💣┇weapons-gadgets

[hollow wind]

RPG finally feels balanced to me lol. can't just obliterate a light for trying to fight you, but can still use it on grouped/weak enemies for lots of value

[steel umbra]

rpg is at a good spot rn inst season 4 good and it isnt -1 heavy gadget slot but it also isnt terrible and unusaple

[mossy ibex]

Most of them are weakened just to make the light not easy to kill, which goes against the positioning of high risk and high reward

[exotic pawn]

Exactly

[hollow wind]

shouldn't be infinite risk tho
insta kills don't make much sense

[exotic pawn]

Then why can light insta kill other classes?

[hollow wind]

I main heavy and havent had an issue punishing stupid lights, it was unbalanced when any LOS with a light meant their demise

[hollow wind]

HIGH RISK HIGH REWARD BRUV

[steel umbra]

rpg cant one shot light but frags were ables to i dont think it was being used as and example because rpg was bad...

[cedar idol]

they need to fix weapons with high arena damage. the KS-23 can shot all of it bullets at a wall and not break it at all because its a corner of three blocks. sledge is better but its still weird that it breaks the floor when im crouched but looking up. Idk what other weapons have near as fast of a wall break time but just like demat. it could use some collision help

[exotic pawn]

How do they face high risk if their main counters are always getting taken down a peg? I also think light class as a whole is the worst in the game but taking everyone down to their level instead of giving them increased survivability doesn’t feel good to me

[hollow wind]

right. the RPG is finally normally balanced. 1 single frag was more useful than an RPG and they carried too, just didn't make sense

[hollow wind]

again, there's middle ground between instakilling with a cool down and making them uncounterable

if you're having issues securing followup damage on a weakened light, you may not be using the RPG right specifically, or you're more focusing on other issues. I'm being specific to the RPG balancing since that's what was mentioned

[spark hamlet]

They should give make a gun that shoots hammers

[hollow wind]

finally a common sense take

[exotic pawn]

Saying there’s no counterplay unless we remove all things that threaten light is just incorrect, positioning, stealthy play, and waiting out util is a huge part of the game and making it easier for all lights just because in your experience “stupid” lights still aren’t an issue

My conversation wasn’t even about light in the first place I just wanted to bring up that every answer for the devs balancing seems to be to take away value instead of add value which I believe inherently hurts the game

I have friends who no longer play the game because they feel like it’s not as fun as it used to be due to weapon changes

[graceful nova]

Frags used to deal 149 dmg and you get 2 per cooldown cycle. 2 can eliminate up to medium.

But it also has a delay, long enough to leave the radius or become useless in a gunfight: Lights and mediums can sprint/jump away. Heavy can block or tank the damage. So stealth and surprise is where it’s lethal, and I think that’s what frags should be good at.

Honestly I don’t even mind the frag grenade damage nerf much (140 HP is still a lot). But with just 1 frag per cooldown, it might be too slow to flush rat players in buildings/rubble. I’d buff the cooldown so you get 1 frag more often.

[sand monolith]

Not really? Rpg is in a good state. Frags weren’t.

[normal jasper]

The fact they still haven't added a indicator for frags or flashes made the nades too powerful considering the high damage and how many you carried regardless if you play high skill or not someone can slip a nade in the battle and you wouldn't know until you either see the small fuze on the floor or your already dead

[trail marsh]

All I really wanted for frags was for them to be more obvious. A louder more distinct sound que and maybe like a red glow around them to indicate "THERES A GRENADE RIGHT HERE!" would have been great

[mossy ibex]

The RPG nerfs damage twice so that it is not easy to kill the light, but does not get any cooldown compensation

[normal jasper]

I rather it stay where it is then the RPG becomes the new charge and slam where everyone uses it as a panic button if they reduced the cool down

[hollow wind]

this. I feel like I'm constantly watching the ground and still a second too late leaving the radius bc the grenade spam is just a simple low effort way to control an engagement. a grenade indicator would ruin the stealth aspect of nades though. so I'm interested if having just 1 going to make them use them wiser, as openers or finishers etc.

[graceful nova]

I mean the finals is full of explosions. What makes frags so poweful is that:

if everything is too loud, no one can hear frag grenades that are hot in the room. At the same time, people are already hyper aware, so getting caught is just bad luck

Ironically, when things are quiet, it’s really obvious to hear and (even) see the hot grenade. But at the same time, you wanna throw frags as a surprise/ damage opener too…

I’m saying it should be powerful, otherwise it wouldn’t do much tbh

[normal jasper]

Should have it as when you are close enough it glows just enough you can see

[winter jay]

ive pretty much only been able to dodge when i watched it land, and had dash or grapple. and sometimes grapple wasnt fast enough

[normal jasper]

It's still powerful even after the nerf it's just you gotta use it more sparingly instead of dumping them all and crossing your fingers you get a hit

[graceful nova]

Indirect weapons are like that though, random bullshit go boom

RPG needs LOS (line of sight), but if you have that you don’t need a 2nd shot. RPGs also have no delay

I usually flush many windows at once, or keep a spare when I get LOS

The devs also said to make grenades more readdable, but honestly this has to be aimed at frags. Pyro, gas, goo, smoke, glitch, and flash bang are all really readable. Only frags are quiet until it goes off

What do you think about the arena destruction buff for frags?

[shell sonnet]

Id find it interesting if 2 + half a mag could break a wall

Does it do that right now?

[normal jasper]

I mean I honestly thought it had that at the start it should've to be honest gives more room for creativity

[quartz anchor]

L frag nerf and L gadget cooldown on revive, this game is not going in the direction i like, feel like we are slowly taking away the things that made this game so good

[exotic pawn]

I agree

I feel like this game already has the overwatch issue where you slowly but surely take away value and no one really feels that good

[exotic skiff]

Yeah nade are so fun to play against when there is no indicator and can deal up to 149

[exotic pawn]

Everyone feels worse than they did in season one and two

[quartz anchor]

should have always had higher destruction but no need to nerf it to 1, also im not opposed to the damage nerf more lossing 1 frag

[exotic skiff]

Stun gun should have never be remove and nade nerf is a big W

[quartz anchor]

also they nerfed explosive mines to 1 insteaad of 2 and that sucked as well

[deep sierra]

How good is 93C?

[bright ivy]

Nah stun gun is too f***ing annoying

[graceful nova]

A lot of high burst dmg gadget and abilities like charge and slam, rpg, explosive mines and frags are getting nerfed

[bright ivy]

Calm down bro

[exotic skiff]

and that normal, the game is about shooting his gun more than placing explosive

[graceful nova]

And not running into explosives

[bright ivy]

What time is it where you are ?

[graceful nova]

I love explosives

[exotic skiff]

There is no indicator for nade and he can just pop in front of you with 0 time to react

[bright ivy]

Skill issue

[exotic skiff]

talking about stun gun beeing annyoing is more a skill issue my guys

[bright ivy]

Womp womp

[exotic skiff]

Not understanding, that you can't dodge a nade getting well launch, might be a brain issue from ur side ngl

[bright ivy]

Not for me (I’m a god at the game) but rather for the new players
I may make them wanting to quit

[bronze smelt]

at first nades where a pain in the ass but later become very difficult to someone to hit me with a good nade,
stun gun was funny and not really op, more situational, i dont think that changes are necessary (ah and im waiting for the deadzone fix in controller, play with 5 or more deadzone is really fucking my aim down)

[graceful nova]

Frags do make bouncing noises and have a tracer though. When people use nades on me, I see them coming.

But yeah, it’s not easy when explosions are all around, but that’s the finals for you folks

[exotic skiff]

I do not think you are even good

[bronze smelt]

thats the thing i said

[bronze smelt]

okay hahaha i dont tell if im good or not, only is not that difficult to evade a nade, Unless you’re a tent

[graceful nova]

I throw underhand frags in front of flamethrower user. 2 will put a heavy to 50hp

[bright ivy]

70 now with the nerf

And you won’t even be able to throw 2 anymore

They didn’t deserve that nerf

[peak monolith]

I think grenades needed a nerf, but maybe not one so extreme. It was very annoying to just randomly explode and die when you didn't even know a grenade was present besides "tinka tink" in your general direction.

[spark igloo]

It's a temp nerf while they work on indicators from what I understand

Frag spam was super obnoxious I'm glad they did this

[peak monolith]

I hope so, or at least work on the voice lines, cause some times you hear "Watch out! Grenade!" and then something explodes a mile away from you, and then other times you hear "tink" and then immediately die.

[spark igloo]

It needs something other than sound

[graceful nova]

Call of Duty’s sticky semtexes have a bunch of beeping sounds before it goes off

[spark igloo]

Sound just doesn't work properly half the time in this game and the voice line only happens if your teammate has line of sight on it

[graceful nova]

Idk how to feel about frag grenades having indicators, since indicators make it really obvious, not to mention the delay. So who would get caught by frags anymore?

People who are stuck inside rubble would definitely just get turned into money

[spark igloo]

Getting by caught by frags shouldn't happen unless you are completely unaware, not just randomly because the sound engine bugged out for the 90th time that game. Good frags will still be rewarded and be mostly unaffected by indicators

[graceful nova]

Winch claw rework: make the range 15m, and keep the stun effect. However, for contestants, the distance you pull them depends on the class: lighter classes get pulled in closer

[past parcel]

Delete the cerberus from the game please it's just annoying and strong

[spark igloo]

Put it to 13-15m and give it a wind up that equals the distance it gets thrown

[chilly lance]

i dont think the stun gun was such a dire emergency that it needed to be taken out of the game entirely temporarily. i agree it was a little strong but stun guns are somewhat easy to counter. for new players i see this as a problem but i think this ties back to the matchmaking problem where people are getting pared with level 15s as a level 80. also for the frag i dont know why they nerfed it considering 2 for a frag was great for opening fights. if you miss one you throw another it was very forgiving but at the same time balanced. i think it was really annoying as a light main to be 1 tapped by it but i think thats just my lack of spatial awareness.

[winter jay]

150 dmg that is nigh unnoticed unless its complety silent, did not need 2 charges

[chilly lance]

isnt the whole point of the stun gun that you can isolate an enemy so you can do some damage on them. maybe lower the time being stunned

[royal pier]

They said in the notes today that it's intended as crowd control.

[chilly lance]

thats half of medium and not even half of heavy. the only detrimental damage it does is to lights and its good to get those guys out of the way

[winter jay]

half of medium and heavy is fight winning territory. and you had 2.

i think the dmg nerf was unwarrented all i cared about was the 2 charges

[royal pier]

Also, the time to kill in this game is low enough that any low commitment slow can be devastating. Especially so for melee and other short range weapons.

[chilly lance]

you do have a point. but i do think again removing it wasnt the right option concidering its been in the game so long why have it gone for a few days

[winter jay]

if i had to guess they want to see what takes its place in the month its gone

[chilly lance]

alr good point

[royal pier]

That's why I offered a rework that makes it a support CC weapon.

[chilly lance]

wait its gonna be gone for a MONTH?!?

[winter jay]

i thought until season 6 but i could have misheard

[chilly lance]

i think thats like 29 days

[royal pier]

My suggestion also reworks already existing mechanics like the Lockbolt's tether.

[winter jay]

thats basically a month

[chilly lance]

the lock bolt pisses me off but its not that insane cuz u can just run around or your teamate can shoot it out while you distract the heavy

im a little biased because im a light main but ive been stunned and fragged countless times so i do think i have a small say in what happens to my gadgets

[royal pier]

My suggestion would make it not your gadget tbh :p.

I'd give Light the Jump Pad. It has great synergy with Gateway.

Also the Motion Sensor.

[sour sonnet]

light already has graple dash gateway

[royal pier]

Make Light the mobility/intel role.

[sour sonnet]

sonar grenade??

[royal pier]

Team mobility. The goal is to make Light less selfish.

[royal pier]

You can have both, or focus on one.

They also have tracking Dart.

[sour sonnet]

tracking dart is useless tbh

[royal pier]

The point is for builds to have two main focuses.

