theorycrafting

[valid palm]

Depending on cooldown and cost, Rossi could very easily be forced to run dumb amounts of ultimate gen to access it every time she needs it, which is kind of rough when she's also supposed to be a crit character

[proud vector]

Hmm, maybe

We will haaave to see

[valid palm]

Just like her damage and team archetype, her stats would be spread thin trying to do too much

[teal pawn]

If your goal is to shoehorn her into physical

Honestly she looks like she'd perform better if you just

ignore her vuln

[valid palm]

[proud vector]

@drifting quest A thought reached out to me

Have vulns and no affliction
Rossi Ult > combo seq1
Crush via endmin
Combo seq2 > 2 vuln
EBS 2x > 4 vuln and a lot of personal energy

Might be a decent loop honestly, if it turns out her physical side has legs somehow in terms of damage. Provides her with a lot of energy and stuffs

[lost void]

Hello asking if somebody already tested out Wild Wanderer on Perlica for electro team.

[teal pawn]

That split scaling is what's pulling my hair

[lost dirge]

test for what?

[lost void]

How efficient it is if not going for other weapon options

[unreal light]

Wait do we know what each of the skill does?

[lost dirge]

Isn't that like her only choice for supporting electric?

[proud vector]

For the most part?

[terse bramble]

is there any info out to know if any of the new ops would be good with surtr/last rite?

[unreal light]

For the upcoming characters

[valid palm]

Tangtang will be good with Last Rite

Nothing for Surtr

👍

[lost void]

If she's on a team having other element probably Stanza. If on a heatlectro probably the OBJ something?

[terse bramble]

who would she replace or how comparable would she be with the current team?

[dusk pumice]

obj procs on burst or phys tho

[proud vector]

Did you see the 40 min video

[lost void]

Ember+Rossi since, so far Ember has no definitive line up but the phys guys.

[unreal light]

No I did not

[dusk pumice]

wait it wouldnt even be able to proc

[proud vector]

You should it has full kit reveals and other goodies

[unreal light]

Okay Ty

[lost dirge]

yeah, obj won't proc with perlica

[unreal light]

Do you have the same banner for Rossi by any chance?

[lost void]

needs arts burst on combo to proc

[valid palm]

No numbers yet to tell for sure. That will take longer, I just gave you the simple answer xD. Her SP will determine if she can replace Alesh, and the size of her susceptibility will determine if she could replace Xaihi or Gilb

[dusk pumice]

yeah perlica cant even proc that

[proud vector]

Replace Xaihi is a pipe dream

50% amp says fuccyu

[valid palm]

Probably, but I'm not committing to anything until we actually know, so

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[terse bramble]

alright thanks

[bronze plume]

you mean this

[lost void]

Tang tang's tornado skill obviously has lift mechanics in it so Estella would benefit.

Probably also have if has vuln= lift otherwise apply dot cryo

[unreal light]

tysm

[lost dirge]

wait what?

[lost void]

She has a skill that has tornadoes making a revolution within its aoe.

[lost dirge]

pretty sure we know all her kits except numbers, and she doesn't have lift

[proud vector]

it doesn’t lift though

[lost dirge]

her only util is art susc, and the obv za warudo

[proud vector]

It’s more of a Domain Expansion: Infinite Void tbh

She even takes off the eyepatch like Gojo

[lost dirge]

yeah, but it doesn't apply lift

[lost void]

It''s not forced lift though. And lift only applies if it is used every second action.

[proud vector]

My guy did you watch the 1.1 preview 40 minute video

The full kit details were revealed there

Go take a look then come back

[lost dirge]

where did you get all these misinfo from?

[unreal light]

first one is also arclight frontiers

oblivion is 14% team damage increase

[lost dirge]

what set does perlica use on both?

[unreal light]

It's full pulser, no slab shenonigans

[chilly bolt]

Does it count swapping to perlica for finisher

[unreal light]

it does

wild wanderer damage, first non-crit, second crit avg

obli non-crit, crit avg

twice the increase

[lost dirge]

I'm surprise avy's dmg is not that much higher with WW

[unreal light]

arclight adds a lot of ele%

ww buff is strong on avy's basic attacks

but they are phys

so they don't have the pleasure of antal debuff, electrification, arclight buff and stuff

perlica basic attacks do more damage (bots deal as much damage as you do)

[chilly bolt]

Oh this is mono electric team

[unreal light]

(I've accounted for their delays, by literally rewatching and adding every basic attack sequence bots did)

[chilly bolt]

How about gil+akekuri team

[unreal light]

but you should autoattack with avy, as her BA sequence deals 19 stagger, whereas perlicas is only 15

[wanton notch]

[unreal light]

I haven't accounted for that yet. If you do have a good rotation for gil+ake, send it up

Ake damage is shit, equal to antal

I mean antal does more, just because his basics are also electro

[wanton notch]

Have you got to Perlicia best DPS builds yet?

[unreal light]

I've accounted for full pulser

and obli

[wanton notch]

Although new sets coming

[unreal light]

this is for p5 thermite jet and obli, jet gets more increase with potentials, than oblivion does

[wanton notch]

So there's kinda pointless to calculate best set for Perli already anyway

[unreal light]

yet it is not like totally worth it

sligthly more than a 10% increase lol

This is antal obj, I think I need to do him with deto also, it should change much

Also worth noting, this rotation is only honest, when the boss survives the 2m damage

If they don't anything that kills them faster would be profitable

[lost void]

I think this would change once gear upgrade comes out.

[unreal light]

Might be, might not

I was talking of weapon potentials specifically

not about gearing perlica however you like

people tend to forget that perl also does damage

[chilly bolt]

so like just stick with deto unit and try to nuke

[unreal light]

for that they chase the Idea - Must feed link to bunny

[lost void]

She somewhat seem to be the electro who can work pretty well with phys team.

[unreal light]

I have not calculated deto antal yet, I believe, it will make any build stronger than with obj antal

[unreal light]

Uhm. I don't think so

she does electrification

electrification increases all damage but phys

[proud vector]

And Aether

Joking (but technically correct!)

[lost void]

There's a weapon that can boost both phys and electro damage. If from a full electro team standpoint Arclight would benefit most out of it but if you use the f2p build with Endmin,Chen,her & Ardelia.

[unreal light]

wild wanderer

I mean not the best buff one might find for a phys team

but if you like the idea of chen endmin perl, why not

[rare zodiac]

But can it fare against stanza

[lost dirge]

less duration, but maybe more uptime?

[unreal light]

ww gives dmg bonus%, stanza gives atk%

they are not the same

[lost dirge]

but ideally you want both

[lost void]

22% attack for 20 seconds for teammates not electro, that means she will not get buffed?

vs +Arts int, +22% DD to physelectro for 20 sec

[unreal light]

endmin gains up to 100,8% bonus damage from his weapon passive solely

[unreal light]

well it's not like you have other electro buffs in your team, whereas there already are a plenty of phys%

flints for chen and endmin

grand vision

WW might come out better for chen's damage, if you play sundering steel

but def not for endmin

and if you just add some funny pog man into the equation, your whole perlica dps becomes insignificant

[lost void]

So it's better to get weapon for Perl making her more dps than sup?

[unreal light]

in the phys team, it's better to bring stanza, if you play pog

just because you don't have any buffs for electric

and you happen to have one of the strongest in-game debuffs

alongside atk% buff to phys characters from fervent morale

[lost void]

phys is the best team to get enemies stagger phase fast right? I mean for Perl's talent I think +30% dmg?

[unreal light]

yes, cause swordmancer

[main nova]

my phys team lift

arts phys ftw

[unreal light]

it's nothing compared to whoever finisher with fervent morale and breach debuff

[chilly bolt]

chat do i go for this

or just 10 pulls and dip

should give enough arsenal

[unreal light]

there's plenty more fish in the sea, you know

[chilly bolt]

ok i did an x10 and got enough arsenal

[normal tangle]

you're already 10 deep, might as well go for 60

[valid palm]

what is your 6 star pity at?

