flint warren
~
The brand new Attacker Type, Iron Element, Rocket Launcher, Burst 3 Nikke, Raven has been announced.
Put all findings surrounding Raven's mechanics here.
You may discuss the character here as well, like what their uses are in PvE or PvP content.
Press "follow" to add this to your channel list
gloomy topaz
Mommy
clear trellis
Emilia wannabe
gloomy topaz
A2 and Emilia bastard child
clear trellis
actually Emilia and Sakura
also her pose is super insane
probably the best pose imo
graceful lynx
Slow windup on her RL, seems like A2 more
clear trellis
gloomy topaz
Dat ass
outer glen
~
The brand new `Attacker` Type, `Iron` Element, `Rocket Launcher`, `Burst 3` N...
She is A2 but Ice element (Like a pokemon)
flint warren
outer glen
<:wahahaha:1008472874513870882>
Also, given she is blue and Ice, she should have saved Water NIKKE from the drown but no, FUCKING IRON!!
Iron Woman.
outer glen
God forbid Water element have Meta.
vapid mason
Very nice
frank lava
more iron for the diet
glad ermine
Sound like one time use for soloraid only
viral kiln
so the next boss has parts 
glacial elm
Summer Sakura but RL, basically, and her burst isn't single target focused according to the kit hint. Could still be saved for bossing if it's Distributed Damage or sequential attacks.
Likely doesn't use Sustained Damage, just self-buffing, I suppose.
fiery pollen
weak ledge
uneven raft
destroy parts
hmm for ultra niche
shy crane
they should make new compaign enemies that all come with a bunch of parts
then those nikke could be meta for a few chapters
uneven raft
they should make new compaign enemies that all come with a bunch of parts
and durable
weak ledge
SBS in disguise
mortal spear
you mean doro
weak ledge
you mean doro
Yeah, but u can see SBS smile on Raven
outer glen
SBS in disguise
Raven is the child of SBS and Mihara.
somber parcel
Hawt
fiery pollen
my morale compass leaving my body when the villain is hot
sick salmon
Raven eating good in arena
same Explosion Radius UP gimmick as A2 / Laplace
and iron coded
need to see what her burst does
weak ledge
fiery pollen
what are tits? i'm a visual learner btw
weak ledge
"You know what? Fuck you."
moves the chair to change the timeline
glacial elm
what are tits? i'm a visual learner btw
Trina has two, ask her
weak ledge
weak ledge
cobalt gyro
SU ado fan
glacial elm
Now watch ShiftUp hide Raven kit until maintenance starts 
clear trellis
in be4 her kit is so broken and never require part anyway
destroy 1 part = +3% ATK
see, she gains power by destroying part
vast lagoon
Unmentioned in summary: she gives 10 seconds of CDR every burst
strong crag
Now watch ShiftUp hide Raven kit until maintenance starts <:KEKS:107558491423534...
her kit gonna be out next week
cobalt gyro
Just in
strong crag
what is this
strong crag
again, wtf is sustained dmg?
muted elk
What kind of bgm is that?
Raven's boss theme from SB lol
strong crag
ye that
austere laurel
not clip?
outer glen
Raven's boss theme from SB lol
It does sound like Shika Noko remix.
glacial elm
Mother Whale slayer
austere laurel
I might save my tickets for summer units dupe
shy crane
nvm remove buff
cobalt gyro
Get buffs to get 2nd buff
outer glen
lol
She buff herself with Vital attack during non-burst. Then during burst, it get removed and she get a better buff.
outer glen
Ofc, the vital buff must get after destroy parts
shy crane
She buff herself with Vital attack during non-burst. Then during burst, it get r...
back in my day we wanted both buffs at once
outer glen
while burst buff is universal
shy crane
zoomers these days can't handle 2 buffs at once
outer glen
So her kits are simple, just dmg and destroy parts
outer glen
i don't trust your guys imags
Your img is the same resolution as mine...
cobalt gyro
Off burst?
shy crane
is she confirmed mag? no chance in pvp
cobalt gyro
Since 680% att from s1 is just brutal damage
nimble frigate
What kind of bgm is that?
Her song is dubbed Costa Nico, and is a fun song from the original game
This is the full version of the song
and is very popular
tawdry turret
would
raven forum
Better than mihara?
outer glen
Her bursts also nuke parts as well, which is a double-edged sword.
Because with her normal atk + burst, she might destroy parts too fast which make her Vital attack buff not last long.
Also, Vital attack doesn't stack, even if it does, the burst will remove anyway.
cobalt gyro
Wait her burst specifies it also nukes parts
shy crane
Better than mihara?
no
outer glen
Her song is dubbed Costa Nico, and is a fun song from the original game
Imagine you are a cool edge swordwoman and also a boss, but your boss bgm is funny.
flint warren
Your img is the same resolution as mine...
happens
outer glen
Wait her burst specifies it also nukes parts
Stronger burst dmg, but lower Vital attack's overall buff duration.
Imagine you wreck the parts in just 4 bursts, so she won't get Vital buff for the rest of match.
slim sentinel
srosy coming back? 
cobalt gyro
Taking advanateg of respawning parts is an iron gimmick
outer glen
Her Vital buff is guaranteed always on before the burst when destroying a part.
But if the burst kill all parts after that, she won't get buff anymore.
Niche meta.
strong crag
thanks shiftup
glacial elm
But if the burst kill all parts after that, she won't get buff anymore.
That’s incorrect, MAYBE
strong crag
i can mlb 2b with a clean conscience now
broken echo
why would u need vital atk anyways when parts are dead
charred chasm
Single point attack
shy crane
respawning parts are a thing and it seems the only way to get the buff is 'by entering battle'
can't regain it
glacial elm
I read it as, she starts off with 20%ish dmg to parts.
Once a part dies, she trades it for 47% sustained dmg buff for 15 seconds.
Once she bursts while having this buff, she trades it for 80% sustained dmg buff for 10 seconds.
The key is I think she gains Vital Damage on bursting as long as she already traded it away.
