suggestion-discussion

[mossy ruin]

the triple shot works at 0, puts u back to max and you can commt the three fast shots or cancel and keep full quiver, maybe not intended but worked

idk if it was sarcasm or not

or was that a recent change it it was op? and you think it needs reverted?

agreed if thats the case, this was my first playtest

[smoky yoke]

imo it should work if you have the arrows loaded already

[mossy ruin]

it works either way

but it does reload them if at 0

[sweet blaze]

can confirm

[mossy ruin]

or do you mean only work

then agreed

it should be that way, is op

[smoky yoke]

yes

[sweet blaze]

I kind of feel like it should still reload some arrows on use but not full quiv

[smoky yoke]

ranger if mastered, has many advantages in very open field
like in very open spaces

[mossy ruin]

its good burst tbh, its just too good

why would a ranged class have burst like that, imo unnecessary

kiting isa counter to burst

[smoky yoke]

maybe keeping but with lower damage

and fixing the reload issue cause it auto refills arrow somehow 🤔

[mossy ruin]

then theres the shotgun skill too lol, never tried it myself idk if its relevant

[smoky yoke]

and ive seen that ranger traps dont affect ranger himself?
like does he can walk to his own traps without being trapped?

[sweet blaze]

The burst is really insane with longbows but it's not all that much of a gamechanger with other bows, still incredibly good and worth using but it's certainly not busted in any way

[mossy ruin]

I am not sure, I think rangers can hit own trap, Im pretty sure I did

[shy pollen]

Rangers can step in their own traps

[smoky yoke]

ah okok

[fickle gorge]

Idk why i keep seeing people talk about this. I 100% stepped on my own trap before

[faint dirge]

The 5x shot does this too btw

[faint dirge]

Not at all

Way too easy to dodge

Like small but long ways are nice

Chokepoints are insane

Easy as fuck to hold

Trap are op there to support and defend u

But in big rooms with a lot of space in every direction arrowd are pretty easy to dodge

[brittle oracle]

yea honestly sometimes id find my self having trouble hitting arrows in a hallway that didnt have any obstructions obvi some of that is me being bad but also good movement from the enemy i found my self trying to only fight in smal spaces but not too small so id be able to runn if i get rushed. also at some point during this play test the quick attack ability did less damge somewhere around like 20-30% less than normal arrow but then later in the play test the damage wasnt different.

also didnt even notice the long bow nerf

[wary flower]

Arrows actually have a noticeable delay, so when you shoot at someone that is actively dodging feels more like a bet than actual skill >/<

That being said, there's people that excel at betting!

[red jewel]

Triple shot and shotgun arrows want a word with you

[burnt cove]

Yeah the triple arrows in one shot at close range is really silly. Rangers have so many ways of never having to use a melee weapon which makes it too easy to play

[agile marsh]

guys how to download this game?ù

[tired osprey]

Wait for the next playtest.

[agile marsh]

ok thx

[lucid root]

Next test it's going to re-download the entire game so might as well uninstall it right?

[tired osprey]

Not sure on that element, may just update with a large file.

[lucid root]

What you guys think about winter maps, like a first level floor would still be cold so frost on the stone walls and floor, zombies are frozen to the floor, some cold environment themed enemies like snow trolls

[tired osprey]

Interesting but it needs a classical fantasy uniqueness to it.

[lucid root]

What are some examples?

[junior hawk]

It will be a huge disadvantage for the rogues, no?
The brighter the map, the less opportunities to sneak behind after all

[lucid root]

Bright?

Why would the map be brighter, you mean the frost reflecting more light?

[junior hawk]

Won't a winter map have ice and stuff? which is of lighter color

[lucid root]

Maybe some ice, it'll just be cold mostly. Frost, seeing your breath in front of you

[junior hawk]

Oh, I like the idea with the breath

[lucid root]

Zombies can't move but they explode with gas when you kill them

[tired osprey]

Modern fantasy would do pure glass like ice wonderlands, but we could have perhaps rock, stone ad gravel mixed with trodden preserved plants and dead grass. Frost is encrusted on every wall. Your breath is as thick as clouds as the heat and energy is drawn out of you by the surrounding air, occasional gusts of winds come racing down blowing out any standing torches that they pass by. Snow bleached corpses lie entombed in the ground as well as walls where not even undeath can free them, in the dark tunnels the ice gives off only the reflections of banshees who stalk the shadows when upon seeing any would adventurers they unleash ear drum busting screeches that temporarily deafen those who hear it and causes severe damage. On the rare occasion a yeti may cross you and as long as you do not anger it with fire for if you do it will rip to you shreds.

[lucid root]

I like the howling wind through the dungeon

Creepy vibes

[tired osprey]

Torches could be few and far between and making taking torches all the more important especially against howling winds which will snuff out any torch you hold in your hand.

[lucid root]

The mage mobs use ice spells instead of fireball

The current ice spells suck though

[junior hawk]

snuffing out torches sound like bad game design in my opinion

And making the whole map pitch black doesn't sound fun with few lights

[junior hawk]

I agree

so slow...

and small

[tired osprey]

I didn't say pitch black, I mentioned few and far between perhaps more subtle lighting like dim glowing blue ice or refractive light from the moon also very few things are inherently bad game design.

[junior hawk]

Well, arguing in a idea that doesn't exist is kinda pointless. You can be both right and wrong.
I currently like how the current map is bright but has a few spots that are totaly dark.
Without knowing how bright the map will be, is hard to judge.
My take was that the current map uses more dark colors for walls and such. So in my mind, a winter map filled with ice would be a disadvantage for the sneaky guy's. But as I don't know if it will be possible be brighter or the same, I can't judge

[tired osprey]

A solid statement and one I cannot disagree with inherently, maybe just I wanted to argue that to make up for the natural brighter colour palette of a ice map the change to more natural darkness would be an interesting change of pace compared to the other map and balance out the natural increased difficulty for stealth. But what I imagine and what you imagine for a winter tomb themed map will be different so that I understand.

[lucid root]

I'm thinking second floor would be no ice as you go deeper underground

[tired osprey]

Maybe Norwegian tombs could inspire the look of the 2nd floor.

[lucid root]

Or not, keep it all the same theme, just thinking in terms of ground temperature as you go down

Like some nord stuff from skyrim

[tired osprey]

Ye but maybe a lot less fantastical.

[lucid root]

If we're doing dwarf races it could be dwarf themed, dug too deep and unleashed some evil like the mines of moria

[spice pawn]

think devs already stated it with adding only basic weapons thus far, but I'm looking forward to more mace weapons for cleric (all the flail-type weapons, war picks, spiked hammers, different sized warhammers w/ different attack pattern advantages) -- let's not forget the "big ass wooden clubs" from Elden Ring

[prisma acorn]

What do you think about the suggestion of being able to craft your own portal from the souls of three or four players that you have slain in that round? i thought it was a good suggestion but got downvoted. i wonder why

[glacial bridge]

if teammates are split up and one dies, the whole point of a soul is to retrieve it

people looting them breaks the intent

[spice pawn]

thing is, the devs introduced some slick and unique concepts thus far that probably wouldn't been down-voted to oblivion if some random reddit thread had pitched the idea long before DnD was even an early playtest.

there's probably something there that's spiritually aligned with what you've touched on- which is to give more uses for soul hearts aside from friendly altar revivals. I'm thinking hostile usage (Warlock,Necro,Artificer, etc.)

[glacial bridge]

if you kill 3 people in pvp, getting a blue portal is a non-issue. doesnt need solving

[opal sparrow]

Gotta love a community that bounce back ideas, I could feel that I would be in this discord server for awhile

[tired osprey]

I like the fact they have stayed with solidly grounded melee and ranged weapons from medieval times and I hope they if they do add any more fantastical weapons they stay on the legendary or Unique rarities.

[lucid root]

It could potentially be useful? Taking it into hell/infernal

[opal sparrow]

Oh wait Aritificer is already a decided class?

[tired osprey]

Bard is, not sure on Artificer being from 5e and more modern fantasy idea pools.

[glacial bridge]

only bard is confirmed

Paladin, Warlock, Druid, Artificer, Monk have been hinted at

[spice pawn]

Yeah, it doesn't sound like they'll knee-jerk to overly pander to the loudest portions of player-base reactions, so all we have to do is wait for their vision to finish building itself up. (like folks have said plenty of times, probably in good hands seeing the tests so far)

My guess is they'll save the really unique items for much closer to prime-time release. Was watching Cohh play Balduer's Gate, and saw a unique crossbow that didn't need bolts, and always fired enchanted flaming magic bolts. There'll probably be more unique stuff like that later

[opal sparrow]

Oh! well Im glad I posted it on suggestions then, wouldnt want a suggestion be redundant

[lucid root]

I thought druid was confirmed too or no

[spice pawn]

or like some unique anti-shock armor that has a graphical lightning elemental pulse (visual) on the body armor or something so you know they've got that unique on

[lucid root]

Rubber suit 👌

[tired osprey]

They might do him, I hope they do but fitting a dude who can turn into a (wait can we swear or is that auto censored?) Bear! in a tight dungeon will be interesting.

[spice pawn]

I love the idea of a utility-belt focused artificer. potion grenadier

[tired osprey]

I like artificers being basically field alchemists and not just gun guys.

[spice pawn]

not all of the obvious neon/glowing potion colors have been taken, yet- so there should be plenty of room to add some more utility categories

[opal sparrow]

My suggestion for that is becoming a subclass called Alchemist or something

[lucid root]

Like a job system or somethin

[opal sparrow]

Speaking of will there be subclasses?

The higher your lvl i mean

[tired osprey]

Maybe through the skill tree.

[spice pawn]

my initial thought was that I hope they stay away from gun hit-scan, but with the windlass crossbow and high-end longbows, spiritually we're almost there anyways

[tired osprey]

The fact when I first reloaded a windlass crossbow I had to crank it made me fill a small amount of joy.

[spice pawn]

but hopefully they don't design in a sky-high flick-shot skill ceiling so that the game gets dominated by shroud-players

[tired osprey]

Maybe they go with the idea of some ranged stuff being hit-scan and others being kinetic for bows and crossbows.

[lucid root]

The only things that should be instant are lightning spells I think

Is there a projectile holy spell?

[spice pawn]

should be able to buy holy water in a vial that you can throw at undead

or even pre-buff by lathering your own weapons with a bottle of it as a consummable (Witcher lore as an example)

[lucid root]

Mmm ignited AND poisoned rondel

[spice pawn]

Ignite works extremely well with the current targeting/self cast system. just needs tuning before prime time after all the other systems have been built out

item system/magic modifiers still feel like stand-in placeholder values

[half cobalt]

Escape from Tarkov's latest patch/wipe is widely regarded as a massive disappointment. Game audio is in the worst state it's ever been, after two previous patches attempting to fix it, they've actually made it worse. Frames and FPS are terrible. Cheaters have not been curbed at all. The AI is broken. Queu times are 10-30 minutes depending on the faction you play. Game breaking bugs with the karma system. The "Twitch Drops" event has been regarded as a massive failure, with players watching for 12~ hours to get a screwdriver or a can of dehydrated meat.

I say all of this to suggest an earlier release for Dark and Darker. Whether people admit or or not,** there is overlap in the fan base.** This is evidenced by the top Tarkov streamers enjoying Dark and Darker during it's playtest. Pestily, General Sam, etc.

Strike while the iron is hot, strike while Tarkov, the only competition for D&D is at it's weakest point in years. Don't give them a year to recover.

[tired osprey]

A solid suggestion but the devs don't seem like they want to fight with tarkov for players?

[bitter stratus]

Devs already said game is slotted for release later this year I dont see them suddenly deciding to put it out as early access. Just give it the time it needs to cook

[lucid root]

I thought the leader boards were already based by server

[tired osprey]

I think they were universal?

[bitter stratus]

it was across all the servers afaik.

leaderboards were put into the playtests for added fun according to the devs

no guarantee theyll keep em later on but they said they were thinking about what to do about them, if anything

[lucid root]

I heard a couple people say it was server based but idk

It felt a little too easy getting into the top 100s

[white cliff]

Tarvoc is broken, so my idea is to release an unfinished game to compete with it! Interesting take….

