💣┇weapons-gadgets

[sand monolith]

https://tenor.com/view/super-mario-galaxy-mario-galaxy-mario-galaxy-super-mario-galaxy-2-gif-11372057849495304600

[lofty kite]

naw that shits just cod

[pliant steppe]

brain rot response

[lofty kite]

is it not

[ashen hawk]

its not just u sword guys.
im an akm main, and occasionally go for akimbos.
randomly roaming around the arena, and suddenly i get hit my one burst shot of that throwing knives, reducing my health to half. then as im ABOUT to turn around, i get hit by another burst, and there u go im ded

[lofty kite]

i hate throwing knives

[grave zodiac]

That's just this game as a whole, ttk is wack for some weapons

[pliant steppe]

So anything similar to cod is a “nah” from you? The fact that COD has had several modes that were Bank it, before the finals even existed means bank it is “just cod”?

Also, other games, other than cod, have camo grinds. Ffs, The finals already has a camo grind, but the top level camos suck.

Finally, who gives a shit if It’s just a finals version of one thing that is in COD. There are a lot of cool things about COD even if the overall game is trash.

[lofty kite]

oh god im not saying "no"
i say "nah" or "naw" when i see a similarity

you are one argumentative fella
write me a whole cta on why i am a trash player

[covert parcel]

me when i have to collect 100 purple bank it coins

(its more of a chore than a gamemode)

[timber idol]

i just discovered that bow is classified as a marksman rifle

[pliant steppe]

Naw

[strange fox]

So when it's coming

[boreal laurel]

Wait really?

[timber idol]

yup

[hazy spear]

I don't know, but if it gets sended more often then maybe it's gonna come out

[snow salmon]

That would be fire

It does seem like something from cod but if THE FINALS team were to do it they'd fs make it better

[cyan mantle]

best weapon for light ?

[exotic skiff]

Lh1/m26

[cyan mantle]

thanks

[spare hollow]

Especially double barrel but every time I use it it feels like ass

[feral nebula]

buffed movementspeed or maybe a lunge on 3rd hit on double swords for medium please. Everyone especially lights just runs away from you :D

[covert parcel]

M11, SH1900, LH1

[spare hollow]

Forgot the name but the little silenced pistol I’m goated with it

[covert parcel]

W embark for making NORMAL guns for casual playerbase, genuinely thank you

[boreal laurel]

Gonna say—V9S is the name, and it’s the best L weapon IMO

[boreal laurel]

Also where is this from?

[covert parcel]

Golden Joystick awards

the finals had a little segment & that photo was shown
Thats most likely a med with R870

[slate mulch]

We need an EMP for the light class. And EMP should have range similar to sonar but it disable all gadgets for 15sec. Also add some one shot kill weapons that are not melee

[covert parcel]

glitch nade

[covert parcel]

sniper, DB, M26 combo, M1887 combo, heavy dumping his entire utility bar combo

[slate mulch]

Not exactly, instead of the electric shocks it should be like sonar that stops the gadgets within a certain range

[shell sonnet]

Was anything else shown?

[covert parcel]

no it was a mixture of already shown trailers, but that image was the ending photo

throw them both at the same time

[boreal laurel]

Defo signing with VAIIYA this time

[slate mulch]

Everyone like to 1v3 or 1v4 in other FPS games, like Pubg, Cod, Apex, etc but in finals we only have 1 weapon and also the damage is so low that 1 guy can eliminate only 1 other in a direct head on fight , even if you get one elimination in a fight your ammo and health is too low to deal with another enemy, the concept of Doing A 1 v3 clutch is far from this game

[covert parcel]

CNS > OSPUZE > ISEULT > Everything else

[slate mulch]

Same 😀

[covert parcel]

its a high TTK game, these types of players exactly why we need TDM

[tranquil rose]

My man, 1v3 in a teambased game is not good design at all

[drowsy pasture]

You are not very smart

[slate mulch]

It's all About getting the satisfaction of 1v3 clutch, if you ever played PUBG you would understand how it feels to be the king of the field

[tranquil rose]

And I dunno about you but there is TONS of moments where someone clutches a 1v3, it's just that it's not easy to pull off

[slate mulch]

Agreed, but for that you have to take mid range fights and have to rotate like crazy

[drowsy pasture]

Why would you use a br as an example?

[slate mulch]

The Finals is a different concept, but at the end of the day it's a shooter game , we need the dopamine of 1v3.

[drowsy pasture]

No you don't and you can already get that if you're not shit at the game

[tranquil rose]

But you're kinda critizing something that already happens in the game

[slate mulch]

Also they should add a little bit if aim assist for Mouse players also

Sometimes the bullets just pass through enemies with registering

[tranquil rose]

...why?

[drowsy pasture]

No the fuck they shouldn't

[tranquil rose]

Ok this is bait, i'm out

[drowsy pasture]

Bye bye

[restive plover]

No regs aren't something aim assist can fix.

[drowsy pasture]

The game does have a hit reg problem though

[slate mulch]

Are u a controller player, because I saw how controller players have this crazy aimbot like aim assist, it's almost like cheating

[tranquil rose]

Have you ever played season 1?

[restive plover]

And this is a game where teamwork is very important, universally short ttks undermines that.

[slate mulch]

Nope

[lofty kite]

i pulled off a 1v4 once
tough but for sure not impossible

[drowsy pasture]

No and the finals aim assist isn't that strong compared to a lot of other games

[tranquil rose]

Yep, it happens but it's not a common thing

[lofty kite]

as a controller player
no

[tranquil rose]

It used to but now it's super tammed

[slate mulch]

That's why 9 out of 10 games and I don't find people with open mic. Lol, every body is a shybaby in this game

[spring oasis]

No

[drowsy pasture]

Then don't solo queue

[slate mulch]

When I started playing this game I was amazed with the concept and the gun play, but then they started nerfing everything, lol

[restive plover]

Yeah randoms are unreliable at best. That has nothing to do with game design.

[slate mulch]

It's not easy to find good players in this game, and it's so fustrating how I always get 2 light in WT, when I am trying to rank push

[drowsy pasture]

Then quit the game

[spring oasis]

In some games they do, like COD, Apex and Halo. The solution is not to make the game less skillful by giving mouse rotational AA, the solution is to make the game more skillfull by reducing rotational AA that controller has

[slate mulch]

The game it self is outstanding, no question. But still it feels like their is something huge missing.

[restive plover]

World tour is a casual mode, you shouldn't take it too seriously.

[restive plover]

A lot of the balance is questionable.

[slate mulch]

Yeah but I need Coins to purchase the royalpass lol 😵‍💫

[tranquil rose]

Makes you wonder if it's true they only check data but not feedback

I mean, in balacing design not bug reports

[slate mulch]

The best thing is I didn't encounter any hacker so far

[restive plover]

Fair enough.

[drowsy pasture]

Buff revolver

[slate mulch]

Agreed 💯

[slate mulch]

And the light sniper, it should be able to 1 shot med if not heavy

[tranquil rose]

How many hours did you invest in the game?

[slate mulch]

And please someone ask them to let us have 2 weapons, I am Fed up dying reloading lol 😂

[slate mulch]

3 to 4 daily

[tranquil rose]

No I mean, in total

[covert parcel]

unpopular opinion (excluding heavy sledge 1tap light, light sniper 1tap light, light dagger 1tap all)
no other one shot combos should be a thing

[slate mulch]

Almost 250

[tranquil rose]

You have 250 hours in the finals but you don't understand why TTK cant be this low?

[slate mulch]

Why

[lofty kite]

hell no

[slate mulch]

It's so satisfying to one shot an enemy 🥲

[drowsy pasture]

I love c4, mine, rpg in powershift

[tranquil rose]

Grab a hammer and bonk a light

[slate mulch]

Why 🤔

[drowsy pasture]

https://tenor.com/view/bonk-gif-19410756

[tranquil rose]

Jus think for a bit, lad

[slate mulch]

Haha, like he will come to be for the spanking lol 😂

[slate mulch]

Naa I am fine without it

Its broken bro, it goes on cool down even if U miss, at least they should count it as used if we successfully grab something

Goo gun is the most satisfying thing in the entire game

What's that 🤔

But I have when heavy one shot me with hammer, I mean it's so fustrating

[spring oasis]

I don't want 1 shot kills in an fps game where the ttks are so long. Impossible to balance and always lead to unfun gameplay

[slate mulch]

What is ttks, please explain the abbreviation

[spring oasis]

Time to kills

[narrow chasm]

what about trowing knifes and bow?

[slate mulch]

Oooooo, yeah I also don't like how long it takes to kill, I switched from pubg to this, and in pubg I even do 1v4 with only M4 with 40 bullets and still gave 4 or 5 bullets in the end

[spring oasis]

No, I like the long ttks, the issue I have is the 1hit kills

[slate mulch]

Knifes takes 3 shots and bow mostly misses the target

[spring oasis]

I want them to go away

[narrow chasm]

both left and right click knifes can oneshot light

[slate mulch]

I think medium should have a Drone instead of torrent

[covert parcel]

exactly, it should be a commitment playstyle (melee)

[narrow chasm]

why not both

[covert parcel]

honestly i would be happy with 0 1shot kills/combos but 99% who already use it wouldnt like it

[slate mulch]

A drone with guns following the medium will be much cooler

They should add airstrike line the COD, one bit and all 3 dies 🔥

[spring oasis]

I don't want them to exist at all because the optimal play against them is to not engage which is unfun to play against, and allows lower skilled players to exert a lot more influence over the game than they otherwise would be able to if they were using a fair weapon because their very presence has a chilling effect on aggression

[slate mulch]

Is it only me or are for guys also not like when u get mute teammates

My lobby is always full of Chinese players

[drowsy pasture]

"Watch out there's someone behind you"
Controller players:

[weak kernel]

this game is all about engineering advantageous engagements as much as you can to play for the objective, it would be extremely lame if it were condensed down to pure honest aimdueling when the aimduel guns are already honestly very strong already.

[spring oasis]

The pacing of the matches where 1hit kills are not present is not lame, in fact, it is how most matches are. The presence of 1hit kills wrecks the pacing. Aimdueling should always be the standard playstyle, you saying it is too strong as if it is a bad thing that it is is asinine

[weak kernel]

I don't really feel that way at all, I like the presence of sudden bursts of violence from a shotgunner push or something much more than I like the mid range tracking duel followed by the push when someone finally goes down. I guess it depends on what you define as a one hit kill, a LITERAL one hit kill or an unavoidable death combo like hook or getting double meatshot by the double barrel

Also to me, trying to avoid direct confrontation is kind of an unavoidable part of the game when it's built around third partying and I don't really hate being encouraged to play for positioning rather than direct kills. Overcommitting to fights is generally how you lose in my experience

[solar bridge]

y'all think the gun in the cover art just revealed is another shotgun for medium? looks like it to me

[patent comet]

Can't wait for the Thruster Gadget that I was promised!