[lost dirge]

60 deep, might as well go for 120

[chilly bolt]

no matter how you look at this it's so tempting

[valid palm]

if that was for the dossier I'd say yolo but Urgent Recruitment is kinda ass

[summer flicker]

its ok value if you want at

otherwise its ass

[unreal light]

bros arguing over free tenpull being better or worse than another free tenpull

https://tenor.com/view/saber-artoria-pendragon-fsn-cute-eating-gif-20992415

[valid palm]

I'm arguing over whether 'wasting' a ten pull on a banner you don't need in order to get a non-pity ten pull is good or bad

and also, not really an argument either tbh lol

[summer flicker]

its wasting pity, and potential pull for the next char

[valid palm]

I'm a believer in the Big Brain Pulling Strategy

[lost dirge]

Anyone gonna pull for tangtang?

And what's your plan team with her?

[summer flicker]

im pulling tangtang

[chilly bolt]

resource wise it's not a waste

[summer flicker]

her sig too

yvonne tangtang gilb xaihi

[unreal light]

chentang

[summer flicker]

[normal tangle]

on yvonne banner it is

[summer flicker]

i have 100k, overkill to guarantee her

surely ima be lucky and save for future char

[unreal light]

bro believed anti-yvonne propaganda

without seing any calcs

[normal tangle]

vro i have her

[unreal light]

https://tenor.com/view/arknights-endfield-tangtang-wuling-jump-gif-5889053850376434839

[normal tangle]

i don't like her

[lost dirge]

same, but I will also test with LR too

[unreal light]

And there are people who might like her

[unreal light]

a free arsenal tenpull

[proud vector]

I did not like Alesh either until he greased my gears and polished my rotation

[unreal light]

sorry, I meant rotation, sorry, I meant rotation

[chilly bolt]

LMAO

eyja dupe

[lost dirge]

Tangtang solve my LR team issue, which is the slow gs moveset

[normal tangle]

the difference is alesh is a support

i can handle not liking a support

not liking a dps is gg

they're not gonna get any other use

AND you have to onfield them

[unreal light]

don't play em eh

basic stuff

[normal tangle]

unfortunately not in my control

[valid palm]

well, depends on the DPS

[normal tangle]

yvonne and laeva came in the same pull

[unreal light]

to not play them?

[valid palm]

Laev and Yvonne are the only main DPS you HAVE to on-field atm

or, 'control' anyway

[normal tangle]

and avy kinda

and lr kinda kinda

[valid palm]

Technically you have to on-field all of your party members in this game

Ehhh, I feel like LR being on-fielded is kind of overblown

[normal tangle]

only ones you can straight up ignore are crush dps

[valid palm]

Partially because people don't actually pay attention to what the wording on her skill means

[normal tangle]

they cast an ability and then go home for the rest of the rotation

[lost dirge]

Nah, I've played with her first 3 days, had enough

[unreal light]

bro doesn't like the characters and continues to play the game

[normal tangle]

she has huge sp recovery on final blow

i think like 30 compared to the usual 20ish

[valid palm]

But LR 'needs' to be on-fielded just because her stagger and SP is much better than other characters

especially if you're animation cancelling

[normal tangle]

?

[valid palm]

yeah

[unreal light]

?

[normal tangle]

who is bro even talking to

[valid palm]

28.84 SP

plus some change

[normal tangle]

vro you can round up

[valid palm]

More accurately, 3.75 seconds of SP

[main nova]

normal, building factory is fun

i did not stay for the battle. I like trying to minmax my factory

and honestly they should remove those limitations for building stuff in open world

i like to put more gun

[valid palm]

I think it's a testament to how much Endfield feels like an actual game and not just a 'gacha' that you can kind of just choose not to engage with the combat and you still have a whole game to play. If you did that in like any other high budget gacha out right now, you'd just be playing a glorified VN.

[main nova]

yeah the combat its mid if compare to the some popular combat stuff gacha game

[warm galleon]

Ayo......AYO

[main nova]

but pulling zipline is fun

[valid palm]

Eh, I think it's a matter of preference. I like the combat a lot, but I feel like a lot of people are going to go into this expecting a traditional action combat system and be filtered by it

[potent hornet]

nice essence pull lol

[main nova]

most of my essence basically comes from turret farming

[valid palm]

To me the setup feels more like it's a turn-based game with QTE like Expedition 33 or Paper Mario

but with an ATB system for its turns

[potent hornet]

i have all mine farmed up for the weapons i have atm

[wind nebula]

this game WAS originally kinda turn based. had mass effect style action pause, right?

[valid palm]

No clue, I didn't see anything from the OG OG CBT

Just 2 and 3

and by CBT 2 it was already almost identical to what we have now

[unreal light]

what are you referring to, I wonder

genshin is kind of the same

except rotations are twice as faster

[wind nebula]

probably wuwa or pgr

[valid palm]

the biggest difference being that in CBT 2, dodging reset your attack sequence

[unreal light]

wuwa is also kind of the same

[main nova]

[unreal light]

pgr they say is the hardest of them all

is it worth a try?

[lost dirge]

most fun combat for me so far is where winds meet

[main nova]

umbrella main here

[valid palm]

Which like... I absolutely get why they changed dodging to make it not reset your attack sequence, since it makes the game way more fun and untuitive to play.

[normal tangle]

interesting take for sure

wwm combat felt kinda bland

[valid palm]

But at the same time, I feel like that's the source of a lot of the reason why Defenders feel useless

[lost dirge]

sure you do you, but it definitely has high ceiling for doing Abyss hit-less

fun to learn boss movesets

[normal tangle]

the bosses have nice movesets yes

[main nova]

wwm battle is really fun tho

[normal tangle]

but i feel like the player moveset is lacking

i feel like i'm just doing the same thing over and over again without any adaptation

[potent hornet]

welcome to rotations

[main nova]

i want to try halberd tank

[normal tangle]

maybe if the rotations were 3 buttons long

skill 1 skill 2, parry parry parry parry parry, skill 1 skill 2

awesome game

more inputs than genshin tho

[lost dirge]

it's about finding the best move between parrying to deal the most dmg

[valid palm]

Before, you had to choose.

a) Don't dodge. Speed up your final attack string, increase your Stagger and SP generation, deal a little bit more damage. But then you take a lot of damage and might get knocked out of it anyway unless you're running a Defender who can parry or protect for you

b) Dodge. Now you don't have to run a defender, and you don't take any damage, but it interrupts your attack sequence, meaning you lose out on some Stagger and SP and a little bit of damage.

Now, your options are:

a) Don't dodge. Run a Defender and take a small amount of damage. Easy to execute.

b) Dodge. Gives you extra SP, doesn't reset or slow down your final attack string at all, take no damage, and you get to run another sub-DPS or support instead of a Defender. Takes a small amount of skill to execute.

[north thistle]

Max pot Xaihi running this full artifice gear at lvl 90. What's the Int gain from P0 Detonation Unit's +16% secondary?

[normal tangle]

it absolutely slows down your attack string

have you tried getting a final strike while getting spammed with attacks on last rite

[valid palm]

Well, technically yes. But not by much, and since that 'slow down' is tied to a time stop it usually works either at a net neutral or in your favor due to how time stop mechanics work. And either way, it is way more generous than having to start from the beginning every time like you used to

[craggy pond]

you'll have to manually calculate it because no one knows the situation with your int stat

[valid palm]

Like, I still think the dodge changes are an overall positive for the game. However, the dodge changes inherently removed the Defender class's primary source of value and utility to the team, and it doesn't seem like Gryphline ever really gave them anything to compensate or make up for that.

