combat-and-skills

[gleaming musk]

You should be able to do that now, except jumping doesnt interrupt casting.

So you can just repeatedly double-jump away from things. Feels kinda silly though

[steady crystal]

The fell soldiers are much less of a homing missile

[unkempt ivy]

Yeah, that seems like theres needs to be a more engaging alternative maybe

Give me cold aura that slows enemies within 5 meters 😃

[gleaming musk]

I put in a lot of feedback about how to overhaul mages so that this is the case. Hopefully we see at least some of it in the mage rework

[steady crystal]

First of all, what does everyone play on as far as settings? I play with 150% enemy damage and health, more enemies, and 150% attack rate

Because we might all be talking past each other if we’re all experiencing different game settings

[unkempt ivy]

Same but I always max enemies. I think thats one or 2 mobs more

[obsidian rune]

I run two worlds for testing.
Straight normal mode, and normal mode + Max mob density.

[tired pagoda]

Kinda over the aura and passives stuff. Not saying everything needs to be active but auras feel very lazy when you start layering them

[steady crystal]

If spacing and positioning played a more important role I could see dancing around the range of the aura interesting to juggle. But that’s not the game right now.

I think if I played normal mode, no mod for terror. I think the only way to play staff reliably is jump kiting. Which at least feels a little engaging. You have to decide where to jump and where to target in a rather short amount of time.

[tired pagoda]

I dislike that auras now can have points on them just to increase the radius. That feels very underwhelming to me. I think the intention is that you can get a self buff with one rank, but why are there three then lol

[unkempt ivy]

Is wand dmg really that bad? My wands hitting like 40% of the dmg my spells are, but i feel like i get alot more wand casts in the time it takes to cast

[obsidian rune]

Staff hop, light burst for the stun bar.
But I'm struggling to find a good damage source to apply to stunned mobs to actually kill them

[steady crystal]

A lot of wand damage is tied up in multi hits triggering crit triggering other skills. So it’s less the number that shows up from the wand projectile hit

There is no piece of gear that improves terror that I can find

I’m just going to mod it back and my friends can play on my server

[misty sedge]

I run default settings.

From a personal standpoint, I find a lot of criticism falls apart when people are on higher settings. Specifically people would complain about pre-patch Greatsword not performing very well in 200% mob density, and it's like yeah. Things are harder when you're playing on settings higher than the default? Crazy

The higher settings are there so people can turn the challenge up as they want, not whine that their adjustments made the game too hard

[tired pagoda]

Yes and no. I don't think everything scales linearly like that. Some things work better in easier and harder settings. The harder just showcases the problems more

[steady crystal]

Oddly, I think staff builds get better on the more enemy settings, especially for mana Leach

[misty sedge]

Some things do straight up benefit from there being more mobs

[tired pagoda]

Yeah mob density definitely changes the game dynamic on a lot of levels

[misty sedge]

It also makes resource farming for certain things less grindy

[steady crystal]

Yeah, I find myself increasing the rune cost just so I don’t have stacks of them sitting in chest

It feels so bad to kill a group and then not pick up the stuff

[obsidian rune]

Was the case when you had reliable stunning and could just artillery strike packs.
What I'm running into on the high density world is things just don't die. And with no stun, now I have 6+ mobs up my rear

[steady crystal]

I have more cloth than I know what to do with

[steady crystal]

Yeah, I only play on more not Max, so I don’t quite have the same experience.

My issue with the terror changes is it was the only thing keeping lightning channel in my inventory.

I know a spell Work is coming in the distant future but for today it is fireball / ice bot all day every day and it’s rather wind dimensional. The one shroud spell is still OK. But it is definitely worse without terror.

But I am modding terror back when I get home

[obsidian rune]

Really the thing I'm struggling to find is, what's the mage dps spell now? Fireball and icebolt are decent spikes. But is that it?

[steady crystal]

I already built the mod. I just need to find the values for the stun chance in the game code.

[steady crystal]

Yeah, you just bunny hop jump, cast those two spells a few times and then updraft away and do it again. No more. Terror stunning an enemy and circling behind them to delete them with backstab bonus damage.. It just doesn’t work.

You don’t even have time to get behind them now

[obsidian rune]

Like I said, I'm having reasonable success with staff hop, light burst to force a stun. But what's the switch spell to kill the stunned target?

It isn't acid bite, or channel lightning. Fireball and icebolt don't kill things unless I'm casting 3+ times. And that's with trying the soaked+ 4 iceman trick. Or the flame gloves + bright ring for the 5 arsonist ranks.

[steady crystal]

How is double handed melee damage now

If everyone has been brought down to mage level of damage, I wouldn’t as irritated

[obsidian rune]

Stream I watched to get the cosmetic unlocks were constant 1k plus charges, little upward bops, and cleave swings.

2h melee rips drak apart.

[misty sedge]

Shhh shhh I don't want 2H melee nerfed too

[tired pagoda]

It's honestly in a better place, considering the way the tree is set up now directly supports it

[steady crystal]

I’ve been resistant to mods, but until the game devs start reversing directions with how casters sit I’m just going to have to do it myself

[misty sedge]

2H melee is in a better place but axe/hammer and greatsword are still different

2H greatsword special is very nice for hollow halls

[pliant sigil]

Full blunt + life leech is still strong
Greataword feels okay, but they still ONLY count as greatswords. They don't benefit from the Two-Handed Attack Speed node for example.
The Heavy Attacks feel slow on Greatswords but are good at catching mobs. You can chain them back to back.

[obsidian rune]

The spin to win one? That just deletes everything caught in it

[steady crystal]

Yeah, they really should’ve left terror in until they did the spell rework

[pliant sigil]

Comparing to Axe/Hammer's Heavy Attacks they don't go as far but have a bigger AOE.

[obsidian rune]

Anyone tried 1h+shield? Seems the least popular of all builds

[misty sedge]

It's just not very dynamic, even with the new heavy and special attacks

It doesn't have a delayed attack to switch things up

[obsidian rune]

I think that's most builds right now. But how effective is it?

[misty sedge]

All damage feels small to 2H greatsword. I'm specced into all the 1H skills too but I think I only swap to 1H shield to parry projectile attacks

It might be effective? But it's so boring to play

[tired pagoda]

I think a large part of the reason 1H is not pushed for is : what does it offer over 2H

And the answer is very, very, very little

[obsidian rune]

That's probably correct. Do the little hop attacks to hit flying enemies work with 1h as well?

[tired pagoda]

2H style has a ton of interactions, skills, nodes, things that make a fully fleshed play style. There isn't a single node that affects shields lol

[misty sedge]

Upward Slash?

[obsidian rune]

I think that's the one. I haven't tested melee in the last 24 hrs

[misty sedge]

Yeah you can do that with every melee weapon

Even daggers

[tired pagoda]

Yeah that's just all melee

[obsidian rune]

But 2h great sword has a little bop ability it uses to hit flying enemies. Like a little hop, and a punch looking animation

[misty sedge]

The heavy attack?

[obsidian rune]

Dunno. Streamer is doing it mid air, run up to a banshee. Little hop, little punch looking strike. Like a street fighter bop.

[cobalt bridge]

guys, wanted to ask a rhetoric question: "Begone" is considered a magic effect, right? (its damage is boosted by intelligence) ?
Or is it still fully bugged and scaling with neither Strength nor intelligence (don't even want to mention other interactions)?
Because I can see SOME progress on the skill tree as well as the Unarmed gear but I kind of have my heavy doubts about this and I don't really want to waste time on it. Does anyone have definitive answers?

[slow locust]

Anyone else noticed that Inner Fire gives just six seconds of shroud time instead of six minutes?

[obsidian rune]

Ye

[misty sedge]

That has to be Upward Slash

[obsidian rune]

Follow-up question then, does upward slash base damage on your weapon. Or will daggers, 1h and 2h hit differently?

[misty sedge]

Damage is based on weapon in my experience

[obsidian rune]

Noted. So I shouldn't expect the same numbers, not using a great sword.

[tired pagoda]

Damage is weapon based yes

[misty sedge]

My Greatsword upslashes do like 1100

But others are sub

[misty sedge]

Correct

[obsidian rune]

That's almost exactly what I was seeing. Good info, appreciate

[cobalt bridge]

does anyone know anything about "Begone"? Any reliable information?

[steady crystal]

I have not tested bad skills on account of it bad.

and I don't mean just bad damage, i mean, there is no point standing in melee, no life leach, low armor. no triggering other skills, why are you stand that close to thinks that want to kill you

[misty sedge]

The text says it scales, but I'm not specced into intelligence at all. I did take all 3 tiers of the unarmed boost node right after Begone! and noticed little to no difference

I just use it for the stun

Which is miles better than Kick, I haven't even taken Kick this update

[tired pagoda]

Kick is something I want to be cool and good and still hasn't really found its way

[steady crystal]

there is a kick? \

[tired pagoda]

How will I make sparta if my kick is baby

[misty sedge]

baby kick

[tired pagoda]

Dex linked, think it's around the inner ring now, or close to it

[cobalt bridge]

Well, it should scale with both Str and Int since there's no other way to scale its dmg up efficiently. And since there's a very bold hint that the Unarmed builds should be a thing now (judging by the "Sleight of hand" talent), I have all the rights to presume it should now work properly. But I am not convinced simply because neither anyone talks about it nor i've seen the supposable difference in my gameplay so far. Not to say that a powerful focus-based attack is missing in the tree, also a high-level gear for Unarmed is missing (currently only the Gloom monarch set is available but it's level 20~23). And to my surprise, Keen haven't really given any feedback on this even though it's been a large discussion in the past 2+ years...

[obsidian rune]

Yea... The devs have no in game support for an unarmed build. You can, is just not in any way, shape, or form competitive as it's own build.

Ie. It bad

[cobalt bridge]

on the contrary, if the dmg wasn't that bad, I can say it's no worse than any daggers

[tired pagoda]

I think leaning into unarmed for anything more than Begone is going to lead to disappointment

[obsidian rune]

Sure, if it wasn't. But the damage is bad. And has been bad.

[tired pagoda]

That always kind of felt like the intention behind it, not to support a whole build around it

[cobalt bridge]

yes but we have an update since yesterday, including that talent, increasing unarmed dmg by 3x30% which means something. This is the main point of the whole discussion now.;.. ?!?||..,./

[steady crystal]

If I finish the mod to revert terror, does anyone else want it?

[obsidian rune]

I did used to run it with a head on my bar for the punch spot. Just so I could bap bosses. That was fun, especially in groups

[tired pagoda]

Yeah, I think begone and the new damage increase nodes for unarmed are meant to just boost functionality when you use Begone. Not to enable an entire play style. But that's just my interpretation

[steady crystal]

I don’t even know the use case for it. When something gets close, you want to get away

[cobalt bridge]

would be a very lame way to achieve this boost of functionality, wouldn't it? I don't think it's that shallow

[steady crystal]

And if you can’t, that’s what pairing is for

[tired pagoda]

You mean you want it "Begone!"

[steady crystal]

It doesn’t do that though

Locks you into an animation that takes as long to recover as it does, the enemy

[tired pagoda]

If unarmed had compatible numbers to a weapon build of any kind for just a few talent points I think that be incredibly problematic

[cobalt bridge]

these 3x30% are that high only because the unarmed doesn't have a proper base dmg as you would have with any actual weapon. That's why I said it should benefit from both Str and Int if you have allocated "Begone!" and using it

[steady crystal]

I think it’s far beyond a number problem. It doesn’t have any synergies.

[misty sedge]

Not true

Begone! can be animation cancelled

[tired pagoda]

Oh nice. That I didn't know

[misty sedge]

And even if it couldn't, I've never been locked into the animation as long as the enemy is stunned for

[steady crystal]

Well, I guess I go back to my didn’t test Bad skill statement

[cobalt bridge]

in practice - yes (that's the main problem, apparently). In theory - considering all of the descriptions and tooltips around the skill tree, what you said is totally wrong.

[tired pagoda]

I just don't see the layout of the game in its current state able to support it as a fully fleshed out style. Even keeping a space free on your bar, to me, feels like a weird interaction. Almost like a cost to use the skill

[obsidian rune]

Actually, a hybrid use case might be the new dagger circle Dodge. Bop stun, circle Dodge, backstab?

[cobalt bridge]

to me, clicking the mouse button to activate something on your action bar by default is wrong to start with

not the other way around.

[tired pagoda]

I definitely wouldn't want to mash my 1 key to attack animation, if that's the insinuation

[cobalt bridge]

no

what I said was that clicking the mouse while your selection is on some food or whatever shouldn't activate the food

but just and only attacks

in short: mouse shouldn't have anything to do with the action bar

you will just attack with the mouse as in any normal game

[obsidian rune]

They also seem to have changed the behavior that selecting a hotbar slot with number shortcuts doesn't 'attack ' on the second press. It's made wand switching a pita.

[cobalt bridge]

switching is one thing

switching is THE meaning of using the buttons

1, 2, 3.... etc.

but USING UP things with the mouse button is messed up

[pallid panther]

there is a setting in the option to change that behavior

[misty sedge]

Yeah this is how I fight bosses with Greatsword. I just Begone! > roll behind enemy > pop a few hits with GS > Begone! > repeat

[obsidian rune]

Hallelujah. Thank you for this info

[tired pagoda]

Yeah stuff like this is what I always figured it was for

[wild cypress]

Please bug report this. ♥️

[cobalt bridge]

🙄

[main dagger]

As interesting as the combat update has been, the player nerfs, at least to mage and ranger, are insufferable. Melee is still decent but only because of heavy attacks and new abilities. I don't mind the enemies doing more damage but them being so tanky that it makes ranges builds unviable was a huge miss by the devs.