[opaque igloo]

Nerf healing beams and limit them to 1 per team

[humble fractal]

What

[rare sluice]

Lmfao what is this silly shi

[humble fractal]

Also new medium shotgun who else predicted that

[humble fractal]

What. The. Frick.

Also thats for heavy, no?

[opaque igloo]

This “silly shit” would balance the game instead of getting two or three mediums usinh the healing beams practically making it unplayable you fucking clown 🤡

[lofty parrot]

Bro it already one shot headshots lights, nah

[sullen bear]

Do y’all think the rail on the bottom of the triple barrel gun means anything for attachments?

[lofty parrot]

That would be crazy, also you are the first person to mention this I’ve seen

[polar trout]

Where are all these leaks

[amber plinth]

I think the weapon should be the Chiappa triple crown

[sullen bear]

#game-announcements

[rare sluice]

Quit yappin dumbass. If you cant kill tuff opponents that's cuz you have a skill issue. Even if they playin like thats why you dont get better.

If they weren't tough youd never improve bozo. You the clown here

[amber plinth]

But I think embark would add to it a "special use" like the ks23

[humble fractal]

Anyone else thinking these battlepass cosmetics gonna be lowkey not thw best

[sullen bear]

Low key idk if more attachments would be a good fit for the game

[polar trout]

Is it the vid? I don't see a triple barrel gun

[sullen bear]

The guy is holding it

[opaque igloo]

“Tough opponents” isnt not physically being able to kill someone you moron 😂

[humble fractal]

I agree i dont think it is, too much complecation for a game like this

[humble fractal]

Just be better highkey

[polar trout]

That looks like a normal shotgun with an ammo tube, i don't even see three protrusions much less three barrels.

[opaque igloo]

Avg 15-25 kills per game i dont need to get better. When something is near impossible to play against especially when the game gives you awful
teammates who dont help its not a skill issue. Open your fucking eyes

[polar trout]

But it doesn't seem to have the ammo gate on the bottom, and it does look like it breaks

[rare sluice]

Did u just call me moron when you typed a sentence like that?

Isnt = is not and you added not. So I dont understand what your dumbass is even telling me 🙏💀

[shut bane]

Any clue what the new shotgun is? My guess is that it’s for the medium class

[rare sluice]

Then why cry over a game with mediums just move on.

[weak kernel]

current guess is a medium triple barrel

[polar trout]

It's a double negative

[humble fractal]

Or. Or. Just lock in...

[opaque igloo]

Because they arent balanced?

[shut bane]

Holy shit is this just a balance yapfest again

[polar trout]

Yuh

[sullen bear]

I can't send pictures but I'm pretty sure it's a break action with three barrels, you can see the top barrel above where the barrels start in front of the break

[amber plinth]

Chiappa triple crown

[opaque igloo]

This is why the game is a cesspit of pure shit, Because people like you are braindead and dont understand when something needs to be balanced

[polar trout]

You have more than what's in the announcements? My DMS are open if that's the case

[rare sluice]

Next you gonna yap abt mediums using turrents in platforms and they're gangin on you womp womp

[opaque igloo]

You badly dont want something to be nerfed because its the only way you can win, without your op shit youd be awful at the game, maybe you need to get better

[rare sluice]

You jus crying so bad. Like relax bro. If you meeting the same medium tricks. Just over come it. Get better yourself get better teammates

[shut bane]

[polar trout]

Ok actually looking at it closer you right

[rare sluice]

I use light I dont know what you're yappin about broski. I played only 2 or 3 games as medium and that's it. I use throwing knives nothing OP or bad about it

[opaque igloo]

Get better myself i get highest dmg lowest deaths 90% of the time in my games, the reason i lose them is because of a group of mediums gang banging eachover in a corner with three turrets or three healing beams

[polar trout]

I see a double barrel bottom assembly then it's too tall to just be DB so it must be triple barrel, and the third muzzle is kinda visible

[humble fractal]

Ive neved once run into that issue. Gas damages at the same rate one heals. If youre playing as a team (if not get some friends, i can see why you probs dont have any) its easy to deal with. Gas plus guns, explosives for big chip plus gunfire, light flanking to pick healers, counter pick util, glitch mines, just lock in.

[opaque igloo]

Throwing knives are op? You can miss 4 shots and still kill them 😭

[opaque igloo]

I have friends they are in different timezones

[shut bane]

Repost for reference, shit iPhone quality holy fuck

[humble fractal]

So you dont have friends?

[rare sluice]

Just get better or dont try to kill them 🙏😭. I dont get you bro just cuz they used their brains to fight you're mad you want it nerfed. Use yo brain fight as team.

[opaque igloo]

Most of my friends dont play the game because they left because of shit like this

[sullen bear]

Am I tweaking or is bro wearing a tactical skirt

[rare sluice]

What is bro yappin abt

[opaque igloo]

I can tell you use invis

[rare sluice]

Just get better bro or use medium yourself

[humble fractal]

So you dont have friends? Bro just keeps narrowing down why he doesnt have friends.

[amber plinth]

Tacticool indios

Which made me think about south America locations

[shut bane]

Yeah it has to be some kind of ancient ruins

[rare sluice]

Nop I use dash you fool. Clearly you dont hAve braincells to know what works for what.

Invisible is good for sword or dagger.

Throwing knives x Dash = Op

[humble fractal]

Gotta love the iseul-t representation ofc ofc although not lookin too keen on the new cosmetics

[polar trout]

I think it's just pants

[sullen bear]

Blowdart with sniper scope

[humble fractal]

Also by the way we're definetly getting a javelin rightlike for the tribal stuff and a skin thats primal

[opaque igloo]

Invis shouldnt be used at all its the gimpiest thing on the planet

[polar trout]

Yes please

[shut bane]

We might just get that spear jacks throw rework

IPHONE HOLY SHIT

[rare sluice]

You jus mad you get banged by cloaked players.

Even tho we can see them running if you cant maybe you have skill issues at idk high point broski

[sullen bear]

Fr could be a high risk gadget with damage over time if landed (no actual scope ofc)

[polar trout]

The fuck is this take cuz

Eh whatever I ain't tryna infect myself

[humble fractal]

Nice idea

[opaque igloo]

Its difficult to spot them in fights or when your chasing after them, when they stand still in a corner its easy to miss them. Its the gayest thing ever to push a fight get hit to one hp then run off from the fight you started and hide and go invisible

[sullen bear]

What is going on in the light community in #💣┇weapons-gadgets 😭

[rare sluice]

@shut bane dont be surprised broski

[polar trout]

Nah make it a primary and give it access to a sniper scope (it has horrible dropoff and the scope is useless)

[amber plinth]

Dude you are clearly on an anger rampage, but I think you love the game as much as we do , let's have faith in embark, they really listen to us

Let's try to make this community more united

[polar trout]

Fuck Fortnite

[rare sluice]

🙏🤣 idk what your eyes be seeing. Cuz their easy to find ain't gonna Lie. I been seeing them used a lot and I can clearly see them. How can you not see. Bro jus get better at the game. Not just aim

[amber plinth]

Exactly

[humble fractal]

A chuckable spear would be so nice as an ability, rpg vibes but like puts mediums on 1 and recharges like once every 20 seconds

[opaque igloo]

Dual deagles need a nerf have they been nerfed??? But they nerf the pike twice and dome shield??

[polar trout]

Make it count as a carriable so you can grab it with your winch to insta reset the cooldown

[humble fractal]

Pike deff needed a little nerfy nerf and so did dome shield chill bro theyve been in the game for 1 season not even

[opaque igloo]

They nerf things what dont need to be nerfed take ages to nerf things what need to be nerfed or dont at all then have certain weapons specialisations what sre way too good what just cause metas

[rare sluice]

This guy s hating on every other person s gameplay

[humble fractal]

DUDE THATS SO COOL

[opaque igloo]

Dome shield didnt need a nerf bfr, pike needed a nerf but not 2

[polar trout]

I've put a lot of thought into this as I love spear

[rare sluice]

Stop playing the game then just leave. Go away no one cares? Why you insulting the game devs. Just shut up and piss off. Go back to playing roblox.

[humble fractal]

If you think this is bad you got another thing coming if you ever touch valorant or cod

[crude leaf]

I might've found the gun chat

It's called the "Chiappa Triple Threat"

[polar trout]

Must critique to bring good change

[rare sluice]

Tell me what is it

[humble fractal]

LMAO AMEN

[opaque igloo]

Im criticising whats wrong with the game. I could list all the many things i like

[polar trout]

Ya someone else called it

Looks fun asl

[opaque igloo]

You play valorant? Says a lot

[rare sluice]

No one asked bro. Even if you yap here the devs are not gonna see it do not realize that ? You think the devs are gonna check each message and be lookin for our opinions ?? 🤣🙏

[crude leaf]

Should be

[humble fractal]

Valorant left a character broken for like a year and then hasnt buffed its most underpicked since theyve dropped its kinda attrocious

[opaque igloo]

No im just venting

[polar trout]

Which one?

[sullen bear]

Idk any thing ab the chiappa but slugs could be cool like the ks if they only gave them headshots

[rare sluice]

I'm guessing that's the Jett or chamber

[polar trout]

Ah chamber ya

[rare sluice]

This ain't roblox community broski

[humble fractal]

Never said I play val, can you read? Also, youre on an angry rant about a game thats making waves in the community in a discord server at 3pm on a thursday cause you got fired and your girlfriend left.

[opaque igloo]

I hope i see you in game so i can shit on you 😭 Have a good night

[humble fractal]

Chamber and jett yeah

[amber plinth]

Chiappa slug would be nice or maybe incendiary rounds

[opaque igloo]

Time zones its 8:49pm

[humble fractal]

Thats worse ngl work starts in 11 minutes, cause theres no way you do anything but mcdonalds day shift

[humble fractal]

I saw a video suggesting that, I think itd be realy cool

[opaque igloo]

And what do you do??

[amber plinth]

It would make sensein my opinion if you have only 3 rounds

[opaque igloo]

How many hours do you have on this game?

[humble fractal]

Be a student in highschool lol

[opaque igloo]

Touché

How many hours do you have?

[humble fractal]

Ya agreed, i think like a low to medium damage slug plus a solid few in burn damage would be dope

[humble fractal]

🤷‍♂️ been playing since closed beta one

[opaque igloo]

Started near end of season 1 got like 400hrs only game i really play

[amber plinth]

Oorrr poison rounds since the guy looks like a Maya warrior

[humble fractal]

Oh dude thatd be sick a new status effect, or like gas just directly inflicted

[amber plinth]

I hope for gadgets and specializations for season 5

Things along with weapons that shake the gameplay

[sullen bear]

fortnite dragon shotgun:

[opaque igloo]

M11 is sooooo good with the scope

How am i meant yo get 1000000 cash in 23 days

[wind folio]

what if sa1216 got a red dot. it has the rails to put on one, i mean it would be useless but fun

[rare sluice]

Sure thing looking forward to it. Give me your ign. Let's 1v1. I ain't good at it but if yu want to sure

[rare sluice]

Yeaah they nerfed neon now. Are u a val player ?

