lore-discussion

[worthy rose]

When Gency canon

Just make it canon

[grand wedge]

Stop shitposting please

[opal gull]

shes hot

[worthy rose]

[grand wedge]

!!loreonly

[twilit nacelle]

This channel is for serious discussion strictly related to the lore of Overwatch. Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[grand wedge]

!!shitposting

[twilit nacelle]

Shitposting will result in a loss of access.

[worthy rose]

Just mute him alr

[sonic rain]

moira is basically the worst person in the lore

[grand wedge]

she lack basis human emotions, yeah

compassion? empathy? nope, never heard of it

[keen summit]

well she has honestly understandable reasons, she sees herself as the only person who is willing to take actual steps in science

fuck morality she wants results, much like doom and most of the talon mems

[ember pendant]

Do we know all of junkrat and road hogs back story? All I know is they met in the military and they’ve stayed together since

[keen summit]

junk and hog didnt meet in military

hog got pissed that his home was taken away by omnic housing, so he and a group blew up the omnium.

[ember pendant]

???

[keen summit]

yeah thats the canon lore

[ember pendant]

Crazy

Tf was he doing in the military then

[keen summit]

lemme see if i can get it back up cuz they fucked the website

[keen summit]

it was a millitia, those arent official militaries but civilian made ones

cant find it

the new bios basically ruined their lore

here it is

sorry for ping

i despise the new bios man

[haughty kestrel]

The OW lore sucks

[keen summit]

first we had age, a whole backstory etc. i wanted to know more about jq in between the origin story and cinematic but we just saw how she killed omnics etc. i wanted to know more but well we only get exactly what we knew already

[keen summit]

whys that?

[haughty kestrel]

It's bad... bad writing, bad characters, lame story

[keen summit]

tell me some examples of those

before you say kiriko, i agree on that one

i dunno if its a hot take but imho kiriko is the worst written character

[haughty kestrel]

Mei

Sombra

Mercy

It's just not good

[keen summit]

whats bad about those?

[haughty kestrel]

Lame ass characters

[keen summit]

like mercy i kinda get and mei has big disconnect with her backstory

[keen summit]

do you know meis past?

[haughty kestrel]

Yes

Lame

[keen summit]

what are good backstories in your opinion then?

only gripe i have with mei is how quickly she got over it, it was like "all my friends just died and the world is going to shit, anyways"

[haughty kestrel]

Elden Ring has good lore... or The Witcher 3... or Lord of the Ring... or Cyberpunk 2077... or Stormlight Archieves...

Reinhardts backstory was cool

[keen summit]

in general you want more dark lore

[cursive turtle]

ow cant have that kind of lore because its not that kind of game

[keen summit]

overwatch tries to do a hopefull message with it but it still has fucked up stuff that happens

[haughty kestrel]

It totally can...

Look at LoL lore

[keen summit]

you do realise there was legit in overwatch the omnic crisis where humanity was close to extinction?

[cursive turtle]

that is a much much older game, and at first they definitely didnt have the deep lore they do now, ow has lore but just isnt as good at showing it as those games do and is no where near as established in its story yet

im sure they have been working on it all this time and will be ready for when the story mode comes out. blizzard is good at stories

[haughty kestrel]

Story mode will be as shit as OW2

Only good thing at OW2 is, that there are players

[cursive turtle]

idk man this chat is to talk about the lore not to complain about it so im just gonna stop

[keen summit]

i mean complaining is part of talking

[haughty kestrel]

"Lore discussion"

[keen summit]

• they for some reason took away the elaborate bios on site

[haughty kestrel]

This is a common thing in sci-fi though

[keen summit]

yes, those other stories you said also have common things

there is dark lore, they just dont focus on it.

[haughty kestrel]

Yeah, but it's about how you work with it. OW makes it into a shitty good guys vs bad guys show

[keen summit]

because overwatch mainly is about spreading a hopefull message

[cursive turtle]

im sure they want to revamp the backstories for people

[keen summit]

well its not like that tbf, the bad guys arent truly just evil. The bad guys are also grey and even the "good guys" are doing illigal stuff. Overwatch isnt allowed to exist so they are doing illigal stuff for a good cause. Talon too is doing bad stuff for what they see as a good cause

[keen summit]

which honestly is bad cuz that can legit just now change what was established before

they can just retcon it

[cursive turtle]

no im sure they will keep the main premise of their lore but change it a bit to add more

[keen summit]

with how kiriko was shown im not hopefull cuz genji was 35 and in her origin story they didnt seem to have 15 year age gap

[cursive turtle]

like each time a new character is introduced they bring a little bit more to the story for multiple people

[haughty kestrel]

People also say that Genshin has good lore, so i won't talk about this anymore because i will never change your mind just a little bit. 🤷‍♂️

[keen summit]

so kiriko logically should be 30 but her lines constantly talk about being young

[keen summit]

i mean you havent given proper arguments

only that you dont like its premise

[cursive turtle]

yeah she is definitely old enough to have moved out and be self sufficient so maybe mid 20s ?

[keen summit]

yet the ages dont add up so they retconned ages probs

[haughty kestrel]

Nah, it's just lazy writing trying to be something they can't reach. Also OW2 is more focused on money making anyway.

[cursive turtle]

or maybe, she actually is around 30 but the fox spirit keeps her young ? a possibility

[keen summit]

you do realise lore was part of overwatch since ow1 beta right?

thats what drew me in

doomfist for example being introduced in the first trailer and having a ton of build up and then bam there he was as a hero

[haughty kestrel]

Has nothing to do with anything.

[cursive turtle]

yup i just rewatched the original recall animation from 6 years ago, and you can actually see sojourn there, so they definitely have things planned far in advanced

[keen summit]

ik wee knew about her since then

we also knew about dr liao since ana

dr liao is the maker of echo

hammond was teased before doom even came

and also yanwra they put alot of time into lore

why?

they have comics, novels, cinematics and all new heroes get origin stories

also archives event

if that is lazy writing i dunno man

[cursive turtle]

thier animations are always so good

[keen summit]

compared to other games in the genre overwatch is far from lazy

compare it to valorant or apex

[keen summit]

cuz notice how these are all singleplayer pve games where its entire goal is having a good story? in games like apex its way shallower in fact it just uses an already made work from another franchise from same devs. Valo is also really basic and general and all characters arent deep at all. Even r6, one with more realistic backstories, has been going downhill.

[keen summit]

i really dislike the kiriko one

[worthy rose]

It’s not bad

There’s just better

Like Honor and Glory, and Dragons

[keen summit]

its really generic imho + just the dialouge, listen i respect vas as a starting one myself but idk her va just doesnt feel right

[worthy rose]

Oh well

[keen summit]

like her va sounds like an adult, her lines sound like teen yknow 16-18 or sum and she looks about 20. The donut line doesnt feel sum an adult would say. Asa almost randomly says "yknow i have a sword right?" like it felt out of place. She acts super young and sounds to old

even worse is that in lore she should be around 25-30 if we look at her origin story and compare the ages

[worthy rose]

Can we just appreciate Zero Hour’s soundtrack for a second

[keen summit]

its great yea

[worthy rose]

It has no right to be that good

Why hasn’t it been used in game?

