The OG Apexs Buff Thread

[low rock]

Forgot to add Gorgotrebex and Discord doesn't allow for pics to be added to an original post I made a few days ago

Anyways, they all need it.

EDIT: Mortem and Hadros have been reworked again, see further down in the comments. See them here: https://discordapp.com/channels/974302444643311636/1056355865906663485/1056461118853349436

[grave minnow]

You made mortem a better Rexy

[low rock]

Debatable, since Dominant Roar has the speed buff whereas Roar doesn’t

[elfin void]

Ref doesn't need a buff but all the others are nice additions that could bring more variety to this boring meta

[low rock]

Agreed. Ref doesn’t really need it, but I didn’t want to hurt its feelings by leaving it out 🤣

[grave minnow]

You could put a lot of speed boosts on Mortem

[bright quartz]

Hadros losing Medium Resilient Counter Attack and its option for Turn 1 Rampage aren't changes I'd be comfortable with. Bellow moves are also more for sauropods.

The changes I want for Hadros are either its Strike or Impact becoming a Group Attack, and I want Shelter to replace Greater Emergency Heal.

[atomic coral]

The problem with your morty, is you made its rampage hit lowest hp which will hinder with its raid viability

Otherwise looks cool

[low rock]

How so? There aren't any successful strats that require Mortem to use Rampage on Turn 1

[grave minnow]

Doesn’t have to be turn 1

Could be last round

[low rock]

I meant to say turn 1 of each Round

[low rock]

In hindsight, having GDI and DC is kind of redundant. Might just give it GRI instead of GDI

[atomic coral]

I say give a version of devour rampage that hits highest hp

[atomic coral]

Also imagine, morty is fastest, or outspeeds any, the others take care of Minions so morty rampages to target boss then the other dinos come in and ko the minions

There is a few strats that rely on morty targeting boss

[low rock]

Not on the first turn of each round 😂

[atomic coral]

I didn't worry about it on the #1036379970156646552 thread but now that I've seen it, it makes sense

[barren oriole]

at first glance these don't seem so bad.

Then you realize that the dinos have to get change so much, just to keep up with the insane power creep.

Look at boa, it literally has an NEGATE button, as 2 parts of its possible moves. And even then i don't think it would do much.

Mortem does not need devour, we don't need another 3k+ per turn healer, that also just throws around big numbers.

Everything else needs a hit first before we buff anything.

[atomic coral]

Unfortunately I don't see morty being good without devour, or the game to be fully balanced (which isn't happening) all I say is morty should at least be used the same amount as rexy as rexy is a legendary morty a apex, but I don't see that happening even with devour

I would rather them fully balance it but at least make morty stand up to rexy a bit more

[low rock]

If the Mortems get below half health to trigger the Alert aspect of the Impact, they do a combined 19,545 without one of them CRITing.

If they're above half health, they'll still do upwards of 13,500 attack without one of them CRITing if they're attack is 3000 bare minimum.

At worst, the strat goes an extra turn and both Morties just have to use Roar to finish the boss off since they should still be faster than the Imperatosuchus boss.

And at best, the strat stays largely the same 😂

[barren oriole]

the problem, like Rampage and run, is it is begin given to dinos who clearly don't need it.

[atomic coral]

Or the boss and minions living there could mean the team gets swept and the strat is out of the window

Or a better strat is found making morty irrelevant

I agree give it devour there, but make it target highest hp

[barren oriole]

Actaully if we want to make it similar yet same, without giving it an OP devour.

Put devour on the roar move.

[atomic coral]

That can work too

[low rock]

How so?

[atomic coral]

Problem is in raids you want it to devour alot but in pvp it becomes op

[barren oriole]

then it can't be spammed, nor can it suddenly heal 3k and become unkillable like dilo, or indo Apex

[atomic coral]

Imagine at that point your dinos can't live a group attack that the boss might be about to use (or a minnion) that meaning the raid is lost, or if it gos a extra turn a better strat that might not include morty might replace it as most efficient

[atomic coral]

I think the problem is devour was given to something that can triple its attack then devour in a non 1x way, plus has armour for rexy (the devour move in question) the devour isn't as bad of the issue as indonymys

[low rock]

???

