Looking back the game has made a lot of stupid nerfs. (Removed vamp)

[lyric torrent]

This will be going over several updates back to even current if needed
I made this suggestion out of seeing someone else’s fail do to low effort
Hope you like reading
Im not making it fancy

Abilities that are useless, or still useable but over nerfed
jello
Its damage is so horrendous, it can hardly do half the persons heath if they slowly walk out
Im not asking for the old jello but who’s dying to jello anymore without a damage orb
Along side that the best way to get a kill with it is camping the void

slime
Why slime what was so wrong with slime it was funny to use and it hardly can be called a slow now might as well not be a thing anymore
Who even uses slime anyway what brought attention towards this

lemon
Did you nerf this because people hated it
Because theres so many abilities that are just about as annoying to deal with
How did it go from at least a few lemons to it being a mythical fruit to find
The iframes was all that had to go whats with everything else who cares if the people complain it’s just unjust crying

army and mastery
Its such a waste of time to get that mastery the troops can’t even jump
The old target was annoying, just make it so it stays near the user like a aoe and make it wear off after
At least 15 seconds to 10 seconds
Its so useless compared to what the hell you made the required amount of kills
specially now are you heartless who wants to get that many kills for a garbage mastery

bomb mastery
For context E skill
Bomb is still something good
But nerfing something like bomb would have been fine, if thats what you saw as unbalanced, but you have made way worse things
Bomb was over nerfed

I need space

If you have additional nerfs add because I can’t comprehend the amount of nerfs they have done to ability’s, that didnt need the nerfs

This will continue the suggestion because the list wont stop
Justice for the abilities that were demolished

bind
Over all the ammo was all that needed nerfed the damage nerf was to much of a nerf I hardly see bind users and when I do it’s extremely weak
Give it a damage buff keep the ammo the same
Nerfing the ammo is the same as nerfing its max damage already

hoj
The bow nerf was unnecessary.
This could be me but personally unlimited blade works sucks
All it takes is simple movement and it’s extremely hard to land the swords off
The swords are slow and even if I aim perfectly at them they hardly hit because of the spread

[drowsy surge]

A cool time additional nuff that prevents bomb E from detonating for a while when used.

[lyric torrent]

Adding that to what else did they butcher on it

Because I haven’t seen a bomb mas for so long

[drowsy surge]

There are no more users who use bombs on the Ability Awards server.

[drowsy surge]

The E skill, which was the most important skill for bombs, became the most bad skill.

[lyric torrent]

Im telling you they nerf random things to fill the update log😭

Alright if anyone has more nerfs to add to the list I will continue to add ill add them when I see the messages

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[low horizon]

lemon and malice nerfs are good

and army

vampire def needs a buff tho

[lyric torrent]

You got any nerfs you want to mention on the list
It’s annoying to see the most random stuff get nerfed I want the devs to at least see this

[ember elbow]

Vampire actually got bugged then nerfed

Cause they buffed it too much

[low horizon]

bind tbh

used to be actually fun

[lyric torrent]

What did they do to it because I quit so long ago do to bad choices

[low horizon]

they halved the ammo of the ball throw, and nerfed the damage to the ground

some aoe stuff too

[lyric torrent]

The ammo seems fair I remember getting gunned down by bind but the damage is kinda crazy

The damage was fine

[lyric torrent]

Added thanks for the addition

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[eager bloom]

Malice is STILL good after all the nerfs

it absolutely fucking deserved what came to it

as soon as an undodgeable projectile reaches 30DMG

suddenly its meta

[eager bloom]

yes undodgeable combo moves still count

theres a reason why they did what they did to Malice

Lemon ALSO deserved the nerf

with something as shitty designed as lemon

its GOOD that its not common to see

Army is still good, back then Army was HORRIBLE to see, and frankly was probably one of the worst designed abilities

Vamp is still good.

Bomb Mastery's nerf was more than justified

Bomb Mastery is still quite strong, its now not piss easy to use

also Bind deserved the nerf

its still good nowadays

and deals great damage

i barely even noticed the nerf

[odd hornet]

Jello nerfs was needed

Army needs a whole rework

Malice is fine

[void crypt]

Engineer was messed up in the nerf though to be fair half of it was due to bugs

[bleak fog]

Dos 300 has been nerfed countless times for no reason

[lyric torrent]

Like I said unjust crying the iframes was the only bad thing the hell did everything else on it do

[lyric torrent]

And malice is good but are you dense theres way more op stuff that auto hits basically malice is a corps of what it was

[lyric torrent]

And do you just say nerf to anything that slams you
Because its buns now
I swear any suggestion I see you in you are the one delusional guy

[lyric torrent]

And wdym needed its not even a ability anymore with how little damage it does

[odd hornet]

Jello had too much damage rn it encourages blocking the person from escaping instead of a cheesy 60 damage attack

[lyric torrent]

And destroying it is the solution just rase the damage so it can get a kill

The cooldown is way to long for the baby damage it deals

[lyric torrent]

Also most spots you can use jello in good makes you need to camp good spots

This suggestion is a thing because meta crushes almost any lower ability, who wants to use the same stuff as everyone else

[outer granite]

jello is wayy too op

very runner based

[lyric torrent]

Im not going to go on a entire debate with you
But what makes you think its fine now
A nerf shouldn’t kill a ability do you even recognize how trash it is now

[outer granite]

so ur telling me we should bring back old jello?

do you even know how annoying it was to go up against it?

[lyric torrent]

Who said that

Do you only think of two things op or trash

Just buff the damage not revert the nerf

[outer granite]

jello should not be this op yk

press e kill player

if player escape press q to run away

[lyric torrent]

And it shouldn’t do a sliver of hp with how long of a cd it has

[lyric torrent]

Also do you even read I just said not to revert the nerf but to buff it

Talk about over reacting treating jello like its a nuke being dropped

[outer granite]

jello is ok the way it is

[lyric torrent]

Have you even seen its damage

[outer granite]

its old dmg was too unbalanced

[lyric torrent]

This again who said old damage lol

[outer granite]

and all it did was promote run inside e as a safe zone

then press q and run away

the dmg should stay the way it is

it should not do half ur hp in 5-3s

[lyric torrent]

You release a lot of abilities have this issue get this one sided mind set out of here and use your brain plenty of things counter others

[lyric torrent]

Are you rage baiting again who said give it the old damage

[outer granite]

i should not have to switch to an ability to counter a jello user

i should not be required to switch to an ability

to be able to play the game

[lyric torrent]

Then don’t deal with them how do you think camping works

[outer granite]

do you realize how unfun it was to deal with a jello user?

[lyric torrent]

Do you realize you’re bias to the ability you dislike it and want it to be trash

[outer granite]

do you go dont deal with the dos when its killing you every 3 seconds?

[outer granite]

want reasons on why i dislike it?

it promotes a lazy unskilled playstyle

it did wayy too much dmg

keeping jellos dmg the way it is right now is better

[lyric torrent]

Not everyone camps lol and again what do you not comprehend no one said old damage

[lyric torrent]

Definitely not it does basically no damage

[outer granite]

it still promotes a lazy unskilled playstyle

[lyric torrent]

Alright clearly logic is out of this go ahead explaining don’t work

[outer granite]

u just want ur old 20 dps tool back huh?

