@fossil basalt May want to check things before you start talking shit... they are an exile and overpoch server not a life server...
#ip_rights_violations
pure glade
fossil basalt
First off, I'm not speaking about one particular group/server. Secondly, I was speaking about life mods (read what I posted). Thirdly, there is an approved monetisation list, if the server is not on that list and they are monetising, they are thieving bastards like I said. How hard is that to comprehend?
Fourthly, if a server monetises and uses someone else's content, regardless of the game mode, then that is still in violation.
cobalt creek
@fossil basalt Pls use "99% of Life-mods", i feel better then ๐
hybrid tide
Yeah don't pigeon hole every life mod person there are some of us who do actually make our own content in here.
fossil basalt
@cobalt creek Fair enough, 99%
opaque fjord
It's sad how Life servers have completely shifted motives.
Back in the day of Chernarus Life, it was all about fun cops vs robbers styled gameplay. Now it's all just a scheme to make money.
fossil basalt
Yes, very sad.
hybrid tide
Yeah zoo most are like that, there are still a few of us that are still about the fun. Problem is there are ppl daft enough to pay 30 dollar entry fees for life mods and a sniff of money is enough to turn most heads and bend and break the rules to get it
fossil basalt
More importantly it cheats the mod creators. No one should be able to make money off of their work.
echo orchid
@hybrid tide aren't you the same bloke who was porting ripped forza meshes by any chance?
@opaque fjord well, i i write something in my eula, i expect to be respected, i don't expect a cut
if i would be expectig a cut, i would start my ownsuch server since i would actually be the only one entitled to monetize that
opaque fjord
@echo orchid indeed
The fact that others profit off of our hard work is bullshit.
When in fact, we rarely if ever profit off of it ourselves.
People are more willing to donate to server hosts than the content creators, which is sad.
Owners of these life servers are ethically bankrupt.
hybrid tide
@echo orchid u are very much mistaken, everything i do is modelled by myself from the ground up
please dont drag me into the same catogory as the others thanks
echo orchid
cool, my bad, i asked, no pun intended
hybrid tide
infact i rarly even model cars
echo orchid
don't take it the wrong way
cobalt creek
More importantly it cheats the mod creators. No one should be able to make money off of their work. ``` 100% agreeyep
It's bullshit that modders are used as a means for someone else to make a quick buck
we're being exploited
wheat wave
it would be enough for BI to enforce their rules and take down dishonest people, clearly the way it is right now doesn't work for anyone but those who abuse the rules or just don't care
opaque fjord
Yep
Maybe a licensing system where monetized servers have to purchase rights from the addon creator use the addon.
to use the addon*
would have to be managed by BI
but they already whitelist the servers, so this would be another step in that direction
right now it's like me stealing someone's artwork and showing it off, having people pay ME because they like the ARTIST'S work.
dull moon
what do you think of a monetized servers licence for CUP that includes the right to use it, but costs 100.- a month? 1000,- in an abo for a year as a special deal? ๐ @wheat wave
opaque fjord
That's fair
More than fair.
Maybe a pricing scheme based on the number of player slots on the server too.
dull moon
well, let's set it to 400.- a month... the hookers i like are not cheap girls from the sidewalk ๐
fossil basalt
Much cheaper in Dubai! ๐
dull moon
i have no comparative values for this yet ๐
fossil basalt
Thanks for all your hard work on CUP btw. I know it's not a single person job, but teamwork. But, I still try to thank everyone involved individually.
wheat wave
you can make all the licenses you want but people will still infringe them and wont have any motivation NOT to if BI doesn't prosecute them
dull moon
hmmm... right. how about a "i'm gonna nuke your server to the moon" backdoor function? ๐
wheat wave
yes that sounds reasonable
opaque fjord
Hey Chris, I can help you with that backdoor idea ;)
dull moon
you mean writing a code that melts the whole serverfarm and causes a national power collaps in the hosting country? that'd be great ๐
opaque fjord
Yea
tender hawk
@fossil basalt Is seeing an odd parallel between the old argument about mod creators versus streamers/vloggers that I'll imagine you probably didn't intend
fossil basalt
Slightly. Life mods tend to like to brag. So when you get one showcasing their non approved monetised server running non authorised mods..... You get the picture.
tender hawk
@fossil basalt I imagine you feel differently about streamers/vloggers who aren't (directly) advertising non-approved monetized servers running non-authorized mods though?
fossil basalt
I'll answer your question with a question. If a bear who lives in the woods, takes a poo in said woods and incurs no cost to the govt or any other governmental agency, has he done anything wrong? So, if we take that one step further.. If an " insert type of mod" uses another's IP privately, without monetisation and without public advertising it, are they truly making money off the back of someone else's hard work?
amber ibex
technically the argument is not invalid @tender hawk
both tend to not produce any money for the original creator
both make money by using the content of the original creator
however, one is advertising
the otherone is not
in the end both are making money by using your content
wheat wave
idk, it feels a bit different, getting money from youtube ads isn't exactly the same as asking people straight up to pay you to get rewards in game
also you can go around youtube monetization if you don't like it, and the service you get is still the same (hoping not too many people decide to do the same one day ๐ )
amber ibex
like that was anything anybody here ever was concerned about ... not all ppl being able to play with stuff you created
thats a lie you can tell somebody else
wheat wave
?
amber ibex
what ppl here do not want is that somebody else makes money with their content (if they would give a share things would already look different for 99% here concerning about stolen stuff)
not that some ppl are outlocked to the content they have created
who the fuck cares about who can access your content ... most addons are barely used specialized stuff or contain a ton of those which are barely used by the majority of players in a server
but i think all that does not belongs to this channel ...
wheat wave
dude... what are you talking about? :\
amber ibex
also you can go around youtube monetization if you don't like it, and the service you get is still the same (hoping not too many people decide to do the same one day ๐ )```
for further discussion head to [#general_chat_arma](/guild/105462288051380224/channel/105462288051380224/) or [#offtopic_arma](/guild/105462288051380224/channel/105465611991150592/) and annotate me if you want ...
the discussion does not belongs to here due to its nature of not being an IP violationfirst, you misunderstood what i was trying to say, second, keep that edgy kid attitude to yourself ๐
have a nice day
hybrid tide
problem is bis offer 0 protection for anyonone wanting to protect/dictate who uses their work, way i see it the more ppl playing arma (yes life servers are a massive part) there not really bothered.
even tho its part of their faq
u cannot use mods to monitizes ur server without permission from the content cretor
in my opinion its getting out of hand
servers are getting huge populatirty even tho they give 0 fucks about playing by the rules
using ingnorance as an xcuse
opaque fjord
Ignorance does not exclude people from the law.
steep mulch
Law doesn't matter if you can't/don't enforce it.
opaque fjord
Still doesn't make it any less of a law.
It could still be enforced later. Though the lack of enforcement does make any Joe Schmoe feel like they can walk all over others.
steep mulch
@opaque fjord Yes, doesn't make it any less, but law doesn't apply in practice until you enforce it. You can see how well it's going with servers monetizing content because Bohemia isn't enforcing their rules.
opaque fjord
Yea, quite a sad situation.
pliant oar
@steep mulch "because Bohemia isn't enforcing their rules." please stop such hints ... IP/legal related matters take time, there're standard procedures to uphold to ... just because you don't see xyz taken down yet, don't mean other violators aren't ...
steep mulch
@pliant oar Alright. I was talking about unauthorized usage of 3rd party mods, not breaches of server monetization rules. Or are you reacting to that too?
pliant oar
oh, well we trying cover that too if it's within our reach ... cause usually one infraction goes with hand full of others ๐
steep mulch
I see. Thanks for info ๐
nimble fern
Looks like another cancer: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=687485832
Here are all the mods I could screenshot: https://i.gyazo.com/53c1c9a1a6f1bb4b686de2fc221c1361.png
carmine folio
Looks like it already got DCMA, that was fast
south nimbus
hello I just want to ask something that am having trouble with I work for small Life server and where doing well and am going about getting written permission from authors to use items and such for our server and crediting them via a page on site and all is good, However what is the policy on contacting an author to get permission to use their mod and them never answering you back? I mean I see that they have read the message but just leave it never gave a clear yes or no? And there are modโs that do not having a clear license use? What do I do or can I do to protect myself? I'd like to know so i don't get any DMCA or incur legal issues for using people stuff who don't have a license use or never get back to you I was going to try and just give them credit on a page but am bit iffy about the whole thing.
vast notch
Are you using their mod or assets from their mod to put in your own mod?
south nimbus
Some of them yes if we have permission do so but we use the steamwork shop so a lot of the mods if we can link via the steam required addons part as some authors have told us to do?
what I guess am on about is say I find a mod and there is no lience use at all and I try to contct the dev and he never answer's what should i do? I throught about crediting them but very iffy about as they could come back later and say you dont have permission even tho we ask and they never got back to us? i hope that makes sense
willow star
As far as i know, no license means no permission for anything. If a content creator doesn't answer you will have to follow his license.
south nimbus
Thanks for that kinda what I was thinking as well but little unsure on use of an item with no license I basic throught it means no permission for anything but most people keep telling me simple if there is no lience then it can be used and if the Author never gotten back the same use it. But this made me feel bit unsure so throught be better to ask here but yeah @willow star I had the same feeling as you cheers.
carmine folio
If the license doesn't give you permission or the author hasn't given you permission.