[opaque igloo]

Alright lmao, tomorrow though

[rare sluice]

Ofcourse tommrow. I'll tell you now I play with server lag meaning stuck on one place. Just letting you know so that you dont tell me I'm making an excuse.

[humble fractal]

I used to play a lot more than I do now but I still play some

[rare sluice]

Oh noice. New updates are lit too.

Is that fade in yo pfp you a fade main?

[opaque igloo]

Servers need fixing istgg

I have 100+mbps and im still lagging

[covert parcel]

grip/pump is bigger i think

[rare citrus]

I'm crashing every game I get into

[opaque igloo]

Still shitting on the lobbies though

[rare citrus]

Good for you be happy you can even play I keep crashing in ranked losing 1k points back to back to only get a matchmaking suspension

[dreamy sage]

Who is the new weapon for you think? Logically it would be Med since they only have one shotgun but the character looks kinda lighty?

[opaque igloo]

Great i love it when the game purposefully gives good players incompetent teammates, wonder what its like in ranked!

Shit team wins all but one with negative k/d

Wonder why lmao, oh yeah theyre mediums with model 1887s, i need a team so bad 😭

[patent comet]

Hear me out
Next sight is Laser beam

[opaque igloo]

Model 1887 is such a joke man

[shut bane]

Holy shit the yappage is still going?

[tranquil rose]

where

[midnight hedge]

“Balance the game or add another shotgun”
Embark every season:

[opaque igloo]

Average tk user:

[timber idol]

also is anyone talking about the new shotgun we see in the teaser image

[opaque igloo]

Embark need to stop adding shotguns

[timber idol]

i swear they either have the best aim or the worst aim there is no inbetween

[opaque igloo]

Fix whats already there dont add more problems

[midnight hedge]

They should give the medium another one and then stop for like 3 seasons at least

[timber idol]

yeah i want magic weapons or sum

[midnight hedge]

Wut…

[patent comet]

give me a fkn wand

[shut bane]

Ks-23 counts as a shotgun?

[midnight hedge]

I don’t want nobody casting spells in my lobbies what’re you on 😭

[timber idol]

nah its a good idea trust

[midnight hedge]

💀

[timber idol]

you be stealing a cashout and hear some wizard shout "FIREBALL" and then you get a team wipe

[midnight hedge]

That sounds awful

[timber idol]

perfectly balanced 👍

[opaque igloo]

Dont give the medium fuck all and nerf the one they already have

[timber idol]

idk i just want more creative weapons than more guns

[shut bane]

Heavies get anti materiel rifle confirmed by embark

[midnight hedge]

We have rpgs for a reason

[opaque igloo]

Literally getting hit from miles away thinking its a rifle and its a medium with the model

[midnight hedge]

I think bros just mad actually

[timber idol]

i liked season three as we got 3 cool weapons that arent guns

[midnight hedge]

Source? 🤨

[shut bane]

My ass

[opaque igloo]

Ive lost every game ive played today because of the model turrets and healing beams. Im sick of it.

[midnight hedge]

We can’t have that every other season tho because player numbers will fall off like crazy

[opaque igloo]

What is the fun in camping in a corner with a healing ?

[midnight hedge]

Just get good and lock in

[timber idol]

im not saying to stop adding guns, i just prefer more creative and abstract weapons

[midnight hedge]

Ummm it’s called strategy. You sound like a cod player 🤢

[opaque igloo]

I dont play cod

[midnight hedge]

Ok bud

[opaque igloo]

Stategy in a quick cash game???

[midnight hedge]

Yea… so they can win. Unlike you

[opaque igloo]

How sad do you have to be to use meta in casual?

[timber idol]

fish game

[opaque igloo]

Wanting to win that badly to gain nothing. Sad little lives

[midnight hedge]

I’m not sad

[opaque igloo]

Not saying you are?

[timber idol]

theres a difference between wanting to win badly and having strategy

[midnight hedge]

We play (and win) for fun

[opaque igloo]

Why use that meta in a casual game?

[patent comet]

balance idea:
Give heavy 2 hammers

[midnight hedge]

They can use whatever they want bruh

[opaque igloo]

Sitting in a corner with a healing beam is not fun?

[timber idol]

give heavy a skateboard

[midnight hedge]

Learn to counter it instead of whining for it to be nerfed

[opaque igloo]

Exactly but they use meta? Casual is meant to be fun not painstakingly boring and slow paced

[opaque igloo]

Learn to use something what requires skill?

[midnight hedge]

People who enjoy tactical games when this guy says slow pace can’t be fun: 😢

[midnight hedge]

Already did 🥱

[opaque igloo]

People who play the casual mode and use the meta because theyre shit at the game and just make the game boring and slow paced: 🤡 🤓

[midnight hedge]

Admit you’re bad at the game without admitting you’re bad at the game. Turn you @ off next time btw I don’t want you in my notifications lil bro

[opaque igloo]

Slow paced as in standing there like a fucking idiot with a healing beam in your hands for 30 seconds or having to run away because theres a full stack there

[opaque igloo]

I get most damage and kills every game consistently?

[midnight hedge]

Pretty sure you can’t run while using the healing beam so that’s why they’re standing there 👍

[midnight hedge]

I bet you also lose consistently

[opaque igloo]

What do you gain from winning a game of quick cash

[midnight hedge]

Fun

[midnight hedge]

What do you gain from getting the most kills?

[opaque igloo]

From sitting in a corner with a healing beam???

[opaque igloo]

Fast paced action whats very fun???

[midnight hedge]

I don’t use the healing beam. Not because I think no one should just because I always forget to use it when in intense fights. Also I’ve never lost a gunfight and been like “darn it’s because the guy had a healing beam” 😂 I think you just suck

[neon canyon]

Watch how you respond.

[midnight hedge]

Yea well I have fast paced action and winning which is pretty fun to me. You play your way I’ll play mine. Also healing for 30 seconds is not gonna ruin the pace of an entire match

[opaque igloo]

Its not that i lose the fights, its because it makes the game boring and slow paced, when you want to use what you want in quick cash like i do its unplayable

[opaque igloo]

30 seconds is a lot in cashouts especially bear the end where the real gangbang begins

[midnight hedge]

How in the world it that unplayable?

[midnight hedge]

Bro what are you talking about

[opaque igloo]

You can’t fight them???? Even more so when you dont have any good teammates becayse the game gives you awful teammates on purpose for “balancing purposes”

[midnight hedge]

You are an awful teammate

[opaque igloo]

How?

I go for the objectives? I dont go round chasing kills 😂

[midnight hedge]

Because you just said you can’t fight someone because they have a healing beam

[opaque igloo]

“a full stack”

[midnight hedge]

“Does he have a healing beam? I can’t fight this guy.”

[midnight hedge]

Shoot them

[opaque igloo]

I can when theyre on there own

[opaque igloo]

I use m11

[timber idol]

you can glitch grenade them if you main light

[opaque igloo]

I cant kill a full team with 1 mag, i kill one leave to reload theyve been revived and being healed heavys shooting at me i could go on but anyone would be dead by them

[midnight hedge]

Bro came across ONE squad triple stacking healing beams and decided it was his goal to exterminate them. The people probably didn’t even triple stack it on purpose they probably just happened to get put in the same squad

[opaque igloo]

I dont use glitch nade i use what i want, The point im making is that in casual its so embarrassing to use meta, in ranked yeah whatever

[midnight hedge]

Last time I checked that was a gun so like I said just shoot them

[midnight hedge]

So you lose because you refuse to counter the enemies gadgets

[midnight hedge]

What gadgets do you run?

[timber idol]

so you choose not to counter them and get upset when they beat you?

[midnight hedge]

“Winning doesn’t make the game fun”
Bro when he loses:

[midnight hedge]

So if I enjoy using something and then it gets buffed and becomes meta I should stop using it?

[timber idol]

imagine it was stun gun 💀

[midnight hedge]

I think he got banned 💀

[timber idol]

oh wait no he got muted

[midnight hedge]

Ah ok

He was dming me saying he got muted and how he “just wanted to play casual” so basically he wanted everyone to let him win. But when I tried to message him back it wouldn’t send.

[timber idol]

damn

ask him what gadgets he uses im curious now

[midnight hedge]

I like the stun gun but if I rush a room with three mediums and then try to use the stun gun on them and they kill me I’m taking responsibility for it 💀

[dreamy sage]

I never understood that mentality. You have the tools to counter shit but instead you opt to use a fkin spork to get the nail in. 🙄

[midnight hedge]

Yea idk what he was on

He said he didn’t like the glitch grenade but if there’s a room with three mediums any type of grenade would be helpful so that’s why I asked what his gadgets were

[timber idol]

oh well, some people just choose to be mad over the smallest of things

[dreamy sage]

Man give me that sexy smoke smoke any day. Smoke has clutched so many cashouts for me xD

[timber idol]

i appreciate people who use the items that you dont see too often

[dreamy sage]

Same, love me some spicy matches!

[pliant steppe]

Heavies should get zip line

[timber idol]

what weapon do you use

[dreamy sage]

Honestly i try to use all of them, it's all down to mood really. except dagger, i'm absolutely dogshit with it

[timber idol]

i applaud 👏

[dreamy sage]

Whats your preference??

[timber idol]

personally i go riot shield or bow

[rare sluice]

Damn he got banned or he left. Reminds me of myself on valorant Me. Fuck them for banning me.

[dreamy sage]

Ah love me a good shield and bonk. Bow is tricky still trying to get the hang of it.
Tbh initially i was very basic, m11, akm mostly, but they kept releasing such sick skins that i felt such a waste not to use em

[timber idol]

yeah, i love convos like these, nobody is complaining about the game, just two fellas discussing preferences

[dreamy sage]

Yeah it does tend to get quite....well yeah in here XD Also we gotta show class in here man, we're Iseul-t!

[timber idol]

hell yeah

[tranquil rose]

Complaning is a natural part of the experience, but sometimes focusing too much in the game flaws might just take away the enjoyment

At moment there's very little things that are busted, it used to be MUCH worse with nuke/recon meta

[timber idol]

yeah thats true

[wind lintel]

another shotgun

[dreamy sage]

I'm hoping the new shotgun is a non vanilla one like the KS23 turned out to be

[wind lintel]

hope it won't just be a bigger sa

[steel umbra]

what gun is this?

