lore-discussion

[polar garnet]

sombra is interesting because she presents power in a way which isn’t just strength or ability to kill
as her voiceline says, information is power, and the fact that she knows how to pull strings to bend people to her will instead of using violence is so cool to see
alongside the fact that she’s in a morally grey zone, she’s not loyal to talon, nor anyone

sigma i like because he’s absolutely terrifying
this guy is one of the most powerful characters in lore yet he doesn’t even know what he’s doing, because he’s literally gone insane
and it’s not the loud, crazy kind of insanity that junkrat has
he thinks normally, just in the wrong way, and having that alongside such insane power makes him scary

moira i like because she’s also terrifying, but for the complete opposite reason
sigma is terrifying because he doesn’t know what he’s doing, meanwhile moira is terrifying because she knows exactly what she’s doing
she is the pure embodiment of evil, even more evil than reaper, because she is more actions than words a lot of the time
she doesn’t give a shit about anything, even morality, just so she can get her work done
and if that means killing people in grotesque ways or turning them into a monster for the rest of her life, so be it, she doesn’t care

widow is well written because of what’s nearly bipolar disorder
yes she’s a (literally) cold blooded killer who feels no emotion, but almost
you almost feel sorry for her, and she knows she shouldn’t be feeling these sorts of things for her husband which she herself killed
and comparing that to her profession, it creates a contrast that is strong but not unnatural

[white cobalt]

https://x.com/westofhouse/status/1827769508200870362

Michael Chu 瞿華明 (@westofhouse) on X

Funny story, when I first wrote Cassidy’s “It’s high noon…” ult line, some people were confused about why it was “high” noon and insisted that I change it to “It’s noon!” or use a different, “more cowboy” adjective.

Twitter · Aug 25, 2024, 6:06 PM

and huh https://x.com/westofhouse/status/1824568633072423184

Michael Chu 瞿華明 (@westofhouse) on X

You might have heard that Hanzo’s and Genji’s stories were partially inspired by my love of Jiro Dreams of Sushi. Similarly, my original story for Kiriko also drew inspiration from an unlikely source: Phoenix Wright: Justice for All.

Currently replaying the #AceAttorney series!

Twitter · Aug 16, 2024, 10:07 PM

[opaque scroll]

that voice line in game is not canon, unless you're referring to something outside the in-game voicelines

[tight ermine]

It’s noon 🕛 🤣💀

[opaque scroll]

the in-game voicelines are hypotheticals, sort of what would happen if the characters interacted

[tight ermine]

https://tenor.com/view/couldnt-care-less-i-dont-care-dont-care-do-not-care-spy-idc-gif-25739626

[hushed jetty]

i wish more of this growth happened on screen though

we have like short story of him realizing bastion was different anddddd thats about it

yeah he has comics but those are like. when he FIRST found bastion and i wouldve liked to see more of his journey later down the road

[knotty trout]

LORE

[merry mason]

I think it feels really weird because we didn’t have any update on him since his comic

[scenic parcel]

Does anyone know about any possible future map locations

I'd like to see a map of the archeology which would tie into liveweavers lore

A gothenberg map for pvp would be cool aswell

What othet characters don't have a map related to their lore?

[merry mason]

There are super-coral reefs in the lore. Those would be pre cool. Also, some of the other watchpoints.

[potent temple]

Mercy Zurich map when 😩

[peak escarp]

Baptiste, Echo, Mercy, Ramattra, Reaper, Sigma, Symmetra

[worthy rose]

Guys

What do u think reaper looks like under his mask now

[peak escarp]

this is what he looked like a year after the explosion

[worthy rose]

That’s fan art tho

Isn’t it not?

[peak escarp]

that's official art

from Code of Violence

[worthy rose]

Really?!

Wow

I didn’t think he would still be hot

But damn

Do h think he stayed looking like that?

[scenic parcel]

Does ram not have shambali monastery

[peak escarp]

probably got worse

[peak escarp]

oh I guess that counts

[worthy rose]

Because Ana was shocked and she yelled “what happened to u reaper” in one of the comics

Who has the coolest lore and why?

[peak escarp]

Mei

because she was frozen

😎

[worthy rose]

But genuinely who has the coolest lore in your opinion

Cause ur the lore guy so

[peak escarp]

lore girl

idk, they're all pretty interesting

I'm biased towards Cassidy

[junior ore]

why dont they just launch anubis into the fucking sun they have the tech

[peak escarp]

because that would be too easy

and they could just destroy him if that's what they wanted to do

[junior ore]

lame

i assume hes only kept around because some company thinks they can make money off of it or they just genuinely dident think of destorying it

[junior ore]

oh okay

[knotty trout]

LORE

[rapid mountain]

What about doom

Or does Numbani count as his lore

[peak escarp]

he's tied to Numbani and Rialto

[rapid mountain]

What happened in Rialto?

[peak escarp]

that's where a Talon base is

[rapid mountain]

Oh

Did Doomfist personally recruit all of talons in game operatives? Sombra, Moira, Reaper, Sigma, Mauga

I know Widowmaker was brainwashed by Moira specifically

[peak escarp]

not personally

he talked to Reaper, but Moira brought Reaper to Talon

Reaper and Sombra went on the mission to capture Sigma

Mauga and Doomfist had a duel that ended in a stalemate, so Doomfist offered him a position in Talon

[rapid mountain]

Oh

[peak escarp]

Moira joined Talon because they offered her funding and research subjects

Sombra joined Talon to use their resources

[sly fractal]

What type of subjects does moria even do

[rapid mountain]

Does talon plan to kill Baptiste if they find him?

Or force him to join back as a soldier?

It doesn’t seem like Mauga wants to kill him

[peak escarp]

the elite units in the Retribution event are said to have genetic enhancements that are probably Moira's doing

Mauga already tried to bring Baptiste back once - Baptiste blew him up

so Mauga won't give him a second chance

[rapid mountain]

Damn I thought they were best buddies

[sly fractal]

Im curious does sombra really wanna be apart of talon

[rapid mountain]

Whatever she’s using their resources are must be worth it

Cuz I’ve never seen her express that she likes talon

[acoustic ice]

one thing i've been always unsure about is how mirrorwatch sigma would be like

since he means no evil but is unaware that he's being used for it

most other heroes i can clearly envision what they'd be like in mirrorwatch

but it's sigma that i can't get a grasp of

ok maybe juno i find it hard to envision as well for mirrorwatch

[hushed jetty]

i dont think mauga is gonna kill him but he's definitely not gonna let baptiste play any more games

well.

i HOPE mauga isnt aiming to kill him, although i wouldnt be shocked if he wants to now

[shy dagger]

He could simply be the smart scientist guy at Overwatch, taking Winston’s place in that case

[acoustic ice]

nah im thinking hammond would take winston's place

and winston would be a junker

[shy dagger]

They don’t have to total opposites just characters on different paths

[shy dagger]

Could be

Juno is also hard to implement in mirrorwatch

Cause she’s a neutral character in lore

She’s not exactly on either side yet

So it’s kinda difficult to pinpoint how should do in an opposite scenario

[wet tusk]

I want vishkar junk

[desert yacht]

antarctic peninsula is theorized to also be related to ram right

[desert yacht]

does this mean like a higher up position like council or around that

did he move up from an unremarkable talon unit to a higher position through a duel

[peak escarp]

it's theorized that his omnium is in Antarctica, but the Peninsula map isn't related

it's more relevant to Mei

[peak escarp]

Mauga isn't on the council, Doomfist just gave him a position in Talon as an enforcer

he wasn't in Talon before the duel

[polar garnet]

i mean
i made a list of my favorites

^

maximellian i also like

hell

nearly all of talon is awesome

[ionic summit]

RAAAAM

[keen summit]

key word, were

[gusty cloak]

sigma imo

they made one lore video on him then dipped

but he has the coolest lore

[polar garnet]

and she definitely rebels from talon

contacting bap and cassidy, blackmailing volskaya, etc

[floral cape]

Explain to me how it’s cooler than Mei’s lore?

