#beta-ptr-spoilers

1 messages · Page 44 of 1

rain cave
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I'm assuming you mean normal races

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which pandaren aren't really a part of

dense plover
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they literally are

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i would say anything except dracthyr and allied races are core races

upper pasture
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i mean it really depends on what you consider a "core" race i'd say anything that shipped with the base game as a "core" class. with that being said i DO hope that pandaren are soon i think the new item design and MoP themes are gonna look so good.

subtle oar
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Good God I want more MoP themes

rain cave
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a different kind of race

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I'm just curious as to how their heritage would work

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would it be 2 colors based on faction?

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or some design differences

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like for example, the horde one being a little more tribal, the alliance one being a bit more kept

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like very minor differences, in terms of magnitutde probably like how mythic sets are to their normal versions

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since even though pandaren are asian inspired, and their armor should reflect that. I reckon a core part of their race fantasy is how they're neutral and have joined these factions

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taken on some of the factions identity

willow dock
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guys in 10.1.5 healer paladin going to break?

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im new into the game and i played tank paladin in my whole play time , tried to play his healer too but someone said don't do that it isn't worth after 10.1.5 idk why

upper pasture
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that's someone being very pessimistic about the changes my guild paladin healer is very excited for the changes

willow dock
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i think its a change like dps paladin right?

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rework

upper pasture
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It might be worth saying it’s not worth learning the whole ins and outs of the spec as it stands now since it will be changing to some extent in the next patch but yes, there is some level of rework on holy paladin in 10.1.5

cosmic beacon
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the spec changes a good amount but learning now wont be detrimental

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if they really want to play the spec

uncut vault
plain violet
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"Tintintiiiin"

sleek solar
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Good luck waiting!

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“Core race” yet they were introduced a few expansions later xD

sleek solar
subtle oar
sleek solar
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How am I a troll lol

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Weird accusations🤡

crystal pond
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They choosing next heritages by popularity of races i think

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Not by "core, not core races"

uncut vault
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honestly I think theyre just choosing by what ideas they have lol

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legit the only one I think has a solid "cant happen till x time" is night elves because they're waiting for their post-BfA plot to (finally) be over

subtle oar
deep pawn
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Night elf, Draenei, Troll, undead, and Pandaren are what we're missing from non allied races

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Pandaren can be whenever honestly

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And it'll be about merging the two orders in balance

sleek solar
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Undead should have been with the Shadowlands reclaiming Lordaeron questline imo

rain cave
# subtle oar Cope harder troll

Pandaren aren't a core race, that isn't an insult to them it's just a categorization.... the same as how just because void elves are an allied race doesn't make them any lesser

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No reason to escalate and antagonise this

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After all the core races didn't get their heritage first did they?

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Pandaren are a unique and cool race. They aren't a core race though.

deep pawn
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They are though. They are an expansion race and a fully fledged one unlike allied and Dracthyr.

rain cave
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just because a race is allied doesn't make them not fully fledged

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core race to me means one of the basic races

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the ones from vanilla

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if you wanted to extend it, since belfs and draenei are so important

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sure

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we can include them

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but pandaren are more unique of a race than allied races

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pandaren are by definition a non-standard race, similar to dracthyr

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I just don't understand why people are taking that as a bad thing

deep pawn
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Fully fledged means fully brand new model, starts at level 1 and doesn't reuse a skeleton. A lot more work went into Pandaren, Goblins, Worgen, Draenei, and Blood elves than any of the allied races. Closest you get to is Kul Tiran

rain cave
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nightborne, kul'tiran, zandalari, vulpera

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I mean those share skeletons sure

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but if that's your definition for core races

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then even orcs don't count

deep pawn
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Nightborne are reskinned nelfs

rain cave
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because they share a skeleton with amani trolls

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the bug bulky ones

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a bunch of the core races share skeletons

deep pawn
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With NPCs maybe but not another playable race

rain cave
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pandaren are not a core race, I didn't think this would be a controversial statement

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it;s not a negative

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it's just something to point out

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what difference does it make

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as I said they're more non-standard than even allied races

deep pawn
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They absolutely are. They have been around for more than half the life of the game as a playable race. They have a full starting zone at level 1 and more.

rain cave
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being the only neutral race, they're in a whole category of their own

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I mean, eventually every race will fall under that argument though

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the time one

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if we can't draw a hard line in the sand on what is and isn't a core race

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then it's a pointless argument

upper pasture
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I’d say anything that was a playable race at the OG launch would be considered a “core” race.

rain cave
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there's no positives or negatives to being a core race

rain cave
upper pasture
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It’s not a bad thing just a simple definition

rain cave
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yep, considering some of the best liked races are non-core

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like belf, draenei

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pandaren...

deep pawn
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Are you on the outside or the inside of char selection. If you're outside you're a fully fleshed out race, not an allied race reskin.

rain cave
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worgen

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we aren't saying full fleshed out

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we're saying core

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as in

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they are the races that were part of the core game

deep pawn
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To me anything that isn't allied is a core race.

rain cave
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so if they added another race

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that would be a core race

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as well

deep pawn
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Given where they placed Dracthyr I'd call them core once they add more classes.

rain cave
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to me it just sounds like you have your own arbitrary list of rules

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which is fine, but kind of pointless for the sakes of this argument

deep pawn
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Last one I'd go with do they have their own city faction that sells multiple mounts.

rain cave
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since lehr and I are defining it based off of the core of the game

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not our own checklist

deep pawn
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I'm going based on how they were designed and sold. Allied races are deliberately sold as less unique

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Expansion races aren't

rain cave
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you could argue that some expansion races aren't unique

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belf's and draenei were in previous editions/games

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worgen were in vanilla

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goblins have been around for ages before cata

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worgen still borrowed from human customisation, goblins obviously werre still goblins even if they were visually updated

deep pawn
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They all got brand new models and animations when they became a playable character

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Allied races are lucky to have a unique idle stance.

rain cave
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doesn't make them any less of a race

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there are some fan favourite characters who are allied races

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alleria, princess talanji, ebyssian, thalyssra

deep pawn
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They aren't a "core race" though mechanically. Allied races all have a single mount earned by achievement when unlocked. They all start at level 10 and skip starting zones. None have a faction listed in classic rep. It's not about popularity or anything. Tushui and Houjin Pandaren are full fledged factions inside the cities. The others aren't the same. Closest we've gotten since Pandaren are Dracthyr because they have their own faction and set of normal and epic mounts. If any future classes of theirs start at level one that'll be another point to them being a core race.

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I'm admittedly a bit wary of them calling Dracthyr a full race because the dragon forms are lifted from npc models vs a model that can wear armor being repurposed as an NPC, but it checks every other criteria that sets a normal/core race apart from the allieds.

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So yeah, I fully expect to see Pandaren heritage. Troll will be whenever Vol jin returns as a Loa, Draenei will be whenever they are forced to side against the Naaru. Undead and Night Elf are waiting for plot advancement

upper pasture
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Yeah trolls will likely tie into Vol’jin’s return as to what he will be we’re not too sure as the loa even said he’s “something more” which is the best thing to come out of SLs in my book

deep pawn
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Hell watch undead be Sylvanas and Calia working together

uncut vault
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The term doesn’t come from the community, it’s comes from blizzard and how they code the races/select screen

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It was more obvious in the pre-Shadowlands one where you had to tab between them but only the explicit allied races on each side aren’t core races

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Pandaren always have been, and dracthyr now are too

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They start at level 1 on exiles reach with the basic classes like any other core race, not in a racial starting zone at 10 like allied races

rain cave
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because technically, there are a ton of 'core races' as you'd put them coded in

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including venthyr, kyrians, tuskarr, taunka....

