💣┇weapons-gadgets

[shell sonnet]

Holy shit
How did i not think of that

Im adding that to the list

[magic knoll]

It doesn’t work anymore in the attacker’s spawn border though.

[royal thicket]

Riot shield got nerfed this season without even it being mentioned in the patch notes, a post on reddit calling for a riot shield nerf got 100+ upvotes and the skill floor is five times higher than with any other melee weapon. Medium has no gap closing tools whatsoever and sorry if this came off as rude but when someone says they can‘t manage to get an enemy within a 12m distance while riot shield has to get in neckbreathing distance to damage the enemy in any way I just snap

[shell sonnet]

Doesnt matter
If its tech, its tech

Even if it seems insignificant, anything has potential to be build on
Thats my goal

[magic knoll]

Honestly there should be some tradeoff for having a scope equipped

(Guns that were previously scoped would be buffed at base for the nerf to not affect them.

[shadow onyx]

Why do they always remove the cool movement tech 😭

[shell sonnet]

What was it this time?

[shadow onyx]

Idk just in general

I remember the good old days of grappling onto red barrels

[shell sonnet]

Something something messing with pacing

||meanwhile the whole 3v3v3 format:||

Even with the new spawning system, i think it itself is not the problem

It only amplifies the issues having more than 2 teams brings

[latent pike]

I killed a top fragging riot shield player by RPG-ing the floor then dropping on him with a spin spear attack

Feels good, even taunted

[shadow onyx]

No offense, but that's kind of a low bro move, like respect to him for top fragging with the worst weapon in the game

[latent pike]

More over do people even taunt or nah, I've almost never seen people taunt unless I do it (usually when defending cash box)

[shadow onyx]

Only as retaliation or if I'm in ranked and we're about to win we all start emoting

[latent pike]

Taunt a sweaty light
Become his prime target rest of the game
Dominate them anyway

[fleet brook]

You said 6 different gap closers you listed 3 and 2 can't be ran at the same time

[fleet brook]

Also newer players don't have all of that unlocked and alot of the gap closers are expensive

This also brings up the issue

Starting the finals is gonna get more difficult each season

[warm gyro]

Ads speed is already affected iirc

[covert swift]

maybe more recoil for the scout scope

[buoyant pivot]

"New" player here. No it won't, the finals is, incredibly bad at matchmaking in quick cash, I have repetitively been put in lobbies with people who are level 1-10 on all groups. So grinding the currency for gear isn't all too bad

[buoyant pivot]

The ads either feels slower or is slower, and the scope itself blocks off more when adsing then with iron sites.

[fleet brook]

I mean if someone joins in a later season (scaling item costs per season) unlocking everything will feel daunting

And most people will want to unlock the best things first

[buoyant pivot]

Then they do just that, they'll unlock what they want to first, and if they don't want to unlock something for whatever reason, they don't need to. You don't have to unlock everything, that's not something a new player would even be capable of from the start.

[hallow leaf]

And some people play for the purposes of unlocking everything, some play just to complete the battle pass then stop for the season, so new players having more stuff to work towards could give them more reasons to keep playing

[buoyant pivot]

But if you play for the purpose of unlocking everything then it shouldn't entirely be daunting to see what you have to unlock. I feel rn that the process to unlock things is already pretty forgiving.

[spark igloo]

why'd you need an rpg at all for this

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/the-dark-knight-its-about-sending-a-message-joker-heath-ledger-the-joker-gif-18201880

(The message is boom)

[slow linden]

Real

[latent pike]

So I can throw his ass down the floor

[spark igloo]

Fair enough ig

[royal thicket]

How do you think 6 tools are gonna fit in a kit with a maximum of 4 slots? Also mb there are only 5 I think or I forgot one. Still 5 more than medium

[fleet brook]

I'm more wondering why you're throwing a mix of a pity party and self aggrandizement

2nd at max heavy can have 2 gap closers active

3 if you count goo nade but those aren't heavy specific

[royal thicket]

The riot shield community is waiting for ONE gap closer since open beta and then someone comes around the corner complaining about gap closing with heavy who‘s got 5 different tools to gap close I just snapped

[fleet brook]

Brother you've been snapping for over an hour and it's been this weird mix of self glaze and a pitty party heavy is also inherently the slowest class in the game without this help there melee would just be unviable because if you don't dedicate at least two of your slots to gap closing heavies melee is inherently broken

Broken as in bad at concept by the way not broken op

The addition of dash also wrecked pre winch pre lockbolt heavy and mediums melee

[shadow onyx]

lets take a step back here, the guy said he was getting out dpsed and asked for a buff to swing speed for hammer, no mention of getting gapped

[fleet brook]

Here

[fleet brook]

Here

[fleet brook]

Also if you scroll up to the top of this conversation the first message is us talking about someone struggling or potentially struggling on closing the gap with heavy

[hot reef]

Don’t jump pad and zip line and maybe goo grenade work for gap closing

[fleet brook]

Goo is finicky but yeah it's been majorly changed

[shadow onyx]

mb I wasn't meaning to reply to you specifically, it's just that the original guy said he was getting out dpsed by a famas with a hammere and then someone else mentioned it was fair because of heavy's gap closing ability

[royal thicket]

Where did I ever self glaze in any way? I never said I was the guy reaching diamond with RS and saying that complaining about riot shield being bad is a pity party is the same as telling a sportsman with a broken arm to concentrate. Did you even play riot shield before? And to the point of saying heavy being bad without the gap closing tools, well medium melee is bad and it has no gap closing tools. Go figure

[royal thicket]

Goo grenade is for everyone so that doesn’t count. Jump pad and zip are good for moving in a general direction but not usable for getting close to someone who‘s 5 meters away running

[fleet brook]

"I’m here to tell you that you are a sad noob because people made it to diamond rank with the riot shield that gets countered by turning around and just walking away. You have 6 different gap closing tools, medium has 0. Sorry but that‘s just a massive skill issue"

Also I'm saying it's a pity party because you chose to main the weapon and in every breathe you have to bring up how it's bad and you still make it work

[royal thicket]

The moment I switched to a different weapon in world tour I got 15 kills with a support build. Riot shield takes a lot more skill than any other hitscan weapon and the fact people are able go make it work is not a good argument for it being balanced. If you want to have a look for yourself go play it and get demolished by the entire lobby because if you don’t pay attention to every little detail you just get obliterated

[fleet brook]

This is what I mean by pity party with a mix of self glaze

Also I did play riot shield I play in a stack

[royal thicket]

Played heavy melee for a few rounds. Hate to break it to you but if you can‘t manage to gap close with heavy you are just bad

[fleet brook]

Again I wasn't the one with an issue

Also you're just generally not a nice person to conversate with

2 can you gap close as heavy yes is it enjoyable and is melee enjoyable without it no

If I played a normal gun could I actually have 4 slots and a decent specialization also yes

[last rock]

medium can reasonably catch 2/3 classes with no gadgets, heavy can only catch 1/3.

[hot reef]

Heavy gets medium and heavy tho
And I don’t even play heavy

[shadow onyx]

You shouldn't chase people though, especially with any melee weapons it usually causes you to die, speaking from experience

[royal thicket]

How else am I supposed to say this? Heavy has a get out of jail free card for close encounters, a 12 meter get over here button or the most versatile gun in existence. Plus a f**king rocket to finish of someone who got away. There‘s nothing rude about reality

[fleet brook]

Heavy gets a bad medium (if they are both aware of each other's presence and tools)

[fleet brook]

If they start running at a 10+M difference and heavy doesn't have winch

[hot reef]

In a 1v1 sure, but idk how realistic that should be. Like I feel if you play with your team it should be easy enough given all the mobility tools to offer

[royal thicket]

No. If the medium knows how to turn around and press w it‘s a stalemate. If the heavy has charge n slam or a melee weapon you have to run and light you already mentioned. Heavy has the winch claw and rpg as mentioned and if you wanna argue that heavy melee is worse than mediums I don‘t know where to start with you being just wrong

[last rock]

if you cant catch another medium thats on you.

literally just a skill issue.

[royal thicket]

Do you play medium melee?

[last rock]

when i have a team, yes.

[hallow leaf]

Medium melee can't catch shit

The other classes have cc gadgets or specs to help catch people, medium doesn't

[royal thicket]

I doubt that you have much experience because a ruby player who mains riot shield said that medium has a big gap closing issue

[royal thicket]

And a coordinated team makes even the worst weapons look at least usable. Have fun in the solo q experience where you dedicate you entire kit to chasing an enemy for a solid minute.

[last rock]

is it the same diamond player from earlier, or do you just have a list you go off of?

[royal thicket]

I can send you the video if you give me a minute or two. 20 minute interview with one of the best melee players in the finals if you‘re actually interested. But you can skip all that by solo queuing with riot shield and just experience for yourself casing someone over the entire map or getting crushed by a sledge heavy without being able to do shit

[hot reef]

The appoh interview or a different one

[loud aurora]

That's true but duals have the auto aim thingi idk what it's called

Besides both mid meles are more of a defending weapon and you go for kills when you got a chance

[royal thicket]

Why do you think that? Just because they can block?

[hallow leaf]

Its known that medium needs some sort of gap closing gadget or ability to make their melee viable

[toxic plover]

Buff sledgehammer swing speed by 8-12%

[royal thicket]

Sadly couldn’t find the interview so the source is just trust me bro but this video by Jinko is still pretty relevant
https://youtu.be/ZHK4mUvYjzI?si=3kktrmge-mqEU4MP

[hallow current]

Well, of a medium needs an SMG, what assault rifle should the light class have?

What SMG should the heavy class have?

[royal thicket]

Primary I agree it needs a small buff but I don‘t think attack speed‘s the problem

[warm gyro]

Light should lowkey get a repeater rifle or smth

[hot reef]

I’d recommend watching the appoh one it’s quite good

[shadow onyx]

ngl, I feel like embark wanted to leave specific classes of weapons to each character class

[royal thicket]

Found it:

https://youtu.be/SFYLfb0XP1A?si=G1YChuQyiZRJ_VDm

[toxic plover]

I disagree. Medium excels in staying close to their team and so their melee is built around that by blocking and reflecting bullets. Also their base movement speed is higher how is ANY heavy supposed to escape them?

[toxic plover]

It is because the damage being increased would do nothing to decrease the number of hits it takes to kill a enemy where TTK wouldn't actually be affected unless swing speed was increased. Prevents famas spam and 3 tap revolver shinanigans from making doing everything right feel really REALLY bad.(Winch doesn't always stun fools)

[royal thicket]

Heavy should stay with there team and riot shield is best in 1v1s so yeah first point. If the heavy has charge n slam, flamethrower or a melee weapon the riot shield is the one getting chased and not escaping and if med melee is supposed to be a team weapon they wouldn’t have buffed riot shields damage and made the shield hitbox smaller

[loud aurora]

Yes but also deters players from coming too close

[hallow current]

Unless I'm wrong, shouldn't the light class get the PDWs and SMGs?

The light class should get the Vector.

-No visual recoil
-Super low recoil
-Large magazine "extendo for you and your friendo"
-Fast fire rate
-Low damage per bullet
-Supresser because it's hawt
-Red dot options

Rework the M11 to own the close range burst

Rework the Xp54 to be the well rounded option

Allow the Vector to own the long range sustained fire

[hallow leaf]

People literally try to make any excuse to try and keep medium melee useless

[hallow current]

Yeah, until it's time to refresh the game. For now they can keep the SMGs to the light class and the heavy guns for the heavy class.

[hot reef]

Yes yes yes yes please

[toxic plover]

I looked up riot shields damage and it's 90 per swing. 2 sings kill light, 3 kill medium and 4 kill heavy. The sledgehammer is not making up for the difference when it comes to time to kill being in the slowest class in the game

[royal thicket]

The Famas rise is just the effects of Embark nerfing everything thats meta and the revolver got heavily buffed because the visual recoil got basically removed. Maybe a small speed buff but I think a range buff would be better

[hot reef]

If vector is added I’m never playing anything else

I think med could get a p90 tho

[toxic plover]

I was thinking 8-12% speed boost at least only on light attacks what do you think?

Maybe .3 meter range boost so stupid double ceilings stop causing me trouble

[royal thicket]

What does this even mean? Like please explain yourself because if I understood you correctly you‘d be stupid as hell and I don‘t think so of you so please explain what you mean

[toxic plover]

Not even using REAL numbers. Just from damage we see how fast a medium can kill each class right?