Then you don't have permission to use the content on a montized server / or re-package it.
south nimbus
@carmine folio I understand that lets say am not a montized server and the mod has no license at all and the dev is no where to be seen and is not taking pm's? would you still use or re-package it and still give the author credit? iv kinda oppted for a "if no contact can be made dont use it just in case" policy but iv all ways wanted to know what peoples throuht are on this.
carmine folio
You still have no permission
Just because you can't contact the author, doesn't give you special permissions
That is why you look for stuff that is licensed & gives you permissions to alter.
heavy moon
If there is no licence is usually means the most restrictive licence applies, according to AMAR
south nimbus
Thanks fellas for all the info I kinda throught that this was the case but i keep getting told about unwritten rules and other laws and stuff wanted to make sure so the community am apart of does not fall into a dark hole. once am done with stuff and getting the server set up how do i submit the sever for a review? just post a link with screen shot of the repo?
dull moon
if you want to run a server WITHOUT monetization and run mods that are NOT changed or edited (e.g. use a mod collection that does NOT contain redistributed / reuploaded mods) you are basically free to use all mods you want if you credit them.
if you want to run a server WITH monetization you have to ask EVERY author for permission if his license does not include rules for monetization. if he does not reply you are not allowed to use his mod.
also if you want to change/edit/reupload/include a mod for your customized use, you also have to ask permission. no answer, no permission. @south nimbus
so if you want to keep it easy and simple and avoid a lot of trouble, use mods provided on steam WS to create a collection. also forget about monetization and go for donations instead. but read this carefully, especially the part about donations:
https://www.bistudio.com/monetization/faq
nimble yoke
@south nimbus BI's rules are very clear on this. For every mod you want to use on a monetized server, you need the EXPLICIT permission from the author. If you can't reach the author, you have no permission, so you are not allowed to use it.
or, basically, what @dull moon said
south nimbus
Just got on now cheers for the info and help Chris Lutz and TheCoen where not going down the monetized or donations path I dont like the way they work and most of all feel its cheeky to make money even if it is for the server coast. as your making money off the hard work of other modders? just dose not sit right with me so the server I help run will not be doing monetized or donations I know sounds funny coming from a life mod? so after seeing all this info am going to try and get written permission from authors for the use of items. most of the ones iv contacted so far have been very helpfull to me. once more thanks for all the info it does help in making th right choice.
fossil basalt
As Yoda says, "There is no try, only Do" ๐
carmine folio
i think he would say "no try there is, do you must!" ๐
fossil basalt
๐๐ป
dull moon
thx @iron flame for this video about monetization, thumps up!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rR_F1tTEak
echo orchid
๐
south nimbus
๐ amazing video and info love it Just kinda wish he touch a little on people who use mods and are not under any Monetization rules. he kinda did but in very meh way still amazing video.
queen wing
"Some community owners are physicly incapable of reading" LMAO, nice vid @iron flame , you got yourself an extra subscriber ๐
fathom acorn
^ The above is my forum, I'd love to have a chat with @pliant oar regarding it
pliant oar
and i clearly told you several times that while you abusing the loophole where the IP owner isn't acting, it don't mean it's right, sooner or later it may happen your items will be removed from workshop for good
fathom acorn
@pliant oar I just removed my items from the steam workshop, for good. If you would reply to my private message on Discord I would appreciate it
fathom acorn
@pliant oar is doing his job @drowsy verge.
neon rover
Shame I am no moderator. I would remove you now.
queen wing
DEADdem = Savage ๐
hybrid tide
lol
fluid heart
Lol
fossil basalt
๐
cobalt creek
โฎ
nimble fern
#JeSuisTalamander
fossil basalt
@nimble fern , no we're not. ๐
river spear
Man I thought some cool shit is going down here when I saw the notification...
hybrid tide
The dram is over in the model makers channel today, the righteous linch mob are grilling someone!
heavy moon
polishes halo
fossil basalt
this one? http://www.ribbongaming.com/
neon rover
y
vast notch
people cheat on your server and get banned, then offer them a pay way to get unbanned, sure fire way to kill your community ๐ก
pliant oar
extortion method too, analyze who is addicted, ban him for suspicious script cheating and offer unban for money ... definitely legit style ๐
vast notch
imagine if Bastian Suter did that ๐ฝ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeXatquVqAc
south nimbus
Banning should not be a feature that is purposely built into video games. Instead, having fun should be built in.
amber ibex
Banning should not be a feature that is purposely built into video games.
i also think that murderer should be no consideration
just like rape, theft and many other things
the problem is: ppl do not care for such stuff
--> banning is needed as you always will find someone to ban
pliant oar
banning is badly needed @south nimbus because of all the vandals, griefers, harrasment, teamkillers, exploiters and similar bunch ...
neon rover
They are not on the list of Approved Server Monetizers either, by the way
south nimbus
@pliant oar Sadly this is true one day we can dream of not needing to ban people if the muperts just play nice with each other never going to happen but we can dream haha
south nimbus
I haz noob question If i make a model and its open soruce what liecnec do I use that covers people to do what they want with it I.e change it / sell / monetization or Reupload? I.e hassel free for them? other than posting on the addons saying do what you want with it?
atomic kraken
I believe CCL (Creative Commons), but don't take my word 100%
hallow frigate
@neon rover there are many black sheeps. If they get warned by bohemia, they just continue monetizing in secret i.e. over teamspeak or to people they trust. Just had that entire matter with British Borders, it's always interesting too see how many communities refuse to remove perks from the actual code while they're officially not monetizing and should have no use from it.
quartz cliff
@south nimbus use CC, although i'd recomment CC-by at least. when you publish something you want your name attached to it, don't you?
errant robin
any bohemia staff here regarding a server shut down?
hearty ledge
server shutdown?
hearty ledge
Ohhh, battleye then
hearty ledge
Battleye = 0 in config ๐
errant robin
yes i know haha
hearty ledge
so yea, for now just make battleye = 0
you won't have RCON but it won't kick players
errant robin
ok, i'll have infistar to kick tho
hearty ledge
yup, that would work
errant robin
wanna know why it was shut down?
because i had a garrys mod shop in my shop but i never had it labeled as garrys mod
lol
errant robin
i did
heavy moon
https://www.bistudio.com/monetization/ scroll to bottom, hit contact us and email them about it
hearty ledge
it's the end of the day in Prague though
heavy moon
oh n/m then
errant robin
cheers
errant robin
i will do thanks
hearty ledge
np
errant robin
@hearty ledge are you active?
hearty ledge
meaning?
errant robin
are you here
lol
sorry for late reply @hearty ledge
Is there anyway of getting an rcon without using battleye?
hearty ledge
nope
pliant oar
@hearty ledge well by suggesting workaround how avoid the BE warning or takedown you techncially pushing us to take further steps which will not allow such 'evade'
@errant robin if you got the warning and ignored other C&D or similar contact attempts from us (as usually this will not happen all of sudden) now you need wait till the infrigement/monetation/legal teams answer
errant robin
I followed as it said, i emailed the email it asked me to email
the problem was that i had a garrys mod shop on my shop on my website and you guys where mistaken as to thinking i was doing $10,000,000 in game money
but the $10,000,000 was for garrys mod, not arma
pliant oar
well in that case you still need wait for the answer, it may take some days (as you not the only one ... ) , also make sure the GM mod isn't using our content either
hearty ledge
@pliant oar I don't think he's trying to "evade" anything, his BE got wrongly shut off by his description and I was offering a temporary fix since he won't hear from Votja until the morning
errant robin
lol
hard tangle
BI you may want to check this out. :D
http://www.arma.com.eg/
manic urchin
Hello, I have such question:
I am translating the technical documentation about Arma scripting to Russian language and publishing it on my website, is there any specific license/restriction/guidelines or limitation for such activity?
undone pier
what documentation do you refer to?
manic urchin
@undone pier script commands description mostly
undone pier
so you mean from BI and BIKI?
if so, i'd suggest to look for the projects that already did this in the past, and see if you can join the efforts or ask them for permission to use their work as a base
manic urchin
I was not satisfied with what I've seen, so question mostly goes to BIS, because it is not just copy-paste
but fair translation to deliver the sense
undone pier
well use @pliant oar
i guess they are fine with it given it happened in the past for French, German, Russian, Chinese, etc (as long as its non commerical, and no other abuse is happening)
manic urchin
commercial translation for Arma? where should I sign up?
echo orchid
you didn't get this: there should be NON-commercial
so you're doing it just because you want to
there should be no issue whatsoever
nimble fern
Hey, isn't this ArmA 3 characters' hand ? http://tf3dm.com/3d-model/rigged-hands-28855.html
echo orchid
unlikely
nimble fern
Thought so when I saw the 6th image
slate portal
Hey guys, I have had someone steal my work and upload it both on mediafire and the steam workshop. I have put in DMCA reports to youtube and mediafire as well as steam. I messaged Dwarden today. Is there anything else I should do? I have never had this happen to me before.
fossil basalt
I think youre ok. Dwarden should be able to point you in the right direction.
proud flicker
Whats the recommended protocol for getting stuff taken off Steam Workshop? Some numbnuts uploaded my content without even asking me.
dull moon
file a DMCA report on the uploaders ws site
there is also a email adress for bohemias legal dept. no idea what it is, but @pliant oar should know it
proud flicker
Rgr. Going the steam native way first. Thanks.
dull moon
may i ask what mod it is?
such guys tend to violate more than one authors rights
@proud flicker
tulip nexus
@proud flicker always do the DMCA form rather than merely flagging stuff - gets taken down a lot faster that way. The times I've done it was only a matter of a few hours
proud flicker
Aye, done it in one case already.
Its my MBG content that gets frequently lobbed into people's terrain uploads onto the workshop.
Without even asking me.
tulip nexus
Yeah, people are really dumb not realizing that you have to actually own the content you upload, otherwise Steam will always take it down when someone points out it doesn't belong to the uploader
proud flicker
At least that works. All this content stealing (intentional/unintentional) really is a big mood-buster for me. Makes me think twice about releasing. oh well, the times are a changin'. ๐ Thanks for the quick help everyone!
dull moon
@proud flicker mind sending me the link to the steamWS?
proud flicker
PM. So what's the stance of the more seasoned content creators about uploading their stuff to the steam WS?
bronze anchor
RHS doesn't agree with the license https://forums.bistudio.com/topic/183435-rhs-escalation-afrf-and-usaf/?p=2859383
proud flicker
That was/is mostly still my concern. Hoped this changed recently. ๐ฆ
Section 6 is still pretty obnoxious. Wow.
I like the convience of the steam WS for users to use content, but this whole "my stuff is now steam's" stuff doesn't combine well. :/
bronze anchor
I'm curious if they have actually ever created a derivative work of workshop content without the permission from the author
proud flicker
I doubt they actually will. Cf. that whole monetized Fallout mod stuff.
bronze anchor
So I wonder why they include that portion
proud flicker
Cover their butts from a legal point.