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blizzard don't define core races

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they just have races and allied races, but even allied races are just treated like normal races now

uncut vault
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Again, core races is literally a game term haha

deep pawn
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Not really. They don't have starting zones or full sets of mounts and a faction

uncut vault
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It is the distinction between regular and allied races

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It was made by Blizzard in BfA

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The core races (at least prior to next patch) do not require any in game content completed to unlock, a new player can immediately play them

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Allied races were distinguished as the ones that had to be earned through in game achievements and had a unique starting process as a result

upper pasture
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what's that WotLK classic? maybe cause it was the first hero class so they had to put "core races" and "hero class"? idk

uncut vault
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BfA client

upper pasture
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it's a moot point anywho. let's all just hope for everyone to get more flesh out and their heritage armor/questlines

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to me it's less about who's next and more about when we're getting them lol more content is always good

deep pawn
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It's coming eventually. I imagine any who still don't outside of Pandaren have big lore moments coming

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If we are getting a light invasion the Draenei are going to have a huge moment of choice

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The warlock quest already has some questioning the Naaru

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I really hope it's an old world expansion. Not a redo levelling like cata but the old world as max level content

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A lot of the theories are centered around the Draenor races having taken over large chunks of Kalimdor

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I wanna see Arrakoa with harpy slaves

rain cave
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it just lines up too well

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they do often surprise us though

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personally, if we're getting a light invasion and revamp of zones

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I'd like the see outland get a touchup

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since that is where yrel's army would break through technically

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if they just swapped timeline in the same location

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there is also the naaru in shatt'rath who could accomodate their arrival

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could also keep sabellian an active character, since he might have some vested interest in defending his old home

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I doubt we'll get a revamped outland though

deep pawn
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I don't think Blizzard dares does a third Outland/Draenor expansion

rain cave
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that being said, I do think they could instead go for the route of having a patch zone be there

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but it's like instanced off from the main outland

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could explain it how the arrival, as well as the time since we were last there have erroded a lot of outland

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so there's no reason to leave that area

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but yeah, just imagine a high rez shatt'rath with a light army inhabiting it

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could even be where we end up as part of a raid

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but again, doubt it

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even though a lot of the light plot could be tied to outland, from characters to just raw world placement

deep pawn
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Only reason I don't see outland being involved is Yrel's divine mother saying they'll cross space

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On a ship, not use the dark portal

uncut lintel
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maybe the ship needs a part but the shop went out of buisness 5 yrs ago

sleek solar
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Voidforged Draenei when xD

deep pawn
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They don't have a powerful demonic artifact like Illidan had to open a portal. They've had to take the long way haha

plain violet
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@uncut vault Malfurion skull.. 😖

image.png
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It's not a skull of Gul'dan in this timeline, but a Malfurion skull, that is still not fel-touched at all despite the timeline. It's a skull with antlers.

deep pawn
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I presume that one is one Illidan fell fully to the fel

plain violet
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Yeah, as a betrayer and lord of Kalimdor in title...

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We fight in a Legion ship, no dialogues of this Illidan but he's fully inner demon.

rain cave
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just imagining our illidan just pointing to him and going "see I wasn't THAT bad!"

plain violet
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xD
Would have been funny.

silent urchin
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I guess we're done with the story stuff for 10.1, if nothing came out this week

austere gazelle
# deep pawn I really hope it's an old world expansion. Not a redo levelling like cata but th...

nope, at this point everything tend toward a " soft " reboot to warcraft core, and the very cradle of creation of Azeroth, Avaloren, the primordial continent, with all the starting seedling races prior the black empire.

Soft reboot because they got the chance to unveil a new whole continent with part hidden beneath a veil that we will touch progressively with each new expansion, like the ancient time²

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It'll cater to the " exploration feeling " and the " revelation " of everything about the very start of creation , and repurpose everything we knew and will introduce new mysteries and stuff. All of this will in the end lead to the Awakening of Azeroth, and the return of the EarthMother

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( Or so I hope )

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They have a unique chance to explore stuff we never heard about, the state of the world before the black empire, aka Proto Azeroth

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I don't know what is this, where it came from, nor if it's wow related, it was just flagged " leak " on another discord. If that's the real deal and preview and work before the future blizzcon, then I'm already hyped.

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( can also be just generated AI image through midjourney though xD )

silent urchin
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it's ai generated

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they're not bad ones, someones clearly cherry picked

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also being low res helps make them less odd

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but you can definitely see weird things if you look long enough

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Midjourney lets you generate from an existing image, I assume that's what this was

austere gazelle
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^^

crystal pond
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I think the whole stuff is AI generated

dense plover
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it does

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considering the name avaloren isnt a thing

crystal pond
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It is lol

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There is a book in game that spoiler that

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In Uldaman? I dont remember what dungeon exactly

dense plover
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its just a name of a place - it isnt anything

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its from the new uldaman

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but i more meant it like - isnt anything

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its just noted as a location

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it could be an island

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it could be a building in the middle of the ocean

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and it likely isnt significant

crystal pond
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Its can be evn an underground zone lmao dracthyr_hehe

dense plover
ionic terrace
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not sure if bugged or in character

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(yes it's bugged)

subtle oar
rain cave
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that being said it's funny how it's kind of combining new and old styles

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like it's got the colour pallette and complexity of newer areas but with some of the fidelity/texturing of like Wrath/tbc

austere gazelle
# dense plover and it likely isnt significant

It is significant. We already have several hints raising the hype - slowly - about a continent that is located on the other side of Azeroth.

1- Odyn talking about Avaloren, sending expendition there that just results in wreckage. Considering - at that time - that Azeroth was not sundered and Kalimdor was a full continent, sending expedition at sea clearly indicate that it is something that is not part of Kalimdor - nor underground

2- The Pirate and the Nigthsquall in the forbiden reach. Mentions that he braved the forbigging sea and found a world full of riches to seize. Is amassing a coalition of several pirates FLEET to go there ( which means it's not a random island considering what he's aiming to )

3- Neltharion's annoted book about the Old Gods and the Ordering of Azeroth. On the paragraph mentionning Kalimdor being the only continent, Neltharion clearly indicated that there was something else.

Combine that with the name of the two seas surrounding Kalimdor " Forbidding sea " and " The Veiled sea "
Clearly there is something there, and the multiple indication flourishing since the beginning of this expansion are just teasing something bigger

20230411_073851.png
dense plover
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doesnt mean it isnt an island btw

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and i think its them leaving themselves open to more continents

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because they have to

austere gazelle
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Clearly they have, and there is a silver lining to be found into the Tale of The Earthmother.
If there is another continent, it will be the birthplace of Elune and An'she.
In the tale its even mentionned that before going to sleep the Earthmother " spread her arms far into the seas " to make a land bridge to allow the Shu'alo to escape the place, probably toward the future Kalimdor

deep pawn
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that's just going off real world history though with the Tauren's Native American inspirations

dense plover
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^

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dont try and draw giant conclusions

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we never even got the squid temple on the dragon isles and im still sad about that

rain cave
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kalimdor

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eastern kingdoms

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northrend

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just big islands

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:p

ionic terrace
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https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/dragonflight-fractures-in-time-ptr-development-notes/1587226/9

World of Warcraft Forums
Dragonflight Fractures in Time PTR Development Notes

Here are this week’s Fractures in Time PTR notes: CLASSES Developers’ note: We are lowering the effectiveness of all Primordial Stones that deal damage by 40% to increase gearing options for players. We are compensating specific specializations that are commonly using the Onyx Annulet ring for this damage loss. Alongside this, we are reducin...

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Players that have defeated Garrosh Hellscream in Siege of Orgrimmar may now skip directly to The Inner Sanctum on all characters on the account by reading the scroll hanging on the wall near Loremaster Cho at the entrance.

silent urchin
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We expect this to be in a future 10.1.5 PTR build. I guess we're not getting the patch next week then

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maybe 27th

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Updated some legacy raids to drop bind-on-equip items more often when running them solo neat

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I guess some were dropping as per player loot or something

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and now it'll be similar to regular legacy rules as if it was a full raid

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Hmm, nearly all class tuning, so I'd be surprised if the patch was more than a couple weeks away

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New quest from Tempo down at the fountain in eon's fringe

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this one also doesn't show up in tracking

dense plover
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i dont understand the new brewmaster talent

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sounds sorta like the demon bite talent for DH?