[royal thicket]

Sledge: oneshot for light, heavy attack plus a big swipe, heavy, the tank class, two heavy hits.
Riot shield, two hits for light without any way of gap closing so dash saves you there. Three hits for medium if they don‘t decide to just run and 4 full hits for heavy BUT if they have cas or anything else good at close combat you‘re cooked

Plus riot shield has way worse range, hit width, hit reg time and lower dps

[hallow leaf]

You will never get through to them, they will forever think if it's on medium there is no way it can be bad. You might as well be chatting to a brick wall 🧱

[royal thicket]

Come on you can dodge riot shield by crouching and you‘re telling me sledge and RS are comparable?

[hallow leaf]

Tbh heavy melee beat medium melee all day, there is no way medium is winning

[toxic plover]

You can't combo a winch into a heavy attack so dash beats sledge too. Heavy attack into light attack is of comparable speed to riots 3 hits. I'll give you that for heavy, but loosing out to SA, sledge, spear, and maybe flame thrower doesn't sound so bad when sledge is supposed to be the more damaging more punishing melee weapon. I'm just envious of y'all's ability to get stunned and not be a guaranteed kill

Also I only play heavy so I don't crouch to dodge riot I actually get screwed when people are on stairs

[toxic plover]

Getting a single hit on a heavy with the heavy unaware guarantees the kill when it comes to sledge

[toxic plover]

I miss my swings against lights because my sledge grazes the top of their head so I don't think it's just RS issue

[royal thicket]

Ok I don‘t have time to point out everything here this is just 95% wrong

[toxic plover]

I kinda need you to elaborate because what I said about winch heavy attack is apsolutly correct so I can only be as much as 80% wrong

[hallow leaf]

You can 100% winch into a heavy attack with sledge

[toxic plover]

And it lands? No not against a light with dash

[hardy dust]

*dash light

But you can land a light attack, then finish them off with basically anything (rpg)

But dash light is literally the hardest counter to sledge and its still close.

[toxic plover]

If I'm lucky I can do a light attack into quick melee, but that's still no guarantee because winch will sometimes just not stun at all and I get killed for it

[hardy dust]

Ignoring server issues, you can land a m1 100% of the time, leaving the light at 30 hp. While you might not be able to land the qm if the dash quickly enough, you can always finish them off with rpg or even just throwing a prop at them.

[toxic plover]

Imo RPG bad though and I don't run it

[hardy dust]

Rpg is still a top 3 gadget.

Possibly top 2

[toxic plover]

Along with C4 and dome yeah, but I think those suck ass too 😂😂

[hardy dust]

🤷‍♂️

They're all super good

[toxic plover]

My loadout is winch, sledge, goo nade, anti gravity cube, and motion sensor

[toxic plover]

A single C4 charge is bullshit and dome should last 12 seconds with 500 hp

[hardy dust]

Hell no

[toxic plover]

RPG should do 80 damage but recharge quicker

[hardy dust]

I'd personally have dome take longer to deploy but last a bit longer, but overall they're fine as is.

[toxic plover]

For how meta they are? Yeah. I'm just saying those are the changes it would need for me personally to run them

[last rock]

I forgot how fun bullying DB lights with the riot shield is.

[toxic plover]

Sounds amazing

[last rock]

its like a deer in headlights once those first few shots dont do anything

[toxic plover]

Still feel like sledgehammer should be buffed. Imagine how stupid if they increased the heavy attack damage from 200 to 210

[weary eagle]

Same with dual blades, I'd want to see the look on their face when they get one shot by their own shotgun

[pastel fog]

yo

oioioi

[cyan orbit]

Is there any "easy way" to do the headshots outside of 30m i have 2/15 and i been trying it for a work week now

[hallow sable]

Play power shift and sit back as a Light with a sniper

[sand monolith]

Play power shift and sit back as a heavy with m60. Lean into your monitor and hit heads

[fleet brook]

This combo also has a 45 second cd

That's longer than a respawn

[arctic fog]

Try using any of medium's ARs and you're bound to get some

[cyan orbit]

From 70 feet away? With the recoil on those things?

[arctic fog]

Oh 70m?

[cyan orbit]

Even with recoil control I might be able to hit body shots

[arctic fog]

I thought it was 30m mb

[cyan orbit]

70 feet = roughly 30 meters

66 feet if my calculations are correct

[tired osprey]

https://youtube.com/shorts/Uj1vKG36dNg?si=ujN-PeNX6_coZhJT

Make the cerberus do this, fixed it

[vale obsidian]

honestly i don't think it will be too much of a balancing headage
even sacking 1 shot for mobility mean you can't kill a heavy or medium anymore forcing a reload
Buuutttt it open the floodgate for more crazy mobility galore that will be more of a headage to balance in the future so idk

[tired osprey]

Med having it i think is fine, makes it fun with zipline but you land and have to reload lmao

[vale obsidian]

thats what keeping it balance so yeah

[boreal laurel]

I got it last season with FAMAS in Power Shift. Each headshot is worth three because of the burst fire

[vale obsidian]

unless you use it like me and just flick without continue to track
hitting 1 headdy at most and the guy move out of my crosshair before the other 2 shot hit lol

[cyan orbit]

I currently have 7 because I went godmode with the sniper dropping i believe it was a 17 kill game

[fickle charm]

Add alcohol as a gadget

[hallow current]

Brass Knuckles for heavy & nun chucks for light class

[vale obsidian]

your movement is randomize and your cam move like you have crazy random recoil xD

[fickle charm]

no cooldown, but if you use it too much you're liver gives out

[vale obsidian]

KAMAKASI EXPLOSION

https://tenor.com/view/01-gif-23830650

[cunning kettle]

Screenshot this message and post in back in #👂┇game-feedback

[mystic nimbus]

it should give 50 xp everytime someone travels through it

or 25xp at least

[fickle radish]

Definitely

[arctic fog]

Is there even a single person with the lvl 9 or even level 8 gateway?

[solemn arch]

i saw level 8

[mystic nimbus]

if the game was fun i know someone who could've gotten lvl 9 by now

and i see lvl 8 alot

[loud stone]

how do i make shotguns work

the reticle doesnt cooperate when i customize it and when everyone is using light it gets annoying, and they have 6 bullets

its like everything is working againts me

[vale obsidian]

click better
there is no short cut to success unfortunately
just the usual usual gitgud

[loud stone]

ty

[brittle yoke]

shotguns have perfect accuracy all the time, no penalty for being in the air or moving so adsing dosent do much. play shotguns with movement as best you can, dodge around and weave quick melees in where you can

[loud stone]

thanks! ill do my best

[restive plover]

And better melee damage. 🤑

[steel cove]

AK is Perfect and rpg

[dim carbon]

Dual ice picks for light that allow them to slowly climb walls

[gritty bobcat]

Just use the winch claw (if youre playing heavy)

Winch claw + SA1216 = instant death for lights

[loud stone]

im getting the points for it

[gritty bobcat]

Ive yet to unlock and try the KS-23 tho

[loud stone]

gl with it

[gritty bobcat]

Thx

[rough drift]

Do you guys know what happened to that spreadsheet on the stats of all the weapons 😭

I’m trying to figure out which weapons I should get

[covert swift]

get the lh1 and the xp 54

[tough prairie]

If you wanna try a good heavy weapon with a somewhat niche role, try the KS-23. Pretty fun to use. Damage fallout is quite bad, but the destruction it can do to structures is good.

I am hoping for more skins on that shotty

[rough drift]

Thanks

[tough prairie]

Just remember to lead your shots. It is not a hitscan

Center mass is best as it deals no headshot damage

[rough drift]

Got it. Normally my accuracy is a mess 😭

[slim mango]

yo

whats up guys

[tough prairie]

Oh you are gonna struggle with it at first. It fires slugs. Hard to hit with

But hey, it does 100 damage

I still struggle with it, mostly in the more exposed situations. But at closer range, you will get an upper hand most times. It pairs well with the winch claw to bring your targets right up point blank for a free shot. And oh boi, those lights can easily get melted if you do that to them. I usually go for a winch, shoot, quick melee combo. If they manage to kill you, you have your teammates to clean them up

Hopefully

[fickle pilot]

Imo, i think they should make the flamethrower a secondary with a time duration, something like the RPG we have now...cos its kinda OP in close quarters

[tough prairie]

At close quarters, pretty damn good. But we are not always in such enclosed spaces.

Pretty damn easy to counter a flamethrower heavy with the right equipment.

[slim mango]

hm

[craggy monolith]

Yo im serious they need to nerf double barrel for light because i know it takes skills but FUCK full health from a heavy ONLY TWO SHOTS???!!!??? That is BS

[tough prairie]

It is powerful af, but eh, you really gotta get up close. Just need a bit of counter play

[half torrent]

invis in general is not fun to play against unless i land a wench

[fleet brook]

How would you nerf it?

If it can't 2 shot meds reliably then it'd suck

[tough prairie]

Oh you are definitely asking the wrong person for that. You already gotta get so close to get the most value. Plus you only have two shots.

[restive plover]

Therein lies the counterplay. Staying out of range/not allowing them to close in, and taking advantage of the downtime after trying to get a kill to pressure them when they're defenseless.

[tough prairie]

My solution

Mines everywhere

I do got a friend who was playing chicken with a sword light one time.

He littered the ground under him with mines and a C4 charge and was daring the light to approach

[rough drift]

Guys what is motion sensor function 😭

[fleet brook]

Intel after you setup control of a area

[terse gorge]

Irl rpg😂

[crystal garnet]

Whats the fastest way to grind weapon / gadget XP?

[terse gorge]

just play wt or quick cash with the gadgets

[umbral widget]

How Can I use the arsenal weapons in game??

[wind lintel]

the what

[umbral widget]

Can I send you an image in DM

[wind lintel]

sure

[shut bane]

deagles are 100% heavies best weapon

imo imo

[restive plover]

They're definitely the second best.

[shut bane]

nice opinion I disagree respectfully

[shell sonnet]

has anyone seen any cool/weird goo tech lately?

[outer flint]

They’re insane if you can consistently hit headshots with them

[shut bane]

i cant take them off for anything else atm

[west perch]

the only thing ive seen is heavy goo gun stunning enemies to close the distance with hammer/spear

[hearty bear]

i ahve been using deagles what sahould i pair it with i have been using slam dome and gas grenade

[shut bane]

charge is the obviously better option but you can opt for mesh shield

rpg is always a no brainer but lockbolt makes it pretty easy to track and hold people in place

dome shield is still just insane for the free damage negation and output even if just for a few seconds and its even more useful with deagles for their range

i personally run motion sensor to shit on the invis lights and know where to break through with charge and slam if youre in a building dense area though goo grenade can be just as if not more useful for both defense and mobility

[toxic plover]

I'm so tired of winchclaw not stunning when I'm using sledge. I winch people to me and they are still shooting me while winched or I winch them and they quick melee me before I can get a swing off

[shut bane]

if theyre being pulled from a longer distance i believe they can still fire off a few rounds as theyre getting to you but its a very short window

if they manage to get you weak by the time theyre in front of you then the swing time of the hammer is probably what will get you killed lol

[toxic plover]

Sometimes they are still shooting at me the entire time they are winched. And when they are running famas or revolver it feels very unfun

[toxic plover]

That shouldn't be a thing. I like how when I winch someone they will be stunned long enough for my team to get a free beam on them, but I'd honestly rather it be a instant pull and then stun once they are close to me

[toxic plover]

Heavy specialization it's MGL but it shoots 150 hp dome shields

[toxic plover]

Oh it should stick to walls and ceilings too

[autumn dirge]

the vortex for light is bad right, it would be a lot better if you could throw it and it would automatically activate

[sand monolith]

It’s good

Just very hard to use

[mystic nimbus]

mfw when a gadget has a skill gap

[autumn dirge]

im not sure how youre suppsoed to use it. IG you throw it in a place where you are expecting enemies and then have the trigger out and activate it when enemies are around and then shoot them? The thing is that if they come from somewhere else you have to waste time switching guns.

also imagine if RPG still did 150 dmg, that would be a pretty insane combo lol

[sand monolith]

You can throw it pretty far. It can prime in mid air as well so depending on distance you can detonate it immediately when it reaches the enemy

[autumn dirge]

im trying it out in the practice range and I feel like it doesnt nueter enemy movement enough. You dont have time to spam nades before they escape. Maybe its fine though

[sand monolith]

When there’s a poo gap

[autumn dirge]

do you agree or disagree

[sand monolith]

With what

[autumn dirge]

poo gap

[sand monolith]

No bruh 😭

[mystic nimbus]

[vale obsidian]

That'll be a yesn't and a half form be

[warm gyro]

It’s good but for cashout plays only from my experience, put it near cashouts and then activate when being stolen trust it’s not bad

[weak kernel]

vortex is cool but i feel like i'm handicapping myself if i don't have breaching charge and breaching charge can achieve similar things

[warm gyro]

I personally bring thermal bore, stun, and either gateway or vortex. I use thermal to create new sight lines and also helping prevent steals. Stun for obvious reasons. And then I place a gateway on cashout also so I can stay in my spot that I made with the sight lines and then when stealing I gateway > stun to prevent cashout, or just use vortex

[weak kernel]

I'm at the point where I instantly feel the negative impact if I swap off of my main light gadgets so I feel pretty stuck with what I've got, gateway, charge, goo

gateway and charge for mobility, goo for survivability and controlling engagements

[warm gyro]

I mean if it works for you that’s completely fine, I don’t wanna seem like I’m tryna tell you to change your stuff. I’ve never tried goo nade on light before, maybe I’ll use it next game

[weak kernel]

I didn't really take it that way, no worries. Goo nade gets more value on light than anywhere else because it's one of fairly few ways for light to get around their weakness of instantly melting when someone makes extended eye contact

I understand why someone would drop it for something with more direct team value but it's so good at covering your mistakes

[ruby shuttle]

Buff frag

[tranquil portal]

yo anyone knows if ks23 got a damage nerf since its release?

