more to do with azeroth and the offerings are more just for show

[dense plover]

i dont think thats going to happen at all

i think we lose in 12.0

we NEED to lose for the last titan to make any sense

i think its an old datamined thing that was fully cut

its probably flagged DNT

which generally means its cut

i havent even seen the actual proof of this datamine

beyond like - animations for specific characters with cinematic models

which isnt great evidence

[pulsar minnow]

I saw Thalyssra was datamined with an Arcandor Fruit which has me worried

[upper pasture]

You mean, something that’s already in the game files and can be easily faked to seem like something that’s happening in the upcoming expansion?

[dense plover]

she has a new cinematic model but afaik no one has a model viewer that works on those models by default

it takes a lot of hacking to get those to work because theyre special

[upper pasture]

And it could also be blizzard just covering their tracks throwing in old files to confuse dataminers for no particular reason

[dense plover]

eh, probably just leftover junk

metzen isnt the best writer, but i do not see him writing a 'chuck junk in the well and the problem goes away'

i legit dont see us winning in 12.0

we cant

where would the story go from there?

[upper pasture]

We aren’t doing so hot after the launch stuff

But tbf I’ve only played a tiny bit of the beta

[dense plover]

imo, 12.1 zuljan goes to that island to prove that he is worthy to lead his people and disappears or gets possessed or something (they do not appear to be making him a villain)

12.2 i have no fucking clue

the people screaming "theyre making him a villain" did not pay attention at all to the ending or the way he grows over the amani story

the ending is literally him reflecting on why his sister is a great leader and why he isnt and how he really fucked up

and how he needs to find how he can help his people

[dense plover]

i disagree - though i havent tried voidstorm

[upper pasture]

i mean, i've done the "intro" stuff the sunwell seems like a bandaid on a bullet wound

[dense plover]

yes - thats the point

the 'solution' isnt feasible

we then help arator and we go get artifacts to try to help reinforce the light

and then we go to voidstorm because that still isnt working

and afaict even that doesnt work

because the raid after has the well going to the void

im hoping post-raid the sunwell is void-corrupted

[upper pasture]

which usually, we are in better shape. that's my point we don't seem to be doing too well and i can easily see us losing further until 12.2

[dense plover]

oh yeah

thats good though

we dont usually lose

[upper pasture]

oh i know

[dense plover]

we did a bit in dragonflight and i thought that was good

[upper pasture]

i'm very pro-we lose

[dense plover]

especially if Xal is sticking around into TLT

we cant win here if thats the case

i really cant think of what 12.2 would be though

i dont see them using the arathi stuff

i think that will be saved for 14.0

theres not really any other blood elf areas

and theyre using the other troll area in 12.1

and i dont see them doing another void world patch or another harandar

could maybe be an underground titan facility if they want to lead us into TLT but idk

[uncut vault]

as someone who has seen all the animations, they are actual cutscene animations that can be loaded in Narcissus

The stuff people have been discussing has definitely not been cut, it's all fully animated

and yknow, this is still on the beta right now lol, baffling that blizzard titled the final chapters like that

[dense plover]

i really hope they dont follow through with that then

if we WIN after 12.0? wtf is the story after?

just random shit happening?

how would anything even lead into TLT?

[uncut vault]

that's more or less how TWW was, perhaps it wasnt as much of a fluke pivot as we might have thought

I do think that they will likely have Voidspire be our "loss"

leading into March on Quel'danas

[dense plover]

thats too short

thats like 3 weeks

and if the void assault doesnt work, how does Xal even fit in here?

[uncut vault]

I agree, but Blizz hasnt been the best at lingering intra-patch issues for a few xpacs now

I'd love to get more Argus-style cliffhangers for major patches

but Blizzard has been a fan of isolated patch stories recently

[dense plover]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

i can only hope they go in a direction that benefits the game's story

i kinda want them to do the stupid cutscene and then like, a week later, theres a new quest and the sunwell turns back to void and its actually a total failure

i think that would be even more devastating

[elder seal]

I tested the vehicle toys in another dungeon and seems like that instantly crashes the game as well. Havent tested in non follower dungeons nor old dungeons so im assuming it affects all of the dungeons atm
EDIT: going to test in non follower dungeon in a moment.