And she cannot trade for the 89% sustained dmg buff if she didn’t already exchange it.
shy crane
why is the duration 5 seconds
that's a bit more ass than i expected
and i know iron has bad dps
cobalt gyro
The 5s part during full burst is too short
You want to to be active outside burst to get the single att buff
shy crane
it is 5 seconds but still it needs to be removed
charred chasm
Her theme is fire 🔥🔥🔥
tawdry turret
sex
shy crane
just to make sure you really don't have the buff lol
glacial elm
Hmm she doesn’t trade does she? Can she still gain everything 
outer glen
you lost 2s (jump cooldown + Raven charge up)
shy crane
finally we can beat train
strong crag
big number, rl, pvp meta? 
shy crane
no longer part problems
outer glen
Mobbing she is very good due to high raw dmg even without parts.
shy crane
it will be when the enemy has 50 parts
outer glen
47.52% dmg buff during burst
cobalt gyro
Entering fullburst
glacial elm
But if the burst kill all parts after that, she won't get buff anymore.
Looks like it’s a confusing mess of ShiftUp trying hard to avoid letting Raven overstack to godhood. If it’s not trading buffs, then it would be she outright gains them but cancels other buffs to avoid being too OP
cobalt gyro
So her nuke doesn't count
glacial elm
Which means she gets the 89% sustained dmg selfbuff on her burst, always, even if she didn’t have the parts dead buff.
That’s IF trading the buff isn’t required
outer glen
Looks like it’s a confusing mess of ShiftUp trying hard to avoid letting Raven o...
So this is how SU treat their favorite daughters huh
charred chasm
The core is considered a part right?
outer glen
So her nuke doesn't count
Yes, she get s1 atk buff no matter what burst
cobalt gyro
She's just collab midhara
glacial elm
Consider it this way though
If destroying a part is impossible, and if trading isn’t required, when she full bursts, it’s the same as if she did destroy a part
outer glen
Her boss battle bgm is funny, just like her kits.
glacial elm
So it seems like it’s preventing her from being too useless when no parts are up to be destroyed (or couldn’t destroy the parts)
tawdry turret
If destroying a part is impossible, and if trading isn’t required, when she full...
I.e Good off burst if boss have parts
celest quiver
Why does shift up not want my money, wallet kun sees another day
lost urchin
do i need her for pvp?
outer glen
yeah, the dmg buff is good, but you still want parts to maximize her dps.
shy crane
no
celest quiver
Wuwa is getting it all I guess
cobalt gyro
No
lost urchin
Aight
shy crane
she might be good when boobs are considered parts in nikke pvp
ocean mesa
did they make the stellar blade collab units ass?
outer glen
Her nuke deal medium dmg to NIKKE's enemy.
cobalt gyro
With parts, she's just have better damage when not bursting
outer glen
that come once a year
shy crane
can't complain about that
outer glen
shy crane
hope it becomes 0 times a year in 26
glacial elm
So uh.. Raven > Eve?
glacial elm
Also does this bait new players into springing for Summer Rosanna in the summer reruns? 
outer glen
Also does this bait new players into springing for Summer Rosanna in the summer ...
Centi will get a summer skin...
CENTI SUMMER CONFIRMED!!
outer glen
The Queen Return!!
shy crane
Also does this bait new players into springing for Summer Rosanna in the summer ...
if summers are like last year
new players could actually skip collab (eve) > collab (nier) > summer
and new players skipped the last 2 characters
this is fantastic for f2p
save up for 3 months
lost urchin
Not like they won’t rerun stellar blade in the future since its their own ip
shy crane
i'm not sure if they rerun it
austere laurel
part 2 and make both stronger 
shy crane
does stellar blade have more characters people want?
clear trellis
Am I wrong if saying this is the first burst nuke that affect parts
you are wrong
cuz Emilia hits parts too
also wtf is her DoT?
it's so WTF
shy crane
what is 'single point attack'?
nocturne pulsar
New DoT queen
shy crane
mihara dot stacks a lot more
clear trellis
123k% ATK over 180s. Base, no buff
Compared to Midhara, she's pretty much the same
clear trellis
yeah except Midhara has to ramp up over and over
while Raven doesn't, unless you reload too much
frail summit
what is 'single point attack'?
clear trellis
or full screen QTE, rip
shy crane
hahaha
lost urchin
https://fixupx.com/nikke_en/status/1932718090191593770?s=46 chat wheres her pants 
outer glen
She basically remove the previous buff to get a better buff
boreal hound
No parts = whole kit is gone
outer glen
which we wishes she would just keep all the buff
boreal hound
shy crane
and she requires parts the entire fight
some bosses have parts in parts of the fight
partly
glacial elm
No parts = whole kit is gone
We’re hoping that her burst doesn’t require buff trading, and it just removes old buff if it’s there but always gives new buff
outer glen
well, yeah, consider her burst hit part as well, the more parts, the more dps.
nocturne pulsar
She's still okay without parts
broken echo
No parts = whole kit is gone
wdym
outer glen
We’re hoping that her burst doesn’t require buff trading, and it just removes ol...
Non-burst: Vital buff obtained => Single point buff obtained => Vital buff removed.
Burst: Single Point buff removed => A.N mode buff obtained.
Each better than the last.
glacial elm
Each better than the last.
