Min-maxing doll upgrade

[frigid hill]

cause we get 2 of those boxes

[bitter notch]

1 pity box per month

not bad actually

[frigid hill]

if you wanna get SR0 dolls on everyone fast you can reroll R dolls

quick CP and DPS, I guess

taking a doll from R0 to SR15 takes a really long time

maybe too long

yes presumably

this is how many mats you get per month from dispatching (without rerolling) + 1 Solo Raid

Dolls amount will be wrong cause I made some assumptions

I don't exactly understand how upgrading works myself but I've been told this isn't enough upgrade mats to get a single SR15 doll

yeah

I think I'll prioritise getting SR5 Dolls on many nikkes before trying to get a SR15

that way I don't brick myself too much

feels like the best of both worlds

you replace the R doll by an SR doll

it consumes the R doll but the XP transfers

since SR dolls need 3x more XP per level, R15 = SR5

yes

the reason I think option 1 is better is because you get to use blue mats on R dolls

using blue mats on SR 0->5 is pretty bad

rerolling R dolls gives either

SR dolls which you get enough of imo if you aim for SR15s
less XP on average than you would gain from doing R15 -> SR5

if you hit the gold mats on the reroll that's actually really good but you can always just reroll all the Rs you want after you gave one to every important nikkes

[frigid hill]

think I’ll use blues for R0->15, purples for SR5->10 and golds for R10->15 and see where that leads me

[dim zodiac]

gotta accept maintenance kits now

[obsidian basalt]

exp obviously

[dim zodiac]

[sudden fossil]

Today, I lost gems.

Around -45 with no dispatch improvement.

Here are some tips.

The Collection Item Box,

Is worth around 250 XP.

This is because if you get an R, you are fucked up. You need 4 Rs to combine, which will result in 1000 XP almost most of the time.

So, mathematically one box is close to 250 XP.

Hence:

• 60 Parts = 75 XP
• 40 Parts = 50 XP
• 20 Parts = 25 XP

These are worse than getting Maintenance Kits!

What I highly recommend is taking 40/60 parts if available and never the 20.

Most 3★ maintenance kits have 50-60 XP value anyways.

And the 2★ have at least 40.

But 25 is too steep.

You will end up combining a lot, even if you use them as upgrade fodders.

[glacial robin]

They're worse long term, but dolls are more important rn imo

Once I have all core DPS outfitted with at least R1s, then I intend to switch fully to mats

No? By refreshing you can get 1 doll a day

60 x 4 = 240/200

[sudden fossil]

• There is a 6.428% chance to get 15 gems.
• There is a 3% chance to get 20 gems
• 10% chance to get 25 gems.
• 4% chance to get 30 gems

Let's average this out.

23.428% of obtaining gems.

(4 * 30 + 10 * 25 + 3 * 20 + 6.428 * 15) / 23.428

22.4696943828 gems.

So, for each reset slot, you have a 23.43% chance of obtaining 22.5 gems.

You need 2.22 slots * 100 / 23.43% = 9.47 slots on average for a single reset to pay itself.

We have about 10 slots, so...

Today I experimented with resetting with only 5 free slots and I lost -45. Dumb move.

Multiple times.

But you want to take the free gems from the free daily reset.

If you reset the 10 entirely, you basically gain nothing and lose nothing on average.

But remember, Dispatch should make you gain something.

[glacial robin]

That's why this system puts F2P at a disadvantage

[sudden fossil]

You gain about 5.27175 gems × free slot on average.

If you take all the gems from the free daily reset, you are usually left with fewer slots.

You can reset ONCE and get value on average. If you are left with 7 slots, then one reset will cost around -15 gems (since on average, you get ±35 gems).

Note that you are free to take Core or Credit Boxes as you wish, but the cost will also go up.

[dim zodiac]

stop F2P

spend

[sudden fossil]

I lost -45 gems today following your advice and got zero Dispatch improvement.

Yeah, but if you get downgrade like I did today.

My 3★ turned into 2★.

While costing me -45 gems.

[glacial robin]

If you have over 100k gems, you can't see the loss

[sudden fossil]

But let's be real. It is worth it.

More worth it than event entries.

[glacial robin]

If you can't see it, there's not loss

[dim zodiac]

stop thinking

keep reseting

make that SR becomes Treasure

lv 15 SR should contribute around 15k cp

[sudden fossil]

Each slot costs 5 gems, and you can get 2-3H of Core Dust. While 5 gems on event = 1H of Core Dust.

[dim zodiac]

5 SR dolls = 75k cp

your noob 750k team suddenly have enough to kill 30-34

[sudden fossil]

• Goal is take all gems. Take all core dusts.

And maybe credits.

• Refresh. Take all gems, core dust, and credits.

But too few slots, you get fucked.

Cus each slot you take costs 5 gems.

[dim zodiac]

I don't know if core dust worth anymore

each lv gives like 1k cp

[sudden fossil]

Those XP modules are shit anyways. They aren't worth it at all.

So technically Dispatch is just another event entry ticket that people overlook.

Because their value is better overall.

Well less consistent.

Let me see how much % is Core Dust.

• 7.4288% of 2H Core Dust
• 2.2856% of 3H Core Dust

9.7144% of getting Core Dust at an average of 2.235H of Core Dust per appearance.

How am I supposed to normalize this again

For each slot:

• You have a 23.428% chance of obtaining an average of 22.469 gems. While resetting, each slot gives you around 5.27 gems on average.
• You have a 9.71144% chance of obtaining an average of 2.235H of Core Dust. While resetting, each slot gives you around 0.217H of Core Dust on average.

[chrome oriole]

50 gems from event entries = 8 1h cd boxes?

[sudden fossil]

10

[crisp oracle]

[chrome oriole]

dispatch is worse if it just for cd then...

[sudden fossil]

13% chance of getting 2h Credits.
4% chance of getting 3h.

17% chance on avg

Also 2.235h

For each slot:

• You have a 23.428% chance of obtaining an average of 22.469 gems. While resetting, each slot gives you around 5.27 gems on average.
• You have a 9.71144% chance of obtaining an average of 2.235H of Core Dust. While resetting, each slot gives you around 0.217H of Core Dust on average.
• While resetting, each slot gives you around 0.38H of Credits on average.

[north wolf]

anyone explain how to upgrade R to SR doll?

[sudden fossil]

So, the idea here is that, when you free daily reset, those Core Dust should be taken because they only cost 5 gems, technically, if you are planning to refresh.

Take gems, coredust, credits, then refresh MAXIMUM once.

Second refresh makes you pay twice, so...