Get it? Because Mei be in the snow 😉forreal curious tho haha

[stray adder]

mei is a bum

[keen summit]

ram is also in an ice covered place atm

so

[unreal pasture]

Love when blizzard does that

[polar garnet]

tbf they did feature him in the code of violence short story but that wasn’t much

[crisp crater]

i love that short story

[past copper]

Interesting survey skins for possible seasons

I’m gonna come out and say this on one of them

Missed opportunity with the Summer skins

[peak escarp]

missed opportunity?

[past copper]

JQ and Illari don’t have Summer skins yet

[peak escarp]

there will be other summers

[past copper]

And Mei and Rein are long overdue for new ones

Heck, coulda gave Mei n Rein new Summer skins instead of recolors of Pharah n Mercy lifeguard skins

I also kinda like that one with Winston, Ball, n Genji. Look out, here comes Dreamwatch

[digital linden]

the way genji’s basically in every one😭

[peak escarp]

some heroes are just more popular to design for

this has been a problem since the beginning of OW1

[past copper]

As we see with Mercy unfortunately

[peak escarp]

Genji, Mercy, Widowmaker, Tracer

and now Kiriko

[past copper]

I blame the player base. People don’t always play other heroes

[peak escarp]

it's not the player base's fault

it's the artist's

they're just the easiest ones to design skins for

heroes like Reinhardt or Orisa have more complex silhouettes that have to be maintained

[digital linden]

i feel like overwatch should step it up with the skin effects too, like changing the colour of a primary fire to match a skin, limiting it to just mythics is boring

[past copper]

I kind of think it’s easier to keep it just for mythics. Especially now all things considered

[peak escarp]

the colour of abilities stays the same for consistency

different colours would confuse players

[digital linden]

i wouldn’t mind it just being player sided

others couldn’t see

[past copper]

Now, something I would love to see are these

[peak escarp]

that first group looks like Dark Souls bosses

[past copper]

Might be. Never played, but I’ll take your word on it

The other looks like maybe fallen angels?

[digital linden]

do these surveys ever get used?

bc they’re really good designs

kinda be a shame to just scrap ideas like that

[past copper]

It might depend. But frankly, it’s all in whether or not they can make a themed season out of them

We have heard witches as a theme and suspect that will be for Halloween

But there is also opportunity for a vampire theme instead. You never know til it comes

[digital linden]

i love the plant fairy ones

[past copper]

That said, ones I expect to be getting witch skins… Ramattra, Symmetra, Lifeweaver, Moira, recolored Mercy n Kiriko

[digital linden]

if they miss out on moira for witches i’m gonna be so mad

she’s like the epitome of witch in the overwatch cast

[past copper]

Although, be a little wary of recolored

[past copper]

I mean… technically

[digital linden]

now that there’s been double support mythics and now double dps, i can only assume it’ll be double tanks for the next 2 seasons so i wonder who gets witches mythic

[digital linden]

proud lilith owner

my bets on ram

[past copper]

I’m not saying Moira won’t get a witch skin, but bare in mind that while the Lilith skin was actually a demon, she still looks like a witch

[digital linden]

mhm

i just wanna see everyone in a witch hat

it’d be fun

[past copper]

Oh… I guess Sombra could get a witch skin? Call her hack and virus curses

[digital linden]

that’d be cool

there’s a lot they could do with it

[past copper]

I forgot about warlock Ashe

But we already know she’s not getting a witch skin based off this

[peak escarp]

why would that mean she's not getting a skin?

plenty of heroes have gotten multiple skins in a season before

Genji has two this season

[past copper]

Because that skin was supposed to be available 2 seasons ago, but it never came

And I don’t see Ashe getting lucky enough out other lucky heroes to get 2 skins in a season

She might get one each season, but she’s not lucky as others to get 2 skins

[peak escarp]

like I said, it's not about luck

the artists choose the skins

[spare fox]

apparently Juno has PvE voicelines that have been datamined oof

they must record voicelines real early

[past copper]

Or PvE isn’t officially canceled

As nobody from Blizzard has confirmed otherwise

[spare fox]

I mean, they aren't going to officially cancel it

but they got rid of the PvE team devs and writers

and I don't remember his name but he opened up the Overwatch segment at blizzcon last year with "Overwatch is a competitive PvP game"

so... in so many words yeah

I mean I'd like to be hopeful and optimistic but it's not looking good

[peak escarp]

https://overwatch.blizzard.com/en-us/media/stories/where-honor-lives/

the Hanzo and Kiriko short story from Heroes Ascended has been posted for free

[spare fox]

so other than the Ashe and Bob one which we don't think will be posted for free, 2 more to go? Ana/Jack and Jack/Sombra ones, right?

[peak escarp]

yes

[cursive basalt]

is PvE mission good?

[twilit patrol]

Imo yes

[spare fox]

You might want to get another 3 players to team up with though the bots are kind of awful

[knotty trout]

LORE

https://tenor.com/view/pass-the-lore-lore-nav-xo-taytay-gif-25554546

[worldly lintel]

have any ow heroes canonically farted?

[worldly lintel]

this is critical

[fallow mantle]

yes i would say so except for the omnics and robots

[unreal pasture]

which characters would be the best blunt rotation

i feel like lucio zen dva kiriko and hammond would be

[worthy rose]

spot on

[dusk current]

is bastion a boy or a girl

cuz like

acts girly, when ana nano'd bastion in old overwatch she'd call bastion a girl

[peak escarp]

Bastion is a robot

it doesn't have a gender, although in English some heroes use "he" for Bastion

[polar garnet]

nah replace kiri w/ cass and it’ll be perfect

kiris annoying

[keen summit]

from tank it would probs be dva

[crude mesa]

lore talk

[buoyant current]

Ximmer on Xbox, top 500

REPLAY CODE: 1YTEYW
PLAYER: SIRCLEMITY

[peak escarp]

go cheat somewhere else, this is the Lore channel

[worthy rose]

I do agree, but I think they were talking about a ximmer in their game

[peak escarp]

oh

my point stands, wrong channel

[peak escarp]

I need to get around to updating that

[rapid mountain]

Do you count in voice interactions

Cuz I think Junker Queen hates Junkrat

[vital steppe]

mercy and genji also seem to be on not great terms

[rapid mountain]

And Pharah seems to be friends with Baptiste and Cassidy

[rapid mountain]

Yeah

They don’t talk to each other anymore

[peak escarp]

what gives you that idea? they're close friends

[rapid mountain]

They don’t speak to each other in game tho

[peak escarp]

in game isn't canon

[rapid mountain]

I think that’s why he say that

[vital steppe]

https://youtube.com/shorts/iuHIJnbDV54?si=ECAIiTuarJ81hRlq

literally only video i can ever find of this shit

[peak escarp]

that interaction doesn't mean they hate each other

[vital steppe]

why is it lost media

[vital steppe]

I didn’t say they hate eachother tho

[peak escarp]

and the tone is playful

[rapid mountain]

But does junker queen not hate junkrat?

[peak escarp]

it's complicated

[rapid mountain]

What happened between them

[vital steppe]

i took it as either implying they stopped writing (not speaking, just writing), or that they stopped speaking after they lost contact

[peak escarp]

Junkrat tried to blow her up

[rapid mountain]

Damn

[vital steppe]

this made me laugh I can’t even lie. like yeah, but putting it so blunt LMFAOOOO

[rapid mountain]

I wonder why he did that

JQ seems chill

[peak escarp]

but he also kept a secret treasure from her

[vital steppe]

https://youtu.be/_q0QGtk_AM0?si=OmUv9ED97OXe2cbr

[rapid mountain]

So Junkrat is just an asshole to her

For no reason

[vital steppe]

lol

not really “no reason” but you could say he’s a little heavy handed about it

[rapid mountain]

But like

Did she do anything to Junkrat?