[glacial bridge]

people will find anything they can use as evidence to justify their predetermined conclusion

[deft sequoia]

the quality of suggestions got better. but some people are stil out of their damn minds.

[lucid root]

Vaulting?!

[deft sequoia]

vaulting as in, using it to boost?

sorry i'm not familiar with the term

[mystic sundial]

Im curious why people are against trading between alts, we've got the functionality already, how would you stop that from happening in practice? =p

[deft sequoia]

because it means making alt as a storage and letting you hoard items

[mystic sundial]

Having a hard time to see how you're gonna stop friends from trading, without literally banning trading, or making the fees outrageously high

My point is, you can in effect already do that

[deft sequoia]

you can stil make alts to hoard but not letting you out right trade makes it less desireable to hoard

[mystic sundial]

any serious player would just have a 2nd account to middleman, i'm just suggesting to let you transfer one item for the same fee you'd pay to trade it twice =p

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Craftable portals are for sore losers.
You either get lucky with portal spawns or you take a down portal if there are no blues.

[mystic sundial]

agree 😄 stakes should be high, no hiding in the corner and hoping to escape

[rough elm]

Mhm having some a rare/unlikely way to escape the dungeon besides escape/down portals would be nice

[glacial bridge]

ide only be interested in a trap portal that sends you down unexpectedly a layer

[rough elm]

This is scuffed idea but something like u could buy a special vial from alchemist for 50 gold which would take 4 slots (Just a big magical bottle) and u could put dead player hearts into it and slowly fill it (would take 20 hearts approx to fully fill it) and if u have enough u could either summon a portal which would take longer than putting a campfire , or u could bring it back and do something with it maybe a quest for alchemist , potion creation ? , enchanting ?

[tired osprey]

20, their are only 16 players in a match.

Or do you fill over multiple matches.

[rough elm]

Yeah that's why it's scuffed because not sure if you could refill after you escape or it's only one time thing

[glacial bridge]

the point of player hearts is to retrieve an ally. if enemies loot them then it defeats the reason they were implemented in the first place

[quasi fulcrum]

Kind of like a piggy bank

[tired osprey]

Perhaps redirect the resource from players to enemies like the wraith where you get a Phantasmal essence which can be used with a catalyst you buy from the alchemist for a short lived blue portal. Phantasmal Essence drop 25%, catalyst 10 gold cost from alchemist.

[rough elm]

Mhmm that could work

[tired osprey]

@bitter sail They already do drop loot, and they did during the last playtest.

[bitter sail]

Really? I swear in all my runs I never noticed once, guess I just didn’t look close enough then

[tired osprey]

Most likely you kept getting silver coins which on the floor are near invisible.

But they can drop goblets and plates and candelabras.

[faint comet]

Yall think you should beable to have one of each character or be limited to say 3 for example like other games

[mystic sundial]

no reason to not let people play all classes, you'd be forcing people to give up 80% of the game's gameplay :p

[glacial bridge]

you talking about someone having 3 Rangers on their roster?

with Multi/Subclassing then theres a reason behind it. just dont allow them to transfer items and use it as a mule for gear

[tired osprey]

I prefer to be able to make multiple characters, especially if they add characters with unchangeable skill-tree choices.

[white cliff]

Lie detector said that, this was a lie.

[marble musk]

Buff fireball, it doesn’t do enough damage. Chain lightning needs to go through walls too

[glacial bridge]

i think similar when i wake up. but then NA wakes up and the suggestions turn into trolly dogshit

[marble musk]

My bad

Sorry that jokes are unacceptable, I do love the game

[glacial bridge]

im talking about actual submitted suggestions to vote on. ur good <3

[marble musk]

Ah gotcha ❤️ what did you main during the last play test slate

[glacial bridge]

i got Rogue/Ranger/Wizard/Cleric to 20, Fighter/Barb to like 3-5ish

my brother got Fighter/Barb/Ranger to 20

[marble musk]

Nice, wish I could have played more but I really only got into cleric. Super enjoyable

[glacial bridge]

so we tried most 2 man team comps

[marble musk]

Which ones were balling

[glacial bridge]

tbh all of them if you adjust playstyle to their strengths

the ez mode no brain was double ranger. we just steamrolled

we mostly played Rogue/Barbarian. seemed like the easiest duo to wipe a team of 3 but almost always ended in him rezzing me

[marble musk]

Yeah I can only imagine what a team of two geared rangers does to people

[glacial bridge]

was just getting into the flow of things with wizard when the playtest ended. obviously hes a monster

[marble musk]

Just wizzin on people huh

[lucid root]

Can you crouch jump over spiders?

[full delta]

ye

[tough quartz]

Heyo, I got this message when trying to make a suggestion but I didn't write anything offensive at all so I'm a bit confused: "This can't be posted because it contains content blocked by this community. This may also be viewed by the community owners."

Does anyone know why this happened or is it just a bug

[half cobalt]

some language filters are hyper restrictive, and even words that contain partial bad words might trigger them... like saying "Knight" may get filtered because of the 3 letters in the middle, for example. I haven't heard of any problems in DND with that though, but other games.

[tough quartz]

Huh

Do you think the word "Dragon" would set anything off

I used it alot

Eh I'll just shorten it

[mossy ruin]

I also had this issue with rogue barbarian comp. Barbarian has to commit more and if the rogue follows well he dies. Conversely the rogue can retreat easily and switch to a different fight. I think barbarian rogue is a bad combo tbh

They cant support each other at all, or maybe my partner wasnt in sync with me idk

[loud matrix]

Imagine not being able to write Japanese in a chat because of the first three letters.
I've seen that happen.

[formal raven]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @mkgt#1868 This makes rogue poison passive for everyone, maybe a poison that shows instead of damage. otherwise your taking an ability that is exclusive and giving it to every class

[lusty wren]

90% of the time you dont even have to crouch jump.

[jagged thunder]

BDO filter on xbox was the worst it banned the number 10 and countless other words that had no combination of letters in it that spelled anything disrespectful or offensive. idk how a filter works or how to go about making one, i know that they can be easily ruined by my experience with other games not allowing you to send a message 30 times because you didnt know you couldnt say "took" or something similar

[stark aurora]

GIVE DaD or i will jump!

[idle cape]

give barbarian huge codpiece, bigger

[gray vessel]

Well most people do it wrong, its not about tanking with barbarian. Its about having the mobility class in the lead and when a fight starts the barbarian acts as an unpassable wall while the fast class goes in n out doing poke damage. Then the barbarian can push slowly until either the enemies can deal with it, either by ranged, or by having enough room behind them to leave. OR they get pushed into a bad spot with pve coming in and they have to rush the barbarian which never works

[mossy ruin]

in our experience it was cleric wizard fighter zoom rush me down, or just cleric fighter

[gray vessel]

Yeah that's a tough one. Usually the fighter can beat the barb 1 on 1 with all the buffs, so its down to the rogue to either help kill the fighter and risk being killed by wizard spells, or try to go for a play on the wizard with the assumption that they will have to also kill the cleric else the fight is lost

[mossy ruin]

idk, ran into a lot of cleric fighter, but as soon as we switched off the combo, poof they gone, just unlucky maybe

[lusty wren]

Wiz/Cleric/Barb strongest thing in this game

Just turn the barbarian into a unstoppable force and sit back and chill

[mossy ruin]

Im sure its fine to swap barb and fighter there

[lusty wren]

Barb is just superior for the tactic in every way

[mossy ruin]

But yeah dual wield barb or felling axe with ignite and haste yum

[lusty wren]

ya its crazy

Only thing that team loses to skill for skill is itself

If the other team gets their barb charging first you lose 😄

[white cliff]

Since when did suggestions turn into just making obvious blanket statements. Like how many VOIP suggestions need to be upvoted?

[next wing]

please never add sbmm or solo lobbies bro

[white cliff]

They devs have stated a numerous amount of times that solo lobbies will never be a thing.

[lusty wren]

Nah, this is not quite what they said 😄 They said they are going to experiment with many options and try to find a alternative, before considering solo queue.

Something to that effect anyways, Its in the Pestily interview

So he leaves the door open for it if they cant find something better that works

[white cliff]

If they’re trying everything to avoid it, it’s pretty telling that they don’t want it in their game though, no?

[lusty wren]

Its pretty telling theyd prefer to find a better way which is good. But they did leave the door open

Its definitely not saying "solo lobbies will never be a thing"

[granite plinth]

@wintry forgeDUDE

Are you trolling?

[muted crag]

The danger and potential reward of running into a three man team should always persist.

[glacial bridge]

my bad i lost electricity for 4 hours. what we did was have the rogue play lead and do scouting. he had an option to run away and people are gonna take the bait to follow. If I saw an opportunity, I would assassinate their squishies and while they were panicking to kill me, the barb could close distance and win.

Definitely not a great comp on paper but i think the key is that Barbarian/Fighters dont need to play in front

[lucid root]

Suspense is why we need 1 suggestion per day limit lol

[wintry forge]

I'm not the one trolling.

[wintry forge]

I reported you. Keep the discussion respectful.

[lucid root]

It's true, I'm the problem

Your limb injury idea isn't too bad, there's not really much to fall off of right now though

Surgical kits could heal injuries

[carmine current]

how do people feel about the double dipping on wizard's ignite buff to spell damage? I noticed from my experience in the game that ignite got the benefits from flat magic and flat true magic damage. Then later found out that players were abusing the fact that ignite actually buffed your spell damage. meaning that rolls of flat magic and flat true magic damage were doubling up on every roll, since it was applied once on the ignite and once on the spell itself.
#d-and-d-suggestions message

[white cliff]

Yeah you can’t ignite magic missiles anymore.

[sudden fractal]

did ignite work on spells?

i thought it was just for physical damage

[carmine current]

@sudden fractal I was just watching a video a bit ago that showed a wizard hitting the dummy with ignite on did get increased damage. However it would only work when you applied it to the weapon that was casting the spells, as otherwise it only applied to your main hand. meaning it would not work with crystal ball and only worked on staff, crystal sword, and book.

[white cliff]

It did, it was hot fixed.

[sudden fractal]

ahh i see i see

makes sense

[carmine current]

that being said it appling like that was dumb and it let people double dip flat damage increases to the spells.

so it was very possible to get over 100 damage per magic missile without having insane gear.

[lusty wren]

non issue, suggestion is asking for the hotfix that already occurred 😄

[sudden fractal]

^

[jagged thunder]

they need to lose 3 will and disperse it between +2resourcefulness and +1knowledge imo

[carmine current]

@lusty wren im not sure it was, like i mentioned i watched a video that was just uploaded today of someone showing it off. if you read the hot fix the only mention of the ignite spell is in hotfix 4 saying fixed an issue where ignite could malfunction.

[glacial bridge]

servers are down, its been patched. lets move on

[lusty wren]

Old footage

[ancient briar]

Suggestion from @carmine current is that how ignite and magic damage stacked and buffed the magic missile? I've heard it doesn't

[white cliff]

It was patched like mid play test.

[ancient briar]

Yeah I think so too. I'd notice insane amount of damage with magic missiles right away

[lucid root]

Suggestion warfare going on right now

Ooh yes a buy by quantity specifier

[glacial bridge]

devs already said they were going to add that dont worry

[fickle gorge]

Thank tha lord lol

What about gold stacking more than 10?

[lusty wren]

id rather see a dedicated coin purse

[glacial bridge]

yeah you can stack 50 with a pouch :D

[fickle gorge]

You being serious? This legit?

[lucid root]

Seems like that's a deliberate thing, inventory management/gold sink with the purse

[carmine current]

@halcyon patrol i hope they keep the bags, but then add a item that can spawn in the dungeon that you can take out that lets you hold more gold in it. like you can find a vault that is a 3x3 or something that lets you stash 20 pouches in it or something.