[loud solar]

[sudden fossil]

Easier way to analyze this:

[obsidian basalt]

this feels like a direct attack at me

[dim zodiac]

damn nub

[loud solar]

So confusing

[sudden fossil]

SIMPLIFIED:

• For each slot taken (from the previous reset, free or not), when resetting, assuming you take all Core Dust, Gems, and Credits:
• Your ∆ is [5.27 × Open Slot - 50].
• Your ∆ Core Dust = [0.217H of Core Dust × Open Slot]
• Your ∆ Credits = [0.38H of Credits × Open Slot]

To compare, event entries cost around 5 of your selected resource for 1H of Core Dust/Credits.

So, the question here is: should you take those Core/Credit Boxes after the daily resets, assuming you always reset at least once for paid daily?

The easiest way to picture this is that, for each slot you take, you pay 5.27 . You still pay less than event entries, but...

Remember, you also pay 5.27 for the Gem dispatches if you take them and decide to reset ().

Let's say, after the daily reset, I get 2x 2H of Core Dust and 2x of 20 . If I reset after taking all of them, it is the same as paying 21.08 for 4H of Core Dust (while gaining 40 in return). Standardized, this costs me around 10.04 per 2H Core Dust, right? That's similar to buying event entries!

[dim zodiac]

don' think

don't read

keep rerolling

RNG God is watching you

[loud solar]

[chrome oriole]

@heavy imp

[heavy imp]

ok and?

[chrome oriole]

you think r doll is useless?

[sudden fossil]

I will put these in a separate thread.

[sudden fossil]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1t_OTPCzEklWK5OQ6YzmpnCanfUWxprEivrDUpSLKeoc/edit?usp=drivesdk

Corrected calculation.

[frigid hill]

get R doll to lvl15
replace R doll with your SR doll
the SR doll will be lvl5

[north wolf]

so I can’t just upgrade R to SR without having the SR

[frigid hill]

nope

[north wolf]

oh my days

the grind

[frigid hill]

but still worth

[north wolf]

[frigid hill]

you should get the R15 using blue mats only imo

maybe some purple for R10->15

[north wolf]

nah the prospect of having to deal with another endless gacha bullshit like OL

is kinda tiring

might throw the towel if august update is crap

[frigid hill]

[glacial robin]

You pull the stuffing out of the R doll and fill the SR doll with it

SR doll is bigger though, so only 1/3 full

[north wolf]

no I’m asking if you can up a level 15 R to a level 0 SR or something like that, without needing a SR doll

because SR doll grind is kinda bs

gacha from dispatch, gacha on opening boxes, gacha from solo raid

[dense cave]

No

[frigid hill]

only way to turn R doll into SR doll is with the 15% reroll

[glacial robin]

Yup

[north wolf]

bruh

AR doll on SW is kinda lit

does RH burst count for sniper rifle doll effect?

[glacial robin]

Yeah, SW was the first Nikke I gave a doll to

I don't believe weapon transformations would alter the doll effects considering they're basically ignored by other mechanics

Lemme check

[north wolf]

wait until summer releases a meta AR dps

[glacial robin]

Any non-Pilgrim AR that manages to be meta is going to be meta on skills, not normal attacks

Aw, the doll effects don't show up in the battle pause menu's effects list

Can't check if SW loses it during burst then

[muted scaffold]

Are the dolls exp requirements per level 1000 for R and 3000 for SR up to 15 lvls? Not counting great success.

[glacial robin]

Probably should ignore the actual exp requirements

They're so terrible that the entire system is reliant on super successes

[frigid hill]

yes

[muted scaffold]

Yeah, I was checking the the recommendations and trying to understand. So, we are basically trying to hit great success by slowing leveling up the doll, correct?

leveling up raises the great success rate

[glacial robin]

Ideally the only levels you ever hit are 0, 5, 10, and 15

but yeah, each time you level up from failures, your chance to super succeed increases

[muted scaffold]

What a rng hell, even worse than SI rocks

[glacial robin]

It actually is

At least with OLs, you can get low rolls or okay stats

meanwhile failures that don't level up provide literally nothing, essentially

I'm probably just going to toss all of my blue mats at the treasure Nikkes since expecting them to actually do anything is a joke

just slightly boost the chance of getting them all the way up

[muted scaffold]

With the new OL CP padding, it is actually quite good in a way. I can just OL pvp units and have the tier 11 lines and call it a day. For DPS, I don't really have to spend that many rocks if I just want two usable lines, and the SI rock drop rate has been sufficient to reach that bar for me at least. Meanwhile, the maintenance kit income from dispatch is so low that I cannot even do more than one blue maintenance per day.

[obsidian basalt]

its not endless

at least its rewarding in the end

unlike rocks where you never end the grind

[glacial robin]

Unless we get get SR15 dolls faster than characters are released, technically it's endless

[obsidian basalt]

she wouldnt

[glacial robin]

I'd assume not, but I have no concrete evidence for that claim

Shift Up has done weird things before

[frigid hill]

Sniper Rifle buffs don't apply to SW burst

so I would hope Assault Rifle buffs do at least

[glacial robin]

Yeah, all of the interactions with weapon transformations up until now have ignored the transformed weapon type in favor of the base weapon type, so the reasonable conclusion would be that dolls would, too

[north wolf]

is the 17% core damage up additive or multiplicative with 200% core hit?

200->217 vs 200->234

[glacial robin]

I'm assuming additive but hoping multiplicative

[dim zodiac]

217

we have Naga

stop thinking

[north wolf]

sir yes sir

[obsidian basalt]

weapon switch never affects weapon register in code

[glacial robin]

Yes, it hasn't before

[obsidian basalt]

they wouldn’t change that

[glacial robin]

Unless the current code has been checked for changes, it's nothing but an assumption

[obsidian basalt]

why would they go and update 10+ nikkes randomly just to mess with weapon buffs

from dolls

[glacial robin]

Intern-kun could put something in wrong

[obsidian basalt]

red hood is already tested to have the charge dmg carry over to burst

[glacial robin]

Why'd Alice randomly get the burst bug from release again

[obsidian basalt]

so unless its bugged it works

[glacial robin]

Ah, good to know

[obsidian basalt]

if its bugged you ignore it in game and bitch till it gets fixed outside of gake

[north wolf]

got R AR from gacha box

thanks SU!