If you mean to say if the team can't survive Imperato Boss's group attack I fail to see how that matters since that most likely means one of the creatures on the team was not up to snuff anyway

[atomic coral]

I guess I have to say it this way

Your dinos make it to the final round right,
They are hurt heavy from the previous
The boss attacks last
Your 4 dinos ignore the minions and end the battle before the boss can do its attack
You win

Vs same thing except you can't ko the boss before it attacks
It uses its group attack and you lose because your dinos where too hurt

And you can't ko the boss first because you have to worry about the minions

[low rock]

Except for Hadros and Hydra Boa (for Round 1 only in the latter's case), the Apex Bosses that do attack on the first turn of every Round don't have Minions with counter-attacks of their own, while the Apex Bosses that don't attack on the first turn of each round (including Imperatosuchus) do have counter-attacking Minions.

But, that doesn't matter anyway. None of the Minions have rending Resistance, so a 60% Rend buffed by Roar is still going to do almost, if not completely, one shot both Minions before they can do anything.

And if their health is low enough that they can be brought down by a single counter-attack from the Boss, then odds are, again, the team just wasn't up to it anyway.

[atomic coral]

Or the team would have made it if it didn't have to worry about that counter

[low rock]

I could get behind this actually. In fact that would actually make it different and nice alternative to Dominant Roar

[atomic coral]

Anyways I got to go, I did not expect anyone against making the same move, counter a different target for this one creature and I explained possible ways it not changing could hurt its raid viability more then it improves it

I'm not saying your moves are bad, it looks good but make the fierce devour rampage target highest hp thats all I say

[low rock]

I know, but just trust me on this. I run Mortem in raids all the time, and the changes I suggested would have absolutely no effect on it's raid viability at all.

[atomic coral]

I've shown the examples I can, I don't get why making it target highest hp is the biggest deal tbh

Anyway its late I need to get sleep so gtg

[barren oriole]

change should be done with balance in mind, and without over correcting something, Devour on roar would make it different enough from rexy.

As rexy gets speed and power ( assuming rexy lost its devour ) and 2 group moves.

While mortem gets heading on roar, and bigger over all attack.

[atomic coral]

That sounds decent though at this point I'd take any buff on morty

[low rock]

Damn straight I would too 😂

[atomic coral]

But I don't see balance making it become usable again tbf

Unless jamcity changes their ways

[low rock]

Funny thing is, I totally forgot that I also made Alert Fatal Impact a priority ability when it's Alert status is activated.

So the Minions won't even have the chance to benefit from Imperato Boss's attack buffs to them before they're taking down

At any rate, I thought about everything discussed and agree with some needed changes

[magic zephyr]

Honestly, I think it shouldn’t have the stunning obstruction, and it shouldn’t have more than 75% distraction res. In exchange for those, I think it should get 35% armor

[magic zephyr]

This is talking about magnus btw. Forgot to clarify

And that opinion is coming from a magnus user. I may be non meta, but I do still use her

I’m glad you didn’t change precise rampage tho. That’s one of my fav things about her

[atomic coral]

Hmm

I do also say make the roar ass damage before, but its not the biggest deal

[warm warren]

I think Hadros Lux’s bellowing call should have the 100% shields when it is secured and the 50% when it is threatened.

[atomic coral]

I say visa versa

[atomic coral]

Because you need more protection if your hurt more

[warm warren]

But you heal more if you are threaten anyway. You don’t also need invincibility.

[atomic coral]

True, didn't realize it healed at all lol 😆

[blazing crypt]

Seeing as Ref is dropping from the meta. Would it make a difference is Super Distraction is reverted to what it was before?

2 Turn Cooldown instead of 3

Leave the 25% chance to Stun out. That is annoying and not needed.

Instead have it also remove cloak.

[low rock]

Is Ref leaving the meta? I still see plenty of players using it

[atomic coral]

Its getting harder to use

[magic zephyr]

I really don’t think ref needs a buff

[atomic coral]

It probably doesn't, besides mabie reverting its nerf

[barren oriole]

why not just give everything prefect stats and moves. There we go, everything is the same, everything does everything, and the only difference is appearance.

Hadros does not need ANY shields

[blazing crypt]

Is this too much for Haast?

[magic zephyr]

No rocket alert. Makes it a LOT harder for resilients to kill it, which is their job

[blazing crypt]

As long as Dilorach is the way it is right now, that Rocket Alert is tame in comparison.

[magic zephyr]

You’re basically using dilorach as an excuse to break the meta more….

