💣┇weapons-gadgets

[random depot]

Thats how I feel about OW these days

[hazy hemlock]

I went back to ow. It .made me appreciate it more I just wont play ranked without my friends who sit at about plat skill level. With me playmaking we hit diamond but we wont pass that tbh I aint grinding like that cuz I dont care and they arent good enough

[random depot]

I came in for 2 days at the end of this season got m1 m5 m5 m4 for all the Qable ranked modes.

Felt 0 challenge besides my throwing team mates on occasion. I miss scrimming but it ain worth the hassle. Either I scrim pisslow in like 4k or I rebuild a 4.5k team and play Expert division again

Either way more effort than its worth

[hazy hemlock]

Thats so real. Its so free when im on dps. Lock tracer, kill them. Either they dont break 2 off to run counter flank and die for it or they all focus me and their team walks them down as I just survive them tryina push me. Skill level seems to have dropped significantly tbh

Im seeing dudes in plat/diamond that still dont know positioning at all which baffles me cuz in OW1 you HAD TO KNOW THAT

Oh hes super fun unfortunately the devs admitted that they intentionally kneecaps all dive because bad players feel upset when going against strong players if you dont belive me I can pull up the dev vision where they say it cuz im obv paraphrasing. Only poke meta in that game

Its the whole thing where if one team is better than the other when brawl and dive are good the fight doesnt last cuz they just get stomped cuz they only play poke and ignore 60% of the game mechanics

[slow linden]

Invis is bad and is very audible,plus you can just see them

[random depot]

No im talking about the the afk in a corner ones. The rest is fine 🙂

Invis aint bad, my Duo is an Invis main.

• i was using it in season 1 the same way people are using it now. I mean hello? Sombra has been a sore points of ow since her release for a damn good reason. Invisibility NOT tied to a major CD is obnoxiously broken.

Having her use a visible, telegraphed ability rather than just popping invis and teleporting across the map.

Moreover its not that I can kill them, thats not the point. The issue is the interaction is talentless and if I win its not because im good its because they suck.

Realistically with patience cloak has infinite skill ceiling in its current state.

[slow linden]

Idk I think being able to temporarily lie in wait for no mobility is a fine trade off,also it's still quite loud

[gaunt ermine]

M 11 nerf

[random depot]

Thats not a justification for it. I go back to my c4 argument.

If cloak can exist then c4 should be able to explode the second I throw it.

Heavy is loud? Should have predicted I have a nuke in my left ass cheek

Matter of fact, you know heavy has a winch why are you interacting with him in his space?

Shouldnt have tried to fight a winch heavy 4head

[slow linden]

It should

[random depot]

Hell naw tf

[slow linden]

Explosives are an overnerfed category

[random depot]

Disagree

Then winch is perfectly balanced 👌

[slow linden]

Remember when most grenades came in 2s

[random depot]

Frag is the only thing ill agree on

[slow linden]

Two fireballs is funny and you know it

[random depot]

I care about balance

[slow linden]

As do i,but fun is more important than balance

[random depot]

No

[slow linden]

Pyro nade is also a universal,so having 2 wouldn't be annoying

[random depot]

Balance comes first always, fun comes second.

Much like the real world, suffering is necessary for progress

[slow linden]

Embark doesn't seem to be focusing very well on either

[random depot]

Eh I still find the game plenty fun

[slow linden]

Game fun yes

But the balance isn't good,and most of the balance isn't particularly fun rn,you get punished hard for running anything fun in this meta

[random depot]

Sure, that's more the playerbase than anything else

Meta isnt real, its just an assumed perspective that something is optimal with very little thinking outside the box to determine if its true or not

Something being easier doesn't always make it better

As long as you dont have a situation where the only counterplay is never having been there to begin with without any discernable or feasible prediction or counterplay. It should not exist.

The reason winch is aids is the same. Your only realistic option is to not peak or be in the same space as it

The Megaknight of the FPS games if you will

[slow linden]

True enough

[slow linden]

While I agree for the most part,the fcar is very overtuned rn

[indigo nexus]

Perhaps slightly? But “very” seems to high

Unless you already believed it to be too strong by a good bit prior to the buff

[plucky spade]

Lmao

[slow linden]

It wasn't too strong prior to the buff,just strong

Was in such a delicate spot that such a minor tweak made it genuinely miserable to fight

[near scroll]

melee bad, game boring

[slow linden]

Pretty much,or shotguns,or launchers,or pistols,anything that isn't explicitly made for poke or isn't automatic is just bad

[near scroll]

indeed, it's pain (i have not played the finals since s10 dropped)

[slow linden]

If you enjoy minigun play it they gave it 50 more ammo

[near scroll]

that's cute

but meh, i've been playing deadlock and actually have friends that play that game, as opposed to the finals where i'm a sad little chud soloQ-er

[vocal flume]

there has to be some bugged ass desync issue with cb01 and .357, sometimes i feel like the shots dont even register even though its right on the person

[slow linden]

Well hit me up I play finals with at least one other person at all times

[near scroll]

who knows, maybe i will

[slow linden]

Goo guide thee

[random depot]

Yes fuck the car

[near scroll]

https://tenor.com/view/na-bro-what-the-hell-gif-7793300054678430924

😳

[vocal flume]

LOL WHAT? It's kinda ass bro, sometimes it hits hard which is great but most of the time its not functioning as it should, its the most inconsistent weapon i find, especially back to back games it doesnt deal the proper damage as it should

[near scroll]

imagine saying an automatic hitscan weapon is inconsistent

[vocal flume]

it is, imagine not being able to understand how the servers are shit and dont perform well, imagine also not understanding that the magnum and cb01 have random spread for no reason and cause shots to miss even though its literally hitscan

[near scroll]

servers being shit doesn't mean hitscan is inconsistent, just that the entire game is, and one of the most consistent forms of hitreg is affected too

[vocal flume]

yes it does, the worse the server, the worse the registration and damage output, stability of the server dictates the registration, this isnt some single player game, latency and ping/packets bursts of the server causes issues, the worse the server behaves the worse the game will run, causing shots to not even register, go into practice mode and hip fire the cb01 into a dummy, it literally misses and the shots go either around the target or through them

[near scroll]

i'm sorry but are you complaining that peter isn't 100% accurate when hipfiring?

[vocal flume]

its not just hip fire its also scoped in, there are people who even say that a shot will just go somewhere else even though its scoped in and aimed on the person, servers cause issues which cause hitscan to not work properly

[near scroll]

if u jumpshoot spread will be applied even when ADS'd

it's on the way down that u're accurate not on your way up

[vocal flume]

ive had and still continue to have no registration with the sniper, especially on the platform in powershift, the game has micro fluctuations with its servers which cause issues, its rare but it does occur

i never mentioned anything about jumping

i am talking about standing, it should go straight as its hitscan but it doesnt

[near scroll]

we know the servers are inconsistent, but i don't think there's anything wrong specifically with peter and fcar

[vocal flume]

it has some issues and the servers need a fresh maintenance every month, i dunno why embark gives 0 effort into the servers

[near scroll]

cuz they stupid fr

[vocal flume]

fcar has its issues, some shots reg and others dont, ive experienced it, its rare but it does happen, which is a shame because this game is hella fun and dope to play but the way its being handled is a joke

[slow linden]

This guy just can't aim I think,he's always complaining about some sort of hitscan not hitting,the other day he was complaining that sniper didn't work 😭

[near scroll]

so does every other hitscan cause its the servers that are bad and not fcar

[vocal flume]

sniper rifle on platform in powershift doesnt act as a hitscan when the plat is moving, all the shots become projectile, just because it doesnt happen to you doesnt mean its not present

[vocal flume]

FCAR depends on the server, overall ive been using it more and its become really good but again the servers dictate how it behaves

there are small desyncs and fluctuations in the game but its rare, when it happens you definitely realize it

[slow linden]

You're not supposed to be on platform with sniper You're supposed to be giving it covering fire

[vocal flume]

never said i was on the platform. maybe you interpreted it that way from my message but im not talking about on plat

[slow linden]

That's even worse,enemies on the platform are free kills for sniper

@sudden pewter gookenuinely this goy can't be real

[random depot]

The fucking car is fucking broken end of story

https://tenor.com/view/russia-car-gif-19939928

[vocal flume]

when it registers yes!

[slow linden]

I have no problem using sniper in powershift,it's literally a top weapon in powershift

[vocal flume]

yes same but its an issue with the plat and hitscan

[slow linden]

It's the servers not the weapon gng

Weapons perfect

[vocal flume]

saniper needs a hitscan buff, its not as good as it should be

fcar is fine, servers just need to be buffed

cb01 is fine too maybe a fire rate nerf and a hitscan to 65m nerf otherwise its in a good place

[slow linden]

Sniper is a hitscan,all hitscan weapons have a set distance where they become projectile,it's not the Sniper or the platform you're just too far

And you wouldn't be too far if you'd just lead shots a bit

[slow linden]

Fcar needs to be reverted it was a pretty good weapon before the buff

[vocal flume]

Sniper rifle is hitscan to 40m after it becomes a projectile, its NOT full hitscan like most of if not all the weapons,, i know the distance of the sniper i have it as my highest leveled weapon and have mainly been using it but i know there is an issue with the platform itself as it moves its not smooth and doesnt register hitscan shots as hitscan

Its rare but it does happen, ive had it where i fired all 6 rounds and it didnt even register on the person and it was in the 30m range.

[slow linden]

All hitscan weapons aren't full hitscan

[vocal flume]

Then they arent hitscan

[slow linden]

Sniper shouldn't be any different

[vocal flume]

All hitscan guns are hitscan otherwise you wouldnt damage players cross maps while aiming on them as they are moving. They have spread but ultimately they are hitscan

[slow linden]

There's a cut off range where the scan ends and a physical bullet is spawned

[vocal flume]

No there is only a damage drop off range not a hitscan range, sniper rifle has it at 40m, and i think some of the heavy weapons have it at 25m or so

But i wish i played more where the sniper was fully hitscan all ranges like the beta up till i think s4.

[near scroll]

is that true? isnt it just sniper and ks that start off hitscan and become projectile?

[slow linden]

Fairly certain,only the m11 and the minigun that I can think of is full hitscan

[near scroll]

ive never heard that before, would need to check

[near scroll]

wrong

comically loud buzzer sound effect

[tardy light]

I feel you’re just making this up

I can actually feel sniper projectile and it’s explicitly listed on wiki, every other weapon I’ve never had to lead even at very long range and the wiki is silent on projectile

where are you getting this info from besides vibes in game?

[slow linden]

I'm not,I've beamed with every automatic and only ever noticed a lack of delay on those two weapons

Either that or they have an obsurd scan cut off range

[tardy light]

Are you kidding me dude

[slow linden]

Test it yourself

[tardy light]

You are quite literally making this up

[vocal flume]

Its literally on their own wiki, all guns have a damage drop off, why do you think within a certain meter range a weapon kills with less shots that far away?

[slow linden]

Not that you could really benefit from the m11s theoretical lack of a hit scan drop,the spread and recoil is all over the place

[slow linden]

I'm going off of recent memory

[near scroll]

you said there wasn't a hitscan range on sniper, that is incorrect, sniper is a hitscan up until 40m iirc and then becomes projectile, same with ks-23 but i think that one has only 15 or 25 meters or hitscan range

[vocal flume]

Sniper hitscan is 40m, after 40m it becomes a projectile, thats why it has bullet drop and travel distance

I said it was full hitscan on beta till s4 or so.