Yes but there’s no condition saying the old buff is required
broken echo
u just don't have parts damage buff and the burst skill effect which damages parts
shy crane
maybe if we get that sustained buffer
outer glen
Yes but there’s no condition saying the old buff is required
there is
I onyl said they get removed
broken echo
u dont need any parts for sustained dmg
outer glen
^
Sustain dmg is from Vital and A.N mode
which one get removed, but other always on during her burst
nocturne pulsar
She gets the parts buff at the start of every full burst. Parts just helps her maintain it longer
She still functions without parts
outer glen
The fact her burst also target parts, mean no part equal less dps.
shy crane
this is the thing i find shit
some bosses like to be off screen every once in a while
outer glen
yeah
shy crane
re-ramp your stacks
glacial elm
In any case, I think Raven will be fine if indeed her sustained dot stacking is OP
nocturne pulsar
It's not long to ramp her DoT
outer glen
a jump and she already lost 2s (1s of jump landing + she charge up)
Can charge beforehand, but that already lost 1s guarantee, and I'm already being generous.
glacial elm
Can manual her, and pre-aim, yes, to maximize uptime of the dot and players will if it’s that good
charred chasm
Is there a possibility for her S2 single point to stack with her burst?
glacial elm
Like Indivilia, she jumps a lot
broken echo
Is there a possibility for her S2 single point to stack with her burst?
burst removes single point
tulip flame
Is there a possibility for her S2 single point to stack with her burst?
Impossible.
If you are in Burst you can't get her S2 anymore. And if you Burst, you lose her S2.
outer glen
Burst alway remove Single point
glacial elm
And her S2 says she can’t get the buff if she’s in burst mode
So can rule out stacking S2 buff and Burst buff
nocturne pulsar
Her charge time is only 1 sec. The boss would need to jump for 4 seconds to lose your stacks
outer glen
15s, so you are guaranteed to have it buff before the burst.
outer glen
Her charge time is only 1 sec. The boss would need to jump for 4 seconds to lose...
Depend on boss
some jump longer than other
nocturne pulsar
Outside of QTEs I can't think of longer jumps
shy crane
some stupid boss like modernia
could happen
someone for fun analyzed the potential raid boss and said it moves a lot
well i'm confident raven is good in her own collab boss
nocturne pulsar
Possibly Modernia but she's more the exception than the rule
nocturne pulsar
Like 3 secsond?
outer glen
For mobbing, Raven is fine, but we have Rapipi and RH which are best Iron mobbing...
Sad fate.
shy crane
not long mother whale is free then just need an iron weak version
it has parts you want to kill so it could be a good fight for raven
cobalt gyro
Even without parts she won't suffer that nuch
Her sustained damage numbers are huge
And you can burst to make the dots much higher
outer glen
Yeah, she is RL, so she deal splash dmg
which depend on mob's position
when they stay close, she can deal sustain dmg to all
but not if they are far away
I wish her burst regen would be good though
that is a big point for mobbing
glacial elm
when they stay close, she can deal sustain dmg to all
It’s limited to 1 enemy nearest to cursor
boreal hound
6 parts + body
shy crane
outer glen
Core is part when it have HP
shy crane
raven best iron dps?
outer glen
shy crane
raven must pull
glacial elm
Idk, but Raven sounds more fun than Eve
boreal hound
If there's Iron MW
outer glen
I don't think she can compete with Rapipi, even in best scenerio
boreal hound
tawdry turret
shy crane
we just need a crown that also buffs sustained dmg by 100%
outer glen
Idk, but Raven sounds more fun than Eve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmVSXf8wIhI
Her boss battle bgm is sure fun, imagine you are a sexy edgy killing machine... and your bgm is funny.
ruby canopy
<:COPEW:1376059282876923994>
What about Ultra Anomaly?
The parts respawn rather slow
glacial elm
What’s Laplace do per second outside of burst?
tawdry turret
Sw rapi redhood maxwell
shy crane
a2 is quite different from sustained dmg
glacial elm
Seems like Raven beats Laplace treasure at Ultra unless Laplace’s burst is OP enough
crisp ether
glacial elm
Seems like Raven beats Laplace treasure at Ultra unless Laplace’s burst is OP en...
And, I think it is. At least it can pierce core and body. And Ultra is killable, no need to waste investing on Raven who is Abnormal 
outer glen
A2 is just big aoe dmg and better raw atk scale
shy crane
the design of this game is a little stupid ngl
all attackers bring their own buffs
what are supports for
more buffs
outer glen
Crown: "Yeah, what are supporters for?"
cobalt gyro
the design of this game is a little stupid ngl
all attackers bring their own bu...
Mihara:
outer glen
cobalt gyro
Crown: "Yeah, what are supporters for?"
She defender so it doesn't apply
shy crane
back when i used to play video games the attacker wasn't loaded with their own support kit
cobalt gyro
shy crane
actually true
crown is a tank who happens to bring the buffs
fuck off white mage
your days are over
helm is an attacker
crown - b3 - rapi - b3 - helm
tank + attacker line up
supporter where
back to raven
upper snow
Why is Raven sustained dmg higher than Mihara lmaooo
vast lagoon
like Modernia
47->89 isn't a huge increase for a valuable B3 slot
42% sustain damage buff from using her B3
timber gull
Why is Raven sustained dmg higher than Mihara lmaooo
must've mixed up their kits at the boardroom meeting 
shy crane
If boss has parts I think she might be best off just not bursting tbh
this is a nice buff though
boreal hound
What about Ultra Anomaly?
Idt she will relace SW or RH in Ultra
outer glen
Where is Snake? we need God's verdict.
cyan drift
How big is her splash
graceful folio
Where is Snake? we need God's verdict.
outer glen
Aim at the rapture, and splash destroy object on the right.
shy crane
why is she blue
outer glen
Yeah, this is the only moment I could see her splash hit clearly
shy crane
not so bad
outer glen
why is she blue
Why is she not Water element
shy crane
outer glen
seem like her normal atk splash is standard AoE
cobalt gyro
Why is she not Water element <:kekw:1009394634692247632>
Cos she's blue steel
shy crane
Why is she not Water element <:kekw:1009394634692247632>
are we actually getting a sustained dps for every element
we have water/iron/fire now and ssakura is wind?
cobalt gyro
We getting electric sustained damage soon
outer glen
The release will be shocking.
shy crane
now that's a collab
clear trellis
cobalt gyro
Palpatine booty
cyan drift
Papa palps
outer glen
She can poison any target/part easily with a full charge, so I guess no reason for her normal splash to be big.
cyan drift
I can make her splash big
boreal marten
💔parts damage ah hell nah gang I've played these games before
outer glen
A2 RETURN TO THE NEXT RAID!!
gloomy topaz
A2?