Yeah seems like using vehicle toys in a normal dungeon crashes the game instantly as well

I suppose i got to wait either for live till dungeons can be done for screenshots then. Already reported it when i originally tried it with murder row weeks ago

[deep pawn]

HARANIR EARS ARE ANIMATED

[deep pawn]

I mean Blizzard has been clear they see "Midnight" as just the launch story lol

Also, Blizzard loves to copy other media

I said this in another discord, but we're making a better honmoon.

So that's what the iridesence is gonna look like lol

[pulsar minnow]

its a new thalyssra model and a new arcandor fruit model lol

On a side note though- I feel like we’ve known about a Dawnwell for a while. I don’t remember it entirely but early on in alpha we were talking about a Dawnwell and how it was connected to Harandar or something? I might just be misremembering things tho

[deep pawn]

I thought the Dawnwell was inside Haradnar

They said it was responsible for the bloom.

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah- looked back through- one of the YouTube shorts after Gamescom goes over the dungeons and says the Dawnwell is affecting the lifebloom in eversong

So they got the names mixed up and accidentally leaked it a little early lmao

Because Eversong questing makes it very clear the Lightbloom is the result of the Sunwell freaking the hell out

[deep pawn]

I'm frankly a bit tired of Xal so I'm okay if we take a break from her

[pulsar minnow]

https://youtube.com/shorts/QjPesrkfU3c?si=LGJzCXDaIFsnIb1Q

This was the short for any interested

[pulsar minnow]

I just want her plot to actually move forward lol. Praying we get her motives in questing

[deep pawn]

it hasn't so that's why I'm so damn tired

I'm still freaking mad that 11.2 ended the EXACT SAME WAY 10.2.7 ended

Alleria making a god damn oath to chase down Xal

but this time it matters cause oaths matter on K'aresh.

[elder seal]

I should honestly get into lua so i could fix those simple addons myself for the midnight

[pulsar minnow]

I’m kinda worried that her motivations will just ring hollow when we find out

All this buildup but imagine it’s just “I want power because void is about power”

[lavish raptor]

"I did it for the vine"

[deep pawn]

I'd be fine if she just wanted power to always survive, but that's not how it's been presented

she has some goal related to the world soul being denied her.

[pulsar minnow]

My hope is that it’s about the Titans. I think they’re gonna go the route she was once a mortal, but I hope they say the titans destroyed her world just so that it makes sense as to why she wants Azeroth so bad and why she joined the void to do it

[deep pawn]

We know Iridikron is counting on her bringing them back

[rain cave]

Keep in mind that could split the story so we get main story and side story raids

In one patch

Like 12.2 could be half a lightbloom raid and half a dark heart raid

[warm topaz]

i hope we get one of those in 12.2. When Metzen said "things may just spiral widely out of control leading us to TLT" i thought we would lose the sunwell for the entire expansion

i wish we could have and expansion where we resist instead of fighting back and winning

[fathom fulcrum]

Midnight is akshually based??!?!?!

was i wrong the entire time???!??!

[rain cave]

Imagine caring about fel in the big 25

[fathom fulcrum]

Blood Elves are the real enemies of the expansion

and Haranir

[plain violet]

Geez.

[fathom fulcrum]

is tru

[tropic trail]

Wonder what today's next big beta update will include

[deep pawn]

No build this week

[rustic cliff]

I thought the elven exteriors were coming week 2/3 of beta- they didn’t come last week so it would have to be this week to follow the schedule

[elder seal]

Followup to this not that anyone really gets anything out of it but the vehicle toys work just fine in delves

ah lemme guess. i cannot see the ID of these NPCs anymore cause the content is being instanced?

https://www.wowhead.com/beta/npc=246361/
For reference this should be the correct NPC but i wouldnt know as the ID is not visible

[elder seal]

Anyone else bothered by the Arator VA btw? 😂

[deep pawn]

For better or worse the build on 12/2 is called Beta 3.