A better patch would have buffed enemy damage and given them more move sets/attacks to make combat more of a challenge whilst retaining the players ability to put them down quickly; a system where enemies can be taken down quickly but they can also take the player down quickly.

Overall, I feel like this game just needs to decide if it wants to have soulslike combat or not and commit to that choice.

[solid star]

In mage armor i take like three times more dmg than in melee armor, while doing less dmg at the same time, but this is the case since before the update. There needs to be some balancing done to what feels like everything

[wild cypress]

And in 2 of the new videos they have promised a Mage overhaul is coming including new spells. I'll be play testing my Mage today, but understand we're in the "growing pains" stage for Mage right now, just stay strong. With armor and rings fully upgraded Mages still have some strength and with the buff to wand reach and wand Focus attack added we can see hints of where it will be going. In the meantime we are just gonna have to get even better at the Don't Get Hit game lol. ♥️🍀

[solid star]

Yea, Update is just out, lets See what the devs have done in a week

But talking about these Things is important

[unkempt ivy]

Wait, can I bind Begone! To a key that will auto unequiped my weapon and also do the animation in one press???

[gleaming musk]

Don't think so. People have been asking for weapon sheathing mechanics for a bit now in part for that reason. At least now there's a setting to not auto-fill the hotbar

[unkempt ivy]

Oh okay, gotcha. I didn't find it that bad just putting some stone in the prefer hotbar slot

But I honestly keep forgetting to use it lol

[gleaming musk]

Yeah, as a pure mage the only times I've used it was by accident when planting crops

[wild cypress]

So real.

[gleaming musk]

Imo it needs a ranged projectile so mages have reason to use it. Nothing else in the mage kit requires such close quarters fighting. Instead, mages are heavily incentivized to stay out of that range

Also needs to scale off of Int somehow. Either for damage or for stun generation

[celest girder]

Anyone rocking RF atm? How dose it feel.

[obsidian rune]

I'd love to hear a short summary when you're done. I've somewhat adapted, but seem to be missing dps output. Considering I'm just overlooking something

I still stand on the wand reach being a lie. Projectiles still fizzle out just before hitting the fell Drake in the same exact spots.

[gleaming musk]

It isn't a lie. It's just not as long as it needs to be.

[gleaming musk]

The more significant buff was to projectile speed, and endlag time reduction.

[gleaming musk]

Think what you will. I've had plenty of time to try it out.

[wild cypress]

I know one downside is Fireball doesn't automatically get backstab damage anymore, the projectile itself has to hit the back, aoe doesn't count. 😩

[obsidian rune]

No test I've ran has shown any increased range. Id love to see one that proves otherwise.

[obsidian rune]

Thus far, hop casting light burst for the stun buildup. Into icebolt in the back has worked in small engagements. But on swarms in not sure what the answer is.

[gleaming musk]

You're not really missing much. Overall dps and survivability have taken a major hit.

However not all is bad:

• Wand-play has seen some pretty big improvements, though still need work
• You can now jump while casting spells
• Resin is way easier to acquire, which helps the early-game experience
• Fireball 1 radius increase, which again helps newbies
• Mana regen has been bumped up which lessens the Mana Leech necessity. Regen is still weaker than Leech though
• Heal Channel targeting has been fixed and now properly heals the caster when allies are nearby
• Water Balloons should now be usable to apply Soaked on enemies in combat. This change wasn't available until the full patch as far as I know

Wards also got nerfed overall, which is pretty sad/funny

[steady crystal]

true

[solid star]

Buff fireball pls

[obsidian rune]

Do water balloons apply soaked to the player first, or just wet? I've been using the big water jug thing and the currents gem.

[gleaming musk]

Water Balloons place water blocks, which behave the same as all other simulated water. The final version of the patch changed them to place a sphere of water instead of a disk (the prev implementation)

[obsidian rune]

Likely soaked first then. I'll stick to the big water jug as not to eat the fur in crafting

What gems are you running on your staff/ wands?

[unkempt ivy]

I hope they add something like a thunderstorm aoe spell to apply soaked to a targeted area, in the future 🤞🤞

[gleaming musk]

The important part of the Water Ballon change is that it should theoretically let you apply Soaked to enemies directly and not have to bother with Wet & Gem of Currents on yourself.

[unkempt ivy]

Throwing water balloons before casting sounds really odd. I haven't even tried it yet though

[gleaming musk]

Previously you could directly apply Soaked to enemies with them, but it took multiple thrown in rapid-fire and only worked on smaller enemies

[obsidian rune]

I've got, currents on the staff. Which has been pretty useful for keeping the ice / shock debuff rolling.

Curious way of doing it. Sounds like that burns a lot of fur patches

[gleaming musk]

Gem of Soul Reaping on everything except my cold and shock wands, where I use Currents. If Water Ballons let me reliably apply Soaked to any enemy, I'm fully changing over to Soul Reaping.

No reason to suffer Soaked/Wet stamina penalties when I already cant invest much in Endurance. Though its nice they added stam regen to Candied Ginger

[obsidian rune]

I run that on one wand, and was considering doing the same. Currently, mania on fire wand. Skulls on ice, and currents on shock. Currents on staff means wide application, and doubled on wand to keep the debuff rolling if I have single target time.

[quaint gyro]

so what's the overall concensus so far on builds? I'm reading mage / archer aren't that great? Is melee the way to go now?

[unkempt ivy]

How much does being Soaked actually increase your dmg on a mob?

[obsidian rune]

30% negative resistance according to the tool tip

[gleaming musk]

Soul Reaping honestly needs a nerf. It heals bonkers amounts. Even if it were lower it would still be good, though. Especially if the devs fix the flasks' targeting for spells like Lightning Channel, and Necromancy's spell OHKO spawning bug

[pliant sigil]

Melee is still good, maybe not as good, but it didn't take as much of a hit

[obsidian rune]

I really want to like lightning channel. But it's just so low damage, and keeps getting interrupted by any tap

[gleaming musk]

being soaked doesn't do anything for you against a mob, unless you're using Gem of Currents. A creature who is soaked takes heavy max stam and stam regen penalties, -30% resistance to cold and shock, and +30% resistance to fire

[tawdry meteor]

Not really seeing why people think Archer got worse tbh, just hit your skill shots and it's arguably better than before imo, I think the normal crit nonskillshot bit is struggling though

[obsidian rune]

This, I just keep myself enmoistened so the currents gem applies soaked to anything I hit.

[tired pagoda]

Enmoistened

[gleaming musk]

Lightning Channel is bad on its own, but becomes the best CC & healing spell in the game by a very wide margin with Terror, Bloodletting, and Good Metabolism. That's including the nerfs to Terror & Bloodletting. Can also take it further with Frost, though that was slightly nerfed too

[tawdry meteor]

Boat update when lol?

[tired pagoda]

Enshrouded? Hasnt gotten that far yet. I'd say it's more enmoistened

[tawdry meteor]

I wish there were more summon based spells, even if it's just beefy low dmg minions that distract enemies for you

[obsidian rune]

Healing hasnt been my issue so far, I need more dps.

[gleaming musk]

It's not just healing, though. It's also the best CC spell. And it's shock damage, so you can leverage Soaked.

[steady crystal]

Anyone know anything about the scaling of the skulls summoned from Necromancer? It is so hard to test

[wild cypress]

Boat parade! Boat parade! Boat parade! Boat parade!

[gleaming musk]

They spawn at your player level.

[tired pagoda]

I think actual honest to goodness summons that scale well and can even just largely tank would do wonders for a lot of mage concerns on survivability

[steady crystal]

but what does that mean. I feel like at low levels they can solo when enough spawn and at high levels, well poof da gone

[gleaming musk]

One of the reasons I use Soul Reaping is that the flasks can also spawn skulls.

[obsidian rune]

A lot of mage survivability would be addressed if anything more than 3 paces from you didn't spam lunge attacks.

[tired pagoda]

Yeah that makes a lot of sense

[tawdry meteor]

Same lol, I don't really play mage build but it feels weird that you can't summon the Vukah as a spirit to soak damage or something like that, and that it's locked only behind beastmaster tree

[gleaming musk]

It means they're at a higher level for their stat block. I don't know that anyone has tried to datamine their stats.

Also, at higher levels you're gonna be spawning many more of them.

[tired pagoda]

Are they still doing it now? Didn't melee builds on the player side kind of lose their lunge capability? I would have figured that would follow suit for enemies

[steady crystal]

I have not used skulls in a bit, I like the Heal channel death rez trick, so did not get to use them last patch

[tawdry meteor]

I haven't been lunged by an enemy since the update so I believe so

Sans a very poorly failed stab from a spear dude

[obsidian rune]

In all my play time yesterday they were just as lunge-y. Especially the shroud guys with the 2h swords, drak, and red hollow Hall guys.

[tawdry meteor]

Oh maybe I was just fighting the wrong stuff yesterday

[tired pagoda]

Well that sucks. Kind of a big feels bad if melee builds lost the auto lunge on attacks but monsters kept it

[quaint gyro]

can't decide if i want to go 2h sword or still try out archer, reading up on the changes 🙁

[tawdry meteor]

Little bit, encourages either sword and board or big two handed a bit more

Very rough for daggers though

[steady crystal]

I noticed fell soldiers are rooted when they swing. They are not homing missiles any more. Don't know about the rest.

[gleaming musk]

You could always just go archer but hang on to 2h swords you find rather than scrapping them, just in case. Respeccing is cheap and fast.

[obsidian rune]

I've not seen much feedback from rangers or daggers people. But the very limited sample size were not happy.

Maybe they just haven't found the good build yet

[unkempt ivy]

Have the gems of necromancy not been fixed yet?

[tawdry meteor]

As someone running archer after the changes, if you can hit your skill shots consistently it's still really good

[gleaming musk]

Fixed how?

I never personally used them

One was incompatible with mages and the other whiffs too much

[tawdry meteor]

Like 2 shot pretty much anything at your level even with a pretty meh bow, maybe even oneshot if it crits

Not sure for bosses yet but I easily outdamage my mage buddy so Im assuming it's still solid for them too

[unkempt ivy]

I thought they werent spawn mobs at all

[obsidian rune]

Mages in shambles

[steady crystal]

Can we make a thread here a keep track of the mage combat playstyle optimalizations at different Settings?

I think I am full back on Necro, and still iffy about terror.

[gleaming musk]

From discussions with other players before this patch, they were spawning things just fine

[tawdry meteor]

Kinda, I also tend to out damage my melee buddy who went full damage, but Im more squishy

[obsidian rune]

Hollow buddy always seemed to work. Just not the on merciless kill Gem. (For mages)

[gleaming musk]

That'd be because wands can't perform Merciless Attacks at all

[tawdry meteor]

Probably helps that Im more used to challenging things well above my level though, and Im not sure about maxed out trees yet

[steady crystal]

lucky your buddy had a off build, 2 handed mace or axe build are monsters with 1k swings and 2k crits. and they don't need your healing they have their own and it is better

[obsidian rune]

The 'bug' seemed to be it states, if one is not active. Can spawn. When in practice what I saw was, just keep spawning them regardless if one was active or not.

[unkempt ivy]

So did they do a good job of tanking for you???

[tawdry meteor]

Yeah Im assuming it may just be us not having a ton of skill pts tbh

[gleaming musk]

That, I do not know. As far as I am aware no gems were touched in this update, which is a shame.

I really want the soul flask targeting and Necromancer spell OHKO bugs fixed. If they were, mages would want Soul Reaping even if the healing amount was heavily nerfed.

2x skulls to draw aggro would help a ton

[steady crystal]

I was excited to try Stelth mage, But LOL skill points rework stoped that dead. Skills cost to dam much. I can't match my old build let alone expand it.

[gleaming musk]

Stealth mage still isn't really supported tbqh

And not just by skill point restrictions

[obsidian rune]

I still need the lightning crown and Thundersnow ring.

[gleaming musk]

If anything, the nerfs to backstab damage and AoE backstab made stealth mage even less viable

[tawdry meteor]

That and I still haven't found a good ring or bow with the new update yet, if I can find more skill shot dmg increase I think I could begin to hit for big aoe skill shot damage with bomb arrows

[obsidian rune]

Ya this hurt a ton for artillery strikes

[steady crystal]

Well, it never is in most games. but still works on the principle that opening with a long casting OP spell that is hard to cast is made viable when you do it from stelth.

I jsut want Shroud meter to work dam it

[gleaming musk]

I am aware, yes. That's also assuming such a spell exists.

[obsidian rune]

Ya I can't think of one that fits this description.

[tawdry meteor]

Closest would be a spell to set up a combo, but I don't think that's what you intend with that

[gleaming musk]

The only spells in Enshrouded that do heavy DPS extremely quickly are Bone Channel 2 and Shroud Beam Channel, but both have short cast times and hinge more on making space in open combat.

[obsidian rune]

Bone channel has been my secret weapon for a couple patches now. Shhhh.

[gleaming musk]

Fireball does too, but its more AoE focused and balanced for DPS across repeated casts

[gleaming musk]

Not really a secret lmao. It's well known that it shreds (assuming the hits register ffs)

That's kinda its main job

[obsidian rune]

Was hoping shock wisp would take over the spot. But the crafting is horrendous

[steady crystal]

Oh I shroud depot the nerve 100% no shame.

[obsidian rune]

I'll also never touch shroud beam again, because that fecking hour, uncleanseable debuff

[steady crystal]

Try it with shroud Filter.

[gleaming musk]

It's also not all that great to begin with tbh

[gleaming musk]

Shroud Filter was heavily nerfed fyi

[obsidian rune]

When they had the trailer and I saw the blue beam I was so hype. Ray of Frost?! Please?! No... Self debuff beam instead. Great sadness.