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but as someone who refused to use that stupid stones ring, i love seeing all those damage buffs

silent urchin
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Seashellamayne

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dense plover
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my god - it finally happened

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silent urchin
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ooh, pet

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quest giver becomes a vendor afterwards, some old recipes available

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dense plover
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and some cosmetics - are those new?

silent urchin
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No idea, might be

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the off-hammer is actually an off-hand item

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seems to be unique for sure, even if it's not a new model

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Does seem like the others are unique too

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It seems like the three recipes were unobtainable

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Well that seems to be the only thing new. Time rift vendors also got some updates to costs etc, but not done a full comparison

candid ruin
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well this didn't take long

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silent urchin
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weird to have that many sizes

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but I can't see what they'd be other than shop

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might be only in certain territories

candid ruin
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yeah def going onto the shop

silent urchin
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I mean there were xp potions for years on china and/or taiwan or wherever

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and every so often they got rediscovered on ptr

candid ruin
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which i'll say is fine so long as they don't inflate the price of the trading post goods in order to force people to spend real money but this IS blizz

dense plover
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not guaranteed neccesarily

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this could be them replacing the icons in the tender thing or adding coins as rewards for stuff

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people have been saying they dont get enough tender so they might be making changes so that tasks directly give coins instead

candid ruin
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true there are a lot of icons

dense plover
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it doesnt match the concept of "we are selling these"

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there would only be a few icons

candid ruin
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feel like shop would be 5 or less icons

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yeah

dense plover
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it SEEMS bad

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and i feel they might do a blue post BECAUSE it seems bad

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i wouldnt jump to conclusions just yet

silent urchin
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there's only like 3 images, the rest is just changing the number

dense plover
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especially since it would make more sense to just directly sell the cosmetics instead of selling the tender

silent urchin
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so I feel like an artist might have thrown out any option possible so the actual shop quantities can be decided later

candid ruin
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also.. do.. they.. not have the tech to programmatically change the numbers so they don't need all these icons???

dense plover
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they do

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usually the boxes are blank for shop stuff

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thats rendered later

silent urchin
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and it can also be different for different currencies/regions etc

dense plover
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but these could be icons for like - bundles or something

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different currencies/regions wouldnt make much sense

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thats not how anything similar works'

candid ruin
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oh i see I see Thonk

dense plover
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runestones in HS dont do that

silent urchin
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You'd be surprised how annoying it can be to get text to look right when doing it programmatically compared to an artist doing it in like 30 minutes

dense plover
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it could also be that theyre going to give the currency with subscriptions

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like 1 month, 3 month, 6 month, a year

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each get different amounts of bonus tender

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or part of recruit a friend

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in which case they WOULD need to pre-render the amounts

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or as I said, could be them adjusting how the system works

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since 1000 definitely isnt enough

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they may add other ingame methods to get currency

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like tasks directly giving specific amounts after you get your 1k

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or achievements that give it

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or even a way to buy it with DI's resources or gold or something

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we REALLY dont know yet

candid ruin
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very good points

silent urchin
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this time rift is uhhhh not subtle

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Neither the activity log or shop are open on PTR

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although the post itself is, but none of those icons are used there

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Oh, just noticed, those new mace appearances are specifically the ones off the weapon rack doodad

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dense plover
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oh so definitely new

silent urchin
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Unless that also got sneakily updated

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hmm, all the other racks I can see have blades of some sort, but those maces do make appearances in and around various blacksmith areas as well

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dense plover
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dunno if this was in before

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theres some older sets with new recolors now

image.png image.png image.png
silent urchin
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Oh, yeah, apparently a lot of the naxx "ancient crafting" stuff has been put in this build

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secret finding discord are exploring how you unlock it

dense plover
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is the way the drop shows where it comes from and the tracking icon thingy new?

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silent urchin
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that's a 10.1.5 feature, yes

dense plover
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cool

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oooo it even puts a world pin on vendors

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dense plover
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i do NOT like what this implies

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candid ruin
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I think its a safety for when the event dies down and you may not have enough people to complete the bar or something, someone put out a video on it

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maybe that was something else tho Think

dense plover
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also the map for the dungeon seems unneccesary

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wonder why they made it

ivory meadow
rain cave
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so they'd probably up the quality of the trading post to compensate

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(which is sorely needed after the past few months lol)

dense plover
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this is sorta what i think is most likely as well

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i do hope they increase the amount available each month if they arent going to cut some of the prices

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some of the items are too expensive

rain cave
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Already the ettin that is asmongold is making clickbait anger reaction stuff about it being p2w

dense plover
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wut?

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i dont understand your reply

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in what context does this have anything to do with main story?

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its a daily

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its just there in eons fringe

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on ptr

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i dont see how its out of line

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we have to make sure the timeways stay the same

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i do

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you this guy?

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because uh'

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i very much doubt the book is canon anymore

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its old af

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half the old books arent accurate

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the implication thing i was talking about was the item

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because it implies you dont always get a reward

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its an optional daily

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you dont have to touch it

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because saying a fucking short daily is "out of line" is dumb as shit

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and so is the forum post

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is it? a thing happened and we cant change it because thats the timeline

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its that simple

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just like saurfang had to die

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just like sylvanas had to destroy the helm

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etc

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its just another point in time

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again - i was trying to POINT OUT THE ITEM REWARD

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I truly couldnt care about the quest

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then you shouldnt have responded to me

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im done

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blocked

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if you arent a troll, i dont have the patience to explain things multiple times to you

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try reading plz

little hound
# dense plover you this guy?

Not sure how much people like this spend their daily time making up this stuff to post, but surely desperate for attention.

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On the other hand: CALLED IT! ❤️

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dense plover
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I hope they change it to purely cosmetic

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otherwise people will complain about stats and shit

clear parrot
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The garrosh fan club is nutting atm

harsh mason
# dense plover wut?

I didn't understand the hysteria about this at all. This is part of the story, part of the lore. For me, to be honest, it's a little unclear why extraterrestrial rape has become worse than murder. Both things are terrible, but it's part of the lore of the game

plain violet
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We enable it, it's a daily, they treat like a daily side thing, they don't explain at all why they need to allow Alex to be tortured X more month and not be liberated early, to have her knowing...

harsh mason
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For some reason, I am 1000% sure that if there was a quest related to timeline, when there was a genocide of dreenev, the rection would be normal

plain violet
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Also the "don't change the timeline" is a bit false: we know we can change the details without too much problems, like the War of the Ancients: same outcome, differents details and what happened.

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I also imagine Blizzard history with sexual assaults make the fact of a quest about us enabling it because "timeline" a bit more... displaced.

harsh mason
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Just because we can change doesn't mean we have to change. So in general, you can change all the inconvenient details, it's not right.

plain violet
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As many said, it's more how it is told and what is around that bother, more than the classical dilemna of "not changing time" (that was also proved false) and of such a dark quest for such a detail: when she is liberated.

#

And just because because we have "canon event" doesn't mean we have to be strict about suffering (here, the duration of her suffering). That's funny because well, the new Spiderman movie does talk about that...

#

I also talked about the War of the ancients: bronze dragons changed it big time, and Chromie have no problem changing the fate of Nozdormu or at least trying.

#

The quest just said "she must not be liberated too early" (without explaining why) and have us enabling more suffering. It's very different that "made sure this happen"

#

It would be like having a quest where we are sure the invasion of Quel'thalas is here vs having a quest where we are sure X childrens have to die during the invasion of Quel'thalas because "it must not have that much survivors", and have us making sure nothing can save them.

#

Understandably, people will be pissed.

harsh mason
#

Well, that is, just need to add an explanation of the reason. I don't think it's a huge problem, because it's still on PTR. As for the war of the ancients, this is a bad plot movie, because: 1) the meaning of bronze dragons is not to allow ANY changes. 2) so you can generally change any terrible details of a historical event

#

Imagine that you can change any event in this way (even in detail). But then any value of the plot is lost

plain violet
#

That's the same with the bronze dungeon in BC, Cata and Wotlk: we changed details, not the big plot.

#

But suddenly it must be exactly like before.

#

For sure the quest need to be rewritten. For now it's needless.

harsh mason
#

I understand that this needs to be written in the plot, but speaking from the point of view of the players, the fact that bronze dragons should not allow someone to change something in the timeline is just a way to remove this opportunity to change something that don't like

silent urchin
#

There's little consistency with how time travel changes work in wow, but ultimately that doesn't matter. It's a very sensitive subject, for many people in particular, and it's not really being given appropriate levels of consideration. It's also very reminiscent of much of the old blizz attitude to these things. The main issue isn't necessarily how the quest resolves, but that it exists at all when it adds basically nothing to the story except "hey remember when afrasiabi wrote some awful stuff"

#

I don't think it's meant to come over that way, but three paragraphs of text is not a lot to add some nuance

plain violet
#

It wasn't necessary to make this quest, and to make it this way.

silent urchin
#

Oh neat, like with niffenseeking, all the various quests you can get from time rifts go on a table for you to inspect after,

image.png
subtle oar
# dense plover i very much doubt the book is canon anymore

I'm pretty sure it is still very much Canon, considering the elderly Dragonmaw that came to the Dragon Isles and his related story of regret for the atrocities they helped commit. Plus War Crimes which has Tyrande put Alex on the stand to try to implicate all Orcs as Monsters, only for Alex to stun everyone by saying she forgives them and holds no ill will to an entire race for the actions of only one clan

subtle oar
#

Some ppl really are just terminally online and need to go touch grass

subtle oar
# plain violet Also the "don't change the timeline" is a bit false: we know we can change the d...

