lore-discussion

[shrewd pivot]

having trauma from the omnic crisis that causes anti omnic sentiment is understandable, but overwatch narrative asserts being anti omnic is not a moral stance to have

[stark folio]

I wouldn't say invalid when omnics can be overrode by some sentient god AI

A sentient god AI awakens again who says the omnics have a say?

[shrewd pivot]

you can be hesitant of being next to an omnic (just as a cyborg that can get hacked like Emre is) without wishing for all awakened omnics to be killed

[spare fox]

I'm pretty sure you're the one who is asserting that. I think Overwatch more shows that it's a world in the process of healing from an omnic crisis even after a generation

[shrewd pivot]

Is there one hero that is anti omnic that is portrayed as a good guy for being anti-omnic?

[stark folio]

It's been a generation at best

Sombra

[shrewd pivot]

Sombra is not a good guy

[stark folio]

She isn't evil necessarily

[spare fox]

that's not the point, once again you're conflating one thing with another thing that's tangentially related

[stark folio]

Sombra is doing what needs to survive but she isn't evil she is a anti-hero

[peak escarp]

Sombra isn't particularly anti-omnic either

[spare fox]

you're doing the monolith thinking thing again where you're equating viewing omnics favorably as 'good' and thus the opposite is bad

[stark folio]

Isn't she just anti-AI?

Because of the eye and such

Which terrified her

[shrewd pivot]

overwatch narrative has yet to portray a moral character good guy being anti-omnic as a good thing. It's not me asserting if the whole message is "being anti-omnic is a flaw"?

[peak escarp]

it was one thing that happened to her

I don't think that makes her anti AI either

[stark folio]

Yeah she uses cybernetics

And is a hacker

So she might find it useful

[shrewd pivot]

i mean, overwatch narrative clearly shows Freja is an antivillain (thinks she is the hero but is actually doing bad things) so i don't really get how it's monolithic thinking to say "overwatch's narrative shows being anti-omnic as a character flaw"

[stark folio]

Yeah sombra uses AI

Isn't that why her hacking is so efficient?

[peak escarp]

she's just a good hacker

[stark folio]

Maybe just her emp but I don't know

[crisp canyon]

Sombra doesn’t need ai

[shrewd pivot]

sorry @spare fox ig im kind of lost on the "it's showing the world recovering, not making an assertion" part. Overwatch absolutely IS about the world recovering from war, but the narrative also asserts certain philosophies to be villainous, like doomfist's philosophy for example. the narrative also asserts anti-omnic philosophy is a character flaw, not a good thing.
So I don't understand what you mean, pardon.

[stark folio]

There has been two omnic crisis though

[shrewd pivot]

1st omnic crisis, and if you count the null sector invasion as the 2nd, then yes

[stark folio]

But was the second one even a war?

It started after widow shot Mondatta to my recollection

[shrewd pivot]

the null sector invasion was a global invasion, and there was war done, yes.

but once ramattra collected the subjugation omnics, he retreated. so it wasn't a war for destruction, it was for kidnapping awakened omnics.

[spare fox]

because an assertion would be that it is a rule of sorts that people who are anti-omnic are bad. You're projecting your own experience onto it when there are plenty of people who have had their entire families, half their countries, destroyed by omnics and it is overly-simplified thinking to put them into a "Villain category" - which I don't see Overwatch as necessarily doing as you claim
yes just because some people who are anti-omnic are villains doesn't mean that that's a point Overwatch is trying to make

[shrewd pivot]

The point overwatch is trying to make with the anti-omnic thing is that unity(understanding eachother, fostering community) is good, and bigotry is bad, and that war creates long lasting scars in communities.

And in overwatch it IS a narrative rule that being anti-omnic(as in, anti-awakened omnic) is NOT a moral action. Efi and Orisa's hope of omnic human unity, Widowmaker being portrayed as villain for killing Mondatta and Tracer being portrayed as the good guy for trying to stop the murder, Bastion and Torbjorn arc, the Junkers being anti-omnic killers, etc show that awakened omnics don't deserve to be killed, that being anti-omnic is narratively a character flaw.

making an immoral choice doesn't make a character a villain, it makes a character flawed.

[stark folio]

It's because blizzard just hasn't covered it extensively and how it ruined the lives of people

To be fair

Freja isn't necessarily evil she is flawed

Freja is no villian despite she makes work with Talon

[shrewd pivot]

she's writen as an anti-villain, she did the right things (Search and rescue overwatch) for the wrong reasons (thrill seeking) and then ended up being a bounty hunter for hire no questions asked (villainous activity). She shows that just because a person did good deeds, doesn't mean that person is a "good person" and i think her arc with Emre will explore what it means to be a real hero

currently she is helping emre because she has hope in him, and usually characters having hope is treated as a strength in overwatch's narrative

[spare fox]

but do you not see how what you're now saying is different from "Overwatch as a world says that being anti-omnic is immoral"? whatever, I'm kind of bored with this convo, probably won't reply again

[shrewd pivot]

Overwatch's narrative / "as a world" does say being anti-omnic is immoral (aka a character flaw) im sorry i don't understand your point /genuine,
what i said prior IS still the same thing I am saying now.
to explain my logic:
You had said it was my assertion to say 'overwatch narrative asserts anti-omnic was not moral',
so i brought up how no moral character (aka good guy hero) was ever shown as being good/moral for being anti omnic.
^This is evidence that the narrative does assert 'being anti omnic is not a moral stance.'

^and this isn't separate from the 'globe's recovery from war' aspect of overwatch's narrative. Overwatch narrative clearly makes moral philosophy assertions, as seen with Junker's extreme anti-omnic violence being portrayed as villainous behavior, etc.
Characters are written with flaws, but that doesn't mean overwatch's narrative is saying being anti-omnic is moral. the ow narrative says that being anti-omnic is immoral (a character flaw).

[stark folio]

Do we know what has happened to winston?

Since the attack on Gibraltar

[peak escarp]

we don't know anything after the attack on Gibraltar

[stark folio]

Just that it was attacked and is burning now

[peak escarp]

they'll probably cover it at the end of the season

[stark folio]

Winston spends all his time there

[peak escarp]

they probably abandoned Gibraltar and went somewhere else

[stark folio]

Why is there Winston's stuff on the new rialto?

[shrewd pivot]

memes ig?

[peak escarp]

there's Winston stuff on Rialto?

[stark folio]

I don't know if that was a lore peak or a joke

Team 1 spawn has winston the talon side

Nevermind just a Easter egg

[shrewd pivot]

winston plushie with peanut butter jars

[peak escarp]

ah

[spare fox]

the wanted posters?

[stark folio]

That one is interesting

Is he on the run

[shrewd pivot]

multiple overwatch agents had wanted posters on the map, not just winston

they apparently made a grammar error with Tracer's poster text (incorrect gender in word)? i hope that gets fixed

[shrewd pivot]

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH okok wait wait im using the incorrect word(kind of? it's a more vague word, i apologize). @spare fox pardon /genuine

I mean "tone"

"tone" being the writer's specific attitude on things, while "narrative" can mean encompassing the events
I get what you mean, overwatch's events don't assert, they portray. I agree with you

mbmb, i should have said the "tone" in overwatch was that being anti-omnic was not a moral stance

English, why must you have terms that mean "plot events" AND "presenting a story that promotes a set of values" interchangeably
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/narrative
I will use the word "tone" from now on to make sure my communication is more clear, pardon.

[brittle sky]

I mean we don't really know the motives of the siberian omnium. Whether they are true holdouts from the crisis, Volskaya antagonized or aggressed them in some way, or some other thing. I would be very surprised (and disappointed) if the war being enacted by a russian oligarch gets portrayed as morally simple as 'bad robos'.

[brittle sky]

I think that's the new stadium map, not rialto.

[shrewd pivot]

OH mbmb, yeah

[viral pilot]

What does Moira mean by "sweet Idina has grown into a domineering beast" to Orisa?

[brittle sky]

So Orisa is based on and draws many parts from the OR15 unit, a security bot numbani briefly (unsuccessfully) tried to deploy as protectors of their city. They are either upgraded units or successor units of the OR14 Idina, warbots from the Nigerian Omnium that we saw in Honor and Glory. Moira is identifying that Orisa is derived from an Idina into her current rather gung ho (throw energy spears at criminal) self, maybe implying that there's some continuity of self through those refurbishments and retrofits.

[crisp canyon]

Orisa went from protector to defender and changed her protection abilities for offensive ones, it’s just way to nod that Orisa had a rework

[viral pilot]

Oh so it's just OR14 Idina

[brittle sky]

one of these buddies

sweeties, if you will

[viral pilot]

I knew she was an OR14 I just didn't know Idina was also part of its name

[lavish osprey]

Are there any potential Supports among the Junker characters?

[fathom flax]

What is the “company” or whatever it is that Symmetra and the new tank are from, the one that everyone hates for some reason, with the most notable being Lucio.

Is it “Vishkar”? And what do they do that people hate

[brittle sky]

You could arguably point to some of the 'clan' leaders we see in the JQ cinematic (meri of the fixers comes to mind), or the mechanic bruce from wasted land (though he's kinda just working class aussie torb). Mayyybe you could dig into some of the NJC gladiators, though that would make our 3rd gladiator hero. In general there's not too deep a well of characters that seem likely to be future characters, though there's plenty of roles in the Wasteland storyline that could be filled.

[brittle sky]

It's vishkar. They're a development firm, but their projects are often pretty forceful, displacing or otherwise not considering the immediate wellbeing of locals in the name of their vision. They also do general shady company stuff (send goons after lifeweaver to try to enforce their patent for tech he made while associated with them, stealing the credit and ownership of lucio's sonic tech) and are currently aligned with talon in what's effectively global insurance fraud (rights to reconstruct areas damaged by vendetta's attacks).

[fathom flax]

O h

[lavish osprey]

As much as I like Wuyang, JCP, and Mizuki, part of me wants just one giant type of character who supports because he or she has to carry the people who can't help but die

[peak escarp]

Meri could be a Junker support

[lavish osprey]

Baptiste is probably the closest to the "I'm dragging you through this whether you want to or not"

[brittle sky]

While a second old lady would be neat, I don't think she offers much in terms of narrative potential. Lt. of the junker queen who's an engineer in a mech is already taken by the hamster, and 'moderate capo' doesn't have appeal in and of itself.

[lavish osprey]

I really hope they let Jinkx Monsoon's character be a dps or tank haha.

[brittle sky]

presuming she gets a character, why would you say that?

[acoustic ice]

Would Junkrat actually get fan mail or is he lying

[drowsy locust]

is there a voiceline about this?

[acoustic ice]

he has a random game setup voiceline where he talks about fan mail

[glad zenith]

I really hope that detective looking omnic is Maximilien having to go under the radar bc he’s a double agent

Judging off of the lights on his face tho it doesn’t look like him 💔

[wise grotto]

Vishkar are an extremely capitalistic company
They’re hunting Lw csuse he refused to hand his technology over to the. For profit
They’ve blown up buildings to stop competitors
They pulled up to lucios hometown to steal tech and exploit everyone who lived there for labour (and do this in particular a lot) work with talon to make themselves look like heroes by pulling up to places talon destroys of seriously harms and helps “rebuild” them for profits

[civic lynx]

Sadly I doubt it will be 😭

The devs have said multiple times when asked they don’t really know how to make max a hero since he doesn’t have any sort of special talent or skill that can translate into a hero shooter kit

[spare fox]

Yeah I agree with them and I hope they keep some characters npcs like Max

Just because a character exists doesn't mean they need to be a playable hero: same for ppl calling for Emily, Suzie, Sanjay, etc etc

[glad zenith]

No idea YET..

[civic lynx]

I doubt they ever will

Max works better as just a character for the story

There’s nothin about him that makes him really interesting or exciting if made playable

[remote wing]

do u guys think that tracer can hear the melody sigma hears?

[glad zenith]

I still want him

Either they could evolve his character with this years story

Or introduce a really cool gameplay mechanic

[civic lynx]

His story most likely will evolve since he seems to have some sort of plan for vendetta

But that wouldn’t involve anything hinting at him being playable

[glad zenith]

Alright what about this idea

[civic lynx]

It would just be him affecting the lore of the characters we do have/are getting

[glad zenith]

What about an omnic directly working for maximilien and he just follows his commands

I just want Maximilien voice heard during gameplay

Like that omnic detective guy doesn’t speak and Maximilien just gives him orders and tells him “good work” and shit

[civic lynx]

If they ever return to PvE even if it’s a smaller scale thing more like OW1’s archives rather than invasion or OW2 in general I think we would have max be like a narrator to some missions or in cutscenes

[glad zenith]

I agree that max is a great lore character

Because as a double agent surely he has an ulterior motive

I forgot what his motive even is

[civic lynx]

His motive based on the fact he views vendetta as a pawn in his game is whatever benefits him

[glad zenith]

Also is it just me that really doesn’t want dmon

Or whoever that big mech is

[civic lynx]

I think they’re cool but I’m not the most invested

Another meka is long overdue since the community has been asking for one since like 2018 but to me they’re just not as interesting

[glad zenith]

They would seem too similar to DVa

I would’ve preferred one of the other mechs even then

[civic lynx]

Tbh they all seem quite unique

Especially mastermind’s hovering mech is quite different to dva’s

I’d assume none of the others (including d.mon) can eject from the mech since the whole reason we never got a meka hero for a decade is bc dva was hard to program

[glad zenith]

Yeah out of all of them mastermind seems most unique

[crisp canyon]

I still think they’ve definitely figured this out because it’s not 2014 anymore

[cosmic crest]

They did make Echo

Who is even more of a programming mess than Dva

[brittle sky]

I'm sure as a mech and a kit it will be distinguished. I just hope d.mon's likely addition to the cast does not require them shoving aside the gwishin (a deeply interesting faction/entity worth exploring both as a threat and a part of the world), and they do something to distinguish luna's perspective and role to be more unique. 'D.va but serious' or 'D.va but dutiful' feels like it wouldn't be a worthwhile addition.