Heavy: Defense/Destruction

Medium: Support/CC

Light: Team Mobility/Intel

[chilly lance]

thats actually a great idea. i need something in that slot that the stun gun left if they remove it and thats the perfect fit

[chilly lance]

wouldnt med be team mobility cuz it has zip

[chilly lance]

i think i used it once and that wwas for a contract

[winter jay]

wait im on baord with this actually. ill take bounce pad over stun gun anyday. stun gun feels lame to use

[winter jay]

its funny against demat meds. i was on monaco and they would all hide under the stairs like harry potter

[chilly lance]

yes especially because it looks like when you shoot it, it looks like it has more range than it does imo. its a bit clunky

[sour sonnet]

i killed someone once whit the tracking dart lol

[chilly lance]

😭 doesnt it do like 1 damage

[sour sonnet]

5 per shot

[chilly lance]

id alt f4 the game if that happened to me

[winter jay]

i think right now heavy is just as you described but medium is more of support with utility kind of charatcer and light is a scouter/off angler. i guess they have to decide if they want medium utility to include movement

[lean dagger]

as a light player who loathes m11, if they nerf it i know who to point my finger at

[chilly lance]

why would they nerf m11

[swift agate]

Iirc the m11 has the best dps in the game, but that's kind of balanced out by the fact that light players can't aim

[chilly lance]

u def havent watched any ttv streamers 😭

it really depends on the gun. the m11 has a lot of recoil and bad damage at range

[royal pier]

First image is suggest gadget shuffle.

[winter jay]

idk about glitch on heavy. i dont think id ever run it. the rest are interesting

[royal pier]

I think Heavy has an issue with RPG still kinda being "must have," and Lockbolt has also entered that conversation.

I think the other changes might make RPG less mandatory. Giving C4 two lower damage charges and a shorter arming time might help.

Mesh being lackluster doesn't help either.

[winter jay]

yea i still havent found anything to replace rpg. the ranged aoe dmg is too good to give up. i think maybe lockbolt could replace, but i just usually use both together, because i cant think of a reason to take off rpg. same with defib and gateway. these are like perma additions to my loadout

[royal pier]

Doesn't help that most Heavy weapons are close range. Having the RPG as a finisher is super valuable.

On Spear and Sledgehammer I take Lockbolt, RPG, and Goo Nade.

[winter jay]

i run pretty much the same thing on melee i just take barricade.

i figure if heavy is the only one with barricade it must be worth learning

[woeful agate]

based on ama we might be getting a holo/red dot for pike and sight skins. my life's work has been accomplished

[tender pendant]

Now the stun gun is gone im using lots of different gadgets. Im noticing a lot of gadgets dont even work. Sonar nade and tracking dart dont work when you join a game in progress, and the thermals visions doesnt even do its job halve the time. Kinda sad to remove a functioning gadget when there are some that dont even work properly.

[royal pier]

I do barricade with non-melee.

[royal pier]

Yeah cause Pike needed another buff /s.

[woeful agate]

in complete honesty i do think adding a 1x to the pike will make it better, just not super significantly. it makes short range pike a little more viable

[winter jay]

i would say its the sturdiest one, which after trying dome with melee was greatly appreciated. i just run goo on my other 2 classes so i wanted to mix it up

[royal pier]

My gripe with Barricade is that it'll refuse to place if there's even the slightest obstruction.

[nimble sand]

NERF TURRET

[royal pier]

I miss the thin barricade. I'd bring it back but tall enough to remove the head glitch.

Make current barricade not curve and cleanly "snap" into doorways. If it's a small doorway, have it adjust (if possible).

[winter jay]

yea its less consistent then goo, but i think when you get it placed its mores powerful. i think its just learning curve. it requires posotioning, while goo is more an "oh shit" button. they are both good, i just cant run barricade on another class so i cant practice on anyone else

[royal pier]

I forgot to say that on melee Goo Nades also act as a way to stop someone running. If I'm using LMGs/Shaq-50/Deagles, Barricade for sure.

Unless I'm doing this.

[winter jay]

based cube enjoyer

i usally run dome with deagles. dont really know why it just feels better to me. i also run CnS normally instead of winch. but the cashout shennagins are a pretty good reason to pick goo especially after the goo gun proj change.

[peak monolith]

https://tenor.com/view/fire-writing-gif-24533171

[plucky spade]

I think that tracking dart would work better if it was a sonar grenade that only emitted one pulse, but you could shoot further away.

@limber gull honestly, stun gun got removed because it didn't provide any meaningful way of crowd control like other gadgets, it was simply a fuck you in particular tool that when met with the slightest bit of teamplay became useless/needed a lot of comms to be used effectively

[hardy dust]

It got removed because it was a crutch tool for bad lights against bad players. Not an issue at high ranks but a glaring one at low ranks.

It had great team utility if used properly, but also doubled as a free kill against bad players.

It's also not fun to be on the receiving end in general.

CC just isn't fun. That being said, it's still a necessary evil in design.

Tbf it was a very strong tool for light outside of being a free kill against bad players, and really doesn't help with light already being the weakest class. Although it definitely needs a rework to make it less of a crutch for bad players while still retaining it's utility.

[limber gull]

250,000 players at launch!
.....and under 15,000 players currently.

Those nerfs are working, keep em' coming!

[hardy dust]

Easier said than done, but that's the dream

Yeah probably because they were the strongest class by far at launch

No shit they should get more nerfs

Yep

[limber gull]

have fun with it, it's probably going next

[hardy dust]

Winch 🙏

Winch needs a rework. It has the same issues at stun but worse

[limber gull]

250,000 players at launch!
.....and under 15,000 players currently.

Those nerfs are working, keep em' coming!

[hardy dust]

Rework =/= nerf

More range but actually being able to react to it

[limber gull]

Yes, because when you get hit by a STUN gun. You should be able to move freely as if you are not STUNNED.

[hardy dust]

Imo stun should have 0 movement penalty, but full glitch. Make it a glitch gun.

[limber gull]

nah, just add in a new gadget. The Glitch Gun. XD

[worthy haven]

what r we thinking about the frag nerf

[hardy dust]

Bad

[worthy haven]

real

[hardy dust]

Doesn't solve issues with why they were problematic, just makes em feel worse, still better than gas and pyro by far

[worthy haven]

idm the dmg decrease, but PLEASE give me back my other frag

[limber gull]

It's a brain rot nerf

[restive plover]

Got an idea for the stun gun rework:

Rename it to the Taser
make it sort of a melee gadget where you need to physically press in into the player
you can copy the lunge mechanic from the sword (or not)
make it a single use and have a balanced cool down

This would help with risk vs reward:
you need to get in close to benefit from the stun mech
keep the same effects of the current stun gun
But you can still get bonked by a heavy sledge or barrel stuffed by a model

[timid sandal]

Is the new revolver skin werf since it has a hammer fan style like last word?

[hardy dust]

Its a bit more visual clutter but goddamn the animation team cooked on it

I'd say it's worth it. Whenever im not shooting I'm constantly spamming the inspect 😭

[compact nexus]

Destruction is cool, damage nerf is cool, but I much rather would have seen the cd increased a bit and the total remain at 2

[sharp knoll]

why tf do I even play this game????

[lament mountain]

search within your soul for the answer to that

[royal pier]

I mean a slide can typically avoid winch. The problem is the desync making it seem screwy. That desync messes up the winch user a lot, too.

If you flick and use winch, it'll often fire from where you were just looking.

[royal pier]

That wouldn't fix the spam. Sure, it would be less overall, but you would still get pelted with 6 frags at once.

This was an APS buff, too.

[hardy dust]

If the heavy misses.

[royal pier]

It's a projectile. If you slide, it'll generally miss.

[timid sandal]

Sold, I already have the free revolver skin from the cowboy event but I’ll snag this one as well

[hardy dust]

It also has a huge hitbox which will still hit you as long as the heavy doesn't miss.

[royal pier]

You can do some weird stuff on the return pull, but just strafe the opposite way.

[royal pier]

Idk what to tell you, I mean I'm a Heavy main and I'm decently good at avoiding it.

[hardy dust]

So you're just going up against heavies who miss their winches smh

[royal pier]

Maybe spend some time using it.

[royal pier]

Winch is a 10m projectile to the stun's 16m hitscan. It's not even in the same category.

[compact nexus]

Both are stupidly op but winch is hard stun

[royal pier]

Winch also doesn't hard counter like 6-10 weapons.

[compact nexus]

Once again both are op

[royal pier]

I just disagree that winch is OP.

[compact nexus]

It's very op lol it's a guaranteed kill with a coordinated team

No other spec is just a free kill

[royal pier]

Except that it can be blocked and avoided via movement.

[sharp knoll]

I tried man. I fucking tried.

[compact nexus]

If the heavy is ass sure but it can not be blocked on reaction no

[royal pier]

I will say the Demat + Winch combo can be devastating, but also I have never seen it happen outside of that tournament.

[royal pier]

I parry it with Barricade and Goo.

Goo is harder for sure.

But I run from fight to fight with Barricade/Goo at the ready.

Also, 10m range now.

I'll agree that 16m was too long with that speed.

Slowing winch at 10m just means nobody who's paying attention gets hit ever again. That's not balance.

[shell sonnet]

I have literally had a goo nade already pulled for something
Noticed a heavy round the corner, unaware that they have winch, threw it at them anyways because they were the bigger threat, and then still got winched
How exactly do you block it like that?

[royal pier]

That's unfortunately a server issue that won't get solved with a slow down or anything like that.

Cause I've been on the giving and receiving end of that myself.

When I do it to someone it's because on my screen they hadn't reacted yet.

[compact nexus]

Goo does not deploy fast enough to counter on reaction, same with barrier (assuming you are not already holding it, which you shouldnt be)

[royal pier]

And the game favors the wincher over the other person.

[shell sonnet]

I like to spam inspection
I dont wanna run around like an ipad kid

[royal pier]

You should absolutely be going from fight to fight with defensive utility at the ready.

A good habit I picked up from using the MGL32 so much.

[compact nexus]

Theyre just not going to start the game with a winch then lol theyll just shoot you and still have it up, or theyll rpg, which will destroy said defenses, its just not practical to block winch on reaction

[royal pier]

Goo nades can also be used offensively.

Hit them directly and it'll often break the winch even if it pops in their face mid pull.

[compact nexus]

a better solution to winch would be to increase its range again but make it so people pulled are not stunned and are instead launched more like objects with an arc instead of instantly pulled to the heavy, so they can counter with goo mid flight or use mobility

[royal pier]

Or, if you know they have winch, be prepared to counter and stay out of 10m if you can.

16m hitscan stun was a different story.

[compact nexus]

Once again, both are op it doesnt matter if you compare it to stun gun or not

[shell sonnet]

Counter how exactly?

[royal pier]

If it didn't stun, the user is signing their own death certificate. I know this because often times the desync means you can get the winch to connect, and they get to shoot you anyway.

[royal pier]

Barricade/Goo/Slide/Hold something in front you you.

That last one is only half a joke. It'll grab the object.

[compact nexus]

OK then winch from bubble or by cover instead of raw dogging it, the stun is part of what guarantees kills

[royal pier]

I discovered this while goofing around with a turret on a goo can.

Dome/Mesh should 100% block winch, though.

[worthy haven]

whats cd?

[compact nexus]

Cooldown

[compact nexus]

A lot of things should block winch, including shields, riot, and dual blades

[royal pier]

Poor guy thought he was getting a Ben, and got a turret to the face.

[worthy haven]

ohh

[shell sonnet]

Goo takes too long
Holding out barricade while staying on yout toes 110% of the time to see if a heavy is nearby at all times makes it feel mega sweaty
And those are item counters, ir you wanted to have fun with something else, tough luck
Sliding/movement depends on the heavy missing

Id really like it to have inert counterplay that always applies
Even if it get buffs to compensate

Im trying to think of other games and how they solved problems like it

[royal pier]

But anyway yeah the stun is mandatory or else the once using Winch will just lose most of the time.

Don't forget you can't attack during that animation that lasts longer than the average TTK.

