lore-discussion

[halcyon nest]

Blizzard need to seek prime videos or someone else

[muted ferry]

sure but they still couldve made the effort to have it made somewhere else

[wooden drift]

I heard netflix was stealing their animators and that completely ruined chances for that series

[muted ferry]

what im sayin

i mean

[spare fox]

Netflix poached one of their Chief directors/higher ups

[muted ferry]

i dont doubt that blizzard tried other streaming services

[wooden drift]

I guess they did the Nintendo there with netflix

[muted ferry]

but netflix was prob the only one that was viable for whatever reason

[wooden drift]

Got burned once and wouldn't be doing anything similar with any companies for awhile

[muted ferry]

getting a show made is complicated with all the contracts and stuff

[spare fox]

not to mention the cost and risk is soooo high anymore

literally every piece of media is a colassal failure or a colassal success, no inbetween

[wooden drift]

I think getting people to play online shooter is much easier than league of legends to be honest

[muted ferry]

league is much more technically accessible and has existed for way longer

[wooden drift]

Lol has a bad reputation of always being butt of the jokes

[muted ferry]

i think you overestimate the power of the bad reputation and underestimate the power of being able to run on a potato

[wooden drift]

And no way mobas are accessible genre

[muted ferry]

why do you think so many people play gacha games

[wooden drift]

Cuz they're made for casuals

[muted ferry]

bc they can be played on phones

[wooden drift]

I don't even think arcane made that many people to go play lol

And even if it did, not for long

[muted ferry]

that doesnt matter

[halcyon nest]

I feel like vendetta is just some dev’s overpowered oc

[muted ferry]

im talking about how league got popular enough to be able to get arcane made in the first place

[wooden drift]

Every new character is an oc

[spare fox]

that's such a ridiculous argument 🙄

[halcyon nest]

Meant like someone’s personal oc

[muted ferry]

every character is an oc by definition but i get what u mean

[wooden drift]

I guess orisa was someone's over powered oc too

She defeated him too

And winston

And doomfist is someone overpowered oc too

[spare fox]

yeah honestly I don't understand the hangup with vendetta defeating doomfist

[wooden drift]

Cuz he beat tracer and genji

[halcyon nest]

Maybe i put it in wrong term

[shy dagger]

Literally 😭😭
By that logic, Doomfist is also an oc who beat og heroes like Genji and tracer

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta feels like a character that does not take into account overwatch worldbuilding lore well enough, and is a generic "my roman empire" villain with flat writing, so yeah Vendetta feels like a badly crafted oc rather than a character that actually lives in the overwatch world, like Ashe, Ana, Moira do.

[wooden drift]

It could've been done better, I agree with that, but developers wanted to go into new direction

New villain with new story

[halcyon nest]

Thank you

She kinda reminds me of abby from the last of us

“Oh you remember that one guy you killed? He has a daughter and she wants revenge “

[wooden drift]

Aw, man, I like the last of us 2...

[spare fox]

how does she not take into account the worldbuilding? I don't understand this argument

[shrewd pivot]

Wuyang and Vendetta have not compelled me bc of the lack of connection to overwatch's world building and scifi story telling.

Wuyang is scuffed wuxia

Vendetta is "mafia + roman empire" with a lightsaber and uses plot armor to survive battles other characters would have lost (Zarya, etc) in lore.

[wooden drift]

Did Zarya fought against doomfist?

[spare fox]

bc the more I think about it, the more his defeat at the hands of Vendetta works narratively

[shrewd pivot]

If Zarya was hit by a giant robot arm, she would have been severely hurt. Vendetta tanked a robot hit BARE SKIN as a NONAUGMENTED HUMAN. it doesn't make sense

[spare fox]

since he's all about becoming stronger and putting the world to the test

[wooden drift]

We already have proof that people survived almost with no severe wounds by that glove

Widowmaker was hit by it and she was fine

Went flying, but not really hurt badly

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah the general idea isn't bad, it's the execution of the actual events that aren't too great

[shrewd pivot]

A kid with no experience used it.

[dense nebula]

Tbf, a kid with no experience using it was wielding it

[wooden drift]

Gosh it's like saying gun isn't that dangerous in the hand of a child

[spare fox]

it's not exactly the same

not a good analogy

[dense nebula]

Wat

the fist doesn’t magically work at full strength regardless of who uses it

It’s a gauntlet, it has force based on the punch thrown

[shrewd pivot]

A charged up weapon you have to properly aim without recoil in the hands of a kid not knowing how to use it, versus Akande who mastered the doomfist. There's a difference.

[dense nebula]

By that logic Doomfist’s punch and that guy’s punch would be the same strength

[wooden drift]

I don't think we even have explanation how it works. Just that's it supposedly powerful

[snow fractal]

Anyways Vendetta wasnt built up enough to proper win that battle

[spare fox]

built up narratively? she was established as the colosseo champion before she was even introduced

[dense nebula]

Show not tell

Show us the sort of stuff she fought to warrant her being DF level

[snow fractal]

Doomfist bested two of Overwatch agents before Winston

[wooden drift]

And she was teased in rammatra's comic as the problem

[snow fractal]

That is telling us, not showing us

[wooden drift]

We saw her cut a giant robot in half

[spare fox]

it's literally showing

[dense nebula]

One robot

[wooden drift]

It was big robot

[snow fractal]

LOL

[dense nebula]

One robot

[wooden drift]

Did doomfist beat giant robot?

[snow fractal]

Overwatch has been battling Null Sector for years

[dense nebula]

He beat an army of robots

and 2 veteran Overwatch agents

[wooden drift]

But were they big?

[dense nebula]

and the former Doomfist

[spare fox]

keep in mind doomfist has been captured by overwatch and defeated by baby's first security drone so....

[spare fox]

sorry, Baby's First Security Drone AND the power of music and friendship

[snow fractal]

He was bested by a genetically modified electric gorilla and giant metal death machine specifically built to counter him

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta should have still won the battle narratively, but done things like use dirty tricks (suprise attack from the shadow to disarm THEN monologs as she plays with Doomfist. Doomfist was matched with mauga hand to hand, but doomfist WOULD be outmatched if disarmed against an opponent with a weapon. That would work. OR have Vendetta reveal last minute her sword parry's the doomfist, showing she was bluffing by getting hit, then parry a full charge and reflect it back to blow off Doomfist's arm. OR use the vishkar shielding technologies from Domina to shield herself from the doomfist punch OR use the shield technologies to lock Doomfist in place as a dirty trick to win)

Instead she got punched in the gut, somehow got up unwounded bc she got angry, out maneuvered the very Doomfist that caught TELEPOORTING Tracer and NINJA STEALTH Genji, and then threw Doomfist out a window after he ooc pathetically lunged at her. :I

[snow fractal]

Strong woman holding a big sword is different

[dense nebula]

If we wanna powerscale as well Mauga fought DF to a standstill and Mauga can survive multiple point blank explosions

[snow fractal]

YESSSSSS

[snow fractal]

This is literally what I was thinking fr

[dense nebula]

They better redeem my man or I’m dropkicking my controller at therapy

[spare fox]

Vendetta did get him w dirty moves - she cut his calves and faked him out

[snow fractal]

True, that is weird and im breaking a rule where i think he found without the Doomfist

[dense nebula]

Breaking a rule? Don’t lol

Unless that’s not what you mean

[snow fractal]

Sorry, I meant that I headcanon that he fought without the doomfist and he and mauga just had a fist brawl

[wooden drift]

Ye, I think we'll be arguing about this cinematic for awhile...

[shrewd pivot]

Doomfist beat Genji who can do that already, and Doomfist beat Tracer WHO TELEPORTS.

[snow fractal]

No guns, no gaunlets

[snow fractal]

I like the use of “Italian” in that description

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta isn't 6'7 lmafo she's like Widowmaker's height (Widowmaker with heels is a little shorter than Vendetta without heels)in game

[bold fern]

with no bulshit i believe he got too cocky once he became a leader

[bold fern]

shes slouching

[spare fox]

bc that's Tracer's downside, her teleports and recalls are predictible, she was outplayed. Vendetta knows better than to be predictable from fighting in the ring

[bold fern]

he could have followed up after vendetta crashed to the ground but decided to monologue

[dense nebula]

If she were French he would’ve won smh

[wooden drift]

I think he got cocky because he didn't took Vendetta seriously. She isn't really overwatch agent or anything like that

[snow fractal]

You are thinking clearly, I like you

[shrewd pivot]

My friend sent me screencaps doing the Universal mic drop emote side by side, Vendetta's model with sandals is just a tad taller than Widowmaker's in game model with heels.