[lyric torrent]

This is like talking to ai
Who said old damage

Let me spell it out
The old damage was bs
The new damage is buns
So give it damage thats fair🤯

[outer granite]

the only way i will agree with jello doing dmg again is if it did 20-30 dmg

[lyric torrent]

Now you see this is basically what ive been saying

You need to loosen that logic

[outer granite]

idc how buns jello is it needs to stop promoting a lazy playstyle

[lyric torrent]

Omg here we go again
Look if its a reason that doesn’t have anything to back up on it its just a unjust nerf
Lazy can apply to many abilitys blame the person not the game

[lyric torrent]

This right here is why nerfs can’t be fair
Because you just hate its existence

[lyric torrent]

This is like if I saw a annoying guy with a ability and I wanted it to become unusable because of him
This is your logic

[lyric torrent]

And here you have me having a debate

[outer granite]

u think i seen only one idiot?

i seen multiple

[lyric torrent]

Bro you don’t have any reasonable complaints

[lyric torrent]

You feed into the behavior

Why follow them

[outer granite]

i guess the ability doing shit ton of dmg is not a complaint

[lyric torrent]

Do you have a set dialogue
Again who said old damage😭

Who let chat gbt cook up a argument

[outer granite]

do you seriously want jello to get that press e to hide and q to run playstyle be more effective?

[lyric torrent]

No I want everyone to have the choice to use anything they want

[outer granite]

litterally 10% of ppl who use jello dont use this in this exact way

[lyric torrent]

Meta is the only good powers

If it does so little damage to were you have to stop using it theres a issue

Your opinion is fed out of bias rage to a single play style trust me games will always have a annoying play style don’t ruin the game for others use your brain and deal with it

[outer granite]

u just want to promote this annoying playstyle eh mate?

jello should stay where it is

[lyric torrent]

I don’t promote anything mate I just want a fair game

[outer granite]

it had it coming to it

[outer granite]

OH YES TAKING HALF UR HP BECAUSE SOMEONE PRESSED E IS VERY FAIR

[lyric torrent]

Good lord are you a brink

[lyric torrent]

Who said old damage just buff it a little

[outer granite]

jello only doing 30 dmg is the only way it will actually be fair to go up again

[lyric torrent]

Do you see red and can’t read or something

[lyric torrent]

30 in total

Because you can walk out

Ok lets have a proper conversation

[lyric torrent]

Jello was op
But even now walking out of it you take little to no damage

Am I right

So how can you go about making it so people cant treat it like a swimming pool and walk out fine
You should have the rush to need to get out

But not come out basically dead

[lyric torrent]

Now you walk away
Come on logic is a thing

Guess I was talking to chat gbt and blew the fuse with a question

[outer granite]

i guess u fucking looove jello users being annoying

[lyric torrent]

Really come on man

[outer granite]

and anyway im in the middle of playing a game with more balancing in the code then jello

[lyric torrent]

Will you read

[lyric torrent]

You have eyes and a working brain

[outer granite]

screw jello let it do only 30 dmg period

[lyric torrent]

Ok then don’t share the bias option its good for no one

[outer granite]

jello is good for no one as well

[lyric torrent]

You are just a crash out

[outer granite]

if u think the jello playstyle is some isolated incident then ur a nuisance as well

[lyric torrent]

Like I said for the multiple times I have now
I want a fair game

[outer granite]

reworking jello is the only way to make it fair

[lyric torrent]

I support no behavior you clearly are a raging volcano for a man rather then be able to communicate

[lyric torrent]

Literally right here

[outer granite]

jello is not almost pointless it still is viable for running

[lyric torrent]

Balance in the works

[lyric torrent]

With all do respect will you shut up and be fair instead of bias
No behavior is supported in this how can you make jello not op or garbage

Answer that

[outer granite]

with more respect syfm jello should be doing atlesat 30-40 dmg maximum

inside e

[lyric torrent]

See d1 crash out

[outer granite]

if u cant tell why jello doing 100 dmg is terrible then im not gonna shove the answer into ur face

[lyric torrent]

Make your login make sense

[outer granite]

30-40 dmg is the only way it will actually be fair

[lyric torrent]

Who said 100

[outer granite]

to go up against

[lyric torrent]

Right there as ive been talking

Now why did that take you so long
Took you a pile of crash outs and complaining to finally name something balanced

😭

[outer granite]

eitherway im gonna stfu as u told me to

[outer granite]

is 30 dmg not balanced?

[lyric torrent]

Who said stfu

[lyric torrent]

I said it is
30 to 40 so it can deal damage as they get out
And not be so unbelievably trash its not worth using

[lyric torrent]

I said if its bias its not worth anything

[eager bloom]

It absolutely DID deserve the nerf, it was the most annoying ability in the game and lemon iframes made it friggin disgusting

[eager bloom]

Or maybe I like the nerfs because the ability was previously broken beyond belief.

[eager bloom]

It's nowhere NEAR being buns after ONE measly nerf.

Cause rn, I don't think I'm delusional if I'm really only favoring game design that is more fun.

Runner abilities are nerfed because they WERENT fun to fight, and having everyone run is definitely also not good for the pacing of the game

90% of nerfs you are complaining about are to the formerly meta ranged abilities (Lemon is effectively ranged due to how it's played.) that had little to no counterplay and actively rewarded running away.

And 100% of the nerfed ranged abilities you talked about are STILL good

Honestly to me, I think it's WILD that all these abilities were THAT good

And that you want that power back

[uneven trench]

bomb mastery nerf was needed

[eager bloom]

Wtf

I did NOT expect to see him make a take I agree w

Anways

If I made this EXACT same suggestion, but only complained about the justified melee nerfs.

The reception would be a LOT different

Who cares if Bomb Mastery was the same tier and old Teleportation.

And received less of a Nerf.

I mean, the day I see BM get buffed is the day telepunch should get added back

[wispy scarab]

They also did some stupid buffs
Example: adding an aerial E variant to midas (literally who asked for this)
Rabbit becoming even more annoying to fight

Mas ufo being annoying to kill because of lockdown

volley (this one was indirect but they refused to deal with the consequenses of removing hitstun for 7 entire months)

[eager bloom]

Mage 😁😁

Lava

Lava becoming cancellable WAS ALL THEY NEEDED TO DO

[wispy scarab]

That one vampire buff

[eager bloom]

and they instead chose "nah guys lets make it top 5"

[eager bloom]

RAGE TOO!!

rage buff was so goof

at least give it 0.5 regen

not full regen

[odd hornet]

Lava cancelling and better movement was great

[eager bloom]

for you

but for the balancing

it was stupid

[odd hornet]

But aimable rocks pleaseee

[eager bloom]

oh god

buffing a now top 5 ability AGAIN?!!

[odd hornet]

Lava rocks is basically a win the fight button in most cases

[eager bloom]

i'd honestly argue that its better than midas

[eager bloom]

yes

it is

so buffing it again-\

[eager bloom]

WAIT

EDIT UR ORIGINAL MESSAGE

[wispy scarab]

Why

[eager bloom]

I FOUND THE KING OF GARBAGE BUFFS

RABBIT

[wispy scarab]

Oh riiiiight

[eager bloom]

RABBIT BUFF 😭😭😭

[wispy scarab]

They somehow made it even more annoying to fight

[odd hornet]

Lava q could be reworked into a burst of lava puddles that deals damage faster close to defender mastery lava puddles

[eager bloom]

from S tier to S tier

[eager bloom]

yeah

the Q is what i'd personally choose to nerf about lava

wait didnt firework receive a buff like last year?