If you look at the time it takes to Winch and follow up vs just using the Lewis/Shaq-50 to shoot them, the latter is just as fast, if not faster.

[royal pier]

I mean the barricade/Goo thing is for anyone that gets the drop on you/you have no ranged.

[shell sonnet]

I assume that means youre speaking from a ranked perspective (also since you mentioned that before)
Is that correct?

[royal pier]

Why are ya'll acting like the Heavy can adjust the winch midway? You can't.

[royal pier]

All the time, any mode. You aren't going to always be the one striking first, so be ready to defend.

Especially if you're using the Spear/Sledgehammer/SA1216.

If you manage to slide from the initial winch, watch for them strafing/sliding. That's the way they get you on the return. Strafe/slide the opposite way. Also, remember that you can shoot them this whole time.

So many people just stop fighting back when they could be doing enough damage that even if they get hit with the winch they could kill right after.

[sharp knoll]

alright guys I officially deleted the game off my PS. put in a request with embark to delete my account. I will now see myself out of this discord and be glad to be done with this game.

man I wish this game had some solid devs behind it :/

[silent dawn]

Weapons are great

[eager wasp]

bye bye

[polar venture]

HOWDY

[eager wasp]

how dee

[nimble lynx]

L8er G8ter. This game friggen rulez

[toxic plover]

I disagree, I have a high silver/low gold friend that while I'm chasing him will flick a 180 goo grenade SOMEHOW right when I go to winch. Slipperiest bastard I've ever seen. Cannot winch him.

[compact nexus]

We call this getting read like a graphic novel, not reaction

[toxic plover]

So what I'm hearing is...you don't have to react to winchclaw you can read the heavy. So if you get winched any more than a single time it's your fault because now you know they have winch

[toxic plover]

And let me assure you, I am NOT an ass heavy, I almost always get my winch if the servers aren't fucking me

[compact nexus]

Yeah you can block anything if you read your opponent correctly, but that is no where near a consistent option, especially if they just mix up the timing and keep shooting at you

[toxic plover]

Nah because still getting goo'd in the face and saving my winch for the next attempt still slows me down significantly, and there's nothing I can do if he just plays roof and keep his distance because not only is winch only a messily 10m but he can still slide away or my combos just don't land cause he's faster than me

[compact nexus]

Ok then just shoot them

You playing sledge is not a problem with winch claw, it is a problem with sledge hammer, which you signed up for by playing melee

[toxic plover]

Yeah, he's staying out of my effective range and doing exactly what he's supposed to be doing I'm not denying that.

[compact nexus]

Yes and that becomes significantly more difficult if you force them into said rsnge on the cashout or by just flanking

[toxic plover]

That's still no excuse though because you can open sightlines using destruction tools and gas/pyro/goo for area denial. Also getting flanked is a situational awareness skill issue

[fading rain]

the grind

[toxic plover]

Nothing feels worse than stungun, but getting poked to death by a demat medium is pretty high up there cause I'm entirely reliant on cover

[shut bane]

ill gladly die to a demat medium to a stungun any day of the week

[patent idol]

The sniper already sucks, and heavy has 2 good weapons for distance. No creativity on these sweats. A marksman at least.

Broke boy says what?

A heavy falls off a building and it ruins a push for 30 seconds. Terrible pacing. I’m not saying a horizontal speed buff, but their vertical momentum needs work. Only a medium main has an issue with that😭 can’t demat from everything boss

[toxic plover]

Same. Unless it's Cerberus. They can stand there and 3 shot me faster than I can do anything

[sacred scroll]

The medium have to be in sneezing distance to do that

[toxic plover]

Nah, they can still be out of my swing radius

[sacred scroll]

Shame , still better than fighting a light with the stun gun

[rose harbor]

Nade nerf and stun gun disabled thank the lordy

nades were in every one of my loadouts makes sense

[toxic plover]

Yeah, at least I can get SOME damage in even if it isn't the kill

[sacred scroll]

One gadget to shut down a whole entire category of weapons on the most agile/mobile class is fair and balanced

Why not just Give heavy a gadget that just deletes the account of lights when it hit them

[spark igloo]

if this is an issue just use goo

it's not even a bad run

[patent idol]

Goo leaves the heavy wide open to getting sprayed back down and if they’re building is more than 3 stories? Useless advice ur better taking the stairs.

[patent idol]

It’s a fast paced game, giving the heavy a slight pacing buff doesn’t hurt the other two at all bro😭

[spark igloo]

90% of buildings you can pretty easily combo this with window jumps

[spark igloo]

heavy's main weakness is his speed

[hoary fox]

Make defib a specialization

[toxic plover]

That's pretty fucking funny. Deleting accounts when hit haha

[boreal laurel]

Sounds good, then maybe people will stop using it and I won’t have to worry about dying when someone defibs me right in front of a loaded M11

[hoary fox]

Medium has quickly turned into the most brainless class imo. Non stop in world tour and ranked mediums are completely ignoring the fight just to revive spam until they win the fight. Its sad honestly.

[spark igloo]

the other solution to this would be make medium intentionally worse at doing damage and buff/add to their support tools

encouraging teamwork and healthier metas

[spring grotto]

Heavies want movement, they should lose their damage. The only separating H and M is movement and Hp…

[toxic plover]

I'd like to see automatic guns have their falloff adjusted to do less damage past 30 meters

[hoary fox]

I just want the game to seriously shift to a Heavy, Medium, light meta. Its the most fun to play against

[boreal laurel]

I will say I like medium sometimes. That is, when I get to bully casual lobbies with riot shield and demat 😈

[spark igloo]

it is an HML rn but it sucks because nothing meta feels good

like mesh is meta but it feels awful because they gutted it for some reason

[toxic plover]

Mesh is meta when your teammates can actually aim 🤓

[boreal laurel]

Imagine team play 🤡

[toxic plover]

Teamplay? What's that? Not in my lobbies lmao

[hoary fox]

Mesh already has a perfect counter too. If you have a decent light on your team one glitch screws up everything for them

but no heavy needs more nerfs according to a lot of people

[toxic plover]

Me and a friend litteraly made a call out, 4 times all together, just for our random 3rd WHO IS ON MIC to run out into the shit and we died because of him a Cerberus snuck up on us

[toxic plover]

I think if light is going to keep 2 glitch grenades, then a single glitch grenades should take out 75% of mesh health not all of it, and protect you and your team behind it

[boreal laurel]

IMO heavy is fine except that Deagles could maybe get a little dropoff nerf

[hoary fox]

I was playing ranked last night and our random was still playing like it was plug meta. I was telling him it wasn't the move anymore and he goes "and?" some players man smh

kept leaving our entire team for a 2k plug LMAO

[toxic plover]

Makes me wanna homer Simpson their Bart simpson

"Why you little"

[toxic plover]

I want winch buffed and googun adjusted, the projectile size is too large

[hoary fox]

I think he needs a buff and people need to stop complaining about literally everything when they only have like 10 hours played

[toxic plover]

Also I want mesh shield quick melee to return

Charge and slam needs it's turn speed nerfed and damage buffed

[hoary fox]

You're insane

[spark igloo]

charge nerf was perfect

[boreal laurel]

Agreed, I was just thinking about nerfs. For buffs I think mesh shield juggling should be returned. Honestly it wasn’t that problematic, and now mesh is terrible. Also decrease KS-23 dispersion

[spark igloo]

winch needs a charge up and 13m again

[royal pier]

Ok, so atm Spear does 65 - 80 - 90 damage for a standard 3 hit combo.

Lower that to 55 - 70 - 80 for body hits, but headshots deal 70 - 85 - 95. So hitting all three headshots kills a Medium, and leaves Heavy at one hit from Spin to finish.

Also, remove the gd slow down when you attack that lets people just back away from you.

[hoary fox]

C&S Needs a rework. Has since S1. The destruction of the ability needs to be the charge and the damage of it needs to be the slam. If you had to use C&S with your brain it would be a much better ability. Right now and before it is a panic button for people who can't aim.
I've been saying this for a LONG time but if the slam increased in damage the higher you did it from, it would need a actual setup to be super damage potent. Instead, you get a small buff from height which makes the charge the more viable option for damage, espessially considering you can slam from just jumping.

[patent idol]

Their damage isn’t even nuts though, they lose a 1v1 with most light builds. If anything the movement needs the buff not the damage

[patent idol]

90% is definitely exaggerated, Only in Kyoto and Skyway really

[toxic plover]

All the automatic heavy weapons are lacking, and lewis is stupid to control. Shak is 2 bullets away from good I think

[patent idol]

I agree, which makes their jumping momentum terrible, they can’t even climb the same things their team can. So give them a way to do that that doesn’t improve their speed and let them climb everything ALL THE TIME, only do it on a refresh…makes sense and people think it finna be OP

[spark igloo]

ngl I think you're just bad at parkour

[patent idol]

The Shak and the KS are the only heavy guns that REALLY feel like a heavy gun…damage is not OP with heavy’s this guys smoking pack

[spring grotto]

They lose against lights because their dmg is so high….

[spark igloo]

Never playing heavy do I struggle that much with movement and I've stopped running goo grenade

[hoary fox]

I do thing the juggling was a problem. In almost every 1v1 scenario you're at a total disadvantage going against a mesh juggle. However, I don't think the way it was reworked was the correct solution. I would have to sit and think on an actual rework but I do think that mesh is a bit weaker than it should be at the moment. Making it stronger would also encourage even more HML comp and I'm all for that.

[cunning kettle]

Nah I just stopped by here and yall are complaining about lights even tho heavies should win the ttk trade if you got good aim

[patent idol]

Dude I’m a light main, parkour is my thing. heavy’s momentum can work but it sucks in most cases. New players ESPECIALLY have issue with it.

[spark igloo]

as they usually are

[spark igloo]

new players will have issue moving around regardless

[cunning kettle]

All 5.10 patch’s fault

[patent idol]

Yeah…that’s literally the purpose of a light. This guys acting like heavy’s would dominate with this…yet it already fits the Power-Class dynamic

[spring grotto]

Heavies arent supposed to be all rounders man… you have 350 hp, all the util in the world, and guns that shred. Being slow is its trade off…

[toxic plover]

To be fair, there are certain things like railings on stars and very certain spots that my head gets caught and I just can't climb over and it gets me killed@spark igloo

[patent idol]

Exactly…like the game has a whole build designed to stop this from being OP bro😭

[spring grotto]

Why are u so pressed dude? Heavies are slow… go whine on reddit

[toxic plover]

We would literally be in a undying HHH meta if heavy got Zipline lmao

[cunning kettle]

There’s a reason why hhm and hmm were so popular

[spring grotto]

Thank you! If heavies had the ability to be everywhere like medium or light, it would be everywhere

[royal pier]

Copy/Paste from last time I wrote about Charge.

Before I start, I rarely levy the accusation of devs being lazy. With that said, how else do you describe the Change n' Slam changes? Instead of trying to keep the Spec strong while adding more counterplay, they just made it worse by lowering damage. They talk about a major mid-season patch, and this is what we get?

Getting to my main point, I'll keep it simple and bullet point it out:

• Lock the turn radius so that increasing sensitivity/DPI doesn't allow the user to make sharp turns.

• Add in multi-hit protection to keep people by from taking multiple hits in an instant. Doesn't need to be long, but getting hit into a wall shouldn't instantly hit three or more times.

• Make the start-up animation more clear, and/or add a sound effect, like they seem to have for swords lunge. I suggest a train whistle or a semi-truck horn.

• Move the front-loaded 130 damage from the first time someone is hit with Charge, to the Slam. Then, make the Slam a forward-facing cone. This encourages players to actually use the Slam on flat ground instead of just canceling out of Charge.

There, that's actual mechanical changes that both makes Charge require more finesse to use, while not gutting it.

[hoary fox]

I have to agree. The last thing heavy needs is movement.

[patent idol]

It’s how I talk I don’t actually gaf, but on most games with classes, there’s always a tank build that has semi movement, this is never a problem…unless it’s done wrong. Y’all are all lights and mediums saying “it’s gonna be OP” when heavy barely beats a medium in damage.