[bold fern]

so was mauga right? the fist made him rusty

[snow fractal]

Tbf, the ingame models can be shifted, like how Lifeweaver was scaled down for gameplay purposes

[bold fern]

u cant tell me this same dude fought 1v3 and tied mauga then lost to vendetta

[snow fractal]

Take it with a grain of salt yall

[spare fox]

I also like how Mauga coming to a draw with Doomfist is somehow not contrived

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah and it looks bad to do that to humans. Bastion was OK but now Lifeweaver looks disproportionate to the rest of the cast.

[bold fern]

so mauga was right, fist made him rusty

[flat light]

is it doom with or without the fist?

[bold fern]

without

[spare fox]

yeah I do think in-game models aren't necessarily lore-accurate

[snow fractal]

Unknown, they just fought apparently. No other things have been stated

[flat light]

need more lore on it, I can't scale mauga up

[snow fractal]

It just depends on how they show this fight unlike how the clearly showed Ven’s fight with doom

[shrewd pivot]

No weapons, a Dambe fighter vs a roided out augmented human? Not impossible. It's canon, and it's not like Mauga beat Doomfist, they came to a draw. Again, power is not the only reason you draw, it's strategy used too.

[wooden drift]

Mauga is just weird

He's not really normal human

[bold fern]

doomfist also used his punch once the entire fight

[snow fractal]

I always assumed it was a fist fight but with no doomfist, just regular fist from when he broke out of prison and stuff

[bold fern]

mauga has 2 hearts and the fight lasted 3 hrs

how good is doom

[snow fractal]

He broke through multiple feet of concrete or steel

Without the doomfist

[wooden drift]

He's kinda a cyborg tho

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah like I wanted to see Doomfist charge up a full powered punch and Vendetta parry it, it would have been so badass

[snow fractal]

Yeah but Mauga has two hearts and is augemented for sure

[wooden drift]

Yea, mauga is beast

[bold fern]

this was winnable if he followed up when vendetta was on the ground

[wooden drift]

Wish we've seen more him about what he can do

[bold fern]

instead he aura farm and walk towards her

[shrewd pivot]

Doomfist did hand to hand combat without the doomfist, and Mauga didn't use his guns. It's not that implausible considering Mauga's body is probably physically stronger than Akande's human body.

[wooden drift]

Bad guys love doing that

I'm sure Vendetta will do the same

[bold fern]

this shows that his flaws dragged him down and he deserved the loss

as he had no competition

and was rusty

[wooden drift]

Except the horse

[snow fractal]

He a fraud then

[shrewd pivot]

I have a feeling Vendetta will have a very silly ending in how she eventually gets defeated by the end if her arc

[spare fox]

that's what they're conveniently forgetting...

[bold fern]

the horse was a 1v2 cuz lucio helped her

[wooden drift]

Skill issues

[snow fractal]

Its not like it was shown or told

[bold fern]

and orisa was made to counter doom

[snow fractal]

And Lucio is the goat

[wooden drift]

She's definitely getting betrayed by max

It's obvious

[dense nebula]

Vendetta with the plot armor

Ngl I think only like 2 out of the 6 there would follow Vendetta

Mauga there’s for the ride, and Moira just needs bills paid for her research

[wooden drift]

Mauga and Moira definitely staying

Reaper was in talon because of doomfist

[dense nebula]

Widowmaker idk what she’ll do

[wooden drift]

Without him he has no reason there

[snow fractal]

Max too is staying because he “promised”

[dense nebula]

Sombra has her own motives but she knew Vendetta was a wild card

[shrewd pivot]

Akande looked like he didn't know how to fight in the cinematic. In Dambe it's brutal, and when an opponent gets knocked to the ground, you win a point. It's a challegevto stand back up after getting knocked down in Dambe. It doesn't make sense that the fight didn't use the pillars around them as debris to toss at eachother or fake out with.

[bold fern]

Talon members and doomfist

moira: didnt care
mauga: excited
widow: concerned/scared
reaper: vengeful
sombra: concerned

[wooden drift]

Widow is staying too I guess, she has nowhere to go except staying in talon

And drugs

[snow fractal]

welp its over(watch), Doomfist sold the bag and I blame the writing for the most part. In lore, I guess he was just feel sick tha day

[bold fern]

he simply got cocky and didnt respect her enough, it happens all the times in fights

[spare fox]

it makes sense because they didn't do that? like the fight was what it was, I don't understand why you're arguing that it should have gone completely differently with a completely different outcome

[snow fractal]

Max: Max

[bold fern]

max: mr krabs

https://tenor.com/view/hello-money-giveittome-mr-krabs-spongebob-gif-4184913

[snow fractal]

Max:Millien

[dense nebula]

Hotel: Trivago

[wooden drift]

Max is getting his sit that was promised to him, he's chilling

[snow fractal]

Doom:Fraud

[shrewd pivot]

Because the fight scenes we have gotten in overwatch in prior cinematics actually use the enviorment in the battles???? Hello?

[dense nebula]

Yeah honestly that’s the worst part

Doomfist is now on Fraudwatch

[spare fox]

but that's irrelevant because this one didn't

[snow fractal]

So like yall think Domina’s chest is augumented or nature

[shrewd pivot]

Doomfost got the Darth Maul treatment that was the extent of the enviorment being used in the fight

[wooden drift]

Hardlight

[bold fern]

doom didnt want to destroy his nasa supercomputers

[spare fox]

Doomfist could have uppercut and grabbed a skyscraper and flattened Vendetta, but he didn't

[wooden drift]

Will his super computer be able to run unreal engine 5 tho?

[bold fern]

its a character flaw idk why ppl are coping, mauga literally said the fist was making him weak and cocky

[shrewd pivot]

Idk how to tell you this but fight choreography that fundamentally ignores the enviorment the fight is happening in is bad choreography and a downgrade in quality, as compared to Doomfist vs tracer vs genji, or Dragons, or litterally any 1v1 we have seen in cinematics

[spare fox]

IDK... some of those central-Asian women are pretty stacked

[snow fractal]

True, Ive seen it

(Im lying)

[wise grotto]

I just don’t think he was prepared for an attack this close to home and too cocky now
He got lured into this especially it was a meeting and there’s a traitor on that small list

Out of everyone sombra reaper are prolly the least likely to just follow vendetta though

[snow fractal]

I miss Sigma

The goat

[wise grotto]

Mauga just likes causing chaos and prolly doesn’t care that much
This at best just proves his point
Moira just wants funding
Max betrayed
And I doubt widow cares much

[bold fern]

its a character flaw idk what to tell you and idk if doom wants to wreck his crib for a fight

[shrewd pivot]

So why didn't vendetta pounce to disarm him, THEN start monologing at him like a wolf playing with its food?

[wooden drift]

Maybe they'll make talon jr. together with doomfist

[spare fox]

well he didn't use the environment, she did and that's on him - he was bested

[wooden drift]

Wasn't even the first time max betrayed doomfist

[bold fern]

Talon members and doomfist

moira: didnt care
mauga: excited
widow: concerned/scared
reaper: vengeful
sombra: concerned

[wise grotto]

Cause it was cinematic that’s about all there

[true ocean]

The move they did with vendetta and doom feels like a cheap narative to sell out the character more

[wise grotto]

Mauga likes fights and this was a fight

[shrewd pivot]

Ah yes, doomfist didn't want to break pillars (he's rich he could replace it) so he allowed himself to be disarmed, dethroned, and yeeted out a window

[dense nebula]

Tho he’s also a crafty tactician so who knows what’s going on in his head right now

[true ocean]

The dev team just hates doom

[dense nebula]

Maybe he sees her as easy to fight or something idk

[wooden drift]

That's moreso lore team

[spare fox]

but - according to you - he should have used the environment but he didn't, thus he deserved to lose

[wise grotto]

Oh yea definitely
I think he sees this as more so proving a point he’s made that the fists made him complacent and such

Doomfist clearly relied more on the fists sheer strength in this fight and most other fights he’s had people haven’t been on the offensive they’ve been scared of him while firing

[wooden drift]

Darn, we're arguing about this darn cinematic for how many hours?

[wise grotto]

Fighting

[wooden drift]

Six?

