⚠Rework siren⚠

[cunning kindle]

Siren is so stupidly broken in any state even if nerfed because that freeze can melt your health bar instantly.
I was not allowed to play a whole match because of a Siren that targeted me on purpose and froze me over and over killing me instantly every single time with little to no cooldown on that ability.
I lost 13 points towards my next rank and ruined my whole playing experience just because some player wanted to be toxic?
It's actually insane that this can be done in game with literally nothing to stop it.

[boreal plume]

Take it as a compliment! They prolly focused you because you would have been a threat 🙂

[ember falcon]

The max cooldown they can get it to is 30 seconds, and max freeze time 6 seconds…

BUT, the Siren Torso ability doesn’t 100% work all the time…there’s been times it says the enemy is crippled, but not frozen and moving like a champ..

There’s a good chance, 1 of these things happened….

1. They deemed you the threat ( as above comment mentioned)

2. They know it trolls people, so they chose you to constantly do it to… because people read comments and sees what pisses people off and do it just for that reason…

[wispy ravine]

yeah but it's really unfun to fight. its happened to me, only twice though. worst experience ive had in this game.

[vague condor]

One of my mains is a siren... I use it well. I target those going for a base or those nasty artillery guys that don't know how to stop.. Stay out of the way, in cover is my recommendation. there is way more to complain about in this game than getting shot at with a freeze that has be to pretty accurate and sometimes fails..

nothing like stopping a flamer out of reach and finishing him off, or that dull grim who thinks he's a boss.

Got to have some counteracts to those bots.. or should we just put all mods out of the game, because of the whines?

[cunning kindle]

Well I've gotten frozen multiple times and instantly killed with armor shredding weapons that have killed me before i even got unfrozen... It's severely over powered

[rapid escarp]

can you not beat flamers and grim without siren? i just ask because i do regularly, and there is likely another reason it takes the strongest torso in the game to deal with the aforementioned threats for some :X

[vague condor]

@vague condorso is plenty of other things artillery, flamers, or whatever else, even grim has a tangle freeze.. plus blade, plus dash.. now what? rework siren to do what? less freeze? no damage on impact, slower time to engage, a timer on release? an more accurate hitpoint.. so well squall out some ideas, rather than be complaining, solutionalize with suggestions, and hope it works. I don't mind and not into dishing other players about complains, just come up with ideas than complaints. Make sense overall?

[rapid escarp]

I think you'll find that many ideas have been suggested in regards to siren, i don't think we are in a situation where people don't know how they would like to see it fixed

[edgy forge]

100% agree, siren chest is over powered. It should not be a freeze at all, instead it should be a "slow" Combined with fuel burn a slow is everything you need to stop an opponent from escaping.
One of the biggest issues with the siren is that it also provides a light weapon slot. So, it's one of the most powerful abilities in the game AND it is one of the only choices available for running 5 gun combos.
It has no business being lighter than the Phantom torso, or even having a weapon slot imo.
And don't get me started about the harpy.

[vague condor]

how about grims tangle or the artillery unvisability and speed, or the flamers torch, I don't like that I can't turn my guns with cylops when the torso is firing, or that theres such a delay in the jump press, or a hundred of other things I could whine, or jive about.. so do you want to pollute the boards with all your complaints.. instead of let them do their work, work out the bugs, clean up the code, then work on the more prevalent issues. So sick and tired of every more BS about more BS and people ranting and dissing other players.. its downright rude and impolite.. have some distinguishablity to talk to fellow gamers properly.. what may be 1 issue with one gamer, may not be with another.. yet like said.. there is much more pressing matters with bugs and so on, than this useless discord chat.

[somber phoenix]

Slow could be good, or just a shorter duration of a freeze. Like a quick 1 second completely stop you dead so you have to start from 0 acceleration

[somber phoenix]

Grim is a titan, a bit of a different scenario

[somber phoenix]

Balance is also definitely an issue. Half of the weapons in the game are virtually useless, particularly the shotguns and flak cannons, literally nobody even uses those new rockets they added with cyclops. The only reason I’m even using flamers is because I’m running fenrir and its the only weapon that can even heal it

[rapid escarp]

nothing to do with siren, but punisher, pulsar, trident, shocktrain, shredder, quantum, thunder all work well with fenrir too (apparently trebuchet is also good with fen, but i dont really use treb)

[somber phoenix]

None of those can heal the damage it does to itself.

[rapid escarp]

well they can, and do, this statement is more true the less health you play at, as it does a % of current health, so if you have a part with 1 health, it takes no damage, and any damage you do still heals you

all may not be able to keep you at 100%, and its harder to do this the larger the health pool on the parts you chose to use, but it is a 50% dmg buff, and around the same speed buff... and the healing keeps you in the upper %s of health, and is able to equalize lower health parts so its hard to 1 tap you... bots that have trouble getting back to 100% (assuming this is at all the goal, and not the throughput) could just pair it with marcus

[heady bay]

Stop trying to downplay the strength of siren’s ability. You can lie to yourself, but everyone else sees the issue very clearly. Sure, it’s not fun to see the feedback section flooded with complaints about one or two items, but that’s what happens when you have overpowered items in a PvP game.