It seems like he just started being an asshole

[vital steppe]

well did you watch the cinematic LMFAO she did kick him & roadhog out of junkertown, though it seems like she holds a grudge more towards junkrat

[fickle socket]

[nocturne solar]

I reckon Juno is racist

[spare fox]

Please don't shitpost 😩

[inner niche]

It's sounds more like they mocking each other in the mind of messing

[peak escarp]

why would Juno be racist, she was raised by a multicultural group of scientists

[lavish bluff]

yo are the battle.net servers down? i cant log in for some reason

[merry mason]

Maybe unintentionally omincsist

[toxic marsh]

Can someone explain the lore to me

[opaque tundra]

Anubis controls robots and starts omnic crisis and then Overwatch defeats robots after sentient robots makes other robots sentient and then Overwatch gets into legal trouble and gets shut down and then new robots start new war and Overwatch comes back to beat them up

[worthy rose]

Juno gonna come back to Mars and everyone's bones 🫶

[past copper]

First off, I recommend buying Overwatch: Declassified if you want a full depth explanation to watching Overwatch Genesis trilogy on YouTube for the beginning of things

But, to begin around the year 2060-70s, humanity created machines and technology to help them with like daily activities like cleaning and cooking to much bigger tasks like supplying food around the world and colonizing the moon. Omnica Corp. made the most of these times with their omniums building omnics. Robots built for a variety of purposes for the average citizen. But their greatest feat was building the god programs. AI which were each designed for a specific purpose to benefit the world and humanity. It was a peaceful time

However, because of many financial factors that damaged Omnica Corp’s reputation, the company was bankrupt and the omnium factories shut down. That is until out of nowhere, one factory suddenly reactivated started building a battalion of war bots that it soon sent to attack a city in Africa without warning. The initial threat was contained, but had no immediate explanation behind it

[peak escarp]

more 2030-2040s

30 years before Overwatch's present day

[past copper]

I had to make a rough estimate

[peak escarp]

https://youtu.be/4wVaqOQS-xU

just watch this, it'll be faster than waiting for Ryu to finish typing

[past copper]

Anyway, after the attack in Africa, people thought it was an isolated incident. That was until out of nowhere, every omnic around the world suddenly turned on and began attacking people. Men, women, children one and all. Not too soon after this unprecedented attack on such a massive scale happened, armies of war bots like the ones that attacked the African city suddenly appeared in multiple locations and started assaulting cities on a massive global invasion. This would mark the beginning of the Omnic Crisis

[toxic marsh]

Thank you

[past copper]

I mean… that’s initially why I recommended the book n series

[toxic marsh]

Thank you

[past copper]

Mini-series I should say

[digital linden]

how does moira’s biotic grasp work in lore, like does she use some sort of telekinesis to drain peoples life force

[vast swift]

should be triple dps :D venture wshould get it

what do we know about s14 TONKEH hero?

[vast swift]

lkike who it could be where its from maybe a full concept art or samth

[golden oak]

So Juno’s family is Vietnamese right?

[polar garnet]

chinese iirc

[spare fox]

Her mom is Chinese, her father Vietnamese

We def needed more "multinational" heroes like Venture and Juno

[tranquil orbit]

Tbf I'd classify juno as more international since they kinda took the angle of her claiming martian identity above all else ... the whole "village raised her" aspect

[peak escarp]

her mom is from Singapore

[tranquil orbit]

Also yh venture seemingly has v little references to the Canadian part of their identity

[peak escarp]

and might have a connection to Dr. Liao, based on a datamined Echo voice line

[tranquil orbit]

Bit of an odd choice but ig they must not spend much time there

[tranquil orbit]

Sendddd

(Pretty please)

[peak escarp]

uh let me see if I can find it

nope, can't find it

[spare fox]

Oh where is the fact she's from Singapore brought up?

[merry mason]

I believe the devs said it

[tranquil orbit]

Ah all good nws im sure it'll turn up eventually

[tranquil orbit]

Yh joshi zhang interview iirc

[fallow mantle]

ht tps://comicbook .com/gaming/news/overwatch-2-devs-break-down-junos-development-backstory/

i don't think i can post links yet without getting muted so uh just take the spaces out - you're right, it's in that interview

[polar garnet]

from what we’ve learned, she basically unravels the dna in their body and destroys it

[polar garnet]

ngl im surprised by 2080 the base is still so small
for a world which has forcefields, hover tech, ftl, teleportation and much more crazy technology, i would assume a simple mars base would be much much bigger by that time

[merry mason]

But how does it heal her?

[polar garnet]

not explained

[merry mason]

Yeah I was really disappointed when I saw it was just a couple people in a bunker

[polar garnet]

agreed

i mean it is explained a bit

the base was overwatch-run and when it shut down the base stopped getting resources

but even by the time overwatch shut down
the base should have been huge

[merry mason]

It’s leucheng run. The disconnect happened at an unspecified time (probably recent) and for an unspecified reason.

[polar garnet]

oh?

i never heard of that

i assumed it was overwatch since it was an enormous organisation + it shut down around the same time overwatch did (few years give or take)

[merry mason]

Yeah they’re logo is literally the leucheng logo but with mars in the background

[tranquil orbit]

I think the reasoning is that it was done on purpose by lucheng

It was a covert operation and also they dont seem to use omnics on either HLC or mars despite them being the best candidates for these jobs

V strange i think theres something going on

[merry mason]

Nah Doctor Chao just forgor 💀

Got distracted by moon monkeys or something

[tranquil orbit]

This isnt an excuse icl I'll be v disappointed if it's this or "they got distracted by null sector"

IF OVERWATCH W LESS THAN 20 PPL CAN PICK UP JUNO FROM ATMOSPHERE FIRST AND TAKE HER STRAIGHT THERE AND THE TOP SPACE COMPANY WHO HAS VESTED INTEREST IN FINDING HER CANT

Then idk

[merry mason]

Maybe that new structure Hammond saw on the moon was a mars signal jammer🤔🤔 nah why would the apes care

[tranquil orbit]

Outside chance that it might be them and im willing to let them cook if it's cool

[merry mason]

What do you think that moon structure is

[tranquil orbit]

Honestly ive not thought abt it enough

I think some ppl were theorising trying to make a spacecraft of sorts*

Altho they dont have the capabilities rn they are smart to try

[merry mason]

It’s just such an odd detail to point out it seems like it has to be a tease for something

[fallow mantle]

monkey death ray

[tranquil orbit]

Possibly but the OW writers also have a habit of leaving things open ended so someone else can come fill in the gaps later

[fallow mantle]

planet of the apes 🦍

[tranquil orbit]

It's just how these things work

[tranquil orbit]

Tbh i wouldnt be surprised if and when they revamp HLC for clash we get some planet of the apes references

Like it's gonna happen isnt it 😭

DR ZAIUS DR ZAIUS

[fallow mantle]

HELP ME DR ZAIUS!

[peak escarp]

https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/overwatch-2-devs-break-down-junos-development-backstory/

[polar garnet]

calling the red planet red is like calling blueberries blue (they’re purple)

i sound like a massive nerd

and i am sorry because i probably am

but i am going to punch whoever wrote that because mars is fucking orange

[fallow mantle]

mars is notoriously called "the red planet"

[peak escarp]

yeah

iron oxide in the soil gives Mars a reddish hue

[rapid mountain]

Doctor 6

What’s up with Rammatra. Does he just want to kill all humans because of how Omnics are treated?

If so, then why does he work with Doomfist?

[past copper]

Ramattra’s plan is to capture all omnics around the world and do so by equipping subjugation helmets to them

Casualties are to be expected in such an endeavor

[rapid mountain]

Why does he want to capture all of them?