No element advantage, she sucks
She only came back in modernia raid, P5 ele advantage
outer glen
The next boss have 6 parts
gloomy topaz
fiery pollen
chat, what does this mean?
river spoke
its the buff she gets from destroying a part
glad ermine
Its removing the sus buff from s2 then apply better buff
outer glen
jaunty fern
shy crane
why does mihara have such a convoluted sustained damage kit
when they just do this simple shit right after anyway
to make mihara good in pvp? guess what idiot shift up she's bad
jaunty fern
What are u talking about
Mihara is a simple unit
She just had a new way of dealing damage
With the chains
shy crane
what was the point of that entire mechanic
not useful in campaign
not useful in pvp
just a gimmicky way to do sustained to a boss
shy crane
mihara also had that whole dying bullshit nah it was convoluted bullshit that ended up doing shit
this character could be simple and better
flint warren
<@684751911907360838> <@348235841430355979> is she good
looks like a mother whale killer
outside of that i dont know the full dot value
flint warren
jaunty fern
500% of burst skill damage is 2 shots of Alice
flint warren
when you enter FB you gain 21% part damage and the 492% also hit parts
jaunty fern
when you enter FB you gain 21% part damage and the 492% also hit parts
You don't get those buffs for burst skill damage
atomic leaf
Isn't her dot strong ady?
flint warren
i hate both SB kits
flint warren
500% of burst skill damage is 2 shots of Alice
that's what i think too
only her S1 is good really
but you can't sustain 10 charges
unless they get refreshed when you apply new? that'd be pretty good then
perma 684.6% DoT
if they run out, dead unit imo
shy crane
it should get refreshed
i don't think there is a mechanic in this game where it is counted individually
shy crane
i don't think shift up has to code to run it individually
gloomy topaz
i hate both SB kits
Better, one copy and moving on
cobalt gyro
when you enter FB you gain 21% part damage and the 492% also hit parts
The 492% doesn't get the fullburst part damage up
boreal hound
just burst Raven first work ?
cobalt gyro
Her burst damage not huge though, unless you got a gazillion parts
summer steppe
mmm.... dunno if she's that good or not
jaunty fern
Raven is good
jaunty fern
Raven is good
tacit hull
but why?
cobalt gyro
Good dots
fiery pollen
just like mihara it seems the dot is permanent
unless boss goes into hiding/wall qte/raven gets stunned for too long
shy crane
realistically probably only the qte event makes her lose stacks
near topaz
Raven is good
boss with parts only?
pale tusk
will her RL spread hit 3 targets when aiming at p1 in pvp?
graceful lynx
So charge speed stocks have value again outside of Alice and SBS?
shy crane
there's no need for speed
dots should never drop unless the boss is gone for 5 seconds
steep glen
^
steep glen
will her RL spread hit 3 targets when aiming at p1 in pvp?
will have to wait for after maint on that
they never post range or burst gen 
boreal hound
do u even need cspeed? <:think:773560053969321985>
need at least 1 ammo ig
gloomy topaz
That was fast
vast lagoon
Hear me out
Liter/Rem/Raven/LaplaceT/Emilia
atomic leaf
That was fast
Let him bench 
vast lagoon
I mean as is she's not going to be super relevant outside Iron is she
clear trellis
Ha ha you bet
fiery pollen
not really, she has her own almost 90% sus damage buff
so srosanna's +20% is kinda meh
just like mihara
fiery pollen
clear trellis
Actually
gloomy topaz
raven forum
clear trellis
clear trellis
Definitely better than random ass attack dmg
shy crane
they should release her with a treasure
i don't see the problem everyone will mlb anyway
clear trellis
Still, we need another rl
glad ermine
Rem fits siren requirement for mg too
graceful lynx
there's no need for speed
I ask because 80% of my OL rolls on any Nikke are Charge Speed. 
gloomy topaz
Iron RL is ok
clear trellis
Laplace she is then
pale sorrel
glossy eagle
rank 1 Sr used her with mihara.
srosanna without sus is pretty close to Blanc. with us pretty good
glossy eagle
oh sorry I meant to reply to the guy who said sros wasn't good with mihara
ppl see x damage up in a kit and immediately say diminishing returns don't use them with this buffer
it's kind of annoying
vast lagoon
Of anything RosCO is good because of diminishing returns logic
Damage taken is the hardest buff to get
glossy eagle
what matters at the end of the day is which damage number is higher not how efficient your buffs are
sometimes they're correlated sometimes they're not
tacit hull
Siren rem lappy raven
this is unironically a good team
cdr and heals are both covered
only damage is left
steep glen
And may be frima last spot for the lul
Wat about xlud for buff +siren procs
tawdry turret
cobalt gyro
this is unironically a good team
cdr and heals are both covered
only damage is l...
There's sHelm for flex cdr+dmg taken also
glossy sandal
does anyone know the lyrics of Raven- Oliver Good? All I can hear is Niko niko
outer glen
does anyone know the lyrics of Raven- Oliver Good? All I can hear is Niko niko
Raven is a case of:
When you versus the final boss
and
When you unlock the final boss as playable
tranquil umbra
So, should I just skip raven?
steep glen
I'm pulling 1 copy of both
fiery pollen
pull for this
cobalt mauve
pull for this
Overspec crow when SU
cobalt gyro
Overspec crow when SU<:whyyyy:1008347080097542144>
give her on death trigger effects, and resurrects her
clear trellis
cobalt mauve
tulip flame
give her on death trigger effects, and resurrects her
Imagine we totally wipe her memory, and then we brainwash her so she became docile and submissive, Redo of the Healer style
tranquil umbra
what else are you going to pull
Summer?
outer glen
2B has proven to be worth MLB.
tranquil umbra
rosanna and ssaukra are skips
We don't know what the new units might do
shy crane
we just skipped marciana and k how broke could you be
tranquil umbra
we just skipped marciana and k how broke could you be
78k gems
shy crane
i think you can get raven
tranquil umbra
Still, raven kits seems... Not worth it
Like, I know she's limited, but I pulled alter rei and she's been benched since
shy crane
i do agree with you
if you're not into raids you can skip
i barely have any iron dps so i like a copy
rh / max basically with soda depends on if sg can be used
uneven raft
raven goes to maids
eve goes to Miranda
uneven raft
laplace true damage sir
glacial elm
i barely have any iron dps so i like a copy
I only like RapiOs for Iron dps, that's my problem I was hoping Eve or Raven could be the one to join RapiOs
RapiOs is technically Fire too Laplace treasure and Bunny Soda cleared the Iron OC Infinity for me
frail dune
I miss when we had better things pinned that "is bad" and "is good".