[obsidian basalt]

yeah I got R RL

[frigid hill]

got R SR

went to Frima

[obsidian basalt]

i just want an RL SR pls

im only gonna max scalter for now

rest are staying SR5

[frigid hill]

can't wait to get a 2nd SR RL doll the second after I get my first one from the selector

[obsidian basalt]

real

im saving my selector till next SR

cause im getting cucked this SR being mobile anywaus

[frigid hill]

#raid-planning message

so collectible box II is 100% SR apparently

which means these are the average mats and dolls we will get from 30 days of dispatching and 1 solo raid

almost 4 SR dolls and almost enough mats to get one of them to phase 15

[pliant grove]

this means dolls will be 0 problem over time we're never getting 3 meta characters in 1 month on average

its all about min-max exp

[glacial robin]

Yup. Solo Raid is lucrative

[obsidian basalt]

okay so 3 SR dolls a month

that’s plenty

ngl

very generous

[obsidian basalt]

who knew? oh wait…

[dense cave]

13 blue, 2 purple, got first R doll to lvl 15

[pliant grove]

from your reaction you didn't know about the doll amount per month

if only someone knew and could've told us

[obsidian basalt]

I already said it would be 3 possible for sure

from SR

we didnt know if it was guaranteed or not

hence I said only 1 per month

now we know the other 2 are 100% SR boxes

so 3

[frigid hill]

let's say I wanna calculate how many blues it would take me to go from R0 to R5 on average

how would I do that

[obsidian basalt]

.

[obsidian basalt]

i slept during statistics calculation idk

whats the % for Rs?

level 0

nvm got it

average 4 for super crit 0 -> 5 R

assuming level 0

[frigid hill]

ty

[frigid hill]

nvm it's even simpler than that

but also means the numbers are worse than expected

[frigid hill]

If using blue mats only on R0->15, purple only on SR5->10 and gold only SR10->15:

R 0->5 : 5.58 avg blue upgrades
R 5->10 : 6.04 avg blue upgrades
R 10->15 : 6.59 avg blue upgrades

SR 5->10 : 10 avg purple upgrades

SR 10->15 : 5.9 avg yellow upgrades

182.1 R Mats = 14 days of mats
100 SR Mats = 52 days of mats
59 SSR Mats = 81 days of mats

yeah let's hope they increase mats acquisition lol

[pearl rain]

How about SR0->5?

[frigid hill]

SR0->5 would take around 22.8 blue upgrades on average with only blues

so 228 blue mats

so by doing this exact upgrade strategy you save around 20% blue mats for the cost of 1 R doll

which is worth it

[pearl rain]

Oh u mean use blue on R so we dont need to do SR0-5

Got it

[frigid hill]

yeah

[frigid hill]

heres a more balanced upgrade strategy:

R 0->5 : 5.58 avg blue upgrades
R 5->10 : 6.04 avg blue upgrades
R 10->15 : 6.59 avg blue upgrades

SR5->10: 30 avg blue upgrades + 0.97 avg purple upgrade

SR10->15: 6 avg purple upgrades + 2.45 avg gold upgrades

482.1 R Mats = 32 days of mats
69.7 SR Mats = 33 days of mats
2.45 SSR Mats = 31 days of mats

if everything goes according to plan you get a SR15 doll in a little over a month
if unlucky with a specific type of mat try using the other to balance it out

so imo
on R0->R15 only use blues (never purple and gold)
on SR5->10 use mostly blues and some purple if out of blue (never gold)
on SR10->15 use purple and gold (never blues)

[muted scaffold]

Does the stat given by dolls factor into “castor’s ATK/DEF/HP” for units like crown?

[desert berry]

Yeah, it's base stats

And there's no atk buff that they give

Dolls are basically cubes

[muted scaffold]

Hmmm, thanks. I wonder should I upgrade the dolls for those units from R or just slap a SR0 and be done with it.

[desert berry]

Materials are rare so swallow a no take backsies pill before doing it

Ideally, if you think about it
Only upgrade dolls on ultimate meta nikkes like redhood, SBS, Alice, scarlet, modernia

Or use them for treasure

[desert berry]

I don't think we can afford to split the cost between the 2 things

[muted scaffold]

Yeah, that’s what I am leaning towards as well.

[dim zodiac]

do your solo leil

[pearl rain]

i find this kinda unpracticable... we don't have enough blue mats to get any gears to lv15 ...
but ig it is more of a reason to do this so we can save mats
it will take a lot time tho

[dim zodiac]

Mod

[north wolf]

i’d say crown

[solar pecan]

diesel

[carmine leaf]

4 RL dolls

SBS and Emilia and then ...

[solar pecan]

Laplace then throw the last one on a pvp unit like biscuit/noise/noah for free power

[north wolf]

you wanna minmax lines on mod in the long run (albeit gonna cost hundreds of rocks), which will inflate her cp naturally.

you don’t wanna minmax crown lines which means bad rolls = low cp. she’s also used 100% of the time in the most important cp gated content, campaign. so you’d want her cp to be buffed the most.

mod is not even used 100% of the time in campaign.

[sudden fossil]

Good enuf

Rosanna

[vestal harness]

I predicted this when they first announced this system in the Feb (?) Dev letter

[wicked tusk]

Just got my first sr doll and placed it on scarbs. Holy shit upgrading this thing is gonna take years

[hoary forge]

so whats the math on combining dolls?

[bitter notch]

Pray for good luck

Then cry because rng kills you

[hoary forge]

whats the ssr rate

trash?

[bitter notch]

your whole life

You soul and you money

Nah idk

2 months?

Too cope for me reading maths behind this shitty new system

[hoary forge]

cause im trying to figure out

if its even worth giving these r shotgun dolls to my girls

already gave one to sanis

[bitter notch]

read pins

[obsidian basalt]

it is if you plan to max them out in the long run

[hoary forge]

hmmm ok

[obsidian basalt]

level R to 15 -> SR5

[hoary forge]

[fervent swan]

Imma solo raid

3 SR dolls

Lets GoOoOoOo

[hoary forge]

I hate you

what it do now

this is on drunk scarlet

[obsidian basalt]

wait for SR doll

then you can transfer exp

[hoary forge]

ok ok thanks

[dim zodiac]

don't combine

fill your meta with R first

may be combine SMG

they are just terrible

[hoary forge]

[pliant grove]

put that shit on liter too doesn't hurt to boost her cp

[hoary forge]

thats true

shes' really the only smg you care about it on

[pliant grove]

i'm gonna put it on all smg's that i use for anything

i use soline for ely tower for example

don't see why i wouldn't want the marginal dps gain either by putting one one balic etc

[hoary forge]

my ely ttower

is privaty privaty guillotine

and sometimes vesti

[obsidian basalt]

yeah thats what im doing

[frigid hill]

yeah thats only if you care about getting treasures fast

[pearl rain]

• do X to save mats
• but I have no mats

[frigid hill]

oh shit

we get more mats from SR than I thought

[frigid hill]

so more like around 33 days of mats for one SR15/Treasure

lets go

can start upgrading laplace

[abstract basalt]

use the selector to get the sr one directly

there's one on day 7 or 6 I forgot

well on level 7 or 6 , not day lol

[frigid hill]

the whole point of this thread is to prove that it’s better to start from a R0 than SR0

have you not been paying attention

[abstract basalt]

tbh , not really no

that sounds kinda dumb though lol

even if true

[frigid hill]

it's better as in it saves xp mats

[abstract basalt]

pff

[frigid hill]

and if you're going for treasures you want to save every xp mat

[abstract basalt]

what a strange system

[frigid hill]

if you're not and just want to equip the meta nikkes

just do whatever

[abstract basalt]

honestly the timegate for geting the treasures is kinda concerning. Luckily there's not much meta RL anyways so laplace can kinda get my first doll