[civic lynx]

I’m pretty sure they still pulled the hard to program card during OW2 era when asked about a new meka

Never underestimate blizzard’s capacity to be stupid

[civic lynx]

I think the EMP they plan to detonate to counter the gwishin will be seen as a total victory but they reveal it has survived and is coming back with a vengeance in a future season once the OW vs talon war is no longer the main storyline

[brittle sky]

I think that's perfectly possible, but just about the second least interesting thing you could do, second only to it being an actual total victory

[civic lynx]

Tbh 99% of the time they pick the most boring stories anyway so I have little faith this will be different

[brittle sky]

what examples would you say count for that?

[civic lynx]

IMO a lot of the heroes added in OW2 have boring or generic stories and personalities (Illari, ram and to some extent Juno are the only ones I think have good enough stories)

[wise grotto]

That’s cause dvas been repeatedly a mess to program consistently
Like she remained an issue when swapping over where echo didn’t

[glad zenith]

The final “villain” of overwatch would defo be that Finnish AI thingy

[dense garnet]

I still don't think Chernobog's even a villain

[civic lynx]

Same I think chernobog is under the control of someone else

Rather than just being evil without any outside influence

[dense garnet]

I don't think that either

People say Chernobog is evil but don't explain why he's evil other than "well he has the conspiracy eye on his chest"

Which doesn't even look like a 1 to 1 to the same eye symbol imo

For all we know, every god AI is associated with their own different eye symbols

I just think the conspiracy is using Chernobog's security blueprints and Chernobog wants them back, which is why he's infiltrating Helix bases

[crisp canyon]

They also said something about how there would not be another sniper after Ashe released because of how hard it is to make them feel unique, and now we have Freja

And it’s sounding like hero 51 like a sniper

[brittle sky]

I do think they often go for relatively safe and presentable versions of the stories of new ow2 heroes.

[crisp canyon]

I saw something yesterday that apparently hero 54 (far left) player icon was leaked but idk it’s real or not

[brittle sky]

link?

[crisp canyon]

I didn’t save it but it was a white male with white hair and red streaks

[civic lynx]

I think I saw that as well

[brittle sky]

all this kids talking rumors without the common courtesy of showing sources so we can tell how flagrantly made up they are

[glad zenith]

How do we know it’s 54

[glad zenith]

I wanna see it

[brittle sky]

likely just estimation because we have silhouettes lined up for 51-53

[glad zenith]

Oh cus I thought u knew the order for 54 and 55

Where do u even find this portrait

[brittle sky]

no clue. I just asked earlier to see how credible the leak looks.

[glad zenith]

Yh I wanna see too

[flint thicket]

Last week's lore focused on jetpack cat. Any guesses for this week's lore hero?

[peak escarp]

Domina

[flint thicket]

I feel they are saving mizuki for last.

[brittle sky]

nah he's 4th

we have the week by week title of each weekly

[flint thicket]

Oh damn. I did not pay attention to that.

[brittle sky]

3rd is like price of excellence or something very domina. 4th is cursebreaker, which is mizuki, 5th is from the ashes, which is anran and likely following up on the gibraltar attack

[flint thicket]

We shall see in a week if mizuki does break his "curse"

[brittle sky]

Would be too bad if they complete his whole arc and make his whole personality outdated so quickly, but we, uh, kinda got that for vendetta, sooooo

[peak escarp]

we already know the full trajectory of his arc

[flint thicket]

True. But wonder how it will go.

[glad zenith]

Isn’t far left a female or omnic

[shrewd pivot]

For this new 4v4 mobile game, do you think anything will count as canon (like enviorment designs)? Or will it be a noncanon Heroes of the storm situation? iirc there were some npc 'MOBA creep' designs in heroes of the storm for overwatch, but it was noncanon, seemingly.

https://youtu.be/2p0oqXD3voI?si=G2M9RQpiHw7s5Nx1

[peak escarp]

probably noncanon

[shrewd pivot]

That's my thought too, hrm.
I am greedy for canon lore bites lol maybe in another future game.

[brittle sky]

would be a very snatched waist for a human of any sort, and does seem more in their androgynous to femme range of shape language.

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah, the hero (Edit: on the left based on shadow silhouette) is a human cyborg or omnic. I'm hoping omnic

[brittle sky]

no way of seeing if there's any validity to the 'leaks' without a link.

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah! Pardon i meant the shadow silhouette not leaks, let me rephrase

[brittle sky]

sure. I was just saying the folks claiming to see leaks are claiming it contradicts, but without any sourcing I'm not trusting the reports enough to have that discount what we definitely do have (the shadow)

[tranquil current]

How did Freja join talon?.. like how did we get there- she appeared and all of a sudden she’s on there or what?.. I’m not caught up n I love my girl Freja

[brittle sky]

She is a bounty hunter. She got hired on by max (the talon councillor) to track down her mentor, emre, who has since leaving ow become a talon agent. On tracking emre down it became clear that his work for talon is at the behest of a mysterious entity that takes over his mind (theorized by fans to be the God AI previously in charge of global security, Chernobog), which is having him work for talon for its own mysterious ends. Unwilling to leave emre (there's a strong attachment there that many read as romantic), Freja is continuing her contract work for talon.

[dense garnet]

In her reveal, she got hired by Max to locate Emre

She's still under contract so she has to work for Talon

[tranquil current]

Ohhh

[brittle sky]

I don't think she's continuing her work for Talon out of breach of contract concerns.

[dense garnet]

Well I don't think she's pro-overwatch either

She's sorta in the middle where she doesn't really care about what either are doing

She has member of Overwatch she still considers friends probably but I don't think she'd wanna get wrapped up with Overwatch's whole stuff

And breaching her contract is akin to how people break NDA's irl. People would be less inclined to work with someone who could violate a contract

[brittle sky]

I think she's clearly bothered by emre's condition, and her cynicism at overwatch does not equate to her being jazzed with fighting neo-overwatch. I think another life and vendetta's evil plan comment would heavily imply the reason she's sticking through her contract is to help emre more than get her money.

[dense garnet]

Yes Emre too

I didn't count out Emre

I'm just saying that if Emre got better and left, she isn't joining Overwatch regardless

[brittle sky]

she's not joining ow, but I'm not sure she'd see out her contract with max either after what went down with emre.

[glad zenith]

What happened in the ramattra comic I didn’t read it

[brittle sky]

the one with zen or his short story when he was released?

[glad zenith]

The newest one

[brittle sky]

talon took zen to meet ram in london, ram explained a little of what he was up to (verified the omnics he forcibly hatted have their minds preserved in a hidden place hoping to wait out humanity's extinction), offers zen a chance to come with him but respects zen's decision when he refuses, makes some allusion to vendetta's arrival and talon's problems becoming everyone's problems soon.

[vernal wagon]

I lowk realllllyyy want illari to join some form of talon I dunno Shes had so many interactions and likr Shes young and has gone through much which like extremist groups generally target and illari had never really said no and it would be an opening for character development vut I’m pretty sure it will never happen.

[peak escarp]

I could have seen her going that way before she met Soldier, but now I think she's too cautious

[brittle sky]

That was early speculation when she was disconnected, but given she worked with Soldier, and was very standoffish from goals or agendas outside her own, yeah what doc said.

Also, Talon went from a guy who seems generally pretty good at convincing you that Talon is a vehicle for you to get what you want, to a lady that's just 'I'm the best. Join me, so I can use you to take over all of italia."

[crisp canyon]

Is there a canon reason Juno has purple hair

[civic lynx]

https://youtu.be/BWd_QJjBAbM?si=SsBjDEfggFwPOIwJ

[edgy meadow]

there we go

[south torrent]

Thought on the new short story

[lone quartz]

She's just alien

Anyway. What is Mizuki's story and what is he hiding from Kiriko? I've been playing him too much and get killed a few times by her so now i'm curious

[crisp canyon]

Domina seems like she’s inspired by tahani from the good place

[crisp canyon]

He’s just cursed

[south torrent]

Her voice actress is so good I got goosebumps watching this

10/10 casting, She embodies Domina so well

[south torrent]

I saw someone say this in the comments

[crisp canyon]

I wouldn’t be suprised if someone watched that and said what if we made vishkar ceo type with that personality

[civic lynx]

Real also omg beomgyu

[south torrent]

Yesss

[lone quartz]

And what's the curse

[crisp canyon]

We don’t know yet

But it seems like it has something to do with his arm missing, where as Kiriko is blessed by a spirit Mizuki is cursed

[civic lynx]

I believe the thing he’s hiding from Kiri is the fact he’s a double agent (he’s infiltrating the faction Kiri is in but he’s not actually working with them genuinely… yet)

[crisp canyon]

I also love mizuki va him and domina are my favorites

[south torrent]

Same those two are my favorites of the new 5

Mizu’s va is so funny on twt

[civic lynx]

Domina is the only va I truly love out of the new 5 sadly

The others are talented but they’re not great like domina

[south torrent]

The cat was good too but like it’s Jen Hale so of course it’s good

[crisp canyon]

I just realized on the roadmap, Route 66 is getting the Gibraltar treatment next season, I think this confirms Frankie is coming to the game

[south torrent]

YES I need Frankie

[civic lynx]

I’m still pretty certain in s2 is helix’s head of security

But route 66 is still a major part of S2’s lore so that’s why it’s there

[south torrent]

I’m excited for season 3

[civic lynx]

That Tokyo map better be good

[south torrent]

I need the hashimoto hero too

[crisp canyon]

Frankie fits the description of the silhouette and her name is sprayed on a building in the stadium version

[south torrent]

I hopes she’s another higher up type character like Domina

[crisp canyon]

When you kinda look at how the 5 were all hinted at this past year in game it’s makes sense for Frankie to be one of the next 5 I don’t think that detail would be there otherwise

[lone quartz]

That might be one of the reason why Hanzo's on his tail like how Doakes do

[crisp canyon]

And if we’re gonna get the Tokyo market as the map in season 3 with hashimoto hero it makes sense to have a deadlocke hero with the Route 66 map change

[civic lynx]

I wonder how/if busan will change for S4

[south torrent]

Oooo maybe the mechs will be moved

[civic lynx]

Could also be junkertown or NJC that changes if mauga meeting JQ happens in s4

[south torrent]

Or at least d.mons

Her room could be opened too

[civic lynx]

It would be cool but ig a bit repetitive if they did another war destroyed redesign for busan where they detonate the emp to stop the gwishin, it fails then the gwishin launches a large scale attack on the city that partially succeeds

[crisp canyon]

The junkers might attack Busan

But they didnt use a photo of it for the roadmap

Just shows Queen and dva looking like they’re fighting each other

[glad zenith]

New junk city 2

Wrecking ball lore season 4 pls

Make him help dva

[brittle sky]

• basic instinct on catching this character in a moment of doubt is a good one shows the cracks a bit.
• voice acting seems well done. I can quibble the prose in story form, but very possible it was written with the pure speech form in mind.
• playing up the envy and insecurity angle feels like a mixed bag. Gives some humanity to Domina, but feels a little of the 'explain a way a female villain's villainy through emotions' trope they said they specifically wanted to avoid with the likes of vendetta.
• the level of masking and some other remarks will definitely fuel some fans into reading her as neurodivergent in a kind of parallel with sym.
• while we're presented as a deep and somewhat sympathetic dive into her perspective, the result (that she seems ready to hijack a dedication to architects to insist on her own important) is some absolute bananas behavior.
• I do wonder if the writers might be going too hard into 'write what you know', if we keep seeing this thread of crushing family expectations. Like, the key to making human characters in fantastical settings like overwatch is to center in on universal human experiences, but the hero release seems to be like... 60% characters being crushed under unreasonable family expectations and legacies and massively compensating, and half the remaining 40% is a cat.

[dawn topaz]

I agree with the last point we should get like 5 more widowtracer battles which people will use to fuel the ship (as they should)

Jokes aside I definitely think the newer characters need to interact more with eachother and the rest of the cast

Alot of them feel like branches on a tree that go nowhere

In other cases I feel like certain new factions were not really needed when other characters haven't really been doing anything in the overarching story

I love Hazard but the Phreaks are just...kind of there

[shrewd pivot]

I agree with all your points, well put.
Though the neurodivergent aspect you brought up might be more so Vaira facing sexism, as that aspect was explored with Vaira and Vendetta in thier short story together. Unless neurodivergence gets brought up somewhere that i didn't see prior, pardon.

