lore-discussion

[keen summit]

they see it as "OH YOU KILLED EVERYONE AND NOW SAY IT DOESNT MATTER NOW!!!"

and "she says shes the last, but well she kileld everyone so obviously!!"

[hushed jetty]

bruh??? the reading comprehension is crazy

[keen summit]

just check illari origin story comments

[hushed jetty]

illiteracy

[keen summit]

its fucking hilarious

also in this discord

happens alot, people call her a psycho VERY often

act like its her fault etc

[hushed jetty]

its almost like the ENTIRE POINT was that it wasnt her fault

[keen summit]

and the fact that its kind of up fro debate is cuz origin stories are ALWAYS in their POV

If illari instead for example said "they couldnt stop me, they held me back" then yes. but in her origin story she doubts herself, blames herself which shows its NOT on purpose

illari is just bland af

feels like another anime/marvel backstory, personality is bland, no connections, kit is bland too and her origin story dropping AFTER it
also i dislike how people use that to say shes one of the most powerfull heroes in the game, most likely she isnt. to do that explosion she needed the altar, the tribe powering it and THEN she could do that. we dont know if she still can

if she can still do it shes in the top group for sure, if she cant which is MUCH more likely shes likely in like the A tier of strength. yknow what i should do a tier list at this point

but ngl after like A tier it gets hard

this id say is the tier list of induvidual strength

sigma sym lw will stay theoretical till we see their limits

[fresh rock]

Ah.. this is a bit flawed.
What are you measuring strength by?

[keen summit]

induvidual strength.

its very tough after A tier ngl

B and C are very mixable tho

for example some we just dont know enough, illari for example is kinda weird cuz she could be strong or could not be, rama we dont know how he compares to norma lravagers same with bastion

[fresh rock]

You have D.va really high up

That's concerning considering Zarya is so low.

[keen summit]

flight is very VERY powerfull

and with her fighting huge omnics vs zarya is kinda...

[fresh rock]

You're including her mech?
I don't think that fits well on the power scale.

[keen summit]

point is more that she could stay out of reach of tons of heroes and be hard to fight

[keen summit]

well yeah

otherwise it would be kinda useless

cuz without she'd be like ashe

just a person with a gun

without any weapons or abilities just physical would change a shitton

im talking with everything we know of them how powerfull they are in a fight

ashe might actually be a contender for D tier but i thought that honestly using a gun and having bob does put her out of there

widow is also really odd cuz technically id see her being quite good vs some of the higher tiers especially when she surprises them

but when it comes down to it shes just a really skilled sniper B tier is very loose in ranking tho cuz well most there are very VERY similair in strength

hanzo would go down a bit tho. aight wait ill make a few changes to make it a bit more accurate

few adjustments have been made.
illari honestly from what we KNOW doesnt seem THAT strong. but thanks to theoretical power i did give her a bit higher rank cuz well if she could it would be great. decided to switch brig and bastion just cause bastion 1 on 1 against any uncovered enemy is quite hard to fight even in lore, though not SUPER tough any normal person would die to him

also changed rein and reaper cuz rein is powerfull all around but reaper has the yknow, doesnt die thing

[worthy basin]

I don’t think ashe is stronger than a normal person tbh

[keen summit]

reaper is mainly held back by just every single time barely doing anything to his enemies so it seems his dmg in lore isnt that great

[keen summit]

ashe not, its just cuz bob

2 people vs 1

thats all

bob puts her above normal cuz its not 2 v 1, 2 people with guns v you who might have a gun

[golden oak]

Cuz he fights heroes with plot armor

[keen summit]

Fair

But thats why its tough to make an assesment comparibg to other heroes on his output

the only times we saw good output was vs null sector drones but sombra did well vs them too so doesnt really matter and vs those volskaya mechs, which we dont know how they compare to the rest of the cast really

the only ones im VERY iffy on are really ram jq ball and all the retired overwatch people

and bap

but bap is helped by his abilities cuz his burst and immort are both canon, his boots too

mei could go higher but doesnt have good battle knowledge as yes i base that in here aswell

if we dont take their yknow skill etc into account and say everyone is same skill level etc and just as smart it would look very different again. cass would likely be below ashe probs in D tier for example or ashe would be next to him etc. its also why lw and sym are so theoretical, aside from the not knowing limits parts we also arent sure if theyd do something as brutal as say creating hardlight around someone and shrinking the cube to crush them

any other questions on my placements?

should i make another tier list of hero writing 🤔

[keen summit]

here is imho the writing tier list
the ok tierlist isnt in order nor is the bland, the rest are aka lw is the least badly written hero of the ones who are bad and rama is the best

for context for some of them, soldier is in good and sojourn is in bland cuz sojourns story feels very very close to his, while his having more depth and intrigue. sigma is in best tier just cause he hasnt gotten enough screentime to make me say his writing is SUPER good. we dont know much bout him and his voicelines are, likely intentionally, very mixed in style

[golden oak]

What if Antonio didn’t actually die and we get his cyborg version, genji style

We technically never see his corpse so we can’t be sure he’s dead

[keen summit]

could be interesting

[golden oak]

Also he was Italian and have colosseo map that has no ties with any specific character so far

[keen summit]

well yeah but esperanca also doesnt

[golden oak]

Lifeweaver

[keen summit]

has he been there?

huh missed that then

[golden oak]

We know he’s hiding in Atlantic arcology which was founded by the collective (the Martins)

[keen summit]

ahhh yeah missed that

[golden oak]

I wonder if the arcology is near Portugal or like in the middle of the ocean

[keen summit]

eh idk

but interesting

well sadly for this year we aint getting any lore heroes

so

cuz we have no green haired hero in lore

[golden oak]

I wonder if sojourn knows venture

If anyone knows venture

[keen summit]

like cmon

[golden oak]

Sombra probably cuz she knows everyone

[keen summit]

ana could also know them

as ana is knowledgable bout Hamid, whos part of the org

[golden oak]

Oh right cuz she was in necropolis and stuff

[keen summit]

its such a missed oppurtunity to make venture just be one of the people from Petra but all the names are well, not american

[golden oak]

The way we could’ve got those gladiators from colosseo but we got this junker looking thing

[keen summit]

Dr. Nachareon
Al-Hamadan
Hamid Faisal
Idannidis

[keen summit]

honestly

and like, i know its just a doodly but it seems like a mech

cuz it goes above his head

[golden oak]

I know it’s probably not a junker but it damn looks like one

[keen summit]

ikr

probs the hair + very bulky style, grey and green colours

yknow green like distillery on junk city

its also why i think its a junker, but cmon ANOTHER junker tank

hammond, hog, jq werent enough?

also 2 of the other tanks also have a junker skin

[fresh rock]

We can't exactly pick out who that is

[keen summit]

honestly i thought from how it was going it would be each year like 2 new heroes and then one big lore ingrained hero in december. the way they didnt show concept art of the hero made it seem like we might already know them

[fresh rock]

We'll just have to wait a while and see

[golden oak]

It kinda looks like an animal

[keen summit]

maybe the hair is actually an arrow

[fresh rock]

That's.. honestly really smart

[keen summit]

thats what it seemed like

[golden oak]

What if it’s the 1st alien hero

[keen summit]

december first year was ramattra, then we got lw illari and then BAM mauga, they were swapped so at first it would be rama which wouldve made more sense

[fresh rock]

Last year we got Ram

And when we launched we got Sojourn

[keen summit]

and next december is.... mystery monkey or guy with mohawk

[keen summit]

and jq and kiriko tbf

[fresh rock]

Ahh somewhat

Kiri's lore is scuffed

[keen summit]

the first heroes of ow2 basically all were previous hero candidates

[fresh rock]

And Queen..