And what does he want to do with them

[past copper]

However, he works with Doomfist because he offered Ramattra something to help in his ambitions. What he did for him remains to be seen

[past copper]

As far as Ramattra’s revealed, his goal is to save all omnics from the cruelty of humanity’s abuse and subjugation… by any measure necessary

[hushed jetty]

it is not clear exactly what he's doing with the omnics that he subjugates

he definitely doesnt want to hurt them or like hypnotize them to be in his army or whatever, since that goes against his entire goal of preserving his dying species

but removing the helmet off an omnic just straight up Kills them, so clearly its something kinda important. maybe its like? downloading their soul? or whatever? idk dawg

[copper cypress]

Hello everyone! I have a lore question regarding Genji's in game design. I'm new to the server so sorry if you've talked about this before

So we see in his blackwatch skin that his one arm, his face(kinda), his torso and his thighs are human and the rest are cybernetics. However in the default ow1 skin his human arm is also robotic (see reload animation) so does this mean he lost his other arm after blackwatch or did he just go full cybernetics, or do we have no idea

[peak escarp]

we don't really know

[copper cypress]

damn😔

[rapid mountain]

Was the reunion cinematic really the first time Ashe and Cassidy seen each other in 20 years?

Like did Cassidy not try to reach out or explain his story to Ashe at all inbetween those times

[spare fox]

I was under the impression that Cass sold out the Deadlock gang or at least some of them

it's not very clear what exactly went down

[peak escarp]

one of Ashe's big rules is always punish betrayal, so Cassidy knew he couldn't go back after selling out the gang

[unreal pasture]

Which character is the best at shaking ass

I feel like doomfist or mauga would be

[tall hound]

Hog would be up there

[vast swift]

he wants peace with omnic and humans so he kills all omnic haters (and kills sombra and widow bc they annoy him)

it hink

[vast swift]

he isnt aggressive toward venture, and they dont hate omnics

[vocal cairn]

torb

[scenic parcel]

Wouldn't be surprised with how ruthless the businesses are

Probably costs more to bring them all back

Instead of just sending another team to pick up from where they left off

Is the leader of lucheng a known person?

[tranquil orbit]

The CEO dr chao is well known and she appears in hammond's short story

However it's unknown if shes the only one shot calling altho shes defo a big part of it

Theres some implied links to the chinese gov and also theyre not a private co iirc so that means that theres other big shareholders that might have influence

[tranquil orbit]

This is why i wonder abt why theres seemingly no omnics on HLC or mars because they dont have the resource issues humans do

So part of me is thinking there might be something even darker afoot 👀

Maybe some kind of social experiments akin to the fallout vaults but thats likely just my imagination running wild

[peak escarp]

probably just garden variety anti-omnic racism

they would rather mess with ape genetics than use omnics in their projects

[tranquil orbit]

It could be

But im also wondering if in the name of human advancement that they seem to intent on pushing whether theyve been trying stuff

Maybe they want to see how the martians react to having all ties to earth cut off to see how human behaviour unfolds

It could provide an explanation for why they dont (at least from what we know rn) seem super intent on tracking down juno

If it's all an experiment then maybe they dont want to interfere? Idk

It would also explain why theyd want to keep it covert without anyone else knowing for now

[peak escarp]

that's a bit too conspiracy for me

[tranquil orbit]

Which then leads me to wonder if theres a secret mole on the colony

[tranquil orbit]

Tbh i think so too kinda 😭

But it does provide some explanations for certain things

[peak escarp]

there are probably less sinister explanations

[uncut briar]

Juno's lore:
A baddie from Vietnam (mars) with two voluptuous, perfectly circular moons with a water pistol.

[unreal pasture]

Every time blizzard runs low on money they add another hot female to the game

[uncut briar]

Wouldn't you???

[unreal pasture]

I would

It's lowkey smart that they added hot characters to act as free advertising with fanart and r.,34

[peak escarp]

!!shitposting

[twilit nacelle]

Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[sullen girder]

You think Juno has anxiety? I mean she sounds nervous half the time (when she’s not battling the enemy)

[rapid mountain]

That’s unfortunate

I wonder if Ashe is the type of person to consider joining Overwatch

[peak escarp]

probably not

she likes being in charge

[sullen girder]

Maybe she’ll make a compromise, I mean she probably dealing with the null sector business as much as overwatch

[peak escarp]

she could team up with Overwatch temporarily to help deal with Null Sector

but I dont see her joining permanently

[rapid mountain]

Would that even work If she teamed up temporarily tho

Cuz wouldn’t she just try and kill Cassidy

And probably be pissed they took her score away from her (Echo)

[peak escarp]

she's mad at him, but I dont think she'd want to kill him

maybe just humiliate him

[polar garnet]

good evening lore discussion

what funky shit is happening today

[polar garnet]

100% no

she was mad as hell at cassidy for joining overwatch

and she would never follow in his footsteps

[rapid mountain]

I thought she was just mad at him leaving specifically

I didn’t think she cared who he joined

[polar garnet]

he didn’t leave deadlock

he was captured and arrested

[acoustic ice]

the more i listen to kiriko’s spawn room interactions the more i believe the notion that she’s the edgy sonic oc of the ow devs (or something like that)

just starting to really hate hearing her talk in the interactions

[rapid mountain]

But wouldn’t Ashe still hate that he was captured tho

[sullen girder]

Unrelated, Does anyone have a theory of how reaper keeps spawning guns out of nowhere?

I’m just trying to see the logic behind it is all

[peak escarp]

the logic is: it's a video game

he doesn't do that in the lore

[topaz wave]

can i … put my overwatch oc’s lore/somewhat lore here? or is it just strictly overwatch lore ( ；∀；)

[peak escarp]

just overwatch lore

ocs would probably go in #fanart

[topaz wave]

OHH kay’

[past copper]

Look, game and lore logic aren’t the same but..

Realistically, Reaper just carries a number of shotguns in his coat

[loud marsh]

The number is infinite

Even in cinematics he just throws them on the ground

[lapis raven]

Bro knows sorcery or something

[keen summit]

they kinda hinted at it by saying shes outright meant to be anxious

[fallow gull]

reaper has infinite shotguns lmao

[gusty cloak]

What is the current situation in lore rn? Like is there some world ending event? Or is the null sector Omnic war stuff still going on?

[tranquil orbit]

atm we're assuming that the null sector war is still ongoing however they havent rly mentioned it that much for their newest material

i.e. neither juno or venture had any references to it and the last we saw of it properly was in one of mauga's 2d animated shorts

we also saw the invasion feature in a lot of the short stories in heroes ascendant but this was likely written quite far back ... my guess is 1 year at least

also it was technically released before venture

so technically no references to invasion in new material since march 2024

[unreal pasture]

he pulls them out of his ass

[visual star]

+10 fart damage

[unreal pasture]

reaper canonically is a walking fart cloud

[visual star]

thats what he turns into using his ability

[spare fox]

!!shiposting @unreal pasture

[unreal pasture]

1984

[spare fox]

!!shitposting

[twilit nacelle]

Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[obtuse tiger]

https://tenor.com/view/1984-gif-19260546

[livid elbow]

Is there any lore information about physical enhancements to humans that is not related to the supersoldier programs Soldier 76 and Reaper went through? I remember there was a bit about some alterations where you can age slowly, i noticed that Torbjiorn has physique resilience. I wonder if that means something.

[peak escarp]

nothing significant

the "Aging slowly" thing was made up by the fans

Torb doesn't have any physical enhancements

he does have dwarfism though

[cinder sequoia]

If you think about it Mauga’s basically on steroids

[tranquil orbit]

I mean he quite literally has 2 hearts id be surprised if he wasnt on steroids asw as a lot of other things to ensure this medical procedure stays intact

[supple osprey]

Do you think he's immuno compromised cause he's gotta be taking suppressants to prevent rejections, maybe the common cold is his hard counter

[livid elbow]

That information is from the Overwatch Declassified book

Not enhancements but above average physical resilience

[tranquil orbit]

i mean probably he was part of a military organisation after all

above average physicality is a requirement most of the time if u need to be out in the field (which he was given that he's an engineer)

[peak escarp]

this is Lore Discussion

[dapper light]

this is my lore

[livid elbow]

What materials are omnics made of?