[bronze plume]

tbf

im confused as to why they added defenders in the first place

since they where added with cbt2

[normal tangle]

you may not have to repeat the whole string, but you have to repeat the ~1.5s animation for a final strike every single time, and that adds up

keep in mind the dodge timestop doesn't stop stage timer

[valid palm]

CBT2 didn't have the dodge changes yet

[bronze plume]

wait was snowshine a defender in cbt1

[valid palm]

CBT2 is when Dodge was added to begin with

[normal tangle]

so you're just sitting there dodging for 10s, meanwhile your buffs are running out

[proven mauve]

a lot of mmos/gachas have useless defenders tbf

[bronze plume]

but it had dodge

[valid palm]

Yeah, but dodging forced you to restart your attack strings

Not like it is now

[bronze plume]

yeah and it was still

better then just having a defender

[lost dirge]

one day they will make good util defenders

[compact bridge]

Well, zhongli was not useless

[valid palm]

So Defenders let you ignore attacks to increase your SP and Stagger gen by a lot

[lost dirge]

copium

[proven mauve]

zhongli just subbed for the healer role though

[normal tangle]

that's because genshin dodge mechanics are not good

[bronze plume]

granted in cbt2

[proven mauve]

endfield could do the same thing theoretically

[bronze plume]

akekuris ult regens 300 sp not 80 so

[proven mauve]

has nothing really to do with dodge mechanics

[normal tangle]

nah, zhongli was good because shields in genshin grant full stagger immunity

healers only fix dmg taken

zhongli let you keep going uninterrupted

[bronze plume]

its not hard to make defenders in a game good

they just need to give something more then just

[compact bridge]

Its not the healer role, he is there mostly for the interruption res

[bronze plume]

block the attack

because why only block the attack

when i can dodge it for more sp

[valid palm]

I absolutely agree with you Beef

[summer flower]

Ehhh

[valid palm]

My point is that the status quo used to be different

[normal tangle]

just make every defender give you armor of agathys from dnd

[summer flower]

Can you dodge it for vunl?

[north thistle]

Tide Fall 104? Isn't it 113 at max?

[bronze plume]

clearly

[valid palm]

And they didn't do any of those things after they changed it

[normal tangle]

if the enemy hits you, they take 20k dmg conditionless

[bronze plume]

make ember give 50% heat vuln

[normal tangle]

pufferfish playstyle

[summer flower]

20k base

[valid palm]

Thorns build

Rammus Core

[summer flower]

Before attribute and attack %

[unreal light]

oh you're right, it is

[bronze plume]

they call me 007
0 defence
0 ways to mitigate damagae
7 was to 1 tap my enemies

[lost dirge]

or just when blocked an attack, make the enemy who attacked take massive stagger

[valid palm]

"Why are you hitting yourself, why are you hitting yourself"

[north thistle]

what about tubes secondary attribute +26.9% * 2?

[unreal light]

it somehow slipped under my radar lol

[unreal light]

here they are

[bronze plume]

we start a new campagin

make ember great again

[summer flower]

You mean 7 ways to get one shotted?

[bronze plume]

thats not how a glass cannon works

[normal tangle]

i heard curse of strahd was good

[bronze plume]

idk what that is

[north thistle]

dnd campaign with vamps

[bronze plume]

is this a dnd joke

[normal tangle]

damn i thought bro knew

yeah

[lost dirge]

If defender can full, or even half stagger the boss when defended, they might have some utils for speed run?

[bronze plume]

is it like some kinda youtubers dnd campaign

[north thistle]

?

[bronze plume]

or like a dnd made one

[normal tangle]

no it's a campaign module

[bronze plume]

thatll be why ive never heard

[valid palm]

Tangentially on the subject,

does anybody wish that the four attributes actually did anything inherently besides mild defensive buffs, and the rare small damage/heal buff for people who scale off of Health specifically?

I use to think that at least Will had an innate value to it, before I realized that it was only incoming healing boost and not outgoing healing boost.

Right now, it just feels like the four stats are a way to split 'Attack' into four different stats to further gatekeep weapons/gear, rather than actually contributing anything interesting.

[normal tangle]

or whatever

[unreal light]

they are considered

updated with 113 int

[bronze plume]

yeah it doesnt really feel like they do much outside of this character wants this primaryily and this secondary for there atk to be boosted

also will increasing healing done is kinda weird

considering are only actually good healer is my goat

[normal tangle]

eh

[valid palm]

it's healing received

[normal tangle]

i don't really mind

[north thistle]

yeah they're pretty basic. Ig the devs didn't intend for players to explore any attribute effect gaming

[craggy pond]

i mean they probably do something but it's more in the background so we don't notice the effect too much, specifically agl & int

[bronze plume]

oh yeah

chalked

[valid palm]

😭

[craggy pond]

thought hp & both types of res are pretty redundant if you can dodge

[valid palm]

Like, it's not that big of a deal, it's just kind of disappointing/underwhelming

[north thistle]

So what's the total?

[normal tangle]

i would rather have attributes than some weird character scaling their attack with HP% instead of ATK% or something

[bronze plume]

i guess they need someone for you to increase dmg reduction of characters

[dry kindle]

Kinda not really

If they actually mattered then yk

[unreal light]

667

[bronze plume]

but its not like youll ever not go into the 2 stats the character wants anyway unless they have some kinda funky talent

[dry kindle]

Gotta cope they aren't shit stat as main

[craggy pond]

they're more of a bonus than actual impactful stats

[main nova]

yeah the will stat is really weird

[dry kindle]

Or you're lifeng

[north thistle]

667 int? How about the Int gain specifically from P0 Det

[raven chasm]

halo

[unreal light]

depends on what you run instead of det

if it's some starry beach, the deto int will be lower

[valid palm]

It's just

Strength: Get some HP (small defensive buff, unless you have an HP scaling)
Agility: Get some physical defense (small defensive buff)
Intelligence: Get some magic defense (small defensive buff)
Will: Get some extra incoming healing (small defensive buff)

They're all flavors of the same thing, and only Strength and maybe Will ever have effects that actually matter outside of super niche situations

[north thistle]

Only two considerations for xaihi are det and chiv

[unreal light]

starry beach grants you up to 1000 int

[north thistle]

I just want to know how much Int gain is coming from P0 Det's line

[bronze plume]

tbf id rather this then the same ass atk% and def% on all gear pieces

it spices it up a lil

[potent hornet]

you use that to start off with xaihi ult in speed runs then hot swap it back to deto or chiv

[lost dirge]

Then just take 16% from whatever max int she has

[potent hornet]

you don't actually use her in a fight with it on

[north thistle]

Seems excessive to cap out her Amp

[craggy pond]

not really how it works

[valid palm]

... honestly that's true. It is at least more interesting than the standard "ATK, HP, DEF" split every other game uses. I'm just disappointed that it's only very surface-level interesting, and doesn't really do anything cool or meaningful.

[craggy pond]

because it's in the same mutliplier bracket as the frontiers kit

[normal tangle]

her amp caps at 1200

[craggy pond]

so he'd have to take the base int

[bronze plume]

we are for some reason still in the realm of surface level interesting for endfield

[unreal light]

+10% int over chivalric

[bronze plume]

we will be saying let them cook until the endfields

get it

[normal tangle]

people when the 1.0 patch of the game doesn't have anything that goes against the baseline (we are literally inside the baseline)

it only gets weirder from here

see:rossi

[flat agate]

can i get away with LR, TangTang, Xaihi, Ardelia comp

[north thistle]

So her limit is 24%+36% Amp increase?

[bronze plume]

yvonnes kit is really weird surely 1.1 will bring characters that make her better

sees tangtang: ok we cooking

sees rossi: ... rossis kit is really weird surely 1.2 will bring characters that make her better

[north thistle]

63 Int?

[unreal light]

yes

[warm galleon]

Yvon premium team

[craggy pond]

it's weird because many people are transitioning from other similar games to endfield so they naturally have high expectations for it even though the game is literally a month old

[normal tangle]

i can see the vision of rossi being good later, however every single one of those visions requires gilb and i don't have her

so i don't care for rossi

[north thistle]

Translating that to Amp increase, isn't it just 63*0.03 = 1.89% Amp?

[unreal light]

it is

[proud vector]

your cope is weak, child. Rossi will swallow the sun if I imagine hard enough!!

[normal tangle]

i guess we'll get the 1.2 operator kits while rossi banner is still up

so it's fine

[unreal light]

18,12 amp chivalric vs 20,01 amp deto

[warm galleon]

Please be rossi or tangtang essence please please

[chilly bolt]

Damn got 60 arsenal today, good stuff

[normal tangle]

i thought tangtang was like nothing special for yvonne

am i trippin

[proud vector]

Lock it

Keep that one warm

[north thistle]

With that in mind, the sole difference between Chiv and Det is their respective +14.4%?

