#Replace weapon vendors machines with book machines

69 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

silver spire
#

I was just thinking that if they fix the lootbox/biome loot cheese this would be the next thing to do depending on how hard it would be to gather dukes. I might have to just play 'vendorless' in a mod that removes vendors.

small hemlock
junior yew
#

Just remove the vending machines.

small hemlock
tame axle
#

Yeah Amy's got a point. Just because it's there, doesn't mean you HAVE to use it, just like if you find an exploit, you don't have to abuse it 🤷‍♂️

tame axle
#

Urgh dammit Valor, the point that's trying to be made is, you don't have to use it. You're not obligated in anyway to use it

#

Same for electrics for e.g, I hate the electrical system in 7D. Sure it's cool, it has it's uses, but I rarely use it even for lighting cause I think it sucks

upbeat halo
#

Books and bullets 😄

exotic monolith
#

idk about this

#

I mean I'm not COMPLETELY against it if the duke costs are real fukn high

silver spire
#

it would have to be at least equal to whatever the cost in paper to counterfeit cash compared to just using paper to make lit frags.

exotic monolith
#

way too cheap

tame axle
#

Those 25 magazines could be reinvested into something else

#

Which could be potentially huge

silver spire
#

could be only weapon mags in the vendor

#

or each destroyed trader has different set of ones

#

could also remove the daily refresh and you take what you can get from each one you find

tame axle
#

Personally, I like the refresh. It adds variety. If it were to be magazines, I'd definitely price them higher than the aforementioned amount

silver spire
#

the refreshing machines never made much sense to me with how everything else is stagnant. If each machine at X magss to pick from it would encourage trying to find all of the traders and explore more of the map.

tame axle
#

I get that and don't disagree, it's a different perspective. It's not so bad now but one of the reasons I liked refresh mechanic in the past is, my PC wasn't able to handle me exploring the entire map, and my PC before that, I could explore even less before ending up with bigger performance issues

#

Now, I'm still okay with the refresh mechanic as long as it can't be actively abused. It's one of my issues with traders and why I reluctantly use them in vanilla or other mods, they are easily abused with ridiculous buy/sell prices where ultimately, you can solely rely on traders.
To the point where, some people, YTers/Streamers were just gathering any loot they could early days and then selling it for things that realistically they shouldn't be able to get that early on

#

And don't get me started on the whole reward feature for every quest, every 10? Sure okay, can be down for that but not ever quest.

silver spire
#

for the gun machines it seemed like they randomly rotated the same Guns+Quality. I would frequently see the same machine gun with the same X quality every other day or so, sometimes 2 of the same copy.

#

my point being that the variety is very little currently. while the logic of magic refreshing stock feels like it goes against the mod in general.

grizzled echo
#

I also don't like the gun machines. Also the fact that they magically refresh doesn't make any sense.
Instead, I would introduce magazine stands which don't refresh and can be found not only within trader compounds. Maybe next to a cafe, gas station or truck stop also. Or next to other vending machines (food/drinks). You could also replace existing machines.

The magazine stands contain few books/magazines which can be bought with dukes.

tame axle
#

"you dont have to use it if you dont like it" seems invalid when its clearly intended as an avenue of progression.
It's ultimately down to the player and if they choose to use it or not. It's entirely possible to progress without using the vending machines, I think I've used them once maybe twice throughout all my playthroughs

ancient sail
astral parrot
#

my wish is just that we can pick up thoses machines and bring them to our bases (single player only of course)

twilit surge
#

I love the weapon quality crafting mechanic.

However, I've been through.....idk 10+ horde nights (I have no idea what day I'm on, LOL) and still don't have enough rifle books (81), which has been my magazine focus, to craft more than a qlty 500 L96, which only has 1 mod slot. And the qlty 15K L96 I found only has 1 mod slot. Thus, each mag doesn't progress a weapons durability and mod slots all that much, which is great! But it begs the question, how many do I need to read to get that next qlty level that expands mod slots or significantly increases durability?

I ask that to 2nd the suggestion of selling mags at the Trader VM. And being that money is pretty scarce & hard earned (I've only saved $15K at this point), selling each mag for $500 - 1K wouldn't be OP or game breaking, unless money is less scarce for others, than it has been for me.