[wise grotto]

Except for two people who’ve fought him
Unleashed winston and orisa had no more fear from him and went all in

Those are also the two other times he’s actually lost a fight

[true ocean]

Orisa was made to completely counter him

[bold fern]

character flaw, cocky = got ahead of himself + didnt follow up on his attack = didnt respect her power = lost

i do mma and the no.1 thing is never turn ur back against ur opponent, unless u wanna get knovked out or submitted

[wise grotto]

Yea and vendetta spent 10 years training and multiple years planning how to fight him Unleashed
Aka how to find his weakness and counter him through it in a way she actually could

[shrewd pivot]

She didn't use the enviorment, she had legit no where to hide in the tiny room so they pulled the bs of pillars and shadow, Doomfist would be able to tell where she is by the sound of her running lol. Her throwing him out the window into a pit is a motif of her father being thrown out a window and a star wars reference. Please don't be obtuse, just say you don't care if the choreography goes down in quality, compared to prior cinematics.

[bold fern]

fist made him rusty

[wise grotto]

Widow got scared by a small child swinging a giant fist around in past cinematics I’m sorry we’ve had weird moments like that before

Correction she got suprised and wiped out

By a child

[spare fox]

nice ad hominum there... but she DID use the environment, she perched on the ceiling/pillar and then used the window/height of the building

[wooden drift]

Wait what?

[wise grotto]

Exactly

[wise grotto]

Widow in an old cinematic had a child literally knock her out via the giant let

[wooden drift]

Oh wait, I thought you said giant fish

My bad

[wise grotto]

Doomfist sorry

[wise grotto]

With the literal power she’s been shown to have of flying in the direction of her sword

[true ocean]

Lets say that it truly made him more cocky because it's the most powerful weapon and all but they literally made him look like he s a beginner

[wise grotto]

That now we know doesn’t actually have that much weight since it’s mostly hardlight

[true ocean]

I missed this moment

[wooden drift]

Yeah, I know that, just misunderstood words

[spare fox]

this dude is arguing that Doomfist shouldn't have lost, but he made mistakes and did lose, and therefor it's bad narrative 🙄

[dense nebula]

Blame the writers

[bold fern]

not really its his own fault that he lost composure and played with his prey

[dense nebula]

They made DF lose that easily

[wise grotto]

Like if doomfist has become more and more lax and cocky he’s gonna make mistakes against someone who he views as kinda pathetic

[dense nebula]

Vendetta was given way too much plot armor

[small fable]

Good

[wise grotto]

Vendetta would have won
I do think the fight should have been longer
But there’s no way she was gonna lose that at that point imo

[wooden drift]

Every written character has plot armour

[bold fern]

spooky lets discuss winton at the end of cinematic how cooked is he

[true ocean]

That s what I'm saying
Not that Doomfist shouldn t have lost,but at least if they would animate more action???

I know it's about money but

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta: character flaw, cocky. Revealed her location to doomfist and began monologing. Vendetta didn't follow up on her attack and Doomfist called her weak. She litterally turned her back to doomfist for aura farming after the gauntlet was cut off.

It's not that his actions aren't obvious flaws, it's that all of a sudden Doomfist who was last shown being strategic and competent now didn't even know how to fight Vendetta without the doomfist. It is ooc writing for him.

[wooden drift]

He's already dead

[dense nebula]

The writers will let him solo

[spare fox]

DUDE how he went "MAGNIFY" for a freaking WINDOW

IT'S A WINDOW WINSTON

[bold fern]

if he has primal maybe

[wooden drift]

He's scientist, he just has these cool windows

For moments like these

[shrewd pivot]

Yeah that cracked me up, cornball Winston dialog

[true ocean]

Anyway i hope he ll be back like some heihachi mishima type shi and have an actual good fight with her,not this simple choreography

[spare fox]

reminded me of that Law and Order episode of Community where Brie is shouting "enhance" at the evidence photo on the computer

[wooden drift]

That's almost guarantee

[dense nebula]

He went out the window and we never saw a body, he is alive

unlike Mace Windu

[wise grotto]

There’s no way he doesn’t come back after probably actually improv in himself

[true ocean]

Funny thing is it made me hate vendetta even more,so i ll make sure to tbag each one after kill

[dense nebula]

Vendetta’s Zazza moment

[wooden drift]

Wow villain is actually hateble...

[dense nebula]

It’s one thing to make a villain you love to hate, it’s another to hate them for being insufferable

[shrewd pivot]

Narratively, Vendetta should have won the fight. I have no issue with Vendetta plot point of Vendetta going into to rule Talon.

But the writers wrote doomfist ooc just to portray him as incompetent so Vendetta could beat him.

My issue isn't that Vendetta won omfg. It's that it was poor writing in HOW she achieved her win! I wanted to see good writing showing her go toe to toe with the canon doomfist who IS a competent fighter, and win because she actually strategized and played dirty.

[wooden drift]

I mean, she doesn't really have any attributes that make her likeble

[dense nebula]

That’s the problem lol

[wooden drift]

She's power hungry

[spare fox]

my bro stop, it's not ooc just bc you say it was. It's been confirmed that he is cocky and let his guard down

[bold fern]

doomfist turned his back vs vendetta and it was pre fight, safe to do so

Doom did it DURING the fight

Doom was already in a bad mental state after he realised vendetta was indeed a threat when she threw her sword and disarmed him, making him reckless, she knows that. (being reckless in a fight is how u lose 99% of the time)

[true ocean]

I meant overall,both what they with her hypertuning of her kit and story bcs im biased towards doom and I personally dislike,still would consider him lose as long as its cool and not cheap

[shrewd pivot]

Doomfist not being able to hear where Vendetta is around pillars IS ooc. Doomfist was able to track TRACER who can TELEPORT.

[spare fox]

he was able to predict where Tracer was going to be

[dense nebula]

So it’s character assassination then. Point is the way the writers chose to portray him in this is not at all how he was shown in other material. OOC, he was cocky whatever. The choice to make him act that way was not a good decision and it even weakens the impact of Vendetta winning

[spare fox]

but the point is that Vendetta will be defeated eventually too

whether it's OW, another usurper, DF resurrected

[dusky fulcrum]

Mystery Tank Hero Theory

Images are in order and ill be talking about them in the order they appear.

-Who is She?
D.mon. "D.Mon is a member of the MEKA Squad. She is tough and protective of her team." ( Info comes from the wiki https://overwatch.fandom.com/wiki/D.Mon)

-Why do i think D.mon and the Silhouette are the same?
The 3rd picture is a low quality screenshot taken from the spotlight(time stamp is 22:13 if u want to check). It shows different perspectives of a character we dont have in the game atm. Not only that but the front view is identical to the silhouette from picture n.1. The picture displays 2 cyan asymmetrical weapons very similar to a sword and a shield(both also appear on picture n.2 as concept for D.mon).

-Buuut isnt D.mon concept a little more...Chonky?
Yeah. Her concept was teased with the style same as ow 1 D.va. It isnt odd to believe she also got redesigned to look closer to nowadays concepts. The fact that the silhouette on n.1 has the same antennas as Ow2 D.va meka(Picture n.4). I also want to point out that tho in picture n.3 the colors seem purple and cyan there are good chances its a dark red that simply due to the light seems purple.

This is all ive been able to find so far. Hope you guys find it interesting. If there are any questions, feel free to ask.

[shrewd pivot]

And he also did so with Genji. Two rather quiet heroes. Vendetta makes NOISE when she runs and uses her jets. Unless Doomfist is just suddenly too old and his reflexes suck, it doesn't make sense that Vendetta would get the best of him like that.

[dense nebula]

I’m more interested in the Oni looking dude and the Omnic detective

[wooden drift]

God I hope it's not asian character. Enough is enough

[shrewd pivot]

I hope trenchcoat omnic is peak

[dense nebula]

12 billion more Japanese ninja heroes

[wooden drift]

FUCK

[dusky fulcrum]

korean

[shrewd pivot]

Exactly!

[spare fox]

I am surprised there aren't more Korean heroes

[wooden drift]

I think he'll take overwatch agents seriously than some rando who he didn't cared about

[shrewd pivot]

A MEKA support would be fun

[wooden drift]

Big support hero?

[dusky fulcrum]

way to big yeah

[shrewd pivot]

I think it was "overlord" that was the MEKA support of DVA's team? That's what I mean.

[spare fox]

basically a Baymax

[fossil wren]

I really wonder how they'll make another member of Meka Squad feel different from D.Va

[dusky fulcrum]

this one is probs mele

[dense nebula]

There’s a character with a drone that looks like a flying fish

Could be from Barbados

Source? I looked up where Flying Fish are native lol

Could not be a flying fish and I’m absolutely wrong

[fossil wren]

Yeah, but besides that, what else?