See, this is much different tho. Alexstraza was kept alive because she was able to produce more mounts for the Dragonmaw, and to keep the current flight of Reds in line. If we somehow changed it to that she was not producing more eggs for the Dragonmaw, that would drastically change the future, as the many reason she was kept alive would be gone, thus the Dragonmaw would have just killed her and turned the Dragon Soul on all living Reds to force them to obey or die as well.

plain violet
#

So it is not much different. In the context of the quest, nothing explain or present a situation that such a detail would radically change the future, and just make us do that "because we have to"

#

Worse, because "it's too early", and the quest sounds really arbitrary about.

#

You can read the rest of my messages to understand why others can have problems with it: I also used a comparison with Quel'thalas to present of this quest is different from others bronze quests such as Stratholme.

subtle oar
#

I just don't agree with the 'outrage'

#

Bad shit happens.

plain violet
#

I do not know about outrage: but I understand why people will be upset about it, considering how it is represented and how Blizzard decide to have a quest focus on rape.

subtle oar
#

Trying to whitewash fantasy of all dark themes is not the way to go

plain violet
#

People asked to rewrite the quest to portray a serious subject with seriousness, or to not do it, not to whitewash.

subtle oar
plain violet
#

Just look at what I explained, the absence of consistancy of it, look at the quest text. Ask Portergauge or others.

subtle oar
#

I have read your reasoning, I just do not agree

plain violet
#

Doing a quest about such a subject, while I am not against, and despite being a survivor, ask to treat like the dark subject it is.

#

Let's agree to disagree in that case.

#

Because I do not agree with how the quest was presented, and the absence of justification for doing such a thing (when others had way others justifications and that we know details can be changed, and this quest is about details)

harsh mason
subtle oar
#

The subject is not rape. The subject is to make sure history plays out how it should to not disturb the timeline. There was no backlash to making sure Arthas could cleanse Stratholme or for Medivh to summon the Horde; who rape, murder and pillage across Azeroth. The backlash to this is hypothetical at best and performative at worst

plain violet
#

We know directly what happen and what the dragonsoul was used for, it is heavily implied before, during and after the quest and yet not treated like it, it was a good old Afriabasi writing.

#

As said before: Arthas and Medivh are big event, not details.

#

Here, we are assuring details about her having, for some reasons, to suffer this for X time because "timeline" with a direct implication of it. Not to made sure she's captured, but to make sure she suffer long "enough"

subtle oar
#

There is no difference.

plain violet
#

There is. Like I explained before it's like a quest having you making sure Arthas invade Quel'thalas versus a quest having you making sure % of childrens are killed because "there must be 90% of killed, not too much survivors"

silent urchin
#

Fantasy can definitely explore dark themes, this just isn't the way to do it. Wow narrative is so restricted in length in general it's hard to do justice to anything, the amount of dialogue in even the entire 10.1 campaign is a few pages at most. One daily with a few paragraphs of text about a very difficult subject is just not a good experience for a lot of people.

plain violet
#

One quest is about the big event, not details (like Medivh or Stratholme, as in Stratholme you can refuse to kill the civilianz still), one is about details, arbitrary.

And as said also before (thanks Vaephera), this is a very difficult subject that can not be presented like a daily quest.

harsh mason
#

Well, this theme can be developed in some more global quest. But lol, it has already reached the point that people write that it was because of our players that she was raped. I'm talking about this hysteria. No damn, not because of us, these are events of the past that cannot be changed (that's what the quest is about)

crystal pond
#

They just need to make it as a normal quest, not as daily
and make the text so that there are no questions or objections

ivory meadow
plain violet
# crystal pond They just need to make it as a normal quest, not as daily and make the text so t...

Clearly the text need to be rewritten, and not a daily (making it daily would be.. just no).

I do not know about the hysteria, surely some people could have bad takes about it and reach it far. Mine was that people could be justifingly pissed about it, it's SA, or not liking it at all, and that there were no need to say people not liking such content, or not liking how it is presented, are terminally all or like I have seen elsewhere, "fragile snowflakes"

plain violet
crystal pond
plain violet
harsh mason
plain violet
#

How it is presented, and as a daily, for now it's a plain "no" and in contradiction with previous. They need plenty of more text about it, before/after.

#

Like maybe how they did with the dwarf dragon.

ivory meadow
# plain violet I don't really understand what you are trying to say.

Sorry, I should clarify that the straw-manning and other things are from Twitter spaces and also this post from yesterday that I just... don't understand as to why doing this quest even implies us being... this. Also, people saying that "we can save Nozdormu from turning into Murozond but can't save Alex from being SA'd?" when those two things have very different consequences or that the quest is framed as something heroic when nobody involved was the slightest bit happy about to having to do this, etc. Just didn't really appreciate people losing a bit of their common sense even if I do understand why they're upset.

image.png
plain violet
#

Oh, that kind of things!

#

Sadly bound to happen, some lost their cool, and we have that, others are just seeking conflict.

ivory meadow
#

true true..

crystal pond
#

Yummy

#

Ffs need to wait until November

plain violet
#

It seem very promising..

#

But so, I imagine Vyranoth will become an ally.

harsh mason
daring heron
#

rofl

subtle oar
subtle oar
daring heron
#

it was always planned to be a battle pass honestly

#

the thing that concerns me is that they might deliberately increase the price to obtain some rewards from the trading post just to push people to buying it with RL money

harsh mason
daring heron
#

this is exactly a battle pass, lol, the only difference is that from patch 10.1.5 blizz will add the "premium" tier to it by allowing people to buy tenders from the store

dense plover
#

we dont know what the assets are for

#

its likely they arent being directly sold

#

theres too many options for it to be normal selling

#

its more likely they are giving them away or bundling them with stuff

#

or they might be part of recruit a friend

#

for example it could be a way to convince people to pay for a longer sub - ie 1 month gets 100 extra coins per month, 3 month gets 200 per month, 6 month gets 350 and 1 year gets 500 extra

#

not saying thats a good thing, but its very different from directly selling it

harsh mason
#

It makes no difference, because the items in the shop still have no effect on the strength of the character. Nothing at all. It's just cosmetics.

#

And those who write about P2W (we all know who), my condolences

#

I agree that when we buy a cosmetic set, the mythic Sarkareth immediately dies

dense plover
#

its still icky because we pay for the sub

#

and they said you wouldnt be able to buy the currency

#

so if they are going back on that, thats bad

#

if they arent, thats a different story

subtle oar
dense plover
#

it really depends on what they are doing with this

light compass
plain violet
#

I already talked about the Stratholme example and how it is different (at least in my eyes).

#

Also: no need to post after one year just to relaunch a subject about SA. Thanks.

dense plover
#

theyre probably just going to remove that quest

#

maybe a short comment in the patch notes like "we didnt plan for this quest to go live and it snuck through"

#

or no acknowledgement at all

clear parrot
#

This game is an eternal cycle of deception

plain violet
#

I think that's how it will goes yes, some comment or silence and boom. I expect some video about of it of Taliesin (but I do agree with his tweet, same as Portergauge, who are really reasonnable about it)

rustic cliff
#

I wanna know more about this Quantum courser. It seems really cool

silent urchin
#

MrGM had one drop, it seems like when you use it then it unlocks a random unknown mount (probably with some restrictions)

#

same with the quantum transmog

#

you don't learn the quantum courser itself and get a random mount each time

#

They permanently unlocked the attumen mount from karazhan, I think

dense plover
#

i wonder whats considered "old"

#

like is it specifically wow classic stuff?

#

b/c i think that would be great - running vanilla wow content feels bad

silent urchin
#

oh it was apparently legion karazhan

dense plover
#

huh

silent urchin
#

so not just classic (or tbc) for original kara

dense plover
#

so is it just any random drop mount?

