All of the prominent Talon characters we know of are more closely tied to Akande's Talon, learning about the old Talon is like learning about the start of the Horizon project where it's not very useful info compared to present status
#lore-discussion
valid terrace
I would much rather learn of early Omnica than Talon
They are probably the only group with a greater historical impact than Overwatch
worthy rose
I need the mercy comic link thing please idk what its called
its a comic w mercy in it?
desert edge
Yeah, that's what the link is
valid terrace
Old Talon isn't the main antagonist either, we don't need to see how a bunch of non-relevant characters started an organization that has already evolved beyond what they had created
If we get a new character reveal that was actually part of the original Talon and they affect the story, then that would make it more relevant
The start of Overwatch has main characters that can reference it, Talon so far does not, so it won't be any information beyond world building
Which is fine, but just as important as any other new info that doesn't affect the story
worthy rose
I wish for more Reaper lore :(
I know he has the most lore in OW but still. I really want to know more about his personality and motives
peak escarp
I want to know what drove him to join Talon
worthy rose
Me too. I assume he joined so he has more resources to enact his revenge
worthy rose
Its kinda unknown but apparently they left him to die
valid terrace
Talon actively wanted him to die
And made plans to have it be so
That's why him joining them is very strange
past copper
Well, if I’m remembering this right, Talon wanted him dead before the Doomfist we all know and love took over
mortal rock
but why does he want revenge?
I mean I assume he blames jack for the explosion
peak escarp
that explains why he hates Jack
past copper
Maybe that changed since we don’t have a clear idea when how or why Gabriel joined Talon alongside his teammate Moira
peak escarp
not why he hates Overwatch and is hunting down ex-Overwatch agents
mortal rock
yeah I don’t know he seems to be mostly sane and I don’t know why he would hunt down people with not much affiliation with him
peak escarp
Reyes was actively against Talon prior to that - there's no explanation for why he suddenly switched sides
past copper
Honestly, I think they learned of what Gabriel was capable of due to Moira’s experiments and Talon, after Doomfist took over, wanted someone like that in their ranks. They’re probably just using him like how they’re using Sigma
That’s my guess. Unless Blizzard is making him the classic character who joins the villains to do what they believe is right through destroying those who turned against them.
To be fair, the public almost Immediately turned against Overwatch once they discovered Blackwatch existed. We saw how that affected Jack, but how did that affect Gabriel
Your guess is as good as mine, but unless some more lore drops about Reaper, we’re all in the dark
mortal rock
but he seems sane in his voice lines and motivation, it would be surprising if he turned out to manipulatible
peak escarp
Reyes is too smart for that, I don't think Talon would be able to use him like that
mortal rock
sigma is like full on mentally insane, and I think putting him in the same category as reaper seems unfair to reyes
past copper
Well, it could be that after Blackwatch was discovered, not only did the public turn against Gabriel, but his own friends too. More so Jack, who was highly against Gabriel’s actions in Rialto.
He allowed Blackwatch to go and bring in the target. Not kill him.
cosmic crest
I think Reyes caused the explosion at the Swiss base One of Soldier's interactions with Moira implies he had been planning something.
past copper
Yup. And Gabriel in Ana’s comic implies that THEY did this to him. They being Overwatch in general.
past copper
I can only guess that with all the secrets Gabriel was keeping from his comrades along with going against protocol on a mission that ended in a target being killed instead of captured, which resulted in Blackwatch becoming known to the public and making both themselves and Overwatch abuse their power, Gabriel made himself public enemy #1 and untrustworthy around his own comrades
peak escarp
that explains hating Jack and hating Overwatch
that doesn't explain joining Talon, or hunting down ex-agents
past copper
If you think about it, it almost sounds like Madara Uchiha’s own back story from Naruto
crisp hearth
i wonder if reaper just walked up to talon and just said "lemme join"
peak escarp
I think Moira probably vouched for him
and outside of Doomfist and Moira and maybe some other leaders, his identity probably isn't known to everyone in Talon
past copper
My guess. Because of this, Gabriel’s world was crumbling around him with no way to save it. His position as Strike Commander was taken from him and given to Jack. The public’s views of him made him out to be a criminal. And his own comrades turned their backs on him. He was living in Hell.
But, maybe the clever Akande met with him and offered Gabriel the chance to restore himself. Gabriel of course would have liked nothing more than to kill the man, but given what he was going through, decided to listen. With some enticing words of encouragement, Gabriel was convinced to destroy those who abandoned him. He just never would’ve expected what would happen that faithful day in the HQ.
worthy rose
I wouldn't be surprised if some think Reaper is just some Frankenstein like creation of Moira's.
mortal rock
I wouldn't be surprised if some think Reaper is just some Frankenstein like crea...
it seems that’s what moira thinks of him like
worthy rose
Yeah kinda except hes more powerful and smarter
past copper
Maybe, but given how Akande is, he would bring it up that a weak man was put in a position he doesn’t deserve over someone like Gabriel
worthy rose
Jack is not really weak
peak escarp
Jack isn't weak, and wasn't undeserving
mortal rock
but it’s not like reaper doesn’t respect jacks ability’s, he knows he’s just as tough
peak escarp
he got the promotion because he was a better leader than Gabe was
worthy rose
Gave was smarter but Jack was a better poster boy
peak escarp
Gabe was better on his own, without having to be responsible for other people
worthy rose
Gabe was better on his own, without having to be responsible for other people
Exactly like me lol
Imagine what he was like back in his prime
past copper
Well, Jack has kinda become ruthless after Overwatch. He’s become Batman
worthy rose
Reaper is more like Batman tbh
Yeah he became less captain America and more Punisher
worthy rose
Batman is ruthless af
He's a mix of Punisher and Batman
He tortures criminals and beats the crap out of them
mortal rock
reaper is pretty much punisher with superpowers
worthy rose
Reaper would stomp Punisher easily
past copper
Regardless, the leader part aside, I’m sure Akande still would’ve been the one to convince Gabriel to join Talon and turn against those who abandoned him
peak escarp
that does seem plausible
mortal rock
I feel that could’ve been apart of it
worthy rose
He would of turned against them weather Akande tried to convince him or not
peak escarp
much better than the double agent theory
worthy rose
He's no stranger to talking people into joining him imagine
worthy rose
~~much better than the double agent theory~~
Oh God please no
mortal rock
the double agent theory sucks
worthy rose
So cliche I would prolly drown myself if that happened
past copper
Like I said, if this were Naruto, Gabriel would be Madara Uchiha.
worthy rose
If Reaper was a double agent he wouldn't be shooting at his old friends with full intent to kill
peak escarp
the double agent theory falls apart as soon as you analyze any part of it
worthy rose
I also hope he stays evil
Also Reaper is....well for lack of a better word cartoonishly evil
And he killed a few ow agents so the theory is false
peak escarp
yeah, he's not the sort of character that gets redeemed - he's the type that gets defeated
worthy rose
And cartoonishly evil villains never do good as heroes, because outside of being a villain....there's not to much there
past copper
I mean, can really blame Gabriel if that’s the case? If everyone turned their backs on you and made you out to be a criminal, would be able to stand it forever
worthy rose
yeah, he's not the sort of character that gets redeemed - he's the type that get...
Unfortunately despite his power plot defeats him
peak escarp
I mean, can really blame Gabriel if that’s the case? If everyone turned their ba...