Are someone's damage calculations not worth pinning instead? Can't be less accurate than a rating by words.
outer glen
I miss when we had better things pinned that "is bad" and "is good".
Are someone...
We still have, but both Eve and Raven need to test.
frail dune
We don't though? This is the only (non-opening post) pin.
outer glen
Like I said, they need to be tested to be sure.
frail dune
Irrelevant to my point.
outer glen
Not every NIKKE get a correct prediction right away.
potent ruin
It is the calculations that Torn wants pinned. It’s more valid than just “is good/is bad”. Does that make sense?
shadow rivet
is that how it is?
Hope eve get buff
placid cosmos
Hope eve get buff
hype up anticipated collab > collab gets revealed > it's stellar blade > kits get revealed > main character is mid
thorny forge
Raven is mid? 
shy crane
top 5 iron dps
strong crag
lol
broken echo
Recheck eve
look where mihara bonding chain no burst stands in that chart
shy crane
it can make sense depends on how you calc it
if you calc non burst as 'there is no burst' then her dmg is a lot weaker
our understanding of non burst mihara still benefits of a full burst
look
modernia non burst is still lower than mihara non burst
shadow rivet
hype up anticipated collab > collab gets revealed > it's stellar blade > kits ge...
Nooooo not my eve!
graceful lynx
JP Whales send blimp, both characters get buffed. Or Tachy buffs both when she comes out in Stellar Blade Collab 2.0
slim sentinel
do we know good teams for them yet?
gloomy topaz
I'm really curious in eve lines here
Also Alice 32 shots? Cmon is 2025
Even a noob like me can do +37 per burst
atomic laurel
That feeling when my Alice only has 14 ammo
feral crystal
Raven an MLB?
pale sorrel
how does that make any sense
Breaking part gives raven a little bit of dmg boost, the chart is also based per nikke not team
frank lava
The more parts the boss has the more damage she will deal
clear trellis
nimble frigate
drowsy lantern
Even a noob like me can do +37 per burst
Mine can't unless unlimited ammo comp cuz 8 ammo 
tawdry turret
No cleave damage, but assuming you can break parts for her S2 up time
Pretty good as imagine
uneven raft
it's time rossana back to meta?
clear trellis
raven forum
Summer one dude 
clear trellis
it's okay
tacit hull
2025, still using literal PAPER MATHS when we have AIs running circles around competitive pros
I like your dedication
tawdry turret
2025, still using literal PAPER MATHS when we have AIs running circles around co...
Cuz im at work and im bored
clear trellis
then keep working to reduce boredom 
tawdry turret
then keep working to reduce boredom <:pepeEvenMadder:900788172315840602>
Anything but
dull plinth
sharp plaza
is Raven good in PVP? or only in PVE?
shy crane
could be usable we need to see her burst gen
sharp plaza
got it , thanks
quartz hamlet
Is Raven even close to S class in terms of Tier list?
shy crane
for bossing i'm sure she is
competition pool is small
would not be hard to compete with laplace or maxwell
crisp oracle
atomic leaf
Is Raven even close to S class in terms of Tier list?
She ady has higher dot than mihara no? Don't think she will be as low as S tier in prydwen sense
jaunty fern
Is Raven even close to S class in terms of Tier list?
Yeah easily S tier
Prolly not ss
?/?/S/C~B
smoky saffron
Not even SS for bossing? damn even stuff like asuka fire is SS 😦
shy crane
asuka is part of the best fire team because she's a buffer too without getting cucked like mihara
but idk where raven lands though
mihara is sss
glacial elm
I think Raven will be SS, but she'll be a lot more expensive because OLs affect her a lot
Just like MiharaOs too
Eve is losing because of practicality. If there are Electric bosses with no pierce happiness then Eve will overtake. Eve is also expensive OLs, though easier than MiharaOs
A lot of the mid Eves you see are from cheap or basic OLs going something like 80% ele 0% atk 0% crdmg/crrate, or a weak mix of these
And then being thrown against a target that lets RH or RHH hit multiple hitboxes
Or not even being with a buffer for crits
Not saying that everyone's doing it wrong (ahem...), but it doesn't exactly inspire the confidence to max invest her
And with no confidence, far fewer will dare it
jaunty fern
Not even SS for bossing? damn even stuff like asuka fire is SS 😦
Wait fuck
I thought this was eve thread
Raven is SSS bossing according to current prydwen tier list if everything holds true
glacial elm
Summer rosanna raven best teammate besides crown right?
Would be Anomaly Ultra that you're thinking of, and it's possible to beat it with RRH + RH + Eve, but it's also painful as hell and depends more on RH being great
latent crest
Raven is SSS bossing according to current prydwen tier list if everything holds ...
is that accounting for the incredibly long forced delay she has?
jaunty fern
is that accounting for the incredibly long forced delay she has?