#

can you get ashes or invincible?

silent urchin
#

Well

#

so far I know you can get Midnight from legion karazhan

#

Anything beyond that is speculation :p

subtle oar
dense plover
#

i mean - you can have darker themes and avoid this specific one

#

they might rework it

#

they reworked the wrathion one to not joke about alcoholism and remove the punch

silent urchin
#

Oh they did? neat

dense plover
#

yeah

harsh mason
#

Remove is too radical.

harsh mason
# dense plover i mean - you can have darker themes and avoid this specific one

And why exactly is this to be avoided? You could say that about anything: the theme of orcs invading Azeroth, followed by murder and violence? Well it wasn't avoided in BC. And just clumsily described in the quest, but lol, that's exactly what shaped Alex's character and her attitude towards mortal races( she loves and protects mortal races even though they caused disgusting things to happen to her ( last time, in Legion, everyone knows what DK did). This shows the strength of her character and that she also has to accept the fact that she cannot interfere with the past( no matter how much she wants to change it). And the players need to be shown that so they know what she's going through. So I only agree that this should be done as a big storyline, on a non Daily quest. But not remove it because it's rape. That way you can remove any mention of horrible moments in the game's history at all( I mean, it kind of was, but you can't mention it). But this is nonsense.

dense plover
#

because rape is a trigger? because it isnt handled with sensitivity?

#

i dont think i need more reasons then that

#

its a poorly written quest

#

they need to change it or remove it

harsh mason
#

Many people don't know that Alex has suffered more than almost any other character at all, yet she continues to love the mortal races. That is the essence of the character. And if people take any attempt to show this so radically (and blizz will so radically just delete it), it's better not to do anything at all

dense plover
#

im not saying to delete the history

#

im saying this quest

#

because its nonchalant af about this

#

so either it needs to be rewritten or if they arent going to do that, it needs to go

silent urchin
#

it's not radical to cut content that's bad

dense plover
#

^^^

crystal pond
#

Its just need better explanation and not just removing it from the game
if the problem is simply removed and not explained, it does not develop writing

silent urchin
#

the quest as is doesn't develop anything

crystal pond
#

For us yes
But for who writing this quest does

dense plover
#

wut?

#

its old lore - it isnt supposed to develop anything

#

so either they need to redo it or it needs to go

#

it doesnt need to stay

#

it being gone would not be a major loss

crystal pond
#

People who write quests / books / other things are committed to this or that issue all the time. If it's just cleaned up, and not dispersed, people do not progress in any way
Wich is leading into bad af writing for absolute new stories

dense plover
#

its not new

#

and its not cleaning up anything

crystal pond
#

I mean the quest is new

dense plover
#

its a new quest about an old thing

#

the quest adds nothing to the lore

#

what you said literally doesnt apply

#

this isnt them cleaning up old story

crystal pond
#

Yeah and the person who writed the quest totally not from the old team who writed about alex enslavement

harsh mason
#

If the game is to reveal Alex, need to show what she's been through and why she still loves and protects mortals. You can't delete a quest just because it's about the topic of rape. You need to finalize it, make it part of a larger storyline (like blue flight). But do not delete.

dense plover
#

this quest doesnt resolve that or even treat it with respect though

#

its part of a series of goofy dailies

dense plover
#

wow does not need to have a questline focusing on past rape

#

thats not a thing wow should have ever

#

dark =/= fucked up because it can be

#

you can do dark fantasy without triggers and focusing on something that honestly should be cut from the lore completely imo

crystal pond
#

So enslavement of Alex must be removed completely you say or what?

dense plover
#

enslavement not neccesarily

harsh mason
dense plover
#

wow has lots of history with the nastiness that is slavery

dense plover
#

like the wrathion quest

#

like

silent urchin
#

We've got 9 expansions in without bringing up that particular plot point from warcraft 2

dense plover
#

do you have any context for where this quest appears @harsh mason because it sounds like you dont

crystal pond
dense plover
#

its the hyper focus on rape that is this shitty storyline

rustic cliff
#

Tali was saying something on stream that felt reasonable, which was like, don’t remove the past, don’t retcon it, but like, at the very least don’t make us complicit in it

dense plover
#

^^^^

#

they need to rewrite it

#

if they arent going to rewrite the new quest

#

it doesnt need to exist

rustic cliff
#

Oi fuck off crypto boy

dense plover
#

already reported

harsh mason
dense plover
silent urchin
#

The quest doesn't even explore that at all

rustic cliff
#

And honestly- if they still wanna have that whole thing be a plot point, why not have us be the good guys? Like “oh no!! The horde are keeping alex way longer than she was supposed to be there, and she hasn’t broken free! Go free her to restore the timeline” or some shit

dense plover
#

again - it sounds like you are saying it should be a thing it isnt when it isnt in that place

#

its a short daily

crystal pond
# dense plover the slavery isnt the problem

It wasnt about slavery
It was about that people complain about dragon being raped when we have children being murdered with no mercy by orcs and everybody is okay with latest

dense plover
#

so uh

#

fuck off with the whataboutism

#

ok?

harsh mason
dense plover
#

go look at the other similar dailies

#

instead of making a strawman about why it should be turned into a fucking storyline (it shouldnt, thats fucked but thats a whole other issue)

silent urchin
#

I would personally be very happy if we got a blue-dragonflight length quest line where we just talk with alexstrasza the whole time

#

but I don't think we're gonna get that

harsh mason
# dense plover but its not the place for it dude

What are we talking about? That this has no place in the game itself or in the daily quest? If the second, then I have already written 10 times that I agree and it should make a storyline.(like blue dragos). If the first, then I do not agree.

dense plover
#

i dont think they need it as a quest in this context

#

covering alexstrasza's past? sure

#

we could absolutely use some of that

#

but not as part of the infinite dragon stuff

#

and not as part of a series of sillier dailies

crystal pond
dense plover
#

its the player being complicit in it

#

and its handled poorly

#

it either needs to be much better written or it needs to be removed

#

the dailies are supposed to be a bit silly

#

this topic is NOT

#

its not complicated

crystal pond
#

With alot of screaming about this quest they will sure do something with it

#

Hope for proper explanation and normal quest

dense plover
#

as i said, im gonna guess theyll remove it

#

and then yeah maybe actually revisit her past as a real questline

#

not as part of this

crystal pond
#

Because alot of new players do not understand about Alex enslavement and how it playing out for the lore
Wich is sad because most of the explanation in books and almost none in game

dense plover
#

this. is not. the place. for it.

harsh mason
# crystal pond Because alot of new players do not understand about Alex enslavement and how it ...

Alex's reaction to the final quest was great: it was the first time in 20 years of the game's existence that she was really pissed off( straight up really pissed off). But it will probably just get deleted. Yes, I've written before, many players don't even understand what Alex is all about and why her love for mortal races is so important and so valuable. She really sees value in every life (which she constantly talks about), but it is everything that has happened to her that adds value to her position

dense plover
#

"hey we just worked to send a bunch of wrathions back in time, now go stop alexstrasza from escaping from force mating done by orcs" <- this is why it isnt a functional place for this

#

do you see how those tonally dont match?

harsh mason
crystal pond
#

^^^

glass flicker
#

Ah yes. When Blizzard didn't write stories for teenage girls.

crystal pond
#

Ah yes kid friendly game

glass flicker
#

I miss MoP storytelling.

#

What's the worst that happened since Garrosh, besides Sylvanas burning Mr. Tree?

crystal pond
#

There is alot in warcraft in game that is absolutely not okay when you think about it
But its in game still
Massive genocide
Experimentation on living beings
Enslavement
And then sadenly "rape is bad remove it"
???
Making a proper explanation why it is bad and why this must not happen ever again is better then removing it
Its way better because its making people actually think about the situation

silent urchin
#

didn't realise every story without sexual abuse was for teenaged girls (and if you actually saw literature aimed at teenage girls it's probably one of the places most likely to explore that topic)

crystal pond
dense plover
#

again - the quests here are goofy

crystal pond
#

Neltharion lab is absolute mess

#

Wod was cuted
But something with Yrell

glass flicker
harsh mason
glass flicker
#

Just look at the best example. Jaina and Katherine making up. You could say Jaina's phase is over and they hugged it out.

crystal pond
#

Lol i was trying to think about dark lore but it was alot of dark since legion dracthyr_hehe

harsh mason
#

Although no, there was a local concentration camp in SL in Maldraxxus

#

Where experiments were put on, killed, and the corpses were re-rolled into a mass to create cadavers

crystal pond
#

"Sounds okay to me" Wow community

harsh mason
glass flicker
#

Remember when blood elves were considered controversial for mind controlling their own people for political views and enslaving leper gnomes to build Silvermoon?

