Girlboss Moira skin
#lore-discussion
patent fable
probably with the healing arm
opal nexus
lookin like zamasu from dragon ball
past copper
I’m curious to know more about Junkrat and how he messed himself up
peak escarp
the missing leg and arm are on the same side - probably lost them at the same time
I want to know about his missing finger
past copper
I want to know about his missing finger
That’s what I meant
patent fable
Didn't they say it was an explosive accident
past copper
The missing finger and his teeth might indicate an explosion gone wrong
clear kestrel
oh shit null sector DO have or-14s
peak escarp
there's a line about his leg in HotS, but those shouldn't be considered canon
clear kestrel
oh shit null sector DO have or-14s
please show up in the story mode please show up in the story mode
clear kestrel
oh shit null sector DO have or-14s
or would they be or-16s in this case?
past copper
patent fable
The missing finger and his teeth might indicate an explosion gone wrong
could also be radiation from the whole thing with the outback
tall sleet
I want to know about his missing tooth
patent fable
Echo's design was my favorite
past copper
Junkrat’s new look is 🔥
clear kestrel
he did not consent to that bath
I'm telling you now
patent fable
It seems like he's trying to get onto the good side of OW, seeing how he constantly is talking to em now. Even Roadhog calls Ana "Nanna" in one of his pre-game lines
(in ow2)
tall sleet
I think junkrat just wants to fit in anywhere
patent fable
A lot of the characters really don't like him tbh
tall sleet
Let my boy into your social circles please!!!
past copper
he did not consent to that bath
I'm telling you now
He didn’t consent to Roadhog’s deal with their bargain either, but it was either share his wealth or lose his life lol
peak escarp
getting away from Junkertown has been good for him
tall sleet
I don’t think I’d like junkrat irl either if I was one of the heroes
But as a viewer I have to Stan
clear kestrel
oh that's interesting
baps "immorality field" is just a bubble shield in universe
neat
past copper
I’d imagine he’s a great guy to get along with. Just as long as you don’t piss him off
patent fable
getting away from Junkertown has been good for him
he apparently still goes to the outback for his therapist, seeing how he brings up he's still seeing her for his pyromania.
past copper
He’s very defensive towards Hog lol
tall sleet
I think he’d be funny but idk how to explain it
Doing a mission with him would be extremely stressful LOL
one wrong move and everything is blown up
past copper
Can’t be anymore stressful then playing the game
tall sleet
What r the most popular “ships”
patent fable
one wrong move and everything is blown up
he could trip & fall and there would be a mushroom cloud somewhere near him with all the bombs he carries around
tall sleet
Genji mercy = cannon or implied right?
patent fable
implied
peak escarp
heavily implied
peak escarp
they're friends
tall sleet
Even though he isn’t in talon anymore?
peak escarp
yep
tall sleet
Interesting
patent fable
I mean Sombra is a traitor to Talon and i doubt she really cares
clear kestrel
ana x rein also seems to have a lot of implications
peak escarp
Baptiste has an encrypted app that gives him a direct line to Sombra
patent fable
No way I’d want to get on her bad side
Bro you wouldnt even be able to have privacy regardless tho
past copper
Heh. Just watch people try to ship Sombra and Sigma because of a concerned voice line
peak escarp
people will ship anything
patent fable
Sigma tried to go out with Widowmaker tbh
peak escarp
even heroes who have never canonically met
clear kestrel
Heh. Just watch people try to ship Sombra and Sigma because of a concerned voice...
yknow what
that'd be kinda cute actually
past copper
Technically, they met. Kinda. I don’t think he actually “met” Reaper and Sombra. His mind focused on his research
patent fable
"Focused"
peak escarp
not talking about them
past copper
I mean what next? Bastion and Orisa ship? I doubt it, but that would be cute
Two robots built for combat only to become something more because of someone who saw potential in them
past copper
True. I’ve seen some weird ass ships before
chilly tundra
backrooms
crisp hearth
Only canon ship is like genji and mercy
limpid agate
Only canon ship is like genji and mercy
More like the only one that is implied. Its not canon yet.
There are a bunch of canon ships that are hero x non-hero
Torbjorn/Ingrid
Tracer/Emily
Reaper/Martina (formerly)
Ana/Sam (formerly)
Widowmaker/Gerard (formerly)
Soldier/Vincent (formerly)
timid eagle
Also, Rein and Ana were a thing, according to a recent character interaction in this latest beta.
iron plume
They were not
limpid agate
Ana was married to Sam and had Pharah years before she met Rein.
empty hazel
so they danced until dawn platonically?
grand wedge
It could implied things the same way Mercy and Genji are implied tbh. But it doesn’t confirm anything.
limpid agate
The difference is
Mercy and Genji were teased in multiple formats aside from voice lines, and got exclusive valentines/white day interactions
Ana was literally married for decades to someone else
grand wedge
And now she is not anymore
We can’t denied there isn’t fondness between Reinhardt and Ana in those new voice lines.
limpid agate
When does it do that
rare charm
We can’t denied there isn’t fondness between Reinhardt and Ana in those new voic...
two people of relative same age sharing war experience i would assume brings bonding and closeness between
fringe thistle
nah that’s definitely more than platonic lmao
you don’t “dance until dawn” with someone platonically
that’s romantic fs
peak escarp
you do if other people are there dancing too
fringe thistle
i think you’re misinterpreting lol
the way that conversation is written is romantic
them talking about being foolish and dancing until dawn is not something you say to a platonic friend
it’s pretty cut and dry what that’s supposed to be
peak escarp
okay
doesn't mean they were a couple
people are so quick to assume flirty banter is confirmation of an existing romantic relationship
rare charm
y’all have never danced with friends?
grand wedge
of course! Never say they are or were in a romantic relationship before. Just that their close proximity and the tone they talk to each other in this new beta looks more romantic than it was before. Hence, I don't really make a difference between Gency and Anahardt. Both are kinda implied and could led to more imo
peak escarp
the difference is that Ana was married
grand wedge
i want to say... so? xD
peak escarp
Reinhardt doesn't seem like a homewrecker
karmic turret
Was ana married during the time of Overwatch?
limpid agate
I don't see anything that suggests otherwise
sullen ingot
how much water do the classes consume everyday
timid minnow
the difference is that Ana was married
I thought it Ana’s marriage didn’t work out?
grand wedge
because she said herself : "Relationships don't work out so well for us, do they?"
depends how you interpret it I guess.