I'd find new friends, not murder my old friends
past copper
Maybe, but if someone was there to convince you otherwise
worthy rose
Yeah forget Ow they were bad friends
mortal rock
I just hope that if the overwatch tv show happens, there is a big finale where every character either joins talon or overwatch and there is a big fight where a lot of characters bite the dust, but that is wishful thinking
worthy rose
That would be cool
peak escarp
I don't want everyone to join a side
I'd rather have some characters stay independant
past copper
I doubt that would happen. This isn’t Avengers Endgame
mortal rock
the junkets seem like they could be easily swayed to talon
past copper
Well, I wouldn’t jump in and say OW3 just yet. Let’s see if OW2 drops first okay
peak escarp
or at least, the story that ships with the game is the Null Sector arc
they could do future arcs as DLC
worthy rose
What an EA move
peak escarp
I never said paid DLC
we've always gotten DLC in Overwatch - new heroes, new maps, seasonal game modes
worthy rose
Honestly idc as long as we get more Reaper lore
mortal rock
I never said *paid* DLC
laughs in activision
peak escarp
new story missions would just be a continuation of that
past copper
Yea. EA kinda failed with loot boxes in Star Wars. Blizzard wouldn’t make the same mistake
peak escarp
and honestly, I wouldn't mind paying for new story content
past copper
In fact, didn’t they say there won’t be anymore loot boxes in Overwatch 2
worthy rose
I won't pay ill just watch cutscenes on YouTube lol
timid eagle
As far as lore goes, while OW2 will probably not focus on Roadhog and Junkrat, I do want to know what they've been up to after failing to get back to JunkerTown.
peak escarp
there's always short stories, comics and novels
the lore won't be exclusively in-game
worthy rose
I hope they make a Reaper novel
mortal rock
In fact, didn’t they say there won’t be anymore loot boxes in Overwatch 2
honestly that’s probably to make way for a battle pass, which currently is pretty profitable for activision
past copper
We’ll see come this Spring in 2022. Even if people are worrying about OW2 ending up like Cyberpunk 2077 now
timid eagle
the lore won't be exclusively in-game
That's true. If anything, the conflict for OW2 will probably focus on New Overwatch, Talon, and Null Sector, while the characters who are not attached to any of the main groups will be left on the wayside.
peak escarp
personally I'd like to see more of the Old Soldiers plotline
worthy rose
Me too since the characters there are the most important
past copper
Personally, I’d like to see Reaper as Soldier: 24 in action. He looks like an edgy badass
peak escarp
I'm also super hyped for the upcoming McCree story arc 👀
mortal rock
I hope it doesn’t mainly focus on null sector, because “evil robots” aren’t really great villains, unless there is something involving a human, but I doubt it
timid eagle
I really liked the JunkerTown short that premiered years ago, and I would be fine if they could create more shorts in a similar vein.
worthy rose
Personally, I’d like to see Reaper as Soldier: 24 in action. He looks like an ed...
Imo Reaper looks cooler than soldier 24
mortal rock
I really like the side character (ei hammond junkers or moira) and hope they get storylines to themselves
timid eagle
Imo Reaper looks cooler than soldier 24
I personally like Gabriel before he became a grumpy gas cloud, as Reaper (aside from that panel where he's stalking that family) is either Grumpy or Grumpier.
rancid egret
moira is a side character? isn’t she an active member of talon and a former black watch agent?
worthy rose
I personally like Gabriel before he became a grumpy gas cloud, as Reaper (aside ...
Idk i think masks can make a character way more badass
peak escarp
she is, but she's not involved in the main plot directly
she's a side character compared to Winston, Tracer or Doomfist, for example
mortal rock
moira is a side character? isn’t she an active member of talon and a former blac...
what I meant is characters that haven’t had much of a spotlight in terms of content like shorts or comics. also she has not had much of an impact besides creating reaper
timid eagle
Idk i think masks can make a character way more badass
I respect it. He at least rocks the edge-lord look for being a 50+ military man.
worthy rose
As a fellow edgelord myself I am proud of Reaper
past copper
I actually like the new looks the characters are getting. Hyped about what Junkrat and Hanzo will look like
mortal rock
I hate reapers aesthetics, it feels so forced edgy, and edgy itself is already cringe
past copper
I won’t hold you, I don’t think Brigitte or Echo would get a new design. And possibly Sigma
mortal rock
I can’t wait for road hogs new look (not biased at all)
timid eagle
I hate reapers aesthetics, it feels so forced edgy, and edgy itself is already c...
I always seen him as a caricature of what a 14 year old would think as being cool.
peak escarp
they did say "all 31 heroes" would get redesigns (this was before Echo was released)
worthy rose
I am 17 and I think he's cool
peak escarp
but by the time the game comes out Echo will have been around for 2 years
so she should get a redesign too
mortal rock
I always seen him as a caricature of what a 14 year old would think as being coo...
I mean it kinda makes sense if he was born in like 2010-2020
past copper
I only say Brigitte and Echo because they’re actually pretty new to the team. One being apart of something big for the first time. The other experiencing combat probably for the first time.
Sigma though, idk. He doesn’t seem to see much of anything
mortal rock
I am 17 and I think he's cool
I am 17 and his voice lines make me want to break my head on a table lmao
rancid egret
I only say Brigitte and Echo because they’re actually pretty new to the team. On...
that means nothing lmao you gotta see it from a gameplay dev standpoint, everyone is gonna get new looks
rancid egret
I am 17 and his voice lines make me want to break my head on a table lmao
yeah i hate reaper
worthy rose
I am 17 and his voice lines make me want to break my head on a table lmao
His voice is asmr to my ears
past copper
Reaper is a badass. Though, I kinda wanna see what Doomfist will look like when he’s fighting. We’ve already seen his formal appearance
timid eagle
I only say Brigitte and Echo because they’re actually pretty new to the team. On...
Sigma is a weird case. In his reveal trailer, he was the textbook example of what every person thinks a mentally deranged man would act and appear in fiction.
But in-game? If it weren't for the gravity-based powers and his ultimate, he's a chill dude who believes he's performing different experiments.
rancid egret
idk like it’s been said above, it feels too forced
worthy rose
Reaper is a badass. Though, I kinda wanna see what Doomfist will look like when ...
We already saw him fight
rancid egret
We already saw him fight
in his trailer
mortal rock
Sigma is a weird case. In his reveal trailer, he was the textbook example of wha...
well overwatch has never been great at expressing personality traits through gameplay (except maybe ultimates)
peak escarp
yeah, gameplay is a bad example
rancid egret
ingame the only personality you see seems to be from emotes voicelines and the “what if” interactions
past copper
We already saw him fight
I mean in his new appearance in OW2. Not from his decade old trailer for OW1
worn island
well just the way they react to certain stuff as well, such as resurrect or dva nuke
mortal rock
I don’t get how they will give omnics a new design, since they can’t change clothes or anything
past copper
The only time we saw Doomfist in OW2 was speaking to what looks like Max while dressed in his formal attire. But what will Doom look like in combat
peak escarp
and the redesign can be more than just clothes - look at Bastion for example
worn island
would zen purposefully upgrade/redesign himself?
peak escarp
past copper
Yea. Bastion was given new armor by Torb and even a cute hat
peak escarp
OW2 Bastion's whole body has more rounded armor than its OW1 design
mortal rock
oh I didn’t even see that image
peak escarp
Bastion's redesign has been seen a few times, but never officially revealed
past copper
Zenyatta. No idea what he would look like. We saw him in trailers and development, but nothing that looks new
worn island
torbjorns crotch armour looks like it would really mess with his walking
past copper
Torbjörn doesn’t look exactly like that
mortal rock
overall, I don’t like the less stylized, more realistic looks of the heroes
past copper
It’s just a concept. His real design is out
peak escarp
the concept art is a bit more stylized than the in-game models
due to the different art style
mortal rock
Why?
I have always like stylized video games, because they never age and just look better in more, well, fantastical games
peak escarp
Blizzard's cartoony art style does make the heroes look younger than they are, particularly the women
compared to the concept art
past copper
Well, Overwatch 2 is gonna be so much more better with the environments feeling more real and the characters/clothes/expressions/weapons feel lifelike. Seriously, I don’t think I can compare it to any other game right now
Though, I need to play OW2 before I can give such opinion
mortal rock
well the problem with games with “revolutionary” graphics that are “super” realistic, never last for more than 5 years before the art style looks old
peak escarp
compare how angular Mercy's face looks in the concept art comared to her game model
past copper
I honestly think people will prefer the story more. Besides, 5 years isn’t bad. That’s about as old as the current Overwatch is now.
One looks like a comic book design while the other looks like it could pass for an animated movie
mortal rock
I honestly think people will prefer the story more. Besides, 5 years isn’t bad. ...
a 5 year life span isn’t that great for as big of a hit launch day hit as ow
mortal rock
compare how angular Mercy's face looks in the concept art comared to her game mo...
yeah the only overwatch character that really looks skinny is junkrat, and that is one of his key design elements
past copper
Well, to be fair, when it comes to game women, Blizzard knows that will get hentai artists to go to town. Which in turn brings more attention to the game.
