lore-discussion

[spare fox]

yeah, I get where you're coming from but I don't think it's that deep - during the spotlight when they introduced her, the writers/directors kind of handwaved her like... she's there, she exists, but she's really not that important/deep

[odd slate]

she'll probably be in the background unless they think of something that has deeper involvement with her

i just find it a bit strange

[civic lynx]

I wouldn’t be shocked if she appears as a comic relief character from crashing into shit

[odd slate]

LMFAO 😭

"that fuckin' cat"

[spare fox]

I look at it this way- a character like JPC gives the writing team some room to breathe while still satisfying the need to constantly add more heroes

[civic lynx]

All the other heroes this year seem to have some major role in the plot laid out for them

[odd slate]

fika's likely just an outlier

hm

[spare fox]

she's a character they don't need to come up with a big story arc and complex voicelines and interactions

[civic lynx]

Cat is just shutting people up who begged for the best part of 10 years for a goofy concept

[spare fox]

that too

100%

[odd slate]

ended up with a nightmare instead

[spare fox]

but now they want mama hong... give a mouse a cookie I guess

[civic lynx]

Emre also felt like just dealing with the constant begging but they were able to create an in depth storyline for him since he’s actually capable of speech

[odd slate]

mama hong would be interesting, but she's def from an outdated version of the game

her visuals would be updated im sure, but her kit would likely have to be reworked as well if original ow was a lot more violent and deathy

[hushed jetty]

if mama hong gets a visual redesign i'd love for her to be at least name dropped

[spare fox]

yeah from a phase when the game was just deciding who it was

[civic lynx]

If we got mama hong she’d basically be a new hero bc the original idea was a racist stereotype from a tv show/movie

[odd slate]

yep

[hushed jetty]

they namedropped Hivemind at some point along with some other concept art heroes

[spare fox]

or like in the background of a comic as an easter egg

[odd slate]

which ironically made me want to watch kung fu movies from back in the day

😭

a martial arts-based hero would also be really cool (pure hand to hand) but with ow that would be impossible

[civic lynx]

They’d probably have some element of her kit that is named after or references the original concept but visually she’d be something new

[odd slate]

so im happy with anran

even if her kit pisses meoff

[spare fox]

not if they keep adding flying heroes
*cries again in junkrat main

[civic lynx]

D.mon being a sword hero but she has a mech so will probably be able to fly around 🫩

[odd slate]

you dont love being airbombed by the cat??? cmoooooonnnnn its the best!!!!!

[odd slate]

most likely

she's not really a "martial arts" hero

i mean someone who utilizes tai chi, taekwondo, karate, muy thai, etc etc

but since there's always a ranged weapon, it's hard to make that work, if not outright impossible

omnic hand-to-hand fighter would be really cool

[past copper]

Also. New hero trailer might have teased a new ability ||Emre||

That ||scarf defense||

[odd slate]

maybe? i dont think theyd make that a perk

alternatively, it couldve just been a neat thing for him and not intended for the kit

[past copper]

They would if people thought he wasn't playing well as a DPS

[odd slate]

i think he's been doing pretty well considering how often i die to him 🥀

his kit is fine rn i think too

[civic lynx]

I think it could be for a perk or maybe stadium if they’re planning to add him soon

[odd slate]

primary fire, the weird secondary gun, the bomb things i think, and something else?

[civic lynx]

Vendetta barged into stadium before heroes that have been almost done since last summer

[past copper]

For a perk, throwing 3 nades instead of one as Minor Perk

[odd slate]

would they make a perk a shield though? have they done that?

[civic lynx]

Orisa has the shield instead of javelin spin

[past copper]

Yes. Orisa

[odd slate]

even with orisa's major perk she used to have that shield

[civic lynx]

But that’s the only one I can think of

[odd slate]

in her original kit

[civic lynx]

Doesn’t sym have a shield as well

[past copper]

Plus. Vendetta has a shielding ability not in perk

[odd slate]

i dont play enough sym

so i got noooo clue

[past copper]

Yes she does

She got her shield back as a perk

[civic lynx]

Again bringing back her old ability

[odd slate]

maybe that could work then

[past copper]

I would not mind if Emre had some kit changes. Mostly to his pistol

[odd slate]

just unsure of how much it would block

and for how long

likely a few seconds so it'd have to be timed accurately

would fit the theme of chernabog always wanting to upgrade emre

[past copper]

I think it kinda takes away the usefulness of his pistol if you need to button mash. You don't get that problem with other heroes

[odd slate]

that is quite annoying, yeah

[past copper]

Like, you are already locking on to a target, but you need to button mash just to shoot them with little payoff

[odd slate]

maybe kill them if they're low enough

it adds to the panic feeling that sometimes happens in close quarters

[past copper]

Maybe. But I'm just saying. The button mashing gotta change

[odd slate]

yea mashing isnt the best

[past copper]

I chalk it up to no play testing and rushing to get 5 heroes out by January

[odd slate]

hence cat's entire existence

LMFAO

i do hope the new heroes get some cool skins next season....i could see fika getting some cat species skins, and maybe some mythos related ones for the others? anran would be a shoe-in for a phoenix

[past copper]

Domina and Anran feel like they're in good spots, but Emre, Mizuki, and Cat need some nerfs and buffs

[brittle sky]

Give Fika a pug skin

[odd slate]

HELP

[odd slate]

wouldnt be surprised if the trailer was going to lead to some emre buffs like you said

maybe some stuff will come in the next season with sierra

[past copper]

Tom and Jerry. Nough said

[odd slate]

cant wait to see more stuff on sierra's lore too, esp with helix

[past copper]

I know Mizuki needs a buff to that escape ability of his. It just doesn't feel very useful right now

[odd slate]

the april fool's patch where he can bounce around three times is really fun

i like that

[past copper]

Not sure what will be the next collab either. I didn't really have interest in the last two

[odd slate]

kpdh eventually please

there would be some good options

[past copper]

Might see some Summer skins for Vendetta, Anran, Mizuki, Domina, and Venture. And of course Kiri smh

[spare fox]

lol idc if they recolor another kiri skin if it makes money for the game and in turn we keep getting lore, let them

[odd slate]

pretty much, haha

[spare fox]

note this isn't me saying they shouldn't be creative

just saying I'm not complaining about kiri skins

because - and this might be very hard to believe - some people twist words around here

[past copper]

Get ready to see recolored lifeguard

Just like they did with Pharah and Mercy

Maybe Sierra gets a Summer skin too

Looks like she would

[shrewd pivot]

I wonder how Sierra will tie into Helix lore considering in the cinematic has no Helix tag, I wonder if that's indicating lore aspects? Tomorrow in game model might answer the question

Hype to see more of her voicelines, and her animations

[odd slate]

surely there's supposed to be something

dunno why it wasnt in the trailer tho

maybe "mesa team" was the helix thing?

[past copper]

Outsourcing

[shrewd pivot]

I think they could do some dynamic highlight intros with the drone too so im excited to see the animations for those

[shrewd pivot]

I think they said a motion comic will happen next season, I presume something similar to prior heroes motion comics exploring the lore

[odd slate]

perhaps

[past copper]

Hmm. Invincible collab. I can see Doomfist as Conquest

[meager geyser]

Vendetta Rumi
Mira Ash (B.O.B. Bobby)
Zoey Kirko (Fox Derpy)

[meager geyser]

I'd like to get Dispatch collab

[swift trout]

Godsdamnit K-Pop Demon Hunters will not leave me

[vocal cedar]

Darm 2079? Im like 78 years old .

Im really old

[shrewd pivot]

I presume you meant to reply to my prior comment haha, but ye 2079 is my best guess,
it's pretty interesting to think some of the overwatch roster are Zoomers haha

[peak escarp]

if i live that long I'd be 92

[languid nacelle]

sierras drone is named dorothy (doROTHy)

what is the acronym though?

[spare fox]

omg I'm younger than Doc? (by only a year but still I always thought I was the old outlier)

[peak escarp]

nah I'm the old auntie of the group

[proud thistle]

Overwatch theory: Kiriko isn’t 21. She’s just lying about her age

[peak escarp]

[proud thistle]

How else do you explain her somehow being childhood friends with Genji and Hanzo

[brittle sky]

Side note: sierra's va is 28. No way the char is cracking 30.

[peak escarp]

I thought I saw wrinkles on her face, then I realized they're probably scars... and since it was outsourced they probably won't appear on her in-game model

[spare fox]

Not all VAs are similar age to their characters. Wasnt LW's VA ~10years younger than LW when he started?

BUT I do agree, she sounds young

I mean, Sierra IS rank of captain right? So she's probably not 18

Yeah I thought they were wrinkles at first too but just scuffs

27-30 years per Google ai answer

And the data pad in powder keg really glazed on her so... she's possibly a bit younger and a prodigy

[digital linden]

my guess is she’s 25, just seems like a decent middle ground

[peak escarp]

that still seems too young

I'll be disappointed if she's not early 30s

[shrewd pivot]

My guess is late 20s?

Genai is not reliable, it's a statistics machine, best to use actual websites as sources bc genai can get things wildly wrong or create nonsense info out of thin air.
Edit: never use genai, it's slop

https://usafacts.org/articles/how-many-people-are-in-the-us-military-a-demographic-overview/

Just a quick search, can't find anything specific about average Captain rank ages, just active officers and general age ranges allowed for enlisting.

Sierra could easily be early 30s too imo

I feel like she could veer a few years either or between the omnic crisis 28 years ago.

Her release is soon anyhow, so we will know by then.

We have Emre as a young military prodigy already, along with many others being advanced despite youth, so it's hard to make a real call imo

[spare fox]

Relax I'm not using genai for serious research, it's to brainstorm on a discord about a fictional character's age in a totally fictional job in a soft sci-fi video game, it's not that serious just to get a ballpark estimate for a reasonable age for someone who reaches captain rank

[brittle sky]

I mean when was the last characters they made older than absolutely required by their role or the timeline?

[odd slate]

i still feel like sierra is late 20s-early 30s

just the vibes i get

[spare fox]

What does this mean? They're not out to make characters as young as possible
OW heroes skewed a bit older bc most of them are from the crisis to the golden age with only a few younger characters

Post OW2, they're bringing in more "new blood" and new stories to the universe which makes sense

[spare fox]

OW over half the human heroes were over the age of 35:

Vs. OW2 humans:

[brittle sky]

I'm sorry, you think 50%+ being over 35 is a huge skew towards the olds?

[spare fox]

it's a skew, yes

[brittle sky]

Over 35 is multiple huge age groups

[spare fox]

which makes sense because OW focused on heroes mostly around during the crisis and the golden age

[brittle sky]

And like, the under 30s were at 7 on release, versus 5 over 40! (on release)

[spare fox]

I'm not talking about on release, I'm talking about the invisible line between OW1 and OW2, since OW2 is now the present

you seem to think I'm saying that 1- 35 is old and 2- there shouldn't be as many older characters

my point is that the human heroes in OW1 introduced a lot of heroes that were already heroes - DVa, Lucio being brand new heroes were outliers
OW2 picks up where the older established heroes were basically already there (Emre and Mauga being the outliers here), now new adults are being introduced so it makes sense that they'd be younger as that's when their stories are starting

[brittle sky]

I think there was more characters south of 30 than north of 40 on release, making the perception of it being dominated by olds pretty unfounded.

[spare fox]

again, I'm not talking about release and again, I'm not saying it was "dominated by olds"

and I'm also not considering non-human characters because when talking about age, it gets weird with them

[brittle sky]

alright, brace for impact, breaking down the basis of the whole 'ow2 consistently deflates character ages to the bare minimum, if not beyond'

[spare fox]

yeah what do you mean their ages are deflated?