[shrewd pivot]

Vendetta was mafia and had a hardlight sword, a public gladiator. It's not like she was Mei rolling up for fistcuffs lol

[fossil wren]

Some people guess Is from deadlock gang

Frankie, to be exact

Deadlock hacker

[dense nebula]

Wait I just realized most likely 4 of the 5 unrevealed heroes look like they’ll be female with the Omnic detective being the only male

[dusky fulcrum]

probably wont have flying like diva but perhaps a super jump

[wooden drift]

My only hope for him is that he'll be caricature

[dense nebula]

Wait I don’t have img perms but the lady on the far left

With the really thin waist, that may be another Omnic

[fossil wren]

She looks a lot like a Null Sector Stalker

[dense nebula]

We need more Null Sector rep

[wooden drift]

I don't think we'll be getting any null sector heroes

[dense nebula]

We have Ram lol

[fossil wren]

Well since Ram went to sleep

Is kinda hard

[wooden drift]

Is anybody even there except ram?

[dense nebula]

There was a few others but idk for sure

[fossil wren]

Technically no

There are only other cells that are affiliated with Null sector

[wise grotto]

Ram is kinda the only other actual omnics in null sector anymore the rest left him csuse he was too crazy

[wooden drift]

I thought every other omnic were just mindless machine

[fossil wren]

But in Null sector there is only Ramattra

If it really is from Null sector it could be a drone or something similar to the Ana mythic skin (an artificial intelligence)

[wooden drift]

So, not really conscious

[fossil wren]

If it were an artificial intelligence, It would probably be like Orisa or Echo

[wooden drift]

Kinda surprising that Rammatra only one there

[dense nebula]

HOLY CRAP WAIT THE DETECTIVE OMNIC HAS A CANE

[wooden drift]

But orisa and echo are just exception. If rammatra could anything like this it would've been mentioned somewhere

[wooden drift]

He's beating people with cane

[fossil wren]

We certainly don't know what Ramattra is doing right now since he just leaved

[wooden drift]

Or maybe he shoots with it

Like penguin from batman

[fossil wren]

They could use as an excuse that during that time he started designing something like that

[wooden drift]

That could kinda contradict with what he said to zen

Why would he be doing anything else, if he already got what he wanted

[wise grotto]

Wait we’re getting that giant omnic from the ow1 backsplash art

[fossil wren]

Why not? More heroes to the roster

[dense nebula]

Show?

[fossil wren]

[dense nebula]

Cause otherwise we have better hints that it’s DMon

[wise grotto]

The colourful motherfucke r

[wooden drift]

God I hope not

[wise grotto]

I had to find the image patience

[wooden drift]

I think he was supposed to be early orisa, if I remember correctly

[wise grotto]

He looks pretty similar to the giant robot dude in the background of the upcoming heroes

[wise grotto]

Maybe but he still might be the design inspo for this new guy

[wooden drift]

Orisa had lots of design to be honest

[dense nebula]

Early Rein

[merry mason]

It’s dmon we have the concept art

[dense nebula]

he was called Wildebeast

[wooden drift]

It would be so lame if it's mecha character

I wanna play giant robot

Just giant robot

Not omnic or anything like that

[merry mason]

There were other founding members (though they left) and apparently null sector has recruitment material so it probably has other members

[wooden drift]

I think if there were somebody they would've been mentioned by now

[merry mason]

My baseless headcanon is that she’ll get taken by the Gwishin and Kerrigan’d so she’ll be like half omnic

[wooden drift]

I dunno, maybe ram kidnapped all the other members too

[merry mason]

Maybe they did some soul searching and decided ram was right

[wooden drift]

He liberates everyone

[merry mason]

I just always thought nameless would be a hero because they were definitely describing them with powers that would be in a hero kit

But that was like two years ago they would be out by now

[wise grotto]

That’s been proven to not work as a baseline Mauga was supposed to release ages ago and only release like 4 years after the initial expected year (or longer)

[wooden drift]

I heard mauga was supposed to be released in place of rammatra, but something went wrong and they delayed him

For some reason they had problems with making mauga

[merry mason]

Yeah that happened

Wait no it was sigma actually

That they swapped him with

[fossil wren]

It's funny to think that Briggite saw a random cat arrive in Gibraltar and her first thought was giving her a jetpack

[wooden drift]

It did worked out

[fossil wren]

She's probably been thinking about that for years 😭

[merry mason]

What’s funny to me is talons gets a four armed goddess, heartless killer cyborg, and yakuza assassin and brig was like “we need a cat to even the odds”

[winged dagger]

I'm so excited for vendetta to rebrand talon as a pizzeria and create a global chain

[wooden drift]

Mama mia

[merry mason]

Honestly I would love some information on whatever fronts talon uses so pizzeria lore is welcome to me

[azure flint]

sombra is def leaving talon

and will drag sigma with her since she has a soft spot for him

[merry mason]

Nah too useful for her

Like I don’t think she’d really care who’s in charge anyway

[dry pebble]

Since when Brigette has two cats in lore?

[peak escarp]

since always

[covert harbor]

I think she actually has multiple

[peak escarp]

her origin story had a white cat (Mitzi) and an orange cat

Jetpack Cat isn't Brigitte's cat though, she's a stray that showed up at Gibraltar

her name is Fika apparently

[dry pebble]

In website it stated that its Brigette's

[dense nebula]

She adopted it though no?

They mentioned her when talking about Jetpack Cat

[dry pebble]

Mitzi was good why they are pulling different Cat out of ass

Literal industrial plant

[peak escarp]

I guess

but she's not one of the Lindholm family cats, is what I mean

[sand veldt]

Hazard is so underrated as a character

[peak escarp]

Mitzi was their cat when Brig was a child, cats usually only live about 20 years - Mitzi is probably dead by now

[covert harbor]

F

[sand veldt]

He just gives off supportive good guy with an edge of bitterness energy

[peak escarp]

I like Hazard

[dense nebula]

What do you take from the Omnic detective with the cane?

For the unknown hero silhouette

[azure flint]

love it

[peak escarp]

they interest me the most

[azure flint]

reminds me of cass omnic skin

c455 sharpshooter iirc

[covert harbor]

Hard to speculate on what we have for the silhouette characters other than D.mon.

One of the other ones looked like Cammy from street fighter.

[spare fox]

destroyed gibraltar map goes so hard

[azure flint]

the remaining heroes:

• null sector lady
• dmon
• another hashimoto? horns look like part of a mask unless it's an actual oni or smth
• detective style omnic
• lady with a gun who can control a drone or a pet

[covert harbor]

Yeah can't wait to see the update on the talon vs ow war

[peak escarp]

null sector lady?

[azure flint]

what else do you call it

it looks familiar somehow

[covert harbor]

The omnic looking character on the left, looks like one of the concepts for a null boss

[peak escarp]

idk, but nothing about that silhouette says null sector to me

[azure flint]

null sector or omnic

that waist tells me it's not human

[peak escarp]

I've seen people speculate it might be Hivemind, the terrorist that caused Reinhardt's retirement

[spare fox]

the one with the horns, pretty sure will be Hashimoto

[peak escarp]

could be a cyborg

[shrewd pivot]

I hope the left most character is an omnic, and I hope trenchcoat omnic is peak. I would like to see a feminine awakened omnic on the Roster eventually, and an omnic that explores "omnic integration into human society" would be a great addition to the roster so I think the trenchcoat omnic might cover that worldbuilding

[spare fox]

if that long braid girl is Frankie, another married hero

[covert harbor]

Is that the deadlock character with the garage?

[azure flint]

kinda funny dmon is coming if it is her since blizzard hated making dva lol

[covert harbor]

Hopefully she doesn't pop out her mech as well. Coding nightmare for the dev team.

[past copper]

Would be nice to see new Talon heroes beyond what we have with Domina, Mizuki, and to an extent Emre

[honest adder]

FR

[azure flint]

hope we get a little side story of how emre became who he is rn

[honest adder]

I feel like Domina could have SUCH good lorr

[honest adder]

Yea we need sum info

[azure flint]

he's like being controlled

by "the conspiracy"

[wise grotto]

Could also be a member of yokai

Kiris group

[covert harbor]

Oh boy fandom will get a kick out of kirko 2

[wise grotto]

Cause I’m sure every member of her group is a 21 year old female

People just want elaboration on them csuse we’ve gotten fuck all since kiri showed up

[azure flint]

kiri age retcon will happen this year

trust

[spare fox]

the one dev in the red dress (forgot her name sorry) mentioned that we will be getting more story w Mizuki and Toshiro - hopefully more insight into how those weapons work

[azure flint]

do you think they made hero trailers for all five?

[covert harbor]

Probably, ig it depends on how far along they are in development. I'm sure they are still putting the finishing touches on those who are coming later in the year.