[craggy pond]

the funny thing is it's honestly not even that big of a deal

[normal tangle]

||that's tangtang sig essence i'm pretty sure||

[north thistle]

So is +14.4% Arts DMG taken or +14.4% Team ATK% Buff better in LR team?

[craggy pond]

i never really understood the obsession for a better essence straight out of the oven, it takes no time to go from 1/1/1 to that

[normal tangle]

?

it takes like 400 sanity minimum

that's +400 sanity saved

[craggy pond]

ah yes, less than 2 days worth of farming

[normal tangle]

2 whole days

[north thistle]

The difference is you spend that sanity regardless via all the fodder you get while farming for said perfect essence

[normal tangle]

yeah but now you're saving fodder for future essence

[craggy pond]

surely that saves you more time than spending an eternity looking for something better than 1/1/1

[normal tangle]

it's not like fodder has an expiration date

[north thistle]

An unending cycle...

[unreal light]

it depends on the buffs and debuffs you run in your team, I'm unaware of LR rotations and teammates

the stronger your electrification, the less you get from Arts DMG Taken, the more atk you have (some akekuri with 10% atk + 28% thermite), the less atk is worth

[compact bridge]

If they want defender to be actually useful, i expect them to work like zhongli, so we can actually ignore all those incoming attack and go surtr berserk mode

[chilly bolt]

LR has a shit ton of dmg% already

[north thistle]

I genuinely want to know if anyone who farms like this in practice has a better outcome than me

[unreal light]

arts damage taken is not a dmg bonus

[outer ermine]

🔫 hand it over

[craggy pond]

the logic makes no sense. Rather spend 10000 sanity looking for a better starting essence than just get the base one and 1 day worth of sanity to get it to the same level

make that make sense

[chilly bolt]

Oh the fragile?

[north thistle]

The only scenario I would do this in is if I'm farming for multiple essences at once

[unreal light]

yes

so it's combined with xaihi's talent

[north thistle]

Say I'm going for Thermite Cutter perfect and I already have khrav and JET perfects, but they're +1/1/1

The prescient move would be to hold off on upgrading them, as my pre engravs have a chance to drop perfects for the other two

[north thistle]

However, I would never farm specifically for weapons that I already have perfect essences for

[craggy pond]

that logic only makes sense if you're a weird perfectionist who's obsessed with minmaxing sanity in the long run

[north thistle]

My logic?

[warm galleon]

I'm farming for a fooder and happened to get that one so I lock it and hope it works on future weapon banner

[normal tangle]

i don't think it's that deep guys

[chilly bolt]

No he's talking about essence

[north thistle]

You can already check leaks

[normal tangle]

if you're farming fodder anyway, just keep the tickets on

[north thistle]

so am I?

[normal tangle]

slight chance for a better starter for free

[craggy pond]

no, the guy i was replying to

[north thistle]

*slight is an understatement

[normal tangle]

it really isn't

i've gotten a better starter for 3/4 essences i've farmed

[north thistle]

The chance for any single perfect, no etches, is already several hundred sanity

[normal tangle]

so?

[north thistle]

How many unique perfect essences do you have?

[normal tangle]

you're spending literal thousands on fodder anyway

[normal tangle]

4, 3 started with better than 1/1/1

that is what 3/4 means

[north thistle]

again, the difference is you never spend sanity solely to get fodder. You get trash essences in the way of farming for perfects

[normal tangle]

what are we on about

you get perfects long before you ever get enough fodder

i've gotten 4 perfects while trying to farm enough fodder to etch 1

[unreal light]

Bro the amount of perfect essences is terminal

[craggy pond]

and i've gotten like 30 of them it's literally pointless to waste more permits trying to look for something better when i can save them

[unreal light]

You don’t pre-engrave, once you got all the perfect essences

[normal tangle]

save them for what lol, they're so cheap

[compact bridge]

Perfect is 1/1/1 right?

[normal tangle]

a minimum of 1/1/1 all matching stats, yes

[compact bridge]

Yea its quite easy to get those

[normal tangle]

sometimes can get up to 4/4/3 but very very rare

[craggy pond]

why are we acting like "better" is gonna be some god rolls of 4/4/3, the majority of the time it's just gonna be 1/2/1

which again takes no time to get to from 1/1/1 anyway

[normal tangle]

i've gotten 1/3/1 and 4/1/1

it's not huge but it's literally free

what is the big deal here

[compact bridge]

I learn 3/3/3 is quite useless to look for since the first upgrade are cheap

[unreal light]

Oh no I spent 80 more sanity on the essences, I could have dropped 1/2/1 instead of getting 1/1/1 and upgrading it

[north thistle]

The first etch? Or max etching a stat line?

[normal tangle]

no x/x/3 is rare

3 on bottom line is max

[north thistle]

All locked flawless are unique perfects

[unreal light]

There is no eternal sanity spender in this game

[compact bridge]

Yeah that too

[normal tangle]

full etch one essence

[craggy pond]

great, now ask everyone how often they get a perfect essence better than 1/2/1

[compact bridge]

1/1/2 probably the best i can hope for

[normal tangle]

like 6/6/3

[unreal light]

You’ll get enough mats and T-creds to max all of your operators

[lost dirge]

I'm happy with anything 1/1/2 or better.

[north thistle]

You are supposed to use coolant for the last upgrades

[unreal light]

Sooner or later, there won’t be a place to spend your sanity forever

[normal tangle]

bro thinks i'm rich on coolant or something lol

[unreal light]

Just etch other stats / other essences

[normal tangle]

i use coolant if i can, but it takes 30-45 failed attempts to even do that

[craggy pond]

it's really not that deep, you spend the same coolant you got from getting the essence there

[unreal light]

That’s how you gain coolant gel

[craggy pond]

it's self sufficient

[compact bridge]

Hold your thought, they will introduce us to rock sanity farming soon

[north thistle]

450 Coolant to go from 5-6. You only need to do that for your DPS or a key stat. 300 for 2-3

[normal tangle]

vro what do you think i'm doing man

i know how the etching system works

[craggy pond]

the optimal method is literally to spend coolant on the last level

[unreal light]

You’re a smoking fish, after all

[normal tangle]

do yall just not understand what i'm saying

[compact bridge]

Isnt the last few level got the same chance to success?

[normal tangle]

you're farming fodder anyway
keep using tickets because there's literally no reason not to, and you might get a better starter for free

[north thistle]

I do, which is why I think the only way to settle this is to prove it in practice

[unreal light]

The amount of perfect essences is terminal

Once all are upgraded, you have nowhere to spend your sanity on, so you’re not winning anything in the long run

[craggy pond]

except that "no reason not to" part just doesn't apply since you're literally wasting permits

[north thistle]

But I'm never only farming for fodder. Fodder is a byproduct of farming for perfects

[unreal light]

Based

[chilly bolt]

Classic hg using the same text instead of just show the %

[normal tangle]

assuming you're using coolant gel, that's a MINIMUM of 30 essences you'd have to farm regardless. you're going to get a perfect before even touching 30 essences

[unreal light]

You have farmed only 4 perfect essences, of course you have other essences to farm for

[normal tangle]

not even mentioning that it usually takes like ~80 essences

[north thistle]

?? I have 18 unique perfects what are you talking about?

[normal tangle]

perfects are so common

1/12 i'm pretty sure

[unreal light]

Sorry, I mixed up you and psychic moves

[compact bridge]

How do you know those very low value lol

[normal tangle]

no i have 4 etched perfects, i have many unleveled ones

[lost dirge]

did you just compare permit that are bought using stock bills to sanity?