[odd hornet]

Lava rocks when it comes to hitting 90 degrees angles

[eager bloom]

RNG

[odd hornet]

https://tenor.com/view/rizz-hoop-peter-griffin-green-fn-gif-16271132247808270949

[eager bloom]

hivemind buff too bro

[odd hornet]

Lava rock barely go forwards

It mostly to the top left or right

Brick battler buffs

Specifically the new gears

[wispy scarab]

Just to then make half of them worthless

[odd hornet]

Banana peel and super explosions 😭

65 damage and a shit ton of kb for doing 4 simple clicks

[eager bloom]

ok top 10 most unnecessary balance changes

1. M1 Combos Removal
2. Rabbit Buff
3. Freeze (30DMG Glacier, buffed Q and buffed M1s)
4. Brickbattler New Moves
5. Mage Buff (R Move Buffed 30 -> 45)
6. Teleportation Tele-Punch Buff
7. Buff Q Punch Nerf (cmon guys, you nerfed the wrong thing..)
8. HOJ Archer Nerf
9. Combo Priming Nerf
10. Mech Q Speed Boost Removal

[lyric torrent]

I never said that I want them to be useable no one is using most of the things ive named

[wispy scarab]

Mech q speed boost allowed you to just keep zoning your enemies

While spamming E

[eager bloom]

good riddance broski

also i def met a jello main

[wooden cobalt]

indeed @lyric torrent , indeed.

[lyric torrent]

So what im getting is you don’t like the abilities so you want them to be trash
The nerfs were excessive

[eager bloom]

honestly

i dont want them to be trash- good thing they arent

most of these are still quite good

just not broken

[lyric torrent]

Lemon didn’t need the other nerfs the iframes were all that needed to go

[eager bloom]

yeah that ones trash

and you're absolutely right

i dont wanna see lemon users

[lyric torrent]

It shouldn’t matter if you don’t want to see them

[wooden cobalt]

one buff for abilities with un needed nerfs
lemon: make it better in general.
i forgor

[eager bloom]

actually it should matter-

[lyric torrent]

Your logic is if it’s annoying to you it should be unusable

[eager bloom]

no

if its terrible for the game, and everyone hates it

then it shouldnt be good

(right now its still useable. just not exceptionally strong)

it has speed, high knockback, decent damage

all the mastered ofc

[lyric torrent]

So how about bind in this case the current ammo is fair but it’s damage is trash

Old damage with current ammo

[eager bloom]

honestly i think bind is justified

but

i could see where you're coming from

the nerfs from the easter update were crazy for every ability

but still

Bind isnt bad

the R has always been quite good

it has stuns

ima check the easter updates nerf again

• Nerfed Bind (Recharge speed 3s -> 5s, Projectile speed 80 -> 50, Bounces until burst 3 -> 2)

yeah this is an insane nerf

[lyric torrent]

Its over kill

[eager bloom]

its overkill

but hey

bind is still quite good :)

[lyric torrent]

But most people won’t recognize it is

[eager bloom]

honestly, i see where you're coming from with that one

[lyric torrent]

It needs to stand out

[eager bloom]

but then again, i see where the devs are coming from

[eager bloom]

it does

it has a good design, good sound effects and three moves that work well in tandem with eachother

oh yeah, bind users are still quite common

its the most common secret ability

[lyric torrent]

I just say some small buffs to make up for the overkill nerf
Because theres way more op abilities then bind rn

[eager bloom]

actually jester may be more common nowadays

[eager bloom]

yeah

thats totally justified

i'd say

[eager bloom]

keep the other two nerfs

and change the recharge speed to 3.5s

[lyric torrent]

Those are fine definitely

[eager bloom]

as the recharge speed is the most overkill out of it

honestly

i used to honestly hate Bind (when it dealt 70DMG)

and its so funny how it keeps getting nerfed, and I DONT EVEN NOTICE 😭😭

i check the changelogs

and I some how

never notice the bind changes

even when its so stupid like that one

[lyric torrent]

They nerf a lot of random things to

What did overcharge do lol

[eager bloom]

no honestly

Overcharge is really good right now

[lyric torrent]

It still is definitely

[eager bloom]

Overcharge isn't dodgeable lol (Q)

so i definitely see where the devs came from

[lyric torrent]

I can combo someone heavily with it
But what was the point of nerfing it
Never was game changing or anything

[eager bloom]

yeah, but it was hated

ima check the nerf actualy

[eager bloom]

wait

are you talking about the easter set of nerfs?

[lyric torrent]

Was afk im not even sure of everything they have done recently

Im aware of the older nerfs

[eager bloom]

me neither

i dont think they touched overcharge recently

aside from the easter balance patch

[lyric torrent]

Nah probably in the old logs that got wiped

[eager bloom]

ohh like a year ago

[lyric torrent]

Crazy how long ago that was lol

Alright im going back to what I was doing

If you have anything to add ill add it

[eager bloom]

Mech's Q nerf

https://alt-battles.fandom.com/wiki/Ability_Wars_Cosmology_Explanation

wtf

what the HELL is this

why is there an ability wars section in some random ass powerscaling wiki

https://alt-battles.fandom.com/wiki/Ability_Wars

what did i just find

why is this so funny

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[clear yarrow]

wb plant

[strange viper]

https://tenor.com/view/fire-writing-gif-24533171

[strange viper]

No but seriously this is peak fiction

Someone make this canon i beg of you

Ability wars lore should legit be like the transformers lore where two groups fight for the allspark

Except it’s a free for all and everyone just hates each other lol

[eager bloom]

this must be canon now bro

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[lyric torrent]

Peak

[mellow compass]

vamp is fine

malice is fine

what else

ig lemon q kinda underwhelming

but other than that i think its fine

so is jello its not a damage ability but rather a push people off the map type of ability

i agree with slime though

[strange hearth]

hey man i still use slime :c

[near harness]

mystic

[eager bloom]

Bomb Mastery

Fuck that ability.

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[lyric torrent]

How would you balance bomb since you hate it so much

[lyric torrent]

Looking back the game has made a lot of stupid nerfs. Added hoj

Looking back the game has made a lot of stupid nerfs. (Added hoj)

Much better

Ill start adding new additions to the name

[eager bloom]

Thankfully I agree with the nerf we got

I'm just spreading the GREATNESS that is the BM nerf

[robust ferry]

stop nerfing something js bc they are lil better than others consider buffing other things

[lyric torrent]

They sometimes nerf the right things or nerf something that didnt need the nerf
They never go after the newer op stuff tho
Let alone buff the abilities that suck

Ive never liked the choices the devs make
I swear suggesting is useless in this server
The only suggestions that make it through are riots like bring back festive
And if they did listen to suggestions the game would probably be no better
With this half brain rotted community

[fluid eagle]

hypothetically, if pre nerf storm still existed, would you
a) nerf storm
b) buff everything to be as strong as storm

[lyric torrent]

But nerfing doesn’t mean it has to be major

Balance still is a thing and a option

If you are so lazy to a point were you can’t tweak some stats around to be perfect its the devs

[lyric torrent]

Question
Hypothetically if you have people meant for testing and a full dev team
Along with the fact you can compare something op to something balanced
Do you think it would be as difficult as people make it out to be

[fluid eagle]

the testers aren't exactly the best players in the game nor are they the best at the abilites they test

when an update gets released, everyone has access to the fun toys, and then you see someone turning into a death god

[lyric torrent]

Another easy solution
They’re testers and they are useless to the game
Fired we can find new testers anyway

[fluid eagle]

hiring more or firing testers isn't the fix

more people testing something means that issues will be found more quickly, which is just what happens when an update is released

[lyric torrent]

If you can’t look at something like pre nerfed storm and not be sure if its op
You aren’t cut out for testing

Who confirmed puppet it’s basically default with a trash passive

[fluid eagle]

puppet is a decent ability if you know how to use it

[lyric torrent]