[cunning kettle]

Honestly they should remove H and L and then make this a battle royale

[royal pier]

Heavy either makes you stop moving, or brings you to em. That's fine.

[patent idol]

Never said heavy zipline that’d be OP ash, my suggestion was a single use high jump for mainly building scaling and platform plays.

[cunning kettle]

Just window climb or have a medium teammate

[royal pier]

Charge obviously needs to speed you up some because otherwise you could just sprint away, but tht boost is real small. You can avoid all of it with two Dashes. One if you're good.

[patent idol]

Bro😭 I give up this community is crazy

[boreal laurel]

I like the idea of the slam having the higher damage. Only potential imbalance I could see is that the slam does splash, so technically it’s easier to hit

[hoary fox]

Get out

[royal pier]

So odd to me that they used Light as the justification for the dmg nerf on Charge. It's the build with the most ways to avoid it.

[cunning kettle]

It ain’t that hard to climb up building vro

[royal pier]

That's why I'd make it a cone AoE in front. Requires them to be really grouped up.

[boreal laurel]

Also this 👆

[cunning kettle]

I’m saving the game vro

[boreal laurel]

Oh right, didn’t see that part 😄

[spark igloo]

medium was arguably the most affected, they are so out of touch they dont actually know why nobody likes charge, just that nobody liked it ig

[patent idol]

And a building with no windows? Or that new ranked map? Like bro there’s 3 maps where goo grandes only work on 50% of the buildings AND they got no windows

[cunning kettle]

What new ranked map 😭

[royal pier]

Goo Gun on Heavy doesn't count as mobility, but it does let you navigate more efficiently.

[spark igloo]

goo gun counts as a self nerf

[patent idol]

A single, boosted high jump for heavy’s, has 0 potential to be Overpowered on anything but powershift…lights and mediums complain abt heavy until nobody wanna use it😭

[toxic plover]

I think USING goo gun as mobility is genius

[patent idol]

The stadium like one with all the zip lines and bounce pads

[cunning kettle]

Just use the fucking stairs 😭

[spring grotto]

Heavies have grab cube. If u hit a tap strafe through one you can prolong momentum, two tap strafes, grav cube, two more tap strafes…

[royal pier]

People also only remember the times it wombo-combo killed, not the more frequent moments where it only hit once or they avoided it entirely.

[cunning kettle]

Oh yea you could also just use the portable elevator

[winter jay]

i think it for sure does. makeing little platformsto climb up, bridge gaps too far to jump, it helps alot.

[patent idol]

Which can only be used from certain angels and feels jankey in a pinch.

[spark igloo]

which was never if you fought a person who knew how to us it

[cunning kettle]

Wait till bro learns about the jump pads on that map

[hoary fox]

I assume you're joking, otherwise I suggest talking to your nearest brain surgeon for help. The thing that makes the finals the BEST fps out right now is the game modes. The uniqueness of the gameplay. The last thing we need is another cash grab battle royale. I mean ffs they should've never added Terminal Attack (CSGO) or Team Deathmatch, even if it is limited time. Now people are gonna be begging for TDM to stay.

[royal pier]

My definition for mobility is something that moves you long distance quickly. Still, Goo Gun does let you move faster via bridges and such. I call it a traversal tool.

[patent idol]

Which takes 30 seconds to get to them in some maps😭

[winter jay]

and what does a traversal tool do. gives more mobility

[royal pier]

I mean they could have only added multi-hit protection and turn caps and 95% if the problem would be gone.

[spring grotto]

Exactly man, hit it off a zip, u go flying. Charge and slam an arrow pad u go flying..

[cunning kettle]

Real but also just look at how pubg is thriving after a decade

[bitter surge]

Mesh, Flamer, Dome, RPG, and Lockbolt… don’t sleep on this

[royal pier]

I'm pedantic. Like I said I only count Zip, Jump, and Gateway as mobility.

[winter jay]

yea fair enough

[cunning kettle]

How did bro go from complaining about fortune stadium to maps in general

[royal pier]

Mesh makes me sad. I hate how much down time it has when used up.

[winter jay]

wait wtf they have 151k on steam. i thought that game was dead

[patent idol]

Which can’t get you on the platform in 80% of the Skyways Stadium locations? Bro…heavy does not have ENOUGH movement, it has some, yes, but this would be all they need.

[hoary fox]

Don't care. I'd rather wait 20mins for a world tour game every time then let my favorite FPS in a decade turn into a stupid BR

[winter jay]

yea if the finals became i br i think id fly to sweden

[patent idol]

Cuz that’s a problem that’s relevant in fortune stadium AND every other map…it’s hard to talk about 2 things, I know man :(

[bitter surge]

Yeah it’s not very fun to use but efficient enough

[hoary fox]

you and me both, we'll fly together 🤝

[cunning kettle]

Yea this game has an amazing concept but embark is fucking it up in so many ways

[royal pier]

But yeah, no build should be like Medium and nearly entirely self-sufficient. Classes should have to rely on each other to make up for weaknesses. Heavy's weaknesses is range and speed.

[patent idol]

Y’all haven’t said one way how the single boosted jump would be OP, it’s vertical movement buff…so it literally doesn’t make them faster at anything but climbing…

[royal pier]

You can place jump pad at an angle via Goo Nade.

[patent idol]

Needs 2 people and doesn’t help a heavy if he’s solo queued

[royal pier]

You can do it solo as Medium.

[bitter surge]

What kind of gadgets do you guys want to use in the game ?

[spring grotto]

High jump, c4 and rocket… entire team dead…

[winter jay]

jet pack

[spark igloo]

the first hit was the main issue by far, the multihits were just further issues

[patent idol]

Obviously I’m talking about a heavy spec, so how does a solo queued heavy do that?😭

[spring grotto]

High jump, pyro mine, mgl spam… entire team dead

[winter jay]

free charge and slams

[spring grotto]

Itd be a spec so no

[bitter surge]

Mgl’s rockets will just bounce and go away

[patent idol]

Like that can’t be done with jump pads already…and nobody does it why? Cuz rpg radius sucks. Nice try but no, wouldn’t be OP and you can’t even do all that in the air before you hit the ground again.

[faint silo]

give the light a computer mouse that when you click on an enemy, instantly kills and deletes them from the match and uninstalls their game

[winter jay]

oh missed that part. mgl has some launch tech on its own

[royal pier]

Heavy should be reliant on others for movement.

I wouldn't say no to Heavy getting boosted to Medium sprint speed while out of
Combat and standing close to a teammate.

I constantly have to yell at my team to remember that I'm slow lol.

[winter jay]

heavy sledge overhead slam should alt f4 your game

[spring grotto]

You can shoot the c4 with rocket for more dmg, you can shoot the pyro for more dmg… man do u even play?

[patent idol]

Again this isn’t gonna be like Superman jumping buildings boosted jump. Like double jump height max. So this wouldn’t happen.

[faint silo]

nah it should delete the french language pack on linux

[spring grotto]

How is double jump helping you climb buildings.

[patent idol]

And you’d have to set that up before hand…you wouldn’t be able to do that before you hit the ground. Nice try man, but this is a plan you can already do.

[spring grotto]

Window climb, goo stairs…

[patent idol]

Reach climbable objects a heavy can’t, and make the goo stray more viable for tall buildings without having to wait too long.

[patent idol]

Again for the third time, not every building has windows, and anything over 4 stories without climbable windows you need to wait for a goo recharge. You KNOW that strat is picky

[spring grotto]

I still dont see why heavies need movement. Just play as a team.

[hoary fox]

I don't think so. I think they're doing a good job, maybe at just a slower pace. Some updates are targeted to help some players and others are targeted for others. People kept complaining about heavy over and over and so he got nerfed to the sorta pushover he is now. Either way, if you've followed the game for the last year+ then surely some patches have made you happy and others pissed you off. For instance recently with the removal of stun gun, as a light main, I love this change. We're finally not rewarding terrible players that just stun, kill with M11 or DB, and repeat. Now the people that can aim are having a great time. However, I bet those DB and M11 players are swearing off the game until it comes back lol. Saying stuff like "oh my god, how am I supposed to kill a heavy now??"

I'm rambling, point is, embark is trying to make their small community happy. Some updates need to help the new people and some need to be changes that veterans have been asking for. Also, at the end of the day, its a free game man. Some people forget that when getting angry about certain things. The game being free doesn't give them a pass for everything but its not right to expect everything to be perfect.

[cunning kettle]

Holy wall of text I ain’t reading allat

[patent idol]

Cuz over 50% of players on console are probably solo queuing like most FPS games. It’s not like they force people to use mics, and people barely do in this game. Not to mention, heavy is boring and this would be fun, not OP, and USEFUL TO NEW PLAYERS. ur only argument is “yeah but I’m good and I can make do” okay?

[winter jay]

heavy isnt boring. some of the most fun weapons,gadgets in the game. plus i love CnS

[spring grotto]

Sorry if when u play heavy, your team doesnt zip n pad u around.

[patent idol]

Btw as a DB player who never used the Stun Gun, the DB gets a lot of hate…it’s hard to be crazy with it and not die every push, okay?😭

[hoary fox]

Brother you got problems if you call that a wall of text. You ever write an essay? lmao

[patent idol]

They do, but the fact that the heavy has no choice but that, and a lot of people like going double light in WT these days? If heavy needs to be in their own, they should be able to be efficiently. Notice how you couldn’t say examples on how it was OP? And every reason you said it’s unneeded had problems? You have some sort of issue with the idea bro😭

[hoary fox]

Its not hard to kill a light with it though :3

[cunning kettle]

Bro has not heard of a phone screen

[toxic plover]

I call it a utility tool that can be used for traversal

[patent idol]

You right :)

[hoary fox]

Bro has not heard of scrolling

[obsidian nexus]

lol its not

[patent idol]

Heavy sucks to play on WT or Ranked brother, some people like it but most casual players go light and medium for a reason

[cunning kettle]

Bro is taking discord way too seriously

[spark zenith]

heavies have good movement tbh

[patent idol]

Okay, you kill a team with two bullets son😭

[hoary fox]

bro is in a discussion channel and cant read

[winter jay]

i mean it sucks when my team leaves behind, but thats not really heavy issue, its a teamplay one

they could just like wait for me before engaging

[spark zenith]

heavy isnt bad on world tour its just mid

[patent idol]

Yeah but I came up with with a non-OP way to fix that, that doesn’t mess with the dynamics or pacing of the game and every light main and medium main is just complaining 😭

[toxic plover]

Round shield, basically a smaller barricade you can sprint with on your hand

[spark zenith]

the body slam thingy goes crazy when u jump off a pad and 1 tap everyone on the ship.

[spring grotto]

I do have an issue with giving the class with the most util, the most health, and the best spread of weapons more chance to use that. If heavy bores u pick another class. Go watch truce use the most niche weapon and absolutely obliterate good teams. Go watch any heavy main, absolutely carry games with their nearly infinite resources.

[patent idol]

Like if there’s a non-broken way to fix that, that’s faster than the janky backdoors you have to take in the game, why not?😭

[obsidian nexus]

all u need is 1 door or 1 little pillar/rock/tree/ literally any cover.

[hoary fox]

The thing about heavy in the current meta is that his gadgets and abilities are really only enabled by his team. If your team leaves you behind or ignores you and splits up, you're normally doomed.

[winter jay]

because you are solving a problem thats solved by playing the game correctly

[obsidian nexus]

db is by far lights easiest weapon to get good value with. apart from lh1 but lh1 can more easily be baited value if u only play it on range

[spring grotto]

Group up! If you team is leaving you. Spam the fucking thing man

Heavy is absolutely fun asl to play. And comes with so much pressure you can control entire fights.

[spark zenith]

real. you can also js follow ur team and rush with them

[royal pier]

It's a wonder gadget that still feels underwhelming at times.