[normal tangle]

you asked me how many etched perfects i had

[gritty briar]

but like if they're v4, permits are practically worthless anyways. You can buy more than you can possibly use in a week with a worthless currency so this cost may as well be nothing

[unreal light]

Not me but yeah

I get it

[north thistle]

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fwhats-the-success-rate-for-very-high-and-high-for-essence-v0-f1kv50pk6fig1.png%3Fwidth%3D1353%26format%3Dpng%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D6191cbeacc132e25b5f4a5ceae9d1a34adb85eaa

[craggy pond]

compare? Please quote me where i was comparing them

[north thistle]

It's in chinese so I automatically trust it

[craggy pond]

why do we act like spending sanity on alluvium without permit yield you any less essence when it's on the topic of farming for fodder

[normal tangle]

permits are free dude

what the hell else are you using stock bills on

valley 4 artificing catalysts?

[north thistle]

4 maxed perfects? What about the others?

[gritty briar]

permits being an item i cannot possibly run out of and costing a resource that is effectively monopoly money is practically no different than being free

[normal tangle]

they're for weapons i don't use rn, essences i got while farming for another

[north thistle]

Again, the real cost is never permits but sanity

[normal tangle]

for example i have a wedge essence but i abandoned yvonne at level 60

so i'm not investing in ts

[craggy pond]

then it's just preference, i'd like to save up my permits for future use, it has nothing to do with how free it is in the current economy, i want a decent pile of permits when i need them in the future

[north thistle]

I do understand the game never requires you to have more than 4 perfects, as there's currently no content for multiple teams.

[north thistle]

idk, you'll always have more permits than you have sanity to spend

[compact bridge]

Unless its from a data mining, its probably a guess based on trial and error

[north thistle]

Unless you do max sanity refills, 28 origeo per day

[normal tangle]

genuinely tell me what the hell you're using stock bills for if not permits

because god knows i have too many

[craggy pond]

you won't have that luxury in the future when only 2 regions can be active at any given point

which means your v4 factory will shut down completely unless you choose not to

and along with it v4 permit income

[compact bridge]

Buy those permits, but keep them so you can use them as soon as rossi here

[craggy pond]

i made a choice to save v4 permits for the future so i won't have to worry about it when the time comes

[lost dirge]

you meant another 11 months?

[craggy pond]

it's really that simple

[north thistle]

idk, if you can understand here's the original video
https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1VakbBVE9P/?spm_id_from=333.1387.homepage.video_card.click&vd_source=7b8df949d9a67e0db67557c8a98f2b99

[craggy pond]

so? The choice i made is not worth any less than farming for a better starting essence

[lost dirge]

bro worrying about valley 4 permit stock

[normal tangle]

i have already bought out this week's permits

[lost dirge]

you do you, we think it's less value

[normal tangle]

which is why i'm saying they're free

i don't know why we're pretending engraving permits are such a valuable resource

they cost literally nothing

[north thistle]

Is there any way we can come to a consensus based on practice?

[chilly bolt]

Bro called statistics is a guess lol

[midnight stirrup]

Cause this chat has bricks for brains

[normal tangle]

autocorrect

[compact bridge]

Depend on the sample lol

[north thistle]

The original point of contention was whether farming solely a better starting essence is worth it.

[compact bridge]

Probably no

The first two level probably only cost like 5 essence to upgrade

[north thistle]

I can understand doing something like that if my target is a perfect I do not already have

Say I'm going for Thermite Cutter perfect and I already have khrav and JET perfects, but they're +1/1/1

The prescient move would be to hold off on upgrading them, as my pre engravs have a chance to drop perfects for the other two

[gritty briar]

5 essence is like 150 sanity bro

[lost dirge]

uh, man. math and logic are not a thing anymore

[normal tangle]

spending permit = chance for better starting essence = less fodder needed to max

hope this helps

[craggy pond]

really the same way you guys think permits are free, i think doing alluvium for fodders is free without having to waste permit. This circles back to my point earlier being it takes no time to get a 1/1/1 up to the level of whatever you guys are farming for anyway

[warm galleon]

The wall of text started because of what I got

[north thistle]

The point is those trash essences aren't worth sanity

[wind nebula]

if the content stays this easy, how long until the TC community just implodes?

[north thistle]

Currently irrelevant, that isn't a perfect

[normal tangle]

?

how are they not worth sanity

[craggy pond]

and i don't think the amount of essence i save from doing that is worth wasting my permits on, that's all. Again my goal is to save & stockpile permits for the future

[north thistle]

You won't ever use those essences for anything but etching. They byproducts

[normal tangle]

yes, how are you going to get etching fodder without using sanity

what are you etching with

[lost dirge]

"take no time" yeah, but do you understand the concept of equality and inequality? 1 > 0. If it take even 1 essence less to max, it still has better value. I'm not sure why it's so hard to understand.

[north thistle]

I'm saying you will always have fodder as you farm for perfects

[compact bridge]

Yeah, but we dont know how many sanity is required to get 2/2/1, since we dont have a permit that can upgrade your minimum essence level

[normal tangle]

not nearly enough

[craggy pond]

and i'm also not sure what's so hard to understand about wanting to save permits for the future instead of needing like 5 less essence

[north thistle]

If your goal is to max every single unique perfect (6/6/3) then yes, true

[craggy pond]

i stated my reasoning, it's really not that deep

[north thistle]

However, that is stupid

[north thistle]

Most characters don't even need 6/6 on the first two

[lost dirge]

it's not hard, if it's a scarcity issue. But it's not

[gritty briar]

i mean if you've ever continued to farm trash after getting all perfect essences in order to etch, then you are spending sanity on it, and therefore it is worth sanity to anyone who has done this
I think the majority of people will eventually get their perfect essence but still need to farm to etch.

[north thistle]

Do you have every single perfect?

[gritty briar]

well sure, but it's at least more than 0

[normal tangle]

why are we even talking about every single perfect

[craggy pond]

if that's what you mean by me comparing permits to sanity then sure, i think the hundreds of permits is worth more than the extra like 200 sanity i would save

[normal tangle]

this remains true even trying to max 1 essence

[gritty briar]

I have all the ones i plan on using faster than all the ones i plan on maxing.
I am essentially done farming for matching essences so i do just need to farm fodder at this point

[north thistle]

Because only trying to max a single essence is a waste for the future. It's like choosing between pre engravs that let you see 2 unique perfects vs 5 unique perfects

[compact bridge]

Honestly im using my permit 24/7 to get essence for ardelia and endmin, but the best i got was 1/2/1

[north thistle]

Then what are you using for your pre engravs?

The same ones that drop the essence you already have?

[gritty briar]

yeah pretty much

[compact bridge]

If you guys know the statistics for getting a 4/4/1 starter im all ears bro

[north thistle]

So you basically have to start the cycle at 0 when you decide to build new characters

[gritty briar]

it doesn't really save a lot but it's more than 0 and the permits are worth 0 for me

[north thistle]

If you had every single perfect, I would understand farming solely for fodder. At that point it is terminal (though you could pre-farm based on leaks)

[craggy pond]

it's just a matter of perspective then, in the long term the 1000 permits wasted is worth way more than the like 1-2 days worth of sanity saved in my book

[north thistle]

Personally, I'm coming close to that limit, which is why I've been etching in priority of characters I already have built.

[compact bridge]

How about the future character essence? It could drop a 4/4/2 starter but we never got it since we are using permits for character that we already have its essence

[gritty briar]

If there were other weapons to get essence for to prepare for those characters, i would also likely get the perfect for those far before i get a satisfactory amount of etching material for that weapon
So in the end i'd still need to farm a shit ton of fodder regardless

[north thistle]

The point is not everyone needs a maxed essence

[craggy pond]

this all ties back to the same idea of only 2 regions can be active at any point, with all those permits saved up i can be certain that i won't need to touch my v4 factory again until eos

[north thistle]

In my laev team, I only maxed laev's essence. Everyone else I got their skill line to +3

[gritty briar]

even maxing a single line stat each weapon is absurdly expensive

like i'm not missing etching material by a small margin

[north thistle]

Not in the long term

[craggy pond]

if you guys are fine with making more when you guys need to, sure, go ahead, i care more about optimizing my factory gains

[north thistle]

You'll spend more starting the cycle over when you build another character

[warm galleon]

I got a 2/1/2 once that works on jet(usable on other standard wep) but idk if I'll ever use them.