But if you died while still married (and you marriage was a success), why remove your ring then?
warped garden
how much water do the classes consume everyday
Not water, Jarate
sweet tide
the only conclusion that i can draw from all the classic cars w hover jets on havana is that a blockade on cars to cuba continues up to OW times, but not on hover jets
important lore right here ^^^^^^^^^
worn pasture
Heyy
sharp cloud
Lore whose who’s one of the strongest characters in overwatch
worn pasture
In my opinion, moiras
Because shes behind reapers powers and a big part of Blackwatch and the history of blackwatches and overwatches rivalry
worthy rose
Lore whose who’s one of the strongest characters in overwatch
Imo Symmetra
Sigma could be stronger but we just don't have any info on him to say
worn pasture
Good point
worthy rose
After Symmetra I would say Primal Winston, then Doomfist, and then Reaper
worn pasture
For me its moira, we should have a lore on mercy too and then the reason ashe and mccrees rivalry should be revealed too
sharp cloud
Sombra is pretty powerful
fringe thistle
Lore whose who’s one of the strongest characters in overwatch
winston and doom
genji is like 3rd place
actually hold up
worn pasture
Cassidy*
fringe thistle
- sigma
- winton
- doom
- genji
- zarya
worthy rose
I think Genji could defeat Reaper actually. It would be an interesting bout for sure
fringe thistle
i think that’s the actual top 5 strength list
i forgot how insanely strong sigma is
worn pasture
1. sigma
2. winton
3. doom
4. genji
5. zarya
worthy rose
Reaper would wreck Zarya though.....
worthy rose
Reaper has better durability imo and he's fought Winston who by feats strikes me as her superior
fringe thistle
i think the 5th spot is pretty interchangeable tho
you could easily put rein or gabe there
worn pasture
Guys, random questions, why do you think cassidy and ashe are rivals?
fringe thistle
instead of zarya
worthy rose
Guys, random questions, why do you think cassidy and ashe are rivals?
Idk I didn't read the Mccree novel
fringe thistle
Guys, random questions, why do you think cassidy and ashe are rivals?
because cassidy betrayed her and left the deadlock gang
worn pasture
Is it canon?
worthy rose
you could easily put rein or gabe there
I think Rein and Reaper and equals. Reinhardt can't really win but neither can Reaper put him down
worn pasture
Okay thanks:>
fringe thistle
I think Rein and Reaper and equals. Reinhardt can't really win but neither can R...
i think rein is physically stronger but gabe can’t die from normal injury
worthy rose
Probrably just an eternal stalemate honestly
fringe thistle
btw im just talking about the characters themselves, no weapons or armor
worthy rose
Oh well Reaper easily then
fringe thistle
in his crusader suit rein is pretty crazy
worthy rose
You said no armor though
fringe thistle
zarya also can literally shoot black holes
worthy rose
I doubt its as powerful as a real one.....
fringe thistle
but without her gun she’s still strong af
worthy rose
Or the earth would be screwed haha
fringe thistle
I doubt its as powerful as a real one.....
definitely not as strong as natural ones but it’s really strong
would still squish you into red goo
worthy rose
We don't know how powerful it is exactly
I don't think she ever used it in lore unless I'm missing someting
fringe thistle
i normally always put winston at the top level in power scaling but i always forget how op sigma is
gravity control is one of the most OP powers in fiction
worthy rose
We don't know how powerful is his gravity control though
It could be low level for all we know
fringe thistle
it’s powerful enough to distort reality
sigma is implied to have some kind of multiversal sight
worthy rose
Multiversal sight?
fringe thistle
he mentions it in a few interactions
worthy rose
Interesting
fringe thistle
he says “this universe” like he’s been to multiple
worthy rose
It could be he's just insane though
fringe thistle
knowing sigma i think he’s telling the truth
worthy rose
Multiple Reapers accross the multiverse. Would like to see how they interact
worthy rose
he also says he “met the iris” to zen
That doesn't seem like it has anything to do with a multiverse though
fringe thistle
we know sigma is at least dangerous enough to put under maximum security
like, even more than doomfist
dude was under layers of security
he had dozens of bodyguards just guarding specifically his room
fringe thistle
and he probably could’ve broken out if his insane side came out, he just doesn’t seem to be aware of it
worthy rose
Well Doomfist doesn't have as much security because they took the gauntlet away so he would be way weaker
Sigma always has his powers
fringe thistle
i know gameplay isnt canon but i feel like flux is something he could actually do
like from his origin story he sounded extremely dangerous
cosmic crest
Abilities are cannon
peak escarp
discussing strongest hero and nobody mentions Orisa?
the omnic literally built to defeat Doomfist?
limpid agate
Winston, Sigma, Orisa, or Symmetra are the big ones worth considering as strongest
Winston literally beat Doomfist in a fist fight
peak escarp
if we're just talking physical strength, then Winston, Zarya, Doomfist, Orisa, Soldier, Reaper
peak escarp
oh yeah, and Genji
fringe thistle
that zero hour feat was easily the biggest feat we’ve ever seen in ow
mf “oh yeah and genji” 
the disrespect
smh
limpid agate
If you want to talk about raw strength
fringe thistle
i also think jack is really strong but he’s clearly past his prime
fringe thistle
due to those chemical enhancements
limpid agate
And Winston won that fist fight, while Winston lost while wielding a weapon
fringe thistle
power scaling doesn’t necessarily have to be just physically strength tho
limpid agate
Which is why my list was Winston, Sigma, Orisa, and Symmetra
fringe thistle
Its still Winston or Doomfist
id say winston is the physically strongest because he beat doom with the gauntlet
limpid agate
Yes
fringe thistle
oh yeah i completely forgot how busted sym technically is
limpid agate
I decided to remove Reaper from that list after Code of Violence seemed to tone his power down
fringe thistle
we don’t know how durable hardlight is though, could a hardlight chain hold winston
fringe thistle
I decided to remove Reaper from that list after Code of Violence seemed to tone ...
tbh that was his first mission and he was still weak from the switzerland incident
plus moira kept experimenting on him later
limpid agate
It toned down his immortality aspects
Sombra holding a gun to his head was a real threat
fringe thistle
yeah because that was early reyes, not reaper yet
limpid agate
So bullets can put an end to him
Still Reaper
Its not like Moira exponentially increased his power levels in a year
Or 4
At least, not a second time
fringe thistle
also he can just fade through gunfire now
limpid agate
He could fade through gunfire back then too
But Sombra holding a gun to his head was a real threat
fringe thistle
he has much greater control over his power in the current day
limpid agate
He needs to actively turn it on
fringe thistle
infiltration and code of violence make sombra look a lot scarier than i expected though
like she’s downright ruthless in cov
and her hacking is super OP
she could probably make tech guns explode or disable comms with emp
launch nuclear missiles
steal top secret intel
frame people for crimes easily
like she might not be physically strong but she’s OP as hell
limpid agate
She has also hacked into omnics in numerous occaisions
She did it during the ARG, to Lynx in Searching, and to Numbani omnics is Hero of Numbani
It makes them spasm, inflicts amnesia, among other things
karmic turret
was moira the one to make widowmaker widowmaker?
opal nexus
she did the experiments yes
karmic turret
many thanks
opal nexus
to slow her heartbeat and stuff
limpid agate
@opal nexus @karmic turret Neither rebuilt Genji
Mercy was his doctor
Mercy didnt make his cybernetics
opal nexus
yeah better way to word it
fringe thistle
Moira says she wouldnt have used so many metal parts
oh god
can you even imagine
genji would be reaper instead of reyes right now jfc
sharp trench
genji would be reaper instead of reyes right now jfc
an armored reaper would probably be very scary
crisp hearth
Moira has an interaction with sigma of her pretending to be nice to him kinda sad
opal nexus
yeah shes basically sigma's caretaker
fringe thistle
i’m THRILLED doctor
worthy rose
clear kestrel
Moira has an interaction with sigma of her pretending to be nice to him kinda sa...
the worst part is he's completely oblivious to her obvious dislike of him
poor dude just wants to wax philosophical
twilit nacelleBOT
@cobalt viper Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
limber gate
what do you think
move to general if this doesn't have to do with overwatch or the lore
clear kestrel
also that was
incredibly fucking racist @sullen pagoda
opal nexus
pretty sure pinging the modmail bot doesnt do anything lol
limpid agate
You need to DM Modmail
opal nexus
what is wrong with people
bored, irrational, whatever
simply ignore and move on
limpid agate
Report and ignore, then move on.