[sullen girder]

You think ram swore his allegiance to Anubis? The ai I mean

[rare trail]

doesnt he hate anubis

i remember theres some voicelines about it?

and uhhh

in his short story the uh reflections

[peak escarp]

Ramattra was made by Anubis

but thinks Anubis should have been destroyed when it failed

[tranquil orbit]

yh he does

it makes sense asw when u think abt it because he's all abt omnics having safety and self determination (bit hypocritical given his plan but still)

and anubis is the complete contradiction of this

[sour vale]

AJAAHAHAHA

SOTP

STOP

THATS MY FRIEND

LMFAOOOOOOOO

HELPPPPP

[sonic chasm]

ramatra is ohio sibibi tioelt lore

Also im gold 4 dps looking for a team dm me

[peak escarp]

no

go somewhere else

[polar garnet]

!!shitposting

welp

[shy dagger]

!!shitposting

[twilit nacelle]

Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[shy dagger]

Btw, what exactly was Blackwatch. Were they proto-talon or what exactly

[peak escarp]

they were Overwatch's black-ops division

[tranquil orbit]

In fairness 2 of the members in the notorious venice/rialto incident did end up joining talon

Reyes/reaper and moira

[graceful stag]

Werent they just made to oppose Overwatch?

[tranquil orbit]

Nah they were part of the OW organisation

A sub category

Like i said a couple of their members did end up defecting

[shy dagger]

Reading about them, they seemed to be a sub-division or a branch of Overwatch

[graceful stag]

If im correct Blackwatch was made by Reaper after being overthrown so it cant really be a branch as it was made in spite

[past copper]

Blackwatch was the secret covert branch of Overwatch

[tranquil orbit]

It wasnt made out of spite it was made out of necessity

In order to operate in countries where theyd bypass international law they needed a covert division

Jack didnt like it but reyes saw it as necessary

[past copper]

Blackwatch carried out secret, sometimes unsanctioned, operations under the radar of the UN. Until the Venice Incident…

[graceful stag]

damn, always thought it was to hate on Overwatch, gotta get my lore checked

[tranquil orbit]

Talon is moreso the "OW haters"

If u want to know that from a story pov

Altho not rly explicitly their goals kinda change based on whoever is in charge and thats changed a lot

[past copper]

Blackwatch was revealed to the world and Overwatch was exposed as abusing their authority by sending Blackwatch where they weren’t allowed

This is a big part that would lead to the downfall Overwatch altogether

[graceful stag]

Alright now tell me the Illari lore

[silver vault]

It’s a blank page isn’t it

[shy dagger]

No, it was founded after reaper and Jack had a falling out

[opaque tundra]

She nuked her friends and possibly family and is depressed about it

[graceful stag]

serious question, didnt Sigma work on Lunar Colony when the black hole incident happened? Or at least, shouldnt Mei or Juno or Winston remember Sigma as a scientist before the incident?

[past copper]

Illari was born into the Inti Warriors, South American warriors who use Solar Threading to imbue themselves with solar energy from the sun

On the day of her solar threading, something went horribly wrong and Illari unleashed a blast of solar energy that wiped out her entire people

[graceful stag]

I WAS JOKING 😭

[past copper]

Whatever the case, we still don’t know anything about Illari. We know more about Venture n Juno then we know her

Which is odd

[silver vault]

Illari lore soon to be added?

[past copper]

Probably not

[graceful stag]

Illari the filler character

[silver vault]

💀

[past copper]

Illari seems to have gotten the short end of the stick next to the others recently released

Really makes you question why even add her if she brings so little to the game n lore

[graceful stag]

Money

https://tenor.com/view/crab-gif-26300412

[past copper]

Can’t be about money. I don’t remember when she was released tho

I think it was… just before the merger?

[graceful stag]

just before Mauga right?

[past copper]

Yea. I think she released a season before Mauga. Right after Lifeweaver

I think

[graceful stag]

Not a season before, 2 seasons i think, cause its hero map hero map

[past copper]

Regardless, Illari is the odd one out. Mauga, Venture, n Juno have gotten more lore than her

So I don’t know, but maybe the team who had a story for her were part of the wave of layoffs from the merger 🤷‍♂️

[peak escarp]

Sigma's accident was on a space station, not HLC, but he did know Dr. Winston (and met our Winston when he was young)

he also met Mercy at a conference at one point before his accident

Mei would have heard about him, maybe heard that he disappeared (or died, we don't know what the public knows about him)

Juno wouldn't know him, since she was born on Mars

[graceful stag]

I wonder if it was a hospital or a facility we see in his video

[peak escarp]

he was held in a secret government facility in New Mexico, USA

until Reaper, Sombra and Widowmaker went on a Talon mission to steal him away

[graceful stag]

Real question is how did Sigma survive, he should of either melted by the heat or crushed by the gravity of the blackhole. Some crazy plot armour

[peak escarp]

it was a pinprick of a black hole and only open for a fraction of a second

[graceful stag]

oh

that makes more sense

[peak escarp]

enough to fracture his psyche

and somehow give him gravity powers

[graceful stag]

sorry to ask so many questions but his weapons, are they mini black holes or just pockets of gravity?

[peak escarp]

they're similar to Zarya's graviton surge

little balls of graviton particles

[graceful stag]

probably the most excruciating feeling possible

even for a fraction of a second

[peak escarp]

yeah

[polar garnet]

tbf i think it was just science bs plot armor

you see in his origin story the size of it

[peak escarp]

the origin story was very stylized

but also, the science in OW doesn't always work like it should IRL

[polar garnet]

understatement of the year

ow is probably the most scientifically unrealistic game i have ever played

[tranquil orbit]

In fairness they do kinda try w at least putting in effort behind explaining some things 😭

Which i think ppl do appreciate

[peak escarp]

they make sense within the universe

[tranquil orbit]

It's just abt enough to get ppl to suspend disbelief

[peak escarp]

you just can't apply real-world logic to everything

[tranquil orbit]

Yh exactly

[peak escarp]

like, slowing someone's heart won't make them blue and emotionless, it would make them lethargic and sluggish

[polar garnet]

fair

[peak escarp]

but it does in OW

[tranquil orbit]

Unless it's to do w emotions/the human psychology thats when it starts influencing character and the like

Which imo is a lot more integral to enjoyment of a story

Thats the point at which u cant just be like "because i said so" if that makes sense 😭

It'll work for juno's purple hair tho

[polar garnet]

(as a hard scifi writer, i respectfully disagree )

[peak escarp]

I'm not saying you can't apply real world logic to anything

[tranquil orbit]

Nah nah ofc not

[polar garnet]

ohh i see

[tranquil orbit]

I didnt mean to out words into your mouth doc

Just elaborating

[peak escarp]

I'm saying that when it comes to OW lore, some things don't work like real world science

if you want to use real world logic in your own writing, go right ahead

OW has its own logic

[polar garnet]

one of my main gripes though is the scientific inconsistency
for example why does pharah and dva need rockets to fly while people like echo juno and mercy can do it without any visual propulsion

[tranquil orbit]

Maybe a weight thing?

[peak escarp]

they do have visual propulsion though

Echo and Mercy have wings

Juno has her boots

[polar garnet]

well yk what i mean

[tranquil orbit]

Dva and pharah are also way more bulked up and w armour

And heavy weapons

[polar garnet]

fair

[tranquil orbit]

Juno mercy and echo are all light

Streamlined sort of designs

Which btw was probs an intentional design choice for this

[peak escarp]

also Juno's propulsion is intended for use in low/zero gravity

it just works that way in the game because it's fun

the only one with unexplained propulsion is Zenyatta, who can float because.... Iris powers?