[dawn spoke]

new, likely

[steel umbra]

looks like a tripple barrel lmao

[dreamy sage]

I'll be happy as long as its not for light. They are too geared towards rapidly closing distances x.x

[dawn spoke]

looks like a breakaction too

[dreamy sage]

somebody earlier suggested this #💣┇weapons-gadgets message

[steel umbra]

the skin looks like a medium ngl

it does need another shotty

[dawn spoke]

yeah i reckon its an M. L and H already have 2 shottyes

Add'lly it looks like we're getting numbered body paint

[steel umbra]

the player model in the image cant be a heavy not big enough

[haughty drift]

its surprisingly hard to tell at glance a light from a medium in the promo shots

[dreamy sage]

Yea angles can make it very tricky @.@

Still hope we get a sawn off skin with wood. Loved the hydra from Resident evil 5!

[median cedar]

can we take off the charm rack if theres no charm on the gun? kinda just bugs me bc i dont use charms often

[wind lintel]

first impression for me was ksg family

[floral bane]

nah, the weapon is a break action double barrel
the barrels are on top and the hand guard takes up the bottom space, where the tubes on the KSG would go

[wind lintel]

yeah I know it's obviously wrong, it's just what it reminded me of lol

[floral bane]

it def bears some resemblance but its most likely a drilling rifle

WW2 era double barrel fitted with a smaller barrel that could load and fire rifle rounds

unless we’re reading into it too deep and its just a skinned db

new revolver skin

[haughty drift]

medium shotgun nerf inbound

[charred wing]

would love to see a bola as gadget its basiclly rocks on a rope that inca culture threw to capture wild boar or even people

[floral bane]

bola mine

[charred wing]

gadget idea : aztec death whistle to get more speed or decrease from opponents or would that be too OP

[hasty juniper]

virtual extension skin?

[serene hull]

Was that a pump shotgun for medium in the photo?

[royal pier]

Fire damage shouldn't be so RNG, imo.

The first instance of damage from a fire weapon/gadget should always apply a burn that lasts a set amount of time. Once it ends, there's a moment where you can't be burned, then the next hit from fire damage burns again.

The Flamethrower applies a unique burn, so they'd probably have to add a small multiplier to make sure that a Pyro Mine/Nade doesn't override it, or it just replaces the remaining time with the higher damage version.

[royal pier]

No, break action. Likely three barrels.

[lofty kite]

lowk a BAR would be amazing with heavy

[serene hull]

Explain. So like three shots?

[lofty kite]

decent damage, shit mag size, good distance

[royal pier]

Imo, we don't need more ARs/LMGs/SMGs. They'll just all have roughly the same DPS, and the only differences will be fairly small.

[lofty kite]

i mean fair but what else would heavy use

heavies should get some love too <3

[royal pier]

They don't have to be stuck using conventional weapons. They can literally add anything.

[serene hull]

A chair. That’s it

[royal pier]

Steel chair that hits for like 105 dmg, but can also do a little bit of blocking. Not as good as Riot Shield, just the top of the body.

[lofty kite]

metal chair melee would be peak
sledge skin?

oh i just read bens reply and i like that idea too

[serene hull]

Maybe it could be put in front of you while sprinting and can ram people

[royal pier]

Could make it be right click/LT + left click/RT while sprinting lol.

[shut bane]

I can totally see them letting us throw the spear like an actual spear next season

[lofty kite]

there better be crazy projectile drop because its now a "ranged melee"

[shut bane]

Maybe about as much as throwing knives second attack

But big damage and decent wind up time

[lofty kite]

not crazy big

[shut bane]

Not one shot a light big

Unless if its to the head

[covert parcel]

casual player retention, we have more shotguns that SMG or AR

we have more melee than any other category of weapon

this game struggles to appeal to casuals yet embark doesnt add casual weaponary, ie automatics (AR, SMG, LMG) - then wonder why people dislike the gun system (+recoil/sight misalignment, +recoil buff/nerfs, etc)

30 weapons and only 6 are automatic, thats 20% avg

[steel umbra]

light has enough weapons honetly dont add any more to the class lmao

[covert parcel]

it is the most played class its expected to get the most

[lofty kite]

based
i like your ideas

[covert parcel]

every season every class gets 1 weapon

[steel umbra]

and they should wait for med and heavy to catch up to add more

or just remove some (sword)

[covert parcel]

removingcontent

[chrome wadi]

I want to see more weapons for medium

like I feel like there are not enough melee options

Heavy has sledge and spear. Light has sword and dagger. Meduim only has

[covert parcel]

we have SIX melee

[hallow leaf]

Wait... Medium has melee options?

[covert parcel]

we have 5 shotguns

[hallow leaf]

And 4 usable ones

[steel umbra]

the damage for dual blades is fine it just needs to attack much faster

[chrome wadi]

Bro aint nobody care about dual blades, and riot sheild is a joke

[hallow leaf]

The damage is not fine, the last attack of the combo is atrocious

[lofty kite]

so you want medium to have more melees than every other class...?

[covert parcel]

true

[steel umbra]

personally think its fine but when using it it never attacks fast enough to win the fight

[chrome wadi]

OR just buff already existing ones

[hallow leaf]

The damage goes 100-120-70 it drops off at the end for no reason, it literally punishes you for finishing the combo, the damage should be 100-120-140

[chrome wadi]

yeah

[lofty kite]

thats actually weird

[hallow leaf]

And if you want to be technically correct it's 50x2-60x2-70

[steel umbra]

yeah it should kill a heavy honestly

[hallow leaf]

Im a firm believer that the last attack has to be bugged and is supposed to do 2x it's current damage because it just doesn't make sense otherwise

[chrome wadi]

light has 12 weapons. we need more medium weapons (and heavy I guess)

Also I stopped playing the finals when pike was meta, is It nerfed? it feels like it is doing less damage

[hallow leaf]

Yes it was nerfed

[steel umbra]

nerfed perfectly imo

[hallow leaf]

Had it's damage reduced and drop off changed to make it just as effective at long range but do less damage close range

[lofty kite]

seems to encourage it being long range now and im a bit happier with it

[chrome wadi]

That makes sense, sounds like a good nerf

[hallow leaf]

Surprisingly enough it's one of the rare times they actually nerfed something correctly

[lofty kite]

helldivers 2 fucking type nerfs

[chrome wadi]

Also the model I think got nerfed nicely

[hallow leaf]

Without absolutely killing the weapon

[hallow leaf]

Agreed, but it could still use a little more spread imo

[chrome wadi]

What are your opinions on the M26 Matter?

[hallow leaf]

It's balanced tbh

The sh19 on the other hand.... Fuck that gun

[chrome wadi]

😂

[hallow leaf]

But tbh I don't know how else to nerf it besides a slower fire rate or longer reload

Any other nerf would make no one use it again

Or s good nerf for it would be to remove stun gun 🔫

[chrome wadi]

How much damage does it do currently?

[hallow leaf]

It 2 taps heavy and one taps lights

[chrome wadi]

damn

So like, I want more weapons for medium. But idk what else they would add

[lofty kite]

mk18
high fire, decent mag, decent damage
i mean "oh my god another ar"
but like what else could they do

[hallow leaf]

195 per shot

[hallow leaf]

A crossbow for med

Since light has a bow, and give heavy a ballista or cannon

[lofty kite]

oh my god i love that

[sullen bear]

Crossbow with poison affect

[lofty kite]

fire crossbow would be better imo

[chrome wadi]

gotcha, that more than the model

[sullen bear]

True

Poison gadget

[chrome wadi]

Wait that's a good idea

[lofty kite]

whats that one carriable cannon from fo4

[hallow leaf]

Just imagine a heavy shooting a ballista or cannon at a building a blowing a hole through it

[lofty kite]

would be perfect for heavy

oh its the broadsider i think

[chrome wadi]

Heres what im thinking. What about an axe (hatchet for medium)

[lofty kite]

throwing axe...?

[sullen bear]

Hmm maybe it could do easy arena damage, but only like small holes

What buffs or changes do you think dual blades need to be viable

[lofty kite]

imagine making a peekhole with a fucking carried cannon

[sullen bear]

I meant for the axe 😂

[lofty kite]

oh

would be good for a carriable cannon still

[chrome wadi]

Well as mentioned before, dual blades seem to drop off in damage when you use them. Making damage increase towards the end would cause dual blades to be more effective

[lofty kite]

especially with what timezone i think this next season this is in

crossbow, cannon, and what would light possibly get?

[sullen bear]

A bag of stones

[covert parcel]

any SMG

[lofty kite]

a bola?

[covert parcel]

ohh aztec times

[sullen bear]

Yeah

[chrome wadi]

guantlets

[sullen bear]

New light spec: sacrifice a teammate for increase team damage/ health

[lofty kite]

oh god

[chrome wadi]

😂 😭 💀

[sullen bear]

It could just be like a portable temple

[chrome wadi]

Medium:
Slingshot

[sullen bear]

True

[chrome wadi]

This would be cool but I want to see crossbow first

[lofty kite]

okokok
yknow how aztecs sacrificed for rain (allegedly)
sacrifice your respawn tokens to start a halftime effect early?

[sullen bear]

That should be too crazy

Could

[hallow leaf]

Pocket sand

[lofty kite]

theyd have to get team-ressed so it has its "nerf"

and obviously its not gonna last as long as a normal halftime event

[hallow leaf]

Imagine a game mode where its all heavies but it's all melee and your ranged options is the cannons around the map and the map has more cannons spawned in and you can push them and move them

[lofty kite]

pirates

you gotta board other teams ship to steal treasure chests

basically vaults/cashboxes

[chrome wadi]

Just really fast. How do I get Like a server role (rank i guess)

[lofty kite]

look up at the top of channels

under the banner should be "channels & roles"

[hallow leaf]

Omg a sea themed map where the map is pirate ships would be amazing, it would also open up the possibility for a space themed map

[chrome wadi]

thx

[lofty kite]

we're cooking

[hallow leaf]

The map would also be the introduction to crossbows and cannon, and you could give light a flintlock

[lofty kite]

im still thinking of a bola for light

[fleet brook]

That sounds like a great way to greif a team

[lofty kite]

only the lights tokens

[hallow leaf]

Or throwable bombs that are short range and are basically light version of a grenade launcher and does structure damage

[lofty kite]

and for gamemodes that have infinite tokens, itll obviously be disabled

[fleet brook]

I guess that falls into the griefing as In purposely dying after burning your tokens

[lofty kite]

cartoon bomb frag 'nade skin!!!

[hallow leaf]

Also light needs an animation for goo grenades where they are eating them, but is a light only animation

Give the goo eaters their own animation

[lofty kite]

speaking of goo
i saw a heavy towering with a googun in terminal attack
lowk smart asf

[chrome wadi]

I want to see what new sponsers have to offer

[chrome wadi]

Fr

[hallow leaf]

@lofty kite @foggy thorn

[lofty kite]

cringe

[hallow leaf]

That's how it works

[lofty kite]

yeah i somehow got it by dropping cashout box down with demat

or i killed them with a mine

prolly the latter

[hallow leaf]

Honestly that's just a dev response, there could be other ways but that is an official response from them

[foggy thorn]

Perfect. I hate it.