[gleaming musk]

Still worth taking, but no longer trivializes the Shroud

[gleaming musk]

Shroud Beam Channel is better balanced than the meteor. It's the highest DPS spell in the game by a pretty wide margin. Also by the time you get it, your Shroud Timer isnt really all that low and you probably have Shroud Filter

[obsidian rune]

And all the shroud creatures are of course immune to it.

[gleaming musk]

Though I did make a feedback writeup for de-janking the Shroud mechanics as a whole. Hopefully some of it gets listened to

[gleaming musk]

Yeah. For them, just use Bone Channel 2

[obsidian rune]

I need jocat's just fireball meme to be, just bone channel.

[elfin beacon]

I like fireball because I can just throw it out at a group of enemies and hit them all. A few casts of that and everything is dead.

[obsidian rune]

I mean with the fire gloves and burning light ring. Maybe giving up the currents gem and just fireball spam is the way to go. It puts me at 5/3 arsonist

[frosty sentinel]

Ring of Rapacity + Elder/Crafted Gloves puts you at 90% casting reduction for Fireball. So as much as the damage is nice the cast speed is a game changer.

[gleaming musk]

Sadly, most players don't look past "gotta see big numbers".

[obsidian rune]

It's just hard to give up the flame gauntlets

[gleaming musk]

Often players forget that usability impacts DPS just as much as damage stats do

[frosty sentinel]

It's all situational though too I suppose, if you're sniping from ranged safety and just want to explode things then stack damage. If you're getting swarmed or roaming around then it's probable faster fireballs, triggering (albeit nerfed) more Terror's quickly...

It's nice to have real options either way I'd say. Limited as they are but it's more than we've had before.

[gleaming musk]

Even if you're sniping from ranged safety, casting speed and general spell damage buffs also impact Ice Bolt and Shroud Beam Channel, and not just Fireball.

[frosty sentinel]

Sure, but if you're close to one-shotting things then the extra cast speed potentially matters a little less.

[steady crystal]

90% casting speed is not a 90% reduction to the cast of fire ball, only the the charger up time, the casting animation is not changed and makes up the bulk of the cast time for short cast time spells.

[frosty sentinel]

But I do agree, I'm gonna be hard pressed to take the cast speed off now I've had it.

[gleaming musk]

If the tiny bump in damage reduces H2K, then sure. If not, you're better off going with more generally-applicable effects atm

[gleaming musk]

Nobody said otherwise. Reducing the casting speed is what mostly matters for firing off the spell.

But reducing that time also has the effect of increasing dps, which helps offset the loss in raw damage stats.

[steady crystal]

ok my bad, I though people where saying it as a massive DPS increase. which is not true. it is a modest one. but the casting animation is a bigger role.

[steady crystal]

the casting animation is about 2 seconds. Fire ball's casting time is 2 seconds, 1.1 second with 45% talents. so 3.1 seconds between spell cast. 90% casting speed, makes it 2.2 seconds btween cast.

29% DPS increase IF we have perfect target acquisition and the space to keep casting.

I may record the casting and count frames later

[gleaming musk]

And if you don't have perfect target acquisition or spacing, casting speed increases in value, whereas focusing on burst damage worsens.

[steady crystal]

explain,

you mean needing to react fast?

[gleaming musk]

What about that do you not understand?

With poor spacing, you have a smaller time window to fire off your spell. With poor accuracy, quantity will result in a more stable average DPS.

Casting time emphasis is more tolerant of suboptimal conditions than burst emphasis, just like in every other game.

[steady crystal]

When i was talking about Target acquisition and spacing I mean

Target acquisition, IF you are standing there with the spell ready at 2.2 seconds, and nothing to shoot at yet until 4 seconds, casting time is not a realized, DPS increase.

Spacing, is you being able to cast 2 or more spells before the enemy force you to move. if It takes 4.4 seconds to cast 2 times, but you have to move every 4 seconds, there is not realized DPS,

You seem to be responding to accuracy. We where talking past each other not disagreeing on one topic.

[steady crystal]

I agree.

[gleaming musk]

Target acquisition, IF you are standing there with the spell ready at 2.2 seconds, and nothing to shoot at yet until 4 seconds, casting time is not a realized. DPS increase.

This is a meaningless comparison metric. Not only does it not reflect actual gameplay, it intentionally leaves out one of the two sides' contributions entirely.

Spacing, is you being able to cast 2 or more spells before the enemy force you to move. if It takes 4.4 secnods to cast 2 times, but you have to move every 4 seconds, there is not relized DPS,

This is also a meaningless comparison metric, because it again does not reflect actual gameplay. It ignores a major factor that casting speed has on combat by assuming a total number of castings regardless of distance.

[dense cliff]

Is magic finally fixed?

[gleaming musk]

In some areas, yes. In most areas, it's been made worse.

[dense cliff]

I had issues in the last patch with magic hits not registering.
AoE spells no problem, but something like Bone Channel and 9 out of 10 spells would not hit. And its inconsistent too, sometimes it works just fine and the other time it does nothing.

[gleaming musk]

My response was assuming you were making good-faith comparisons that modeled actual gameplay.

[dense cliff]

btw is there any special attack for mage staff now?

[wild cypress]

No, but based on the recent changes it seems very likely it will happen with the upcoming Mage changes devs talked about in videos. They already promised new spells. :)

[warm bison]

whats the max level for all attributes now? i can only find 23 constitution in the skill tree

[frosty sentinel]

I believe 23 is the max for all before food buffs.

[warm bison]

ok cool, thanks!

[frosty sentinel]

(I have all Spirit and Int nodes and both are 23, just to say I havent counted everything 🙂 )

[main dagger]

Just set enemy health to 50%, increased attack frequency to 400%, and set multiple attackers to very hard. Holy shit the experience is so vastly improved. This should be the default of the game.

[wild cypress]

One of the best parts of this game is that you and I can pay the same price and play very different versions of Enshrouded. It's part of why I can't take too seriously the people who say the game is "unplayable" for combat changes or buff changes.

[finite nimbus]

Just lost a TON of materials to the new special move mechanic. Was trying to deposit stuff after returning from a trip (R to stack like materials) and accidently hit R outside of the inventory menu with my axe equipped. It destroyed all my nearby containers. NOT HAPPY

[gleaming musk]

F

Rebind the key

[steady crystal]

I agree, until your friend ask you to play. Then you have to play the same settings and the class disparities are a problem.

[finite nimbus]

Gonna have to, but I already lost so much I don't even want to play anymore for now. So much time and effort lost in an instant

[steady crystal]

mood

[wild cypress]

Yikes. Glad Shroud Depot exists but it's on us to be aware of what we're pressing. Still, sorry that happened. :(

[tawdry meteor]

Eh, as someone playing with a couple people all of different "classes", its really not noticeable unless you try to be an all rounder and that tends to go poorly in a group of people anyways from the bits I've seen so far. Unless it's beastmaster, that one kinda just sucks completely from what I've seen

[steady crystal]

your feelings are valid, the lack of a warning to players, like they did with redoing you skill tree is an oversite.

[gleaming musk]

Ngl, I wish we couldn't accidentally break decorations we place in our own bases. Can't ever think of a time I wanted to do that.

Also my ADD partner once got trigger happy and started firing explosive arrows at a friend of ours, destroying a nice dirt road + fencing I had just finished blending into the environment so it looked natural. Made him fix it (which he did poorly) 🥲

[austere hornet]

Try reloading one of the earlier saves. There are 9 right, every four minutes or so....

[gleaming musk]

So I'd personally also prefer if environment destructing effects like bombs didnt destroy blocks in bases too

[wild cypress]

But the patch notes did "warn" players about new functions and the need to check keybinds.

[wild cypress]

If all you're going to do is complain, neg and contradict people why don't you find another space to occupy?

[limpid rivet]

So how is 2H vs 1H vs Bow performing with the combat changes?

[wild cypress]

I hear people saying bow is a touch weaker but my experience has been the opposite. I use daggers 80% of the time, not 1h or 2h so I can't speak to that and defer to the experts.

[finite nimbus]

How?

[tawdry meteor]

If you consistently hit skillshots, Im pretty sure the bow was technically buffed, if not, bow was kinda nerfed for a lot of people ig

Two handed seems better assuming you keep good lifesteal up

One handed is kinda the same but less enemy gap closure on the player's side, which sucks but you have a shield for a reason ig

[austere hornet]

uh oh. a technical question that is beyond me....there is an index file in your saved files, that says which of the 9 saves to 'point to' and you can change that number to one before the boxes were destroyed. There is a you tube video on it.

[wild cypress]

Type /saves

Further help can be had in #troubleshooting for technical assistance. ❤️ 🍀

[austere hornet]

or just do what @wild cypress says -- better recommendation! 🙂

[tawdry meteor]

Also the special moves are kinda just an improvement all round for all 3 of those imo, especially bow

[wild cypress]

Kelinyx with Dagger Special Attack.

[tawdry meteor]

Exactly

Bow special attack is insane when it crits and you hit a backstab+skillshot

[wild cypress]

It's so juicyyyyy!

[tawdry meteor]

Frfr, it pops off some insane numbers

Not sure if it pierces or not yet, but Im kinda hoping it does

[gleaming musk]

Vogan (my mage) with wand special
https://tenor.com/view/dart-miss-target-fail-gif-17198928

Especially against the Fell Wyrmling lmao

[finite nimbus]

Update: Thank you!

[wild cypress]

Cici FTW. Glad it worked, big dog.

[finite nimbus]

Yes they did. They also changed the bind for how you stack materials in chests. I was trying to give the new binds a chance and see how they fare. Not liking they gave the special move the same bind as stacking in inventory. Definitely changing that. Probably not the best design choice on their part either. 🤷‍♂️

[wild cypress]

I completely agree. New binds should be on unused keys. I am sorry it happened, man, and it's probably worth a feedback report.

[limpid rivet]

I see claims that "Greatswords" are king now, even over bows. Anyone experienced this?

[tawdry meteor]

I think in terms of survival this is true, in terms of raw damage it's really just can you hit your skillshot consistently

[limpid rivet]

Yah the Greatsword rework with the adjusted tree and leech appears to be pretty nuts.

I'm debating with my new game whether or not to start 2H or Bow.

[delicate eagle]

Is it worth starting over?

[tawdry meteor]

Personally I output more damage than my buddy with his damage focused greatsword build, but we're only midgame so idk about endgame and fully optimized builds yet

I use a bow from really far away and tend to just oneshot things that aren't bosses or elites though, even a couple levels above me

[limpid rivet]

Yah I think I'll do bow again. Oh, have any of the online skilltrees updated? Also, are you going towards the traditional exploding support zappy/wet endgame build, or mana/ice arrows?

[wild cypress]

Skill Tree site not updated yet that I know of. :(

[tawdry meteor]

I haven't looked at any of the online stuff, I maximized crit damage, crit chance, backstab damage, and skillshot damage along with dex so far

Basically just pushing my single target damage to the absolute maximum

[wise karma]

Please change how much the I frame zoom out. I am constant being blinded by vegation and other stuff around when the frames zoom out so much. I like the new fighting but do NOT like the zoom out stuff.

[tawdry meteor]

My biggest issue rn is finding a ring that increases one of those damages by a decent chunk

Preferably skillshot

[wild cypress]

You can set to old camera behavior, I think it's under accessibility?

[finite birch]

I cannot figure out how to rebind this on controller either.

[delicate eagle]

How fast is leveling now?

[wild cypress]

https://tenor.com/view/talking-heads-once-in-a-lifetime-david-byrne-same-as-it-ever-was-new-wave-gif-17711755

[wild cypress]

They actually made the first few levels a little faster though, to help new players.

[delicate eagle]

What is shared in a world, progress wise, for new toons?

[steady crystal]

As fast as you want it, there is a slider for that

In my opinion, you tend to out level areas baseline, which is exciting in the early part of the game but stale in the mid game when you’re a little overturned. But I haven’t finished leveling on this patch so take that with a grain of salt.

[tawdry meteor]

This is true, can be accounted for by being a goober like me and purposely chilling out in places well above your level

[delicate eagle]

But with a new toon do I have to get all the Wells and Roots again?

In the same world I mean

[steady crystal]

Yes

[delicate eagle]

Gotcha. I just wanted to stop respeccing overall and just have dedicated toons for classes

Since we don't have loadouts as is

[steady crystal]

I’m not sure how questing is tho. I have not brought a new character into an existing world. I’ve always made a new character for a new world.

[delicate eagle]

Will test later, not on my pc, sadly at work

[steady crystal]

I suspect you might get bombarded with quest, but I think you can still place through each of them

I know they changed it a while back and it was a change for the better.

[tawdry meteor]

It's not too bad tbh

[delicate eagle]

I don't remember if gear is level locked

[steady crystal]

It is not. So if that’s fun for you, you can do it.

And there’s always shroud depot if that’s your thing

[delicate eagle]

I am fine with using higher level stuff to level fast honestly, I have done the grind, it is just not in the mood to switch loadouts

I have done archer and mage so far, need to channel my Unga Bunga at some point

[steady crystal]

In that case, I would recommend experience scrolls from a resource world.

You play how you want, but I would recommend trying to tune in the difficulty settings to something that’s fun and try enjoying the lower levels.

[delicate eagle]

Probably will do a mixture of stuff

[tawdry meteor]

Would definitely reccomend endurance and a lot of the guardian tree at low levels, purely because before lifeleech melee can be very rough

[steady crystal]

I like reduced EXP settings because I feel like I actually need to go out and explore places and clear them to advance . It also saves you from the trouble of not being able to find equipment you want if you enjoy optimizing . Lower leveling speed means more time in an area opening chest naturally, rather than feeling like a grinding task.
For me playing with half combat XP, 75% quest, XP and zero mining XP feels like the sweet spot.

