It's about time Concatoloch gets a DESERVED nerf.

[lunar breach]

Or

[minor arch]

And there’s other dinos in the game you can use

[lunar breach]

Pay a LOTTTTT of money to JC so that they create New counters

[slow anvil]

Or just skoonamet abuse the conches

[tiny valve]

Unsurprisingly conloch can prove annoying to my team

[lunar breach]

Skoonamet isn't meta anymore unfortunetly

[minor arch]

It’s funny when you time battle ready with their shield

[slow anvil]

Yeah but mine deals pretty well with their conches

[tiny valve]

my team is getting stronger over time as more of it gets buffed

[lunar breach]

Yeah

[slow anvil]

Most of them tend to go for expose first move so I go for defense then br

[minor arch]

Yup

That’s exactly what they do, if I don’t have my concatoloch I gotta use skooonamet

[tiny valve]

was that community support J2?

[umbral snow]

The dual rend t1 is really weird because half of the time it decides that 50% + 50% ≠ 100%

[slow anvil]

Anyways we're once again getting off topic
The point is conch still doesn't have a 100% counter so as long as there's not a counter, I'm still gonna be complaining

[minor arch]

Exactly it should kill it. Not 45% + 54%

[slow anvil]

And I like conch because of how much damage it does but nevertheless it needs a nerf

[fervent granite]

Rounding issues with odd HP numbers

[minor arch]

As well as gyrganth

[umbral snow]

It has 2, technically. Issue is that both of them are instantly swapped on because they're in carboto range ☠️

And have no OE

[slow anvil]

Carboto range 💀💀💀

[umbral snow]

The hell happened with the slow mode here, has it always been like that?

[slow anvil]

I'm not sure

I think it was added after we were a bit....rough on the rend fix

[fervent granite]

Concatoloch can also just 🔄 out of potential chances to kill it with its grandiose SP immune + Rejuvenate OE combo and come back in later and wreak havoc again

[slow anvil]

The thread got too chaotic so I think mattiodon added slowmode

[fervent granite]

Stall abuse also has a part to play in this

[umbral snow]

Anyone who says conloch shouldn't be nerfed has never had someone play stall conloch (I love 20 minute matches)

[fervent granite]

Yeah I wonder why, what would happen if the chain got broken 😢

[balmy pebble]

mr.troodon has been warned

Reason: Capital letters

[tiny valve]

Carbotoceratops sweep

[slow anvil]

Man I remember in the cash tournament how boring it was to do those mirror matches every battle

[fervent granite]

The fact you even have to repeatedly do them

Says a lot about oppression and team countering

[umbral snow]

Mfs who don't play Shield --> Expose conloch mirror are menaces to society

[simple meadow]

all threads have slowmode

[slow anvil]

My memory is lousy so idk

[slow anvil]

Fr. I hate people who do that so much like give me my win already

[minor arch]

I’m not against a nerf, what I am against is a bias one, all of the meta apex’s are broken (plus all concatoloch “nerfs” turn it into literal useless garbage) but yes, get rid of the first ability that allows it to stall (or change it to a 1x attack) and then reduce damage resistance to 50 along with swap prevent, and then change the heal on escape to only be active at 33% or disabled. Gyrganth needs a nerf as well as the others. Look at my time and I tell you I’ve come across more concatolochs than gyrganth (because gyrganth is more broken)

[slow anvil]

I think the only problem with conch v grygan is that grygan can continue switching and getting itself below half hp until conch doesn't stun it so it can win

[minor arch]

Guilty, I stall against 10k hp geminidues 💀

[fervent granite]

Even if Rejuvenate OE goes away, stall abuse into SP immunity...

[umbral snow]

All I ask is that it not be significantly better than the other apexes and just be on par with them

[tiny valve]

as I keep saying all modern apexes need a nerf just Conloch is the most oppressive one

[fervent granite]

The whole chain needs a nerf 💀

[slow anvil]

I get that but it's such a rude way to continue you and the opp's suffering in a conch mirror match

[umbral snow]

We nerfing back to srg3 with this one 🗣️

[slow anvil]

Every creature unique and above needs rebalancing
I hope they do that in 3.11

[tiny valve]

nerf back down to 2.6 so that I can use shart dog

[fervent granite]

Back to Compy G1/G2 🤑 We're including tournament formats that since hindered my performance in them

[minor arch]

Yeah but I don’t have a counter to it lol

[minor arch]

What 💀

[slow anvil]

Shart dog 🔛🔝

[tiny valve]

do you not know of Shart Dog

[minor arch]

Which one is that

[tiny valve]

https://tenor.com/view/star-lord-star-lord-did-we-just-lose-star-lord-did-we-just-true-star-lord-did-we-just-win-did-we-just-lose-gif-7704850861712378939

[slow anvil]

Bro not keeping up with JWA slander tsk tsk

[minor arch]

I was gone for like 7 months

[tiny valve]

2.6 was more then 7 months ago

[minor arch]

You talking about indolycan?

[slow anvil]

No

[tiny valve]

no thats Shart Chupacabra

[minor arch]

I also recently joined this server. So yes I’m not familiar with all slangs to ever exist

[tiny valve]

lets just say

you know if he had more health and instant rend it could be a counter

[slow anvil]

Man that was like 3 years ago

[tiny valve]

It was...

[slow anvil]

Honestly I only know about shart dog because I joined paleo back when I was edgy and cringe

[tiny valve]

I don't like knowing this

but yeah this is not Conloch talk

[slow anvil]

Oh right

Back to where we were

[tiny valve]

nerf it

[slow anvil]

Sì

[distant urchin]

yes

[tiny valve]

personally I believe we extend the cooldown on the stun
remove the decel immunity so rejuvenate actually decels
change rejuvenate to only activate after a certain threshold
limit swap prevent res

[slow anvil]

Ima make my take on it and get y'alls thoughts

[fluid sundial]

Rejuvenate on escape working only when threatened would make conca much more manageable.

[distant urchin]

lemme see if i can make smth similar to that concept

[tiny valve]

cooldown 2 for stunning slowing seems fair

[slow anvil]

Oh yeah

[distant urchin]

fr

[fluid sundial]

Change deceleration immunity to 50% resist

[slow anvil]

100% Stun on an impact is bogus

[distant urchin]

what abt borealopeltas stunning impact?

[tiny valve]

idk I have never seen anything about borealo

except the human teeth

why

[fluid sundial]

25% speed reduction resistance to match its component concasaurus

[distant urchin]

priority 100% group stun 1.75 move

[tiny valve]

fair and or balanced

[distant urchin]

on revenge that is

[fluid sundial]

It what

[tiny valve]

Borealopelta has human teeth

[minor arch]

Oh this guy. Dude I loved this guy when he first came out, got it to level 20 (before a unique hybrid was even datamined) and got its damage to like 1400+. Back then it was basically killing everything with the rend + vulnerability or getting them extremely low with the impact and crit

[tiny valve]

Mine is L25
2/2/2

I was going for it before Atops released

[minor arch]

Same lol. I already knew vulnerability counter was broken

[distant urchin]

i never really like it and the other one until now

now i love therium and shart dog

[tiny valve]

bajatondon has a different counter with the exact same name

[distant urchin]

what

[tiny valve]

I was also going for Eleshart
and Shart Doed

shart doed is L21 but I started going for Ankylodact
and also Atops released so I put andrew towards that

[distant urchin]

oh yeah

except that one is better since it is for 2 turns instead of 1

[tiny valve]

both have exposing counter
yet they are different moves
bajas is just better

Oloro also just has a stronger version of A's counter

[fluid sundial]

Here’s what I would do.
Change speed reduction immunity to 33% resistance. (Between 25 and 100 resist of its components)
Change the stun immunity to 75% (between 50 and 100 of its components)
Stun has a 2 turn cooldown
Rejuvenate on escape only works when it is at 33% or less. Maybe 25% or less.