And yet one aoe move is enough to counter its sole purpose

[fluid eagle]

it's basically got midas R, but nobody uses it like midas R because they suck

[lyric torrent]

That to
The way I see it is, a ability can look weak but have a lot of potential
Something that takes zero skill or has a easy to land skill with outrageous damage it needs nerfed

You can sweat with a power and that doesn’t make it op
You don’t need skilled testers
If they see broken easy to use skills that take little to no effort to use thats the red flag

There should be draw backs to everything

[fluid eagle]

what if instead of complaining you got good at the game and learned how to beat these abilities and then could pinpoint exactly what needed nerfs

[lyric torrent]

How does getting better make any issues go away

Its hiding it under a rug

[fluid eagle]

if you're good at the game, you'll know better how the abilities work

[lyric torrent]

But skill doesn’t determine anything infact it makes it harder to balance using it

[fluid eagle]

it makes it easier to know how to balance things when you're better at the game

[lyric torrent]

If someone has skill with a ability look at the potential it can lead to

[fluid eagle]

im not talking about how skill affects the abilities, im talking about how skilled players know more about the game

[lyric torrent]

This could make good testers sure but this hasn’t happened

[fluid eagle]

the best testers are the entirety of the community

[lyric torrent]

So then again this leans on the devs fault they get feed back and don’t utilize it

[fluid eagle]

they get feed back from people who are either biased or bad at the game

[lyric torrent]

So then if you were in their shoes wouldn’t it be easy to just look at the ability yourself and see
Just use a few moves wouldn’t take long

[fluid eagle]

spring

[lyric torrent]

Just like that you can look at your work and see if its fit to what you intended

[fluid eagle]

why don't you make an ability wars then

[lyric torrent]

Making something else because this game style doesn’t go far

You make abilities then what

Its a infinite loop hole that will die

[fluid eagle]

the hoj nerf was good

the npc was basically a truck

and meleeing the hoj user usually got you punished with an arrow

[lyric torrent]

The npc is fine now
The dimension is not worth using

[fluid eagle]

the dimension is fine what are you talking about

[lyric torrent]

I disagree heavily the blades are inaccurate you can shoot a guy standing still and a few will hit

[fluid eagle]

you shoot your swords and then punch people into them before they land

[lyric torrent]

Which is mostly ping base
People can move out of the way before they hit based off the ping

[fluid eagle]

if you can't utilize an ability at all, you're not good at the game and shouldn't be allowed to talk about balance

[lyric torrent]

Who said that
If something ping based its not about balance

[fluid eagle]

it isn't ping based, you're just lazy

[lyric torrent]

I think you just want a reason to try debunking a suggestion because it leads to unnecessary nerfs getting reverted

[fluid eagle]

how many of those nerfs were really unnecessary?

[lyric torrent]

Look at it like this does nerf = kill
Not saying bring back the old thing
But some of these abilities are trash now

70 something abilities and I only see 20 or more actually being good

[fluid eagle]

jello used to have absurd damage, slime was and still is annoying, vamp still has great damage, malice was a ranged dps killer, lemon had a free reversal/counter, army and its mastery were practically unkillable, bomb mastery was some of the freest damage ever, bind still has great damage, and hoj had it coming for a while.

[lyric torrent]

And yet I left no part in this suggestion saying the old versions were ok
Jello was op now is trash
Theres a middle

[fluid eagle]

jello isn't trash, none of these abilities are trash, you're just not putting in the effort to make them good

[lyric torrent]

Slime was meant to slow
And the slow isn’t really slowing anything

[lyric torrent]

Like I said before potential look at other abilities that have gained much more love and the option for skill on top of it’s already good move set

[fluid eagle]

then get good

[lyric torrent]

Going on any further is pointless
You just simply don’t care to use your brain and think

Its either max or low for you
No middle

[fluid eagle]

coming from the person thinking malice didn't deserve the nerfs...

[lyric torrent]

The pumpkins deserve them

[fluid eagle]

all of malice deserved it

[lyric torrent]

The slash did about the same damage as any other ability on average

The pumpkins made it op

[fluid eagle]

malice would be op with or without the pumpkins if its slash wasn't nerfed

[lyric torrent]

But what im not getting how is the slash damage a issue to you when theres way stronger skills also easy to land

Malice does less damage at long range

Used up close it deals more

Encouraging you to push

[fluid eagle]

them off the map with the slash?

[lyric torrent]

So many abilities can snipe you off the map

[fluid eagle]

and none of them have hitboxes as large as malice

except custom's prismatic bomb, but that's not reliable for throwing people off the map

[lyric torrent]

You used to be able to jump the slash damage has not fixed your issue

[fluid eagle]

no you couldn't

[lyric torrent]

Ive had it since release yes you could

[fluid eagle]

and even if you could, nothing was stopping the malice from jumping before using their slash

[lyric torrent]

Thats true and yet you don’t put up these complaints for anything else

[fluid eagle]

because I'm good enough at the game that I know how to deal with these things

[lyric torrent]

And another thing how does the map come into balance

[fluid eagle]

reimagined is easily the worst one

desert is fine and classic is the best

[lyric torrent]

But the void doesn’t determine the abilities damage

[fluid eagle]

yes it does

[lyric torrent]

The void is one shot not the attack

[fluid eagle]

an attack dependent on the void is

like magnet

or railgun (against full health players)

[lyric torrent]

It isn’t dependent on the void for a guy talking like he knows the ability

[fluid eagle]

if someone's on the edge of the map, i only need to hit them once for them to die

where you are on the map determines how you fight

[lyric torrent]

Logic with any range attack

[fluid eagle]

logic for any attack actually

[lyric torrent]

What was malices nerf
Damage not no hit box nerf

[fluid eagle]

i wonder why the damage was nerfed

maybe because it could reliably kill players without punching them...

[lyric torrent]

It’s damage was never the issue up close was strong far away it was weak

[fluid eagle]

up close or at a distance it didn't matter, it was getting kills regardless

[lyric torrent]

Up close made it’s damage higher while long range hardly did half it’s actual damage

The slash was balanced the pumpkins are the issue
They effectively give you a shield to rush people with

[lyric torrent]

Youve just complained about map issues instead of actual ability balancing in a balance suggestion
You just want a reason to justify not thinking
Im going to bed now this was extremely pointless

[robust ferry]

pls keep talking

you are just right

we need more like u

[fluid eagle]

ability wars players when their crutches get nerfed:

storm and lemon are dead in a ditch somewhere...

but if people stopped using storm and lemon because they were nerfed, did they even like storm or lemon in the first place?

did they like storm and lemon because they were storm and lemon, or because they were stronger?

[lyric torrent]

Ngl this kinda goes against your argument from before
You said malice is op because you can snipe people off the map with the slash
But you also said (im actually good so I know how to deal with these things)
Firstly the map has nothing to do with a ability unless its made for camping like magnet

So how are you going to complain when your the guy sitting at the void while basically printing a target on yourself saying snipe me off
Thats not a balancing issue its you

[lyric torrent]

And it doesn’t matter if I like lemon or not it’s annoying to me
But ill cope with it because the nerf was overkill and is ignored because of the dislike towards it

[fluid eagle]

this entire suggestion is basically you complaining about low skill ceiling abilities getting nerfed

[lyric torrent]

And yet I’ve already told you what this is about and said its not

[fluid eagle]

i can't recall any unnecessary nerfs

[lyric torrent]

Because you are extremely unfair to anything you dislike and don’t use

🤷‍♂️

[fluid eagle]

my main ability is currently less than half as strong as it was pre nerf

and im still using it just fine

[lyric torrent]

Because a nerf on something broken doesn’t mean its dead and it depends what you use

[fluid eagle]

spring

[lyric torrent]

Not everything nerfed is dead

[fluid eagle]

none of the nerfs have killed off any abilities

[lyric torrent]

And yet some are extremely trash because of them

[fluid eagle]

the only abilities that are trash are the ones you don't put any effort into

[lyric torrent]

How is that?