Like. This is now yet another character directly about bucking around family legacy pressures. Wuyang, Anran, Vendetta, Vaira, even Mizuki with his family bad luck curse heavy on his shoulders and working for the Hashimoto.

I also agree with you now, I feel like Vaira does indeed steal some of Symmetra's thunder for her complexity atp.

I do think it's really funny tho that Vaira is a nepo baby crying "nooo im not a nepo baby MY talent(cough not artful hard light talent but negotiation talent cough) made Vishkar great" while conveniently ignoring all the work and talent the employee architects brought to Vishkar, and the fact Vaira is indeed a nepo baby that inherited Vishkar "dynasty". Her charismatic hypocrisy and ego is much more effective "love to hate" villain writing than Vendetta is atm imo.

[dawn topaz]

Echo hasn't been relevant since the overwatch 2 trailer because nobody played the mediocre PvE slop 🥀

[shrewd pivot]

We def need another phreak on the roster, ideally one that shows off some gnarly body mods

[dawn topaz]

Recluse...

[civic lynx]

I really hope they actually make the ow or talon conquest skin canon to the story and it gives her some sort of relevance again

[shrewd pivot]

Peak....

[dawn topaz]

But yeah, there is some heroes where I'd argue they fit into the story better due to already theoretically existing previously

Ramattra, Junker Queen, Mauga

They all fit nicely as they were already established or atleast, mentioned/referenced

But what does Water College and Fire University do?

[shrewd pivot]

Pretend to be Wuxing lmafo (it's VERY scuffed westernized Wuxing rep)

I personally don't mind new faction imo, like the phreaks are cool and the inti warriors are interesting (Illari ultimately relates to the eye conspiracy plotline too, so it all gets connected in the end)

I think it is inevitable we will get more "factions out of the blue" popping up as more countries and cultures are explored. A mix of old lore refs + new factions is my preference.

I just want less botched writing like Wuxing university tho. Please writers, do some proper research into the pulp fiction you are referencing 💔 Wuyang and Anran SHOULD have been the fun levels of camp for Wuxia, that Cassidy is for Spaghetti westerns.

[full dome]

is there any imporant recent lore that isnt vendetta 'killing' doom

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta is in charge of Talon, made allies with Deadlock gang and Hashimoto gang, plans to steal something from Grand Mesa, sent Mauga to negotiate with the Junkers, and attacked overwatch Gibraltar HQ. https://overwatch.blizzard.com/en-us/media/comic/vengeance-comes/

[past copper]

So. You think any of the new heroes will have connections to the Talon traitors?

[shrewd pivot]

It isn't out of the question I suppose :o
Sombra, Reaper and Widowmaker seem to be lying low for the moment.

[brittle sky]

The emphasis on masking and the idea that her natural inclinations (organic like hardlight) was quashed by her family can definitely be read as the expectations around growing up AFAB, but there's definitely potential fodder for those who want to read her as neurospicy.

[peak escarp]

I like the detail of her preferring to walk on the ground in private

also the confirmation of mag-lev tech in her wardrobe (probably the things on her calves)

[shrewd pivot]

Oh for sure.

I suppose I read it as more so as sexist ettiquite imposed upon Vaira to appear as a "flawless woman in charge" kind of deal. She has insecurities about people judging her, frustrated she can't show her true potential all about mememeeee kinda deal bc she feels undervalued.

Let me read the... text version? of the story actually that will probably help a ton lol. Brb

[brittle sky]

what, you mean she didn't just affirmation max herself to shambalic enlightenment or pay for a very expensive surgery putting a singularity in her brain matter?

[shrewd pivot]

Oh im criiieeeeen already
"Vaira had bought herself fifteen minutes. It hadn’t been
difficult—she could buy herself anything once she set her mind to it—but it
felt like an achievement, nonetheless."
Pffffft I kind of love how conceited Vaira is. Peak corpo villain.

Oh it's "Architechnical" that's a really fun scifi jargon word ngl! /genuine Yay lore

Architectural + technology, fits Hard light architect sciences well.

"Well, if I must deliver this speech tonight, I should at least be
well-rehearsed" 😭 😭 😭 😭 lady you have 15 minutes left and they are giving you a script to read that you don't even approve of, this is hilarious

[shrewd pivot]

"The screen flickered, and she took
brief pleasure in imagining it to be something alive and perhaps intimidated by
her vitriol."

" But when she was alone, Vaira liked to feel the
earth beneath her feet. The pinch in her heels and the weight of her own body kept her grounded. It all reminded her that she was still here—that she existed
outside the public eye."

"Vaira had always found it easier to focus while on the move. When she was
expending less energy on looking poised, she could better direct her thoughts
toward the matter at hand. Sitting for family portraits as a child, for example,
had always been a nightmarish exercise in restraint."

Ok yeah this short story reads way different from the video (of course it does--),

Vaira possibly being neurospicy, I could see it.

[brittle sky]

it's not the only read, just a read for people who want it.

[shrewd pivot]

For sure!

I am live time reading and like:

"She studied her features closely. Through the makeup, she saw the faint
beginnings of lines around her eyes. When she brushed aside her fringe to look
closer, she noticed the weight of the gold strands—and how much thinner her
natural hair felt in contrast.
“No,” she chided. “Just give them what they want. Deliver the speech. Hand
out the award. Smile.” "

Are the writers seriously trying to pull a "Vaira is dealing with the sexist ageism of image in the public" while not making Vaira... actually an older woman character??? Like Vaira could have been older looking and older in age omg lmafo that isn't reading the room at all.

[dawn topaz]

Blizzard making a neurospicy person the villain #notverywokeofyou

[shrewd pivot]

Lol but we have neurospicy heroes and neutrals tbf

[brittle sky]

yeah definitely a moment where it would land better if she was north of 40

[shrewd pivot]

Need that tf2 administrator inspo injected into Vaira ASAP 😭

"“They want you to be perfect, Vaira.”
At the edge of the stage, beyond the velvet curtain, Vaira glimpsed an image
of herself displayed above the podium. She looked stunning.
“It’s a good thing you are.”"

Ok this line hits SO DIFFERENT from the video. Like it's a sad statement of being forced to be perfect, not actually a confident one like in the video.

The story felt a lot slower paced with breathing room, anxious, and more scared-insecure than the video did.

Sigh. When will voice direction do thier job, the video is cool ofc, but the story's mood is entirely different from the video.

I will take the text version as the canon then.

[crisp canyon]

Not really lol

[shrewd pivot]

I do think it's... a choice... to have both Vaira and Wuyang have toxic perfection as the family standard, and both characters struggle with achieving that expected excellency. Vaira is able to create the facade of perfection, Wuyang is just genuinely trying his best.

With Vaira it seems like her creative talents were never allowed to grow bc of her family's perfect standard, but it could have been that she wasn't going to be a prodigy regardless.

[edgy meadow]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1074715474522288148/1121705328833212446/Mitosis.gif

[shrewd pivot]

Hello @edgy meadow what did you think about the new Vaira lore story

[edgy meadow]

I enjoy parallels, and I think that legacy and family is supposed to be the major theme of the narrative this season

we'll see how that holds up as the year goes on

but thats something ive personally picked up early on

overwatch was already a very knit-tight found family group under the layer of the organization Winston wanted to reform

so it makes sense theyre pushing the first narrative cycle in this direction

[edgy meadow]

i liked it

i dont have much to say about it since its mostly just an inspection of the character rather than the development (which granted is probably most of what theyre doing this season) but it was solid

[brittle sky]

I guess Vaira is just after she's taken all the aussie immortality juice.

[edgy meadow]

im still very happy to have a vishkar character thats deeply involved with the role of the organization in global affairs and im curious to see how the corpo, and Vaira along it, aree tugged around as the war continues

[shrewd pivot]

Yeye! I am def getting that vibe too. With a rebrand, it might even be topical with tackling the weight of legacy lol.

I just hope characters can get more than family legacy pressure as a main story focus this year. 😅 ...especially if its with characters from asian households, the family legacy bit starts to be... a bit stereotypical. And Vendetta being a mafia daughter is all loads of stereotype i don't need to rehash lol.

I think perhaps legacy in general would be an interesting focus for this year. I say that bc I wonder how the trenchcoat omnic could lean into the pressures of family legacy considering awakened omnics don't have that kind of parental lineage.

[edgy meadow]

i dont think all characters should tackle it from the same angle, but im expecting most/all of them to tackle it in some way

[shrewd pivot]

I agree, save for the ageism bit, it read very well. And yeah, seems like these stories are akin to hero origin stories.

[edgy meadow]

i read the ageism bit as moreso demonstrating an obsession rather than the struggle coming from actually being old

Vaira is like what, 30?

[shrewd pivot]

Oh same!
I just think that Vendetta and Vaira share similarity in the presentation of perfection, dealing with being forced into etiquette, etc.
And Anran and Wuyang and Vaira share similarities in it being toxic family expectations of perfection.

Mizuki is more nuanced, but still deals with baring a family curse if badluck thus anxiety from family legacy.

JPC is meowmeowmeow

And Emre seems to be lost in the eye conspiracy lore sauce for the moment not related to family legacy really

[edgy meadow]

but if your expectation, set by yourself or otherwise, is to present perfection, youd always want to be younger

[edgy meadow]

the comparison between the wuxing siblings and Varia is very strong, I agree. Vendetta, not as much, i think she tackles the theme of family and legacy from a different angle enough that it doesnt feel redundant

[brittle sky]

I mean i think the family curse is almost definitely self fulfilling/psychosomatic in there

[edgy meadow]

namely that Vendetta isnt deying expectations but fighting to restore them

to a radical degree

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah it's more so the meta context of writing a young looking character that could have EASILY been older, as fretting over her age/looks. It feels kind of aloof with meta context. Having Vaira actually BE older would have made the point hit harder.

[edgy meadow]

i think theres a subtle realist irony in her not being that old but still obsessive with her age

but i get your point

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah that's my guess too, if not some conspiracy nonsense haha

[edgy meadow]

if your goals are unrealistic so will your obsessions

thats the way i read the age-centric part of the story

which is why im fine with it

if we can have people in their 20s in real life obsessing about looking young i dont think its stretched to have a 30 year old women following the same obsession

[edgy meadow]

Mizuki's story is the one im most interested in seeing this season, I think he has a ton of potential as both a lead to his own narrative branch and as a roleplayer on the hashimoto/shimada/yokai front

family will definitely play a role - it already kinda does. im mostly curious to see how Mizuki processes the feeling of being torn between two worlds and duties

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah Vendetta is different enough, but idk they both relate a lot over the ettiquite and being undervalued and the legacy that haunts them motivating thier current day actions. Vendetta's ALL ABOUT EMOTIONS while Vaira is all about hiding emotions.

Ig i compare the two bc Vaira is a much better "love to hate" villainess than Vendetta, but the writers said they wrote Vendetta as the villainess you "love to hate"

[edgy meadow]

i think vendetta will be a stronger "love to hate" character down the line, but so far Vaira's flaws are much lower fruits to pick with her role as a top executive in the notorious Vishkar

[edgy meadow]

also, the way i interpreted the short story between the two, the tension basically gave the feeling of two businesspeople who only co-operate because stabbing each other in the back right this moment would not be a good look to either side. They respect each other but also hate each other's guts, is what im saying.

[shrewd pivot]

Oh I agree! My comment isn't that it's unrealistic or ooc for Vaira, it's the meta context.

An actual point would be made if Vaira actually WAS older, but with the recent Anran face looking way too young, among the various young looking ladies on the roster already, it feels pretty aloof for writers to have Vaira's character at her age making a big deal about worrying about looking old. The moment was to show Vaira is not actually perfect, that she has wrinkles, but the subtext shows it's about ageism too-- which is hysterical to put on a 32 year old VP who looks very young for her age, she doesn't even have wrinkles on her 3d model. That's what I mean by meta context.

[edgy meadow]

especially with Vendetta pulling Vishkar's reputation as an argument to pressure them into submission

[edgy meadow]

valid

[shrewd pivot]

Fair! There def was an improvement with Vendetta's writing in the latest comic, so I hope Vendetta's character gets the care in writing her character deserves.

[edgy meadow]

Vendetta just needs to do more stuff. it feels like her development and role in the narrative is a very slow cook. but Im fully expecting her to do enough things in 3 seasons that put her above Vaira as a Villain

Vaira just naturally presents as the entitled and self-centric corporate elite, a trope thats much easier to hate at a first glance than 'warrior girl with beeg sword'

[prisma briar]

There is no lore in overwatch stop yapping for no reason

[shrewd pivot]

I see that. I also think Vendetta saw a kindred spirit in a way there, she noted how Vaira ettiquite poised just like Vendetta had been taught. Vendetta made a deal with blackmail, but still allowed Vaira's conditions of if anything goes wrong, Talon takes the fall not Vishkar.