[tardy light]

your “feel” that you’re having trouble hitting shots at 60m with hitscan weapons is because you’re missing not because the weapons are projectiles, and the fact that you point out two very high RoF weapons (which are easy to land shots with because they shoot so many bullets) is completely arbitrary based off your hunch

Sniper and KS are the only projectile guns in game (aside from bow, tk, cl, MGL)

U are just straight up spreading misinformation lol

[near scroll]

this is correct

[vocal flume]

And i never said sniper was fully hitscan. I use it alot and i know what it does, im saying the platform in powershift causes hitscan issues where you need to aim infront of the person as the platform is moving for the shot to register even within the 40m hitscan

[tardy light]

Platforms are weird

[slow linden]

No no,not miss,delayed hits,that don't happen with m11 and minigun

[vocal flume]

They are never smooth and seem to be rubberbanding all the time, from what i experienced anyway they are very unstable.

[slow linden]

Because of travel time,because there is a cut off range for a lot of autos

[tardy light]

idk what to say man, I never feel that, embark doesn’t confirm that, I’ve never heard anyone else claim that, maybe you lag or something? If you had gameplay footage that’d be one thing but it just sounds false as a statement alone

[tardy light]

there may in fact be a cut off range (idk if you can hit people at 250+ meters) but hitscan means no travel time

[slow linden]

And the only semis that are full hitscan are pistols,revolvers and the lh1,haven't tested the pike extensively it's just too ass

[vocal flume]

Isnt the flamethrower also projectile, like you have to lead your shots with it

[tardy light]

Oh idk lmao maybe

[slow linden]

Yes,it is a projectile,you can also whip it around corners and over cover

[vocal flume]

The only cut off would be damage not hitscan, i think perhaps its the servers where he is shooting someone but the shots are landing on the player but just not registering and damaging.

[tardy light]

yes, a damage cut off is what I mean.

I agree he is definitely experiencing bad servers and interpreting it very incorrectly is funny he calls it “testing”

[slow linden]

I play on two different servers,this observation is consistent on both

[narrow bane]

sniper being hitscan and then projectile is very quirky

just make it a very fast projectile

[vocal flume]

He can test it in practice mode, there is distance and moving dummies to try it out on, for me the servers in the practice mode are far superior to the regular matches.

[near scroll]

ngl giving every hitscan the sniper/ks treatment would be interesting

[vocal flume]

I played on NA and it became hot doo doo and had to change it to Auto, been having lesser issues on Auto than NA even though i live in NA.

[tardy light]

If you don’t record a video it will never be more than crazy ramblings

[slow linden]

In fact conventional hitscan firearms are basically the only consistent thing when I play on Asian servers

[near scroll]

it'd be another balancing lever similar to what damage ramp up could do

[vocal flume]

It got a velocity/drop buff or something, i really havent noticed much difference

[vocal flume]

Are you in asia? Maybe you are playing in a region with high ping/latency causing issues

[slow linden]

I have clips of oddly specific topics but sadly not this,keep hating or take my word for it ig

[slow linden]

I am in NA ,I play in NA and Asia servers

[vocal flume]

Its not hating its just saying that auto hitscan guns will land no matter the distance like instantly, maybe there is spread on the gun but ultimately it is hitting on the thing you are aiming at.

[tardy light]

Why would I take your word for it? You are challenging a fundamental feature of the game with no evidence

[vocal flume]

Yeah just pick auto, i am in NA and played NA servers and they have become utter doo doo, best to just play auto. Its been improving for me tbh

Do you play pc or console

[slow linden]

My evidence is my word and my distrust of embark to do what they say they'll do,they're always doing shadow changes

Pretty sure the flamethrower nerf,the removal of fire spreading from it was never in the patchnotes

[slow linden]

Eh,if it's not minigun or mp5 or Lewis I have no interest in playing it consistently

I stick to melee or revolvers and grenade launchers,but mainly flamethrower lately

[indigo nexus]

observation? Of what evidence?

If most weapons were actually projectile it would not only contradict developer word and community consensus, but it would be really hard to measure in the first place.

[indigo nexus]

they limited fire spread in a patch quite some time ago, for fire in general. It was so a bit of fire wouldn't eventually burn down a whole forest area

[slow linden]

Not at all what I was talking about,flamethrower used to be able to put down fire pools

[indigo nexus]

On areas of foliage. Can it not do so any more?

It was definitely never able to cause fires on arbitrary surfaces

[slow linden]

In buildings dumbass

Are you being intentionally dense?

[indigo nexus]

Intentionally dense for not predicting what you were going to say..?

if that were possible it seems that it must have been prior to the game's release, as anything I can find of S1 gameplay doesn't show any evidence of this

[shell sonnet]

afaik, it was very early
(dont recall seeing it in the beta's)

was insanely expensive to run
so it got removed

[slow linden]

It was removed due to performance issues and not added back when the game had better performance

[indigo nexus]

When?

[slow linden]

Was in open beta,apparently removed season 3

[indigo nexus]

apparently according to?

[shell sonnet]

no fucking way /not mad

[slow linden]

Rumors

[slow linden]

That I don't personally believe

[slow linden]

So you are mad? I don't understand

[shell sonnet]

huh, thought tone indicators would be rather intuitive

[slow linden]

It's late gng

[shell sonnet]

well, now you know

[indigo nexus]

I've never seen a tone indicator use full words so it didn't register as a tone indicator to me

I thought you meant x/y as in a selection, or an inclusive or I guess

If people are to use tone indicators I'm not sure why they'd use punctuation that has normal uses in speech. Why not use {} instead? I don't think there would be potential for confusion then

[shell sonnet]

my though process was "i rarely see them, it may be unreasonable to assume everybody knows, use full words to take the ambiguity out of it"

[slow linden]

Idk man,I'm not great with social cues

[shell sonnet]

thats what theyre usually for
gotten more used to them because of that

[slow linden]

Huh

[shell sonnet]

if someone is making some remark, tone indicators are supposed to convey the way its meant to be taken
genuin question vs rhetorical
serious vs sarcasm
etc.
its supposed to prevent confusion

well...
requires the other person plays along ofc

[slow linden]

I see,so you are unhappy with the flamethrower nerf of mysterious time of implementation

Fair enough

[hazy hemlock]

You keep talking and you keep saying the same shit as me😭 fav mf in this gd server bruh fun comes second cuz if the shit aint. Balanced right people will drop like flies eventually. The only exception is if NOTHING being balanced is part of what is making your game balanced

Also is that a mf complaining about about the fcar being inconsistent??? Yeah bro its no more inconsistent than any automatic weapon in this game. If you dont think its broken im inclined to say your just bad.😂

[shell sonnet]

no, disbelieve it was removed in s3
i would surely have better memory of it

[slow linden]

It was a rumor that I heard,but don't have much stock in,I was up front about that

Fairly certain it was removed in either open beta or very early season 1

Someone said something about it crashing kyoto games tho

[shell sonnet]

ye ye, no worries, i saw that

[shell sonnet]

odd

maybe that was just fire in general, and they had foliage instead
people misremember

[kindred gorge]

"balance > fun" mfers completely disregarding the existence of tf2 and other such games

[compact tundra]

Sniped that fucker

[compact tundra]

I am a firm believer that fun goofy shit and balance should both be considered for changes

[knotty steeple]

Random crits are fair and balanced random crits are fair and balanced

[kindred gorge]

random crits are funny

[knotty steeple]

Also tf2 was made by valve, and valve always delivers

[lusty thorn]

dont play pubs

[knotty steeple]

Leave it to valve to find a way to make random crits fun

[indigo nexus]

A better balance is specifically done with the aim of making the game more fun

I think it's odd to separate the concepts when not bringing in other factors

[kindred gorge]

That’s a good mindset

[frozen hemlock]

suggestion for gadget/spec

gas mask: obscure vision too gain temp imunity to gas

[indigo nexus]

I think that is a very poor idea. A gadget that exists exclusively as a niche counterpick when counters already exist? Why?

And with a downside no less, that would be a wasted slot under virtually every circumstance

[stoic garden]

so that triple gas mine medium becomes viable 🥀

[frozen hemlock]

yes

[stoic garden]

perish the thought

[frozen hemlock]

but only for me

[frozen hemlock]

they should also add a ban hammer so i can use it on u >:P

[last steeple]

@frail wren look at my bow shot and be proud of me pls

considering I had a lot of lag in the game Im happy I could do a cool shot

[frozen hemlock]

PUBLIC PSA: IF U DEFIB ME IM ON HALF HELF AND COL DOWN

swear some people do it just to make my KD worse

[stoic garden]

we know, go say that in #⚡┇the-finals-chat

[hazy hemlock]

This is the point im making. The issue becomes in anything where you pick a specific character most gamers lack the self awareness to set aside their own biases and just want what they play to be broken. When it is broken it needs to be nerfed of course thats less fun because their thing isnt overpowered anymore but its no fun for others if you just GETZ TO BE BROKEN. SO THE WAY I SEE IT IS balance and fun are in most cases one and the same but you do have to put a bit more emphasis on balance so one playerbase doesnt hog all the fun

[hazy hemlock]

What pisses me off is when they got goo grenade AND DONT USE IT TO BLOCK YOU OFF LIKE CMON MAN THROW ME A BONE

[indigo nexus]

This is true, people enjoy doing better so they may defend poor balance decisions with the perspective of largely being the one on the dealing end of the disparity

[hazy hemlock]

@indigo nexus in on mobile and didnt realise caps was on for a bit my fault OG

[hazy hemlock]

Yeah this exactally what I mean. Like i think balance SHOULD be fun centered cuz good balance is what keeps it fun. Yk the rest you got my point

[frozen hemlock]

or, idk, carry me to somewhere safe!

[hazy hemlock]

Tldr let people have fun just dont make it at the expense of other playerbases.

[indigo nexus]

There is a notable exception where a weapon can be measured to be simply more or less enjoyable overall to the playerbase than others due to its traits though, in which case making it a little weaker or stronger can be good for overall player satisfaction

Embark however maybe went a bit far with this logic for the dagger…

(I say maybe because I don’t actually know)

[lapis meadow]

You know what would be really cool. If heavy had a tether, allowing him to yank back team mates from dangerous area's or to help them get back to them.

[indigo nexus]

The raw griefing potential is just too high, maybe. Intentionally or accidentally

[lapis meadow]

It'd be cool, send your light team mate down with a tether attached, then they get the cash box, the heavy could then yank them back up.

Or during a gun fight, you can yank your teammate back into cover.

the only way to balance this would be to stop the heavy from being able to use a gun though. or turn all the way around.

[hazy hemlock]

I disagree to an extent. In a game like the finals where counters exist i beleive it is on the devs to point players in the right direction for players to counterplay stuff properly. Light gets to much hate despite never being close to best class save for those 2 weeks of broken lh1. The class shouldn't be shit on as much for existing. Literally on medium one glitch mine is all you need and most cases where your fighting a light they get shut tf down. As a bonus you also shut down heavy they jjst have more health lol.