[azure flint]

season trailer gonna be 5 mins long

[chilly pivot]

Currently, who is the most powerful character in the series? As in singular power.

[spare fox]

do a search

[azure flint]

idk sigma

[chilly pivot]

Thanks

[peak escarp]

currently, Vendetta

[merry mason]

Idk beating doomfist has been done before. Maybe not as badly but there’s still room for argument

[peak escarp]

the plot says she's strongest

until someone comes along (or comes back) to beat her

[dense nebula]

Let’s be honest here she doesn’t deserve to be the strongest. They just wrote Doomfist to lose so easily

[peak escarp]

I agree

he only lost because the plot needed him to

which is why I'm 100% confident that he will return by the end of the year and retake Talon

[lilac badger]

I think it kind of made sense

Doom is out of his prime while vendetta is in hers

hes 49, shes 20 years younger lol

[past copper]

I'll say this, I feel so sorry for Talon
You know damn well Vendetta will wean out any loyalists to Akande in Talon

Along with anyone who disagrees with her authority over Talon

Or anyone she views as a threat to Talon all together

I can guarantee Reaper and Sombra are on her watch list

I wonder, will this new leadership force Sombra to flea Talon? Bc I doubt Vendetta will allow her to remain if she's working with enemies of Talon

[lilac badger]

Either sombra will flee and become freelance, or she uses her connection to domina/vishkar to pull strings and stay. I don't think theres much in it without akande for sombra so i imagine she'd leave

Reaper will maybe pull a starscream

lol

but successfully

[past copper]

Uuuuh. What connection to Vishkar?

I don't remember seeing anywhere Sombra has a connection to them

[lilac badger]

Back in one of the old cinematics

she made a deal with a vishkar higher up

[red olive]

That was volskaya

Different group

[lilac badger]

Wasnt volskaya under vishkar?

[red olive]

Not to my knowledge

[lilac badger]

Sorry its been a while since i watched the older cinematics

[red olive]

We should all probably get a refresh on them

[lilac badger]

Then I suppose she'll probably just go freelance

[lilac badger]

yeah especially with all this lore revitalization, im so excited

[red olive]

Hell yeah

[past copper]

Katya Volskaya is the head Volskaya Industries. No connections to Domina or Vishkar

[lilac badger]

MB lol

really thought it was in some way

[red olive]

Doomfist has fallen!

[past copper]

Sombra's bound to flee to Overwatch. Or reunite with Soldier. Possibly Ana and Illari with him

[lilac badger]

He has indeed

[lilac badger]

wdym reunite? To my knowledge sombra wasnt in ow, or did work with them

[past copper]

You really gotta read the books, friend

[lilac badger]

Don't have the money for it sadly

[wise grotto]

She’s worked with him finding the conspiracy guys solidiers been hunting

[red olive]

It was in one of the recent story collections

[lilac badger]

Oh

lol

How recent?

[wise grotto]

Also Maximillian is more of the starscream imo

[lilac badger]

emre?

[past copper]

Sombra worked with Jack in Heroes Ascendant

[peak escarp]

last May

[lilac badger]

Oh then thats why

[dense nebula]

Is Emre with talon or just a random mercenary?

[lilac badger]

I took a break from the game until a week before vendetta came to the game

[peak escarp]

he worked with Talon for a while

[past copper]

Both. More or less

[red olive]

No idea

[peak escarp]

if anyone needs a refresher on the lore, I have a database here
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BFYjC78shFuhpu4Fm0l99qKQznIc7lPouQaikD5YvkY/edit?usp=sharing

[lilac badger]

Thanks

[past copper]

Until further notice, we don't know what will happen with him now that Freja has found him

[red olive]

Appreciate it

[lilac badger]

If i remember correctly from the freja comic moira said he was with talon but hes been mia/quiet recently

[red olive]

Isnt emre supposed to be the same age as soldier 76 and ana?

How the hell does he look so young

I need his secrets

[lilac badger]

Nanomachines, son

[past copper]

Freja worked with him too and still looks young

[lilac badger]

They harden in response to physical trauma

[red olive]

I guess that tracks...

Senator armstrong mauga skin would be hilarious

[peak escarp]

it has been 915 days since our last Blizzard animated short

[past copper]

But it's because the people in the OW universe are living healthier lives in the 2070s thanks to science benefitting the world

[lilac badger]

that would be peak

[lilac badger]

We just got one

With the vendetta and doom one

[peak escarp]

yes

but the last one before that was Calling in 2023

[lilac badger]

Oh

yeah

if u look at it like that yeah

[red olive]

Could this be the secret to kiriko's aging

[lilac badger]

Its not even that she just looks younger, she just IS 20 years younger

[peak escarp]

[red olive]

Uhhh

Time

Travel

Yeah

[peak escarp]

Kiriko should be 26, not 21

her age isn't that far off

[lilac badger]

yeah i forgot KIRIKO's slipstream my bad

[red olive]

Thats low balling honestly

[peak escarp]

that's the math

[past copper]

I'm quoting Freeman here a little bit. If we under paid politicians and overpaid teachers and scientists more, we could change the world for the better

We could live in the Overwatch universe by now

[peak escarp]

she was 12 when Sojiro Shimada was killed 14 years ago

[red olive]

Never happening

[peak escarp]

12 + 14 = 26

[red olive]

My bad, never knew that

[lilac badger]

Are you saying they should have made her twenty six? (my six doesnt work on my kb)

[peak escarp]

correct

[lilac badger]

because i agree

okay

[red olive]

I personally havent read anything they put out since new blood

[peak escarp]

she doesn't need to be as old as Hanzo and Genji

[lilac badger]

no

[red olive]

I kinda just vaguely know about the newer stuff

[peak escarp]

because she is clearly younger than them in the art

[copper viper]

So like is my goat confirmed dead? Orrrrr?

[peak escarp]

it's probably a fakeout

[red olive]

Defeated

[peak escarp]

we didn't see the body

[red olive]

They never used the word dead either

Or killed

[copper viper]

Aura investment*

[red olive]

I guessss.....

[copper viper]

He's coming back

I know he is

[lilac badger]

if any character ever is thrown off a cliff, they come back

[peak escarp]

I'm positive he will be back by the end of the year

[copper viper]

True

[lilac badger]

ESPECIALLY if you dont see them finish the fall

[red olive]

I dont like his portrayal as an aura farming anime villain

[copper viper]

That is the law

[copper viper]

That's not a portrayal that's just who he is

[past copper]

The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence with Doomfist right now. If you get that quote, you a real one

[red olive]

Realllyyyyy

[copper viper]

English mothafucka do you speak it?!

[past copper]

What?

[red olive]

Im surprised we dont have a sigma voiceline referencing that

[lilac badger]

I think they are trying to force him out of the villain spotlight slightly, because they are tired of writing for him, its been like 8 years of him being the big baddie lol

[peak escarp]

it's a reference

[red olive]

That would be so cool

[red olive]

Big baddie for 8 years but didnt get to do much

[copper viper]

Say what again I dare you!

[past copper]

I know. I'm quoting the same one

[peak escarp]

clearly one I don't get

[copper viper]

Holy airball

[red olive]

Doomfist isnt dead until his in game bio says "was"

[lilac badger]

No I know, just saying its newer writers and of course this all just my headcannon but i think they want to write on someone new, or at least give it a refresh until they inevitably bring back doom

[past copper]

Funny as hell show the Boondocks. They had Samuel Jackson voicing in it

[lilac badger]

New person being vendetta

[copper viper]

Why not write about how venture discovers a new metal for the torbfam to use and defeat talon?

[red olive]

Akande's whole philosophy is about growing through conflict

[lilac badger]

Im not a writer fam just saying i think thats what they want

[copper viper]

It's also just pulp fiction

[red olive]

This is merely an opportunity for him to develop

[lilac badger]

true, hes like a saiyan lol

[copper viper]

What they want is terrible and should be changed

[red olive]

You could put it like that i guess 😭

[lilac badger]

In the vaguest way possible

[past copper]

The quote or the show? Bc the show was more like a whole series of movie parodies

[copper viper]

My goat would NOT die that easy

[copper viper]

Both

Wait no the quote

[red olive]

I will say it was definitely out of character for him to lash out like a baby after his defeat

[past copper]

Also, not to offend anyone here if you like it, but yea. I'm not interested in this coming collab

Just not a fan of Hello Kitty

[red olive]

I hope this is part of the plan, and the writers dont genuinely think this lowly of him

[peak escarp]

I love it

[past copper]

Don't get me wrong. Cool reminder of stuff from my childhood

[red olive]

The lucio and juno skins are really cute imo, but i dont really care for the others

[peak escarp]

I like cute things

[copper viper]

WHICH CHARACTERS ARE GETTING SKINS AND PLEASE TELL ME EITHER REIN OR HOG ARE GETTING ONE

[red olive]

Lucio, juno, widow, mercy

[past copper]

But honestly like the magical girl collab one bc I'm a fan of Sailor Moon. The og version

[red olive]

And someone else

Cant remember

[copper viper]

FUUUUUUUCK

We need a cutsie skin for the big guys

[red olive]

Mercy getting her second mythic has to be ragebait

Poor frogger

[red olive]

!!!!!!