Vendetta also seemingly acts this 'kindred spirit' way to Widowmaker (not canon ic, but Vendetta says its a shame that Widowmaker didn't chose to hunt by her side she would have sought vengeance beyond her own)

(By kindred spirit I do not mean actual sibling, just that Vendetta sees bits of herself in them in a way)

[prisma briar]

only a little story to keep you guys entertained

that omniacs or omnium stuff sucks

[edgy meadow]

https://gif.fxtwitter.com/tweet_video/HBp70kgXIAA37o3.gif

[shrewd pivot]

We waited like 10 years, ill take what I can get 😁

[edgy meadow]

w ragebait

anyway

[prisma briar]

Don't loose your tome with the "lore" , they add new characters every months of course they didn't have VENDETTA written in their books back then in 2016

The story has no meaning and no ending

[dawn topaz]

The story is the friends we made along the way

[prisma briar]

As long as we will play to the game they'll find new things to add , don't waste your time with this fake story

[dawn topaz]

Like Widowtracer ship art

[prisma briar]

ONE PIECE aaah ending

[edgy meadow]

i can see where this comes fron, I just personally felt there was just as much tension was respect in the dialogue

[prisma briar]

I'm french and in France nobody is interested in the story of Overwatch

[shrewd pivot]

Tell that to the year long arc this year that they planned!
Ik overwatch lore isn't a direct story, it's worldbuilding, and I like worldbuilding. So I like the bits of lore we get, bc i enjoy overwatch worldbuilding :)

[dawn topaz]

that's the canon ending of Overwatch, Widowmaker is now free of Moira and as such the mindfuckery will decrease and eventually she will turn good out of guilt

and then she joins as the third member of Tracer and Emily's relationship

[prisma briar]

Don't you have anything else to enjoy ?

Enjoy your family, enjoy your cat, enjoy the world

Not gaddamn Vendetta

[boreal oxide]

[edgy meadow]

youre too chill mate dont feed the ragebaiters

[dawn topaz]

And Jack and Gabriel also reconcile and become good friends again

[shrewd pivot]

Many things! I am autistic, and Overwatch is a special interest of mine. :) so seeing new worldbuilding and lore brings me joy.

I don't personally enjoy Vendetta haha

[dawn topaz]

and they die in war together

[prisma briar]

That's very simple, if you keep talking in this chat about the lore I will talk to the mods and you will get banned

[lost axle]

Story of overwatch is compelling enough to make you think, but it'll never be truly completed without a significant story campaign, or actual payoffs

[dawn topaz]

like lovers

[boreal oxide]

[prisma briar]

Oh, you're autistic!

[shrewd pivot]

I agree

[prisma briar]

I find a lot of guys like you in solo q

[dawn topaz]

what's that supposed to mean

[boreal oxide]

mods kill this guy

[lost axle]

Fella dexter is Sigmamaxxing

[prisma briar]

My ranked teammates :

[boreal oxide]

sigma has standards

[lost axle]

The universe sings to him

[shrewd pivot]

If that's a microaggression against autistic people, I feel sorry for you that you have so much hate in your heart.

[prisma briar]

What are you exactly?

Naruto Uzumaki ?

[shrewd pivot]

Oh that WAS a microaggression against autistic people. Please learn kindness.

[boreal oxide]

it is not a micro aggression this guy’s just ableist

[prisma briar]

I love a lot of autistic people. Sherlock holmes, Dr House, L from death note...

[boreal oxide]

as in calling it just a microaggression is an understatement

[prisma briar]

Sadly there's no Sherlock holmes with me in solo q

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah it is blatent ableism now unfortunately

[lost axle]

L ragebait

[boreal oxide]

you’re french you genuinely cant be making fun of people dexter

[edgy meadow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/395993166878343169/1460268108114825450/image0.gif

[prisma briar]

So much hate in your heart...

[boreal oxide]

nymble from phantasmal flames mentioned

[shrewd pivot]

Hey now, im not sure the French claim this ableist haha

[prisma briar]

I mean I don't have anything against autism, but

[boreal oxide]

the FUCK do you mean but

[edgy meadow]

real

[shrewd pivot]

Anyways Symmetra is canonically autistic so teehee :)

[boreal oxide]

junkrat is canonically diagnosed with being australian ❤️

[prisma briar]

But sometimes, these autistic guys are just not able to play videogames. Especially when they play tank

[dawn topaz]

nothing to do with autism

[prisma briar]

It's related

[boreal oxide]

sigma is diagnosed to be a victim of being a physics student

can someone modmail already this guy is trying wayyy too hard to be funny

[dawn topaz]

unlikely

your teammates are just bad

[shrewd pivot]

If you aren't trolling, some people on the spectrum do have motor skill disabilities. I myself am pretty clumsy.

But many autistic people are very good at videogames and have good motor skills and reaction times. Autism is a spectrum, and each person has different levels of symptoms. So please don't lump every person on the autistic spectrum into one bucket.

[boreal oxide]

widowmaker is diagnosed with being blue

[dawn topaz]

@unborn mica sorry for the ping but this Dexter guy is being somewhat ableist

[lost axle]

You can't rly determine if someone's autistic by their skill ceiling

[boreal oxide]

baptiste is diagnosed with having immense swag

[lost axle]

Some lads are just garbage

[boreal oxide]

thank you bro finally

fun favt i just joined this server like 2 minutes ago and this is what i see

[edgy meadow]

i modmailed the team

i assumed theyd respond

[boreal oxide]

thanks cooters

[edgy meadow]

guess next time i just have to annoy the mods

https://tenor.com/view/snorbbler-snorbler-manatee-the-snorbler-the-snorbbler-gif-14493384683725054374

anyway

[boreal oxide]

oh they muted him yay

[dawn topaz]

I did too

[boreal oxide]

[dawn topaz]

Anyways I should write Overwatch from now on

[edgy meadow]

this is usually one of the most chill channels trust, this guy just came in outta nowhere to troll

[dawn topaz]

Ramattra x D.Va is CANON

[boreal oxide]

FALSE

[dawn topaz]

Solider 76 x Reaper is CANON

[boreal oxide]

ramattra x REINHART

[dawn topaz]

Genci is canon

uhh

[boreal oxide]

reaper x mauga

have you heard the interaction

[dawn topaz]

Mauga x Baptiste*

[boreal oxide]

reaper gets all flustered

[shrewd pivot]

I thinks mods will get out the wiffle bat for 'shipping fan fiction' discussions in the lore channel haha

[dawn topaz]

he's just jealous of those pecs

[boreal oxide]

mauga just pulls hella hoes /pos

venture x ME is canon

(i am getting selfship art of my sona and them done soon c:)

[boreal oxide]

oh dang thats not allowed here?

dang

[lost axle]

Back to lore

[dawn topaz]

nothing in the rules says anything about it in general, but fanfiction is not to be discussed here

[boreal oxide]

oh fair enough

however me and venture IS CANON AND IS NOT FANFICTI i’ll stop sorry

[lost axle]

Ya think Doomfist is gonna be back with a new faction or he'll meet some older chat acts ts?

[boreal oxide]

and they say

[lost axle]

characters?

[boreal oxide]

doomfist rework

[lost axle]

Doomfist support with a Lifeweaver produced healfist

[boreal oxide]

bloomfist

[lost axle]

Crazy

[brittle sky]

bit of an age gap there, given you'd be like 60+

[shrewd pivot]

Hm. I do feel like a big solo return for doomfist would be pretty dramatic and fun, but Doomfist building back up with some new allies by his side would be interesting too! It's really hard to say how Doomfist will exactly return.

[boreal oxide]

wha

oh igwym

[lost axle]

I'd rather pair him up with some less lore relevant characters atm

Cuz some lads are

[boreal oxide]

didnt mean it that way i meant my sona dingus 😭

enough talk abt that

[shrewd pivot]

A reminder: Jack Morrison is a Zoomer

[boreal oxide]

maybe uhh

[shrewd pivot]

https://tenor.com/view/soldier76-overwatch-67-meme-jack-morrison-gif-10260015071089858250

[boreal oxide]

whats her name

[boreal oxide]

i know and i wish i didnt

[lost axle]

Shit idk

Echo?

Nah, unfeasible

[boreal oxide]

i started playing OW again about 4 weeks ago (for reference i dropped ow around 2023-4) and oh my goodness this game has changed

[shrewd pivot]

Fair! Not sure who Akande could ally up with atm tho. Unless you mean non roster characters?

[boreal oxide]

oh yeah speaking of non roster characters, frankie

[lost axle]

I mean, Sombra/Reaper/widow for once + some renegades like Roadhog?

[boreal oxide]

pretty sure theyre doing something with the junkers soon enough

[shrewd pivot]

People are saying the drone hero might be Frankie bc "hacker looking" and the map background being deadlock gang related.

I personally think the character looks too military type, bc of the hat. So i don't think it will be frankie. Might be helix...?

[boreal oxide]

yes that

[lost axle]

Mauga is going to junkertown

But the thing is that only jq and ball are there atm

[boreal oxide]

frankie has not been shown in any novel but has been described plenty

[lost axle]

Cuz ratjunk and hog are exiled still

[boreal oxide]

oh right

mauga bowling hammond

[shrewd pivot]

I mean, idk. I don't think the drone hero will be Frankie. But we shall wait and see

[brittle sky]

again: there is a tablet in the powder mine map that's all about hyping up helix's new big strong security chief. That sort of tease doesn't go nowhere.

[shrewd pivot]

Exactly! Pardon for not mentioning that bit too

[shrewd pivot]

Idk about Roadhog but hm Sombra seems more chill with Doomfist but Widowmaker seems to think Doomfist didn't act enough and Reaper disagreed with Doomfist's leadership choices of ignoring Vendetta prior to Vendetta's takeover. Hard to say tho

[fleet scaffold]

Help me understand something. Is Vaira canonically someone who has no talent with hard light projections?

The lore drop kinda makes it feel like she's had to learn everything from scratch.

[cinder estuary]

When did Mauga fight DF to a draw?

[shrewd pivot]

Vaira is not artfully gifted like Symmetra is. The recent text story maybe implied Vaira's parents stifled any creative endeavors that were not "perfect" from Vaira. That, or maybe Vaira would never have been a prodigy even with support. Either way, Vaira doesn't seem to 'get' art.

Regardless, Vaira is working very hard to maintain a facade of effortless perfection. Her character doesn't really seem to have a knack for artful design, she values money and status more so. She bought her tech and seemingly studied hard to be where she is. She seems to be a fantastic negotiator though.

[shrewd pivot]

I believe Mauga having a draw in a fight with Doomfist is how Mauga joined Talon. I am unsure exactly around what time this happened, maybe someone else like @peak escarp can answer.

[crisp canyon]

It’s entirely possible if helix is working with talon now and deadlocke as well someone like Frankie would probably have more of talon operative look now than just cowboy

Adding another cowgirl type would confuse players by silhouette esp if she is a sniper 2

[shrewd pivot]

Would Helix be working for Talon tho? If so, Vendetta wouldn't need to sneak into Helix controlled Grand Mesa with Emre's help, Vendetta would have used a Helix ally to sneak in.

[crisp canyon]

I honestly don’t remember atm what helix exact relationship to talon is, but I still stand by that it wouldn’t make sense for her to look similar to Ashe or Cassidy, esp if she’s using something similar to what looks like Sojourns gun and tech like the dragonfly bot, and deadlocke with being with talon

[shrewd pivot]

Oh I agree, i think Frankie should look distinct!

I just don't think Frankie is the drone hero tbh, it's probably a Helix hero bc of the military hat and Helix lore text bits on the powder keg mine map

Helix these days are more so army for hire seemingly. But not super Talon affiliated as far as we know...?

[crisp canyon]

I just read thru some lore pieces on her she doesn’t seem like her and Ashe are connected anymore in terms of communication, and she left deadlocke around ashes 18th birthday, and was apart of multiple gangs being a hacker for higher, she could’ve ended up at helix with her abilities

Which ig would explain the new look, given the description of her is from when Ashe and Cassidy were teenagers, but the biggest giveaway it’s Frankie is the drone, because the look is pretty much what is described

[sullen girder]

You think venture’s team will join overwatch? I mean they seem to have beef with talon due to the whole stealing artifacts thing

[crisp canyon]

Nah not important enough I don’t think probably saving it for when Anubis comes back

[brisk notch]

2cp is coming back?

[edgy meadow]

its not

[crisp canyon]

Never give up hope soldier

[acoustic tusk]

im reading the rebuilding ruins short story right now and my heart is absolutely shattered. I need to yell at someone about this 😭😭 satya and niran .... ouuuhhh they mean a lot to me

[acoustic tusk]

the way it goes from calling lw "niran" to "bua" :(((

[viral pilot]

Hey sorry if this was asked already but that new mobile game isn't going to introduce anything story wise will it?

NVM it just looks noncannon

[remote burrow]

They are SUCH a great example of a harmonious friendship between people perceived as opposites… and the fact that their relationship is based on such strong trust for each other makes me want to see more of that from the lore

[acoustic tusk]

YES!!!!!! YOU GET IT!!!!!!!!!!! I need to consume every bit of information possible about the two of them. My darlings OUUHHH

characters strongly affected by vishkar mean the world to me. except for domina idk much about her yet

[remote burrow]

I hope they really will put a bigger emphasis on the story now that the story tab is actually in game

[acoustic tusk]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

please im begging overwatch

blizzard if you can hear us GIVE US MORE LOOOREE

[remote burrow]

Domina seems verryyyy interesting to me right now… she seems immoral and heartless but in the recent video they published it seems like she forces herself into a role she does not even fully understand

[acoustic tusk]

ooh really? is the video on yt I haven't seen it yet

[remote burrow]

Yeah she seems uncertain about her identity as an heir to vishkar, and because of that uncertainty she just plunges herself into propagating vishkar’s connections and power just to distract herself

Thats how i interpreted it at least

[acoustic tusk]

well now im invested tysm . Ill look into it after school tomorrow because I need to sleep LMAO

[remote burrow]

Gn

[past copper]

So. Who bets the award Domina gave out went to Symmetra

[spare fox]

I was thinking/expecting it to be Symmetra at first, but the thing is, I don't think it's that important to Domina so from her POV, we would never find out

after all, it's all about her and how she's seen

[regal heath]

Lore chat? I just want to see Roadhog's face, man.