Not the most attention, but all kinds of attention is good if it gets people playing it
peak escarp
what
worn island
I dont think that was in their mind in the slightest
past copper
Except for negative stuff. Like people once throwing a fit over Sigma’s asylum skin
limpid agate
Reminder this is a SFW server
worn island
I think that they make sure none of their characters are super ugly and uncomfortable to look but i think thats as far as their thought process went
mortal rock
Well, to be fair, when it comes to game women, Blizzard knows that will get hent...
didn’t they litteraly take down nsfw content online
past copper
didn’t they litteraly take down nsfw content online
I have no idea anymore. Blizzard is making so many changes lately that at this point, I can just cross my fingers and hope OW2 comes out and doesn’t turn into another Cyberpunk
Never played it, but heard nothing good about it
worn island
i mean ow2 hasnt actually been hyped up as much over what, like 10+ years?
mortal rock
I have no idea anymore. Blizzard is making so many changes lately that at this p...
all i’m saying is it invalidates your point, also cyberpunk is pretty fun, not worth the hype, but pretty fun
peak escarp
Cyberpunk wasn't as bad as everyone said
mortal rock
it was like a 5/10 imo
peak escarp
OW2 has been in development for about 4 years now, it will be fine
past copper
Heck, with McCree’s name change means having to change some lines in OW2, which I don’t think is a big deal, but as long as the story is great, I wouldn’t complain
limpid agate
I think that they make sure none of their characters are super ugly and uncomfor...
I think that almost every successful game tries to make their characters not uncomfortable to look at.
The ones that do, do it on purpose for a reason, like Binding of Isaac.
past copper
IDK, we still don’t know what Reaper looks like under the mask
mortal rock
Heck, with McCree’s name change means having to change some lines in OW2, which ...
I mean they already make like 30+ new voice lines every year so it shouldn’t be too bad
limpid agate
Reaper isn't uncomfortable to look at. The player doesn't look at what is under the mask
The player looks at the mask.
worn island
yup, and roadhog isn't exactly a great looking guy but he is still not eyesore
I'd like to think roadhog looks very handsome under the mask
mortal rock
blizzard still has to be marketable so they wouldn’t make a character downright uncomfortable to look at
past copper
Reaper, Genji, Roadhog. I don’t think hog or Genji look that bad
worn island
what makes you genji is a likely candidate for looking bad?
limpid agate
He is scarred. His face looks burned.
worn island
ooh
well thats in a cinematic
and no products have been made of him looking like that
limpid agate
And they play it down to a very low level in Blackwatch Genji
Its not good business to make your characters hard to look at.
So you don't.
worn island
in zero hour, how exactly was mei hurt
cause we see absolutley nothing wrong with her
iron plume
yeah the only overwatch character that really looks skinny is junkrat, and that ...
And Moira but she has the same deal
past copper
A blast sent her flying into the road
peak escarp
Moira is disfigured, but in an aesthetically pleasing way
worn island
clearly no cuts
limpid agate
She was blasted back, and then had a limp
past copper
It looked like it fractured her shoulder
limpid agate
So presumably, her leg was broken.
worn island
hmmm, and mercy healed it just like that?
limpid agate
Yes.
mortal rock
hmmm, and mercy healed it just like that?
yeah mercy’s healing power isn’t excactly consistent
worn island
what did mercy actually do to her
past copper
Mercy devolved tech to heal the human body faster. But not actually bring them back to life
limpid agate
She used waht is effectively her resurrect.
iron plume
Mercy healing her "just like that" is the lore version of her res
worn island
but she just touched mei
limpid agate
Have you read Valkyire?
mortal rock
what did mercy actually do to her
she touched her and her leg was un-broken
worn island
i did
peak escarp
limpid agate
Valkyrie explains it as well as we are ever going to learn
peak escarp
it visually matches what we see in the game as "resurrect"
worn island
hmmmm
past copper
Look up Mercy’s lore. It says how she developed tech to help in the field
worn island
i dont remember valkyrie very well
peak escarp
complete with the "let's get you back in the fight" voice line
in regards to Mercy's healing
mortal rock
if resurrect was ever canon it would destroy the entire canon if it worked in the same vein as in the game
past copper
It’s the year 20+ in Overwatch. Don’t question the advancements in technology that put our world to shame 😂
worn island
i know its real advanced stuff but it's annoying to not a have a set in stone answer
worthy rose
Tbh I would rather live in ow than irl
iron plume
depends on where I guess
worn island
i mean an omnic uprising all over the world sounds pretty bad
peak escarp
Mercy's healing is nanobiotics, which is a real technology that exists now in its early stages
like many of the technologies in Overwatch
worn island
i see
past copper
Nanobiotics. It the same thing as Ana’s grenade and Jack’s grenade
iron plume
The real nanobiotics almost certainly won’t work like that but still
past copper
Though, Jack’s probably doesn’t work like in game
worthy rose
i mean an omnic uprising all over the world sounds pretty bad
Still better than my life rn
peak escarp
nanobiotics, robotics, AI, cybernetics, even black hole research and hard light theory are all things that are being researched now
mortal rock
Tbh I would rather live in ow than irl
I mean I wouldn’t like to live in a world where crimes against humanity are excused (moiras experiments) and terrorsists gave super powers (reaper sigma)
worthy rose
That would be awesome imo
peak escarp
Moira's experiments weren't excused
iron plume
I mean it’s obviously got some artistic license
peak escarp
she was disgraced because of them
past copper
Imagine if we had hardlight. Let’s create solid holographic bridges and buildings lol
mortal rock
Moira's experiments weren't excused
well she’s not in jail, which I would call pretty merciful
worn island
i hardlight permanent once put in place? like you can make buildings out if it right?
iron plume
hah, “merciful”
peak escarp
for a scientist, being discredited is worse than jail
iron plume
eeeehh
mortal rock
for a scientist, being discredited is worse than jail
not for moira clearly
iron plume
i hardlight permanent once put in place? like you can make buildings out if it r...
yes, Vishkar supposedly builds cities out of it
past copper
Well, we don’t know what happened to Moira after Overwatch. We know she joined Talon, but what happened in between
cosmic crest
I don't think it's been fully explained what her experiments entailed.
iron plume
or at least it can be permanent
peak escarp
Dissent among her peers soon followed. Many considered her work to be dangerous because of its perceived ethical shortfalls, and O'Deorain was even accused of having the same unchecked desire for scientific advancement that some believed had caused the Omnic Crisis. In addition, other geneticists were unable to reproduce the results of Moira's research, which further called her discoveries into question. Instead of kickstarting her career, her paper seriously damaged her reputation.
this is as much as we know about her experiments
iron plume
you know who else was disgraced instead of being put in jail? Andrew Wakefield
peak escarp
who?
timid eagle
Yep. Moira herself isn't evil, but she sure lacks a moral compass.
iron plume
and, well
gestures broadly at everything
peak escarp
what did he do?
iron plume
The guy who started the modern antivax movement
past copper
Basically, she’s a scientist trying to play god. If we’ve all seen Jurassic Park, we know that never ends well for anyone
peak escarp
oh
mortal rock
The guy who started the modern antivax movement
worse than moira, 10x worse (joke)
iron plume
Yep. Moira herself isn't evil, but she sure lacks a moral compass.
"lacking a moral compass" is what we generally call evil
limpid agate
Basically, she’s a scientist trying to play god. If we’ve all seen Jurassic Park...
She's not trying to play god.