[vague condor]

bleh.. I highly doubt that I would be downplaying it, but how about upscaling that there is alot of other issues, like bugs than harping on the devs about some overpower weps.. I rather see the work done on the base code and see it refined.. than gotta turn all the weps down the specs each time another complaint goes through.. enough already. Say what you may, but just cause you say "everyone" doesn't count everyone.. especially those that really care, because at the end of the day, it doesn't fix the cause to keep on BS to BS one more about another grip.. cause it doesn't go your way.. whichever. Sit back and chill, but don't stand still. its not like they don't have a developer's white board with all the suggestions and hints eh.. so what's the continuous ramble and ramble.. so bored here, bye. BTW. very rarely I get freezed, I wonder why? Maybe you don't aim right, maybe not. idk.. still doesn't matter to me, I have so many other things to think about than spending valuable day listening to grips.. Speak of something worthy.. which is for everyone. "including myself" ☮️ ✅

[rapid escarp]

I mean siren is arguably the single strongest isolated thing in the game, and offers among the least counterplay options

[heady bay]

“Maybe you don’t aim right”

What are you rambling about? We’re talking about the siren having an instant kill ability and how it’s unfair to play against. We’re not talking about me being bad at using it. Lmao

[edgy forge]

The grims trap is also FAR weaker than the siren, and that's a great example of just how overpowered the siren is.
The grim doesn't "completely" shut down movement, or shut down abilities, and it's on a titan.
The siren "completely" shuts down movement, and abilities - an ability greater than what's on titans. AND it has a extra gun slot, on a chest that weighs less than the Phantom. That siren torso is a problem.

[edgy forge]

Then you should go find a post talking about the base code, not join a post about the siren chest to try and downplay how overpowered it is.

[vague condor]

yup, here I will show you how to do this.. I really enjoy trapping people with the freeze.. its a good way to shut people down.. and I agree, there's is ways to counteract it.. and I gave plenty of suggestions which probably where mostly already mentioned here.. So did we cover all the points, or is the complaint post for constant repeats about the same thing.. Oh.. I agree, I see, and lets work out a solution. Easy said, now let the dev's do their work.. Ever wonder why devs or those creators that work for the devs, you could say. Get overloaded or just don't care afterwards.. follow the bunny, too much rant and those that may genuinely care about listening to the players, spend so much time reading and such like and get so tied up with the rants etc.. So whoa, how about chill and hey, do your homework, and search the post and that area has already been covered, why waste the space.. Thumbs it up. Do you think putting your "name" to the extra line in the post will make that much of a difference to regurgitating the same content over and over again, LOL.. gets kinda pathetic.. its a wimpy cry afterwards.. another nickel in the dispensing machine. Have a good game ya'll, don't ruin the fun for others.. and Please remember the dev's could have a sense of intellect to collect information and put it a proper resource.. so how about instead of all this knowledge, have wisdom and get understanding. Ciao!

What we really need right now to chill everyones little booties and pewpews. A couple new maps! Might calm down all these anxieties people are having in tight frozen spaces, LOL

From a dev's point of view.. why create anymore content, when theres no real appreciation, very obvious here. Just to have people never shut up about the same topic which has been "obviously covered" here. As the expression goes "We've heard you" goes the toddler's pit and fits. Rampage bros an gals, Rampage, lo/ !

[cosmic herald]

Siren shield damage could be lowered, but the game having cc isn't a bad thing

[cunning kindle]

Honestly shield damage should be taken away completely so that it would not instantly burst down an enemy, it would make it less toxic and more fair if it rewarded bursting down already damaged enemies.

[cosmic herald]

Something they can try, makes more sense the cold makes the enemy brittle and easier to damage

Maybe does more armor damage instead?

[knotty hollow]

@ember falcon wrong. My siren has a 23 second cooldown (technically if you count the time the enemy is frozen that drops to 17 seconds) you can basically rely on it in every fight

[hazy night]

The issue with siren is that even if it had like 90 second cooldown if you play properly you can guarantee a kill
so if you have 2 players one of them runs 5x siren and the other one doesnt the one running 5x siren will win every 1v1 encounter

the same goes for Grims trap if played properly guarantees a kill and the enemies can not do anything about it

luckily most people havent figgured out how uterly broken cround controll is in thie game yet and i a free to abuse it as much as i want to

[brittle nymph]

Happens to all of us. I was tagged team but 2 guys that kept freezing me. Frustrating but just have to keep fighting.

[vague condor]

I know how to counter act the invisible, haha, if you have any sight issues, its a done deal.

[vague condor]

Here's a cleaned-up version of your sentence:

"How utterly broken ground control is in this game and I'm free to abuse it as much as I want to."

[shrewd dew]

you can turn your guns when cyclops is firing, always have been able to. the cyclops will turn slowly to where your crosshairs are pointing, you can even fire behind you while cyclops is going in opposite direction

[sterile orchid]

There should be a cooldown for after you’re frozen

Because getting frozen 3 times one right after the other is complete garbage. I would know because it’s happened to me multiple times

[shrewd dew]

Siren doesn't have an instant kill, and against some bots, doesn't deplete a full shield. Now, according to the tooltip, it deals about 5k dmg at lvl 1, that shouldn't be enough to break anyone's shield, but it often does, again, depends on the bot. I normally have a small sliver of purple remaining on most of mine if I get hit by it. Now, if I have a bot with emergency shield, I pop that as soon as I'm frozen. Against Orkans, I walk away with zero armor damage. Against leveled Gozers and Punishers, I'll have about half health on a specific part. I could also drop Energy wall and take zero damage. Now, if you rush into a group of enemies and get frozen, you totally deserve to last 2 seconds and lose a bot.

[vague condor]

theres a guy that makes sense!

[heady bay]

"Siren doesn't have an instant kill"
Yeah, nah. I'm not arguing about this anymore. Y'all enjoy your toxic meta.