[dawn topaz]

So much lore yet no lore

[broken eagle]

Real

[grave saddle]

I would like to see a lot more lore in a written format. Just because it’s quicker to not have art to coincide with art and not every bit of lore needs a visual. Like it would be cool to have more lore written in game about the canon skins, the hero bacsktories, etc

It would be cool to see the lore summaries for each characters era they have on the website in game also

Even non canon skins having small bits of writing on them that kinda sum up the thoughts behind the design in a fictional medium. It would add a nice level of development behind the skins

Especially mythics

[hot rivet]

only one more lore drop left until chapter 1 is done for the lore menu

[shrewd pivot]

Oh I thought 2 were there, Mizuki vid and Anran vid? :o

[brittle sky]

It's actually likely more. Notably last season they upped the amount of slots at the midseason, and given they have been doing 1 lore drop per hero on their themed week, their is likely at least 2 more (1 for Mizuki next week, 1 for Anran week 5), and week 5 is just past the midseason. So that, and any remaining lore, will likely get slots then.

[regal heath]

I want Emre's cyber posession to tie in with Echo, and because Echo is an Omnic, it will tie in with Zenyatta and Ramattra, like an evil Omnic thing possessing a human sounds like something the Omnic brothers would be interested in.

[peak escarp]

technically Echo isn't an omnic

[brittle sky]

So okay, a few nerdy distinctions:
Echo is not technically an omnic. She was made by Dr. Liao, one of the big minds behind the Omnics, but Omnics refer to a generation of created robots made by Omnica Corporation and subcontractors (most commonly the civilian model like Zen and Mondatta, but including both security/warbots like Bastion and the Ravagers, special tactical units made by the Anubis AI) who notably received a kind of enlightening/uplift when the prototype Omnic AI Aurora dispersed her consciousness.

Echo is not part of that generation, and was not part of the enlightenment event. She has come to her own awareness through a much messier, trial and error, (for lack of a term, organic) process. She's cousin to omnics, and a kind of artificial life like them, but outside that key fragile generation of enlightened omnics.

God AIs, like the entity speculated (with ample evidence) to be possessing Emre, are an entire third category of being, huge aministrative AIs with massive supercomputer bases that were in pre-crisis charged with global issues. They have been portrayed thus far as not actually sentient, just massively intelligent algorithms, but there's some decent speculation that such portrayals are a human oversight and they are more intelligent/aware than we thought, either on their own or because of some interaction with Aurora's enlightenment event.

So while both Echo (being a later project of Aurora's creator) and God AIs (one of their number having used pre-enlightened omnics to wage the Omnic crisis) are relevant to Omnics and likely of interest to big picture omnics like Zen and Ram, neither are Omnics per se.

[vernal wagon]

I’m a starving child who wants more illari lore feed me blizzard feed me

[jaunty gorge]

I got more Sigma lore... but at what cost

[brittle sky]

you read lucky man?

[vernal wagon]

I can read

I might’ve misinterpreted that

[brittle sky]

Sorry, Lucky Man is a short story centering Soldier but prominently features Illari

I was asking if you've read that.

[vernal wagon]

Ooohhhh

[wise grotto]

Omg that is the funniest damn way to word this

[brittle sky]

wait no, lucky man or futures past

[vernal wagon]

I will now hehe I forgot I hadn’t read all the short stories I have read the comics cuz I’m very awsome

[brittle sky]

I mixed those up! You want futures past for Illari lore:

https://overwatch.blizzard.com/en-us/media/short-story/futures-past/

[vernal wagon]

Thank u thank u thank u

[jaunty gorge]

Are there any short stories or comics that have Sigma lore

[brittle sky]

Not much. A reaper centric short story reveals how Talon nabbed him, but he's not really the center of that.

[jaunty gorge]

Eh, I'll take it

At this point, I'm just glad we have a lore update for him. I hope someone frees grandpa soon

[silent rose]

I really don’t think anyone, Talon or Overwatch, is ready for the full potential of Sigma. Like- the man has SO much untapped power

[gritty abyss]

is wrecking ball in overwatch

[wooden drift]

Nuh

Cut character

[gritty abyss]

i mean like

the organization

[peak escarp]

no

he's the Junker Queen's champion

[vernal wagon]

guys have u seen the overwatch tik tok thing where widow is like way more pale than normal

https://www.tiktok.com/@overwatch/video/7609054954376023310?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc&web_id=7601186042830423574

[gritty abyss]

i thought so, thank you

[edgy meadow]

i dont see widow being more pale than normal here

[vernal wagon]

shes way more pale smt shes way less purple.

[peak escarp]

it's probably just lighting

[spare fox]

Widow is def going to get a (minor) rework and a visual redesign to go with it

[vernal wagon]

i dont have image perms but when they go close up u can def see it

[brittle sky]

why do people assume that every lore development will come with a mechanical rework?

like, not every time a character goes through a trial or change should they get a character rework

[wooden drift]

Some people just want characters reworked, I guess

And they wanna reason for it

[lavish osprey]

hmm, so the Overwatch map is getting hacked by Sombra I think

its all glitchy when it wasn't last week

The Talon side it seems OW made some ground

[edgy meadow]

which map

[lavish osprey]

in the event

I don't recall it being glitched last week

I'll take a picture after this match

[lavish osprey]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/117109898420027400/1476281946488307925/image.png?ex=69a08e34&is=699f3cb4&hm=dc6bd265ccda6fe1e8ef58c935e0e475646f09231cb3cfb663e4757baf396771&=&format=webp&quality=lossless

I don't have embed permissions but thats it

it might just be damage

[dry pebble]

Does anyone has the image of Emre's record icon "We see all" as HD

[deep bolt]

where do you like watch the overwatch story start to like whats currently up?

[crisp canyon]

Just look it up on YouTube

[crisp canyon]

For what

[crisp canyon]

Sombra isn’t affiliated with talon anymore and her hacking has a signature of the sugar skull

[lavish osprey]

I mean I associate the glitch effect with her too

[spare fox]

it's just a prediction of mine based on shakey circumstantial evidence

[crisp canyon]

Frankie is also a hacker

[spare fox]

mostly that she ran off along with Reaper and Sombra - who are also slated for reworks. And Widow has always been a very divisive character gameplay-wise

I don't think they'll take away her one-shot but idk... I'm not a game designer lol I imagine they have something up their sleeves, if a rework or kit change is in store

[cunning copper]

I'm still confused on how moral ramattra is

[crisp canyon]

Reaper isn’t slated for a rework

[edgy meadow]

why do people keep expecting characters to be reworked due to lore

genuine

[spare fox]

I thought they confirmed he was recently? I know they had planned it last year and decided against it, but more recently? I could be wrong

[spare fox]

for me, not necessarily due to lore, but they did mention in the spotlight that they are going to be looking a number of the legacy heroes, for reworks and kit adjustments

[crisp canyon]

There was an idea supposedly to have reaper rework to be more offensive and help him out but I’m pretty sure it turned into volley perk

[edgy meadow]

true

[spare fox]

maybe I'm mis-remembering but I could have sworn either Alec or Dion mentioned in an interview within the past few months - maybe pre-holidays - that Reaper is shortlisted for a rework, along with Sombra

and, like I said, I am basis on this circumstantial evidence that there will be a "lore reason" too

[edgy meadow]

reaper was not mentioned in the interview with Alec

as far as i can see

they mentioned weaver and mercy getting some perks in base kit and definitely mentioned sombra

[spare fox]

no, that was more recent, I thought it was from a while ago around end of last year

[crisp canyon]

There was one like I mentioned in December 2023

[crisp canyon]

What would reaper gain lore wise or wid for that matter

[spare fox]

Idk, he's leaving Moira so that might have an effect on him

[crisp canyon]

That would make him worse I think from what ur getting at

[spare fox]

Wait huh? This is speculation

And it depends on what Moira was doing to/for him like

Unless he's still meeting Moira unofficially/ outside of Talon which to me seems probable

But they made it sound like Widowmaker "escaped" Moira in her profile update so yeah, I would think that will have an effect on her sniping ability

[south torrent]

Wait so I’m not the only one I swear I remember this happening too 😭

[crisp canyon]

This would make her worse rework wise

[spare fox]

It depends on what Moira was actually doing to/for her

Like, for all we know, Moira could have been doing weird other experiments in addition to what she told them

[crisp canyon]

That still makes her reliant on Moira which in return leaves her weaker

[spare fox]

Well then I guess she's going to be weaker

[brittle sky]

Some of that is it comes down to interpretation. Like I think most people can agree doing large scale attacks on cities for the sake of forcibly moving omnic minds to some kind of digital sanctuary is generally bad.

But whether you read him as someone trying to save his people at any cost and the stakes being so high because his people are utterly finite and human society doesn't seem to be meaningfully stopping their oppressive and destructive elements, or that he's driven by his ego and rage to do actions that do more harm than good, or even that he's just some extremist rabble rouser who should have trusted in incremental changes and that human governments and overwatch would make it eventually better, or somewhere in the spectrum amid those reads.

You have to choose what narrative makes the most sense to you, there's not a single correct vision of canon, and that will come down to how you read the story, and what you think of the real life dynamics of change, oppression, and violence his story bears resemblance to.

[ruby ridge]

Ppl need to chill out over Frankie possibly being the next hero when most of the lore teasers are hinting towards a helix hero

Vendettas comic that included ashe specifically mentioned helix being protected by cutting edge drones

There’s the tablet about someone defending grand mesa and we know it’s not emre now

[cunning copper]

i think in the end it comes down to personal interpretation as you said of morals themselves, his intent is clear but it boils down to how everyome judges, whether he's a misunderstood freedom fighter with questionable execution or a tyrant

[cosmic crest]

Ramattra is evil. Regardless of how noble his cause is.

I used to assume he was unaware that Talon was responsible for Mondatta's murder. But no. He was fully aware. He was complicit in the murder his brother, an omnic that only ever vouched for peace, because his views were inconvenient to his extremist campaign.

Also he is responsible for the wounds and deaths of likely hundreds of innocent civilians.

Also despite claiming to fight for omnics he has only made their lives harder by proving anti-omnic slander right by waging terror. Also he's assaulted and indoctrinated many omnics without their consent.

He is a bastard.

He's a good character. But he is objectively an immoral one

[brittle sky]

You uh, realize that was a subjective interpretation yes? Not a bad read, but it requires certain moral statements and assumptions.

Like we don't know how complicit ram was - did he learn of it only after the fact? Did he know about plans ahead of time and just not rush to save him? Did he actively encourage or commission it? We really don't know there. And then, If your brother was as you saw it misleading the people you both cared about to their doom, is it the more moral thing to allow his death, or prevent it?

And like, how do read the cost of his actions? Are some quantity of civilian casualties and some omnics being digitally (psychically?) kidnapped worth it to save a people? Is it more moral to do no harm even if it means accepting a slow, brutal extinction of your people, with zero reason to think it will stop? Or is it more moral to say "you gotta do something, even if it's messy and involves doing evil things, to save these lives".

Again, not disputing your own read, just saying your "objective" assertions are subjective. I think most people would agree with most to all of it, but them being common does not make them objective.

[cunning copper]

fascinating

[cosmic crest]

Waging terror and violence against people that can't defend themselves is vile. That much is not up for debate.

If you want to talk about subjectivity then Ramatra believes that his people are doomed if he does not act, but that's just his pessimistic world view, it's not an infallible truth.

[ruby ridge]

He is evil and isn’t thinking long term for omnics

Omnic rights were already rising with more and more humans growing to accept it

His attack likely brought back this disdain for omnics

[cunning copper]

i am kind of dissapointed with how they went about ramattra and ended his story arc. in fact i couldn't have been more dissapointed. the recent comic basically swept him aside for the foreseeable future to make space for the current story arc.

[cunning copper]

how do we know this?

[ruby ridge]

Bah I don’t necessarily mind it because we know it’s going to come back, it’s better they focus on one story and finish it nicely then have two half baked stories

[ruby ridge]

Just the simple apparition of highly omnic friendly cities like Toronto and numbani specifically

We also saw it in the point of view of Zarya who once hated omnics but accepts them now

[ruby ridge]

And for the counter argument kings row suffering from anti omnic attacks due to null sector

[cunning copper]

well at least i hope so. overwatch is a story that continues as long as the game itself lives and the lore as far as i see it doesn't have an ending in the near future

[cosmic crest]

Yes, the entire Null Sector arc was effectively shoved under the rug. Even if they weren't gonna give us PvE they could of done more to bring it to a satisfying end.