[keen summit]

dragons also has really good

[worthy rose]

For POG or overtime

[worthy rose]

Yeah but Zero hour best ost

[keen summit]

overtime it would be seen as distracting probs

and they gotta make it loop

so if it would stay for too long it starts being repetitive

[worthy rose]

It’s possible

Actually yeah

True

But it would sick for pog

[keen summit]

there is a reason why most boss music is ridiculously long

cuz then you dont feel the loop as much

cuz it changes enough

its really tough to create music that doesnt start feeling repetitive on repeat

a good example of how it can work is alot of pokemon music or "under siege" from hyrule warriors

but in short i really dislike kirikos animation, it feels kinda like a riot animation with the words on screen n shit while also have imho the worst dialouge from all cinematics

[worthy rose]

Yeah the dialogue was off putting

[keen summit]

i also didnt like zero hour's dialouge tbh

[worthy rose]

It didn’t need dialogue

[keen summit]

but it had clever uses of callbacks and the emotional moments worked well enough + action was good.

[worthy rose]

[keen summit]

that winston was going to sacrifice himself said more

but compare all of kirikos lines to other lines and it just feels off

[worthy rose]

Genji tho

[keen summit]

for example in dragons you have lots of good lines

[worthy rose]

Hanzo x Orisa

Best ship

Hanrisa

[keen summit]

"you think you honor your brother by praying and incense?! Honor shows through your actions"

[cursive turtle]

That is the best one

[worthy rose]

“You dare to lecture me about honour?”

“You are not worthy to say his name!”

[keen summit]

or "it was my duty, and my burden. That does not mean i do not honor him."

vs "im going to kick every one of you, in the face"

[worthy rose]

Cute ngl

[cursive turtle]

im more interested in kirikos mom lore than hers xD

[keen summit]

i always loved the first line of hanzo cuz its just so well done
"you are not the first assasin send to kill me, and you will not be the last."

i cant take kiriko seriously with how she acts

[cursive turtle]

yeah its kinda like how I imagine genji used to be

[keen summit]

and also cuz her enemies are activly shown as incompetent it doesnt make her seem good

yknow the enemies blindly shooting etc

[worthy rose]

“Perhaps I am a fool to think there is still hope for you, but I do.”

Best line

Not up for debate

[keen summit]

still dont get why its not between cass and orisa cuz yknow CASS ASKED tORB FOR ROBO HORSE

kirikos lines are just i think maybe the worst in the series. Even jq had a few bangers with "ill show you the same mercy you gave my family 13 years ago"

[cursive turtle]

How did hanzo get in his current position? I thought he was supposed to be the leader of his clan but he doesn’t seem like he is anymore

[keen summit]

he left

[worthy rose]

He sacked them

[keen summit]

shimada was destroyed then and hashimoto took over

[worthy rose]

”wE aRe hAsHiMoTo sAn”

[cursive turtle]

I wonder if they were an actual family, or just like a crime organization under the shimada name

[keen summit]

they couldnt take over till shimada was weak

[cursive turtle]

i wonder if that means until Hanzo left , i cant really tell what the timeline is

[keen summit]

yes thats what it was though

[cursive turtle]

kirikos animation could have taken place just after he left

[keen summit]

when they had no heir

[keen summit]

no its later

its quite a bit too. Hanzo left long time ago. Just a bit after genji "died"

then hashimoto took over.

[cursive turtle]

I wonder how long

[keen summit]

the thing is..

timeline is messed up BECAUSE OF KIRIKO

[worthy rose]

kiriko is a pretty good character but bad lore. she kinda feels thrown together just so ppl buy the fortnite battlepass

[keen summit]

say she was 5 in her origin stroy training with them, then if she is say 20 now its 15 years. hashimoto took over recently that we do know. But this would mean that either hanzo killed genji about 10 years ago and then stayed with shimada? but he also left and hashimoto could take over.

its just

Not clear

[keen summit]

her character also isnt good cuz of it imho

shes supposed to be this baddass teen girl

[worthy rose]

we like fortnite we like fortnite

[keen summit]

but her va doesnt sound young

[worthy rose]

i mean like how she plays is good

[keen summit]

her lines arent badass

[keen summit]

ah the gameplay

but everything just... doesnt fit together as character

im supposed to think shes cool but shes only put up against weak goons. Her lines often just leave me going "just stop"

[grand wedge]

Not really - Kiriko was 7 when Hanzo father’s died

[keen summit]

we know nothing about hanzo's current state

[grand wedge]

In Asa’s letter (Kiriko mom) she says that the Hashimoto have ruled for 12 years

[keen summit]

only that he doesnt know what to do, much like how blizz dont know what to do

[keen summit]

ah forgor

bad at numbers

[grand wedge]

And in Kiriko Yokai short story, about 10 years…

[keen summit]

kiriko just says fuck time

[grand wedge]

And Hanzo was a mercenary after he left the clan

[grand wedge]

That she did

[keen summit]

i legit despise kiriko, i like her gameplay but the rest..

she feels the least believable of all characters, and thats with talking gorillas

she introduced SPIRITS to the mix and confirmed that they truly are spirits, fucks the timeline, personality is all over the place, her introduction is trying to force how cool she is but it just doesnt work cuz its against goons who cant fight and it feels like for her to be cool everyone around her needs to be dumbed down

look at Asa in kiriko short

"you believe in a animal dety" ASA YOU LEGIT IN YOUR LETTER WENT ABOUT HOPING THAT THE FOX DEITY WILL PROTECT SOMEONE

and she legit had a grandma with the fox spirit who could heal cuz of it

did Asa never talk to her mom and see her legit healing with magic?

and then her going "you grandmother is dead!" like okay? so?

[grand wedge]

Yeaaaah that’s part why I don’t like her lore that much- messy timeline and forget about the past lorz, high risk of retcon & spirits are real spirits

They had Kiriko dad making weapons for the Shimada… like, come on, he could have had some secret tech to build into weapons to get those « spirits » out, but he just make regular blades

And they could have use that to make cool stuff for the Hashimoto and such ?

[keen summit]

like i dislike one thing with mei and that is that she got over her trauma wayy too fast but kiriko seems like she doesnt care about naything yet we should still think shes cool

like kiriko acts like there is no real danger then why should we?

[grand wedge]

I didn’t like that she didn’t put the girl and old grandpa to safety first… like you teleported with them at the end!!

I get it’s for drama, but it contradicts her own words in Yokai >< where she cares about the people of Kanezaka

[keen summit]

she feels to cocky without really it being repremanded or it being justified

for example in honor and glory its reins arc that he was too cocky

and it then was shown that it was bad

kiriko acts kinda cocky, yet nothing bad happens

he gets shot? she just heals him instantly, not like itll take some time no he just gets healed

and BECAUSE theyre shown as being bad at fighting i cant take them seriously so i dont feel like shes strong

[past copper]

Hate to say I told you so, but I told you so

[keen summit]

in soldier 76 short we saw them not always being good but we saw them beating up omnics, also we have the context that hes a veteran + see how ruthless he is. Every other time its well done

im staying on this, kiriko is the single worst written character in overwatch, in lore and ingame

[past copper]

I already said the moment she was dropped that people would grow to hate Kitiko for being unrelatable to players

But the new devs have more or less put the lore of Overwatch on the back burner and just allowed leave it there while getting lazy with their efforts

I say spam Blizzard to give a retcon on Kiriko. Come up with a scientific or technological explanation to her “spirit fox” so she actually fits into the world, fix the mistakes you made with ignoring her mom’s letter and whatever else you screwed up with her character

And actually put a leash on how much freedom the devs have in making a character. It’s fine to make new characters and all, but not if they don’t properly fit into the universe

That’s basically what the game Multiverses did by adding Shaggy based on a stupid meme

[cursive turtle]

I think they are just using Kiriko as a plot point to introduce more mystical/ spiritual concepts

i think the same thing of Sigma, his lore, and voice lines are so interesting. It hints at how little the world knows about what is really happening in the universe

[grand wedge]

Sigma was created to fill the void left by Mauga because of his kit

[past copper]

For what conceivable reason? The plot was perfect the way it was! A hero universe where everything revolves around science & technology instead of using dead tropes like adding aliens, magical people, or other universes

It was unique and now the new devs are throwing that uniqueness away

[grand wedge]

But Sigma fits in universe

[cursive turtle]

I definitely think Sigma will have a story or plot that introduces some kind of alternate universe or something

[grand wedge]

I don't care if his powers kinda came from a scientific adccident. Tracer was the same, i like low sci-fi like this, i can get behind it, it's Overwatch

[past copper]

100% doubt it

[grand wedge]

but spirit world, let's go??? Nah, that's WoW, not OW?