Realistically I don't see them ever actioning it. But still, it does have this sideeffect of "technically, but." Hence why I am 50:50 on uploading my stuff.
echo orchid
@bronze anchor
tulip nexus
@bronze anchor actually, with RHS the issue now is more about making sure everybody that has contributed to the mod over the years agrees with having their content on there than a flat out disagreement with the EULA's terms since Valve clarified the extent to which they are permitted to use the content
ah, @echo orchid was gonna say the same I guess ๐
echo orchid
you cannot upload content to sw without you being the original author
@tulip nexus - nope :p
bronze anchor
So you've changed your stance in regards to this RHS does NOT AGREE with Steam Workshop License Agreement, more specific sharing our IP rights with Valve and it's affiliates on content upload (please read section 2. and section 6. of the mentioned EULA)?
echo orchid
the short version yes
the long version: eveyone who has ever created content for rhs needs to agree with it
as in unanimity vs majority
that is the legal way to do it
bronze anchor
Makes sense, sorry for linking out post then
echo orchid
that being said
no one else besides us will ever upload it on sw
section 2 states it clearly
and is the main reason dmcas work so fast
no ip rights = no upload
we will make an official announcement and reason behind it soon-ish
tender hawk
the long version: eveyone who has ever created content for rhs needs to agree with it as in unanimity vs majority Reminds me of the story about MAME finally going 'truly free'
proud flicker
So I contacted the people who uploaded my stuff onto the SteamWS. So far I got two of them to reply and pledge to remove my content. ๐
dull moon
sounds good, doesn't it?
echo orchid
@proud flicker - waste of time if you ask me
contacting
DMCA in much faster
@tender hawk - hmmm? what?
dull moon
well, i had quite often luck contacting them. many of them are often not aware of what they are doing. once cleared it was a matter of hours until violating content disapeared and propper steam WS dependencies where set
proud flicker
Thats what I think as well. Never assume malicious intent if negligence is just as likely. Doesn't apply to repeat-offenders, of course.
fossil basalt
Not even negligence half the time @proud flicker @echo orchid just idiocy. Most don't even bother reading the READ.ME, let alone visit the Forums to see who is who.
tender hawk
@echo orchid http://mamedev.org/?p=422 / http://mamedev.org/?p=423
bronze wigeon
@pliant oar not sure if anyone has raised this but it might require some attention from someone?
https://www.arma3-mods.com/ - Paid mods site
heavy moon
hah, had to happen sooner or later, good spot though
bronze wigeon
3CB's Evrik is on the steam thread asking him to remove thier stuff. https://steamcommunity.com/app/107410/discussions/0/366298942099224251/?ctp=2
pliant oar
Flax if they breaking the usage licenses use the email in channel description header
bronze wigeon
Ok thanks
finite crescent
https://infistar.de/ there is a other side that do the same
selling "Anitcheat" aka Admin Cheat tools
bronze anchor
Is there an issue with selling scripts though? I thought it was with him monetizing someone else's content without permission
undone pier
if you dont use BI tools, you are technically allowed to sell stuff/you are not restricted by tools EULA
manic urchin
hmm, interesting
pliant oar
@undone pier it's not that simple as it still needs to read/use the engine to work (so no blank allowed monetize pass) ๐
undone pier
this is what Marek told me years back
of course the policy from BI might have changed in the meantime
yet legally probably he is still right
cobalt creek
Thats also my point of knowledge oO Sooo, what is true now?
undone pier
like what has changed is that server monetization is just allowed under specific conditions
i am not aware of any changes in EULA or other relevant legal descriptions for modders
also BI forum moderators (which is not the same as BI - very important) had the strict rule to ban promotion/showing anything related to paid work
if i am not mistaken, there is even a subforum now when looking for work/modding job - although it doesnt mention pay specifically (as allowed or forbidden)
https://forums.bistudio.com/topic/185269-arma-3-editing-find-or-offer-editing/
from what i recall there was a discussion in BIF some years back when Marek even stated in public his/their stance
pliant oar
for IP owners, please use DMCA takedowns vs STEAM workshop items
e.g. for item http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=698942592
goto report icon > then in text is "... proceed to our DMCA compliant notice of copyright infringement form here. "
where word here == active url to DMCA form https://steamcommunity.com/dmca/create/698942592
only in case you can't use such DMCA premade report then use https://steamcommunity.com/dmca/create/
to take down stuff which don't have normal accessable DMCA from from it's report page and similar
manic urchin
if someone from @biminions interested: warthunder advertising using Apex key words:
https://pp.vk.me/c636317/v636317784/16ef0/c1WaltOAcE4.jpg
warm urchin
that site doesn't even exist so it could be some kind of an error
river spear
ha
haha
Those arma3-mods.com guys want to sell the AltisLife RPG framework
on Lakeside
Things are getting pathetic
hybrid tide
thing is there will be ppl stupid enough to buy it
dull moon
and if so, they should be extra charged for their stupidity
fossil basalt
Accessories after the fact.. ๐
neon rover
This mod selling website is the living devil. wtf
daring geode
I'm not sure if this is exactly the right place to ask, but would I be breaking any rules if I uploaded an Arma 2 map from another site to the steam workshop, but kept it private? I would like to do this just to keep things simple for me and my group. I would never take credit for it or send it to anyone but my small Arma group.
tender hawk
'fraid so, unless the author said you could put it on Steam Workshop it ain't yours to distribute on SWS
river spear
Apparently the owner on Skype was like " The website is legitimate, the process is legitimate and so is the idea as it's the first marketplace that's launched. I've gotten to some contacts and they gave me some numbers at BI and we are going to be receiving a certificate for it."
ancient yoke
Doesn't look legit, although it does look like alot of work has gone into it
river spear
Have a screenshot lol http://prntscr.com/bu7r7n
Or wait this one http://image.prntscr.com/image/64e2b8a23d3d4f168cd5692927ed29b3.png
Oh I thought Discord would give a small preview
@ancient yoke Its a template, anyone can set that up
ancient yoke
@river spear Dwarden is the developer, perhaps pass it along to him?
river spear
I think Dwarden is already aware of it
I just found it hilarious to say that they will get a certificate from Bohemia
manic urchin
at least that sounds like violation of BI tools license, as it states that written permission should come prior any commercial activity
anyway, the fact of having some marketplace of addons sounds questionable, IMO such marketplaces should be controlled solely by vendor and be placed for example to steam workshop, to ensure payments safety
sudden spruce
Some 2 minute Google sleuthing has revealed its likely a 16 year old kid.
dull moon
dull moon
in case you wanna know, those are also sites related to this guy
http://pastebin.com/bi0HsZE4
smells... fishy...
river spear
Well atleast he knows where to get templates
dull moon
๐
fossil basalt
His office would have heads on pikes outsides his door! Or scalps.
cobalt creek
Mine wouldn't even have Doors. Just a huge pet with trained Sloths that kill you instantly, if i wink with a finger.
On 2nd thought... Sloths might not the best idea... ah, who cares. They are cute.
sinful osprey
lol on the topic of the arma 3 mods marketplace thing, it's just a $30 website script http://preview.codecanyon.net/item/theme-portal-marketplace-sell-digital-products-themes-plugins-scripts/full_screen_preview/16869890?_ga=1.234909956.401607529.1469161609
cobalt otter
,kjl
hallow lark
Question regarding mod making teams and licensing. Working with a decent size team on a large mod. We are using APL license, and everyone brought aboard understands all work will be released publicly, with permission to use, repackage, modify, or use on servers authorized for monetization. This isn't a problem now, but as the team continues to grow, I worry about a content creator deciding at a later date he doesn't want people modifying his work, or using it on a monetized server, etc. Does the licensing prevent this, or would they be free to say remove the things I worked on?
carmine folio
Just get them to agree to APL-SA + Arma Monitzation Rights to anything they commit, and keep a record of it somewhere etc...
Or anyone that commits code assigns copyright over to someone i.e so you can relicense it in the future (unlikely etc)
None of the arma licenses allow for commerical / monitization usage, they were written before arma monitiazation was approved.
hallow lark
Thank you.
hallow frigate
@OPTiX#6431 great, that guy registers a website over UK while living in Germany.... impress is missing minimum requirements by german law. Domain registration also contains fake data. He has quite a few websites you should stay away from:
http://www.arma3-mods.com/ !!
http://arma3-life.weebly.com/ !!
http://doleft.com/
https://www.Spreadrr.co.uk
https://canddlemarket.com
http://www.puihub.com/ !!
http://www.lcpdfr.com/ !!
http://www.rapidore.com/
http://www.ibedrive.com/ (here he keeps mod- & missionfiles to provide them for download at YT)
http://myinstancy.com/
http://www.armalifemod.com/ !!
- !! = Arma related
All registred by him. He seems to mainly use the name "Captain Honda", or as his old steam /twitter profile "CptHonda"
coral torrent
For websites registered with fake data send a report to the domain master, and those will be taken down in no time, if the leon leon guy can not proove his identity via ID or passport.
the domain names though ... seems to have to much money, so he wastes it on useless domains ... he should have gave that money to charity or buy arma for friends or so ๐
odd wigeon
OK...If someone packages different mods to basically turn it into a REPO for their player base to play with. Is that conflicting with any agreements.
Name of the mod /collection would be let say "best server collection for X mod"
solemn snow
mod repos / mod packs are quite common no?
There's no problem with just collecting different mods into a common repo for players to use, most communities do this
odd wigeon
Thats what I thought too. I just wanted to make sure that my guy was clear to publish before the EULA police cry foul...I know that everyone hate the Steam EULA agreement. But come on.. Unless BI has Steam change the agreement, there will not be any kind of love within the community and BI vision of the mods being available to everyone easily will be a mute subject. RHS, Exile and other mods that refuse to upload them, will never be completely satified until the agreement is changed.
sorry I guess I just neded to vent alittle.
solemn snow
Well actually RHS is planning on uploading to Workshop next update
odd wigeon
OH THANK god...
fossil basalt
@odd wigeon let's clarify what you mean though. Are you suggesting one single workshop mod that contains multiple mods ("best server collection for X mod)?
odd wigeon
Yes. Lets say CUP mods (weapons, units etc) and RHS (usaf and ARF). I wold be considered a collection and not a outright mod
chilly fractal
I believe @solemn snow may have been referring to communities hosting the repo/collection of mods albeit repackaged on their servers for distribution to player base. Unsure if you can create a collection of mods and publish to Steam Workshop without people calling foul. I'm not in tune with workshop in that regard.
solemn snow
yeah actually looking back, I might have interpreted wrong
chilly fractal
Apologies if I'm interpreting wrong
fossil basalt
A repo of individual mods is one thing, but to take other people's mods and throw them together in "Bob's fav mods for X" seems "iffy" at best. I'm not saying it's frowned upon, but I would not do it unless you had the blessing of the original mod creator.