[fluid eagle]

this is a fighting game, you get good

if you're good enough, then you can make any ability good

[lyric torrent]

So then hows the void a issue to talking about good
Even you complain about things that are skill issues

[fluid eagle]

i never said the void was an issue

i said that your location on the map determined how you would fight

that positioning also effects how you use your abilities

[lyric torrent]

Thats not based off balancing when almost any ability with a range attack can do this

If you go to the void when a magnets at the edge its not the ability its you

[fluid eagle]

it is the ability because certain abilities have mid-range attacks that can hit magnet users

[lyric torrent]

Thats called countering it still not about balance

[fluid eagle]

thats not countering

stop misusing the word countering

[lyric torrent]

You use a ability to prevent getting thrown off that’s countering

[fluid eagle]

no its not

your mere existence does not turn the magnet user to ash

you aren't countering magnet if they are still existing

[lyric torrent]

Who said that

Enlighten me with the point of view you had to get that logic

[fluid eagle]

a counter would be something that wins despite any and all skill gaps

100% of the time without fail

[lyric torrent]

That doesn’t mean 100% win a counter prevents the use of said attack

[fluid eagle]

no it doesnt

if the freeze has their move on CD, then they aren't stopping anything

give the magnet a melon and the freeze is mega dead

[lyric torrent]

Thats called you not balancing you used the move that don’t make magnet op

[lyric torrent]

Called a teaming issue

[fluid eagle]

do you not want to fight teamers?

[lyric torrent]

Im here about unjust nerfs what does teaming have to do with this

[fluid eagle]

don't bring up teaming then

[lyric torrent]

Yet you basically claim teaming has a part in the abilities balance

[fluid eagle]

its a ffa game, these fights do not occur inside a vacuum

its not a good idea to make a car as an engineer when 3 people are running puppet

[lyric torrent]

But you can’t determine a ability because it had outside help from another

[fluid eagle]

yes you can

dos and unmastered portal are horrific

[lyric torrent]

Draw back they get way less kills and require you to go in the portal

[fluid eagle]

no they dont

[lyric torrent]

Then they have to leave the portal

[fluid eagle]

the unmastered portal allows the dos to heal to full and recover their cds with no counterplay

[lyric torrent]

And thats a teaming issue so should dos be nerfed for that
Portal needs delay at opening the door at least

[fluid eagle]

dos or portal or both should be nerfed for that, and a delay wouldn't fix it

if you sugguest a delay of all things to nerf the dos and unmastered portal interaction, you don't know a damn thing about proper balance

[lyric torrent]

You can’t fix teaming so don’t pin it on balance dos alone is fine

[fluid eagle]

there are many reasons that is not true that i'm not going to get into

[lyric torrent]

Making it bannable makes new issues false reports

[fluid eagle]

what are you talking about

[lyric torrent]

Secondly if I don’t have a way to fix portal im not going to mention it

[fluid eagle]

you just said to make a delay

[lyric torrent]

Gives a chance thats better people can push the portal away from the door to kill them to get dos out if they leave

[fluid eagle]

the portal can easily enter their own portal even if anyone is near them, anyone fast enough to reach the portal user before then would be killed by the dos, as everything else that could kill the dos is slower

[lyric torrent]

#1426734655771770921 message
if you have something to say about portal man go here

I didnt mention it for a reason

[fluid eagle]

that suggestion has nothing to do with portal's main issue

that suggestion is about portal being super easy to run with

[lyric torrent]

Yea because you can’t fix teamers put some logic behind that thought

[fluid eagle]

yes you can, it's as easy as preventing dos from being able to enter the other dimensions

[lyric torrent]

Not a bad idea if they can make that work
Why not make a suggestion instead of bringing this up inside a unjust nerf suggestion

[fluid eagle]

because we were talking about how to properly nerf something inside a unjust nerf suggestion

[lyric torrent]

And you found a solution
It’s about removing unjust nerfs not justified nerfs

[fluid eagle]

you can't say whether or not a nerf was just or unjust if you don't know how to properly nerf something

[eager bloom]

30DMG

as soon as a projectile/AOE move exceeds 25 damage

its suddenly meta.

its how the game works

so if its easy to land

and has low cooldowns

nerf it to be ACTUALLY worth the damage and cooldowns

similar to Freeze

it used to deal 30

now it deals 15

they did the same with Malice.,

it deals 15 now, and used to deal 30.

[lyric torrent]

It can’t get a kill on its own because of cooldowns firstly juts like freeze
Pumpkins needed the nerf

[eager bloom]

except Malice still has the melee

so its strong AF

[fluid eagle]

the slash also needed the nerf

[lyric torrent]

Your talking as if it was a move you can spam every 10 seconds

[lyric torrent]

And your argument was you complaining about getting sniped off the map

[fluid eagle]

its 13 seconds

[fluid eagle]

and the damage

[eager bloom]

yeah it is bro

so wtf u on about

[lyric torrent]

It deals low damage at far range so you get time to heal
At average most abilities do the same damage as it
Its the fact you can run and spam long range attacks

[eager bloom]

THEN DONT USE THEM AT FAR RANGE

UNLESS ITS OFF THE EDGE LOOL

anyways

Malice is DEFINITELY Still good

[eager bloom]

also wtf, you seriously cooked on this one bro

i might steal it

like

ability is reworked

[lyric torrent]

The damage is from close range you’re pushing not running

[eager bloom]

then the players use it

they dont adapt

even the slightest bit

and they say the ability is ass now

[eager bloom]

then run\

why would running deal good damage

actually

why should running deal good damage

they absolutely help w ur running

so like

[lyric torrent]

It shouldn’t (pumpkins keep up consecutive damage)

[eager bloom]

they do their job as intended

[eager bloom]

anyways even while running, malice still deals decent chip damage

so like its not weak

[lyric torrent]

The nerf makes it a lot more annoying for people that don’t use the ability like a coward

[eager bloom]

nope

[lyric torrent]

The slash hasn’t been the problem alone

[eager bloom]

the 25DMG up close and blocking punches

i feel like thats good damage

[lyric torrent]

Blocking punches comes from the pumpkins

[eager bloom]

yeah, ignoring the insane kb and 30DMG

[lyric torrent]

You complain about 30 damage like most abilities don’t deal that

[eager bloom]

bro what are you ON about

FYM undodgeable 30DMG zoning

shouldnt be complained about

and it "isnt OP"

cause it very well is!

seriously, name a 30DMG zoning attack that HASNT been meta

[lyric torrent]

Because of the constant range attacks being spammed nerf the cd and not the damage

[eager bloom]

no, the damage was the problem-

keeping the damage will just have them stall longer

look at Time

ik its an extreme example

but would u rather nerf its cooldown

or rework it entirely

[regal flame]

So I can find the suggestion lol

[lyric torrent]

It ranged hardly does anything
So how does your argument make sense

[eager bloom]

yeah, so the insane damage was fixed

how DOESNT my argument make sense

what im saying is

30DMG ranged abilities = meta

so like

[regal flame]

I miss old jello :c

[eager bloom]

they are

[lyric torrent]