[tawdry meteor]

Oh I don't pay attention to levels tbh (they don't really mean much imo?), I tend to explore places 10+ levels above me and shoot things to oblivion with my bow

Like they exist and I recognize that theyre a reccomended difficulty level, but I tend to ignore them

[desert fable]

explosive arrows + multishot = ez mode

[delicate eagle]

I play ARPGs. I know I am supposed to start the game by killing a few goats and eventually be powerful enough to kill gods.

[tawdry meteor]

I don't use aoe, I just skillshot until things are gone

If I die, I didn't maneuver well enough

If I didn't die, I know how to counter that enemy type

[delicate eagle]

EXPLOSIONS!?!

[desert fable]

multishot is skillshot because its linear

[delicate eagle]

https://tenor.com/view/syllabels-apologize-borderlands-mrtorgue-torgue-gif-26797226

[glass ferry]

How are you guys feeling about the new skill tree so far?

[tawdry meteor]

I just don't tend to take it, not really worth the arrow expense when it tends to not hit from the distance I shoot from

[desert fable]

they nerfed updraft which is only L imo

[steady crystal]

I was very excited and then that deflated mostly around point cost and blue skills

[tawdry meteor]

Biggest issue I have is the enemy health reset if youre too far away

I tend to be too far away😮‍💨

[delicate eagle]

Updraft is the biggest L imho. Some stuff is nitpicking but over all good changes, feedback is needed

[glass ferry]

Does it feel like you don't have enough points anymore?

[tawdry meteor]

I don't mind the updraft one since it works as intended now, but it's definitely a bit rough and I think they should add a better way to get around with it gone

[steady crystal]

That’s precisely it. I’m not quite able to replicate what I had before. And some of the new blue talents feel gated behind spirit, which isn’t feeling attractive, particularly the staff damage.

[steady crystal]

On the upside, I am liking the concept of the new skill tree just not the implementation

[tawdry meteor]

It feels like specializing is more forced and party play is encouraged further

[steady crystal]

I really like being able to skip past talents, and I really like be gone has been sequestered away

[glass ferry]

Yeah, I've seen a lot of people not happy with the updraft changes. The team is aware of it. My understanding is that the changes were to address how powerful the skill could be when abused to cheese combat encounters (it was the best escape in the game), so the changes were an attempt to nerf that while maintaining its identity as a traversal skill

[delicate eagle]

Staff damage and overall feel is still not great. But I think it is more so animation lock than anything else

[golden gyro]

does anyone else feel like making epic fishing bait is a waste of time? finally starting to fish in the game and feel like the wiki's % for each fish is way off for the different baits. also trying to find out if its worth it to speck into fishing at all once you get good rod

[steady crystal]

Yeah, if casting speed also sped up the casting animation things would be really different

[tawdry meteor]

Cast time should reduce animation time

Also a skill to increase bow charge speed could be nice

Unless that already exists and I missed it, entirely possible

[delicate eagle]

Ohh I 100% understand and agree with that sentiment, but it feels like weight is part of the animation overall and investment on it feels detrimental for a somewhat needed skill

[glass ferry]

Did animation lock for staffs change with this update? I didn't think it did

[desert fable]

not a logistical approach imo. nerfing is never gonna receive a favorable response in a pve game. especially when its not a game breaking exxploit but more so a QOL/get outta jail free card

[steady crystal]

I understand why cast time doesn’t reduce the animation. I’ve overly sped up. Animation doesn’t look good.. I wish the animation was faster with casting times being linked to compensate.

[delicate eagle]

I think it is a combination of how lock on animation is now and staff cast animation is

[hushed sierra]

combining skills in stages great, visually much better, new layout is ok, capability to partially take a skill and go further is neat, resistance skills are still useless junk, mage nerfs are terrible and the new mage skills costs are just disgusting

[steady crystal]

No, it did not, but casting speed is featured on a lot of items and that stat fills devalued next to the casting animation

[delicate eagle]

Wands feel great in comparison, despite the low damage

[glass ferry]

People say "devs should never nerf in a pve game" all the time but that's just... not a very logical stance if I'm being honest. Not to say player feelings aren't valid when something they like gets nerfed, but there are definitely moments when nerfs are appropriate for the long-term health of a game, especially when it's in early access.

[delicate eagle]

Added with a somewhat situational heavy attack

[steady crystal]

Yes, wands are much improved.

[tawdry meteor]

Definitely a fan of the wand changes personally, even if I don't use them often

[delicate eagle]

I feel wands are at the moment a very good grouping side weapon if you are willing to not use the special on your main weapon

[tawdry meteor]

Multishot feels like it shouldn't spread and instead should be a second/third arrow following the exact same path as the first, might just be a me thing

[glass ferry]

Ah, yeah. The general clunkiness of mage is something the team wants to address in the future I know, we have mage reworks planned for future updates, we didn't really have the dev time for them to make it in for .8, though, beyond basic balance changes

[golden gyro]

i like multishot spread due to if you shoot 2/3 arrows in real life at the same time they all have a slightly different trajectory

[delicate eagle]

I do feel biggest gripe for spells and arrows is not having dedicated bag for them, inventory slots are at a premium and I do like the concept of spells having a cost, that eventually can be eliminated. I also want other element arrows

[tawdry meteor]

Its not bad, just feels clunky is all, feels like it should be called spreadshot instead iykwim, might just be me thinking about it as more of a one arrow after the other thing though

Like a rapid shot ig?

[steady crystal]

About Nerf and PVE, here it is a lack equivalent gameplay to compensate. Specifically terror. A loss of crowd control without the spell rework to give new crowd control . It’s a difficult spot chain stunning all the time isn’t fun eventually. But this is way too far in the other direction.. we play staff builds the cast spells and we can’t do that with a sword in our face

[wild cypress]

As a Dagger Enjoyer with bow backup
Overall I feel slightly more potent as a backstabber but not a sneaker and I am happy after about 10 hours of testing yesterday. To be specific now...

• It's cool that clothes buff your Sneak speed
• It's very cool that Sneak Damage can go higher than ever before, feels very satisfying to land
• It's cool we can make and place traps (though I think that's gonna benefit bow and spell users more than melee users)
• It's cool grenades got a small buff
• I feel like I have to "waste" fewer points getting to things I personally love and still have a few points left over to get "for fun" things like Kick
• Appreciate more clarity on all the tooltips, wonderful work there
  --
• Sneaking as a playstyle still isn't quite there, since we can't use it on flying mobs and several major bosses, and we have no ways to alter how easily we're perceived
• Grenade damage buff is cool but the ingredient costs are still so high as to not make it a playstyle, which diminishes the value of spending points on it at least for a player like me
• Explosive Arrow buffs are cool but again, making them is very grindy
  --
• I wish for something to enhance my sneak; invisibility/reduced visibility potion, stationary smoke screens, a formal distraction/noise maker throwable
• Would love a Confusion/Frenzy type grenade to make mobs fight each other
• Bows deserve ranged sneak attacks, though the Force attack is pretty yummy and a decent enough alternative
• Would love to see poison specialization going deeper (poison grenades and poison leg traps plz) and temporary crit chance buffs
• Still wishing for tree and wall climbing, even if slow
• Would love fuse/timer on grenades so I can do more rogue/ninja style traps - or tripwires!!

[golden gyro]

i would love to have a quiver style inventory

[spark wagon]

In my head I'm always comparing this to No Mans Skys MeleeAttack-Jetpack boost (which yes, is just a "bug" but they kept it in since 2016) and Crimson Deserts high velocity speed flying glitch which they turned into a skill to obtain instead of removing it.

And I'm just kind of sitting here and going... why change it tho? Why limit player freedom instead of working with it? Someone wants to boost up a mountain or skip a combat encounter? Well, make it worthwhile to actually do that encounter (hide a chest or other goodies there or something), player wants to boost up the side of a mountain instead of following the road up? Well, hide goodies along the way they don't wanna miss... that sorta stuff goes through my head..

[golden gyro]

i get what you mean, i think its a little harder with the combat style requiring charge times and it would overlap with that for those who try to do the timing game for it all

[delicate eagle]

I do like the new UI for ammo when ADS. So it is the realm of possibility for a dedicated bag for it

[tawdry meteor]

Ig that's fair, maybe a separate skill where you can only choose one or the other would be appropriate there. I tend to snipe things from over 50m away so multishot as is just feels wasteful personally

Actually most of the time it's closer to 100m, but that may just be a flaw in playstyle ig

[cunning mural]

Sneaking as a playstyle still isn't quite there, since we can't use it on flying mobs and several major bosses, and we have no ways to alter how easily we're perceived
just wear camouflage #creative-corner message

[tawdry meteor]

Being able to grapple sneak attack would be cool

[golden gyro]

i get that as well

[delicate eagle]

I would agree that certainly we need more big payoff skills that are either one or the other: like Snipe vs Multishoot since it can increase game styles overall

[tawdry meteor]

Like it costs stamina like the one grapple skill, but it allows you to sneak attack if you have the sneak attack skill

[cunning mural]

I would love an un-armed sneak attack, let me snap their necks MGS style

[tawdry meteor]

I meant grappling hook but that'd be cool too lol

[delicate eagle]

You wouldn't suplex a Train?

[cunning mural]

https://tenor.com/qy7OjgqwmR9.gif

I'll try

[hushed sierra]

Does anyone know which new staff 45+ lvl has Mana Leech? They removed it from the one I used before 🙁 None in my current collection has it.
And maybe where it drops if it's not completely random?

[delicate eagle]

https://tenor.com/view/sabin-phantom-train-suplex-baronduki-cyan-gif-15271154236652633458

[cunning mural]

amazing

[delicate eagle]

Not to my knowledge, but there is more Mana regen options in the skill tree

[glass ferry]

For the "why change it" question, the answer is that our past selves kinda put us in a bad position, honestly. When Enshrouded first released into early access, balance was all over the place, and it was pretty fundamentally broken in a lot of places. Armor (which we changed with this update) is a good example. That system was effectively bloat, most armors were poorly designed in such a way that the armor value was almost maxed out, meaning that mage sets would be giving you the exact same amount of damage mitigation as warrior sets (60%), despite having drastically different armor values.

To fix this, both to make armor more meaningful and to create more interesting class identity, we inevitably needed to nerf it in some way.

There are a lot of systems like this. The combat is somewhat subpar in our game, which we'd agree with, but in order to fix it, we need to fix the parts that are broken in order to create meaningful, well balanced combat.

We know nerfs feel bad, and we're not doing them because we "like nerfs" or anything, but it's sort of a situation where things need to get worse before they can get better. We need to bring the overpowered things to a reasonable level so that we can actually create a well-rounded combat and progression system where every part works together.

Updraft is another example of that, I think. I'm not a designer, but that's my understanding. Because it's a basic skill where at the simple press of a button, you can instantly escape any combat encounter in the game. If you're trying to balance things like enemy damage, health regen, healing items, etc. How exactly do you balance around a skill that's that insanely powerful? You honestly can't. We know updraft is a fun skill, and I don't think our designers want to make the game less fun, but I think it was throwing a wrench in the design of several other systems if it was left untouched.

[delicate eagle]

I am concerned that you know of The Brute Squad but not about FF6

[cunning mural]

I don't play turn-based RPGs :P

[delicate eagle]

I am of the believe that games like this have a vision, and most of the time, players tend to find the easy way around it. So "nerfs" are sadly needed because it can just show a side of the game that takes away the core of it

[north nest]

staff of the moor has 5% health/mana/stam leech (+8shroud dmg), oracle's everblue 10% mana leech (4mana regen and 8shroud dmg), and crystalwater staff has 10% mana leech (40manaregen and 4fire dmg); idk if there's a forced drop area for them

[spark wagon]

Fair enough and a good explanation, I'll take it.

Would've still preferred if y'all just like, disabled it in combat or something

[delicate eagle]

Inconceivable

[tawdry meteor]

To be fair, the previous usage of updraft wasn't even how the skill was worded anyways, now the skill description accurately describes what it does, sucks a little but definitely a good change overall

[cunning mural]

My biggest problem with Updraft nerf is... they didn't add the good thing to justify the change, they just made updraft worse potentially to add a good thing later
but right now like... the updraft changes have caused serious glitches and deaths in blackmire for me. turns out if you updraft when your character barely touches Tar? (Which I am encouraged to do cause I have to wait before updrafting now) it softlocks your game

[glass ferry]

Well that definitely sounds like an unintended bug and not part of the nerfs lol, what is the softlock you experience? And what do you mean by "barely touching"?

[cunning mural]

if you barely touch it, to the point your character doesn't *land" but got close enough they could've landed in a couple frames... when you updraft... this happens

[tawdry meteor]

Ngl I think most people's frustration with the nerf is purely from goofy bugs that seem like theyre intended

[glass ferry]

wacky waving inflatable flameborn bug

[steady crystal]

Try popping over to a resource world and looking at them

[glass ferry]

Thanks I'll see if QA can recreate this, really weird

looks like you might have gotten stuck in the wall or something?

[cunning mural]

that's just the animation of me "drowning" in tar, cause the animation doesn't actually make you go lower, it just makes the character look like they've gone lower

[tawdry meteor]

Can you access your map during that?

[cunning mural]

I am pretty sure I am standing on floor, but can't move and the thing bugged

[misty sedge]

For what it's worth, I think I had this happen last night while playing. I can see if I have a clip, if not I can probably recreate it

[tawdry meteor]

I assume not, but Im a bit curious

[cunning mural]

access the map, probably, teleport? glider is there thus I am "in the air" and can't warp

[tawdry meteor]

Oof

[meager swallow]

Hoping for a Grimoire item so Mage doesn't have to continue to eat it on inventory space.