Lockbolt on heavy as well would be a good example

[alpine sphinx]

massive server lags

half the teams are missing

dash light are actually such a fucking plague omg
Dash and M11 -> i will not respect you

[signal hill]

More respecatble than m11 invis controller players

[glossy sun]

I think the Zooming lights with Dash and M11 is garbage invis Light can be easily spotted and heard.

[arctic zodiac]

M11 is just overtuned to hell since they have nerfed everything else into the ground.

Highest dps in the game and its a babygun. TBH most Light weapons are too easy to use compared to M & H weapons.

M11 bullethoose
V9S recoilless pistol
ARN220 recoilless AR
93R recoilless Farmas

Its shocking that the LH1 still has recoil at all. Almost like an oversight by how they make guns.

[alpine sphinx]

it is ridiculously busted, especially since dash is also overtuned as hell

[arctic zodiac]

Well the game gets balanced for Ruby players and dash isnt a problem if you never miss a bullet.

[alpine sphinx]

yeah, its the same garbage as so many other games. balancing the game around the top 1% means at least 80% of the playerbase suffers

[last steeple]

Not missing a bullet ❌
Having a decent mates and playing with your team instead of being an egoist, ✅
If a light uses all of his 3 dashes to duel you, he will be easily traded, if he doesn't, having a decent aim is enough, know that dashes are better at repositioning, engaging and disengaging that they are at dueling

80% of the playerbase suffering from dashes is just false 😭

But note that it's normal if you die from a light dashes M11 on a 1v1

It's meant to be like this, unless you are a great heavy using his utils

Or an insane player not missing any bullets indeed

[arctic zodiac]

The M11 has been S-Tier for far too long and its waaay too easy to use for its effect

[last steeple]

Without a great spray control it looses easily a lot of range, but for controller players it's just too good I do agree

But if you don't have a rlly good spray control it forces you to come close and to be vulnerable to a coordinated team

But please dashes aren't op wether you played a lot or not

[arctic zodiac]

Totally. I just think that weapons that are that easy to use shouldnt be that effective.

[arctic zodiac]

I dont mind dashes that much. Its the guns that bother me.

[last steeple]

And dashes nerf didn't affect that much great players using meta weapons but it's annoying to see bow a bit nerfed caus of the dashes nerf

[last steeple]

I think they should make it harder to use so it doesn't loose its identity

M11 having a low ttk is a great thing

[slow linden]

They are

[arctic zodiac]

Alot of new players get stuck with L as its just so much easier to control the weapons.

[slow linden]

Pubs indeed is bad

[arctic zodiac]

Plus short reloads just takes alot of the reload timing out of the equation

[last steeple]

I don't think it is the reason why new players spam L, like fcar for example melts and is easy to use

And there's a lot of other weapons like this, it's just that light is the movement class and it's fun and all

[arctic zodiac]

Its easy to use now after they removed the hard pull it had.

Anyone can melt with a M11. It makes guns like the Matter useless.

[shell sonnet]

Good ol ubersaw

[last steeple]

Not true, m11 do perform better in most of the situations, but not in all situations, matter do allow more poke as it is a shotgun, and is still a super solid peak and it is fun to play

In this game you can play off meta and still win

Well mgl or spear might be some exceptions

[arctic zodiac]

Dont really need much poke with 266dps

[last steeple]

But matter is super solid and it's not far from being meta

[arctic zodiac]

i love the matter

but the M11 is just too rewarding

[last steeple]

You can still beat "non skilled" M11 players with matter

And you can still perform well with matter, so M11 having a low skill floor isn't a problem

It could be nerfed, but it's not mandatory

[arctic zodiac]

Its having a low skill floor is an issue for the casual pop though

Wont affect high elo anyway if it was higher

[last steeple]

I mean when I played in bronze and silver M11 was never a problem for me

[slow linden]

I was running around teufort 247 with a sharpened volcano fragment and i would always random crit this specific soldier player to the point where I apologized to him,I couldn't stop laughing

[last steeple]

As I already said you can still win with non meta loadouts, and this even while not being sweaty

[arctic zodiac]

Just think the guns should have a higher skill floor thats all.

[last steeple]

It probably should but it's not that big of a deal

[slow linden]

All hitscans except minigun sure

Also lewis

[arctic zodiac]

It kinda is. Light is like the biggest complaint from newer players.

[slow linden]

And the revolvers

[arctic zodiac]

They hate Lights dashing around pubstomping everyone. Especially with all the damn smurfs.

[last steeple]

Btw a casual player abusing M11 has a lot of other flaws you can use to beat em, even if you are yourself a new player, the finals makes you think and learn how to counter things that bother you

[broken mulch]

cause new players cant aim

[arctic zodiac]

And M11 doesnt really require you to aim

[last steeple]

Smurfs are a way bigger problem than lights tbh 😭

[broken mulch]

heavy beats light in a straight fight p much 100% of the time

obviously this is why the light makes it not a straight fight

[slow linden]

I see way more medium smurfs anyway,medium doesn't get enough hate

[arctic zodiac]

Feels like M is slowly falling out of the meta though

[broken mulch]

it was last season idk bout this season

[grave harness]

I need help if anyone can help figure out how 2 make this a constant https://medal.tv/games/the-finals/clips/mvkvc0TdSWugY2F1X?invite=cr-MSx1elgsNTQ3NDY4Mzg2&v=7

[slow linden]

They're like not tho

[broken mulch]

thats cool asf im ngl but i cant get on for a bit so sorry

[last steeple]

Nah absolutely not, light is the worst class in the game

Medium has defib, heal beam, and now has movement with shockwave

[broken mulch]

its between light and medium rn for sure

[last steeple]

Light is slightly worse

[broken mulch]

heavy has p much always been at the top

[last steeple]

And light requires more effort and skill

[arctic zodiac]

L just has so much utility right now and the H+ can be a gamebreaker

[broken mulch]

and if they get reliable vertical mobility i think we'll see more HHH

[last steeple]

I'm talking in mid-high level

[broken mulch]

since thats what heavy relies on the other classes for

[broken mulch]

light when people can aim kinda sucks yea

[last steeple]

I hope we'll never see a triple comp meta

[broken mulch]

plat is hell for me but thats partially cause im playin sword light

i am no longer in plat after the incidents that occured yesterday

[last steeple]

Yeah you just need to have a great positioning and to play support, I like it but it's not the kind of brain-dead playstyle you would see in new players lobbies

Infuser and gateway are the reason light can still keep up with medium

[broken mulch]

i want to make tracking dart work so bad but H+ is js so much more useful 95% of the time

and gateway and goo are p much required for sword dont listen to anyone who tells u otherwise

gateway is a bit more debatable but goo is 100% needed

[last steeple]

There's a dude on ig and maybe other social medias who makes it work

[broken mulch]

on sword specifically
it js seems like theres a synergy, tracking dart at farther ranges, sword at close range

[last steeple]

Yeah on sword

[broken mulch]

o fr?
i havent seen him

[last steeple]

I forgot his name, it's a drawing of a cat that smashes a keyboard 🧍‍♂️

[slow linden]

Triple heavy is fun

[broken mulch]

H+ generally ends up feeling more useful and then whenever i get put with 2 other lights i run smoke cause im not good enough at heavy to run it

i play sword light or heal beam medium and i like playing lewis heavy but i suck at it so i dont play it in ranked

[slow linden]

Honestly more Triple heavy would happen if more heavies learned goo gun

[broken mulch]

goo gun is significantly more effort to get use out of so it makes sense that people dont play it

[kindred gorge]

If heal ball stacked then there would be more triple heavies

[slow linden]

It's fun tho

[broken mulch]

it also js vaguely feels like a cheesy pick

[last steeple]

I think if they deleted a certain spe we would see more goo guns 😏

[broken mulch]

kinda like picking dagger

[kindred gorge]

Actually fighting three go guns at once sounds like hell

[broken mulch]

that sounds miserable

k bye now i have a calc exam

[slow linden]

At a glance yea,but it's way less cheesy than winchclaw and unlike winchclaw it actually takes skill

It's the flawed Swiss army knife that almost no one cares to pick up,but those who do will have a hard time putting it down

[slow linden]

It'd be a literal hell if one of them were me,I'm a gooflame main

[slow linden]

Kill the serpent in the garden

[grave harness]

https://medal.tv/games/the-finals/clips/mvmnrBsmm121c2HfL?invite=cr-MSxUUlAsNTQ3NDY4Mzg2&v=11 this one is even more confusing 2 me

[muted slate]

.

[sinful bolt]

Does anyone know how to get the arn-220 skin that has the tiger stripes on it and says pop pour perform?

[timber sparrow]

the lightning one?

[sinful bolt]

no I saw one in game today someone had that looked very similar to the m60 skin with tiger stripes not the lightning one

I have looked everywhere and have not seen how to get it

[timber sparrow]

do you have a picture of the m60 skin?

[sinful bolt]

the m60 skin from the osp uze sponsorship

[tropic river]

Nerf the crossbow already, you cant hear where it coming from, its so easy to aim and has insane good ttk. Most OP weapon in the game and ruins every fight

[sinful bolt]

but it's on the arn the black and yellow stripes and says pop pour perform down the barrel

[timber sparrow]

is this not it?

[sinful bolt]

no

[timber sparrow]

this is the only other ospuze skin for the ARN, I dont know what other skin it would be

[sinful bolt]

no

[timber sparrow]

u sure it was the ARN?

[sinful bolt]

I have looked everywhere and can't find it, positive it was

[timber sparrow]

it would be on the wiki if it exists

[sinful bolt]

I have checked the wiki its not there but I promise you it exists

I have it on my stream from earlier but cant get a pic until later

[timber sparrow]

if u can get a pic that would be nice

[sudden pewter]

You mean the M60?

[slow linden]

Lmao

[sudden pewter]

The Tiger Stripes theme is only present as of last season(?) and from some cosmetics during the Heavy Hitters event

[tidal urchin]

Revolver needs a nerf a tad

[sinful bolt]

none of those

[sudden pewter]

Are you absolutely certain it's the ARN?

And if possible could you post the video/image that you're referencing?

[timber sparrow]

he said he can get pic later

[slow linden]

Hell no,mods kill this guy with hammers

[sudden pewter]

Sweet

[hazy hemlock]

Cool story now mediums do it with more movement and better than light. Lmfao

Actually ignore me I no longer care I just realised its chat from people who think light is top tier lmfao I dont have the energy for this

[sinful bolt]

do i have to have nirto to post a pic

nitro

It won’t let me post a pic

[timber sparrow]

u just need roles

u get em by chatting

[sinful bolt]

Guys please help us get info on this ARN skin above

[sinful bolt]

Ok makes sense

[harsh mauve]

I'm struggling anyone have some ideas for a medium build?

[lone wagon]

howd u do or are ustudying, lk im doin calc too, hate it

[broken mulch]

i was studyin
i hate calc but tbh the calc that i have to do in physics e&m is significantly harder than the stuff i do in my calc class anyways

[kindred fog]

lets play

[sudden pewter]

I’ve never seen this? Is it an unreleased skin or an event reward?