[toxic plover]

Yes. From like 120/115 down to 100

[tranquil portal]

thx man

[toxic plover]

Np. Used to be able to one shot qm a light or one shot charge and slam a medium

[warm gyro]

Yeah I see what you mean I’ll try it out

[light brook]

Hey question for everyone, do grenades have collision with player bodies?

[toxic plover]

Looks like I have nobody jumping down my throat when I ask for a sledgehammer buff. So y'all are okay with the sledgehammer swinging 10-14% faster?

[covert parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/jarvis-tony-stark-tony-stark-meme-iron-man-meme-gif-25013071

[toxic plover]

Lmao so you disagree?

[covert parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/jarvis-screenshot-jarvis-screenshot-and-crop-out-of-context-crop-cropped-gif-26975564

[toxic plover]

@coral root

I thought about it and honestly, it would only really affect those really close moments where you finally get close to the revolver/famas medium and you go to swing and right as your sledge gets to them you pop and they take no damage. Or when I fought Rubys who use famas or lamp when he was using revolver. He has absolutely no fear of me because he could get the triple headshot kill on me like it was nothing. It also prevents those times I winch people and they shoot me before my light attack comes out and I die. I guess it would just be easier to buff sledge a little because of these niche little issues that really add up.

[toxic plover]

That's pretty funny too

[placid ruin]

as a near predasheen sledge player, no. the weapon does not need a buff

[toxic plover]

Did you read what my reasoning was(also your XP on a weapon doesn't necessarily mean qualification, but I'd hear you out just as much if you said you've been playing for a while)

[placid ruin]

Yeah I'm fine with the winch claw, I personally feel that if they get a quick melee off before you can get a swing out, its a personal problem. no specialization has no downsides. if you're in a situation where a quick melee would kill you, and you winch claw the enemy to pull them in, I feel like its kind of expected for you to lose. the same way that cloaking and trying to run away with 3 hp doesn't guarantee that you will escape.

I played a lot of rampart in apex (ew I know) i got used to cycling the amped walls, and how to push using them that it's kind of carried over to barricades. I don't have a problem closing distance without taking a ton of damage unless im in revive sickness or just used all my stuff for another reason.

(but I see what you're getting at. maybe not a buff to winchclaw/sledge, but a nerf to how fast an enemy can act out of winch? I have fun playing the loadout so im not really sure lol)

[toxic plover]

I haven't played apex but I think I understand. My loadout is winch, sledge, goo grenade, anti gravity cube, and motion sensor. I don't run barricade because it's too iffy on if it'll place or not and gets me killed. I don't think the winch issue can be fixed because I think it's tied to desync and Internet issues because there are times where winch doesn't stun at all and I eat shit from 14 meters away, so I figured swing speed buff would be almost unnoticeable and not an issue considering your mostly only effective at arms reach and the SH1000 exist

Kinda worried if they change the ability to do shit when winched it's gonna lead to a nerf overall

[placid ruin]

I take the chance on barricade since it comes out instantly, goo takes time to deploy and gets me killed, but i guess its a matter of preference like jump vs zipline. typically i hide behind the barricade at low hp, and wait a second or two, then slide heavy swing to the side of the barricade out of cover. kills 9/10 lights that try to push, big ass hitbox appears out of nowhere. I run the holy trinity of rpg, barricade, and dome shield. though rpg is kinda iffy with it's damage output. I like the idea of the swing buff, but I'm out here killing people so fast, I just don't think it would be fair. but again, melee weapons are difficult to balance since they require almost no skill to use close range. but a LOT of skill to master / be viable

[toxic plover]

Yeah man don't get me wrong I myself don't want to be cocky but I'm pretty nasty myself with the sledgehammer. I do the same thing you do but for doorways. Youd be surprised how effective it is to throw goo down in front of you then sonar a ceiling. You can REALLY get a good lick in if they push for you.

(I need to learn how to stream to twitch)

[toxic plover]

Yeah I figured that changing damage wouldn't do anything to actually help the sledgehammer effectively since the real number of hits doesn't decrease unless you buff it WAY too much, it would only help in team play where as most of my kills come from light attack combosnwith QM

[placid ruin]

Here are my top techs for barricade that I like using

and to be honest about motion sensor....

never used it and I want to keep one thing at 0 xp, cause it's funny

also I saw you're a holtow signee, i wanna share my fit lmao

[loud merlin]

500 rpg damage
5 charges
5 seconds recharge time
5ms reload time
that would defo make rpg better trust me

[loud merlin]

ive used everything almost once

[placid ruin]

I swear i've used motion sensor before the rework but apparently not. so I'm keeping it at 0xp, it's gonna be rare im telling you

[toxic plover]

When I get home I'll show you mine

[toxic plover]

How tf you picking it up so quick

[placid ruin]

its called buffer input, you hold the pickup button right as you place it, maybe 1/3rd of a second after

[olive olive]

The climbing one was crazy to see
👁️👁️

[placid ruin]

you can do it with basically any placeable that can be recalled. you can also hold Y or whatever to cancel defib into regular revive

[toxic plover]

I'm too lazy to get my own footage ngl

[placid ruin]

I call it magnet hands, look at a ledge that's climbable or a set of climbable ledges, and absolutely MASH jump

you can also climb onto things while falling, doesn't matter the speed, just mash fast enough

[toxic plover]

If only that tech worked for climbing goo on low ceilings

[placid ruin]

Magnet hands is by far my favorite tech for heavy, especially with sledge. the arena is your oyster. you can carve holes and patch them up, go through ceilings or tunnel through floors. you get so good with arena manipulation that your enemies just cannot get away, you're always a floor/building ahead of them

[toxic plover]

I used to main demat medium. It really carrys over to sledge heavy

[placid ruin]

something i find unfair, is typically if a team is pushing our building, and just camping the roof, i try to pull one through the ceiling by alt attacking the roof while jumping, a lot of the time, if I break the floor directly underneath someone, it also hits them for the full 200hp. before they even know the floor is broken

[toxic plover]

It's not unfair, especially if I put a motion sensor down and hit a MF through the wall they deserve the bonk

Ceilings are usually pretty high too so actually getting a hit is very lucky

[placid ruin]

maybe, but im swinging and winging it. I'm guessing where they are, and if i'm right. they take a full smack after the swing animation is already over lol

[placid ruin]

Monaco is a playground for that reason alone

[toxic plover]

Is already over? Sounds like you benefiting from your Internet service provider(desync)

[toxic plover]

Lmao so true. Too bad it's mostly only effective the first time

[placid ruin]

well they nerfed alt fire, but the hitbox is out longer than the animation. always has been

[toxic plover]

That's strange. My favorite thing to do is vertical winching.

[placid ruin]

durring season 3 you could hit the ground durring a slide, and the momentum would carry the hitbox into the nearest light player after you had already broken some arena object

it was ridiculous, almost half a second after the hammer was on the ground the hitbox would be active

[toxic plover]

That's insane. I just wish I ran winch prenerf dude

[placid ruin]

i like winch clawing a light or medium right as they go around a corner or into a window, they almost always get pulled out. i know it's cheesy but its fun to say "ooop, not so fast" or
"I don't think so" or "no you don't"

I also wish i ran prenerf winch claw

[toxic plover]

My shit be breaking when I try that or if they hug a window frame too hard. Feels really good when desync is on my side and I can light into quick melee a light to death from winch

[toxic plover]

Hilarious

[placid ruin]

winch 5hp
swing 115hp = 160 damage
quick melee 40hp

It's like sledge was built to kill cloak lights, they just cant do anything

RED NAMETAG WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO LEVELED UP IN THE WORLD

[toxic plover]

Works well if winch stun doesn't fuck you

[placid ruin]

i've never been screwed by winch, except for when i miss winch, carry on attacking, and winch connects on the return, but they're already point blank. they become invulnerable for a second during the "pulling towards you" animation, which might negate a whole attack

[toxic plover]

I get screwed pretty frequently by winch😂😂you'll just have to see sometime.
It either stuns them as soon as it hits and pulls them to me and then they are not stunned.
Doesn't stun at all..
Or stuns for a half mile second and while they are still starfished out from the winch, they are shooting at me

[gritty bobcat]

Bro is spiderman 😭

I usually just bring goo grenades instead of barriers, more reliable for climbing and cover more area than a barricade

My personal loadout for Heavy is SA1216, winch claw, rpg, dome shield, and goo grenade

[visual mist]

You guys remember recon?

[scarlet thunder]

now it exists as a bug

[toxic plover]

imma get a glow up once the battle pass is maxed

[acoustic patrol]

KS-23 is so close, yet so far.

(I created a picture that I found funny about the KS-23, but couldn't post it because I don't have permission)

[drowsy osprey]

Devs hate us ks23 chads

[acoustic patrol]

I love the gun, prob my third choice.

[restive plover]

why are the guns i main not levelling up but the m11, that i’ve used like 7 times at most, is at level 3

[loud stone]

is invis+double barrel a way to go with light?

[floral ledge]

Ks-23 users hate me

[deep grove]

Is there any reason to use the FCAR over the AK or Famas? It honestly just feels like it's useless compared to those 2

[outer flint]

The FCAR is better than the AK in my opinion, but generally you should just be using famas cause it’s a lot better than those two.

[drowsy osprey]

Famas fcar AK seems to be the general balance of meds ars right now. Iirc the fcar has the highest light ttk though

The little bounce it does is weird though

[restive plover]

The only one would be a personal dislike for burst weapons.

[covert swift]

the ak is more consistent overall but fcar has the best ttk on heavies

[restive plover]

That is untrue. Fcar kills heavies in 1.67 seconds, the famas does it in 1.59.

[covert swift]

i forgot the famas existed icl

im just biased towards the ak really

[restive plover]

It's in the message you replied to lmao.

[covert swift]

ik i just never use it

[restive plover]

That's fair. It's not exactly a nice feeling weapon.

[covert swift]

i like burst weapons but that thing does not feel good to use

it just needs faster projectile speed bc it feels really hard to hit shots at long range

anyway something i dont understand is why you have to unlock the sights (i hate grinding)

[restive plover]

It's a hitscan weapon, like all the rifles.

I think it could afford to lose the weird horizontal recoil.

[covert swift]

projectile guns (aside from snipers) feel awful to use

[covert swift]

horizontal recoil is horrible in general

[restive plover]

Eh it depends.

[covert swift]

vertical recoil is just easier to predict and control

[restive plover]

It's fine on most guns as long as it's reasonable, it's really strange on burst weapons with their "start-stop" nature.

[covert swift]

on like the 2nd or 3rd bullet of a burst would make sense for horizontal recoil

not the entire burst

[gentle linden]

does anyone know whats meta rn?

[graceful nova]

Anything that goes boom because off angles

(Never played a ranked match)

[gentle linden]

ok lol

[outer flint]

I really hate that when trying to control the recoil

Not long after you start firing it bounces up and to the right

[lavish plover]

What weapon and what platform? I found turning off vibration to be very helpful on console

[drowsy osprey]

Yeah that's definitely the main skill curve with the fcar. I see some people use it like a laser and I'm still trying to get there. I like that the famas is good but i don't love burst weapons. I wish they'd revert that terrible AK nerf since it was my preferred gun for a while

[outer flint]

FCAR and I’m on PlayStation

I can control the recoil but the jump throws me off a bit

[lavish plover]

If your PS5 i highly recommend gyro.So maf xbox dosent have it built in

[outer flint]

I’ve tried using gyro but it feels really odd

[lavish plover]

It can take some getting used to but I cant turn back now. I utterly garbage without it

[outer flint]

I’ll try practicing with it in the range

[stable smelt]

if you use the dagger, you will never have my respect or be my friend. I block you every game I encounter you

[mystic nimbus]

https://tenor.com/view/roleist-yellow-role-piss-role-stupid-gif-15128108691403199674

[graceful nova]

Are you the contestant who got tazed and backstabbed in the closed beta trailer

[outer flint]

It’s the only issue I have with the FCAR, other than that it’s my favourite weapon

[royal thicket]

light hate's one thing but dagger?