[brittle sky]

If you're telling characters at only one of any part of the human spectrum, it limits the kind of stories you're telling, and that's absolutely occurred with ow2. OW1 had some oldsters, but they had plenty of 'new generation' characters like dva and lucio in the mix as well. like of the original 21, cutting omnics because they'd deflate the age and don't have a human-like life cycle, we have 7 characters under 30, and 5 characters over 40. It really wasn't particularly skewed.

Compare that to Ow2. Of the 18 released, Ram and JPC have nonhuman life cycles, let's set those aside. Sojourn and Mauga were existing characters who had hard obligations to the timeline or to other characters - Sojourn had to be a soldier in the crisis, Mauga had to be a peer to Baptiste - so okay, that's how we get 50s and mid to late 30s (and even then Sojourn's age was low balled at first until they realized they would make her sister do a teen pregnancy). Lifeweaver as well is meant to be a peer to Sym, who is 30 by ow2, so he gets low 30s.

JQ is a warlord who had a career as a wasteland scrapper, then a grand rise in the pits of junkertown, then 10 years of rule of junkertown. That's someone with a full life, she could very credibly be 40s to 50s. She's 31. She did her whole legendary wastelander and gladiatorial rise, and her usurpation of her whole society, by 21.

Kiriko's age has been overly talked about, won't get into it too much, but the 16+ year gap with the shimadas did weaken early insistence of her as a peer, and also means she was all of ~10 when the whole shimadas fell. You could have easily had an older, closer to credible peer filling that role. Hell, you could have had aza - a vassal and tutor of the shimadas put in dire straits - as the character picking up the pieces of the fall of the shimada.

Illari, 18 and still reigning youngest. Young scion who never really got to enter the society she trained to be in, arguably works, though you could do all sorts of versions of 'last survivor carrying the burdens of her otherwise vanished order'. Again, it's not that they can never do young characters, just that it's weird and creatively limiting that they seem to always push them as young as possible.

Venture, 26. Meant to be part of a society of researchers, in a field that usually takes ~30 years to get through all the schooling to be a fully trained professional. Instead, they're like, and assistant, but not to anyone specifically? Just kinda a 20 something that hangs around and helps out, rather than a full archeologist.

Juno, 19. Rather than make a character out of the person with a direct personal connection to a cast member (jiayi), they instead make it her daughter, resulting in a thing where the super illegal secret martian colony also just had two members who... decided to be massively irresponsible and have a kid in 40% gravity on an illegal space colony. Like the amount of risk they inherently subject Juno to is weird as soon as you think about it, for no clear reason. So now we have another teenager shouldering the burden of her vanished society, stepping into the shoes of her forebearers, and naive to the world stage. Just making her older would have sidestepped all the very apparent moral implications, and made more sense for an astronaut characters.

Hazard, a punk rebel who suffers massive injuries. Easily could have been a vet of the phreaks with old injuries from the crisis (which would make his relationship with suzie all the sweeter), maybe even someone old enough to ahve tussled with og overwatch in their heyday. Nah, make him 24, because young punk.

Freja is 34, our oldest age on a character where their hand wasn't forced. Except it kind of was, both because she needed to be a vet of overwatch, and because they're clearly coding her as having romantic attachments to a 45 year old guy. So hey, old enough to be a semi-established adult, though again making her older could give her more experience, let them articulate her as embittered, canny, and ruthless better.

Wuyang, 19, his story is purely struggling under parental expectations.

Vendetta, meant to be the next big bad we take seriously. Has a tie to Antonio, but he easily could have had adult children, and she's meant to have built a whole like gladiatorial empire starting around 10 years ago. Nah, 29, so she did that whole rise to power at 19, and she's now in charge of a whole huge organization that is across the board older than her. Again, we see them push credibility as soon as you think about the timeline to scrape by as much as possible.

Anran, 22, meant to be a peer of Wuyang (though even then you could have mad her loom larger and emphasized her responsibility to him by widening the gap there)

Domina, meant to be part of a c suite of a company and also have 'mommy vibes'. That's a level of experience that fits middle age to a t. She's all of 32.

Emre. He's meant to be their very first recruit after the end of the crisis ~25 years ago. He could so easily be a peer of the 50-60 gen, and we know that because he was on a mission with the team 25 years ago before Brig was born, he must be mid 40s at least. They had him at 44, meaning he was recruited at 19. A man that was legally fighting for a year is the first recruit for the elite soldier squad, rather than anyone with veterancy in the global crisis that just got done.

Every time we see them strain credulity to push their characters as young as physically possible. They choose to follow the path and arc of heroes that justifies getting the youngest version possible, while avoiding any version of a story where it would make sense to have someone even at modest middle age (especially if that means picking a middle aged woman).

[spare fox]

my dude you are acting like they're going "yeah this character is 41 buuuuuut let's make them 19"

[brittle sky]

Whenever they can choose versions of a story that can fill the role with someone very young vs. someone even just at an experienced adult age, much less anyone middle aged or older, they have chosen the young version. Every time they sketch out a character's backstory, they have had them accomplish things at a very young age, often to the absolute minimum of squeezing their accomplishments into their adult lifetimes, and ignoring the time they would need to build power, expertise, or accreditation. Sometimes they've gone so far as to low ball it into territory where the timeline doesn't make sense, in the name of keeping them at a young age. This has been consistent, even constant, in the age of ow2, and the heavy concentration on young characters has meant they have gone for samey choices on characterization and position.

[peak escarp]

Domina absolutely should be older

[brittle sky]

I mean... there's nothing stopping them from making any character whatever age. Any character who was 19 they could have instead designed to be 41 - not as exactly the same version, but an equally viable version of that character. Multiple examples I listed they clearly invented a whole new character to make a 19-20 year old daughte rather than a preestablished woman over 35.

Certain ages lend themselves to certain stories absolutely, and there are valuable perspectives and stories to be told with young characters or the next generation. But they have sought that angle ever single time in a way that feels more boring than if they varied it, and it seems like rather than something that serves the story or setting it's either a shortcoming of their imagination or a means of guarenteeing characters who can produce marketable skins.

[runic mauve]

Im surprised hazard is younger than 25

[peak escarp]

also timeline stuff means that Hazard enlisted and had an Overwatch dropship crash into his flat as soon as he was old enough to join the army

[brittle sky]

I mean 'everything happened as soon as they were old enough to join the army' holds true for Haz, Tracer, Emre...

[peak escarp]

for Tracer it works thematically (always in a rush to do things) but the other two should be older

[brittle sky]

Like I'm not saying you can never have a character be young or have a brisk timeline. But the fact it must always be so (without exception, at least in the ow2 era) is what makes the decision frustrating and creatively limiting.

[peak escarp]

there's plenty of OW2 heroes I would say should be older... I can't think of any OW1 heroes I would make older

[spare fox]

samey? what?
God I'm not going to go into your huge wall of text but
JQ - the omnium exploded 20 years ago, she'd have to have a completely different story for her to be an older character
Kiri - dead horse, don't really care, it's not that much of a difference. Asa would have been just another Shimada but without the "fallen" part of the story - kind of boring. Kiriko is stepping up as a hero despite being the underdog, despite it being illegal and dangerous. That's what makes her a hero - and more interesting than Asa
Venture - idk where you're getting the whole "needs 30 years of schooling" like, they're researching digs?
Juno, again like Kiriko, they're taking the more interesting story. Juno didn't sign up to be a hero, but her family believes in her and relies on her. Again, much more interesting than Jiayi
Hazard- he's the kid of crisis soldiers, he's going to be young- we already have the old injured veteran characters who took totally different paths - it would be redundant
Freja - again, she joined bc her mom was a diplomat during the crisis, but also had the falling out w Overwatch at a young age, forcing her hand into bounty hunting
Vendetta WAS an adult when Antonio died - 19, that's when she started her 10-year rise to power. It didn't come all at once when she was 19 - she had nothing at 19
Anran - she still needed to be in school of Wuyang, both of them are the "newbies"
Domina I can understand her age like- she's a nepo baby but also under the pressures of having to be perfect both for the family and the company, like I guess she could be older but I think 32 is old enough to have been "gifted" the high position from nepotism - she didn't get there through skill, all her abilities are stolen/apropriated from others

[brittle sky]

I think you could argue mercy and maybe mei could be older without much harm (allows mei to be an established researcher rather than just out of her doctorate, lets mercy be like an actual established researcher overwatch pulls in rather than a teen prodigy), though I think that's less urgent than most ow2 examples.

[spare fox]

PLUS with younger characters, it gives more story opportunities for down the line, if there's another time skip
Adding an old character = fewer fighting years left in them

[peak escarp]

they don't need to be 60+

[spare fox]

I'm not saying that either

but a hero who is 40 has fewer fighting years than a hero who is 20

[peak escarp]

well they're probably not going to do massive timeskips

so a 40-something hero isn't going to be at risk of old age problems

[spare fox]

but creating new heroes who are older limits the possibilities of future timeskips

[peak escarp]

then they can retire like Torbjorn (and still manage to be part of the story)

[spare fox]

ok but why introduce a brand new hero in 2026 who is 55 (like Torb) just to have to "retire" them in a few years?

from the story

[peak escarp]

because they have a story to tell in 2026

[brittle sky]

The game appears to be moving its story forward at a rate of... what, 1 year for every 5 in game years? By the time a 55 year old character is like, 65, it will be the actual year overwatch is set in.

[spare fox]

that's not a rule or anything

[brittle sky]

It's also not a rule they ever acknowledge forward progress of time in such a way characters age ever again.

[peak escarp]

timeskip is just as likely as no timeskip

[brittle sky]

Like, the genre it's mostly based on have kept their heroes in around the same ten years of their life for.... 80 years.

[spare fox]

I'm saying that we already have our established veteran heroes in the mix - not that they can't add more veterans - but having younger heroes just starting out under those veterans is what makes the story interesting
Like in Undivided - Juno doesn't want to hurt the Talon grunts. A valid point, but then Ana the veteran comes in and tells her the hard truth

and introducing old characters does require more flashback storytelling. Not that that can't be interesting but the writers would need to account for where the 40-year old hero was the last 20 years during post-crisis/golden age. Possible, but the story is moving forward at this point

[brittle sky]

we already have established neophyte characters in the mix.

[spare fox]

ok but neophytes don't stay neophytes for very long

Tracer was a neophyte, then Dva and Lucio, then Juno (who still is) and now Wuyang/Anran

and they have played with the veteran heroes learning, too

Torb and Reinhardt learning to accept and befriend omnics/Bastion

like, that's interesting too - again I'm not arguing that there shouldn't be older heroes

just that it makes sense that there are new additions of young adult heroes and that more young adults would be joining the fight now vs adults who already have established lives (again, they'd have to explain why they weren't in the fight up until recently)

[brittle sky]

I mean, there's a pretty obvious reason why any number of people weren't in the fight until now

ow was disbanded, and is still very illegal, and there have been some pretty huge global crises that kept most people busy

presumably there is any number of people who were reacting to the null crisis or whatever else and we just don't see it.

[spare fox]

yes, and they did get into that
Sigma and Doomfist were imprisoned
Baptiste is a defector so that sparks a new story for him
Freja didn't want anything to do with Overwatch and was happy as a bounty hunter
Emre taken over by the AI

[brittle sky]

I'm off to bed, but I will end that the notion that the most interesting version of every character was always the young version they chose, or that the timeline requires all of them to be as young as they are feels thin and to me unconvincing. I think there are multiple examples of characters who strain their timelines to insist they are as young as they are, and of those who can work individually they would have been better served mixing up the ages so we get a wider variety of character perspectives, veterancies, life stage, and dynamics in more recent waves of heroes. You clearly disagree in some ways, and you're allowed to.