[cunning copper]

there's just so many things that could be done and i don't exactly understand why the pve was cancelled?

a book...a show...a STORY GAME for God's sakes

they're making...a mobile game

[ruby ridge]

The simple answer is that it just wasn’t profitable and likely never would’ve been profitable

[cunning copper]

you sure?

wouldn't it have just built on the hype?

[ruby ridge]

It takes so much money to make cinematics etc etc for this and the thing is PVE isn’t replayable, it’s something you can honestly get the full experience of it by watching it on YouTube like the telltale games

[brittle sky]

Again, not debating that you're wrong. I'm debating that what you say comes from subjective moral judgements, not provable empirical facts.

[cunning copper]

see here's the interesting thing

i think we all know what the concept of accelerationism is, yes?

[ruby ridge]

I feel like the mobile game is easier to make no? They have experience in it and they already have a universe to reuse for models and what not

[cunning copper]

well they're gonna get more money, money i hope is gonna go into good content in the main game

[true obsidian]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-jackson-comendo-picoca-gif-9669437860846841235

[cunning copper]

what you're suggesting is that in resisting change you are aiding more progress towards the common goal than forcefully reaching that goal

in saying so you are assuming that we are looking at a loss of popularity for anti omnic sentiment

and that eventually this sentiment would permanently falter at one point or another

but the way i see it, omnics were forever going to be seen as servants

which is why ramattra acted

it is difficult for us to completely understand what it's like in the first place

because this is fiction and we are humans, we can't exactly understand what it's like for your entire race to be opressed under something unfamiliar

the best you can do is imagine aliens came to earth and humans became servants of said aliens LOL

there are stronger feelings since the sake of his entire kind was the catch

[brittle sky]

I mean, there are some human groups that have an easier time remembering both sides of the issue than others

[cunning copper]

well mondatta being assassinated was the final straw

begs the question

[grave saddle]

Rams kidnapping of omnics against their consent may “save” them now but will only cause more harm to his people when they all wake up. He took omnics away from their friends, families and probably killed some of them at the same time. When they wake up ofc they aren’t going to want to be at peace with the guy who took them from their life without consent. A good villain with a good goal, but harmful methods

[cunning copper]

okay look

[cunning copper]

I don't think ramattra had anything to do with Mondattas death

why are we assuming that ramattra is evil AS he was still a monk that defeats the entire purpose of that arc

[brittle sky]

I mean, here's a doozy - do we have evidence original overwatch ever helped omnics? Like I'm not even sure we have evidence they let them into the org, much less did anything to help omnics at large. Maybe you could say the kings row uprising was helpful, but returning omnics to an apartheid status quo seems a dubious bit of help.

Like, peaceful omnic community get terrorized by a militia movement? Overwatch does squat, including and behind the point that militia blows up the omnium, irradiates the desert, and creates a rogue state whose main hobby is omnic genocide.

Some omnic separatists take hostages within an apartheid state famous for its brutality to omnics? You best believe they'll be ignoring international law and the express wishes of the local government to crack down violently and bombastically, even if that means hardening the extremist group and getting the ball rolling on overwatch's eventual demise.

[spare fox]

Tbf, Overwatch did try to help in the Aussie Outback but the junkers/locals did not want them there

It's mentioned in Declassified and I think there's an interaction between Sojourn and either JQ or Hog about it

[brittle sky]

Oh glad they respected the wishes of the terrorist group.

[spare fox]

I don't think it's as much respecting the wishes as being fought off by the terrorists

[cunning copper]

oh and

yeah i forgot

junker town and all

or new junk city idk which it was

having a literal Colosseum

where omnics get killed

[brittle sky]

Number one rule of junkertown. Before even establishing the legitimacy of the queen, is omnics must die.

[boreal oxide]

omnics have all the reason to kill all humans bro

they should make humans suffer as they have

hold on..

pause rewind…

play that back…

[spare fox]

There's just no peace with you

[brittle sky]

I mean we've yet to see a character who actively wants to wipe out all humans.

Unless we think Anubis is an active character.

[shrewd pivot]

This is why I personally like Ramattra's character, because it gets people discussing his philosophy.

I agree, there is no excuse for the harm Ramattra has done.

I think it's important to look at what Ramattra's story is trying to convey (His writer said Ramattra was an antagonist, but not an evil villain.) Ramattra was awoken into a situation where he had to make an impossible decision: watch as the finite generation of awakened omnics are killed off into extinction by humanity, or stand up and fight at the CHANCE Ramattra could prevent awakened omnic extinction. It's not like Ramattra didn't try nonviolent routes, he was a Shambali monk. Notably, both Zenyatta AND Ramattra disagreed with Mondatta's dogmatic pacifist approaches, neither Ram nor Zen are pacifists now.

The way I view it, humanity uses force to stop poachers from poaching critically endangered species, which is a moral action (even today, the last finite generation 2 female Northern Rhinos are being protected in a safe facility, protected with force). Ramattra saw awakened omnics being killed globally by humanity, so Ramattra used force against what he saw as awakened omnic's poachers, and preserved awakened omnics in a safe facility to wait out humanity. Ramattra is willing to be the matyr, be viewed as the monster, be the one to take blame, if it means he can secure a future free from humanity's oppression for his people--and Ramattra did so for the preserved. Yet, Ram does not plan to kill off humanity in revenge, Ram strongly disagrees with Anubis and thinks Anubis should be deleted. Ram plans to let humanity live out it's days, and Ram's guess is that humanity will war itself into extinction. "Suffer as I have" -- and the suffering is watching your people squabble into ruin. "I wanted to know how to save a world that refuses to be saved"

Ram is not willing to save humanity from itself. But Zenyatta is, as Zen has not lost hope in humanity. I find this writing set up to be very interesting.

Text wall over i promise, I just think Ram's and Zen's 'two sides of the same philosophy coin' is an interesting writing set up ✌️

I wonder if we will ever get a % or numbers estimate for how many awakened omnics remain non-subjugated after the Nullsector invasion.

It would be scary if like... less than 10% of awakened omnics remain or something

[peak escarp]

no further damage or casualties to the occupied territories, they
successfully absconded with 99.2% of all previously subjugated
omnics.```

from the Atlas News Report

oh I guess that's just 99.2% of subjugated omnics

doesn't say how many weren't subjugated at all

[spare fox]

They're kinda vague about omnic population in general, which is just as well, imo

[viral pilot]

Hey is there a reason why ramattra has his face covered?

[crisp canyon]

That’s just his model

[viral pilot]

Is there not a way for me to put photos in this discord? Do I need to be promoted or something

[brittle sky]

Omnics in general (at least citizen models and descendant lines like ravagers) have face plates to cover sensors and the like, probably both for anthropomorphic reasons and for reaons similar to why human faces have skin.

[brittle sky]

I mean I for one would love a larger survey of omnic populations and cultures.

[viral pilot]

I see

Would be a pretty cool idea for a skin

[edgy meadow]

you need to be a regular to get photo perms

[viral pilot]

Oh, I see

[spare fox]

Yeah and it's super impossible now bc of the influx of activity

[viral pilot]

Ha, ramattra getting a skin

[viral pilot]

Roger that

[brittle sky]

ain't that kinda primordial?

[viral pilot]

Yeah but cooler

[fathom grove]

Not a skin, but I believe in Ramattra's origin story video you can see him withut his faceplate at the start

[boreal oxide]

suffa

as ai haf

[acoustic flax]

Yeah Ramattra isn't some reverse genocider like Magneto

[boreal oxide]

i wish ramattra would kill all humans so i can see lifeweaver get turned into a pink mist

[wooden drift]

Wth did he do to you

[brittle sky]

(*like the less interesting iterations of magneto)

[acoustic flax]

I need Ram to call the Omnic species robo superior

[nocturne flint]

i think hes racist enough dude

[grave saddle]

Imo Ram is doing evil things, but he is happy with that because being evil is the best route to saving omnics in his eyes

[fleet scaffold]

So

Vaira's story is basically about how she had to be taught the trade of hardlight architecture instead of having a natural talent for it?

[drowsy locust]

imagine if junker queen got dethroned in a future season

it sounds cool like how doomfist got thrown out

[nocturne flint]

Who can even dethrone her tho

There aint many Junkers who can beat him in lore

Maybe hammond, but he dosent wanna rule shit

[grave saddle]

Do you think season 4 might be the time we see DVAs junk mech skin in canon. I’m not sure what reason she would have to be in that situation, but the lore around the skin directly mentions junkertown

I know you asked this a while ago but I’ve been looking at sigmas lore and I think it supports the idea that those two mythic skins, and their subsequent creatures, are actually a canon alt universe/dimension. Sigma to me has clearly seen alt dimensions and it makes sense with what we know about black holes connecting two points. I believe part of sigmas “insanity” is that he keeps seeing into not just the universe but these alt universes aswell. As he describes the outside of the universe to lap neatly with time, it could support the multiversal theory of multiple dimensions with similar but distinct timelines. And in one of sigmas interactions, he talks to moira about how he has spoken to fairies and they hold nice conversations. If the theory of him seeing glimpses of other universes, like mirrorwatch or starwatch, then I believe these fairies he is talking to are whatever the creatures are in those mythic skins lol. Fairywatch

[low viper]

Dang, that’s an interesting take. Thanks

[safe sun]

does anyone know the name of the song (or the cinematic it's from) from the audio playing in the spotlight @ 6:30?

https://youtu.be/N8Sgnn72e9Y?t=390

it's super familiar but I cannot remember the name of the track. I think it's also on spotify but I just can't find it

[broken heath]

Currently making a timeline on all Overwatch media for a few friends. In the Train Hopper comic, do we know what the glowing purple box is or is it just never acknowledged again? Wanna see if it has some importance or not. https://overwatch.blizzard.com/en-us/media/comic/train-hopper/

[broken heath]

It’s from the Eichenwalde Map Trailer. It’s called The Essence of Discovery.

[hot rivet]

it would be so cool if they added little slice of life things to every skin

like anas new year one would talk about the festival or something she did there

[broken heath]

Agreed, I like some of the little lore bits you get in the skin selection of each hero.

[hot rivet]

i wish they would do it for every legenddary though

[broken heath]

Yeah, that would be cool, even if it has no lore base. Maybe a silly thing to write about. Like “Genji’s Sentai Skin: Genji loved watching Sentai shows during his Blackwatch days” or something like that. 😅

[hot rivet]

exactlyyyy

just some fun facts about the characters would also deepen their lore

not in a story way but in a character way

[nocturne flint]

The Anubis God Ai is creepy dude

[brittle sky]

I mean this would definitely be more an end state or finale to the junker ecology, but the natural thing would be junkrat doing it mostly on accident, and that being an upgrade by benefit of him not being an egomaniacal genocidaire bully with ambitions of attacking the world with an airship.

[dry pebble]

If Theories that made turns out to be True and they revert Doomfist from Tank to DPS as his release

I hope it stays as one of the most skill requiring characters still it synergises with his lore motif so well one of the things i like about Doom

[boreal oxide]

winston brings him in and his chopped off arm is now a healing arm and he says “guys say hi to bloomfist”

[civic lynx]

I smell doomfist BlizzCon cinematic appearance change

[brittle sky]

source?

[civic lynx]

https://x.com/owcavalry/status/2027029900754907171?s=46

Overwatch Cavalry (@OWCavalry)

New #Overwatch Rush Heroes 👥

Alongside the previously announced roster, Brigitte, Doomfist (now with a beard), Genji, and Hanzo will also be arriving soon in the mobile game!

🔎 Source: @s3cr11t

X · Feb 26, 2026, 2:36 PM

[brittle sky]

damn, doom is getting his beard before brig gets her tiara.

[flint thicket]

Do we know who or what exactly killed Mizuki's father? I have a thoery the Hashimoto was directly responsible.

[grave saddle]

Could see him do it intentionally if junker queen had roadhog “killed” also. Junkrat locks in

[dry pebble]

You were.. right

I hate the beard tho

[civic lynx]

I think it might be temporary ngl

[dry pebble]

Beard looks hella ugly where my bald, hairless man

[civic lynx]

Just meant to show he’s not as calculated and clean as he used to be

Once he’s a bit more organised in lore he’ll get rid of it

[dry pebble]

Rip Tank Doomfist you won't be missed

I will miss him tho

[dry pebble]

He needs his DoomRazorBlade to sharpen its beard only

Also his doombathroom

[civic lynx]

I think we’ll get a hero with a similar playstyle relatively soon to make up for it

Might not be d.mon but I think if he is moved to dps a new mobile, close range dive tank will be brought in eventually

[dry pebble]

Not that but i always view his design more akin to being a Tank then DPS

It's also his character y'know

Like Doomfist being Tank was fitting for me

[civic lynx]

He has the more muscular build of a tank and his kit fits better imo

But dps doom mains will never rest

[dry pebble]

He is not a blood thirsty murderer, but a calculating brute

[dry pebble]

Yeah they have been like

Requesting it for whatever reason since then

[civic lynx]

Bc it was the only way they got value as dps

[dry pebble]

Real

[civic lynx]

The people who mained him as a dps literally never played anyone else

[dry pebble]

Argh i just hope he remains as skill hero and not some braindead crush and burn

[civic lynx]

I think they’re very aware of his need to require skill and will keep that as part of his rework

Part of the hero fantasy of doom is being able to play a damn near lore accurate version of him if you’re good enough

[dry pebble]

Does this also means his air knockback will also return

[civic lynx]

I hope not

[dry pebble]

That's why i love him as Tank

[dry pebble]

Shi just might end up as Spiderman for Rivals 😭

[fossil wren]

I honestly like the beard

[civic lynx]

I like it as a temporary thing to show how he’s lost some of that perfection and control, but it shouldn’t be permanent

[dry pebble]

If they attending to small hero redesigns might end up adding scars to Vendetta arleady

[lusty heath]

Gave him the kratos treatment

[dry pebble]

Give her a big scar to her eyes so she might gave the feeling of a leader

[civic lynx]

I don’t think they will tbh

[dry pebble]

This take might cause me to end up liking the beard

[lusty heath]

I like it

[dry pebble]

I wish

In a better world

[civic lynx]

When vendetta was revealed the devs were on Twitter saying it doesn’t matter that she doesn’t have scars and she’s accurate a specific type of gladiator

I think they’ll stick to that excuse until she’s removed from power and then they’ll give her battle scars from whoever fights her

[dry pebble]

Would you guys like it if Moira half of the face looked in similar anormally like her arm?