[tidal urchin]

the m60 one you get from sponcer not sure abouy the arn

[timber sparrow]

I have no clue, I just posted the picture for him since he didnt have perms

[proper pumice]

im having a really hard time figuring out the shockwave bounce pad combo...i seem to either shoot the shockwave it too early and fly over the pad or hit it too late and have my shockwave bounce off my pad as a projectile. help?

[old flame]

high chance it's a part of embark partner bundle or a gift from the newsletter

it is deffo not something from store / event since wiki database has all of these skins for arn already added

[sudden pewter]

Slide and aim directly down

[grim goblet]

i mean are you interested in a support medium build?

[dry widget]

Cerb still buns

[vocal flume]

its good when its used agaisnt you but when you use it its ass, shot someone direct with it and nothing even registered

[near scroll]

still better than melee

[dry widget]

I mean...it gun so...

[near scroll]

yes. makes me sad

[slow linden]

I like it,could use a tiny buff but it honestly feels fine

Just cause it can't kill a heavy and 3 seconds with no effort like the fcar doesn't mean it should

[dry widget]

I hate the reload

Oh sh0t

[slow linden]

It feels fine

[dry widget]

I am red-name now

[slow linden]

And that's one of the things they could give a little buff without effecting the overall power but making it feel better to use

[dry widget]

Reload takes too long imo or I just hate that it's cancelled by any action.

[slow linden]

Use minigun or flamethrower and you'll understand why reloads are canceled

[dry widget]

Maybe I'm dog but I feel like it already loses a lot of trades unless you really nail the shots up close. Therefore, it feels like a gun that you want to chip with and run away.

[dry widget]

I mean you don't have to reload those as often. You get a lot more juice per cycle.

[slow linden]

Flamethrower has like an AR amount of ammo

You do have to reload frequently and it's a slower ttk than a lot of options unless you're fighting lights

[dry widget]

Cerb is like a weaker Double-Barrel that doesn't outright kill anyone most of the time.

So you're just constantly getting people low and then being forced to run away and reload.

[slow linden]

I think it's fairly serviceable if you space your shots to let them burn out a bit

[dry widget]

Idk. Feels bad whenever I use it and another gun would perform far better.

It's very satisfying to use though. It feels fun. It just doesn't feel very strong.

[slow linden]

Positioning is very important for non ars or non smgs

[dry widget]

True

[slow linden]

Positioning isn't really that important if you can just point and click adventure most problems unless they're just in a plain better position

[uneven musk]

Hey can i have some help with a minigun build

[cerulean furnace]

Quick question, is there a bug with invis? Whenever someone uses it I can't hear the glitch effect anymore despite being near them and see them move, both from Vanish bomb and spec. Used to hear it quite clearly back then, did it got buffed?

[random depot]

For heavy we are the position lmao, for mediums they need to play around the heavy and lights generated space.

[last steeple]

I don't think it got changed so it might be a bug, have you tried with someone in private matches just to be sure ? And also you should turn on night mode in audio settings it makes weak sounds louder like footsteps or invis

[cerulean furnace]

I'll try doing that, been quite busy so I didn't have the time. Thanks for the tip, I usually dislike having Night Mode on but I'll check it out if it helps

[brisk acorn]

That is kind of the point

You hit em once and let the fire damage tick

Then just don’t die until you can hit them again

[gritty nebula]

Wish they add reticle size adjustment.
Personaly would like to reduce size of it..
Works okay-ish on V9S but I find it too big on 01 REPEATER
Sight customization would be great thing since most sights and reticles are kinda bad (my personal opinion).

[broken cave]

I feel like if dual blades can block melee then riot shield should be able to as well, makes more sense too imo since its an actual shield

That or make it so neither can, it would just be nice for those two to be consistent in that way

[cerulean furnace]

But the shield can, most melee hitboxes are just swings that go around the shield

[broken cave]

Damn it's so inconsistent I thought it genuinely didn't happen

[cerulean furnace]

Nah it happens. If it helps, Dual Blades block is also incredibly inconsistent, especially when ur point blank at them

[boreal laurel]

I run healing emitter, pyro mines, and motion sensors. For the spec I would say C&S (but I am a goo gun addict so there’s that 😏)

[uneven musk]

Thanks

[indigo nexus]

it just has to flatly hit the shield, but if even for one frame of the active hitbox the shield isn't in the way, it won't work

[warm python]

thanks for the night mode tip i will try it

[compact tundra]

It works pretty well against swords for that reason, you can block the lunge consistently, the swing is much harder to block but medium will win that ttk race so it's risky to slug it out with a riot shield

[knotty steeple]

Nothing gets my blood boiling more than a medium who walks around holding block with dual more than actually attacking. Especially when I'm using minigun. I found this with dual and riot shield, if I'm using a single shot weapon like revolver, I just run for my life while snapping around to shoot once then continue running. Or go up a zipline

[alpine apex]

I feel this. I’m fine for it to block some. But seemingly all bullets is kinda crazy. None of the other melee weapons can do that.

Also just despise anyone running sword, dagger, DB with cloak.

I love the weapons themselves but that strat just seems so…. cheap

[polar coyote]

whats db

[cerulean furnace]

yea running away perfectly counters them, popping back to shoot em works, and if u know they're low health u can bait them into attacking to drop their guard and then shoot them (Only really viable with single shot burst weapons tho)

Also y'all gotta learn that Dual Blades gets countered the moment there's 2 of u. They thrive on duels

[sudden pewter]

Dual Blades don’t block melee, just mitigates damage to 25%

[cerulean furnace]

(Fun fact, the barrier to deflect doesn't exist when u shoot them point blank)

[cerulean furnace]

Yep

Kinda wish they did 🤔

[sudden pewter]

I don’t believe melee should have melee be its counter, once you’re within distance to throw hands you’ve mitigated the weakness of meee

I wouldn’t want extra hoops

[stoic garden]

your weakness...

[sudden pewter]

Minigun

https://tenor.com/view/thefinals-minigun-season-6-the-finals-coined-gif-9581155447877553437

[cerulean furnace]

Admittedly, u can just stop shooting them and pull out ur RPG or other shenanigans (Teammates helping u especially)

[sudden pewter]

CL40 existing

[cerulean furnace]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1480999444194398480/1483201021676093470/image0.gif

aw man :c

[stoic garden]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1480999444194398480/1483201021676093470/image0.gif

[cerulean furnace]

CRIES

Need to yap more so I can post funy gif

[alpine apex]

Double barrel shotty. Aka SH1900

[alpine apex]

That would require my friends to stop focusing on the heavy in the corner with the dome shield, healing emitter, and flamethrower and turn towards my screams of terror as I’m trying to jump out the nearest window.

[cerulean furnace]

dam they got u good

[stoic garden]

if you said lewis gun it coulda been me

[alpine apex]

They always do lmao

[alpine apex]

I firmly believe it was you. In fact, it’s any other player other than the one slicing up me and my teammates

[alpine sphinx]

m11 is actually such a fucking stain on this game right now, easily the least fun to play against

[stoic garden]

v9s:

[alpine apex]

Oops…. 😅

To be fair I only started using it after they nerfed the XP a few seasons back.

[stoic garden]

Lowkey m11 has to be the most balanced top tier weapon this game has

[sudden pewter]

I don’t mind fighting M11

I’d rather face it than an SR84, Dagger, or DoubleBarrel.

[stoic garden]

I'd rather face m11 than arn

[alpine sphinx]

most skillless piece of shit weapon tbh, no offense

[alpine sphinx]

nah, give me any of those any time over a m11

[sudden pewter]

You know not what you ask fool. Your hubris, your blind hatred, will blind you in kind. Ashes build no homes.

[alpine sphinx]

those weapons all have weaknesses tho, m11 can still deal way more damage than it should be able to across 30m+

like at anything more than 10m you should be extremely inaccurate and hit maybe 20% of your shots

actually, with that rof and dps, 20% is still too much over range

to top it all off the weapon has never been nerfed, there was one "kinda" nerf where they increased damage fall off but there they also buffed falloff range so it doesnt really count as a straight up nerf

[sudden pewter]

That’s cap

Its max range is 17.5m

Are you confusing it with the ARN?

[stoic garden]

shit deals like 9 damage after 17.5m

[alpine sphinx]

bro it has *max falloff range, thats not max range

[sudden pewter]

I’m 90% certain he’s referring to the ARN. Its max range is 42.5 and I could see a casual player confusing it with an SMG

[stoic garden]

you know what he means

[sudden pewter]

Someone confused it for an LMG last week

[stoic garden]

LOL

[alpine sphinx]

it also has 1000rpm and one of the fastest reloads in the game so you can just rain bullets

[sudden pewter]

Were I a stream monkey I would load up the practice range right now and show how ineffective it is at range

[stoic garden]

true, but like almost every single gun in the game outranges it

even if you can perfectly control the recoil you will lose to most weapons at 20m

do you understand how little 9 damage is

[sudden pewter]

I’m sure he does, probably just had a particularly frustrating match. I’m sure we’ve all been there

[alpine apex]

lol I do the spray and pray and fast reload like you said. But definitely would rather face it than a BUNCH of other weapons.

Anything that’s a cheap strat or lazy is infuriating to me. Cloak with melee or DB, lobbing CL40 shots through windows/doorways aimlessly from an adjacent room/building, camping a corner with a flamethrower behind a barricade or dome shield WITH healing emitter.

Far worse “skill-less” combos out there

It’s just so unimaginative. I’d much rather die to a cloaked bow who can move and aim like a god than some 12 year old on his 8th Smurf account running cloak sword any day

[sudden pewter]

Poor yellow role 😔

[alpine sphinx]

cloak with melee is so fucking easy to counter, you're literally doing the enemy a favor by not picking dash or grapple as melee light

[alpine apex]

They took my thermal away from me 😭

[alpine sphinx]

the only thing its good at is wauting in a corner

[alpine sphinx]

M11 + dash is the most unimaginative build out there, the only thing more generic is maybe healing medium with akm or fcar, but thats it

[stoic garden]

ok bro

[alpine apex]

I don’t run dash 👍

Grapple all day baby!

Verticality is king

[glossy sun]

Very unimaginative... Literally the most CoD Thing anyone can do.

I still want a New weapon for Heavy... Even if it's not part of a Spec...

[alpine apex]

As an orange role I say…

Nothing

Because I’m insignificant 😭😭😭

[sudden pewter]

At least you’re aware of your place in the caste system Ishallah

[glossy sun]

Here I'm still wanting a AMR just to Pierce Walls.

[sudden pewter]

Not happening

[alpine apex]

I’d post a gif saying “yes m’lord” but that’s also not allowed lol

[glossy sun]

Or something that can Do something with Walls.

[sudden pewter]

• KS23
• Minigun
• CL40
• MGL
• Sledge

[glossy sun]

I already use Mini gun... Screw KS weird ass Bullet...

[sudden pewter]

Gadgets?

• C4
• Breach Charge
• Thermal Bore
• Drill*

[glossy sun]

Something better needs to be added since Heavy is 1 off a Weapon.

[alpine apex]

Oh, oh! Tell him about charge and slam and explosive barrels next!

This is so exciting 😁

[sudden pewter]

Rather than adding more weapons I’d rather Embark adjust what we already have.

All melee weapons are being reworked and readjusted next season, that’s essentially 6 new weapons

[glossy sun]

Would been fun if they Added more Events to test out stuff like that CL40 that shoots rockets.