[past copper]

The thing that people loved bout the heroes? They’re relatable

[cursive turtle]

the world is getting bigger with each new hero release so i think they are going to start adding in more of those concepts

[past copper]

Bastion has PTSD and doesn’t wanna be a weapon for destruction. Symmetra is autistic. Tracer was in an accident that completely changed her life. Genji has to live with having prosthetic body parts. Hanzo lives with the guilt of what he did to his brother.

[cursive turtle]

It reminds me of the show Heros in a way

[past copper]

My point is, how is Kiriko even remotely relatable to anyone?

[grand wedge]

To young adults playing the game & weebs?

[cursive turtle]

I don’t think all the heroes need to be relatable

[grand wedge]

it's clearly a move to attract new young players to the game tbh, the ones that came from Valorant & Fortnite & Apex

[past copper]

They are. They’re all relatable in some way. Big or small

[cursive turtle]

i think she stands for protecting the weak tho so maybe people can find that relatable

[past copper]

Oh yeah. Because it’s not like a hero in general doesn’t do that already

[grand wedge]

We already had the complicated mother/daughter relationship with Ana & Pharah - but they're older. Idk, I relate more to their relationship than the one with Asa/Kiriko

[past copper]

Remind me. What did Soldier do again in his Hero Short?

[cursive turtle]

💀 jeez i feel like im being attacked here for just saying something positive about her

[past copper]

Or what exactly was Orisa built for again? I forget lol

[cursive turtle]

Fine. Frick kiriko i hate her shes bad she’s dumb, delete her from the game, she ruined the entire world

[drowsy sierra]

Lol

[past copper]

Not saying delete her. Saying actually establish her character in the lore

That’s not too much to ask of the devs and you know it

Or the writers

[keen summit]

He knows the iris which defo is plot point

[cursive turtle]

No just delete her, shes dumb, she ruined the game, the story is broken, overwatch should just stop trying to make a story mode

idk what you want me to say here

[keen summit]

Point was herods felt humab

[past copper]

For one, stop trying to find a silver lining to a character who clearly had a decent concept in the beginning that got dragged through the mud during actual development

[keen summit]

To fight doomfist,

And build up doomfist

[past copper]

And to protect the city because it couldn’t protect itself

I’m just saying. Give people a scientific explanation behind her “spirit” or say it’s only in her imagination. Explanation behind her abilities too please. And fix her lore, bc that is clearly broken in a few places

[cursive turtle]

What is wrong with the sprits, why does it need to be science based

[drowsy sierra]

Because I love science!

[willow torrent]

can someone explain sigma please?

[past copper]

Because Overwatch is based on a scientific universe. Reaper, Soldier, Moira, Sigma, their powers come from science and technology

[cursive turtle]

Yea but it’s science that could never exist is reality

[keen summit]

Its explained in universe

[cursive turtle]

might as well be magic to us

[keen summit]

Hardlight is just hard light, but its clearly explained how it works

[cursive turtle]

the spirits can be explained im sure, its not too hard of a concept

[keen summit]

It needs projectors

[past copper]

The science they use could very well exist. Because we’re literally developing such science and tech today, but it could take years before we succeed at it

[drowsy sierra]

Is there science in hanzo’s ult?

[past copper]

Hence the Overwatch era being in 2070

[worthy rose]

Nah we'll never make a Reaper like being

Or Winston

He's too awesome for us

[cursive turtle]

Come on dont even try to start that. You know as well as i do that they are not things that could happen

[drowsy sierra]

No Winston

[worthy rose]

Yes

[drowsy sierra]

Back to my question

[worthy rose]

If Winston existed he'll be too dangerous and it's not even a joke

[past copper]

My more reasonable explanation. His tattoo in a perfected electronic tattoo that’s connected to his arrow, which allows him to create a holographic or hardlight dragon that drains his target’s energy on contact. Rendering them defenseless for the final blow

[drowsy sierra]

Genji

Now genji

[frail palm]

old ppl in 2070 remembering overwatch and realized none of the game became real

[cursive turtle]

That is just your head canon tho its not based on anything in the lore

[worthy rose]

Likely

[cursive turtle]

the sprits are fine I think

[drowsy sierra]

Only shimada can control dragon

Which means shimada is science

Right?

[worthy rose]

Yeah

[frail palm]

i like to think about it as the shimada spirit

[keen summit]

Now its a spirit

[drowsy sierra]

Yes

Spirit

[keen summit]

As its shown that spirits exist

[past copper]

Right.... Because people just wave around technology weapons everywhere in Japan. Sarcasm

[keen summit]

Theyve always been explained as a spirit

[past copper]

No they haven’t. It was confirmed long ago that they’re not magic. Which spirit falls under

[keen summit]

All other heroes arent defined by nationality

Japan..

[worthy rose]

Never has it been that way

Shimadas are lame

[past copper]

The Shimada either use technology weapons by choice or don’t. Hence how only two can probably use the dragons, which you don’t have to be smart to see Genji’s sword clearly creates a hologram. Or is that trigger for something else?

[keen summit]

Retconnes have happened now

[past copper]

And given their power in Japan before getting taken down, you honestly think the Shimada would allow other criminals use the same kinda tech?

[past copper]

Because of Kiriko. Back to square one of ruining the lore

[keen summit]

Yes they said magic IN GENERAP doesnt exist

But they define spirits not as magic for some reason

[keen summit]

Yep

[past copper]

And that makes sense how?

[worthy rose]

I think the dragons are just hardlight

[past copper]

Unless science actually acknowledges the existence of spirits in Overwatch, then it makes no sense

[keen summit]

Its never said either way, they always said spirit dragon

[keen summit]

Kiriko.

[worthy rose]

So its just like Dragon Ball chi in a way?

[keen summit]

We dunno, just ots a spirit dragon

[past copper]

No. I’d imagine in their case it’s like Demon Slayer breathing techniques. You the viewers see them, but outside, the flames and water don’t actually exist

[keen summit]

We thought oh its just hardlight but with kiriko its gonfirmed spirits exist

[worthy rose]

Oh

[worthy rose]

Wait the dragons do exist though since Hanzo and Genji can see them. So it's not really like Demon Slayer

[keen summit]

Very unclear still

[worthy rose]

We'll never get a concrete answer

Just like how the lore will never ever end in like decades lol

[past copper]

That’s because it’s clearly some kind of tech. Just no explanation. Honestly, if it were a tv series, we would clearly get one, but we won’t

[past copper]

Did you see a fox in her animated short or just the gates?