[frigid hill]

I mean it's all rng

the rng on upgrading SR dolls is trash so you want to use R dolls as much as you can to save mats on average

but if you just hit the rng then nothing matters

[muted scaffold]

The collectible upgrade system is a gacha in a nutshell

[abstract basalt]

tbh im not entirely sure if I should do treasures at all or just focus meta

1 buffed unit is going to make such a difference over multiple units getting upgraded?

idk

[frigid hill]

treasure units are likely not even better than our current meta units

[abstract basalt]

yeep

laplace is cool though I would love to see her rock

but liberation 2.0.. eugh

and I thought they would scrape liberation system lol

[north wolf]

there’s no liberation just 5 stories you have to read/skip through

[tacit wraith]

Question, if you upgrade an R doll to lvl 15 can you transfer that to an SR doll of a different weapon type or it has to be the same one?

[quaint comet]

Same one because the doll is permanently equipped to the nikke. No way to unequip I think? Hope someone else can chime in.

[frigid hill]

yeah the R doll is locked onto the nikke

so you can only replace it by a doll that the nikke can equip as well

so the same weapon type

[tacit wraith]

Ok thanks

[earnest harness]

so does R dolls matter in pvp for padding or is it worth to roll for 15% sr chance

[obsidian basalt]

level 0 doll only gives about 2k cp so

i would only feed smg Rs rn

[earnest harness]

is it 2k flat or scaling with the sync

[frigid hill]

scaling

also skill CP and OL CP scales on base CP and SR0 dolls give like 4x the base stats of R0 dolls so that's more complicated than that

I can do some maths and give you a more precise answer

if u want

[earnest harness]

so I should roll these R ones right

[obsidian basalt]

no

just smg

listen

[frigid hill]

either equip R dolls then use 14 days of blue mats to get them R15
then transfer onto SR5 for better stats & cp than SR0 (long term)

or just equip SR0 directly (short term)

[obsidian basalt]

yea sorry didnt clarify i was referring to R doll cp

[earnest harness]

tbh I asked specificly about R ones so

[frigid hill]

for PvP units probably just slap SR0 cause it would take too long to farm a R15 for each

if the SR ones only gave 10% more CP they wouldnt be worth it

you gotta compare

but yea only reroll smg tbh

[obsidian basalt]

thats what im planning to do yeah

[obsidian basalt]

yeah cause its useless

people focus on cp padding a bit too mych

your liter doing 3 mil more in SR is not gonna make any diff

[frigid hill]

getting like 5 RL SR dolls and 5 SG for PvP will also take a few months

so might want to equip the R dolls for PvP in the meantime

is PvP is a priority

[obsidian basalt]

PvP gives more income than SR lmao

[obsidian basalt]

im doing that

slapped scalter jackal noise with R RL dolls

[earnest harness]

after the ol changes my cp dipped in pvp

[obsidian basalt]

im gonna max jackal eventually

[earnest harness]

probably I should slam whatever I can

[obsidian basalt]

cause shes permanently gonna be a pvp character

[obsidian basalt]

mine skyrocketed

one team went up 60k cp

[past sable]

Most likely, unless something makes RLs miss

[obsidian basalt]

[obsidian basalt]

that would be so stupid tjo

they already have a chance to wiff

besides her main gen comes from the bonus thing not her shots

[past sable]

Yeah, it would, but I better not tempt devs by saying "they'd never", arena is pretty buggy in general
But yeah, most consistent bet is gonna be to doll your batteries, mainly clip RLs and clip SGs (and Laplace)

[earnest harness]

inb4 they "bugfix" the shared damage

I wonder if we are going to get some doll remover items

like how we are getting skill resets

[past sable]

They seem like OL, in that the grind for a maxed out piece is slow and can't be removed, don't think they'll let us take them off

If the overall power was lower like with cubes, you could probably switch them around

[earnest harness]

the problem with ol's are the rocks, usually ol's itself isn't the investment but the doll gain is kinda slow like books

maybe later down we can get like 2.5 anni or something

[obsidian basalt]

OLs are never finished tho

dolls do finish at least

so it feels a lot more rewarding

[earnest harness]

thats true

also isn't it sick that they made the freebie skin of mod cannon

for every nikke

[obsidian basalt]

real

[pliant grove]

where is it canon? in user interface land?

[obsidian basalt]

maxwell

[pliant grove]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NchmxkJ94w

[frigid hill]

rayelgun noway

so yeah, use gold on SR 5->15 because better XP value

just use 120 gold mats bro

it makes sense till you realise it takes 5 months to get 120 gold mats (unless heavy rerolling)

(no disrespect to the research ofc)

because it's assuming a gold mat is only 5x as valuable as a blue mat

so most of it's exp value comes from the fact it has 70% of dropping 5 blue which is very valuable xp wise

but exp isn't all that matters in game imo

tbf, he does clarify that in the bottom text

it's very similar to what Kisenix/Lorax did I think

imo actual in game supply of the mats should be considered more

if gold mats are the best at super crits and are the best thing to use at most stages, they should be valued at more than 5x a blue

when you add the fact that they're super rare even with Solo Raid rewards, they should be worth even more

[frigid hill]

as we can see here, to reach R5 from R0 you'd have to use on average 57 blues
this is where blues are the most valuable, it only gets worse from here

while you'd only have to spend 10 golds
so yeah we'd trade 50 blues for 10 golds anyday of the week

Expected T1 Materials to SS
Phase 0: 5.7

it's actually T1 Upgrades

so 57 materials

yeah

I made my own scores/values

oh nvm I told you already

[frigid hill]

you're right though I think it's a big issue in this research

the first table tells us how great purple and gold mats are and that they should be used pretty often while blue mats kinda suck

but we have the issue of gold and purples being rare

so he makes a rerolling guide since that's the only influence we have on how many golds/purples we get

but the reroll guide says to prioritize high chance of blue mats with low chance of golds over guaranteed golds?

that's weird to me

[barren phoenix]

Is the optimal way to upgrade this first to upgrade a blue doll to 15 and feed it into this doll for lv 5

[frigid hill]

yes

that's gonna take a few days though

[barren phoenix]

Okay. I had already given my scarlet a blue doll before I got this one

A few days?