To me it seems disingenuous.
chilly fractal
I've seen communities make an @ mod folder with their entire mod pack inside. For what that is worth. Still a bit different then tossing a collection on workshop, or other locations. Personally, I've hosted repos or provided links. More acceptable that way in my opinion.
fossil basalt
I agree that there is a difference between @mod and Workshop. Always lean on the side of caution.
odd wigeon
There needs to be an outlet on allowing Communities who have regular player base to download mods and play with their player base. Learning a completely new system to make a REPO is completely a waste of time and money on the server owner/communitys part...this Steam tool app that BI has is simply easy to use and requires no futher instructions on how to utilize it. It's being hosted on a reptubale gaming industry and since you already paid for it though purchasing the game you have (ARMA) you do not need a 200+ GB data per day (pending on how many player you have playing.) server.
bronze anchor
I can't find the exact line in the workshop EULA, but I recall there being a statement that you couldn't upload content that you weren't the IP owner of
odd wigeon
If thats the case then a private Repo should not be allow either. Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to troll the subject.. I agree with modders who nake their mod and allow other to play them. The one who come out and place the EXACT mod out with afew code line changes is stright outright stupid.
But if the tool aloow me to take some mods make a mission and allow my playbase to play.. Then I do not think it a EULA . thing.
bronze anchor
I've never heard of a single mod that restricted you from hosting it in your own private repo for your community (with the exception of people banning A3L use)
chilly fractal
Private repo, and Steam's legal language would be two different issues.
bronze anchor
That's what collections are for though
tulip nexus
Valve don't want to be liable for hosting content that they should not have on their servers. It's as simple as that
chilly fractal
Agreed
odd wigeon
Liable how? Context?
tulip nexus
Same as youtube will take down copyrighted content, or any other file host. If it's your privately owned and hosted Repo then you're the ones that are liable
fossil basalt
@odd wigeon No one is suggesting YOU host the mods on your server. They are already out there on tools like Play With Six.
odd wigeon
Been awhile .Does PWS now have the tool to do that same with Steam Tools does?
Allow me to upload a modified ACE folder for example?
bronze anchor
Most mod makers wouldn't want you modifying their content and then reuploading it publicly because it takes control away from them. What I mean by that is that they can't control whether or not you update to the newest version, or if you make a modification that breaks part of the mod. It would then reflect poorly on the mod maker when in reality it wasn't their fault
fossil basalt
Subscriptions? IDK, I use the standard version and check for updates manually daily.
odd wigeon
That what I mean there is no outlet for communitites to upload and share their Repos. Example ACE or ALIVE with it's mirid of options you can create with the addons folder and it includes a options folder that if you want that special something you NEED to place it in the addons folder. Yeah I can get it off of PWS or Steam.... But I need them to have the adjustments I made to the addons folder. Now you need to figure out a way to "teach" 50 players who some do and some do not have ARMA experience. Every try to help 50 player at the same time? (BTW it was not directed at anyone here.again this is a discussion). With the Steam Tool. I can make my adjustments, call it a collection and then have my player base suscribe to my adjustments and they automatically get the changes....all with me to have to talk with anyone and the change took about 5 min..
Again I agree with Penny...Modders that create individual mods. Asshole who go out and change that mod and call it their own are assholes...
PWS WAS the best thing for ARMA back 3-4 years ago. But now...
Times change..
bronze anchor
For ACE atleast I think you'd have no problem making changes and uploading it to steam workshop, because they have a more open license in comparison to RHS. It specifically states
Additionally to the conditions of the GPL, you are granted the right to
redistribute any combination of the .pbo-files of the finished product
without having to share your source code, as long as you do not modify the
source code of the individual modules.
When publishing a derivative of this product you may not use a name that
might create the impression that your version is an official release.
Any idea how steam's legal language feels about that use case?
odd wigeon
Show me a court brief on EULA with STEAM....
bronze anchor
Worst case you ask the mod owner for permission, I did say earlier you had to be the IP owner but I'm sure with explicit permission to upload you'd be fine
chilly fractal
Apologies if I am causing confusion. Simply pointing out that the mod owner may be 100% ok with that, and Steam may still balk. I agree with @bronze anchor on speaking with the mod owner for permissions as suggested. Don't want to see anyone get slammed by Steam, or any other service.
I am also not up and up on Steam's language at all, so obligatory "take what I say with a huge grain of salt".
fossil basalt
Which brings us full circle to what i said. You can ask the mod creator or you can ask Dwarden. There's really no point in a discussion of its not allowed.
odd wigeon
@chilly fractal sir.. I'm not bitch at you and I apologize if I came out that way...I just wanted to point out how some maybe taking the IP right too far. Making a repo is one thing and if the owner of such repo is not adjusting the orgional modders Mod.. then it a closed case and no IPR conflict exists...
carmine folio
depends on the license, some licenses prevent redist etc.
odd wigeon
Then why place the mod out there then in the first place? It's GOING to be redist...
either from armaholic, steam or some other outlet
fossil basalt
Best guess is that the author has full control. When it's in your personal mod, they do not.
carmine folio
Author might want to remove the mod in the future, prevent old versions from being redist....
Doesn't matter anyway. Its thier content etc, and they can license it however they want etc
odd wigeon
ahh if it is private mod and then it become public by a third party.. then yes thats a shitty thing to do and shold be under the agreeemnt and the IP owner has every right to bitch.
chilly fractal
Its their content etc, and they can license it however they want etc -- that sums it up pretty well. I'm with @carmine folio on that one.
odd wigeon
correct
echo orchid
the moment you are redistributing it, it is not private anymore
echo orchid
regarding RHS, since i am the one who brings down the legal whip on ppl who can't read a license
we don't have issues with any sort of mirrors
but Steam Workshop is not just another mirror
how did you get what?
odd wigeon
The any mod... Where did you get it from in the first place or in this case where can I get the mod from?
armaholic
Lets say.
fossil basalt
Let's say someone allows you to put their mod into your "fav mods" pack. How does it get updated? Does the author have a magic pipeline into your pack to update it at will? Is there some sort of version control mechanism?
odd wigeon
ok.. Lets say the "Fav mod pack" = your car....You see that the Modder has a new Radio you want to add into your car since yours radio is too old. You get the new radio and install it it your car... everyon is happy that you hav a new radio now. Now I did not change the radio's functions it still works just fine. My riders ask what kind of radio I have and tell them it from the modders company....
Did I break anything...
fossil basalt
And when the modder says that radio is crap and releases ver 2.0, how does he remove it from "fav mod" and replace it with 2.0? If he can't.....
fossil basalt
I have FULL CONTROL over my stuff. If I replace v1.0 with v2.0, I pull and replace 1 with 2. By keeping it in your private un-updateable collection, you prevent me from doing that.
odd wigeon
Exactly what CUP is doing. If more and more come out to the Steamworkshop then everyone would be happy ...no?
echo orchid
you think as a user
fossil basalt
At the end of the day, you must realise that it is the Mod authors choice, not yours.
echo orchid
what you don't understand that mod creators don't do it for the user
in any case, to the point: if you get RHS from armaholic and stick it on your dropbox folder
as it is, no one would care, it is within the license
the moment you start using it on a monetized server
or reverse engineer it change shit, repack it and redistribute it, even if you this for a single person
or you put it up on steam workshop
you are in the shitter
yes, we'll get RHS on steam with the next version
odd wigeon
Isn't Armaholic a monitized server?
echo orchid
that said, legally, only us can upload it on steam.
@odd wigeon - because i have IP rights
i can choose to grant special permission to X or Y
and no, i do not believe Aholic is monetized, no
chilly fractal
They have a donator function, that's it I believe. Donating provides you with faster download speeds, among other perks.
echo orchid
i've known foxhound since 2007
odd wigeon
higher the pay/donation the faster the speed
fossil basalt
@odd wigeon do you not understand what it means to be the IP rights holder?
echo orchid
he does it because he needs to
not because he wants to make a quick buck
@chilly fractal - donation does not mean monetization
monetization is a sale of a product / service
you expect something in return
chilly fractal
True, it depends on your take on it. Should have included that tid-bit in my reply.
echo orchid
donations are voluntary
fossil basalt
In the case of PuFu and RHS, he can put it wherever he pleases really, YOU cannot.
chilly fractal
Ultimately, it's the IP holder's decision, and I'll always respect that.
echo orchid
steam workshop agreement clearly states
that unless you are the ip owner, you cannot upload anything
hence the very fast DMCA service they provide
fossil basalt
Why do I always read that as DCMA?
chilly fractal
I do the same
echo orchid
personal issues with it ๐ ?
fossil basalt
Lol, Dyslexia?
chilly fractal
DCMA | Defense Contract Management Agency -- yeah I think I'll stick with DMCA.
fossil basalt
Dey C Me Arollin'
chilly fractal
Hah
echo orchid
๐
fossil basalt
@odd wigeon I've just returned from the mountain top with the stone tablet, The Offical answer is NO, You cannot.
odd wigeon
RGR thanks
echo orchid
@fossil basalt dude...fuck you for sticking that dey c me rolling in my head... ๐ i can't think of another tune now....
fossil basalt
hahahahaha
chilly fractal
What happens in #ip_rights_violations, evidently gets stuck in your head.
fossil basalt
As it should
echo orchid
๐
fossil basalt
Sort of like playing on Tonal...
heavy moon
@fossil basalt ๐ ๐
fossil basalt
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
chilly fractal
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ -- I get so much flak for using this emote at work.
river spear
guess they cant deal with it ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
coral torrent
Just because I read it here, Armaholic is NOT monetized ... poor foxhound has to pay alot of money for servers, and bandwith. Also the content on the website is FREE, you neither have to register for anything, nor pay one cent even if you are using the website for years. And don't you dare to compare Armaholic with Stolen Workshop ...
fossil basalt
You're absolutely correct
echo orchid
@coral torrent tell that to the young bloods
that feel entitled
to use shit they get for free with no regards to licenses
and no respect for all the people that madr aran modding community possible way before
steam was "the thing"
solemn snow
we've gone.... mainstream
river spear
All hail Steam @echo orchid
carmine folio
those rants come from 5000 B.C. and will remain until 2150 A.C.