[slow anvil]

Yeah you just basically described what I was gonna do

[tiny valve]

more or less

[fluid sundial]

In return give it a 50% taunt resist like concasaurus

That is only useful in raids anyway.

[tiny valve]

still strong but probably not as oppressive

[fluid sundial]

Either 50% or 33% taunt resist.

[fervent granite]

Either 0 or 100% for something RNG related

[fluid sundial]

The problem with that is that it’s component only has 50% taunt resist

And it’s other component has none. So giving it 100 taunt resist would come form nowhere. People would complain.

It’s as nonsensical as Pantherator having determined strike

[sturdy wigeon]

These are concatoloch's matchups when it got that one nerf that was quickly reverted

Spinonyx is gryganyth and pyrritator is magnaraptor

[dark gale]

So the slowing would work if it was like other oe s that go through resistances but they apparently never thought of that when making it

[zenith obsidian]

i just close the game tbh

[slow anvil]

Best counter tbf

[umbral snow]

best concatoloch counter is a DDoS attack

[flat panther]

real

[upper dome]

If the hp number is odd it will round it down, leaving the dino at 1 hp

The message was from yesterday 💀

[slow anvil]

Basically if it's an advantage tournament thylos ain't killing conch if it has an odd hp number

[upper dome]

Yup

[golden star]

Right if you lot want a good nerf without it being too harsh (even though it should be) first thing is remove this things no escape resistance

The fact this thing has all this healing and can just LEAVE when it’s bled is absurd

[fluid sundial]

Afflicting lockdown is like the only way to trap it. Even then it can just heal.

[upper dome]

And maybe nerf its on escape (give it an alert version of this on escape, so it doesnt mess with dinos like koreanosaurus who already have rejuvenate on escape )

[dark gale]

Or they could give conc a new version of it

Like alert (what ever the oe name is here)

[golden star]

In all honesty the escape healing is tolerable to an extent, what annoys me with it is you’re unable to use it against your opponent because it’s also immune to speed decrease

Like why would you give it that when it’s immune to it?????????

The thing has literally no downsides

[dark gale]

Have you fought it? Literally the oe is super annoying

[upper dome]

Yup, the speed decrease resistance was put just so it didnt get punished by it (knew it as soon as I saw the notes)

[upper dome]

It was supposed to but because of what I've stated above it doesn't

[golden star]

I have and I can also say I could set things up against it if the slow actually did what its supposed to do

[golden star]

That’s utterly stupid

Then make a new OE?????????

The whole point of that slowing was to at least somewhat balance that ability out, a full heal cleanse immediately with no downsides? How did that even get in the main game without anyone saying “this might be a bit much”

[golden star]

Just to add I do absolutely hate it, I hate conca’s (unique) one enough as it is but like I said the slow adds some sort of counter play against its absurdity

[dark gale]

What does the slow do?

[upper dome]

Nothing, cause they gave it immunity to it so I doesnt get punished by its OE (it is supposed to heall you to full hp but set your speed to 0)

[golden star]

And for anyone who’s confused like “oh how could you even benefit from that” thylos benefits if the thing had just healed

Then you WILL be faster and can just end it with dual rend

[upper dome]

If it didnt use hastening shelter

Screw vitalize or whatever it is now

[golden star]

No no, if it used that first THEN you swapped even with the speed increase you should be faster depending on boosts

[upper dome]

Yeah, I forgot toloch doesnt get speed boosts

So TI is always faster

[dark gale]

Not what I ment

[upper dome]

Eggsplain man

[minor arch]

Doesn’t help much since it has 3 healing abilities

[dark gale]

Only 1 cleanses

[hasty bone]

Thylos never had an oe impact

[slow anvil]

dawg that was 4 days ago 💀

[hasty bone]

oh

but still

[slow anvil]

true

[minor arch]

I thought it did, probably just got it mixed up with compso oe

[distant urchin]

didn't thylos have a strike not an impact

[slow anvil]

ye

[minor arch]

Yeah it has strike, compsoraptor has impact

[slow anvil]

idk if this is too "hateful" but the server is 17+ so I don't understand why they'd mute me

but if I don't talk in here or just at all, I probably got muted lol

hold up lemme read the rules again to see if this violates anything

wait we can't post vulgar content even though this is a 17+ server?
what's the point of even being a 17+ server if you can't even swear 💀

[minor arch]

Good

[minor arch]

Because sometimes kids lie

[balmy pebble]

thegamingsaurus has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[slow anvil]

wait what did I say?

[minor arch]

Yeah but some people don’t want kids learning some of the words

[slow anvil]

I mean either way, they're gonna find out I mean this is the same platform where we clown on its moderators

[upper dome]

Y, they will just learn em with friends anyway, Im 17 now but learn them 12 years agowith friends on school

[dark gale]

Can we go back on topic

I don't want this shut down

[distant urchin]

why does expose weakness have vulnerable before attacking

[dark gale]

Expose weakness shouldn't give armor since it now shatters

I'm fine with the vulnerability part but the armor is annoying

[distant urchin]

make it shield instead

[latent igloo]

I think that would be worse

[upper dome]

I dont, most dinos have ways to remove it

Armor increase can only be removed via nullification

[latent igloo]

And those same moves bypass armror

[upper dome]

yup

[latent igloo]

Armor piercing attacks wont be able to do much if cloch gets another move that can shield it

[upper dome]

it can just keep stalling with SF

[latent igloo]

I get that but adding shields would only be worse

[upper dome]

wich is annoying af if you are using something like a concato/ grypo on a tournament per example

[upper dome]

maybe

if it was a 25% shield

[latent igloo]

Even if we did replace the armor increase with shields what would that accomplish?

[upper dome]

I actually dont know, but 55% total armor is worse (for opponent) than a 25% shield (would probably ease matchups like dlux or comspov)

[latent igloo]

It really wouldnt, dlux has a base move that bypasses armor but with shields that armor bypass gets negated

[upper dome]

speaking about aflicting horn / lighspeed charge and run, since those are the most used moves against it

no one uses CHS unless they want to bait ot a SV to then aflicting horn it

[fluid sundial]

I propose nerfing its 66% HP heal to a more reasonable 40% HP like Alankyloceratops once had.

This thing can easily be boosted to 8.3k or 9.2k health.

[dark gale]

50% might work

But the oe should definitely be only active at 33% hp

[high cave]

It's the same one that sin has

[flat panther]

alankyloceratops never had 40% tho

[fluid sundial]

Yes it did. Dragon’s flight once did 40% max

[fluid sundial]

I’d make it 25%. Because a toloch at 33% can still have like 2.5k-3k health left

[flat panther]

Oh, yeah that was a bug tho so

[fluid sundial]

Still would be significantly better on toloch

[slow anvil]

wait a minute

so y'all know that nothing can beat conch h2h as a hard counter
we missed the hard counter xd

conch's hard counter is Magna if it has an hp build

so it DOES have a hard counter but yes I know I know, 1 out of 408 creatures isn't enough to say that this proves that it doesn't need a nerf
I was just pointing it out

[tiny valve]

this is not the way you build Magnar though

[slow anvil]

that's the problem

[tiny valve]

Last I checked (I didn't) Magnar is all speed and attack
little if any health

[slow anvil]

so it means that out of the thousands that have a Magnaraptor, only 500 or smth have that build

[tiny valve]

less I imagine

[slow anvil]

maybe idk

[tiny valve]

don't want to loose to gryg

[slow anvil]

even if it is only 500, you know how much of the playerbase that is?
0.005%

[tiny valve]

yeah

[slow anvil]

out of 10,000,000 players, only 500 can counter the game's most meta creature?

like you can see the problem with that

[tiny valve]

easily

well Tryostronix counters
nobody aside from me uses a good enough Tryo to do so probably
I'll probably have to drop it to leave aviary
and conc can just swap

[slow anvil]

there's less than 100 people that use tryo competitively

maybe even less because people just give up on this game too early

but from 10 million that's another 0.001%

[tiny valve]

I'm getting lower and lower high and average scores each season
so its just not worth keeping with the team I've got

[slow anvil]

so the amount of people that can counter conch 100% are only 0.006% of the playerbase

[tiny valve]

Gnyx also works
its 100% but conc swaps out

Tryo is actually a 50/50 as it needs to crit

[slow anvil]

so a lot more let's say 1500 more have giganyx at lvl 30 with boosts

that's still only 0.021% of the playerbase

[tiny valve]

and again
the people who use these creatures competitively either drop them or quit

[slow anvil]

exactly

[tiny valve]

again
I'll have to drop Tryo soonish if I want to escape the bottleneck

I'll have a counter once my SpinoA is ready though
Oh wait!