[cunning mural]

I just had to return to menu and reload

[delicate eagle]

I want a Grimoire of spells offhand and a Quiver for the bow

[gleaming musk]

I definitely agree with this sentiment. As it was originally, Updraft was too strong.

That said, I still would rather it be a channeled effect gated by Mana with an "overheat" gauge that modifies its cost, instead of a hard timer and usage count. This would fix the "instantly Updraft away" issue without making it a full-on nerf. It would also enable it to scale in usefulness based on how long you're gliding.

In its new incarnation, it's really easy to accidentally use it earlier than you intend to and lose out on a lot of lift, or too late and accidentally landing instead.

[steady crystal]

After I finish this week of testing, I am modding terror back.

[delicate eagle]

The Grimoire+wand gives it access to staff spells with animation 🤣

[tawdry meteor]

Could be nice, or instead of just backpacks being neutral, you make a "mages medium pack" and "archer's medium pack" that sit in the backpack slot but have slots for ammo

Medium is just a size placeholder but you get the idea

[meager swallow]

No, I just want an item I can stuff my spells into so having a variety of spells doesn't eat a quarter of my bag space.

[tawdry meteor]

The warriors pack can hold health potions that are bound to a quick use keybind

[delicate eagle]

True.. but why stop there... When you can go .... PLUS ULTRA!

[glass ferry]

Yeah, I suspect we'll want to take another look at Updraft in the future, but we only just released the update and currently the team is focused on fixes and stuff, so I can't say for sure yet.

[tawdry meteor]

It would do this but also be a backpack at the same time with the same current space amounts and a separate extra space for ammunition

[dusk nexus]

Is there a link somewhere on how the skills on gear work? Does it raise the cap, does it give you a point and make the max 4/5/6? or does it just help you get up to 3?

[north nest]

raise cap

[tawdry meteor]

Basically not forcing them to make an extra armor slot

[delicate eagle]

Goes over the limit

[dusk nexus]

Odd, I can't seem to put a 4th point into something I have a +1 on

[tawdry meteor]

Because thats inconvenient asf and time consuming and makes the UI more messy

[misty sedge]

If you have the skill fully specced with an armor part that adds to it, it'll go to level 4. You can't add more skill points to it.

[tawdry meteor]

Also I don't want to do a convoluted quest to have ammo slots

[delicate eagle]

Clean UI mod incoming

[steady crystal]

Ah! They Nerf, my ability to heal my skulls! (I’m joking please don’t revert it)

[delicate eagle]

We found a dude that makes bags, end of quest

[meager swallow]

If we were JUST talking about numbers and playstyle it'd be one thing, but Mage also having to carry all of its abilities in its backpack ontop of everything else both the other playstyles carry on an adventure, makes every negative impacting change to Mage hurt even more.

When Mage was 'overpowered' it was paying for that power by having to farm for scrolls, mana pots, and carrying 2 whole inventory rows of spells. It was a big cost to be where they were, and now -- we kept all the negatives while being cut down at the knees.

[delicate eagle]

Mages are technically for rework in next big update

[dusk nexus]

Does it just increase it ONCE it's max then, or I assume you need a point in it? Cause I have +1 blood rage armor, and I don't proc blood rage. If I had a point in it would it be 1 skill point + 1 armor for a total of two, or do I need to max it out to get the armor bonus?

[steady crystal]

Which is great, but doesn’t fix today

[tawdry meteor]

I carry a row of things as an archer, but I think Im an outlier there

[tawdry meteor]

It's a free extra level

[meager swallow]

And everytime we get new spells -- that inventory tax gets bigger if we want to use them.

[north nest]

you need a point in it to have it

[tawdry meteor]

You dont pay for it, you just get the skill level from equipment

[steady crystal]

I don’t think I want new spells I want reworked spells.

[delicate eagle]

True. But game dev doesn't happen overnight and complaining about it not going to go anywhere if no feedback is given

[dusk nexus]

But a single point with a +1 would give me rank 2 then, or does it need to be maxed?

[north nest]

see it says "dormant" even though i have +2 to it

[wild cypress]

The armor adds its bonus as long as you wear it; there is no need to spend skill points. Wearing armor that buffs a Skill does not unlock it.

[dusk nexus]

Roger.

makes sense.

[delicate eagle]

Don't you have to unlock the skill still?

[north nest]

you do

[dusk nexus]

I just figured other people might have done all that testing and it didn't jump out to me at the start.

[meager swallow]

I've had this feedback on the books (Suggestions, here, surveys) for over a year now and it keeps going the opposite way.

:)

[delicate eagle]

(:

It be like that sometimes

[gleaming musk]

Yep, which is unfortunate and means players get pidgeonholed into wearing armor the devs intended for their build. Who needs diversity amirite

[steady crystal]

2 hand is OP again, better nerf mages

[delicate eagle]

Indeed

[steady crystal]

Apple is so far behind on voice recognition

[delicate eagle]

Back to explosive arrow and bows it be

[tawdry meteor]

I think it'd be interesting if you could make armor legendary with legendary runes whilst crafting, and could choose the skills it boosts in the process

Specifically for legendary crafted armor only though

And it'd cost a LOT of runes

[steady crystal]

Yes, if your build doesn’t include the skill point that’s on the armor for your current tier of play/class. You don’t benefit. It’s less choose how to play and more. Here’s how to play.

[delicate eagle]

We need a Tabula Rasa armor: you decide it's perks

[tawdry meteor]

And you'd still have to level it afterwards

[steady crystal]

You don’t have to. You just have to get that first point. but yeah, if it’s something worth taking.

[north nest]

he's talking about his hypothetical new armor system lol

[gleaming musk]

Realistically, unless the entire skill tree is perfectly balanced, this kind of armor set could easily become the best option for every build, which is also bad.

[north nest]

it'd just be the same as it was prior to update8 no? crafted armor was the best

[delicate eagle]

We do need more unique armor pieces overall

[north nest]

but we would have tons of build variety between players

[tawdry meteor]

Crafted armor should be the best, or we should at least have the ability to reroll skill options on looted legendary armor

Maybe make a new npc to unlock the ability to do so that's annoying to get to keep it fair and reasonable

"Mythic Armorer" or something like that

[gleaming musk]

Honestly, as much as customization is fun and etc, the first step should probably just be to not require a skill being unlocked in order to benefit from boosts to it from armor.

[steady crystal]

The zero armor that buffs terror is big feels bad. It feels very targeted.

And kind of think of it I haven’t spotted something that buff’s mass destruction either

[gleaming musk]

Because even with that, there's still the limitation that many skills arent useful to every build

[north nest]

circlet of lightning buffs terror, and i think a pair of legendary pants posted far above has it too

[gleaming musk]

As well as skills that are nice to have but not worth the skill points

[tawdry meteor]

Really any fire damage increase does this I think, maybe not on the desired scale though

[tawdry meteor]

Wild animals leaving us alone is the big one here

[glass ferry]

Oh also I just remembered I forgot to respond to this, but I appreciate the writeup. I shared it with the design team :)

[steady crystal]

I could see a number of skill points invested in a certain branch to be middle ground, but yes, I would much prefer it just being available

[tawdry meteor]

Not worth that entire tree unless you need dex/endurance, but it's incredibly convenient

[gleaming musk]

Weapon-repairing skills as well. And elemental defense skills

[tawdry meteor]

True

[wild cypress]

Thanks so much, it means a lot to get confirmation you heard and shared it. I worked real hard on my testing recently.

[steady crystal]

Has anyone took the elemental defense points On their build?

[small sluice]

Half of my skill points are now missing. Nice update.

[tawdry meteor]

On my guardian yeah, its convenient but probably not worth it for most

I just liked being tanky asf

[north nest]

id have to test dmg taken (wont do for this update) but given what toast said above i think maybe the armor changes made just wearing mage stuff make you super tanky to ele dmg

so the nodes for extra ele mitigation might just be superfluous for mage

i goofed around vs wolves and bandits at the northern camp and wolves would do like 500dmg while i could perma sustain the big bandit guy who dealt what i assume was fire dmg at medium range

[steady crystal]

I’ve always worn warrior chess pieces.

[wild cypress]

The patch notes explain this, please read them before negging our chat.

[north nest]

😮 +150% healing too good

(imo)

[steady crystal]

That’s not really necessary, policing other people’s opinions I mean

[gleaming musk]

Nope. Didn't before, and won't be doing so now that SP is even tighter. They're just too weak and infrequently relevant to buy.

Also means that my wards also now have less elemental defense too though, cause I didnt unlock the skills lol

[tawdry meteor]

Wish it would multiply with the one int healing skill

[north nest]

it does i think?

[tawdry meteor]

Unless it does and I misunderstood that skills

[north nest]

im in game rn i can check rq

[small sluice]

I have actually read them. They are still missing. But sure keep the passive aggressive style, it is very helpful. We can clearly see how everyone is happy with the patch.

[tawdry meteor]

I thought it was just spell healing

[gleaming musk]

Healing strength almost exclusively comes from armor, both before and after this patch. It also doesn't scale at all with your stats (outside of Water Aura).

This incongruous nature of healing strength is often discussed here

[gleaming musk]

It also multiplies Water Aura, yes.

[north nest]

it 100% works on water aura

[wild cypress]

If you're confused why a Skill tree rework altered some skills then reading might not be the same as understanding. 👍

[tawdry meteor]

Huh, didn't realize

Thats pretty useful ig, might go an int endurance build with that

Try to have stupid high tanking and self healing passively just to see how it works with the new stuff

[steady crystal]

He’s not confused he’s unhappy. And you know that.

[north nest]

ive pretty much done con int mage entire time playing, water aura is super feelsgoodman

[small sluice]

I understand the change. The total number of the skill points is incorrect. And excuse me who are you to say if I understand something correct? Did you even asked details about my problem? Ah yes, you didn't. Good job.

[steady crystal]

It’s a distraction. Make anyone with a complaint feel like they have to defend themselves . Give them enough rope so they sound hateful . Let’s just talk about the game.. which talent points took you back?

[wild cypress]

I spent six months helping people who ask questions in good faith and zero time respecting people who have entitled, hostile and insulting attitudes. This trend will continue.

[tawdry meteor]

Do we know if any armor skill buffs can make those skills even stronger? It'd be pretty cool to see how far you could push self healing

[north nest]

ive only seen healing+1 on boots so far, but im not really farming gear (just gonna wait until shroud depot updates before 1.0 release xD)

i am interested in maxing passive healing and/or lifeleech healing too tho 😄

[mortal hazel]

anyone else get the mega pull effect after using the one hand specialization ability? I can blink like an eon away.

[north nest]

there is water aura+1 on chest piece, but that just gives +5meters of range

[tawdry meteor]

A full set of legendary armor with only healing +1's on it would be insane

[north nest]

haha yeah i only have 3 legendaries and they're all dmg focused, the boots are crafted rare 🥲

[tawdry meteor]

Who needs damage when things can't kill you💪

Death by a million papercuts

[north nest]

https://tenor.com/view/big-stall-pokemon-smogon-showdown-gif-14123779968220414613

ima be looking at big armor buffs too when we get depot update, usually always wore warrior legs since they don't buff healing% for mage

[limpid rivet]

It seems the new upgrades for rings, etc. have added a very deep layer of item hunting to the endgame.

[small sluice]

Take a break kid. It is a problem with the amount of skills points refunded and not in understanding how skill points work. But don't worry, I already sent a ticket reporting the details of the bug. But your attitude was very helpful to understand why some people need to touch grass once in a while.

[small sluice]

Pre-patch amount is not matching the amount that was given after reset.

[tawdry meteor]

Might not be registering that you've completed shroud roots

Thats my best guess

[lethal scaffold]

Unfortunately all the armor pieces in the late game all are once again just stat buffs, since their upgrades all have the same effects which is dissapointing to me

for instance, Mountain sneak armor is the same as Basin sneak armor in other words

[small sluice]

Yeah, I agree with that. It is the same amount of skills that I got the day before the patch.

[steady crystal]

tell the devs, https://enshrouded.featureupvote.com/suggestions/707978/skill-tree-rework-feedback-thread-update-8-forging-the-path

[gleaming musk]

What amount did you have before vs after the patch?

[steady crystal]

I can't tell if he Lost points from a bug, or if everything is just soo much more costly now that he can't build his build.

[runic zealot]

I tried to rebuild my old build as well

And I also came short roughly 20ish points.

But I still had the same amount of point (148)

So it's definitely just a skill cost economy change.

[steady crystal]

I was expecting to have more points to pay with from skipping skill I did not need, So this was a huge upset against that expectation.

[runic zealot]

I actually like this change tho.

Because it does very much allow u to build ur build structure much sooner in the game.

[steady crystal]

you can like one with out liking the other.

[runic zealot]

The full refinement of your build just requires longer investment than before.

I believe the skill cap is still 184

[steady crystal]

I too like going keeper into the tree earlier, but I am level 21 on my new patch play though. and I am not getting there like I though I would. Turns out the extra cost is inhibiting the benefit of going deeper early.

[runic zealot]

Just invest single points rather than multiple for now

Aside from the skill your absolutely certain of.

[steady crystal]

com'on you and I both have brains, we both did that

[runic zealot]

Also do note that for the cost efficiency enviroment, sll armor and rings now can be upgraded like weapons and can give you free points into certain skills.

So by utilizing that fact you can also mitigate some of the costs of building into ur character.

[steady crystal]

some yes. only some tho.

[runic zealot]

From what I seen most have at least 1 skill point bonus.

More so mid-late game tho is where u will see more.