Mags should be fairly affordable, sine we need hundreds of them to advance quality level. But each book is unique and should be quite expensive, maybe $5K - $10K each.

small hemlock
#

Everyone is dead who do you want to sell to amysfeThought amysfeLaugh

silver spire
#

the same people restocking the machines? /s

grizzled echo
#

15k at around day 80 isn't much. There are many ways to get money: there are several ATM in each town, you should have found few treasure maps, gold, silver and diamonds can be exchanged. You can even create your own money in the research desk. So I don't think it is hard to get enough money for a good weapon, if you want to buy one.

modern notch
#

Please god (red beard) not another book related mechanic it’s the worst! Basically like let me read a pile of books now I can manufacture guns/advanced tools with 0 prior skill no machines… nothing

exotic monolith
#

god (red beard)
lol wow

modern notch
#

lol was gonna plead to god but he can’t do nothing about this 😂

#

I mean if you wanna take the vending machines out maybe add other crafting stations that require certain items etc to make them work RNG can be good when done right idk

#

But books are a bit silly

#

Or even just make the top shelf weapons loot only like in Izy’s original pack “legendary class weapons” would be a cool addition anyway probably should’ve made a new thread but it’s too late to give a rats ass aye!

exotic monolith
#

something aobut this makes me wanna add slot machines

opal chasm
small hemlock
small hemlock
silver spire
#

having choices are good and all, but when they can quickly circumvent the entire crafting system it seems that it misses the point

upper sage
#

Maybe maybe maybe:
a) a vending machine that sells books, not too expensive, but the selection is very limited and doesn’t restock. You’ll need find those machines in the world and hope for a good selection.

b) it doesn’t need to replace weapons vending, they can be at different Tabs in the same machine.

b) controversial. Vending accepts to convert book fragments to Dukes (fast). Then use that to buy books. And remove the at home Research desk “writing books ability” completely. Because, seriously, how are we writing our own books? Like scraping a few cooking magazines makes me write a Rifle book and learn from it 🤷‍♂️ ? Although this change people may hate 😁 since everyone is making magazines at home now

merry steeple
tame axle
silver spire
#

I can see it being considered expensive if you removed the 5k-15k~ coins you get from treasure chests. You can easily get enough from those pretty fast. I never really tried making counterfeit cash yet tho so I can't speak to how fast that would be.

tame axle
#

Oh yeah, I never do the treasure chests so I didn't actually include them. I see how 5-15k is a lot, offt. But just from atms, the exchange and counterfeit cash it's definitely slower

silver spire
#

yep once you have a couple treasure chests done you have a 100 craft skill gun with 50k+ quality. just skip gun craft and do that /shrug. same issue i have with tools and weapons on biome loot

vague jewel
modern notch
#

Game balance > too much choice

small hemlock
small hemlock
# upper sage Maybe maybe maybe: a) a vending machine that sells books, not too expensive, but...

a) I am against
b) why does it helpamysfeThought and what amysfeThought I am missing the point
Other b) (yeah you forget c amysfeLaugh ) frag for dukes...idk. Not against or for this...depends what for. To sell them, I am against too. I would be more for exchange them.

Yeah writing your own books seems ...not realistic but Red and The Crew > realism IG

I think I would be okay for something like, no books in those vending machines but a few schematics after a certain GS only (meaning they are valuable only if not found before and it is sure that the End-User did play without them) which ones idk yet but I find this more realistic to "find/exchange" a plan than having read the whole encyclopedia in no time for sure. amysfeHugg

silver spire
small hemlock
dusty basin
#

maybe gun vendors have less selection so you have to be very lucky to get the gun you want and they also sell limited ammo. The ammo grind is hard early on. I like the idea of lit frags being sold for money then you buy books

dusky barn
#

on my day 56 save atm im 105 crafting books in my main gun crafting perk and i could afford 50k gun since 2 hordes, the fact that gun vending machines sells me gun that would take me prolly 100 + magazines more to craft its demotivating to purse books more.