[mystic nimbus]

LOL

[stable smelt]

I'm the contestant that doesnt respect annoying af weapons. (Really the entire class but specifically dagger is so annoying this season)

[graceful nova]

You must have known about the Sword dashing lights since S3…

[stable smelt]

Yes those were super annoying. I brought glitch mines for that which was annoying to have to do, but even that barely worked

[graceful nova]

At least lights don’t have a lot of HP

Fully charged sledgehammer bonk… light instakill

[stable smelt]

yip, just the most annoying equipment in the game. I could do without it for sure. I'd be fine with a slight bump to HP just for a little less annoying kit

[grand turtle]

Imagine if AK and FCAR ( M60 and LEWIS as well) were "Close combat beast vs ranged power".
Something like M11 and XP for light.

Whats the point of extra range weapon when it has insane recoil that makes you miss shots...

[polar coyote]

tap-fire

i mean snipers are like that

[grand turtle]

Tap fire would be the idea in a game where you can die from few if not one shot and you do not regenerate health after 6s.

We got a choice of 3 ARs for medium and 2 MGs for heavy. 3 if we count SHAK as it is also automatic.
There is barely any difference between AK and FCAR now and it felt like AKM got its mag reduced just because FCAR wasnt popular enough or something.

I just wish there was some kind of specific use for those weapons just like light has with the smgs.
You can pick M11 for the fast reload, big mag, good hipfire, ease of use shredder. But it stops being great at killing things past like 15m or so.
Or you can have slower reload, less in the mag, worse hipfire and overall power but you can damage people at range they might not be able to damage you effectively.

This is what I think they should do with AK and FCAR as well as M60 and LEWIS.
Close range shredders and the longer range option.

I kinda want to use FCAR but that recoil jump just stops me from using it.
Hitting heads with LEWIS feels like trying to win a recoil lottery.

[stable smelt]

MGL 32 Supremecy

[limpid wave]

-level

[stable smelt]

me? 72

[craggy monolith]

Can anyone please answer this for me the rpg got a damage reduction but why when you shoot it close to you the weapon deals more damage than shooting it at an enemy?

[cedar idol]

there are lots of weapons that are ‘team weapons’ and only realy viable when your playing with a team who stick with you and help each other.

The KS-23 is the best exaple of this because missing with it is probably the most punishing as heavy has less mobility than a light with throwing knives or a cerb medium with a turret or somthing.

The m60 is another one cause of its range and recoil being worse that the lewis its bester is a supressive fire role while your teamates push or get real pick damage with the pike or somthing.

The lewis is a weird example but i think embark sould push more to the accurate supressive fire gun than the assault rifle with more ammo.

I noticed the pyro and gas nades are sorta ‘team gadgets’ cause if you don’t coordinate you’ll kill them but because of the synergy between gas fire and smoke you can pull off some cool plays with a good team load out.

[bronze cedar]

I hope they'll revert med's dmr to the state of mid-4 season. At the moment it's just useless version of LH-1.

We have four guns that are so unbalanced in their class. Overall, Famas is the best gun for medium while AK and FCAR are nearly copies of each other. And we have Pike that is just Famas but worse.

[tranquil rose]

I know knife is not op and incosistency, but for christ sake the server tick rate make it so fucking terrible to go against it. Face stabs is annoying asf

[ripe sentinel]

Meme I made in 2 mins xd (about my utmost favorite, the LH1)

[cyan orbit]

Pike is just famas but worse pike 556 is a dmr, or in your terms, a "worse" gun despite it having the effective range of a sniper??????? It's not supposed to be used in close range

[fossil elk]

Shotguns

60% more range

Sa1216
Goes through walls

Cerberus 12ga
Fire is 100% likely
Fire can happen at any range

[shut bane]

Nah

[warm gyro]

Sa-1216 does not need a buff. Shotguns do not need 60% more range. You are tripping brethren

[fossil elk]

Shotguns are literally useless. They’re beat by melee and they’re definitely beat out by ranged. If you don’t wanna die just don’t get close

[brittle yoke]

lmao

[fossil elk]

There’s almost no benefits to using a shotgun They do barely any more damage than range and if you get only head shots range do more damage

[tidal hollow]

My guy SA is one of the best weapons on heavy 😭

Use winch or shield to get close and shred

[brittle yoke]

and model shreds and matter also shreds and db can also shred like bro

[fossil elk]

What are you talking about? They have barely more range then flamethrower and if you really want to get close, just use sledgehammer. It is more DPS has a better TTK and can break walls

[tidal hollow]

The only shotgun that could use. a buff is Cerberus

[brittle yoke]

uh oh the clown reacts are coming out

[fossil stirrup]

finals players when someone disagrees with them

[fossil elk]

They’re not disagreeing they’re denying the truth

[covert parcel]

the bait is real

[warm gyro]

Get a load of this guy

[fossil elk]

Get a load of me you guys don’t know what damage means

[warm gyro]

Shotguns aren’t that hard to play with bro you have a major skill issue pal

[fossil elk]

Look at the numbers the numbers don’t lie look at the numbers the numbers don’t lie you’re going crazy if you think that shotguns are part of the meta-unless you’re talking about the SH 1900

[warm gyro]

If you aren’t good with shotguns then don’t play with them

[tidal hollow]

Ain't no way bro even plays the game

[warm gyro]

Never said they were part of the meta stupid 😂 I said that shotsguns aren’t bad and don’t need a nerf

[fossil elk]

Shotgun aren’t good. Just get all head shots with a range weapons and then you have the benefit of ranged plus more damage and what are you talking about? I never said they needed a Nerf.

[tranquil rose]

At this point is better to sit this one out, I mean, just let it be

[fossil elk]

What do you mean, I’m clearly right the numbers don’t lie the numbers don’t lie the numbers don’t lie

[tranquil rose]

https://tenor.com/view/what-do-they-mean-random-numbers-gif-10654449

[tidal hollow]

And I assume you always hit headshots at close range too?

[fossil elk]

SHOTGUNS ARE TRASH THEY NEED A BUFF THE NUMBERS DONT LIE

[tidal hollow]

My guy raw numbers aren't everything

[fossil elk]

And yes, I actually do hit all head, shots. That’s why I’m saying this you can just shoot someone in the head with the revolver and you win no matter what and I’m tired of the meta

[outer flint]

I think you just have a major skill issue, the sa1216 is the best weapon on heavy, same situation with the model, it’s arguably the best weapon on medium right now.

[fossil elk]

How many hours do you have on the game?

[outer flint]

60

[fossil elk]

I have 700

[outer flint]

okay?

[fossil elk]

You are so lost

[outer flint]

just because I have a lower amount of hours than you do, doesn’t mean I’m bad at the game?

I’m definitely not great, but my KD is like 1.2-1.3 rn

[fossil elk]

Yes, but I know far more than you

[outer flint]

well by the looks of it you don’t, shotguns aren’t bad.

I do perfectly fine whenever I use the model/sa1216

[fossil elk]

Look at the numbers, the numbers don’t lie the numbers don’t lie the numbers don’t lie the numbers don’t lie the numbers don’t lie The only reason you’re winning with shotguns is because the people you’re playing against aren’t skilled

[outer flint]

Well I mainly play world tour, also I don’t get to choose who I play against lol

I’d say atleast some of the people I go against are skilled

[outer flint]

Also can you show me the numbers you’re referring to?

[fossil elk]

Look it up

[outer flint]

Okay, tell me what to look up

[fossil elk]

TTK DPS for all weapons in the finals

[outer flint]

All I see are links that are a year old

I see nothing up to date

[ripe sentinel]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Ud7Rdl3AgMw9mmfDwW2LtDMnzZQ9IIhnqSE4ivsaMTs/edit?gid=2136619021#gid=2136619021 5.0.0 but no weapon has recieved balance changes as for right now

[fossil elk]

How do I save this?

[outer flint]

Well from what I seen on that spreadsheet, shotguns all seemingly have low ttks

[ripe sentinel]

I had that link copied somewhere (:

thing is for some weapons you can reduce TTK by using combos

[outer flint]

Sa1216 is tied for the second fastest ttk on mediums

[ripe sentinel]

For instance the sledgehammer:
: left click + quick melee
: right click + left click
: right click + left click + quick melee

[fossil elk]

This is not accurate. m 11 does not deal 16 damage it deals 9

[ripe sentinel]

Huh? It never did 9 at its optimal range lol

That's at far distance.

[outer flint]

From what I’m seeing on the chart, you’re completely wrong lmao.

shotguns almost all have the highest ttks

[ripe sentinel]

All this data is correct and thoroughly tested

[fossil elk]

I’ll be right back

[outer flint]

How many kills do you have in this game, if you don’t mind me asking?

[pulsar apex]

they should add irons onto the sr-84

[covert swift]

a red dot/holo would be cool as well (this gun is not good at close range unless you get lucky with hipfire)

[fossil elk]

This can’t be happening I can’t be wrong no NOOOOOOOOOO

[ripe sentinel]

If you're far away from your target it deals 9 dmg I think

[outer flint]

If you have 25k kills you should seemingly be smarter than this about the games weapons.

[fossil elk]

What do you mean

[covert swift]

give everything (except the riot shield) a chance

basically any weapon can be good if you know how to play with it

[fossil elk]

Shotgun aren’t good. Just get all head shots with a range weapons and then you have the benefit of ranged plus more damage and what are you talking about?

[covert swift]

assuming your playing cashout, a good 60-80%of your fights will be close range (THE RANGE WHERE YOU USE SHOTGUNS)

in power shift its different but who (seriously) plays that

[covert swift]

besides its not like your entire team has to run shotguns just bc you did

[fossil elk]

Play the long game and chip away at the defense

[ornate tiger]

@fossil elk there's a reason why the meta for all classes is shotguns lol

[covert swift]

for example i could run db while my teammates run akm and the lewis gun

[sand monolith]

Shotguns are hard meta

[covert swift]

a good flank/unexpected rush is unmatched

[outer flint]

Okay, tell me why they’re not good. Your last argument was “ look at the numbers they don’t lie!!!!!!! “ and the numbers proved you wrong, so what’s your argument now?

[fossil elk]

Look at the range it never lies

[bronze cedar]

The main problem with pike is that it wants to be a sniper weapon, but it is not. It has the same niche as LH 1 - a weapon that can hit hard at range, but is rather inconvenient in close range. The main problem is it has too low damage for a sniper rifle, and too slow firerate for a battle rifle. It is outclassed by Famas in most situations, even in range. Also, in most situations, you don't shoot in this game for 70m or further, most fights happen in range of 30m or less, and in those fights Pike cant show it's benefit of "range".

[outer flint]

Obviously shotguns are gonna have a big range, they’re shotguns.

[ornate tiger]

even ignoring the better damage shotguns are also just objectively better in movement games because they, you know, allow you to move, which allows you to dodge and stay alive longer, doing more damage

this same discussion is why people who play TF2 and main heavy eventually learn that the shotgun is very good

[fossil elk]

I WIN

[covert swift]

no type of gun in this game is bad overall and dismissing them as just bad absurd bc every gun in this game can 1 clip

[outer flint]

???

[fossil elk]

Look at sword

[outer flint]

Win what?

[covert swift]

melee is good fym

besides your only looking at the individual weapon which wasnt my point

[fossil elk]

Melee is bad

[bronze cedar]

The only "buff" that would be ok for shotguns, is to make the pattern a bit tighter while in scope, like in Apex. Other parameters are mostly ok with them.

[covert swift]

sledgehammer. opinion disregarded

please just admit you lost this is getting boring

[fossil elk]

Just don’t get close

[covert swift]

did you forget that the rpg, barrier, goo gun (and nade), and the dome shield exist

[fossil elk]

RUN

[outer flint]

Winch claw

[covert swift]

well that makes your "counter" invalid

[fossil elk]

It only has 16m

[outer flint]

Well it still stops you from running doesn’t it?

[fossil elk]

Play the long game

[outer flint]

What is the long game

Just continuously running away the whole game?