Well, she's your queen

[keen summit]

funnily enough you also see that in my writing tier list

you have like most of their writing low and then rama and mauga pretty high

like thats what i expected, so from them not wanting to show the tank hero, being all mysterious etc and the pattern it seemed logical for that cuz well. the december hero is almost always shown at blizzcon, so being the BIGGEST hero makes sense.

so i expected it to go say idk Venture, space ranger, Sanjay
this would mean we first get two whatever heroes most likely, fun n all but then the big splash at blizzcon is so much bigger cuz we had unknown heroes before and now a known character. course with sanjay or kace it wouldnt be THAT big but hey

say theyd do overlord or sum, i despise the idea of it but ey, that would make sense to show at blizzcon cuz HYPE

so unless this somehow is someone we know or they got super good writing / gameplay im expecting it to be... eh

so yeah, next year is filled with randos. i will say the tank kinda does look like an animal cuz the weird ears but if it IS one, nice thats the third animal tank.

however the tank could be like kiriko or hammond was, mentioned in lore we just dont know what they look like, but then again we also cant speculate unless they hint at it

so its not the most hype ones sadly

[worthy rose]

Dont think sombra should be that low imo

[keen summit]

against modified people or omnics shes really strong, against non modified or mechanical she isnt THAT strong

thats why

[golden oak]

Ram was released early cuz he’s important for ow2 lore

[worthy rose]

but most of the OW world are modified in some way

she can even pull dirt on ppl for blackmail

[keen summit]

imho he wouldve been better AFTER invasion. cuz then it wouldve had that mystery

from what i heard here they were swapped cuz mauga wasnt ready

rama now had that in invasion there was no mystery to the omnic, there was no "why would he do this" etc

[golden oak]

No cuz he hyped pve, which they needed to keep the hype bc it was delayed

[keen summit]

but imho, his release wouldve been WAY better afterwards as he woulldve had more hype, more speculation to what the mystery omnic wants, why he does it and then bam origin story at blizzcon, showing who we were thinking off and why hes doing what hes doing

all i hope they do is give some build up

imagine for space ranger they add to lijang some reports from her about mars

or for venture if they add some petra things

cuz just even adding a name, a random name to a map would get people speculating, look at what happened with hammond. all they had to say that he was small and got people speculating since before doomfist dropped

[dreamy shoal]

Does doomfist keep the gauntlet on all the time? Even while sleeping or while he's in the bath?

[golden oak]

Of course

He can remove it

After they beat him it was on display in museums for some time, then he got it back

[keen summit]

we honestly dont know

tbf we know very few of heroes' casual lifes

[keen summit]

oh yeah im not saying he CANT take it off

im saying we dont know if he in normal day to day life keeps it on

like if he showers, sleeps etc if he keeps it on

[viral tendon]

Maybe he keeps it near him unless he be full showering with the gauntlet still on him

[golden oak]

I dont think he keeps it on
In fact I think he mostly puts it on special occasions

[merry token]

He just has a normal (albeit very realistic looking) prosthetic on for the most part I’d assume

[next jewel]

Didn't he have it on when calling Sombra and Reaper in the "Great Day" cinematic?

[keen summit]

Yea

[next jewel]

I feel like Akande keeps the Doomfist on during the times he has important stuff do to and once he is in his private room or smth he puts on the regular prosthetic

[acoustic ice]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but is Talon also attacking Null Sector?

From the animation with Mauga, it seemed Talon was stealing something from a Null Sector ship

[peak escarp]

Talon and Null Sector are working together, but Doomfist is sending covert missions to steal tech from Null Sector ships

so it's not a healthy alliance

[next jewel]

Ramattra has a good ingame voiceline that fits the situation between the two "For the moment we have a common purpose...let's focus on that" I think that how it goes

[lavish vessel]

I feel like he’d be similar to how tracer is with her chronal accelerator

[peak escarp]

except he doesn't need the gauntlet to live

[lavish vessel]

Oh yeah ik, I guess that was worded kinda badly lol

[candid escarp]

Are there lore reasons to all the black characters having 10’+ verticals?

[spare fox]

I think it just happened that way lol, I don't think it's intentional

[rare trail]

to be fair there like is a lore reason for that

they all trained under kiris mom so it makes sense they would all be mobile

[golden oak]

Btw does kiri’s mom teach multiple fighting styles
Cuz Hanzo and genji trained swords (kiri is also shown holding one in backstory) that’s a samurai weapon
Meanwhile after Hanzo fights genji they adapt more of a ninja fighting style
Hanzo takes a bow and genji his shurikens (he still uses a sword but he also uses it like ninja style, if that makes sense)

[rare trail]

its possible they had other teachers

like kiri is shown to have learned the kunai thing from her grandmom right?

[golden oak]

Ok but why would they train anything other than swords

[rare trail]

oh wait nvm im just remembering wrong

it was her mom

ig this does confirm that the mom teaches multiple things though

[golden oak]

Yeah it’s weird cuz she’s announced as just a swordswoman usually

And not like dojo master or whatever

[peak escarp]

a swordmaster

[manic ermine]

So has blizzard ever aknowledged the whole Kiriko Hanzo and Genji being kids together thing? Like try to explain it or retcon something.

[hushed jetty]

they have not

[peak escarp]

they weren't kids together

Kiriko trained with them when she was a kid

[manic ermine]

In the video Hanzo and Genji look like teenagers.

[peak escarp]

that's not kids

[manic ermine]

I can't post the image for some reason...

[peak escarp]

I know the one you mean

Kiriko's age is incorrect, and we haven't been given a reason

she should be 24 minimum

[manic ermine]

Even if she was 24, even if she was 5 years old in that video. That would mean Genji was 18 and Hanzo was 21.
I know Genji is short generally but he was like 4 feet tall.

[peak escarp]

art is subjective

I don't care about the artwork

I care about Kiriko's bio saying Sojiro was killed when she was 12

Sojiro was killed at least 12 years ago

[hushed jetty]

i think ages in the art specifically can be kinda inconsistent looking in general

[peak escarp]

so at minimum, she has to be 24

[hushed jetty]

like thag one pic of all the ovw agents where mercy is supposed to be 17 but she looks the same as she does now

blah blah women dont age that much, but still

the art isnt much to go off of

[peak escarp]

and Cassidy looks really beefy for a 17 year old

[manic ermine]

I just find it so funny that the actual story of Overwatch as like only JUST begone.

And they've already made these giant ass plot holes and inconsistencies.

[hushed jetty]

i wouldnt really say its just begun

we've had lore for almost 10 years now

[manic ermine]

Yeah but basically all of Overwatch 1 was basically just world building and set up.

[peak escarp]

it's one hero's age being wrong

that's not a massive plot hole

[manic ermine]

I know it's just funny because these are the people who manage the lore monolist of World of Warcraft.

[peak escarp]

she's not even a major character

[manic ermine]

And they couldn't keep some ages consistent.

[peak escarp]

that's a different dev team

[manic ermine]

Yes I know...

[hushed jetty]

"some ages" one age

[manic ermine]

Just let me make the joke

[manic ermine]

There's also the thing with Sojurn's sister.

[hushed jetty]

they fixed that

[peak escarp]

this is a serious discussion channel, not a place for jokes

for a franchise that is almost 10 years old, it has been surprisingly consistent

I would expect more retcons

[acoustic ice]

Where’s Underwatch and Whitewatch

[past copper]

!!shitposting

[twilit nacelle]

Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[acoustic ice]

sorry

[formal summit]

dont care

[worthy rose]

banned

[dusty snow]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-squarepants-sunglasses-book-reading-gif-15790482

me looking for ow characters with deep personalities (there are none)

[peak escarp]

!!shitposting @dusty snow

[twilit nacelle]

@dusty snow Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[dusty snow]

where does it go then

[peak escarp]

anywhere else

[wheat bolt]

Someone told me that they retcon Sombra’s “Idgaf about talon.” and actually isn’t in it for herself, and that she actually enjoys working for Talon? I still believe she’s in it for herself as shown in the cinematic. Plus how she acts with Sigma and refusing to give up Bap to Mauga. It makes her character more interesting.

[peak escarp]

they didn't retcon that

she just does what's in her best interest

sometimes, that's working with Talon

[wheat bolt]

Thank you cause I was fighting for my life with this guy on YT.