She's more interested in discovery and research than "playing god"
mortal rock
Basically, she’s a scientist trying to play god. If we’ve all seen Jurassic Park...
she’s not trying to play god, she’s trying to advance science past a moral limit
limpid agate
That's not it either
Its not "trying to advance science past a moral limit"
Its "trying to advance science without moral limits"
There is nothing unethical about her discoveries. Its how she arrives at them that is unethical.
mortal rock
Its "trying to advance science without moral limits"
that’s what I was trying to say sorry i’m had with words lmao
peak escarp
the last part of her bio sums it up pretty well
Though O'Deorain will go to any lengths to make scientific breakthroughs, her work is still unknown to most of the world. But now that she has been freed from all constraints, it is only a matter of time before everything changes.
limpid agate
She is currently based in Oasis as the minister of genetics.
peak escarp
she's all about scientific progress at any cost
limpid agate
Which is a city that agrees with her philosophy.
mortal rock
I hope we get another oasis minister as a hero, I think it’s one of the most interesting concepts in ow
median frigate
What’s oasis’ purpose again
limpid agate
What’s oasis’ purpose again
scientific progress without constraint
mortal rock
What’s oasis’ purpose again
it’s a city where scientists can do experiments without having to be concerned about morals
median frigate
Oh
peak escarp
Oasis is one of the world's most advanced cities, a shining jewel rising from the Arabian Desert. A monument to human ingenuity and invention, researchers and academics from around the region came together to found a city dedicated to scientific progress without restraints. The city and its inhabitants are governed by the Ministries, a collection of brilliant minds who possess many secrets that have attracted the interest of powerful organizations from around the world.
from the official description
timid eagle
"lacking a moral compass" is what we generally call evil
I should clarify. Moira reminds me of a Star Trek: TNG character Dr. Toby Russell, where that person had a blue & orange morality. In essence, if it helps scientific progress, it's a boon. If it doesn't, she becomes indifferent and moves on.
lament wadi
Does any other part of the world have anything negative against oasis because of how it works or is it just fine?
timid eagle
Does any other part of the world have anything negative against oasis because of...
Mercy doesn't seem fond of their philosophy on technology and medical science, in general.
iron plume
I should clarify. Moira reminds me of a Star Trek: TNG character Dr. Toby Russel...
I understand what you meant. What I'm saying is, in real life terms, "evil" isn't really "do bad shit and mess people up for the sake of it"
Not having moral restraints is evil
mortal rock
moira seems to genuinely want mercy, because she could help advance the science at oasis, which seems to be all she cares about
peak escarp
a lot of Moira's interactions seem like she's genuinely curious about something
like her interaction with Mei
it just touches a nerve
mortal rock
the mei one seems to be her just messing with her
peak escarp
mortal rock
it may be genuine, but I don’t get that feeling from it
peak escarp
sounds genuine to me
lament wadi
I don't know if tracers interaction with moira would imply she disagrees aswell or she just doesn't want people messing with her chronal accelerator
mortal rock
I haven’t actually heard it though, so let me listen real quick
mortal rock
sounds genuine to me
your right it is pretty genuine
peak escarp
if you want an example of Moira being condescending, there's her interactions with Winston and Pharah
cosmic crest
I think Moira might struggle to feel empathy, and may have some form of ASPD. That interaction with Mei is a good indicator.
peak escarp
mortal rock
if you want an example of Moira being condescending, there's her interactions wi...
oh i’ve heard those
also the “our guardian angel” voice line
timid eagle
In the case for the Mei interaction, Moira probably didn't know what happened to Mei's colleagues at ECO Point Antarctica and just wanted to learn about their research.
peak escarp
I love the delivery on "jumped up ape"
peak escarp
it made headlines
of course she knew
but the research is more important to her than the loss of life
cosmic crest
Yeah, I think she knew.
timid eagle
Hmmm, fair enough.
iron plume
The difference between "innocent question that was poorly delivered" and "actively malicious" is in whether she expected Mei to care
peak escarp
she lacks empathy
cosmic crest
Her mind is hard focused on science, she wouldn't have thought how her words may be hurtful.
lament wadi
I think that she wouldn't expect mei to care about the loss of life because she wouldn't herself
timid eagle
Yeah, she also seems completely unable to understand why things have changed, or why Genji and McCree hate her so much now (in the case when she reminisce on old times with her former Blackwatch teammates).
cosmic crest
I don't think McCree was ever very fond of her.
iron plume
Neither was Genji
mortal rock
I don’t think anyone, except maybe reaper was particularly glad to have her on the team
worthy rose
I think Moira might struggle to feel empathy, and may have some form of ASPD. Th...
ASPD?
peak escarp
I don't think she's on the spectrum, I think she just doesn't care
mortal rock
worthy rose
Not having empathy is a symptom for anti social personality disorder
Its possible she might be a sociopath
mortal rock
Its possible she might be a sociopath
she definitely has something going on “up there”
peak escarp
it's a symptom, not the only symptom
if there was more to it I think we'd know about it
worthy rose
Shes not really manipulative though
mortal rock
do you think moira was responsible for sigmas manipulation?
worthy rose
Which is why I said might
worthy rose
do you think moira was responsible for sigmas manipulation?
If you mean him being manipulated into joining Talon, that anyone's guess
peak escarp
I also don't think Blizzard is going to hand out personality disorders to their heroes
mortal rock
that’s fair
peak escarp
the community loves imposing them on heroes though
worthy rose
If you mean him being manipulated into joining Talon, that anyone's guess
Once heard a theory that this "Melody" Sigma is constantly hearing in his head is how talon did it
mortal rock
Once heard a theory that this "Melody" Sigma is constantly hearing in his head i...
thats the theory I believe, that they almost skinner box him into trying to find this artificially produced melody
and that’s how they get him into doing talons work
peak escarp
that's unlikely
worthy rose
I wished you could hear this "Music" faintly when Playing as Sigma, that would have been a cool detail
mortal rock
that's unlikely
I know but it’s a cool theory, and blizzard already killed the coolest theory about sigma
peak escarp
it's a bad theory
worthy rose
I know but it’s a cool theory, and blizzard already killed the coolest theory ab...
Which is?/was?
peak escarp
which one, that he's schizophrenic? or that he's got split personalities? or that he exists across multiple realities?
or that Tracer hears the music too?
worthy rose
which one, that he's schizophrenic? or that he's got split personalities? or tha...
I mean each one of those sounds interesting
mortal rock
which one, that he's schizophrenic? or that he's got split personalities? or tha...
the one where he got split across realities and that what the voices are, and potentially why he doesn’t leave talon, because another universe sigan tells him not to
worthy rose
I can kinda get the schizophrenic theory, but then again. I mean he only shows one major symptom to me which is hearing/seeing things that aren't really there. Not really enough to say he DEFINITELY has it
peak escarp
it's a bad theory because it's based on the origin trailer, which is highly stylized and not an actual representation of the hero
and the writers have explained it - Sigma's mind was fractured by the black hole
mortal rock
it's a bad theory because it's based on the origin trailer, which is highly styl...
yeah but it was a more interesting than just having him be cartoonishly crazy, which is what it really seems like he is unless i’m missing something
worthy rose
Sigma has such an amazingly small amount of lore, like Torb says in one of his voice lines, it's like trying to make a chicken from a feather
peak escarp
he is one of the newer heroes added
and was pretty much made up on the spot when they realized that the kit they made wouldn't work for Mauga
worthy rose
Man I love Sigma don't get me wrong, but I wish we got Mauga
past copper
Just a thought. I doubt it would happen, but would it be possible for the apes on the Horizon Moon Base to make an appearance? If Winston and Hammond can find a way off the moon, couldn’t the other apes (possible other animals) too
desert edge
i mean yeah, but wasn't winston the smartest?
Why have anything inferior to what we already have?
peak escarp
if Overwatch has a reason to go to the moon (and the means to get there), then they could appear again
but right now they're lacking that
the other apes were content to take over the base and claim it as their own
past copper
True. I just kinda hope something like Planet of the Apes thing happens. Good reference though
Well, maybe we would get a map of the Overwatch HQ. Wouldn’t that be interesting? Not only for game, but lore too
worthy rose
It would probably be a payload map
past copper
Possibly, but we can’t rule out Death Match Map
worthy rose
I would hope a place with so much overwatch History tied to it wouldn't get the Deathmatch treatment
peak escarp
the deathmatch treatment?
past copper
Like Kanezaka or the new upcoming map
past copper
Don’t ask me. I don’t care what kind of map it is
peak escarp
Malevento is a bit small
Deathmatch maps can be very lore heavy, like Kanezaka, Necropolis, Castillo and Chateau Guillard
past copper
I just assume deathmatch because of an artist making the HQ map in Artstation and honestly, it would have to be a deathmatch map since I don’t see how a payload would work
peak escarp
likewise, core maps can be relatively absent of lore, like Hollywood
worthy rose
But I mean,it's the headquarters of Overwatch, no way that wouldn't be a core map.
peak escarp
it was the headquarters of Overwatch
but it got blown up
the ruins would make a good deathmatch map
worthy rose
Did it have a proper name?
peak escarp
it's just called the Swiss HQ or Swiss Base
past copper
Well, I mean true, but the only maps in game that are still a core maps are Rialto and Havana.
worthy rose
it's just called the Swiss HQ or Swiss Base
At least everybody knows where to find it. No wonder it got bombed
past copper
Eh, I kinda think it was more of a military base type base not a secret superhero base
More like the Avengers base over the Justice League Watchtower
peak escarp
Well, I mean true, but the only maps in game that are still a core maps are Rial...
what?
past copper
what?