[tranquil orbit]

Maybe thats what he was learning before the crisis 💀

He just tried floating every day until he managed it

Unemployed guy

[peak escarp]

it also seems to be something he can only do while meditating

he's seen walking in some unfinished cutscenes

[tranquil orbit]

Tbf idk if weve seen him enough to know that for sure

But ik what u mean

[tranquil orbit]

If his emote is anything to go by the floating takes effort

He like stretches after

So maybe thats the explanation

[tranquil orbit]

He's also standing in the post credits scene from pve w ram

In the flashback

[peak escarp]

yeah

[willow meadow]

This would’ve actually been so cool if they didn’t scrap this

[peak escarp]

😔

[willow meadow]

I actually liked the story missions, they just got so much hate because of what was promised before hand

[tranquil orbit]

Yh but sadly this is what happens after years of anticipation

[willow meadow]

True

[tranquil orbit]

It was never not gonna happen

[willow meadow]

If they had only promised and announced the missions we ended up getting, they would’ve been loved by the community

[tranquil orbit]

Process was sabotaged

[willow meadow]

How did Illari end up in overwatch after the destruction of her village

[opaque tundra]

She did not

We don’t know what’s up with her

[tranquil orbit]

SEND HER TO TALON

[merry mason]

It honestly might go that way

That being said she seems to have beef with Moira

[tranquil orbit]

Half of talon already do 💀 so that wont be anything new

[spare fox]

just Talon? it seems like most of the scientific community and then some lol

[shy dagger]

“Great minds are always persecuted”

[spare fox]

yes well so are people who do unethical things but y'knowww...

lol but of course

[keen summit]

its still not officially scrapped

do i think its likely we'll get it let alone soon? no. but blizz really hates throwing shit away

[keen summit]

talon doesnt fit illari AT ALL

her entire character goes against talon

the only way she'd be with talon is if she got captured

[ionic summit]

i really doubt they'll go back to this but hey i'd love to be proven wrong

[keen summit]

Again im just saying its not officially said

So till it is its still possible

They moght just make jist that one playable cuz they had lots of beta footage in 2021

[ionic summit]

i mean it is officially said they have scrapped the pve

[keen summit]

No

Its not

No official person has said it

Only pn hold

[ionic summit]

where did all the news accounts get it from then?

[keen summit]

From a person claiming that he was told this

There were layoffs across the entire company

Including that of pve

[tranquil orbit]

I think the voicelines theyve added w her would beg to differ

She requires a bit of development before she gets there but shes absolutely susceptible to doomfist's agenda

[ionic summit]

if she were to join it would be for the same reason as bap. she has nothing left

[keen summit]

Its only on hold, blizz HATES throwing away

[keen summit]

Like?

[ionic summit]

blizz also hates their players

[tranquil orbit]

Check her voicelines w doomfist, zen even ones w reaper and sombra

[keen summit]

Thats not why bap joined tbf

[tranquil orbit]

But mainly the doomfist and zen ones abt how she views strength and controlling her powers

[ionic summit]

doomfist seems to try to get her on the team by motivating her and being nice to her. he's gaslighting her basically

[keen summit]

I don't remember those

[tranquil orbit]

Not rly gaslighting if he acc has something to offer her

[ionic summit]

he joined because he wanted to right the wrongs of the world and because he had nothing left

[tranquil orbit]

He too was also a prodigy in martial arts and probably could acc attempt to help her manifest her powers through his agenda

[ionic summit]

gaslighting her to change her view on talon

[tranquil orbit]

Idk if it's quite gaslighting as opposed to rly strong convincing

[ionic summit]

he does it with cassidy too. telling him talon can make him stronger and all that stuff

[keen summit]

Whats the line again

[ionic summit]

what's the difference nowadays anyways

[tranquil orbit]

Gaslighting tends to be when u manipulate someone to make them question what they know or their intelligence

He gaslights cassidy

Not illari

[ionic summit]

knowing doomfist. could be either tbh

[keen summit]

I dont see illari joining them at all

Her personality is all about redemption

[tranquil orbit]

Sometimes the path to redemption isnt always a straight line

I acc think the better characters tend to involve this

Baptiste for example

[keen summit]

Thing is his redemption is happening after talpn

[tranquil orbit]

It would for illari too

Im not suggesting she'd necessarily be there permanently

[keen summit]

Illari dod nothing wrong and wants to still redeem herself, then she goes into talpn, and then seeks redemption

[tranquil orbit]

But i wanna see her in that setting and i absolutely do think it'd fit

[keen summit]

No no, but shes trying to redeem herself alreafu

So it would be redemption after redemption

[tranquil orbit]

She is but shes aimless rn

She's described as lost

[ionic summit]

not really sure why she tries to redeem herself over what she did. what i would've done is try to find out what happened

[keen summit]

I know, but joining talon doesbtvfitcthere

[keen summit]

She is a young person

Shes blaming herself abd is traumitised

Shes trying to figure it out but doesnt know

[ionic summit]

wouldn't surprise me if doomfist would convince her that answer lied with him and talon

[keen summit]

Well shes working with sombra dor it

[tranquil orbit]

He already kinda is

[tranquil orbit]

Tbf we dont know that exactly

[keen summit]

Why would she believe doom knkws about her clans special tech

[tranquil orbit]

We also dk if it's necessarily derived from the tech

It could be something abt her specifically or not

Tbh im not even sure if the details are important

[ionic summit]

who knows how much doom knows

[tranquil orbit]

Fundamentally none of that will erase what happened

What matters is that she lacks control over her powers

[keen summit]

But why would she think he knows

[ionic summit]

my theory is it's something about her. either that or someone sabotaged the machine

[tranquil orbit]

If i had to hazard a guess some form of genetic engineering

[ionic summit]

he is doomfist. if anyone would know, it's him. and it wouldn't surprise me if she knew that

[tranquil orbit]

Idt it was just the machine was sabotaged thatd be insanely boring and kinda aimless

[ionic summit]

most likely more to it but that's just the basics of that theory

[tranquil orbit]

We already have an identical plotline w the OW hq explosion sabotage

[keen summit]

but its possible she would be like sigma

working with them unknowingly

or like sym ig

[tranquil orbit]

Zenyatta: True strength comes to those who accept their weaknesses.
Illari: That's not what I was taught.
Zenyatta: But it is never too late to learn.

Doomfist: You seem lost. Searching for your place in the world?
Illari: No, I wouldn't know where to look.
Doomfist: Embrace your inner conflict, and like-minded people will find you.

[ionic summit]

sigma works with them without knowing who they are or what they really want. Illari is smarter than that

[keen summit]

yeah i looked em up

[keen summit]

ik, but thats the thing

if she knew what theyre doing she wouldnt

cuz then she'd feel guilty

as she has immense guilt already over yknow the accident

[tranquil orbit]

Baptiste also knew what they were doing and went along regardless

[keen summit]

and my running theory is that the solar threading works like her being a battery, so she gets charged but got overcharged so, the stuff she couldnt hold was all discharged

[keen summit]

yeah, because back then he did it to survive

specifically

[ionic summit]

if Illari found out what Talon is doing she'd go on a rampage on them

[keen summit]

he said that the choice seemed simple, you did what you needed to to survive

[tranquil orbit]

Idt it's that farfetched to think that in her desperation to understand her powers she'd be willing to look past certain things for doomfist

Alternatively if doomfist sees her as a super weapon of sorts he could try and mask certain elements of the truth from her

It's not like it'd be impossible

[keen summit]

thats what id imagine, that he would send her on missions where he masks the others as bad

and for training etc

[tranquil orbit]

He might not even need to send her on missions he could literally just do 1 on 1s talon have plenty of secure locations

[ionic summit]

if doomfist saw her as a superweapon he could use, he would do everything in his power to convince her to join him. including hiding all the bad shit Talon does