[spare fox]

again, you're acting like they're concepting characters and actively decide on making a hero 45 y/o but "ohhh no we need younger because we're biased like that so let's make them 22"
They're coming up with heroes based on many many different concepts, not just the story. Younger people are more active, more likely to put their lives on hold to take up a fight
Older characters - especially soldier characters who were in a war - yes they still take up the fight in many ways (we have examples in the cast) - but they also retire, turn in their guns, go into hiding, and even die it makes sense that there would be fewer of them, especially since OW1 basically laid the groundwork as it is

I want to reiterate that I'm not saying there shouldn't be older characters added, I'm saying it makes sense to add more young heroes NOW, especially since the groundwork story is established and all the ongoing overarching stories are rolling, in order to get NEW stories into the mix, new adults getting stakes in the story VS how many young characters we got pre-2022

it's more that OW1 had a lack of "newbie" heroes and it made sense then (Dva and Lucio being outliers), and now in current time we're getting more young adults added and that makes sense too- Emre, Mauga being outliers now - that's my point

[languid nacelle]

what does the roth in dorothy stand for?

sierra obviously added the do and y herself, so what do the other letters mean?

[shrewd pivot]

Unsure, but we will probably have that revealed by next season :)

[shrewd pivot]

Nah, using a genai statistics machine as an internet browser is not a reasonable habit, arguably even an unsafe habit if it's ever used for more serious things like info about food etc, as it can give wildly incorrect info. (Seriously)

If not for your information, anyone else in the server should be informed that using genai ai summaries is not reliable.

See, I def can shame genai slop use being dismissed as not a big deal. Don't make excuses. If you want to brainstorm, actually use your brain and don't rely on statistics machines to support your fandom engagements.

Edit: the thumbs down emoji doesn't change the fact using genai like that is bad habit and cringe

Anyways.
I do think Sierra having "doROTHy" is a fun thing, I am also interested in seeing what it stands for

[languid nacelle]

maybe the h stands for helix?

i know thtas very weak, but thats all i got

wrong letters but sounds like something they would call it 👍

[shrewd pivot]

Oh im brainfried rn (bad sleep) MB LOL

Let's try that again LOL

[languid nacelle]

reconnisance oversight topography helidrone

[shrewd pivot]

Remote Operated Technology Hoverdrone is all my brainfried self can imagine haha

[languid nacelle]

im guessing that sierra has modified it and its original use was for landscape surveying

[shrewd pivot]

Ooo nice

[shrewd pivot]

That would be fun!

It would be cool if she was a tinkerer as well :D

[vocal cedar]

Im quite sad as Malaysian, because Malaysia have not make any appearance in Overwatch. We have Echo's Creater called Dr . Liao from Singapore, We have Life weaver form Thailand.

[languid nacelle]

i would love it if she had interactions with torb as a fellow tinkerer

[vocal cedar]

Singapore and Thailand already have their Spotlight in the Overwatch Universe. But Malaysia we have nothing

[languid nacelle]

it may come in the future

[shrewd pivot]

Maybe one day! With year long arcs, I expect next years to have new areas explored.

I don't recall Malaysia within lore, but that doesn't mean it won't happen one day :)

[proud thistle]

So I’m working on a custom magic the gathering set for Overwatch
Do you think it would make sense to have multiple cards for characters who have switched allegiances, like Soldier: 76 and Freja?

[languid nacelle]

🤯

gib

[proud thistle]

Join me on the custom magic server

[shrewd pivot]

I hope someone can answer you! Idk how the game works unfortunately

[languid nacelle]

i only really play lorcana, but if magic had ow i would learn

[proud thistle]

that’s crazy 🐢

[languid nacelle]

@spare fox do you have any theories about the dorothy acronym? you seem pretty accurate with your theories

[spare fox]

Nope, I'm more interested in the serum and why OW is getting involved with Helix, tbh

[languid nacelle]

yeah thats fair

the serum is probably for vendettas gladiators

[vocal cedar]

Im gonna be honest We Malaysian is more like a Jungle and Tree people than Technology

It won't fit in overwatch universe

[spare fox]

To me, as it stands the fact she drew the extra letters around ROTH is more interesting as a bit of character illustration than what the letters stand for

[languid nacelle]

true. methinks that she is a tinkerer. maybe not torb level, but still smart enough to modify the drone a bit

[vocal cedar]

And the if Malaysian Hero is introduced he must be a Malay , because in Malaysia we have Chinese, Indian and Malay in Malaysia. Ans we already have Chinese and Indian , so Malay is introduced

[shrewd pivot]

Hey that's not true imo! I think Malaysia can fit in overwatch's future. Countries with rural areas or big city areas, overwatch can have the globe because it is set on earth in the future :)

[languid nacelle]

yeah good point. watchpoint grand mesa is literally in the middle of nowhere

but this also brings up the point, does ow plan to have a hero for every country? we gonna get places like vietnam, qtar, iraq, etc.

i feel dumb that i only thought of places with big wars in us history

[proud thistle]

Heck, are the geopolitics even the same as right now?

[languid nacelle]

ukraine

ooh, what do you suppose they did about chernobyl in the ow universe?

[proud thistle]

Probably still going

[shrewd pivot]

I personally like to see general cultural areas represented bc i know not every country can be on the roster, ie, I am fine if we never get a Greek hero bc the general cultural area has been explored.

I don't think overwatch will touch certain countries due to political situations, ie North Korea etc.

I don't think Zarya's lore has been touched due to the current irl conflicts

[proud thistle]

I agree with this take

Nation states are made up anyway

[languid nacelle]

wonder if their tech will be advanced enough to safely clean up nuclear disasters

[shrewd pivot]

With overwatch optumistic scifi future, maybe they managed to atleast contain the contamination maybe? It's speculation tho ofc

[languid nacelle]

yeah, but still

still mildly sad that in game emre cant block with his scarves

[shrewd pivot]

Based on the Australian Outback omnium contamination, it's probably still a thing tbf

[languid nacelle]

oh yeah, junkertown is highly irradiated i forgor

[shrewd pivot]

Oh I laughed when I saw that, very camp

I assumed the cables were, yknow, cables. But ig this meams they are armor

[proud thistle]

Australia is in general

[shrewd pivot]

Just the outback mainly actually! The other side's cities seem to be the usual overwatchy scifi city stuff

[vocal cedar]

Can i ask can Omnic have children?

[languid nacelle]

its been bugging me but is that greivous?

[proud thistle]

They’re built, not born

[languid nacelle]

i think they kinda do like how it works in murder drones

[shrewd pivot]

No. Aurora created the awakening, it was a one time event. Ramattra mentions awakened omnics are a "finite generation" meaning no more can be created

[vocal cedar]

I mean Aurora kinda sacrificed herself to give all other Omnic become sentient

[languid nacelle]

yeah

[vocal cedar]

So no Omnic will be created?

[languid nacelle]

but what is orisa then?

[shrewd pivot]

Hello there!
Yeah a friend drew me a grievous with a pikmin sprout lol

[vocal cedar]

Or any Robot after The awakening will be not sentient?

[languid nacelle]

but then how did efi give orisa consciousness?

[shrewd pivot]

Orisa is not an awakened omnic.

There's debate ofc, but based on Efi in the novel tweaking Orisa's personality module etc I would argue Orisa is not a sapient robot. I think of Orisa like baymax kinda

[vocal cedar]

Oh mine , i do love to have Omnic as my companion. They seems kinda cute

[languid nacelle]

ohhh

like bob

[vocal cedar]

Is BOB sentient ?

[shrewd pivot]

No, Bob is awakened!

[languid nacelle]

wait whaaaaa

[vocal cedar]

Darm this make me love him more

His kinda interesting

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah BOB is awakened and sapient. He just doesn't speak. In Ashe's novel, he leaves and returns, implying he had the Awakening

[languid nacelle]

yeah, like what is the original purpose of bobs model

[vocal cedar]

His cute like gentle giant

BOB

Big Omnic Butler?

[languid nacelle]

the wrist cannons werent standard, mcree said "bobs got himself some upgrades"

[shrewd pivot]

Big Omnic Butler, BOB.
He is more parent to Ashe than Ashe's bio parents were

[languid nacelle]

back when he was mcree

[languid nacelle]

wow thats plain lol

[vocal cedar]

Anyway im kinda new in Overwatch univers

[shrewd pivot]

It's camp, southern "Big Omnic Butler" is goofy fun yeah haha

[languid nacelle]

scary thoughts: most of the crisis heroes are gen z/a

[shrewd pivot]

I recommend reading the new overwatch webtoon, it's a decent introduction because Juno, who is new to overwatch, leads readers to learn along side her POV :)

I recommend watching the 3d cinematics too!

[vocal cedar]

Okey

I watching now

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah overwatch 1 is maybe 2077 with overwatch 2 being maybe 2079, my best guess

[vocal cedar]

Man Overwatch have a lot of cinematic

[languid nacelle]

that means that reinhardt is out here somewhere

[vocal cedar]

Finished the Genesis part 1-3

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah! Dragons is a very loved cinematic by the fans

[vocal cedar]

Yes his is in Germany

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah! That's a good lore explanation.

The omnic crisis occured 28 years ago, and ended 26 years ago according to the PVE codex

[languid nacelle]

i really liked honor and glory

[shrewd pivot]

My favorite is Bastion's :)

[languid nacelle]

SAME

[vocal cedar]

Im kinda getting emotional and tears after watching that

[languid nacelle]

i also cried when i watched meis

[vocal cedar]

Which is a minute before

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah, the Genesis series was the first time we saw visually animated just how scary the omnic crisis was globally. The Bastion-style units attacking a public beach was very potent imagery imo

Aurora's sacrifice too was a very memorable scene

[languid nacelle]

junkrats is by far the most funny

[shrewd pivot]

For sure, slapstick cartoon core

[languid nacelle]

theres*** two*** things that solve every problem

(holds up three)

[flint thicket]

I hope we get that as a movie for theaters. One of the most core lore.

[thorn moss]

Fun detail is that when Dva or cat is hit by a sleep dart they don’t actually sleep and instead wrestle for control of their vehicles

[spare fox]

Genesis and all were fine but I personally am tired of the Crisis-Golden Age era. I'm ready for them to trek into what's going on now and follow those stories currently ongoing

which, tbf a lot of them are continuations and consequences of events that happened during those eras, but I'd rather the current stories like Undivided and the lore we've been getting this year

[wooden drift]

I dunno, I would prefer to have a movie about overwatch's fall

Because most of it was just telling what happened without showing, which is kinda lame

[vocal cedar]

Who is sombra' s friend? That most powerful women in Russia.

[brittle sky]

Katya

Volskaya

[vocal cedar]

So is she gonna be a hero ?

[brittle sky]

absolutely not

[thorn moss]

Volskya

[vocal cedar]

Why does sombra wanna be her friend

[brittle sky]

She's a russian oligarch waging a protracted war of attrition with at least some of the circumstances around it being lies. They ain't touching that with a ten foot pole.

[thorn moss]

She blackmailed her with incriminating images

[thorn moss]

This

Sombra knows it’s fake and that she’s using it as an excuse to build up her technology

[brittle sky]

Yeah blackmails her in hopes to get information. Of course volskaya's response is to sic zarya on her to threaten her back with like, evidence Volskaya doxxed Sombra, so who knows how well it stuck.

[vocal cedar]

So is sombra is going to be friend with Domina ?

[brittle sky]

I mean the real incriminating thing is she's getting some of her tech from omnics, which would not go well given how russia very much has propogandized the cyberian conflict as a continuation of the omnic crisis and has pretty deep running anti-omnic sentiments.

[vocal cedar]

Since Domina is the CEO of the Viska coop

[brittle sky]

no evidence they've even interacted

[thorn moss]

Being friendly with what people think is the enemy is definitely incriminating

[vocal cedar]

The Headlight is also technology that she needed

I see i understand now

[thorn moss]

Did you know some characters actually don’t sleep when hit by the sleep dart

[vocal cedar]

Now im watching Winston's cinematic, noticed he can play Hearthstone with his feet .