[covert swift]

im not saying this again JUST BECAUSE YOU BRING A CERTAIN TYPE OF WEAPON IT DOESNT MEAN YOU HAVE NO RANGED CAPABILITY (stun gun and rpg exist, not to mention teammates bringing ranged guns)

[outer flint]

I really feel like he’s just ragebaiting

[covert swift]

i think hes just stupid icl

[fossil elk]

All I’m saying is that non-ranged options are just a little worse than ranged

[shut bane]

Sounds like an opinion

[outer flint]

That literally isn’t what you said at all

[fossil elk]

Not part of the meta

[shut bane]

Who decides the meta

[outer flint]

You said shotguns were terrible and melee is also terrible

[covert swift]

the majority of fights in this game are close range (or melee range) how many fucking times do i have to repeat this

[fossil elk]

Pros ask a streamer

[shadow onyx]

😳 😳

[shut bane]

I have my own meta though why isn’t that the meta

[covert swift]

streamers always have bad/out of touch takes

[fossil elk]

Ask top 10

[covert swift]

people other than pros have opinions yk

[fossil elk]

But only some opinions are right like the top

[covert swift]

its just unfortunate you have them

[shut bane]

So shrouds opinions because he’s a top streamer

[covert swift]

no opinion is objectively right

like i think the db is a great gun but people can disagree and say the xp 54 is better

[fossil elk]

What is that?

[shadow onyx]

db invis is kind of cheese and the mp5 is so much worse this season

[covert swift]

db is the double barrel xp 54 is the mp5

[fossil elk]

They balanced they’re both as good as each other

[covert swift]

what does cheese mean

[shadow onyx]

mainly people who camp in corners using invis with it. It's like a troll/low skill playstyle

[shut bane]

Xp is still more reliable at ranges than m11 but lights close distance fast anyway so m11 is the better choice for most people, though if you can track well xp is more insane imo

[covert swift]

this was just an example i dont think the db is objectively good

[covert swift]

people who rat/camp are bad icl

[fossil elk]

It’s one of the best weapons in the game

[covert swift]

i thought all shotguns were bad according to you

[fossil elk]

Scroll up I said that it was good. The SH 1900 is great.

[shadow onyx]

meta for light is lh1, with 93r being decent

[covert swift]

your original point was that ALL shotguns are bad, no exceptions

literally backpedalling

[fossil elk]

But then I deviated

[covert swift]

*changed the topic bc you were losing the arguement

[fossil elk]

I don’t care about winning and losing. I care about the state of the game and melee and shotguns are just not good enough in my eyes

[shadow onyx]

tell that to trent 😳

[sand monolith]

Don’t do that

[covert swift]

i always think the takes people have in this server cant get worse then i get disproved by people like impersonator

[fossil elk]

Who

[sand monolith]

The goat

[wind folio]

ttv scory better

[fossil elk]

Headshot range will always be better than shotgun

[sand monolith]

It’s scruy….

[wind folio]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1291395860755644438/1316325335331246140/guitarblaster-ezgif.com-optimize.gif

[covert swift]

headshots are a universal mechanic (not including melee) that makes no sense

[fossil elk]

Shotguns can’t headshot

[wind folio]

shak 50 is cool

[bronze cedar]

It is, i’m kind of surprised that it has the best ttk in most situations.

[wind folio]

but it has only 20 bullets, so its balanced

[covert swift]

headshots arent what youre going to hit 80% of time anyway (jumping, movement, cloaking, etc.)

[fossil elk]

I hit head shots 90% of the time

[covert swift]

that sounds sus are you using mnk on xbox or something

[fossil elk]

What’s that?

[shadow onyx]

Not trying to hate or gang up on you or anything like that, but that is not true 😭

[covert swift]

mouse and keyboard

[fossil elk]

It is true

[stable smelt]

bro does not hit 90% headshots lmfaoooooo

[covert swift]

i encourage you to hate this man dismisses shotguns (best heavy gun is a shotgun) as bad

[shadow onyx]

do you have like stats or something. Also, 1887, sa1216, and even m26 are all very much meta

[covert swift]

db is niche but if you hit and run with it its nasty

[shadow onyx]

db is great in qp lobbies

I've never tried it in ranked or anything but it has its uses

[fossil elk]

Sa is not Meta akimbo 50 Cal deals the same DPS

[covert swift]

i only really play qp icl (dont have time for world tour and ranked is boring)

[shadow onyx]

sa is meta and I'm not even the one who came up with that

[outer flint]

You should definitely participate in the 100k tournament, you’re probably the best player in the game if you can hit headshots 90% of the time.

[fossil elk]

I will actually

[covert swift]

how have you not been signed to a pro team if thats the case

[fossil elk]

Cause I’m an Xbox player

[outer flint]

Wow you’re a real generational talent

[wind folio]

get this man a contract with faze

[outer flint]

Hitting 90% headshots in an fps game on a controller is unheard of

[fossil elk]

What are you talking about Xbox players do it all the time?

[shadow onyx]

bro is a sigma 😈 👹 🗿. Ya'll are actually just not on his level lmao 😈 👹 🗿

[fossil elk]

You can’t say I don’t know what I’m talking about because I have 700 hours and have used every weapon for at least 10 hours or more and I’ve mastered every single combo with every single shotgun and melee weapon

[bronze cedar]

Guys, we have a literal god in this chat, Run!

[sonic wren]

ok skibiti sigma kid

[shadow onyx]

damn that's sigma I'm quaking in my boots rn 🥶 🥶 💀 😳

[sonic wren]

ohhh so sigma bro sigma bro

[shadow onyx]

Put that on skib so we believe you

[sonic wren]

ok bikidi

[outer flint]

Are you actually being serious dude, or are you just ragebaiting?

[fossil elk]

I can send you an image of my hours right now

[sonic wren]

do it butty

[shadow onyx]

Send them on skib, sigma

[outer flint]

I think you were being genuine when talking about buffing shotguns, but there’s no way you’re not trolling right now.

[wind folio]

nice

[fleet brook]

Technically you can just take few shots

[shadow onyx]

That's like 2 hours a day for an entire year straight 😳

[fleet brook]

Go outside brethren

[fossil elk]

Go full auto

[outer flint]

Yeah but he also has 700 hours in the game, I don’t think he’s doing that lol

[fossil elk]

Why would I want to go outside when I can get Ruby instead?

[bronze cedar]

Just take a shower and go touch grass, dude.

[fossil elk]

Gross

Anyway, back to giving my take

These are some weapon ideas I have come up with.

Heavy

1. mini gun
   15 damage
   800 RPM
   300 rounds
   Reload speed 5.8
   25 m before fall off
   ADS time 0.6
   Holster animation time 0.3
   (Cannot fire until ADS. cannot crit. Cannot skip holstering animation)

2. crossbow
   140 damage
   18 RPM
   1 round
   reload speed 2
   40 m before falloff
   Headshot multiplayer 1.5

3.Knuckledusters
70 damage
120 RPM
Secondary
Tactical sprint this would allow the heavy to run at the same speed of medium, but holsters the weapon meaning there’s a slight delay between stopping running and attacking
(Has no lunge)

4.ARTL .50
125 damage
37 RPM
3 rounds
reload speed 3.2
40 m before fall off
Headshot multiplier 1.5
Projectile

Specializations

1.Explosives expert
80 damage
8 rounds
Refill speed 0.8
empty refill speed 6.4
(They are small plastic explosives with glue on the back. Takes two to destroy a wall. Only detonates the ones you look at.
Activate them with a detonator)

2.railgun
100-300 damage
1 second per charge
Refill speed 15
Reload speed 1.5
(create a small breaching hole that allows a heavy to barely fit in. does 50% less damage per person 300-150-75. At base charge goes through two walls, one wall per charge. this is an extremely loud weapon. also this is a rail gun, not a laser. Please don’t make the projectile look like a laser)

3.Cluster mine
239 damage
Refill speed 12
Mine HP 200
Range 3 m
Explosion width 2 m
(a rather large mine that does a wave of damage in four directions. It is a quick projectile wall that you can dodge if you stand in the corner.)

4.berserk
duration 8
Damage 50
RPM 70
Refill speed 20
HP 550
Hit box and player model size increase %28
Increase speed to speed of light player
Jump height increase 15%
(during duration attacking walls, instantly breaks them. When at half HP during the duration increase RPM to 150
Based off of Winston Overwatch Additional HP is shield that dissipates after specialization is over
When enemy is hit knockback 4 m)

5.Combat shield
duration 5
refill speed 18
(While activate summons a invincible shield with cracks in a grid shape. The color is red enemies, and teammates cannot shoot through the red. They can only shoot through the open holes in the grid you can also shoot while this is activated works and looks like mash shield, but width his half)

[outer flint]

Given your prior opinions, I’m not gonna bother reading any of that cause it’s most likely extremely stupid ideas.

[fossil elk]

Bro, you’re stupid

[fossil elk]

You’re not a competitive player

[outer flint]

Yeah I’m not

[fossil elk]

Which is why you’re wrong

[outer flint]

Neither have I claimed to be one

[outer flint]

Wrong about what?

[fossil elk]

Wrong about me being wrong

[outer flint]

Are you talking about the shotgun argument?

[fossil elk]

Melee Weapons

Dual blades
Increase the range and accuracy of which it can deflect make it so if you hit a critical hit, you take no damage the final slash is now activated by holding down mouse one or right trigger and does 120 damage each consecutive hits deal an extra 10 damage

Riot shield
You can now sprint and you can block all damage even fire the hit box is increased by 10% in all directions

Sword
Base damage increased to 100
Lunge range increased to 8 m
Lunge damage increased to 149

Dagger
Make it so you have to be standing right behind them and looking at their back and it automatically charges it and you can’t hold it while it’s charging it disable cloaking and it takes 0.3 seconds to charge but immediately discharges as soon as you look away from their back while charging and stabbing, you cannot use any specializations

(All secondary abilities are now activated by holding down left click or right trigger.
And all melee weapons can now block they cannot block bullets. They take 50% less damage from each other. Excluding dagger, this weapons cannot be blocked or block but they can be Perryed
Riot shield cannot parry)

Perry it allows you to stun your enemy and take no damage the last for 0.5 Seconds You can also Perry bullets, but you still take damage unless it’s dual blades or sword which can also deflect but only when you Perry you cannot spam Perry if you block there’s a cool down for Perry ing for 0.4 seconds if you are perryed you can still move You just can’t attack for 0.5 seconds

[outer flint]

Ban this man from the server

[fossil elk]

For what?

[outer flint]

General stupidity

[fossil elk]

How are you gonna to call me stupid

[outer flint]

You’re right i shouldn’t have said that to you, I apologize.

[fossil elk]

What did you just say?

[outer flint]

I apologized for calling you stupid

[fossil elk]

Never in 1 million years have I seen someone on the Internet say I’m sorry

[stable smelt]

Ban the light class from the game ❤️

[fossil elk]

Anyways, back to s*** posting ideas

[vale mulch]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1282499252211417140/1315750168251072532/image0.gif

[fossil elk]

Abilities

Abilities are a substitute for gadgets you can unequipped your gadgets to equip two passive abilities

The way you would equip these abilities would be by pressing the upwards arrow button above the first gadget, and it would swap to abilities and do unequipped abilities press the down arrow next to the ability to swap back to gadgets this can only be done in the menu

The way you were unlock these you go to equip an ability and press a ? And it would give you a random ability this cost 1000 VRs

Heavy
1.Plated protector
+100 HP But start regenerating 6 seconds later

2.Heavy-handed
range weapons deal 30% more damage
melee weapons deal 15% more damage
Shotguns deal 10% more damage
No ADS or secondary’s

3.Healthy head
Gain 5% HP per elimination in a row

4.Rapid succession
decrease the amount of time you have to wait for your specialization by 40%

5.Long legs
Run as fast as a medium and reload 2x faster but at the cost of 100 HP

6.Butcher
Lose 35% of your speed gain 40% damage

7.Tank
+200 HP start regenerating 8 seconds later But lose the ability to run

6. Swift hunter
   Deal 15% more damage

7.Healthy dose
start regenerating 2 seconds earlier

8.Thick ego
With every elimination gain 10% HP but loose 5% movement speed
(stops when you reach 1% movement Speed)

Medium
1.Plated protector
+100 HP But start regenerating 2 seconds later

2.Heavy-handed
range weapons deal 30% more damage
melee weapons deal 15% more damage
Shotguns deal 10% more damage
No ADS or secondary’s

3.Healthy head
Gain 5% HP per elimination in a row

4.Rapid succession
decrease the amount of time you have to wait for your specialization by 40%

5.Insanity
Do 10% more damage and move 20% faster every elimination in a row, but lose 5% of your HP with every elimination
(stops when you reach 100 HP)

6.Elimination streak
Do 5% more damage with every elimination in a row

7.Lifesaver
Revive 60% faster

8.Swift hunter
Deal 15% more damage

9.Butcher
Lose 35% of your speed gain 40% damage

10.Lazy medium
Standstill to quickly recharge your gadgets

Light
1.Raw deal
lose 50 HP but move faster than light itself
(Plus%70 speed)

2.Speed Demon
With every elimination in a row gain 10% speed

3.Great sacrifice
The time between you can use your specializations is 30% longer, but you gain 50% speed

4.Elimination streak
Do 5% more damage with every elimination in a row

5.Spider climb
stick to walls and climb 2x faster then a ladder

6.Lazy light
Standstill to quickly recharge your specializations
(This works while you’re using cloaking device)

7.Rapid succession
decrease the amount of time you have to wait for your specialization by 40%

8.Insanity
Do 10% more damage and move 20% faster every elimination in a row, but lose 5% of your HP with every elimination
(stops when you reach 80HP)

9.Swift hunter
Deal 15% more damage

10.Butcher
Lose 35% of your speed gain 40% damage

[lofty sky]

I feel the lh1 needs an overhaul or some big change because it does not make sense at all.