[tranquil orbit]

Malavento for example

[keen summit]

and keep in mind its not farfetched she'd buy it, she was well raised very sheltered

[tranquil orbit]

Yh agreed

He might even see her as a potential heir

The doomfists tend to seek apprentices

Who they see potential in

[keen summit]

so her buying that say certain omnics are an obstacle would fit really well

[ionic summit]

that wouldn't surprise me at all. he seems to see potential in her

[keen summit]

and illari wouldnt surprise me if she didnt really care bout omnics

[ionic summit]

she doesn't really interact with any of them except zen so can neither confirm nor deny

[tranquil orbit]

Weve not seen any evidence of the inti even interacting w the outside world

Let alone omnics amongst them

It's v hard to say

[keen summit]

i do have a piece that might fit your theory here

[tranquil orbit]

Yh tbh i think this is her path

[keen summit]

the truth until they find out what it costs doesnt fit her past tbh, cuz she wasnt seeking truth she was just a prodigy so it would fit with strength more

[tranquil orbit]

Shes gonna go on a jack morrison style chasing shadows path trying to explain or manifest her power in response to the accident

Until she eventually comes to the realisation that none of it is rly solving the issues at heart

Or at least this is my feeling

[ionic summit]

i think Jack has gotten the least lore out of all ow characters atp. honestly kinda insane how little he has been seen

[tranquil orbit]

He just had a short story w sombra i recommend checking out

[ionic summit]

huh?

[tranquil orbit]

I forget the name

[keen summit]

hes gotten lots

zen is the least

[ionic summit]

ahh i forgot. all those comics and all that

[tranquil orbit]

It's called "Lucky Man"

[keen summit]

multiple comics etc

[ionic summit]

i don't read comics so...

[keen summit]

a book, alot of declassified mentions

cinematic

origin story

[tranquil orbit]

Illari surely 💀

[ionic summit]

what other cinematic does he have other than the one from 2016

[tranquil orbit]

Shes literally only had 1 appearance

[keen summit]

she atleast has origin story

and compared to time out its less abd

bad

[tranquil orbit]

True i guess

But zen has many minor appearances

[keen summit]

he has 1 yeah

[tranquil orbit]

And also a pve post credits dedicated to him

[ionic summit]

he appeared in the pve. in the best cutscene in the whole thing

[keen summit]

yeah but thats also all

and stuff we already knew

[ionic summit]

anything you can link?

[keen summit]

but id say compared to time zen is the least

[tranquil orbit]

True but i think seeing it in the way it was shown was nicer

[tranquil orbit]

Yh this is for sure true

[keen summit]

not really but bastet has him alot, old soldiers is a comic with him too, he has origin story on yt, declassified is a big book

[ionic summit]

still gives me goosebumps everytime i see it

[tranquil orbit]

Illari at least has the excuse of only being like 1 year old

Altho tbf nothing after 1 year is kinda crazy 💀

[ionic summit]

i can't read so i need something i don't need to read

[keen summit]

yeah and being made right before declassified and that book of many mini stories

[tranquil orbit]

The excuse i guess for zen is that he was a launch hero and so many other characters took priority at the time

So he kinda got lost in the sauce

[keen summit]

tbf its kinda crazy that so many others got much more tho

like some make sense obv

[tranquil orbit]

Lucio also didnt get much until pve

[keen summit]

i agree

[tranquil orbit]

He was in a similar boat to zen

[keen summit]

but for example dva

[tranquil orbit]

Who probably wouldve been expanded on a lot if we acc got the next missions

[keen summit]

like rein made sense to get alot

[keen summit]

again tho its still possible to drop eventually

[tranquil orbit]

Dva i think has a fair amount given shes not super central to the story

[ionic summit]

well we obviously would've seen more of genji and zen

[keen summit]

but this is the problem for pve: they wont shut the door on it yet but that means they have their story in a vice

[tranquil orbit]

I think the story isnt gonna be the same when it eventually starts getting progressed more

[keen summit]

if they officially cancel it they have shut the door but then open the door to continue the story in different ways

[tranquil orbit]

Atm our guesses for the number of writers/narrative designers left on the team rn is 3

[keen summit]

its a trade off that is risky

[tranquil orbit]

Or at least 3 we know of

[ionic summit]

if it starts getting progressed more

[keen summit]

atleast juno was actually well done

i was kinda surprised bout juno

[tranquil orbit]

So they'll appoint new ppl in time and they'll have their own vision

[keen summit]

was so expecting stereotypical cute girl archetype

[tranquil orbit]

I mean in game they kinda tread that line a bit more 💀

Out of game less so

[ionic summit]

i was expecting the new kiriko

[keen summit]

but they actually made her feel like how a person in her situation is tho

shes excited but scared

[tranquil orbit]

Out of game shes got some of the best backstory weve seen in a while

[keen summit]

that is obv cute for lots but it is also realistic to her situation

her in game writing actually suits her backstory perfectly

[ionic summit]

love how much she trusts rein to protect her too

[keen summit]

shes awkward, often talks in confused ways about cultural stuff while her other lines are sometimes very matter of fact too

cuz she grew up around only scientist

[tranquil orbit]

Shes still defo more in the cutesy archetype from her in game voicelines vs her stories

[keen summit]

but again, i feel like it fits

shes awkward and weird but tries her best. shes just very anxious

[tranquil orbit]

It does but it still doesnt sideline this fact

But it's how it always happens tho

[keen summit]

i mean atleast its not as bad as lots of others

[ionic summit]

who can blame her. going to a new planet you've never been on to live there would make anyone nervous

[tranquil orbit]

It's hard to get rid of 1 dimensionality from in game voicelines

[keen summit]

unlike lots of others her ingame personality fits her lore

[tranquil orbit]

Rein is a lot more big headed for example in game than outside

[keen summit]

yeah, thats the point, shes nervous but also really excited

[keen summit]

my biggest focus is that their personality should fit their lore

rein i also do have gripes with tho yea

but cough DVA

[tranquil orbit]

For me i enjoy personality thats nuanced and so i do always have gripes when in game voicelines feel a bit "boxed in"

[keen summit]

ahem dva in lore: responisble overworked girl archetype, dva in game: gamer girl

[tranquil orbit]

But as ive said it's hard to avoid

[keen summit]

dva in game even contradicts herself

[tranquil orbit]

They need to keep them short for ppl to latch onto them

[keen summit]

she has one line about "i prepped all night for this mission, okay maybe gamed a little too"
and then with ana about how she has so much to do and cant afford time to rest

like

those contradict, IN GAME

[tranquil orbit]

This is why ^

[ionic summit]

funny with her messages to winston too. she asks where the game room is, winston says they don't have one, she leaves the chat lmao

[tranquil orbit]

The emphasis is on those lines being easy to consume and less how they adhere to the character's complexity

They work more as snapshot bubbles rather than puzzle pieces

If that makes sense

[keen summit]

the thing is, dva is just an example of contradiction

lots have this

good writing should be consistency

and fitting their lore

[tranquil orbit]

They only appear as contradictory because theyre snapshots

[keen summit]

hence why i call juno pretty good in writing in game too, she fits what you would think someone from mars would be like

[tranquil orbit]

Ppl are filled w contradictions naturally but they feel more jarring when it's in this bitesize format

[keen summit]

shes alien, mispronounces stuff, is very oblivious to lots of things too

[keen summit]

yea, however in writing that shouldnt happen UNLESS that is the point

its not good if a character is 2 characters like dva

dva isnt 1 personality, its 2

[tranquil orbit]

For dva the contradiction comes in because i think she uses her personality more as a front for her internal issues

[ionic summit]

something that has always bugged me regarding this is doomfist's goal and a voice line of his. his goal is to make humanity stronger through conflict. but then he has a voice line there he says "i am not your savior". like, does those two not contradict eachother completally?