Nah this is only paper math for now 
We're gonna do our stuff tmrw
latent crest
her forced delay is somewhere between 760ms and 790ms, having on just the 30 fps demo video from official media I can't narrow it down more than that
it takes her a full 61 frames to cycle a shot at 30 fps in the video
SBS forced delay is 430ms for comparison's sake
latent crest
on auto it won't
her forced delay appears tuned for specifically that case
which means manual is the way, just hold each shot for 2 extra frames for instant DPS boost 
latent crest
1 second at 30 fps takes 31 frames to actually pass, so her natural cycle time of 61 frames puts her just before the next natural tick at 62 frames
closer to 50%
mortal spear
which means manual is the way, just hold each shot for 2 extra frames for instan...
wouldnt just 1 charge speed achieve the same
latent crest
since another tick will happen while she is still in her delay
latent crest
wouldnt just 1 charge speed achieve the same
it is better to hold 2 frames to let the next natural tick pass by (for 2 back-to-back ticks) than to just slightly accelerate a single tick
mortal spear
i see
how does it make it diff tho since wouldnt it just be (for simplicity sake) tick at 0.9 then 1 vs 1 then 1.1
latent crest
so, she shoots and you get a tick (we're going to remove travel time from the equation to simplify things, there are edge cases introduced by boss movement)
31 frames later, her DoT ticks again while she is still charging
30 frames later, you are 1 frame away from another DoT tick and she is ready to fire
if you fire at this point, you essentially waste a DoT tick
you could potentially speed it up by stacking charge speed, but the most you'd get from 4x black line CS is -0.24s charge time
this pushes your timetable up by only 7 frames
so you'd get that next tick 7 frames sooner with CS, or you hold your shot until after and get a tick 1 frame after a tick
ie at 30 frames, you hold 1 frame, DoT naturally ticks, and then you release on the next frame for another tick immediately
effectively removing 30 frames wait time vs 7
all of this is at 30 fps, will need to reassess at 60 fps (demo vids are all 30 fps)
mortal spear
icic
drowsy lantern
That sounds super annoying, so I'll hope 60 fps works normally 
Thanks for that info 👀
thorny forge
ah yes just consistently manual but holding 1 frame later than optimal manual, for 3 min
clear trellis
I need to check "reliable" source for that force delay
sadly Lorax is not available right now
also, I don't get why we care about her force delay, when she only needs to shoot once per 5s to refresh DoT
if you worry about ramp up, I currently put it at 13.67s to stack 10. Can push it to 16s and I don't think it changes much
her DoT is ultra broken whatsover
also I even put her DoT as standalone timing, so it ticks 180 times. Exact case should be Raven swings and apply dot, dot applies on 1s interval, Raven swing again and trigger DoT immediately 1 frame later etc... which can make DoT ticks more than 180 times
viral kiln
Raven is really good (catalog spec)
imo, she might be used in neural raids too
drowsy lantern
I need to check "reliable" source for that force delay
Altros spent like a year analyzing how Shift Up's code affects SBS DPS. I think it would be hard to find a bigger expert on RL mechanics 
drowsy lantern
If it's just a 30fps problem, then it's negligible for competitive players anyway
clear trellis
but you can say, we have A2 as referrence, can check very quick if Raven has force delay in code or not
drowsy lantern
Ah, fair 
clear trellis
cuz even if she has stupid ass delay
it doesn't really matter much
since her DoT contributes about 90% of total dmg
so as long as you can swing one hit within 5s
she's fine
drowsy lantern
If her DoT is that much of her damage, than that delay is a major problem, no?
You're basically bleeding damage
The concern isn't stacks running out, but application of stacks timed with the 1s ticks of damage unless I'm misunderstanding
My big question about Raven tho, which is entirely unrelated
How worthwhile is putting Trina in her team?
Get that 400+% burst damage buff
clear trellis
eh why delay is a problem
you mean it takes longer to do first 10 hits?
because after first 10 hits, that delay doesn't matter anymore
clear trellis
she has delay, confirm
don't think it affects anything though, probably take longer to ramp up first 10 stacks
strong crag
what's this delay? Meaning we have to manual her?
clear trellis
no, she just shoots slower than normal
to prevent you shoot faster than 1s
which means you can forcefully trigger her DoT less than 1s
like Mihara
Mihara DoT shows 500% ATK but in fact it's 750%
because she triggers it 50% faster than 1s expected
but for Raven, it's whatever. You always whack 1 every 5s
so her DoT will be 1s per tick
strong crag
ah ok thanks for the explanation
clear trellis
tawdry turret
I think Raven will be SS, but she'll be a lot more expensive because OLs affect ...
No, just atk and ele 
clear trellis
we expect DoT trigger 1 tick per sec
but Mihara will trigger DoT every 40 shots
aka 0.67s
tawdry turret
Oh
tawdry turret
What
clear trellis
yeah, inflating her dmg by 50%
tawdry turret
tawdry turret
Why does she trigger DoT every 40 shots?
clear trellis
she applies DoT every 40 shots
which triggers the current DoT
and also add 1 layer of DoT
tawdry turret
tawdry turret
which triggers the current DoT
Also works in her burst and after max stack?
clear trellis
only the normal DoT version. The burst version is still 1s
tawdry turret
Oh
clear trellis
the burst is lame ass 1s
tawdry turret
clear trellis
I mean, multiplier is pretty much the same
clear trellis
yeah, we figured out back then. Now in Raven's case, imagine she was a normal RL. And you could reduce her charge time by 0.3s
which means she can trigger her DoT 42% faster
making her the strongest DPS pretty much
clear trellis
I think Altros thought I calculated her assuming faster triggering time
I only need to throw 1 attack every 5s and it's fine
whatever the delay
glacial elm
No, just atk and ele <:E_KekPat:1191763965244616714>
Oh, that’s nice then. No important secondaries to worry about 
latent crest
my current guess is that raven's forced delay is between 780-790ms, as that would cause her behavior to be consistent in both 30 and 60 fps, I've not seen datamines of her this is purely based on the video and what I gleam as the intention behind her forced delay
in which case you can boost her dot damage by 50% by holding each shot by 2 frames with 0 charge speed
as it would go from 2 ticks in 61/117 frames in 30/60 fps to 3 ticks every 63/119 frames
so manual play Raven will be preferred, even without perfect macro timing as humans will almost never release a shot the exact frame it is fully charged
most people are going to have an inherent delay of around 50ms or higher just from being human
but the key here is that optimal raven is 0 CS with no CS buffers
shy crane
human delay is irrelevant when you play on a rythm
but being frame accurate is really hard
latent crest
that might change in the future if we getting more substantial CS buffers, but I am not expecting us to get any major CS buffers in the near future
they still have not fixed the fact that full charge based skill effects won't trigger if a unit's charge time is pushed to 0s or less
and given that my report of the issue got sent back with "sorry, we can't replicate the issue", I think they intend to leave it swept under the rug as long as possible
clear trellis
anyway, we calculate on the worst Raven, aka the 1s trigger DoT. The best Raven may be even more insane, but that's too much to worry about
strong crag
All this Raven good talk how good is she without parts? 