The HQ was something from the past and not present in Overwatch. It would have to be like a map that still has stuff from the before getting blown up. Or something like that, I don’t know. Depends how Blizzard would want it.
peak escarp
"the only maps in game that are still a core maps are Rialto and Havana"
past copper
They did keep the whole damage done to Max’s car on Havana, but map Rialto look untouched
peak escarp
there's 21 core maps
past copper
"the only maps in game that are still a core maps are Rialto and Havana"
I think I meant like core maps from the past of Overwatch. Not the present
past copper
Unless you also count King’s Row bc of Uprising
worthy rose
The HQ was something from the past and not present in Overwatch. It would have t...
I mean Horizon Lunar was taken over and ravaged by monkes but aside from some knocked over chairs I think?, It doesnt look like that so....who knows?
past copper
I don’t know about Horizon. Pretty sure it might be forgotten come OW2 unless they got a hero mission in store for it
worthy rose
Well good riddance,I hate that map 🤣
past copper
I’m still gonna miss Hanamura and Anubis
peak escarp
Hero missions will take place on all PvP maps, including deathmatch maps
they will probably keep 2CP maps for hero missions
but they'll get redesigned into different modes for PvP
past copper
Yeah, but I meant in QP. And sometimes Comp
worthy rose
I wonder if they will do wave/tower defense missions like junkenstein gamemode
past copper
But, I guess if that’s the price of expanding current maps into bigger maps, so be it
past copper
I wonder if they will do wave/tower defense missions like junkenstein gamemode
Hell if I know. They seem to have something planned similar to Fortnite though. I kinda hope they cut that one
The shrinking storm
peak escarp
the devs called it wall of death
worthy rose
This may just be the Bloons fan boy in me but I love tower defense type gameplay.
worthy rose
the devs called it wall of death
How poigant
peak escarp
but anyway, that's getting away from lore
the Swiss HQ would be a great location for a map though
personally I'd like Singapore as a map, just like the Doomfist origin
past copper
Yea. It would be cool to see what Overwatch was like before they got shut down
peak escarp
we do already have Gibraltar as a former Overwatch base
worthy rose
I wanna know how overwatch met the Monke
peak escarp
he probably crash landed and Overwatch was sent to investigate . . . and he somehow convinced them to let him join as a member?
past copper
I’d actually like to see where Tracer’s, Winston’s, and Genji’s recruit or training uniforms are.
worthy rose
Genji never had a training uniform, when he joined he probably looked like his blackwatch skin.
past copper
I don’t know what they are. They weren’t exactly canon until you see Tracer wearing one in the Uprising comic
worthy rose
Plus blue is definitely not his color
past copper
No. Not that uniform. The ones from Winston’s group photo and when Tracer was training with Genji in the Uprising comic
past copper
Well, it was a photo on Winston’s wall of Recall
past copper
Well, it was before the lore grew.
worthy rose
That is true Ryu, Shouldn't Genji look different as well? Like closer to his blackwatch skin?....
past copper
Still, I do think those uniforms Tracer is wearing may be for new recruits
worthy rose
They definitely have a still in training look to them
past copper
Maybe. Honestly, it seemed both Genji and Lena were new to the team. Relatively speaking.
Winston though probably moved up in the ranks, which is why he was monitoring both Tracer and Genji alongside Mercy
worthy rose
Being the smart monke he is, definitely can imagine that, especially after building something to stabilize tracers chronal displacement condition or whatever it's called
peak escarp
Tracer completed field training before Winston, yet another reason why this image is non-canon
Storm Rising was one of Winston's first missions
it's likely he was just part of the science team before asking to work in the field
worthy rose
Storm Rising was one of Winston's first missions
I would've never known, he seemed so full of confidence during it
worthy rose
it's likely he was just part of the science team before asking to work in the fi...
And then someone touched the glasses
peak escarp
Winston: I'm still getting used to this. Getting out of the lab... Being an agent in the field...
Tracer: You're doing just fine. Why, my first mission, I threw up on the train heading into the city!
Winston: You did? Oh, well, it must have been some irregularity with the flow of the chronal accelerator. Well, maybe if I go back and change the-
Tracer: Winston, that's not what I meant. You're fine.```It started as Retribution, Uprising, then Storm Rising
worthy rose
``` Tracer: You look nervous, Winston.
Winston: I'm still getting used to...
He's such a overthinker, fitting for a hyper Intelligent Monke I suppose
Wonder what Moira's reaction to a talking Ape was, as a scientist who specializes in the genetic field
peak escarp
probably curiosity
past copper
Not sure about most of these, but imagine if these became real maps
peak escarp
Galapagos would be interesting
Kyoto Temple became Hanamura
Cairo is Anubis, Iron Star is Volskaya
worthy rose
Thinking about it...Moira is probably aware of how closely related Apes and Humans are so it was probably
"Huh....I wasn't expecting that....but I was expecting not to expect that so it doesn't count"
peak escarp
the Iris became Nepal
past copper
Funny thing about Galapagos. It kinda looks like the concept for the East China Sea Omnium
worthy rose
Not sure about most of these, but imagine if these became real maps
Wow, Numbani looks hardcore in that concept art
past copper
Technically, I the India map is coming in OW2
worthy rose
And underwater map?....how would that work
peak escarp
use low gravity
past copper
I doubt you would actually fight in the water.
I mean, it’s not like you actually fly in Overwatch, yet you get on the drop ship and let Echo fly you
worthy rose
I doubt you would actually fight in the water.
Characters like Genji, Orisa and Zen would have.... complications
past copper
Overwatch had a base in Antarctica and the Omnics have one underwater in the sea
worthy rose
Maybe the east china sea omnium could be that, an Omnium map period would be awesome
past copper
An underwater map doesn’t seem unrealistic
Heck. Is there actually a map where you even go through water? If not, Monte Carlo
The pool
worthy rose
Vishkar map, seeing what the company is capable off, has the potential to be absolutely stunning, visually.
pastel dust
I'd love to play The Iris map
past copper
True. Though, I’d like to see what these maps turn into with environmental and times of day changes. Like rain, snow, sandstorms etc or night time or day
Imagine a blizzard in Nepal
past copper
Weather and times of day will really bring the maps to life
pastel dust
Yeah it will
I imagine Ilios will look beautiful at a sunset, or during the night
Playing in low light setting will be pretty interesting, unless they plan on making a way that there's still high visibility
limpid agate
I think that is best set for non-PVP gamemodes.
past copper
I don’t know. I’d imagine it would look like Necropolis at night. The only map I’ve seen through concept with this is Numbani at various times of day to night
That African Sun looks beautiful
Numbani and Hollywood
Though, I think these maps would amazing at night when these lights are on
past copper
I know, those two maps look awesome. I can’t wait to see what the others will look like at different times of day and with different weather changes
past copper
So, anyone wanna guess who Blizzard will show off next with a new design?
I’m betting on Bastion and/or Soldier: 76
compact cobalt
Bastions already been shown
past copper
Not out of concept art or what little they showed in behind the scenes. But that just means he’s got the most likely chance of being shown off along with whatever they redesigned on Soldier.