The sniper has 6 shot and range but it gets projectile after a certain distanse and a slow firerate to equal it out. The revolver has 6 shots, it dosent have a slow firerate but not as fast as v9s. But it still needs 2 shot to kill a light at close hold even with a headshot. I can see that make sense. But that is almost half of my ammo. The revolver also dosent have a good range so it doesnt equal out as good as the sniper does i feel. The Lh1 on the other hand has range(without turning in to projectile), high firerate(not as high as v9s but fuck why does it need to), it also only needs 2 shots to kill a light if one is a head shot. Tho it needs one more shot on M and H with headshots to kill them It has 15 shots in a mag. WTF, how is that fair. that does not equal out. Where is it suposed to be bad? With revolver you almost need to be perfekt. With the Lh1 on the other hand its fucking easy mode. I am also salty take that in to considuration thank you

[stable smelt]

Cuz light class is broken

[bronze cedar]

If you want to taste nerfed LH-1, try Pike on medium. It has same damage, but slow firerate, higher recoil and for some reason it has 20% less bullets in mag.

[stable smelt]

Cuz medium aint broken anymore

[warm gyro]

Why would the spread be smaller, shotguns aren’t magically going to be more accurate just because you are scoped in. They have their own set spread ranges regardless of aiming in or not

[mystic nimbus]

against bots yeah

[sand monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1051646677381038170/1159120373049200640/FrqkdisWIAIv4m-.gif

[stable smelt]

Nah, all that movement and DPS, doesnt take anything to team wipe with a team of lights. Very much broken at higher levels

[mystic nimbus]

i was about to ping u lol

[sand monolith]

It’s broken at lower levels. Light is hard countered by gamesense and aim

[bronze cedar]

We already have magical bow that deals more damage then 23mm bullet. Explain it as “variable choke” or smth. It was just my take on “buff shotguns” while not being too stupid, it might be good idea due to the fact that shotgun’s scopes are useless, while grenade launchers have some joke instead of trajectory shown while ads (like in titanfall 2).

[mystic nimbus]

mfw so called higher level don't have that many lights

[stable smelt]

Don't agree at all. A team of lights with game sense and aim can beat out a team of any other composition easily. Maybe not every time, but at a frequency that suggests balancing is needed.

[fossil elk]

Light is by far the best assault class in the game as long as you’re not just standing there and taking the hits all you need to do is run away hide and you regenerate faster than everyone else come back deal the same damage and go away

[stable smelt]

Correct, and escaping those situations is far too easy. And the damage output far surpasses the other classes. A team of 3 absolutely incinerates anything in front of it.

[sand monolith]

I mean, we ruby lobbies, scrims, and tournaments all show the exact opposite

[stable smelt]

Congrats

[sand monolith]

The damage output is higher but light still loses almost every trade in the game

[stable smelt]

F the rest of us then I suppose

[sand monolith]

You said higher levels of play

[stable smelt]

Sorry Father Trent I was out of line. I'll crawl back in my hole.

[sand monolith]

I agree light is broken in lower elo.

[fossil elk]

Light is balanced

[stable smelt]

I mean those of us that arent just jumping into the game. I've played every season but 3, not a scrub, and I still encounter this.

[sand monolith]

Light is very poorly designed

[fossil elk]

Yes, but it’s still balanced

[sand monolith]

Not really. It’s a balancing issue in every elo bracket

There’s not really an area where light is just a safe pick not too op or weak

[mystic nimbus]

u agreeing or not don't matter, it's a fact and easiest way to fact check it is by opening any stream of high elo players playing ranked and tell me how many lights you'll see

[stable smelt]

Got it, I'll shut up and get back to scrub play now

Daddy embark feeds me lights and I BETTER enjoy it

[placid ruin]

Same lol

[chrome bobcat]

Ong

[sand monolith]

Nobody is saying this

Everyone agrees light needs changes to be healthier in every area of play

We were just disagreeing with you saying it’s op in higher tiers of play

[stable smelt]

I see. Well either way as long as some changes are made I'd love to see that

[sand monolith]

Imo it’s mostly an issue with the specs. Most of their power is dependent on how well the enemy is playing. Like for example you pull out a mesh shield and it will block bullets, you spam evasive dash and you might avoid the bullets it just depends on how well the enemy is aiming. But if your enemy is having an off day it’s very strong

Making the specs harder to use but give more consistent value will fix the issue entirely imo

[shadow onyx]

light has been a balancing problem since s1. Also, light relies heavily on specs, like if you use another class you can forget they exist and still do decent at least, but light would get clapped if you had no dash, grapple, or invis

[sand monolith]

Yeah it’s a very interesting class. It’s just unfortunate they fucked up the specs so hard

[surreal vigil]

I think the invis is pretty well balanced. that cjhunk it takes out when u pop the abilty makes the uptime on it much longer. It makes it so you have to plan accordingly when you want to invis. If you pop it too early into the fight you can find urself running into the open with no movement, small healthpool, and no invis.

[toxic plover]

Buff sledgehammer light attack from 115 to 125

[sand monolith]

This guy HATES mediums

[outer flint]

I don’t think sledge needs a buff tbh, it’s fine where it is now

[toxic plover]

I really do

[toxic plover]

It definitely needs a buff considering how damn slow heavy is and over tuned famas meta

[tidal hollow]

Wouldn't really change much

TTK wise

[shadow onyx]

How many full tournament wins is required to get the emerald famas. idk why the in game progression thing is so useless

[spring grotto]

All rewards are given at the start of next season!

[shadow onyx]

Sorry I mean to reach the emerald famas

[broken vigil]

Sledge is literally the only viable meele weapon

[drowsy osprey]

Saber?

[spring grotto]

Its like 2400 wtp, 100 each badge. if you’re winning you get maybe 20-25 like i think, idk actually tho never paid attention to it. Either way, just getting into the second round is good, maybe like 10-15 ish each time. Don’t even pay attention to it. Also only play season 1 and 3 music only 🤭

[toxic plover]

It would for medium and for heavy you can reliably heavy attack>light>QM

[toxic plover]

Dagger and sword are good regardless of level of play. Sledgehammer falls off drastically because heavy is so slow and 350 health isn't shit to enemies running famas and revolver, double barrel and dagger, or literally charge and slam and stungun.

[spark igloo]

dagger is terrible at all levels of play and sword falls off hard against good players

sledge is unironically the best melee at high level because it slots fine in meta loadouts and essentially acts as a crippled sa12

unlike sword where you're forced into playing specific loadouts that dont really benefit your team the same way a meta light loadout would

realistically every melee in high level is bad but sledge is like slightly better than sword at barely competing

[fleet brook]

To be fair they nerfed shield massively by removing juggling and punishing you for it

[sand monolith]

which was dumb

and its also still objective value

[fleet brook]

It just makes it simpler like all of heavy specs are too simple

This game is too simple counterplay is usually one button away from shutting down or severally Harming someone's kit

Like glitch grenades power is only being gatekept by people not using it

[analog carbon]

First time I’ve seen someone have beef with the revolver

[toxic plover]

I'm convinced everyone here has never used sledge heavy and that's why everyone is indifferent to my struggles lmao. Melee wouldn't have any issues almost at all if you would attack while sprinting

[sand monolith]

revolver is a very poorly balanced weapon. because its stats are overpowered and its kept in check by random spread

[analog carbon]

I get your concerns, but I do think that sorta comes with the territory of playing off-meta. Getting grapple hammered by a skilled heavy is always something I respect. Had one get a team wipe on us tonight and couldn’t even be upset bc the homie earned it

Revolver is also an off meta pick. One missed shot tanks your ttk. I don’t think revolver or sledge or sniper need nerfs, I think they’re fine as is, but will never be “meta” with the flow of the game and that’s just okay. They exist in a space where they’re usable and lethal in the right hands, but more of a fun pick to begin with

[sand monolith]

balancing issue waiting to happen idk why thy keep micro buffing it every once and a while

[spark igloo]

I was ruby with it in S3

[toxic plover]

i understand

[toxic plover]

im on now if you are willing to watch and give pointers

[spark igloo]

sure I can sit in a call for like 15 minutes

[grand turtle]

I would probably use the revolver if it did 75 damage.
So 1 headshot for lights or 2 bodyshot.

Missing a shot is very punishing and it is harder to score a hit than automatic weapons.

But getting that good hit and seeing a guy just dash away with 2hp while you try to shoot them once again with that thing is just not worth it.
Feels like high risk-barely any reward weapon.

[spark igloo]

or actually if u want to hop on a WT I need some points

shut up trent

[jolly thicket]

how bout that gravity vortex

[lavish plover]

Dps is impacted by the burst. I love the Famas and am biased so get your gravity gloves off it.

[quick raft]

Yooo what’s the meta

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/im-gonna-kill-it-kill-it-mad-angry-annoyed-gif-15720228

[bright tiger]

Im new to the game, so what is your opinion on the meta for heavy?

[lavish plover]

Sledgegammer is actually so good not kidding. Every specialization works with it.

Also deagles are great, the lmgs are in a tough spot imo, spear is fun but mid and foeget mgl until they rework it except for powershift.

[bright tiger]

yea, Im really enjoying the dual deagles

[fickle pilot]

Dude, flamthrower...in an fps...

Making it a secondary would prolly be better....COD BO4 had it as an ult...

[lavish plover]

Pretty sure it had one of the lowest dps in the game

[hardy dust]

It has the lowest dps

[fickle pilot]

im getting merlted in close quarters

[lavish plover]

What gun u using. Why cant you run away?

[fickle pilot]

Xp54

[lavish plover]

You should be able to out dps, if not shoot some runaway turn around shoot repeat. Heavys vision is based off movement and their movement is about the same as a orangutan in jordans

[bright tiger]

does the finals have a automatic shotgun yet?

[fickle pilot]

Hnm but in a cqb situation the AoE is really strong

Im new

[lavish plover]

Kinda the sa 12 for heavy shoots four automatically butbthen you twist the mag tube. It holds 4 tubes of 4

[bright tiger]

hmm

[royal pier]

Smoke needs a complete rework. It shouldn't be client side, and it should always be the same density.

[bright tiger]

suggestion, how about adding an AA12

[lavish plover]

If you can balance it go ahead

[bright tiger]

High damage, big mag, high fire rate, low range

*decent mag

*decent fire rate

[lavish plover]

Are you a heavy main?

[bright tiger]

yea

[hardy dust]

You cant outdps heavy as light with xp

[weary eagle]

Yeah its designed to be strong up close (Not really strong but its particularly effective against lights up close as your so low health)

Best to keep your distance and play with your team

If they're distracted by something else light them up

[royal pier]

The SA1216 is kinda already the AA12

[ocean stirrup]

Riot Shield is the BEST medium weapon!

[covert swift]

im all for using off meta/niche weapons but this is a stink take icl

[eternal peak]

Lh1 definitely needs to be Nerfed

[mystic nimbus]

sure once they revert xp to how it was pre 4.0 and nerf overturned weapons like model and nerf deagles & lewis range i will gladly accept a lh1 nerf

famas also needs a nerf but idk in what, probably range

[shell sonnet]

I feel like famas should stay as the longer range rifle

(No idea what to do with fcar tbh)

I dont mind famas atm, but if anything, slightly longer delay between bursts would be good imo

[mystic nimbus]

if it's for longer range then nerf it's rpm

but the rpm is fine imo, so it's either dmg or range

[sand monolith]

Famas should kill slightly slower, FCAR should kill slightly faster, AKM should have more bullets

[hardy dust]

Pretty much this

[spring grotto]

AK kills fine? Hit headshots even 3-4 the ttk is great. Fcar, if your not hitting headshots the gun is poo poo. Famas is a win button but i mean so is any other gun if your good with it.