[frigid hill]

a few days worth of mats

[barren phoenix]

Oh right

[frigid hill]

when you consider that, your opinion on "optimal way" might change

[barren phoenix]

Well, seeing as scarlet already has a blue doll, it would be wasteful to replace it immediately

[loud solar]

The only exception would be if u got an SMG purple because who’s gonna upgrade the blue version

CP push for campaign at least for me

[barren phoenix]

Isn’t it cheaper to upgrade blue first tho

[loud solar]

It’s because SMG units aren’t usually for damage while the others are

So they low priority

Which is why it’s fine if u just place purple first instead of blue

And if u ever get blue SMG its best to combine

[wicked tusk]

I just got it.

[loud solar]

IMO the priority would be SR = RL > SG > AR > MG > SMG

[loud solar]

Time to place it on liter

[barren phoenix]

Gotcha

[wicked tusk]

Time for liter to make a comeback and take her spot back from redhood

[obsidian basalt]

if you get purple SMG just slap it on and never level it

[pliant grove]

ye its a no brainer

[barren phoenix]

Got 2 super success on scarlet’s blue doll out of 4 tries

Just need one more then I can replace it

[obsidian basalt]

fuck you

[remote ice]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1038708366630977566/1047768821747941376/20221201_022935.gif

[obsidian basalt]

i spent 4 blues and no super crit for scarlet

since I got 2 purple AR dolls

[jovial siren]

Link the sheet

[frigid hill]

it's not mine

just an imgur link in the description of sky's video

[pliant grove]

i got it yesterday on my modernia

free lvl 10

[obsidian basalt]

basically just feed blues on Rs even if it takes longer so we have better mats for SRs in the long run right

even if purple is technically more efficient

except for 10 -> 15

[carmine leaf]

purple can only be more efficient if you have infinite purple materials

[jovial siren]

Why does Rayel value 1 gold to be 2 purples, and 1 purple to be 2.5 blues?

oh, purely due to EXp

[frigid hill]

yea

[obsidian basalt]

imo thats kinda dumb cause the exp value doesnt matter that much

[jovial siren]

but that's not why they're valuable tho... they're valued for SS rate

[frigid hill]

yea

[obsidian basalt]

at most it’ll boost your level by +1 and up your chance slightlg

a gold is like

8x more effective on SR right?

[frigid hill]

R on SR10 is 1.2%

gold is 15%

[obsidian basalt]

damn

10x + even

id say the general ratio is 1 gold = 10 blues

[frigid hill]

and if you fail 3 gold upgrades in a row which is pretty likely

it becomes 27.5%

[obsidian basalt]

so almost doubles

[frigid hill]

while you'd need 15 blue upgrades for it to become 2.2%

[obsidian basalt]

I got 2 fucking SR AR dolls

[frigid hill]

same

[obsidian basalt]

so now I have to level drunk scarlet

[frigid hill]

[obsidian basalt]

but hey pvp cp

ill just select RL doll tomorrow idrc

even if I get dupes of them later on

more meta RLs are bound to happen

[desert berry]

Ye I don't like how he did it

Crit rate matters much more

[frigid hill]

I mean I said smth above

at the peak of crit efficiency of blues

50 blues is still not worth 10 golds

[obsidian basalt]

imo its more like 10 blue rolls = 1 gold roll

which is insane

unless rngesus blesses you

and if he does in like 5 rolls fuck you

[remote ice]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1038708366630977566/1047768821747941376/20221201_022935.gif

[barren phoenix]

I’m gonna get cucked by rng now

[frigid hill]

I told the guys to upgrade R dolls first

they said fuck you and upgraded SR directly

[remote ice]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1038708366630977566/1047768821747941376/20221201_022935.gif

[frigid hill]

now they have SR10 and I'm still at R10 with the same amount of mats used

gotta love theorycrafting and optimizing gachas

[obsidian basalt]

stupid rng

i dont trust my rng enough cause this game cucks me too much sometimes and is really good other times

[jovial siren]

@frigid hill @obsidian basalt @desert berry
Based on the T3 Random Kit Box:
**- 2 PURPLE = 1 GOLD

• 8.75 BLUE = 1 PURPLE**
  Use 2 and 8.75 for breakeven ratios for columns H and I if you want to factor kit sourcing instead of kit EXP.

[frigid hill]

I used mats rarity myself

so based on how much you get of each per month on average

[jovial siren]

that's the same as mats rarity

assuming you get all your mats from t3 random box

[frigid hill]

yeah

[jovial siren]

and not reroll dispatch until you get purple and golds like me

[desert berry]

Whale behaviour

[obsidian basalt]

ty

[obsidian basalt]

so yeah basically 1 gold = 9 blues

so I was about right

10 gold = 90 blues

[jovial siren]

1 gold is 17.5 blues

[obsidian basalt]

oh wait thats purple

im blind

blues really just fucking suck bruh

[jovial siren]

you do get a lot of them

[obsidian basalt]

and there will be mfs that lucksack with them

not me tjo

[frigid hill]

1 gold = 2.67 purple = 19.2 blue

[obsidian basalt]

past 2 days ive burned 90 blues and have gotten one super crit on R

[frigid hill]

no offense but why pin though

that's very arbitrary

[desert berry]

just wanted to get it into perspective

so like

1 gold reroll = 18-20 blue rerolls

according to u guys

right?

on average

[frigid hill]

my values depend on how much you reroll stuff which is the issue

but if you don't reroll much then yeah

[desert berry]

i think everyone prolly rerolls once per day

cuz it usually gives more gems than u spend

im also rerolling all R dolls into SR dolls or Materials tbh

the end goal is SR dolls right? might as well start working on it now

ill take those 20+ R dolls gladly and reroll em

by september (champs) im very sure ill have 20 SR dolls this way at least

r to me is fodder

[frigid hill]

the end goal is SR15 doll on everybody

[desert berry]

yeah but imo its not worth it to upgrade R doll first and then go SR doll

id rather just gamble

[frigid hill]

based on what

[desert berry]

on the 4% rate or 10% rate on purple

[desert berry]

feels

if u factor in -4 R dolls that give at least 20 purple from rerolling

i think going straight into SR doll maybe nearly worth it

even if its worse, i think it might not be that much worse

how often will u lose this rate

[frigid hill]

tbf you just hit 3.6% after 6 attempts

so yeah I bet it must feel pretty easy

[obsidian basalt]

yeah must be nice getting lucky

[frigid hill]

hopefully (or hopefully not) you'll get another feel for it when you fail it 27 times in a row

[obsidian basalt]

R dolls i’ll probably have to fodder by next SR

[desert berry]

i lost 1 gold, 2 purple and 2 blue on phase 6

lets see how far we can go

[obsidian basalt]