[peak escarp]

there's a upcoming short story collection that features a story about Sombra working as an informant against Talon

she's giving info to Soldier

[acoustic ice]

when is this coming out

[peak escarp]

March

[acoustic ice]

mmm i see

i have another lore question:

what’s the lore behind each payload cart? like why is the cart on gibraltar being pushed from one side to another with heavy resistance by an enemy team? same thing for paraiso, etc

[jagged mortar]

The only one that I know that has some lore is the King's row payload

The king's row mission, but tbh I can't remember the objective of the payload. Like was the 3rd point an omnium? or their main base that they're using to attack? I can't remember

[past copper]

Route 66 payload was originally the crate that held Echo, but was later used to send Ashe and her gang back to their hideout empty handed

There was also the Numbani payload in the beginning of the game. It was used to deliver Doomfist’s gauntlet to the museum. This has been changed as of Doomfist’s release

[keen summit]

You could say sge "enjoys it" cuz she gets pots of info. But not cuz its talon. Day if overwatch had that luch intel she'd lovr it too

[hushed jetty]

the junkertown payload is from the junkrat + roadhog cinematic where they plan to blow up the queen

[jagged mortar]

Oh yeah I forgot about route 66 and junkertown's payloads

[lavish vessel]

I think Dorado’s payload is also the truck from the “hero” short, the one soldier tried to stop but saves the girl instead

[desert yacht]

I like how interesting her dynamic is because talon almost certainly is aware of a large extent of what she’s doing behind their backs but still keeps her around despite all the potential costs

they’re willing to risk so much just for the advantages she can bring to the organization

maybe doomfist simply acknowledges that if she wants information on talon she’ll be able to find it regardless of whether or not she’s a part of the organization so there’s not much point in even trying to keep it from her, so he’ll try to at least get as much value as he can from having her on board

[golden oak]

Btw it’s hard for me to believe Jack would just ignore the null sector attacks

[twilit patrol]

Yeah that's weird

[next jewel]

Is it just me, or does Reaper have more mercy then Jack in the current lore state, Reaper goes for quick kills and only kills when he really has to, and Jack has his rifle but decided to throw hands anyway with the Los Muertos and even beat up that one guy with the pinata when he really didn't have to, and infront of a child

[valid wedge]

Hey may I ask where are y’all getting this lore? I’d love to watch it

[next jewel]

Cinematics and comics I think are some of the biggest sources, I just know what I know and pick up whatever else I hear

[valid wedge]

Thanks! Are too able to link anything please

[next jewel]

I think a lot of stuff is in the pins

[valid wedge]

Woah illari is 18?!?

Gosh what age was she when ||she destroyed her entire kingdom???||

[rare trail]

probably 18

[peak escarp]

Circuit Royal: you're escorting an F1 racecar to the hotel
Dorado: you're delivering a power core to the new power plant
Havana: you're delivering a truckload of rum to the fort
Junkertown: see Junkertown: The Plan
Rialto: you're delivering artwork from the museum to the Talon base
Shambali Monastery: you're driving a mining truck up to the monastery
Route 66: the payload formerly held Echo's crate, now it's empty
Watchpoint: Gibraltar: you're delivering a communications drone to the launch pad so Winston can re-establish the satellite communications network and initiate the recall

and for hybrid maps...
Blizzardworld: you're delivering a prop to the Diablo area
Eichenwalde: you're escorting a battering ram to break down the door of Eichenwalde castle and recover Balderich's armor
Hollywood: you're escorting omnic director Hal-fred Glitchbot to his trailer at the end of the map
King's Row: you're delivering an EMP to the Underworld (an omnic neighbourhood)
Midtown: you're escorting a firetruck to the subway station
Numbani: it used to contain the Doomfist gauntlet, which was being delivered to the Numbani Heritage Museum for the Unity Day celebrations, but now it's just a generic artifact
Paraiso: you're escorting a float to Lucio's club for Carnivale

none of them are strictly canon (Junkertown comes closest)

[jolly jasper]

How did Mei survive?

[next jewel]

Luck

[past copper]

Plot armor, dumb luck, maybe body fat? Take your pick on that

It’s either these, or Ram having accidentally spared her. Which isn’t unlikely, given he’s been in Antarctica for years now

[spare fox]

yeah the antarctic team went into cryostasis to wait out the storm, but the storm lasted far longer than anticipated and the rest of the team's pod's malfunctioned while the storm raged on and made it impossible to rescue them

Mei's pod just happened to hold out

[peak escarp]

it was random chance that hers was the last to fail

in another universe we could have had Torres

[proven sigil]

Dorado was also in that one solider cinematic

they referenced it

[golden oak]

Not entire, just the altar area pretty sure
We’re getting Peru map in upcoming seasons with nearby area most likely

I wonder if we’ll be able to see the catastrophe site from the map

Oh and I hope for some Illari lore to come with the map, cuz the girl needs some

[peak escarp]

the truck was there, but not the power core

[proven sigil]

yeah

[worthy rose]

I ain't reading alat

[stuck mist]

Was it ever stated what the treasure that junkrat found in the omnium was?

[peak escarp]

no

but it's speculated to be something relating to how Aurora/omnics became sentient

[muted kite]

That wouldn't explain why everyone wants him dead, though

[peak escarp]

they don't want him dead

they want his treasure

because they assume it's something valuable like money or gold

[spare fox]

I think (practically) everyone wants him dead but they want the treasure more so they don't kill him, hoping he'll give it up eventually

[acoustic ice]

Is there lore behind Reinhardt ditching his helmet and Soldier 76 ditching his face mask?

And what would it be like if Echo and the heroes introduced in OW2 had “OW1” designs

[keen summit]

Not that we know

I despise they did that tho

[acoustic ice]

Idk i vastly prefer the OW2 designs of rein and 76

[keen summit]

Soldier is supposed to feel like hes trying to hide who he is and the mask hides who he was

[keen summit]

I like soldirr more but it misses q big thing of him

[acoustic ice]

the only other ow2 design that i feel significant is bastion’s because of the ballcap

[keen summit]

And with rein its a little weird and i dislike the look

[acoustic ice]

also orisa i guess

[merry token]

I like rein’s helmet change just cause the “new” voiceline characterizes him a bit more for me

[keen summit]

Yeah some are actually pribs tied into lore

[merry token]

The one with Brigitte

[acoustic ice]

i genuinely cannot remember the rest of the design changes

[acoustic ice]

pribs?

[keen summit]

I can

[merry token]

Genji hoodie

They covered hanzo’s nips 😔

[keen summit]

But tbf im known for insane memory

[acoustic ice]

i think months of royal guard genji have made me forget about hoodie genji

[keen summit]

Ngl it seens like it got colder or sum. All heroes are dressed for colder weather

[merry token]

I like brig’s new design, her armor looks less clunky

[keen summit]

Widow, genji, hanzo, zen

[merry token]

They’re clearly experiencing global colding in the ow universe

[acoustic ice]

i’d still like to see what it would be like if echo and the ow2 heroes had “ow2” designs

most i can think of is how mauga looked in the baptiste comic

[keen summit]

But most changes are very insignificant yea

[keen summit]

Most likely not

[keen summit]

That honestly didnt really change

It did, but not cuz redesign

[merry token]

Mercy got a haircut ig

[keen summit]

Their vision for him likely just changes

Keep in mind in the novel mauga wasnt at all tactical

[merry token]

I honestly do like dva’s new hair, she looks better with it up IMO + it’s annoying to get hair in your face while doing stuff

[acoustic ice]

just imagine mauga having gravity powers

[keen summit]

Now hes actually secretly very smart but can get carried away

[keen summit]

It most likely would be gravity based then

He wouldve just gravbed a rock, had some absorbtion device and a device to create the shield

[acoustic ice]

that just gave me a weird idea
mauga and sigma just straight up switching their kits

[merry token]

I think sigma’s e ability would look really nice for him tbh

[acoustic ice]

mauga throwing balls and sigma holding two miniguns in the name of science

[keen summit]

Wouldnt fit either of em

[acoustic ice]

i just think it would be funny

[keen summit]

But most chsnges in designs were minor

Some have some implicatioms like moiras arm

But most were loke made Mildly more complez

Like doom having fur on his gauntket, orisas everything etc

[hushed jetty]

it was implied by baptiste that he was still at least smart but pretended not to be

[keen summit]