Thats funny lol

[thorn moss]

Winston would be a master piano player

[peak escarp]

Domina is the Vice President of Operations and Development, and the heiress of Vishkar's founder Vishwakarma Bhatt

[vocal cedar]

Okey im done watching all cinematic untill 2026

So , reaper, sombra ans widowmaker quit Talon ?

And Sword Lady killed Doomfist and became the Boss of Talon ?

Anyway I don't like that Sword Lady

[flint thicket]

Another good movie idea. Like i mentioned before, I see a full-length theatrical movie focusing on kiriko and mizuki trying to survive in Tokyo while being hunted down by thr hashimoto. Kiriko for being a thorn and mizuki for betraying them.

[brittle sky]

finding vendetta not (yet) a credible or compelling antagonist is a pretty common sentiment.

Though doomfist is almost definitely not dead

[languid nacelle]

good job on that, youve pretty much got it right

[odd slate]

honestly seems the type to have work done if they did so

[south torrent]

SHE SAYS BLESS YOUR HEART 😭

[odd slate]

lmao??

anyway uhhh idrm if we get older or younger heroes

i jus like new content

[south torrent]

The new hero gameplay trailer

[spare fox]

S2 is named Summit

[shrewd pivot]

Huh! She seems pretty youthful in personality and voice lines in the gameplay trailer compared to the cinematic, my guess is that she is 20s?
https://youtu.be/gojQHSdKxHI?si=kiADYEZv3O_FOuAZ

[languid nacelle]

oh she is gonna be SO fun

[south torrent]

Shes amazing

[spare fox]

yeah, just the mobility creep is absolutely going to be a thing, non-hitscan/non-ultramobile heroes taking another hit... but that's not lore so

[odd slate]

dammitttt i missed the gameplay trailer

lemme see here

omg that autohit is gonna be a painnnn

and the drone bit

but she still looks fun

cant wait to see her in every match when she releases

[shrewd pivot]

Im ngl i could defend Juno as a support getting an auto aim damage, but a dps with high mobility getting auto aim damage...? Yeah it seems like it won't be fun to play against

I do like her animations tho

[odd slate]

her animations look baller

the "bless your heart" took me straight back to my old town of 9 years tho...

so her season is named summit

makes sense

she does sound a lot younger than the cinematic....hm

[shrewd pivot]

She's much more cutsie wootsie compared to the cinematic, but I do find it really nice to get some high femme rep for her :)

[odd slate]

maybe an inflection change?

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah her lines read more like 20s in game, while cinematic could be late twenties maybe early 30s

[odd slate]

i was def thinking early 30s

[shrewd pivot]

For sure the voice direction feels different

[languid nacelle]

backcapping is about to become a MASSIVE problem

[odd slate]

i was about to say

a bit worried about that now

we already have to deal with people like sombra and reaper

and now we have her too? oh dear

[shrewd pivot]

I kind of got a younger vibe from her design bc of the midriff outfit so ig she was just serious mode in her cinematic

[odd slate]

ig 😭

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah the high mobility drone + auto aim damage is a bit much.

[odd slate]

it doesnt seem like the auto aim is the ult either

it looks to be a secondary

[languid nacelle]

what do you think her perks will be like?

[odd slate]

since the dorothy carpet bomb is the ult

[shrewd pivot]

I would think auto aim damage on dps would remain an ult, or atleast a lower mobility hero

[odd slate]

minior:

• can latch onto dorothy from longer away and drop from her faster
• something that changes the bomb to be smaller and do less damage but have more readius, perhaps?

major:

• something that lowers the number of auto damage bullets but heightens the damage
• something with the ult? idk

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah it is, a secondary fire shot tags a target that can be autofired with main fire.

Emre faced that in the cinematic

[languid nacelle]

the helix shot pattern is pretty neat though

[odd slate]

i have a really strong feeling they're gonna make the auto-aim even worse with a perk though

[shrewd pivot]

It is! I think the Helix motif in her design is cool

[odd slate]

supp mains like me are not gonna see the light of day

and that's really...rough, too, for mercy mains, since she can auto-lock

[languid nacelle]

she will wreck tank

[odd slate]

so GA isn't going to be much help for much longer

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah like. I get she has to secondary fire tag a target, but that's real cheese bc she can get high ground easily to get easy tag shots

[languid nacelle]

ooh, she can counter cat though!

[wooden drift]

That's kinda normal, some characters act completely different in game than cinematic like kiriko and junker queen

[languid nacelle]

who wins in a fight? cat ult or dorothy?

[odd slate]

if you time dorothy right, dorothy

[shrewd pivot]

Ye! Not saying it's bad for Sierra, just noting she was probably just serious mode in the cinematic

[odd slate]

i wouldnt be surprised if you could launch dorothy and use her to get out of the grip as well

[shrewd pivot]

Kiriko ult + Sierra or Mercy Pocket + Sierra 😭

[odd slate]

STOPPPPPP

OH MY GODDDD

[shrewd pivot]

Actually Mercy and Sierra might be oppressive--

Anywhoo that's not lore pardon

[odd slate]

quaking in fear ough this is gonna be a game shaker

[languid nacelle]

this will be very screwy the first couple days

[odd slate]

its also

really REALLY funny

she's so mobile in the gameplay trailer

but the cinematic had her wrapped up by a bola immediately 😭

[languid nacelle]

that is funny haha

the trailer did her dirty

[wooden drift]

Sneak attack, doesn't count

[civic lynx]

Sierra’s perks have been revealed

[languid nacelle]

does her shooting start slow and then speed up like the tempest from war robots?

[odd slate]

MINOR PERK DOES INCREASE THE HOOK LENGTH I WAS RIGHT

[civic lynx]

Doesnt seem like it

[odd slate]

AND THE AUTO SHOT IS BOOSTED

[civic lynx]

They just get more accurate

[languid nacelle]

so kind of similar

this will be very bad to go against

[shrewd pivot]

A look at her hairstyle design, it's in a Helix shape which is interesting, and I think the pink gradient was handled well

[languid nacelle]

that it is. huh

[shrewd pivot]

I am a bit confused tho about it (besides aiming to create an iconic design ofc) it's so long and braided im guessing it's extensions

[languid nacelle]

rapunzel over here

[odd slate]

she could also have hair naturally that long

low chance but ow does have science stuff

and i used to have hair so long i sat on it

[wise rover]

Its really cool tho either way

[languid nacelle]

yeah it is.

[shrewd pivot]

Maybe? The braids being undone would easily be double the current length, I will presume it's extensions (maybe relates to her pink tech even), and ye it looks nice in game!

[languid nacelle]

so hers is like the finished version of what soldier has then?

the helix rifle?

[shrewd pivot]

Soldier76 stole his Helix rocket etc from Helix security Grand Mesa iirc

[languid nacelle]

exactly, but his was the prototype wasnt it?

[shrewd pivot]

That i do not recall :o Dr can probably answer that with a true source

[languid nacelle]

The Stolen Gear: Soldier: 76 uses an experimental heavy pulse rifle that was stolen from Watchpoint: Grand Mesa, a facility guarded by Helix Security International.

or i can google it

[shrewd pivot]

Oh experimental heavy pulse rifle rings a bell ye!

Then yeah that's really interesting if Sierra has the finalized design and Soldier76 has the prototype

[civic lynx]

Not the skins for s2 leaking

Oh blizzard

[shrewd pivot]

Oh it did? Lol

[languid nacelle]

where?

[south torrent]

Twt

[south torrent]

Everything’s leak pretty much

[odd slate]

also, got a battlepass leak apparently?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/s/Fyz30AgMOv

DAMMIT IM LATE AHAIN

sighhh

[south torrent]

😭

[odd slate]

but yea

[languid nacelle]

aint no way sierra gets to come with a skin but emre doesnt

[civic lynx]

Soldier 76 is the launch s2 mythic

[languid nacelle]

😭

[odd slate]

all the homies hate emre

[south torrent]

Emre came with a skin

[languid nacelle]

a $40 one

[civic lynx]

Illari is allegedly the mid season mythic but I can’t find where that came from

[spare fox]

not the yellowwashing JPC

[south torrent]

Sierra is probably in that 40 dollar one too

They usually put new hero skins in that

[odd slate]

honestly niran's looks good

wuyang's too

my fairy duo

or elf

illari's....i dunno, something about that one is offputting

maybe the eyes

[languid nacelle]

dark elf

[spare fox]

that pack of skin's color scheme is so chef's kiss

[odd slate]

its very noice

[civic lynx]

The leak came from this random ass account

[odd slate]

HAHA omg

thats so funny

[languid nacelle]

folded under no pressure lol

[civic lynx]

Account had been dead since 2020

[south torrent]

Sierra looking like she came from splatoon

[odd slate]

but it has a bowl pfp

we should trust it

[spare fox]

probably some playtester getting back into the game/hype

[languid nacelle]

oh my god she does!

[civic lynx]

They also don’t have the s76 mythic image

[languid nacelle]

oh thats a moira skin

hey when were we supposed to get the character comic?

[civic lynx]

Monday

[languid nacelle]

oh i have goldfish memory then

[odd slate]

pleaseeee new maps

new maps

PLEASEEE

[languid nacelle]

new maps s3

[civic lynx]

Soon…

[odd slate]

oh my god im going to tear UP japan night

neo-tokyo is such a cool aesthetic/vibe

i love stuff like that

[civic lynx]

The Icelandic prison map if I had to guess is s5 in October

Then s6 is another rework

[languid nacelle]

support with anima pistol

[odd slate]

hashimoto support who's suspecting mizuki is going softhearted

[languid nacelle]

the theory is icelandic map for null sector things right?

[civic lynx]

I think that’s the only thing that makes sense

Depending on if the far left silhouette is meant to be a null sector bot being made playable they might be the one that escaped containment and destroyed the giant robot in the concept art

[languid nacelle]

i wish blizzard would fix that one part of the hedge on illios that i keep falling through.

i done it twice now

[spare fox]

S3 hero probably a DPS too, idk it just doesn't look like a Support to me

she/they whatev

[south torrent]

I just don’t see them doing 2 dps in a row

[brittle sky]

Yeah and would also mean the back half would be pure support, which also doesn't seem like it would go well

[south torrent]

Her gun doesn’t really give dps either

[shrewd pivot]

Here's a front view for reference to fanartists as well, she has a little freckle on her forehead!

Based on her in game model, I think it seems her eyelash makeup isn't canon per se compared to the 2d art and cinematic?

Another angle, to show forehead freckle

[spare fox]

But there's no confirmation of the roles of any of the unreleased heroes? We can speculate but nothings confirmed yet
Plus, there's never, ever been any rules about hero release order based on roles

[dry pebble]

Sierra looks like a Valorant character to me

Especially in her gameplay trailer they put a music in background made me reminded of Valo for real

[south torrent]

I’ve seen some people say she looks like Raze

[spare fox]

She looks like an OW character cosplaying as a Valorant character

[dry pebble]

Lmao thats one of a describe

[dry pebble]

I mean, for facial structures yeah but for theme and vibe it doesn't bring bell to me

Raze is spoiled, Sierra is joyfoul looking

[south torrent]

Oh definitely it’s just the face

She’s not like raze personality wise

[dry pebble]

Dmon is the one i excited the most

I wonder how they gonna execute her character

I want her to be direct opposite of DVA but not necessarily evil

Tsundere even

[dry pebble]

We need more opposing characters like Ramattra / Zenyatta and Hanzo / Genji

[south torrent]

Two potential Asian heroes in a row I’m sure the community will take that well

[dry pebble]

I'm sure community gonna pass it for D Mon since its a mecha

[shrewd pivot]

I didn't believe the "Cammy overwatch" comparisons (i saw maybe archetype but not "Cammy Overwatch" if that makes semse) but then I saw this outfit for Cammy and yeah lol it's a similar outfit

Sierra still works as an overwatch hero design ofc, like, Genji is a is a heavy MGS Raiden ref etc

[dry pebble]

Features in Sierra design is all over in her appearance it feels "complex" to me

It doesn't feel like it is made under a prepared themes and designer just add on as it goes

[shrewd pivot]

I think Sierra's design is distinct enough imo, (but I do agree it could have gone farther)

but I was suprised her first skin removed her neon arm sleeve, I presumed all her skins would keep the neon arm sleeve bc its a readability thing tied to her drone ability

[dry pebble]

Why did she stole Widow's hair style

[shrewd pivot]

She didn't? It's a different style

[dry pebble]

I'm tired of getting Hitscan DPS more than getting more asian heroes

[dry pebble]

It's not even different style Sierra's hair is just way longer

[shrewd pivot]

Let's rephrase that... there's nothing wrong with Asian heroes, it's that you want to see other areas of overwatch lore explored right?