[north nest]

lol yeah skipping hasn't shaved off many points at all; trickster should connect to wizard at the top so we can skip the 5cost spirit node T_T

[runic zealot]

Also armor found throughout the world seem to have more skill point bonuses than armor crafted at the NPCs

[north nest]

yea they added legendary armor to drop tables

[runic zealot]

The helmet I hav that I found has 3 points toward mages including a point into Water Aura (which costs 2pts per investment)

[north nest]

nice, altho water aura extra points just ups the range by 5m

big for some players i suppose 😮

[mortal hazel]

didnt even realize that you just saved me 2 points lol

Looks like Soul leech is similar in the guardian tree.

[north nest]

yea someone joked about it because it's a melee skill in the first place

[small sluice]

180 vs 172

[frosty sentinel]

Hmm

I thought level cap on items was 50?

[keen torrent]

I haven't played for a bit, did the new update give any love to the necromancer skill?

[frosty sentinel]

It features on most boots and probably some other bits so potentially a higher proc chance than before? I'm not that familiar with the little skulls but possibly?

[keen torrent]

Eh. I'm already excited to see the skill changes but I won't be able to see em for a few days

[misty sedge]

This seems like a bug lol

[cunning mural]

shush! D:

if it's not intended, and it's bad, it's a bug
if it's not intended, and it's good, it's a feature

[frosty sentinel]

It was a boss drop rather than a chest drop. Will farm it a bit and see what happens I guess.

[hushed sierra]

maybe it was before but skulls now fly rather well, they don't get stuck behind barriers very much and move in 3d

btw did they also make gliding much worse? meaning shorter. Not talking about Updraft.

[late cloak]

Been playing the past week and i can confidently say gliding is the same as before the update. With the Exception of Updrafts (see patch notes).

And don't forget to reassign the skill points on the stamina reduction

[teal dragon]

I don't think anybody is saying otherwise, the complaints are about updraft

Oh the comment above totally does ask that

I'm so upset about updraft tho :))

[left crescent]

They can make up for it by giving us a spell to cast stationary updrafts like the ones in the mountains

[tight bolt]

What would be the best skills for building and mining? I mostly play on very easy settings and focus on building studf

[hexed bison]

Is the Ground slam attack not working ? I have it unlocked in the skill tree, but can't get it to do it's ground slam, also have the double jump unlocked.

[misty sedge]

crash down is now triggered by holding the attack button

[hexed bison]

Also can't pick up the new cooking bench. Set it down in the kitchen in my Keep, to check it out and now can't pick it back up no matter what I do. And is not where I would have to put it. Which is going to require a lot of rebuilding my Kitchen for it.

You just hold it and thats all

[misty sedge]

Well like after a jump. So jump and click and hold the attack button and you should do a crash down

[hexed bison]

have done that, and the double jump and it seems like you don't really jump as high now either.

As it is pretty soon with all the new controls I will need a AI just to move in the game......just saying

Well back to the game and see if I can mess up some more.. lol though the new Kitchen bench I think is bugged

[misty sedge]

Huh, I've never had an issue with it... Can you do a heavy attack while you're standing on the ground? It's also just a hold click

[misty sedge]

I believe that is that case, and you aren't alone on that

[hexed bison]

It does the new focused attack even when I do a jump and hold the attack button down. I'm on a Keyboard and mouse. Can't use controllers

[misty sedge]

Interesting it seems like it doesn't input the hold until you're on the ground

[hexed bison]

Ok got it to work finally. Though still cannot pick up the Kitchen bench and thats in the way now. Can it be destroyed ?

[misty sedge]

... Probably? I'm afraid to try with the ones I've placed, I don't want to pick up all the clutter around them to avoid destroying them 🤣

I'll build a new one and place it in a field and test when I can

[hexed bison]

Same here, I have over 30 hours making this kitchen, it's really medieval

Have about 350 hours just into the Keep, and only about a third of the way through the build....

Will be adding more to the keep now with all the new bric a brac thats been added in, still have to finish the village inside the keep and the farm area. plus doing the outside the walls village, though those new spiral stairs are going to be a winner for the corner towers, I now have to redo for them.

Well nearly 6:00 PM here have to go feed the chickens and the dogs, then back to the game.

[misty sedge]

Yeah they added a lot for builders to have fun with in this update

Not my metal ladders tho 😭

[hexed bison]

they might still come... keep hoping ....it's what I do..... now if they made round building a thing in the game I would just start a new world...And I don't do AI though they really are making the options in the game a bit complicated for simple people like me. I don't tweet, twitter, X, Tic or Tok or any of the social sites not even facebook ( much to some of my family and friends dismay ) so getting ahold of anyone about bugs and stuff is just here I guess. And at 70 guess I'm a bit set in my ways, just a old bird lol

[teal dragon]

Sometimes it feels like Enshrouded would have been better off just focusing on building completely. Scrap all the combat stuff and the skill tree and be more of a Minecraft game with exploration, quests, puzzles, platforming.

Not that mc does that stuff, like that on top of rpg-like quests and stuff.

[tired pagoda]

Personally, in a similar vein, I'd love to see the combat based nodes and non-combat completely separated. As in, two different trees. I think it would help a lot of the less combat oriented things shine a lot more, as I know they are regularly in competition with combat, and thus aren't chosen nearly as often

[teal dragon]

@steady crystal This isn't the game I would want either, but right now I think Enshrouded attempts to do too much and falls flat because it's spread too thin.

In some* areas

[teal dragon]

Yeah that mix feels odd, it feels optimal to respec every time you go out to grind resources and then respec again when you fight enemies. I'm not sure this is super fun or healthy?

[unkempt ivy]

yall know of any hosted servers that have rings available? i just want to see what stats are avaiable on rings later game

[thick edge]

is anyone else not getting the invincibility window while dodge rolling? i keep getting killed mid roll

i have a rogue build so i rely entirely on stamina and stealth

[teal dragon]

may I introduce you to the veiled vigor perk

It will solve all your survivability needs

[thick edge]

i literally have level 2 of that

i'm level 37

this never happened to me before recent update

[runic tree]

A little late to this since I just got back from work, but the layout itself definitely comes across as more organized than the old layout for the most part. Granted it's possible some things could still be moved around to better spots given the extent of the changes, but overall there's less of a slapped on filler feel to the new layout.

Point costs seem to be a bit higher cumulatively. The individual skills don't seem too pricy for the most part at first glance, but when trying to recreate my build from before the patch I found myself running out of points a lot faster than I was expecting to.

When I tried to figure out why I noticed a lot of skills cost just one point more at rank three than their former costs for the same effects on the previous skill tree.

I'm also not a fan of the Spellslinger staff damage skill being behind Arcane Concentration. Given that Spirit really isn't that good of an attribute without percent based mana regen to compensate for the increased mana total, it honestly feels like wasting points just to get 5-15% extra damage. Despite being a mage player Spirit is easily my most expendable attribute.

Lastly, as a mage player, the doubled cost of Bloodletting and the complete massacre of Terror are easily my most hated changes to the skill tree.

[thick edge]

i like the layout, it makes more sense. i am specifically having issues with the more stealthy perks as they do not seem to work very well

[teal dragon]

Out of curiosity how much HP is it actually giving you?

[thick edge]

my dex is 19

[mortal musk]

I was recommended to drop my question here. So here it is:

I have to unbind my special attack from right trigger when I play on my controller on my PC... that allows me to use my bows and staves like I used to. Yet I don't want to lose the ability to use a special attack. Is there any fix to this so I can still use ranged weapon auto draw and soft fast target, and still use a different button for special ability/attack?

[runic tree]

Honestly not worth the points imo. Much like the mage version Life Essences, you're frankly better off putting three points in Constitution for even more Health.

[thick edge]

my issues could entirely be user error because i'm still getting used to new combat stuff but i dont normally die this much unless i'm in hallow halls. the drak are literally too powerful and oneshot me every time. my armor is all maxed out with upgrades too

[teal dragon]

So you're getting equal HP to a single point of constitution which is 1 skill point, from a node that requires 4 2 for the same value?

[thick edge]

this is without food

[teal dragon]

Ah looks like you've already gone into con

[thick edge]

the health is not entirely the issue. the drak are extremely powerful because i have a more squishy build, but i can usually get around that with endurance and dex

this is not happening at all

i am killed mid roll consistently

[teal dragon]

Also I'd give my thoughts but I wouldn't want you thinking I'm being too emotional

[thick edge]

i've barely been able to sneak up on enemies

[teal dragon]

I haven't tested the i-frames so I can't say, are you getting hit maybe in the recovery of the roll?

[thick edge]

nope, right in the middle

sometimes i get hit at the end or beginning but i expect that

my most recent death like 10 minutes ago was in the middle of the rolling animation

stealth is kinda broken for me rn

[teal dragon]

I reckon if you can post a clip of it that would give the answer

[teal dragon]

I'ma be real with you, the game is not built for stealth in my experience despite the perks around it and marketing suggesting so

[thick edge]

stealth and dodge rolling are just not possible specifically against the drak, most other enemies is fine with the occasional oopsie

[teal dragon]

It doesn't seem like it has a properly robust system for stealth like Valheim surprisingly does

[thick edge]

i get that but it was working better before is what i'm saying

and this is a huge bummer for me as someone who built my character based on being quick and stealthy

[teal dragon]

That is very odd then, yeah I tried to build something similar and it just did not work

But not this patch, so specific AI behaviours I'm not sure about

[thick edge]

i am very stubborn so i make it work lol

this latest patch has kinda thrown all my strategy into the bin

[teal dragon]

Stealth imo is just another area of Enshrouded that is very half-baked

[thick edge]

it was 3/4 baked before 😂

[teal dragon]

I would guess it's due to enemy AI changes

[thick edge]

i don't think it's the enemy AI, its the roguish mechanics themselves

i can't do melee combat anymore because all the things i used to rely on don't work

my strat has always been "find a perch on high and snipe, take out as many as i can from this vantage, then jump down and finish off the rest." now when i got to finish off the rest, i get one- or two-shot in toe to toe melee because i still get hit even while dodge rolling

[hexed bison]

Soon it will be Ai doing the battles, we will just be watching

[north nest]

might not be helpful but if you're looking to have fun/progress now you could try blink dodge upgrade

[thick edge]

do not ask me how i beat the ||fell dragon youngling|| i still don't know how i managed to pull that off

did it solo in the sheep costume 😭

[runic tree]

To be fair that fight is rought no matter your build.

[thick edge]

i should not have survived lmao

though it did take me like 2 hours of doing it over and over

eventually found a way to cheese it

[hexed bison]

I have blink didn't want the new dodge, felt it was ...dodgey not my type of game play, and you don't seem to have the points to make a all-around build now

[thick edge]

i already have that perk

[steady crystal]

OMG i have soo much less Crit. Every mage skill trigger from cirt and they ripped so much off the armor and tree.

[thick edge]

the only red plips i have are the two beginning str and con. my tree is completely green otherwise

[north nest]

you mean blink or?

[thick edge]

i did it this way because i have a friend who is doing a tank build and another who is doing a mage build we haven't played new update together

[north nest]

gotcha

must be drak huge hitbox i suppose hitting everything around them when they swing sword

you have the same issue with the spear guys' lunge?

[thick edge]

yup

tho that one is easier to dodge by evading sideways

but it still hits me a lot more than it should

[north nest]

ye i would have guessed the side dodge is best vs the lunging enemies

those are my bane personally, i mostly just double jump around instead of dodge

[thick edge]

see, the double jumping is less reliable for me

i mostly do that when i'm trying to slow fall while shooting arrows

not as an evasive maneuver

[steady crystal]

so the crown has a point for Terror, that makes it 60% chance to proc. still for only 1/2 the duration.

so a the very end of the (current) game. terror get a tiny bit better.

They put wizard on chest pieces. which is +2% crit. and the cost of a lot of HP and Armor from not warrior warrior armor, Skill can where warrior legs, blood letting is kind ok on the caster legs, But we just don't have the armor.

But Circle of Lightning lost it's 15% lightning damage boost for 5% and 2 nodes of spell slinger which would be nice if we could get to spell slinger without wasting so many points on spirt. I don't understand the obsession with sprit. there is a single talent that scales with amount of spirt, we don't need more

[hexed bison]

By they way you have to rank your armour and rings up just like your weapons

[steady crystal]

doing the good work there 🫡

[runic tree]

If it's the Circlet of Lightning you're losing 13% magic critical chance to even trigger Terror against unsoaked enemies. Doesn't really sound worth it tbh, especially if you're not focusing on a soak build.

[steady crystal]

Yeah, soaked build. But also not.
I keep both helmets on my hot bar key balance to mouse button 4. Only swapped to it when I need to lightning channel down something.

Well, I keep one helm on the hot bar and the other equipped and when you press the button and use it, it swaps

[hexed bison]

Think they need to do some tweaking here and there yet myself but thats just me.

[north nest]

there's also

[runic tree]

Oof, that might actually get me to switch away from sprint speed pants.

[hexed bison]

Yep gotta unlock those britches now after the update

Lotsa ruins gonna get burned now after this patch lol

[runic tree]

Too bad my RNG sucks...

[halcyon vale]

Has anyone found the legendary tidecaller pants and boots?

[north nest]

i have seen this #combat-and-skills message

[halcyon vale]

I wonder if as a mage it might make sense to run the drakian boots now. They give up to 15% additional damage against drak if u upgrade them

[frosty sentinel]

Im running them as a mage personally, I'm not too fussy for necromancer levels tbh

[halcyon vale]

I've never ran that skill. Is necromancer any good. Is that skull useful lol?

[frosty sentinel]

It's better now, doesn't get stuck as much and has 3D movement but really it's just a one-pointer on the way to Shroud damage for me.