You guys are so money oriented that making something free is the elixir of human kind
fossil basalt
@carmine folio Due to the history of certain groups, IP theft has become a bone of contention with many in the community. In some ways it's an "old vs new" issue. By that I mean newer players think it's ok to take the hard work of other and profit from it. In no way is it ethical or acceptable to modify, redistribute, edit, put behind a paywall or charge for in any way either a BI made or community make product without explicit approval.
echo orchid
who is "you guys"?
fossil basalt
I think he means anyone that wants to protect their own creations.
carmine folio
Nothing is really free if you want more than credits. Some will made bad use, but there are the ones that will make good use. I see a problem only if everyone makes bad use of your creation.
fossil basalt
This is a legal issue , not a philosophical one.
cobalt creek
+1
carmine folio
Really? Those legal things inposed on earth by aliens are not nice.
fossil basalt
@carmine folio If you don't have an IP Violation to report, you can always discuss the writings of L Ron Hubbard over in #offtopic_arma
carmine folio
I understand. Thankyou for the kind sugestion.
dull moon
indeed... thx for the heads up. the are reported now
graceful cliff
@Armitxes#7219 Ahh, captain Honda. He took over as developer on a server I useto play.
- WEEK LATER -
Holy fuxk, discord didn't want to send this. Lmaoo
nimble fern
Aren't these ported from RHS: https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1442026 ?
finite crescent
no that not look like RHS
warm urchin
blazing wyvern
some things never changes
cobalt creek
sadly
green moss
Yeah and it's caiden and Melek / Zannaza the original A3L crew who started this whole cycle of monetisation approval
blazing wyvern
i did wish to see that "our content"
green moss
They originally had everything was hand made from their team, however i believe called out on it and it was removed
warm urchin
how they can even apply amazes me
blazing wyvern
if they could , they would add real gambling into it
green moss
I mean I used to care and gave BIS a case but they didn't really give a shit so now I don't either
Projectlife lotto
Like the cs go websites haha
blazing wyvern
yeah with loadouts and cars
fossil basalt
I liked the suggestion of a steam ban and having the game deleted (as well as workshop items).
And the same for those playing on their servers. Accessories after the fact ...
But that's my personal opinion.
blazing wyvern
If that was up to me , i would ban this crap forever heh
blazing wyvern
yeah only those kids that play those mods "kill cops lulz" puts on youtube , shows how brainless it is
fossil basalt
Don't forget, there's always the DMCA nuclear option
blazing wyvern
like Nodunit pointed out - monetization allows this "Limiting access to only paying players is allowed."
which is a bad idea imho
green moss
Does seem odd, even more so if the mods are not there own. (Or ripped) it's like a3l v2
fossil basalt
While I won't go so far as to suggest that someone is keeping tabs on them (to keep them honest), but in reality it wouldn't be very difficult to do so.
green moss
True and thousands of servers exist
fossil basalt
But there are only a few that draw attention to themselves over and over and over again. "The squeaky wheel gets the oil"
warm urchin
but there aren't thousands of official monetized servers if I'm right?
fossil basalt
Not that I've seen.
graceful cliff
There's like 2 dozen I think @warm urchin
green moss
FYI There have been many, many servers hacked from a new injection tool going around. They can steal all server code and mission code. I won't link the github as most is now being DMCA'd but doesn't matter as many fake servers will be appearing with knock of / stolen servers.
hallow frigate
@green moss would like to have more details on that. Stealing mission code isn't hard but server code is a whole other matter. Can you provide a source or something?
green moss
DM'd
pulsar pollen
https://i.gyazo.com/763cb16a93f9bd8507c4632fe89e00fe.png Giving ingame vest's with different amor level do donators - Aint that against the monetization rules?
cobalt creek
imho simply the "buy cheap" is enough
pulsar pollen
^^ Yeah
graceful cliff
@cobalt creek Tbh, I understand why they don't want to make it Pay To Win.
But can we not get a little more than "cosmetics"
I've seen servers
Sell islands on the map
They make an island
And add a text to it "labeling" the island
So they can sell it to Gangs
With buildings and shit they can buy and put storage crates on
fossil basalt
If it gives an edge to paying vs non-paying players, then NO, it's not allowed.
languid fog
Soon they will start up gambling sites for weapons and gear
I still dont get why this shit is legal? You're still technically having to pay to access game assets?
nimble fern
skins are ok
graceful cliff
Problem is
Most life servers use a single framework
But you can't give "skins" to specific people/groups easily.
It's either cop, civ or medic
For skins, same with vehicles.
Not without modifying the vehicle section of the framework, which then you would have to individually go through every vehicle they have adding support for the modifications, which some servers ik have done
But like damn, it's not that easy with most frameworks
cobalt creek
dafuq you talking about?
+ffs... every sentence a new "post"... oh my, never knew something like that annoyes me oO
graceful cliff
@cobalt creek it's a lot of info/words. Am I supposed to make a 1k long post?
cobalt creek
Yes
you
can
do
that
Text before: again: What are you talking about in there? oO
nova drift
The thing I don't get about server monetization is what was the goal? As a modder that does not run public servers it serves no purpose for me and the other Epoch mod project developers.
cobalt creek
ServerOwner: QuickBuck by some spoiled brats, who can't enjoy the game properly by playing how it was designed
Players: always having the "will" to be someone better (like: "me can buy stuff cheappaaaa dan you, bruh")? Having an advantage to others.
atomic kraken
@nova drift I guess the goal for little server owners are to make a quick buck so they can buy new computers, all that. Most servers cost no more then $80 a month (If you're using a GSP.), I've seen some servers get $2k-$3k, where does all that money go? Right to the owners.
heavy moon
@nova drift yep couldnt agree more. I guess it's BI way of trying to police those that do monetize, if they can't afford to pay for thier own servers they shouldn't have one and should not rely on monetization nor money making schemes to pay for them.
cobalt creek
"Uh, my bankaccount is on -500, but i want that Ferrari. Ah, who cares, somebody will send me money and pay for it"
carmine folio
Not on BI list
doing reserved slots on cups servers
been reported many times
do BI even care ?
hallow frigate
Uy, the European Court of Justice made a new ruling about hyperlinks to protected works today. If you have any kind of monetization (note that in many countries such as germany even a donation button or ad-banner counts as monetization) on your site or product, you must now ensure that none of the links on your site breach any copyrights by checking them yourself before publishing them. http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?qid=1395932669976&uri=CELEX:62015CJ0160
echo orchid
๐
cobalt creek
Oh, nice.
queen wing
๐
pliant oar
another typical absurd EU legislation ... not even technically possible to ensure (manual control, naive, automated, neither, imagine site like wiki, with thousands to millions urls ...)
dull moon
host your server outside eu and redirect your .de (or other EU domains) to it
clear mulch
it doesnt matter where you host it, but if you are citizen or not I assume
autumn glacier
It counts where you live, not where you host
clear mulch
IE I have .org domain bought from EU based company, I host site in NL but Im not EU citizen. That law is not obligatory to me
European Court of Justice
wtf is that it doesnt sound like its EU court
autumn glacier
if i will buy a webhosting package on a U.S. Site like Rapidgator as a german citizen i need to follow german rights, even if the Website is hosted outside of Germany / EU
clear mulch
is the highest court in the European Union in matters of European Union law. As a part of the Court of Justice of the European Union it is tasked with interpreting EU law and ensuring its equal application across all EU member states. Ah the Luxembourh one..
coral torrent
Hmmm and now? No one cares about such a law in the real world ...
autumn glacier
Until you get punished by this law. Some times in Germany, Websites that missing an imprint, disclaimer and/or privacy information on the website can be punished. They don't care about, if this is a small Website or a big Company.
Or the new and awsome Cookie Law ^^ where you need in the EU, to inform Users that Websites can save Cookies on your Computer.
clear mulch
so BND and NSA should poke you on facebook before intercepting your chatter :3
or not
regal vortex
hi
hallow frigate
Is it allowed to only give donators access to "alpha"?
fossil basalt
Are you on the approved server list?
hallow frigate
It's not about me but about a community that already got 2 monetization rules breaches. And no, they're not on the list.
But before I report them, I want to ask them to overthink it themself.
fossil basalt
If they're not on the list then no. (According to the rules). Dwarden may have more clarity on the matter though.
'''From February 1st 2015, anyone is allowed to monetize their Arma 3 server in the following way as long as they're registered, approved and listed on https://www.bistudio.com/monetization/approved/arma3:'''
hallow frigate
Yep, talked with them. They said they made a mistake in the news. Of course donators won't get special access to the server but staff may invite such to it.
pliant shadow
Limiting access to a server is allowed by BI rules. Just saying
autumn glacier
@hallow frigate No it's not allowed to give people payed acces to Versions of a Mod. It's allowed as Grim says, that you can have payed reserved Slots for your Server, but not payed Mod Access.
pliant shadow
If you have 60Slot server with 1 mod you are running that only runs on that 1 60 slot server and you have 60 reserved slots
its the same thing tbh
fossil basalt
I'm referencing the monetising bit, not private (clan) servers where everyone contributes to its actual running cost.
autumn glacier
@pliant shadow but it's not allowed to pay to get access to a Mod. If the Players can get the Mod, but only the Server has Reserved Slots, it should be ok, as far as understand the rules. But this means that the used Mod also allowed to be monetized.
graceful cliff
Is it hard to get Monentized? Age limit? Adverage player limit?
autumn glacier
You will be approved if some things ara against the rules of Monetizen, when yes you got an info to change it, then it would be revisited. And when all is ok, you get clearance.
autumn glacier
graceful cliff
If PMC (private military company, whitelisted that can apply for on site) gets access to Hunters
Can I give donators access aswell?
autumn glacier
Charging players to access your server, if the fees and associated perks do not affect gameplay in any way, is allowed. Cosmetic perks are allowed. Limiting access to only paying players is allowed.
graceful cliff
I've read that
But they don't HAVE to pay to get it
They can apply to be PMC and get it
autumn glacier
if the fees and associated perks do not affect gameplay in any way
That's not allowed, every Palyer needs to get acces to gear
only Cosmetic things (Maybe a black painted weapon) instead of a TAN Version will be allowed
graceful cliff
Then 99% of life servers break that
By giving vehicles, guns, spike strips, etc to COPS
autumn glacier
Did Cops need to pay real money to get this?
graceful cliff
No
autumn glacier
The best way to clear it, that you get in contact with BI directly and ask, they can give you a clear Ok or not
Accepting donations is allowed, but to avoid any doubts: not providing donations must not prevent anyone from accessing the content.
autumn glacier
That's not allowed
as you read above
Accepting donations is allowed, but to avoid any doubts: not providing donations must not prevent anyone from accessing the content.
hallow lark
Doesn't matter. Giving donators special treatment (instant access to something non donators don't have instant access too) is not allowed unless the access is to simply cosmetic items.
graceful cliff
Hmm
I've seen monentizated approved servers give donators special treatment by letting them instantly teleport to donator HQ
Also, a server called Horizon Life horizonlife.enjin.com gives donators special donor hunters
When civs have to walk/drive to Rebellion HQ's
But they aren't shut down...
hallow lark
Don't think anyone here is surprised to hear about a life server breaking monetization rules. Just because someone is doing it does not make it legit.