[glacial bridge]

yeah that was already a thing, costs 5 gold to buy a pouch and it holds 50 coins is the current system

[lucid root]

You went the whole test with piles of 10 stacks? 👀

[fickle gorge]

"Whole test" = I only played a handful of games at the end of the most recent test. Friend put me on to the game

[carmine current]

@glacial bridge the issue with that is people like myself had 80% of our stash filled with gold and over 200-300 candy canes. you need to be able to condense it further.

[rough elm]

Prob they need to make bigger pouches or at this point just a bag of gold coins (100)

getting free pouches from questing also could be a good idea

[lucid root]

I think what's going to happen is the main currency for pro players will be something more valuable to taken up less space, like stones of jordan in d2

[carmine current]

@rough elm i dont think the pouches should be free or anything. I like the idea of buying a pouches to store more. However, I think either you should be able to spend even more to condense further or have to find vaults or pouches in the dungeon that can store more

@lucid root that was already the case in the last test. everyone that had to much gold to stash would just by candy canes for 25-30 gold a pop. however it was a pain to trade around since not everyone wanted candy canes

[cold yacht]

I mean what is more iconic in D&D than bags of holding? Just make them rare and let you hold more things inside

[lucid root]

I'll probably be converting my currency to allstat jewelry or something

Then sell it as I need gold

[carmine current]

@lucid root all stats were just not that good. the best rolled jewellery were dual flat damage rolls.

[lucid root]

Well there ya go

[rough elm]

I wonder if silver coins will be more useful or it's just to convert to gold

because they are kinda useless it's not even worth taking them maybe in first dungeon there is going to be much more making them have a purpose for converting to gold i guess

[lucid root]

One ring worth a few hundred gold vs 1 pouch that's only 50 gold, big brain time

[carmine current]

the other issue with that is trying to buy them is a PIA and selling them for the price you want for them was also a PIA. most players when I was trying to sell jewlery would come into the trade and ask if they could buy it for half, and when i said no they just leave.

[carmine current]

also a dual rolled flat damage ring or amulet wasnt a few hundred it was almost a minmum of 900-1k even if it was just +2 to both rolls

[lucid root]

I didn't have trouble selling, but people were pretty willing to part with gold since it was the end of the test

[rough elm]

I will suggest an useless idea add pouch for silvers lol

[carmine current]

if it was something like +5 or +6 to both rolls it would be like 20k gold at least

which then could only be traded for candy canes

[jagged thunder]

did any1 try putting silver in a pouch?

[carmine current]

silver didnt go in pouch. they should just remove silver all together it was a terrible thing to pick up and selling it was cumbersome and boring. i specifically went out of my way to never pick it up

[jagged thunder]

they might have plans for it, or it was just a stress test for inventory items and transfering to npcs

they adressed it in dev qna i dont remember what they said other than they were going to do something about it

[lucid root]

I might have like one or two mules just for gold because it takes up so much damn space, other than that I think I'm just going to do item for item trading when it comes down to it

[jagged thunder]

they arent going to make it easy for you to transfer items between (your) characters so youre gonna have to hit the market

[carmine current]

well when selling all you had to do was post a few times and you would get a trade offer. the issue i was having is everyone in the middle of the test was just so damn stingy with their gold they would come into the trade to then try and haggle down the price to an unacceptable amount. That would happen over and over again. for instance selling a purple longbow for 1k with +3 flat added physical damage, i would constantly get trade requests asking to sell it for 500g, when it was clearly posted to sell for 1k.

[lucid root]

Don't see how it'll be difficult if I have more than one account

[jagged thunder]

why not just party up

[lucid root]

Because I want to throw my money away and buy multiple game copies

Disposable income people

[hearty fractal]

and where you see a problem

[glacial bridge]

ide rather you buy 2 copies than them make that change

[fickle gorge]

you're welcome to buy me one, I'll be your dungeon buddie

[jagged thunder]

i would usually charge 50g under avg what i saw prices or just let ppl make an offer

[carmine current]

well the issue is that i knew what the items were worth. if people want to haggle like 10%-20% or so on the item im fine with that. However, you shouldnt send a trade request asking for 50% off.

[hearty fractal]

why no this is free market

[jagged thunder]

i went off the merchant price first then stats on the item

then whatever outrageous prices i seen on the market id undercut to a realistic price

[lucid root]

When all my mule stashes are full, the firesale begins, you get half off, you get half off!

[carmine current]

sure, but then i have to wait to repost the item and other that try to send trade requests wont be able to actually trade. if you want items for cheap, then look for cheap items. if the price is already posted and your asking for half off, then its out of your price range.

[hearty fractal]

and still dont see a point

if you dont have lose time on market just dont sell anything

[rough elm]

many ppl suggested this but they just need to add filters like: Weapons - Bows - Longbow - which rarity - and approx between how much seller is selling

[jagged thunder]

cm needs filter and not allow people to list items in different listing channels keep armor to armor etc

maybe filter out item types

[lucid root]

If you put everything in one channel though the filter does the work

[jagged thunder]

thats true you can just wait on what your looking for or ask in the channel

just puts an end to the top channels spamming

[rough elm]

but to be fair if i was playing in a group 1k for 3+ flat damage (Bow , or any epic weapon) is definitely correct price but since i'm playing solo that 1k price does not seem like a good price knowing very well that u can run into 3 group teams and just die and u just like well shit i just lost 1k gold

[lucid root]

Damn you guys were trying to make bank, I sold shit way underpriced I guess

And still ran out of stash space:(

[jagged thunder]

if i couldnt sell on market id end just selling to the merchants for super low

[carmine current]

1k wasnt an outrageous price. there were people just throwing up legendaries for 100 candy canes (about 2.5-3k gold) that were comepletly trash with one good stat and no flat rolled stats. 400-500g was what blues with okay stats (eg +1 or 2 strength) were worth when it came to the high value items. Flat damage rolls were the king of stats and on a purple base for one of the best types was easily worth that.
if anything I think when you get a trade request and go into it you should be able to still get the other trade requests so you can immediately go to the next one. As someone doing stuff like asking for 50% off would waste both peoples time

[lusty wren]

I didnt sell shit, I picked up what I could use or my group could use and trinkets only i aint got time for that shit and I still had plenty of gold

[jagged thunder]

idk i was charging like 200-300 for blues

[carmine current]

@jagged thunder for what base types though. for instance a long bow as a blue will go for more then a survival bow or recurve as a blue. since its the most valuable type of bow.

[jagged thunder]

accessories id hit 350 or up otherwise id go off stats and demand

[hearty fractal]

like the problem is not game or type market the problem are people wich playing games with fleemarket auction house etc this game is on oldschool vibe and you can sell your bow for 4k forbids you

[brittle patrol]

I think judging prices of weps right now is sort of unrelated to how it will be when the game is live. everyone knows its for a limited time so most things go for cheap as there is no infaltion with gold in the few days that the game is live

[rough elm]

👆

[hearty fractal]

and if you dont have time or nerves just maybe this game is not for you ?

[jagged thunder]

it will always be player ran so when market runners start having more items there will be a change in the avg price

merchants will set the standard

[carmine current]

accessories only mattered for the high % rolled stats and the flat damage roll stats. for instance if you were selling a +2 strength +1 all atribute ring it would be way less valuable then a +3 flat physical damage +1 strength ring. what im was getting at is that the types of weapon/ armor mattered when you take the exact same rolls from one item to another. Since some items were just bad in comparison. for instance a survival bow did about half the damage of the long bow, with 1 extra arrow in the quiver

[jagged thunder]

+any points to all would sell instantly, weapons and armor were hit or miss you just have to catch players in between runs

[hearty fractal]

2 arrows and lesss _ for speed

[brittle patrol]

I think its easy to say a +4 surv bow is not good, but to someone who is newish and has a free 300/400 gold, and they are out of longbows they might snag it

[jagged thunder]

turkey bow headshot on youtube goes crazy btw

[carmine current]

yes but what i was saying is if i post a long bow and say WTS [Longbow] 1000g, then get constant trade requests asking for 500g or so for the item its a problem. since others cant send trade requests when you are already in a trade. meaning you now have to wait longer and the more it happens the more you have to wait. I get the point of saying just sell it for less to then go into another run quicker and earn gold, but the problem stands that people like that shouldnt even be asking for a trade no matter what if its out of their price range.

[hearty fractal]

@carmine current WHY NOT ?

[lusty wren]

If you dont want bartering you may as well have a auction house.

[carmine current]

because it wastes both players time?

[brittle patrol]

@carmine current My mistake, I had that happen many times. And I would even do that to people as well to see if maybe I could get 100g off or something after all it is a trade post. but the functions are flawed in that you can not whisper that person without taking up both of your trade spots

[hearty fractal]

and this is free market if you dont have time just dont go there

[carmine current]

bartering isnt the problem, like i said if you want to negotiate the price of like 20% or so im fine with that. going in saying half off isnt the same.

[carmine current]

or just dont waste your time and mine by offering a crazy low amount when the price for the item was already listed.

[jagged thunder]

i was going to say just action it off in chat goin once going twice style

[lusty wren]

They are bartering, maybe poorly but its a starting point 😄

[glacial bridge]

whats the issue though? if your time isnt worth waiting for a trade then either dont trade or sell it 50% off

[hearty fractal]

or just waste time playing games ?

[jagged thunder]

dont be mad at yourself

[brittle patrol]

The fix for it i was doing, was someone opens trade with you they say some low price I counter they they say "im poor" then you just leave and repost and ignore their trade request for future times

[hearty fractal]

thsi is the part offf the game no one

[hearty fractal]

iam not mad for me that sound stupid

[brittle patrol]

To be fair i offered some people crazy low ammounts and got the item just because its new they cant use it and dont care because everything gets wiped in a day. I think the live game will be very different than now

[rough elm]

I think this is pointless discussion , we need to wait for proper filter and just wait and see what happens because yes it's annoying when ur trying to sell and item and some guy just like i will give you some gems u give me this 300 gold rare sword

[jagged thunder]

turkey headshots get their head slocked off in time for thanksgiving

[lucid root]

Seasonal wipes every 1 week. Must crush the hopes and dreams of full time traders

[carmine current]

expect you had a 1 min wait between every post. other players would try and trade and then giveup if the person was already in a trade. when the way it should have worked is you can still recive the trade requests when in a trade with someone. that way you can quickly go from one trade to another, if someone is doing stuff like that

[brittle patrol]

well it comes down to, the way it is setup right now is not ideal we can agree. Its early EARLY testing. the fact that there is a trade post at all im stoked for. And dont mind the inconviencses because Ironmace knows thats not the finished product. I am with you in, it needs to be fixed for future playtests/the game release

[gray vessel]

that's not how supply and demand work 🙂

[hearty fractal]

yee but they dont understand

[brittle patrol]

I've seen a lot of people asking for soloq and not. I'm in the park of i like everyone mashing together and there being no mmr/solo q. but lean middle of the road. What reasons do you guys have for soloq or just keep it how it is.

[lucid root]

I just want solo to stay brutal, I'm a masochist

[carmine current]

@gray vessel @hearty fractal well the issue is that the supply for good longbows was low since every ranger and fighter wanted them. Making their prices more. if you think that someone posting something for a certain price then asking for a huge discount for a very desirable item is okay, then you are crazy.

[rough elm]

it's a constant war between people wanting soloq and not

[gray vessel]

They are free to ask no? The whole idea of a NON-regulated price system is that it can't be corrupt, but it also is often unfair/imbalanced because of that.

[hearty fractal]

@carmine current in your case i see that the biggest problem is playing game when you have no time and never see like free market in game

[carmine current]

personally i thought that down the road what they should do is prioritize solo players with other solo players, but if there arent enough, then open the lobby up to duo's, then trios.

[rough elm]

I personally want soloq , because i said many times it's fun to kill noob groups , but it's not fun whenever ur going against experienced group and you die not because of skill issue but because of numbers and u definitely know u could win 1 vs 1 if it was soloq

[lusty wren]

How would you regulate this?

[gray vessel]

You are spending both time and supply for money. How can you complain that your time is being wasted, when YOU are the one spending it.