Similar to TwoFace from Batman

[civic lynx]

I like how she is now but I wouldn’t be against that tbh

[dry pebble]

As much as how much i find it ridicilious for Vendetta to take place of Doom this instant

I hope she won't be getting killed

[civic lynx]

I think vendetta’s story is good but they rushed it

[dry pebble]

League of Legends arleady gone way too off the chart to the point where they can't develop a story without killing one of the cast

That's why it sucks lmaoo

[civic lynx]

IMO vendetta should’ve been the leader of her own faction (maybe the gladiators) and destroy doom’s talon from the inside out over the course of this year then the reign of talon arc is 2027

[dry pebble]

Would gladiators even give shit about destroying talon tho

[civic lynx]

Rather than just she’s introduced, wins against doom and starts a global war within 3 months

[dry pebble]

Also i find it crazy for Ashe to help Vendetta in lore

[civic lynx]

I think there’s more to that story that we’ll see in s2

[dry pebble]

I thought she was supposed to be Anti Hero

[civic lynx]

Ashe seemed a bit too happy to help

I thought she would’ve either rejected or taken a bit more convincing

[dry pebble]

Like i don't expect she to help Overwatch but compared to her associating with a terrorist organisation that up to kill his old foe is crazy

[acoustic ice]

I think she was just paid or getting her share of a heist

[dry pebble]

True judging by her interactions and anything she doesn't even seem to be a bad woman

By character

[civic lynx]

She seems to do things that will bring her money or something she wants but this (I have awful memory so plz correct me if I’m wrong) is just the deadlocks running distraction while talon take the items they want

[dry pebble]

There's no way i expect her to help the faction that wants to kill Cassidy even she can't get along with him

[dry pebble]

I like the way her tubes and hair is but i really don't like Ow 2 and its decision of removing coloration of some characters

Sigma and Moira

I get it they are scientist but their suit was way more outstanding the way they were

[shrewd pivot]

This is the roster for Overwatch Rush.

Notably, Doomfist has a different design with a beard and fur collar.

This could possibly be a look at Doomfist's new design when he inevitably returns?

Oh im late to the party, nevermind LOL

[edgy meadow]

everyone talking about doomfist with beard

what i notice - brig is a tank

[peak escarp]

heroes sometimes have different roles in other games - Mei is a tank in HotS

[edgy meadow]

fair fair

[peak escarp]

has no impact on the main game

[shrewd pivot]

Which is completely bs btw! Lol

I think the artist said she was based on certain kinds of pit fighters, which is bs. Her model is the kind of muscle Brigitte should have, but Vendetta has a weirdly small skull that doesn't fit overwatch's stylization like Zarya and Reinhardt do.

Vendetta's armor is also extremely inaccurate to Roman legionaries 'scaled' metal armor, and various Roman gladiators. Her armor should have looked like a long sleeve of scaled armor and used scifi chainmail of some kind, and if she is a nonaugmented human, Vendetta should have atleast had spinal armor to explain her acrobatics imo (Mercy wears a suit, Pharah wears armor, Doomfist has prosthesis, etc)

Vendetta pulls more from stereotypes... not any historical design despite the artist claiming so.

[peak escarp]

Overwatch is not the place to look if you want historical accuracy

[dry pebble]

Funny thing to say when Ramattra is a good Moses inspiration

[shrewd pivot]

Never said it was, it was the artist saying historical references were made in an article, let me find it

[dry pebble]

I wish she had a helmet that shows her face tbh

[peak escarp]

I never said you said it was

it was just a statement

if it was directed at you I would have replied to your message

[shrewd pivot]

Ah ok, pardon.
Still, it's interesting to read the articles to get an idea for what is going on during the creation process

https://www.polygon.com/overwatch-2-new-hero-45-vendetta-abilities-kit-dps-damage/

"Bedford said. “I'm a huge historical costume designer nerd, so I absolutely loved working with the concept team to come up with how that gladiator look would appear in the Overwatch world.”"
...
"but again, being a historical costume nerd, I wanted to work in and slip in a few historical references. She's got the manica armored gauntlet on one side — she doesn't use a shield, so she actually uses that as her defense. The little wolf pads on her shoes are evocative of the Roman caligae, which is a studded combat footwear. The sword is obviously reminiscent of the gladius."

Basically, it's poorly implemented details imo, for example, you cannot even hear her studded shoes in Vendetta's footsteps audio so the detail might as well not be there.
Plus, the studded Roman shoes are really only effective in a group of soldiers to instill fear when approaching (marching in unison loudly), a solo soldier with studded shoes doesn't do much. The loud footstep from studded shoes is also antithetical to her "stealth" fantasy they were going for, unless it was meant to be a fun dramatic footsteps to enter the room... but again, her audio doesn't even have studded shoe noises, so it's a pointless detail addition :c

[shrewd pivot]

I wish her base design had that helmet she was teased with, even if they opened it up to show her face

I would have GLADLY taken actually curly hair under a helmet, than them deciding to straighten her hair from 2d concepts 🥀 the only curls that remain are the forehead strands

[grave saddle]

I would rather overwatch designers cared enough to add small details like that than not add small details unless they go 1000% of the way

A skin with the helmet would be dope tho

[lusty heath]

I was deadass thinking when the cinematic first came out like “oh hes gonna come back with a beard ir something”

[civic lynx]

I expected him to be heavily scarred but the beard is good as well

[grave saddle]

Do we know where his talon base was that he fell out the window of?

[shrewd pivot]

I disagree. The details aren't being incorperated properly like past designs have, and are ultimately pointless additions not tied to any worldbuilding or visual metaphors.

Same thing with Freja, she has a glowy necklace to reference the famous Freyja goddess necklace-being-stolen mythos, but Freja's necklace has NOTHING to do with her plot at all. It's pointless visual details.

Ana and Pharah had matching tattoos bc Pharah honored her mom after presumed death, and it relates to Ana being a sniper, Eye of Ra being protective, etc.

Reinhardt has a missing eye from battle, not just an Odin ref, it was an important plot point.

Ramattra has a Moses like Shepards staff to represent him vs Anubis and being a 'Shepard to his people'

JunkerQueen does Vendetta's 'modern day gladiator' trope much more effectively imo

[civic lynx]

Not as far as I know

It’s pretty unlikely but I think it could be cool if the base was in Iceland and the place he landed in was this long forgotten (I think it’s ow but idk) prison that something has recently escaped from

[shrewd pivot]

Was it not in Italy...? Maybe im wrong tho idk

[grave saddle]

There may be other decisions behind her sound design that meant a metallic sound wasn’t desirable. Or maybe they just couldn’t figure out a way to make it sound good. I would still rather have the details there. Ofc I would love character design to be perfect to the T in every minute aspect. But she is a gladiator, so the design team took various visual elements from the culture that spurred gladiators. I think from a design perspective that’s pretty good. As a lore nerd ofc I would rather there me 10x more detail that actually relates to their story, but I would rather we get what we got than nothing

[grave saddle]

I really am not sure. I didn’t see any indication it was leading up to it but maybe I’m missing something

[lusty heath]

wish they gave vendetta a helmet like the poster she was first teased in

they kinda did in the bp ig

[shrewd pivot]

Seemingly, Vendetta didn't have footsteps in early playtests, and her footsteps audio is an edited version of Tracer's. So it seems to be a pipeline issue imo.

That's fair, I just... want more characters like Domina that have good storytelling in visual design and kit metaphors, and less heroes like Vendetta who seems to be non-mindfully cobbled together stereotypes, with 'history fan' defending subpar implementation. 😔 🙏

If overwatch can ever reach the peak worldbuilding of: Orisa+Numbani vs Doomfist, Sigma origin short, or Ramattra writing set up, I would be elated. But I'm willing to accept solid additions to worldbuilding like Hazard and Domina

[shrewd pivot]

I can't wait until we get skins of her other comic outfits lol these are cool designs. I honestly wish they went MORE camp and gave her a wonder-woman WWE wrestler look

[crisp canyon]

I prefer vendetta with really big hair it makes her standout more I just wish it translated to the game better

[crisp canyon]

Doom with a beard?

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah I would have LOVED big curly hair in the game 😔 🙏 idk why they nerfed her curls so hard

[crisp canyon]

Ashe is a criminal it fits

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah it might be a... 'leak' or hint at what Doomfist will look like when he returns in the story.

[shrewd pivot]

overtaking. i was suprised too. Ashe is notably pro-omnic and idk Ashe's pretty against large conglomerates like her parent's weapons company. Ig this writing shows that Ashe will go VERY far to steal things that embarrass her parents and ruin her parent's company's reputation?
Like, Talon is the biggest bad she could collab with imo, it's not like Talon is some small gang.

[scenic bolt]

Looking for a 3rd for Invasion hard missions

[crisp canyon]

Talon isn’t exactly anti omnic tho

[civic lynx]

I want this so badly

[crisp canyon]

No one plays missions 😭

[scenic bolt]

Thanks for the helpful advice.

[crisp canyon]

Isn’t this in game alr

[grave saddle]

Ofc that’s fair. Adding to the worldbuilding through character design is fire. I’m hoping they have the opportunity to do it well with the upcoming 5 heroes tho tbf. D.mons mech has evidently changed since we last saw it so there could definitley be design details in relation to that such as with Reinhardts numbered armour. The drone woman is either Frankie and has change a decent amount so plenty of opportunity, or the helix chief in which case they have the opportunity to showcase a lot of cool features about that “uniform”. The likely hashimoto character might be the most basic in terms of design developing lore but there is still opportunity. The “sniper” omnic seems to have a very unique design that could definitely develop null sector storytelling if not something else. And the trench coat omnic has such potential story wise, they are the one I’m most excited for

[civic lynx]

I dont think so

[shrewd pivot]

We got that one!

[civic lynx]

I wanted it to be more accurate to the comic

With the jacket etc

[crisp canyon]

It’s still in game tho

[civic lynx]

In an uglier form 🔥

[crisp canyon]

Only thing different is a jacket and parting of hair

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah, I just note it bc Talon is willing to try and ally with the Junkers. Idk if Ashe would have willing helped Talon if she knew that Talon was trying to negotiate with Junkers.

[crisp canyon]

And giving her leggings

[grave saddle]

Ashe could also have another motivation. Bit of a cliche but it could be something like she thinks helix has Frankie jn the facility but turns out Frankie joined them or something. I haven’t read much deadlock lore so assume that’s very much out of character, but I could definitely see some other motivation for Ashe to want to get in there so much she doesn’t mind working for talon

[shrewd pivot]

I agree lol. Also sucks that her first skins straightened her hair completely 💔 like why even have her have curly forehead strands atp... 🥀

[shrewd pivot]

Frankie was a hacker for Ashe and the deadlick gang, and yeah the only way I could see Frankie being the drone hero is if it was a plot-line like you suggested.

I honestly think the drone hero will be military or Helix, probably not Frankie

[civic lynx]

Same

[crisp canyon]

Is there any reason for it to be a completely unknown new addition from helix over character that fits the description and has been hinted at in a map

[shrewd pivot]

There's lore bite text about a new person being put in charge for Helix controlled Grand Mesa on the powder keg map. So, a new Helix hero probably

[crisp canyon]

Does it mention anything ab them using a drone tho

[shrewd pivot]

No, but Helix is involved with security and is being hired by Oasis who is using surveillance ai (minority report style)

Pharah and suit users like her, is just one part of Helix security

[crisp canyon]

It makes alot more sense for Frankie than it does a new helix character

[shrewd pivot]

It's most likely the drone hero is military in some way bc of the hat, but yeah anything could happen technically :)

[shrewd pivot]

Not really? The reason people say it's Frankie is bc of the map background in the road map image, and drone"=hacker" conclusion. No mentions of Frankie in files or anything, Hazard had lines before release, so did Emre.