I thought this would meab new heroes would have those needlessly complex looks like valorant but so far that isnt trye

[keen summit]

But not some mastermind, he had to be stopped fromkillinv a person who cluld hive infi

Hence the "genius who gets carried away in battle" explanation i use

Anyways im also kinda tired of people saying sigma is the strongest no questions asled

Or that illari is in the top few

the only thing illari did was that big blast which was with the solar trimming device, powered her up etc. we have 0 clue if she can still do that and it very likely seems like she cant

[peak escarp]

Illari wasn't in control of that explosion

I wouldn't consider it part of her powerset

[hushed jetty]

they're the strongest in Theory but based on canon evidence it's more like winston or orisa

[keen summit]

and yet some do

[keen summit]

illari i wouldnt count even in theory

cuz she needed something else, unless she always would be able to do that its not part of her

sigma sym lw, in that order, id call theoretically the strongest just cause unlimited gravity control or creation of matter is just madly op

[hushed jetty]

if we imagine that she could eventually learn to explode like that on purpose then she's super busted but we have no reason to believe that she can

[keen summit]

i did make a tier list of in lore strength

how powerfull theyd be 1v1 or in general

some are iffy, i might place zarya higher for example, and just because one is above the others doesnt mean they could beat all of them for example orisa and sombra or widow and well, open heads

the ones im iffy on are bap zarya rein and brig, the rest im pretty confident in

mauga is also kinda iffy just cause we dont know if doom was using his gauntlet or not during the battle they had

but surviving multiple explosions is quite impressive already + the power of two miniguns and pure physical strength already make him quite high up

genji is a glass cannon but is so high cuz against most he could just very quickly end the fight, and most i mean like almost everyone, hes not in top tier just cause if he gets outsmarted or hit by any of the top hes out

the only reason mercy isnt in D is cuz she has flight, and flight is super good too

[worthy rose]

why is lifeweaver is on strongest ?

[keen summit]

zarya could easily go up a tier the more i think bout it ngl but oh well, not remaking the entire thing4

[keen summit]

hardlight creation is theoretically one of the strongest things in lore. if it has no limits u could just create a constant stream of cages and crush a person in it by shrinking it, or by constantly attacking them while they cant move

[worthy rose]

ok

[keen summit]

hardlight is litterally matter creation

[worthy rose]

and sigma can litterary make black holes

[keen summit]

we dont know if he still can

[worthy rose]

why

[keen summit]

we know he could ONCE, but we dont know if he still can

we dont know what tech was on site

sigma stays theoretical for now solely cuz we havent had any confirmation of what his limits are now

for all we know he could have unlimited power, or just lift a small rock

this is all based on what we know and then comparing that to others in a fighting scenario, i once in the past did a usefullness irl one which also changes it alot

any other questions bout other placements?

[worthy rose]

no

wait

[keen summit]

it is interesting how the most powerfull ones generally are tanks

[worthy rose]

why dva is on A

shes just a robot

[keen summit]

flight, unlimited flight

• missles

• dm

its quite powerfull and would be a tough matchup for tons

flight alone makes them often go 1 tier higher than without, and with dvas mobility and the power of the mech its makes her be above most

before anyone asks about rein, mind you this is 1v1 so yes against flying ones he'd have trouble but against people with a gun he just.. shields, or wears his helmet. we know his suit is bulletproof thanks to his short

so he can just slowly get to them and then just, hammer

and as i said, just cause say A is higher than B doesnt mean all heroes in A will always beat all heroes in B, case and point of sombra v orisa or even mercy v rein which would be a stalemate probs

Lastly, on bastion. Yes lots would have trouble with him but well, overwatch and armies have fought dozens of them so its kinda... eh? in an open area itd be tough but in a closed arena you could just slowly widdle him down

[hushed jetty]

i think it's implied he wasn't

well

idk i don't think he was but i don't have a source on that

[keen summit]

Yeah but thats the thing, the line that implies it is very up to interpetation

So we can assume it either way, i decided to do a loose mix cuz well ranking him above doom cuz unclear info also would go against how i do things

[keen summit]

still think its also funny that they had lines referencing later things on rama and sojourn cuz they were meant to release after or with PVE

sojourn has lines referencing her cinematic and delivered the exact same way

rama has lines about pve

[keen summit]

Btw on the jq beating ravagers, i just realised couldve been matchup dependant too cuz he magnet

[next jewel]

Reinhardt in lore:

Reinhardt in game:

[keen summit]

Yep

[spare fox]

A bunch of heroes have that problem lol

[keen summit]

If we had lore accurste only it would be hella different

Cass can technically always aim like deadeye for example

Its just him focussing

[next jewel]

Illiari 💀

[jolly vapor]

it felt super jarring to play the pve missions and have all the "mystery" around who this omnic leader is

even though we all know full well because they released him 4 seasons earlier

Ram should of come out in Season 6

[dense nebula]

Pretty sure Mauga was supposed to release first

Then Ram in Mauga’s current release place

But that may be wrong

[peak escarp]

why is Mei in B? she's "just a person" with tech, same as Lucio

and she has little to no combat experience

[keen summit]

flexibility, her ice can stop a big thing crashing so its very powerfull so potentially she could do quite a few things with it

[peak escarp]

that just means her potential power is higher than her actual power

also Zenyatta might be "just a person" but he's still an omnic, which automatically makes him stronger than most humans

[keen summit]

fair

[edgy rapids]

i think im the strongest tbh

[tacit stirrup]

That's true

[proven hornet]

wait why is symettra strong in the lore

[scarlet apex]

i'm still salty they decided to shaft genji x mercy for pharah x mercy

[peak escarp]

barely

[keen summit]

In theory she could create infinite amiunts of matter

[proven hornet]

they what???

confirm ts rn

[keen summit]

We dont know the limits yet of hard light, so her and lw are judt like sigma just theoretical rn

[peak escarp]

nothing is confirmed one way or the other

[proven hornet]

wasn't loverwatch basically just confirming gency or am i stupid

[peak escarp]

Loverwatch was noncanon

and had the player dating Genji/Mercy, not them dating eachother

[proven hornet]

true true

i haven't been playing overwatch seriously until like 2 months ago

even though ive had the game installed since launch

[keen summit]

We dont know anything yet, genji and mercy are also just very populair so its logical to choose them

[scarlet apex]

except the problem is the new writers heavily favor the pharah x mercy shippers

all the nuance michael chu put into ow1's story is just gone now

[keen summit]

well yes. and the heroes of ow2 that id call well written both likely were being written while he was here but eh

dont be a doomer just yet. they favour it but know its not wise to confirm it

[peak escarp]

it's hilarious to see people praising Chu's writing now

[keen summit]

confirming one or the other would make the other side not be happy. i personally find it weirder with pharah and mercy but thats personal view

[peak escarp]

when he was head writer, people hated him

[keen summit]

thing is i honestly cant tell the difference

[peak escarp]

accused him of writing Genji as a self insert

pharmercy stans posted death threats on twitter

[keen summit]

cuz yes illari kiriko and lw arent well written but ashe is also a hero that exists

illari on her own isnt badly written, its just that she kinda exists, kiriko feels forced and lw is just that well hes VERY stereotypical

as in what people think woke people are like

not in a negative light but just everything there is again so eh

[peak escarp]

the current writing is fine

I just wish we got more

[hushed jetty]

getting more smaller pieces of lore would be great

when was the last time we got an in-universe article of some kind

[keen summit]

declassified

which was like, alot

[hushed jetty]

excluding declassified

[keen summit]

torb and bastion thing

[hushed jetty]

i also said Smaller, so lmfao

i wouldnt call that an article but i guess i get what you mean

[peak escarp]

besides Mauga's origin, "A Great Day" and Declassified, our last lore was in season 6

[keen summit]

fair but its all an in universe history book with lots of smaller pieces of information

[keen summit]

i was bout to say lindholm but then realised that was in september, god time flies

[hushed jetty]

we also haven't gotten a Canon* comic since new blood i think

[keen summit]

technically the kiriko manga ig

[hushed jetty]

thats not even in english

[keen summit]

it is technically kinda a comic

[merry token]

It’s been translated

[keen summit]

about nobodies really

i mean KIRIKOS GANG GUYS YEAAAAAAAA

man atleast it might be some build up to heroes

cuz ngl we barely have any realistic hero candidates left, tho this year we are only getting nobodies

[hushed jetty]

there aren't a lot of NPCs who could be heroes at all left

[keen summit]

max (is a stretch but ive said alot how it could be done) sanjay, meka squad IG, uhh Hamid Faisal

they just said with meka squad no ejects basically

[hushed jetty]

like
meka [probably not happening], maximilian [probably not happening], sanjay, emre, the colosseo gladiators???