[carmine current]

let the trade requests continue to come in even when in trade. so if someone asks for a crazy low price, you can immediately bounce to the next trade

[lusty wren]

I dont see a problem with this but I doubt the trade is anywhere near how it will be on release. So its kinda meh

[brittle patrol]

I like that a lot but the problem I would see is you have 13 solos then 1 team of 3 and that team of 3 is unmatched (on the wild off chance no one in the lobby can 1v3)

[gray vessel]

That's tough, but you still have free will so i don't see the problem tbh

You go to the market for the potential of getting a trade, not the guarentee of getting a trade

[carmine current]

what do you not understand about the price that someone puts on an item. it absolutely doesnt matter if you come in and ask for whatever price you want. the price at that point is already set. you can sit here and say its not set, but in fact it is. I get it if you leave the item unpriced and are asking for offers, but no if you post the price that is the price. if you dont get that your dumb af

[jagged thunder]

Turkey "HEAD SHOTS", BOW!!

[lusty wren]

nah price is not set, its the wanted price. Bartering works well if you do it and can often get a much better price IRL and in this game

[hearty fractal]

bro taht have no sense he dont understand

[lusty wren]

Its a "ASKING" price

[hearty fractal]

he is probably play all life games with flemarket auction house etc he dont know how old school game and bartering work

[rough elm]

This is some stupid discussion but i love it keep it up

[hearty fractal]

he probably never buy some cheap vegetables on market in really life

[lucid root]

More stupid than solo que?

[jagged thunder]

[lucid root]

You will never have solo que! Over my dead wizard corpse nyaaaahhhhh

[carmine current]

do you go to a grocery store and say im not paying this much for this item. how about this lower amount instead. no you dont. your an idiot if you think that is done. if someone is asking for an offer they will say that (example WTS [Longbow]1000g OBO). If someone posts WTS [Longbow], then its an open market to name your price. If someone says WTS[longbow]1000g, then what else does that mean other then selling it for 1000g.

[hearty fractal]

soloq in this game have no sense beacuse then you can just take rouge and sit all time on stealth

[lusty wren]

Then why were so many people successful at getting a lower price for shit by asking for half off? WTS for 100 is an asking price.

I am very free to say nah but ill pay 50

[carmine current]

no the answer is its not very common and almost never done. i can 100% gaurentee you if you or i went to any store, other then a pawn shop they would say no.

[lucid root]

Never stop lowballing, waste their time until they give in

[hearty fractal]

ye i do like that in grocery in my life and you know i surprise you its sometimes works

[lusty wren]

Then DaD's system is closer to a pawn shop than a store... Point? barter

[lusty wren]

Works at a farmers market that is for sure

[hearty fractal]

ye

[lucid root]

DaD is like a street side market in a third world country

[lusty wren]

Yes DaDs trade center is like a flea market. Where bartering is part of its purpose

Look at all these different examples of bartering 😄 I love it almost as if its a normal thing

[carmine current]

@lusty wren except it depends on what the person is saying. for instance if I said WTS[Longbow] 1000g no less, by your logic that would mean you are still flexible and willing to sell it for less. When in reality its the exact opposite. if you dont have that much or dont want to spend that much, then dont buy it.

[lusty wren]

Car dealers often say I want x for this car. You ever tried to barter with them?

Ever seen a craigslist listing?

[hearty fractal]

😂

[lusty wren]

People barter bro

[lusty wren]

Same logic, if you arent willing to sell for that price say no

[lucid root]

But you're wasting his time

[carmine current]

@lusty wren again your just to damn dumb to understand the concept of what OBO means. it stands for Or Best Offer. when you see a craigslist post that is what they put. to specifically state they are flexible on the price. if you dont then it means they arent flexible on the price.

[hearty fractal]

this is just new generation of players they dont understand a lot and everything must be simple

[lusty wren]

Wrong, people who just put a price often are willing to haggle.

[minor pond]

True and real

[lusty wren]

If you are not willing to haggle that is fine just tell people and move on

Many would rather start negotiations on the front that they are not willing to be flexible even though they are 😄

Its called sales

[lucid root]

Schulze will eventually monopolize the market and you'll have no choice, he'll be the walmart of DaD

[carmine current]

okay so going forward then I will put WTS[Longbow]1000g absoletely no lower. Then what happens if the same person comes in ask asks to buy it for 500g. The issue is that you need to be able to do a few things. 1 you need to be able to get trade requests during trades so you can go from trade to trade if shit like that happens. 2 you need to be able to 100% block players from sending trade requests, so you dont then have to sit there and get low balled by that same person over and over again.

[hearty fractal]

you can block thsi person

where is problem ?

[carmine current]

still cant get trade requests during a trade

[hearty fractal]

and ?

[gray vessel]

just sell it to the shop keeper for 30g and be happy wtf

[lusty wren]

The market likely will be vastly different by the time the game launches. Chances are this is a non issue. But we shall see

[hearty fractal]

i hope that market not change at all

the filltres on some tape of item and class is all what they can add there and this market for me is gold

[carmine current]

@hearty fractal well considering like i said before when someone sees you are already in a trade that generally makes them think that the item is already gone so they ignore the post, then you cant post again for another 1 mins. after which you get another request from someone doing the same thing. the cycle just never ends in your world of just leave the trade and block the person, then repost. if you think the market is fine then your delussional af. if you think that getting trade requests when you are already in a trade is to much, then i dont know what to tell you, since breathing might be to much for you then as well.

[lusty wren]

All I am hearing is people are delusional if they dont agree with my opinion cry cry whine whine

Maybe have a debate without resorting to personal attacks

may get you further

[hearty fractal]

just you have some problems bro for me its ok you can post trade every 10 sec if you accept 3 time this same man you probably dont even care what you sell and to whom

[rough elm]

To put in summary market will be with different prices , filters going to be added , u will have to buy a game so no random kids in playtests bartering 50% of the final price , and prob merchants will take better rarity items for more gold like into hundreds

problem solved

i go sleep

[lucid root]

@carmine current would you be in favor of an auction house?

[hearty fractal]

and bots buying good cheap bows and no one look on his bow XD

[carmine current]

@lucid root I'm fine either way with this system or an AH. I think games like path of exile do trading near perfectly without an auction house.

[lucid root]

I forgot how poe does it

[lusty wren]

100% of the trading I did on PoE was on a third party website

[lucid root]

That's what I remember, haven't played since 2014 ish

[carmine current]

poe lets you get as many party invites as you want while you trade, and you directly message the person if you want to haggle. it doesnt block other people from messaging you or trying to trade you if someone else is doing it

[lusty wren]

All poe traders use third party bro

😄

[glacial bridge]

as a veteran player who knows what items are worth, you missed out not taking the 500g

[carmine current]

what @lusty wren is talking about is on poe trade you can click a button on poe trade that copies a basic message to say you want to buy the item. poe trade is used to go through all the useless gear you dont want

[hearty fractal]

but this is not poe XD

[carmine current]

i eventaully sold all the items it just took longer.

[hearty fractal]

on this moment you cant add someone to friends

[gray vessel]

people probably payed too much at the end since gold means nothing when playtest ends but using a cool item is worht no matter how much gold was wasted

[hearty fractal]

and you want than they make like 1000 trade request spam

[lucid root]

It's so bad for streamers

[carmine current]

yeah and why try to reinvent the wheel when poe does it near perfectly. what this game does is the bare bones system that nearly all games try to steer away from since its outdated and bad.

[lucid root]

You say bad, I say design choice 😎

[lusty wren]

PoE literally relies on third party websites to do it

[lucid root]

Suspense why are you on this crusade dear god!

[carmine current]

sad thing is it wasnt overpriced it was realatively under priced. the gear most players were buying were just terrible and they had absoletely no idea what the stats they were looking at did. anyone who knew anything in the test knew that flat damage rolls were the king of stats. so getting purples and legendaries with flat damage rolls were BIS.

[carmine current]

https://www.pathofexile.com/trade
litterally not a third party website its on their site. second posting items in a chat is the most outdated form of trading that has been gone in games for decades now.

[lusty wren]

If no one is willing to pay full price its overpriced ;D

[lusty wren]

Oh sorry, they copied the third parties and did it themselves on a website 😄

So now you want to take the trade out of the game

NAH no thanks

[soft relic]

To be honest, it was so hard to get rid of money in this game that it was always clogging up my inventory. I was constantly buying things I didn't need at full price just to get rid of money and gear up friends.

[carmine current]

no im saying make the trade system better, there are hundreds of ways to improve upon the basic trade system of posting gear and waiting for people to go through all the other hundreds of posts to then find your item, at which point they cant trade you since someone else already did. even if they had no intention on actaully buying the gear and wanted it for as little as possible

[rough elm]

tried to sleep can't sleep it's 3 am for me. Suspense idea wouldn't be that bad if it was purely hardcore game it's still somewhat casual , and if the game is fully hardcore u will see mortal online 2 situation if it's too casual , people will get bored and game dies. Best mixture is strike a gold spot between casual-hardcore so any ideas making game more hardcore would switch balance to hardcore players

so no don't remove minimap lol

[lusty wren]

Which one the minimap one?

[carmine current]

thats why most of us just started buying candy canes since their value was 25-30 per and it saved on overall space

[lusty wren]

If the circle didnt exist you could get rid of it. But knowing where the next circle is pivotal

[soft relic]

I started doing that, too

[gray vessel]

I'm sorry that you think that man, it would be hard to get over that level of arrogance.

[glacial bridge]

you're just jealous how rich this guy was in a play test 12 months before release

[rough elm]

Well infamous users suspense ideas i see are purely making game more hardcore so he's getting disliked into an oblivion

[lusty wren]

Most of them are just shit takes tbh

or trolls

[soft relic]

He has a point. Most players had no clue how to gear up.

[hearty fractal]

he is just jealous that he selling this bow for few hours because one guy giving him like 500g in 20 trade post

😂

[lusty wren]

Ye it was a playtest many people were playing for the first time 😄

[brittle patrol]

I mean wasnt it + damage and + all stats the best. if the game is out longer than 2 weeks the whole playerbase would be aware of that

[carmine current]

@gray vessel do you not understand that gear with flat stats were just better and then gear being better would cause it to sell for more? like take 1 strength if your base weapon damage was 100, then it would give you 2 hp and 1 flat damage. now imagine that on anything that didnt have 100 base damage which was basically all items in the game other then a legendaries of war maul and windless crossbow. meaning a flat roll gave more damage to everything then the % damage rolls.

[soft relic]

I know, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to go, "Rogue only gear with spell cast speed and buff duration. Yeah I'm not paying 500g for it."

[gray vessel]

ofc I do? I'm talking about the price it would cost lmao

[lusty wren]

Many players had more gold then they could handle so they gave 0 fucks if it was a upgrade from what they had they bought it

[sudden fractal]

this is fax

once i figured out how to use trade chat i had like 5k sitting around

but no one to sell me the stuff i wanted

[soft relic]

I guess, but for the same price you could buy stuff with +physical damage rolls of equal quality.

[lusty wren]

Ya and many did. What is the point? lol

Value is what one is willing to pay and nothing else. If you could not sell your items they were over priced.

if you could, they were better priced 😄

There was no "RIGHT VALUE" because it was a playtest and gold had 0 value because of it

[carmine current]

@gray vessel well do you know how much longbows themselves were selling for i bet you dont. a green longbow was selling for about 150g with no good rolls what so ever, up to 300g for good rolls. blue was 350-800 based on rolls. purples were from 600-1.5k. legendaries were selling almost exclusively for candy canes at a minimum value of 30 (900g) up to 150 (4500g)

[soft relic]

I'm not disagreeing with that. I was more commenting on chadiator's comment about someone's arrogance due to thinking things were underpriced and players had no idea how to gear up.

[lusty wren]

Ya, as players get more informed and gold has more value things will change.

Gold was a nuisance to me 90% of the time

[soft relic]

Same.