[peak escarp]

it's part of the Rainy Day set

[red olive]

Thats adorable

[copper viper]

I want to be absolutely ginormous while being pink and adorable like a true hello kitty fan

[red olive]

Holy

[past copper]

I'm going to say this tho. Mizuki look like Baby Saja of the Saja Boys from K-Pop Demon Hunters. Fingers crossed for that collab

[copper viper]

Why haven't they made this yet?

[peak escarp]

it's coming soon

[wise grotto]

Emre probabky related to that yea

[copper viper]

YEEEEEAH

[red olive]

I could see that happening

Along with zoey reinhardt

[copper viper]

I want a jjba collab with a jotaro ram and a Dio zen

[red olive]

Jotaro cass wouls be cool since they have the same voice actor

[copper viper]

No

Hol horse cass

[red olive]

Oooh

Mista cass?

So many options

[copper viper]

FUCK no

[past copper]

Not that big of fan of Jojo. Anime feels like it fell off around Golden Wind? Was that the name

[red olive]

Lmao

[red olive]

Interesting take

[past copper]

I just liked the other Jojo ones before that one

[copper viper]

Mista used an m9 Beretta one time and lost his collab priveleges

[copper viper]

Understandable but I promise you stone ocean is so much worse

[red olive]

All of the joestars are static characters until jolyne, so ive gotta give props to stone ocean for that

[copper viper]

At least in golden wind the stands were cool and still simple enough to understand

[red olive]

For me, jojo has alwayw been about the amazing side characters like bucciatati ans polnareff

[past copper]

Hmm. Genji, Hanzo, Kiriko, Wuyang, Anran, Mizuki

I feel like there an amime collab there

[red olive]

Part 6 side cast was kinda weak in comparison

[copper viper]

Polnareff lover = based

[red olive]

We have been building up to this for a while...

[red olive]

Hell yeah

[copper viper]

Except ermes Costello who was hot AF 😩

[red olive]

Jjk collab would be another cool one

[red olive]

Ill give you that

[copper viper]

Ehh

[red olive]

Mechamaru ramattra

[copper viper]

I fw jjk but idk about an ow collab

Like they already got mha and one punch

[red olive]

And have nemesis form be his giant mecha

[copper viper]

I feel like they should go a bit older than those

[dense nebula]

I’m getting sick and tired of every hero from Japan being a ninja

[red olive]

Its a weird stereotype i guess

[dense nebula]

It’s overdone

[red olive]

At least this guy doesnt have a wall climb

[past copper]

Wuyang and Anran aren't ninjas

[red olive]

Theyre improving

[dense nebula]

They’re Chinese

[copper viper]

Hanzo is a ronin 😐

[dense nebula]

He was trained as a ninja and his kit is ninja inspired

[past copper]

Point still stands. They aren't ninjas. And we don't outright know exactly if Mizuki is

If he doesn't have wall climb, then he's not being portrayed as a ninja

[copper viper]

So like a ronin? Which is a ninja whose less stealth and more range?

[past copper]

The Hashimoto don't seem that well trained

[copper viper]

The hashimoto clan was built on assassination money

[past copper]

Ronin is rogue samurai

[copper viper]

Yeah with a bow

[past copper]

Samurai have used bows you know

[copper viper]

A ninja is a type of samurai who relies on stealth

It's like dnd classes

[red olive]

Tomato tomato

What even is a ninja anymore

[copper viper]

Ninja is rogue, ronin is ranger, whatever kiriko is a paladin who forgot constitution is important

[red olive]

What would jordan peterson say in this situation

"Define ninja"

[shrewd pivot]

I think I know why the C-walk dance emote doesn't sit right for me for Ramattra. (I say this as someone who's fav character is Ramattra and wants Ramattra content)

The dance emote is a ref to the superbowl performance "Not like us". Serena Williams C-walked during the superbowl on stage as a public expression of authentic black culture, to reject the person that hurt her and others. Sojourn is stated to be inspired by Serena Williams. C-walk comes from ||crip walk|| where Henry Heard, a black man with amputated leg, danced with a crutch to challenge norms about disability, eventually the dance style became C-walking.

Like. Idk does Ramattra the robot character need to do this dance? why doesn't Sojourn, a disabled black woman character directly based on Serena, C-walk instead? Or, yknow maybe overwatch shouldn't shallowly ref this big moment in black history, during black history month, when that superbowl performance was specifically about rejecting shallowness/appropriation of black culture.

Idk i just think it's really awkward for ow to use this like a "meme" for Ramattra. The dance/event isn't a "meme" to slap on robots.

[copper viper]

"I think young men are too distracted by figuring out the different types of samurai and instead they should be learning the basic ways of life that a samurai would live by, such as discipline, honor, loyalty, respect, and pride." -Jordan Peterson on the topic of what type of samurai is Hanzo from overwatch 1/2

[red olive]

"This is a circular argument. What does hanzo have to do with any of this. Define samurai"

[copper viper]

Crazy how some proper punctuation turned that from two lines of text to three

[red olive]

I guess i must be ignorant since i simply didnt know the history behind it

I could definitely see that being an insult to a lot of people

[peak escarp]

I don't think most people would care

[red olive]

You never know

[copper viper]

Dawg you can say crip walk

This is discord not tik tok

[shrewd pivot]

I was unsure if it counts as an ableist slur, and I put slurs under spoilers when discussing history to respect others who might be reading.

[red olive]

Fair enough i guess

[copper viper]

I suppose

[shrewd pivot]

I mean, the superbowl was a big deal. It meant a lot to a lot of people.

A shallow meme of it isn't exactly... mindful? Especially during black history month.

[peak escarp]

it's just a meme

[wise grotto]

Fhe walk itself has been somewhat of a meme since then and I literally have seen next to 0 issues regarding that fact

[shrewd pivot]

<:( I feel like you aren't getting my point.

[peak escarp]

I didn't know its origins, and I'm betting most people don't either

not everything is super deep

[untold sparrow]

Ram gets a dance emote at least

[shrewd pivot]

Like if it was Sojourn then ok ig that's a meme and maybe devs are having a good spirit about things.

[merry mason]

Yeah it already evolved past its origins into, just a dance really.

[shrewd pivot]

But Ramattra is... a robot. Idk it's that the video directly referenced "not like us" that announced Ramattra's dance emote, so it seems to be intentional.

[untold sparrow]

It's A DANCE be glad he has one lol

[lilac badger]

I really dont understand how this is a big deal, it's just a dance at this point is it not? Also, just like how the x-men in marvel represent oppresion towards minorities, omnics do the same in the overwatch community

[untold sparrow]

Exactly

[shrewd pivot]

Again, not my point. It's about being mindful and not memeing up an event about authentic expression of culture as "just a silly dance"

[untold sparrow]

Why is it a big deal though. It's just a damn dance emote?

[lilac badger]

Since when was the overwatch spotlight an event about authentic expression of culture, or am i a dunce here

[shrewd pivot]

Like it gets to a point where something is a tongue and cheek ref, and where it starts to boarder into just being shallow

[dense nebula]

That’s not at all what a ronin is lol

[lilac badger]

All ive seen them meme about is the overwatch community asking for the dance and now they do it

[dense nebula]

A ronin is a samurai without a master

[untold sparrow]

Agreed, it was to showcase stuff

[dense nebula]

Ninja can and have used ranged weapons

Hell, there’s an entire clan that specializes in gunpowder and explosives

[peak escarp]

you're a little late Grimm

the convo has moved on

[dense nebula]

I was in a match on Smite lol

[lilac badger]

Thought ronins were wandering samurai

[shrewd pivot]

I mean, I explained the history, that's what makes me pause. I just hope this doesn't make people uncomfortable if they see that context.