[gritty briar]

in the long term i'd likely get a perfect essence of everything I need far before i get etching material for it. The difference in getting perfects and farming etching is just that big

[north thistle]

The difference is you'd have gotten more perfects while also having similar amounts of fodder per sanity spent

[warm galleon]

I have 3 detonate and 3 fracture too but no compatible weapon

[compact bridge]

I always farm essence without the permit, and lock every random essence that has at least 3/3/1... If in the future someone want it i dont need to waste sanity to look for it

[warm galleon]

Yah

[gritty briar]

No I won't?
The amount of farming i do to get the perfect essence at the start doesn't cost me anything.
If i need 20 runs to get a perfect but 100 runs to get enough fodder, i will never actually need to spend any additional sanity on getting a perfect.
Getting a perfect doesn't have a cost.

[north thistle]

By farming for multiple uniques at once, you save sanity that you would spend on exp, materials, etc.

[warm galleon]

May be the 3 deto/fract will find a home

[north thistle]

20 runs to get a single perfect, 20*3 - 1 is still 59 fodder

[north thistle]

Farm for a second perfect, you get two unique perfects and enough fodder to max one, in your scenario

The difference is you will never be maxing every essence

[chilly bolt]

The cost is you wont have instant power spike as you have yo wait for enough fodder, but ye in the long term it makes sense

[north thistle]

You'll max DPS, +3 the skill stat for supports, then move in priority for your second team

[compact bridge]

The real question is how many run will you guys do to get an essence that is better than 1/1/1?

[bronze plume]

i just do runs until i get the line im looking for

[north thistle]

Greater than the odds of getting the specific perfect

[bronze plume]

if im not looking for any

everything is fodder

[north thistle]

Like far greater for it to be meaningful

[gritty briar]

But that's not even enough to max a single line on an essence
And if i didn't even want a single stat on each essence, why am i even farming that essence? It'd be clear i'm not even using the weapon at that point.

[north thistle]

Bc the first few stat levels upgrades are worth basically negligable amounts of sanity

[bronze plume]

yippie

[compact bridge]

Most people here seems want to keep farming for better essence than a 1/1/1

[gritty briar]

Like if you don't care enough about the stats on the essence to even etch a single stat on it, why even care about the perfect essence for it?

[bronze plume]

thats just a waste of my time imo

[craggy pond]

i mean i totally get the idea of farming for better essences to save sanity in the long term, the permits wasted in the process simply worth more to me

[compact bridge]

Exactly

[north thistle]

You're correct in this scenario where you've only farmed two uniques and stopped

[lost dirge]

Uh, why not? If I'm farming for fodder anyway, why not farm better perfect essence for other weapons as well?

[north thistle]

Ardelia weapon on Ardelia

[bronze plume]

if i get better then 1/1/1 sure im happy ive done that already but i aint going outta my way if i got the 1/1/1 im looking for im not using more permits

[north thistle]

I don't need Int, not even Treatment. I only want the third skill stat so she can be better at supporting laev

[north thistle]

Exactly, that's my point

[compact bridge]

Perfect essence for other weapon is totally worth it, but the question here is farming for better essence than a 1/1/1 perfect essence

[bronze plume]

sad sheep noises smh

[normal tangle]

not even p5?

fake fan

[lost dirge]

And that's not what we are talking about here.

[warm galleon]

Xaihi might steal that

[bronze plume]

theres a deference between being a fan and spending money i dont want to spend on pixels

[compact bridge]

Really? What you guys talk about then?

[bronze plume]

thats not the sheep

[lost dirge]

I don't get what you don't understand, seriously.

[gritty briar]

Look i have a perfect of every essence that i plan on using in the game. If they announce a weapon with a new essence, i will get that perfect before a satisfactory amount of etch material for it, every time. Getting the perfects is just not a relevant cost because I just always need more etching
Even if it's a weapon I dont need max etching for and only need 1 stat, like only needing 3rd line on thermite cutter. The etch cost is simply so high i could never care about the time spent on getting perfects

[north thistle]

Yeah, I understand

Most players definitely don't need every perfect

[lost dirge]

Wait, let me illustrate this. Give me a sec.

[north thistle]

but I'm saying it'd be prescient to keep your pre engravs open

[dawn patrol]

lmao

[north thistle]

Bc the benefit is you not needing to spend several hundred sanity when you decide to build that character's wepon in the future

[north thistle]

Based no sustain

[bronze plume]

that or 0/0/3 is what is more worth it in the first place

[compact bridge]

I thought we are arguing whether its worth it to farm better starting essence after we already got a 1/1/1 perfect essence?

[north thistle]

Yeah that's what I thought the point of contention was

[craggy pond]

it's literally just a trade off, let's just say you guys will be auto spending permits every run until the next map gets released. Sure, you guys may have saved 2-3 days worth of sanity in total by that point, but what's the cost? Your permit pile is non existent. Now if you guys wanna farm for any essence in v4 you'll have to turn on your v4 factory and in the process heavily cripple any future factory's gains for it. I'd much rather just spend those few more days worth of sanity to get my base essences to the exact level you guys farmed for, while not having to worry about my permits until i retire

[gritty briar]

you still would though for etching materials so it's not cutting down on the total grind

[normal tangle]

my ardelia essence just dropped like this

0 sanity required gg

[dawn patrol]

eventually i'll hit 1k heals like u (maybe)

[north thistle]

I'm saying you should never be farming just for fodder

[bronze plume]

you wont hit 1k unless you use the healing set or youre healing someone who wants will

[normal tangle]

you're saying you're getting enough essence to fully etch something without ever farming fodder?

[north thistle]

That is very lucky, but not something I would specifically go for

[dawn patrol]

[warm galleon]

I just realized I don't have her essence yet

[dawn patrol]

not putting lynx on my ard smh

[lost dirge]

Ok, so let's say, I have detu essence and LR sig perfect essence now, both 1/1/1. So now, I'm farming for fodders for LR. Ignoring the 5* weapons, should I use permit to farm still? We argue that using permit is worth it for the off-chance of obtaining better essence for Detu (and the other 5* as well), and some think the value of permit outweigh the low chance of getting better than 1/1/1. This is the simplest I can explain.

[bronze plume]

1 sheep to laevatain is 692

[compact bridge]

Understandable, she want the best of your resource lol

[north thistle]

Bc from a quick glance, when you farm for Ardelia's perfect, your best pre engravs will only let you see perfects for

• Umbral
• White Night
• Navigator
• Wedge

[dawn patrol]

almost 700 isn't bad but don't you also have the pot that increases dolly chance

[normal tangle]

basically it's
group 1: permits are worth more than the saved sanity
group 2: permits are worth literally nothing, might as well save a bit of sanity

[bronze plume]

i do not have pot3

[normal tangle]

normal people are in group 2, people who never use scrolls or potions in rpgs are in group 1

[craggy pond]

yes, that's basically the debate. I say it's just a matter of preference but to me personally the permits are worth more and it's not close

[warm galleon]

She's staying at lv 40, unless you know i got bored or somtin.

[north thistle]

The permit thing is a different matter, I just want to talk about farming specifically for fodder

[normal tangle]

you're going to be farming fodder regardless

that is an unavoidable fact of life

you will never fully etch something without farming fodder

[craggy pond]

are you referring to farming for fodder without any specific essence in mind

that's just inevitable

every soul here is doing that every day

[dawn patrol]

ngl i always thought u did

[north thistle]

I'm going to be farming uniques. Once I get the unique I want, I farm for a different one. The byproduct is fodder

[bronze plume]

nah my ardelia is p2

[craggy pond]

you'll never max an essence without farming for fodders

[normal tangle]

what level is your essence

[north thistle]

At some point, I will have all uniques and enough fodder to max my DPS essences and important lines for supports.

[north thistle]

Which?