[sudden pewter]

LTM’s as tests are good, don’t affect the game at large and lets them get valuable data

[alpine apex]

Real talk @sudden pewter what are the levels in which to change the color of my skin?

5, 10, 20?

Mainly just want to post gifs and host VCs

[glossy sun]

That's what I mean... Imagine if they Added that Battle pass Cannon skin and make it where it shoots Cannon balls at an Arc.

[sudden pewter]

Try #👋┇welcome and then go to #🏆┇rank-check and use the -r command

-levels

[flat crypt]

Our leveling system

"Why can't I do some things in the server?"

• You may need to level up first!

How to level up? Just look around and join conversations. Lots to talk about!

Lvl 0: Newbie 0xp
• join and create VC • make bug reports • chat in most channels
Lvl 1: <@&1011197091470647317> 35xp
• reactions • external emoji • images in drip check, pet channel
Lvl 3: <@&1011197119199191071> 115xp
• images in most channels • embeds in main chat
Lvl 8: <@&1133322765194235904> 1015xp
• embeds and images everywhere
Lvl 15: <@&1012661788401217579> 3955xp
• external stickers • VC streaming • bragging rights!

Role descriptions: #👋┇welcome
Check your rank: #🏆┇rank-check

[sudden pewter]

Thank you Saphire.

[alpine apex]

Omg WHERE WAS THIS? I swear I looked everywhere

[glossy sun]

I really wanted a Cannon in the Medieval season

[alpine apex]

Also I definitely CANNOT create a VC, only join

[glossy sun]

Not just a skin.

[alpine apex]

Wait…. Unless that got changed????

[glossy sun]

What about a Mine Layer Weapon...?

[spring oasis]

It would be cool if Heavy could pick up an arena carriable in each hand

[sudden pewter]

Stop

Please take a moment to think about the game and it’s weapon ecosystem as well as design philosophy before suggesting anything else

[glossy sun]

I will never Stop!

[sudden pewter]

Then you will burn

[alpine apex]

As a light, this is the worst idea ever.

Unless it’s my mines, because people can just run over them without issue

Might as well lay teddy bears on the ground if that gun is in my hand

[glossy sun]

That's the Point lol..

[spring oasis]

Can I have a flare gun as a weapon that you shoot into the air and it calls a UFO invasion airstrike on your position?

[alpine apex]

Point broken..

Breaken…

Fah! I’ll show myself out 🚪 🏃‍♂️ 💨

[sudden pewter]

I’d rather Medium have some method of reconstructing broken geometry. PointBreak Meta (especially with the last few boxes) is to level the field and then defenders can fight from the safety of their spawn while attackers are forced to move through open ground

[alpine apex]

Omg imagine killstreaks in this game. I’d just set down the controller and never return

[glossy sun]

How about... A Hand held Mortar? That shoots in an Arc.

[sudden pewter]

Goo is burned or otherwise destroyed too quickly, domes and mesh are vulnerable to glitch grenades. There’s no safe avenue to approach in an 8v8 once all cover is gone

[spring oasis]

Their could be a killstreak inspired by the K9 unit from Black Ops 2 but instead of dogs it is really fast and really big Roomba's with swords tied to the top of them

[spring oasis]

I think a really big slingshot or sling would be cool for heavy

[glossy sun]

I know I know An Unguided Missile Launcher that Gradually builds up speed when it travels farther....!!

[alpine apex]

The further we get away from call of duty the better

I’ve never looked back since MW3 and my life is chefs kiss

[glossy sun]

Exactly that I'm thinking about!

[glossy sun]

I was thinking of a Cannon since medieval season.

[lapis meadow]

That would be really cool. Kinda like the ones from half life 2 which I think would work well for the finals.

[glossy sun]

How about a Single shot grenade launcher for the Light that explodes after a certain range?

[sudden pewter]

This is what drives me to drink.

It’s all wrong!!!! Stop!!!

[lapis meadow]

? Why so?

[compact tundra]

Ooo is today a goofy take day, been a while since I've seen goobers just spouting off ideas in here

[alpine apex]

Welcome to the shite show

[compact tundra]

Ooooo wait I actually like this one

[sudden pewter]

Weapon types aren’t a checklist. Specific weapon types are omitted from certain weights because it goes against their intended roles.
A Sniper on Light makes sense, they thrive in extremes and have the mobility to make a getaway once they’re focused, which they need to do due to their smaller health pool. A Sniper on Heavy makes 0 sense because Heavy has defensive utilities that allows them to fortify their position and make it almost impossible to move them.

An LMG on Light (removing their need to reload during an engagement) removes the burst flanker aspect. A GL on Light would be ridiculous given their insane mobility and peek potential.

[alpine apex]

You are quickly becoming my favorite person.

But don’t forget…

In the finals, logic is non existent

Tis a virtual game show after all

[sudden pewter]

“It’s a gameshow” isn’t a valid argument for ignoring basic game balance.

[alpine apex]

Nope, but lore wise, it’s accurate

[sudden pewter]

That’s a nothingburger statement.

[alpine apex]

I’m a nothingburger orange role remember?

[sudden pewter]

Of course, how could I forget 😔

[alpine apex]

My job as your plucky sidekick is to say dumb shit and support your bloodlust

[compact tundra]

But hear me out, we make it a hand held long range mortar. When you ads you go from moving your camera to selecting where on the ground the mortar should it, with it basically acting like a missile strike weapon. Would be super cool since you have to balance movement via camera with shooting, and since there's a delay between when it hits and when you fire you have to predict where they'll move like a projectile weapon

[lapis meadow]

I mean. I think an anti material rifle for heavy would be really sick and fitting.
it would fit the role for a heavys arsonal while also giving the player a really strong weapon for clearing walls.

[alpine apex]

Especially if there’s a princess involved

[compact tundra]

That's just a ks-23 skin tho

[alpine apex]

Because really, what is Gaston without his Lafue?

[glossy sun]

I think the AMR Pierces walls

[lapis meadow]

but have it be more devestating, probably give it a longer reload and give it range.

[compact tundra]

There are no wall piercing weapons in this game, and sadly there really shouldn't be since it'd become the wall hack special in the first week

[sudden pewter]

What part of it exactly fits the Heavy? The Brawler archetype that thrives in close/mid range engagements?

[alpine apex]

Pierces my nips when it shoots me in the chest

Too far?

Yes, yes, quite. That was silly

[compact tundra]

Na we don't need to give the class with the most stall and defence items, and the only class that can heal themselves, a sniper

[alpine apex]

I am INCREDIBLY bored at work over here guys

[sudden pewter]

Embark experimented with giving Heavy a dedicated long range option with the BFR, a move that went against the basis of the archetype.

Then realized it was a terrible idea and that they fucked up, now the BFR doesn’t have a niche and we have another weapon in the Pike-Pit

[glossy sun]

What if you had to Charge the AMR for it to pierce

[lapis meadow]

I mean. A heavy usually can't do much in long range anyway. Giving them one tool to do so isn't gonna destroy the world

[glossy sun]

Like a Railgun

[compact tundra]

The BFR took over the meta when it released, it only had a 40m range I think, a sniper wouldn't have a range limit really, that'd destroy what semblance of balance we still have

The lewis and D-eagles are the most range heavy should ever have, and the BFR proves that, if heavy has long range burst it breaks the meta

But light mortar, that idea slaps, I love it

[glossy sun]

Mortar was for heavy.

[compact tundra]

Na give it to light

[stoic garden]

but scotty said "anything can happen at the finals"

[glossy sun]

Light already has mobility.

[lapis meadow]

theres an arguement to be made that you could merely just get up close and it wouldn't be an issue for dealing with an AMR. Most weapons meant for range (with the exception of light weapons) CANNOT survive any real encounters when upclose.

Most lights just get up in your face anyway. so it really CANNOT be that bad of an issue.

[stoic garden]

the thing is that the long range weapons in this game have actually decent ttks even up close

[glossy sun]

And can use a Sniper meant mortar for heavy to break walls and such

[sudden pewter]

Anything that doesn’t OHK Lights. Because the only thing that gets to OHK Light is another Light.

[stoic garden]

c4 btw

[glossy sun]

Listen to the long range whistle or a mortar coming down.

I would love that.

[lapis meadow]

an anti material rifle would be too slow to reload or deal consective shots even while dealing with a target upclose.
probably make it like the CL where it does damage to yourself when it's explosion hits you and it'd be fine.

[compact tundra]

Funnily enough the BFR was ran with winch, cause you could winch + 1 shot a light

[compact tundra]

That's the point, it's a slower fire rate hard to aim weapon that you'll need the ability to keep your distance with

[lapis meadow]

I Mean... if you get caught by that as a light then it's geniunely your fault.

[compact tundra]

By a winch?

[lapis meadow]

Yeah. The fastest class and you can't predict or evade the hitbox of a vertical barrel kinda sounds like a skill issue...
Hell I've done it plenty of times without dash ability.

[compact tundra]

It's a super fast projectile with a wide hitbox and instant deployment, there is no dodging that especially in close range. The way you beat a winch is to avoid the winch range

[stoic garden]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1205580028864372766/1490857640983527505/snip.mp4?ex=69df7820&is=69de26a0&hm=2b7c6d3596a5ad3131a56f168688ec8e8e53e660f735212a467cfde6662ef59f& this is so fair and balanced

[glossy sun]

I wouldn't give light a Mortar I was Already Oppressed by 2 Sniper lights and Then them having a way to Destroy the Barricades without a Cool down does not make it better.

Also Light has more Range with any gun? Like Hello stop standing near a Heavy with a winch!

[lapis meadow]

Why yes. I believe that this is fair and balanced.

[stoic garden]

thermal bore

[glossy sun]

That's what I mean

What f Thermal bore didn't had a Cooldown

[stoic garden]

https://tenor.com/view/povjisoo-gif-87348781533848892

[sudden pewter]

KS23 exists

[stoic garden]

real..

[lapis meadow]

I much think about the finals like a fighting game. Every move and input matters. Predicting your enemy and playing against them with your team is the name of the game.
you must use every bit of information you obtain to your advantage in order to counter and ultimately win the game.

A man can see an opponents specialty. And prepare for it.
If it's that hard to do then I think we could hit up matches in overwatch :3

[sudden pewter]

Requires manual detonation and for the Light to eat the full blast, but true

[glossy sun]

I'm serious about a Main weapon for Heavy or just let us Use Our fists.

[sudden pewter]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/856603795738722307/1425920121473470554/togif.gif

[alpine apex]

I mean you could do something like “brass knucks” and instead of the pathetic amount of damage a melee punch does, maybe they get like 100hp damage or something? Or make it like dagger where if you clock them in the back it’s a one shot?

[glossy sun]

Have you Been reading what the other Says or are you Fixated on me~?

Me talking about 2 Lights sniping me while I'm barricading But then imagine if a Light has A mortar that can't be a thing.

They already have 2 options and no one uses it against Barricades or walls

And those who uses it they are using it Wrong

[compact tundra]

But wasn't your point that getting close to them is how you counter the sniper? That's the problem I'm pointing out. Winch guarantees a headshot on someone within 12 meters, but being past 12 meters gives the sniper the advantage

[glossy sun]

Would be funny just punching the crap out of people for fun lol

[glossy sun]

I was talking about Heavy having a Way to bomb camping people. Rather than Trying to walk in

(I hate Sniper light Having most power at long range and Blank point)

(C'mon Raise the Spread while moving)

I get it with Bow cause it's a Projectile.