opal nexus
molten shore
Is echo technically the strongest overwatch character
clear kestrel
yea adaptive circuits is probably just
a gameplay representation of her whole "she's an AI that is constantly learning" thing
peak escarp
she can imitate things perfectly, but she probably can't physically change shape
clear kestrel
"imitate me, and you'll regret it"
"ImItAtE mE, aNd YoU'lL rEgReT iT"
"that's.... not bad actually"
fringe thistle
gabe has a sense of humor
clear kestrel
I'm so happy that interactions arent just limited to two heroes that know eachother anymore
peak escarp
I swear at this point there must be interactions between every hero
fringe thistle
there probably are
and if not they’re working on it
25,000+ lines remember haha
clear kestrel
did they specify how many of those are meant for the PVE?
peak escarp
some other amount are for abilities
worthy rose
Is echo technically the strongest overwatch character
I think Symmetra or Winston is stronger tbh
molten shore
Oh yeah I forgot he is a Scientist
sharp trench
i want to see reaper and mercy have arguments over life and death given how they are literal polar opposites
opal nexus
reaper would probably just go "stfu. die."
fringe thistle
reaper probably hates science in general after moira used him like a lab rat
sharp trench
isn’t that more moira and mercy
less polarity
Reaper is a cold blooded murderer wielding shotguns and praising death, Mercy is a pacifist praising life
turbid whale
I want to see Mei and Reaper argue over him ruining the environment with his wasted shotguns
clear kestrel
"MY SHOTGUNS ARE BIO-DEGRADEABLE"
turbid whale
Would be amazing
clear kestrel
"THEY ARE MADE FROM ETHICALLY SOURCED, ECO-FRIENDLY MATERIALS"
Reaper is a bloodthirsty terrorist and even HE believes in global warming
timid minnow
Do junk and torb have any lines?
brazen sand
Mei contributes to the rising sea levels
timid minnow
Something like
Junk: you should have your turret fire my grenades!
Torb: Humpth, that’s a good idea!
opal nexus
theres one in the ow2 beta as far as i know
something like
junk: Jamison Fawkes and Torbjorn Lindholm! Two handsome geniuses just chit-chatting away!
torb: you cant be serious...
junk: don't be so hard on yourself!
covert cape
Junkrat adopted by Ana, well is interesting.
grand wedge
Nah he wants to, that’s different
young roost
Let’s be real
Ashe and Junker Queen would be gal pals
They love doing things their way and their personalities are a pretty good matchup
Now I yearn for an interaction between them
young roost
Side note: Ziggs (from league of legends) and Junkrat would also be friends. Two pyromanic explosive friends.
clear kestrel
god hammond's an angry little fucker
I guess that makes sense
he spent a good majority of his life in junkertown
feels like every interaction he has that isn't with JQ involves him getting pissed off to some degree
limpid agate
He was always lacking in interactions, its good to see that started to change
clear kestrel
he's a tiny, condensed ball of rage
karmic turret
she can imitate things perfectly, but she probably can't physically change shape
do you think the voice changes?
rare charm
her voice doesn’t change, she just mimics them
sharp trench
Ashe and Junker Queen would be gal pals
they seem like the type who would rather compete
storm gate
So Sigma mentions about Max having a greek statue collection when in Circuit Royale. Does that explain Talon's presence in Ilios?
limpid agate
Probably
magic tide
I just listned to all the audio interactions for ow2 😳 jesus it was good. favorite is baptiste embracing the exaggerated swagger of a haitian from omnic crisis 😂 was flirting with ana AND ashe . this man shoots for the stars
errant silo
I just listned to all the audio interactions for ow2 😳 jesus it was good. favor...
oh my god yes!
opal nexus
chadtiste
fringe thistle
bap is such a goddamn player
digital forum
Bapbeast
timid minnow
I just listned to all the audio interactions for ow2 😳 jesus it was good. favor...
Do you have a link for that?
lost crystal
fringe thistle
!!shitposting
twilit nacelleBOT
Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
fringe thistle
don't be a weirdo
sharp trench
Ok
rare charm
!!shitposting
twilit nacelleBOT
Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
peak escarp
if you don't use this channel for its intended purpose, you will lose access to the channel
worthy rose
Ever wondered what characters that have no story fit in ow ( hammond bap junkerqueen etc)
worthy rose
That's depressing
limpid agate
How
opal nexus
Ever wondered what characters that have no story fit in ow ( hammond bap junkerq...
tfw baptiste the ex talon agent with his own side story
worthy rose
In ow2 I mean
opal nexus
ow2 revealed that hammonds got a hate boner for winston
clear kestrel
McCrees new overwatch is probably gonna have their own story missions too
we've seen them in concept cutscenes in one of the devlog videos for OW2
shit's gonna be bussin
iron plume
Cassidy doesn't have a "new overwatch"
He's signing people up for the one led by Winston, it's the same organization
The missions will likely mix and match
clear kestrel
oh I thought he was just
making his own squad that would run independently
my mistake
ok I just finished reading "a better world"
I knew vishkar were bad but holy fuck
grand wedge
yup.
grand wedge
ok I just finished reading "a better world"
I knew vishkar were bad but holy fuc...
try to go with stone by stone next - it's a nice character development for Symmetra.
peak escarp
we don't know if the bombing was sanctioned by Vishkar or if it was just Sanjay making sure he had no competition
digital forum
Jeez louise, wrecking is very ruthless in his interactions
He calls Cassidy a tumbleweed and disrespects hanzo
I wonder if he was always like this before junkertown
worthy rose
In Junker Queens song she said she was abandoned in the outback
Does she mean exiled by the junker King?
Or like her family also abandoned her
grand wedge
Does she mean exiled by the junker King?
Yeah.
Also, her father probably die after a while - there is a shot with graves... so she probably lost her siblings too.
grand wedge
I mean who would exile a family and kids??
limpid agate
Junker King
fringe thistle
king howl was a total pos
but by all accounts jq is not much better, she’s becoming just as bad
worthy rose
Woah
opaque tundra
Do we know when sigma had the black hole experiment incident?
opal nexus
nah its never been specified
willow prairie
Can you explain the incident
opal nexus
he was definitely in the government facility when overwatch fell tho
willow prairie
Im not fully up on the newer heros lore
opal nexus
astrophysicist tried experimenting with a black hole on the international space station
ended up ripping his mind apart, he ended up being hidden in some secret facility and the incident gave him gravity powers
then talon busted him out of there when they found about his existence
willow prairie
Was he just cool with it
Like okay he was just a bad dude
Or was he brainwashed
opal nexus
hes not really
all there mentally speaking
hes a nice person just manipulated by talon to do what they want
he genuinely believes talon are good people for giving him a lab to work in and stuff
rare charm
i’m not 100% but i don’t think there’s anything that indicates sigma is a bad person
the incident made him go literally insane. his mind was ripped apart in two and then stuck back together
opal nexus
atm yes sigma is still with talon
and ball is just traumatised and distrusting of other people now because of his experiences
oak rapids
Sigma chad
opal nexus
they want to start a world war so yeah
limpid agate
They are literally the main antagonists since the start
Or rather, the only meaningful antagonists
tall sleet
What about Omnics / null sector?