#

That's darker because it's more grounded and real, imho.

dense plover
#

its also part of a dark storyline

#

not a daily mixed in among goofy funny silly time travel quests

glass flicker
#

Also starting to lowkey hate Chromie.

harsh mason
dense plover
#

im more arguing with the other person at this point

#

i know youve already agreed this is NOT the place for this

glass flicker
#

When I saw "Amber Kearnen must die" I actually questioned her morality as a good guy. Surely she can look at the bigger picture and say "Yeah, I can probably prevent it all by exposing the fake Mathias Shaw before anyone knows what's happening. Oh well! Here I go killing! Again! peepoCute"

crystal pond
#

Chromie just depressed dracthyr_tea

#

But yeah karen quest gived me questions too on how bronze work in general

glass flicker
#

Yeah no. She can go straight to Torghast. Next time I quest around Thaldraszus, I'll make sure to not save her and Eternus. And I'll teabag Morchie's corpse simply for existing.

crystal pond
#

"Its so important to kill a person when legion invaded, but we not gonna prevent garosh being freed"
The hell?

glass flicker
#

Thank Garrosh she doesn't bring up the buttfly effect.

#

"Small changes in the timeline can cause irreversible damage!"

crystal pond
#

And after Kearnen Alex enslavement happening
Wtf with bronze
Murozond already happened and we still dont know or what???

glass flicker
#

I wouldn't be surprised if Chromie was actually Morchie all along and that's why we had scuffed Classic too.

#

Remember, she pressed that button on the Temporal Discombobulator.

crystal pond
#

I hope they will not forget about legion time stuff and will explain why this shit cannot be prevented and why guldan from different timeline is canon for our true timeline

#

When others stuff not

glass flicker
#

Here's a better one.

#

Why does the Bronze Dragonflight let Elisande play with chronomancy in the Nighthold when they know elves usually screw everything up?

#

"They say time can be quite volatile"

#

Yeah, no shit.

#

And what is the Bronze Dragonflight's goal, anyway? To maintain the true timeline?

crystal pond
#

People on writing team must watch nobbel87 videos on past events idk

glass flicker
#

We had two expansions kicked off with time shenanigans. The Bronzes did nothing to help us. Nada.

#

And let's talk about this too.

#

How is alternate universe past Gul'dan able to hack into our universe future Azeroth?

#

They never did explain it.

crystal pond
glass flicker
#

I hope Nozdormu gets a personality akin to that of Omniman before "What will you have after five-hundred years?"

#

Just angry, nihilistic and ready to enslave an entire world.

crystal pond
#

"Think champion think"

glass flicker
#

Exactly that.

#

"Why did you make me do this? You're fighting so you can watch everything around you die. Think, champion, think! I can change the destiny of every fragile, insignificant being in this world. I'll live to see Azeroth crumble to dust and blow away! Everyone and everything you know will be gone! So allow me to create one perfect timeline"

plain violet
#

Thanks @dense plover . I am glad you think it that way too.

silent urchin
#

hmm, I specifically checked to see if they'd added events for the other continents for dragonraces and didn't see them

#

unless it got added in one of the many restarts since tuesday

#

oh it seems like there aren't any actual calendar events up yet, but I guess the event type was added?

harsh mason
#

https://www.wowhead.com/ptr-2/news/for-azeroth-interview-with-morgan-day-and-stephen-cavallaro-333508 "More quests will open up after completing the mega-dungeon as well, including "some encrypted things that players will have to wait until launch to see." No spoilers though!"

Wowhead
For Azeroth! Interview with Morgan Day and Stephen Cavallaro

Morgan Day and Stephen Cavallaro spoke on the For Azeroth Podcast about the upcoming Dawn of the Infinites mega-dungeon in Dragonflight Patch 10.1.5, discussing story content, heroic raid target difficulty, Heroic split in 10.1.7 and Mythic+ in Season 3!

#

Vyranoth arc, Vyranoth arc, Vyranoth arc

dense plover
#

"10.1.7 will split the mega-dungeon into two for Heroic. It will enter the rotation in Season 3." extremely useful info from one of the interviews

#

this means you can queue for it in 10.1.7

#

which is probably how ill be doing it

#

i dont have a guild and im terrified of tanking a dungeon that long

#

"The experience of the dungeon will be different when it is split, with some narrative and other RP stuff being removed to better-fit M+, all the while keeping the core of the narrative." - also interesting

#

"By the end of the Dawn of the Infinite, the Murozond story is finished, for now. However, there will be more quests following the dungeon. And this doesn't mean the end of the Infinite Dragonflight."

#

this is interesting and implies that murozond is not the villain of this expac, which does make sense at this point

#

but it also means he isnt done yet

silent urchin
#

if we're getting a bunch of interviews now then I expect a date announcement soon

dense plover
#

my guess is right after 4th of july

silent urchin
#

my guess is the 27th

dense plover
#

or the week before

#

which is yeah, the 27th

#

i only think it might be later because of a ton of bugs still in this patch

harsh mason
#

"he Incarnates do not see Galakrond as a martyr or as an ally, as they feared him, as well as the Aspects did"

#

well

#

This means that no one is going to raise him from the dead

harsh mason
dense plover
#

definitely still iridikron

#

fyrakk is going to think he is tough shit

#

and then iridikron is going to dunk him so hard he disintegrates

harsh mason
#

Well, for now I'm assuming that Iridikron can survive in DF

#

Fyrakk, on the other hand, doesn't seem to me to have a chance anymore.

dense plover
#

fyrakk and iridikron will both be dead by the end of this expac

#

no way they are setting either of them up to last longer

harsh mason
austere gazelle
harsh mason
#

Igira also creates something from metal and shadowflame (this is the essence of Fyrakk assault)

crystal pond
#

Yall dont forget that iridikron got the artifact with "hunger of Galakrond"

#

In new mega dungeon

#

Maybe incarnates do feared Galakrond but i think that with this power necro stuff will be happening

#

zombie dragons zombie dragons dracthyr_hehe

uncut vault
#

And then galakrond will take off his hood

#

And he’s secretly been the jailer the whole time

#

Master plan

silent urchin
#

Oh hey the Anduin time-daily is up again and the tracking got fixed, no wonder it was impossible to find, it's in a cave in western azure span

#

sorry, llane wrynn, not anduin

austere gazelle
rain cave
#

peels off face like a scooby doo villain to reveal dragon head

ivory meadow
plain violet
#

Thanks Wowhead for locking the topic.

#

I was writing a very serious response to these people trying to justifying what is not justifiable, but I think it is better to erase and lock all comments. Clearly, some people are just cruel.

sleek solar
#

What topic?

austere gazelle
#

Alexstrasza difficult time with the Dragonmaw

sleek solar
#

Ahhh that topic

glad niche
#

The one from the old book?

#

They put that in game??

sleek solar
#

The one where she has to make babies

#

Forcibly

glad niche
#

Yeah. No hints needed

#

I know the old timeline enough.

#

I'm more curious how someone at some point thought that was ok to put into the game

#

Lorts almighty

austere gazelle
#

They did not technically put that in the game, but from what I understood you had to bring back the dragon soul at that point in time somehow

sleek solar
#

Its a quest where you go back in time, and she almost escapes, but you have to stop her from escaping or something

austere gazelle
#

and Chromie just talk about this casually with some light hearted discussions and jokes ?

glad niche
#

Well not THAT specific detail. Reading your last comment
Jeezus crist

dense plover
harsh mason
glad niche
#

The thing with chromie, as doggo has clarified, is no better tho

upper pasture
#

That is what the major problem is lore nuts/nerds know what happens when she’s captive and it’s not great but to the average player it’s just making her stay the appropriate amount of time. It’s not like blizzard specifically said in the quest that we need to make sure she stays there to get TR ||raped||

glad niche
#

I guess the clearest way of wording my perspective would be - that's all a part of the timeline id always figured would be left entirely OUT of the game side of the universes consumable content.

austere gazelle
#

That's not the issue tbh

#

the issue is Chromie talking about this like its some funny matters

upper pasture
#

All the backlash I’ve seen and heard about it is all “our characters shouldn’t be complaint with this”

austere gazelle
#

It's like you're going back in time to stop Uther being saved and chromie just mumble stuff about the paladin having to crook no matter what while throwing out jokes

glad niche
#

Dialogue and tone do matter a lot. I've not seen this stuff since I don't play on the ptr. But if it can be heard or understood in some joke form, then it's poorly executed dialogue.

upper pasture
#

But if you’re not a lore person it’s simply just another quest but tbf I guess you could make that argument for anything

#

Yeah it’s a good thing that they are reworking it to be fair

glad niche
#

Thanks for the clarifications btw.

plain violet
#

Some comments in Wowhead were atrocious in the subject..

glad niche
#

I was nervous of asking here since the post in my wow news feed is locked (ya know. The wowhead comments) but I was curious what would actually get a blue post to admit to reworking dialogue content.

austere gazelle
#

Imagine " Go back in time to prevent Theramore to be saved or else it'll shatter the timeline "

Chromie : " Yeah, we need Jaina to become that old warmongering bitch or else nothing we did will matter "

glad niche
plain violet
#

Or that a "true survivor" should like this quest.