[keen summit]

maximillian could be done with a long controlled drone basically, he controls the dealer or sum.

[peak escarp]

they already said there's no plans to adde MEKA squad

[keen summit]

as circuit for example HAS cars controlled from long range

[keen summit]

TBF they said that before ow2 launched. it just deconfirmed it till after s8, now its also deconfirmed for 2024.

so 2 years? couldve changed. though i honestly dont want meka squad

[peak escarp]

it doesn't seem likely

[keen summit]

seeing how they have dva be in game i have no faith in them adding another gamer

like cmon

[peak escarp]

most of all because they're irrelevant to the story

[hushed jetty]

they could add casino. he's not a gamer

[keen summit]

are we gonna get more annoying gamer slang

[hushed jetty]

but i digress

[keen summit]

yeah, but most of the people asking DONT want him

[keen summit]

like that has been important tbf

[hushed jetty]

iff they added another meka member it'd probably be dmon. or maybe king

[keen summit]

nah theyll look at demand

[peak escarp]

it's somewhat important

[hushed jetty]

theyd find a way to make them relevant somehow im sure

[keen summit]

overlord is mostl ikely cuz of it. they never seemed to have thought of addign any so if most want overlord theyd make him it

[keen summit]

my point is more, illari and lw

[peak escarp]

why Overlord?

[keen summit]

most people ask for him

thats only why

[peak escarp]

most people ask for D.Mon

[hushed jetty]

i think its implied that illari Will have more lore in the future, and lw has connections to vishkar and sym and ,,, sanjay i guess

[hushed jetty]

since when

[keen summit]

i honestly see way more people ask for overlord ngl. people saying it would be overlord tiem and time again

[keen summit]

i see him asked way more

i also dont see how dmon could be interesting as yknow

[hushed jetty]

overlord is the little babyface guy i haven't seen people specifically asking for him

[keen summit]

i have seen tons, there were people saying lw would be overlord

[hushed jetty]

lmao?

[keen summit]

yea

WHILE THEY WERE DECONFIRMED

wanna know why?

"cute support hero"

thats why

but tbf it could be cuz it was confirmed support. but i while liking dmon the most think shes maybe the least likely cuz well...

idk how ud make it unique

but well the only one i could see being added easily is Sanjay just cause hardlight can make u fit into anything

[vapid tusk]

are you talking about the mech team

[keen summit]

hero candidates in general

not for this year

just in general

[hushed jetty]

they should make sanjay a tank so there's a vishkar-related hero for each role

[keen summit]

cuz this year has no heroes we've seen before
(wasted potential making a digging hero from Hamids org and not making it Hamid)

[keen summit]

the funny thing then is that since after release the only in lore known heroes in ow2 would be tank

[vapid tusk]

tracer's girlfriend would be kinda cool

i know she's just a regular human though

[keen summit]

dont really think we could call her a candidate

[hushed jetty]

she's a civilian yeah

[keen summit]

thats never mattered before

look at ashe

[hushed jetty]

i'm hoping for another talon support so you can run a 100% talon comp

[keen summit]

its more that shes shown nothing special

[peak escarp]

Ashe is the leader of a gang

[hushed jetty]

well ashe has a gun

and bob

emily is just some guy as far as we know

[peak escarp]

Emily's only notable feature is that she's Tracer's girlfriend

[keen summit]

they could just pull a kiriko and say "Emily secretly runs an orginization without people knowing and is very skilled"

or some shit

[peak escarp]

we don't even know her job

[peak escarp]

that would be bad writing

[keen summit]

theyll pull a kiriko with "shes secretly also a hit-woman

[peak escarp]

and how is that pulling a Kiriko?

[keen summit]

forcing lore in

without ever having hinted at it etc

[peak escarp]

how is Kiriko's existance forcing lore in?

[peak escarp]

you could say the same about Ashe or Baptiste or Orisa

[keen summit]

hanzo and genji NEVER mentioning her and her suddenly existing and secretly have been a childhood friend

[vapid tusk]

they could explain her role in lore :D
but that's just a wish i have i guess

[peak escarp]

or almost every other post-launch hero

[keen summit]

why would anyone hint at bap, hes a nobody to most of talon, skilled sure but not worth mentioning

orisa was BEING MADE in the lore

[vapid tusk]

i just remember there being voicelines referencing Lena

[peak escarp]

Kiriko is a nobody too

in the grand scheme of things

[keen summit]

its different from being added to their lore out of nowhere, they couldve atleast given hanzo or genji a line bout her before hinting that they knew her personally

[hushed jetty]

i mean its not like they had Every hero planned for a long time

[keen summit]

they add lines all the time

[hushed jetty]

i would like if they teased new heroes with voicelines though

[peak escarp]

Ashe is a better example

she's a very important character from Cassidy's past, but she was never once mentioned before she was added

[keen summit]

i wish they did that again but its well, sadly not sum that happens alot

[keen summit]

fair

ig it would be more of an ashe thing then cuz she also was first, cuz with kiriko its still bad but its with ashe first

[sharp slate]

I go Dva they go Zarya I go Rein they go Orisa I go Dva they go Zarya

[keen summit]

so, they could pull a ashe, make emily secretly have been trained in her past and tracer decided that she could help

[sharp slate]

And the cycle continues

[peak escarp]

or Moira - she's very important to Reaper's past but outside of a tiny cameo in one comic and a voice line on Oasis, she was never hinted at

[keen summit]

but tbf reaper doesnt talk that much bout his path while hanzos entire thing is redemption

[peak escarp]

why would that make him talk about a kid he trained with?

[keen summit]

to wonder how shes doing after it all, if she took it well, etc

but well the only hinted at hero in ow2 has been mauga, who i called with the VA being in that samoa vid, but it wasnt really HINTED it was more "oh guys its mauga, look mauga stuff, look"

[sharp slate]

Is there any way Dva can deal with Zarya? Because being forced to swap all the time is fucking annoying

[keen summit]

now for this year we have 2 heroes we just straight up know about now and 1 that we also just saw a bit

[peak escarp]

we've known Mauga was a coming hero since 2019

[keen summit]

i know

i meant more that hes coming NOW

[peak escarp]

wrong channel - ask in #overwatch or #overwatch-serious

[peak escarp]

he was supposed to be the hero for season 2

[keen summit]

its the same as people saying "but rama was hinted at before he was shown" yea i know he was in storm rising but thats it

[keen summit]

yeah, the swapped version wouldve been much better

rama wouldve been hinted at with invasion

[peak escarp]

I would have liked Ramattra to come out after Invasion

[keen summit]

which wouldve made us speculate to his intentions etc

[peak escarp]

it would have made his appearance in Toronto so much better

[keen summit]

and then at blizzcon, BAM there he is, his motivations

[keen summit]

given us reason to go "its him again! so hes behind this!"