[worthy rose]

It's probrably not very relevant tbh

[keen summit]

In her origin story we did.

[worthy rose]

It's not gonna affect the story

[grand wedge]

We don't see the fox spirit. You see it in game because it's for gameplay. But people outside don't see it. It's like you're possessed by the spirit

[grand wedge]

because it's from her own perspective

Kiriko & her grandmother see it. The others do not

[past copper]

She strongly believes in the fox. Like how you believe in an imaginary friend

[keen summit]

Thats how her grandmother learned an ancient art of healing from it?

[past copper]

Every culture has an ancient art of healing. Look it up

[keen summit]

Yes? But this is showb to activly work

[past copper]

Hell, ancient times used leeches for medical practice. And guess what? They’re still used for that today

[grand wedge]

Healing with one paper to prevent a man with a gunshot wound…

[keen summit]

Yes but ahem healing talisman that appear from nowhere

[grand wedge]

It’s more than ancient art of healing

We have a technology that does that : nanobiotics

[keen summit]

Or ahem her teleport

[past copper]

Last I checked. Those talismans were paper in Kiriko’s origin short and from her perspective. What she actually uses isn’t paper at all

[keen summit]

But that doesnt just come outta npwhere

[keen summit]

Ahem animated short

[past copper]

Tracer, Sombra, Reaper, Moira. A lot of people have a teleport or similar ability

[grand wedge]

I saw someone theorised that it’s actually some kind of meditative state or hypnose and make believe to the enemy that she teleports when she doesn’t… but it doesn’t fit I think

[past copper]

Yea. Those weren’t paper now were they

[grand wedge]

Reaper and Moira are just fading cells into mist instead of teleport

[keen summit]

All those are explained in science kiriko isnt

[grand wedge]

It’s just shown differently in gameplay/lore

[hard pulsar]

🗿

[keen summit]

Sombra has an active device similair to tracer's chronal accelerator

Kiriko cab tp anywhere

[grand wedge]

Tracer just plays with her own timeline

[keen summit]

Exactly

[hard pulsar]

Who is the stongest in lore?

[past copper]

My point is. Teleportation isn’t unique in Overwatch. I’m sure there’s dozens of tech that can do it

[grand wedge]

But Kiriko just… goes in the spirit world and came out of it elsewhere

[hard pulsar]

[grand wedge]

They could have used some tech to explain it But they didn’t

[past copper]

Bc they’re getting lazy with explanations

[grand wedge]

Not that again, every day someone come and ask that question

Yup

[past copper]

You’re point? Bc that looks like holographic tech

[hard pulsar]

Idk what else to talk

[keen summit]

We know, i also wanted it to be science but it isnt

[hard pulsar]

I wanted to start a discusion

[past copper]

Bc paper ain’t gonna just disappear or sink into someone

[keen summit]

All healing is shown to come from this yellow liquid

[grand wedge]

We already are in a discussion ^^

[hard pulsar]

K

[keen summit]

She creates a projection without tech

Keep that in mind

All others create hard light or projections with a projectpr

[hard pulsar]

I hope the story mode will explain a lot more

[past copper]

Exactly. Which I’d like to say, it’s not like we know everything about medical science in Overwatch. That never really gets attention given the game is shooter based

[keen summit]

We know alot about it already

I mean look at moira and hog, they use a yellow liquid amd gassify it. Bap has whole explosives with yellow liquid, anas darts are filled with it

[grand wedge]

Hog is more gameplay tbh

[sullen canopy]

How can i show screenshots?

[grand wedge]

Bap & Moira stole the tech

[keen summit]

It isnt just gameplay, look in JUNKERTOWN

[past copper]

Look. Cards on the table, it is hard to believe that maybe. Just maybe. Kiriko uses modified tech like Sombra and Symmetra to create her hardlight and holographic projections?

[grand wedge]

People have to take some things to stop radiation poisoning

That’s probably what Hog takes

He would probably die without it

[keen summit]

That isnt it, we see on junkertown map a big vat of yellow loquid with his cans next to it

[past copper]

Because think about this. Where do you think Sombra’s screens come from when she uses them? More than likely her eyes since her computer is wired into her brain

[keen summit]

Thing is others can see them

[past copper]

Yeah. Bc it’s a projection from her eyes. Would like the devs to make it look creepy if her projections had light projecting from her eyes when using them?

That really would look creepy ngl

[keen summit]

Well my guy

Every time we saw her create em

Was from her hands

[past copper]

Her hands and more than likely her eyes. Who the hell knows how much she’s upgraded her body

[keen summit]

And symm creates from her prosthetic

[past copper]

Yes. But she also creates things that seem less like hardlight and more like solid objects. Her teleporter and turrets

[keen summit]

Yes

She has special skills with hardlight

[past copper]

I don’t know if you can make hardlight look like a solid object or not like a brick wall. But probably

[keen summit]

It still is hardlight

[past copper]

Regardless. There’s multiple heroes with a form of hardlight/holographic tech and Kiriko just can’t be counted as an exception

[keen summit]

she is though, all other heroes have projectors for it

thats the thing

[past copper]

We’ve never seen a “projector” for Baptiste’s window though. Have we?

[keen summit]

legit his thing that sets it up

once projected it stays

just like the buildings vishkar creates

[grand wedge]

He does, that little thing in his backpack

It projects the window

[keen summit]

exactly

all other heroes have projectors

thats the only rule we have for hardlight

it needs to first be projected, then it can stay until destroyed technically

[past copper]

This is the literal scene from his part in the comic

[grand wedge]

But in game : it’s projected

They probably didn’t tell her to draw it

[past copper]

I seem to recall that thing on his back is for scanning

[grand wedge]

When you try to put the window you hear it move

And you see it move too iirc

[dreamy epoch]

bap literally has
a projector for that reason

I'm gonna assume it's multipurpose and can also scan things considering he's a combat medic

[keen summit]

we dont see him put it down

but we legit can see the thing on his back placing it ingame. it would be odd if it was just there to scan randomly and it projects it with effect

• here its a action shot, it would look weird if you added another moment where he lets the backpack first put it down

[past copper]

Whatever the case, I stand by if so many heroes can use hardlight/holograms in some way, then Kiriko just can’t be an exception. But the writers or devs one just refuse to give a straight explanation. That’s on them

Not the first time they’ve done something like this, but still. It would be nice if they actually tried

[peak lodge]

on the topic of yellow healy liquid, is there a direct connection between moira and mercy? are they both using nanotech?

[rustic stone]

why do lucio and sym hate each other

[peak lodge]

isn't that because lucio advocates for the removal of the corpo that sym works for from his home country?

she believes the corpo with bring peace to their homeland, but lucio doesn't?

[keen summit]

They have given us a straight answer though.

[rustic stone]

Brazil

[keen summit]

Also vishkar stole lucio dad's tech

[keen summit]

No other hero can do it wothout some form of projector

Only kiriko can

We have an explanation: ancient ways of healing taught by the fox spirit

[quartz forge]

do the signs on ashes gun on the warlock skin mean anything?

[keen summit]

Probs just google it

[keen summit]

Almost all healers use the same tech

That yellow liquid

[peak lodge]

didn't mercy pioneer it? or did she just have the first use of ressurection?