#

(spoiler: no I don't like this quest)

glad niche
#

Jeeze.

upper pasture
#

Yeah they could have easily wrote chromie to have some remorse that she “has to fix” this or else the timeline would be ruined

glad niche
#

Peeps need to touch some grass.

plain violet
#

Yeah... Wowhead was right to lock the comments.

#

Agreed..

plain violet
#

So glad it will be reworked.

upper pasture
#

Yeah

glad niche
#

Which makes the (assumed) outrage? At the jokes thing completely understandable

ivory meadow
glad niche
#

Case by case basis.

glad niche
#

I got it.

Monthly quizzes for the devs that test their understanding of wow lore. If they pass, they get more say in test content. If they fail, they lose a good boy star.

Jokes aside, while I know they pretty much retcon willy nilly, I've always found it odd when devs seem to not fully grasp the long standing lore on projects that they join late.

Not saying that's what happened here, cause I don't work at blizz. Just failing to fathom some choices they make. This being one of them.

#

Anyways. Walkers of the future. Do dracthyr get to fly normally yet?? I yearn to afk flap at max skybox height.

timber frigate
#

You mean dracthyr flight like worgen running?

glad niche
#

Si

#

Gemme a cast bar like a normal mount and let me flap flap.

#

That or give me a cast bar for full dragon riding capabilities

#

Really I'd be ok with either. Specially considering there's ptr info regarding dragon riding for old zones

timber frigate
#

The soar is neat you can fly from valdrakken to zaralek caverns in a single run

glad niche
#

I do like soar. I use it when it's viable. I wish it weren't so limited tho. Or even that we had the ability to unlock regular riding capabilities at some future point

#

The dracthyr NPCs can fly normally, we know background wise there's nothing saying dracthyr CANT fly.

The only reason we can't is really just dev side.

#

So I'm holding out hope and huffing copium via choosing to believe it will be some sort of future unlock.

#

Hell I'd take the ability to fly or full DR as a heritage questline or something.

#

There's a lot of ways that could hand wave the ability in.

sleek solar
#

Dragonriding for Soar pls

#

Would fit the most

upper pasture
#

I think the whole reason they didn’t do it yet is because they didn’t want Dracthyr to not have the whole customization for DR through soar so maybe we will get it after DF but who knows

#

Cause if we could just fly why would we need to collect the mount scrolls

sleek solar
#

For alts

#

Also different mount

upper pasture
#

Not everyone plays alts. You have to think of each player individually and if someone is a single player and an Evoker t would invalidate a whole box feature

#

I’m not saying we shouldn’t have it but that’s probably their reasoning for why we don’t have it

sleek solar
#

You never think about each player individually, because thats impossible

#

There are always people who do not agree

#

Troll xD

upper pasture
#

…right

#

You do realize. I’m agreeing with you

sleek solar
#

Oh I thought it was a sarcastic "ok"

#

I'm sorry xD

upper pasture
#

No that IS a sarcastic “ok” because game dev often think of players individually when creating things

#

Because you want to make sure each type of player will find enjoyment in the product not just one specific type of player

#

Okay, well I see this is going literally nowhere. Enjoy being salty

sleek solar
#

Thanks! You too! 😄

#

Ofcourse a dev wants to make as many players happy as possible, but you cant make them all happy, people will always complain

upper pasture
#

Yes but that’s no reason to develop your game for one audience.

#

The point still stands it would invalidate a box feature of DF which the devs would not want to do even if it’s for one specific type of player.

rain cave
#

does anyone have an idea of what the quests blizz are talking about in the blue post?

#

I haven't seen anything about them, and they don't mention which quests/why

glad niche
#

It's something on ptr involving Chromie. The short version is, if you happen to know the background lore for what's going on at this point in the timeline you visit with chromie, some of chromies dialogue was .. Hm.. distasteful.

#

Which majority of long time players and lore enthusiasts know it.

#

While I don't know the exact dialogue nor it's tone, I know the lore. Tho it's dark stuff and a topic I'm not comfortable being the one to explain.

#

So if you want the lore, Google up alexstaza and her time with the dragonmaw. Trigger warning tho : ||rape||

#

To clarify. Chromies dialogue does NOT broach that topic.
But the short version is chromies dialogue was deemed inappropriate for what goes on in that point of the timeline

#

Or more so the fact what Chromie was saying was supposed to be jokes and humor, in said situations point in the timeline.

I'm foggy on those details.

#

Anyways. That's the rough version

subtle oar
plain violet
upper pasture
#

I feel like there’s a middle ground that could have been taken but to completely removing it is sorta meh.

#

But I’ve already expressed what I thought they could’ve done

ancient canyon
#

I'm down with completely removing it

#

plenty of other things have been retconned

#

but all that has to be done here is not even to pretend like it never happened, just skip it entirely

subtle oar
ancient canyon
rain cave
#

I think the issue is more that its an uncomfortable truth that's being joked about instead of chromie being a bit more sombre with it

#

not the contents topic itself

#

there is great potential for more serious storytelling with the bronze, we've done some of it before but it's never been fully explored

#

like making sure the dark portal opened

#

helping arthas purge things

#

the difference there was that it's acknowledged that whilst it's unfortunate, it has to be done to maintain reality

#

and stop the infinite from creating a massive threat to everything

ancient canyon
#

that kind of mission does help us with something though, it's a great honey pot

#

clearly reveals a large proportion of the extant chuds in the community

rain cave
#

you're not using the word chud unironically

#

are you

ancient canyon
#

i am not using the word chud ironically*

#

anyone who unironically defends a mission where you are complicit in an SA is a chud at best

rain cave
#

thank god

subtle oar
rain cave
#

chud is as bad as the word woke

ancient canyon
# rain cave chud is as bad as the word woke

the word "woke" is used by people as a replacement for "* * gger" and " * * ggot", the word chud is used to describe people who use "woke" that way

and to describe people who defend SA like this

plain violet
#

You're one to talk, responding RIP (and tagging me) when I am glad a SA quest is reworked...

#

Or to say that people not liking SA are terminally "online", Baifeng..

#

Please stop. You are making me uncomfortable.

rain cave
#

we need more of that good old thing called "actual human discussion" instead of mindless word hurling between 2 arbitrarily labelled groups who think they have moral highgrounds

#

but yeah back on topic

#

honestly, the whole SA questline thing has great potential for storytelling, sounds like they've just missed the bat

#

and it also does feel a bit out of place for (modern) WoW

subtle oar
plain violet
#

You did days before...

#

You blocked me, yet you read my messages and say such things, or even goes to tag me hours after just to show how much it is "RIP" that I, a survivor, is just glad a text about SA is reworked.

rain cave
#

the classic bai block gloating (if they'd actually blocked they wouldn't have seen the message)

subtle oar
plain violet
#

Do you even understand what you are doing just because you don't like me... ?

rain cave
#

dw neronn Bai got banned before for being spiteful, no idea how they're back but it doesn't surprise me that it continues

plain violet
#

You did say that Baifeng, for you it was just "an hysteria"

subtle oar
ancient canyon
plain violet
rain cave
#

oh boy here we go time to tap out

#

lets get out of here neronn

#

I can sense a storm brewing if I stick

plain violet
#

I will. I hope Baifeng will stop this one day. I don't wish to have conflict with you. But I wish you would not provoke me again and again, or say.. this kind of things considering my own experience, that seem insensitive.