SMGs im tbh just gonna leave at level SR0 forever

[frigid hill]

but even if equipping R dolls theres some point when you're gonna reroll Rs as well

and it's not that far

[obsidian basalt]

R dolls will all be feeder in 1-2 months

[frigid hill]

you need 1 R smg doll for like life

[desert berry]

i equiped 3 of dolls on my main campaign team thats about it for now

[frigid hill]

after that they can all go to rerolling

[desert berry]

liter modernia redhood

[obsidian basalt]

im not even gonna use my R smg cause ill eventually get an SR smg

[desert berry]

thats where cp matters

[obsidian basalt]

dolls are not just for the cp

[desert berry]

my aim is 20 SR dolls on pvp nikkes
which i think ill be able to achieve by sept if i reroll Rs

[obsidian basalt]

welcome to the gamba

[desert berry]

im very confident that the mat rate is just so bad i wont be able to upgrade more than 2 dolls per month lol

thats being generous

[frigid hill]

I'll make my own thread with my own numbers focused on getting treasures
I feel like that's not the end goal of most people here so I don't want to pin it here

[obsidian basalt]

its 1 SR doll per month give or take

[desert berry]

oh, so its worse than what i thought

[obsidian basalt]

for SR15

ofc if you get lucky then it could be 3 days

[desert berry]

then yeah, I would definitely rather just reroll R and put everyone on SR dolls if possible

cuz im not getting to upgrade R dolls anyways..? right?

[frigid hill]

long term yes
short term no

how long you willing to wait

[desert berry]

im playing at least till anniv now

is that long term

[frigid hill]

upping R0->15 is 2 weeks worth of blue mats

anniv is in 5 months?

[desert berry]

yeah

[frigid hill]

so 10 R15s

into SR5s

but that last unit will have to live with a R0 doll for 5 months

when the +5k CP SR0 is sitting in your inventory

[desert berry]

realistically u only need doll on campaign team

cuz i dont think R dolls are gamebreaking enough for SR

[obsidian basalt]

SR makes a big diff on max stats

same with bonuses

pretty sure noise + full SR doll team can tank any scarlet now

[desert berry]

in 5 months we'll be getting repeated bosses cuz like

gd -> summer boss -> landeater/kraken -> collab boss -> landeater/kraken -> anniv

[barren phoenix]

Gold isn’t 100% on SR dolls?

[wet elbow]

I'm in Spain

without the S

[frigid hill]

check pins

[barren phoenix]

Wow. That’s so rough

[frigid hill]

yup

thats why you keep gold for the very last upgrade

and even then you’re gonna need lots of them

I got a grand total of 2 gold mats since the update came out

without including the 10 we got for free

[barren phoenix]

Same

[heavy imp]

im about to upgrade SR doll for Redhood instead of those trashy fav item

someone convince me otherwise plz

god damn

i got lucky lol

[barren phoenix]

What did you use?

[heavy imp]

i used like 1 gold 4 blue for first phase

[barren phoenix]

Hmm. That’s some good luck

[heavy imp]

super activated on the blues

then 1 gold for second phase

super activated on the 20%

so lucky

[barren phoenix]

Nice

That’s really lucky

[heavy imp]

but im out of gold and super chance now is only 1.2% and 5.4% for blue and purple on last phase

im scared

NO FKING WAY

i cant breath

[barren phoenix]

So lucky

[gaunt pawn]

When we have the choce to equip a unit with R or SR dolls, is the best strategy to start directly with SR dolls even if it's more expansive?

[fervent swan]

Note this

And finally got this

What a roll

[obsidian basalt]

fuck you

[remote ice]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1038708366630977566/1047768821747941376/20221201_022935.gif

[earnest harness]

its so bad that we can't even gacha the dolls

the game just does gacha by itself

[earnest harness]

what a good spread

[obsidian basalt]

fuck you

[remote ice]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1038708366630977566/1047768821747941376/20221201_022935.gif

[frigid hill]

Privaty reacts to you giving her a SR0 doll

[desert berry]

Child bearing hips

[loud solar]

What’s the first RL I should put a doll?

[desert berry]

laplace imo

sbs benefits considerebly less

otherwise
sbs for pve
emilia for pvp

[grand jay]

someone lucked out with their blue mats super success twice (SR 5 -> 10, 10 -> 15) at reddit

fastest SSR doll laplace possibly lol

[frigid hill]

we love rng

[north wolf]

that’s why we’re playing a gacha game

[vestal harness]

Don't think you should ever bind a doll to a treasure nikke unless you simultaneously upgrade them

SBS gives more value from being used at all and the raw stat is a 7% atk boost at sync 400

Having a doll vs not having a doll is already a difference maker on that point alone

[signal oriole]

is it worth to put a doll on crown?

will it affect her buff?

[vestal harness]

For the ATK yeah ofc

Getting ATK stat is good

Defenders benefit even more

[signal oriole]

but will it contribute to her caster atk buff

skill

cuz gear stats don't

[vestal harness]

Gear stats do

OL lines don't contribute to buff

Raw atk from gear does

[signal oriole]

yeah that

[vestal harness]

A doll has raw atk stat

[signal oriole]

ok thats what i wanted to know

so its good for her buff

[vestal harness]

Anyway it's super good for crown

Since she's a defender

[signal oriole]

i was thinking if i should prioritize her over modernia

since she brings more to the team

[vestal harness]

Not an easy answer to that question

[signal oriole]

yeah...

[obsidian basalt]

I WON THE 20% ON GOLD YIPEEEE

[desert berry]

Yeah, that's my unionmate

70 blue mats

[desert berry]

In my opinion just giving the doll to Laplace and getting ready to up her is the best thing to do out of any doll use

Cuz regardless of anything, Laplace WILL be SS tier in PvP, and SS tier in PvP means META

So like
Just put it on Laplace and start upgrading

No other unit is worth it cuz getting Laplace treasure is actually an upgrade

No other unit actually benefits as much, so the mats should only go to Laplace

Imo at least

[tacit wraith]

does laplace laser dmg nikkes behind cover in pvp?

[desert berry]

Yeah, but the cover isn't the reason she'll be meta
It's burst grn

Her burst gen becomes ×1.5

[tacit wraith]

from S2 treasure?

[desert berry]

Yeah

[limber prairie]

Does laplace with treasure have a place in PvE?

[bitter notch]

Math boys said yes

[vestal harness]

I said, I don't agree you should give laplace the doll UNTIL you have mats ready to simultaneously raise the doll to SSR

[desert berry]

I was trying to say that
Only doll worth upping is lappy

[vestal harness]

It's better to first analyze how many mats you have and then, bind only when needed

So for example if I don't have mats for laplace rn

And I have 1 SR doll

But I do have use for BScar

Then I'd argue it's best to bind to BScar

[desert berry]

ohh that's what you meant

[vestal harness]

And wait for next purple RL doll

[desert berry]

So you want to have enough enough mats
And not rely on pure rng

[north wolf]

laplace treasure works on pvp too yea?