[slow anvil]

this game is like Rise of Kingdoms
the only people who continue playing it are the ones that have been there for a long time or ones that spent a lot of money on it

[tiny valve]

Assuming I start SpinoA tomorrow again

[slow anvil]

hmmm surely JC won't do anything to stop you...wait

[tiny valve]

it takes 2-3 months to get it from 16 (900/1500) to 21

whats the bet its not even that good by then

[slow anvil]

yeah I'll have a lvl 21 spaegy by the end of October since I thankfully can still do them

[tiny valve]

unnamed tyrannosaurus based creature
probably doesn't counter

[slow anvil]

another problem with the game unfortunately: POWERCREEP

[tiny valve]

I can do a spino raid
I have a good Poukan, it can probably work
just its so hyperspecific

not to mention all the coin and boosts I'd then need
its ridiculous

[slow anvil]

man I want ludia back

jam city ruined the company

[tiny valve]

I'll be plotting how to take it down tomorrow
its probably doable

[slow anvil]

definitely is

best of luck to you

[tiny valve]

I'll need an insane team so this better go well

[upper dome]

what u said is true, HOWEVER draco lux´s broken swap in breaks magna's reliability (as we all unfortunantely know)

[tiny valve]

yeah if you're building Magnar you go for speed

[upper dome]

yup, or else you might loose mirrors and stuff

or even get outsped by speedy gryganith builds

I've seen it happen

[tiny valve]

I think its for Gryga

[upper dome]

yeah, most mirrors end with a swap to draco

[vast spoke]

should've gotten nerfed ages ago

and it did but got reverted for no reason

18 people are noobs

[cursive agate]

Buff skoonamet, or even old apexes like kyrie to make them actually counter cloch. Maybe improve gry's stun resistance, or lower the stun chance of clochs move from 100% to 50% or something

[high cave]

Or buff mortem rex

[latent igloo]

Bro is saying buff skoonamet😭🗿

[cursive agate]

Make it more fierce, but make it more killable (not from swap) at the same time. Its annoying because it can heal so much in such a short cooldown, but it should be able to do more damage against cloch because it either hits and not do enough damage (and gets killed) or it uses move 4 and gets killed before it can even hit

It should be able to increase damage without such a big sacrifice that it either gets killed or gets swapped in after using the buff

[latent igloo]

With out the bug sacrifice it's threatened state wouldn't activate in most cases

Which is the main point of the big sacrifice

[cursive agate]

Bring the threated state to 67% or something

[latent igloo]

Honestly I have a level 30T2 skoonamet but I think it's fine as it is

[cursive agate]

The sacrifice gives access to priority, but that doesnt break shield, cloch is shielded most of the time

[latent igloo]

It dosent need a nerf (atleast not a big one) and it dosent need a buff

[cursive agate]

That would explain it. Mine is always lower than enemy. Mine is 26 with some boosts while cloches i see are mostly 30

[latent igloo]

It's impact deals 1.75x of base attack and it shatters so it's fine, plus the rampage is a piercing priority so it's fine for it's moves to vary a bit depending on the situation. You either use the big priority hit or you use impact and still deal tons of damage

[latent igloo]

That's just terrible matchmaking

[cursive agate]

I definitely agree that the heal part is ridiculous. But id also like if its able to shatter at a buffed damage without going so low health that it gets killed before even attacking
Thats why gry does better because grys buff move gives it a shield rather than lowers its health

[latent igloo]

I agree with the part of buffing old raid apex's but buffing skoonamet is to much

[cursive agate]

Yep, skoonamet vs cloch is a guaranteed loss for me

[cursive agate]

Its only fine when its able to 1 shot. I cant 1 shot anything lmao, if cloch survives the attack im done, which cloch always survived my attack because cloches are always more than 6k health even in library

[latent igloo]

That's because gryganyth and skoonamet work in different ways, skoonamet is able to heal a lot and gain Invincibility with a cooldown of one but gryganyth heal is only a cooldown of 2 and doesn't offer Invincibility

[latent igloo]

So it needs a buff because YOU can't one shot things?

[cursive agate]

Different problem, that would go to the matchmaking problem

[latent igloo]

I get that it gets infuriating not being able to take down enemies in a single shot but it all depends matchmaking, sometimes you face players you can easily one shot and other times the opponents are to hard to beat or they only win based on dumb luck but that shouldn't mean something should be buffed that still relatively good

[cursive agate]

But even a higher attack skoonamet will need to be in buffed state to be able to one shot, buffed state means half the health, half the health means cloches big attack will kill it

Im just saying there should be more hard counters for cloch

[latent igloo]

Against cloch it's all mind games and cloch is sometimes more than likely to come out the victor if skoonamet dosent guess correctly or is being an idiot in the match

[cursive agate]

Mind game when theyre level i guess

[latent igloo]

Right my bad forgot you have a low level skoonamet

But my point still stands

[cursive agate]

Btw i have never ever faced any players who is lower level than me. Like maybe an occasional lower level dino but they always have something else thats max level. Everything i have is 26 or 27

[latent igloo]

Are you Lockwood library?

[cursive agate]

So no ive never had the honour to 1 shot anything 🥲

[latent igloo]

Same here, ive only got two level 30s, 2 level 28, 2 level 26, a level 25 constrictoraptor with 14 speed boosts and a level 23 thylos with 10 speed boosts

[cursive agate]

I suggest you stop leveling thylos at 25 because ive learned to stop using uniques lol

[latent igloo]

Yeah I've done that with all of the unqiues I use to use

Except for panthertor, it's level 30 T1

[cursive agate]

I still have a unique aloch and ptor but everything else is apex

Ive got old stuff like gdeus and lycan holding up a spot

For future apexes, who knows when ill unlock them

[latent igloo]

The creatures on or above level 26 are apex except for the pantherator I just mentioned

[cursive agate]

I used to use constrictoraptor but its failing to kill stuff on revenge because of its low attack so its basically useless 🥲 swapped it off to something else

I wish i have the dna to unlock your 2 lv 26 apexes

But i lack styra and draco

Theyre nowhere near 25

I was wrong i have enough styra

[latent igloo]

My two level 26 and literally draco Lux and compsoven

[cursive agate]

Nowhere near compso, and im waiting for unique discount for dlux

Also actually i dont lack styra i lack dracorex!

[latent igloo]

Ah I see

[slow anvil]

trykovenator dropped

it's a conch counter 🥳

and a 100% one because you can't really switch Draco lux on it

you don't need a certain build either

[tiny valve]

its not 100%
but its very close

[fervent granite]

Doesn't change the fact it's still oppressive for what it does

[dark gale]

Conc is the dilo of apex

[latent igloo]

Until we get Dilorazorion

[tiny valve]

absolutely

still easily the best creature

[upper moss]

I agree that all creatures should be nerfed, except the ones I use. 😹😹😹

[light quiver]

I have a Plateorex and a Skoonametrodon, and I would understand if both were nerfed

[upper moss]

Plateo got a big nerf already and you want more. Ok.

[light quiver]

When did get nerfed?