iron plume
I assume you got autocorrected from Omnics
The Omnic Crisis is the Big Deal from the background but it wasn't relevant in the present
Null Sector was introduced in the first Archives, while Talon was around since the game's announcement
and with OW2 we know they themselves are supported by Talon
dusty patrol
Feels kinda weird that Genji doesn’t have any interactions with Mercy in the OW2 beta. Aren’t they like really good friends?
clear kestrel
I swear I've heard one
opal nexus
yeah they only got one elim line for each other
clear kestrel
tho it might have been Genji and Ana
clear kestrel
oh yeah it was Genji and ana
dusty patrol
Those lines seem kinda out of place for them to be saying to eachother.
digital forum
I heard the "no need to take care of me, doctor" elim line with mercy too
willow prairie
Does torb still have amazing lines
cunning ledge
ionic flax
Why people acting like Hammond is soooo dark? Little hamster just hurt from what Winston did, but once they have a couple of talks I bet everything will be fine.
clear kestrel
also I'm happy that judging by a few of her voice lines
Orisa isn't just constantly stoic and serious all the time which I was kinda worried about
clear kestrel
I'm gonna miss cute and naive orisa cause
that's just how I've always known her
opal nexus
aye they grow up so fast
clear kestrel
shes like superman
almighty protector but also a friend that cares <:amfeelingwe...
Orisa believes in santa claus
peak escarp
of course she's heard of Vishkar
opal nexus
i was fooled
waitwaitwaitwaitwait when orisa says "I do not know of this Vishkar" does she actually mean she doesnt know about the shit vishkar has done?
my ass has been misinterpreting it as her not knowing about the company at all
peak escarp
in OW1 when she's newly made she didn't know about Vishkar
in OW2 she definitely knows about them
opal nexus
ok that makes sense 
sharp trench
apparently reaper and mercy have a new voiceline
“I’m not giving up on you Reyes”
“I wish you would”
what is that supposed to imply, mercy is trying to convert reaper into liver?
peak escarp
maybe she wants to heal him
sharp trench
how would she even know its him though and “im not giving up” implies she’s tried before
though, IIRC some interactions are non canon so this might be one of them
peak escarp
with their red and white masks were everywhere, pinning down the Helix soldiers in
blue. Suddenly, a series of explosions tore through the night, and my eyes fixated
on a dark mass, darker than night. A black figure emerged from it. A hailstorm of
gunfire exploded from its center, and the two old soldiers raced for cover, out of my
sight.
“What is that?” I breathed.
“Gabriel.”
I winced from the intensity of Jack’s voice in my ear. A dozen questions tried
to shoulder their way into my attention, but right now, I had to push them away.
“That’s not our concern, Morrison. We have people to save.”```she knows Reaper is Gabriel Reyes
sharp trench
ah, but still
might be interesting to see how that plays out if mercy is actively trying to heal reaper from moira’s experiments
My question is though, would he betray talon for a chance of easing the pain at the very least
peak escarp
he still wants to get vengeance against those who have wronged him
I don't think healing him will change that
sharp trench
well would going to mercy for a bit of help be betraying talon
I dont think mercy has ever wronged reaper anyway
peak escarp
she's an Overwatch agent
he feels like Overwatch has wronged him, so all agents are his enemies
sharp trench
that’s true
neat thistle
wait so reaper has a wife? It’s in a voicline in ow2 and he has a son too? I searched it up but I didnt get that much info.
peak escarp
Martina
she was mentioned in Code of Violence
Martina’s smiling face on that grassy path in Echo Park. A melting ice cream cone
dripping against his scraped knuckles, an injury caused by climbing a tree to
rescue an errant birthday balloon. A time of absolute joy. He tried to cling to the
sweet aroma of her perfume, the weight of his six-year-old son in his arms, but
instead was greeted with the acrid stench of gunpowder and burning flesh.
Your old life isn’t gone. You can still walk away.
Martina’s face melted into blackness and was replaced by Sombra’s sneer.```In another line from OW2 Sombra offered information on her and Reaper declined saying he wasnt interested, Sombra said that it wasnt what the tracker showed
neat thistle
oh I see
peak escarp
that's Martina and her son... and her new partner, I guess
neat thistle
I only got some lore from the game but I never got the chance to get one of the comics
clear kestrel
good to know he hasn't completely buried who he once was
peak escarp
she thinks Reyes is dead
clear kestrel
probably for the best it stays that way
neat thistle
I mean it is normal to move on if he is “dead”
it would hurt her to see what he’s become
fringe thistle
you can read all the comics and short stories on the official website
there’s a command somewhere around here
neat thistle
oh alright
peak escarp
you can also find links in the pins on this channel
fringe thistle
the novels you have to buy though
clear kestrel
ngl I definitely think they're setting up for a reaper redemption
between this mercy interaction and one he has with zen
fringe thistle
like hero of numbani and deadlock rebels
sharp trench
ngl I definitely think they're setting up for a reaper redemption
between this m...
I wouldnt say that
It’d be cool, but I don’t think he’d put aside everything just to get some pain off from some good samaritan in the enemy faction (referring to Mercy)
clear kestrel
well if this wasn't a hero shooter I could at least see him taking a "redemption through death" kinda route but yea
I dunnno
tall sleet
I don’t think reaper could ever be truly redeemed especially since he’s like a cold blooded killer now
But it would be interesting to see them try
Even serious self reflection on reapers part
worn island
so in the interaction between rein, zen and genji where rein asks what zen did before the crisis and zen has a bunch of potential different answers
Does Zenyatta not know what he did? or is he simply choosing not to tell
He does mention not remembering much
clear kestrel
wouldn't have a clue
both are interesting routes
worn island
where the omnics connected in any way before the crisis? like a joint hivemind kinda thing?
that would make a lot of sense for all the different occupations, with zen being unable to seperate other omnics from himself
clear kestrel
Does Zenyatta not know what he did? or is he simply choosing not to tell
it could be the latter, kinda like the joker but more benevolent
worn island
mmm
clear kestrel
weird
JQ feels a lot more casual and laidback in her short
tho I guess it makes sense, that was before she became queen
kinda hope we get her animated short look as a skin
clear kestrel
I honestly prefer it to her current look
cunning ledge
same tbh
but they're both very cool
it might not have the crown but i hope it does
fringe thistle
i like the loose hair strand in the flashback design more
i also like the hair color
peak escarp
I hope it has the crown too
cunning ledge
i could imagine it not having the crown if the crown is used in emotes or highlight intros instead
limpid agate
We've seen a few highlight intros already
fringe thistle
one of her highlight intros was her ult
cunning ledge
could be a case where they use that skin customisation thing if that turns out to be real or used outside of mythic skins
optional crown for the queen, optional helmet for rein, etc
sonic helm
any lore enjoyers know the material with the lowest freeze temperature that is contained on an overwatch hero
stupid question but i'm interested
peak escarp
alcohol freezes at around -114C - I'm pretty sure Hanzo carries a flask of sake
sonic helm
interesting
trying to figure the stupidest figure for meis cryo gun temperature
cuz it can freeze the entire cast
peak escarp
well, liquid nitrogen is -196C/-320F
and it can freeze organic matter solid in seconds
sonic helm
found some reddit post where physicists calculated it's about -1.7 million degrees
smth to do with how fast she freezes
did not think of it
worthy rose
Okay
pseudo goblet
Hanzo nerf
worthy rose
dragons cinematic is just gone now
Really???