The upclose damage didn’t need to be nerfed

[eager bloom]

name one 30DMG ranged ability thats not dodgeable

[eager bloom]

that HASNT been meta

[eager bloom]

how much did they nerf it by

[lyric torrent]

You can dodge anything first of all

[regal flame]

Let me be honest, the game was a lot more fun before all these people started complaining about balancing, back then I miss when the game was just use stupid op abilities : D

[lyric torrent]

Some things no

[eager bloom]

first of all, what

[eager bloom]

i like using any ability i find fun

:D

yeah i just checked the DMG

it seems alright

[regal flame]

Ye but, back then things were more chill (me experience) and it isn't the balancing tbh it is just a lot of new or reworked abilities are spammy and now people are so serious over the game like they be sweating over ability wars ykyk

[lyric torrent]

Malice up close should deal good damage and they need to nerf the range part
The biggest issue is the wide aoe making it easy to land and pumpkins giving a punch shield

[eager bloom]

back then, what abilities are you talking about-

im actually pretty curious

[fluid eagle]

i just facetank the pumpkins and punch the malice, i do not care about the pumpkins

[regal flame]

Well uhh ofc we all hated oneshot time,plasma, and freeze

[lyric torrent]

You can’t hit people while you get hit by pumpkins

[fluid eagle]

and they can't hit you either

[eager bloom]

so what did u like about then

[regal flame]

But it wasn't the abilities it was more of less sweats and less people who took the game so serious

[lyric torrent]

They can

[regal flame]

I mean I do wish there still was a oneshot that was f2p (ima get roasted and toasted for saying this)

[fluid eagle]

when someone is in hitstun, they are temporarily invulnerable to punching and cannot punch either

[regal flame]

I hated those I rly miss old bionic

[fluid eagle]

archer volley used to have hitstun, then at some point it didnt and started instakilling

[eager bloom]

ehh that was so annoying lol

[lyric torrent]

They need to be remade entirely and it would be more balanced
I can use the slash on you and stack constant damage over and over it’s extremely op

[regal flame]

But funny cause u could lose your legs somehow lol

[regal flame]

I also miss old mushroom sure u couldn't choose but when u got king u generally felt powerful

[lyric torrent]

Agreed on that

[eager bloom]

ok i hated rerolling them

it was so unfun

[fluid eagle]

people were doing nothing but resetting while using mushroom

[eager bloom]

didnt feel like an army

it felt like a casino

[regal flame]

But the dopamine rush, also the variants were op when u finally got them and felt worth it

[lyric torrent]

For what the pre nerf king was it was needed now its fair to let people pick

[eager bloom]

ugh

thats the same kind of defense Sols RNG fans say

[regal flame]

Yeah it was like one of the few counters against freeze lol

[fluid eagle]

it was not economical in the slightest to use king mushroom to fight one shots

[regal flame]

Remember when festive first came out the chestplate would like make freeze not one shot u

[regal flame]

Yeah but freeze didn't oneshot king

[fluid eagle]

freeze killed in like 3 hits, king mush would kill in over 10

[regal flame]

King had tons of resistance

[fluid eagle]

even if the freeze did die, they could just respawn

can't say the same for king mush

[regal flame]

Eh ur not wrong

Ok but the army nerf was kinda dumb

Loke

Like

Sure army was verbally the strongest ability

But I miss it :c

[fluid eagle]

i dont

[lyric torrent]

Making it a aoe with a short period of agro would be fair

[regal flame]

Ye but there are lots of spamming and dumb abilities rn

And the dos users rn are soules

Back then there were very few dos mains

[lyric torrent]

Yea they don’t nerf the op things

[fluid eagle]

what are the op things

[lyric torrent]

Fr

[fluid eagle]

except for custom

custom is definitely op right now and there cannot be any argument against that

[eager bloom]

they do tho--- they nerfed the abilities u complained about

such as Bomb Mastery and Storm

those deserved it

[regal flame]

Berserk is one, stardust if u can somewhat aim, rage, custom prismatic bombs, and stuff like paladin mast (I mean when it came out it isn't too strong but like 5 in every server was anoyying).

[lyric torrent]

To the ground and you are extremely petty and refuse to acknowledge the nerfs on some things have been overkill

[eager bloom]

yeah Rage is justified

[eager bloom]

atr u should just call the TP nerf "stupid" cause it killed the ability

hey

[fluid eagle]

paladin mas tho?

[eager bloom]

why arent u complaining about Telepunch removal

HUH destory?

also

[lyric torrent]

Tp has no purpose without a attack

[eager bloom]

how in the living FUCK is the Storm nerf too overkill

[regal flame]

When it first came out it was anoyying having to fight like 5 in each server

[eager bloom]

how in the living FUCK was the BM mas nerf too overkill

[lyric torrent]

Storm hasn’t been mentioned in this

[eager bloom]

yeah, ikr

[fluid eagle]

its annoying to fight 5 of anything at the same time

[eager bloom]

wait the fuck, fr?

[regal flame]

True that was kinda unrelated

[eager bloom]

damn

why were ppl talking about the Storm nerf then-

i thought u added it

[lyric torrent]

Storm is still good that wasn’t overkill

[eager bloom]

damn ok

[eager bloom]

then how the fuck is BM mas nerf overkill!????

it got less of a nerf than TP

[regal flame]

Here yall go if u need to read it

[eager bloom]

and it was stronger!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[fluid eagle]

if you go to the top right corner, there is an upwards pointing arrow that takes you to the top of the post

[lyric torrent]

Having wind up is good but the other skills don’t make the ability stand out remotely

[regal flame]

Wow

[eager bloom]

mhmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[regal flame]

Let's talk about hoj and alchemist combo 💰 🤑

[lyric torrent]

Buffing saber😭

[regal flame]

I love arrows that oneshot

[lyric torrent]

That to lol

[fluid eagle]

why use hoj when you can use baller with homing balls

[regal flame]

Cause ranged oneshot 👍

[fluid eagle]

you one shot a few people at most if they're standing close together

or you kill the entire server

[regal flame]

But that isn't oneshot, it more satisfying

Wth is dat

Ok there fixed

[lyric torrent]

Alchemist mastery is basically selling steroids

[regal flame]

Fr lol

Tbh

[lyric torrent]

I seen a guy give a god punch speed to kill a dos before

[regal flame]

Naw 😭

[lyric torrent]

Had the dos running for life

[regal flame]

Let's talk about lemon tho

Like I agree lemon didn't need to basically remove it's whole thing

But it did need a nerf

[lyric torrent]

100%

[regal flame]

But like it ain't even work tho

[lyric torrent]

The iframes were unneeded

[regal flame]

Enemy has to be blind

Ok ima go cya

[lyric torrent]

Cya

[glossy sentinel]

you gotta take out bind bro

it can literally infinitely combo

otherwise its looking good

[lyric torrent]

Its unable to do that the ammo rn is fine nerfing the ammo nerfed the damage but nerfing damage on top of that is over kill

[regal flame]

I found another dumb op spamming ability: overcharge

[glossy sentinel]

wdym nerfed the ammo?

its always had 10

[woven forge]

hmmm

[silk ember]

Mkay here comes counteract paragraph block of doom and despair

Jello can still majorly slow with ZERO counterplay and you can still use the e+q facing a ledge for a free kill (not fair at all) not to mention the damage nerf was needed (it still does good damage, just not half ur health bar in 1 e)

Slime is another ability with a slow with 0 counterplay, not to mention it's the best slow in the game as it sets ur walk speed percentage to ZERO then raises back to 100% over time (I think the nerf was to lower the amount of time it took?) which it still has the fair and balanced "I don't want to engage with you anymore" q which does what it says (free run away)

Vamp always was and is still BUSTED with it's old lemon e and knives that deal 25+ damage that can combo from an m1 (35+ free damage). This is post nerf btw because knives had a STUPID low cd along with it's bs "backstab" mechanic that made it deal double damage on hitting from behind

Malic is probably one of the most nerf deserving abilities considering it's any zoners we dream with the pumpkins of "FUCK your m1s" and the e with decent damage and kb of a 3 soul dos (pretty far)
Pumpkins low-key just shouldn't be a thing (but that's more personal). but yeah all nerfs are deserved

Old Lemon e (and vampire q to the same extent) could just, CANCEL the opponent m1 combo and make it yours pretty easily considering you get I frames with 0 wind-up, which is why people didn't like it and it got removed.