[sudden pewter]

Mortar on light is a terrible idea. That goes without saying

[glossy sun]

I'm not the one that said it.

[compact tundra]

I disagree

[sudden pewter]

MGL and RPG already fulfill that.

[compact tundra]

I am the one who wants mortar light, it is a green that spews this shit

[sudden pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cat-pat-cut-this-vein-gif-15495131099012497825

You should know better

[glossy sun]

I would rather have Bore do damage than have a mortar on light lol

Heck no one Expected a Minigun for Heavy to be in the game.

[compact tundra]

No, I never no better, I think simply to think, not to understand
But hear me out, we make it a hand held long range mortar. When you ads you go from moving your camera to selecting where on the ground the mortar should hit, with it basically acting like a missile strike weapon. Would be super cool since you have to balance movement via camera with aiming your shot, and since there's a delay between when you fire and when it hits you have to predict where they'll move like a projectile weapon. Make it do like 120 damage in direct since it'd be difficult to use

[compact tundra]

Think C4tter, you'd aim in 3 dimensional space, most aiming takes place in 2 dimensions, but with this, your literally dragging a blue travel guide line across the ground to tell the mortar where to fire, it'd the the only weapon that aims in a true 3d space, itd be so sick to use

[glossy sun]

Okay okay how about a Radiation Beam that Messes up with your Vision like that Kill streak from MW2

[compact tundra]

Na but I do want to see heavy get a flak gun

[glossy sun]

I would like that honestly.

[sudden pewter]

Anything that removes the player from their contestant is a no-go from me. A mortar would remove the LoS requirement to offset its offensive potential.

Snipers at least need to be visible to an enemy to take a shot.

[compact tundra]

Na na it's not a top down view. You know how grenade launchers have those like ADS lines that show where they'll go in other games

[glossy sun]

Ahem MGL.

Bounce off wall to another room...? Hello?

[compact tundra]

It's like that but the line comes from the sky and your cursor directs where on land it hits, so like it's hard to explain but your dragging the little blue ball on the ground that shows there the strike will hit around when ads'd

[sudden pewter]

A trajectory guide?

[glossy sun]

So that Means Your against MGL?

[sudden pewter]

Still a hard no. Light of all weights shouldn’t have access to a mortar.

[compact tundra]

YES, there is one for there the shit will land but it isn't centered on your screen, you move that while ADS'd

[glossy sun]

Most likely Mortar should go to heavy or Medium and Medium has CL40

MGL is unreliable

Please Rework when.

[sudden pewter]

Medium is at its best when orbiting a Heavy and providing support through healing or mobility utilities. MGL is due for a light rework to make its role more concise. I personally don’t believe a Mortar has a place in the game as a dedicated weapon. As a very niche gadget perhaps but nothing more.

[alpine apex]

Now all I can picture is a medium running circles around their heavy and when asked why he didn’t help team fire he shouts “I was on the dark side of your moon!”

🍑 🌘

[sudden pewter]

That’s not a terrible way to look at it, I use the term orbit because you’re not supposed to be hugging the heaviness necessarily having some distance is healthy but you wanna stay within range so that you can provide support when needed

[compact tundra]

I honestly love the mortar light idea enough to work on it, once I finish the weapon concept I'll dump it here

[alpine apex]

That’s it, I’m switching to medium. That way I can stare at heavy cheeks all day

Hashtag, finals twerk team #

[glossy sun]

Twerking emote When?

[sudden pewter]

You will be burned at the stake for your transgressions.

[compact tundra]

Your fire is not nearly hot enough to out burn my love of stupid weapon concepts

[sudden pewter]

It was removed from the game after being shown in a teaser. Replaced with generic K-Pop Dance (this is not a joke)

[alpine apex]

@sudden pewter I think we need to play one session together. Minimum of 3 games. Just let me follow you around and whisper sweet nothings into your ear and engage in shenanigans

[compact tundra]

They added it back as a separate emote that's sold with the modified version as a set. People were upset that it wasn't the same as the clip so they changed it but then people who bought the other version cause it was goofy were upset so they just reverted the change and then added another emote with the dance shown in the trailer and you get both when you buy one

[glossy sun]

Really? When was this?

[sudden pewter]

So they changed it again after the fact?

Might pick it up then because I want my CatMaid Medium to throw it back

[compact tundra]

Yea, so full timeline

Trailer of emote shows ass swaying

Emote releases with no ass swaying

People by it anyways cause it's goofy

People who no like goofy mad

Emote changed to add ass swaying

People who bought goofy are now mad

Emote changed back to goofy and second emote with ass swaying added and they are sold for the same price as a set

[spring oasis]

Medium is at its best when it has Dematerializer and a Model 1887 and is playing as aggressive as possible

[alpine apex]

NOW you’re officially my favorite human ever

[sudden pewter]

That was certainly the case for a few seasons. Still very strong, but I wouldn’t personally agree with saying that’s Medium at its best (though that’s mainly opinion)

[sudden pewter]

Will purchase today

I’m hoping we get more Medieval cosmetics as the weeks progress, I’m very much not a fan of the fantasy elements of this season. What offerings we have are pretty lackluster and don’t fit with the rest of the game. Not that they shouldn’t exist, but so few options can be worn with existing cosmetics and mesh well

If the wizard garb was black instead of purple/blue, it would be S tier

[compact tundra]

I'm getting kinda mad at the lack of medieval cosmetics so far, like bro we got 4 different helmets and like 1 set of armour in the battle pass and 1 set of chain mail and a cuirass in the store as part of a bundle and like bro I need more outfits with the damn helmets

[hidden vine]

turrets need to be nerfed.

[sudden pewter]

Embark doesn’t seem to know what’s going on this season. In the S10 showcase the AlfaActa Lady said we could “see the season shift from medieval to fantasy” but that clearly isn’t the case. I’m not against fantasy but they’re outliers in style

[glossy sun]

I mean There is Thief Leather armor and such... Also The witch doctor... I'm using the heaven or Else Armor that looks like a Valkyrie...

What else is there....?

[alpine apex]

Real talk, do turrets lock on quicker based on class? I feel like as a light I could be a mile away behind cover and that thing still beams me the second I peek.

Meanwhile when I play medium, orange, pink, and purple can all stand in an empty room and my turret just sits there smoking a cig like its on break

[glossy sun]

It's based on where they are looking...

[hidden vine]

the light statement is so real but don’t chat to me if ur not w ospuze

[alpine apex]

I’m with whatever cosmetic I haven’t unlocked yet lol

[sudden pewter]

Piss Role 😔

[alpine apex]

Pretty sure that was from like season 7… should probably change it

[hidden vine]

are you employed

[alpine apex]

Unfortunately yes

[compact tundra]

You're a cog in the machine man, open your eyes bro, you like vaiiya, they're using you bro, your a pawn in there game, get outta there man

[glossy sun]

Hey I like Alfa Acta...
But I indulge in Some ospuze and Vaiiya.

[alpine apex]

Funny I actually can’t get it to switch off haha

Theeeeere we go

Had to do it on the desktop, not my phone

Let’s chat fam!

[dusty thunder]

Is there a point to use Model 1887 or Repeater? Since Cerberus and Pike seem better

[compact tundra]

Just, how, how did we get here

[dusty thunder]

By getting here

[compact tundra]

Ok I do have to ask is this bait or a genuine question, I genuinely mean no offence by that but I gotta know before continuing

[dusty thunder]

Its genuine question im returning to the game after dropping it after a month or so of playing

[alpine apex]

On the astral plane man

[sudden pewter]

Pike was taken outside and doubletapped like old yeller. Repeater is still a strong poke option and the model is an interesting close/mid range dueling weapon

[compact tundra]

Ok so the hard answer is, the model and repeater are leagues better than the pike and Cerb. Pike is probably one of the worst weapons in the game and Cerb is aight but worse than the model. I think the problem is you have an aiming style that makes more precise weapons harder for you, idk what it'd be in specific but id guess the more forgiving nature of the pike and the wider spread of the cerb give you better results then the more aim demanding model and repeater

[sudden pewter]

Pike was so good for so long Embark had to specifically target it for Mediums to use anything else. One day SA will get the same treatment and we will weep

[dusty thunder]

Im not asking from experience just simply from the stats

[alpine apex]

You play your game dawg. Fight the power and have fun

[compact tundra]

Model and repeater stats wise are just straight better than the pike and Cerb, tho maybe damage numbers don't convey that well and it's the experience that hammers that in?

[dusty thunder]

I really liked the repeater and the 1887 when I was playing around last year I think but they didnt seem very good at the time

[glossy sun]

Oh right what was the point of the Pike when Repeater and now the crossbow overshadow it

[dusty thunder]

Probably ya I just wanna make sure im not shooting myself in the foot by picking them

[sudden pewter]

Use whatever you like, just know the Chimera/Repeater are currently better Pikes

[alpine apex]

You can shoot yourself in the foot with any of the guns from a literal sense.

You can also stab yourself in the foot, blow it off, or smash it with the sledge

What am I missing?

Hey look at me! I’m yellow now.

Bring on the piss role!

[glossy sun]

Imagine Light has its own Stim pack

[sudden pewter]

No.

[glossy sun]

Damn you answered so quickly~

[sudden pewter]

Because it’s one of the most common suggestions from tourists and people that don’t understand the game

[alpine apex]

He really does hate you hahaha

[sudden pewter]

• Heavy Sniper
• Light Stim
• Spear Throw

[alpine apex]

Won’t even enable me. Like a true Gaston 😘

[glossy sun]

LOL I know~

[alpine apex]

Ok spear throw I can get behind. Mainly to give it SOME relevance outside of power shift

[sudden pewter]

No. Spear needs work, absolutely. But mitigating its one and only weakness is stupid. Even dual blades requires outside input to be able to deflect ranged attacks.

[glossy sun]

And Lights can toss knives and have a Dagger?

[sudden pewter]

Throwing Knives are not melee weapons. Not sure why you brought up dagger?

[glossy sun]

Seems Unfair~

[alpine apex]

Don’t you dare speak to me unless you’re barking orders before physical abuse. You’ll ruin the relationship

https://tenor.com/view/gaston-le-fou-laughing-lol-funny-gif-5251271

[sudden pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/wawa-emdeb-fail-failure-cat-gif-16703817715131368982

[alpine apex]

NO!!!! I thought I could gif now 😭😭😭😭😭

[sudden pewter]

Red Role is when you earn the privilege

[alpine apex]

That’s the most abusive thing you’ve ever done.

I love you

Ah damn I did read that wrong

I saw images in most channels and was thinking moving images haha

[glossy sun]

Sword slash and can Lunge
Dagger can Slash and Backstab
Riot shield can block and attack
Dual blades can deflect and slash
Sledge can Attack and Overhead bonk and break walls... But what can Spear do...?

Twirl in place and get shot?

[sudden pewter]

Spear spins for AOE.