[shrewd pivot]

Nope, Widowmaker has a French braid,

Sierra has a Helix style braid that is much longer.

[dry pebble]

Oh yeah i kinda worded it mistakenly

Thanks genuinely

[dry pebble]

Holy shit she was a Helix soldier right

She looks nothing like she belongs in there

[shrewd pivot]

She is a Helix Captain yes

[dry pebble]

I kinda wish she had an animal motif similar to Pharah's bird armor she could get going with

[shrewd pivot]

She's got the "neon colors on military gear" archetype, it's a pretty big staple in military esque scifi

[dry pebble]

She doesn't look like a character you would expect it to be in same army as pharah

[shrewd pivot]

Kinda sad we didn't get a flying fish Barbados thing....

But! I do like Sierra's animations, I think her lore will be interesting, I am hype to see her voice interactions lore wise

I am confused why she shows midriff as a nonaugmented human when she's not a sniper tho lol, she has no armor on her vitals

[dry pebble]

Also yeah

For a captain, and a soldier i expected her to have armor

Lowkey wish she was way older than she is now, so we could know that for this character is experienced

[dry pebble]

This battle pass is trash

[flint thicket]

And he eventually will go completely softhearted, but not before killing a few hashimoto himself because I predict that will happen.

Cannot wait to check out Sierra tuesday.

[odd slate]

it's the beret for me

[dry pebble]

This looks quite good modelling actually

[odd slate]

most likely, there's a debate about whether he's gonna treat kiri/her dad as found family or a love interest

[dry pebble]

I kinda wished when OW designs were practical

[odd slate]

probably the former since toshiro somewhat raised him

mentored him, etc etc

[dry pebble]

Like looking that hair just keeps me at the thought of "she gets tangled in that"

[flint thicket]

We will have to see. If he does not see them as family, I see mizuki and kiri as a potential couple.

[odd slate]

yeah i keep coming across art of them and im like 'cool'

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah so far Mizuki hasn't used particularly close familiar honorifics with Kiriko’s dad as i recall? But with so much found family in overwatch + since Kiriko’s dad was a mentor to Mizuki since he was young, I personally wait to see the end of an arc before I jump into shipping,

Edit: and I am also guessing it will be a some kind of long lost step sibling situation bc yeah Kiriko’s dad was there for Mizuki at a young age

[flint thicket]

Have to agree with you on that one. But I can also see mizuki and Kiriko joining overwatch full time, though the latter will reclaim yokai leadership whenever she gets back.

[shrewd pivot]

See I don't know if Kiriko will join overwatch or not. Genji is thier intro to overwatch but idk Kiriko seems to dedicated to her locale and the kitsune / shrine maiden stuff is usually a specific locale. We shall see!

Mizuki probably joins overwatch bc of the vrs thing, if not overwatch he will def defect to Yōkai gang

[odd slate]

if anything i think she'd be an ally to overwatch while keeping close to the yokai

she can use mizuki as a vassal of sorts

if he ends up with overwatch

[shrewd pivot]

True!

[odd slate]

they have a close enough connection for it, i think

honestly i dont mind how their relationship turns out; either way, i think it's sweet that they rely on one another, and i really hope this ends up with them growing closer instead of further apart

im a sucker for the shimada family dynamics

[flint thicket]

I have a dumb theory that kiriko will find out on her own or already knows but pretends to not know that mizuki is a hashimoto.

[odd slate]

i think she's close to figuring it out if she hasn't already

[flint thicket]

The anima weapon mizuki has is a good clue. How this will affect her relationship with mizuki at that moment, we will see, but it will most likely be really bad.

[odd slate]

she's probably gonna be furious he knew her dad was alive the whole time and never told her

[shrewd pivot]

Iirc Kiriko does ask Sombra about Hashimoto in voicelines! Idk how exactly canon that is tho.

I think it's very fitting for a kitsune(prankster)-themed character to pretend not to know so that when Mizuki has his dramatic "I have to tell you something,,,," moment, Kiriko and the gang are like "yeah dude, we know lol"

[flint thicket]

Hopefully does not lead to an interrogation where kiriko has a kunai near mizuki's throat.

[odd slate]

omg i can react to messages now

[shrewd pivot]

Yay!

[odd slate]

i yapped so much in this channel i'm a regular lmfaooo

okok but focusing up

that WOULD be super funny if he's like "i have a secret" and she's like "dude. i know."

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah it would fit the Yōkai gang trope of being "delinquent" trope, lots of little pranks, pulling legs etc lol

Im hype to see where Mizuki's story leads tho :)

I am really curious how Sierra will interact with others bc she is Helix tho

[median orchid]

No way squid game mentioned

[odd slate]

helix has a more positive connotation right?

not like the phreaks or the sea pirates or something

[flint thicket]

Something tells me mizuki might be frightened of kiriko if she ends up killing some hashimoto if she is pushed to the edge.

[median orchid]

My view is that Helix is kinda a 'Meh' group. They are a private defence company tasked to sort of replace overwatch after the Petras act ... So idk

[odd slate]

omg drives are back

[median orchid]

Having whats basically a PMC group conduct international defence is kinda iffy

[edgy meadow]

https://tenor.com/view/ough-seal-fade-in-ough-ough-seal-seal-gif-14792446552053252484

she looks cool

[shrewd pivot]

Helix is "technically" neutral but not really positive imo? Oasis hired Helix to enforce "minority report" ai and the Phreaks call Helix sky cops. Helix is basically an army for hire, organized mercs. They guard things and enforce laws if the price is right.

Helix guards anubis ai, preventing Anubis escape.

[shrewd pivot]

She seemingly might have killed already or atleast severely wounded Hashimoto in Hanzo's heroes ascendant story.

[odd slate]

sky cops lmao

[median orchid]

Yep. They are a private military contractor / defense group. A somewhat inefficient one as they fail to keep the assets they protect secure: (I:E Doomfist)

[flint thicket]

True. But either way, I'm feeling the hashimoto story is gonna take a dark turn.

[median orchid]

And using Rocket launchers in urban civilian filled enviroments?

'What a excellent idea*

[shrewd pivot]

Hazard's exact words from the voicelines "sky cops"

I personally see the "Helix works for Oasis to enforce laws around Oasis' "minority report" ai as indication Helix is not all that positive, to say the least.

Yeah I hope Helix's bad side is actually addressed in lore, I am very curious what Sierra's views on things are

[odd slate]

yeaaa fs

[shrewd pivot]

https://x.com/PlayOverwatch/status/2042301521929326706?s=20

Perks idr if it was shared already pardon

Overwatch (@PlayOverwatch)

If it wasn’t obvious already, Sierra IS that girl 🔥

Check out Sierra’s brand new ability kit and try her out when Season 2 starts on Apr 14 🧗

X · Apr 9, 2026, 6:00 PM

[languid nacelle]

congrats rai

[odd slate]

nutsss

[shrewd pivot]

Locked in perk seems op to fight against.

But that's not really lore talk but ye

I am wondering if we will get lore about her pink arm sleeve, like is it tech? Or is it just fashion... Bc her first skin removed the neon aspects

[odd slate]

it looks like a sleeve

her fingertips are still organic

as is her shoulder

[past copper]

They're gonna have to upgrade other heroes perks ans abilities

[odd slate]

she even has her nails done, oughh

[past copper]

This hero has a mix of Sojourn, Widoemaker, Juno, Venture, and Hazard all thrown together

[civic lynx]

Looks like a sleeve

Just attached to whatever that grey thing is on the top of her arm

[past copper]

And Sombra because of the half health thing

[median orchid]

So are we getting Watch Point Grand Mesa as a possible map?

Idk but it would be coolio

[civic lynx]

I wouldn’t be surprised if they never have skins with it like how Juno’s helmet is in what 1 legendary skin

[civic lynx]

Possible but not for this year

We’ve now seen both the inside and outside of it technically

[past copper]

Hate playing against this hero. But damn. Gonna love seeing Cat and Ball get exterminated

But now watch the tracking shots do nothing to the most broken tank Roadhog

[civic lynx]

I wonder if they’re gonna allow her to lock onto multiple targets when she’s in stadium

[potent briar]

Oh they definitely are

[odd slate]

oo that would be a really cool map

[potent briar]

No doubt about that

[civic lynx]

Considering how vertical it is I do wonder if this stadium map they’ve been working on since 2024 is a new, larger section

[shrewd pivot]

Oh yeye! Pardon my poor wording,
I meant, is the sleeve itself tech for the drone, or is it just a fashionable sleeve, I presumed it was tech gear so the drone could locate her arm or so she could attach with her line to the drone etc

[potent briar]

It might be tech because of the matching color and techy-looking texture. Likely for directing the drone.

[shrewd pivot]

I assume so too, but the new skin removes the neon sleeve aspects so I am unsure

[potent briar]

What new skin?

[median orchid]

Leaks lol

[languid nacelle]

the drone has a name and its dorothy (LOL)

[potent briar]

Ohhhhh

[shrewd pivot]

This new skin for Sierra

[median orchid]

Her new battlepass / season skin got leaked apparently

By some rando lol

[languid nacelle]

asdf

empty cup pfp

[potent briar]

Dang that's a sick genji mythic weapon

Ig it could be cybernetic. Weird that the fingers are still organic if it is.

[median orchid]

Maybe its some sort of climbing / mountaineering thing idk

[potent briar]

Also probable

I wonder why she named her drone, Dorothy.

I’m guessing from her mother or her grandmother

Or any woman who is/was in her family really

Or Dorothy from Golden Girls lmao

[odd slate]

oh in that case, tech sleeve methinks

[potent briar]

I miss hero trials brooo 😭

I wanna do an early dive into her character lore SO BAD

Lemme autistically analyze the voice lines

[odd slate]

LMAO real

[shrewd pivot]

Reaaal

[peak escarp]

it appears to be a ROTH drone, and she just added 'do' and 'y' around it

unknown what ROTH stands for

[potent briar]

Oh I didn’t catch that nice

Ig my new question is: what gave her the idea to do that?

[shrewd pivot]

It's some cute characterization on her end imo, naming it Dorothy

[civic lynx]

What looks to be S2’s key art has been found on ps4

[languid nacelle]

me and ultra had some theories earlier, one being remote operated topographical helidrone

oh my god. i asked chatgpt to fill in the shadows on a whim. HOLY i am not dissapointed.

i desperately wish i could share it with you guys

[elfin bane]

she looks sick

suprised she isn’t frankie tho

[languid nacelle]

i am sad about that, but it was leaked early enough that i had time to cope

[elfin bane]

w moment that looks so sick

[languid nacelle]

its funny. ultra completely called it that doc would be interested in the acronym on dorothy

[elfin bane]

ow likes to do that

like orisa name looking like OR15 plus an a

[jade linden]

WHAT

[spare fox]

I wonder if S2 we're going to see those "in-game" differences from OW team winning S1

I wonder if it'll be environmental stuff with maps or maybe voicelines? That'd be my guess

[languid nacelle]

a rebuilt gibraltar perhaps?