[keen summit]

Res isnt canon

[peak lodge]

ah

[keen summit]

Dunno if she pioneerd it tbh

Probs created the staff

But we see others use it

[peak lodge]

well I know ana's biotic rifle is a bastardization of mercys nano technology, was wondering if moira was the same way

[keen summit]

Moira uses the liquid and turns it into gas, hog uses it and turns it into gas baptiste also uses gassified version for burst and a mix for his secondary fire. Ana has injection needles filled with it

Soldier also uses it

[keen summit]

Could be that mercy means the targeted healing part how ana instead of a beam uses jusf needles

And as evem hog has acces to it it moght not be as special

[peak lodge]

the old skin description of ana's merciful skin had a anecdote about ana making and using the rifle against zieglers wishes

[keen summit]

Wel yes

Cyz healing tech in a gun.

[peak lodge]

I assume what they're implying is that the damaging aspect is the problem

not the delivery system

[keen summit]

By shooting people

Well

[peak lodge]

mercy makes it very clear she's pro healing the wounded

[keen summit]

You are shooting an injection into someone wothout them wantkng

[rustic stone]

how does it hurt the enemy

[peak lodge]

mercy can also attach to anyone without consent

or so we can assume

[rustic stone]

anas rifle

[keen summit]

Yeah it might then be cuz in lore ana just switches between bullets herself

[peak lodge]

I would assume the darts are biocoded to heal allies and damage anyone not coded? @rustic stone

[keen summit]

So what if ana shoots someone with the toxic ones

[peak lodge]

because they're nanotech, which is programable in most media

[keen summit]

In lore she just switches

Cuz its two different liquids

[rustic stone]

hmm what about her nade

[keen summit]

Game mechanic

[rustic stone]

canon?

[peak lodge]

i guess in lore that makes sense being a sniper, but in game that wouldn't be feasible

[keen summit]

Her made in canon als she can choose

[peak lodge]

they would have to be dual coded syringes

[rustic stone]

ah so like 2 different nades

[keen summit]

Yeah

[peak lodge]

it also doesn't make sense for the nades as she can boost and damage a group of both allies and enemies at the same time

[keen summit]

Imagine having to load a different bullet everytime you wanted to heal or dmg

[peak lodge]

wierd inconsistency

[keen summit]

Its not canon

Thats why

[rustic stone]

what is sojourns lore

[peak lodge]

that makes sense from her shrike perspective

operating alone as an assassin

[keen summit]

Well yes

But in game

[peak lodge]

but swapping mags midgame would be atrocious lol

[rustic stone]

good thing we don’t have to

the whole overwatxh pvp is not canon

😭

[keen summit]

Yeah cuz we see her pull back the bolt, it fills there, she would change the liquid there

[keen summit]

Also not true, some things are some arent

[rustic stone]

Us fighting a 5v5 to move a payload isn’t canon

[keen summit]

Often its just to either lesser or greater extent in lore

[rustic stone]

that’s what i mean

[keen summit]

Yes but the gameplay of the heroes

[peak lodge]

the best way would be to make it a one round system only, and have her chamber every shot manually

and then choose the type

[keen summit]

All maps have a reason tho

[peak lodge]

that would be horrible for microing though

[keen summit]

It would feel clunky

[peak lodge]

assuming she's working with an established team, they probably should have just done nanite coding instead

it's logical with the tech level of overwatch

[keen summit]

But in lore she just swirches, but imagine having healing liquids and toxic liquids so close to eachother, mercy is against it cux what if it mixed? The person would ve in massive pain but also doesnt die

[peak lodge]

i presume the actual toxic solution is still mercys nanites just coded for damaging? or does the lore not specify?

because I wouldn't understand mercy being against it otherwise

unless it really is the syringe delivery that she's against, which would be interesting

[keen summit]

No specification, moira uses the same. Honestly its more likely ana got it from moira

[peak lodge]

it's more invasive yes, but about as consenting as mercy's staff

that would be neat

get the healing tech from mercy, toxic from moira

[keen summit]

Its shooting a glass projectile at high velocity at your team

[peak lodge]

i would assume not though based on ana's dialogue towards moira

right but is that explicitly stated anywhere?

we're both just assuming otherwise

[keen summit]

Moira's healing tech is apso closer to ana

[peak lodge]

risks need to be taken as a healer in battle

delivering medical syrum from a safe distance is ideal

mercy's form of healing is incredibly dangerous comparitivly

[keen summit]

But its not humane, its smaller doses of it too so the client gets hurt alot

The syringes still hurr

Hurt

Just cuz you get healed doesnt mean it doesnt hurt

Its still a high velocity projectile stabbing in

Mis that with incredibly inhumane toxin

[peak lodge]

i think i would tolerate syringes of healing fluid if they counterbalanced the 1 psycic damage with like 80 actual hitpoints of healing

[keen summit]

Healing doesnt take away pain though

[peak lodge]

like she's a top shelf sniper, I think she can consistently aim well in universe to avoid problematic stabbing areas

[keen summit]

Also hitpoints don exist

[keen summit]

Well yes

But it would still hirt

[peak lodge]

it was more of a reasoning system for pro vs con

[keen summit]

Shes the most painfull healer

[peak lodge]

needles don't hurt that much, the serum heals a lot

[keen summit]

Its not just a needle

Its a high velocity glass projectile

That glass shatters

[peak lodge]

no actually it doesn't

if you fire her rifle unscoped at a metal wall, the syringe stays intact

[keen summit]

And even if it doesnt it creates cracks in walls

[peak lodge]

i think it'll survive a fleshy human

[keen summit]

Those thing defo hurt

Like airsoft already hurts and its as fast as a bullet

[peak lodge]

you seem to be repeatedly ignoring the amount of healing they output compared to a needle insertion

[keen summit]

Yes

Thing is

the healing doesnt take away that pain

[peak lodge]

an airsoft pellet is a milimeter sized projectile intended to cause pain, so you realize you were hit

[keen summit]

It works

[peak lodge]

a needle is exceptionally thinner, penetrates and injects fluid and falls out

you might develop bruising, but again, we can assume the nanites immediately heal that pain, and bruising

[keen summit]

Thing is this isnt just a needle, at those speeds it would go further in with the base too

[keen summit]

Again healing doesnt take away initial pain

Ana is the most painfull healer cuz of it

She shoots a high velocity projectile into your body. It heals you sure but it also has smaller dose of it. So another comes in and another

[peak lodge]

i'm not denying that there isn't some pain when healing is applied, I'm saying that the amount of healing it does significantly outweighs the minor temporary pain

this is a little off topic anyway, we were initially discussing why mercy was against the rifle

[keen summit]

Yes thing is that that can be considered inhumane

[peak lodge]

whether it was the delivery system or the damage serum

[keen summit]

Ithink it is the delivery system

Imagine a person is gravely wounded and person comes up and jist shoots a painfull needle into them

[peak lodge]

thinking is cool and all, but this is supposed to be lore discussion and not lore extrapolation

[keen summit]

Its effective but painfull

[keen summit]

Thing is its never said outright

[peak lodge]

i imagine a dying person would be incredibly happy if they received an injection that saved their lives

[keen summit]

We can however logically assume

[peak lodge]

needles are the primary system for delivery medicine

and have been for centuries

[keen summit]

Yes but they would rather not have a projectile fly at them at bullet speeds

[peak lodge]

i imagine should wouldnt just point blank shoot someone on the ground

she would probably unload a round from a magazine

[keen summit]

But not at the speed of a bullet

[peak lodge]

and inject it manually

or use her biotic nade

I'll also have you know that air powered needle systems do exist

[keen summit]

Yes they do

I kno

[peak lodge]

where the needle is inserted the deliver fluid, and removed at incredibly high velocity

which i have experience first hand

[keen summit]