[tiny valve]

It's swap locks it down for 2 turns instead of 1

[latent igloo]

Plateopika*

They meant plateopikas swap in

[dark gale]

It wasn't locked down at all

For a while

Just like pika but I already told DL about that so it's on the radar

[upper moss]

It's amazing that you guys are asking for a creature you have spent your hard-earned coins to be nerfed. It's easier to just get a worse creature. It's already nerfed by design. 😹

[tiny valve]

yeah because Conloch is the strongest creature by a mile

I don't have it I'm just going to overlevel my Concatosaurus

[dark gale]

I have it and it's way to op

[high cave]

I have it and I agree

[dark gale]

Anyone would

[dark gale]

In the right mind

[high cave]

It's still powerful I think the vulnerability should be after the attack instead of before

I killed it

Now gryganyth wins every time

[high cave]

And my new gryganyth can kill normal concatoloch

[upper moss]

Gryga is way better than Conca. You're just whining.

[tiny valve]

no gryga is worse overall

they're both incredibly strong
but conc is stronger

[distant urchin]

dude i've fought gryg once

and it only took me a rexy and dracoceratosaurus

they were stupid playing it

[ivory dagger]

Is there anything released this year at the top end that doesn't need nerfing into the ground?

When you have minimally boosted 26s/27s (or even unboosted) holding their own against and often beating fully boosted 30s, clearly a substantial rebalanced is required.

[muted kernel]

If I had the coin I would think about taking conloch off my team. He doesn't do so well in the gyro arena anymore.

[high cave]

Because trykov

[dark gale]

I think that's a skill issue

[tiny valve]

thats just a skill issue

[dark gale]

It 100% is

[high cave]

Yeah it is

[craggy summit]

Seems to be the best counter.

No not trykovenator but them not knowing about concatolochs 100% swap prevention.

[high cave]

Or they don't want it to heal and get a attack and crit boost

This is why they didn't swap

[craggy summit]

Yes I know about trykoV no escape 😅, but with the meta currently this person had a draco lux which removes the buffs and a flock which walls trykoV

[high cave]

Also the Rampage

Would kill it

[craggy summit]

On my 1800 dmg trykoV 😅

[high cave]

Because trykov counter makes draco lux vulnerable and with your Rampage

Because draco lux can't easily kill trykov from a swap In

[craggy summit]

Missing the point though that a decent concatoloch player can easily play around its counters. Alot easier than alot of other creatures.

[high cave]

I mean true

[craggy summit]

Has way too high resistances and it's counter like TrykoV and Gryganyth have other creatures that wall them. Concatoloch doesn't really have a brick wall match up. Can even beat some of its counters with RNG

[high cave]

I made some that could easily fit in the meta (the colossal compy are wip and godzilla is a joke

[craggy summit]

Never know colossal compy could be a thing in the future 😂 fuse it with a sauropod.

But gor the player base it would be better to balence concatoloch than keep making hybrids that are expensive to make. Would be OK with it with regular coin events and more access to not paid booste refund tokens.

[high cave]

Colossal compy is a april fools boss

[craggy summit]

So was the dodo and that's in the game 😅

[high cave]

Yeah I know

[craggy summit]

Anything is possible we even have frogs that can kill therapods 🤣

[high cave]

But lord lythornax and the goats

[craggy summit]

Except nerfs they seem to be impossible atm.

[high cave]

Which one do you think might have a chance in the meta

Like against concatoloch

[craggy summit]

Probably the indoT one concatoloch has no rend resistance.

[high cave]

That's literally the 1st one in the list

[craggy summit]

Armour from the ankylo side would help vs the rampage and possible cloak stops concato from buffing with the counter.

[high cave]

It definitely can be killed

But it's powerful

[craggy summit]

Seems decent to me, probably a on escape rend attack might be better vs concatoloch.

Something needs to stop its safety in swapping.

[high cave]

Yeah

Welp this is concatoloch's nightmare

Depends on what concatoloch does next

If it heals and use impact it could win

But if it swaps

Well you know what will happen

[craggy summit]

Like sometimes you actually cant counter the thing no matter how lved your creatures are.

[muted kernel]

I'm finding again and again in the higher arenas that concatoloch has many counters and isn't OP at all. He has lots of counters. The newer apexs are much harder to deal with. But they seem fairly par with each other. Gotta keep up with the meta, chasing the new Dino's otherwise you'll get crushed to their new abilities.

[lunar breach]

"Conch is not OP at all"
Yeah so no Cloch is OP
All of it's counter are not guaranteed because of the swap prevention immunity
Only Trykov Skoona and Plat can beat it in a 1V1 no matter what
All the other are rng relevant
So basically you're telling me that 0.75% of the game countering 1 dino is normal and balanced ?
Trykov is good agaisnt 3 dino
THREE
And has got many counters
While Cloch
3 Counter, all the other RNG dependent
1 out of the current Meta
And the other 2 that can't 100% kill it because again, swap immunity
And, oh, all the other dino in the game are struggling against Cloch ?
Sounds fair to me

[craggy summit]

Yes the newer apexs can beat concatoloch, the only problem is that to unlock a fusible apex.

1. Need to get 700k coin if you don't have the components lved to 25 (from 21).
2. Boost tokens which JC refuse to give to f2p. Like when was the last free attack refund token.
3. Most components being exclusive and behind pay walls.
4. JC Using the same exclusive components for different fusible apexs, making the DNA an absolute grind.

Why its easier and fairer on the community to nerf concatoloch. Pvp isn't fun with it being in, it's boring to face against.

[gleaming tide]

😂😂😂😂 The complaining still continues....lol.

[tiny valve]

Yeah that sounds about right

[tiny valve]

Its not just conloch but it's definitely the biggest offender

[slow anvil]

well well well

y'all asked, they delivered

and it's a huge nerf

stun Res nerf makes grygan way more countery to it

[cursive agate]

Ooof, i was literally thinking about spending 600k coins on concatoloch like an hour ago!

[flat panther]

good thing you didn't

[slow anvil]

coin sale is so clutch

glad now I can work for smth else because of this huge nerf

[cursive agate]

The stunning changes are gonna hurt
Still definitely meta relevant, just not completely OP

[cursive agate]

Literally been saving up for unique discount for ages

[cursive agate]

But still kinda shame that ive been fiping and requesting its components for months (and obvsiously saving up for months)

[flat panther]

told y'all a nerf would come eventually, it just takes time

[tiny valve]

Its concover

[slow anvil]

fr

[tiny valve]

well
not really
still a strong creature

[flat panther]

gryga or raja is probably #1 now

[tiny valve]

I'm happy that its no longer oppressively strong

[pine cosmos]

Now which creature needs to b nerfed?🤣

[high cave]

I think everything is actually fine

Especially after concatoloch's nerf

[tiny valve]

this is
not true

everything at the top needs to be toned down
but Conloch not being as oppressive is a good start

[pine cosmos]

Trykove will simply replace conc seat

[tiny valve]

Trykoven isn't #1

[high cave]

Only thing I think needs a changed is raja 75% Affliction resistance

[pine cosmos]

I didnt mean it's #1. But what trykoven can do is very similar to pre nerf conc

[tiny valve]

it can't stun

and it only heals off devour

[pine cosmos]

I meant against the meta

[latent igloo]

Grygs heal should have 1 more cooldown

[high cave]

It can't heal more than half it's health

[simple meadow]

well, that wraps up this post. Thank you everyone for the civil discussion, but us that wanted a conloch nerf have finally won

VICTORY

[muted kernel]

You are right. Conloch is complete dog poop now with the new nerf

[high cave]

Yep we won

[muted kernel]

You guys won! Conloch for that big nerf you all wanted. Now he is way less helpful in raids too! Hahaha

[simple meadow]

womp womp

[high cave]

I'm pretty sure concatoloch isn't used that much in raids

[balmy pebble]

thegamingsaurus has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[simple meadow]

😂

so saddd, the hard carry is nerfed!