[shrewd pivot]

Did I? I don't recall.
Also please don't use Chatgpt... :/ genai slop does not need to support your fandom interactions.

[shrewd pivot]

Not uncommon, Playstation has had a record of such things iirc

[civic lynx]

Apparently the other leaks today also came from PlayStation (ps store I assume), they’re gonna reveal the full roster image for this year next month at this rate

[shrewd pivot]

I mean atleast it's only a slip up when next season is a week away, rather than a whole season ahead

Im hype for Sierra motion comic tho I wonder what it will be about

[vocal cedar]

I was hopping Sombra , Reaper and Widowmaker can have Redemption arc

I mean Sombra isn't a Horrible person , She is a good Person she care for Sigma

[languid nacelle]

i am sorry about the slop

[vocal cedar]

And Widowmaker she is a very poor person, she have so much trauma and sadness inside her , her memory is suppressed, trying her very best to escape her pain and trauma

She ended become a cold blooded person

[peak escarp]

her memory isn't suppressed, just her emotions

she still loves and remembers Gerard, she just hates that killing him felt so good

[vocal cedar]

She is manipulated by Talon i remembered

She is trying to escape her emotions, but its not going to work because emotional is a part of humans , she will eventually get back and stop the drugs that suppress her emotions

[peak escarp]

yes

[vocal cedar]

Maybe with the help of Mercy or ana

[brittle sky]

Honestly I hope Sombra isn't immediately woobified.

[vocal cedar]

What is woobified

[hollow night]

Anderdingus

[vocal cedar]

What does Anderdingus mean ?

[shrewd pivot]

Woobified means a character's personality was softened and made more innocent/less harsh.

Like, how a fandom might turn a serious murdering villain character into a "aw cute small little guy" in fanart (not any fandom in particular, just a trend)

[peak escarp]

the fandom already does this to Bastion

[shrewd pivot]

Bastion isn't intentionally a malicious villain tho...?
Bastion is pretty Wall-E core

[peak escarp]

half the fandom treats him like an innocent toddler

[shrewd pivot]

That's infantilizing more than woobifying imo

But yeah Bastion is not a toddler...

[peak escarp]

there's a lot of overlap between those two

[shrewd pivot]

I think woobifying usually refers to intentionally malicious characters being made softer tho?

Bastion is not intentionally malicious

[peak escarp]

is there an opposite to woobifying?

[shrewd pivot]

Not sure... maybe making characters overly edgy?

[peak escarp]

where a mostly harmless character is headcannoned to be secretly malicious/dangerous?

which is what half the community does to Sigma

[shrewd pivot]

Idk I've only seen woobifying used in reference to villainous or malicious characters being "softened" aka, they lose thier edge or sharpness to personality.

Like, the original character murders and is serious and would not say "uwu" but a woobified version of said character is just "uwu just a little guy"

For Bastion it's a whole mess tho regardless.

Many either think Bastion is a toddler mind or that Bastion has lived 32 years.

Torbjörn found Bastion after the crisis, not sure the time when Torbjörn took Bastion in, nor how long Bastion was in stasis for but Bastion def did not live 26 years awakened so far

[languid nacelle]

what is it with this channel and ages?

[shrewd pivot]

What do you mean?

There's a general chronological order to events in overwatch. And overwatch lore and thus characters are impacted by the omnic crisis which took place 28 years ago and ended 26 years ago in the timeline.

[latent lark]

Bastion wsa taken in two years prior to current events so around Overwatch 1's time frame

so not like directly after the crisis it was decades after

[peak escarp]

Bastion woke up decades ago and has been wandering the forest for a while before encountering Torbjorn

Michael Chu's timeline of the OW1 cinematics/comics places his awakening during the golden age

Binary doesn't appear on this timeline (it hadn't come out yet), but Binary is set around the time of Recall

[shrewd pivot]

Wait decades?
Bastion was in the forest for 20+ years?

[peak escarp]

roughly 15 years was his estimate

so I misspoke

a decade

[shrewd pivot]

Nono ur good, i can't recall years atm so i was checking myself

Fall of overwatch was how many years ago in ow2? Pardon i don't recall.

[peak escarp]

7 years ago, as per Athena's timeline

[shrewd pivot]

Ok tyty pardon.

Venice was 10 years ago,
Fall was 7 then

Chu's estimate was 15 years? Yeah Bastion I assume is like a decade lagging behind other omnics in "mental age" then, which lines up with my prior read that Bastion was basically older teen to young adult mentally (I imagine since omnics don't have childhoods and are basically born with adult minds, it takes them a few years to find themselves akin to an adult with amnesia)

Zenyatta was said to be in his 20s in ow1, and the awakening probably happened 26 years ago (if not 27) so Zenyatta is 20s still.

[peak escarp]

when was that said?

[shrewd pivot]

Pardon, I meant that Zenyatta was described as 20s

Not mentally 20s

[peak escarp]

Zenyatta's bio listed his age as 20 in OW1

until it got retconned in OW2 when they finally figured out the timeline

[shrewd pivot]

Ah okay
Many im brainfried today, ty for your patience and help.

But yeah, Bastion is def not toddler haha

[peak escarp]

it was a little weird in that middle period, when new voice lines were being added but the lore hadn't been updated

those lines of heroes asking him what he did before the crisis

I kept thinking they're all lies because he wasn't made yet... but now I think they're all true and he just did a lot of odd jobs before becoming a monk

    I collected payments at a laser tag arena.
    I was a lifeguard at a water park.
    I served coffee.
    I drove a tractor.
    I massaged sheep on a free-range pasture.```

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah haha I think that's the charm of Zenyatta, mystery "just a guy" vibes for humor

I assumed it was either shared memory from unit type (like, programing for a task) or he had done odd jobs as a general civ bot (my guess) -- or if it was really funny, Zenyatta was just saying tall tales.

Tho Zenyatta seems to not like discussing his past per se-- if he liked to then we would have heard more by now, might be him being more closed off about it

[peak escarp]

could just be part of his detachment as a monk

his past doesn't matter, so he doesn't talk about it

[shrewd pivot]

True!

Kind of funny to think Bastion and Echo might be similar "lived experience" ages. 14 and ~15ish

I mean, I assume the 15 years was estimate from early ow1 days, so it might be more or less than 15 years? But ye that's cool to learn, ty for the info

[latent lark]

just realized the fire wings Anran has come from the long sleeve things she has coming off the back of her amrs

its a miracle she doesnt burn herself

[odd slate]

she's probably used to the burns by now

[lone geyser]

thats hard but also edgey as hell

[odd slate]

anran's a tough cookie hehe

[lone geyser]

not as tuff as venture but fair

[odd slate]

OUGH venture

love them sm

[thorn moss]

A concept I created if they ever did another mirrorwatch event

Alternate blackwatch members and motivations

Hana: jaded and cynical after feeling undervalued and unwanted joins for the chance of straight forward missions at changing the world and to destroy the gwishin

Juno: wishes to expose Lucheing for their role in shutting down the mars colony killing her family and everyone she loved

Kiriko: joins for the opportunity to destroy the Hashimoto and liberate her home from their tyranny

Anran: always second place to Wuyang even after getting into the nation’s top school. Anran has something to prove.

Brig: spent her whole life training under rein and studying under her father. She feels the need to prove herself worthy after her dreams of joining them in overwatch were dashed by them.

Sombra: hacker, leader of blackwatch, recruits girls with a personal vendetta and trains them into being the most lethal secret organization on the globe

[brittle sky]

Is that the most complex interaction? 4 back and forths, at least two of which are optional, with multiple people asking the initial question, him giving one of multiple different answers, even more people who can express credulity (including people who did not ask the initial question!) and then two more that, if there, add in a stinger.

[peak escarp]

I think so

really flexing the interaction system

[spare fox]

I think they're experimenting with pushing it further, not to mention they'll need to update some of the complex "multiple teammates from Talon/OW" lines, being that Somb, Widow, DF and Reap aren't in Talon anymore, while multiple characters have since joined OW and Talon

I have a totally unfounded "theory" that that's (one of) the "in-game changes" we'll see as a result of OW winning S1

not a theory, more of a feeling

I want to see a new "ask everyone" interaction like the "favorite animal" one, but with someone asking each hero what their pizza toppings of choice are

so many possibilities

[shrewd pivot]

Food questions don't work for omnics tho?
Maybe favorite flowers or something to be more universal but idk, the animal question does a lot of fun character work, it's not just there to be facts about favorite animals, each character have something reflected in thier personality with it.

[digital star]

I'd also love to see alternate Vishkar for Mirrorwatch.
Torbjorn could be the eccentric executive who succeded with his inventions
Zarya is his secretary and bodyguard (also an associate of Volskaya Industries).
Brigitte is still his daughter but also part of both Talon and Vishkar. It'd basically be an evil IKEA 😅
Lifeweaver could stay in Vishkar too, going full corporate instead of defecting, but still campy with an interest in high art and fashion.

And then Domina could be the face of The Collective, originally a scientific commune, now an international humanitarian organization in MIrrorwatch, and though Domina is doing good things, she's still really smug, narcissistic, and attention-seeking about it 😇
Hazard becomes her puppy

[round bramble]

How does Venture not die from rawdogging her tunnelling

I feel like there'd be issues with debris and dust

[brittle sky]

They got goggles

[spare fox]

You're not thinking creatively enough. Omnics/ robots can have something to say about it and have something to say regarding the topic

[thorn moss]

Rebel Domina would be interesting for sure

[nocturne flint]

Them*

[digital star]

I'm already imagining she'd be a lot like Tahani from The Good Place tv show, a British-Pakistani socialite philantrophist

[thorn moss]

I’d imagine lifeweaver would stick around with vishkar and let them use his biolight tech

[digital star]

@thorn moss Yeah I already mentioned here

[thorn moss]

Living up to his wifeleaver name

[shrewd pivot]

? It would be no different than asking everyone's favorite boba tea topping (since there are Boba stands in Wuxing university)...? Favorite animals say more about a personality than food toppings.
Like even with boba, Orisa and Bastion and Echo and Zenyatta and Ramattra and incoming Trenchcoat omnic would have nothing to say, Unless Hammond is stealing from Junkrat nothing to say, plus Ashe probably drinks sweet tea not boba tea, etc

A more universal food question could work instead of... pizza topping or boba toppings, maybe "what's your comfort meal?" or a "what is your favorite flower?" for scents and foods, but yeah it's not the lack of thinking creatively, it's that the point of the animal question was good character work and universal, not fun facts for fandom.

I'm hoping for voicelines to be lore related or character work going forward, which, gets me hyped for Sierra, she's our first glimpse into Helix innerworkings proper (Pharah was more vague comments) and I bet Sierra has unique opinions on things, it should be interesting

[spare fox]

no, you are absolutely not thinking creatively - everything is black and white, again with you
Orisa, Echo can comment on what their creator's favorite was, Zen and Ram can have similar yet different answers, Ram can comment on how humans get riled so much over pineapple on pizza, etc etc

Echo even questions other characters what certain foods are like. Just because they don't eat doesn't mean they don't have something to say.

[tiny fiber]

is zen an equinox

[shrewd pivot]

It's not black and white at all? "Again with me" ? I can say you are doing personal insults again for no reason.