Army and it's mastery's targeting issue is a bug and will be fixed soon

Bomb being here really pmos because people like @drowsy surge don't actually get how good bomb mas is (I'm a bomb main). The E nerf only applies to you if you use it on the floor for whatever reason (as it should it was a free combo breaker, combo extender and mobility) but bomb is still REALLY good and sticking any player is still the way you should be using bomb E (it takes more skill now to apply free stun)
I'll do the rest later me bored

[drowsy surge]

You also admit that the bomb's E-skill is ultimately a skill that can only be used when attached to someone's body? It is difficult compared to its performance, so I also admitted that very few users use bombs.

[silk ember]

You can still use it without sticking it to people

It's just that it's easier and better to just

Point your cross hair on the player

(you can even do this in an m1 combo btw)

[drowsy surge]

It is almost impossible to put a bomb on another person's body.
If you use bombs as your main ingredient, you'll know better than anyone else.

[silk ember]

It's a fast moving projectile with little to no drop-down?

Also it's moderately sized

[drowsy surge]

Instead of being fast and having a wide range of judgments, E-skills go up for a while while flying. It's almost impossible to match moving players.

[silk ember]

So then use it in close quarters

It's easier to combo with bomb than zone with bomb anyway

Also the game likes to think that you're trying to throw a bomb into the twilight zone if you aren't looking at the floor

[drowsy surge]

Bombs were used by many users by adding combos using E and Q skills. Now you're saying that bombs are not bad because you can use E-skills somehow, right? From the conditions such as "You have to use E-skills up close" and "What should I do?" I think I've finished explaining them.

[silk ember]

I would show you what I mean but I'm currently doing smth else so I'ma need a second, I'll get back to you tho later

[drowsy surge]

Urgent work > I will come up with an excuse to refute. I hope you work hard.

[eager bloom]

ok slime is NOT the best slow in the game

there are so many better slowing abilities

[silk ember]

As in just stats

[eager bloom]

also slows and stuns should count as the same thing

[eager bloom]

Mage

[silk ember]

Considering the .2 seconds 0 walk

[eager bloom]

mage has a better slow

[silk ember]

Nobody uses mage for the slow (and if you do you're using mage wrong)

[eager bloom]

you're telling ME that IM using Mage wrong?

[silk ember]

(we love infinite firewall m1 combo)

[eager bloom]

also thats just plain stupid

why wouldnt you use your Q

and how is using your ability "using it wrong"

also the argument "nobody does this or nobody does that"

[silk ember]

Waste of juicy many needed for more firewalls

[eager bloom]

is super flawed

[eager bloom]

its actually saving mana-

if all you do is spam E

then your playstyle is flawed

[silk ember]

Erm actually it's 2m1s then e

[eager bloom]

cause Mage has some of the best slowing and healing in the game. not just free 100DMG

[silk ember]

No but like

[eager bloom]

do u even do the reverse E 😭

you must right

[silk ember]

No I just...

[eager bloom]

YOU MUST USE THE REVERSE E -

[silk ember]

M1x2 into a firewall knocking them back?

[eager bloom]

THATS THE REVERSE E!!

[silk ember]

So why is it called the "reverse E" if I'm using facing them...

[eager bloom]

?

[silk ember]

This is why I hate techs being named...

[eager bloom]

its literally dealing reverse knockback

and youre literally hitting ur opponent with the back of the fire wall

[eager bloom]

Reverse E is literally the best name for it

[silk ember]

E combo extender

You could just stop naming techs and calling it what it is😭

[eager bloom]

ok bro, then i'd use it as a dash

and use my Q to combo them

[silk ember]

(personal gripe btw)

[eager bloom]

[silk ember]

I mean that works 2 but...

That's more mana...

[eager bloom]

yeah.

but i can still do that

and call my E a combo extender

anyways, if i can get my hits back

whats the harm :)

[silk ember]

Ig do what makes you happy

Anyways back to the topic of the actual suggestion

I dislike how half of these are just

Some of the most deserved nerfs...

[eager bloom]

ok the only thing i disagree w, other than slime is:

fuck you bomb main

ewww

die

fuck off

[silk ember]

Hey ;(

[eager bloom]

ewwwwwwww

im literally puking up rn

[silk ember]

I said that in confidence...

[eager bloom]

and im puking that confidence out

🖕

[silk ember]

Wow okay mage main

[eager bloom]

oh btw, wanna know the two biggest reasons why Mage is such an awesome ability to main

dirty teamers

dirty bomb mains

3. (most common)

dirty bomb mains teaming

hah

i snuck a third one

[silk ember]

I have NEVER seen anyone (but me) use bomb mas

[eager bloom]

LUCKY BASTARD

[eager bloom]

EVEN BEFORE THE NERF?

IT WAS ONE OF THE MOST COMMON ABILITIES

I DESPISED IT

[silk ember]

Like pre nerf I saw like

[eager bloom]

25

teamrs

[silk ember]

1 per 2-3 servers...

[eager bloom]

THATS SO COMMON

I DESPISE THE ABILITY

[silk ember]

And bomb isn't really a teamer ability..

[eager bloom]

and everyone who uses it still teams 😭😭

its just who they are

[silk ember]

(easy to screw over your teammate)

[eager bloom]

ppl who use slimey abilities, often use slimey tactics

way of the world

[silk ember]

You do know bomb takes more skill than mage right?

[eager bloom]

no actually

it does not

Bomb Mastery is spamming

EQR\

EQR

running

EQR some more

[silk ember]

(bad bomb players run)

[eager bloom]

mage requires punching to combo

and the Q has a decent skill ceiling

[eager bloom]

all bomb players run

when they dont, its only for one hit in order to stun u for Q\

[eager bloom]

and the reverse E actually requires learning!!!!!

[silk ember]

But me ( a good bomb player) uses the very skilled combo of m1s , r while on top of them for free damage while not launching me away, more m1s, q while a little back to not launch me away, then more m1s into E for another combo extender

[eager bloom]

well is that required

to win every fight

and be a fucking menace

ok lets come in an agreement

BOMB MASTERY

AND

MAGE

NEITHER TAKES SKILL

AS THEYRE ALL REALLY FRIGGIN FORGIVING

but

if u WANT mage to take skill\

then

https://discord.com/channels/922921165373202463/1427445965354438656

[silk ember]

Mkay I can agree to that

[eager bloom]

cmon u gotta say this advert is rlly friggin smooth

you gotta admit

[silk ember]

I can't lie

It is smooth

[eager bloom]

https://tenor.com/view/one-piece-kuma-kuma-one-piece-bartholomew-kuma-past-gif-1896615008865795370

[drowsy surge]

He ran away under the pretext that he had an urgent need when he was pushed out of the logical argument with me. He just a friend who's not good enough, so ignore him, LOL.

[fluid eagle]

you got a screw loose or somethin?