Aside from the cool beard
mortal rock
they seem to be realizing in 1 girl/1 boy releases, so I think that the omnics will be released last
peak escarp
Bastion's redesign has been shown but not officially revealed
it's not on the website
worthy rose
I'd bet on Zarya and Brig to be shown next
we've seen some of their redesign, similar to how we've seen bastion's
past copper
Yeah. The only thing I remember new with Zarya is her double bubble ability, but not a new look. Brig, don’t recall a new look at all
I only said Soldier and Bastion because they seem to have designs ready for them now. But it kinda looks like they will reveal the heroes in the story mode first, so Bastion is a definite
Though, that’s only a guess. For all I know, it could be Echo and Brigitte who’s new looks are shown.
crisp hearth
Echo probably won’t be changed that much
past copper
I kinda think they did change her. She looks slightly different from Reunion and Zero Hour
worthy rose
have we?
Im not 100% sure but I thought Zarya looked a little different during the scene where they mentioned DPS passive speed boost in OW2 and they show some characters, including Zarya.
Brig was in the Zero Hour cinematic so i'd assume that's her new look, too
past copper
Brig looks the same as she does in game. I honestly don’t know how they could change her look, especially since she and Echo looked the same as in the Demo on Rio
But, that was an early demo, so that could change. I guess. I think Zero Hour was her first use of her armor, but I don’t know. Not much backstory on Brig to be certain
Although, would it be unlikely that Brig and Echo change their appearance midway in game? When they get more serious in fighting Null Sector and Talon?
worthy rose
Who invented Biotic technology, and is it true Mercy hates it?
past copper
Mercy is the one who came up with the idea for Nanobiotics, but wanted it to be militarized. Yet it was
worthy rose
Aaaah
past copper
Such as her tech getting put into Ana’s biotic rifle
peak escarp
Mercy was against it being weaponized
rancid egret
aye doctor got that new pfp
mortal rock
Mercy is the one who came up with the idea for Nanobiotics, but wanted it to be ...
that’s the opposite of what she wanted???
like her whole thing is she hates war and wants peace
past copper
that’s the opposite of what she wanted???
My mistake. Autocorrect is a pain on my device
I didn’t even notice that
mortal rock
ah ok pain for me too I get it
past copper
Anyway, been thinking about the stuff in that new map. I kinda think it’s a new member of Talon. Possibly a council member since we don’t know who’s all on it yet
And I still say the mohawk guy from Overwatch is one of the members. We don’t know him and he seemed to at least have a connection to the people in the group photo
limpid agate
Based on what
past copper
How many characters have mohawk in Overwatch? Not counting Baptiste yet
I kinda think he was a member of Blackwatch, but we don’t know anything about him to either confirm or deny that
worthy rose
In a fictional universe like overwatch, people don't look similar unless it's for the plot, so there's a good chance that guy doesn't just...happen to look like mohawk guy....unless I am wrong, and it's for real just a coincidence
past copper
Exactly. And like I said, he could’ve been apart of Blackwatch. I recall some Blackwatch agents joined up with Talon. So this guy could’ve been one of them.
Also, am I the only one who can picture this guy’s weapon being some kind of shotgun like the Talon Elite’s
peak escarp
not just Blackwatch
recall sent to every former Overwatch agent. Someone’s trying to get the organization back together.”
“You were Overwatch?” Baptiste said, stunned. He’d never met one before. All the dreams he’d had as a
teenager, the recruitment poster he hung above his bed at the orphanage, the secret hope that somehow,
someday, Overwatch would come in and make everything better. And now one of his childhood heroes
stood before him, a man willing to throttle his country to turn a profit and betray his organization to spare his
own life.
“I was never in the field. I was just a handler, like you.” Sainclair nodded at Nguyen. “Overwatch always took
me for granted. That organization was poisoned from the very start, and the longer I was there, the more I
could see that it was slowly rotting from the inside out.”```
desert yacht
that's painful to read
past copper
That’s an example of why you should never meet your heroes
peak escarp
that's painful to read
why?
desert yacht
formatting
peak escarp
better?
past copper
Oh. That’s what he meant. Whatever, I’m still kinda right. Baptiste always wanted to meet or join Overwatch, and when he meets someone who was apart of them, turns out he wasn’t what he thought he was.
worthy rose
The fact people like Moira and I suppose this Sainclair person were apart of overwatch reveals alot of the fallen organizations flaws
past copper
Damn. Is Overwatch a reflection of Blizzard or what
desert yacht
not really overwatch members don't sexually harass women
past copper
😑just had to bring that up, didn’t ya?
I meant in the sense that both get into trouble for shit
peak escarp
you're the one who brought it up
past copper
Maybe, but I was trying to avoid that part.
I’m just glad it didn’t go the way of that forgotten game company
past copper
Lab Zero Games?
Whatever. They don’t matter
So, aside from what’s coming, anyone hoping for a specific map in OW2
desert yacht
I meant in the sense that both get into trouble for shit
i mean it's such a loose comparison that it really isn't even worth mentioning
reminds me of this
they are both bad organizations
that do bad things for bad reasons
worthy rose
It's amazing to me Moira's work went unnoticed by Overwatches higher ups for any amount of time
Exception being Reyes
past copper
Well, he saw a use for her unethical methods
peak escarp
unnoticed? Overwatch was the ones who shut her down
past copper
While Jack and the rest saw her actions as inhuman
worthy rose
unnoticed? Overwatch was the ones who shut her down
What i meant was it's weird to me it didn't happen almost Immediately
past copper
You mean while she was working for Blackwatch?
worthy rose
But then I think back to the Soilder Moira interaction, idk, it sounds like Jack knew what messed up stuff she was doing, in collaboration with Reyes but turned a blind eye-
peak escarp
I meant before Reyes recruited her: "Overwatch held back the pace of scientific discovery for decades [...] They tried to silence me."
peak escarp
But then I think back to the Soilder Moira interaction, idk, it sounds like Jack...
that's the opposite of what it sounds like
"If I had known" means he didn't know
worthy rose
I mean, fair point but Moira's response to what he said just makes it sound like he's in, denial?....gosh I love and hate ow lore, or maybe it's just Moira being Moira
peak escarp
most of Jack's career was looking the other way while Reyes did illegal things
plausible deniability, etc.
it's part of what got Jack in trouble
worthy rose
Overwatch is alot more morally gray than I thought
At least some of the people in it
past copper
Not to get off that topic, but I did notice this from Retribution.
On the one hand there, even if they did bring Antonio in, he was right. Talon would’ve pulled some strings to let him walk out a free man and Overwatch would’ve probably been slandered.
On the other hand, Reyes knew this would be the case and took justice into his own hands by killing Antonio, but unintentionally revealed Blackwatch to the world, causing the public to look down on Overwatch.
Honestly, no matter how you look at it, things would’ve gone bad for Overwatch regardless. Jack should’ve denied Reyes, but would he have even followed Jack’s orders
peak escarp
if the mission had gone to plan, Blackwatch would not have been exposed, Antonio would be captured and his Talon connections in the government exposed
worthy rose
Maybe Reyes should have let someone else kill Antonio, instead of point blanking him with a loud shotgun and sending him to Narnia
peak escarp
but it didn't go to plan - Reyes impulsively killed Antonio
past copper
A soldier letting his emotions get the better of him. It happens and almost never ends well
worthy rose
Letting your emotions control you is like trying to drive a car, that doesn't have a steering wheel, or any brakes
peak escarp
it was a very out of character moment for Reyes, who is known to plan every detail (even as Reaper)
past copper
Also, even if things did go as planned with Antonio, would you put it past Talon to do whatever they deem necessary to silence him
worthy rose
Antonio was probably behind the deaths of many overwatch agents, which led to Reyes acting out in a fit of anger and vengence, two things that would later become his lifeblood as he became Reaper.
past copper
Honestly, Talon would’ve more then likely assassinated Antonio to make sure their secrets stay safe. It wouldn’t be the first time this has happened and he was easily replaceable among the council
peak escarp
I don't think so
worthy rose
Like that one time Doomfist gave that guy the mufasa treatment in masquerade
peak escarp
Antonio had important contacts that worked with him, not Talon
if he was gone, the contacts would be gone too
past copper
Maybe. But it doesn’t look like his death hurt Talon all that much
If anything, it seems his death actually benefitted them by turning the public against Overwatch. Slowly causing the organization to crumble
worthy rose
I mean all things considered, Antonio's death kinda helped
Wow we, literally thought the same thing
past copper
Yup. Weird
arctic loom
before the accident reyes always had in mind be a bad guy?