is she usable in campaign?
latent crest
the majority of her damage comes from her DoT, not her ability to splash or hit parts with her burst
strong crag
man I’m getting Mihara de ja vu with all the DoT talk now
But I’m excited nevertheless
jaunty fern
my current guess is that raven's forced delay is between 780-790ms, as that woul...
devout anvil
muted wharf
ocean kiln
{
"id": 1085101,
"name_localkey": "Locale_Skill:character_shot_name_localkey_rl_up",
"description_localkey": "Locale_Skill:character_shot_description_localkey_rl_up",
"camera_work": "camera_work_01",
"weapon_type": "RL",
"attack_type": "Metal",
"counter_enermy": "Metal_Type",
"prefer_target": "TargetGL",
"prefer_target_condition": "None",
"shot_timing": "Concurrence",
"fire_type": "ProjectileDirect",
"input_type": "UP",
"is_targeting": false,
"damage": 6130,
"shot_count": 1,
"muzzle_count": 1,
"multi_target_count": 0,
"center_shot_count": 0,
"max_ammo": 6,
"maintain_fire_stance": 83,
"uptype_fire_timing": 3200,
"reload_time": 200,
"reload_bullet": 10000,
"reload_start_ammo": 5,
"rate_of_fire_reset_time": 0,
"rate_of_fire": 60,
"end_rate_of_fire": 60,
"rate_of_fire_change_pershot": 0,
"burst_energy_pershot": 14000,
"target_burst_energy_pershot": 28000,
"spot_first_delay": 20,
"spot_last_delay": 20,
"start_accuracy_circle_scale": 10,
"end_accuracy_circle_scale": 10
}
Just ask us for shot table
You can probably compare it to A2/SBS maintain fire stance and get a formula
latent crest
I don't know how to calculate from their source code delays to real numbers in milliseconds
my knowledge on how charging works and reverse calculating the ms for the delay is built purely on empirical testing
I never even looked it up for SBS as their source code numbers aren't 1:1 with real world numbers so it wouldn't have helped me back then
If you can provide SBS's numbers @jaunty fern, then I can probably reverse the formula to convert it to milliseconds at this point using both Raven and SBS
latent crest
you can actually get that data from the blabla website these days, I think
while attempting to find a consistent way to scrape the APIs in blabla, I noticed that these jsons were included in the files returned by it
pale sorrel
you can actually get that data from the blabla website these days, I think
correct it got even more details than the one snake sent
or he just filtered some stuff out 
upper snow
@jaunty fern @clear trellis expected OL lines for Raven?
I assume ele atk and a mix of cs and ammo to ramp up the dot faster
clear trellis
4x atk 4x ele 2x crit 2x crit dmg
cs doesn't matter when you have 0.84s delay between shot
shy crane
latent crest
given the timing line up, CS has negative impact on performance if you are manually controlling her
bronze sun
4x atk 4x Ele, understood
latent crest
it will marginally improve performance on auto, but if you are manually playing her it will have at best no impact and at worst perform worse than if you had manually controlled her with 0 CS
atomic leaf
The manualling we doing here is just full charge and shoot on manual instead of auto?
Until max stack
shy crane
if the dmg tick happens after a shot hits then you do it after max stacks too
we'll have to see how she works mechanically exactly after release
atomic leaf
Dang sweaty manual 
jaunty fern
I never even looked it up for SBS as their source code numbers aren't 1:1 with r...
"id": 1022501,
"name_localkey": "Locale_Skill:character_shot_name_localkey_rl_up",
"description_localkey": "Locale_Skill:character_shot_description_localkey_rl_up_50",
"camera_work": "camera_work_01",
"weapon_type": "RL",
"attack_type": "Metal",
"counter_enermy": "Metal_Type",
"prefer_target": "TargetGL",
"prefer_target_condition": "None",
"shot_timing": "Concurrence",
"fire_type": "ProjectileDirect",
"input_type": "UP",
"is_targeting": false,
"damage": 5729,
"shot_count": 1,
"muzzle_count": 1,
"multi_target_count": 0,
"center_shot_count": 0,
"max_ammo": 9,
"maintain_fire_stance": 23,
"uptype_fire_timing": 1,
"reload_time": 200,
"reload_bullet": 10000,
"reload_start_ammo": 8,
"rate_of_fire_reset_time": 0,
"rate_of_fire": 60,
"end_rate_of_fire": 60,
"rate_of_fire_change_pershot": 0,
"burst_energy_pershot": 12500,
"target_burst_energy_pershot": 25000,
"spot_first_delay": 20,
"spot_last_delay": 20,
"start_accuracy_circle_scale": 10,
"end_accuracy_circle_scale": 10,
"accuracy_change_pershot": 0,
"accuracy_change_speed": 0,
"auto_start_accuracy_circle_scale": 10,
"auto_end_accuracy_circle_scale": 10,
"auto_accuracy_change_pershot": 0,
"auto_accuracy_change_speed": 0,
"zoom_rate": 0,
"multi_aim_range": 0,
"spot_projectile_speed": 400,
"charge_time": 30,
"full_charge_damage": 15000,
"full_charge_burst_energy": 15000,
"spot_radius_object": 2,
"spot_radius": 50,
"spot_explosion_range": 50,
"homing_script": "lv1",
"core_damage_rate": 20000,
"penetration": 0,
"use_function_id_list": [
0
],
"hurt_function_id_list": [
0
],
"shake_id": 2,
"ShakeType": "Fire_RL",
"ShakeWeight": 120
},```23 for SBS but 83 for Raven 
clear trellis
and the random 4800 vs 1
for Raven (scope lock), no buff, delay between a shot on auto is this much
dang
0.85 + 0.2 + 1s charging I think
dunno what the hell that 4800 does
latent crest
I'm assuming that's on 60 fps
clear trellis
yes
latent crest
11 frames are spent as the "out of cover time" even for units with forced delays
the forced delay is over the moment the charge gauge resets
clear trellis
for SBS
latent crest
at 60 fps she would then need 59 frames to charge
clear trellis
latent crest
so 121 - 70 is the frames from the forced delay
latent crest
SBS takes 18 frames to charge at 60 fps, add in 11 frames for the "out of cover" delay that is also part of the timeline and you get 15 frames left over
clear trellis
so 0.433s delay?
