What makes an ability fun/unfun to use/play against?

[serene viper]

Not only is archer just walking simulator

It’s also disgustingly overpowered

You can hit anyone anywhere

That’s a little crazy

[deep tartan]

That part I can agree with, but what makes archer a walking simulator

[serene viper]

That’s all it can do

Walk away

[deep tartan]

It can eviscerate you in 2 seconds

That doesn't sound like walking

[serene viper]

Which I mentioned in the disgustingly powered part

It shoots you and kills you in seconds and also just walks

It doesn’t do shit

[deep tartan]

Also let's be real here, you cannot reasonably hit anyone anywhere

[serene viper]

It’s really in depth but also bland as hell

[deep tartan]

Because number 1: map obstacles and number 2: projectile travel speed and falloff

[serene viper]

Yet you physically can

[deep tartan]

logically, you won't be able to always pull off map-wide snipes

[deep tartan]

Also, if you think you are so smart, then how about you give me an idea for a new and remade from scratch 3rd path archer

[serene viper]

I never said I was smart

Where the hell did you get that from

Also no because I hate archer and I’m not wasting time thinking of concepts for it

[deep tartan]

You talk like someone who really dislikes archer and knows how to fix it, so how about you try to help me

[serene viper]

That’s for you Mr dm me for archer concepts

[deep tartan]

If you hate archer, then try to fix it

[serene viper]

Well I already did

Over here

[deep tartan]

That's literally damage falloff, something I mentioned multiple times before

[serene viper]

Ok

And

You asked me for a fix

Here you go

It’ll make archer more strategy based instead of walk backwards and win every fight

[deep tartan]

You already have to predict enemy movement but whatever

[serene viper]

That was just

Bottom of the barrel dude

The glaze isn’t even crazy now it’s just demented

It has dementia

You know who else has to predict enemy movement?

Default

And every other ability

Ever

[deep tartan]

it's not glaze if it's correct

[serene viper]

All of them

Ok

I get it

Oh alright

You got me

You got me to laugh

You win

You’re a little jokester aren’t you

Well ya got me

[deep tartan]

???????

[serene viper]

😔 ya win

[deep tartan]

I main archer what

[serene viper]

Ya got me

SO IT IS BIAS

HA

My scheme worked

You’ve been tricked

[deep tartan]

???????

[serene viper]

Step one confuse the enemy

[deep tartan]

I've said that I main archer multiple times before

What is your point

[serene viper]

Step two make fun of them for maining archer

Lmao archer main

[deep tartan]

Don't you like main return?

[serene viper]

No

I don’t main anything

[deep tartan]

Hold on one sec

[serene viper]

I play whatever I feel like lol

Oh god, he’s bringing up the lore

The horrors

The loreorrs if you will

[echo frigate]

Do you never just not talk lol

[deep tartan]

@serene viper then what this

[serene viper]

I die if I don’t yap every ten minutes

[serene viper]

You see it’s called me not thinking about what I say like ever

[deep tartan]

Nice try.

[serene viper]

I was definitely wrong about maining return

[deep tartan]

You disgust me

[echo frigate]

Makes since

[serene viper]

It’s fun, but not a main

MAKES SINCE

MAKES SINCE

T_T

[deep tartan]

You make fun of me for maining archer while maining return

Shame on you

[serene viper]

I’m just a vile little puddle of slop ohhhgggjhh I’m sowwy

🥺

But yeah I do agree return is not very

Skill

At all really

Which is how I know which ones don’t take any

Cough berserker cough alchemist

Cough arccherrrr

[deep tartan]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1348857935761248277/1387796059597701190/speechmemified_pasteimage.gif

[serene viper]

Oh you jokester youuu

Smiles warmly

Shit I think I’m haunted

[stone cove]

why does soap always choose me

and why does its targetting allow it to fly

horrible ability to play with in the same server

[serene viper]

Soap is possibly the bane of my very existence

Other than the crippling self hatred

But mostly soap

Yeah

[gloomy bridge]

Honestly, Archer doesn't take skill and it's not fun to fight nor use

[deep tartan]

I find it fun to use because it heavily alters your kit

What I DON'T like is how neglected it is in terms of balancing

[gloomy bridge]

Just nerf it until it becomes melee

[deep tartan]

Once again, how would THAT work

[gloomy bridge]

Defender Mastery Archer Changes -
-# Arrows [M1]: Damage Fall Off: -3.33% DMG every stud (Minimum: 5DMG)
-# Arrows [M1]: Knockback force: 45 > 25 ^ (Does not knockback after a distance of 5 studs traveled)

[deep tartan]

Arrows normally have 0 kb force though

Unless you pick crossbow

But you mostly pick it for the military grade paper shredder damage per shot

[gloomy bridge]

That's why I'm giving them kb

[deep tartan]

I feel like that'll just

Be annoying as fuck

[gloomy bridge]

Nah erm

Its melee now

It deals less DMG from a far

[deep tartan]

Remember, archer used to have kb, even if you limit it's range to only 5 studs, you remember what I did during the hitstun era, correct?

[gloomy bridge]

Erm

Erm

Ermmm mm

[deep tartan]

Now imagine that but instead of being unable to hit archer you are unable to approach them

[gloomy bridge]

At least ur not spamming me from a far anymore

[deep tartan]

Good one.

[deep tartan]

Erm I still can

Even then, my playstyle is usually staying at mid

[gloomy bridge]

5DMG bro

[deep tartan]

And people will approach you anyway

[deep tartan]

It won't always be that far away

Usually my playstyle is staying at mid, and ONLY using terrain when I know a person is targetting me

[gloomy bridge]

Yeaaahhhh

[gloomy bridge]

No it's staying at Shack

[deep tartan]

"b-but 5 damage" DAMAGE IS DAMAGE

[gloomy bridge]

Ermmm

[deep tartan]

I will NOT tolerate you giving archer a way to zone even better via kb

[gloomy bridge]

Errrmrmrmrmrmrm

[deep tartan]

Do better.

[gloomy bridge]

I'll give it lower KB

[deep tartan]

Archer with kb will always find a way to be annoying

[gloomy bridge]

Æ

[deep tartan]

I'd just add damage falloff that isn't as harsh

To encourage people to get closer instead of becoming a sniper for hire

But not straight up melee range

I feel like making archer melee just makes it feel more bland

Your biggest weakness is you not having a way to keep people away, in return your biggest strength is having consistent ranged dps (currently a bit too high though)

[gloomy bridge]

Mhm nah

Atp just remove Archer

Three defender classes sound fun

Replace it w Piercer, having it pierce the er dealing less DMG and being melee

[deep tartan]

Then we have no choice but to throw hands

[dense willow]

any ability with slightly more speed is so annoying to fight

which is a good chunk of em

[frigid rune]

any ability with a significant jump height boost will be annoying

rabbit, buff mushroom and buff tree, buff ability and being buff in general, slime, alchemist jump boost, stardust, and probably more

out of all of these i believe slime is the only non annoying one

because its jump boost is limited and uncontrolled

[dim saddle]

Mushroom and tree ones aren't too bad.

Probably because their abilities aren't as effective in the air

[frigid rune]

well mushroom is manageable but buff tree is hellish

fruits for near infinite healing with high damage, health, and jump height

as well as a get out of jail free card with the tree summon

[dim saddle]

Most trees I go against are kinda bad