[steady crystal]

If you play on more or many enemies it is good, on standard it will not trigger often enough to matter. Also is useless bosses with out adds. I do like how theymassacre spiders and beatless

[halcyon vale]

Sounds interesting. I might have to give that a shot one of these days

[steady crystal]

well by good, i mean, they will aggro stuff so you can cast.

[oblique matrix]

Has anyone found the legendary Skull stalker gloves?

[frosty sentinel]

Tbh that's the reason I didn't use it, I play on many enemies and a lot of them just seem to outright ignore it.

[unkempt ivy]

why are these dudes leaping from so far back constantly? i dont remember this being so spammed by mobs before

[still lantern]

I'm just going to leave this here and hopefully I'm not breaking any rules...

I've already submitted this bug. But is anyone else having an issue with Inner Fire? Instead of giving minutes, it gives seconds.

[broken surge]

@steady crystal agree mage crit nerf is affecting a lot of linked mechanics. They included the glass but left out the cannon.

[mighty lodge]

Is this the place to put combat feedback and asking about changing things?
After playing with the new changes a lot and going through all of veilwater with different builds multiple times on normal, survival, and maxed out enemy stats and comparing old recordings and movements with the new ones, I feel like the changes are definitely a side-downgrade in fun. I'm not going to bother talking about balance changes overall or what I enjoyed because the positive changes are already positive lol.

The first thing I want to mention is evasion attack, which was one of the more fun moves before 0.8. Now that it moves extremely slowly, it feels really pointless instead of just using a heavy attack. Part of what made this game's combat interesting was the(although unpolished) dance that combat basically was for melee. It was more about positioning, getting behind enemies, quickly moving, not getting hit, and situational awareness Now it just feels like a clunky elden ring where you tap parry twice then slap the enemy with a heavy and merciless and then it dies. It's not really as unique anymore and I don't see why evasion attack was nerfed. It was already a positioning move and the warping part of it was what made it useful (not talking about normal weapon warping, that was a good change). It's a coop/single player game, I don't see why removing play styles makes any sense.

Updraft. Everyone loves updraft(well except the people that don't). I know why it was changed... It just didn't actually solve that problem at all. It's still extremely easy to cheese combat encounters by just jumping on a ledge. Along with that, it's a sandbox survival game. Instantly falling out of the sky after the glide ends regardless of updraft also just feels rough. Again, removing options for motion just isn't fun, and it doesn't solve any balance problems.

Lastly, the skill tree. I know people have talked about this a lot but it could mostly be solved by reducing mage skill costs.

Did I yap too much?

[narrow belfry]

The loss of stun on breaking an enemy's guard (I assume a bug) makes dealing with packs of enemies as melee feel kinda cheeks ngl

[scarlet lintel]

can any bosses be parried? seeing as the first boss of the first elixir well cannot be blocked or parried i have low hope going forward that boss fights will be at all interesting if dodge roll is the only viable method

[broken surge]

Any mages recall if casting a fireball at a distant target triggered burning gem pre-patch? Doesnt now. Tooltip says the range is from the target.

[cunning mural]

there are 2 bosses with ranged attacks, and those ranged attacks can be parried back at the boss... but... I think that's it actually

[scarlet lintel]

I've been told this games combat is better than valheims, and the combat just got improved, yet the entire parry mechanic is not used for any bosses beyond the zelda tenis attacks?

[high storm]

level 50+ items exist?

[gleaming cipher]

@wild cypress You seem to be quite well versed against Sicklescythes, can you test out their combat behavior post update 8 and verify if it feels different?

[keen mountain]

My burning gem was triggered fine pre patch and is triggered fine now

[broken surge]

Mine triggers fine on fairly close targets, anything not in agro range sort of distances it doesnt

[wild cypress]

You can still parry back the blades; you cannot stand under them to get immunity from the blades, they can aim better now. You still cannot parry the skull projectile.

Just tested.

[gleaming cipher]

Thank you very much

[wild cypress]

https://tenor.com/view/kid-oh-yeah-yodeling-gif-4295637337024128969

[bronze hollow]

Are you telling me I can't look up her skirt anymore?

[wild cypress]

I'm telling you it's a much more daring lifestyle if you do.

[tawdry meteor]

Real lol

[steady crystal]

well the terror skill points on some (very rare and end game) gear has be feeling better. Still is meh before the end game.

OOPS, haha, um I am shooting 2 fireballs per cast (well 2 cast per click). hum, configId=1101517683 is NOT a damage multiplier for spell ammo. no clue what I changed in my .lua file but this is actually hilarious

and My ADHD brain started this to find the Terror's stun duration effect ID, not even this stuff.

I wonder how many I can crank it up too.

[sharp cloud]

I am on the fence with this update… love the skill rework, just about everything but the combat tweaks. Everything feels unresponsive… blocking should interrupt attack animations, not as a stand around waiting for the critter to attack so you can block freely and maybe attack after.

I do hope that with release we get some spears or polearms.

[steady crystal]

now that I think on it, they did go through all the effort of modeling, animating, and creating hit boxes for Spears already for the fell spear enemy. seems like some of that could transfer.

[cunning mural]

odd little fun fact, the "rusty short sword" fell use, is actually the tip of a spear. The same spear the fell use, which is why spear-wielding fell can drop the sword too.

[misty sedge]

And the Drak. And the Vukah can throw spears at us

i yearn for pointy stick

[cunning mural]

the "handle" is metal and the "pommel" is wood

[cunning mural]

it is the most effective weapon

[steady crystal]

Ok I am casting 6 fierballs per spell cast, chained back to back while I run around this is kinda fun.

[gleaming musk]

Has a higher proc rate if fully upgraded

Tested Water Balloons against some regular fell soldiers, fell banshees, and the fell wispwyvern. Was able to apply Soaked to all of them on the first thrown. The smaller enemies didnt get a debuff icon but the wispwyvern did under its boss hp gauge

Well, assuming I connected. The banshee was tough cause some fell critters kept knocking me slightly and making me miss. 😐

Shame the crafting recipe was borked though

[steady crystal]

Wet dog got moved closer, so if they leave it where it is but fix the bloody cost of everything the gem of currents could be back in. tho ever bit of armor removing your debuff is a pain.

last patch, I just sucked it up. and walked everywhere.

I feel like SOO much of this patch would be amazing, be it not for some questionable choices around cost.

so the amount of gear with Terror is up to 2 right?

[pliant sigil]

Bloodfeather Helmet legendary stats

[ebon star]

I opened a gold chest over 700 times and I still don't have a complete legendary armor set. And you can get like 7 armor sets from that one. Also I still haven't gotten some of the legendary weapons from the chest, not a single time. Putting blue items in a gold chest was a terrible idea IMHO, also getting blue armor from the crates is a slap on the face, since you can actually craft blue rarity armor yourself anyway. The loot pool is so diluted now ordinary players would take either hundreds of hours to get the items they want, or just settle for never getting them.

[pliant sigil]

I agree it could have been only epic and legendary items

On another note, Guard of the North Star STILL doesn't have a Parry Power value and does abysmal stagger damage, this has been the case for as long as the sword was made a Greatsword, and is something I doubt would take long to fix

[obtuse owl]

Hello, where do I ask developers for a dual wield warrior build?

[plucky sundial]

https://enshrouded.featureupvote.com/

[marble wyvern]

im new here. Is dual wield a thing or only for daggers?

[mossy ridge]

Only daggers - offhand is either shield or ward

[marble wyvern]

then I vote for dual wielding too xD

[plucky sundial]

put these equipment at savedata if anyone need

[mossy ridge]

With what's already in the game - crossbow in strength, spears in dex, and the flamethrower with alchemical ammo in int would be pretty awesome

That would pretty much open up all the different ranges for each type

[runic tree]

Or just start using resource worlds for their loot.

I saw this coming too because my first thought when I read that armor had been reintroduced to chest loot pools was "this is going to make getting the weapons you want almost impossible again."

[ebon star]

Yeah but that is just a sad way to play, and will put off a lot of people. I am opening about 1,5 chest per minute, I am currently at about 1000 chests opened, I still did not manage to find all pieces of the sunpiercer armor. While from the bulwark armor I have only found the pants. This is INSANE.

[runic tree]

Reminds me of the time I spent trying to get a Blackened Staff back when Kindlewastes was the highest biome. Spent a whole weekend doing nothing but opening chests before I got it.

Completely burnt me out on looting chests for high quality gear after that, and is the big reason why I keep pushing to just be able to craft epic and legendary gear at the crafters even if it costs more to do so.

Rare quality limit on crafted items when chest RNG is this bad and the only source for anything better is just bad design imo.

[pliant sigil]

Resource Worlds also need to collect the loot to later have them for everyone. So the initial period after an update the resource world is always be behind you own finds.

[runic tree]

Yeah, that's true. Though mostly just a matter of time.

[ebon star]

I don't really like the looting mechanics of this game. It is the one thing they are doing completely wrong in my opinion. If they somehow monetised it with real world money then I guess it would make sense, but luckily they don't, so it doesn''t even make sense how it works. The armors should probably be in some guaranteed place, hidden behind some questline, and so should like 50% of the weapons. They don't even give that huge of an advantage, it's just a nice little bonus to play with the kind of gear you want.

[sour gull]

would be cool if we could upgrade the level on a found item. So many times I find the weapon I want: legendary: yes. Gem slot: yes. Visual I want: yes... and it's level 7 ;_;

[raw bone]

This would be cool, even if the cost is high... Just makes it something to work towards in endgame

[eternal imp]

I didn't see any notes about it, but did they do any major changes to the general overall character movement? The character feels...weirdly sluggish and slow now?

I'm not sure to describe it, but just moving around feels unresponsiveness.

[solid star]

It has changed, probably in the name of realism

[steady crystal]

Hey guys, just leave feedback and then go mod the damn thing. Increase the chest drop rates., I find two minimum five maximum, to let me only have to play through an area two or three times before I have all the gear from that region. It’s still grinding, but not maddening.
The endgame setting slider doesn’t quite get you there

[eternal imp]

I hope they revert it or make some adjustments. It feels real bad now - the slower combat I don't mind, but the overall movement around feels weird now. Turning is slower, etc.

[steady crystal]

I doubt it was for realism. It’s their first attempt at making combat more interactive. Not easy, not hard interactive.

[sturdy spindle]

quick question here; I know the combat and armor has been reworked, but i'm having difficulties with the damage output against enemies. I ran a explosive arrow build before the patch, but i'm having to shoot way more arrows. Anyone experiencing the same?

[steady crystal]

Adjusting it yes, reverting it. No, we do not need to go back to the days of every attack being a homing missile.

[steady crystal]

They Nerf critical strike chance on gear with too much of a heavy hand

[sturdy spindle]

would've loved to have graceful stride, but can't reach it, and no skill points anymore 🤣

[obsidian rune]

Got to play more in the veil last night. Second characters just feel... Unresponsive. I could not block drak chakrams to save my life.

If I was trying to use my wand, or staff. Holding block the moment they pull their hands back, as the rings do that orange flash. Character will just sit there. Get hit, then block.

[tired pagoda]

Yeah, finally got to get on yesterday and play some content. Maybe it's just me being rusty, but parrying feels like a nightmare now

[steady crystal]

I don’t think parrying itself was changed, but the enemy attack timings are different and many of them are less teleporting homing missiles, mostly the fell soldier

[obsidian rune]

More like, I had to stop attacking ahead of time, to have block available. I couldn't just react to the tell mid-attack. To much time on monster Hunter I guess. Used to reactive gameplay.

[tired pagoda]

It's less their attack/animation and more my own character responsiveness. There are significant delays to interacting in combat that weren't there before

[gleaming musk]

Soaked from water is 30 sec, so gem of Currents is no longer actually required to take advantage of Soaked. Instead it's a side grade. Personally I'd rather have the stamina for mobility and survivability so I'm gonna be running Water Balloons

[tired pagoda]

I'm sure part of this is due to the addition of all the new animations/attacks but hoo boy was it absolutely terrible to try to time parries

[steady crystal]

Oh, the inability to block while the casting and attack animations are playing has always been there. I don’t even think they touched casting animations in this patch.

[tired pagoda]

Many of the attack animations felt easier to cancel or interrupt before. I don't remember it being -this- bad.

[obsidian rune]

Imo, it's just noticably worse this patch, than the prior patch. Couldn't tell you the technical why.

[tired pagoda]

It's like I have to stand there well in advance of attack coming in and even then the timing is off

Could also be something to do with graphics card, unsure

[steady crystal]

Yeah, I’m not saying your experience isn’t true. I just don’t think they’ve changed anything on the player side for that.

There is a long history of post on the feedback, suggestions website from me every patch, asking them to make blocking more responsive around attack and casting animations

Hum the definition of insanity is repeating the same task and expecting a different outcome

[tired pagoda]

For sure. I can't tell you why it feels like this. It may entirely be on my side. But I definitely don't remember it being this pronounced before

It feels wildly counter intuitive to wanting an engaging playstyle and just leads back into the - mash buttons until it dies - methodology

[eternal imp]

To clarify - it's not the lack of the "warping" I dislike. I actually like that they removed that. I'm more referring to the overall turning and just "get up and go" feel.

the character feels more unresponsive

[tired pagoda]

Okay, yeah. It's not just me then

I do wonder if this is a graphical/fps side of things. I can poke around it more tonight. I didn't have a lot of time last night

[ebon star]

Ummm, is it possible to make the game drop more gear or specific gear I want? How is that done? Can you please walk me through it?

[elfin beacon]

Parrying has always been clunky. While they've made some improvements over time, it's still very much a case of learning to predict when the enemy will try to attack and stopping your own attack to time the parry. I hope they improve this.