[sharp slate]

I misclicked I thought I was in #overwatch-serious

[keen summit]

and learn through that that talon is involved

and just made leading up to rama way more hype cuz we wouldve been talking in here about his motivations etc

i just hope they do those map changes or posts etc again cuz those were fun for leading up to hero releass, imagine if instead of just SEEING space ranger we first got liek on lijang teasers for mars colony and maybe reports from well, who space ranger is

or for venture we got stuff about them on petra, saying maybe idk that theyre getting worried about some artefacts being used by bad people

MAKE them exist in the story, instead of just releasing them. thats what i miss

[peak escarp]

it's possible that Venture is one of the archaeologists that is mentioned on Petra

[keen summit]

lucio couldve had a line bout a refugee from vishkar to sym

[peak escarp]

a popular theory is that Venture is Blaise

[keen summit]

from the names i knew none fit

[peak escarp]

they guess Blaise because Venture has flame tattoos on their neck

which is plausible

[keen summit]

ohh thats why i missed it

the name

aight yeah no that tracks

[peak escarp]

yeah it's on the duffel bags

not on the computers

but we do know that Venture is associated with the same group

[keen summit]

thats what i remembered, the computer names

[keen summit]

yeah that i did know

thats why i said why didnt they just make hamid Venture but if its Blaise i dont mind

still wish theyd yknow, like add their weapon there or sum

just to hint more at it, instead of just "HEY GUYS THIS IS THE NEXT HERO"

ngl i found it quite boring to see all the heroes for this year

they couldve done like outlines, then hinted at them further along the way, or just said nationality etc. instead it was just these are the heroes.

ig i just miss their old style of doing heroes, now others do it better

[hushed jetty]

who's blaise again

[keen summit]

a literal nobody

but then its atleast mentioned

the only one we dont know nationality from the name

al others have very obvious name origins

[hushed jetty]

i guess that could be venture, like their actual non-code name

[keen summit]

yeah

would be nice for hints

[keen summit]

also note blaise is a genderneutral name too

[keen summit]

But blaise doesnt actually mean anythin with fire unless ofcourse Blaze ig

[golden oak]

It is their name

[hushed jetty]

like, canonically? confirmed and real?

[keen summit]

Where is it confirmed

[golden oak]

Yeah, it’s probably not their first name tho, but an agent name
Just like “mercy” or “widowmaker”

[golden oak]

Blizzcon I believe

[hushed jetty]

no im talking about "blaise" not "venture"

we know venture is their name but we're saying Blaise could be their actual name

[golden oak]

They only said space ranger is code name

[golden oak]

Oh

[hushed jetty]

space ranger is a code name in the sense that she's gonna have a different name when she's released

[golden oak]

Yeah I doubt venture is their name although nb people often have unusual names

[hushed jetty]

i would laugh so hard if they named themself venture

[keen summit]

Im venture, oh okay but like your name, venture

[golden oak]

There’s fr people calling themselves like “Lake” and stuff like that

[keen summit]

Yea

[little crest]

Has either Genji or Mercy had a partner?

[keen summit]

Not that we know off

[golden oak]

Afaik mercy does mention someone (not by name) in her interaction with Baptiste

Btw, I wonder if Bap and Cassidy is gonna be a thing

[next jewel]

What I think some of the hero's sexuality is:

Bap: Bisexual
Lifeweaver: Bisexual
Moira: Asexual and Aromantic
Reinhardt: Straight
Mauga: Maybe Bisexual, not sure tho
Zarya: Lesbian
Junkrat: Straight, could be gay tho
Junker Queen: Asexual
Soldier: Asexual and Aromantic
Sombra: Could be Lesbian

[peak escarp]

why

also Soldier is already confirmed to be gay

[next jewel]

Wait, Soldier was confirmed???

[peak escarp]

yes, like 5 years ago

[next jewel]

Damn, never heared about that

[peak escarp]

https://vxtwitter.com/westofhouse/status/1082394625837428736

[next jewel]

I kinda just looked at how they interacted with other heros and other stuff I know about them and just thought that they could have that sexuality

[peak escarp]

what makes Zarya seen lesbian?

also Lifeweaver is Pansexual

[next jewel]

I mean, I just think Zarya could be a lesbian, I feel like it fit her, idk why tho, maybe my brain just being stupid

[spare fox]

Ana and Widowmaker were married to men, so that pretty much eliminates lesbian for them

wasn't there an interaction between Mercy and Sojourn with Mercy asking Sojourn about her dating life?

Mercy: So... how is that man you were telling me about?
Sojourn: Angela, I'm not discussing my love life on a mission.

DVa thinks BOB is cute, so she's into that lol

and then there's the whole Wrath of the Bride - whether the Bride is the bride of the scientist or the monster which I know isn't canon and more of a joke but I also don't believe they'd put exclusively characters who are meant to be homosexual in a hetero relationship, even in a non-canon way but that's just me

so basically, everyone is bi until confirmed otherwise I guess?

[rare trail]

isnt cass flirty toward ashe in deadlock rebels?

hanzo says something about like "good looks are not enough" when killing some male heroes

[spare fox]

yes, he is but she brushes him off so there's that

[spare fox]

he also says that when killing enemy hanzos 😆

[peak escarp]

a guy can think another guy looks good without being gay

I think people make too big of a deal about heroes' sexualities

it doesn't really matter

[spare fox]

yeah but it does give a little insight into their lives

people crave crumbs

[rare trail]

tank
dva:calls bob cute rein:flirty lines with ana
damage
cass:flirty toward ashe in deadlock rebels genji:flirty lines with mercy hanzo:"good looks are not enough" towards men pharah:confirmed lesbian reaper:has an exwife soldier:confirmed gay sombra:wrath of the bride torb:has a wife tracer:has a girlfriend widow:had a husband
support
ana:had a huband bap:confirmed bi lifeweaver:confirmed pan mercy:flirty lines with genji

[spare fox]

and shipping is shipping

[rare trail]

at least iirc

we only have 5 confirmed lgbt playable chars right?

soldier pharah bap lw tracer

with a 6th coming with venture

[peak escarp]

correct

[peak escarp]

personally I'd more interested in learning about their families

[spare fox]

that too

[peak escarp]

we only know the families of a handful of heroes

and some of those are just "orphaned during the Crisis"

[spare fox]

right, and (I believe it was MChu) writers said most heroes are "married to their work" so they're not too interested in dating/having families of their own in general

that's generally speaking

[rare trail]

doom jq ashe genji hanzo pharah reaper soj torb widow ana brig kiri lucio

[merry mason]

yup those are heroes

[rare trail]

i mean we know about their families right?

ig like mercy we know vaguely like "her parents are dead from the crisis"

[merry mason]

oh, yeah

lw too

[rare trail]

lw?

whats the deal with his family?

[merry mason]

his parents are the ones that sent him to viskar school iirc

so he's got parents

[spare fox]

they're rich and he's the middle sibling

[rare trail]

ohh oki

[spare fox]

Sojourn's parents are both still alive as far as we know, and she has a twin sister and niece who is grown now

[rare trail]

idk if i should count tracer because like her and emily and kinda family? theyve been together for like 8 years

[merry mason]

i would count it personally

[spare fox]

yeah they live together (or at least look like they do) so I think that's considered family

[lavish vessel]

Tracers parents are briefly mentioned in declassified too

[peak escarp]

there, I made a list of all the known family of the Overwatch heroes

[hushed jetty]

we know mauga's dad is a person that exists but we dont know what he's up to these days

could be dead

[peak escarp]

oh I forgot Mauga

[leaden cliff]

Who’s the strongest lorewise

[leaden galleon]

The easy answer to that is Sigma, but there are other contenders

[golden oak]

If we’re talking brute force I’d say orisa/Winston

Also if a had a dollar for every time this question has been asked here I could fund ow3

[hushed jetty]

i swear to god.

[spare fox]

We went too long talking about something else, quick someone press the "which hero is strongest?" button

[acoustic ice]

would murphy be included in sojourn's family?

also i've never heard about sam english before

[merry token]

Pharah’s dad, his full name was given in declassified

[worthy rose]

That's just a theory

A GAME THEORY

[tiny star]

Has moira's left hand gone necrotic from the succ juice?

[peak escarp]

she experimented on herself

[acoustic ice]

Is reinhardt the same height without his armor?

[peak escarp]

he's pretty big, but not as tall

[spare fox]

Yeah are in-game sizes canon?

Like are Moira and LW and JQ really that huge?

[merry token]

Yeah, lifeweaver’s model is like the same size at base ramattra 😭

[peak escarp]

Sigma, I think

[lavish laurel]

Mauga I think, Sigma floats.