[dreamy sage]

Somebody mention sacrifices for rain earlier. Imagine heavy rain and flooding as a map event? 👀

[narrow solar]

Medium shotgun still needs more reworking... too much range, especially against lights

mml is too dominant and light is the weakest class and nerfing just damage against lights would indirectly buff lights and increase usage of the revolver since shotgun no longer can have good range and do more than the revolver without accuracy

[covert parcel]

me with my HHM comp still dominating with shotguns

[narrow solar]

heavy is in a pretty good state right now but medium is basically required in every set up

[covert parcel]

HHM HMM MMM is all to be seen,* breakout is case and point

[pulsar nimbus]

Anyone know what the most consistent gun/weapon is for medium at the moment? Really struggling to play well.

[narrow solar]

its the most used and boring class imo

[covert parcel]

yeah, as long as he has defib he will be used - hes a team amplifier

[covert parcel]

AKM is pretty much jack of all trades, it gets a sight too as a purchase - very solid

[narrow solar]

ak for consistency and ease of use, famas is super low recoil and easy to hit shots but you cant miss shots or youre screwed

[hallow leaf]

You had me at nerfing the model then lost me when your reasoning was for lights

[narrow solar]

i gave more than just reasoning for lights

[covert parcel]

to be fair, medium is designated at midrange combat
shotguns are close range combat

so nerf the damage keep the range

[narrow solar]

but the shotgun was never meant for mid range

[hallow leaf]

Is damage is fine, it just needs a little more spread the previous nerfed was in the right direction

[narrow solar]

yea spread is definitely to narrow rn

[covert parcel]

just nerf its damage to be a 2/3 or 2+melee/4 or 3+melee everyones happy

[hallow leaf]

Just because it excels in mid range doesn't mean it can't have any close range

[narrow solar]

i just think a nerf on lights is fair because its not super op against other classes

[covert parcel]

it does and look at break out, look at ANY streamer build rn

its ALL models, use or lose

[narrow solar]

but we all agree it needs a nerf

[covert parcel]

yes

[hallow leaf]

Increasing it's spread will reduce its damage and range

[pulsar nimbus]

Cheers guys, I guess my other question is what class would you recommend? My usual playstyle in games is to be fast and flank - but I find it die so easily on light. I think part for the problem is I play medium like a light.

[narrow solar]

medium overall needs some rework because of how dominant it is rn

[hallow leaf]

It's damage is in line will literally every other shotgun (but the sh19 fuck that gun)

[covert parcel]

we literally got a spread nerf to model and it did nothing, its still the most used gun

[hallow leaf]

It just needs more spread don't fuck with it's damage

[narrow solar]

the issue with medium is its not just a medium range class

[hallow leaf]

That's because it was such a small nerf it just needs to be adjusted

[narrow solar]

its a support, dps, close range, mid range, long range, destructive, explosive, melee

[covert parcel]

omg lmao

[narrow solar]

its just too op rn

[narrow solar]

yea which is why it needs nerfed more

the only people denying it doesnt need nerfed are medium copers

[restive plover]

It definitely was, the damage is just too high.

[narrow solar]

whats mid range to you

[hallow leaf]

This is what the model nerf was
Increased inner pellet radius from 0.45 to 0.65, making the weapon less accurate at longer ranges

Increased outer pellet radius from 1.3 to 1.7, making the weapon less accurate at longer ranges
All they need to do is increase the outer pellet radius to 1.9 or 2.1

[narrow solar]

in meters

[covert parcel]

nerf its dmg

support class shouldnt hve CQB capabilities thats its defined weakeness

[hallow leaf]

Increasing the outer pellet radius means hitting less pellets therefore doing less damage

[narrow solar]

I actually agree with u now

[restive plover]

Close range is 0-20, mid is 20-40.

Old model danced right on the line between the two, so I guess not exactly "mid range." But being a longer range shotgun was absolutely the intention for the weapon, and it's what fits with medium's class design. It just hadn't really been touched since season one so the damage was overturned just like everything else was then.

[restive plover]

Unless you're at close range.

[hallow leaf]

Yes... But its a shotgun

[restive plover]

A shotgun on medium.

[hallow leaf]

The only other way to really change that is make it a slug shotgun

[restive plover]

Or just retighten the spread and reduce the damage.

[hallow leaf]

And? Every class has shotguns and melee

[covert parcel]

mediums should be slightly worse if "even" cause its a support class

[narrow solar]

Yea I agree with more of a damage nerf

I’m tired of getting two tapped at mid range, damage nerf would fix that

[covert parcel]

a similar balancing ideal is Overwatch Brig

she was a CQB dmg, Tank shield - AND she could heal while just existing - she was a nightmare and every match was at the mercy of your brig. no role could stop her, you had to 1v3 her to kill her

[dreamy sage]

Support comes in many flavours tho, support trough overwhelming firepower being an example

[covert parcel]

obviously not perfect example but a solid comparison

[restive plover]

Medium not having effective close range weapons is what offsets their support potential. It's why both dematerializer and turret help medium in that area in exchange for giving up heal beam.

[narrow solar]

The issue is incredibly good with support where u basically can’t play a game without a medium. It doesn’t need to have crazy guns for it to still be used

I get out dps close range against a medium when I’m using m11

Unless I hit all headshots, or shoot first, a perfectly even 1v1 with a medium the light is not winning

[covert parcel]

a class that can flex into multiple niches is good, assuming theyre ALL not at full strength

[dreamy sage]

The problem with not having any solid CQ weaponry is that it makes Lights incredibly hard to counter when they get intimate imo

[narrow solar]

The issue is light is the worst class rn because medium almost entirely replaced it aside from gateway

[covert parcel]

ie medium with heal/defib, pad, AND close damage with model is too overbearing

medium is defined as supprot & midrange combat
slightly gut the CQB and it will be fine

[narrow solar]

The only really value lights have is the gateway and stun gun

[dreamy sage]

Then the solution is to buff/rework light not nerf medium if you ask me.

[covert parcel]

nerfing his support or midrange goes against the very idea with the class is how classes get fucked in the long term

[narrow solar]

Medium can be good against light, it’s just incredibly overbearing at the moment

[hallow leaf]

If you nerf the models damage the best option would be 112 damage since that is 7x16 because currently it's 8x16 which is 128 damage

[narrow solar]

A mix of both can be done

[dreamy sage]

Cause as it stands, light is NOT a team player like the other two classes and therefor falls short. or at least has no proper incentive to be a team player.

[narrow solar]

That’s the players fault, I am very team oriented light, I run gateway sonar and stun

[covert parcel]

honestly all of the above, light is too volatile for high/low elo

low elo light dominates (any "new" YT clips playing QuickCash / Powershift / BankIt)
~ Good evasion
~ High DPS
~ Enemies dont know audio ques / visual ques
high elo light is ass (breakout tournament, plat/dia/ruby Ranked, Emerald WT)
~ 150 HP, thats it

[narrow solar]

Light is the scout class and close range class

[crude leaf]

Some buffs I would like to see for Gadgets are

• Pyro Grenade (Increased radius)

• Pyro Mine (Increased radius)

• Data Reshaper (Fix Barrel rotation and allow the Dome Shield to be reshaped outside of the shield)

• Dome Shield (Increased health. No more than 50 at least)

• Glitch Grenade (Allow for cancelation of a Defib revive when the explosion hits their build-up hologram)

• Glitchtrap (Allow to work like a Glitch Grenade with the added AOE effect. Immediately aftee the triggered explosion, the trap dissappears)

• Thermal Vision (Team color'd vision please)

L or W?

[restive plover]

Light has plenty of teamplay potential. Sonar nades, glitch grenades, vanish bomb, stun gun, and especially gateways are great for teamplay.

They just keep getting weapons nerfed and have sucky specializations. Mediums being able to match their damage potential is just the icing on the cake.

[hallow leaf]

I like the pyro buffs but imo pyro should do a little more damage

[covert parcel]

im tired of seeing nades ngl, pyro nade +1 count or gas nade +1 count

[narrow solar]

100%

[restive plover]

Consider the following: 3 pyro grenades.

[narrow solar]

A good light plays with his team. If you watch appoh he’s a great example of how a good light in high elo performs

[crude leaf]

Or tbh, js last longer therefore there's a better reason to run pyro grenade to block off areas than gas grenade

[covert parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/trevero-gif-20308813

[narrow solar]

And how good of a helper if could be

[restive plover]

Also it doesn't matter what we do about gas grenade unless we make it cover the map, just made completely obsolete by barrels

[covert parcel]

to be fair its smaller via barrel, gas mine has 2 charges but gas nade has throwability

[hallow leaf]

It has a smaller radius less damage and last shorter then the gas, imo it should do the same or more then gas if it's got a shorter duration

[fleet brook]

Tbf a class with strong util but extremely weak guns would be terrible to play

[hallow leaf]

Pyro is 20damage per sec and gas is 50

[fleet brook]

This is a shooting game first so it needs to have at least good feeling guns

[dreamy sage]

And my hat off t you for that by all means. But imo they need more stuff like gate way options, hell ive heard solutions for a stim to boost them, change it to boosting deployables THAT'S valuable. Give the ASP turret on more shot, domeshield last a little longer, etc.

[crude leaf]

Damn

[covert parcel]

exactly, have to find a balancing point or make specializations filter weapons/gadgets (which hurts the sandbox element so clearly the option is to remove some niches (ie mediums CQB damage))

[restive plover]

Medium doesn't need terrible guns overall. Restricting it to midrange would put a cap on the offensive potential due to how objectives work and still have an area they shine in.

[covert parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/amen-anchorman-will-ferrell-gif-10865461

[fleet brook]

Tbf a good lh1 player can cook from mid range as well and pre nerf XP

[dreamy sage]

Also Lights not meant to go 1v1 in DIRECT combat, it's a ambush, poke kinda class.

[fleet brook]

Shhhh most people are to bad to understand that

They also stopped balancing the class around surprising your enemies and flanking

[dreamy sage]

Also considering the support nature of Med, doesnt it make more sense to HAVE close quarters effective gear? Most support happens near the front of the battle cause you aint reviving nobody from the other side of the map with your pike.

[restive plover]

Light doesn't really need to be restricted by range as much as heavy or medium because of how restricted they are by health.

And pre nerf xp was still significantly worse than rifles at mid range play. People complained about it like they complain about m11 now because people complain about light.

[fleet brook]

Tbf lights complain about lights and they're a pub stomping class not necessarily good in ranked but can terrorize QP where the majority of people are

I play DB and people complain about that even other lights

[covert parcel]

someone with good takes holy fuck

both

[dreamy sage]

Oh lights for that reason is surely a nightmare to balance @.@

[restive plover]

The support gear is why shouldn't be strong in cqc. If I'm healing my heavy in a teamfight and you dive me as light I shouldn't be able to stop what I'm doing, vaporize you, and get right back to it.