However

Inserted at high velocity

Is the thing

The speed of a bullet

Anything would hurt at those speeds

[peak lodge]

a soldier expecting it would not have as much of an issue

you have to give up some comforts for war to be fought

[keen summit]

Well yes

But most would still prefer something less painfull

[peak lodge]

i imagine it's also not very close to being supersonic

[keen summit]

Thats why it can be considered inhumane

[peak lodge]

considering you can see the speed of the projectile unscoped

[keen summit]

It is though, remembrr on. Scope its hitscan

[peak lodge]

that does not mean it is super sonic

subsonic ammunition exists

[keen summit]

We dont know which is the real speed and which is mechanic

[peak lodge]

and not all projectiles need that speed to be affective

[keen summit]

But im legit telling you why mercy pribs os against it here

Cuz its a painfull way of healing

[peak lodge]

yeah we're kinda assuming a lot here, I imagine miss ziegler would be more against using the biotic rifle to deliver toxins as well as healing

[keen summit]

Thing is shes never been against painfull stuff

[peak lodge]

like sure high speed syringes aren't ideal, but I think the doctor is more against killing than she is needles

[keen summit]

As in you have a tesla cannon wielder as close friend

[keen summit]

She carries a gun for a reason, shes never shown to be agajnst killing

[peak lodge]

it's obviously an assumption, but i imagine morrison forced her to carry a pistol for self defense when she joined overwatch

I highly doubt she carries it to hotswap and merc her enemies

not all guns are murdering tools

it's also a needed tool in the actual game

[grand wedge]

Mercy created the nanobiotics - Moira inspired from he work and it was used byt the army, when Mercy wanted to world and people to have access to it

[peak lodge]

is her pistol every visible in official media?

[peak lodge]

thank you, that's one question answered

[opal hound]

.

[keen summit]

https://overwatch.fandom.com/wiki/Biotic_rifle

[grand wedge]

what were the other questions?

[keen summit]

Found it

Mercy is against it cuz her healing was weaponized into the toxin

Turns out it is the same

[peak lodge]

the other question was if mercy was against the biotic rifle for the delivery system, or for the toxins

which was just answered

I figured it was likely the toxins

angela ziegler is a practicing doctor, she would understand the need for the delivery

since not everyone has state of the art prototype nanotechnology delivery systems

[keen summit]

Yeag i get that but if you have ahem long range heal beams

Its been a while for ana and mercy lore haha

[peak lodge]

mercys beam in game is rather short, and only extends upon ulting

[keen summit]

Moira ult

[peak lodge]

the rifle would likely have several hundred meters of range

moira is a whole nother casserole to dissect

[keen summit]

But also explains moira a whole lot better

The toxin is the reverse of healing then probs. So it destroys cells

Thats probs why reaper blamed mercy aswell

[peak lodge]

Yeah I assume the toxin is just the nanites reprogrammed to destroy tissue

[keen summit]

Its the opposite mpst likely, so cells getting destroyed, if you mix that with healing which is cells beibg fixed you have reaper

So moira mightve actually yknow reversed the healing

And while moira was in blackwatch... Yknowwwv

[peak lodge]

forgot she was blackwatch honestly

[keen summit]

Tjats why i thpught of moira

Would make sense thematically

[grand wedge]

hez does'nt tho

[keen summit]

Moira is the extreme results oriented part of science, inhumane but creates results. Would make sense for her to find a way to try and change the healing. We also in archoves didnt yet see her use it

One goves cells other takes them

[keen summit]

He once had a line bout it though. He doesnt blame her but its still part of it

[grand wedge]

Nah, it was the "you tell me doc" line that was interpreted back in 2016

obsolete now

[keen summit]

Fair

[peak lodge]

there's actually no mention of moira using nanobiotics anywhere in her wiki

[keen summit]

Also sadly keep in mind moira probs was more an afterthought

[peak lodge]

she's just a genetecist who performed cellular experiments

[keen summit]

Its the same liquid and the same hue of purple, also same effects

[peak lodge]

reaper is a result of constant regeneration and degeneration of cells

[keen summit]

I said that

[keen summit]

The destruction of cells and the regeneratong

[peak lodge]

yeah i'm just digging through her wiki and saw a mention of it

[grand wedge]

the wiki are not 100% accurate, since people can edit at will

but what is accurate is that in Moira Lab on Oasis, she has Dr Ziegler work, so she studied it

[keen summit]

Mercy and moira both are made to be parralels

[peak lodge]

yeah it refer's to her abilites as being biotic, so it's definitely in the same field as nanobiotics

[grand wedge]

(and nanobiotics are not nanobots btw)

[keen summit]

If you get something to create and fix cells, why not try to make it fo the opposite

[peak lodge]

might just be shortening

[keen summit]

It is yea as ahem biotic grenade

Also anti makes alot of sense

[grand wedge]

biotic is short for nanobiotics yes

[keen summit]

Cuz of it

If you have negative biotics, the purple stuff it would harm bit if it'd stay ot wpuld in theory also stop new cells

Moira was first in oasis, then overwatch and then blackwatch and lastly talon

Like maybe moira has switched orgs the mpst dayum

Actually the fact that yknow moira was first in overwatch proper doing her expiriments makes that theory of her putting the toxin into it more likely cuz she was tjrown put hor her, less than humane ideas. Imagine that with the biotic rifle but moira also made it able to do her thing and bam

[keen summit]

Honestly i just love these pics

Like Showing the process

[peak lodge]

yeah lore is what i crave from games like this

and LoL

[keen summit]

Well yeah

But i do engineering

[peak lodge]

but it tends to get beat down and reworked frequently

[keen summit]

I love the details of it

Like

I wish we got more of these

Cuz i completely forgot that it basically has mercy's staff in there

And the soldier healing station as a mag

Sadly moira didnt exist yet

Love when we get technical explanations on the inner working of stuff

[dense nebula]

Mercy try not to be a generic anti war pacifist medic challenge (Impossible)

[keen summit]

We didnt get many of those but for the biotic rifle, all of old orisa, torb turret amd some brig stuff ee got full explanations

[keen summit]

I mean she isnt anti war

She just made a tech that did miricales for healing

Amd then its turned upside down

Into cell destroying

[peak lodge]

yeah i can't really blame a swiss doctor pioneering medical technology for being pacifistic

do you think she should be pro war?

it just makes more work for her

[dense nebula]

Tbf, personality wise she’s one of the most bland heroes in Overwatch

[peak lodge]

she's a humanitarian, she wanted her tech to be public for easy access to medical assistance

[keen summit]

Thing is even if she wasbt like pacifist if you worked for sum your whole life and then another person takes that and turns it upside down

[peak lodge]

you say that like having clear morals is bad writing

not everyone needs to be edgy like reyes being a leader that turned psuedo-undead into the leader of the opposing org

[dense nebula]

It isn’t bad writing, it’s just boring

Someone like Baptiste is a good example of a good personality imo

[peak lodge]

I think you might just be oversaturated with unique characters

[keen summit]

Imagibe you work to create the best electric car, 0 waste eyc then another person uses your tech but instead makes it a better car with alot of waste but it does better

[dense nebula]

I think you did the analogy wrong

[peak lodge]

baptiste is interesting because of the dichotomy between himself and characters like mercy who are "boring"

[dense nebula]

Isn’t it supposed to be the antithesis and not a substitute

[peak lodge]

if everyone was an edgelord filled with inner turmoil it'd all be boring

[keen summit]