Mauga has his knees bent, and sigma be floatin

[peak escarp]

even if you take away the height from floating, Sigma is still quite tall

[lavish laurel]

Yeah but Mauga is HUUUGE even with his knees bent

[peak escarp]

we don't have official heights for any of the post-launch heroes

[hushed jetty]

even if sigma is standing he's huge

i've compared their heights before

let me find the pic

sigma is floating in this image but if he's standing he's sliiiightly taller still i think

[little crest]

Sigma is like 8feet

[hushed jetty]

yeah

[little crest]

Also Maugas boots probably have a inch or 2 on the soles

Mauga is at least 7feet though

[spare fox]

I think I believe the in-game heights are only sort of canon

Soo many of the heroes are over 6.5 and 7 feet tall I mean

[mortal pond]

even blizzard is lost with lore

[vapid tusk]

knees bent too

[leaden galleon]

I think the Dutch have the tallest average height in the world

[keen summit]

Tbf peoples average height usually go up over the years, so irs not THAT weird theyre tall

[digital linden]

it is like 50 something years in the future so it’s not that surprising averages heights will have differed probs

[keen summit]

they do yea

id know

[merry mason]

I don’t think heights extrapolate up forever

[spare fox]

yes but still, I do wonder if they were to appear in a cinematic together, for instance, would they be as huge compared to the other heroes
hypothetically I mean Junkerqueen is literally TWICE the size of Lucio it's crazy

[fallen egret]

Has more to do with nutrition than evolution

The average height wont keep increasing like it has in the last century

Only in developing places, most of which already have low average height

[keen summit]

What the hell

[next jewel]

Why does one of them have Ramattra hair?

[keen cobalt]

What did you do to poor zen

[past copper]

That’s clearly not Zen. The lights show this

And just for fun. Their band name is The Insurgents

[next jewel]

The designs are fire tho

[fresh rock]

Are these new? Or is it old concept art?

[loud cosmos]

life weaver actually uses the power of his rose toy to heal.

[sudden tundra]

STEVE IS THE NEXT OVERWATCH CHARACTER LEAKED

[shut void]

Head over to https://discordservers.com/bump/94882524378968064 to bump this server!

[hushed jetty]

those guys were in Calling so i hear

or concept art for them at least

[worthy rose]

it feels like maugas mini gun does no damage at all

[keen summit]

we dont know, blizz just posted it

[acoustic ice]

is it possible for omnics to get high

[hushed jetty]

well its not like they can physically do drugs

[merry mason]

Maybe there’s a virus or something

[twilit patrol]

In the lore, he would shred someone.

[keen summit]

theres probs some robo version of it

[hushed jetty]

thats so funny to think about

ramattra pulls out the marijuana usb like its time to get turnt

[keen summit]

rama wouldnt

he probs would get mad about omnics doing it

[hushed jetty]

none of the current omnics would i reckon 😭 but i needed to be funny

[keen summit]

hmmmmmmmmmm max probs would

[hushed jetty]

ok true

[peak escarp]

maybe they get "high" off of specific electrical currents

like static gives them a buzz or something

[spare fox]

Overclocking is the omnic equivalent of steroids

[hushed jetty]

electrocute max at the talon function so he can break it down too

[shell monolith]

So I’ve never understood what talon is

[hushed jetty]

global terrorist organization, lead by doomfist with the purpose of sowing chaos to make humanity evolve

[shell monolith]

Ah I see

But why?

Why does room fist hate everyone?

[hushed jetty]

i dont think he hates everyone he just thinks this is the only way to push humanity forward

exactly why he thinks that i couldnt tell you

[shell monolith]

Fair enough

Thank you :)

[hushed jetty]

[cunning burrow]

im junkrat height

wait nvm hes an inch taller

[cunning burrow]

i kind of agree

look at wartime

during war, governments develop so much faster

whats to say that dosent go for all of humanity?

[spare fox]

Yeah it is a fair point: post-WWII there was a massive boom in technology, quality of life, space research and exploration, medical breakthroughs

[hushed jetty]

he's not entirely wrong but he's also kinda insane for assisting a global attack on humanity

[acoustic ice]

uhh lol

[spare fox]

pretty sure sojourn and tracer are slightly taller

[peak escarp]

known official heights:

• Symmetra: 5'7"
• Tracer: 5'4"
• Lucio: 5'3"
• Torbjorn: 4'7"
• Hammond: "Pikachu sized" (approx. 1'4")

[keen cobalt]

Why are sojourn and sym so wide

[next jewel]

I'm taller then all of them lol

[worthy rose]

Junkrat is taller than base ram at 6’6. Ram is 6’4.

Junkrat being a whole tight end is actually crazy to me.

[spare fox]

He's built like a twig though

[little crest]

Sojourn is 5'5?

Shocking

[merry token]

Whoever made that chart stretched their portraits so they could fit within the height chart at the height they wanted

[peak escarp]

we don't have an official height for her

or any of the post-launch heroes

[merry token]

People are just getting heights by comparing character models to characters who have official heights

[slate yew]

lore

[little crest]

Sojourn has to be like 5'7

She's either 5'6 or 5'7

Wait, I think she's like 5'10, because windowmaker is 5'9, and in heels, yet Soj is the same height as her...

[hushed jetty]

is widow 5'9 in general or 5'9 with the heels

[little crest]

I think she's 5'9 in general

Yeah Pharah is 5'11 and Widow seems to be a inch shorter(I'm using widow as reference because she stands up straight)

[hushed jetty]

i wish it was easier to get in-game height references
like every hero is crouching

[little crest]

Bro what the fuck.. hanzo is taller than widow somehow?

Isn't hanzo 5'8?

[hushed jetty]

yk what qould be cool? if they added a little height measurement thing on a wall somewhere

(assuming the in-game heights are to scale)

[little crest]

People thought pharah was 6'1 damn

[peak escarp]

I don't think the in game heights are to scale

[little crest]

Genji and Mercy are the same height(5'7) yet Mercy seems to be an inch taller just about, I believe the heels do infact add to their height

I dunno, all I can say is rough estimates are all you can rely on

[hushed jetty]

i at least would like canon heights

[peak escarp]

there are reference sheets that give canon heights for every launch hero except D.Va

https://blizzard.gamespress.com/Overwatch-2/Focus/Cosplay-Reference-Kits#?tab=misc-8&scrollto=

[hushed jetty]

OH WHAT

thats sick wtf

the files wont open

[shy dagger]

Who’s stronger lore wise, Solider or Reaper?

[hushed jetty]

hard to tell but probably reaper due to his whole... ghosty thing

[worthy rose]

Genji is canonically 5,7 so I am happy with that

[spare fox]

I was wondering/theorizing the same thing recently if the in-game models were necessarily canon

[worthy rose]

Why is it so warm? Well, the Earth is tilted on its axis, thanks to a planetary collision five billion years ago!

[dense nebula]

I am taller than a cybernetic ninja

[hybrid monolith]

cant believe there are people seriously discussing overwatch lore when fnaf exists

[peak escarp]

imagine caring about fnaf

[past copper]

Fnaf is laughable considering they can barely keep to a storyline XD

[shy dagger]

I like to believe they’re equal in strength

[fallow moon]

Honestly reaper is in constantly in pain and soldier is a super soldier

So I feel reapers ability and solder is inhuman aspects make that more of a 76 lean

[peak escarp]

Reaper is also a super soldier

they were part of the same program

[shy dagger]

Both have their own advantages.
Reaper has ghostly abilities but is in constant pain, while solider doesn’t have a pain disadvantage but also lacks any inhuman abilities like phasing through and teleporting

[fallow moon]

Now let’s bring Ana into this 1v1v1

[peak escarp]

the only advantage Ana has is that Reaper still has positive feelings about her

that's why he retreated in Old Soldiers rather than stay and fight her

besides that, Ana is just an ordinary human

[shy dagger]

Wait, tracer is a superhuman?