[long nymph]

Area attack (supposedly)

[shell sonnet]

aoe teamwipes

but yeah, the basically stunlock is fucked

[alpine apex]

Well red is going to take forever but I’ll commit

[glossy sun]

What AOE everyone can just run away lol

[sudden pewter]

Just argue with idiots and you’ll get red in no time

[glossy sun]

Harsh Words.

[sudden pewter]

That’s still AOE. The spear was introduced in S3 with Kyoto, where many buildings are particularly narrow

[alpine apex]

He definitely meant you 🤣

[glossy sun]

I know he does

[sudden pewter]

Not directed at you, you’re just not educated and hopefully we can fix that

[glossy sun]

That's still implying

[alpine apex]

If only I could communicate burns though gifs… Ashton Kutcher would be making a swift appearance

[glossy sun]

Your not Dodging this one~

[alpine apex]

The three of us MUST squad up some day

[sudden pewter]

Implying? You clearly don’t seem to grasp the game based on your suggestions

[lapis meadow]

Buddy...

[alpine apex]

The group dynamics would be incredible. Must watch streaming

[sudden pewter]

You’re not an idiot for not understanding. Idiots outright reject

“Yeah I want a stamina system that allows me to buff melee damage and do anime moves”

Oh it doesn’t fit the game even remotely? You just hate fun.

That’s idiot speak.

It’s also unfortunately a reoccurring suggestion/scenario.

[lapis meadow]

Shoot, could I get in on that brother?

[alpine apex]

Typically play 930-1230pm cst! Hit me up anytime

hertel3k#0440

[lapis meadow]

west of the US?

[alpine apex]

The MIDwest

Cuz I’m mid.

Midwest do be best tho

And now that I’m looking at my message, it would be 930pm to 1230am. Silly goose 🪿

[glossy sun]

Wait what.

Anyways... Let's see...

[alpine apex]

What was it you were confused about?

[sudden pewter]

I haven’t been nearly appreciative enough of the +50 ammo Minigun got recently. It was just enough to meaningfully change the weapon without putting it into OP territory. I’m hoping to see it used more and maybe have a presence in skrims.

[glossy sun]

Nevermind just thinking of something else or just jumping to another Chat. Didn't see what I posted.

[compact tundra]

Bro the worst thing the 300 ammo had done for me is make minigun heavies way more brave with there ammo count, used to be minis were careful about ammo count and would regularly reload early if they thought they were safe and I could jump them, now I have to assume every heavy is going to balls to the wall until they are bone dry and that 300 last longer then I'm used to so I end up picking fights I really shouldn't

Cause these motherfuckers been mag dumping me recently

[glossy sun]

That's the point of the Minigun Mag dump on people.

Continuous fire suppressing fire.

[sudden pewter]

I’ve had several engagements where I end on 20-30 left so the buff is very apparent and very much appreciated. I can safely use more rounds to destroy cover and have enough to finish contestants off

[compact tundra]

Yea I've been feeling it man, it's certainly not op but damn do you gotta respect their sightlines and respect the ability that they can chew your cover if your a high enough priority kill

[glossy sun]

Takes about 70 bullets to break a wall segment. If I'm correct.

Unless that changed to 90....

Literally the best thing to do is let them waste there ammo...

[sudden pewter]

The demolition damage was increased last season, depending on the material it’s generally 30-50

[glossy sun]

And not Rush in and face take a Minigun.

[lapis meadow]

alot of the finals is about having common sense...

[sudden pewter]

Which seems to be very lacking, mainly with Light players

[glossy sun]

Sorry but to be Honest Light players Feels like they came from Call of Duty and just thing they can 3v1 .

[compact tundra]

Y'all don't see the vision, 3 deaths to stupid shit is way less annoying then the amazing 1v3 I won that didn't benefit the team in any way

[glossy sun]

Bruh... And still end up losing

[sudden pewter]

Main Character Syndrome
That’s the most succinct way I’ve come to terms with it.

[glossy sun]

And then end up like that Meme where the guy is celebrating when he placed 3rd.

[alpine apex]

I consider myself a gnat light most of the time.

My job is just to buzz around (movement crutch since my aim is shit) and annoy the enemy while my other two teammates kill n’ steal

[lapis meadow]

I just try my best to support my team as a light.

[sudden pewter]

Support Lights are fantastic and I wish Light had more gadgets that facilitated teamplay.

[lapis meadow]

or grab their totem and run away to revive them. I'm more or less just there to pick people off while my team guards the box.

[glossy sun]

What if Light Used Infuser and Tracking dart more?

[sudden pewter]

H+ & Gateway are incredibly powerful gadgets but outside of premade teams you rarely see them used casually. Even Gateway is used selfishly by Lights. I’m glad H+ cannot be used by the Light themselves.

[glossy sun]

And the worst of all I get 2 lights in the same team And they Rush in before I could even get near them they complain that I'm not doing anything.

[alpine sphinx]

i see both used pretty commonly nowadays, and i mostly solo queue

[sudden pewter]

Ranked? Or standard Cashout

[alpine apex]

these are both in my main load out. for the most part my gateway is to move the cash box or totems. but if my team lacks mobility (jump pad, zipline, etc) then i'll help them move from the ground floor to the roof

[alpine sphinx]

ranked

but im only mid gold rn

[alpine apex]

I'll admit, I need to do better at using h-infuser DURING the fight, and not just for a quick heal post fight

[sudden pewter]

Makes sense to see them there. They’re trying to win. My complaint stems from casual play where I don’t see them as often

[viscid carbon]

What do you guys think of the V9S vs M11?

[sudden pewter]

We all start somewhere

[sudden pewter]

I personally prefer the M11 but V9S is pretty good

[alpine apex]

the one that goes brrrrrrt

[viscid carbon]

I actually found myself preferring the V9S even though I usually despise click-tracking weapons

The M11 feels woefully inconsistent for me, maybe I just haven’t played it enough though

[glossy sun]

Man can we have a Leash as a spec that can pull your Allies to you?

[glossy sun]

What I'm only saying it cause people rush in with nothing to lose and then Spams for revives when there in the middle of a crossfire

[sudden pewter]

While I’d love a backpack with a leash for Lights I don’t believe anything that affects ally movement beyond Goo is something Embark would consider

The Winch can grab statues, Explosives can move them too.

Embark made the decision for Shockwave to not affect teamates during closed testing and I believe that was the right call.

[wind pecan]

Every game with a party system is like this , nothing we can do

[sudden pewter]

It’s the nature of online multiplayer. You will inevitably be matched with teammates that make you question how they function in society.

[glossy sun]

Especially those people that Grief people with the Double Jeopardy

[wind pecan]

But I think they should but different than everything else , like there should be different affect to allys being shockwaved and everything else he shockwaved

[sudden pewter]

It’s a shockwave. It’s a mobility option, gap closer, and space maker. It’s already super loaded, it doesn’t need even more

[glossy sun]

Hey Shockwave is simple and can be applied to any situation.

[lapis meadow]

Maybe try getting friends...

[wind pecan]

Yes I know but I am saying why not also make it a mobility option for teammates , like it uses momentum right . The direction you will be moving Shockwave will amplify it similar can be done to allys if you shoot it why they are moving away they will be shot up in that direction gaining speed

[wind pecan]

I have one but finals stopped working properly in his pc

[glossy sun]

Just to put this out there what can they possibly add with Light... As a Spec...

[lapis meadow]

Then make more. Thats the handy dandy thing about the internet

[lapis meadow]

dopple ganger/after images.

[junior portal]

anyone know of any changes to invis

[wind pecan]

Wall phasing but like going directly and with each charges per solid surface

[wind pecan]

I can but I like playing with him every stressful game becomes chill

[sudden pewter]

Medium already has mobility options for teamates. You’re asking for an already loaded specialization to cannibalize the roles of JumpPad and Zipline which I can’t agree with

[glossy sun]

No please

[lapis meadow]

his just a chill guy?
respected then

[dry widget]

I was counting the DoT. Are you saying I should shoot 1 good shot to trigger the DoT, wait for it to tick, and then shoot again when it’s done for more DoT?

Is it mostly DoT and little burst?
I usually shoot all 3 at someone and the DoT at the end rarely finishes. Healing is super common now too so even instances where it would’ve killed are avoided.

[junior portal]

I just played ranked and 2 DAGGERS keep going invis and I can hear their invis but I cant see it at all

[wind pecan]

Yeah , and I like it that way ,I don't like other guy just screaming like where are you what have you done, do this now , not that I am bad at video games but that is just doing too much . I just want to chill and we chill . I actually properly played few matches with him of re6 i am a newbie in that game but I had fun .

[sudden pewter]

Are they using cloak? Or vanishing bomb?

[junior portal]

cloak

sometimes no sound aswell

[sudden pewter]

I’m hesitant to just say “skill issue” because it doesn’t tell you how to address your problems or alleviate your frustrations but…

[alpine apex]

Don't worry @junior portal, cloak users are the bane of my existance as well. Can't hear or see them ever. No matter how close I am to my screen or how loud my headphones are. But I have skill issues so... 🤷‍♂️

[alpine sphinx]

getting kicked right as the final round starts is fun, forgot to turn off all my hax again oh noes

[junior portal]

any ideas on how to see them before a dagger is in my back?

[alpine apex]

You could put your back against the wall? But that only buys you .8 seconds

I usually just scream like a little girl and RUN

[junior portal]

I cant run cause im heavy

[stoic garden]

on what resolution you on bro

[junior portal]

1440p

[alpine apex]

oh well sheesh, definitely just put your back to the wall and fire/swing away

[stoic garden]

i play on 640x360 res cuz my laptop is ass and i see them, no excuses

[alpine apex]

dagger won't do jack squat to your chest lol

[junior portal]

dagger in my back before I know they are there

[stoic garden]

try standing still and looking around better if you must

[last steeple]

Listen

[stoic garden]

shit is loud as hell tbh, do you have night mode on?

[junior portal]

where is nightmode at?

[last steeple]

In audio settings

[stoic garden]

sounds or something idk, i dont use it

[junior portal]

ok

nope not on

[stoic garden]

allegedly makes quiet sounds louder, but considering cloak is loud as hell already idk if that really helps

[junior portal]

maybe my audio is cooked cause when they go invis I only hear it occasionaly

[stoic garden]

try it in practice range and sneak around while cloaked, might give you a better idea of how it feels like

[junior portal]

normally I can see them fine but not today I guess

[eager wasp]

kinda just have to take note, and find out which team is pushing you before they get there so you KNOW that a dagger is gonna be there

[stoic garden]

intel is key fr

[junior portal]

at least on the last match I knew which team but thye were always invis so no clue they are

[eager wasp]

if you know a dagger is gonna be there, you play things much more different, you play with the team, and you play more up against walls and be more aware of your 6 o' clock

a dagger is already so disadvantaged, anything is a counter

[sudden pewter]

Depending on what they’re wearing, and what’s behind them; the effectiveness of cloak can vary greatly.
Many players will say “just keep back 2 wall 4head” but that isn’t always feasible, instead I’ll say “listen for the cloak hum” as it gets louder the faster a Light moves.

[junior portal]

il try thanks

[sudden pewter]

Audio is a constant issue with the game. It’s so fundamentally fucked that at times the cloak may be genuinely emitting 0 audio cues. Other times it could just be masked by gunfire

Dagger isn’t as vicious without Dash to throw off aim and quickly reposition, if they beef with cloak they’re generally dead unless they spam Goo to buy time.