[dense plover]

decor isnt exteriors

i do not think we are getting night elf or blood elf house exteriors with the expac launch

there are still so many missing features/unfinished content for housing

[dense plover]

same guy its always been

Yuri Lowenthal

[rustic cliff]

this is what one of the big housing people said just a couple days ago regarding it

[dense plover]

that could work then i guess

idk

gives them a few months to do lots of bugfixes

still dont know where to even get the stuff for housing exteriors for the horde side (several locked options) and they havent added additional sizes either

[rustic cliff]

something that surprises me still is how many things are still unnamed/have placeholder names, as far as decor goes, especially with housing going live in a week

[dense plover]

well, thats different

theyre continually adding more decor

literally every build has new stuff and thats the unnamed stuff

[rustic cliff]

oh, gotcha

[dense plover]

because theyre essentially autoflagging potential furnishings

and then manually going through and removing the items that dont work

and then they name them after that

[rustic cliff]

ah ok, i didnt know thats how they do it

[dense plover]

i only know b/c ive been watching it happen since alpha 1

usually the stuff from the week before is named by the next build

[rustic cliff]

idk, either way im excited, but i do get what you mean with all the bugs that are yet to be fixed

[dense plover]

and then a bunch of new stuff is added

[elder seal]

Yeah that was the point. I havent heard him actively in ages but was he acting Arator in Legion too? By now all i can see him is being a Spödermän

[dense plover]

yes

he has always been arathor

he sounds the same in legion

[elder seal]

Yeah, doesnt talk as much tho so didnt really think too much of it back then haha

And i suppose the new Spider-Man games got released after legion too so couldnt add 2 and 2 back together, heh.. On completely unrelated matter to the beta.

[rain cave]

I do think yuri lowenthals voice has become more “yuri lowenthal” over the years to be fair

Like I didn’t used to hear him in things even if he was in them, but now I will hear not even dialogue just grunts and other random noises and I’ll immediately hear him in it

[upper pasture]

pog, transmog is saved

not surprised to see the prices come down

[little hound]

Yes ❤️

[deep pawn]

I may actually use it now

I was starting to despair that I was going to need duplicate outfits just for different weapon types at those costs

[elder seal]

Nice, finally covered screenshots up to this point. Im not honestly sure which zone i should go for next.

Arator one sounds tempting only because it seems to happen mostly on old zones and im getting mental burnout for all of the screenshots from Silvermoon 😂

[austere gazelle]

once live if you're interested in Haranir Harandar should be the first to go to unlock them

Arathor Journey can be quite fast excluding the Blackrock mountains quest which are a pain ( don't hesitate to give feeback on those one if they are still in a crappy state )
Zul Aman was refreshing and nice, and Harandar was a blast

[noble mica]

How do you get to these zones, through some portal? It seems like they are far away.

[elder seal]

Havent really checked and I suppose that problem only applies to ||Harandar||

[rain cave]

the ominously empty zone sized gap

lmao

[austere gazelle]

Haranir travels through roots by root walking or whatever. A nearby tree is enough for them to reach Harandar

[austere gazelle]

worst is, the land is already there in game... they should at least have it shown on map like the forbidden reach

Btw I hate those zone placement on the game ( like harandar and Voidstorm ) I've no idea how they could place those better but it give the impression that harandar is north east of QT which is not the case

It'll lead to people thinking it's really there like ppl think deepholme is really Azeroth's core under the maelstrom

Or nazjatar being dunno where

[rain cave]

wdym

isn't the isle of fangs the ones off the coast of zulaman that we can already see?

[fathom fulcrum]

https://fxtwitter.com/Portergauge/status/1993592410295935238?t=dCT6SmzZgK6OyhWDGVRSeA&s=19

Portergauge 🏳️‍🌈 (@Portergauge)

Hunting the Wretched down is a bit sad, as a blood elf in their modern era

**💬 1 🔁 2 ❤️ 11 👁️ 3.7K **

FxTwitter · Nov 26, 2025, 8:07 AM

it's okay most of the wretched were most likely high elves anyway

🤡

[fathom fulcrum]

https://fxtwitter.com/Wowhead/status/1993493253199659347?t=q60xQRGGoQB7mCLlKrWUUw&s=19