Thanks, BigSaint, I will. Have a good night. 🙂

deep pawn
#

I think removing the quests is fine. It's just a different world than the 90s when wc2 was a thing. It's also a different thing being a nameless commander directing and army where someone else did it, to being the player character who has to put the torture device back knowing what it's used for.

proper palm
#

I hope they deleting Strat' with chromie soon, and Sylvanas quest from BFA

  • : And all orcs, they are so bad, and warlock, and undead, they eat humans after all*
ancient canyon
#

I've played Warcraft since then and read plenty of the books

#

I don't mind removing this at all

dense plover
#

theyre not changing the lore

#

so i dont get people being so upset

#

theyre just not revisiting that WC2 story beat

proper palm
#

Cancel culture

ancient canyon
dense plover
#

dude is a troll, ignore them

#

ive had them blocked for a LONG time

glad niche
#

What peach said

#

There are some names on this server that live and breathe discourse.

upper pasture
#

Depends on the subject and the day lol

deep pawn
#

It happened, it's fine as a thing that happened in the past but it just doesn't feel good nor does it fit the current game to make the player character make it continue.

balmy rock
#

Is the trader tender’s assets going to be cash shop? That’s the only thing I’m worried about lol

upper pasture
#

Nobody knows

#

Is it possible? Sure. Is there other things? Absolutely

glad niche
#

Trader tenders asserts?

balmy rock
#

mb

upper pasture
#

The new assets that got added for them

dense plover
#

probably for something other than the shop

glad niche
#

No that's fine. I still don't know what we're talking about lmaoooo

dense plover
#

but we dont know

glad niche
#

The trading post things or?

upper pasture
#

Could be Amazon prime gaming rewards

#

Could be sub rewards

glad niche
#

I'm still kicking myself I didn't play during that jester set in the trading post

upper pasture
#

Not enough info to make a good guess

glad niche
#

I like the floppy hat...

deep pawn
#

Blizzard has said those things will come back eventually

#

Who knows when though

upper pasture
#

trading post items? i'd bet once year 2 starts we get the old ones plus new ones for a whole year and then we might see them retire year 1 stuff in year 3

rain cave
#

I hope we get some good ones soon

#

it's been pretty garbage past couple months

#

I don't want boring mounts and recolour mounts

#

give me transmog!

#

more swords and jester level outfits please

upper pasture
#

can't make everyone happy i suppose

rain cave
upper pasture
#

i think it's bad but that didn't stop me from earning it.

rain cave
#

I mean more like quality/value

#

even if you don't like it's style, it's still the highest quality thing we've gotten from a monthly

upper pasture
#

even if i don't like it there's got to be someone that does. so it's a fine reward for them and meh for me. that's sorta how opinions work. not everything is tailor made for my pleasure

rain cave
#

but then, are we in agreement that a recoloured bird is kind of low effort for what people expect from a monthly

#

even if the bird looks kinda nice

upper pasture
#

no, since i'm sure someone wanted/needed that color of bird for their own mount/mog combo

rain cave
#

I'd have preferred if it was atleast a custom model

#

that mount can still exist

#

but like

glad niche
#

I do like birb uwu

rain cave
#

the bird and the aqir mount recolor are the same tier of item

#

despite one being the big monthly reward

upper pasture
#

and the bird didn't cost me 900 tendies

glad niche
#

I get your point tho. A recolor of a preexisting rig vs a new outfit with physics

upper pasture
#

it was "free"

rain cave
glad niche
#

Effort wise on the dev side, they are different calibers of input. I'm holding my breath to see what next month is. Since last was a recolor serpent iirc?

upper pasture
#

check back in if they give us a bird mount next month that's same birb but black then next month we get birb but pink then yes, low effort and disappointed

rain cave
#

a unique model

#

(even if it was still underwhelming imo)

#

but it was technically a unique thing

glad niche
#

Then yeah, I wouldn't be too sad about recolors mixed in

#

Gives them a chance to focus on the next new new thing

rain cave
#

I was just under the impression the monthly thing was gonna be a unique model for every month

upper pasture
#

but as of right now i'm not upset by anything we've seen in the TP and it's a great system.

rain cave
#

it's just difficult when months are so long 😭

upper pasture
#

i'm scared for july since my tenders are like at 50 RN i just hope july is a bust for me and i can stock up some for the future lol

rain cave
#

I've got a decent amount since not much this month really interested me

#

especially nothing expensive

glad niche
#

Tenders?

#

My fat kid energy keeps assuming you mean chicken. Which is obviously incorrect since I assume we're talking about the currency from the chest?

#

Unless there's another one

upper pasture
#

yeah trading post tenders

glad niche
#

I got the two mounts and the bee pet

upper pasture
#

or tendies

glad niche
#

Tendies.

upper pasture
#

but tendies make me think of chicken

glad niche
#

This is where I too went astray

#

Does the good reward ever cost more then the tender you can gain in a month?

#

I know the parrot was freebie. Earlier dialogue here leads me to believe you have to buy the final one at times?

#

Like did the jester outfit cost coins?

upper pasture
#

i don't think there has ever been a reward over 900 tender

#

there's always a reward for getting the 1k points in the month

#

the reward is always free

#

then you have the 1k tender to spend or hold

glad niche
#

Noice

proper palm
plain violet
sleek solar
#

Do we know what the next trader post items will be?

plain violet
#

Not yet, generally at the end of the month.

glad niche
#

I was surprised I finished trading post so quickly

#

(first time I've been playing during one)

#

Tho I'm happy with it too, cause it means im not "forced" to log in daily when I don't feel like playing

plain violet
#

Yeah, it's way easier than it seem at first!

ancient canyon
dense plover
plain violet
#

Sadly MrPeach is right on this. And I understand it bother you, Ametalshard.

#

Worst case scenario you will get called yourself a troll while calling them out.

glad niche
#

Their entire goal is to illicit assumptions with messages that cause knee jerk reactions. Then when called out they can feign innocent. Pretending they didn't pick inflammatory wording.

plain violet
#

Yeah. Thay they are wrongfully attacked, or were reasonable.

crystal pond
#

Just ignore lol

plain violet
#

(or report to mods when it happen again and again)

crystal pond
#

Just ignore and report and problem solved

plain violet
#

Yup...

#

People here can't resist the urge to make atrocious reference to the Chromie subject.

upper pasture
#

yup typical weird internet bs

crystal pond
#

This is dumb but also so funny 💀

Screenshot_20230617-203428_1.jpg
#

Wrong screenshot lmao

plain violet
plain violet
crystal pond
#

Like i can understand why people are upset that the quest was removed but also i understand why it was removed
Better was moving the quest as a quest and not as a daily, and not just removing it completely

dense plover
#

we dont even know what exactly theyre doing yet

plain violet
#

We don't even know what will really happen yes.

dense plover
#

they havent pushed a build since announcing it

#

and even then, it wasnt in the previous build and it wasnt a good quest

plain violet
#

So it does bother me that people used all over the slippery slope fallacy.

dense plover
#

its not like theyre changing lore or old content

#

theyre just not talking about it with a new shitty daily

plain violet
#

The classical "if it is changed, we can't say anything anymore"

crystal pond
#

They probably removed it
If they maked it as a normal quest then its a win for both sides

dense plover
#

it would need to be completely redone if they keep it

#

and they probably wont

plain violet
#

Agreed on that.

dense plover
#

but people upset are being dumb - theyre not removing an old quest or changing lore

#

theyre just not allowing a shitty new daily to go live

#

thats what ptr is for

#

"this quest is in poor taste" - players. "ok, we dont need it" - blizz

plain violet
#

Yeah, I don't get acting like it's an atrocious removal, it's just "nope, really poor, really bad" "ok not in live"

#

Worse, the arguments used were really insentitive, or cruel.

upper pasture
#

honestly it's a rough topic to cover but it wasn't plain as day that that's what were doing there. the common player wouldn't even know that's what's happening there. i feel like it would have been better to treat the topic with a more serious tone then to completely remove it.

dense plover
#

thats a lot of work though

#

and its a new quest

#

if they want to revisit the topic, they can

crystal pond
dense plover
#

this isnt the place to do it though

#

the chromie dailies are supposed to be a bit goofy

plain violet
#

When you compare to the Jaina one...

silent urchin
#

people on twitter didn't decide a goddamn thing

#

blizz made the decision

upper pasture
#

i mean on a surface level it is a goofy thing that were making sure the leader of the dragons stays captive for the "approprate" amount of time to make sure everything stays normal but not the typical goofy of "oops all time is ending make sure the murloc people defeat deathloc"

crystal pond
silent urchin
#

lmao

dense plover
#

it was a lot of people, not just twitter

upper pasture
#

yes but sometimes that's how life works

dense plover
#

forums, people here

crystal pond
#

If people didnt react they would change it 100%

dense plover
#

honestly my opinion changed once i actually saw the quest

#

its shitty

#

i dont want it in the game