Mercy is konda bland ngl but by looking more into the tech she gets interesting for me

[keen summit]

There isnt really an anti car

[dense nebula]

So the car analogy doesn’t really work then

[keen summit]

So i went good for environment or bad for environment

The person wanted it to not create waste

Then another uses it to create alot of wasye

[dense nebula]

In Mercy’s case it’s does it heal someone or does it hurt someone

[peak lodge]

the issue imho is that mercy didn't get a ton of updates and character interactions when other characters were released

so most of her interacts are as a medic to teammembers

which is boring compared to say, dva talking to ashe about bob

[keen summit]

It heals but someone (likely moira) made it thst purple stuff which does the opposite

[peak lodge]

i feel like bland is an okay description, but moreso when comparing to the other characters

[keen summit]

Still better than kiriko

[peak lodge]

what sucks is it only seems like they fleshed out her past, and didn't give her aspirations for current era overwatch

so she doesn't say anything interesting about current day

other character often interact with events they were involved in, and mercy pretty much only talks to like jack

[keen summit]

I wish theyd actually go more indepth on the healing stuff

As ots relativly mainstream if hog has it too

[wary siren]

tbh

Mauge

[peak lodge]

agreed, very well written

[wary siren]

Mauga fr fr

[keen summit]

Honestly

I almost hope they dont try super hard to justify him beong psycho

Or just please have him well written after the mess that was kiriko

[iron plume]

Hog doesn't have the healing stuff (or at least not the same kind of healing stuff), he huffs his anti-rad medicine

[keen summit]

But in his shed he has that machine

[iron plume]

it's for the same condition, presumably

[keen summit]

I believe the medicine is the same stuff

[iron plume]

They wouldn't justify him being psycho because he's not psycho
He just does his job

[keen summit]

I meab would maje sense

[keen summit]

Well yes but hes killing while laughing about it

[iron plume]

yeah it's the same stuff and it's an anti-rad compound

[keen summit]

If we assume the healing stuff rebuilds cells would make sense

As then the mutated celks might get destroyed by the medicine in it and new cells are build

[drowsy sierra]

Science! I do love science!

[keen summit]

Mauga was said to enjoy the killing though

As he was shooting people he was laughing

[iron plume]

If you're talking about the WYLB scene he has a smile afterwards
Which is, well... not too stable of a behavior but it has more to do with getting Bap than the murder

he's definitely a dark humor kind of person but you don't have to be psycho for that

[keen summit]

I meannnn

The mauga and baptiste pic

Mauga is laughing while bapis serious

[iron plume]

By that measure Reinhardt is the same lol

[keen summit]

Fair point

[iron plume]

or at least was before Balderich's death

[keen summit]

But that was against omnics

This wasnt always against omnics i think

[iron plume]

Just represents the heat of the battle
like yeah he enjoys it but it's more about him feeling cocky and invincible

[keen summit]

Yeah maybe not psycho but probs a person who is anti bap basically

He probs also joined cuz of hardship

But found out he enjoyed the thrill, the heat of battle and kept fighting, laughing might even be a copong mechanism for him

As maybe he still feels bad but by focussing on the fun oart, the adrenaline the thrill he doesnt feel bad

My fav lore idea for him is making him paralel bap even more

Bap was about thinking he had no choice but he did. So what if mauga thought he jad a choice but he didnt?
Say now with the accident wrom bap story he doesnt have a choice bit to stay with talon otherwise he might die cuz hes on active life support

[inland sleet]

How strong is reinhardt in the lord

[keen summit]

Average honestly

For overwatch standards

Maybe above average but not much

Hes just strong man with big hammer and shield + thruster

But he lost to a or14, or15 predecessors, which is what orisa was build off and doom could defeat multiple

Raw strength hes up there but not close to doom, orisa amd winston

Still find it funny that in the strongest in lore one of them is a robot made by a kid

[tame ledge]

Everytime character writing gets discussed i think of Aaron Ehasz and his guidelines for making great characters
https://i.redd.it/igrntpxin4o61.jpg

[mint dew]

Why did they show junker queen before she was released like way before

[dense nebula]

They did that with Sojourn too

[mint dew]

Yet they release them like 4 years after

[grand wedge]

because she was just a NPC on a map - and the community were very vocal to have her as a character so...

[dense nebula]

Same with Doomfist

He wasn’t even supposed to exist

[grand wedge]

but Sojourn was already in development since 2014 so...

I like his existence in the lore (not so much in game)

[alpine pawn]

echo was revealed on the pve beta test no?

[gentle eagle]

i don't think so

[bitter kayak]

Efi is just built different

[keen summit]

Nahh she builds different

[dense cliff]

wasnt echo shown when ashe was released

in the cinematic

[fathom oxide]

Yes, she was in the egg thing

[peak escarp]

most heroes have appeared somewhere in the lore before being added to the game

the exceptions being Ashe, Baptiste and Sigma

and I guess Orisa, but she didn't exist yet in-universe

[fathom oxide]

Is Junker King gonna come back? I think he might return as a villian in the PVE or something

[peak escarp]

maybe in the future

[merry epoch]

moira is not wrong for what she did and mercy is just a lil bitch

[drifting viper]

What did moira do

[ivory garnet]

moira’s experiments had animals and some humans involved, its 50/50. its all based on morals

[ivory garnet]

when the quote “The sleeping dragon could rise again” was that Doomfist speaking to Hanzo? If so when was that

[vernal arrow]

i think its a ingame interaction

[merry epoch]

experimented on ppl and animals honestly as she shouldve

[dense nebula]

Hell she even experimented on herself

That’s dedication to your work

[alpine pawn]

isnt really a mercy matter moira stuff was seen as inmoral in general

[peak escarp]

Widowmaker

[alpine pawn]

i imagine he was offering hanzo to restore the shimada clan with talon help

[peak escarp]

he was

[wide crag]

What is Reapers lore?

[peak escarp]

he was a cop who joined the army, then enlisted in the Soldier Enhancement program and became the first leader of Overwatch during the crisis

after the crisis, he led Blackwatch, and gained wraith power through Moira's experiments

[sullen raptor]

Oh ure here, i wanna ask for confirmation

[peak escarp]

he was believed killed when the Overwatch Swiss HQ blew up, but Moira saved his life and turned him into Reaper

[sullen raptor]

Remember genji quote "master, u dont breathe" (to zen)

[peak escarp]

yes

[sullen raptor]

In overwatch alive,

[peak escarp]

omnics don't breathe

[sullen raptor]

Mondatta seems like taking a inhale tho

Before walking to podium

When he moving the shoulder

If u turn up volume

[alpine pawn]

it may just be behavioral like he tough about relaxing and his body did the gestures

[sullen raptor]

Oh ok

I mean with volume boosted..its not mechanical noise

Or maybe cuz mondatta special idk

[alpine pawn]

i personally feel that would be uneccesary to make omnics start having human things that are impossible, their sentient and have free will thats enough to give em humanity

[sullen raptor]

Fair point

Or could be his mechanic parts need air circulating hence making that noise

[alpine pawn]

oh yeah that would be a cool artistic form to depict it

but again zen confirms they dont breath

[sullen raptor]

O ok

[peak escarp]

they don't need to breathe

but they can still act like it to seem more human

[sullen raptor]

Ooh

So in alive clip, its just spontaneous act of like bracing for speech

Something like that?