It's about writing with a purpose beyond "fandom facts" or "meme lines"

Orisa then doesn't get to answer about herself, Echo then doesn't get to answer about herself, Zenyatta would have no opinions on a food probably not eaten much around him, and Ramattra commenting on pineapple pizza is... random why would he care, it's just a meme line. Plus pizza isn't a universal food, just like boba tea isn't a universal food. Questions about "what is your comfort meal" is much more personal even, but again still excludes omnics on the cast from talking about themselves

And frankly someone liking pepperoni on pizza or jelly toppings in boba or whatnot is far less character work than favorite animal bc fav animal is personal and reflects personality. Also, I am very happy the pineapple pizza hyperfocus around Vendetta's character adverts was dropped, it got to the point is was just awkward stereotyping. 👍

[shrewd pivot]

Equinox? What do you mean by that :o

[tiny fiber]

like an equillibrium incarnate

[shrewd pivot]

If I understand "equilibrium incarnate" right,

Not really sure Zenyatta is "perfect balance" per se, his kit and themes have more of a "harmony with balance" yin yang style where it's more if a flow between states. Not a stark 50/50 is that makes sense

[tiny fiber]

ahhh

[spare fox]

why tf do you keep bringing up boba?
pizza is a pretty universal food, they have it in basically every culture and many have their own cultural variations on it. And it is character work? It's what they like and how they express themselves - whether they don't like certain flavors, textures, they are traditional or non-traditional or a little of both

food doesn't exclude omnics - there are omnic chefs for crying out loud - The overwatch cookbook has recipes for orisa, bastion, and zenyatta even though they can't eat. Just like a human character doesn't need to have "met" one of their favorite animals in real life to have it as their favorite animal - Genji and Hazard just the most obvious animals. They can just like it for whatever reason, yes even if that reason was that their creator enjoyed it and it reminds them of someone they shared a close bond with - that can be and is a valid answer that also shows character

and the "hyperfocus" you speak of for Vendetta's character is not gone? she still has that one spray - the same as always... idk how that's a "hyperfocus," (and if she DID like pineapple on pizza, then I'd bet my next paycheck that you'd be whining about how "Italians don't like pineapple on pizza they find the idea offensive"_

[odd slate]

ooo mirrorwatch....yes that's be so cool

idk if multiverse is canon in ow tho bc i dont think theyd do it again otherwise 🥀

[odd slate]

like 60/40, maybe

[shrewd pivot]

To explain, I brought up boba tea bc has a stand in the game where u can spawn different boba drinks on wuxing map, and it's a food that has toppings, and is not a universal food just like pizza is not a universal food. Also Boba tea can be milk free, unlike pizza. Bc lactose intolerance is the majority, not the minority. (Players playing)

Pizza is not particularly universal btw. Like, it's seen as American-Italian foods in other countries. Greece is right next to Italy and it was only in the past 5ish years that Pizza even became a food locals would eat on occasion on the islands. Boba tea is the same thing, mostly tourists drink it on the islands atm bc Greeks like thier café haha

Character work means a simple sentence says more than the words alone. "I like this topping in USA centric food" is a list item, while "favorite animal" is a universal that relates to archetype and personality and had a broader appeal. Tracer listing off her possible likes says a lot about her character, Symmetra chosing dragonflies(highest hunt sucess rates, fantastic vision, iredecent wings, elegant), etc says way more than just list facts.

And making yet another personal insult/mocking me Just FYI, overwatch also in a post labeled Hanzo would give out sushi on Halloween... which is the same odd comments about characters and cultural food. I think it's safe to say the focus on Vendetta with pizza jokes was the topic I was referencing, not if a character likes pineapple or not.

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah I feel like Zenyatta's kit is healing for ult, but pretty heavy on damage in regular play

[odd slate]

for sure yeah
i think it reflects that yeah, he wants to heal others and focus on peace, but he can easily cause harm if pushed

someone kind /=/ a pacifist

[spare fox]

just like pizza is not a universal food. Also Boba tea can be milk free, unlike pizza. Bc lactose intolerance is the majority, not the minority. (Players playing)
Pizza IS a universal food as 1) it exists in pretty much every country, traditional AND regional variations which includes 2) there are pizzas without cheese, there are plenty of examples of pizza around the world without cheese and 3) there was an interview question where they (I think Jeff) answered that the one thing all the heroes (presumably up until Vendetta, who also "changed everything") have in common is that they like pineapple on pizza. Therefore, all the heroes have experienced pineapple on pizza, therefore it is a valid question to ask

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah! Zenyatta actually falls perfectly into Wuxia tropes, the monks (be it Daoist or Buddhist) kick ass haha. Zenyatta's interaction with Soldier76 is great bc Zenyatta is not a pacifist monk at all LOLLL

[odd slate]

i looove that interact, it's so funny

very telling of their characters too

zen kinda reminds me of nightcrawler in that sense

"just because i am peaceful most of the time does not mean i cannot fight"

[spare fox]

Character work means a simple sentence says more than the words alone. "I like this topping in USA centric food" is a list item, while "favorite animal" is a universal that relates to archetype and personality and had a broader appeal. Tracer listing off her possible likes says a lot about her character, Symmetra chosing dragonflies(hoghest hunt sucess rates, fantastic vision, iredecent wings, elegant), etc says way more than just list facts.
Opinions about pizza would do just the same

And making yet another personal insult/mocking me
What?

overwatch also in a post labeled Hanzo would give out sushi on Halloween... which is the same odd comments about characters and cultural food. I think it's safe to say the focus on Vendetta with pizza jokes was the topic I was referencing, not if a character likes pineapple or not.

You're missing the jokes here. The joke with Hanzo is that he's oblivious about Halloween because he's so traditional/upper class that he'd just give out his favorite food, not candy. Hanzo isn't very fun, so he doesn't think about candy much. That's the joke.
Vendetta not liking pinapple on pizza works on two levels - 1) she was hyped as the hero that will change everything - therefore it can be reasonably extrapolated (from the spray) that presumably she's the first who doesn't like pineapple on pizza and 2) she is "hardcore Italian" and it's just a fun stereotype that traditional Italians don't like pineapple on pizza. It's a fun joke, not to be taken so seriously.

[shrewd pivot]

Pizza is not a universal food anymore than Gyro/Doner/Shwarma is Spooky. Universal food could include soups, fruit based desserts, grilled skewers, etc. Three staple grains are rice, wheat, corn, sometimes potatoes. Majority of earth are lactose intolerant and eating rice as a staple grain or flatbreads.

The pineapple on pizza thing is obviously a joke, like how Roadhog x Mercy is a joke.

Why continue this convo in here Spooky? I don't see a point. I'm just saying "what's your favorite comfort food?" Or a non food question is more relatable than pizza toppings, and veers away from the odd focus overwatch had on pineapple pizza jokes about Vendetta which is a good thing.

Can we get back to lore talk please, or dm me this convo instead.

[spare fox]

You're the one who replied to me! FFS

[shrewd pivot]

Spooky you are chosing to reply to me with escalating comments.
You saying you betting your next paycheck i would whine about Vendetta, is a personal insult. I am not whining.

Making the Japanese character give out sushi on Halloween is not an appropriate joke to make. how are you older than me and not getting that.

[odd slate]

it can come off as weirdly culturally appropriating/mocking, is i think what ultra is saying

[spare fox]

you replied to MY comment first how tf is it that you are allowed to reply to me and me not to you???

[odd slate]

even if the intent is "crusty old man doesnt know halloween customs, laugh at him"

there are also people who just...dont like pizza. asking some of the heroes what their fav pizza topping in could result in them saying "oh i dont eat it, i prefer xyz" and it would still give some lore i think? at least fun tidbits

pizza is common where i live and i dont like it that much

[spare fox]

the joke about Hanzo is that Hanzo's favorite food is sushi, so he'd think it's a treat to give it out as a halloween treat. Hanzo's favorite food being sushi is appropriating/mocking? make it make sens

[shrewd pivot]

I didn't say you couldn't reply, you are replying escalating with personal insults. I don't see the need to spam this channel with that

[odd slate]

bc it's usually seen as the "stereotypically japanese food"

[spare fox]

yes but it's been said that all the heroes like pineapple on pizza

[odd slate]

that'd be like sombra, reaper, or venture giving out burritos or tacos

[odd slate]

all of them for now, at least. that could always change

[shrewd pivot]

Hanzo was animated eating sushi with chopsticks, yet sushi is traditionally eaten with the fingers in Japan. I would argue that was an oopsie by the devs probably not realizing how sushi is traditionally eaten.

Making Hanzo give out sushi on Halloween is random and like Rai said, a stereotype of cultural food.

[spare fox]

that wouldn't follow the joke though because those characters aren't "out of touch" like hanzo
a similar joke would be Domina giving out caviar, Mercy giving out toothbrushes
Like... you guys come on, it's not "stereotyping" for a Japanese character to like sushi

[shrewd pivot]

It's obviously a joke spooky...

[shrewd pivot]

To have a Japanese character give out sushi on Halloween is stereotyping

[spare fox]

if that's "obviously a joke" then so is Hanzo giving out sushi on halloween

[shrewd pivot]

Pineapple on pizza is not a cultural food joke it's a "odd food combo" meme

Hanzo giving out sushi on Halloween is stereotyping

[spare fox]

if I'm replying to you with insults then just report me? why do you keep replying?

[odd slate]

well, i was abt to say but didnt type fast enough lol

yeah, it's fine that he's japanese and likes sushi, theres nothing wrong with that. i think the point being made is there could also be other traditionally japanese foods being out that's not sushi, the immediate food most cultures think of when they hear "japanese food"

he's just old and doesnt know how shit works but that could change in the future or other art or something

[spare fox]

Pineapple on pizza IS cultural - it was started and canada and spread widely from there, becoming popular in north america, asia and the pacific

[shrewd pivot]

I said cultural food joke, not cultural food Spooky.

You aren't mocking Greek Canadians by saying pineapple on pizza is an odd combo in a meme

Can we talk lore now?

[spare fox]

nobody's mocking any culture - the joke is Hanzo, not the sushi

You aren't mocking Greek Canadians by saying pineapple on pizza is an odd combo in a meme
Wtf is this nonsequitor?

[shrewd pivot]

Spooky. A Greek Canadian is credited with the popularization of the pineapple on pizza.

Japanese people invented sushi, and ate it with fingers since it was invented as a method of food preservation using the vinegar rice

Making a Japanese hero give out salmon sushi on Halloween + that supposedly traditional Japanese hero is eating it with chopsticks comes off as stereotyping. Like Rai said, it's akin to making Mexican characters give out Tacos etc.

Can you take this to dms?

Or actually talk lore here?

[spare fox]

Dude, no. I WAS talking lore, you came and disagreed, which is fine. I defended my position. You came in and said I was insulting you for disagreeing with you and providing support for my argument. You continued to derail with further nonsequiturs and I kept supporting the topic that I initially started the discussion on, despite your non-sequitur into non-lore topics of how XYZ is offensive despite that having nothing to do with the topic at hand. You continued to reply to me in that fashion and then declared that I can no longer reply about the topic. You are being completely unreasonable.

[shrewd pivot]

I never said you couldn't reply, I said to not throw personal insults here in the channel, take that to dms to me.

[spare fox]

I'm not throwing personal insults! I IMPLORE you, report every instance of me personally insulting you.

[odd slate]

"no, you are not thinking creatively - everything is black and white, again with you" can come off as insulting, coming from an outsider's perspective, spooky

to avoid derailing the convo further, i honestly think you two should just block each other and go about your lives. this happens constantly and it's making this channel a bit miserable 🥀

[peak escarp]

it's very difficult to carry on discussion in a channel with someone blocked

[odd slate]

it's either that or avoidance

like 😭 this is a lore channel, and arguments over skins being culturally insensitive and pineapple pizza happen constantly

with things getting unnecessarily snippy

[shrewd pivot]

For posterity, going to report now

[odd slate]

blocking would make conversations hard, sure, but it would also just mean conversation with people who don't argue with each other can happen

[peak escarp]

I have work so I can't moderate constantly - if you have issues, contact modmail

[past copper]

SMH. It's either both shut up or both get the boot. Either way would work, but clearly the first thing won't happen

[shrewd pivot]

Modmail is down, who do I contact?
Edit: I sent a dm to the user that posted the modmail is down, idk if that was the right user, pardon.