[blazing crypt]

In the meta we have right now, there is no such thing as balance...

Geminideus and other top tier, broken creatures made that possible.

[magic zephyr]

That doesn’t give an excuse to make everything broken. That’s like breaking your arm and then saying “welp, if one’s broken, let’s just break em ALL”

Top tiers being broken doesn’t give an excuse to ruin the lower tiers

[low rock]

The thing is, is that Haast doesn’t really need anything other than a buff to Fearless Flap and Piercing Screech.

It can easily beat Diloracheirus among many other Cunnings as it is, but it’s lack of real offensive capabilities (even though it’s Rampage ability is good it’s still not enough) makes it fall short of what is needed for the meta.

[low rock]

Gonna bump this so it doesn't get drowned out in Creature Suggestions, but boy do I hate saying it, Imperatosuchus needs a minor buff just to take down Geminideus

The longer cooldowns, turning Bask into an Alert ability while nerfing the "secure" aspect of it, loss of Deceleration in Death Roll, and loss of Rending resistance are all meant to counter-balance the addition of Devour Heal, buff to DoT resistance and the DoT inflicting part of Death Roll, letting it 2x heal while threatened with a longer attack buff duration, and a 100% resistance to reduced armor.

It shouldn't effect the ability of powerful Cunnings like Ref to take it down, sans obviously lasting a little longer, but I'm sure some people here aren't going to be happy anyway 😂

[blazing crypt]

Is this too much for Haast Maximus?

[low rock]

Yes and no.

Ravenous Rampage is fine as it currently is, however Rocket Alert there is an incredibly bad idea (imagine if Diloracheirus’ counter could also cleanse itself of Deceleration).

Haast needs something more like this

[atomic coral]

But rocket alert deals no damage and only boosts 10% so I can see it

Plus is given to its boss (and most bosses have similar moves to the creature) so its weird its not there

[low rock]

Doesn't matter. The point is, is that it shouldn't cleanse itself of Deceleration and give itself a speed boost with a counter that it doesn't need anyway.

[low rock]

I know players have been asking for Cera to get distraction resistance, but frankly I don't think it's necessary when giving it abilities that cleanse Distraction work well enough anyway

[magic zephyr]

Thank you for putting damage back on its speedup. I do think that it could live without the pin immunity, since it’s a resilient after all

[blazing crypt]

How does mine look?

[low rock]

Yeah it losing the damage from Group Accel was a perplexing choice.

I gave it total pin immunity though so it wouldn't be caught in something similar to the old Grypolyth problem where it can't reliably escape from itself. It doesn't really need it, unlike the damage from the speedup, but I thought it might as well have it.

[magic zephyr]

I can see why you’d want to have the pin immunity, but the thing about grypo is that it was basically an infinite matchup. At least with this, there’s no healing, which means ONE will die eventually

[low rock]

True!

[low rock]

Another Anky Lux buff

[primal raptor]

Hostile glow is to OP

[low rock]

It's time to bump

Snake is in desperate need of a buff

[low rock]

Also, Mortem buff. Again

[drifting depot]

I think wound is not neccesary

[low rock]

It is to make it distinct from Tyrannomet and Rexy

[drifting depot]

Don't add no escape to him. Not every creature needs it, the two Rex already has

[low rock]

In this meta, everything needs an On-Escape ability of some sort. Fierce Strike makes the most sense for Mortem to have, as anything stronger than that would push it into super-op territory

[drifting depot]

Used to be cunnings had no escape, especially crocs and piscivores. Classes mixed up too much

[low rock]

What are you talking about? Crocs have never been Cunnings and On-Escapes have never been a strictly a Cunning only thing

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-visible-confusion-confused-gif-14771834

[drifting depot]

But when no espace came in, crocs and piscivores had first

[low rock]

So? That doesn't mean Mortem, or anything else in the game, can't have an On-Escape ability.

[drifting depot]

Yeah but now every creature has no or on-escape. The new cat got too, most omegas has too, almost all apex has it. Of course there are creatures that can dodge it and can escape but it's seems boring, like Ludia can't figure a creature out that has no counter or no escape but still strong

[low rock]

Again, so? There's no reason why Mortem can't have one as well.

[drifting depot]

It's just boring. Many creatures can't escape or just have a chance to escape. Of course you have counters, you can stop swappers, but everyone using these strategies, like if there is no other options