And BI do get around to punishing offending communities. They just do it when they do it.
fossil basalt
BI have always done things at their own pace. I just wish they'd post a Wall o' Shame for everyone caught and then (in addition to local bans) Petition for Steam Bans.
pliant oar
it will be too long and boring list ...
graceful cliff
Lmao
fossil basalt
But I'd take great satisfaction in pointing and laughing at them.
graceful cliff
It would ^
Maybe instead of ALL OF Them
Do the super popular ones
That got gg'd and had to RIP all their donator perks
remote osprey
I'm surprised the FAQ on server monetisation doesn't mention reserved slots/priority slots. I'd assume that falls under having to apply for it, but it'd be allowed
clear mulch
Name and shame is not a best way to do things.
Blizzard, EA does not allow it anywhere
fossil basalt
It is when the offending party argues and argues over how legit they are and how their army of lawyers say they're in the right, yet they are shut down with a quickness and are never heard from again...ironic.
clear mulch
I do recall from BF2 golden days when communities came up with web design of boothill, which was actually a cemetary of cheaters. I would do that, but monetization, I have no comment about that, its dumb I dont like the term at all.
fossil basalt
I don't like the thought of people making money off of the backs of people who make things for the community. It's one thing to "stick it to the man" if "the man" is a multi billion dollar company, but quite another thing to screw over "Bob" who does it as a hobby. It's sort of like robbing the blind man who is handing out match sticks. It a whole other level of sick.
carmine folio
I believe free can be good and is the future 100 years from now. Different people, yeah.
BI gives you everything you need to win tons of money: you can charge people to access your server. Not sure why most "Arma 3 economists" ignore that "holy fuck!" Info.
But you need to apply your server to the monetization program.
graceful cliff
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tHDQXz6jng
THEY USED THE ARMA SOUND TRACK ๐ฎ
I was searching arma
and that came up
and it says "Welcome to arma" ffs
carmine folio
That looks pretty cool tbh! And since it seems to be a tribute and not a paid mod, I think it should be ok?
heavy moon
would probably come under cc fair use, I guess so long as thier not monetising it, but meh youtubes monetisation claimbots would soon claim it for some media group nobody has heard of
just like one of my personal videos - thier claimbots tried to claim the sound in the video was owned by someone else - it was a beach video, only sound was the ocean and some seagulls
go figure.
heavy moon
to whom do you report workshop upload violations other than steam? This is regarding other games IP being ported and uploaded to the Arma 3workshop
@dark jasper may I pm you with the offending content? since I'd rather not openly paste the links.
pliant oar
@heavy moon the best course of action is tell owners of the IP so they DMCA it themself ... (afterall it's theirs stuff to protect)
pure mountain
Hi, just wondering. If someone runs a server and it contains your unit name + unit tag. Is this a violation you can fight?
carmine folio
That would depend on whether you have it trademarked and in what countries.
pure mountain
i doubt it's trademarked because it's the same name as a Dutch unit
It's just that one of the members is threatening some kids with "legal actions" because it contains the same name+tag
carmine folio
Depends on your jurisdiction but it needs to have been known quite well for it to be defended legally as a trade mark unless you have registered it. You can still register it now (some cost) and likely be defending it within a few weeks.
frank wolf
Tbh, having a clan name trademarked.. unlikely to have any foot.
This is for business names, but i think it can relate to 'clan names' too.
- Does the business claiming infringement operate in the same geographic market?
If your customers are in different geographical areas, there is less likely to be customer confusion because you don't have the same customers. For example, in the old days, a traditional Californian marketing firm was not competing for customers in Florida. Thus, you could have AAA Marketing in Florida and in California without any infringement concerns. They both had a right to the trademark.
pure mountain
The thing is, the clanname is the same as a real dutch armed unit.
so i realllllly doubt they have any legal standing
unless the unit is somehow officially recognized
I'm just a bit bothered by the fact the guy is threatening to take legal actions because someone started a server with the same name/tag
frank wolf
Real army names
no go.
Never ever ever ever ver go there
naming groups, sure. NATO, US, BRITISH, fine.
Naming brotherhoods in that army of choice, just dont...
frank wolf
It's like calling your clan after a group that's /w the Yakuza
But little less killing involved
pure mountain
I think there are enough Arma 3 units named to real life units though
frank wolf
If they are part of it, perhaps, i dont know
i would just avoid the whole legal issue at all.
When in doubt, ask them why and on what ground they would force legal actions upon you.
pure mountain
(not me though)
frank wolf
in general
pure mountain
so far the only reason i can see is that the fact someone was using their name and their unit tag for a server not affiliated with them
heavy moon
@pliant oar yep emailed them this morning, reported on steam also.
blazing wyvern
well i think you shouldn't repack others addons from armaholic and uploading it on Steam Workshop just because its easier solution
he should only upload his stuff that he made and others stuff that isnt his he should only link it
also those big mod packs that i see on steam workshop , that are just packed mods into one like for example for some Life server that shouldn't be allowed as well
maybe private yes but not on public
fossil basalt
I think it would depend on whats in them.
fossil basalt
thats why sometimes its good to D/L and see whats in it.
fossil basalt
Because if I ever found any of my stuff (I dont have any stuff) in there, you can guarantee theyre going to have a very bad day.
fossil basalt
Yes, which is unauthorised.
frank wolf
They're not selling your work.
blazing wyvern
nope that you taking stuff that isnt yours into place that the author might dont agree with
fossil basalt
The most simplest reason is this... If you dont have written and explicit permission to do something, you can not do it.
frank wolf
Maybe i'm missing the point. Personally if i'd make a mod/file/pack that's free - and that gets uploaded somewhere else for users to benefit (with a proper link or shoutout or whatever) i couldn't care less.. ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
blazing wyvern
also most of addons from armaholic say - they are not allowed to repack and upload on some random site
frank wolf
But how is the steam workshop, for the game it's intended - a random site?
blazing wyvern
it is a site
fossil basalt
Because the author did not give you permission, period!
You can not upload someone elses work without their consent.
blazing wyvern
its like i will take your car and park it somewhere where everybody can ride on it for free
fossil basalt
blazing wyvern
without your permission lol
this mindset is so wrong and they doing it same thing with stolen models that port into arma - "It's Free! , lets have fun , dont ruin it! "
fossil basalt
blazing wyvern
^those things are ignored by "Who Cares!"
fossil basalt
But for the uninformed it is a good resource.
frank wolf
yeah, that video isn't really for IP properties, but sure.
@blazing wyvern It's not the same analogy. It would be if i made a blueprint for the car, for free, and you use it to make your own with it and deside to share the blueprint on your own site again. with other people. As long as it stays free (GPL/Open Source, whatever) there's no harm done in my opinion. That you make it a whole - OH MY GOD YOU STOLE MY WORK YOU BITCH - situation, just makes it worse. Clearly they value what you made and want to re-share it.
Now, if it's something you made - like a model for a different game that you worked on and got payed for, or people need to buy - and repack that. That's content theft. If they start selling of your work, same story.
Now it's like having a lemon stand, where you give out free lemons - but telling them what they can or can't do with said lemon, because it's yours and you gave it to them - for free..
Freeware means that the package may be distributed freely, the BIS EULA adds the condition that this must be done free of any sort of payment, but may not be edited freely. All addons are freeware unless the creator(s) states otherwise.
YOU MAY ONLY DOWNLOAD IT HERE BECAUSE REASONS. I just dont get it. Really.
fossil basalt
that is, the uninformed Vs the Stupid
No, its not for IP, but consent is consent, either you have it or you dont.
blazing wyvern
you dont own the rights to do it
simple as that
thats why you ask the owners of that stuff
and if they say no , then you know what
frank wolf
It's a personal mindset, really. Let me put it this way, from my experience.
I work as a photo- and videographer in the time i have left next to my dayjob. I enjoy my work. If some random person decides to re-upload it anywhere else - ** and not make any profit of it or any other intent ** - i really dont care.
blazing wyvern
thats your decision , not all things are like that
fossil basalt
You can blame the Life scene for the hard stance on IP theft/misuse
frank wolf
Life scene?
fossil basalt
Life Mods
they were (and some still are) notorious for using community made mods and allowing access to them for a price.
Also, have a look at this with regard to uploading content to the workshop.
"When you upload your content to Steam to make it available to other users and/or to Valve, you grant Valve and its affiliates the worldwide, non-exclusive, right to use, reproduce, modify, create derivative works from, distribute, transmit, transcode, translate, broadcast, and otherwise communicate, and publicly display and publicly perform, your User Generated Content, and derivative works of your User Generated Content, in connection with the operation, distribution and promotion of the Steam service, Steam games or other Steam offerings."
frank wolf
there's the part i was looking for.
carmine folio
That is mainly so they can legally repack/compress/distribute your content.
frank wolf
steam workshop denounces ownership of uploads.
right to use/reproduce. Aka, hey, that looks good. We'll remake it.
fossil basalt
I understand Brendan, I'd just hate to have to fight them in court on that.
carmine folio
True, but I doubt Valve would ever actually take workshop content and try use it themselves for monetary gain.
fossil basalt
Most likely not, but one thing I've learned in life is "never discount the obscure power of legalese".
frank wolf
It's the fineprint. If the location is free, and mearly functions as a mirror in that case, /care.
If it's uploaded to another parties site, and they state: hey, uploading it here makes it ours.. then there's something wrong - and ofcourse, you shouldn't upload other's work there. ๐
blazing wyvern
also steam workshop makes like you are the owner of the stuff that you uploaded
fossil basalt
It brings us back to the core concept, "Respect the work of others".
frank wolf
Respect shows is many forms @fossil basalt
fossil basalt
In this case Respect means, ask before doing, if you're told NO, then don't.
frank wolf
If you made an amazing digitalpainting, free to download. And i link to it, or share that link with the world, because i repect your craftmanship, that's value, too.