[high cave]

But who cares at least it's not immortal

[slow anvil]

chat clip that I didn't do anything wrong

[simple meadow]

find other creatures to whale now

[high cave]

The t and letterf

[slow anvil]

beuh

[high cave]

I know

[slow anvil]

Compsoven is actually gonna be the #1 creature now I think

beats basically everything except conch but now that the nerfie came, I think it's cemented itself

dawg 💀

[tiny valve]

if you genuinely think Conloch is bad then you or whatever you were fighting had a huge skill issue

[simple meadow]

I'm in shores dude

[tiny valve]

mfw it was a contender for T15.5
the only contender

[simple meadow]

deleted message?

[sturdy wigeon]

Just because gryganyth now beats concatoloch 7/8 times it doesn’t mean it’s suddenly trash 💀

[tiny valve]

Trykoven is a 99% counter
instead of a 93% counter

[slow anvil]

obviously the newer creatures will always beat the older models it's basically how every game works
conch is just one who made it really unfair and unbalanced everything

[latent igloo]

Who comes up with those statistics? 💀

[tiny valve]

which

[latent igloo]

^

[tiny valve]

oh ok

[slow anvil]

John from the chick fil a bathroom

[tiny valve]

Trykoven would loose against Conloch if it was stunned twice

which only happens around 7% of the time

now that the stun is only 50%
its not exactly half as likely because resistances are weird

Gryga probably wins 75% of the time now instead of 50
I'm not doing the maths

[slow anvil]

actually

I think that number is lower cuz the stun res got lowered too

[tiny valve]

oh true

[slow anvil]

skewer boutta go brr

[tiny valve]

idk how the matchup worked anyway

[slow anvil]

skulliosis

[tiny valve]

always thought it was max ferocity into rampage

and just hoping you aren't stunned

[sturdy wigeon]

It is

[slow anvil]

in a h2h it is
but there's no way you're gonna face a h2h in pvp

[tiny valve]

yeah true

[simple meadow]

anyways

should I close the post now that we got what we wanted

[slow anvil]

now I'd say smth around the lines of S>MF>S

[sturdy wigeon]

Yeah

[tiny valve]

you can

[sturdy wigeon]

No point anymore since we got what we wanted

[slow anvil]

you shall
it has completed its purpose and we're very thankful

[sturdy wigeon]

Now

💀

[lunar breach]

I love how are you saying that
It's like Cloch has become useless
When it's still top 5

[sturdy wigeon]

Very poopy indeed.

[lunar breach]

Like
The nerf just made Thylos and Gryg more viable

That's it
Otherwise Cloch keeps its old counter (I think)

[latent igloo]

Cloch 1v1s are gonna be hell

[sturdy wigeon]

Its still the same

SF > speed tie expose weakness

[upper dome]

Yup, unless you get stunned after the 2nd sf

If the oponent decides to try

[ivory dagger]

It's about half the nerf it needed (still needs at a minimum - swap resistance down to 50, slow resistance to zero, swap out heal no more than 50 (ideally more like 33)).

Now do proper rebalances on sah, gryg, magna and others (ie nerf them, into the ground - which would still only put them where they should be).

[slow anvil]

I mean at that point you just don't want it to be an apex you want it to be a legendary 💀

[lunar breach]

Swap resistance should be 0 tho

And rejevunate like 66% or something

[lucid wolf]

Or it should afflict and be unable to swap when it does rejuvenate on escape

[sturdy wigeon]

I’d say this is a good enough nerf though

Doesn’t kick it out of the meta but also makes it killable

[lunar breach]

Ngl the nerf didn't affect Cloch itself
Just made Gryg and Thylos better

[sturdy wigeon]

It did

[lunar breach]

That's it
Cloch is still annoying af other against dinos

[ivory dagger]

It's resilient, it shouldn't have slow resistance, especially when one of its moves is supposed to slow it!! Same goes for swap resist (should be cunning based).
What I've outlined simply brings it on par with most other apexes (ie those not released this year) and high uniques - as opposed to be unstoppable killing machines unless you happen to be using one or two other new releases.
If I was being pedantic I COULD have pointed out it's counter shouldn't really be armour piercing either, but I let that be.

[sturdy wigeon]

Conloch is either #3 or #4 now

[lucid wolf]

It can be stunned but that’s all if you think about it

I think we can call that a stunning nerf

[ivory dagger]

The nerf has added maybe one or two counters at best.

[sturdy wigeon]

Its longevity has also taken a hit

[lunar breach]

Yeah but like
Except Thylos and Gryg
(Wich are great, good that we have less rng reliable counters)
Does it really affected Cloch ?
Did it gain more counter that couldn't beat it at all before ?
Rejevunate should just be 66 %
And swap should be 50% or 0

[lucid wolf]

Good thing it lived long enough honestly

[lunar breach]

Yeah

[lucid wolf]

Red Rex now as a chance

[lunar breach]

Well good for Red Rex but like
No one really use it
So hum idk about that

[ivory dagger]

Till it swaps.

[lucid wolf]

I do 🤣

[lunar breach]

It's used not saying that it isn't
But people rather use Apexes over it

Generally btw

[lucid wolf]

Yeah I understand

But appart of that it’s basically still the same

[lunar breach]

Yeah

[lucid wolf]

Good thing is it can no longer be refered as the top 1

[light quiver]

More than I expected, ngl

[umbral snow]

also, I need you all to know that it is NOT garbage now

it's still top 5, just not nearly as oppressive

[slow anvil]

yeah

expect everything to barely change

[rough portal]

I'm gonna say it...it ain't the sort of nerf y'all think it is.

The hit to Stun Resistance doesn't mean a thing because there's nothing that'll really be able to capitalize on it. You MIGHT get an opposing Conch into a scenario where it's stunned and in swap-damage range, but without something to lock it down, the odds of that ever going in your favor aren't great.

100% Swap Prevention Resistance will forever be the real problem with Concatoloch, not Stunning.

And frankly the hit to the Stun effect on Group Slowing Impact makes even less sense...

[latent igloo]

Gryg can now stun it and Draco Lux now has a higher chance of stunning it, plus it'll give thylos a somewhat of a chance to kill cloch without being stunned 100% of the time

[rough portal]

Gryganth has as much of a chance Stunning Concato as Concato has of Stunning Gryganth and Draco always had high odds of Stunning it anyway. In both cases Concato can simply heal itself the following turn if Shielded Vitalize is available, and in all three cases Concato can still escape.

And in Thylos' case especially, Concato still easily sets it up for a Swap-In kill by exploiting Thylos' own On-Escape.

It's a nerf, but not the one it needed, and one that isn't really going to change much in the long term

[latent igloo]

Wait I thought we were talking about cloch not concato

[slow anvil]

here's the thing

[rough portal]

https://tenor.com/view/thing-fantastic-four-gif-9183135

[latent igloo]

https://tenor.com/view/ratcockroach-gif-9933737926074927923

[slow anvil]

the stun res and stun on the impact are really huge nerfs because of 3 reasons

1. it means that things that relied on rng now rely even less on rng to kill this monstrosity
2. it welcomes new opportunities to counter it with creatures that would simply never counter it like surprisingly, Styracosaurus Lux
3. this lowers conch's place in the meta significantly now that there are more counters to it and because of this stun nerf

[rough portal]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-press-x-la-noire-meme-x-button-gif-19259237

[rough portal]

The thing with Stun is that it doesn't operate like normal debuffs. In essence not being stunned is the same thing as having 100% Resistance to it anyway, because aside from possibly taking damage nothing else happens.

[upper dome]

I agree with you, the proper nerf would be removal of SP resistance and rework or OE / heal

[simple meadow]

the nerf was quite solid. It did not add more counters, but the ones it did have were solidified even more. This is a pretty good way to do it in my opinion without lowering usage a lot

[flat panther]

Exactly this,

Now the things that are supposed to counter it, can counter it

oh and it also helps against mirror

[craggy summit]

It was a good nerf for one specific match up (Gryganyth). Problem with that, which what I think Super was getting at was that you can easily counter Gryganyth and thylos with some sort of swap in cunning because you can't pin concatoloch.