If you manage to have a defensive hold, motion sensors can give you an early warning as to when they approach.

Otherwise, a Light with sonar grenade is always handy

[junior portal]

k

cant even remember the last time a dagger was in ranked so I dont know how to counter lol

[sudden pewter]

Dagger certainly has strong highs but it’s very counterable. No offense to Gelz or those that favor the weapon but it’s certainly very reliant on its gimmick, if you can prevent them from getting close (as with any melee weapon) they can’t do much other than shit, cry, pee, eat hot chip, and finger paint

[junior portal]

eat hot chip? finger paint?

[sudden pewter]

Do they eyelashes

[brisk acorn]

Hit them to trigger dot then get away asap to not get killed

Let the dot tick and then shoot again

Most efficient way cause to kill you need the dot effect to linger as much as possible

[dry widget]

Wouldn't it be better to use a gun where you don't have to wait for tick dmg or be really close? What's the advantage? If you want peek, use a repeater, a revolver, or a model. You kill slower for what advantage?

[lone wagon]

day 9 of asking for a paris map till i get a baguette sword skin, a paris map, or both

[indigo nexus]

In flamethrower's case it's in exchange for the DOT (offers an advantage you can play around much like burst damage does, the ability to benefit from waiting is a good thing), it being easy to aim and multihitting very well, as well as a super generous mag

[sudden pewter]

Also pierces shields!

[dry widget]

Yea but flamethrower has that advantage of being able to spray all over the place. You have to be just as precise with the Cerb as any shotgun for less impact.

[dry widget]

And Cerb doesn't, no? Pellets have to land.

[sudden pewter]

No, Cerb bullets have ignition properties and once a certain # land the target is ignited. Flamethrower spouts a jet of flame that completely ignores shields, piercing dome & mesh alike.

[dry widget]

Yea so it doesn't really compare to flamethrower bc flamethrower has those advantages.

[indigo nexus]

Augh, I think I didn’t deduce that you were talking about cerberus, my bad

[sudden pewter]

Definitely not. Flamethrower is a wholly different beast.

[indigo nexus]

Less impact, though? Cerberus deals a ton of damage in a short time

[sudden pewter]

It’s Mediums dive option imo. Very all or nothing

[indigo nexus]

The SH1900 might be a little better by this metric, but it’s also on a very different class and arguably has more punishing misses

[dry widget]

Repeater, Revolver, and Model all do that better.

[sudden pewter]

Cerberus can ignite goo/gas. Niche utility but it’s still utility. I wouldn’t compare it with Repeater or Revolver either as both serve very different roles. Model is probably the closest

[indigo nexus]

Revolver could with headshots (because it beats almost everything at almost everything with headshots), but the other two absolutely not

[dry widget]

Whenever you're not inside your opponent, yes, they do.

[indigo nexus]

Are we assuming a long range here? Your point is confusing.

Nobody is contesting the idea that cerberus is specialised to point blank engagements

[dry widget]

Not being point blank doesn't mean long range.

[versed finch]

Season 10 was a medium season, and cause season 11 looks like a "Balancing" season, and season 12 is supposed to be big, it must be the light season!

Light literally hasn't gotten anything since season 7, sure the H+ is a amazing gadget, and even after all the nerfs, it's still prob the best healing gadget

But where are my new guns? Season 6 added the Arn, an overtuned Sub-Assult rifle

[dry widget]

NEW SPECS

[versed finch]

I really want the drum shotgun, dual smgs, and burst fire smg, im really desperate

[tardy light]

give light a blink!!!

[dry widget]

REWORKED / BUFFED CURRENT SPECS THAT MAKE THEM VIABLE OVER DASH

[versed finch]

Dash is, has been, and always will be meta over grapple and cloak

[tardy light]

give grapple a variable cooldown based on distance between player and target!!

[versed finch]

the nanosecond a pro player complains about cloak db lights its going straight back to the dumpster:

• Nerfed Cloaking Device max duration from 38s to 24s
• Decreased Cloaking Device recharge modifier from 3x to .1x
• Made it 1000% easier to see still cloaked targets

[dry widget]

What if Light could perform a small Dash innately? This gives some of Dash's functionality to the class overall and leaves way more room to actually use other specs. Dash as a spec can stay so you get more, larger Dashes.

[versed finch]

Interesting idea, but then they'd give Medium miniturrets and heavy minicharges and im not dealing with 3 smg machines in the back

Watch Embark add more specs, weapons, and gadgets all for heavy and medium season 12 (And a favored map)

I know that light is likely the most OP class but I for one don't enjoy everyone getting huge big fancy toys and embark rewrapping the ARN-220 with another 12000 skins

[dry widget]

Doesn't have to be that way. Address problems where they exist and not where they don't. Light needs Dash at its core to function well. No other spec can challenge that without being overtuned itself. The only solution I see is to decouple Light's reliance on the spec itself and put some the functionality into the base kit. Other classes don't have this issue and can freely use whatever spec they want. Light without Dash always feels inferior.

[versed finch]

Again, fair argument, and I can very much see how that would fix a problem with light.

Although it's highly unlikely embark would ever do that (Watch that be a change in season 12), I would be interested in seeing how it would work out

[brisk acorn]

I honestly don’t know why people use it

[dry widget]

I mean you could try adding intrinsic perks to every class. Light: perform a short, directional dash. Medium: deploy a single healing mote on the ground. Heavy: perform a short ram that can break walls. Tie all of them to a cooldown and a press, double-press, or hold key function.

Each represents the classes' identities well with Light having some built-in mobility, Medium having some built-in healing support, and Heavy having some built-in demolition.

[sudden pewter]

That’s fucking awful.

[dry widget]

And each represents a weaker version of different specs. Light's built-in dash is shorter than the Dash spec, and you can only use it once every ?s instead of consecutively. Medium's built-in healing mote provides less healing than a Healing Beam as well as having shorter range and duration. Heavy's built-in ram is far shorter and less lethal than Charge 'n' Slam, prioritizing single demolition over going through players or mutiple walls.

[sudden pewter]

Light does not need dash. Grapples only sin is not being dash. Cloak needs a soft rework due to visibility issues tied to cosmetics.

[dry widget]

That's a big opinion.

[still summit]

🗣️🗣️ÖRF Sponsored sight for guns where the red dot is a smiley face with ears 🗣️🗣️

[dry widget]

Wonder why almost every Light runs Dash and not Grapple or Cloak...

[dry widget]

The cosmetic issues are not going to make any difference in how often people run Cloak.

[dry widget]

You wanna expand on this or?

[sudden pewter]

Yeah I’ve just gotta whip up a miniature essay real quick to properly educate rather than just point and laugh with text

[versed finch]

NO PLEASE DONT, IVE SEEN THEM

[sudden pewter]

The masses must be educated.

(I’m typing)

[dry widget]

Yes, educate me on how you propose to fix almost every Light using Dash bc it's the best spec. You think you can come up with some buffs or reworks that are going to dramatically change the landscape and have Lights using all of their specs to a similar degree? I don't think you can. Dash is always going to be superior unless it's either nerfed into the ground OR another spec is buffed into being overtuned. Once things balance out again, Dash is king once more. Every. Time.

[sudden pewter]

I don’t think that even if Cloak wasn’t wildly inconsistent, Dash would ever be dethroned. Even if we took away a charge and neutered the CD.

The goal isn’t to make cloak/grapple more popular, dash is too good with Lights kit, meshes too well with many weapons available to Light. Popularity isn’t nor has ever been the problem, it’s power.

(This isn’t the essay btw it’s just a response)

[dry widget]

Power and popularity share a relationship. Generally, the more powerful something is, the more popular it is. This is especially true as look up the skill ladder as higher skill players generally use the most powerful weapons and tools available.

[sudden pewter]

Yes, that is called a meta.
Competitive players are the most likely to follow the meta as it is the most effective tactic available.

[dry widget]

Exactly. Dash is and always will be meta. You can buff Grapple and Cloak. Who cares? We're still using Dash. You can nerf Dash. Who cares? It's still better than Grapple and Cloak.

[sudden pewter]

I need to finish one thought before I can respond to another, gimme a bit. I promise it’ll be enlightening

[dry widget]

There's very little you can do to change this fact. You can overbuff Grapple or Cloak to unhealthy states and replicate the problem on those specs, but from how I see it, you can never have them all similarly used and viable at the same time.

[dry widget]

Bet.

[versed finch]

IsN't ThAt WhAt MeTa StAnDs FoR?

[tardy light]

im gonna start exclusively saying "metagaming" so people cant define it as such (jk im ok with people giving it a living definition as its community slang)

[glossy sun]

Turn Pyro Grenade into a Fireball!

Lets go full wizard!

[dusty thunder]

Is the bow like really bad or is it a skill issue

[glossy sun]

Isn't the bow like a mid range Projectile weapon?

[dusty thunder]

Idk

Seems to only be goood against lights

[boreal laurel]

No digs at anyone in this chat, but it’s the latter. It is one of the toughest weapons in the game, but very strong and quite viable once you get good at it

(And I’ll be the first to admit that I’m terrible at it 😅)

[dusty thunder]

I think im aiming in too much with it

[glossy sun]

Think you need to use the walls to peek

Cause bow is good.

[random depot]

a skin perhaps? WITH A LITTLE ''FIREBALL'' VOICELINE

[dusty thunder]

ARN feels so bad against any other class

Or is it just cause P90 out dps' it

Or once again a skill issue

[slow linden]

Need

[kindred gorge]

I wish more stuff used the multi pad so I could wizard some more

[dry widget]

It’s pretty good. You sacrifice some TTK for more sustained damage and range with it. It’s useful for beaming people and destroying shields.

[dusty thunder]

I see

I think its cause I was using it like point blank

[dry widget]

Yeah it’ll lose like that bc it doesn’t fry like an M11

[dusty thunder]

Makes sense its probably more mid range innit

[dry widget]

Take angles and get them weak before getting close if you’re going to

You can suppress very easily with it and chip

[kindred gorge]

Mid to shorter long yeah, it’s got a much more generous falloff than you’d expect from an smg

[slow linden]

Mines should use the pad or throwables should have an alternative animation where you pull them from the pad or cast then from the pad

[kindred gorge]

Custom deploy and throw animations would be so good but they’d jack the crap out of the prices

But like imagine if you had one where you threw a grenade like you were shooting a basketball

Or a set where you shake it in your hand and then a low throw where you sidewind it like you’re rolling dice

[slow linden]

Underhand toss that shi like a bowling ball

[kindred gorge]

That would be so good

Slingshot throwing animations

[hallow ermine]

-levels

[flat crypt]

Our leveling system

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How to level up? Just look around and join conversations. Lots to talk about!

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[stable bloom]

Light class grapple is fun

[granite pilot]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[dusty thunder]

The burst pistol is so booty what the heck

[pastel vault]

Used to be op

[dusty thunder]

And then they just decided to make it close to unusable?

[last steeple]

Nah it's not, Arn M11 v9s and lh1 are better but that's all, and since arn and lh1 are long ranged, then 93r is still a solid mid to close range pick with a great ttk, ig if you find it unusable it's a skill issue but I don't play it that much so I can't say I'm doing better