Wowhead💙 (@Wowhead)

Blizzard has announced that they have improved nameplates on the Midnight Beta.
︀︀
︀︀#Midnight #Warcraft
︀︀
︀︀www.wowhead.com/news/blizzard-improves-nameplates-on-midnight-beta-379418

**💬 22 🔁 6 ❤️ 174 👁️ 34.1K **

▶ Play video

FxTwitter · Nov 26, 2025, 1:33 AM

[mossy sapphire]

Might be worth a news item, if it hasn't already been done, but WoWAudit.com has a nifty Guild Neighbourhood plot reservation feature:

It does require that the GM sets the guild roster on WoWAudit, and you have to log in with your battlenet to verify your character name.

[obtuse vine]

https://x.com/wowhead/status/1993742394286854641?s=46&t=xCU5PEs1yQwL9rCJRzfUXg

Wowhead💙 (@Wowhead)

Blizzard has announced that Midnight will arrive on March 2nd, 2026!

#Midnight #Warcraft

https://t.co/ZByeuv2Rlu

X · Nov 26, 2025, 6:03 PM

[dull sage]

So 3 months for rich folk. 👀

[austere gazelle]

Mmm usually the trailers show more images and cinematic stills that stuff we never saw yet... there it's.. lacking

🤷

[dull sage]

It's a date announcement trailer. Nothing really else ot show other than that I'd say.

[austere gazelle]

true

[upper pasture]

And three months and three days for normal people

[dull sage]

Sips wine.

[elder seal]

Lol all advertisement material seems to be 100% focused on housing imo 😂

[upper pasture]

it's the largest community requested feature since the game launched of course they are gonna focus lot of the ads on it

[little hound]

Young Turalyon looks good.

Shame i can't copy this set, Tabard is Gladiator :C

[lone mantle]

Why does he look like me?

[deep pawn]

I didn't expect them to announce a date before the new year

Man we're really going to have RWF during Blizzcon in September aren't we

[upper pasture]

prolly trying to catch people with extra money during BF/CM and then the holidays too

[deep pawn]

Like I don't know if 11.1 was 24 weeks after prepatch or launch, I'll have to double check, but either way the season 2 race is gonna be somewhere around early September

[dull sage]

I think the only thing we're missing now is a solid confirmation on 12.0 prepatch?

[deep pawn]

Jan 20th or 27th remain most likely

[noble mica]

Housing is on Dec 2 so it’s cool

[upper pasture]

stop saying it like that lol, it's next reset! 😄

[noble mica]

What? Already? damn this time flows 😂

[upper pasture]

idk what it is about Nov/Dec time seems to be further away then it truly is

[noble mica]

They should give us all expansion on dec 2 as early access. Hahaha

[deep pawn]

Aug 26/27th for TWW and it's season 1 was September 10th or 2 weeks later.

[upper pasture]

the 2nd is the full expansion not the 3 days EA?

[deep pawn]

Undermined was Feb 25th or 26 weeks later, but that includes a Christmas, so it would have been about 24 working weeks exactly after launch.

[deep pawn]

it's full launch since that's a Monday

[upper pasture]

that's what i figured, and the EA starts the friday before

[deep pawn]

EA should be February 26th for NA

[upper pasture]

errr thursday lol

[deep pawn]

it's Friday for EU haha

[dull sage]

I'll be doing my expansion ritual then. 4 cans of monster energy drink, a big ass pizza, ice cream and the hospital on speed dial.

[deep pawn]

24 weeks after Launch gets me August 18th, they'd be cutting it close haha

and that's only ifi it's 24 weeks because no Christmas this time haha

26 weeks is Sept 1st, Blizzcon is Sept 12-13th

Either way a lot of Hall of Fame guilds are gonna struggle with that Blizzcon timing lol

[dull sage]

They'll probably just watch it after their raids surely?

[upper pasture]

a lot of the HoF guild attend blizzcon

[dull sage]

Huh. fair nuff.

[upper pasture]

but honestly i don't think it will be an issue. it's not like blizzcon is some week long festival with no internet

[deep pawn]

Gamescom was a week long commitment for the content creators that went to it haha