[lusty wren]

id almost pay to get rid of it 😄

[hearty fractal]

nice story i buy green long bows for like 50g this one with good stats for 150-200 bule one for like 300-350

[lusty wren]

Same because I msged those guys and said HEY I will pay this but not that

You know bartering

😄

This guy took every ones asking price and is acting like that is what people paid

Every trade request I sent was followed with a price adjustment 😄

[hearty fractal]

@carmine current is like this guy whose selling green doublet +5 flat dps for like 700g and i see him like for 5h there

[lusty wren]

Ye over pricing your shit is a great way to spend to long tryin to sell it

[carmine current]

@lusty wren what do you not understand about it. its not that it was overpriced it had nothing to do with people not sending trade requests. after posting it you would get trade requests instantly from people who arent even looking at the price at all and are solely checking the item type and the rarity without looking at anything else. what im getting at is those players would send you a trade request blocking others that are actually looking for specific gear that are willing to pay that price. like i mentioned when people send you a trade request and it doesnt go through because you are already in one is an issue

[lusty wren]

Sounds like you got a bunch of people trying to barter because your price was to high 😄

[hearty fractal]

@carmine current maybe they should make special trade post chat for veterans like you XD because no every one is pro player and know everything

[carmine current]

except its not at all the same. when i would post my items i would get trade offers instantly. the issue is getting trade offers that actually matter and arent trying to haggle to unreasonable prices

[wary flower]

Trade is supposed to be improved in the next playtest. Don't discuss it too much because is an issue that is already been attended 👍

[lusty wren]

As I said 😄 ^

[hearty fractal]

haa ? 5 flat dps

you don't see the similarities

[glacial bridge]

i think we all figured trade would be better. thats why ive just been laughing about the 'worth of items'

[lusty wren]

I often want to collapse the free market because people arent willing to pay my price 😄

[carmine current]

yes the stat is fine depending on the type of flat damage it is and if the class. like i said though if the item base isn't desierable then its not going to be worth it. a longbow is the best base for rangers, so good rolls on a long bow will be worth more then good rolls on a bad base. for instance take plate for instance only clerics and fighters care at all for it. put flat magic damage on it and its useless.

[gray vessel]

Actually longbow was about 125, with good rolls it could be 250, blue was 300-750 based on rolls. Purples were 500-1350. Legendaries were only for candy caned or several thousand, so I guess you are wrong on all fronts.

[hearty fractal]

ok i am dont this is not on my mind i hope that some day you finally sell your bow for 1k good night bros

[rough elm]

@carmine current if it was an actual fully released game you prob would be right but it's just a playtest , many people just trying trading they don't know what trading even means u just get dumb bartering not wanting to buy ur decided price so as much as you hate to admit they are right and ur in loss

and the reason i'm saying with paid game better filters instead of 10 dumb kids trying to banter u will see only 1-2 dumb people trying to banter and u will be able to sell almost every time with what price YOU want

[carmine current]

@rough elm like i said from every play test on wards ill put WTS (item) (price) no lower. since you know its just common sense that if someone posts an item for a price they expect that price. if someone posts something saying OBO then it can be haggled, if they dont post a price then you are to offer an amount for it. I guess that concept is just foreign to these people.

but you know its only been that way since every game did a trade system in a chat since the early 2000s

[glacial bridge]

i think longbows were more like 175, with good rolls 310, blue was anywhere between 270 and 800. purples easily 700+. legendary never actually existed. its all government propaganda

[gaunt sinew]

what do you guys think about splitting the lobbies a bit for the first floor of the dungeon? say like 4 teams enter a single first floor but when the circle forces people to move down a floor or escape, then merge all remaining teams into the second and third floors.

[gray vessel]

I think it wouldn't make a big difference to the game, and that difference might not even be benefitial

Just more work in map design for what?

[gaunt sinew]

i agree in its current state, lobby size isnt big enough

[glacial bridge]

33 -> 16 -> 9 is the numbers ive seen for B1 / B2 / B3

[gaunt sinew]

but if they ever plan on increasing the lobby size i feel that would make for a good change to keep dungeons starts much less crowded

[glacial bridge]

gonna be interesting when theres 3 layers how it feels

[gaunt sinew]

first floor i feel their intention is to let players explore a bit with the basic skeletons and mobs to stop you, i cant imagine they want the PvP trolls to anihilate the noobs on the very first floor

so thats why im suggesting splitting the players up a little but only for the first floor

[glacial bridge]

my worry is if the first floor gets repettitive. it either has loot thats worth your time or you feel obligated to run to the first blue portal to continue your run

and obviously a lot of pvp on the Forest

[gray vessel]

with 33 people and 16 portals, they certainly expect a lot of pvp

[gaunt sinew]

well 16 down portals i assume,

who knows how many blue

[glacial bridge]

theres also the issue that when you take a red* portal, you still have to wait for the full Forest game to end

[gray vessel]

That fact + the inclusion of high roller lobbies should mean that the noobs will just have to do what they can and level up the normal way. it's not like its realistic for new players to even imagine extracting their first 10 runs

[gray vessel]

u right, my b

[gaunt sinew]

in the last play test i just felt so bad coming up on like a solo player with no gear at all lol

my team wouldnt have any trouble killing them, it was just so unfair XD

im trying to spare them some of that pain i guess

[brittle patrol]

just give them the 2x crouch if they respond they live if they dont rip

[gaunt sinew]

yeah man i always equipped torch and spammed crouch but they would nearly always rush me down anyways

they could have just been new to the game and thought you were supposed to kill everyone you saw

[brittle patrol]

then they get the blip blap

nah thats universal, unarmed crouch meme spam means friendly

[carmine current]

@brittle patrol there were some funny videos of people gaining other players trust as a rogue by doing that then the entire rest of the game kept doing the pickpocket on them without them realizing that was a thing. sorta scummy but really really funny to watch

[fossil storm]

that happened to me, thought it was funny I didnt want to ruin the gimmick by talking about it too much

2 rogues doing this to each other would be a good comedy

[fossil storm]

what if it cost 5gold just to click on the link ?

[carmine current]

i think one of the rogues would be bound to just stab the other to death if someone was doing that to them. i didnt even realize until i watched a video on it that it was a thing. though i guess people who play rogue would have seen the perk and would know to watchout for it

[atomic elm]

i hope they dont add a battlepass

[carmine current]

i think it would depend on what is in the pass. anything that gives an advantage i would rather not see. if its all cosmetics i wouldnt mind.

[wary shell]

Voice chat will help out solo players immensely I feel

[lucid root]

Proximity chat?

Or just a built in voice chat for teams

[faint dirge]

F2p but cosmetic via battlepass is goated

[muted crag]

Battle passes are a, mixed experience from game to game. Some are totally free, some are partially unlocked, some have a free and paid track, the rest are full priced with limited time things that are fomo driven.

[glacial bridge]

when you stack Suggestions, you're just giving multiple reasons to downvote

[inland pelican]

They stated they believed they were planning a buy to play method and I assume they will be adding cosmetics for steady income likely doing deals with groups like critical role to add those chars as skins etc

[faint dirge]

Didnt they say they are not sure and tending to f2p?

[lucid root]

No they said they don't want f2p, but "accessible" whatever that means

Like 30-40 bucks?

[inland pelican]

Exactly

Likely around 40 with the replies they are being given by us though I'm sure most of us would shell out 60

Then the skins to sell, skins for players, weapons, armors etc

They have a solid revenue stream if they want it

[glacial bridge]

20-30 and they will sell a billion copies. depends on how large a playerbase they are trying to capitalize on

shelling 40+ is easy for a game I like, the big difference is convincing friends to also buy

[civic canyon]

Does anyone know why when I make a suggestion it’s blocked saying there’s content that isn’t allowed in this community? I don’t know why this is happening.

[ancient briar]

Why care how much it is going to cost? It's a good game, you like it you buy it.

[lucid root]

Just speculation, I doubt anyone cares much

Unless someone was really hoping for it to be f2p, sorry to disappoint

[opal sparrow]

Not anyone can afford games especially in SEA regions, if its f2p every single one of us will play 24/7 on the game

Games with 5-10$ price tag is 500-600 pesos here not worth buying when you need it more for necessities.

[ancient briar]

I may sound like a trash but if you cannot afford it most likely you shouldn't spend time on games. :/

[opal sparrow]

You do sound like a tool, do you think we dont deserve playing games on a free time because we gain less cash?

Playing games is better than smoking and alcohol tbh

[lucid root]

True

[ancient briar]

Well, in perfect world I wish they'd base the price of the % of your income, but we all know that is not going to happen.

but then the rich guys won't be treated fair because they'll pay triple what the poor will pay 😄

[opal sparrow]

% of the price is loosely base on the Dev region, if the region has a higher economical status then every one on the lower bracket will be absolutely be left out, thats why even high earners on those regions dont even buy games and still do f2p's

[ancient briar]

Well I hope they'll price the game so you won't be left out, and also I hope developers won't be sacrificing much by allowing that price to happen. This goes both ways..

[opal sparrow]

I agree, I guess the lucky ones on good economic status will be able to play the game if that comes out of it, if its more than 10$ then sadly I will be ignoring it even if I like the game.

[opal sparrow]

I absolutely agree, whatever is better for the game to flourish then they definitely go with that decision.

[ancient briar]

For me personally, it could be buy2play, free2play, pay2play. I wouldn't care. None of those systems are perfect for the game.

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

😂😂😂

[lucid root]

And can do sick tricks on it like a skateboard

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @fathom dove

There’s already Adventure currency that is used to purchase cosmetics and skins.
To get that currency, you have to loot and escape which then you use it in the store.

No point in adding in a physical currency to it.

[soft relic]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

@little rune When you say fix shield blocking, could you go into a bit of detail as to how you were using shields? They worked pretty well if you knew how to use them, I thought.

For example, were you blocking while looking at the enemy? Or were you trying to look at where their weapon was coming from? If the blade was coming from your character's upper left, you had to turn your screen so the shield would intercept the weapon (i.e., look all the way up and left), not just look at the target and the block would succeed even though the weapon would hit your shoulder around the shield.

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @rugged palm

With putin pushed into the corner, it would be surprising to hear nukes going off any time soon.
Early access !

[carmine current]

why is everyone keep asking for the mini map to be removed? like i never once saw an issue with having it. it didnt make it to easy if anything it just gave people an idea of where to go when the circle was closing in. if you removed that then 90%+ of the players would just find themselves aimlessly running for dear life through every room to get out of the circle.

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Agreed, instead of getting like 10-20 bad/joke suggestions a day. Put a time limit of 5-10 hour period between each suggestion 1 can make. So the good suggestions don’t get buried under all these spam suggestions

[carmine current]

#d-and-d-suggestions message anyone else think that the lockpick minigame should allow the marker to pass around at least once in the circle before a failed attempt? if not, why?

[fervent crag]

I agree that it should go around 2nd or 3rd time.
But i disagree with slowing down the minigame.

[carmine current]

@fervent crag well it was one or the other not both. Personally i think that one of the 2 needs to happen. since it too difficult to land it multiple times in a row when a single fail resets all the work done.

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @wintry forge

Put a sticky note over your map while you go into a dungeon, boom you yourself can play hardcore without a map.

[white cliff]

Challenging game should be challenging.

[carmine current]

lol agreed. i cant understand why people really are trying to push to have it removed in suggestions. like I've yet to see a good reason as to why it should be removed other then them saying git gud you dont need it.

[jagged thunder]

highroller already removed killfeed

handheld map?

[white cliff]

What does that have to do with lock picks…?

[carmine current]

but lock picking isnt a time based activity. like thematically it makes no sense unless you are openning a bank vault or something. on top of that you already have to land it at least 2 times to succeed i like a challenge and all but the gear that drops from those chests arent even that much better then most of the good chests anyway.

[fervent crag]

Lock picks should have durability which means it breaks after 2 tries.

[white cliff]

Hit the space bar idk?

[jagged thunder]

the lock pick mechanic is fine

[glacial bridge]

tbh i would prefer a handheld map over the minimap. you absolutely need something to see the BR circle closing in. have it be a blank slate and filled out as you move around

[jagged thunder]

sell a map at the merchants so you have 1 guide with a map

[gray vessel]

don't make it an item you have to buy

[fervent crag]

That sounds like a good idea actually, buying intel before exploring a dungeon.