[vestal harness]

Yes

[desert berry]

Yeah

[desert berry]

That made way more sense than what was going on in my mind

[sudden fossil]

Or use selector

It exists for a reason

[north wolf]

just wanna confirm

when you unlock fave item

do you start at phase 0 or 1?

[vestal harness]

that's why waiting is a very safe option

[frigid hill]

dw

ez one shot with golds at SR10

[barren phoenix]

So..which boxes to use on SR doll to go from 5->10 and 10->15?

Gold then purple gamble?

[solar pecan]

other way around I think

[limber prairie]

man, 8% super success with purples at SR5 just looks tragic

makes me not even want to try

[hardy steeple]

hmmm

soo how do i do this , should i give Laplace the SR one immediately ?

and give SBS the blue one ?

[dim zodiac]

[hardy steeple]

i still got the Selector for da dolls just not sure if i should get it for laplace still not sure how strong she becomes

and resource is scarce atm

[carmine leaf]

Materials are the scarcest part of this system. Your best bet is to save your SRs for characters that have reached R15, or put them immediately on characters that you don't plan on upgrading for a long time

[barren phoenix]

Managed to land the 8% on 4th try

[limber prairie]

Nice, who is this on?

[barren phoenix]

Modernia

Now I gotta fish for 15 with gold box. Only 15%…

[limber prairie]

Lmao that’s gonna be painful

[pallid hearth]

wouldn't it be better the other way around?
put SR on your invested characters and maint those, while leaving R sitting on nikkes until you get SR upgrades?
that way you get at least some stats and 5% when hitting cores
since you are saying mats are harder to get than dolls, then you want to be saving to max SRs no?

[carmine leaf]

It costs fewer materials to upgrade an R to 15, then convert it to SR5 than it takes to go from SR0 to SR5, on average

[pallid hearth]

oh i see thanks for the clarifying

[pearl rain]

what does "Can use Purple at 80% efficiency." mean in the pin @sudden fossil

[sudden fossil]

What should I get with selector? Should I get SR SR and slap it on RH? Then, use the SR SG on Bunny Soda? Or should I use the R first?

@dim zodiac

[dim zodiac]

pick SMG

since you ask

[bitter notch]

I put everything in rehu

[sudden fossil]

Do you hate me

[sudden fossil]

80% of highest efficiency (Gold).

[rough onyx]

SMG is correct, for best grill, I mean, best grandma

[loud solar]

[wicked tusk]

My mod is saved

I’m so happy I didn’t get another smg doll

[loud canopy]

jesus. just went -300 blue kits for my red hood's level 1 r doll. only got her to level 11
i want to swear so bad. love this rng system man

[obsidian basalt]

ive hit level 12 from straight up leveling from 10 on my sodab from blues

god knows how many in total ive spent

[west oracle]

i hate this treasure system with passion

[desert berry]

Why

I think of it like sync

With enough time, say 1 year

• it's guaranteed to have them for each important nikke
• for half of those nikkes i will have them leveled up
• Im getting 2 treasures per one treasure rotation if I don't max them out

[frigid hill]

issue imo is that dolls can't be swapped between units

lets say new unit releases

must have dps for the upcoming SR

[desert berry]

imo issue is that I'm not super critting enough

[frigid hill]

upgrades just dont hit

gg

[desert berry]

Need to use and save mats wisely but for now it's like
We alrdy have 10-30 units depending on your priority to upgrade

[west oracle]

Simple, too many RNG
And yes also can't be unequiped... i hesistant to use it because of that

[frigid hill]

1 year ago everyone wouldve upgraded Scarlet doll like crazy

1 year later its almost useless

1 month worth of mats lost forever

[dim zodiac]

why

this puppet system is actually gacha 3 times

if you fail, you have some kinds of protection

cost a ton tho

[brazen bramble]

150 blues for last phase alone and still not hitting

very rewarding system, thank you Shit Up

[west oracle]

I hope they revamp this treasure system

[dense cave]

Same thing as overload gear

[glacial robin]

Just think about what a unit's strengths are before putting dolls on

Scarlet getting powercrept was an inevitability since she's not actually that great to begin with

High damage, sure, but her garbage reload meant needing Admi/Priv support until we got OL gear

and she hurts herself

Even if RH gets knocked out as a B3, her use as a B1 for short battles isn't likely to be challenged soon

And we're guaranteed 10 dolls a month just through solo raid

Mat investment is the concern, not the dolls themselves

And that's pretty much like rock use

[frigid hill]

I don’t think anyone said the opposite

[glacial robin]

Not being able to swap them shouldn't be a concern then

We'll get enough for everyone

[obsidian basalt]

why the fuck would they do that when it obviously is a system to mirror Ols, just has an actual defined end goal you can hit

you’d want to be done with the system in 3 months as well?

only thing that sucks is super crits is the only realistically viable way to level, otherwise i think the system is find cause you have to decide what is valuable

[glacial robin]

I'd rather not have to deal with another cube system

Plus, as a collector-type player, getting one on everyone is now an extra goal anyway

[glacial robin]

Yeah, this is the main issue

The system feels like OL gear, but the levelling process is more like rolling lines with rocks even though we're just levelling them

Missing a super success is like rolling DEF on a DPS unit

[frigid hill]

and why would they remove the gacha aspect

they love giving us a random chance to fail for everything that’s in the game

SI random boxes not being 100%, molds not being 100%, now the new upgrade system is rng as well

[obsidian basalt]

i think its fine to have a gacha aspect, just raise the exp on each thing by 100 on blue, 150 on purple, and 200 on gold

that way you can still level even if you miss the super crit

super crit is nice to get, but it shouldn’t be the only viable way to level

[obsidian basalt]

yeah but at least there’s an actual end goal

OL gear is impossible to max pretty much

unless you get god tier luck or spend a year’s worth of rocks on one piece

cause max would be full ideal lines and all black

[woeful kettle]

I got like one black elemental line and thats it

[glacial robin]

Yup. I like the doll system more than the gear system when it comes to how the equipment actually functions, but dolls by far have the worse mat rate/upgrade mechanic

[obsidian basalt]

idk

at least there’s still technically a pity

with exp

rocks you could literally burn 100 and still have shit lines

if you’re unlucky

[glacial robin]

Yeah, that's where the mat rate is just worse

Also, bad lines are better than a fuller exp bar

(unless it's like charge speed on an MG)

Hit Rate on AR at least helps with hitting cores

[gaunt pawn]

One random box was not enough to not get what you want and they just added another one

I am only getting R SG dolls

[gaunt pawn]