It's just the play style of concatoloch for me. Just some games when you don't get the correct counter it shield spams and heals and there's nothing you can do. Like I would prefer them to add a 0.5X dmg on the basic hit to allow creatures with shattering counters to stand more of a chance at a 1 v 1 like alacranix/poukan/albertocevia. Doesn't help that concatoloch doesn't have many counters 😅

[simple meadow]

correction: more than one. Dlux has massively benefited from the conloch nerf, as well as thylos

I didn't say you could easily counter conloch in my previous message, but I said that the nerf did enough to solidify its counters. Keep in mind, it is no longer considered a top 3 creature

[craggy summit]

Shame that's locked behind a paywall for most players 😅

[sturdy wigeon]

I mean

[simple meadow]

if you don't have dlux unlocked and are facing conlochs, that's more of an arena issue if anything

[sturdy wigeon]

I’ve started getting meta apexes recently and im pretty much almost fully F2P

[craggy summit]

Yes at around 5250 😂, it's every match you face one at lv30

[sturdy wigeon]

The only time i spent money was for the pass that had angel dna

[craggy summit]

It's coins and boostes I could possibly unlock dracolux but I would be at a base lv26.

[sturdy wigeon]

They’re pretty good even at a base level as long as you have the right synergy

Apart from skoonamet

[simple meadow]

the swap in won't be nearly as good at base but afflicting horn is a good ability at all levels

[sturdy wigeon]

Skoonamet is definitely gonna need a bunch of boosts

[simple meadow]

prex needs boosts too

[sturdy wigeon]

Prex is performing pretty well

[simple meadow]

it still needs boosts more than others

[craggy summit]

But my main point about concatoloch is its play style. Not a good play style for the game, I said the same thing about dilorach when that was popular in the arena.

[sturdy wigeon]

Skoonamet is performing worse than haast maximus 💀

It could also be me being stupid

[simple meadow]

I completely agree it's not a good playstyle, but nothing can be done with nerfs. The kit would have to be reworked

but at least it's more managable now IF you have the counters

I have not had any problems taking down conloch after the nerf, before that it was the bane of my existence

[craggy summit]

Healing meta has lasted too long 😅 just replace one with another.

Like even gryganyths healing is ridiculous

[sturdy wigeon]

Gryganyth has the best heal move in the game

[craggy summit]

Why I thought a small dmg multiplier on the basic plus a 3 turn cooldown on the heal at 66% would of been the best route. Wouldn't be able to just spam shield and heal 👍 agaisnt 99% of the match ups.

Would still beat cunning creatures but give more of a chance to rend counter creatures and shattering counter attackers who are mainly fierce.

[umbral snow]

I'd argue Ferocious Shielded Heal

[sturdy wigeon]

True

[spring jackal]

Ngl the touramoloch group heal is really good aswell as it provides for the team without a cooldown

[light quiver]

The main problem is, most of these creatures (both Concatos, Stego u, Dilorach, Atrocodistis,...) can get away with this playstyle, because there isn't a lot that can punish it (that can punish isn't the same as being able to counter it).

To compare, in Pokemon singles, this type of stalls can be disrupted, thanks to moves like taunt and encore, which negates the use any non damaging moves or forces the opponent to use the last move selected, respectively.
That however, cannot be implemented in JWA due to how moves work. For example you can't negate non damaging moves on Cloch, because there's a way where it can't use anything, because both Expose weakness and Group stunning slowing impact were used, and you can't make any creature repeat a move that has cooldown

[upper dome]

Yeah, D lux can now usually bleed it quite well

[upper dome]

And a move that should be reworked (50% dmg increase but heals 2x )

It makes the counter go from 33% to almost 58%

Or add a 3 turn cooldown to it instead of 2

[upper moss]

Well, the nerf is on, but it's still not enough. I have a level 30 Concatoloch and can kill almost anything with it, yet, which makes the game too easy. All creatures should be nerfed faster, so players will spend real money on new ones. The developers need our money to live, anyway.

[slow anvil]

tbf it's a subtle change to it but a very big one, it allows other apexes to deal with conch more effectively and also lower its position in the meta

[zenith obsidian]

Idk about you but conloch has gotten so much easier to destroy

[upper moss]

It's still op. All previous update's creatures that are Meta should be nerfed, actually, so the new ones get attention and players spend more.

[dark gale]

Yes its still good but it's not like it was before the one before the nerf could kill almost anything

I wouldn't say op

But it's more in line with the other meta apexs

[upper dome]

Yup

[ivory dagger]

It still has les than hslf a dozen counters when it should be several times thst.

[dark gale]

It's the same for all meta creatures

Like take smet for example it has 2 counters and those are crit based

But no one complained about it

[tiny valve]

yeah no swap in or oe really hurt it

[upper dome]

Give it OE impact or just a simple reinforece on escape/ no scape and watch people complain

Battle ready was enough so it had no oe, wich made it suceptible to swap ins, hence making people not complain

[fervent granite]

Everyone only focuses on meta and sees them as balanced against other meta creatures, that's why 🙃

[dark gale]

Smet was meta

It still holds it own in the meta

[upper dome]

I use it still ( have nothing better, other than concloch and draco)

[dark gale]

I use it too

Smet really can compete with anything it's only issue is swap in dmg

[muted kernel]

We need a magnaraptor nerf. That thing can take out anything. Smet is now useless because of him.

Can a 10k hp Smet even survive a swap in? Would need him to be at E2 to be able to get to 10k hp

[sturdy wigeon]

Personally i think the only unnecessary thing about magnaraptor is the swap in

[high cave]

Magnaraptor isn't the reason why smet is useless it's swap ins in general

[dark gale]

Yes he easily can

Even with 6k hp

[dark gale]

It still wins with swap in

[ivory dagger]

1. Smet has several counters.
2. Anything with less than a couple of dozen (minimum, ideally it should be at least twice that) out-and-out counters should be heavily nerfed till it does.

[ivory dagger]

Which is why swap-ins should be (a) removed (no skill), or at the very least capped at 50% damage with stat max caps based on dino classification (like omegas).

[dark gale]

Smet only has 1 counter thats 100% of the time the other 2 are crit based. Smet has 3 total counters if it's other then that it's and skill issue on the smet part

[high cave]

Swap ins actually do have skill

You have to do it perfectly or you're screwed

[dark gale]

Some do but dlux is not one of those

[high cave]

I can't argue with that

It literally hits twice and nullifies

[dark gale]

And then it's rng to see if it lives to be able to swap out again to do the same

[high cave]

Yeah but then again this whole meta is rng

[dark gale]

Depends

[rough portal]

Eh, tell that to the Sinraptors and Yutyrannus’ with 75%-100% CRIT chance and 200% CRIT damage.

Now THAT is in dire need of a nerf over everything else.

[high cave]

They never will nerf omegas that's their money makers

[umbral snow]

Draco Lux did that

You basically never swap kill with magna higher up

[dark gale]

If anything gets a better swap then dlux we are going to have a huge issue

Or even dlux swap on a creature with more dmg

[tiny valve]

love the swap in double null vuln strike

[zenith obsidian]

No bro 😭 Mag is falling off anyway

[tiny valve]

is it

[zenith obsidian]

Tbh it wont last a couple updates frm now

[tiny valve]

still doing fine

plateo and Thylos are probably going to be replaced by Cerastego, Trykov and Rajado

[high cave]

Tigerplayz put ceratostego above concatoloch

[zenith obsidian]

Yeah no

[half urchin]

Cerastego is pretty good from what I saw

[zenith obsidian]

its like top 9 or 10

[half urchin]

Lets see it settle down in a couple days and see how high it is in the meta

[latent igloo]

Goonametrodom climbing the ranks? Is this a dream come true?