[lucid root]

Handheld map sounds cool but what about the circle?

[gray vessel]

the people who need it most are the new players, and guess what new players don't have. GOLD

[jagged thunder]

makes players have to learn the maps

[glacial bridge]

every player needs to be able to see the circle so buying a map doesnt work in that regard

[jagged thunder]

they could make the room shake when the swarm is moving in

[glacial bridge]

im down with it being very basic but everyone needs access

[fervent crag]

All you have to do is follow the circle as it closes in.

[jagged thunder]

minimap is fine too i just like the immersion

[gray vessel]

I fail to see any of the benefits of any option over the current minimap 🤷‍♂️

[jagged thunder]

remove the ring on the circle and only show the bugs

[glacial bridge]

you also need to see the projected stop point of the next circle so you have the intel to make decisions before the bugs push.

[white cliff]

The whole point on them not doing procedurally generated design is so that learning the map is a skill. Being able to buy info kind of defeats the purpose.

Wouldn’t be something they would add based on things they’ve said.

[glacial bridge]

yeah overall i see it as a non-issue, at most i would just say that rather than your minimap be in the corner, you just press 'm' and your character pulls out a physical map with the exact same information

dont need to run off new players for the sake of immersion :)

[fervent crag]

Transparent map when pressing M or a paper map when you press M

[jagged thunder]

what kind of weapons should the classes have that they already dont?

[gray vessel]

rogues should have very low damage quaterstaves

[jagged thunder]

cleric too?

[gray vessel]

I'd say give it to the new class

maybe cleric idk

[jagged thunder]

net?

make lantern an offhand?

[rapid snow]

we need a monk

[carmine current]

i actually really like that idea. before i never saw a point to have the lanturn over the torch, making it an offhand would be sick.

[jagged thunder]

i always sold the lantern it was 25g i think

[jagged thunder]

monk kick

[jagged thunder]

make the torch a primary

[inland pelican]

Lantern is drastically better then a torch atm... free fireball spell for non casters, toggleable light, focused in front... solid win imo

[inland pelican]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Already several monk ideas suggested and the devs ARE considering a monk but it's not easy for them

[inland pelican]

Censors for clerics, it would work as a smokescreen for players and a poison cloud for undead, it should be an offhand so clerics have to pick between them and shields

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @hushed plover

You have to do like hours of grinding for cosmetics such as the skeleton skin and blue torch which is a good way to take things.
Adventurer currency can only be gained by looting and escaping the dungeon successfully.

Also new races and skins that would be purchasable with adventurer currency wouldn’t be too game breaking, for instances the -20% armour on the skeleton skin. With greater power the more debuffs you’ll get which is probably whats going to happen with the newer skins that are due to release.

If they were going to make skins purchasable with real money. It would most likely only be cosmetics/skins without any active effects or buffs that would effect the game.

[hushed plover]

The developers have confirmed that the "adventurer's currency" was added only to make the playtests more fun and that you will not be able to keep the skins you buy during the tests. I think that's pretty assuring that the skins will be paid for with real money.

It would make a lot of people mad if they made paid to skins literally pay 2 win by slapping a 20% damage reduction on them. If they made it give 1 point of stat and remove 1 point of other stat not many people would care

[carmine current]

@hushed plover #d-and-d-suggestions message
crossbows in the last test were perfectly fine. if you had gg gear sure a longbow was better since it would oneshot as well, though the windless crossbow was the easiest way for rangers to get reliable oneshot without much gear. fighters were always taking normal crossbow if they were smart, since the 20% reduced damage from windless on them only gave them about 4 extra per shot but had a significantly worse reload. I understand that some people wanted to use the ranger abilities with the crossbow liek the triple shot, but that would 100% break all game balance with the windless due to the insane base damage on it. i think later on they will add skills to ranger that can be used specifically with crossbow, however stuff like you mentioned to bind players would comepletely break game balance as well. since getting hit by 1 windless shot is already almost death, but then a bind into a longbow shot would just kill the tankiest of characters. as it stood in the last test a bunch of players were taking a long bow primary and a windless secondary. when you get into that oh shit moment the windless could be pulled out and 1 tap a player in close range, especially if you already hit them once or twice.

also rangers that played smart were already basically untouchable by melee characters. since they could setup 6 or so traps all near a door and you couldnt push through it without setting them off multiple times doing basically the same binding that you wanted. if you paired a binding shot with their traps you would just never get to move.

[hushed plover]

I understand where you're coming from but unfortunately you're projecting things. The windlass deals 44 damage and the longbow deals 34.

You have to stop and lose light of sight to reload the crossbow. Ideally you're able to fire a bolt every 7.4 seconds if you shoot and instantly go into the reload exposing yourself (you can't move while reloading). Lastly you have no active abilities to help you use the weapon such as the quickshot or spreadshot.

I think it is very clear why quickshot longbows are meta and will remain indefinitely until crossbows and other bows are somewhat equalized across the board.

[hushed plover]

Are you arguing that because traps were very strong and hard to counter at times the crossbows shouldn't be made equal to bows? What?

[carmine current]

if you are talking about base white sure. a legendary windless was about 98 base.

[fervent crag]

If they remove adventurer currency in the future and make all cosmetic/skins purchasable with real money.
Then that would be 1 good thing about D&D removed.

Grinding for hours to finally have enough to purchase the skeleton skin with adventurer currency felt like you actually achieved something in-game especially the blue torch and emotes.
Hopefully they learn from that and keep adventurer currency for stat boosted cosmetics/skins and make purchasable cosmetics/skins with real money non-stat boosted.

[carmine current]

no im saying if you add a binding shot to crossbow on top of the traps that they could use regardless that would comepletely break game balance.

[hushed plover]

fair

[white cliff]

You don’t have to stop and reload it, it’s free damage on a ranged class. What are you going to do take a rapier, if a barbs in melee range your dead anyways.

[carmine current]

also sure the reload was awful but it can be reduced by half with the perk and generally it was used as a way to instantly get a huge damage shot off.

[hushed plover]

Well the legendary longbow deals damage not that far away from the legendary windlass (I don't have the exact numbers right now but if I had to make a guess it would be about 25% less than the windlass going of the stat difference on whites) which makes the crossbows inferior to longbow big time.

[white cliff]

Sure but you’re not primarily using a crossbow. You’re using it for a free 100 free damage once a fight.

[carmine current]

the longbow was about ~74ish a windless with 98 that generally just meant that the person hit would die to 1 shot in any body part. as oppesed to having to get a headshot to maybe get the kill

[hushed plover]

With windlass you had to sacrifice a perk slot just and to get the faster reloads and it would still be worse than the longbow without it

[carmine current]

like i said if you were using it properly the windless was used to oneshot people then had a long reload. longbow was more consitent dps. however if a barb or fighter are on top of you a longbow wont do anything since you will die by the time you get your second shot off. however if you pulled out a windless and hit them once they would just drop

[gray vessel]

you don't have to

[hushed plover]

If your point is on point is that you can reliably hit 98 damage against naked dudes then yes. You get a free 100 damage each fight provided you're using a legendary windlass crossbow.

[white cliff]

My point is on point, yes.

[hushed plover]

Of course, you don't have to use take the windlass over the longbow too and nobody did except a few people

[carmine current]

well if your using a legendary crossbow your going to have a bunch of other gear on as well. with plenty of flat damage and % damage rolls as well. rangers on headshot vs dummy could easily hit 200-300 with windless and decent gear

[carmine current]

no one is saying to take it over it. you take both

[gray vessel]

That's a ridiculous reply but okay lmao

[white cliff]

What was the original argument?

That crossbows are weak?

Jesus you want 100% armor pierce?

Yeah I read this.

You mind removing that so my eyes don’t bleed from the bright highlight lol.

[carmine current]

yeah that was another thing i thought was dumb. you only survive a windless hit with tons of armor. giving it a 100% pierce means no one lives a single shot

[carmine current]

sure

[white cliff]

Appreciated.

Dark room, got flash banged.

I also don’t really think this game needs any form of hard cc, they even toned back the traps.

There’s no skill check anymore.

[carmine current]

yep i mentioned that paired with a trap every melee character would just die. since you would be cc indefinately

i think an interesting ability for crossbow would be an activated buff shot that would go through shields so it couldnt be blocked. though obviously stuff like that would remove players counterplay. so im not sure if balance wise that would be fair

[faint dirge]

if you mean go through the blue shields from clerics/pots i like it

but i think you mean through handshields

[carmine current]

no i was saying for regular shields like kite or pavise, but im not sure if balance wise it would make sense. though it would be better then what was suggested from the other person of giving all crossbows base 100% pierce

[white cliff]

Make shields more useless?

No thanks.

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Huh? 15g isn’t that much of a fee to pay, it’s like pocket money considering you can get like 150-200g per successful run.
15g trade fee is good and shouldn’t change.

[carmine current]

i thought shields were fine tbh. pavise though was only useful to cheese mobs with the set down

[faint dirge]

i heard they are pretty useless aswell, but form my own experience they are good

but i only play archer

[fervent crag]

Did you make a mishap ? Lol

[carmine current]

yeah i thought you were talking about the inital trade post cost to join it not the fee for each trade. ive seen some people say to remove that inital cost

[faint dirge]

its so little it doesnt make a difference, so it basicly serves no purpose and is annoying

[carmine current]

i thought they were fine were they op no. they are already easily counterable but shotting spots the person isnt trying to block. though ive won plenty of melee fights beacuse of a good block. also in pve its nice and easy to block every attack from enemies

[carmine current]

true but for the initation fee it means you need to go into a run and successfully survive with at least that amount of gold needed plus another 15 for the inital trade. which the issue i mentioned which is a problem is people were trying to character creation farm the candy cane vendor. by creating character over and over until you got good items, then run a mission escape then trade a friend your CC and he trades it to the alt to get the gg legendary item.

it was just a very abusable system that at least put a slight roadblock in peoples way, which i think should either stay or should be increased to prevent things like that

[woeful oriole]

100% armor pen is too much

Now a certain percentage might be fine

Maybe ignore 1/4th since crossbows load slow

Iirc crossbows are deadly weapons of war

To the point where when they were first introduced, nobles wanted them banned because of how easily untrained soldiers could kill trained armored knights

So, the idea that a crossbow can pen through armor isn't far fetched and it would make sense given its reload time

And if someone wants to load like 7 crossbows in their inventory so they don't have to reload... Well... They lose out on loot and shit with the risk of losing all their crossbows from a mage shanking them in the back with a flame dagger >_>

[carmine current]

true but as it currently stand a good windless crossbow already one shots barbs in the chest if they arent going for maximum physical damage reduction. if you then remove the only way not to get one shot by it, then your just making it that much more broken. as it stood it was a good secondary weapon, and personally i think it should stay that way.

[woeful oriole]

Honestly, i think they should create a faster firing crossbow that does less damage and has less range purely for close to mid range battles

Not capable of one shotting, but would work well as a primary weapon

[carmine current]

@woeful oriole they already had that there were 2 crossbows the base and the windless. the base was a less damage way faster reload version of it

[woeful oriole]

We'll call it.. The palm crossbow... And we'll give it to rogue because im tied of rogue being shafted in terms of what they can equip being rapiers and daggers >_>

But thats just my bias

Im talkin an actual quick reload

Not the, I need to put a device that lets me pull the wire down reload

Ehh functionally it'd be kind of like a slingshot

[carmine current]

@woeful oriole well tbh with good gear rogues and barbs could 2 shot with throwing daggers and throwing axes. since all weapon damage flat rolls and % damage rolls increased their damage.

on my fighter when i had tons of gear with flat ture physical and flat physical damage. the throwing axes were hitting like trucks, obviously not as much as the crossbow but were great ranged alternatives

[woeful oriole]

Uh dont know about axes

But i have doubts about knives

I know they can proc bleed

But does their damage scale on a stat?