peak escarp
what do you mean gone?
neat zealot
doomfist is an interesting character
I think that the junk town lore is rlly interesting to
nimble yarrow
just realized that the reason orisa in ow2 seems more "hostile" than ow1 is because efi removed her compassion module
severe dove
is that a head cannon or did you find something somewhere that said that bc that be mad cool
quiet vine
I think the reason is because Orisa has just been learning and adapting, and because she doesn't have to defend Numbani, she can now be more Offense than Defence
nimble yarrow
is that a head cannon or did you find something somewhere that said that bc that...
apparently its from the book Overwatch book " The Hero of Numbani"
which also explains other scenes in orisa's hero cinematic reveal
Returning home, Efi found her family waiting for her. Her mother, concerned with Orisa, asked how long it would be until someone was truly hurt by "the robot." Her aunt was even more agrieved, and while Dayo came to Efi's defense, her father informed her that their insurance company had called, stating that they were threatening to cancel their policy if there was another incident.
Efi returned to her workshop, pondering the problem. She decided that the issue was that Orisa simply cared too much, that her compassion was causing her to make bad decisions. Removing Orisa's capacity for empathy might improve her decision making, but doing so didn't sit right with Efi. Crying, she deleted Orisa's compassion module. As much as it pained her to do so, the risk otherwise was to lose Orisa permanantly. She posted a holovid of the times they'd had together on HollaGram, earning sympathy from her followers, including Naade, despite them not talking anymore. Either way, Efi went to sleep, still crying.
opal nexus
isnt the module enabled again later in the book
nimble yarrow
not sure, i don't believe it is
which would explain the time between ow1 and now 2 where she seems more level headed and sort of hostile because she does not have the same naivety when she was first created
well her behavior anyway
severe lance
Why got Junker Queen and her family kicked out of Junkertown?
past copper
Efi returned Orisa’s programing back to what it originally was before she tinkered with it. After she got a call from Lúcio
opal nexus
iron plume
not sure, i don't believe it is
it is
in the book, without her compassion module Orisa was a mechanical rule-follower with no personality
not just slightly edgier like she is in ow2
The point about her lack of naivety is true but it's not because anything was removed
she learned, watched and grew
although my personal half-serious theory is efi entering her edgy teenager phase
opal nexus
thats a fun theory
orisa is still kind shes just more serious
lot of people seem to stretch this a bit too far because of it
peak escarp
she's more aggressive now because she has confidence and experience that she didn't have before
clear kestrel
yea and she's not all serious and aggressive all the time
she has teasing banter with hanzo
also she wants doomfist locked up in prison
not dead
so she's not all "kill murder destroy swag" now either
peak escarp
Why got Junker Queen and her family kicked out of Junkertown?
we don't know - some have speculated that her father was the previous king who got defeated by Mason Howl
clear kestrel
in the book, without her compassion module Orisa was a mechanical rule-follower ...
she really is just the female baymax isn't she
peak escarp
kinda
clear kestrel
also one of Orisa's lines in OW2 is
"Efi made me kind, but she did not make me weak"
opal nexus
she probably uses the spear as part of a backyard tennis set in her free time
clear kestrel
I like to think Efi got her a therapy dog too
like in that one emote of hers
just to help her relax
opal nexus
last time we heard of her she went with orisa to visit someone that gave orisa some upgrades
think it was sojourn
at least thats what people theorise
peak escarp
it's implied to be Sojourn
“We must hurry. She is awaiting our arrival.”
“She? Who’s she?”
Orisa looked around at the students. Every single eye was focused on her. “I can’t say right now. But with luck, our trip will be a short one. A quick sojourn abroad, and then right back to Numbani so your studies aren’t interrupted. I will explain further once we are airborne.”```Orisa
no
they're getting on an airplane
she's not that big
opal nexus
would be like carrying another crate i reckon
willow prairie
How did zenny reach enlightenment
peak escarp
he hasn't yet
willow prairie
Thought he did
opal nexus
mans still on a pilgrimage
valid lichen
sigma has 'met' the iris and zen responds in a less than tranquil manner
very interesting
clear kestrel
I mean yeah
the iris is a mystical deity to the shambali so straight up being told by someone that they've met their deity in person would probably throw them off a bit
peak escarp
he claims he met the Iris
he also claims he talks to fairies
not exactly a credible source
severe dove
im totally lost on who sigma is i know hes suppose to be like insane or sum but thats basically it and he talks like alfred from bat man
iron plume
!!loreheroes sigma
twilit nacelleBOT
To learn more, please visit https://playoverwatch.com/en-us/heroes/sigma#story
iron plume
basically, he's an astrophysicist who got exposed to a black hole
and his mind is affected by it. He's not "insane" in the typical sense
severe dove
holy shit thats so cool
severe lance
Why did Junkerqueen kicked Junkrat and Roadhog out of Junkertown
onyx light
L junker queen
hushed bough
With Hanzo knowing that Genji is alive, and finally having a redemption, we may see Hanzo wielding a sword in PvE, and as we know, Hanzo was a better swordsman than Genji. 👀
opaque tundra
I heavily doubt Hanzo would pick up a sword anytime soon
iron plume
There's an interaction between them about it
Genji asks why he wouldn't pick up the sword now that he knows he's alive, and Hanzo replies something like "you're not the only one who died that day"
peak escarp
"You are not the only thing I lost that day."
peak escarp
it would be a bit extreme to give heroes entirely new weapons with talents
opal nexus
or a cutscene
neat zealot
they didn't follow the rules
Didn’t they also try to steal her gold stash or something
peak escarp
they tried to blow her up with a payload full of gold, but that was after they got exiled
neat zealot
Ohhh
severe dove
L junker queen
ISAIAH
clear kestrel
they tried to blow her up with a payload full of gold, but that was after they g...
they also blew up her summer shack
onyx light
Jokes
peak escarp
everything they've done falls under the "don't make trouble" rule
quiet vine
I don't wanna take the ow2 beta voicelines too seriously at this moment because of the lack of context, but the junkers (hog and rat) seem to be very chatty and buddy-buddy with Overwatch agents... I wonder if they "help out" in some PvE/lore scenarios
peak escarp
possible, but I have a hard time seeing it
sharp trench
they would probably go against omnics so there's kinda an alliance there
Junkrat and hog both hate omnics, junkrat seems more likely than hog tbh
floral venture
How did cassidy lose his left arm ?
quiet vine
still unknown
neat zealot
Why is mcrees name Cassidy now?
worthy rose
idk sumin when wrong
tall sleet
Tbh junkrat seems like he just desperately wants to fit in anywhere and have friends — especially since the heroes in game are well known in the world of overwatch
I’d loveee a mission where him and hog team up with agents though
tall sleet
Why is mcrees name Cassidy now?