[covert parcel]

exactly
Light is a noob stomper in pubs
Light is model bait in ranked

[fleet brook]

Tbf they're nerfing meds support items

[covert parcel]

YEAH WHY its an intended strength

[restive plover]

Which is fucking stupid and doesn't fix the problem.

It's like heavy is still secretly broken for having lewis and deagles and is just waiting for model to be nerfed so it can be the strongest class again.

[fleet brook]

Yes because it means med has to rely more on his guns to be viable instead of the gadget class having good gadgets

Feels like everyone kind lost they're design philosophy since launch

[covert parcel]

time out time out

youre incharge of the finals
you can do THREE changes to make the game better for everyone
what are they?
(drop ur hours & rank & main too)

[restive plover]

Nerf medium's support just makes this class more boring while still being too strong.

[dreamy sage]

ANd a well placed glitch and flashbang kinda gives you a free kill. But most light players are very singular in their loadouts, they want both cloak and dash and so on.

[covert parcel]

this goes for anyone

[fleet brook]

I say deagles are very much a skill/aim dependent weapon because dear Jesus they do dirt damage to the body

And lewis is meh nerfing the lewis again and heavy relies on the deagles nerf that and people will find something else to rely on

[granite orchid]

Not part of the discussion but I come here to see what’s worth looking into as I’m a fairly new player, only 50 hours in

[restive plover]

Deagles perform nearly identically to the lmgs when landing body shots, but have much higher potential due to headshots multi and insane range.

[covert parcel]

build wise or players opinions?

[fleet brook]

Similar to lmgs with lower ammo capacity

[restive plover]

And lewis still beats every rifle at every range. Heavy shouldn't do that, kill it.

[restive plover]

So not dirt damage. Just normal damage.

[fleet brook]

Then heavy will be the boring big hp do nothing class

Aka the problem OW2 had with it's tanks just getting absolutely bullied

[dreamy sage]

Give heavy a knockback skill

Lights stungun the ability to temp disable turrets and revives

Medium let us attach zip straight up

[granite orchid]

Both, sometimes what people don’t say is just as important though, nobody talked about the 93r and that’s because it’s bad apparently. DPS is just not up to par compared to other light weapons as an example

[fleet brook]

If you're tank class is just defensive items + you are heavy

Or

You have a narrow threat range and outside of that you're useless but everyone else has mid range weapons it will be a miserable experience

[restive plover]

I would also like to see the m60 and ks23 to recive major improvements as well as restoring the strength of mesh and dome shield.

[granite orchid]

Or the medium shield for example, it’s a high skill cap weapon but powerful in disciplined hands if the comp allows it from what I’ve seen @covert parcel

[covert parcel]

use medium if youre new, fairly solid. use whatever you want (just not dual blades). defib is solid rn, youll figure the rest out

[restive plover]

Also ow2 doesn't let you catapult your tanks into effective range with jump pad/gateways/zip.

[covert parcel]

player opinion, im dia solo que in ranked so im a bit biased

A. Casual player retention is horrible, doesnt add simple gamemodes or "normal" weaponary, then the devs wonder why retention is bad & new players leave
B. Embark keeps ignoring their own balance design by nerfs intended strengths while buffing intended weaknesses
C. Light is too volatile throughout the elos

[dreamy sage]

One thing to take into consideration when discussing nerfs/buffs and changes is the other side. I'd love this awesome thing for my main class but, how fun would said thing be to play against?

[restive plover]

You mean riot shield? No that thing is garbage. Some people can make it work, but you have to be putting in 80x the effort for even remotely similar results to conventional weaponry.

[wind lintel]

it's not 80x the effort if that amount of effort is normal to you

[restive plover]

Medium just does not have the kit to play melee.

[dreamy sage]

It's good to have some outlier high skill weapons thats a true challenge to master

[covert parcel]

this is how i feel overall @granite orchid

[covert parcel]

riots really good if you rush as a team, most of the time its kind of rough to use

[wind lintel]

"nerfs intended strengths while buffing intended weaknesses" feels like fcar and akm summed up, they would be pretty much the same gun if not for the mag size and recoil difference

[sand monolith]

They had it until season 4

[hallow leaf]

Original the fcar had better damage and better range but a smaller mag now it's just an objectively worse ak

[covert parcel]

@sand monolith answer this, im curious. be specific or broad as you want

[sand monolith]

S4 weapons have been the biggest deviation from this games design principles

[sand monolith]

Give me like 5 min brb

[sand monolith]

Model nerf

Light spec design rework

Healing focused content update

[covert parcel]

more specific

this can be core design or balance changes. ie gamemode, class reimagine, etc

[sand monolith]

Refocus light specs to give more objective value that isn’t focused on your enemy mistakes. Quick example (not what I’d do) is to make dash give iframes but not allow you to shoot during it.

And healing focused content update that adds healing a healing gadget to all classes

And then adds less healing when in combat

[covert parcel]

i see i see

[dreamy sage]

The healing is one of the main reasons why medium is so dominant.
Giving the other classes something close but not at the same level (gadget vs spec) might be a pretty solid idea.

[covert parcel]

support identity gutted tho

[sand monolith]

Medium should be the go to for healing and support but other classes should be able to fill the gap with lesser healing options

[dreamy sage]

Not necessarily, think emergency bandage vs first aid kit

[sand monolith]

No team comp will ever be viable without a form of healing that’s just an unfortunate fact

Even HHH wasn’t viable when nukes existed

Medium should get more support tools though like a cooldown boosting AOE station and teammate buffs

[dreamy sage]

Example how about a tracking dart style gadget for light that heals a small amount and imdediately starts regen?

[sly estuary]

what is bro on lewis dropoff range is 30 meters it gets mauled by akm, fcar, pike, lh1,

[sand monolith]

Yeah this would be great

Honestly it could just start regen and that’s it but could also be self cast

And a healing station for heavy would be sick. Apparently that used to exist for medium in the alpha

[dreamy sage]

make it doa puff of particles then and a small aoe for a sec

[sand monolith]

Would be cool. This game really needs more gadgets

We are 1 year into release and medium has netted -1 gadget

[dreamy sage]

The healing station would be cooll but i forsee it just making medium and heavy comps even more opressive :/

[sand monolith]

I enjoy defensive playstyles so maybe I’m a little biased but it should definitely heal slow and break after x amount of heals done

[restive plover]

35-40 meters and keeps 67% of the damage at max falloff. Amazing range stats that lets heavy dumpster those guns when combined with his health pool. Even before the nerf pike could only win a head on fight with lewis at 40-50 meters, that shit is not happening anymore with the damage nerf.

[dreamy sage]

To contiue adding to lights team comp value, how about a nanite gadget that can repair deploayables?

[turbid widget]

I'm the best sniper

[cosmic tide]

https://tenor.com/view/this-man-clown-react-him-gif-15079742458003585290

[dusty quail]

is there a real life model for the new gun

[covert parcel]

725 with comically large grip or R870

[sand monolith]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiappa_Triple_Crown

likely this

[covert parcel]

good eye

[narrow solar]

thatd only help 2 gadgets

[dreamy sage]

Barricade, Turret, aps, could also recharge mesh to a point. The idea is for it to feed into the other teams stuff

[granite orchid]

Yeah I’m a quick learner, running with revolver and heal beam, play like a proper supp with JP, Zip and Defib with AK, Frags, Glitch and DR in reserve

[covert parcel]

bro knows

[granite orchid]

There’s a fair amount of counterplay to it hence why I said if the comp allows it, it’s usefulness wholly depends on individual skill for and against. You’re handicapping yourself by using melee on med but you can get away with it in conjunction with demat and another med playing supp

I’m open to being wrong but riot is fairly balanced

[covert parcel]

riot is "bad" on the term of ultra sweaty

in casual play its pretty solid, slightly above average

[granite orchid]

I’m not familiar with the history of the game or high elo to comment on b and c but yeah A is very true. My story starts with me downloading the game during s1 because of friends recommendation playing by myself to learn the game myself outside of the tutorial, played a few matches and deleted it same day 🤷‍♂️

[covert parcel]

im not crazy see yall?

i told yall the onboarding process is too difficult

noone wants to talk ab that because everyone wants to complain about meta items and what not

[covert parcel]

also yeah you NEED a stack to enjoy casually

at least in my eyes, im used to playing solo tho

[granite orchid]

I imagine it’s because its rarer to see and therefore understand the counterplay for casuals or uncoordinated randoms

[covert parcel]

yee

[granite orchid]

It’s kind of funny to see the reactions of folks tbh, negative and positive input comes from right place where folks care about it, if I wasn’t invested, I wouldn’t care to comment or even play for that matter. The community is definitely smaller than a big franchise like cod but I want to invest my money to this because I enjoy this quirky game show fps. The music is phenomenal, the destruction is nostalgic and gameplay loop is addicting. I’m glad I gave The Finals another shot in s3

[granite orchid]

Rarely is a game better without friends so my philosophy is if I can boot something up without others then it’s a fun game at minimum. I play solo as well because my biggest growth comes from learning on my own and shutting up. I get in my own ego with others so I’d rather not subject anyone to it when I’m still learning the more advanced systems. I engage with the community to learn directly or otherwise because you can only go so far alone

[covert parcel]

you came back in S3? damn bro you must really love this game, S3 was rough lol

[covert parcel]

same dude

[rough carbon]

idk sledge skin?

[granite orchid]

That’s what I’ve learned from reading the discord haha, the general consensus was that s3 was a weak point which is pretty funny considering (in my personal opinion) it had the strongest music of any season so far. I would boot the game up just to listen for the ost on the menu. Stardust and Ronin are genuine heat. I did take a break near the end of s3 so I did miss out on the final parts of the bp and dissun challenge because I was enjoying other titles but I’m here to fucking stay. The game would have to drastically change or shutdown for that to not be the case

[granite orchid]

Probably could be a sword skin considering they have a baseball bat skin for it rn

[rough carbon]

could be a weapon that bleeds

[granite orchid]

A new weapon with DoT is an idea for sure 👀

[rough carbon]

boston basher

[dusty quail]

may i say it's unlikely

[covert parcel]

music was fucking goated

S3 changed the ranked mode to Terminal Attack, basically Counter Strike with The Finals flair. did not go over well. its like if the entirety Real Madrid just decided to play basketball for a season (its back to cashout tournaments now)

[granite orchid]

Hell yeah it was, I haven’t messed with the rank mode very much but yeah I saw ranked TA and tbh I was expecting to enjoy TA because I used to play Siege and that’s the closest comparison to it. I don’t enjoy TA and I’m not even quite sure why tbh

[wanton anvil]

Ive notticed that when using the GL on heavy, when firing the grenades at close to medium distance, they consistently hit an object, stick for a sec, then bounce like they would if they didnt stick, making it hard to predict trajectory consistently. Is that stick normal/intentional? It feels like a small delay/lag before they bounce so I didnt know if that was intentional, especially since grenades fired at longer range seem to bounce instantly instead of waiting on the surface they hit for a second

like, I just died because the grenade Id fired hit the wall and stuck before bouncing, so tho it would have hit, i was shot while i waited for my grenade to leave the wall, sure if id played better and not been stupid that wouldnt have happened, but still id like to know if it should be at all

[dawn spoke]

they used S3 to do a lot of testing for S4. I think it payed in dividends

[royal pier]

RPG:
+Instant detonation
+Range
+Fairly wide AoE
-Long draw
-Long stow
-Long reload
-30 second CD
=100 Damage

Frags:
-Not instant
+2 charges
+20 second CD
+149(150 if directly standing on it) Damage
+Universal
+Sound often covered by other noises
+No indicator

Discord: RPG is the problem. Frags are balanced.