If i upload it and mark it as mine, that's the whole issue, i think.
but lets agree to disagree
fossil basalt
No, there is no agree to disagree. Without permission, it cannot be done, simple. Those who condone or support such opinions on IP theft/misuse really have no place in this community.
frank wolf
There's a personal difference is keeping hold on that idea of 'what mine is mine and no-one in the world may use it before asking me, and me alone!!!' or seeing the value of someone sharing your work, without wanting to make money of it, and actually crediting you. With or without permission. To me, that gray area only comes to play when your content gets re-used in either:
a: their name
b: their work which they profit from
It's the same as the whole torrent issue;
i dont host the file, just the link to where you can get it from (the original source included), which would be where you initially uploaded it, or with attached files.
I'll just leave it to rest.
blazing wyvern
this guy really cares about the authors or licences lol
no credits of who made those models , textures etc
frank wolf
That's stealing (paid) work and uploading it. That's not free work made by others, is it?
blazing wyvern
and plus some of it its ported from other games
frank wolf
Sure, that i don't agree on.
Mod uploader takes (paid) work from 3rd-parties, and other sources (maybe even free ones) to jam them in one big pack.
blazing wyvern
some of it are free but if you dont even list them who made it , thats isnt good
yeah but he takes it like its own crap
which is next level of BS
that guy is probably chinese or korean
typically russian dudes like to do that
fossil basalt
I'm sure the uploaded is trying to justify his actions by saying "It's not like I'm charging anyone for it".
blazing wyvern
ye
frank wolf
Again, there's that fine line we're crossing.
fossil basalt
Even free mods have licences with them, being paid for doesn't grant any more rights.
frank wolf
@blazing wyvern, @fossil basalt Say for instance i upload a mod you made, which is free to use in A3, but can't be found anywhere else, maybe the site is blocked in my country - i dont know, think of something ๐ - and I share an alternative link to it, would you mind?
I take the whole mod. /w licenses.
Stating. yo. this dude made fine work. Respect his work please; download it here - mirror - or from this page - source -.
fossil basalt
That's up to the individual author.
blazing wyvern
@frank wolf well in my instance - i got alternative mirrors , my own one and six one
if you somehow armaholic isnt available
frank wolf
It's the general idea; i share your work. Not take ownership.
blazing wyvern
in steam workshop its different , it might not be on first sight but it is
frank wolf
No, that we found out - and i understand from the legal point, you might not want that as a creator.
blazing wyvern
and in any case as a author i would upload it myself there if i would want it
not by some stranger
fossil basalt
For example, I let my neighbours use my lawnmower (because they don't have one). All they have to do is knock and ask. The minute they go into my back yard and use it without permission is the last time they'll ever use it.
frank wolf
That's still physical property.
Something you can actually touch, and by using it, removes the original
also; (IP)theft -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeTybKL1pM4
Anywho; im all for (asking) permission or credit, there where due. Sharing /w the proper credit does not harm the original creator, in any form or way - when it's free(ware).
echo orchid
have any of you actually read steam agreement?
because it doesn't look like it
section 6D
**D. Representations and Warranties
You represent and warrant to us that you have sufficient rights in all User Generated Content to grant Valve and other affected parties the licenses described under A. and B. above or in any license terms specific to the applicable Workshop-Enabled App or Workshop page. This includes, without limitation, any kind of intellectual property rights or other proprietary or personal rights affected by or included in the User Generated Content. In particular, with respect to Workshop Contributions, you represent and warrant that the Workshop Contribution was originally created by you (or, with respect to a Workshop Contribution to which others contributed besides you, by you and the other contributors, and in such case that you have the right to submit such Workshop Contribution on behalf of those other contributors).**
in short, unless you own the content you are uploading, you cannot upload
fossil basalt
๐๐ป
echo orchid
that is for steam, for repacking, unless directly specified that you are allowed to do it, the most restrictive license applies (https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/ is a good start)
which means there will be no repacking and redistributing
nova drift
We had no problem with accepting Steam workshops license for Epoch and was an early adopter as we feel its the best way to distribute the mod.
People used to combine mods together to make it easier to download but now it should not be needed as you can use mod dependencies and the Arma 3 launcher automatically asks the player to download and enable other workshop mods the server running.
Arma 3 Epoch is on its way to becoming a modders resource but we all certainly don't need dozens of versions of the same models and textures floating around the workshop so we will keep the released mod under the same license http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/
echo orchid
what does the above have with anything that has been discussed here?
nova drift
If your licensed by-nc-nd/4.0/ that should still protect your work even on the workshop if I am not mistaken.
The point was you should embrace the Steam workshop to make it easier for players to install your mod. That will only result in less IP abuse.
If Steam or anyone wants to copy your idea there is nothing you can do, but your license should protect your assets from misuse.
covert notch
So I asked a modder on Armaholic if I could use it on my server, his reply was a $100euro license fee. Is that allowed?
just wanted to make sure that I should be offended or not
heavy moon
you question someones reply stating $100 licence fee for using thier content,. yet you charge $500 for in-game islands on your website,. the hypocrasy is real.
dull moon
apply water to burned areas
warm urchin
salty water
carmine folio
@heavy moon do you have a link to his site? that must be a joke ๐
cobalt creek
Sadly its not a joke...
@carmine folio
https://www.orgobyte.com/forum/topic/1692-donation-packages-monetized-through-bohemia/
Island Package โ $500
For the player who prefers to live in style, this package includes a private island off the coast of Kelleyโs Island, accessible via air or sea. The private island comes with a personal dock for any boats or helipad.
Personal, private island made by OrgoByte and placed on the map with a placard stating their name as ownership of the land.
Boat dock or helipad
Holy balls
$100 for
Gang logo shirt
Gang logo placed on your vest that's already been purchased in-game
Gang logo on vehicles
This is what is costs me to run 30+ servers per month
cobalt creek
Yep, ridiculous...
hasty scaffold
jesus, I've heard some comments about life cancer servers being bad but, damn man..
is this what the "other side" of the community has become, ugh.
cobalt creek
"other side" ... i would say it sadly became the mayority.
hasty scaffold
yeah like when you check twitch for arma3 streams and be like "oh cool so many streamers and thousands of viewers", but when you browse it through, its all life stuff. rarely, very rarely, you find some traditional COOP or even milsim mission stream there. aanyways, sliding bit offtopic for iprights so I'll shut up ๐
cobalt creek
=}
fossil basalt
What is the "it" he's referring to? A model? And if you're charging that much for a logo, you (@covert notch) should be the last one to be offended. There are perks and then there is "taking the piss".
blazing wyvern
LOL to those guys who really donate loads of money into life mods
hallow frigate
Wow these prices are just ridiculous. Who pays that? If they would've made everything themself then I don't care how much they charge but to think that people spend that much money for them to place some strings and non-self made logos.
misty mantle
LuL and I thought Ribbon Gaming is over the top.....
fossil basalt
The difference is Ribbon isn't an approved server
carmine folio
but why does shit like this get approved?
fossil basalt
Because it falls within the rules BI set down.
misty mantle
There got reportet month ago ^^ So it looks like bi dont realy care.
fossil basalt
It all boils down to "cosmetic" and "does not affect gameplay"
carmine folio
well being able to buy a island is the same as being able to buy a vehicle, its an advantage over other players that don't/can't buy it...
or am i overlooking something?
fossil basalt
Personally I don't think it has any more advantage than a locker to store your stuff, it's just a fancy locker. If it was a weapon / vehicle / item (gps, binocs, etc) then that would be different.
If I'm wrong, I'm sure BI will do something about it. Or maybe it falls within a grey area.
carmine folio
yea, could be both... w/e it's just ridiculous
bronze anchor
This makes it seem like you can't.
https://www.bistudio.com/community/game-content-usage-rules
"Am I allowed to offer crowd-funding/donation/stretch rewards such as naming an island after someone, naming a campaign character after someone etc?"
"No this is not allowed, donation/funding or any other kind of rewards related to monetary contributions cannot be linked to any kind of in game content, the one exception to this is you are allowed to credit donators by name if you so wish in your modโs ingame credits and/or documentation."
fossil basalt
Hmm, I missed that bit.
covert notch
Uro, all of our 3 packages were approved by Bohemia. We don't really get people donating for them. I don't really care to change the map that often so it's really there for novelty and just like others said it's cosmetic and comes with a nifty sign stating they founded the island. It's no different than a benefit concert or a benefit auction. We've been open for nearly one year and I can count on one hand how many islands have been donated for.
Playerunknown, no one has ever donated for a gang package since we really have no gangs on our server.
Armixes, we don't get those packages donated very often. I've given away more islands than people have donated for.
FM, is was the EOD suit mod. One of our Sheriff Deputies messaged the owner if we could use it and he responded with "you can use it for $100 euros"
Also Bohemia only allows me to create Monetization for cosmetic things so a gang logo on a car or vest is the best I can do. I even had to make sure the rules stated he player already bought the vest ingame and it didn't come with the logo.
neon rover
Mh, doesnยดt sound too bad I think. Still better than Ribbon Gaming. Do they still offer the "unban donation" on their website?
covert notch
I don't really keep up with other communities anymore. I get enough coming to me asking me for my map that's already on armaholic
covert notch
Pennyworth I didnt name the island after them I just put a small sign near the dock that says "[players ingame name] founded this island in 2016"
hearty ledge
@covert notch You don't need to defend yourself. You are approved by BIS, you are following the rules, and if your players donate for those approved things I say good for you!
covert notch
Im aware but it seems some people think im skirting the rules or blatantly trying to "gouge" people. Everything is there as an option and not required to play.
but regardless thanks CEN
hybrid tide
The linch mobs at it again lol
covert notch
ya mike the usual suspects
hybrid tide
Bring out the torches and pitch forks! Round up the men!
fossil basalt
You don't think $500 for putting "a small sign" is gouging?
blazing wyvern
I really should start doing a life mod server , get rich and stuff
covert notch
i make the island and put it on the map. its not there before the donation happens
i wish i was rich
i dont take any donations personally. I have a job, this is just a hobby
I still hold my truck door shut to drive to work unfortunately.
lofty steeple
anyone wants to buy a named locker on the Nimitz? SCNR ๐
fossil basalt
๐
Would those "usual suspects" be moderators and trusted community content makers?
covert notch
not really
hearty ledge
is a $500 Gucci t-shirt "gouging"?