[tranquil orbit]

But like i said u dont get that interweaving just from short voicelines

So it's jarring

[keen summit]

thing is the only thing in lore we get to imply that is that she acts confident

not that she uses gamer words to hide it

[tranquil orbit]

It's a valid explanation tbf

[keen summit]

one that we have to just make up cuz its never shown in any other place

[tranquil orbit]

But also like i said the voicelines are massively "played up" in many cases

Theyre like caricaturised versions of the characters in many ways

Because they need to be in order to make sure theyre short enough

[keen summit]

easy way to explain the game now, its just a show

ez

but you CAN make that work look at ram

[tranquil orbit]

Like sombra has this weird interaction w rein and echo involving hacking which defo wouldnt play out the way it's shown in an actual story

It's way too goofy

But it's like oooh shes snarky hacker girl so it gets diluted

[keen summit]

yeah i getcha

[tranquil orbit]

Yh u can for sure

[keen summit]

but thats why i never call those well written ingame

[tranquil orbit]

It's just v hard

[keen summit]

ram and juno for example both imo are very consistent and very logical with how their lore works

and yes juno is slightly different from her lore, cuz now shes on earth

(though its stupid if she really did just skp ahead to gibraltar)

[tranquil orbit]

Thats true asw

[tranquil orbit]

FACTS

IVE BEEN SAYING THIS

[keen summit]

cuz then like

why was she even in japan

or like

anywhere else

[ionic summit]

never quite fully understood Ram's goal. he wants a better world for omnics. what else?

[tranquil orbit]

This is pretty much the jist of it

[keen summit]

thats it, he wants omnics to be equal and not oppressed, and if the omnics disagree he'll make them agree

[tranquil orbit]

He's also full of contradictions asw

[keen summit]

basically easiest way is an corrupted moses, he wants to liberate his people, but unlike others he CHOOSES to

[keen summit]

but with him thats the point

[tranquil orbit]

Imo tho this is what makes him a well written character

[ionic summit]

so he fights for freedom for his kind but then fights against freedom for his kind?

[keen summit]

hes meant to be contradicting because thats what makes him well him

[tranquil orbit]

Yh as i said i agree w that

[keen summit]

well he basically goes liek this, say you have dogs in a cage and open it, but some are content in there, he would pick them up and throw them out

he wants to force his idea of freedom on them

[tranquil orbit]

I think he sees it as a necessary step to ensure his vision of the future

Which involves subjugation

[ionic summit]

i can see it but still, odd. fits the villain role tho. most villainous plans are not very logical

[keen summit]

he also doesnt hate humans, he hates humanity as the entity, the culture

[tranquil orbit]

His contradictions come from a place of anger and despair imo

[ionic summit]

god damn Eren Yeager over here

[tranquil orbit]

Ive had this convo w someone before but there are technically better plans than what hes done if he wants a better future for omnics

[keen summit]

do you know mondatta? hes basically his opposite

[tranquil orbit]

For example making the omnic version of genosha like an independent safe haven and trying to protect thay

[keen summit]

ram isnt evil, he just like doom wants to achieve his goals at all costs

[tranquil orbit]

Rather than just invading the world

[ionic summit]

ofc i know him. the very thing Ram strove to become, but then strove away from it the second he left his gates

[tranquil orbit]

But he likely doesnt see the point in it because of what he's gone through in the past

So it's from what he's gone through as a character

[keen summit]

thing is with this aswell, mondatta tried a peacefull approach and he saw that fail again and again

[ionic summit]

they're similar to Thanos in a way. wanting something good but the method being horrible

[tranquil orbit]

The plan i suggested isnt necessarily peaceful it just involves more controlled violence

Only for self defence

[keen summit]

thing is: ram will likely if we did get full pve be redeemed by his prime problem being taken away: the sentient omnics are limited

[tranquil orbit]

Theres many lines in between the extremes of ram and mondatta that he couldve explored

[keen summit]

exactly, and who does that? zen

[tranquil orbit]

But he wont because he's so angered and lost w hope

[keen summit]

zen doesnt take the BIG approaches of either

instead zen basically decided to do more personal stuff

[tranquil orbit]

Zen we have no clue what he's doing 💀

[keen summit]

sym and genji

[tranquil orbit]

He could be a mondatta 2 for all we know

In terms of his views

[keen summit]

both were personally troubled, and he helped them as induviduals

[tranquil orbit]

Like we dk what his grand vision is for omnics or if he even has one

[keen summit]

except thats false

[tranquil orbit]

I dont remember it ever being explored

[keen summit]

zen isnt a pacifist

mondatta was

[tranquil orbit]

Yh but that doesnt mean that his vision isnt

As shown w ram sometimes theres a bit of disparity between personal values and execution

[keen summit]

i know, what my point is that both in his kit and everything he seems to be a mix of both

[tranquil orbit]

I get where youre coming from in terms of it's something thats hinted

But we need to see more evidence first i think

[keen summit]

he ofcourse wants peace however he instead of ram and mondatta doesnt try to do it in a big way like huge speeches or invasions, instead he helps induviduals human or omnic

ram and mon tried to make HUGE leaps constantly

while zen takes it more personally from what we know

and the fact that hes willing to use violence when needed shows he also kept the "if needed" approach from ram

ram and mondatta both arent good ways of achieving peace, mondatta took little action but gave speeches in places where generally omnics were accepted from what we saw, which well changed nothing

then in turn ram takes the path of pure action

[tranquil orbit]

Problem is w ram's action is that it's action for the sake of it

W not enough thought being placed into whether it rly aligns w the interests of omnics

[keen summit]

yeah, as he thinks that the compliant would hold them back

which again is bad cuz hes basically trying to force it, still not fixing the root

[tranquil orbit]

He also risks the wellbeing of omnics who are in relationships w humans

[keen summit]

basically it would just delay it

[tranquil orbit]

Or friendships or whatever

[keen summit]

basically mondatta lacked action

and ramattra lacks consideration

or well long standing peace

ramattra is basically punching someone in the face for doing something bad while mondatta is telling him why its wrong

cuz if ramattra succeeds, he now has a place for omnics that people will want to take over again and he basically forced them into "accepting" which will likely cause the opposite effect

[willow meadow]

Those animations for the “next story missions” could likely end up being used as new season trailers or something

Or just be released as a story cinematic alone

[tranquil orbit]

Icl i dont think some of them are done

I might be wrong but i assume that the reason we havent seen anything from them in 1 year is either

1. they rly dont wanna remind the playerbase abt anything even remotely pve related

2. the development progress was so far behind that they were basically counting on good results for the 1st batch to support the completion of the next ones

Or 3) theyve dropped the invasion storyline altogether (not been seen or mentioned since march 2024 so this is a possibility as time goes on)

[thorny zealot]

i have a question

how the heck are juno and Winston functioning normally in earths gravity

its well known to medicine by this point that the lack of gravity in space or even lower gravities on planetary surfaces can lead to drastic changes in human bilogy

i guess winston gets off free because he is an ape but juno should be seriously struggling moving around and breathing due to the fact that she grew up on mars

tbh she does wear a helmet

that explains some of it

and since cybernetics are so common in this universe it is not entirely out of the question to assume that maybe juno has some sort of augmentations to survive on earth

[willow meadow]

Have you ever seen the movie “The space between us” that’s about a boy who grew up on mars and comes to earth, and everything was fine for him other than the gravity being a little tough on him. The only struggle being his heart grew smaller because his body didn’t need as much blood flow. This could be similar with Juno, and there’s probably overwatch technology let alone the doctors in the year 2088 to keep her healthy. Plus her own technology still keeps her in low gravity so her heart is probably fine

[thorny zealot]

i wouldntsay that movie is very realistic if thats the case

if a child grew up in lower/mars gravity they would be suffering from bones that arent dense enough to support them weak muscles

and a colourful array of cadiovascular issues

[willow meadow]

That’s true