peak escarp
no
past copper
No. He was a good guy. But Antonio’s actions that took the lives of several of his comrades just made him finally cross a line that he couldn’t come back from
peak escarp
I believe that Reyes giving in to the impulse of killing Antonio is a side effect of Moira's treatments on him - they made him more impulsive
past copper
That’s also a possibility. There’s no telling what her experiments could do to a person both physically and mentally
peak escarp
Moira's reaction in that image seems to me like a "huh, curious" kind of reaction - she wasn't expecting him to be impulsive, but it's certainly something to take note of
you can say a lot with just an arched eyebrow
peak escarp
McCree hated her
past copper
True, but it kinda seems to me like she was expecting Reyes to kill Antonio from the start.
arctic loom
well so what other option you would do in that moment?
past copper
She didn’t even flinch when he shot him. I don’t remember what Genji did, but I remember McCree trying to stop him
past copper
Well, Genji was apart of assassin’s long before joining Overwatch. Pretty sure he’s used to it
peak escarp
another thing to note, which may also be a side effect from Moira's treatments
Reyes' eyes change colour in that scene
past copper
I didn’t notice that
peak escarp
going from brown to green
past copper
Come to think of it, did he always have dark circles or bags under his eyes
peak escarp
Retribution is my favourite mission, I've seen that cutscene so many times
peak escarp
I can't wait
past copper
Yup.🤞 this Spring
arctic loom
we hoping for
past copper
No. I’m sure we will
peak escarp
and there's the McCree story arc that had to be delayed due to the rename
that should be coming in November
arctic loom
what name you would put on a cowboy?
peak escarp
idk, but I don't want it to be Joel
arctic loom
yeah is not bad
peak escarp
ideally they would just change his last name and keep Jesse, but that probably won't happen
past copper
Kinda hope it’s something like Ace or James
peak escarp
James is a good name
past copper
Hmm. Just saying this to be funny, but what about Dawn?
peak escarp
why
past copper
Eh. Deadeye Dawn 😂
peak escarp
no
arctic loom
i really hope for joel
jaunty crown
carter?
arctic loom
fits more
past copper
Joel just doesn’t sound like a cowboy name
peak escarp
but McCree already said
peak escarp
don't want to make him a liar now, do you?
past copper
I guess not, but why not just change his first name keep the last. James McCree
arctic loom
Logann
past copper
I can’t lie. McCree does kinda does look like like a Logann
Speaking of changes, what do people think of the characters revealed new designs
worthy rose
I think phara's, reaper's and the cowboy's look exactly the same
like at first glance you don't really notice any changes
same with winston
and to a lesser extent, tracer
although, I think my fav one is def widow
past copper
Huge difference in Reaper’s appearance
Same with McCree
Reaper’s and Genji’s are my fav
worthy rose
In McCree all that changes is the texture of the red robe and that he now has two knee plates instead of one
Compare that to Lucio's or Reinhardt's redesign
there were some sketches where Reaper had like silver cyborg arms
I wish they had gone with that
past copper
Firstly, if you actually look, McCree has many differences to his old design. A grown out beard, brand new poncho with a large pocket to carry whatever he wants, armor on his torso, thighs, and knees, a pouch on his belt, a new peacekeeper, and even a new shiny hand.
Ive seen that design with Reaper too
It’s not as cool and not Reaper to have something that doesn’t say stealthy if he has shiny silver on his arms. His design for OW2 is edgy and badass
Besides, if you look closely, they did give him that design. Look at the arms in the concept art and his new look
mortal rock
Speaking of changes, what do people think of the characters revealed new designs
I hate them
worthy rose
Firstly, if you actually look, McCree has many differences to his old design. A ...
the changes are wayyy too subtle
at first glance ow1 mcree and ow2 mcree look the same
and the same with winston
winston is even worse
rancid egret
i mean the point it to just show progression of time right
does it matter if changes are subtle? they’re supposed to be obviously the same character
worthy rose
yea, but look at genji
or widowmaker
or rein
its obviously they're the same character and you don't need to be a huge fan of the game to know the characters have a different design
I'm certain that if you show McCree's redesign to someone who hasn't played the game for a year, they would have no clue it was a redesign
worthy rose
Those designs look dope af but I still prefer the classic
mortal rock
I will always prefer the classics because I don’t like them looking more realistic
ivory pier
Wow the old Reaper looks much better
worthy rose
Saying the designs are to subtle seems unfair, why fix what isn't broken?. They still need to maintain the siloihette of the character so their immediately recognized. The redesigns are good for what the team was going for, there wasn't some big 2 year timeskip like in a anime or something, what was the expectation? 😂
limpid agate
The redesigns are supposed to show how the characters have evolved over time too.
Winston hasn't really evolved much.
But some of the others have by quite a bit.
Mei is wearing armor now because she is now a soldier.
Genji is wearing clothes because he is at peace with his body.
Torb is wearing a more casual blacksmithing outfit instead of armor because he is retired.
Even on Winston, he now have the Overwatch logo on his space suit instead of the horizon logo, and he has a computer on his wrist because he is now the commander of Overwatch
mortal rock
yeah it’s not like any of the redesigns don’t make logical sense, it’s just they might not all look great
valid terrace
There's also a limit on what they can change locked in by emotes and highlight intros, so McCree must have: a hat, poncho, cigar, belt buckle, and spurs
Not to mention his arm and peacekeeper being tied to his silhouette and lore
mortal rock
There's also a limit on what they can change locked in by emotes and highlight i...
well those are iconic/stereotypical cowboy things, so they weren’t gonna change it anyway
valid terrace
They literally can't without removing certain emotes or intros, every McCree skin needs those things
Except for the spurs I guess but that's tied to his walk sound, the cigar is also removable until the animation comes up I suppose
That's how it goes for all of the heroes
Especially the ones with more exposed parts like McCree, they all interact with something in a specific way that can't be altered much
Reaper just needs a cloak and his guns afaik
It's like if Zen had an animation that involved his sash, then every Zen skin would need to keep it, but afaik he doesn't have any that require it so it's on the table for bigger change
Every Bap and Moira skins need their little backpack things
limpid agate
Isn't that the point
raven sequoia
What do you mean?
limpid agate
She's supposed to be a femme fatale.
limpid agate
In what sense
raven sequoia
As in the design of her outfit
limpid agate
In what sense
limpid agate
Oh that's what you meant by flashy
raven sequoia
Yeah lol
peak escarp
I like the new looks, they look more technologically advanced
worthy rose
yeah, the new designs fit the story and scene better imo
raven sequoia
I like a few
The changes are nice and subtle in some too
Like reaper n cree
For example
Still fairly recognisable
peak escarp
I like that Mercy's new design makes her look more mature
worthy rose
I like the new looks, they look more technologically advanced
Tbh I prefer the less technologically advanced version
peak escarp
the ponytail was a bit childish for a 37 year old woman
I'm working on a cosplay of McCree's new look - hope to have it done by launch
worthy rose
oooh very nice
ive had this thought for a while
are the artists gonna make all OW1 skins into the OW2 redesign?
since its gonna be cross-play between ow1 and ow2.. im not too sure
its a lot of work
peak escarp
no
the redesigns will just be an extra skin that OW2 players unlock
OW1 players can see them, but not own them
worthy rose
do we know if OW2 will continue to get skins (events etc) in the new style to unlock, same with OW1?
peak escarp
I expect that when OW2 comes out you won't be able to buy OW1 anymore (aside from physical copies)
worthy rose
have we gotten any news about OW2 or any further storybuilding, besides the mccree thing which was planned for later in the year but delayed?
worthy rose
most likely a week or two after Junkenstein, i'd assume
peak escarp
yeah
worthy rose
last thing
do we know anything about it besides what we were told on that announcement?