All depends on who is spending the money
Complain to BIS if you want, but don't go off on the guy for following the rules
covert notch
oh theyve already tried
ive heard all kinds of things. none have been true yet but theyve indeed tried.
fossil basalt
No, it appears to be within the rules, so nothing to complain about. I'm not "going off on him, Just seems a bit excessive to me.
covert notch
I didnt want every dick and harry to donate for an island and that's all I did and the map would be full of islands. Anyways....carry on.
hybrid tide
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2xlQaimsGg this pretty sums things up
covert notch
you can find our repo from going to our website and filling out an application and completing an interview to become whitelisted. usually takes about a week.
probably not a question for this channel though
good one mike
fossil basalt
With the exception that for every approved server out there, there are many more charging for someone elses content.
Its not a witch hunt when its quite obvious that there are quite a few bad apples out there.
covert notch
ya if i had a package to sell cars or something id understand everyone's frustration. but i made the map from beginning to the end.
You can find the map and the source files to Kelley's Island on Armaholic. Obviously ive completed more of it on my own server but i've given more in just that than most of the people targetting me for my so called "gouging".
fossil basalt
My only concern was the amount, not whether the content was your own.
I want to say that the Life Community (and others) have received a bad rap, but the actions of many (in those communities) have made life difficult for the few. The number of people here on this forum that think its acceptable to charge for, modify or repack and upload someone else work to Steam is unbelieveable. Scroll up in the history for a week or so and you can see people trying to justify what they do with other peoples work, its sickening. So, when you @hybrid tide call it a "witch hunt", its not. It's people sticking their heads in the sand because they dont want to admit that certain communities are profiting from the hard work of others (at the expense of the honest members within those same communities).
@lofty steeple Yes, I'll buy one for Randy ๐
hearty ledge
It's a witch hunt because the rules BI put in place are catered towards life mods
of course they are going to run with it and take advantage
dull moon
and as soon as they take advantage and using stuff i helped to create and make money out of it but it is strictly forbidden, i'm gonna hunt them and bust their fing nuts as hard as i can. i don't give a fing rats ass if smb calls it a witch hunt or not. no means no, that's it! no f***ing excuses or counter offers. i'm tired of this shit. i spend more time on filing IP violation and DMCA reports than modding. this makes me sick
fossil basalt
^
blazing wyvern
It seems we need Steam workshop heroes ๐
fossil basalt
Ive submitted a few myself (DMCA) ๐
dull moon
i can't even count how many of those motherfucking illegal steam re uploading and monetizationed communities i've taken down by now. this is sad, this is so fcking sad. even if the content is APL-SA, it doesn't allow smb to re upload it. what is wrong with all these pu**ies? are they to dumb to read the licenses? if the license says, as soon as smb is making profit with his/hers/its server it is prohibited to use content X, it is NOT ALLOWED for fuck's sake! this includes selling VIP slots or special perks, even if they are not affecting the game itself. what is so difficult to understand? most of those retarded fcks don't even bother to ask the authos before adding the content to their modpacks. fuck, this shit pisses me off.......
nova drift
As we are back on the monetization topic, I wanted to ask an open question:
Since Steam workshop monetization of Skyrim mods failed before it even got started, it would seem that the court of public opinion is against content creators monetizing "mods".
That said, do you think Arma 3 server monetization was supposed to be an icebreaker for some other form monetization to come?
dull moon
not sure. i think it is an attemt to get some rules behind what started back in arma 2.
if BI would expand the forms of monetization they would loose a lot of dedicated and awsome persons from the community. important guys... i don't think BI dares to do so
wheat wave
i think that would only drive to a turnover, like it happened in a2 to a3
dull moon
now imagine this...:
you pay for a weapon mod, and also have to pay a server owner to play the weapon mod you already bought... dafuq?
wheat wave
if anything the modders would increase in numbers if there's money to gain
cobalt creek
One reason why i stopped doing anything in Arma. Its just a big buttf**k.
hearty ledge
"you pay for a weapon mod, and also have to pay a server owner to play the weapon mod you already bought... dafuq?"
Then you find another server to play. There are countless servers out there.
dull moon
even the possibility that this could happen makes me wanna throw up
nova drift
Since that sort of server monetization is intended to be cosmetic would that not be against the rules already?
fossil basalt
could you clarify that a bit (kind of confusing, to me at least)
nova drift
In reference to a server admin charging a player to access a weapon mod as @dull moon said.
I agree with @wheat wave that there would certainly be an increase in quantity and quality of content, everything from Admin Tools and Game Modes to mods full of models and other assets. However, nothing will likely change until public opinion does.
fossil basalt
I dont think anything will change until people stop profiting off of the hard work of others.
wheat wave
@nova drift you forget the unpleasant side effect that content that was once free now requires you to pay
cobalt creek
Wich will result in either a kill of the moddingscene or kill of comunity, since every fktard puts his 3wheeledshittybangbuscrappieceofshit model in the store for xxโฌ
undone pier
what is the reason you guys always take the worst outcome/approach as given to be done by BI - have such low opinion about them or just very cynical?
dull moon
I'm not expecting it because i have a rather high option in BI
fossil basalt
I have a low opinion of thieves, not BI.
dull moon
This also
cobalt creek
Thats the point. +That has been proven alot in the past. In this time, there are way too many "i wanna make money with it" idiots around in the A3-Comm. 1+1=2,1245106 ( โฌ ).
Anyway, i am done with Arma anyway (and thats one of the reasons).
misty mantle
@cobalt creek So you stop working on 2017 ? ๐ฆ
undone pier
so did MANW also cause many infringments? (not talking about other consequences - negative or positive, or lack of such)
from what i recall the submissions itself werent really checked by BI for such, yet the actual candidates were fine (except 1-2 had some controversy if my mind serves me right)
wheat wave
im not blaming BI specifically, im blaming valve/steam for wanting to push the mod monetization
they tried once, they most certainly will try again
if there's money to be made
and judging by how the skyrim monetization went, infringements will happen
cobalt creek
Of course, and how will it be handled? Like now? Waiting X Weeks for reactions? Meh... this won't end well for the Arma-Modder.
wheat wave
heh
or imagine how many people will feel validated for having their own private mod store on their personal website
(which is something they already do with server perks, btw)
cobalt creek
Yeah
This will get so fkn quickyl out of hand.. i mean, we can see it right now... How many Server are approved? How many of those Server do/stay in the regular way? How many Servers have a "hidden shop". There is just no way to handle that. imho, the current handling is too lush. If BI got proof -> Shutdown their Servers until they can proof, that they removed it.
wheat wave
last time this happened: ```Just a small update from your friends at XXXXX for the ones that did not read the previous e-mail on this matter!
As some of you already know we have had some troubles in the past with the creators of CUP. They have applied a license to their add-ons which not allow us to monetize in any way or form. We believe we are not offering any in-game perks, the reserved slots are just a fast-lane for VIP's during peak hours.
CUP decided to report us to Bohemia Interactive and Bohemia wants us to either remove the CUP mods or stop monetizing. We don't know how we are going to solve this issue yet but we have created a new product in our store so you are able to purchase a Special VIP Deal now which will last 90 days. (THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO MAKE SURE YOU WILL HAVE VIP FOR 90 DAYS) This perk will only be available till the 3rd of October, on the 3rd of October we will remove most products from our online store, only the allowed products will stay!
We still love the work that CUP has done and respect their view on this matter but we do not share their opinion!
So to make sure you will have VIP access in the coming 3 months you have to purchase the Special VIP Deal. You can only purchase it today! We have reduced the price to thank you for supporting us. As you guys know we will keep working on our community and servers, we will not let you down. Cool stuff is around the corner!
You can find the special Deal here! Last chance is today!
Thanks for your support!```
"hey we have 10 days, give us as much money as you can lol"
cobalt creek
Congratulations... -.-
Shut them down... instantly... you know... it will never happen
cobalt creek
XD
lofty steeple
just wondering, but would there be really any prob with paid for mods and free mods? Wouldn't it be the same like DLC and free mods right now? Or is the fear that a lot of 'derived' or ripped paid for mods from free content would appear suddenly?
wheat wave
second case
lapis widget
Ah Chariborne stop the complaints please, store is closed within the date requested bu Vojtech.
by*
Why are you so focussed on EXO?
lapis widget
Wow Chairborne, you know what you did.
wheat wave
so do you apparently
lapis widget
I tried to have normal conversations with you guys and I just got banned.
wheat wave
thats not exactly how it went down
lapis widget
You gave someone an approval for monetization because you said it did not qualify as a perk!
lapis widget
You allowed a squad xml, since it is only visual.
For a donations, which make it monetization.
cobalt creek
Salt n pepper here ๐
dull moon
Dude, cut it! You fucked up on cup discord and got banned for it. End of discussion
wheat wave
it was just the final of a long streak of arguments where you guys show up just to cause us problems
lapis widget
I did not, I stop when asked and talked in private..... I was never disrespectful.
I am not there to cause problems, I just got pointed to the fact that you allowed someone monetization because you did not qualify it as a perk.
fossil basalt
When people speak of grey areas, I always have to remind them that "Either you have permission or you dont" There is no grey there, only Black and White.
cobalt creek
^ +1
dull moon
+1
lapis widget
Have you seen the http://imgur.com/a/RzS4E
cobalt creek
And?
lapis widget
Thats monetization.
fossil basalt
If CUP said "No", then "No means no."
lapis widget
CUP said yes to http://imgur.com/a/RzS4E
cobalt creek
Look, same link for the 3rd time.
I don't think we are goldfish's in here, so no need to paste that one over and over again ๐
fossil basalt
yeah, 2 comments taken out of context do not a novel make.
Any issue is between 3 groups anyway, BI, CUP and the offender.
lapis widget
CUP claims to be against monetization but allows a new community to put people on a special squad xml. Which in their own words is monetization, because somehting is given in return. So they allow monetization as long as they do not qualify it as a perk.
cobalt creek
I love the smell of monetization in the morning lights up cigar
dull moon
Hahahahahahahaha
wheat wave
"in their own words" where?
lapis widget
Chairborne do you allow monetization?
cobalt creek
I think, he refers to "I dont think squad url would qualify as perk"
fossil basalt
You can discuss that with BI and CUP and any legal representation they choose to retain
dull moon
Dude, like i seid before... Cut it. You are fighting windmills here
fossil basalt
^
lapis widget
But for me it is simple. Giving something in return for a donation is considered monetization. So allowing the new community to do this is allowing monetization because you think it does not qualify as a perk.
Not fighting anything my store is closed.
Just hope BI wakes up an changes their opinion on this next year.
wheat wave
eh you know, perhaps you're right, perhaps that does constitute monetization