[grave zodiac]

If they want to balance rpg to make it a destruction gadget just make it do like only 50 damage, but SPEED UP ITS GOD DAMN RECHARGE TIME. The thing is basically only used because it's heavies only real ranged burst damage option outside of frags and the KS.
Also, please for all that is holy buff c4. It's so bad, it's just worse rpg. Give 2 of them, reduce cooldown time, something please

[royal pier]

Heavy already has a ton of destruction options. I'd rather it have a very small radius so that it's a skill shot, then up the dmg to like 120.

[grave zodiac]

That's basically how it is right now. It does like 100 damage on direct hit but anything else is a crapshoot

[charred onyx]

While we are at the topic of rpg, i have this idea that maybe it should deal damage in a conical way. The round that it fires it a heat/shaped charge so maybe it should deal some splash damage like 50-100 with a lot of dropoff and the main stream should deal more damage 70-140. It could also add effects like setting objects/targets on fire. Also longer reload and handling speed are a must.

Let me know what do you guys think.

[slate mulch]

Give us some fun gadgets in season 5, like doraemon's bamboo copter or changing the skin of gateway to anywhere door 😂

[grave zodiac]

Please don't nerf the speed any more, thing already has a once a year cooldown

[blissful steppe]

Anyone know the zoom ratio / fov multiplier of red dot sights?

[shell sonnet]

Rpg:
-an enemy missing is not up to you

Frag:
-an enemy missing is up to you

Thats pretty much it
People generally are way less frustrated at something they can reasonably avoid by applying skill

[royal pier]

Ah yes, it's so easy to avoid a small rock that often has its sound covered by other noise in a game where there's destruction causing dust clouds frequently.

[shell sonnet]

Which just so happens to be the only part where people frequently complain about frags
Hence they ask for better audio ques or an indicator

If they get to actually react and play around them, its fine to them

[royal pier]

I mean, my point was that I want those things. Though, I think a CD increase is also fair.

[shell sonnet]

A CD increase would do nothing to fix these issues though

Its the same issue we had with winch and model
The issue is still there
It just happens marginally less often

[royal pier]

I mean visual indicator (even if it's just a highlight to start) + a 25 sec CD would go a long way imo.

[shell sonnet]

How does a longer CD fix the issue of them not making noise and being "invisible" at times

[royal pier]

Are you missing the part where they add a visual indicator?

[vale obsidian]

they did?

[shell sonnet]

No, i read that
But why slap a longer CD on it then?

[royal pier]

Because nade spam is bad?

Also, why is Pyro Nade on 30s with one stack, when frags get 2 at 20s?

[spare scaffold]

nade spam would be the issue still a longer cd just makes is less frequent.To get rid of nade spam u would have to reduce the ammount you can hold at a time or dont give it to all classes(imo its fine when all classes have it)

[vale obsidian]

i think nade are in a good place

[spare scaffold]

i agree

[vale obsidian]

indicator is already a big nerfs

[shell sonnet]

Same
||with the exception of mentioned readability||

Indicators would be pretty harsh though
Id rather just have them make a high pitch noise on hitting something thats incredibly hard to drown out

[restive plover]

Or something like what glitch grenades do while in flight.

[shell sonnet]

Couldnt imagine what they might to besides a whoosh noise
But that would probably be drowned or feel out of place if it isnt

[shell sonnet]

I rarely see any complaints about that
There are probably more people complaining about the lack of readability

[spare scaffold]

If they would add a indicator it shouldnt be like u get a line or smt that points to the frag directly but add like a text popupwarning frag near or anything like that.that leaves enought time to react since i have many enemys just stand there where the first frag hit them and take the second one too💀

[restive plover]

Make it sound like a firecracker. It already sparks, just add the noise.

[shell sonnet]

And thats because they have lingering aoe damage
While frags only deal a single instance of damage
||which you can get away from, wait out the explosion, and re-engage with very little downtime||

If you had 2 pyro/gad nades you could make a cashout completely inaccessable

So they must have a longer cooldown and are not allowed to stack

[restive plover]

I think making aps not garbage anymore and restoring dome duration would also be helpful in dealing with grenades being annoying.

[spare scaffold]

Like you said aps has to be buffed since it takes dmg from absorbing it has been straight garbage.the taking dmg is fine but then u would need to increase its health

[restive plover]

It really didn't need nerfing at all. If it has to be reduced from the original version, give it a lower fire rate for grenade destruction or a maximum uptime or something like that.

[shell sonnet]

Then were back to item counters
"Dont like [this] just use [that]"
And people need to "waste" slots on items they dont like

Obviously we cant make everyone happy
But i do think that audio changes would be enough
And it avoids the frustrations of having to use 1/3rd of yoir gadgets for something thats not fun to the user

[royal pier]

I'd be fine with 1 frag with 20s CD.

[spare scaffold]

like i said a fix would be to reduce the ammount but still i think frags are fine how they are rn

[restive plover]

I mean it's gadget v gadget, I think it's fine. Data reshaper also exists now.

There's also more counterplay than that, you can outright destroy the turret with gunfire or play around it's small radius.

[royal pier]

You won't think that after facing a MMM team where all 3 have them.

[spare scaffold]

i do regularly and its totaly fine bc against a player whit above average movement its hard to hit them whit frags

[restive plover]

Simply nerf the model and make mmm unviable.

[royal pier]

Or me on Heavy with frags and RPG.

[spare scaffold]

same thing movement diff

[royal pier]

It'd be a shame if there was a critical part of the game that required 7-8 seconds of standing perfectly still.

[shell sonnet]

It did need the nerfs
Cl and mgl users could just not do anything
||that resonably allows them to actually win a fight||

And a maximum uptime with unlimited interceptions would add that right back
Basically forcing a gl user to just go afk or twidde their thumbs until its gone

That being said, i wouldnt mind a small increase in projectiles intercepted though

[spare scaffold]

and it would be a shame if that part is designed as so gadgets like frags can defend a objektive oh noo🫣

[royal pier]

Id like players to have to be more clever than "throw frags."

And we're back to "well just use APS" AKA MMM meta.

[spare scaffold]

well just shooting isnt any better then and since its a casual game things like this are very good

[royal pier]

Bullets can be blocked with goo nades/barricades. Those things are basically giant beacons that say "yeet frags here"

[restive plover]

Both gls suck so nothing of value is lost.

Although cl40 could absolutely win a fight by landing grenades outside the radius, damaging both the turret and the user. Mgl doesn't have that but it could actually be a gadget with minimal changes.

And if it really has to accommodate these, simply make it not target primary weapon fire. We did it for throwing knives, simple.

[royal pier]

Gadgets that hard counter primary weapons shouldn't be a thing.

[shell sonnet]

Being gadget vs gadget is specifically the problem
You need to use [xyz] to reducw frustrations surrounding it
Throw away your inventory for items you may not find fun, just to be less annoyed
||and you cant have it available and active at all times anyways||

Id much rather have everything be balanced by itself and have everything be only a slight edge in fighting something else

[royal pier]

APS is still good. Especially since you can pick it up to heal it. Problem is, they nerfed dome, which is Heavy's version of projectile protection.

I don't mind soft counters when it comes to gadgets. Old APS was just "you lose now nade launcher user haha."

[restive plover]

I mean I never said we shouldn't also add an indicator to grenades. Rebuffing aps and dome is just something else that should be done.

[royal pier]

Medium really shouldn't hog all the counter gadgets. They have APS, Glitch Trap, Data Reshaper, and Demat also bypasses defenses like barricades in doorways.

That ain't support. That's overwhelming offense and defense if you set up MMM well.

[shell sonnet]

They can put in work and are incredibly fun
That tells me you either never used them, are not good with them and dont care, or are generally biast against them and want them to suck
If you really think "nothing of value is lost", then there are no other explainations

Hitting the aps from outside the radius has been an argument even before the changes to it
Its not enough
It takes around 2-3 grenades to destroy aps this way
These shots deal minimal damage to any players inside its radius
You are lucky if you can even kill the user with your last grenades
More importantly, it increases ttk for cl even more because the first few grenades deal so little damage
It basically turns you into a free kill for any decent player

And if it really has to accommodate these, simply make it not target primary weapon fire. We did it for throwing knives, simple

Why didnt you say that to begin with?
I couldnt care less if it only did this, sure go ahead

[bright girder]

get a better anti cheat

[spare scaffold]

these things can also block frags

[royal pier]

If the enemy forgets that they can toss them over, I guess?

[royal pier]

The explosion damage changes would also make of APS even more broken I'm pretty sure.

[vale obsidian]

i've been maining cl40 since open beta and all i can say is i just want it to reward direct more cus rn just hitting splash is good enough most of the time
(not enough punishment for missing)

[vale obsidian]

this would be a nerf tho so i'll give it a bonus damage on gatgid/deployable
(the line is based off gut feeling btw)

change the hit maker volume based on damage would be nice too

[shell sonnet]

I think ive mentioned this before, but i cant remember

What prevents it from being just a worse model if both go for direct hits, while one is hitscan and the other a projectile

[vale obsidian]

i know this is kindda selfish but i like it being worst model

[shell sonnet]

I wouldnt :/

Maybe if model were nerfed to not 2-shot mediums
And cl were buffed to be able to do that
At the cost of a higher skill floor due to projectile

[vale obsidian]

when you ask me "what do you want cl40 to be" then, i want it to be a specilase utility weapon

[shell sonnet]

People do actually want to get kills though

Utility based weapons probably wont end up in a good spot
Flamethrower has decent utility
But its so painful to use against heavies

[vale obsidian]

i mean i can't argu with that
a utility weapon/tool isn't meant to kills anyways

[shell sonnet]

Which is the problem
Because people want to get kills

Weapons should not exist with utility as main focus, because it denies them the "basic need" ||if i may call it that,|| of a shooter

Weapons should be designed to kill
With possibly utility added on

Matter does this wonderfully
It performs perfectly fine as a gun
But its also the best way to breach walls without using a gadget slot
If you can get down with it, it frees up a slot for other things

I run breach/bore on all my light loadouts, except the one i run matter on

[vale obsidian]

well i did say it going to be a full on utility tool
i only nerf the splash damage and give it a bonus damage vs deployable
and nothing done to damage vs players

its still the same gun combat wise just need to hit cleaner shot

[shell sonnet]

Which makes it inferior to model it virtually every way that matters
Basically killing it as a viable option

Utility is not enough to offset that
||and likely wouldnt be a very fun balancing aspect either||

[vale obsidian]

well i guess that idea busted

now i have to find another way of nerfing splash damage and rework that pessky self damage

[shell sonnet]

What about this then?