[lusty cosmos]

yeah, new update has made me feel like my character responds less

whenever im using my bow, if i stop holding the fire button and I stop aiming using Q after that, my guy always swings whatever item he's holding once more

[misty sedge]

The way attacks buffer is definitely different. The only new delay I've noticed is when doing an Upward Slash, it's harder to trigger a Crash Down immediately after. It reliably doesn't work if you're trying to do it facing uphill, and mostly it'll just buffer a heavy attack when you land instead

[lusty cosmos]

gods yeah, i had to give up on those two, always felt like i was gambling what attack would actually play instead

[tired pagoda]

Yeah after trying to use both crash down and upward slash, I just specced out of them. Having both definitely felt clunky at best

[lusty cosmos]

this game has always felt like i'd attack or use an item once more after i stop pressing the button, but it's felt significantly worse since the update, idk if that's because movement is less responsive now, so animation unresponsiveness is just harder to deal with?

[tired pagoda]

I think the inputs make sense on paper. I think utilizing them out in the field and in the middle of combat felt really bad and unpredictable.

[wide ocean]

guys with the iframe thing it counts for every version of the dodge? like the normal one the flash and the maneuver ?

[tired pagoda]

I believe it is meant to, yes

[trim trail]

Im curious how long the iframes last for, is it the entire duration of the dodge animation? Or just like a small window from the start of the animation?

[tired pagoda]

I'm fairly certain it's not the whole duration

[lusty cosmos]

it's a pretty damn big amount from what ive felt, its the only reason why im not dying more with how much less responsive combat feels rn

i dont think ive ever felt like i got hit in the middle of the animation now

[misty sedge]

I still have both and use them both at different times. I definitely think the new inputs feel way better, but there wasn't such a delay after using Upward Slash before U8

[tired pagoda]

I think the inputs work well in an isolated environment but I am noticing a lot of overall clunkiness that is making it hard to evaluate stuff like before. Both from the patch and animations themselves

[lusty cosmos]

hitting skillshots with a bow feels harder now? im not sure if im going crazy about it, just feels like i can't aim very quickly, or maybe its just that my movement isnt pairing up to what i expect it to be

[spark wagon]

I think they touched movement during Bow-Aiming so you might be correct here

[tired pagoda]

I will run some driver updates tonight and tweak settings to see if it's on my end though. Wanna be able to rule out graphics and network

[wide ocean]

facts like i dont know why but the new thing that u need to wait to use updraft is ok very normal not a problem but to start to fly it has a little delay right now i already die i think 5 times doing my chest run

[stray moon]

Does this include myself?

[pliant sigil]

Yes

[pliant sigil]

Ring of the Heir legendary stats

[spark wagon]

If you wanna help out with collecting stuff for the Shroud Depot https://discord.com/channels/1046840540550942720/1346947011060170816 I'm sure MamaKira would welcome any help with collecting gear rn. If you arent already, that is.

[pliant sigil]

I'm placing it in the Awesome Armory but they are working hand in hand so it's the same :b

[fast ivy]

Why they make chest farming even more necessary 😭

[lament shard]

To give good stuff

[fast ivy]

Was one of the most complained about things and they made it worse….

[lament shard]

You need the runes anyway

Honestly, I can spend the better part of an hour farming high level chests and legendary runes

But I enjoy the fact that knowing multiple high level chest locations is the correct way to play...

[cunning mural]

I very much wish we had less RNG loot... getting Epics or Uncommons is insanely disappointing every time

[lament shard]

I got my Legendary Max level Chest piece!

[misty sedge]

Are the Sicklescythe skull attacks way easier to avoid now?

[tired pagoda]

That is way easier than before yeah. Are you just sprinting in a circle?

[misty sedge]

Yeah lol

I feel like it doesn't track me as well as it did before

[tired pagoda]

I guess the big question would be : are you going faster than it or is it not able to hone in as well

[misty sedge]

Good question, let me go fight another

I think it's both honestly

It seems very slightly faster than you so if you start sprinting away before it comes out it won't actually catch up to you, but under Cromville is tighter quarters than that Hollow Halls area so it's a bit tougher to test

[tired pagoda]

Intersting. Looks like some of the parking and projectile tweaks hit this too

Your animation also looks -much- more fluid than mine so now I'm definitely thinking it might be something on my end after the patch

[steady crystal]

It’s not too difficult if you’re familiar with C++. There’s a GitHub repository with the .dll and tools you would need if you can just search for it.

Or if that’s not your thing look at, Nexus, it’s a repository for published mods intended for other people to be able to use, and they normally have detailed instructions on how to install them

[ebon star]

I tried a mod actually, but all I managed to do with it was make it so the enemies drop like 200 of each item instead of dropping all items they can drop. Chests only hold about 1-2 items so nothing changed there. Is it possible to makea chest give its entire loot table in one go? Or, give like 10-20 items in one opening? Havent seen a mod with that option. As for C++, I know as much about programming as a goldfish knows about playing the piano.

[eternal pawn]

I'm really disappointed by the new skill tree. I was hoping we'd finally see talents support gishing.
The dream of a magic empowered/spell casting swordsman is still stuck in the mud.

[bronze hollow]

There's more changes planned.

Stay tuned.

[solid star]

I wish for a Talent that, when you cast a spell you have a chance of casting an free duplicat spell

[haughty widget]

Are there any differences between terms "Skillshot" and "Skill shot"?

[tawdry meteor]

Not reallt

It just means a shot on a weak point (most of the time a headshot)

[haughty widget]

I am getting confused by this. It looks like Skill Shot is an improvement of Skillshot? Like there is Skillshot mechanic that is further improved by this Skill Shot passive skill? Or hitting the head etc. does no increased damage until you get this "Skill Shot" skill?

[spiral plinth]

I'm mostly really pleased with the update, there's a few nitpicks and I have to try a few other builds. I think the bloodrage skill increasing the range is absolutely worthless. I like that there are a lot more options, but even at level 45, I didn't feel like I had enough points to flesh out my build

[strange nest]

Is there an updated skill planner? The link in the pinned comment is still showing the old tree

[slow echo]

Heyho,
Really random since everyone is talking about the skilltree itself - how do you like the new design of it?
I find it really unpleasant to look at and with all the numbers idk. It just looks really unpleasant.

I kinda miss the old design, anyone else thinking the same?

[strange nest]

I like the new version better, especially being able to zoom in and out. I find the numbers helpful on the nodes that are upgradeable, as I can see at a glance how much I've spent on that node

[tired pagoda]

I think the logical side of my brain likes being able to see and map out things much more directly with how visible a lot is.

I think the artistic side of my brain loathes how busy and unaesthetically pleasing a lot of it is overall

[lusty cosmos]

ive had this issue with every boss so far since the update, they all just kinda do all their attacks away from me

[misty sedge]

enemies seem to target me just fine, I don't actually notice a lot of different behavior from most enemies

[slow echo]

100%
I really dislike how neon colored everything is. 🫠 I Wish that they could Tone that down a bit

[spiral plinth]

I mean I'll take function over form any day. I would kinda look at this like a beta to see if they like the layout, they can improve the visuals for 1.0

Oh, also, we need either a durability slider or some major work, I would turn it on, but weapons degrade way too fast, it's just not fun so they all the talents that deal with durability end up being useless

[tired pagoda]

Weapons being tied to use is an inherently difficult semblance to balance because it means things that do more damage get swung less. This is super noticeable when I swap between my 1H and 2H builds

[runic tree]

It's still possible. It's just that everything costing a point more here and a point more there makes the points add up a little faster than they did before the update so it's not quite as easy.

Especially if you want the same bonuses you had before, because you have to invest in all three ranks in the same skills just to get the same bonuses it seems.

Or if you're a mage you have to invest in all three ranks to get almost the same bonuses you had before.

[tawdry meteor]

Skillshots already do extra damage, this extra damage is further increased by that ability

[tawdry meteor]

Ngl, I view durability as something that should really just be removed. Weapons don't actually break and every time you touch a crafting bench they fully repair anyways

Same with tools

Durability is a cool concept sometimes, but its not really changing gameplay at all other than being mildly inconvenient (since I can just place a flame altar, tp home to repair my stuff, and tp back and destroy my altar anyway)

Either that or add a consumable that repairs durability like a whetstone or something

[runic tree]

I know a lot of people just turn durability off in the game settings.

Biggest reason I've seen for doing so is people not wanting to carry around 3-4 weapons while exploring.

[tawdry meteor]

Yeah I just do what I described and carry on with my day

[tired pagoda]

Yeah I have sincerely debated turning it off because it doesn't add anything to my gameplay

I feel like as the game has evolved that durability has become more of a problem instead of less of one. And I think a lot of that is due to how much interaction fighting takes compiled with greater specialization in builds that means you aren't using a variety of weapons

[tawdry meteor]

More or less yeah

[runic tree]

Then there's wands which have less durability by default.

[tawdry meteor]

I use a single bow, and usually kill in one or two shots, but for 1h melee and mages I can see it definitely being a problem

[lusty cosmos]

it was a big issue for me when i did a run specializing 1h, using a bow this run: havent had my bow break a single time in an exploration run

i carried 3 different 1h at the same level to deal with it

[drowsy hamlet]

Might be a silly question but does Arsonist effect fire damage on weapons?

[tired pagoda]

It should! At least it's supposed to lol

[drowsy hamlet]

Im working on a paladin build using weapons that have fire on them. Ill have to test it out I suppose. 😄

[tired pagoda]

Should be a quick test with the dummy at the start

[drowsy hamlet]

Unfortunately this char is still pretty low lvl yet. Just hit 7.

[tired pagoda]

The dummy you can smack/test on is very near the beginning area you exit out of so you're definitely able to at 7. They're up in the shambles of the ruins before you get down the steps

[drowsy hamlet]

Thank you!

[lethal scaffold]

Yes, Arsonist increases all fire damage, not just magic fire

[bronze hollow]

Or you could just turn it off.

[tawdry meteor]

I probably will tbh, it's pretty annoying, just gotta ask the rest of my friends that I play with is all lol

[limpid rivet]

Was leveling slowed down?

[bronze hollow]

No

[limpid rivet]

ahh I got accustomed to playing on "max number of enemies" I forgot it's a lot slower with normal hahah

[bronze hollow]

The more you kill, the more you get 🤓

[elfin beacon]

I like durability in Minecraft because you can craft stone tools out in the field a lot easier, then iron and diamond are huge durability increases, with further increases from unbreaking and eventually mending. It gives you something to work towards. And repairing actually has a cost too.
In Enshrouded and Valheim there's just no real gameplay interaction with durability like you have in Minecraft, plus your inventory is so limited and you can't necessarily just craft a new one whenever and where ever you want. We turn off durability in our play throughs and haven't missed it at all.
Having to carry multiple tools and weapons just for durability isn't an interesting mechanic.

[limpid rivet]

BTW does it appear 2H is finally beating out bow for endgame?

And is 1H+SH viable anymore?

[tawdry meteor]

For damage it really just depends, if you can consistently hit skill shots I think bow damage is still a lot better, but if you can't I think 2 handed crits are doing much better. Also 2h lends itself to being a bit more tanky

[mortal marsh]

from my experience the other day bow damage seems lower than it was before. and it relies on multishot procs too.

my wife was doing big hits for like, 1000 regularly on our level 27 characters, and i was doing skillshots for about 500, and yeah with a short bow i can attack faster but the enemies like to dodge projectiles now so its harder to play lol. Not MUCH harder but i dont hit 100% anymore so it all depends i guess

with equivalent gear, assuming using best weapons vs the same foes, i think it depends on if the enemy is flying or not lol, otherwise the added tankiness of being melee is hard to beat

[limpid rivet]

Yah I've done 4 playthroughs over the past year as Bow and it appears to be lower now. But we're dealing with a complete overhaul and I haven't gotten to endgame with the new crafting, etc. so potentially lots to test. It's just going to take time.

[bronze hollow]

Bow has definitely taken a hit. Sword and board is still very strong tho.

[oblique matrix]

The bow’s damage was nerfed by more than 35%

They moved most of the damage to skill shots

[safe silo]

I don't think wand range has been increased for Update 8. I went to Low Meadows Spire on a new character and world yesterday and tried to hit the glowing button standing on a pressure plate on the upper floor. The wand projectile fades before it hits the button ~12 meters away. That's with me standing as far forward on the pressure plate as possible. Exact same range I experienced in Updates 7, 6 and 5. Did they add a new class of long range wand or are all wands going to fail like this?

Also in combat, I can lock onto a distant enemy like a spitting plant, fell archer or scav. crossbowman at I'm guessing 24-25m away, but my wand projectile fades before it gets even halfway there. This wastes durability resulting in 0 damage done. I had this same range issue in previous updates as well, so I don't know why it's so bad but I hope this can be investigated when more severe issues are solved.

[hushed sierra]

I don't know. I do have an impression that wands' range was increased. But maybe it's self-persuasion? I haven't measured.

[heavy nebula]

anyone know if there is s new skill tree builder up on a site or something? Oh and whats the new max level and new max skill points?

[cunning mural]

same level, 45 and 184 skill points

[heavy nebula]

ty

[hushed sierra]

What is definite, is wands' special ability is bad. Way too long to charge for way too little effect. It needed to either half charging time or double-triple effect time. Or radius. Or both.
Now I forget this thing exists most of the time.

[limpid rivet]

Yah Wands and Mages still suck early game and AFAIK haven't changed much at endgame.

[runic tree]

Wands need special attacks like melee weapons and daggers get. Right now it's literal slow walk and click until you get to the new focus attack, and then it's right back to slow walk and click.

Melee weapons can dash, jump, slam and spin with the right skill points, and of course the new heavy and focus attacks as well.

[oblique matrix]

Just go for 2H