[sand monolith]

AK does kill fine that’s why i didn’t say buff ttk

But if it’s direct competitor is gonna kill faster then it needs something to differentiate itself

[hardy dust]

Imo fcar should have a slightly lower firerate but higher dmg per bullet, which gives it overall a better ttk than ak. Ak should have the highest damage per mag by a decent margin and famas should just kill a bit slower.

Maybe a slightly longer burst delat for famas

[sand monolith]

Yeah time between bursts is what I’d change for famas

[hardy dust]

Its basically nothing

Hardly feels like a burst when its almost full auto

[spring grotto]

Famas should just have 12 bullets and leave it there 😛

[hardy dust]

10 so the last burst is 1 bullet

[sand monolith]

If they nerf famas they better buff AKM and FCAR in the same patch or else people will be pissed

[hardy dust]

Watch embark nerf famas and buff model

[sand monolith]

[hardy dust]

Or they're gonna see that cerberus is a worse model so instead of nerfing model to a healthy state they just buff cerberus to the moon

[sand monolith]

I’m very worried they’re going to do that to Cerberus

It just needs a consistency buff tbh. Make the spread more normal and fire proc actually work

[hardy dust]

Idk abt the spread but having a consistent fire proc would be nice

[sand monolith]

I’ve heard a lot of people say the spread like doesn’t work in some way

[hardy dust]

Both at the same time might be a bit much, depending on how the fire proc buff goes

[hardy dust]

Wdym?

[sand monolith]

People say it’s inconsistent idk exactly how tho. Thinking about it now this might be a class medium player skill issue

[hardy dust]

Yeah probably

Either that or server issues

[acoustic mason]

i dont have too much trouble against the model

im more afraid of a cerberus in the hands of someone skilled bc i play aggressive

i can dance around model shots but if ur too close to a good cerberus user its case

We need some better AKM skins this is getting sad lol

[outer flint]

There’s like 30 akm skins rn

Where are my heal beam skins

[humble nacelle]

I think a crossbow for the medium class would be cool

[acoustic mason]

but theyre not fire

quality over quantity is fine but make sure theyre dope

[outer flint]

I’m sure there’s atleast one skin you like

[acoustic mason]

black leopard print thats it

[hardy dust]

Ak has so many skins

And a lot of actually decent ones too

[covert swift]

the m11 has really good skins as well

[south dew]

so... its time to nerf lh1 --- wp with no sens dmg : body 48 in heat 96 (x2) ... 15 mag Size... no limit range for dmg... what you wanna do.. total dmg 720 ( only body) and 1440 (only heat), that range dmg so high for light... i know you boosted light becuase nobody used that hero... but now is too much put 3 light in game with good aim ... everyone is fucked... ITS TIME TO NERF LH1...

[hardy dust]

Maybe a slight rof nerf, but not before nerfs on stuff like famas or model

Lh1 has always been super good, but now that it barely has visual recoil its just a lot easier to use

[south dew]

model is nerfed ... you have only 6 bullets and you need play low range.. famas is good just nerf long range dmg

[hardy dust]

Model nerf did basically nothing and famas is overtuned

Both are much worse than lh1 balance wise

[tidal hollow]

A QM is basically instant though so the TTK would be the same on medium, just easier. For heavy that combo already secures the kill. 200+115+40=355

[cyan orbit]

First anniversary looks decent good

[toxic plover]

I can't tell you how many times I hit the second swing but not the quick melee on controller.

I'll admit I miscounted for heavy

[fossil elk]

Medium
1.fire axe
120 damage
60 RPM
Secondary
Axe throw throws weapon dealing 200 damage
Once you throw it, you must pick it up. While disarmed you’re given fists
70 damage
120 RPM

2.claymore
100 damage
75 RPM
Secondary
(When you get an elimination gain 100 HP.
When you use your secondary drains your HP and gives it to your teammates HP drains at constant rate same tick damage as gas heels, all teammates and enemies two times as fast)

3.DB-12
10 damage
500RPM
40 rounds
Reload speed 3
8 m before fall off
Hit scan
Shotgun
(set enemy on fire after 5 shots)

4.Spell book
80 damage
80 RPM
3 rounds
Reload speed 2
(set enemy on fire spawn fire underneath player reloading animation, flipping pages)

5.Coachman
230 damage
18 RPM
Reload speed 3
Hit scan
Shotgun
5 m before fall off

6.MX-25
100 damage
70 RPM
4 rounds
Reload speed 4
Rocket launcher
(I know it’s a grenade launcher but I think it should shoot rockets)

7.M-16
18 damage
560 RPM
20 rounds
Reload speed 2.4
40 m before fall off
Hit scan/projectile
Headshot multiplier 1.5
(when you hip fire, it shoots a grenade that deals 100 damage)

8.Huntsman
120 damage
26 RPM
5 rounds
reload speed 4
60 m before fall off
Projectile
Headshot multiplier 2
(World War II style bolt action rifle)

Specializations

1.Flare gun
50 damage
Refill speed 8
(set enemy on fire on hit.
when shot in the air pins enemy location for 1 second)

2.RC gunner
Drone HP 300
10 damage
300 RPM
Refill speed 12
Heavy movement speed
(when activated you drive a remote controlled four-legged machine when player is damaged instantly disable specialization 2.5m tall 2 m wide)

3.Speeding charge
80-120-160 damage
1.5 the speed of Charge and slam
You can travel up to 25 m
Refill speed 12
(When you press right trigger or lift mouse, you will swing your arm or if you have a melee weapon equipped it will show the weapon it can destroy one wall the closer you are to the end of the specialization the more damage you do)

[hardy dust]

Tbf the swing has a lot more range than qm

[hardy dust]

Sledge is fine

All that would change is -1 qm on medium, which is not needed

[outer flint]

Meh

It’s alright

[grand turtle]

"Famas is overtuned"
It sure feels like if you compare it to the disappointment the other ARs are.

[restive plover]

Even discounting that it's still a little too good.

Mostly up close, since it's the longest range rifle but has the best hipfire for some reason.

[grand turtle]

Doesnt FCAR have better hipfire though?
This is what makes me lost in the whole design of weapons.

AKM has the least range, recoil is alright, but hipfire is shooting space while also it got some random ammo nerf.

FCAR on the other hand apparently is for longer ranges as well, but the recoil jump makes it hard to actually shoot by making you miss 1-3 shots.
Hipfire is very accurate.

It is confusing and I believe this is why Famas is so popular.
It hits hard, shoots where you want to shoot, hipfire is alright.
I would rather see devs change/buff the akm and fcar than drag famas down to them

[cosmic oriole]

More throwing knives concepts

[restive plover]

Famas is very slightly better if I recall correctly. As for your last statement I believe all three rifles need readjustment.

[spring grotto]

Get the cns skin, orange black and white. Reminds me of a csgo esports team skin.

[spring grotto]

Idk man. Ive never had a bad game with the fcar, or because the fcar. I feel like the fcar and ak are in good spot. Fcar before the mag size nerf was just easy mode imo.

[grand turtle]

Im just saying that it could have been done better.
If that crazy recoil jump on fcar was removed, the gun would be easier to use and actually good at long range shootouts.

I always thought that AK was the shorter range rifle and that was why it had more bullets and faster rof. But that seems to no longer be the idea.
If the gun was designed to be better at close ranges but worse at longer ranges, then it should feel like "easy mode" in its range.
You shouldnt be really struggling to use a weapon within its range capabilities imo.

If you get used to the burst fire, you can squeeze really good potential out of famas.
I believe removing that recoil jump for fcar and giving ak the bullets back and better hipfire would give each AR a specific use.
Close range beast.
Ranged shootouts.
I think it would be more fun that way.

[restive plover]

thats swiss not cheddar and yes we already have playing cards you are asking for a reskin cause you missed out

[spring grotto]

Idk man, ak always seems on par with fcar maybr even better bc the ammo to me.

[cosmic oriole]

ok smartass lets see you come up with a pun then

[restive plover]

cant make it work but I wanted to play on swiss army knife somehow, best I could come up with is swiss slicers

[tame ibex]

Akm should have 36 rounds like it had before.

[swift crest]

Yes, definetly

[outer flint]

There’s no reason they should’ve nerfed it in the first place, it should’ve kept it’s original mag capacity.

[grand turtle]

Anybody knows how proxy sensor gets support points?
Glitch trap gives you 50 per glitched player that comes into its range
Meanwhile sensor sometimes gives you 50 points for detection and sometimes it doesnt?

[vestal egret]

Its inconsistent, it sometimes rewards points if like 2-3 people get scanned but otherwise nothing

[grand turtle]

That is weird.

[fossil elk]

Unpopular truth sa is a bad weapon

[mystic nimbus]

lemme guess, u think model is bad and light is op

[covert swift]

this guy has awful takes (like all melees/shotguns are bad) ignore him

[fossil elk]

It’s true you can just out damage it with any range gun

[covert swift]

winch claw, mesh shield, rpg and teammates using more ranged guns:

[fossil elk]

It’s just a glorified melee weapon that does less damage and attacks in bursts

[covert swift]

im not restarting this argument enjoy talking to a brick wall

[fossil elk]

It’s not an argument you’re just denying the truth

Melee Weapons

Dual blades
Increase the range and accuracy of which it can deflect make it so if you hit a critical hit, you take no damage the final slash is now activated by holding down mouse one or right trigger and does 120 damage each consecutive hits deal an extra 10 damage

Riot shield
You can now sprint and you can block all damage even fire the hit box is increased by 10% in all directions

Sword
Base damage increased to 100
Lunge range increased to 8 m
Lunge damage increased to 149

Dagger
Make it so you have to be standing right behind them and looking at their back and it automatically charges it and you can’t hold it while it’s charging it disable cloaking and it takes 0.3 seconds to charge but immediately discharges as soon as you look away from their back while charging and stabbing, you cannot use any specializations

(All secondary abilities are now activated by holding down left click or right trigger.
And all melee weapons can now block they cannot block bullets. They take 50% less damage from each other. Excluding dagger, this weapons cannot be blocked or block but they can be Perryed
Riot shield cannot parry)

Perry it allows you to stun your enemy and take no damage the last for 0.5 Seconds You can also Perry bullets, but you still take damage unless it’s dual blades or sword which can also deflect but only when you Perry you cannot spam Perry if you block there’s a cool down for Perry ing for 0.4 seconds if you are perryed you can still move You just can’t attack for 0.5 seconds

Shotguns

60% more range

Sa1216
Goes through walls

Cerberus 12ga
Fire is 100% likely
Fire can happen at any range

[outer flint]

Bro you actually gotta shut up about this

It’s getting annoying

[fossil elk]

I’ll shut up when they buff shotguns and melee

[outer flint]

Well I’ve got some bad news for you buddy

I don’t think they’re gonna buff shotguns anytime soon

[fossil elk]

The model was fine…

[covert swift]

dont engage him anymore he just repeats the same thing until he reaizes hes losing the arguement then he just changes the topic and tries to sound like he agrees about shotguns/melee not being bad

[fossil elk]

I never agreed

[fossil elk]

The only reason you think shotguns and melee are good is because you’re a light main

[covert swift]

medium and heavy have shotguns/melee too yk

[fossil elk]

Try closing the distance with an sa I just played 3 ranked games with different weapons, and the sa performed the worst

[covert swift]

(heavy and medium melee are way more unbalanced than light)

[covert swift]

USE. THE. WINCH. CLAW. it isnt that hard

[covert swift]

different specializations combo well with different weapons so if you were using the same specialization each game it was a bad test as some weapons would naturally benefit

[fossil elk]

If you hit all head shots,the akimbo has 337 dps

[covert swift]

whos hitting 100% headshots that basically impossible

[fossil elk]

Top 500

[fossil elk]

What I’m saying they should do is make it so shotguns can head shot and head shots. Don’t have any fall off.