His name was based off a blizzard employee and they changed it to Cassidy due to the blizzard sexual harassment controversies
peak escarp
the in-universe explanation is that Cole Cassidy was his birth name, which he abandoned when he left home
as he gives up his outlaw lifestyle, he also takes back his original name
neat zealot
as he gives up his outlaw lifestyle, he also takes back his original name
That’s cool
tall sleet
Just saw a video of some roadhog interactions omg theyre kinda wholesome
I love seeing hog have fun and banter
neat zealot
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ09xdxzIJQ
my fav animation
neat zealot
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N60o-sPduBI
road hog interactions
tall sleet
orisa in her girlboss era
pine gale
dusty needle
What is zens backstory?
clear kestrel
orisa in her girlboss era
I wasn't keen on her personality shift at first but it's starting to grow on me
also I like to think that all of Zens explanations for his "past" are all true
they're all previous occupations he has held at some point during his travels
opaque tundra
So Zen decided to work at a water park on his way to enlightenment?
limpid agate
No
hollow folio
So Zen decided to work at a water park on his way to enlightenment?
there are multiple responses he can give for that interaction
opaque tundra
Yes I am aware and I was joking about him working at a water park because I know Zen was joking
tall sleet
I choose to believe its true
peak escarp
yep
ember hazel
Do you guys know the lore for why I still don't have the beta yet?
neon aurora
Is there any new blood interactions.. or still none..
peak escarp
Do you guys know the lore for why I still don't have the beta yet?
be patient, the day isn't over yet
ember hazel
be patient, the day isn't over yet
Yeah I am, I was just wondering about the lore though.
iron plume
This isn't a lore question.
ember hazel
Oh that sucks
molten shore
ZEN IS ONLY 20 YEARS OLD
Wait is genji older
opal nexus
yeah genji's 36 i think
peak escarp
yep
stiff laurel
@opal nexus i thought genji would be 20 and zen would be 40 lol
limpid agate
The Omnic Crisis was only 30 years ago
Bob is the oldest Omnic that we know of, and I don't think he's 40
The novel says about how old he is
Then its Bastion, who was built 30 years ago
naive pumice
Wait is genji older
i mean zen is genjis master
willow prairie
Can anyone explain echos lore
grand wedge
peak escarp
!!shitposting @narrow dome
twilit nacelleBOT
@narrow dome Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
narrow dome
she literally says "the true enemy of humanity is disorder
peak escarp
that doesn't mean she wants genocide
cunning fiber
Is there more to sombras story besides the cinematic someone can tell me abt?
iron plume
there's also Deadlock Rebels if you haven't read that one yet
molten shore
i mean zen is genjis master
Oh yeah genji wasn't a cyborg his entire life
timber matrix
bastion
opaque scroll
Oh yeah genji wasn't a cyborg his entire life
Zen didnt make him one, I dont see the connection here
molten shore
Zen didnt make him one, I dont see the connection here
Zen is the smarter teacher to genji I think so I would think zen would be older. But then I realized that zen has been a omic all 20 years of his life and genji has been a cyborg maybe 10 15 less then 20 most likely so zen would know more I guess I don't know. So to me it makes more sense.
iron plume
Zen's teachings weren't about being an omnic/cyborg
But about the higher metaphysical plane, though it did make Genji accept being a cyborg
Zen had his awakening soon after being built, his "age" doesn't really have much to do with his wisdom
molten shore
That makes more sense
still merlin
gabriel reyes am i right
sharp trench
yea
white crypt
Do we have any lore for sojourn?
floral venture
That’s what i was thinking like why would she become a cyborg
opal nexus
we have some hints right now like how she needed cybernetics from a young age but we’ll just have to wait for the novel and cinematic
worthy rose
Do we have any lore for sojourn?
all we know is she used to be a part of the ow team before it was shut down as far as im aware
peak escarp
she was a captain in Overwatch, and was acting Commander when Jack Morrison and Gabriel Reyes were believed dead in the destruction of the Overwatch HQ in Switzerland
sharp trench
was Reyes involved with deliberately destroying the OW HQ or did he only become bad when he joined Talon
peak escarp
we don't know the full details
it seems like he didn't go bad until after the explosion
but there's probably more to it than what we've seen
rare charm
i believe theres a sojurn novel coming out late this year
jolly lava
we have some hints right now like how she needed cybernetics from a young age bu...
i thought she chose to be a cyborg
peak escarp
I think her first cybernetics were a necessity, but all the ones after that were voluntary upgrades
tall sleet
aw junkrat interaction with ana where he says he wishes he had an adoptive mother like her to give him guidance
POOR JUNK!!
peak escarp
makes me wonder what happened to Junkrat's parents
mighty sierra
what is cassidy referring to when he mentioned Hanamura to s76?
opal nexus
blackwatch dismantling the shimada clan
considering this is blackwatch
they probably employed some
less than ethical means
mighty sierra
thats what im assuming since hanzo said his father is dead
opal nexus
well we dont know how hanzo and genji's father died
it happened before the shimada clan fell iirc
mighty sierra
i think it was first mentioned in that one cinematic now that i think about it lol
peak escarp
their father died before Hanzo and Genji's fight
Hanzo was told by the clan elders to make Genji straighten out so they could run the family together after their father died suddenly
also, their father was approached by Talon and he refused to work with them - his sudden death might be because he said no to Talon
sharp trench
so what other clan took the place of the shimada
balmy imp
Hashimoto I think
sharp trench
did they have any any affiliations with blackwatch
peak escarp
yeah Hashimoto
they don't have any affiliation with Blackwatch
Blackwatch was a division of Overwatch
sharp trench
was it possible blackwatch set up hashimoto to take the place of shimada
kind of a "lesser of two evils" thing
peak escarp
it seems more like the Hashimoto just moved in when there was a power vacuum
limpid agate
was it possible blackwatch set up hashimoto to take the place of shimada
No
Shimada Clan was the lesser of two evils
And Blackwatch shut them out
The Hashimoto took power after Overwatch came and went
You can speculate Talon might have had a hand in it, but not Blackwatch
It was most likely just the power vacuum and free territory
worthy rose
So apparently sigma has "met" the iris
Do you guys think the iris is a group of omnics? Is it an entity? A higher being? Maybe a program like athena
Or is it just a concept..? Maybe Zen and the monks at Shambali temple have been keeping things secret..
Genji never talks about the iris even though he trained with Zen for years
If it is an entity, does it have a physical or virtual conscienceness? I feel like with that graffiti on I wanna say it was.. New Queen Street? I feel like we might get a glimpse at what the iris actually is
If it's tranquility and something that the monks look up to, is it spiritual? Is it corporeal?
Or is it simply a belief?
What if it's like the logic plague from Halo in that it's a concept that is so foreign and so unfathomable that once you are made aware of it, you simply fall victim to its advances
Or is it just.. Something that gives omnics life? If that's the case, Is null sector working on behalf of the iris?
I know that they are fighting for omnic equality, but what if null sector as a faction is working to meet the iris' demands?