[crisp canyon]

imo they wouldn’t have shown off that drown in the silhouette if it wasn’t meant to hint at Frankie and just be a generic helix hero

[crisp canyon]

I mean that’s substantially more evidence towards Frankie than anything else with Route 66 and a hero with a drone and hacking

[civic lynx]

IMO the silhouette seems to show a military style hat as well but idk

[shrewd pivot]

Fair! It could also be because deadlock is helping Talon to steal from a Helix controlled Grand Mesa. And again, the powder keg map which was the og location for Deadlock gangs base, has the lore text about a new Helix leader being put in charge

[crisp canyon]

Military style doesn’t mean it’s not Frankie tho

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah it looks military like too me :o

[shrewd pivot]

Frankie wasn't described as such in Ashe's novel, but maybe they changed her design.

I don't mean this to be dismissive! I just am explaining my guess for the hero, anything is possible ofc :)

[crisp canyon]

Was that novel not when Ashe was 17?

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah, but Frankie doesn't seem the type to be military from how she's written. Maybe she could have joined the military later on

[crisp canyon]

Emre was also changed tho

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah! Tragic accident for him against his will

Frankie was a hacker that has done some things that would probably get her arrested, Frankie has people she cares for so that's why she hacks for money, if she was caught it would probably not end well for the people she's caring for.

[crisp canyon]

Is helix military or security because her joining security doesn’t sound far off from how she was written considering she was in multiple gangs and acted as a spy of sorts

And with how the omnic crisis hit Tulsa, it seems like the type of thing she would join to prevent from happening again

[shrewd pivot]

Helix is army for hire these days, for sure corrupt now, bc the UN used Helix to replace og overwatch after og overwatch fell, Helix guards Anubis ai in Egypt atm. But Oasis hires Helix security to enforce in areas with Oasis' oppressive "minority report" style ai.

Morocco map has this issue apparently and the Phreaks are there to disrupt the Helix forces.

[crisp canyon]

Helix protecting Anubis, seems like the type of thing that would motivate her

To make sure no omnic uprising happens again

[shrewd pivot]

I suppose Helix as "mercs for hire", sure, but Frankie would need a VERY special deal from Helix or lay completely undercover hiding her past, to join Helix as a past criminal hacker.

[crisp canyon]

Why would she need to hide it?

[shrewd pivot]

Helix doesn't hire criminals, Pharah had to work hard to get into Helix.

[crisp canyon]

Helix doesn’t hire criminals or is that just what they say, the government irl wouldn’t say they hire criminals but they def recruit hackers to work for them

[shrewd pivot]

It wouldn't suprise me if Helix became super corrupt tho!

[crisp canyon]

Sombra being with talon for her skills make sense since technically she’s like this elusive anonymous being, but Frankie seems more low level for stuff like helix

[shrewd pivot]

I feel like Genji and Cassidy's situations were very unique to Blackwatch, Helix thus far are very "lawful" rather than inherently enforcing what's right, if that makes sense? Like so far in writing, it would suprise me if Helix outright forgave a criminal hacker to then hire them. It would have to be some kind of deal there, maybe even a threat of punishment if the hired criminal disobeys Helix.

Hazard's voice interactions help portray the anarchy vs law dynamics, Hazard calls Helix "sky cops" and Pharah (seemly Helix-like outlook) has a line with Kiriko about laws.

Pharah: I don't work with criminals.
Kiriko: What's right isn't always what's legal.
Pharah: Then you change the laws.
Kiriko: Easy for you to say.

[crisp canyon]

I just don’t see helix getting another addition unless it’s Frankie, at least not until these first 3 release

[shrewd pivot]

Pharah isn't Helix anymore, she joined overwatch.

We have no current day Helix members on the roster

Helix is being written as more corrupt, so I wouldn't be suprised if the new hero is that new Helix leader, to explore the worldbuilding there

[crisp canyon]

Pharah is still technically a helix hero

I also don’t think leader of “sky cops” would be on the ground

[shrewd pivot]

Eh, I say Pharah is now ex-Helix similar to how Ramattra is ex-Shambali and Zenyatta is ex-Shambali and Cassidy is ex-Deadlock

[crisp canyon]

Shambali isn’t really a faction so I wouldn’t say it’s the same

[grave saddle]

I think it’s a very good chance that the character is Frankie post joining helix. But also a fresh helix character is entirely plausible since we don’t have any right now. Most likely, with the pattern of adding Jetpack cat (previously mentioned), D.mon (previously mentioned), Domina (mentioned by family name), I do think it’s likely we have atleast one more not completely fresh character and thus it’s more likely to be Frankie

[shrewd pivot]

That's fair!

The drone has sky surveillance vibes tho 🤔

[shrewd pivot]

Shambali is indeed a faction imo, just a pacifist one. Shambali is akin to the Ironclad or Atlantic Arcology -- not inherently military faction

[crisp canyon]

Not really tho but it’s whatever

[crisp canyon]

That’s what I’m saying, hashimoto makes sense cause it’s coming with a brand new map, so brand new character, Route 66 is established and Frankie is hinted at in powder keg. Then it’s dmon no new map but likely change to Busan, and then most likely Iceland with a new hero

[shrewd pivot]

That's fair!

Your story line that you presented prior iirc , would explain how it could be Frankie.

It's not that it CAN'T be Frankie btw, it's just that Frankie hadn't gotten treatment like prior lore mentioned heroes.

So my guess is Military style hero of some kind, maybe Helix

[grave saddle]

Yeah 100%

To me that person pretty clearly has military designs but that doesn’t rule out Frankie but vice versa just because it has a drone and coincides with the map doesn’t mean it is Frankie. Ultimately my preference would indeed be Frankie in a helix position just because it’s quite an interesting story to explore their motivations behind it

[crisp canyon]

My prediction is the omnic in a hat will be the last hero this year and have changes to kings row before kicking off to the next story

[grave saddle]

I do think the omnic with the “sniper” will be the Iceland map for sure

Most likely that gun that shot through the robot and the wall

Their ultimate mechanically

[crisp canyon]

Are they a sniper tho? I feel like this next hero is probably going in sharpshooter unless I’m wrong and it’s recon

[grave saddle]

They very well may not be. I only say sniper purely from the design of the weapon

[shrewd pivot]

Interesting point!
Sojourn, JQ, did get maps related.
Lifeweaver I don't think had a map connected...? Illari did. Mauga did. Venture did not. Juno did not. Hazard... kinda if you could the additions! Freja did not. Wuyang and Anran eventually did with stadium Wuxing uni. Emre did not.

[crisp canyon]

I think it’s makes sense for the new subroles to get a new addition each in dmg but they could also not

[grave saddle]

Yeah I do agree. I do have a gut feeling that damage to the prison is done by whatever that characters ultimate is though

Just because it doesn’t seem like the new talons approach

[crisp canyon]

Unless that’s when they reintroduce doomfist and it was him

[shrewd pivot]

Ohhh interesting idea! The hat omnic looks rather sharp, it could be a new faction, no faction, or maybe a Nullsector omnic. If its not a cyborg human. (Please be an omnic lolll)

[shrewd pivot]

Also very possible oooo /genuine if that was doomfist blowing a hole through that would be hype!

[grave saddle]

Potentially could be. I do think it does resemble more of a straight shot from a weapon than doom fist but ofc they may be reworking him

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta technically has the doomfist gauntlet atm
Akande doesn't have access to the doomfist gauntlet atm in lore

[grave saddle]

I think they are either going to be a merc for hire that is going to break someone out for talon or they are what was kept inside the prison and is being broken out

[shrewd pivot]

Welcome back "Seven" from the game "Deadlock" /j

[grave saddle]

Or I mean they may not even be the main point of whatever the plot is lol. They could just be a separate prisoner who escapes in this breakout and is someone no one wants free

I’ve said it before, and it’s heavily dependent on where the base was, but I would loveeee if doomfists new fist was built by volskaya

I think the design could be bomb

[shrewd pivot]

Oops sorry! I combined the messages mbmb

[grave saddle]

Sombra has that blackmail over them, they have the tech to give lore reasons behind mechanical changes to doomfist, and I think sombra would help doomfist if it meant saving sigma from vendetta

[shrewd pivot]

Interesting...

It was never revealed how the doomfist actually came to be btw. No one knows if the doomfist was passed down or created by the first person to weild it. I don't know if it would be possible to recreate the doomfist, but if worldbuilding ends up revealing the omnic energy sources Volskaya is getting from omnics, is the same energy tech source used to create/recreate the doomfist, that would be interesting!

Notably, Doomfist wanted Sombra, Reaper and Mauga to steal the power core from a nullsector ship, which is omnic tech.

[grave saddle]

Yeah that would be cool (I just want more volskaya lore)

[shrewd pivot]

Saaaame. It would be a shame if Sombra's intro cinematic setting up that blackmail never goes anywhere

Mannnn can it be next season already im greedy for lore lol

[grave saddle]

Yeah I do think this is just the perfect place to use it

So greedy I got a little background project to satiate me lol

[brittle sky]

I mean, I get why they're not touching volskaya lore atm

[brittle sky]

man can enjoy esparanca until they do or do not do arcology.

[grave saddle]

Yeah I do understand it’s difficult actually

[shrewd pivot]

People were theorizing Atlantic Arcology was a clash map, so it was delayed after removing the clash mode

[civic lynx]

Tbh considering the size of the map i always thought it would’ve been flashpoint rather than clash

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah, same. I would be sad if it was just a clash map lol

[civic lynx]

Would’ve allowed more of the location to be explorable and have references to existing/upcoming lore rather than clash’s 3 lanes style like cod

[shrewd pivot]

This is very cute btw, but also lmafo at implications bc ig Orisa is viewed as a kid more or less in canon

Congrats JPC, you're the second kid on the roster! /j

[civic lynx]

I mean they did confirm the map is coming but not this year so maybe it’s for the best clash is gone so we can have (hopefully) a better map as the outcome

[shrewd pivot]

I would love it to be like Samoa, where 3 matches are all on one map and it has fun worldbuilding.

I would also accept a very detailed Flashpoint

[civic lynx]

I think that’s quite likely tbh considering the sheer size of the location, they can have each point be a different area (maybe outside on the area we see in the concept, inside the massive central tower and maybe one at the very top or out the back like the second concept image of the tiny island behind the main structures)

[shrewd pivot]

I def want one section below the water, and one above the water! And hopefully an area that shows the omnic living spaces that were described in Lifeweaver and Symmetra's heroes ascendant story

I am excited to see the unique architecture of the Atlantic Arcology too, iirc there might be super coral shown in the water too!

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah! There's also the hyperloop entrance that Symmetra and Lifeweaver helped defend that was described in the heroes ascendant story!

[brittle sky]

good. Sink it.

[viral pilot]

Did they ever state why they removed clash from qp?

[civic lynx]

The background things from these images (shop promo and I think BlizzCon… 2021? Idk I’ll see if I can track it down) could be concepts for an underwater area tbh

[civic lynx]

I assume just very low pick rate and general dislike from the community

It was announced to be undergoing a full redesign in like 2024 or early 2025 but it seems they’ve changed their mind to just ditch the mode all together

[shrewd pivot]

Also with 6v6, and even 5v5, certain mobility heroes makes clash impossible bc heroes get back to point too fast, it's forever contested and not fun to play.

[viral pilot]

Dang that's too bad

I guess it'll be reduced to an arcade mode like assault then

[shrewd pivot]

Oooo

My hopes for Atlantic Arcology:

Above water area that shows the tower,
Hyperloop station area,
Blow water surface area to see what sealife surrounds,
Omnic living quarters,
Super coral shown officially,
Unique architecture to show us what hardlight architecture usually looks like

Martins (creator of durovidro material) lore explored, be it audio logs like Samoa or maybe a living quarters

I hope they don't do a "zero g room" for Atlantic Arcology bc imo we don't need swimming areas, it would look silly with just zero g animations anyhow lol

"The initial goal of the project was to create a resilient coral that could survive the changing oceans. The result did so much more. Super coral revitalized many dying reefs across Polynesia, taking root in areas that were previously uninhabited. The coral cleaned the oceans of complex chemicals and microplastics, incorporating these materials into massive reef formations.[1] The coral polyps grew at astonishing rates by converting carbon and waste to food.[2] Fish populations rebounded and multiplied, creating cheap, abundant food. The reefs began growing above the water, creating structures and spires unlike anything seen on Earth.

These reefs attracted a thriving scientific community. However, wealthy nations complained that the reefs were clogging up and interfering with international trade routes.[1]

Even decades after the Omnic Crisis, they continued to spread across the Pacific Ocean"

Like this is genuinely a terrifying concept, it is nearly as disruptive as when trees first began to spread onto land during the Devonian period.

For reference, irl corals can't survive out of water. Coral species have water depth niches. Super corals are growing across all niches, are actively growing OUT of the water surface, storing but not processing microplastics and harmful chemicals, to the point of blocking shipping routes. That's some man made horrors beyond comprehension lol

If the super corals reach Australia coral reefs, I wonder if the Outback radiation traces (wind, water, dust, etc) will impact the supercorals.

[dry pebble]

@civic lynx Wait

Do you think instead of being Akande

That bearded Doomfist could be ACTUALLY the 4TH wielder of Doomfist Moniker

And Akande is actually death

For real time

[shrewd pivot]

Nahhh that's Akande

[dry pebble]

I hope so

Other way would create a lot conflict