[compact bridge]

Im in group 3, permit worth nothing but i dont have the patience to wait for a better than perfect essence drop lol

[gritty briar]

you could attempt to farm a perfect for every essence in the game and you'd still be left etch farming just to max out 3 of them after your done. fodder farming is inevitable. The sheer volume of fodder you need is just that immense

[north thistle]

My laev team is my most built, and her essence is maxed

[craggy pond]

well i mean that's pretty intuitive but i for example am at a point where there's no weapon that can benefit from me farming more perfect essences

[north thistle]

Everyone else
Wulf, Ake and Ard have +3 in their last line

[gritty briar]

understandable tbh
Sometimes i just wanna play the weapon

[normal tangle]

all of your dps essence

[craggy pond]

i have a perfect essence for pretty much every weapon that i use or might use

[north thistle]

Ah, that's important you bring that up.
If we farmed the way you suggest, we wouldn't have enough sanity to build more than one DPS to max

[normal tangle]

i'm afraid that is not related to what i asked

[compact bridge]

I mean yeah, ill probably keep using the permit but after i farmed enough essence, ill upgrade the 1/1/1 perfect essence

[normal tangle]

you farmed 18 different perfect essences, how many of them do you ever care to use? how many of them are etched?

if you're farming essences you won't use, you're farming fodder

regardless of how you label it

[north thistle]

Here are my Da Pan and Khrav essences

[craggy pond]

isn't that like just common sense tho when we refer to fodder we mostly just mean essences that we don't find an use for

[north thistle]

Again, I only have two teams built. My laev and phys

[gritty briar]

yeah isn't farming for essences you never use actually just far more pointless?

[craggy pond]

whether that's from farming for other perfect essences

or random essences

[normal tangle]

apparently this guy is not using the common sense definition idk

[compact bridge]

Anything better than 2/2/1 is not a fodder in my label, unless i already got a dupe for that essence

[north thistle]

Fodder is essences you can never use, because they aren't perfect

[north thistle]

It's important, because the sanity you would save farming my way would then be used on everything else to build a character

If we want to extrapolate, we can also compare how many characteres we have built

[gritty briar]

also i'd like to point out that refarming the same essence is not actually mutually exclusive to farming uniques for other weapons, as an etching permit can cover multiple possible weapons.
While farming that essence again, you will probably get many others for other weapons

[craggy pond]

i mean like of course we're gonna try to farm for other perfect essences before it devolves into farming without permits

i don't think anyone needs to explicitly state it because it's just, well, common sense

[warm galleon]

Define perfect in your pov

[normal tangle]

he defines perfect as any 1/1/1

we went over that

[lost dirge]

I think we are going in circle

[normal tangle]

even if it's for something you don't use

[craggy pond]

wait what

[north thistle]

If I'm farming for a Thermite Cutter perfect which I don't have, while I already have perfects for Khrav and JET but they're 1/1/1, I would hold off on upgrading those 1/1/1 essences, as there is the possibility I get a better perfect with pre etches before I get a perfect for Thermite

[craggy pond]

so he wants to lock every 1/1/1 he comes across

[normal tangle]

every unique 1/1/1 yes

[north thistle]

However, once I get that Thermite perfect and I no longer have uniques to farm, I'm done

[normal tangle]

that's why i had to explain the definition 😭

[compact bridge]

Is khrav jet and cutter have the exact same perfect stats?

[chilly bolt]

Khrav and thermite yes,

[craggy pond]

genuinely no offense but what you've been explaining is just common sense to me

[chilly bolt]

Idk jet

[craggy pond]

it's like you're explaining the floor is made out of floor, it doesn't bring up anything new

[bronze plume]

jet is

main, attack, suppression

[north thistle]

Lock Attack Boost, select Will Main and Strength. You will then have the chance to see those perfects

[warm galleon]

So 4/4/1 is not?

[lost dirge]

I feel like we are having different discussion than them lol

[north thistle]

It's not a perfect as no weapon currently uses it

However, going by leaks, it will be used next patch

[warm galleon]

Ahh

Got it

[north thistle]

Use this to check your essenceshttps://endfieldtools.dev/weapon-essence-solver/#checker

[craggy pond]

yeah apparently he's been having this side argument the entire time we had the permit/ sanity debate

[normal tangle]

this guy prolly farmed perfect former finery essence

[craggy pond]

i just now learned about it

[chilly bolt]

Perfect means it matches every stat, that is just essence with high starting point

[craggy pond]

i thought he was talking about the same thing as us

[north thistle]

?

[normal tangle]

we play the game in fundamentally incompatible ways

[green cipher]

Who has the yvonne weapon calcs

[normal tangle]

this argument was a waste of time from the start

💔

[flat agate]

speaking of etching. how do we get rid of purple essences

[normal tangle]

neither side is right or wrong because we're straight up playing different games atp

[north thistle]

[compact bridge]

If its the exact same, i would upgrade the first 1/1/1 perfect and keep using permit until i maxed out the first perfect.. after that i would start upgrading whatever the best perfect essence i already got

[north thistle]

My priorities are balancing sanity usage because I intend to build multiple teams

[warm galleon]

Open your inv go to essence tab, v4 will turn into v4 credits so is wuling to wuling credits

[north thistle]

Therefore, having a perfect lined up does more for me as I will eventually use it

[gritty briar]

I mean i'm curious how the people who say to never farm fodder will react when they eventually do get every perfect but still don't have enough fodder for even a single team.

[chilly bolt]

But khravenger is higher priority tho, as you only need 3rd line for thermite

[craggy pond]

i just wanna clarify this, but is your point we should lock every 1/1/1 unique essence we get even if it has no use for the time being

[teal pawn]

@drifting quest do we have an estimate of Rossi's ult cost

[north thistle]

Except I do have my laev team's essences etched and still not every perfect

[unreal light]

not really, thermite second line grants you A TON of ATK

[teal pawn]

Based on footage

[normal tangle]

i'm at the point where all my sanity is going towards farming fodder because i have nothing else to farm lmao

[warm galleon]

Pre-farm m12

[bronze plume]

most characters minus pog arent doing much with thermites atk

[craggy pond]

well i'm farming fodder because i already have like 30 perfect essences for weapons i will never use

[north thistle]

Unique perfect, just to clarify. Not every variation of 1/1/1

[normal tangle]

i have 4m tcreds, 200 purple skill gems, 500 blue skill gems, enough promotion stuff for like 4 different operators/weapons, 300 yellow operator xp and 600 purple weapon xp

but i have enough fodder to maybe etch 1 essence

[unreal light]

if a character does ~17% of team damage, why do I deny them this atk, again?

[north thistle]

There aren't even 30 characters?

[craggy pond]

well then isn't that literally what everyone is doing

[dry kindle]

No

🗿

[craggy pond]

but there are more than 30 weapons

[dry kindle]

Especially after that perfect essence box

[bronze plume]

who besides pog that uses thermite is doing that much of a teams dmg

[craggy pond]

i have enough perfect essence to cover for even weapons i don't own

[north thistle]

I'm assuming you're focusing on one team?

[unreal light]

Arclight

[bronze plume]

actually does arclight do a fifth of electrics dmg

[normal tangle]

two, but close enough

[proud vector]

Kirito ass dual wielding weapon guy?!
Wait that’s Chen

[craggy pond]

essence is tied to the weapon not the character anyway

[north thistle]

But you're still limited by your characters

[lost dirge]

We were discussion what's after that? After we already have all perfect essences.

[craggy pond]

one character can use multiple weapons throughout their lifetime

i don't see the problem

[normal tangle]

well not really

powercreeping someone's sig would be crazy

[bronze plume]

itll probably happen

[normal tangle]

i don't think even hsr did that

[bronze plume]

nah it does

[unreal light]

she does

[compact bridge]

Im at the point where all my sanity is going towards farming fodder for ascent essence lol

[lost dirge]

for dps maybe, but for support? no

[normal tangle]

that's absurd

[bronze plume]

mostly older characters whos lightcones have been powercrept by newer characters lightcones

[lost dirge]

there are some circumstance where you might wanna use different weapons for different buffs

[craggy pond]

besides what's bad about just locking perfect essences for other weapons currently in the game

[gritty briar]

there's probably some amount of people that benefit more from stanza than gil sig

[warm galleon]

Reason I'm not touching Xaihi's wep cause I'm hoping for a 6star banner that's usable by her

[north thistle]

Wait I have to ask @normal tangle you have all this other progression material, so are you only building one team?