[untold sparrow]

I'm sure it won't. And if they do complain they just petty

[peak escarp]

he's a robot civil rights leader doing a dance from a culture who struggled with civil rights

[lilac badger]

I really don't think it goes that deep in present day, and if they do complain, its not a new day in the overwatch community. It's like water found in a lake, this community is never happy or satisfied

[gusty cloak]

just watched the cinematic. why is my goat doomfist so washed

[untold sparrow]

That is a valid reason to dance it

[dense nebula]

Ngl, I want some more pure evil Omnics

[untold sparrow]

Bc doom

[lilac badger]

Exactly, omnics are a metaphor towards present day minorities

[untold sparrow]

Is dead

[gusty cloak]

"doom will return in overwatch 3"

[untold sparrow]

"doom will return in overwatch 20"

[lilac badger]

No no, got thrown off a cliff, he is DEFINITELY not dead. We didn't see a body, which means 100 percent he comes back

[gusty cloak]

my boy defeated winston, genji, and tracer in a 1v3 he would NOT lose here

[lilac badger]

its been like 10 years lol

[gusty cloak]

lost to the plot

[dense nebula]

Erm… he lost to Winton

[lilac badger]

and also winston won

[gusty cloak]

only the angy phase

[untold sparrow]

It's bc plot he lost lol

[lilac badger]

Out of his prime, vendetta in her prime

[dense nebula]

Ngl, I don’t think I like Vendetta as a character

[untold sparrow]

Vendetta fueled by vengeance

[red olive]

Fall damage

[lilac badger]

and in her prime lol, 29

[gusty cloak]

the only thing is that i wish she was older. she could've been another moira like character

[untold sparrow]

Mid 20s is prime lol

[gusty cloak]

she's 29???

[lilac badger]

yeah

[red olive]

I saw her described as an "industry plant nepo baby character" in overwatch chat earlier today

Couldnt agree more

[dense nebula]

For one, her design is way too bland

No battle scars, no wolf iconography

She’s too clean for someone who has supposedly been fighting as a gladiator for a majority of her life

[red olive]

She feels too "perfect" like kiriko

[gusty cloak]

unfortunately this will be a massive issue with all character designs in the future. they'll always make more younger conventionally attractive characters over better designs

[dense nebula]

It’s way too safe and simple of a design too

[red olive]

Havent had as much of a problem with juno hazard and freja

[lilac badger]

yeah but till 30/35 her body is in a better shape on paper

[dense nebula]

Ramattra is still the most peak Overwatch design

[red olive]

I cant disagree

[gusty cloak]

i might be crazy but even the new jetpack cat design is too safe and simple

[shrewd pivot]

I wouldn't call people expressing discomfort over shallow culture rep petty per se. If a black person said they found the dance a little odd to give Ram, I could understand why bc of the context/history.

Ig im just more hesitant about these things bc I have Romani heritage and I can relate to shallow "memes" being kinda hurtful when it gets to a certain point.

I personally wouldn't have given Ramattra this dance emote, but I hope the emote can be a positive thing for ppl like you all say.

[lilac badger]

ramattra definitely has a great design but I think illari has a good design as well

[shrewd pivot]

Sigma origin cinematic, Ramattra lore concepts, and "The Last Bastion" cinematic remain my fave overwatch art pieces 💗

[dense nebula]

Ehhh, Ramattra is peak design overall. Gameplay tied to his lore tied to his visuals

[lilac badger]

Alright I gotta go to bed, goodnight everyone

[red olive]

I wish her gameplay was as cool as she was 🥺

[lilac badger]

ong

[red olive]

I hope he gets a summoner build in stadium

[shrewd pivot]

I agree, the Jetpack itself doesn't have strong enough shape use use imo

[peak escarp]

Sigma's origin trailer is my least favourite piece of lore

[dense nebula]

Really?

[red olive]

You are bold

[peak escarp]

it's written as an abstract piece, and that's cool, but everyone takes it literally

[red olive]

Thats probably the most universally loved origin story

[peak escarp]

it's got the cool factor, but it doesn't really tell us much about Sigma himself besides "he opened a black hole and went crazy"

[shrewd pivot]

You are meant to watch it forwards, then backwards. It's meta art, the voice acting is great, and the melody is iconic. Great scifi story too

[peak escarp]

I prefer origin shorts that actuall give us information without the need to interpret

Ashe's is my favourite

(mostly because I love her voice)

[dense nebula]

I’m still annoyed we barely get omnic heroes

It’s such an untapped goldmine

Thankfully we’re getting maybe two coming up

[peak escarp]

at least one of the unknown heroes shown today appears to be an omnic

yeah

[dense nebula]

The waist of the lady on the far left makes me think she’s another Omnic

[red olive]

Sucks that they arent coning until season 5 or 6

[peak escarp]

we don't know what order they're coming in

[shrewd pivot]

Where's the art in that.... overwatch is legit based on pulp fiction which covers a wide variety of genres. That's the strength of overwatch as an ip. You can have a scifi western spaghetti one minute, then a madmax 4th wall break the next. There's a little bit of everything for everyone's tastes.

[red olive]

The roadmap shows the first 4

[peak escarp]

oh does it? I didn't see the roadmap

[peak escarp]

I just care about facts over art

[red olive]

Im hoping the beefy fella is a redesign of soundquake

[dense nebula]

It’s most likely Dmon unfortunately

[peak escarp]

I hope the one we think is D.mon is actually D.mon

[red olive]

Completely forgot about the meka squad

[shrewd pivot]

As in, you prefer explicit canon for overwatch rather than overwatch creating art pieces?

[peak escarp]

yes

I am a strict canon adherent

[red olive]

Theres always fun to be had when you need to piece it together

[dense nebula]

Headcanons are NOT welcome

[peak escarp]

well

[shrewd pivot]

I respect that take, but I think that misses a huge portion of what makes Overwatch special: artful storytelling that makes the world feel lived in and something worth caring about.

[peak escarp]

headcanons with well researched supporting arguments are welcome

[red olive]

Thats why things like fnaf have appeal to many people

[peak escarp]

I have a few headcanons myself

like which heroes are left handed

even though none have been confirmed

but you don't get a title like Lore Warlord without being a stickler for canon

[shrewd pivot]

You must hate silent characters like Bastion then, huh 😅 I personally find the fact overwatch isn't afraid to have unconventional storytelling methods (like having non human characters) a huge strength of the ip

[red olive]

Bastion is a crippling gambling addict

Thats my headcanon

[peak escarp]

why would I hate Bastion?

The Last Bastion is a work of art

[shrewd pivot]

Because if Bastion talked instead of whistling, you would get explicit lore

[red olive]

Bastion's animated short was a much more straightforward story than sigma's despite him not saying a single line

[red olive]

Absolutely

[upbeat rock]

is it crazy to say that there’s no world where Doom should’ve lost to Vendetta

[red olive]

Not really

[shrewd pivot]

I fully agree too ofc haha

[peak escarp]

they were able to convey a breadth of emotion without speaking a single word

it still gets me choked up

[gusty cloak]

not at all. he definitely should not have lost

[upbeat rock]

i feel like they made Doom look so dumb

[peak escarp]

and as someone who has studied filmmaking and art I could probably write a whole essay about the perfect composition of this one frame

[dense nebula]

It’s a bit obvious from my pfp and tag but I wanna see some future Omnic characters that take inspiration from Necrons

[upbeat rock]

and just tried to convince us that Vendetta fairly beat him

[red olive]

I still do occasionally think about bastion beibng updated to use male pronouns for ow2
A really arbitrary change honestly but oh well

[shrewd pivot]

But Sigma's origin cinematic doesn't seem like a great art piece to you? Or is it that you don't like how the fandom interprets it

[peak escarp]

the latter

[shrewd pivot]

Ahhhhh okok

I misunderstood you mb

[peak escarp]

it's cool and experimental, it's just overhyped

[red olive]

He genuinely throws a tantrum towards the end

Its diabolical

[upbeat rock]

like wdym the guy that predicted Tracer blinking thru spacetime got caught off guard by a Vendetta that was literally talking to him from the shadows

like it just doesn’t make sense

[peak escarp]

and the abstractness of it was partially a product of crunch, due to the fact that it had to be made in 6 weeks I believe

[upbeat rock]

and then he acts impulsively leading to him being thrown outta the window??

[shrewd pivot]

I personally find meta art where you explore time backwards and forwards like Sigma does pretty freaking fun tho.

[red olive]

He willingly lost

Trust

[upbeat rock]

yeah no thats not the same guy we all knew

[peak escarp]

because of the sudden shift between designing Mauga to designing an entirely new character

[upbeat rock]

i really hope that is it

cuz at least for me Ven feels like a mary sue rn

[red olive]

He's trying to artificially create a situation where he has to evolve

[shrewd pivot]

I agree, I wish Vendetta won the fight in a different manner as to respect the competency of both characters.