Maybe a new channel needs to be made idk. I think it's fair for someone to ask a question about lore, learn the lore, then reply with an opinion on the application of lore.

Maybe a lore analysis channel or something to discuss things in more of "ppl can discuss effectiveness of xys" etc, that way one channel can stay light and the other can get into more serious topics

[odd slate]

i still say a block and talk with other members of the channel is fine tbh

anyway

hopefully sierra gives more helix insight and more depth to their organization. see how overwatch handles them as opposed to someone who clearly rebels against authority

ofc he'll be biased

and talon probably sees them as a joke of sorts? since it was easy for sierra to be muzzled by frejre

[south torrent]

[shrewd pivot]

By he who do you mean? :o

From my understanding of the cinematic, Sierra was buying time for overwatch, Emre had Chernobog take control which looked pretty lethal, so Sierra stood in place with Freja ult as to not escalate and Freja ulted to show Chernobog threat was contained, and when it was clear Sierra broke the Freja ult and it showed Sierra was tracking Emre and Freja's aircraft.

Regardless I do agree Talon probably doesn't think much if Helix bc they broke out Doomfist (presumably Helix opperated iirc) and Sierra made it look like they didn't put up a fight despite getting that tracking on the ship.

I think it's safe to guess Sierra will not be a fan of deadlock gang and phreaks bc of Ashe leading the Mesa distraction and Hazard is def anti Helix no matter what, and Sierra probably has some nuanced opinions on overwatch bc Helix took over the areas overwatch had after overwatch fell.

I am curious of Sierra's views of general vigilantes bc Pharah was not a fan of the Yokai gang bc of Helix style law stuff.

What I am most interested in is seeing Sierra's opinion on Helix's activities with Oasis. I would think the IJC etc wouldn't trust Helix to guard Anubis ai if ALL of Helix are "the right price" army for hire (bc Helix could be bribed to let Anubis lose then) so I am guessing it's a regional corruption are going on there.

Idk im excited to see Sierra's nuances, hype for next seasonnn

Also thinking on it, going forward I'll also put any of my critique under spoiler, that way ppl can click to engage with it.

I took this channel's "serious discussion of overwatch's lore" as: Serious canon talk, no silly fanfic talk, and open to serious topics of discussion about canon,

I do apologize if I was misreading and that this channel was meant to be light topic convos, as overwatch lore covers some heavy topics.

[peak escarp]

that is the correct read

but "serious talk" doesn't necessarily mean nitpicking fine details

[shrewd pivot]

That's what I'm confused about, the definition of "nitpicking fine details", because Anran's face changes are fine detail changes? They changed her eyelash thickness, eye brow thickness, cheek plumpness, dot opaqueness, lipstick opaqueness, iris size, and stance angle.

I'm genuinely not being facetious either, I'm trying to understand what is or isn't nitpicking fine details because like. Anran's face change includes fine details being changed but this topic is open for discussion? Idk what topics would or would not be included.

Ig we can dm about specific examples to avoid idk. Edit: I am unable to dm so, I presume doctor would have to dm me first.
Edit 2: asked with a mod, I think i understand now ty mod for your time!

[odd slate]

hazard! he's an anarchist so he doesnt like cops haha

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah, I def think Hazard would be anti-helix across the board

[odd slate]

he's anti-many things haha

i think fika would be happy with more pets but that also depends on if sierra is a cat person

[mighty vigil]

im sorry, ||doomfist is DEAD?||
this new comic is lowk great but theres no way theyd ||kill doom off in such a lacklustre fight (cinematic), theud have to have more of a story and showcase of such an important event||
surely ||ana is just speculating/intelligence is wrong about his death||

[spare fox]

I mean, it was an event foreshadowed in Ram's comic, Max's short story, and then Vendetta's release

Ana's info is the OW world's info. We the fans are just speculating that he's still alive and off licking his wounds

[mighty vigil]

true but ||the way he died seems very boring, the fight didnt last very long and doom barely put up a good fight compared to previous comics and loredrops where he was seem as a very strong opponent. im not saying vendetta is weak but compared to the winston and doom fight it was very lacklustre||

[spare fox]

what can I say, animation is expensive. And for as lauded as the Doomfist origin vid is, it's not very animated either, a lot of it is him throwing stuff and standing there. Not saying it isn't good, but it's hardly a super-choreographed masterpiece

[odd slate]

what comic? there's one out now?

[spare fox]

Ep 4, the one from Wednesday

[thorn moss]

I feel like freja definitely saved her life there

[odd slate]

did i miss something????

ill check the game when i log on

[south torrent]

It’s the webtoons one not in game

[odd slate]

ah that's why

[vapid stump]

Hot take: I believe the people of the mars colony should die despite mei and Juno's efforts.

[brittle sky]

I think they should be conquered by space apes

[nocturne flint]

İ think they should turn into space apes

[odd slate]

space apes...

tbh i thought they were already gone 🥀

[peak escarp]

why?

[vapid stump]

Idk. Just having that feeling

[odd slate]

more stakes i suppose

[thorn moss]

That could be a thing for mirrorwatch Juno

[potent briar]

It would be cool to see a return to the lunar colony for a new arc sometime after reign of talon

They could fr pull a gorilla grodd with the colony's apes

[odd slate]

they could! lots of potential for space stuff

[spare fox]

Ngl, I think it'd be interesting if Hammond got in on assisting with the rescue

[odd slate]

what rescue?

[spare fox]

The products of lucheng's wrongdoing taking up the chance to make something right in spite of the wrong that's been done to him, it'd be Hammond's heroic moment

[odd slate]

oh like potential rescuing of other animals on the moon

[spare fox]

The mars colony

[odd slate]

mars, mars, i see

maybe? i wonder if he'd need to be persuaded to actually help since hammond's not the type to do things from generosity, if i read his character right

[spare fox]

Yeah the moon is potentially a destination but idk idt the animals in HLC necessarily need rescuing

[spare fox]

Yeah but it would be getting back at Lucheng, a little thin motive but still

[odd slate]

maybe if he was really feeling pissy that day

[spare fox]

He's also done things just bc he can like the junkertown scrapyard

Lol and imagine a ship showing up at mars colony, they're like "we're saved!" and a friggin hamster pops out

[odd slate]

helppp

[drowsy locust]

i just learned baptiste's regenerative burst isn't just a fart cloud out of nowhere and it actually comes out of his backpack from one of his highlight intros 😭

what are more interesting stuff that i don't know like this

[odd slate]

LMFAO HELP

the image of a fart cloud is so funny

i thought it was from his boots or his legs, but it makes sense it's from his backpack

[tiny harbor]

bruh lmao

[native cobalt]

Can we ping Lord warlord? I wanted to let him know something

[peak escarp]

her

and what

[native cobalt]

Ooops sorry about that

I was just looking at the lore database and I noticed that the Mizuki "cursebreaker" short story is missing

I didn't know who to tell

[peak escarp]

oh, I missed it

thanks for letting me know

also added the Sierra hero trailer

and gameplay trailer

[native cobalt]

Also the recruitment vids for overwatch and Talon would be cool too!

[peak escarp]

added

[native cobalt]

And no problem! Thank YOU for keep lore easy to find and access

[peak escarp]

someone's gotta do it

and if it isn't going to be Blizzard it might as well be me

[spare fox]

Yeah FORTUNATELY we're getting lore at a rate we haven't seen before in the franchise
The only downside of that is it's hard to record it in a timely manner

[wise grotto]

how am I only just learning this

[languid nacelle]

i pretty new here so i just say doc

[peak escarp]

my pronouns are in my bio

[past copper]

I know a perfect collab. Overwatch x The Amazing Digital Circus

Let's make it happen Blizzard. In prep for the upcoming finale

[wise grotto]

Honestly I completely forget about checking the bio I've just seen you as the all knowing warlord of lore (gender is a lie created by the government to sell us more sentences in books)

[wooden drift]

Aw hell nuh

Why that out of any collabs

[somber grail]

Are you a child

[wooden drift]

I think it's ragebait

[light hatch]

they're calling it the worst collab of all time

[thorn moss]

In all seriousness, how did dva survive that fall in her cinematic with minor injuries when a fall from that high easily should’ve done more

[spare fox]

plot armor lol

[thorn moss]

Reaper jax skin

[thorn moss]

She has a top secret surgery to repair her spine or something

[spare fox]

plot twist- gwishin means ghost, but actually SHE is the ghost all along

tha hopes and prayers from her chat helped her survive

[thorn moss]

Interesting idea. She does die and no one notices

[spare fox]

she was able to re-mech in time to 1hk the ocean before it could do damage to her

[thorn moss]

Darker twist, her body was damaged beyond repair in that fall so they had to replace it with an omnic one and didn’t tell her about it

[spare fox]

this is starting to sound like a soap opera from the OW universe

are there any in-universe soap operas?

[thorn moss]

Probably

Don’t know of any

But what a world shattering revelation it would be

[spare fox]

she has the body of an omnic and the heart of a ghost and the skin of a gremlin

[thorn moss]

Yep

The military uses their latest iterations of omnic tech that functions nearly identical to humans so they could hide the fact they replaced her and blame any change she notices on “the accident”

[spare fox]

"I keep getting electrocuted every time I brush my teeth. What's wrong?"
"oh that's just a side effect from your accident"

[thorn moss]

More like “food doesn’t taste like it used to, everything is so bland”

A positive change being she doesn’t get tired like she used to. It’s new but she doesn’t hate it

[spare fox]

24-hour streams, try 24-WEEK streams, LFG CHAT

[thorn moss]

Stuff she can do now she couldn’t do before

[spare fox]

nah but in seriousness, I really don't think they'll do a "human who is omnic in disguise" nor an "omnic who is a human in disguise" plotline - not anytime in the current plot threads, anyway

[thorn moss]

And new skills just clicking when she learns them

[thorn moss]

It’s fun to think about though

[spare fox]

it is, and it would be very philosophical - delving into the "swamp man" theory/argument

it would be fitting further on down the line, maybe after current plotlines are resolved in the far future

[thorn moss]

Hana getting a revelation she hasn’t been human in years

[peak escarp]

she didn't survive with minor injuries, she nearly died

they had to restart her heart

[thorn moss]

That sounds more logical

[peak escarp]

you see flashes of it after she hits the water

[thorn moss]

This is more like it, because there was no way she walked away without some sort of serious injury

[peak escarp]

the news downplays her injuries to maintain the illusion of MEKA/D.Va being this invincible protector of Busan

[thorn moss]

Oh yeah, she’s most definitely the military’s strongest propaganda asset

[peak escarp]

and a few broken limbs is hardly "without a scratch"

[thorn moss]

Still pretty well off from what could have happened

[peak escarp]

hitting the water at that speed could have easily left her paralzyed for life

[thorn moss]

Unless it did and we just never know of them fixing it

[peak escarp]

true

2070s medical technology could have fixed it

[thorn moss]

This is a world of sentient robots, moon bases and cybernetics. Surely a spinal break can be repaired

Even today we can successfully replace broken organs

[odd slate]

hana def has trauma from that tho :<

i feel bad for her

she got fixed up sure but that's terrifying

[swift trout]

It's Overwatch, literally everyone has trauma

[thorn moss]

Yes

[peak escarp]

except Brigitte

[thorn moss]

Anytime I do think of her lore i always imagine she lost one or both parents in a gwishin attack

[peak escarp]

her trauma is "my godfather was forced to retire"