[spring grotto]

Shhhh dont tell him

[patent idol]

I do good with most guns too m8, you are missing the point lil bro. 1: heavys gadgets are plentiful and NICHE. Not one of the heavy’s gadgets is as useful in every game as the light’s or medium’s. People win games without a grav cube. It’s much harder without a gateway or a zipline…Heavy’s util is NOT op as it is, you are just a complainer bro😭

[hoary fox]

I play light and I play off my heavy (on the rare occasion I have a good one). I play off angles and help do damage as he is fighting them head on. I gave up being a heavy main when he was only getting nerfs in S2

[toxic plover]

Yeah goo gun needs buffs

[royal pier]

I wonder if the server improvements made trapping with goo gun more reliable.

[patent idol]

if YOUR TEAM plays the game correctly…I stg all of yall forget what it’s like to be a new player on solo queue, and just cuz you’ve seen tiktok plays work with goo grenades and grav you think they work in every situation…

[toxic plover]

As a heavy I'm usually the fastest on my team, and if I don't have a heal beam medium with me then I play flank

[toxic plover]

Good question, will test.

[spring grotto]

Heavies util decides games man, and is completely balanced. What is niche about bubble and pyro spamming? Or winching and obliterating with SA, SHAK, etc. Whats niche about flanking and kiting with mesh and barricades.

[patent idol]

LH1, M11, XP, and the Bow are all easier imo

[spring grotto]

Heavy isnt op because they need their team….

[spark zenith]

actually real. im usually the frst to rush when my team and i are rushing together. me and my friends are kinda sped so they end up 80 meters away at a vending machine lol

[royal pier]

I've wanted to master Goo Gun + MGL32 but it was always so gd inconsistent.

[toxic plover]

I'm loosing my shit that my Zipline medium can't keep up with me

[spring grotto]

Soloq with a bad team is the beat way to get better. Soloq is the best way to get better.

[spark zenith]

the light with a grapple hook halfway across the map supposedly "rushing head on"

[spring grotto]

Just play like truce

[obsidian nexus]

u need good positioning with xp. u only need 1 door with db

[winter jay]

yea randoms are unpredictable. nature of the game. goo grenades are also one of the most versatile things in the game. cube has other uses besides mobility.

[patent idol]

Bro the average heavy used barricades, nades, and RPG…nobody is yelling at their heavy teammate for not using grav cube my boi. You are complaining about something that is not true. What’s needed more Defib and Zipline? Or RPG and Barricade💀 Gateway or Lockbolt?💀 you are a sweat that thinks everyone gotta play like you and they shouldn’t appease to the newbies. I’m a sweat that wants more people to play the damn game😭

[winter jay]

ong. i cant get the goo ball launch to send me as far as his. idk what im doing wrong

[hoary fox]

You two are getting the WORST lights.

[toxic plover]

(he went to the wrong cashout)
(He says he's"just touching box" gets killed)

[royal pier]

Idk who that is.

[patent idol]

DB damage is unforgiving too, light arm shot and you can’t even 2 tap

[hoary fox]

or still thinks its plug meta and goes for every plug

[winter jay]

youtube who does alot of movment techs with goo, and runs mgl alot

[spark zenith]

trust my friends are soo good at light (heavy grain of salt)

[royal pier]

I love my Anti-grav Cube. I'm scared to see if they neutered the combo with Winch when I get home.

[spring grotto]

I suggested grab cube for movement, why do u keep bringing it up as if its actually good or a decent pick.

[winter jay]

actually ijust realized the heavy movment issues is simply solved by learning niche goo barrel techs. Solved game

[patent idol]

I don’t disagree but some people aren’t playing a game to “get better” they’re playing games casually…heavy’s movement only has enough gadgets for it…if you’re good…this is why people don’t like sweats bro😭

[hoary fox]

My friends are all casuals and mainly play Medium and somehow most of them are still very rough around the edges

[royal pier]

I wanna trap people and blow up their feet but the goo will often just phase through people

[spring grotto]

Then go play quick cash, power shift, TA, tdm

[toxic plover]

He grabs box and lets you and bro handle the 2v3(it's a SA winch heavy and healbeam Cerberus medium, and stungun light)

[royal pier]

Jumping right as you enter Anti-grav Cube does actually give you a semi jump pad like boost.

[patent idol]

Tell me 3 heavy Gadgets that are OP besides the RPG as that’s a given for every heavy. Not one of them compares to Medium and Light builds, and in some cases the Medium has them too. You are BSing about the heavy gadgets lil bro

[winter jay]

probably a server thing if i had to guess. but the thing im talking about can be done with goo barrels around the maps and like an explosion.

[hoary fox]

"you guys just keep dying"

[royal pier]

Also it's bullshit that spear doesn't penetrate goo but sledgehammer does.

[toxic plover]

A winch nerf is a cube nerf fight me

[patent idol]

So ur a sweat that thinks casual players shouldn’t get updates and should just play the casual modes as is…gotchaaaa, y’all shouldn’t be allowed in the requests sections im ngl

[winter jay]

is a cube buff a winch buff

[royal pier]

Oh yeah it's absolutely server based.

[spring grotto]

RPG being an instant 100dmg opener, mesh and bubble stacking, pyro spam, winch….

[royal pier]

Yeah you gotta be careful now cause it's easy to whiff with Winch now.

[royal pier]

RPG as an opener is amateur stuff. Gotta save it for runners.

[patent idol]

You just said “screw the casual players, they don’t need adjustments” without saying it bro. And this is a common problem with the community too. Yall think everyone finna use their brain to use gadgets in the weirdest ways possible…this spec wouldn’t be OP nobody’s come up with a valid reason on that yet, and would help the noobs. They shouldn’t have to learn the nerdiest strats to play the game gng😭

[royal pier]

I do not follow my own advice reliably.

[toxic plover]

Yeah idk what anyone says 2 meters makes a giant difference

[hoary fox]

OR take off RPG and use lockbolt like a chad

[royal pier]

I felt the difference immediately.

[toxic plover]

Huge Chad work lockbolt>RPG

[timid saffron]

Use both 🗿

[royal pier]

I use both. I'd actually love for RPG to be less mandatory.

[winter jay]

use both 😎

[spring grotto]

Im someone who enjoys competitive games, casual players should enjoy the game just as much as the sweat. But changing an entire classes dynamic for the betterment of new player experiences is what has ruined many games. Yes new players should get updates catering to them, but the point of heavy is to be slow, feeling weak when not supported by a team.

[patent idol]

Pryo “spam” only exists on Powershift, isn’t OP on cash out. Bubble stacking needs 2 Heavy’s and is easy to fight against 1. And Mesh is a Spec….winch too….

[hoary fox]

taking off RPG feels like I lose so much destruction but if you have a M make up for it with Demat.. its insane. Demat, lockbolt, beam them.

[spring grotto]

Mesh and bubbles in a fight in cash out is strong. Pyro spamming in cashout is strong.

[patent idol]

It literally doesn’t change the classes dynamic 😭 ur acting like I said give them dash…it’s a boosted just that doesn’t work off angles my boy…you are complaining abt nothing.

[spring grotto]

Im arguing your shit point, your complaining about heavies slow gameplay style.

[toxic plover]

I run sledge, destruction is not something I have to worry about

[royal pier]

I should mess with Lockbolt with C4 more.

[patent idol]

No ur actually trash if pyro “spamming” (with one heavy avg?) gets you. And mesh and bubble with one heavy, again, only is OL with two heavy’s…so like, ur either bad at fighting heavy’s or…nah that’s gotta be it

[royal pier]

Cause you can just toss it at em and duck behind cover for a boom.

[toxic plover]

Lockbolt flashbang flamethrower is nasty

[royal pier]

C4 needs something. Either faster arming time, two charges with less dmg... something.

[patent idol]

No ur not, it doesn’t change the classes dynamic. How does a vertical movement buff change that? Indoors it’s BAD to use and it’s easy to get beamed? Like ur just talking out ur ahh

[spark zenith]

mgl, rpg, barricade, and pyro

[royal pier]

I do like Flash, but my team doesn't.

[winter jay]

i like using it with explosive mine to make the super mine, but yea it kinda seems like it just good for stopping steals

[royal pier]

I play with a Dagger lover.

[hoary fox]

You just have to wait for the recharge on one. If you get lucky or place it smart its a great tool.

[toxic plover]

I think a high jump specialization for heavy would be ass and never ever used, but idc if it was added or not

[patent idol]

They’d still be slow with a boost jump😭 they’d just be able to climb buildings slightly faster, and falling down from an RPG or something isn’t PUSH ruining.

[toxic plover]

You go to the asylum for using MGL

[royal pier]

I do sometimes place it on a throwable so by the time I reach obj I have two. Risky though.

[spark zenith]

w heavy loadout? also i have the dash

[patent idol]

That’s fair, it would probably get used on Powershift a lot though. Especially on skyway

[spark zenith]

its fire

[patent idol]

I’m not saying it’d be the best spec, but I’ve heard so many new people ask for this, and this guys acting like it’s game breaking😭

[toxic plover]

I can't do it bro

[winter jay]

no its goated. you are now an artillery salvo. plus it has movement techs

[spring grotto]

You have a double jump, goo the fucking wall man

[spark zenith]

shooot at the floor w tactic

[winter jay]

its the opposite of gamebreaking. i dont think it would be run ever

[toxic plover]

I'll have to check it out

[patent idol]

Bro are you gonna make me say why that only works on like 2 maps for a 3rd time?😭

[spring grotto]

Im acting as if its actually shit idea. Why add yet another way for heavy to play the game

[winter jay]

its pretty awkard up close but in the right ranges its a menace. like team wipe with 6 nades menace

[patent idol]

Cuz heavy has 2 ways to play the game is is bro😭

[hoary fox]

my man is making nukes in S5, respect.

[toxic plover]

Imagine if there was a lunge specialization for heavy melee
LUNGE
ITS LIGHT DASH BUT YOU GET 1 CHARGE AND A 4 SEC RECHARGE TIME

[spark zenith]

if it was a thing would it kinda be like a body slam or just a high jump

[royal pier]

Catapult Heavy gadget. Have it only give any good distance when used from height.

[spark zenith]

it'd be funny to send enemies flying hundreds of feet into the air

[patent idol]

High jump, a body slam would be a good addition to it like jumping with the charge and slam but that COULD be OP with an rpg

[royal pier]

Use with Slam to be human artillery.

[toxic plover]

I might have to dedicate a weekend to it once I give up on ranked grind

[spark zenith]

w combo

[patent idol]

I originally thought of it with the body slam idea, but that actually would be used…and would be OP. So nah..

[spark zenith]

what if it did like 20 damage but had insane knockback

[patent idol]

If I said the Body Slam thing when I first offered this idea nobody would’ve taken it serious, and kids like this would’ve been like “but charge and slam already exists” so…

[patent idol]

Knock back is a good idea

[spring grotto]

No way your serious

[toxic plover]

It's mostly heavy mains in the gadgets-weapons chat rn if y'all haven't noticed

[spark zenith]

i remember with charge and slam i jumped from a building and sent my friend absolutely flying

[patent idol]

Slaps abt to be like “but why not have ur mic-less teammate with 30 goo grandes place an angled jump pad and charge and slam on an entire team it’s easy man”

[spark zenith]

i did that with a normal jump pad on the ship gamemode and killed the entire team

[patent idol]

Yeah knock back is actually a good idea, think about how teammates can get saved with that.

[toxic plover]

Or fucked

[patent idol]

And it’s not “OP” cuz if you do it wrong ur teammates get knocked off the map. But it’s a heavy thing so ur probably gonna have something

[spring grotto]

Just give heavy the ability to fly man, for the new players who struggle learning to play then game the way it was intended to be played

[patent idol]

That’s what stops it from being OP😭 and we need more ways to kill out teammates fr

[patent idol]

Exactly my point😭 ion wanna catch you in here sayin no ideas man. The games perfect as is.

[toxic plover]

You gave up with him huh lmao

[spring grotto]

Ur totally right man, just mash all the classes together and make 300 the regular health and every gun .17 ttk

[royal pier]

Driving home, these server changes better not be lies istg.