[half urchin]

It is pretty good tbh

[half urchin]

Prob not

[latent igloo]

It's in the top 5

Probably like 4 or 5

[half urchin]

Cerastego has a great counter and swap in

Amazing speed tbh

And packs a huge punch

[dark gale]

Magna issue is that it a cunning that was released in a tank meta

[upper moss]

Basically everything needs to be nerfed.

[simple meadow]

top 8 at least*

at the minimum, top 8

[tiny valve]

ordering is weird
but sure

Cerastetego is good but I think its not top 5

[dark gale]

Tiger plays is not a reliable source

[high cave]

And why do you think that

[high cave]

It's actually also a fierce and it can kill resilients

[high cave]

That won't happen

[upper moss]

You're right. There's Velociraptor.

[lunar breach]

And that's the problem

Because
They just wanna feed whales
Not F2P players
Why nerfing OP dinos then
Like
Compare Magnus and Cloch nerf
(The 2 were oppresing af and were top meta for long)
And you'll see the difference
Magnus really had a nerf
Cloch has adjustments
And they buffed the 2 best unique and one of the best Apexes along that...

[high cave]

Who's magnus

[lunar breach]

Ceramagnus

[bleak sedge]

2 shots Magnaraptor

[lunar breach]

Because of it a whole class got nerfed

[bleak sedge]

Yeah that was pretty bull

[sturdy wigeon]

Most things 2 shot magnaraptor

[latent igloo]

He literally ìs, more so now since he has a beta account and is now able to test out creatures with more efficiency

[high cave]

I'm pretty sure magnus hasn't been nerfed

I might be wrong

I can't look at it right now because I don't have it

[high cave]

Exactly

[lunar breach]

It has been nerfed
By a lot

[high cave]

Well when it was meta I didn't even have a single unique

[lunar breach]

Oh okay

[high cave]

But that account is completely gone

I only have the one I'm on currently

I lost the old account because I forgot the password and username

And the phone battery could've exploded

[versed flicker]

I'm 99% plateorex is not high tyrant, its around mid tyrant

[slow anvil]

why? What'd take its spot?

[versed flicker]

The new dinos

[slow anvil]

they already have been implemented and it's still in high tyrant so

[lunar breach]

Every "New" Apex is High tyrant

[slow anvil]

yeah because there's literally nothing that can break the barrier

[lunar breach]

Yeah

Any other dino is getting wrecked

[versed flicker]

Draco lux is top because of its affliction stun and bleed, gryganyths comes in because it destroys conca now, the new stego is now around 3, than concatoloch takes its place, sah panthera is still there, magnaraptor, compsovenator, rajadorixis and than comes plateorex

[lunar breach]

I've spotted so many errors for someone who isn't even in mid Aviary
No offense btw

[versed flicker]

Whos not in mid aviary?

[lunar breach]

Me

[slow anvil]

me

[lunar breach]

But there are plenty of errors

[versed flicker]

Tell me the errors

[latent igloo]

Compared to the creatures on the tier list plateorex is a High Tyrant

On only just the newer apexs it obviously isn't high tyrant

[versed flicker]

True but considering how it actually performs in fights currently it is not high tyrant

if it is, its the lowest

[slow anvil]

it's just that all of the "new" apexes are so dominant literally nothing can bypass their rule except for new apexes which even then will make them even more dominant which will make them more money

[latent igloo]

True but considering the amount of creatures in the game it is a High Tyrant

[slow anvil]

which is almost exactly where it's at

[versed flicker]

the protonodon does better than plateorex

and thats mid tyrant apparently

[latent igloo]

On select creatures

[latent igloo]

Plux is able to beat Sah but that dosent mean it's the best of the best

[slow anvil]

give me one apex protonodon can counter

[versed flicker]

Plux?

[latent igloo]

Para lux

[versed flicker]

you mean draco lux?

Draco lux is the best because of its versatility in all the fights it faces and when it gets the stun almost nothing beats it

[lunar breach]

Number one is Compso
Number two three and four are Gryg Sah and Raja
Either of those could be in any of these spots
Number five is probably Stego
Number six Cloch
Number seven eight and nine Magna Trykov and Draco
Same way that for Gryg Raja and Sah
Number ten is Plateorex
And for eleven and twelve, it's Skoona/Mega

[latent igloo]

No Para lux

[versed flicker]

the legendary?

[latent igloo]

Yes

[versed flicker]

Aaah thats what you meant

[versed flicker]

I will have to disagree, but alright

[lunar breach]

Just for the information
Paralux Beats Magnus too
Please, buff Magnus

[umbral snow]

This is not a very good list, also delete this

It has unreleased content contained

[strong solar]

No

[latent igloo]

I agree

[tiny valve]

Concato too low

Magnar too high
and old magnar for some reason

[sturdy wigeon]

Rajadorixis is also too low

Its the 2nd best creature

[tiny valve]

thats just a bad list
no way Ovy is that good

[sturdy wigeon]

There’s also no way stegugh is that low

It’s atleast mid tyrant

[strong solar]

Well whuts the bother they do what they feel they must and thats whut is...the whales happy so why change anything? They feed them money ...

[dark gale]

What?

[umbral snow]

this does not fix the issue

it's still showing something unreleased lmao

[umbral snow]

yeah it's complete bogus

if you want a better list, I've got this

it's a rough draft so it isn't perfect but this is accurate enough

exact placements, especially out of the top 10, are fairly interchangeable (within reason)

[latent igloo]

Breh

[umbral snow]

Still a bogus list, but at least allowed in server rules

Gem, Poukan, Kyrie, Skorpiosteg, Ovylen, Gem, Skoonamet, Dsung, Ptor, Tryko, Geostern, CG and Gigantcera are grossly overrated

[tiny valve]

I wouldn't say Poukan is bad at all
Just it's being compared to all this stuff

[umbral snow]

Low tyrant is just a tad high for it

[tiny valve]

Definitely

[dark gale]

I love when I called this a terrible list everyone threw a fit

[slow anvil]

erm actually you said that Tiger wasn't a reliable source ☝️ 🤓

[muted kernel]

Guys, conloch is still too OP

[dark gale]

Same thing

[high cave]

Skill issue

[tiny valve]

doesn't conloch win against rajado
or has that changed

[high cave]

I'm pretty sure they can kill each other

[tiny valve]

and yes
Conloch is still a top 5 creature

[umbral snow]

conch wins

[muted kernel]

Too OP still

[dark gale]

No its not that op now

It's in line with the other meta apexs

[distant urchin]

didn't you complain about it being trash now like a week ago

[tiny valve]

Yeah a top 5 creature is strong
And has a good matchup against rajado

What do you expect

[dark gale]

Also going off that point didn't you say it didn't need a nerf and it had enough counters

[distant urchin]

i never said that?

[dark gale]

I ment @muted kernel

I replied to the wrong person

[ivory dagger]

But those builds leave inherent weaknesses elsewhere, they aren't unstoppable killing machines.

[upper moss]

I hope all your nerfing requests get done, guys. That'd mess the game up so much, I'd finally quit it for good. 🤣

[high cave]

You'll quit just because op creatures got nerfed

That sounds like

[upper moss]

Of course not, silly. You just wanted to use the meme.

[high cave]

I guess I interpreted your message wrong sorry

[upper moss]

We're cool!