[peak escarp]

she jumps around in time

[spare fox]

the individual hero image inconsistencies are bugging me

[peak escarp]

shh it was the first tiermaker I found

Tracer's ability to jump around in time is innate, caused by the Slipstream accident, but her ability to control the jumping is from the device she wears

"magic" means their power comes from a magical source
"superhuman" means their power is an innate ability not granted by an external device
"augmented human" means their power comes from external devices
the rest are self-explanitory

wait Soldier should be superhuman

and Widowmaker

there

hmm

Illari's power is questionable... it's not clear how solar threading works

[hushed jetty]

why does widow count as superhuman

[hushed jetty]

oh i see

im illiterate nvm

[shy dagger]

Widow’s power isn’t innate, Talon specifically made her that way, that’s why her skin is blue

Solider was also part of a superhuman-Captain America type project so he should go down too

[peak escarp]

but it isn't caused by an external device, like cybernetics

it's due to proceedures done to her

[shy dagger]

Doesn’t necessarily have to be cybernetics

[peak escarp]

that's how I'm definining the categories

nobody in the "Supernatural" category was born with their powers

[shy dagger]

Also, we don’t exactly know how they made her the way she is. They may have used cybernetics and they may have not

[peak escarp]

they told us it was through genetic therapy

[shy dagger]

I didn’t get that from your previous text but ok

[hushed jetty]

"innate" is a weird word to use in that case

[shy dagger]

Yeah

[peak escarp]

not innate then

acquired

[shy dagger]

Or gained

But yeah these work

[peak escarp]

updated

re: Mauga being genetically enhanced

also some heroes fall unto multiple categories, I just put them in the first one on the list they qualified for

[shy dagger]

Yeah that’s more like it

Is Illari’s power magic?

Or just enhanced science?

[peak escarp]

unknown

[shy dagger]

Uhm

She seems like a nuclear bomb to me

So I guess her placement as of now fits right..

[hushed jetty]

gerard mentioned!

[rancid phoenix]

Yo who likes who in the lore

💀

[hushed jetty]

like romantically?

tracer has a girlfriend and torb is married to ingrid; otherwise there's a looooot of implied things but nothing too explicit

i think baptiste has a crush on cass or something maybe? idk i didnt read the pride month short story, alas

i think they're also trying to imply that pharah likes mercy maybe i dont know man

[next jewel]

Pharah x Mercy? Hasn't Mercy been an adult before Pharah was even born???

[peak escarp]

Mercy is only 5 years older than Pharah

[peak escarp]

Tracer has a girlfriend (Emily)
Torbjorn has a wife (Ingrid)
Widowmaker had a husband (Gerard; deceased)
Reaper had a wife (Martina; she thinks he's deceased)
Ana had a husband (Sam English; divorced)
there's hints at a possible romance between Genji and Mercy, but nothing confirmed

[hushed jetty]

soldier had vincent at one point many moons ago

presumably just dating and not married

[peak escarp]

yes

barely worth mentioning

[short holly]

I don’t think they ever actually divorced, I thought he also thought Ana was dead. But, who am I to question bro

[peak escarp]

either way, Ana doesn't wear her wedding ring anymore

[short holly]

Fair enough

[acoustic ice]

say the hardlight weapons are somehow canon. in that case, how did reaper get his hands on hardlight hellfire shotguns?

assuming that rein and mercy getting their hardlight weapons in-lore was much easier given their alignment

[keen summit]

You got that wrong

Its actually the opposite

IF theyd be canon, reaper would have way easier acces

[peak escarp]

Sanjay works with Vishkar and Talon

[acoustic ice]

assuming vishkar is making the hardlight weapons, they wouldn’t like overwatch in their current state right?

[peak escarp]

Reaper could get hard light guns easy

[keen summit]

As vishkar is allied with talon i dont think theyd help overwatch

[peak escarp]

we don't know if Vishkar is allied with Talon or if it's just Sanjay

[keen summit]

Yeah thats fair

[acoustic ice]

i’ve also noticed eerie similarities between all the hard light stuff and echo

[keen summit]

But also, overwatch is still banned

[peak escarp]

but Vishkar still isn't likely to help Overwatch

their goals aren't aligned

[acoustic ice]

correct me if i’m wrong but is it implying that dr liao worked with vishkar at one point

[keen summit]

So they wouldnt ruin their "perfect world" by helping people who are considered terrorist

[peak escarp]

hard light isn't exclusive to Vishkar

[keen summit]

U are most likely wrong.

Vishkar is the furthest with development thats all

[acoustic ice]

but not the inventors?

[keen summit]

Think of how irl there are leaders of certain tech, for example tesla for electric cars

It doesnt mean they alone can use it, they just are the best

[peak escarp]

we don't know who invented hardlight

[keen summit]

Id need to check in declassified cuz i forgot

[acoustic ice]

still an eerie resemblance between echo and the hardlight weapons to me though

[keen summit]

Its likely cuz just futuristic

Its most likely not canon either

[acoustic ice]

i still remember people saying “they killed echo and turned her into a hammer”

[peak escarp]

most skins aren't canon

[keen summit]

If it is canon it could be that liao created them to work as tests for echos weapon and copying systems

[acoustic ice]

ok i really like this theory

[keen summit]

But again, thats us going on a likely non-canon thing

But thats the least like, insane choice

Cuz if they got it recently, why did they get it eyc

So if theyre canon id say most likely as theyre all ex ow agents it was made to test echos later combat and copying systems.

[acoustic ice]

on an unrelated note, what could the next set of weapon skins be?

i was thinking maybe shoddily put-together junker weapons

[keen summit]

We honestly got no clue

[acoustic ice]

for like dva, ana & whoever non-junker dps has connections to the wasteland

i think it would be neat

[peak escarp]

it'll probably be for heroes that are unrelated to the junkers

[acoustic ice]

if we’re going off the lore stuff of the hardlight weapons being based off of ex-ow agents

[hushed jetty]

there's a Lot of ex-ovw agents, the fact that all 3 that got weapon skins are ex-ovw could very well be a coincidence

[keen summit]

Both already have junker skins so wouldnt sell

[acoustic ice]

ana has a junker skin?

[peak escarp]

kinda

it's a stretch

[keen summit]

Junker style

[peak escarp]

D.Va's junker skins is a good example of a non-canon skin

[keen summit]

Which means why would peeps buy it

[acoustic ice]

can i see the ana skin in question

[acoustic ice]

ahhhh i see it now

thanks

[peak escarp]

except it's not really inspired by the Junkers

it's based on postapocalyptic media

[acoustic ice]

so it’s straight up previous concept art made into a skin

honestly that sounds neat, and now i want to see other examples of other games doing this

[keen summit]

Uhh we have another

[hushed jetty]

ive never seen that skin in my life

[keen summit]

Its a base skin

[hushed jetty]

what 😭 i might be stupid

[keen summit]

Lucio has an skin thats just his concept art

[keen summit]

Yea

[peak escarp]

here's the other colour variation

[acoustic ice]

which one

[ruby ridge]

one where hes shirtless

Capoeira iirc? Or I nah jjsg be confused

[keen summit]

Nah its another i forgotvthe name

[hushed jetty]

equalizer

[ruby ridge]

Yeah

Cover It up…

[keen summit]

I had a discussion earlier bout mauga v jq and i said that unless theres no coating on his hesrts it probs wouldnt even be close but now i wonder, how would magnetism affect most cybernetics

[hushed jetty]

presumably they're not magnetic otherwise it would be Real inconvenient for a Lot of people

[keen summit]

i thought so too

afterall there are coatings that stop magnetism

people still underestimate maugas power in lore tho cuz lots kept saying that jq could probs beat him but nah, all she could maybe do is MAYBE get his guns away. but that too is a stretch cuz of how strong he is

[hushed jetty]

he tied with doomfist jq got nothing on him

[keen summit]

and that was without his guns and auto biceps

[hushed jetty]

the only other normal person who could maybe beat him is MAYBE sombra and that's only IF we assume she can hack cybernetics, which we dont even know if thats true

[keen summit]

Widow maybe too

1 shot in the head or 2 in the hearts

But depends on distance

[keen summit]

yknow, i adore the schematic things from overwatch like ana biotic

[golden oak]

Well guess what are junkers based on

I like to imagine this is what Ana wore when she was in junkertown so she “blends in”

She did have to wear some protective equipment for sure tho since the radiation sticks for a long time

[hushed jetty]

true, i lobe little things like that

what id like personally is a mauga xray bc i just KNOW its a fucking mess in there