[vale obsidian]

oh yeah that
i can see it working well but idk

[shell sonnet]

Harder to pull off, more reward if you do

Though i must admit
It would probably need a few tweaks if we did that

Like projectile speed

And it feels like it would loose its identity because splash has always been a core factor

Balancing it away from that could be weird

[vale obsidian]

nah never touch projectile speed lol
ive have such good muscle memory with it i don't want proj speed to mess me up

[shell sonnet]

Might also end up in a ks situation where its really fast, but not quite hitscan
Throwing people off

[covert parcel]

increasing CD just creates third party meta

wait

[vale obsidian]

it sound good but i just know something will mess this balance up

[covert parcel]

this

[shell sonnet]

Not really create, more like make it worse

3rd party meta wont be fixed until we actually make more 2 team modes ||imo||

[covert parcel]

nah that would actually make sense & appeal to new players. embark clearly doesnt want 2 team cash to get new players

[shell sonnet]

||rip quick cash||

[covert parcel]

make a new one
5v5 "Mega Cash"

[vale obsidian]

pulling up on 2 team that have 0 cd and all hurt will always be storge

im 99% sure i spell that wronge

[shell sonnet]

I was a bit pissy the other day and just started writing stuff down

I have like 7 reasons already why having more than 2 teams is a bad idea

[vale obsidian]

i wanna see

[covert parcel]

3v3v3, 5v5, & 3v3v3v3

We have Quick Cash for 3v3v3
We have >nothing< for 5v5 (despite being a hit with powershift, doesnt have signature gamemode w it - ok embark)
We have Cashout/WT/Ranked for 3v3v3v3

[shell sonnet]

Just woke up
Ill post it after breakfast

[covert parcel]

yall aint up up?

[vale obsidian]

im bouta go to bed

[covert parcel]

bro

[shell sonnet]

Powershift is awesome
But it just plays too different

[covert parcel]

yeah, its a hit with the casuals

a TWO team gamemode

embark signature gamemode, cash - DOESNT have a two team variant

then wonders why "why dont casuals stay with the game?!"

im geuinely willing to bet money if embark adds 2 team cash variant the player count will be better than without it

[shell sonnet]

1. 3rd parties
   you just fought a team, won, and are trying to steal
   during which the 3rd team comes in after camping, with full numbers, health, ammo and all cooldown items, with which they just instantly crush you without any real effort
   pretty self explanatory
   // this just doesn't happen in 2 team mode because both teams will use their items during the fighting
   so there wont be one team that just suddenly comes in with massive material advantage

2. dog fights
   after a vault gets takes, sometimes 1 team runs off with it and the other 2 teams keep fighting eachother
   this is often frustrating and feels like youre fighting over nothing, as you cant just ignore the enemy shooting you, but the objective is currently running away (or even already started at the cashout)
   // if there were only 2 teams, then the enemy team would be split, leaving the enemy trying to do this at a number disadvantage, making it easier to fight back and far less frustrating to experience

3. positioning
   this may be best explained with an example (the following happened on skyway stadium:)
   orange was set up in open office, my team was coming from estate
   i tried to flank, see if i can get some damage in from afar
   when suddenly, pink pushes in from business office and kills me
   // in 5v5 this would either not have happened, or at least give opportunity for punishment
   if you know the enemy is set up somewhere, you can try to flank
   the enemy might also be active on the flank to try and prevent this, but in doing so, leaves their defending teammates at a number disadvantage, giving it greater risk/reward
   ||and since flanking is less risky and more rewarding, light might actually be viable if this were competitive||

[sacred cypress]

is that a new shotgun in the season 5 leak?

[shell sonnet]

this also happens the other way around
where 2 attacking teams tear eachother apart and the defender doesnt need to do anything and wins
no matter what happens, someone is getting a free win and everyone else is frustrated
||which is made even worse by the fact that it punishes only those that actually had effort in fighting and trying to play the game||

and depending on how you feel about the game, it might actually ruin the fun of the winner, because it can feel undeserved

5. spawns
   with more than 2 teams, to be fair to everyone, the game needs to reuse spawns
   which then leads to people spawning on your team
   // in 2 team modes you can just give every team 1 half of the map and spawn them there, solving this issue

6. win ratio
   with more teams, there are less winners
   in 3v3v3, only 33% of the players will win
   // meanwhile with only 2 teams, 50% of people will win

7. teammates
   in a 3 player team, 1 guy being bad or using a meme weapon makes up 33% of your team
   // in 5 player teams, its only 20%, thus making it less punishing

also works the other way around
// a single enemy thats way too good for your level has way less impact with big team sizes
making teams more balanced

9. teamplay
   // with more people playing together, you have more people to play off of, cover your weakness and synergies with
   which should be more fun

10. amount of enemies
    if you own the cashout, all enemies want you dead
    it basically puts you into a 3v6 situation (even if half of them dont coordinate)
    // this also just doesn't happen in 5v5 because there are only 2 teams of equal size

11. lastly, ratting kills
    you damage someone, and an enemy kills them
    you get 0 credit
    // also just doesnt happen in 5v5, since all enemy kills can only happen through your team, making sure you get at least an assist

a somewhat minor point but still a reason

thats all i could think of until now (turns out i had a bit more than 7)
ranging from pretty minor, to game breaking and fun ruining

if you got any others, please tell me inferno

[vale obsidian]

i don't tbh
or one actually, its the fact that 2 team can distract each other while the 3rd go res everyone back up to full or do objective

leaving those 2 team fighting to lose cus the game are won by objective and not kill

[shell sonnet]

probably falls under 4.
but either way, that should be more than enough reasons to at least give 5v5 more attention than its getting now

[covert parcel]

to be fair it would be harder to get all 5 players on board to play a certain way rather than all 3 players to play a certain way

also, it would be funny to see regardless, which is what this game thrives on

also a single counter deletes their entire 5 stack of said item

"erm 5 turrets wouldnt be fun so no because i dont liek anything new, let the player count just keep dropping 🤓 "

not yo usepcifically but people dont want anythign new

like i dont get it, the player count is dropping and embark needs to make a move - then any time a person suggests something new "no dont do anything new"

[covert parcel]

nah thats something new, surely players dont want that. just keep changing the meta, surely that will get new players to stay with the game who only experience light meta

def dont add new things in an attempt to retain a casual playerbase that would make too much sense

[shell sonnet]

Would kinda go hard tbh
||might be too close to powershift though||

[mint hemlock]

hello chat what weapons are good rn i haven't played in a while

[shell sonnet]

To put emphasis on the main point im trying to make
||while still offering other concerns and points||

^like this

[mint hemlock]

or just use parentheses

[shell sonnet]

Meh
Feels more distinct this way

Not as much of a word salad

[mint hemlock]

any tbh me and my buddies fluctuate a lot

[crisp heart]

Any weapon/gadget/spec predictions for S5 yet?

[normal ice]

M11 and SH1900 are also considerable

[royal thicket]

jetpack for medium

[mint hemlock]

thanks everyone i appreciate the help 💕

[crisp heart]

Mix with the jump pad and watch them fly

[vale obsidian]

blast/kock back nade

[ashen hawk]

yea well i saw ppl saying theres double barrel shotgun, as shown in that splash screen reveal, but if ya look closely its a triple barrel

and prob for meds as ppl said cuz its the only class with one shotgun

[ashen hawk]

damn thats deep

[crisp heart]

Oh no

[covert parcel]

shotguns, more shotguns

[midnight hedge]

You want more shotguns? 💀

[covert parcel]

no its just the meta

[midnight hedge]

Ah ok

[covert parcel]

breakout was SA12 & Model

[midnight hedge]

It looks like light is getting another one next season 😭

[covert parcel]

another not-automatic added to the game great

[normal ice]

KotH is awesome and would be far preferable than the silly cashout gimmicks, to me anyway

[shell sonnet]

We can just mix it too
Koth but you steal a cashout instead of capturing a zone

[dawn spoke]

Oddball visa vis halo would be sick. Just hold on to the vault, not allowed to use gadgets while holding on to curb grapple

[normal ice]

5v5 cashout is fine by me lol

[dawn spoke]

5v5 cashout would be fun af

[shell sonnet]

Yeah

[dawn spoke]

i just want one more 5v5 mode. powershift can be fun but the open air objective leads to some unfun fights and TA is...TA

[shell sonnet]

Its so close to the stuff we already have too

[shell sonnet]

We just need 5v5 that actually plays like our usual modes
5v5 cashout would be perfect

TA has health limitations, item limitations and no respawns
(Alongside different pacing)

And PS often ends up with a ton of people (+aps, barricade and goo) on the point that you cant push into
When it is even accessable and not 20 meters of the ground
And with it moving and being very spammy if you own it just makes it feel so different

[timid sedge]

Hii

I need attention 😭 I’m sad and upset and annoyed and UGH I NEED ATTENTION

[dawn spoke]

#🥚┇off-topic

[shut bane]

ok so mgl32 model altering skin and direct hit detonation buff when

[normal ice]

been wishing for both these things since S1

MGL is my preferred kind of playstyle but is just dogshit rn

especially compared to Deagles doing 88 a pop

[shut bane]

deagles are just the best all rounder for heavies

it'd be nice if the grenades didnt bounce off enemies when they hit them directly i think

[normal ice]

exactly

And it deserves a little more damage imho. Makes no sense it should take 4 grenades to kill a Medium

[shut bane]

with the buff maybe a projectile velocity change as well to make it faster, and maybe 3 with at least one direct hit or really close explosion but I do agree with 4 for a medium generally, itd be a nightmare in cqc

[normal ice]

Even just 85 damage would be fine. It does self-damage, so 3 shotting Medium isn't as free as it sounds

[shut bane]

yeah but the self damage is much more minimal compared to the cl40 i think lol

[normal ice]

true

idk there's lots of directions they could take it

they just better do something besides increase reload speed... 😐

[shut bane]

yeah, i do think it should still retain its wallbouncing uses

[normal ice]

Of course

That's the funnest part. It adds unique strategy

[covert parcel]

starting a cult, im handing out applications

[normal ice]

sign me up lol

[covert parcel]

repost the image in feedback & whereever embark sees

[boreal laurel]

TBF it would be hard to add another automatic weapon that wouldn’t feel like a clone of an existing weapon

[shut bane]

the m26 mass is literally better than the model rn wtf lol if not on par

shit is way more fun on a dash build as well