"... we had planned to kick off a narrative arc in September supported with new story and game content, of which McCree was a key part. Since we want to integrate this change into that story arc, we will be delaying the new arc until later this year and instead..."
dense steppe
Sigma needs an animated short rn💥💥
peak escarp
last thing
do we know anything about it besides what we were told on that announ...
nothing else, but I'm hoping it covers the story of how he lost his arm
maybe told in flashback
worthy rose
that'd be cool
past copper
I mean, there are more subtle redesigns
For Pharah, it’s mostly because what would Blizzard had really been able to change on a hero wearing specifically designed armor?
And Sombra, is both subtle and noticeable at the same time. Personally, like that she looks cyberpunk
peak escarp
I like that they brought Overwatch white into Pharah's redesign
past copper
Yeah, that is kinda cool. Heck, I didn’t even notice until looking at someone that they also changed her hair
peak escarp
also they fixed her skintone
past copper
They’re doing that with all the characters. Giving them more shading to their skin
I actually like Sombra’s new look, because now she looks more dangerous than playful
peak escarp
yeah
worthy rose
Seems in general their giving characters more sleek, less busy designs
peak escarp
you mean translucent
past copper
Yeah. It also looks like her armor gives her more speed both on the ground and in the air
cosmic crest
Yeah, that's what I meant.
peak escarp
opaque means you can't see through it
cosmic crest
Oh right
peak escarp
yeah it's a cool detail
past copper
Even Widow looks more equipped for combat then she used to
worthy rose
I to wondererd how Pharah could see through that thing
cosmic crest
Widow's is the only one where I prefer her old look, but that's just personal preference.
Her redesign is good.
past copper
I to wondererd how Pharah could see through that thing
I always figured it was like one way glass
Also, love that Widow looks even deadlier. That’s what you want in an assassin
past copper
Gotta say though, Widow looks much better with a braid instead of just a long ponytail
raven sequoia
Yeah the braid is nice
And her helmet looks more sleek also
But her outfit and gun just feel very busy
But really and truly the redesigns do look nice, more sleek and fitting of their characteristics
past copper
It’s better than the other concept art
The first looks like something from an 80s spy movie, the second looks like Tomb Raider, the third looks like something out of a comic book
Honestly, now Widow looks like she’s adapted to fight in a war, much like Reaper
raven sequoia
Idek what they're doing with the second one
And the first lol
But I love the ponytail in the 3rd design
2nd was too short
Other than that, the 3rd one overall looks very pointy lol, not to mention, it feels too sombra with the colour gradient
She could poke an eye out
past copper
Gotta say, love Mercy’s new look. She’s one of the few that got major design changes
That white and gold just stands out so much better than it used to
rapid pivot
past copper
I kinda think the new one is to represent cutting back on wind resistance as she flies
worthy rose
A tight braid for Widow makes more sense as well, rather than a loose ponytail, less likely to get in the way
ripe garnet
Don’t like most the changes tbh
Lot of them are just texture and I prefer the older ones
Bleh
Cree is the only one that’s decent imo
past copper
Bro, they’re all more than texture
limpid agate
Lot of them are just texture and I prefer the older ones
Which ones. Can you give an example
ripe garnet
Which ones. Can you give an example
Winston, tracer
limpid agate
Neither of those are "just texture"
ripe garnet
I guess they have a new skin ?
limpid agate
They would both be legendary tier changes.
The changes to the model don't look big because its the same general design. Which is intentional, because Tracer is the mascot and Winston is the second protagonist.
But there are changes to the model on par with the rest while keeping their design looking the same.
ripe garnet
I mean I’m okay with that but like I prefer the old Winston and tracer when I compare them
Cree and maybe genji look better
With their new versions
Everything else looks whatever imo
It’s just preference lol.
limpid agate
There is a difference between preference and saying its just textures.
As that is objectively incorrect.
limpid agate
Most non-mascot characters got much larger changes while still keeping true to the design and silhouette.
Like Mei trading her coat for something more appropriate for warmer weather and armour.
ripe garnet
Skins that have been purchased from ow1 will remain so the changes don’t affect me personally
limpid agate
Or Pharah's armor upgrading to incorporate Overwatch's colours into the design beyond her classic armor
ripe garnet
Unless those get changed too
limpid agate
No, you can keep using those
Especially if you dont buy OW2, since you dont unlock the new looks
ripe garnet
I thought ow2 is just an update to ow1
limpid agate
Overwatch 1 PvP gets updated to Overwatch 2 PvP.
You still need to buy the PvE
And all the new looks come with taht
ripe garnet
Will the hero designs in a comp match look different if someone uses the base skin without having bought ow2 ?
limpid agate
Its a skin
Does an opponent who bought Pink Mercy look different to a player who didn't?
No.
ripe garnet
So they aren’t updating how heroes look they are just adding new ow2 skins that only get unlocked once you buy the game
limpid agate
Those are their new defaults that you will see in everything going forward too.
Such as OWL
arctic loom
is this real?
limpid agate
Of course
arctic loom
oh so is really coming in april
past copper
They said it was basically unfinished but the league will get it
Don’t know how to feel about that
limpid agate
That's not exactly correct
That said that OWL will be played on an early build of Overwatch 2
past copper
Eh. Whatever. I guess it doesn’t matter too much since OWL only plays COMP
Almost makes me wonder what OW2 maps will be in complete if they’re taking off 2CP.
Aside from what they revealed last behind the scenes
Love the looks of that Rio map
peak escarp
we will get a lot more news about it before then
limpid agate
There are still 7 full months between then and now
Including November which will likely bring some news
As well as the announced online event that is probably BlizzConline 2
past copper
Hopefully. That being the case, I wonder if they’ll at least do something new for coming events. I’m not asking for much, just something a little new.
Maybe have another map decorated for Halloween or Winter Wonderland
limpid agate
We will probably get some more mutators
And maybe a couple new playable characters
For Junkenstein
past copper
True. Why not have werewolf Winston as a boss?
Also, great skin and emote ideas.
Skins: Bat Mercy, Poltergeist Zenyatta, Raven Pharah
Emote: Junkrat throwing toilet paper
I really think that emote would suit Junkrat. He seems like he would love tricks over treats
Or maybe Genie Pharah. That’d probably make more sense
worthy rose
Alchemist Ana when? Also, do we have any idea of what will happen with the 2CP maps in OW2?
peak escarp
the 2CP maps will be retired from comp and QP, and their assets will be used for maps in other modes
they'll still be available to play on in custom games, arcade and Hero Missions
past copper
I rather like Genji’s first official Halloween skin. Tengu Genji is awesome
And yea. Pretty sure most of those maps will be in Hero Missions. Which I hope might have pieces of lore to them
worthy rose
nobody does
past copper
Anyone know when overwatch 2 coming out
2022 around Spring
worthy rose
guess somebody has a clue
past copper
Literally been in the news regarding the game
worthy rose
link?
past copper
It’s only an early build, but that implies the game’s release window or the least a demo
worthy rose
thats most likely similar to what they showed in the gameplay part of blizzconline
so they've had that for a while
past copper
Regardless, the fact remains that this is Activision’s way of pushing the game out faster after the recent lawsuits towards Blizzard and the sponsors for the OWL cutting ties with them.
So now Blizzard is being tasked with getting the game fixed, locked down, and out in Spring 2022. No doubt as a means of saying, get your shit together, stop the delays, and get the game done
topaz ledge
Finally
mortal rock
Anyone know when overwatch 2 coming out
before april 2022
limpid agate
before april 2022
That's incorrect.
Do not spread misinformation.
All we know is that OWL 2022 will be played on an early build of it, and that they are aiming at releasing the game in Q2 before summer fully. The OWL debut will likely be before the game is out.
limpid agate
Anyone know when overwatch 2 coming out
So to ping reply, we don't know. It will likely be sometime after April 2022, since they have emphasized that OWL will be an early build, not the released game.
mortal rock
All we know is that OWL 2022 will be played on an early build of it, and that th...
oh I heard from someone that it was announced that april 2022 was the deadline for the release, i’m sorry I did not intend to spread misinformation
limpid agate
It wasn't. Whoever told you that was misinformed
peak escarp
or was making an assumption
limpid agate
Which is worse
worthy rose
So now Blizzard is being tasked with getting the game fixed, locked down, and ou...
I'm happy they're doing this
stop sitting on the fucking game like damn