[upper dome]

Ik concato is super opressive but IMO it needs a minor nerf to heal, not a rework, cause what breaks it is the ammount of heal it recieves

Doesnt kill it but doesnt break it

And maybe a bit less hp, 5100 at 26 is a lot taking into consideration its heal potential

[pastel tide]

Every apex should be nerfed. Or even better deleted from the h game

[tiny valve]

thats a bit far

[distant urchin]

username checks out

no

[dark gale]

Apexs are cool but when they are miles ahead from other creatures that's the issue

[upper moss]

You're doing a great job on asking to Nerf Everything, guys. Keep up the good work! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I've already got my "Please Nerf Me" badge and am proudly using it to support you! You can really teach a lesson to those players that worked hard to get their Apexes while they should be doing something else like, I don't know, living maybe! 💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻

[ivory dagger]

Everyone works hard, and I guarantee I grind more than most, likely all, as I have a lot of free time.
That doesn't mean we should accept the devs basically telling 99% of the player base to do one and releasing ridiculously op dinos on a semi-regular basis. Demanding they be bought to the level they should be is not unreasonable.

[dreamy void]

Guys concatoloch already got a reasonable nerf and is now even more manageable in the meta. It literally doesn't need another nerf, will you guys stop whining with the "Please nerf [insert meta creature]" all the time even after it becomes more manageable?

[oblique tundra]

Look at when this post was made

[upper moss]

I wouldn't mind another nerf to whatever they ask. It's kinda fun, actually.

[ivory dagger]

No it didn't. It'll have a reasonable nerf when it loses the damage buffs it has no business possessing as a resilient, and it's swap resistance is cut by half so it can't swap without penalty.

[dreamy void]

Looks like you don't know how to handle it

The stun resistance change makes it a prime dlux food, grygan obliterates it even harder now, it no longer can swap in on sah and survive the double strike because of the armor nerf, it's heal was changed from 66% to 50% and now it can't absolutely body thylos with its stun because they nerfed it from a 100% to 50%, so in a head to head against thylos it becomes a 50/50

The heal nerf makes it easier to get into magna range

The stun resistance nerf gives grypo a chance to take conc down instead of getting OE abused all the time

• concatoloch has already dropped a lot in usage because of this nerf as it made it more manageable

[oblique tundra]

Their nerfs make sense if everything else gets nerfed

[dreamy void]

Yeah this doesn't hold up

Then what's the point of having anything if everything gets nerfed?

Then we will just be back to square one

[oblique tundra]

Things shouldn't need it nerfs, that's jamcitys balancing issues we just want reset, i have to say rn the metas the best it has been for a while, but everything is still overpowered and old stuff can't hold up, ideally everything gets rebalanced one last time, then keep things right

Problem is its hard to achieve now, they have to do it all at once, as nerfs in time will either kill creatures, or constantly nerf stuff

[dreamy void]

I do agree that most of these apexes are difficult to get as most if not all of them need event exclusive DNA to unlock. The worst offender of this exclusivity is compsovenator, rajadorixis and Cerastegotops

The only way to get these guys are either by having enough dracov, scelid and cerat dna respectively in the first place or just downright buying them from the market

At least you can FIP skorpioven and sphaero in the sanctuaries but not these guys

[dreamy void]

It just sucks that they are doing all of this just to fill their pockets

[ivory dagger]

So to win you need to cheat like the droppers. Gotcha.
My 6yo niece could get midrange meta to high gyro and likely shores just slapping the screen randomly.
I'll stuck to playing within the terms of use and teaching arena droppers using the meta below shores some lessons.

[ivory dagger]

Good. There should be hundreds of viable arena options, not less thsn a dozen.

[oblique tundra]

I do not get how that's the conclusion you get

[oblique tundra]

But I agree here

[dreamy void]

Yeah that's not hoe the meta works rn. You actually have to play skillfully to get high

[ivory dagger]

Except you don't. The skill level required has consistently dropped over the last couple of years, and is now the lowest it's ever been. Hence the prevalence of droppers using meta in gyro and library, or even low level apexes in aviary, estates and below.

[dreamy void]

I wouldn't say it's the lowest rn cuz we don't have heal stallers like dilorach anymore

And you actually have to predict ur opponents next moves if you want to win consistently when climbing

We might see more droppers cuz of brawl tho

Cuz it matches u based on ur current trophies in PvP

[ivory dagger]

There were far more ways to dispose of dilo, also helped by it having no swap resist. It could be a bit annoying, but not even 1% of the current top 10 and their ridiculousness.

[oblique tundra]

Lowest skill level, no you need skill to use them to full potential but while the meta is the most healthy it has been for a while since the loch nerf, its still really only the top 10

[lunar breach]

Nah the meta is probably the worst ngl
You take all the ass meta
Mortem one
Monolorhino one
Cerag and Hadros one
Indot one
Flocks one
Distrat and dodge one
And you fuse all of that together

Like
Cerag and Hadros were oppresive
But it was 2 dino
Now the top 15/20 is like that

[oblique tundra]

I am meaning in a while, we don't have that one oppressive creature (loch, before that skoonamet, then gem) the whole meta is all simular power

[dreamy void]

We have a lot of diversity in the meta rn

You can choose which meta creature you would like to use instead of just being locked to 8

[ivory dagger]

No instead we half 6-8 oppressive creatures. Not entirely sure how you see that as a 'better' situation, better would be zero.

[oblique tundra]

We have had the top 10 ish being usable for a while, so it is better, not best case but its a improvement on what we have had

[ivory dagger]

I don't see it as 'better' when they are so far ahead of the rest that skill is frequently negated. Especially when they refuse to rebalanced most, do a further rebalance on one that only really impacts it against a couple of dinos, and 'fix' thylos by adding its swap in bug to its description rather than actually fixing it.

[oblique tundra]

Tbf the thylos fix was exactly what many of us was suggesting

And you are using better and fixed interchangeably, i never said the meta is perfect, just better than what it's been for a while, especially before loch nerf

[ivory dagger]

I assume you're talking about the buffs being added after the hit, that's not what I'm talking about.
I'm talking about the fact that for 18mths it did a damage buff that was never in its description. Then rather than fix it (ie removing it), they simply added it to the description instead.

[oblique tundra]

It was that, I had no idea the description showed otherwise, especially since the damage increase fits the move

[ivory dagger]

It was supposed to increase crit only, which for me was correct. One or other, not both - but then I've always took issue with moves that have multiple effects attached, mainly as they reduce skill level.

[oblique tundra]

I just saw it as crushing prowl, with a swap in attack lol

My issue was the order of effects and attack, which was fixed, too late though (and now dlux and magna has the issue of swap in impacts)

[tiny valve]

shores needs skill

you can get into Library without skill
maybe Gyro

[dreamy void]

I would say more than 10

[dreamy void]

Gyro might be pushing it but i can agree with aviary and library

[oblique tundra]

Around 12ish is where it turns from meta, to good luck

[white knoll]

Hi everyone, I'm new here. What is "meta"?

[oblique tundra]

The best creatures to use

Without the thinking of the meta you are usually at a bit of a disadvantage

[white knoll]

Oh, thanks!

I started to play again JWA after years, and despite having some apex and 30lvl uniquea I'm a bit rusty

And obviously stuck between the Aviary and library 😅

[lunar breach]

And that's the problem
If the only part of the game that requiere skill is almost impossible to get to for F2P players then there's a problem

[ivory dagger]

Shores requires no skill. It's just who spent more. Cancers of the game.

[dreamy void]

That's gonna get u to gyro at best

Shores players don't just spend a lot of money, they also play good

[white knoll]

That's why I hope JamCity run out of business and the game fails.

[oblique tundra]

I can't wish that on any game I enjoy, even if there's flaws like that

[upper moss]

You're right. Good, not amazingly great.

[dreamy void]

Still better than most gyro and library players

They aren't downright too predictable

[upper moss]

Yup. T5 too.

[oblique tundra]

T5 is too expensive even for shores players that they don't often have a team of T5

[dreamy void]

There's ET5 as low as library and even aviary too 💀 that's not just exclusive to shores

But most of them are on meta irrelevant creatures

Like dilorach, gdues, tmet, thor

[upper moss]

Probably droppers.

[dreamy void]

Heh

Droppers don't use gdeus nor dilorach

[oblique tundra]

Not every T5 is built the same