I think on top of that if you get a very high quality weapon it will preety much last you for a very long time is also a problem, while in early game you progress thru multiple repair tier the moment you hit repair kit tier everything after is as hard to fix up as the 1st repair kit item is a bit odd imo you should not be able to repair a gun you do not know how to craft, would be preety realistic tbf

personaly i would rather then making vending machines sell books make them sell item's like compass and wristwatch i would gladly pay 50k for compass or watch that i had yet to find during 56 days playthru (started as normie so i got watch to tell time) i think impact of these kind of item would be much smaller then ability to nulify entire crafting progress by spending dukes. I think idea of putting non craftable items in vending machines as well could be nice.

Like someone before said trading in vannila is preety op as it allows you to skip progression in a lot of casses but effectively i feel like vending machines in AL do exact same just being limited to guns. And money is not as hard to obtain compared to ammount of books required to craft simmilar level of gun.

vague jewel
#

A general merchandise vending machine with random stuff in it would be cool have a selection of 10 items 1 slot reserved for rare items like watch or compass or high quality armor or weapon. 3 slots for schematics. 3 slots for books 3 slot for random materials

small hemlock
#

I am against books in vending machines as you can just craft them but schematics for watch or compass why not ^^ thanks for your feedback @dusky barn amysfeHugg

dusky barn
grizzled echo
#

Tbh. I personally would completely change the whole crafting system:

  • remove all crafting books (or at least make them rare)
  • remove ability to craft books
  • add recipes for all tools and weapons (loot only, the higher the tier, the rarer the recipe) > tier 0
  • add specific crafting skill in addition to the general crafting skill
    • e.g. Spear crafting as general skill and Stone spear crafting/iron spear crafting as specific skills
  • you need a certain experience in general crafting skill to learn a specific crafting skill
  • crafting items increases specific + general crafting skill. This way I am able to craft better items of the concrete type by crafting them (learning by doing), but also gain general experience which allows me to craft better tier items
  • without knowledge about crafting an item you also cannot repair it

I know that this ends in crafting tons of items. But at least it makes more sense than crafting tons of books and read them afterwards.

tame axle
#

Learn by crafting used to be a thing many alphas ago, it was nice sure. But it got kinda stupid when you'd just set up 1000 stone axes to craft then suddenly you'd be making iron/steel tools. Plus the fact you'd be dropping/scrapping every stone axe

grizzled echo
#

But if you cannot craft steel tools because the general crafting skill is too low? You need to learn the scrap and iron tier first. Otherwise your general crafting skill doesn't increase anymore at some point just by crafting tons of stone tools. And each specific crafting skill starts at 0 and new tier items are worse than (very) high quality items from previous tier (you just don't know yet how to do it right).

brazen oak
tame axle
#

Learn by crafting is just incredibly unintuitive. It's one of the things I like about Afterlife, there's a pretty healthy balance between the magazines and action skills increasing relevantly. The additional, learn by scrapping is pretty cool, because it's not a consistent thing, and is something you'd do IRL (cause breaking down to learn how it works of course)

brazen oak
#

it was also silly how learn by doing had weapon skills awful or not really easy to level up except, take a stone from 500 hp to 1, then fire at it to level up your rifle or something... shooting zombies barely gave much exp. and for even easier tool crafting was make a bunch of anvils but fill the output slots with nothing but junk so the anvil will pop out and you will get granted tool exp

#

i remember it so well because i used to play a lot of pvp back in the days and... i think to myself. wow, i was a fucking asshole

grizzled echo
#

You could also add some kind of workbench just used to practice crafting. Similar to the training dummy.
But these are just some ideas. Didn't completely think about all this in every detail.

upper sage
# grizzled echo Tbh. I personally would completely change the whole crafting system: - remove a...

I like this very much. You need schematics to craft most items (maybe scrap tools, basics don’t need schematics). Schematics are found in loot. I believe it was in alpha 19 (all steel items needed schematics). Remove ability to craft books. And yes, repair only items you know schematics / know how to craft (I had this posted in ideas last week).
and move away from these skill magazines books (which were introduced in A20). It becomes tedious to drive from library to library trying to get all the skill magazines (and scrap a bunch).
Scrap paper would becomes useless if you can’t craft book. May be have a machine to sell them for dukes, and buy some books from the same machine (but very limited selection that doesn’t restock)