[covert swift]

no falloff for shotguns would break the game thats what balances them

[fossil elk]

Spread

[fossil elk]

And I’m saying no fall off for all head shots even full auto weapons

[surreal vigil]

also your job as a heavy is not to "close distance" or "get picks" neccesarily, Your job is to lock down objective and take hits for your teamates. You are entirley supposed to be taking space and making yourself the target. Thats why you can have a giant sheild or be able to run through buildings. Those abilities are supposed to be paired with guns that accompany them. Not every gun will match well with the special you are using. And he is right if you want to use the shotguns and get value then adapt your playestyle to so. In other words, use abilities that make that so. Allowing headshots to not have fall of would ruin the game. A character like the heavy can tank some of those headshots but a class like the light would be unable to play if a team was holding an objective like suspended structures. It would also make medium just the best class to play with a patch like that

[fossil stirrup]

so how to people feel about double blades

I like em

[surreal vigil]

my buddy just started using them he said that they are enjoyable

i acc havent seen much of them

[slow linden]

Fire and gas should be the only thing riot shield can't block,the rest of this I agree,also make the riot shield always active even when using specs and gadgets

[slow linden]

They're alright I guess

[surreal vigil]

my question here is for the riot shield: if all of these changes are made how do you beat someone playing with it?

[fossil stirrup]

I feel like there are strats

[slow linden]

Explosives or just remove him from the area,boom the floor,send them out a hole in the wall

Also just shoot them in the ass

[surreal vigil]

now say im playing something like light class, if Im using a close ranged weapon and shoot him in the ass, what is stoppoing him from turning on me sprinting and killing me with having no way of damaging him back

[slow linden]

Stungun,also you have breach charges just drop him through the floor

[surreal vigil]

but if i stun him then he can just turn and face me and put his shield up then i cant hit him

also ur suggesting i make my entire loadout just to fight the riot shield.

The reason the riot shiled is the way it is so that I dont have to make a loadout just to fiught one weapon, I can use whatever and still have a fighting chance

[slow linden]

Most lights run stungun,a lot of lights use breach charges anyway

[surreal vigil]

I use stun gun but my point still stands, what is stopping him from just turning around and facing me? Now i cant hit him because of the increased size of the shield

and I dont use breach charges my playstyle is a little different

[slow linden]

With max sens sure but there's not a whole lot he can do to attack you,just stand and defend,and both the m11 and the double barrel have enough dps to 1 mag every class in the game with the right placement

[surreal vigil]

the chances of me mag dumping with the m11 right after the stun and him not doing anything is really low

[slow linden]

He cannot turn and face you before at least getting shredded to 13 hp unless he heard you or more importantly saw you,that's not how humans react

Just hipfire and look at their head,that's how m11 is played normally,I see no changes

[surreal vigil]

Your settign urself into too big of hypotheticals here. In a perfect world where i hit all headshots at point blank yes I could kill him but the chances of that happening every 1v1 I get in are so low

[slow linden]

Lights an ambush class head to heads will see them squashed no matter what weapon the enemy has usually,unless you're roof camping and your opponent has a melee weapon

[surreal vigil]

again u are also setting limitations on what I can use. ur saying the only way to kill the riot shield is with stun gun, breach charges, and a m11 or double barrell. You are severly limiting the amount of things a light class has to choose from purley so that this change you have doesnt seem "overpowered".

I personally use the m26 matter and I can be on the side of someone and win a fight i dont need to catch every opponent off guard.

[slow linden]

I am sure light has more shit to counter him that's just what I could think of,I don't even play medium I play heavy,riot shield getting buffed doesn't benefit me

Even with heavys worst weapon I can slam riot shield,which is the mgl

[surreal vigil]

so if you dont play medium why do you feel that it needs a buff? wouldn't it be better to actually understand how the weapon works in order to produce a valid criticism?

[atomic marsh]

Hey guys what is the best way to counter dual blades?

[shut bane]

Shotguns/better melee weapon

[atomic marsh]

Won't the shotgun just ricochet?

[hallow leaf]

Alternatively you could wait for them to get close and hipfire them, or drop a frag at your feet

[dusky gyro]

gotta time it right and shoot him when theres a bit outside of the parry exposed, you can exploit that part better with shotguns since high damage in a single shot

[hallow leaf]

The important thing is not to panic when they get close and just hip fire

They are simple and relatively easy to counter

Or alternatively just run from them, they will never catch you since medium has no cc

[surreal vigil]

yea u can also just kinda bounce around them as their sides are also exposed while also keeping distance

[fleet brook]

Dash so that can't hit you

Also running shotgun helps

[sullen bear]

Would it work to rework thermal vision to be a bomb like invis? I feel like with problem with current invis is that it requires smoking out your own teammates

Also I wish the affect looked more like fortnite’s

[bronze cedar]

I wonder when the frag grenade would be nerfed. Even if it would be reduced to one charge instead of two it will be a great gadget.

[shut bane]

Can’t have two frags though

[outer flint]

I don’t think it needs a nerf tbh, it’s good but not good enough to where it needs a nerf

[still hemlock]

Looks cool

[hallow leaf]

Frag is fine, explosive mines need a buff though

[chilly turret]

M2 browning machine gun with an overheat/jam mechanic for heavy, what do we think

[swift crest]

Also they should buff the .50 Akimbo, rather than always having to stop shooting and start shooting again, I think it should work like the AKM. So the .50 Akimbo already has a slow firing rate and maybe with this buff they should even decrease the firing rate.

[swift crest]

I once tried to use the Thermal Vision and you're basically no better off with no Thermal Vision, it is absolutely horrible though i do not really care because i rarely use light and i use it the least out of all of the classes. (My main class is Medium)

[sullen bear]

Yeah I think if it was as good as Fortnite’s, where the effect didn’t obscure everything else, and also clearly highlighted enemies (their gadgets too?), it could be a specialization with a team affect bomb gadget

[swift crest]

That sounds like a good thermal vision, though i don't play Fortnite.

[sullen bear]

It’s just great bc the environment just gets a blue filter instead of everything becoming a soft black and white

[swift crest]

Yes, that does sound much better than the current Thermal Vision.

[sullen bear]

Yes, embark please make the thermal vision look like this! https://youtube.com/shorts/fW63C05BWz8?si=ZKLt3bzW0rpvCDYW

[swift crest]

Okay yeah, this is definetely better.

[fossil elk]

DB-12
10 damage
500RPM
40 rounds
Reload speed 3
8 m before fall off
Hit scan
Shotgun
(set enemy on fire after 5 shots)

[jolly flower]

Heavy Gadget:
Fish

1 damage
Infinite throw range
Makes fish noises and flops around

[covert parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/clash-royale-fisherman-fisherman-fish-supercell-clash-of-clans-gif-7025962163513567233

[dapper mountain]

Riot shield users when charge and slam

[shadow onyx]

They usually get impatient and run at you and shoot them then

[dapper mountain]

What do you guys think about grenade indicators

[shadow elm]

not a big fan honestly

[jolly flower]

I like having to listen for audio queues and the slight trail

[restive plover]

Bad idea.

[jolly flower]

Indicators would make is less chaotic and I dunno if the finals wants to go that route lmao

[restive plover]

Better audio/visual queue, rebuffing dome/aps to their former strength to protect from projectiles, or a combination of the two.

[jolly flower]

True

Does an enemy frag do more damage if it's trapped INSIDE your dome?

[restive plover]

There's no reason for it to. It's based on radius.

[jolly flower]

True

[restive plover]

If you're talking about domes vanishing after one frag, it's because the little ball itself can be destroyed.

[jolly flower]

Oooh yeah I forgot about that

[restive plover]

Like the anti gravity cube and other placeables.

[jolly flower]

Makes sense

[dapper mountain]

Also they should increase the stack of flashes

[fleet brook]

Anti gravity shouldn't be destroyable

[vale mulch]

i always found the fact you can destroy the cube so stupid, like why even use cube?

[loud merlin]

i mean you can destroy the dome sphere too so ig its only fair

[loud merlin]

they should increase the recharge time of smoke grenades fr

i wanna play silent hill on this

[keen axle]

what yall think is the best light weapon?

[frigid zealot]

hollistically probably the lh1

solid at all ranges

[keen axle]

besides lh1 tho lol

[plush harbor]

matter, situationally.

[restive plover]

M26 is the best if you have a model medium and sa12 heavy to party up with.

[keen axle]

the shotty yeah

cause i like to play aggressive but i mostly solo so lh1 not that good for close range

[faint steppe]

Saying FAMAS is overtuned without ever backing it up will never get old. Very similar ttks across the ARs and equal pick rates among high level players. Model might still be too powerful but that's just shotguns in general. This game favors cqc on most maps

[toxic plover]

Do y'all know if throwing a smoke grenade if you and teammates see better through it than enemies?

[restive plover]

Famas is an all rounder that invalidates the other rifles, albeit not to an extreme degree like old fcar.

Model being strong in cqc is a problem because medium isn't supposed to be strong in cqc.

[quasi warren]

Allow us to slide while holding right click with dual blades -- Just like the mesh shield

[hardy dust]

It has outright better stats in almost every regard compared to AK and FCAR.

[faint steppe]

Outright better stats? We are talking about a 0.06s ttk advantage against M and H and a 0.07ttk disadvantage against L compared to the FCAR. It has better damage per mag (100) but a much slower reload (0.5s) and their damage at range is basically the same with FCAR dropping sooner but retaining more damage at max falloff. So no, I don't agree with saying it has "outright" better stats. And the pick rates don't reflect your comment like they did with the model meta. And guess what, instead of nerfing good feeling guns we could actually buff the weaker feeling ones like smoothing FCAR recoil and adding back more bullets to the AK. Crazy idea apparently

[gaunt lion]

Delete sniper plz

It bad, I hate it

[faint steppe]

If it invalidates anything we isn't that reflected in the pick rates like with the model? Shotguns (SA, Model) will always remain the kings unless something fundamentally changes. It's also why the Matter performs well even though it sucks on paper.

[gaunt lion]

I think weapon effectiveness is (almost) entirely dependent on the player using it :3
(Skill issue)

[vale obsidian]

😐 that can be said to every other weapon

[gaunt lion]

Yes.

It can.

[vale obsidian]

it can indeed

[gaunt lion]

Except for sniper, fuck sniper

I HATE ITT!!!!!

[unborn frigate]

skill issue

it is weird but it is NOT bad in any means

it exceeds in its gimmick

[vale obsidian]

if anything sniper is pretty skillful bc its pretty skill demanding, you need to be better then other people using normal gun to out gun them

[unborn frigate]

you cant think every weapon is the same more obscure weapons like the sniper, grenade launchers and melee all have a large skill gap

[toxic plover]

My worse most beat down matches have been on kyoto in the final round they have a sniper light on the enemy team. Doesn't matter if you are across map or in a building, he WILL juggle a doorway/corner between shots.

Add flashlight gadget to heavy. Works on charge like thermal vision. Blinds TF out of people who look in your direction. Like scope glint but 250x larger. Like if you and your teammates stand almost shoulder to shoulder the enemies won't be able to able to aim directly at you

[quasi warren]

Tarkov meta in The Finals?

[toxic plover]

Lmao that's a real thing? That's hilarious. Can you show me a clip im up at work

[quasi warren]

its in ur dms

[fleet brook]

Turns corner

Turns into flashlight (led build)

Gets shot

[atomic crater]

My console people - How magnetic is the aim on console? Seems wild some of the accuracy coming out of you guys sometimes!

[olive olive]

In the practice range, it feels strong. In a match, non-existent to me.

[vale obsidian]

is your pfp a nft?

[toxic plover]

That shit is hilarious, but yes I think it should be exactly like that, and if not like a active use gadget, then at the very least as a deployable for heavy

[bright tiger]

guys, im new to the game but tell me, it the shak 50 good?

[atomic crater]

Haven't changed it for years! But yes!

[faint steppe]

Yes, very good. Probably the second best heavy weapon

[vale obsidian]

It's the best even!
If you can't aim range with lewis

[covert swift]

depends on the gun really but aim assist does most of the work for me

[devout shell]

We need another pistol for mediums like a glock with a swtich or just dual v9s like the deagles for heavy

[covert swift]

the riot shield should have had a pistol instead of a baton

[devout shell]

Your right about that ngl

[covert swift]

melee just isnt good on medium

[vale obsidian]

Gun with a really fast swap speed would be so nice on meds
We be duel wilding healbeam sometime

[mystic nimbus]

@sand monolith did that guy block us

or has he left the server?

[sand monolith]

He’s still here

[bronze cedar]

Am I stupid, or everybody just don't see a problem? Frag is the only gadget in the game that can insta kill anybody except heavy, has literally no sound or visual indication of itself and it can be thrown on decent range. And for some reason they are not getting nerfed, while explosive mine got butchered in season 4, and it has much more difficulties in it's performance and it's worse then frag.

[outer flint]

Frags can insta kill a medium?

[bronze cedar]

Just drop two of them, you have two at the moment.

[outer flint]

Okay but that’s not instant tho

I can often see and or hear a grenade when it gets thrown at me