RNG in a gacha game is the meta

[woeful kettle]

Rng is filler material for endgame so noone actually reaches it

Ive only got r dolls from box so far

[gaunt pawn]

I don't care to get R dolls I just don't want to get only the same type

[west oracle]

why you have like 219 of that gray box, it's uncomfortable

[gaunt pawn]

because tired to get abnormal gears 😁

[west oracle]

i mean, isn't you can get 20 every run? how can be 19

[glacial robin]

Lower level clears

[frigid hill]

afk auto run gone wrong

[glacial robin]

Or if newer player, wasn't clearing SI before pity boxes were added

[gaunt pawn]

I was not able to clear SI at the start in particulalrly Alteisen so yes it's unconfortable mostly when you are at 199 and you are missing this point

[wicked tusk]

We really love screaming in agony every time we get a missilis defender arms, so they thought it’d be a fun idea to enhance our experience further by making us scream when we get smg dolls after waiting a week for the doll box to be complete

https://tenor.com/view/shagarita-twitch-stare-twitch-tv-shagarita-twitch-twitch-gif-23727414

[west oracle]

Red Hood & Alice worth to use SR doll, right? or is there any priority list?

[woeful kettle]

I would put on rh unless there is a better sr nikke

Can someone please explain to me why leveling r is better than leveling sr directly im not convinced

[winter dune]

Iirc the odds for a super success are higher on the R doll than the SR doll. So a higher chance to save on some mats I believe

We love RNG

[woeful kettle]

For r doll super success chance is higher but exp gain is lower but for sr doll super success is lower but exp gain is higher so doesnt that even things out

[solar pecan]

#1248451493061857312

[woeful kettle]

But you get mats for trading in 4 r dolls is that taken into account

[west oracle]

SMG really have the worst Nikke roster... getting SMG doll equipment really a curse

btw, switching doll between rarity with 0 exp should be fine right?

[frigid hill]

you can just start rerolling Rs once all your nikkes are equipped

[woeful kettle]

I realized that there are not many meta ar nikkes like its almost as bad as smg

What would i do with sr smg dolls

[glacial robin]

AR is honestly worse than SMG imo

SMG: Liter, Miranda, Volume, Novel, Mast, B Alice, Soline, X Mica
AR: SW, Doro, Blanc, Scarlet, 2B, Tove, S Helm, Privaty

I guess about the same

[west oracle]

SMG useless because most of them are support

[frigid hill]

1st smg doll is pretty nice

2nd smg doll is for tetra tower cp

[desert berry]

What about 4

[pliant grove]

turn those into xp

[glacial robin]

And? All units benefit from damage taken down and cover hp

Not very fun when your B1 suddenly gets nuked and you can't burst anymore

Look at that AR list, too. Blanc, Tove, S Helm, and Privaty deal no damage, either

And Scarlet's getting phased out of PvE, meaning the core damage isn't nearly as useful for her

[dim zodiac]

Snow why

[west oracle]

Another reason, there's like 2-4 SMG (Liter, Volume) will you gonna use a lot, which Alice still situational with SG team... the benefit of damage taken down and cover hp can be applied also to all weapon i think, not only SMG
But for AR, there's like 5-7 (Snow, Scarlet, Dorothy, Privaty, Blanc etc.) and most of them attacker, which at least deal more damage than SMG
The scenario B1 getting nuked rarely happen, if the Rapture gimmick most of the time targeting the highest attack (which more vulnerable than the highest hp) or nuked all your Nikke which happen all the time in hard campaign... also if there's going to be new SMG unit, you can guess either supporter or defender... only Soline can deal lot of damage, at least for now...

but if you still gonna say AR worse than SMG, that's up to you

[glacial robin]

Blanc won't deal more damage than even a supporter SMG

And the B1 getting nuked happens plenty to me in campaign

Screamers suck

[woeful kettle]

Does doll def help make nikkes survive how good is doll def

[desert berry]

Def bad

[open raven]

I have two SR dolls for AR, and I think one is going to Rupee. She scales really well despite being below the meta threshold after early game.

[obsidian basalt]

it matters more in pvp

def doesnt matter as much against raptures

but like

it’s impossible to calculate how much it helps since attack varies so much

[dim zodiac]

assuming same core same stat

Def = 20% Atk reduction

so 37% def more = 27.4% ATK reduction

[obsidian basalt]

not too shabby

considering there will also be dmg reduction

[glacial robin]

Yeah, the SR stats are potent

The DEF is more just a bit of QoL

[dense cave]

The important shit is the cp fodding and dmg taken reduction

[obsidian basalt]

purple at 1500 exp

scalter done

[sudden fossil]

Jackpot?

[dense cave]

You saw it jump from 10 to 15

[sudden fossil]

Thus jackpot

[flat oracle]

This doll system is shit

[hasty scroll]

any difference between upgrading one mat at a time and multiple at once? success rate is calculated individually right?

[glacial robin]

Upgrading is insanely slow without super successes, and super successes get harder at higher upgrade levels

Multiple at once spreads your resources thin and lowers the chance you can upgrade anything

Probably fine to upgrade a few Rs at once, but, if you're upgrading SRs, best to focus on one per

[hasty scroll]

I see, currently have a SR11 doll with 3 yellow mats(30box) just contemplating whether to use all at once or not.

i think ill gather more boxes first.

[glacial robin]

Pretty much the three courses of options are currently available (aside from saving up for Nikke 2):

• Focus on getting favorite items (previously "treasures") for Laplace, Exia, Frima, and/or Diesel
• Focus on maximizing critical DPS units like Red Hood
• Spread out dolls on PvP units to CP pad

[regal sphinx]

the % does improve as you advance phases, like if it was 15% chance using elite kits, once you laboriously advance a single phase it changes to 27.5% for using elite kits

Something like that, so my thought is to save your elite kits if the % are seriously bad, and consider feeding the epics and rares until you feel like gambling your elites

So… gamble away your epics and rares without hope, hoard your elites for the big all-in moment while you pray you don’t fail 20% or something five times in a row

If lucky, those epics and rares give you unexpected super successes

I remember seeing a 45% on elite kits so I think don’t settle for 20% or under, that’s a waste of your elites

[glacial robin]

Ah yeah, sorry, I was misleading

Just meant that it gets harder at phase 5/10

[woeful kettle]

Phase 10 rates are horrible

[flat oracle]

If I select all blue mat and upgrade, then get lucky success, does wasteful mat return to my inventory?

[glacial robin]

It just rolls into the next phases afaik

Not sure what happens if you hit Phase 15

[hasty scroll]

pretty sure it will refund the remaining unused mats when it hits threshold lvl

[glacial robin]

Hopefully

[flat oracle]

I read the conversation here that it would be better to single upgrade using gold and purple when SR reach high level