[peak escarp]

probably

[wide crag]

Thanks

[split granite]

Hello gc

New reaper skin is super cool I like how it harkens back to his Hispanic descent

[errant ridge]

why is winston a monkey

is it because he likes banans?

if so why is sigma not monkey?

[worthy rose]

Good question

If he is a monkey why does he wear glasses

:0

[ivory garnet]

Harold Winston gave them to him when he set him off the earth I think

[fathom oxide]

Cause he’s a Sigma male instead

[worthy rose]

I really should watch the cinematics thanks

[ivory garnet]

watch recall cinematic and wrecking ball's origin story

[peak escarp]

apes can have bad eyesight too

[drifting viper]

Why

[west bramble]

What is that melody

[eternal hedge]

Real asf

[dense sundial]

WHAT IS THAT MELODY

WHAT IS THAT MELODY

WHAT IS THAT MELODY

[lapis jetty]

Silly goose

Was jetpack cat ever real

[peak escarp]

if by real you mean a plausible hero? no

[lapis jetty]

In terms of concepts

[peak escarp]

as a concept, yes

the idea of an animal piloting a machine got used for Hammond

there were also these ideas

[lapis jetty]

We need brigs cat to be jetpack cat

Honestly

[peak escarp]

this is the closest you'll get

[lapis jetty]

That we know of.

[dreamy epoch]

dang it

hammond took away my favourite hero (concept)

[bitter kayak]

brigs cat is so cute

[peak escarp]

her name is Mitzi

[bitter kayak]

awhh

[lapis jetty]

What type of cat

[peak escarp]

idk, they never said

but in some interview Chu said the white cat was named Mitzi

(and is probably also dead by now)

(or at least very old)

[lapis jetty]

She looks like a giant Maine Coon.

Considering when Brig carries Mitzi she is huge

Ig

[alpine pawn]

thats younger brig

[peak escarp]

they currently have an orange cat

whose name is unknown

[bitter kayak]

considering how huge the fucking cat is compared to brig in that one emote, probably persian or maine coon

[lapis jetty]

Makes sense.

[bitter kayak]

o

u said that lmfao

[lapis jetty]

They probably have two cats.

[bitter kayak]

why did i think that the baby was a cat too

[lapis jetty]

Because if they made an emote about Mitzi, it has to be alive.

[peak escarp]

they had the white cat when Brigitte was a child... she's 23 now, and cats typically live 12-18 years

[alpine pawn]

gency? ana and rein? nah i want a love like torb and ingrid xd

[peak escarp]

so I doubt the white cat is still alive

[peak escarp]

they made it about the white cat because of the picture from the origin story

[lapis jetty]

My grandmother has one that's lived 26 years. It's definitely possible for the cat to live longer than that, if it's healthy enough and well cared for.

[dreamy epoch]

hmm

[lapis jetty]

Which I am assuming Mitzi is.

[peak escarp]

it's possible

[dreamy epoch]

depending on how medical tech advances in the future

it is possible she's outlived the typical lifespan
but it did look like she was fully organic

and the only example we have of an animal with technical modifications is murphy

who probably just has supports and nothing else

[alpine pawn]

whats the company that makes the prostethics? i saw a add with a puppy with cyber paw

[lapis jetty]

Hammond too.

[peak escarp]

all I know is... Mitzi hasn't been seen in any of the present day lore, but the orange cat has

[dreamy epoch]

he's genetically modified but other than that I'm not sure if he has anything else

[peak escarp]

https://twitter.com/PlayOverwatch/status/968539031070851072

Overwatch (@PlayOverwatch)

“Last minute check! Everyone squared away?”

Likes

29438

Retweets

6221

Twitter · Feb 27, 2018, 5:31 PM

[dreamy epoch]

i just heard a Kiriko voiceline post-ult where she says "That's the power of the fox"

you know what

taiga might be right

this character is ATROCIOUS

[limpid agate]

Yeah.

[dreamy epoch]

why is there like literally nothing not generic about her

they don't even play into the street aspect of her at ALL

she doesn't have a mean streak
or actual issues
or actual responsibilities

she isn't even really mad at genji or hanzo

[peak escarp]

she doesn't have a personality

[limpid agate]

Sally Amaki doesnt do a good job of expressing any emotion at all

She sounds bored

Sally that is

Not Kiriko

[peak escarp]

she emotes less than Widowmaker

[limpid agate]

It feels like she was casted for the short

But then didnt want to do the game too

[dreamy epoch]

my favourite line is
"You Hashimoto..."

that line is like

90% through the entire short

[limpid agate]

I also didnt like the short. But its better than her in game self.

[dreamy epoch]

and it's like 2 seconds before it's ruined because comedic timing

[limpid agate]

And Yokai is a third version of the character absent in the other two

[peak escarp]

her Japanese lines are good

[limpid agate]

She's just a painfully inconsistent character

That's because Ai Fairouz is a good VA

[peak escarp]

no I mean Sally Amaki's Japanese lines

[limpid agate]

Oh

[dreamy epoch]

I actually dunno who did which ones specifically

[peak escarp]

I haven't heard her Japanese dub

[limpid agate]

Nah I dont think so

Sally's Japanese sounds about the same as mine

It sounds very JSL

[lapis jetty]

Wait

I just solved it

Brig is an ADULT in game.

Mitzi is an EMOTE for Brig.

Mystery solved

[peak escarp]

how does that solve it?

[lapis jetty]

She's an adult.

Mitzi is an emote for Brig in game and we see Brig holding and cuddling mitzi AS an adult.

[peak escarp]

the game isn't canon

so logically, emotes aren't canon either

[lapis jetty]

But we don't know that, do we? Emotes are actions, not interactions, so THEORETICALLY, it's possible (and more likely is) that it is indeed canon because actions can be performed at any moment of the day, AE laughing, sitting, etc.

[peak escarp]

it is theoretically possible that Mitzi is still alive

it's also possible that she is not

[lapis jetty]

True.

[lapis jetty]

So that can somewhat coincide with my argument.

[fathom oxide]

Ah Schrödingers cat

[dreamy epoch]

the irony of the game not being canon is so funny

[fathom oxide]

It makes sense tho why would talon work with Overwatch

[alpine pawn]

i mean a lot of competitives arent canon

for that of every match including killing importqqant chars with their friends and so

[fathom oxide]

Oh yeah respawning is definitely not canon lmao

[lapis jetty]

There could be an instance where null sector betrays Talon and they need to work together to fight the bigger threat.

In the OW2 story that is.

Not in game.

Of course.

[peak escarp]

the "downed" mechanic from PvE is more accurate to canon

[lapis jetty]

Wow

[peak escarp]

heroes become incapacitated until someone revives them, if they stay down too long they die permanently (and the mission fails)

[alpine pawn]

i dont think null sector can betray talon since talon already knows their extremist

[peak escarp]

more like Talon betrays Null Sector

since Doomfist is just using them to provoke a war

[alpine pawn]

yeah like i doubt null sector has ever pretended their not in a extermination campaign

[peak escarp]

if anyone is going to be a turncoat it's Maximilien

[alpine pawn]

what about widow, since you know shes conditioned }

[peak escarp]

she's conditioned, not brainwashed

she has free will

she kills because she enjoys it

she obeys Talon because they'll hurt her if she doesn't

but she is free to do what she wants outside of that - including visiting her husband's grave or buying her ancestral home

[dense nebula]

Which annoys me when people say that they should save Widowmaker

They don’t understand

She LOVES doing that stuff

[peak escarp]

okay, so they free her from Talon, then what?

she still enjoys killing

she still killed a lot of people