[spring grotto]

Fuck it just sell to Activision and cashout

[toxic plover]

It's better, melee magnetism is actually working and swings are reging

[patent idol]

Lmaooo still waiting on the legitimate Overpowered heavy gadgets, cuz Pyro Mine is not one of them😭

[spring grotto]

You said op, i mentioned strong.

[toxic plover]

Imma be honest with you dude, and I speak for all the heavys here. We don't want mobility, of any kind really.

[patent idol]

You said it was stronger than mediums and lights bro. Never been the case, never will be….even with a flying spec😭

[spring grotto]

Whern

[patent idol]

That’s valid, I’ve heard this mentioned to me like a dozen times so there’s definitely heavy’s that do want movement too

[spring grotto]

Heavies are strong, a good heavy can carry a game.

[patent idol]

This is the When you were asking for

[spring grotto]

Mediums are strong, a good medium can carry a game.

[patent idol]

And here’s the 2nd when

[spring grotto]

Nothing i said is false?

[toxic plover]

I will say, the long hp Regen delay is bullshit, I want it changed

[spring grotto]

I was being 100% serious when i said completely balanced.. Tf?

[spring grotto]

The Regan should just be a standard time between classes, the hp difference gives the intended effect

[patent idol]

nah you misunderstood my quoting, ur saying it decides games. A light with a gateway, and medium with Defib and Zip decides ANY game before a single heavy gadget does

[patent idol]

and nothing I just said is false

[spring grotto]

HML is the strongest team comp…

[patent idol]

yes, this

[patent idol]

I didn't disagree, but gadget wise the heavy is the weakest link of the three by far gng. Thats not even close

[toxic plover]

Yeah getting low and getting tagged as soon as my HP starts to Regen so I'm out of the fight for a whole 16 seconds feels stupid bad

[patent idol]

There's not a single Heavy gadget as useful to the team as a Gateway, Zip, Defib, Or Jumpad, that argument made no sense as to why we shouldnt have one team based gadget for the heavy

[spring grotto]

Weakest in terms of macro sure, micro they have every tool needed to turn game deciding fights completely around.

[toxic plover]

Barricade and lockbolt

[patent idol]

no. lmfao this was a bad try bro

[toxic plover]

Why no

[patent idol]

Barricade is good, but lockbolt is better in powershift than anything else. it CAN be okay, but no it is not on the same tier as Zip, Pad, and Gateway my boy

[spring grotto]

Defib needs a rework, Gateway needs a range nerf, jumpad and zip are the only thing bridging the gap between heavy and medium.

[toxic plover]

Wrong

Lockbolt straight up wins team fights, so does RPG

[patent idol]

and sure? I guess? like yeah pyro mines are good, barricades, and rpg are all good, but heavy doesnt have one SOLID team based gadget. Jump boost aside, Heavy needs a healing beacon

[spring grotto]

U joking right?

[toxic plover]

Healing beacon? Lmao

[patent idol]

.... -_-

[spring grotto]

Bubble and mesh are being completely ignored ig huh

[patent idol]

like Val has a combat stim? 5 second small healing beacon

[toxic plover]

I'd literally never loose a 1v3 if I could self heal as a sledge heavy bro

[patent idol]

That would be the only team based gadget they have, I'm not saying its healing beam strong, maybe 25% of that but yeah

[spring grotto]

Nahh bro heavy should have movement and self sufficiency

[patent idol]

Light could use a stim charge if we're being fr too, but people dont wanna have that talk

[spring grotto]

Bc new player and such bizz

I think the healing barrels introduced in WT split were amazing and should be added into the game

[patent idol]

Bro it would be like 5 second duration and the heal would be so small its really only usable after a team wipe...y'all gotta remember balancing exists too

[patent idol]

i agree with this

yk what screw the health beacon, Give heavy a combat stim bro

that would actually go so hard on cashout

[spring grotto]

Give heavies a spec that makes them fast towards team mates

Or a stim that makes the faster towars team mates

[patent idol]

atp just give them a running spec lmfao

[patent idol]

an "octane" stim for heavys wouldnt be too bad....but that would be more dynamic breaking than a high jump bro and that was ur idea lmfao

[spring grotto]

Well no shit man it was a joke

[toxic plover]

@spring grotto @patent idol

I did have a thought weeks ago that I liked, two of them and I want your thoughts.

Blind sentry-flashbamg effect the closer and more direct you look at it.

Lockdown turret-APS sized and does a heal beam effect to nearby allys except it's damage redirection. Has 300hp and once it takes that damage it breaks. Redirects 30% of damage taken

[patent idol]

If my heavy healing beacon was over powered, The Lockdown Turret is GAME breaking

[patent idol]

first idea aint bad tho

[spring grotto]

Blinding sentry would go brazzy. But not a full blind. Maybe a tarkov flashlight effect. Dmg redirect should stun once broken and do more dmg to user ino

[sacred scroll]

Or maybe buff the anti-grav cube to let the heavy that threw it to move very fast up and down

[spring grotto]

Or make it have and alternate fire that has a lil boost, like a double jump. 😁

[sacred scroll]

How to you alt fire it when the rmb already underthrows it?

[spring grotto]

Some sorta toggle that changes it mode? And can only be dropped at feet.

Ik @patent idol is punching air rn

It would have to only move the casting player or sumn to keep it from being a cashout stopper.

And grief tool

Tbh i only argued with dude because i like to, and would like to rank up in the server

[toxic plover]

I think blinding sentry would be just so fun though

[spring grotto]

@patent idol where did u go

[spring grotto]

It would be, but as in a partial blind.

[peak monolith]

Playing Riot Shield turns you into a mini-Heavy, you can two shot Lights, you're near-bulletproof, and you can use Guardian Turret to still be able to shoot back or have a teammate behind you to shoot back. (Works really well with MLL comps. Flanks and crushing force.) I'm not saying nerf, but I am saying that a weapon that can basically take and contest space like no other, basically for free?

[spring grotto]

U can put turrets into objects and barrels too..

[peak monolith]

A sentry that just emits a really large glare effect like with snipers, just obscurring vision in a decent sized area.

[spring grotto]

@patent idol did u really give up?

[toxic plover]

I think 60% of your screen should be blinded, looking at two of them next to each other is 100% blind

[spring grotto]

30 take it or leave it

Medium needs a new spec

[peak monolith]

I think either partial dim of the screen or area specific blind is the only really fair option. Maybe if it could only full blind one target at a time, but otherwise that gets really powerful and disruptive.

[spring grotto]

I had a crazy idea but forgot it bc my brain has been shriveled due to consistent mary jane abuse

[peak monolith]

I think it is a fun idea to mess around with, turrets that are designed to perfom the task of specific grenades/mines. A toggleable gas or smoke screen on a turret would be amazing, place it down and be able to remotely spray gas in and area like C4.

Or something like XYZ "Charges" Like a goo charge that can create a wall of goo after detonating to isolate enemies, or a flash charge that could act similar to Vyse's blind from Valorant.

[toxic plover]

I mean it's powerful yes, but it's as easy to destroy as a prox sensor and only blinds if you look directly at it

[peak monolith]

But it's hard to destroy it if you can't see it.

[spring grotto]

How about, mediums get a lil go cart

[peak monolith]

New bumper cars LTM

[toxic plover]

Fair, it would force you to use whatever grenade you have on hand to break it

[spring grotto]

120 sec cd, lasts through death. And has a smaller hp pool

[toxic plover]

Dear God please let me double blind sentry and mesh shield to hold a point please I wanna be cheesy just for like a week then remove it

@spring grotto @peak monolith

[peak monolith]

Oh god

[toxic plover]

I also want lockbolt trap. It's a glitch mine but it does lockbolt

[barren ether]

muted again e.e

[peak monolith]

Spinning in circles while blinded and hitting absolutely nothing.

[toxic plover]

Wanna know what's worse?

Instead of blind sentry, make it a MICROWAVE SENTRY😈😈SEE WHERE IM GOING WITH THIS@peak monolith @spring grotto

[peak monolith]

Flamethrower sentries are terrible ideas

Turn a room into a bomb in 2.5 seconds

[toxic plover]

You don't even gotta look at it just let it hit you and you start slowly being able to see less and less until you are fully blinded and start taking damage

Cancer Ray ass turret

[peak monolith]

I feel like that's actually a good idea, something that punishes not breaking it by amping up over time. Cause it would be good during a fight but could be punishing as you'd have to prioritize it over a steal or res.

[toxic plover]

I agree, it's also not instant value like other gadgets so there's that

When they go for steals but are fully microwaved and can't see me charging up my Heavy attack with sledge HWAAAAA

I think to get maximum value you definitely need to have ample time to set them up though

I didn't mean to interrupt y'all sorry what were you saying @peak monolith @spring grotto

[peak monolith]

I agree that the value should come from playing with the turret, and not something that can kill on it's own, but I feel like blind turret + gun turret = free killz

[toxic plover]

Yeah but if it was microwave sentry it isn't an instant blind and the damage doesn't happen until you are fully saturated with microwaves

Now a sentry turret with barricade behind it then the microwave sentry would be aids, but that's using up one specialization and two gadgets to hold a single direction at a point

@peak monolith

[spring grotto]

Make cl40 one shot barrels if there isnt gunna be any indirect dmg with near hits

Hits on players that is

Actually make it useful toss something at a team if its gunna suck butt

[peak monolith]

That isn't the most costfull thing, I'm just saying these are things to be considered, cause counterplay would need to be thought out, and beating the combo play should feel rewarding, while not being difficult to just play against.

[patent idol]

playing WT now i aint reading all this atm

[spring grotto]

Lmaoo

[patent idol]

wall running

[spring grotto]

I was thinking something not movement based, zip n pad should be it

Like a 5% high velocity mag.

5% capacity that is

[patent idol]

movement based is ight for medium not like heavu

[toxic plover]

There's still RPG,demat, data reshaper, thermal bore, frags, and others that would all get rid of the threat, I'm not too worried

[peak monolith]

Fair enough

[patent idol]

more ammo as a spec? lmao

[peak monolith]

An AMP Gun instead of a heal gun that provides passive ammo regen/move speed and bonus damage.

[spring grotto]

No, it reload the gun with 5% of max capacity with high velocity bullets. More headshot dmg.

[peak monolith]

move speed only if melee and don't have ammo

[toxic plover]

I meeeaaaann...I'm pretty diabolical with sledge you really want me moving faster?

[spring grotto]

High risk, high reward

[peak monolith]

It's the AMP Gun; it's gotta amp you somehow

[toxic plover]

Fair. Or gadgets cooldown faster

[peak monolith]

Maybe just faster attack speed and not move speed.

[peak monolith]

This could lead to a infinite defib loop

[toxic plover]

If used on melee yeah, but that's still 1 guy not shooting so effectively a 3v2

[spring grotto]

You cannot tell me the high velocity mag isnt a good idea?

[peak monolith]

Faster reloads/action speed sounds better, it's just steroids, make you arm nades a bit faster.

[peak monolith]

An ammo box for Medium providing buffed damage sounds fun, much more passive support.

[spring grotto]

Id rather have my revolver one shot head shot lights

[worldly ice]

Yo

[toxic plover]

Super launching the vault as a heavy with double amp beam on a Zipline jump

[peak monolith]

BRADY FROM THE 80 YARD LINE! TOUCHDOOOOWN!!!!!

[toxic plover]

Lmao as a heavy I can jump and QM throw a vault 80m already

We talking 250m launch

[peak monolith]

Me throwing my Light build into the stands because I'm bored

[toxic plover]

I used to hate lights

Now I just hate people who beg for stungun

[peak monolith]

It's not about playing Light, it's about the principle

[spring grotto]

Make the cl40 not do more dmg to me than enemies

[peak monolith]

S-L-A-P buff

[toxic plover]

Make medium not have Cerberus.