And on that note, honestly feels like rogues should start with more knives

Rangers get beartraps, and free heals

[carmine current]

thier base damage scales with anything that gives them physical damage. so strength works physical damage % works. flat physical damage works, true physical damage works

[woeful oriole]

Rogue is supposed to be the cunning trap/item using one

So it scales with armor that gives strength

[carmine current]

yes. also hitting someone that was in heavy armor would reduce the damage

the only one im not sure of is if weapon damage itself scaled them

[woeful oriole]

But even so, i do think rogues should have access to their own type of ranged weapon via crossbow just because crossbows and bows are classic rogue weapons

Or any ranged weapon that isn't a 5m throwing knife

[carmine current]

i mean i dont think a rogue would use a crossbow, maybe like a shortbow or something but idk. they def wouldnt be using the longbow or the windless that thematically wouldnt make any sense

[woeful oriole]

Well if you play dnd

One of the ways rogue applies sneak attack is finese weapons or ranged weapons

Common ranged weapon rogues use is crossbows because it has the highest damage

And can only be fired once per turn

Since rogues can only attack once per turn, it's perfect for them in dnd

[carmine current]

also there would be major balance issues with a crossbow on them with how much % increased damage perks and abilities they have. they would be able in base kit and a white crossbow be able to oneshot a player if they hit him from behind

[woeful oriole]

Yes, that is an issue

Which is why i mentioned making a rogue exclusive crossbow

Similar to how only rangers can use beartraps for some reason

[carmine current]

like a handcross bow or something

[woeful oriole]

Yeah

[carmine current]

yeah i guess i could see that but i think it would be more likely for them to just get something like the short bow added as a useable item. since that had the lowest base damage of them all.

though even that being said a shortbow shot from behind with all those same perks would also just truck players.

[woeful oriole]

Yeh which is why bows wouldn't apply rogue perks

Maybe active skills sure

But not perks

Perks would be melee exclusive and the shortbow/palm crossbow would have their own perks

[golden tree]

Release game early access so we can all play from now on - Take my money - Please :c

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @sacred hill

To be honest, it’s not up to the players even if you have +25 upvotes.
#d-and-d-suggestions is for the devs to browse the ideas and suggestions even if they have low upvotes or not.
Depending on what they’re looking for, they could even take suggestions that have -25 votes.

Considering theres 100,000+ players in the community, upvotes don’t mean any since it’s only like 0.1% players participating in the upvotes.

#d-and-d-suggestions message @wintry forge

If they’re camping the portals. Tough luck, your gonna have to find another, take a down portal or fight to the death with them.
You’re gonna have to take the risks so you can get a successful run.

[inland pelican]

Agreed with the last bit and good to know on the first bit, I thought they used the upbotes as a sort of filtering system

[errant niche]

I hope they look at my suggestions about dynamic maps.

[inland pelican]

Upvotes*

Dynamic in what way?

[errant niche]

People who play last remnant will understand.

[inland pelican]

Well how about you explain for those that havent...?

[errant niche]

Small areas that aren't vital are randomly gen. The map is added together like a puzzle. (From a preset designed dungeon rooms). The main areas are the same but small areas are different every time.

Like shuffling a deck of cards but they puzzled together.

But it is predetermined how they should look.

To not offset anything.

[inland pelican]

Ah so dynamic map generation. I'm not massively opposed to the idea, but I read that it already was slightly randomized

[errant niche]

Feels like a new map every time but it's not.

Just the rooms are puzzled somewhere else.

[silk hamlet]

the biggest takeaway(s) for me of the bad things from the last playtest was the scummy stuff going on with the trade post

the people doing item scams in an alpha test

[errant niche]

From the play test there wasn't anything random not even any of the loot spawn.

[silk hamlet]

also loosely connected to that - scammers who would team up with someone just to TK them and take their best gear to sell on the trade post

[errant niche]

Not that I experienced.

[silk hamlet]

i think to prevent that the game should flag nonconsumables that you recover off your teammate's body as team member items and then they get automatically sent to your teammate if you escape

[errant niche]

I have never experienced tk. But Tk is just part of the game tbh.

I will try to do some tk next playtest. Never thought of it. Gonna evilmax my rouge. Lmao

[silk hamlet]

tk is part of the game but there is some very scummy things about that that they'll need to address

[inland pelican]

XD

[silk hamlet]

like if someone is intentionally tking their teammates a lot the game might temp lock their account

[errant niche]

Imagine all the free purple gear lol.

[inland pelican]

Tk was literally my first thought! I didn't do it, but I sure thought of it, make sure you trust who you are running with, don't take out tk

It's hardcore for a reason

[errant niche]

I think locking someone's account up is too far. And most people won't pk since you stuck on discord together and vc, it to be awkward lol.

[silk hamlet]

reporting someone for abusive tking is a thing even in tarkov

[errant niche]

That's why you don't join random invite lmao.

[silk hamlet]

i'm sure one of the many things future versions of the game will have is easier ways to report and flag players who are being unsporting or toxic

[errant niche]

T bagging people is perfectly normal and not toxic.

[silk hamlet]

i said team killing

[inland pelican]

What I would like better is a color by the name from green to red that changes based on your tk ratio, intentional or otherwise. That's the worst I would want for tkers

[silk hamlet]

teabagging is toxic but not report or banworthy in most games - maybe on some servers in some games where admins dont like that kind of thing

[errant niche]

Yes change name green to red is a good punishment for tk.

But I would just leave it at that.

[silk hamlet]

abusive teamkilling is a problem in a lot of games and most modern games - even hardcore ones - have a means of reporting it and means of punishments for doing it

[inland pelican]

Then learn who to trust...?

[silk hamlet]

not a solution

[inland pelican]

XD is to me

[silk hamlet]

this is a game-side issue

for the devs to address

[errant niche]

Teabagging is a normal act of domination.

[silk hamlet]

i dunno why people brought up teabagging lol

i'm only talking about teamkilling here

and specifically, abusive teamkilling

accidental deaths are part of the game

[inland pelican]

Again I said the worst I want for tkers and it feels a fair trustomitor. Trust at your own risk after that

[silk hamlet]

scummy abusive teamkilling - esp teamkilling scamming - should be discouraged and punished

[errant niche]

Changing name color as a tk player should be that. I mean when I play DND I always expect everyone to be my enemy going in.

[silk hamlet]

In general you should trust at your own risk but there are ways for games to provide a little more protection from that sort of thing. Even if you don't eliminate it you can reduce it.

[errant niche]

Make a suggestion to the suggestion gods then.

And hope that your voice be heard.

[silk hamlet]

I did towards the end of the last alpha.

[errant niche]

Check how it is doing?

[silk hamlet]

it was doing all right last i checked

[errant niche]

Then hope they heard.

[silk hamlet]

i might make another ticket for it in the future

[inland pelican]

That is what my suggested color change would be. It would let you see what their rate of killing teammates is (accidental or otherwise) where the only recovery from red is play games without killing teammates

[silk hamlet]

scammers will find ways around that but that is another layer that might be used too

[errant niche]

I checked it, but didn't get enough votes to be greenlit.

[inland pelican]

Scammers will find ways around everything! Lol

[silk hamlet]

in any case i dont doubt the devs are considering something like what i said

even if they didnt see my post

[inland pelican]

Legit they could just pull a ton of mobs and abandon their teammate, that wouldn't be bannable or reportable in any of our suggestions

[silk hamlet]

whatever solutions mitigate issues like this

[silk hamlet]

an account that gets a lot of negative reporting on them from randos might wind up flagged

[errant niche]

Oh I did that I was almost out of heath and didn't wanna leave loot behind so I gathered a bunch of mobs on me while engaging another player lol.

[silk hamlet]

that is usually how it goes in most online games

it's not perfect

but it is something

[errant niche]

People are sensitive I'm sure they would report anything.

[silk hamlet]

yeah but you can get an aggregate on a potential problem account from hearing from a lot of different people

[inland pelican]

Good way to flag a streamer that pissed off someone with friends

[silk hamlet]

if someone is playing with a lot of randos and doing awful shit to them they will probably wind up flagged

[errant niche]

I see ttv in their name and I'm already enraged lmao

[silk hamlet]

with enough reports

[inland pelican]

Or... hear me out... put responsibility on the individual and skip the tons of costs for nearly no pay off. Party at your own risk

[silk hamlet]

nah dawg that's lazy

[inland pelican]

It's realistic

[errant niche]

Only party if you vc on discord

[silk hamlet]

and irreponsible on the part of the game studio/publisher

there does need to be some kind of mechanisms like this - even takov has them

and there probably will be later on

regardless of our opinion on them

[errant niche]

Nah bro you think tarkov does anything?

[silk hamlet]

for alpha testing they learned a lot about how peolpe can fuck up the game and be toxic

[inland pelican]

Tk ratio to games played color change is easier to code and implement, that much customer service, what you suggest requires constant bills for the.

[silk hamlet]

so they'll find solutions to mitigate that

[errant niche]

Tarkov won't even ban the people that are aim botting in labs lmao.

[inland pelican]

Them*

[errant niche]

I still get to this day one shorted thru a door in labs.

[errant niche]

I agree with your idea it's simple and easy.

[silk hamlet]

pretty much every game like this has teams they hire to handle this sort of thing - this is not unusual

in fact the alpha is a way for them to gauge how much they need to invest in that kind of thing for launch

anyway - we'll see what they do with all that

[inland pelican]

It's cost effective, and you are right space, and im sure they feel more on the lines of lord and i

Agreed

[silk hamlet]

in any case

my ORIGINAL suggestion was not reporting users

it was flagging the gear you pick up off teammates so it returns to their inventory if you escape with it

[errant niche]

You should make that suggestion.

[silk hamlet]

that's an automated way to discourage ONE form of scamming/tking

mitigating certain kinds of toxic player behavior is something where you need a combination of human effort & automated systems

[errant niche]

Nah, I usually tell my team mate to keep it. It would be weird if it gets returned if I picked up my mates stuff. But I do usually just buy them new gear since money is easy to get in game.

[silk hamlet]

in any online game

[silk hamlet]

if you want them to keep it you could just give it to them in trade after you get it back

anyway

there's not much more to say about this

[errant niche]

Too much of a hassle

[silk hamlet]

it was just a suggestion and it might not even be a feasible one due to stuff the devs would probably know about

[errant niche]

I would have to go to trading menu and everything.

[silk hamlet]

but yeah we'll see what they do in future updates about mitigating player toxicity and scamming /abusive tking /etc

[errant niche]

I mean I wouldn't even pick up their item. It would just go to waste.

[inland pelican]

Space... what was your first gaming console if I may ask, so I can try to understand you a bit more

[silk hamlet]

commodore 64

[errant niche]

Oh

[inland pelican]

A man of culture ❤️

[silk hamlet]

i've played a lot of games like these over the years heh heh

[errant niche]

Have you ever played doing the Xbox live era?

[silk hamlet]

literally the loot flagging system i mentioned is something i've seen in text based MUD games too

[errant niche]

What is mud game?

[silk hamlet]

not exactly like that but ways to prevent players from tking for gear in their faction

[silk hamlet]

multi-user-dungeon - the grandpappy of MMOs and online action rpgs

[inland pelican]

To be fair, I'm not super against a flagged gear suggestion

[silk hamlet]

its just an idea as a possible solution

[inland pelican]

Just don't like that it DOES take out the option of the double cross, which I like the possible storyline there

"Learn who to trust kid" says the rogue who stabbed you in the back as you fall at the blue portal

[errant niche]

They should just do like Fortnite does. Every game is recorded and dev just look at footage when someone has reported something and does swift justice lmao.

[inland pelican]

Waaaaay too much storage costs for that

[silk hamlet]

nah dawg i'm thinking that it encourages scammers who try to will try to make money on the game by stealing rares and selling them for real world money or something - that is also another issue with its own can of worms

the same kind of shitty way that you get chinese gold farmers and russian scammers taking over MMO servers

[errant niche]

Like people team with the enemy in pvp match to be the last people. They lock your account for 24hrs lol.

[inland pelican]

Then don't party with those you don't trust! XD sorry it's such a simple solution, teach people to not fall for telemarketing scams

[errant niche]

I understand and is prob unreasonable. But damn does it work. Never encountered a cheater or a hacker lol.