[north thistle]

If so, can you show me which essences you're still trying to max?

[bronze plume]

yeah stanza is also bvetter then gilbertas sig on her already in a good amount of scenarios so

[normal tangle]

i have laeva and lr team

[north thistle]

You mean Chiv and Det?

[normal tangle]

i don't really care for the other DPSes rn

[north thistle]

So which essences are you trying to max?

[normal tangle]

i have yvonne but i don't play her

[warm galleon]

No like better, can reach 1.2k cap

[north thistle]

as you shouldn't, since you already have LR

[bronze plume]

ill get you on dps ardelia

[north thistle]

Starry beach?

[warm galleon]

P5 is barely 1k

[chilly bolt]

oblivion Ardelia

[dawn patrol]

get me on mdps rossi

[normal tangle]

saving fodder for tangtang and fangyi

[outer ermine]

1k ez now

[normal tangle]

i'll need like 140 fodder for both of them

[bronze plume]

in 1.5 sure

[normal tangle]

takes a shit ton

[compact bridge]

Nope, i dont have the time to verify which essence is perfect for who... But ill lock any essence drop that has better than 2/2/1 just in case someone can use it

[craggy pond]

you're building tangtang alone?

[normal tangle]

i have lr team, tangtang goes in there

i'm pretty sure

if she doesn't then gg

[north thistle]

I mean, you'll know bc you're limited by your pre engravs

[dawn patrol]

i'm gonna run that shit in 1.1 🔥

[bronze plume]

im going to give her a wheelchair in 1.1 probably

imma see what 1.2 gives first since her banner we still exist when we get 1.2

[north thistle]

The problem is who she would replace, which boils down to her own stats, and specifically how much susceptibility she applies

[warm galleon]

Your Xaihi finally hit 1k int?

[compact bridge]

The pre engrave has like 24 different essence.. i have no idea which essence is perfect for who

[dawn patrol]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1438785797334503506/1469026229184233679/caption.gif

[bronze plume]

what does that even mean

[north thistle]

Again, I want to see how far you've etched all your essences. Because if you're maxing all 8 uniques out (6/6/3) then I understand how we're playing different games

[craggy pond]

just look up every single one

[teal pawn]

Gonna take the bullet and skip Tangtang for Rossi dupes

[dawn patrol]

i'm saying she's gonna need the wheelchair

[normal tangle]

ur underestimating the timestop

[north thistle]

Show me what pre engrav you're using. I need that

[outer ermine]

w/o full artif yea, just +6 on int w starry

[normal tangle]

lr hates anything that moves more than 1 meter per hour

timestop is so good

[bronze plume]

oh

[compact bridge]

Isnt that what everyone useM

[outer ermine]

she smart now

[flat agate]

yall crazy, i use everything except my essences equiped 😎

[warm galleon]

Can we prevent 2nd phase rhodag with that?

[flat agate]

by use i mean i use it as fodder

[north thistle]

Fair. Still, I want to know which essences you're maxing

[lost dirge]

pretty sure you can

[normal tangle]

6/6/3 khrav scathe, 5/5/3 perlica, 1/1/3 most other units

well technically 1/3/3 ardelia but not on purpose

[craggy pond]

we can already do that without tangtang

[normal tangle]

i should lowkey max perlica's weapon eventually

[north thistle]

Then there's no way you shouldn't have enough fodder

[normal tangle]

?

it takes like 80-90 essence per 6/6/3

that's a shitload

[north thistle]

How much sanity have you spent on essences?

[normal tangle]

idk i don't track that

[craggy pond]

i'm farming 200+ fodders to prepare for fangyi

[normal tangle]

easily multiple thousands

[lost dirge]

this man tracks his farm

[craggy pond]

already half way there

[normal tangle]

at least 10k idk

events give you progression materials, they do NOT give you essence fodder

so all my sanity goes to them

[bronze plume]

aint 5 to 6 alone 450 coolant or is it 350

[lost dirge]

450

[normal tangle]

yea 450 for 5->6

[north thistle]

I think I understand, since you maxed your two DPS and close to for perlica

[craggy pond]

btw is there a way to quickly count the amount of fodders

[normal tangle]

300 for 2->3 on bottom

[craggy pond]

do i really have to count manually

[normal tangle]

but sometimes you just get lucky

no coolant needed

[bronze plume]

its defo over 120 then per 6/6/3

[normal tangle]

i've averaged around 80-90

[bronze plume]

i am not sitting there getting 5 to 6 or 2 to 3

[normal tangle]

i only coolant roll one line per

[bronze plume]

imma move to the next essence at 5/5/2

[bronze plume]

i hope you stub yo toe

respectfully

[craggy pond]

apparently 2 to 3 is preferred optimally

[normal tangle]

💔 fucked up

[lost dirge]

yeah max skill line at least

[craggy pond]

in that process you'll get enough coolant to get the other 2 to 6

so it's self sufficient

[bronze plume]

yeah imma just

move to the next weapons essence

tis what ive been doing

[craggy pond]

i mean that works too

[lost dirge]

1/1/3 for supports are fine

[craggy pond]

it's just a matter of preference

[bronze plume]

theres only been 4 essence ive worked on so far

[normal tangle]

yeah imagine doing phys team though

need 3 6/6/3 essence for one team

[craggy pond]

i already have like 5 essences at 4/4/3 so

i'm litralluy running out of essence to dump my fodders into

[normal tangle]

triple dps comp feels so bad to invest

[bronze plume]

i have 2 6/6/3 and 2 4/4/2

[normal tangle]

everyone needs to be maxed

[bronze plume]

and well thermites is 0/4/3

[compact bridge]

My gilberta want 1/6/3 lol

[neat snow]

[north thistle]

Only 6/6/3 for Da Pan? You can get away with 4 or 5 for the others

[normal tangle]

no you can't

[north thistle]

Going from 5-6 is a massive difference

[normal tangle]

both da pan and chen contribute ~30% each

[bronze plume]

yes you can whos going to stop me

[normal tangle]

lifeng doing 15-20%

[lost dirge]

what breakpoint are you even doing?

[bronze plume]

the 10 minute timer in umbral?

[normal tangle]

you can get away with 5/5/3 lifeng

[bronze plume]

realistically you dont need perfect on anyone tho i majority would like at least 1/1/3

welcome to easy peasy lemon squeezy video game

[warm galleon]

My gilb has art intensity piece with xira set and she's the first one to have her ult up.

[craggy pond]

realistically you could get away without any essence

[compact bridge]

I have no idea, there is a breakpoint on energy?

[lost dirge]

3/3/3 is cheap so that should be the bare minimum for any weapon you are using

[bronze plume]

realistically you could get away with solo chen

its benn done]

[lost dirge]

depend on rotation yeah

[north thistle]

two 6/6/3 if you pushed it. You definitely don't need that 5-6, since that's basically the fodder/coolant required for going to 4 on everything else

[neat snow]

Only max essence on operators you love

[bronze plume]

ardelia i agree

[craggy pond]

every operator has either 1 or many ult breakpoints

[compact bridge]

I just max the energy so every rotation can work lol

[craggy pond]

either you hit them or the spare ult charge is basically useless

[lost dirge]

well, that's one way to do it lol, but yeah, I would just stop at 3 for ult gain for now

better to work on other stuff

[compact bridge]

But if anyone know the energy breakpoint for gilberta, im all ears

[normal tangle]

bro's all ears

energy breakpoints depend on team comp and rotation tho

[compact bridge]

Most tc people i know ignore her ult, they said most stuff dead after first ult so it doesnt matter lol

[normal tangle]

it's not per char

[craggy pond]

i would calc it if you know the specific comp but honestly kinda lazy rn

[normal tangle]

they do NOt ignore gilb ult

her ult is like 70% of her reason to live

[bronze plume]

the other 30% is shes hot

[compact bridge]

Its either tangtang comp or rossi comp lol

[craggy pond]

yeah not even my dog could calc that

[normal tangle]

damn he's got a smart ass dog too

if even he can't solve it, it's cooked

[bronze plume]

yeah i know his dog

[lost dirge]

I have a rotation for you with tang tang, I mean, purely speculation