Delete Cerberus

[spring grotto]

Make the cl40 either two shot mediums or not two shot me

Not its idiotic that my gls do 125 to me, but less that that to enemies

[toxic plover]

How much damage is a direct GL hit

[spring grotto]

A third a mediums hp

[hardy dust]

100

[spring grotto]

Yea that

[toxic plover]

Thanks light main

[hardy dust]

90 damage max on splash though

[spring grotto]

Cap, its always been 11

Cept that one time they buffed it

[hardy dust]

11 damage the moment it's a milimeter off target 😭

[spring grotto]

Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup

Its abhorrently frustrating

And in any close quarters fight 1v1s become 2v1s once any distance is closed

[toxic plover]

I wouldn't mind if they removed self damage from it, but they got to for MGL too

[spring grotto]

Im fucking killing myself faster than they are killing me.

[spring grotto]

Or reduce it

[hardy dust]

It should be reduced for both grenade launchers

[spring grotto]

A little room for error

[hardy dust]

Especially mgl imo, since it would make it a lot better up close

[spring grotto]

Truce would love that, i love truce

[hardy dust]

Being able to bounce it on a roof or wall at point blank would be great, especially considering there is basically nothing you can do at that range rn without c&s

[toxic plover]

True, and I hate CNS

[hardy dust]

Same, but I don't mind it on mgl, or other niche picks.

[toxic plover]

Stun is a win button on melee, that alone is reason enough to remove/rework it

[hardy dust]

Hopefully it gets a good rework.

I really wish winch gets reworked too, since it has the exact same issues as stun but slightly worse.

[toxic plover]

I straight up wouldn't care if it still disabled everything but just didn't fuck my move speed

[swift cradle]

That's silly. It doesn't even happen in every situation

[hardy dust]

That's how I'd change it personally. Full glitch but no movement penalty.

Since the main problem part of stun is the movement penalty working as a crutch for and against bad players.

Full glitch gives it more utility.

[toxic plover]

Or interact and specialization block but not gadget or movement would be cool too

[peak monolith]

Yes. A handheld glitch-gun is perfect, especially for Light since they can get their skull caved in by most Heavy gadgets and Charge&Slam

[toxic plover]

Overhead slide jump go BRRRRR

[swift cradle]

Id just remove it from the game at this point. It's not even a stun gun anymore

[toxic plover]

Damn near

[hardy dust]

Rename it to glitch gun or smth

[peak monolith]

Yeah, but a Heavy just points an RPG at their feet and most Light builds just go away.

[toxic plover]

I'm okay with that too. Only thing I'd bi tch about at this point is SH and cerb

[swift cradle]

You know that's not gonna happen lol

[toxic plover]

Sorry, SA winch is bullshit too

[hardy dust]

I wish it would, but it's embark, so they're gonna manage to completely gut it but still make it horrid to play against as melee or smth.

[peak monolith]

The Cerb is barely a shotgun at this point, most only use it point-blank, they could've just added a firesword and it'd be the same difference

[hardy dust]

Winch is bullshit. Sa12 is more or less fine.

[swift cradle]

I mean everyone bitches about something, that's why stuff gets nerfed out of nowhere now

[peak monolith]

Just straight up give Medium a torch to swing around and it'd be just as good as the Cerb if not better

[hardy dust]

I just wish niche stuff would get more love. Give more things the 93r treatment

[swift cradle]

I literally got stunned yesterday turned around and killed a light without a second thought

[hoary tulip]

To the finals why did you cut OUR tickets to get the Valentines suit some of us had 18 out of 20 finished VErY pissed off

[toxic plover]

Honestly, I think you lights would be okay with winch if it was guaranteed you could get out of the light attack QM combo on winch if you dash

[hardy dust]

Cerb is really good...

[swift cradle]

It's really not that bad. You wanna see busted stun gun? Go back and play the beta version

[toxic plover]

Cerb out DPas sledge at point blank and that's wrong

[hardy dust]

I remember people would have hotkeys to increase their sensitivity when they got stunned

[peak monolith]

Yeah that's what I meant, a melee weapon doing the same damage with consistent fire would be the same thing

[hardy dust]

Winch should be telegraphed and reactable.

[toxic plover]

Oh, yeah. It's bullshit cause now they can keep pressure on you at range just by tickling you so your HP don't come back

[toxic plover]

If it had like 20m grab yeah sure if I'm spinning that thing like a dumbass

[swift cradle]

At this rate, the game is going to get dull and boring with guns and gadgets getting watered down every patch

[spring grotto]

On the contrary, uhh

[peak monolith]

Winch should be like a reverse-grapple, let me swing grappled objects/opponents around like a flail

[toxic plover]

I think the game is getting better to play because things are less bullshit to go against

[toxic plover]

Lmao that would be cool

[swift cradle]

It depends on the player. It's more frustrating for newer players and melee users.

[peak monolith]

I think my main problem is that for a game with some pride on it's destructable environment, there's very little interaction with it. I would love to see more immersive environment interaction between abilities, or more maps with special things or features/traps/events only on one map or area of a map.

[toxic plover]

I'm okay with saying winch is bullshit and needs a wind up if that means it'll be better off later on with more utility

[spring grotto]

Yes, i want to make love to my demo’d builing and have little rubble babies

[toxic plover]

Bernal did pretty good with this

[swift cradle]

Winch is a better stun gun than stun gun

[peak monolith]

Like even something simple as goo being able to replace supports for a structure, like patching up the suspention of a floating platform with goo gun

[swift cradle]

And goo gun

[spring grotto]

Demat the supports to make them invincible

[dusky sigil]

Sup

[peak monolith]

I always forget demat exists it's just Medium's C4 to me

"Break walls" item

[swift cradle]

Does road hogs chain have wind up time in overwatch?

[toxic plover]

Idk I don't play OW

[swift cradle]

Lmf

We can't expect every gadget and ability to have a telegraph. Players need to learn to use their ingenuity and come up with strategies to prevent those situations from happening in the first place.

That's the finals

[peak monolith]

But most of the Finals is just "sigh" and then you lose.

[toxic plover]

I peekaboo door frames to bait rpg

[swift cradle]

Next thing we're gonna have to change guns to let players know they are gonna get shot. With big letters over the u.i.

[peak monolith]

At least with things like Roadhog's hook, you know Roadhog has a hook, you know that that's a thing that is going to happen and can play around it and are prepared for it. For the most part in the Finals, you don't know what an enemy is carrying until KERCHINK

[swift cradle]

They tell you what spec every player is using before the match starts.

They should do it with gadgets too tho.

[peak monolith]

It doesn't need to be telegraphed what a player is doing actively, that's how you learn, but it should be telegraphed that a player has that and you know what you're up against. That is also a major part of learning.

[toxic plover]

Let me ask you something.

Would it be worth it to see the icons of all enemies cooldowns, gadgets, and specializations when you look at them? Or just when you look at scoreboard

[peak monolith]

Completely forgot it does that, probably because I too am a TikTok scrolling teen during the opening of a match.

[peak monolith]

No, but it would be worth it to understand the situation you get into before going into a fight. But there isn't much room to argue this point, as this is not Overwatch

[toxic plover]

@hardy dust what do you think

[peak monolith]

In a game with this many moving variables and things to keep track of, I'm simply saying that it's rather hard to manage, especially as a newer player.

[hardy dust]

I haven't been reading the convo, what's the topic rn?

[quartz juniper]

HEY EMBARK

Still has issue after death my equipped inspect diesnt work, its the default one.

And please do something about powershift platform damaging the player and if you guys seriously want it to be a mechanic and damage you underneath, then it shouldnt be the fastest damaging thing in game and reduce the DAMAGE

Please go back to old ui for gadget icons

Please fix another glitch thats been in game since day 1, when picking up player totem, cashout, whatever, sometimes you will drop it trying to open door or go up zipline and i have gotten caught trying to run away many times because of this

AND HOW LONG IS IT GONNA TAKE TO BE ABLE TO EDIT LOADOUT OR CHANGE CONTESTANT IMMEDIATELY AFTER DEATH INSTEAD OF WAITING 8 SECONDS TO NOT WATCH A KILL CAM. I DONT WANT TO RUSH TO CHANGE MY STUFF BECAUSE HALF MY RESPAWN TIMER WAS TAKEN UP NY NOTHING, AND HALF THE TIME IT FREEZES OR ACTS LIKE IM CHOOSING SOMETHING ELSE, ANNOYING.

another good idea would be WHEN I CHANGE MY LOADOUT while KIA, then i get a revived and have same contestant or loadout, i get that but when i die again then i should have what i chose, not have to select it once again

[peak monolith]

TL:DR is: Knowing your opponent's loadout before-hand.

[swift cradle]

It's fine. That's half the earth at this point.

I do think the scoreboard needs a bit more adjustments to let players know what's going on.

The feedback channel is full or more complaining than reasonable thing embark could do to improve the player experience.

Players knowing what specs and gadgets beforehand could help a bit. But regardless you not going to please everyone. People will always find something to complain about.

[toxic plover]

I said would you be satisfied with seeing the specializations of enemies in the scoreboard so you can prepare for the winch

[peak monolith]

I do think they could swap H, M, L on the board with the icons of the specialization and that would be nice.

[hardy dust]

You can already see it at the start of the match though?

[peak monolith]

#💣┇weapons-gadgets message

[swift cradle]

I think the balance is in a good spot all things considered. But I don't like the frag change. And heavy is a bit neglected. But it's surviving.

Stun gun change is either gonna be hot shit or just ok. So it's whatever

[hardy dust]

I dont think entire loadouts need to be revealed, its fine as is rn.

[peak monolith]

If it's information that can be provided, it should be provided consistently. Since it's shown at the start of the match, it should be on the board; is my arguement.

[hardy dust]

Better than before, that's for sure. Although while it is healthy for medium to be the strongest class, not quite to the extent it is right now.

[hardy dust]

That would be fair, but you can usually pick up on it after a single team fight at the start of the game.

[toxic plover]

In the AMA the devs said the play rate and win rate of all classes are much closer to even with a 1-2% difference

[hardy dust]

Heavy is in a decent spot, but I find heavy's lack of variety the biggest issue for decent options.
Light is in need of some love, but done right. It needs reworks not just straight buffs.

[swift cradle]

It's not necessary, but it would look better for "esports" and in general for newer players.

The fact is everything that happens to certain players is either considered frustrating or broken.

My opinion is different obviously because I don't deal with it as much. But I'm aware it's annoying to other players.

[toxic plover]

For once I agree with you. Heavys variety is a little boring and I agree on the light thing

[hardy dust]

I wouldn't mind it tbh, but I think there are other things worth dealing with first

[swift cradle]

I'd rather have new guns and specs. But embark is still balancing the game rn. So ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[toxic plover]

I say give light a new spec, but make it not totally fucking annoying

[swift cradle]

While they are reworking stun gun, im still waiting on recon senses...

[toxic plover]

Light dashing out my winch be pissing me off

[hazy merlin]

When is stun gun getting back up

[peak monolith]

When they rework it, you can read the patch notes to learn more. #patch-notes message

[hardy dust]

"Some time during season 6"
So probably around s8 or never...

[hazy merlin]

🥲

Stun gun is my main gadget that kinda sucks

[peak monolith]

Then learn to play something else

Having multiple expertise is how you deal with situations like this, where your main gets nerfed/canceled

Why I learn to play all classes and multiple weapons/specialties

[royal pier]

Ngl I ain't feelin it. What area are you in? I legit think the midwest servers are just bad.

[toxic plover]

Texas

[royal pier]

Those might be better quality idk.

[toxic plover]

You ain't feeling it for melee or for googun?

[royal pier]

Haven't tried goo gun yet but spear almost felt worse at times.

Winch was just unusable at times.

[toxic plover]

Ew gross man I'm sorry

[toxic plover]

I have an appreciation for you spear users

[royal pier]

I love it until someone just sprints backwards out of my range. Idk why they slow you while attacking.

[toxic plover]

I think even slowing you by 25% Is better than the stupid 80% move speed feature

[royal pier]

You'd also think sliding would help but nah. Istg the lunge rarely happens.

Even when I do well it can feel like they fucked up more than anything.