[silk hamlet]

here's another thing to add another layer to this;

ingame warnings every time you party up with people not on your friends list warning about trusting random users

[inland pelican]

This is my favorite suggestion so far!

[silk hamlet]

either a quick popup reminder or a really obvious warning onscreen on the party menu

mind you

[errant niche]

Oh that I understand like people selling game items on eBay for real life money. I can see that happening.

[silk hamlet]

that's just another layer to solve this problem

to mitigate something like this you need multiple layers

so stuff like the loot flagging i mentioned (automated systems) and human team based systems (processing abuse reports)

[errant niche]

I like that suggestion

[silk hamlet]

and then you have things like warnings and PSAs to the players about abusive scamming that are visible ingame to warn them

which is another layer

[inland pelican]

The most cost effective and helpful bits would be my color idea with your warning. You win the Darwin award if you get scammed after that

[silk hamlet]

and there's other additional layers of other things as well - some of them can even involve law enforcement stuff for certain things, like for death threats or crime rings that might be using the game to launder money - this just scratches the surface of the topic

user safety is a complex topic

[errant niche]

Like the dude on RuneScape that went to prison for like 30 years because he said edgy things? I think that's too much lol.

[silk hamlet]

some games have used systems where if you are a toxic player you will only get matched up against other toxic players

idk how that would work out in this

cuz you can only really party up with people directly, there's no 'party search' tool

[errant niche]

We could just have a karma system where at the end of the match you can rate your teammates

[silk hamlet]

but there might be a possibility of something like that for matching players of appropriate skill level

for the dungeons you get sent to

which isnt about abuse but about invisible systems that keep the players from getting too frustrated

[errant niche]

That would be dungeon survival and success rate I think.

Easy implementation

[silk hamlet]

CoD has used hidden systems where they 'reward' you by matching you up against shitty players below your skill tier if you have been doing badly lol

[fervent crag]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @wary yarrow

Rogues are already fast enough to dodge most and every attacks that are thrown at them, aside from arrows, npc skeletons just always lock on your head even if your behind them.

For your 2nd suggestion, yes i agree with increasing the amount of steps rogues can take during stealth. They’re suppose to be master assassins so they definitely should have more steps than a wizards invisibility.

[errant niche]

Haven't played CoD in centuries

[silk hamlet]

i think that system is kinda scummy tbh - i remember the details of it being very cynical and basically a way to hook players into buying the CoD lootboxes

anyway it might be irrelevant for this game at least for now

[errant niche]

If rouge gets those bonuses then Cleric should be able to flash bang players.

[silk hamlet]

the hardcore nature of this game means you are supposed to get thrown to the wolves a lot

[wary yarrow]

Blinding light: slow players movement speed in an aoe radius? ^^

[silk hamlet]

but i suspect that the 'first level' coming in the future will be a lot more forgiving so newer players will have more braething room to have fun and get their bearings

the alpha test actually starts players in level 2 of the dungeon

[fervent crag]

I’d agree to that aswel, clerics need Holy nova or blinding light so they can actually stand their grounds instead of getting destroyed

[errant niche]

More like blinds them and impairs hearing. No slowing effects. Last like 5 seconds so I can peace out lmao.

[silk hamlet]

anyway nice talk i gotta jet

[errant niche]

Alright night

[wary yarrow]

I agree, the only problem I have with rogue dualwielding is that it's mostly useless atm, you can prolong combo's and get a bit of stats, but it's hardly ever worth it

[silk hamlet]

quick note; dual wielding with some exceptions is actually useless IRL martial arts XD

it looks cool but generally very impractical

[wary yarrow]

In real life you would use it as a way to deflect attacks most likely

[silk hamlet]

yeah most of the time the offhand is a guarding tool

[wary yarrow]

<not a martial artist

It would fit the rogue theme too

[silk hamlet]

but basically dual wielding is nothing like the fantasy games and movies make it seem like it is XD

it's like that with dual wielding guns too - doing that is stupidly inaccurate

[fervent crag]

You duel wield? Just throw on a stiletto dagger on your off hand and remove the rondel dagger, you’d be killing people fast especially if it has increased weapon damage

[silk hamlet]

but it looks cool!!!

[wary yarrow]

Yeah but then you're still only really using 1 dagger, regardless of MH or OH

[silk hamlet]

monkey neuron stimulation meme 'more weapon!! more weapon means more stabby!!!'

more shooty!

[wary yarrow]

They should just make a stiletto dagger for the MH, and still give options for parrying with the OH

[silk hamlet]

anyway later

irl in dual wielding, offhand weapon is mostly used to block while you make a strike with the main sword

[loud matrix]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @fading pendant
About the point of making alt accounts to hack:
The game having an up front cost in the future will deter making alt accounts just for that. Won't stop it and doesn't apply to playtesting right now, of course, but per general rule f2p games have much more hackers in comparison than games you have to pay up front regardless of the implemented anticheat.

[wary yarrow]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Also about my suggestion, it's not about buffing rogue to be stronger than other classes, obviously other classes need additional/better mechanics too. Try not to think of it too much in the context of the games current state.

[toxic grove]

Why are some suggestions Green and some are blue

[gleaming kettle]

Green means they have positive votes, blue means negative.

[toxic grove]

Nah i See posts which have 70 likes 1 dislike and are still blue

[novel jackal]

@opaque shore neeed admins for help brazzilians and my indication its @opaque shore fros this carg

[lucid root]

Voip yes, proximity chat no

[mystic sundial]

2 dagger double the stabby, cant argue with maths

[crimson stone]

2 daggers allow u to attack with different angles

[mystic sundial]

double the holes aswell

[verbal zealot]

Hold right and leftclick together was good on barb but never tried it on rogue, was that good/bad?

While dualwielding I mean.

[brittle harbor]

I made a suggestion on a guild hall for something to dump resources into. I wanted to get input on what others thought. The big downfall for me as a roguelike player is I can get a full legendary gear set in a matter of a week or two and it doesn't make me feel accomplished. Having something I can put the thousands of gold I make into and share with my friends where we all chip in would give me a reason to come back again and again.

[verbal zealot]

Trying to alternate clicks was clunky and weird, but simply holding both left and right click together made Barb swing both weapons pretty fast.

[brittle harbor]

I will attempt this on next playtest

[verbal zealot]

Guild hall would be cool. More storage in general very cool.
Gold pouches stacking to 1k and being able to split stack without leaving trade would be pog.

[brittle harbor]

true, the trading system will be good in the future. I think they aren't to worried about it as of yet because of how much work they have to do.

[verbal zealot]

These things already have multiple suggestion posts I think, easily 10+ Guild Hall requests

[agile seal]

And you can build things that takes hours to complete but you can pay premium to speed it up

and build troops so you can atack other guild halls.. wait wrong game

[lucid root]

Guilds will make solo even harder, which I'm in favor of

Unless there's a solo only guild, I'll join that one

I might have to make it

#d-and-d-suggestions message

All in favor of more blood and gore!

Fireballs making heads explode mmm

Would be cool if players bleed for a short amount of time after getting hit and you can follow blood trails

Keep it a short duration for the sake of conserving memory

[agile seal]

Have you considered plying Mortal kombat where it is 1v1 2.5d dungeon?

[lucid root]

Yeah but I want 1v3's

You underestimate how much I want to suffer

Honestly I am in favor of guilds, makes the feel more desolate for us that don't want to be in one

Desolation, loneliness, dark and darker, you know

All the good things

[agile seal]

Isn't it contradictory to say you want 1v3 (assuming you are soloing) but then state that you don't want be alone?

[lucid root]

No I want guilds but I don't want to be in one

In other words the more the game caters to group play the more difficult it will be for me, which is better

@ebon sky I played around with the idea of room by room corruption instead of circles, but you wouldn't have that final battle thing in the middle

[idle nebula]

this game seriously should come out sooner

[ebon sky]

Well, getting a final battle in the middle isn't really needed, imo - there should have at least 3 or 4 final rooms acting as "final battles rooms" (the biggest ones).

In any case, you can simply make in sort there is an equal room/corridor numbers between each "swarm appearance" initial point to always end in the middle.

Also, players getting the possibility to affect the swarm (eg. my holy water/sanctify suggestions) also introduces a sort of "strategy", where final battle is affected by the players using that gameplay aspect

[mellow salmon]

you are right but same thing is with blue potion and cleric shield spell. those poison bottles could be rare or expensive + it takes a few seconds to use it on a weapon. and its very much a typical dungeon fantasy idea so i thought it would suit this game

[formal raven]

Fundamental difference with the shield from cleric. The shield protects all damage over a period of time 1 min i think or more, blue potion is 45 physical damage in the next 15 seconds.

If you want a potion for poison it would have to be significantly worse than the ability. Such as a slow effect or 1/4 the tick damage. And since poisons tick damage is already low its nit the best. Also have to remember rogues also have a 1 time poison/damage increase. In other words potions should be fundamentally weaker than any class ability or spell. Also this potion would copy a passive not an ability or spell. The only potion that has done that is invis. And that potion is much weaker in terms of unable to move (even with rogue move ability) and lasting 1/4 the time. Idk if the poison would be worth it. I mean could you imagine if every class could now apply a dot that would kill you after you just barely managed to kill them?

[half cargo]

I made a suggestion, let me know what you think, I think it'd bring a lot of quality and more people would want to stay for the PvP, startegies, adn teamwork #d-and-d-suggestions message

[mellow salmon]

yea i get ur point. it could be hard to balance. Specially with archers. I still think its a good idea but pobably not worth it dev-wise

[formal raven]

I think it could be a good idea, but I already get sad enough when I barely kill a rogue then the poison kills me and noone benefits if we're both solo

[mellow salmon]

sometimes dungeon writes sad stories... with bad endings. thats whats beautiful in this game 😉

[modest thistle]

why people hate idea of removing gold bags?

[wary flower]

that's also why Goblin Slayer is dope!

[lucid root]

Are you suggesting just one gold stack?

[wary shell]

did you benefit from the stats on your secondary weapon at all times, or only when it was equipped?

[serene snow]

only when equipped

[modest thistle]

yea just make it number so u can buy item easier and make more space in chest

[shrewd lantern]

i think for spcae in the chest they can make cool quest dat unlock extra space

[lucid root]

Because inventory management is part of the games difficulty

[royal talon]

#d-and-d-suggestions message This would allow for ghosting and ruin the game imo

[modest thistle]

but u know its no about exploring space bc u have max 100 glod in inventory and im fine witch this acpect but im not fine with buying item and spiting money and no having space in chest bc i have gold it work for week or 2 bc they resart but if they lunch game it will be disaster

[shrewd lantern]

i hate in this game 1. Trade chat ! ( they need to make market cause i cant spend 3h to buy gear ) 2. they need to make quest dat unlock space in the chest 3. make a solo q or something good for solo players and all be happy

[lucid root]

Yeah they're going to work on trade I'm pretty sure

[modest thistle]

this could solve it [i think u should add boxes in trade market so u can check box to sort items types. So basically u can select roge green dagger and trading chat show u only that. Make this for every item/class/rarity it would really help buy items quicker]

[modest thistle]

its not about working its about have idea how to make it

[lucid root]

Knuckle weapon would be cool for monk

@red jewel I like the arrow scavenging idea

Finite arrows, but able to retrieve your arrows

So you're pretty much fine in pve but in pvp you can't just spam chokepoints forever

Spare quivers take up like 3 inventory slots or something

[pallid cairn]

release it

thats my suggestion

[red jewel]

Yea, recovery skill and campfires get your projectiles back.

But spammers wanna spam 😆

[lucid root]

Idk about campfire regenerating arrows though, seems silly

[red jewel]

They should either make all projectiles (throwing weapons), arrows, and magic infinite, or none of them.

Why, that's how it works in D&D. You go foraging and craft traps, poisons etc during rests

[granite plinth]

Suggestion from Suspense#8292
Max 100 arrows for Ranger, to be realistic. See source:

HO GOD

This guys

[red jewel]

It's no sillier than pressing a button and creating projectiles from thin air in seconds

[lucid root]

101 arrows? Laws of physics break down