oh, I always pick the between ammo. Like from 8 => 0. Not from first ammo
I know about covering animation delay
latent crest
the cover delay is there between shots, even on forced delay units, that's the 0.2s you were factoring in
though under the hood it is actually 0.18s
clear trellis
in this case, 0.433s delay = 0.2s + 0.233s?
latent crest
but that 44 frame count does not line up with my math of SBS at 60 frames
clear trellis
may be we can assume 23 = 0.23s
then 84 will be 0.84s
I think, the 4800 represents 0.48s delay since the frame she reaches full charge 250%
till she actually shoots?
for SBS
it's same frame
the frame she reaches full, her ammo deducts immediately
still, it's only 24 frames aka 0.4s
latent crest
I'll need to think on it when I'm not at work, the issue is that Raven's delay is maximally around 2x what SBS has
but the value in the code is more than triple, almost 4x
clear trellis
actually for SBS, it's 1 frame delay, I lag
like
latent crest
the delay you see on auto is also not fully accurate
there is a frame that can be skipped when manually playing SBS
so there is a fluff frame in there
clear trellis
I will check Raven when she's released.
Either delay is 0.32s or 16 frames
yeah I know, auto Nikke tends to waste 3 4 frames on full charge
clear trellis
not very dangerous on SBS, but happen more on normal RL/SR
latent crest
it is in the transition between the forced delay to the out of cover delay
it wastes a frame when transitioning there
for full CS SBS, that becomes significant, manually playing SBS at 30 fps is the only way to achieve 24 shots in burst
but the bigger reason I brought it up is because it is also significant for isolating how much time is actually being spent on the forced delay
clear trellis
yeah, if you let SR/RL playing on auto, especially the one with covering animation, the delay between shot is actually 1.367s aka 82 frames.
A bit "manual" can reduce this to 71 frames aka 1.183s. Perfect 11 + 60
latent crest
hmm at 121 frames that would put the forced delay at 51 frames, 50 if we assume there is a skippable frame in there like with SBS
that's quite a bit more than the expected 23~24 frames for 30fps going by the trailer video
the difference is large enough that I can't actually find a shared value in ms that reconciles that difference
clear trellis
Im quite bored rn so I push to see the optimal frame rate
For normal RL/SR, 71 as show above at 60 FPS
But in 30 FPS, I just need to +1 to both charging and delay between shot 
so 1.183 => 1.217 in 30 fps
and my char shoots full charge all the time
round it up to avoid some weird ass fps drop
1185/35 will be fine I think
will do SBS tmr
upper snow
4x atk 4x ele 2x crit 2x crit dmg
Aight
viral kiln
wait what, no ammo?
most of her damage comes from skill not auto
max ammo x 1 doesn't hurt, but Crit is better
drowsy lantern
Most AR units have a fast enough reload and slow enough RoF that base ammo supply is sufficient
Asuka, Scarlet, and Phantom have uniquely crappy ammo pools and reloads, so those units are an exception is actually wanting ammo
gloomy topaz
most of her damage comes from skill not auto
max ammo x 1 doesn't hurt, but Crit...
Yeah you right, her DoT is broken, but is that good cri dmg instead of ammo?
gloomy topaz
Most AR units have a fast enough reload and slow enough RoF that base ammo suppl...
Helios asked for Raven, not Eve
vast lagoon
All I want to know is can I skip her if I don't care about iron raids.
Or is she gonna be a neutral damage mainstay like Cinderella or SBS&Alice teams?
upper snow
If she’s above Mihara in terms of dps she’s a neutral god lmao
I already regret wasting my resources on Eve
clear trellis
I do a bit for love
viral kiln
Yeah you right, her DoT is broken, but is that good cri dmg instead of ammo?
I guess so, but not 100% sure
shy crane
people say 90% of her dmg is the dot
ammo doesn't matter
you want the dot to deal as much dmg as possible and that's atk/ele/crit
jaunty fern
xd
gloomy topaz
For real
shy crane
people named gatrix say so
viral kiln
glacial elm
why so many math. It supposed to be booty shake game
Even booty obeys the laws of physics
... I think?
smoky saffron
Raven close to mihara? 
She got the asuka treatment.. would have never have thought it.. from playing the game
shy crane
they are banking on spaghetti code that makes raven beat mihara
mortal spear
even without the spaghetti code her top % is higher and doesnt reset
also has self attack buff
shy crane
yeah i'm not buying it
better than mihara and with spaghetti code she's buffed 50% more
she'll be the best character in the game for bossing
crisp oracle
keen quiver
How is she?
acoustic lake
mihara has MG damage
clear trellis
bad
glacial elm
bad to the bone
flat nacelle
Raven drops when
flint warren
flat nacelle
Zamm
flat nacelle
I'll use her for kraken
flat nacelle
I hope she doesn’t screw me like Eve did
Pulls or gear rolls?