[red olive]

"Only through conflict do we evolve"

[peak escarp]

the artist only had time for 4 illustrations, so they remixed them in post to make it seem like more

[red olive]

I hope so at least

[upbeat rock]

even sombra said it, she went from being nothing to straight up be thanos and beat the super evil guy with basically no effort

[red olive]

I really hope

[peak escarp]

compared to most other origin trailers which had around 8 illustrations

[upbeat rock]

i think the issue is that there’s not a single realistic scenario where Ven wins

[peak escarp]

she's got plot armor

[upbeat rock]

unless she surprise attacks him

[peak escarp]

or whatever the offensive equivalent of plot armor is

a plot sword

[dense nebula]

Her visual design still pisses me off ngl

[shrewd pivot]

Frankly, it worked very well. It's one if my favorite pieces because it showcases Sigma's fractured perspective in a fun scifi way

[upbeat rock]

there’s no way the guy that punched thru 8 concrete walls and predicted a blinking tracer loses to Vendetta

[shrewd pivot]

She was really, really angry!

[peak escarp]

it led to a lot of people thinking he literally had a split personality with 4 personas

[upbeat rock]

wait people really think that?

[red olive]

She had an anine flashback

[upbeat rock]

literally 😭😭

i just hate that trope

[red olive]

Doom even realised she was having one and started throwing

[peak escarp]

the writer had to make a statement saying that Sigma wasn't schizophrenic or had any specific mental illness, that he was just suffering from the effects of a black hole

[upbeat rock]

of making the new guy make the former new guy look like a dumbass js for aura and hype moments

[shrewd pivot]

I feel your pain. Good news is that this probably means Vendetta will fall from grace by the end of this year's story arc. I'm pretty disappointed with Vendetta's writing being so "tell don't show" and plot armored.

[dense nebula]

Bro got to experience Spaghettification in just 5 seconds and come out alive

[upbeat rock]

i just really love Dooms lore

[peak escarp]

I look forward to his comeback

[upbeat rock]

and im completely fine with him losing to Orisa or Winston

cuz i mean that makes complete sense

[dense nebula]

Is there even any plot in lore to allow for an evil omnic?

[upbeat rock]

Winston it’s a genetically enhanced gorilla that also happened to be super angry cuz he js thought he saw his best friend day

and Orisa was literally built to counter doom

so it makes complete sense

[peak escarp]

do Ramattra and Max not count?

[upbeat rock]

but Vendetta?? 😭

[upbeat rock]

i feel like Ram is morally gray

not really a villain

or evil

[red olive]

Him and ramattra were taken out back and beaten to death by 20 guys with baseball bats

They deserved so much more

[dense nebula]

Max is a snake and slimy but not entirely evil Ram dances the line like he’s playing DDR. I want a full on pure evil Omnic who views humanity with such disdain he sees them as not worthy of ruling the world anymore

[peak escarp]

that's literally Ramattra

[dense nebula]

Ram can be civil to humans though no?

[peak escarp]

he just won't do anything about it himself

he'll wait for humans to destroy themselves

[upbeat rock]

i kinda feel like Ram allying with Talon is kinda contradictory

[dense nebula]

I want one that takes initiative, and does it with enthusiasm

[upbeat rock]

like talon represents everything that Rams hates about humans

[red olive]

I guess we have kace from tracers comic mini series

[peak escarp]

I don't think we'll get that

[upbeat rock]

yes

[shrewd pivot]

I could see maybe peiple thinking 2, but it's not that, it's portraying that Sigma seems to be experiencing bits of his life span at random. Like not exact ages ofc, but like one moment he is 40, the next 60, the next present, then back to 40 etc etc. It explains why he seems so lost when talking with heroes. He mistakes what year/date he currently is in when he talks to Mercy about a conference that happened way in the past, then remembers.

[red olive]

He has the potential to become that

[upbeat rock]

specially Ram, he has so much potential

but nah let’s give it all to the self insert brand new char that js spawned to be thanos and defeat Doom 😭🔥

the only good thing about that is that i feel like it’ll be interesting to see how the other talon members develop through this plotline

i saw someone pointing out how Widow and Sombra looked really like distressed about the situation

[peak escarp]

I don't know much about quantum theory, but aren't time and gravity somehow connected?

[upbeat rock]

so maybe they’ll get away from talon

[shrewd pivot]

Not even self insert, she's just... idk what she is tbh. Definitely needed more time to polish her story writing imo.

[upbeat rock]

That depends of how u define time

[dense nebula]

Yeah, being in the center of Black Hole makes all time outside appear to move much faster

But

Then again

You could argue the properties of time and space flip when within a black hole

[red olive]

What if doomfist decides to retire to nepal and join the shambali monks

Think

[upbeat rock]

that’s lowk be out of char for him i feel like

cuz like what could he possibly obtain from them

[red olive]

Would be hella funny

[red olive]

Absolutely nothing

[upbeat rock]

yeah and i really don’t wanna see doom being a good peaceful guy now

all his char revolves around sacrificing what it takes to evolve

bro i js hate vendetta💔

[red olive]

It would be very anticlimactic

Expect the unexpected

Or something

Idk man

[upbeat rock]

i feel like Widow could get a plotline along those lines

[peak escarp]

I want to see him go to Overwatch and offer a truce... something something "the enemy of my enemy is my ally"

[red olive]

WE all do

WE

US

[peak escarp]

speak for yourself

[upbeat rock]

finding her true self and forgiving herself for the things she did instead of js hiding behind the drugs and all that

[red olive]

Nu uh

[upbeat rock]

nah😭

[peak escarp]

I love Vendetta~~'s abs~~

[dense nebula]

Must’ve been the wind

[upbeat rock]

i like Vendettas design and gameplay but

she feels like a kid js thought of a char and was like “this is my oc and she’s thanos and will defeat the biggest threat ever after two months of existing”

[hardy shuttle]

Vendettas got a sleeper build

[upbeat rock]

i don’t think she has anything of “sleeper” in her build

[shrewd pivot]

Yep! And it's not quantum theory really, just the rules of spacetime. The more gravity there is, the slower time goes. The less gravity there is, the faster times goes. Think of it like traveling from one end of a trampoline to the other = traveling across spacetime geometry. If you place a bowling ball in the middle of the trampoline (gravity increases around mass) suddenly that distance is much longer to walk across the trampoline. Thus when gravity increases, it bends spacetime geometry, making spacetime a longer trek to pass through.

TLDR; The more gravity, the slower time goes bc you litterally have to "walk a longer distance" across a stretched spacetime.

[red olive]

He was rescued by lifeweaver who taught him about the values of friendship

Incoming rework

Healfist

[peak escarp]

lol

[upbeat rock]

i mean his punched wo empowered basically healed enemies so like

might aswell

less base dmg than melee btw 😭💔

[red olive]

Its a tickle at most

[dense nebula]

Not even the first time I heard Healfist

[peak escarp]

Deadfist

[red olive]

It might be happening

[red olive]

Too soon

[upbeat rock]

i js don’t understand why they js toss their best chars aside

[dense nebula]

Marvel Rivals Iron Fist can heal his team if he has a Luna Snow on the team lol

[upbeat rock]

like if u make a list of the most interesting ow chars

u get what

Doom, Sig, Ram, Widow maybe, Reaper, Hanzo?

[red olive]

Zenyatta

[spare fox]

so what do yall think will happen when Vendetta finds out it was reaper who killed her father?

[upbeat rock]

and none of them are treated properly

[upbeat rock]

that’s what i also find dumb and kind of a plot hole

[red olive]

We know next to nothing about zenyatta

[upbeat rock]

and the Iris

[spare fox]

that's not what a plot hole is

[upbeat rock]

that’s such an interesting concept

[upbeat rock]

yeah that’s why i said kind of

[red olive]

Why is she taking this out on akande rather than reyes

Wait is she stupid

[upbeat rock]

cuz i know it doesn’t inherently mess up the continuity

but wdym she js fights doom outta revenge when his dads killer is “right there”

and MIND YOU

it wasn’t even Talon or DF that killed her father

[peak escarp]

either she doesn't know or she doesn't care

[upbeat rock]

it was black watch cuz Reyes decided to kill him

like Ven Doom is NOT ur guy

[wise grotto]

Oh I have a hunch reapers apart of the first budget cuts

[red olive]

Layoffs

[wise grotto]

Downsizing

[shrewd pivot]

Don't. Get me started. I waited years for Zenyatta lore only for the Suravasa PVE missions to be teased but never released. Those PVE cinematics and all those in mission voice lines with Zenyatta will never see the light of day 💔