And wait a minute.. it sigma's "met" the iris, it must have some form of spokesperson or way to communicate. Unless he was just talking about meeting as in gaining the knowledge of the Iris
Zen seems uncomfortable when Sig says that line. He hesitates. I can't tell in his voice if he is worried, jealous, spiteful, or something else
Some people have thought that it was a cloud network that stored the omnics' souls when they eventually were destroyed and acts as the passageway to "nirvana"
I really wanna see how the story goes. I'm so excited to have some answers instead of being left on a cliffhanger.. hopefully anyway
peak escarp
Sigma also claims he has met fairies, so I wouldn't put too much weight on what he says
as far as we know, the Iris is a metaphysical concept that the Shambali believe in
the graffiti on the Toronto map are just messages of hope from Shambali followers
opaque tundra
I think I lot of people wanna know about the Iris because its various mentions and references (or at least hints) is pointing to its importance. There's the India mission and a possible Nepal mission hinted so I think the Iris or at least something related to it is gonna be very important
worthy rose
well we dont know how hanzo and genji's father died
i vibe checked him
worthy rose
or the Iris is simply the omnics' God, or how they see him
peak escarp
the Iris isn't a god
soft nebula
peak escarp
they seem to be friends
Sombra isn't a bad person, she just works with bad people to get what she wants
cosmic crest
She's killed innocent people, so she's kind of a bad person
But she's had moments of altruism
peak escarp
what innocent people?
cosmic crest
In Infiltration
And Code of Violence if memory serves
Not as certain about that one I haven't read it in a while, but Infiltration definitely
peak escarp
doesn't make them innocent people
"killed innocent people" makes it sound like she went around shooting civilians
limpid agate
If you are holding an assault rifle
And pointing it at someone
You shouldn't be surprised if someone shoots you in turn
I think that because of their job, you can drop innocent
They were not bad people, but they were also doing their job of trying to kill her
iron plume
She routinely puts herself in position where she has to kill people who are just doing the job, while working for a global terrorist organization
I'd say that pretty clearly puts her in bad person category
She's more nuanced than "shits for giggles" evil but no one's straight up like that in OW
limpid agate
Except Junkrat
iron plume
Junkrat doesn't do it to Be Evil, he does it for money and explosions
But yeah he'd be the closest to that
dull flicker
Why do they call the Push Bot a robot but not an onnic?
peak escarp
it might not be an omnic
omnics are robots that were built in omniums
like Orisa or Zenyatta
Echo wasn't built in an omnium, so she isn't an omnic
past copper
Well, they have classes
For example, Zenyatta, Orisa, and Bastion are omnics
But Snowball is a robot
iron plume
If you want to get technical, Orisa wasnn't Omnium-built, her ancestor/physical base is
but either way seems like a pointless discussion
there aren't enough obots to start breakng them down already
limpid agate
Orisa's chasis was built in an omnium
Her AI was not
It's like saying a Shellby is not a Ford
A Shellby is still a Ford, its just an upgraded one
The Pushbot is not an Omnic. Its made by a completely separate company from Omnica.
grand wedge
isn't the term omnic used in universe as a mean to refer to a robot with intelligence/sentience/sapient (whatever the right term is) - a bit like we use the term kleenex for a tissue, even if it's not a Kleenex®?
tall sleet
Adding on to previous conversation about sombra
She isn’t like, the most evil person in overwatch universe by a long shot but she is by no means a good person. She is an icon and a legend but we can’t overlook that she is involved W talon and heavily invades peoples privacy and turns on her own associates for her own personal gain
tawny eagle
Can someone explain the entire OW lore in 5 min
peak escarp
Can someone explain the entire OW lore in 5 min
not 5 minutes, but this video covers it pretty well
https://youtu.be/RD8lxxqZXWQ
past copper
Can someone explain the entire OW lore in 5 min
I mean, not exactly detailed, but a summary at the least. Beginning with how this whole lore starts.
A company called the Omnica Corporation developed self-improving factories called Omniums, which built robots with AI that became known as Omnics and lived alongside humans until the factories were dismantled and deactivated due to evidence of corporate fraud. That was until they mysteriously all reactivated on their own and launched attacks against humanity in a global conflict that would become known as the Omnic Crisis.
The nations of the world fought back with everything they had and while some had managed to combat the omnic threat, such as Russia and Germany, others were struggling as the number of lives lost rose. This forced the United Nation to form a small task force of unique individuals to target the omniums called Overwatch. After years many missions to shut down the factories and rendering the omnic armies inert, the Omnic Crisis was brought to an end.
past copper
Humanity struck peace with the surviving omnics with tens of millions of casualties, 30 million children orphaned, and millions left displaced. Mercenary organizations also rose up to profit off the war’s aftermath. This left Overwatch to handle these criminal group, including dangerous organizations like Shimadas, Null Sector, Talon etc.
Despite ending the war and all the good Overwatch had done for the world, growing suspicion towards the organization made the public begin questioning the need for Overwatch anymore. After an incident in Rialto, people grew to distrust Overwatch for keeping secrets, such as the existence of the covert ops division, Blackwatch and their actions.
After complaints over Blackwatch’s actions, Overwatch’s influence began waning and people within Blackwatch sought to take over the organization. This would lead to the destruction of the Swiss HQ. Soon there after, the UN dismantled Overwatch entirely and deemed any Overwatch activity illegal with the Petras Act.
runic oak
a cinematic about moira's work with talon and possibly her connections to sigma,would be very intersting imo
generally,sigma seems to have a very intersting background,judging by his introduction video back when he was released.
but blizzard seem to dont care much about these type of things nowdays.
tall sleet
Sigma is definitely interesting
I’d love to see a video about their process of transforming widowmaker into the cold blooded killer that she is
I need a Netflix show about moira NOW!
peak escarp
I don't think they'd be able to show that
tall sleet
Why not?
peak escarp
it would be above a Teen rating
peak escarp
I don't think there's a way to show physical and mental torture without it being graphic
peak escarp
it still has to stay within the rating
past copper
it would be above a Teen rating
Netflix literally has the show Big Mouth and Arcane gets graphic too
Don’t think Netflix would have problems making something graphic in Overwatch
peak escarp
that's not the problem
sharp trench
is moira responsible for reaper's whole smoke thing or did she only enhance its power
peak escarp
she's mostly responsible
quiet vine
would it be fair to say that Moira is the main reason for the fall of Overwatch?
if it werent for her experiments on Reyes, he wouldn't have gone out of line and killed the guy they were supposed to interrogate
grand wedge
there were other Talon moles in Overwatch & Blackwatch - so I wouldn't say it's her fault, but she definitely contributed to it
rare charm
if it werent for her experiments on Reyes, he wouldn't have gone out of line and...
iirc, reyes was already starting to do more and more questionable things before moira came into the picture
he had a chip on his shoulder to begin with given he was the original leader of overwatch but jack was scene was the public leader for OW
solemn mauve
Wait
how old is Winston? Like 30 or 40?
grand wedge
Wait
how old is Winston? Like 30 or 40?
29
clear kestrel
but either way seems like a pointless discussion
there aren't enough obots to st...
we need more omnic heroes in general
maybe someone from null sector
give them some rep
that reminds me I wonder how they're gonna factor in new hero releases for the story mode
fox girl feels like she's coming entirely out of left field and I have no idea what her place in the story is
iron plume
She came out of the Kanezaka teaser
and might be a reason for Overwatch to return to Hanamura
peak escarp
he had a chip on his shoulder to begin with given he was the original leader of ...
Reyes was fine with being passed over for Strike Commander - he didn't want to deal with the red tape and responsibility, he just wanted to do things his way
clear kestrel
code of violence makes it clear that the reason
or at least, one of the reasons he went rogue was because he became disillusioned with overwatch
I dunno if doomfist planted that seed of doubt in his mind or if he just helped it grow
peak escarp
I think Doomfist just encouraged it
he was already feeling like they couldn't do enough to reach the people who needed punishing
clear kestrel
I'm glad they went that route
him just being an envious prick would have been super boring
peak escarp
as for Moira being the cause of Overwatch's downfall...