[toxic plover]

Funny they took away your ability to slide while spinning cause fuck you IG

@royal pier you can spin cancel by switching to a gadget now btw

[royal pier]

Lawl of course

[queen pagoda]

Could EMBARK release a top list of weapons most used by light ?
because I just played a game where 8 of the nine light were using M11
and in all matches it's the same thing every day 90% m11

[toxic plover]

In higher ELO it's all LH1

[calm grove]

LH1 still meta? Been feeling the Xp more after the nerf

Maybe it's cause I'm not used to the new TTK and would overpeek because of it

[cunning kettle]

Lh1 always light meta

It gives the best range and still has good damage

[calm grove]

So basically we have a worse long range oppressive meta with both pike and LH1

[royal pier]

This is game changing ngl

[calm grove]

Pike and LH1 sorry

[queen pagoda]

Does anyone have an explanation as to why they nerfed the dagger?
Who cried to embark?

[cunning kettle]

Oscar

[calm grove]

Uh what?

Please tell me you're lying

[cunning kettle]

And embark bandaid nerfs the dagger instead of fixing the servers that caused the weird stabs

[toxic plover]

Yeah spear almost became both viable and legitimately a threat

[queen pagoda]

why ?

[calm grove]

What did they nerf? The damage?

I'm actually gonna crash out

[queen pagoda]

Is it the most melee weapon in an fps game?

[calm grove]

Come again

[queen pagoda]

nerfing from 180 degrees to 150 is absurd, in almost a thousand hours of play I have only encountered ONE dagger player. There's no reason for a nerf like this

[hardy dust]

Backstab radius is 30° tighter

[queen pagoda]

The fact is that nobody plays with this weapon, a nerf to 170 would be plausible

I've been playing with her exclusively since the beta and I know what I'm talking about

[toxic plover]

I wanted nerfs but even I only asked for a 15° nerf

[hardy dust]

It shouldn't have gotten a nerf period

It was one of the worst weapons in the game, probably the hardest to play apart from maybe dual blades, and wasn't an issue in any way.

[calm grove]

I don't get why it's nerfed. So I've played dagger in ranked all the way up to platinum. It's already hard enough to get the mechanics down to kill people with it in casual modes, let alone make plays with it in good lobbies and not die afterwards. It's the hardest weapon to utilise in the game and I guess nerfing it is fair because 0.1% of players get to pop off with it?

That's crazy

[calm grove]

Actually

I myself have only encountered a SINGLE other good dagger player in all my playtime

[hardy dust]

All my messages are getting restricted smh... literally 1984

[calm grove]

And all I had when I got killed was appreciation cause that shit is not easy dawg

[queen pagoda]

it doesn't make any sense

[calm grove]

Why embark 😭

[hardy dust]

Its cuz of dumbass players who just latch on to random shit to cry about without any justification

[queen pagoda]

I only know two, me and a guy called ITS on my server

[queen pagoda]

exactly!

[calm grove]

I played dagger yesterday in a private game and was wondering why I was failing so many backstabs

[hardy dust]

The closest thing to "justify" the nerf is that some backstabs seem to hit from the front, but that's literally an issue with dogshit servers.

I really hope the dagger nerf gets completely reverted with a buff on top

[calm grove]

Backstabs also look pretty goofy in replays but again, not because it's overtuned

They will really leave the most OP weapons and gadgets unchecked but go straight for dagger

[calm grove]

I think just the revert is enough man. We dagger players are such a minority that I doubt we'll even be heard to get the nerf pulled

I'm so sad bro it's actually the most fun I've had in this game 😔

[hardy dust]

Embark hates fun...

[sacred scroll]

I watch a dagger light dash into me , fling his mouse so fast he turns into a beyblade and oneshot me while I'm still hitting him

Blame players that abuse the terrible server connections and get away with this

[calm grove]

Have you ever played with dagger?

[sacred scroll]

Im still not a fan of playing against it , but at least I can recognise it's hard to use

[cunning kettle]

Backstab range from 180 to 150

[calm grove]

You probably see a single dagger every 100 games, and even then it's some dude who fails 9/10 backstabs

[sacred scroll]

Does it deserve the nerf? No
Will it be changed in a way that prevents it from being abused by a even smaller minority? No

[spark igloo]

Idk any dagger player that isn't actively nerfing themselves playing the weapon

[queen pagoda]

the most difficult and least played, leading to a 16.6% effectiveness nerf

[peak monolith]

🤓 👆 Erm, this is a legitimate tactic, I personally use it and is very effective...

(Serious; I do use dagger dash, it's obviously not gonna feel fair to receive, but if it didn't work like that dagger would kinda be useless, the only way to get backstabs would be true complete ambush/stealth stabs and actually getting multiple kills with it would be impossible.)

[calm grove]

So you think a weapon that has barrier of entry of 150 hours+ spent on it alone should not reward the player for the time and dedication put into learning it?

[calm grove]

Real

[sacred scroll]

If the reward is a one-sided interaction that can only be countered by dying and having another teammate kill the exposed light then I don't think that's a good game design

[queen pagoda]

It's a very important point, people don't even have that time to spend on the game

[calm grove]

But you have to fw the vision

[spice vigil]

i love dagger so much, but now it just feels less fun to use

[spark igloo]

who on earth is abusing dagger

you are actively crippling yourself picking up that weapon

[sacred scroll]

Whenever I see the 1% minority that uses the dagger

[hardy dust]

It is nowhere near a one sided interaction, unless you mean against the dagger light, in which case that would make more sense

[spark igloo]

if you look at them they wont kill you

[queen pagoda]

now it's a feeling of... I knew this would kill before... complicated

[spice vigil]

dagger users when the opponent stands in a corner

[calm grove]

That same thing can happen with a sword but with a much lower barrier of entry. There are some weapons in this game that can't be countered with simply standing there and shooting the user

[hardy dust]

Dagger users when the opponent simply looks at them

[spice vigil]

there was a guy saying something like "i hit like 4 bullets on them and they didnt die and just dashed behind me and killed me" unironically lol

[hardy dust]

The only actual situation in which there is pretty much no counterplay is getting winched.

[spark igloo]

ttk isnt really relevant but dagger unironically has a longer ttk than most medium weapons do on light

[calm grove]

I think he means that one in a million time I was cracked on Adderall and wiped an entire team with it in ranked (that happens very often trust me)

[queen pagoda]

The guy has already taken 4 shots to reach the range needed to kill, and he still thinks the dagger is unfair

[spice vigil]

funnily dagger is still pretty good against bad players, all it did was make it even WORSE in ranked

[calm grove]

If you have awareness you can see a dagger player coming from a mile away

[spark igloo]

they only see the 3 chain clips, never the 92nd time dying to glitch traps or not being able to take a fight because the team has a dash light

[hardy dust]

All ttks except model iirc

[queen pagoda]

Now it's useless, you can only play it for pure frustrated fun

[eager wasp]

FR there are so many counters to a dagger light

[spark igloo]

if you dont count first shot yeah but thats like sending the goalpost to space or whatever

[calm grove]

This sentence gives me PTSD

[eager wasp]

whats crazy to me is that sword was nerfed, they revert the changes, and then nerf dagger?????? like whats the thought process there

[hardy dust]

All lights cuz stun used to exist...

[spark igloo]

In my 1500 hours the only dagger light I've struggled with is Kael ON my team

[queen pagoda]

I have 1000 hours of dagger and I only met one other player

[spark igloo]

I can count the amount of times I've been dashstabbed on my two hands

[calm grove]

Sword is the biggest fucking menace and is used far more and is much easier to pilot than dagger but fuck me I guess

[spark igloo]

its so easy to avoid if you have any idea what's happening

[queen pagoda]

someone cried to embark because they didn't accept dying to the dagger, that's my theory

[spark igloo]

the most recent server changes were a better fix to dagger than the nerf the weak prior

[hardy dust]

They didn't even die to it, they saw someone else complain about dying to it and decided "well dagger is on light so whatever" and cried for nerfs

[sacred scroll]

That's the thing, the bad servers let some extreme lights "facestab" you, hitting the crit when in front

[spark igloo]

this is the same thing as getting shot around a corner, it will happen regardless of what weapon you're on. It just looks fucked with dagger and can be avoided 95% of the time

[hardy dust]

Yeah and they also get backstabs which count as frontstabs

[calm grove]

Might look that way from the kill cams pov but that's really not the case

[spark igloo]

90% of facestabs arent even facestabs. Most clips I see of someone getting "facestabbed" is them letting the dagger behind them and turning around after they've already died on all ends

[calm grove]

99% of backstabs are people genuinely predicting where you're gonna go, dashing behind you then killing you

[queen pagoda]

That doesn't exist, I've never performed a fake backstab

[spark igloo]

oh also 100% of "facestabs" are backstabs on the dagger's end

it's literally impossible to backstab someone if you arent behind them

[calm grove]

I've recorded clips of me stabbing someone's SPINAL CHORD and not getting the backstab

[shell sonnet]

Unless they fixed that, thats not true
Ive had stabs where i was questioning how that even connected

[spark igloo]

you havent because that's literally not possible

[shell sonnet]

Literally standing in front of them looking the other way

[spark igloo]

it may look weird, like sometimes their death animation will turn or they'll move last second but you cant backstab if you arent on their backside

[queen pagoda]

180 degrees gives a false impression at certain angles.
A backstab is always performed in the dagger player's view

[shell sonnet]

Think i got a clip of it but may have been lost or left unnamed, but maybe i can find it

If i do happen to find it later in the day, i could tag you

[spark igloo]

cb2-s2 dagger worked different so you may be thinking of that but otherwise I can guarantee you it was nothing more than looking weird

[shell sonnet]

Or it was me looking at them and getting a backstab out of hitting the face

But it was some bologne like that

[shell sonnet]

May have been that old
Not sure
Maybe i can double check in the video based on cosmetics, ui or something to get a rough time frame

[spark igloo]

if it's saved on your pc you can check the creation date in file explorer

[shell sonnet]

Right, im stupid
Whoops

[calm grove]

Inb4 embark nerfs bows because the odd 13th light in my casual games likes the weapon a little too much and frags out with it after putting 200 hours in

[spark igloo]

but otherwise it's just impossible, current dagger works from your end so if you werent behind them you cant have stabbed them

[shell sonnet]

Dont work enough with pc's, thanks for the reminder

[spark igloo]

it's aight neither do I

[calm grove]

Says this then takes a peek in the feedback channel 😭 😭 😭 😭 😭

[pale plank]

How’re people feeling abt the grenade change?? I hate it

[unborn frigate]

i agree

[dark pumice]

bout danm time

for the dash dagger lights, is the nerf noticable. I play stealth dagger so i normaly have a direct backstab

[spice vigil]

yes

[calm grove]

Tried it yesterday without knowing about the nerf and was wondering why half my stabs weren't happening

[eager wasp]

very

[unborn frigate]

yes and I barely play dagger

[vestal wagon]

MAKE GOO DISINTEGRATE ON IMPACT & RID THIS TOXIC GOO GUN MELEE COMBO.. YOU CANNOT MOVE & ITS UNCOUNTERABLE NOW THAT STUN IS VAULTED

[hallow leaf]

Glitch them

[cunning kettle]

Play high ground and range

[vestal wagon]

after they’ve already goo’d and one tapped? okay great🤠 + the glitch grenade isn’t nearly as instantaneous as their specialization.

[vestal wagon]

crazy how ppl will defend the most OP class with their lives… i hate it here

[cunning kettle]

I’m just trying to give you a solution to your problem

[tough mortar]

just tried sword again after a while. shit's so overpowered with dash. I think the dash + lunge bug needs to be fixed at the very least

[cunning kettle]

Goo gun is pretty easy to play against if you just know their weaknesses

[tough mortar]

they have none

[vestal wagon]

word i’ll camp like a freak in TDM & QC.. new players that play only casual will get dogged by that combo, it’s even worse than stun.

[cunning kettle]

It’s a projectile and melee has limited range

It’s harder to goo you if you have high ground, and if you play farther away they can’t fight back at all

And you can run goo nades to block their goo gun

[vestal wagon]

yes because a heavy player is usually isolated… (sarcasm)

there’s usually a battalion running with them bro.. b real

[cunning kettle]

You should also have teammates

[vestal wagon]

nah we all got goo’d & one tapped remember💀😭?