I believe she is, but maybe not intentionally
- Moira's treatment of Reyes caused him to act impulsively, killing Antonio rather than taking him captive, and setting off a sequence of events that exposed Blackwatch to the world and led to Overwatch being investigated for corruption
- Moira's presence in Blackwatch was kept a secret from Morrison by Reyes, which eroded the trust between them, culminating in a fight that was believed to have triggered an explosion that destroyed the Swiss HQ and (according to public knowledge) killed both Morrison and Reyes
- Moira's genetic therapy of Amelie Lacroix aided in turning her into a perfect sniper, who would later go on to (attempt to) assassinate Ana Amari - with Ana no longer there to act as mediator between Morrison and Reyes, their friendship fell apart
these three events led to Overwatch's downfall, and Moira had a hand in all of them
if one of these three events didn't happen, I believe Overwatch could have been saved
- if Blackwatch wasn't exposed, Overwatch wouldn't have been investigated (or at least the investigation wouldn't have had as much to go on)
- if Morrison and Reyes still trusted each other, they could have pulled Overwatch successfully through the investigation
- if Ana hadn't died, she could have kept Morrison and Reyes from murdering each other long enough for Overwatch to survive the investigation
clear kestrel
I feel like the 1st one wouldn't make that much of a difference
Reyes still would have become disillusioned and who knows how that would have panned out even if things had gone to plan in venice
I'm with you on the other two tho
clear kestrel
yea I agree
wonder if he still would have joined talon tho
I have it in my head that if things had been different
he'd still have gone rogue but he wouldn't have gone to talon
he'd still be in touch with his morality and sense of justice, so I could see him just
going off and becoming a vigilante or something
peak escarp
I think he joined Talon because that's where Moira took him
and it was a good outlet for his rage
clear kestrel
I'm very curious how they're gonna handle his story
killing him off is out of the equation I feel
locking him up is very underwhelming and anti climactic
but redemption isn't very realistic either
peak escarp
maybe go the Vader route
he gets redemption with his dying breath?
or maybe he'll just be the perpetual villain, always there as a threat in the background
clear kestrel
I could see him perhaps leaving talon but not joining overwatch
so kind of a redemption but not in the sense that he's all chummy with everyone now
he's not working for the bad guys anymore, just doing his own thing
peak escarp
that's more or less how I see any kind of Widowmaker "redemption arc" happening
she gets away from Talon, but she doesn't join the good guys
she just does her own thing
clear kestrel
realistically she's the most likely to get a redemption arc now that I think about it
we can already see the conditioning is starting to wear off
or at least
we know it CAN wear off eventually
peak escarp
even if she breaks the conditioning, she still killed a lot of people
they can't just forgive her for that
she'd have to go to jail, or get rehabilitated - either option takes her out of the story completely
clear kestrel
realistically she's the most likely to get a redemption arc now that I think abo...
I was gonna say either her or Sombra but like
does she even NEED a redemption arc?
Sombra that is
peak escarp
not really
iron plume
eeh
peak escarp
she has done good things and bad things
iron plume
I'm still not sure where "sombra isn't actually bad" take stems from
clear kestrel
she's a bad person
but she's not pure evil
iron plume
cause like yeah she's not drunk the coolaid and did some good things
but she's still actively involved in a global terrorist organization's efforts
and hardly to sabotage them
What she did in Numbani alone is pretty fucked already
and it was entirely intentional
peak escarp
she's a kinder person than anyone else we've seen from Talon
except Baptiste, and he left
clear kestrel
I still can't tell if her being nice to Sigma is like
genuine
it sounds genuine
but I don't know WHY she would care so much
peak escarp
also she exposed Lumerico's corruption for the sake of her hometown
clear kestrel
I'm not gonna excuse the Numbani thing
but she was orphaned by the omnic crisis
so maybe she still has some hate in her heart
dunno
iron plume
Again, having soft spots for people/places you like doesn't really make you not evil
Let's put it that way with regards to "redemption arc"
iron plume
Which we in real life typically say is a bad person behavior
If you're talking evil in the classic DnD alignment sense where evil is literally a force that lives within you and compels you to do shit then no
But we don't have evil as a literal force
we have selfishness, egoism, lack of empathy or responsibility for your actions on the greater world
and sombra strikes all of that
clear kestrel
you're not wrong
iron plume
and regarding "redemption arcs"
those aren't typically about being nebulously good or evil anyway
it's about atoning for your actions and coming to the other side
which sombra would absolutely have to do if she suddenly decided she'd be with the good guys because fuck talon
and if she does that'll be that arc
peak escarp
that's another reason I don't think Widowmaker needs a redemption arc
she doesn't want redemption
iron plume
Now that one's true
peak escarp
unlike someone like Hanzo whose entire character is basically begging for a redemption arc
iron plume
I don't think anyone needs a redemption arc in the grander sense of the story
as far as we've seen Widowmaker and Sombra are more than happy going along with Talon
clear kestrel
unlike someone like Hanzo whose entire character is basically begging for a rede...
sucks we haven't gotten any supplementary material for him yet
that I know of
peak escarp
yeah
iron plume
but if Sombra decides not to and joins the "good guys" without a redemption arc
it would be cheap as hell
iron plume
which is what I meant about it
peak escarp
*but* if Sombra decides not to and joins the "good guys" *without* a redemption ...
if she did that without a reason you'd suspect it was a trick
iron plume
yeah hanzo seems more ready for it
iron plume
if she did that without a reason you'd suspect it was a trick
that too
peak escarp
here's hoping Hanzo is involved with Fox Girl's story
iron plume
although i'm saying less "without a reason" and more "without sacrificing something"
clear kestrel
as far as we've seen Widowmaker and Sombra are more than happy going along with ...
ok tbf
Sombra is pragmatic so I could honestly see her joining overwatch if for nothing else than they could help her on her path of uncovering the global conspiracy she's obsessing over
she's happy to work with talon because they can help her
but she isn't like
loyal to them or anything
so I feel like her joining overwatch without a redemption arc wouldn't be TOO bad if they play it right
iron plume
yes it would be
clear kestrel
I dunno
iron plume
From Sombra's point of view, it's possible if Talon starts losing or whatever
But why would Overwatch take her in after all she's done
clear kestrel
I could see her offering them an ultimatum or something
she offers everything she has on talon
they give her sanctuary
peak escarp
what I really want to see is Max joining/helping Overwatch - not because he turns good, but because he thinks Talon is going too far and he thinks Overwatch is the only ones who can stop them
after all, he has sold out Doomfist to them once before already
clear kestrel
tbf
it wasn't for any moral reasons
iron plume
now that'd be cool to see
iron plume
At this point he might feel like Doomfist going further is threatening his skin
and, more importantly, money
peak escarp
that first OW2 gameplay trailer way back in 2019 hinted at Max having second thoughts about their war
hope that hasn't been dropped
clear kestrel
I wonder if the mission order has changed at all
I know they said that they brainstormed about maybe putting Rio last
but that would feel kinda weird
having the one mission we've already seen the entirety of be the finale
peak escarp
we'll have to wait and see
iron plume
I feel like end product Rio won't be the same as we saw in the demo anyway
clear kestrel
I'm honestly the most excited for torbs mission
clear kestrel
I'm so excited for the story mode in general