[desert spade]

next update: default damage reduced 10 > 0.1

[lyric torrent]

Looking back the game has made a lot of stupid nerfs. (Removed malice)

[lyric torrent]

I agree with malice still being good

But jello has only one attack move that isn’t for void campaign
The damage is still extremely small

Slime is meant to slow its purpose is slowing
And its slow is now not much of a slowdown anymore

You can sweat with bomb but that don’t speak for the over nerfs on it

And lemon iframes were all that had to go
Every other nerf was stupid

And army definitely isn’t a bug they removed the target completely
Even a aoe around you would be better

And vamps backstab was the only op thing which is gone now
The other nerfs were just nerfing to nerf

[eager bloom]

bomb was- NOT over nerfed

it was undernerfed if anything

[silk ember]

Very much so (maybe reduce ragdoll time to be about the same as a punch because I shouldn't be able to get launched in the air and still combo into an m1)

[heady lava]

Lemon used to be one of my favourites until they removed lemon masterys stairs and ladders and made it so when your in lemon mode people can still see you

[silk ember]

Lemon visibility is only when you close to another player (and if you're trying to hit them they won't see you coming unless you miss anyway)

And the stairs caused bugs

[hybrid barn]

vamp is still op, it is very fairly nerfed, it deals insane damage and the lifesteal is great

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[frank herald]

yeah they can do half your hp (and restore a lot too) if they press e after hitting you 😭

it used to do insane damage before it got nerfed

[fickle creek]

bro vampire is stupidly OP

but fair

cause you gotta know how to use it

it's not a bad ability

it's nerf was reasonable if i had to guess

[frank herald]

yeah it’s abilities have counter play (unlike malice if you don’t have very specific counters for it)

if you have any sort of melee ability you cannot get close to a malice without getting slashed

[fickle creek]

i hate malice

it's unfun to use

and annoying to fight

[frank herald]

rewards holding s too

[fickle creek]

malice is my 2nd most hated ability to fight

return is my 1st most hated one

[frank herald]

oh yeah i absolutely hate return too

rabbit as well

tried making a suggestion that return needed to kill someone before they can revive and it wasn’t well received

[fickle creek]

i hate how return users just run till they have iframes or a respawn

[frank herald]

that’s exactly what i was trying to get rid of when making that suggestion

i think the 5 return mains found it though

[nova totem]

First things first. In the AW suggestions section, try to keep your post objective. I see a lot of complaining here that isn't actually suggestions.

currently jello can do some serious damage AND allow you to get into good positions (sorta). If anything i'd say keep the damage and buff the slowdown. This would allow for better position adjustment. also make jello bigger
additionally make jello restick people even if they get punched while in the jello
The bounce pad is primarily a movement ability.

yeah slime sucks idek what they did to it but it's overall in need of a rework. The slime slows but not for long, and the bounce is just...bad rabbit or alch mastery potion. It's not a very useful ability unless you're very skilled at combo-starting and combo-keeping.

Vamp is fine. I die to it occasionally. If you know how to use the shroud ability well, you can be terrifying. Not to mention, all 3 knives typically hit if you punch and immediately throw the knives. The damage is considerable, 36 damage is great. Also, both abilities can backstab. In short, you can be very VERY good at vampire even with just a little skill. I do wish it had a third ability, though.

Lemon is great, stop missing your punches and be aware of how close you are to people.
Lemon is a melee ability. It's not Pirate, where you can deal heavy damage and immobilize and bamboozle your enemies easily. It's lemon, where you're meant to be sneaky and methodical. Also, lemon is a knockback/punch-combo-based ability, not a damage-based one.
Lemon Mastery's lemon should honestly be reverted to how it was.

Army is ok against anything without ranged. Anything with ranged usually squashes it. Army mastery isn't that hard, but the obtainment is way too long since army mastery isn't very powerful at first.

The archers for army need a HUGE buff to accuracy and damage.

Bomb mastery E doesn't need as long of a windup, but it's good otherwise.

Bind's ammo never needed that harsh of a speed nerf, though the bounce nerf was necessary to prevent ridiculous reach.

You can easily aim HoJ arrows with practice, but the damage should be buffed. The bow is low damage, yeah. Buff its damage, the aim is fine tho.

[formal violet]

Cough cough

#1382093608852656219

[lyric torrent]

Every thing is a suggestion and pointing out the issues of (trashy nerfs)
Dont try acting smart when you can’t make any actual arguments other then opinions

And I never said to revert the nerfs completely most of the suggestion is naming abilities that got some of the biggest nerfs or had a pointless one

[lyric torrent]

And hojs swords have spread on top of the aim
Making perfect shots not even full rewarding

[nova totem]

oh alr

[nova totem]

💀 that sucks

[nova totem]

You had a lot of opinions in your post too. Both of our comments had opinions and facts.

[lyric torrent]

Opinions are a part of suggestions and the point is for people to either like it or dislike it
Unless its something that should just be added without a reason to say no

[nova totem]

yep

[silk ember]

Jello's change is a HELL NO as it just increases DPS more and makes it almost unfair if it get plopped onto you (with no counterplay btw) it doesn't need changes it's balanced as it is
Slime is also fine as it is the most it's allowed to have is it's old 0-100% ws (even that's a stretch tho...) also more knit picking but slime q is more of a get away option
Old lemon E was buggy which is why it was removed
No comment about army because I hate the ability
Bind orbs are yucky as they are just free damage with little to no downside and shouldnt be relatively easy to hit

[silk ember]

Meant to reply to this guy...

[ashen ruin]

nerf malice even more its fucking disgusting

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[obtuse bison]

these are not stupid nerfs, if you use a new acc and play aw, you will see that this game is the most beginner unfriendy game. your only option is to spam grapple which is just BAD GAME DESIGN BC THIS GAME HAS SUCH A VARIETY OF ABILITIES YOU CAN USE. overly tuned nerfs have to be made to have newcomers into this game. i have 7k punches from a few years ago right? I WAS THE PERSON WITH THE LOWEST AMOUNT OF PUNCHES IN THE SERVER. yall have to realize that these abilities are overtuned asf. even if they were nerfed and not others, atleast these were nerfed.

[fickle creek]

YES PLEASE

[lyric torrent]

And I agree to them being nerfed but not as much as they have been

[obtuse bison]

and moral of the story: if you do not have late game abilities, js use cards i used cards once and killed a good asf plasma player

and ntm gut plasma

[lyric torrent]

Bump

[eager bloom]

|| Pls remove the BM nerf from this list 🥺 you admitted it's still good, and that it deserves the nerf, so like.. how's it too harsh or stupid.||

[compact cosmos]

Jello is meh, its not the worst but could be a TINY bit better

Slime the points are valid

Personally as a d1 vamp fan its still Hella good with its good damage(if you can land knives) and heal and its free "dodge" or movement ability which can avoid smt like railgun or malice slice

Lemon is just straight dog

Army base is fitting for a base ability (besides not jumping) and the mastery is UNUSEABLE and the devs still havent fixed it (which is probably a super easy fix too..) for such a cool concept (in my opinion)

Bomb i havent used

Bind only needs like a tiny damage buff

Hoj is lowk bad for how hard it is to get and the bow your not getting off unless the person is running

Overall valid suggestion fr

[eager bloom]

Bind is op tho lil vro

[lyric torrent]

If it were someone less bias then you, that supplied proper reasons, maybe
No offense but you don’t leave any proper feed back, other then you hate it.

[lyric torrent]

Such as this
No reasons to support this
And any time you name a reason, you don’t name the details equally, you just rant on about people being annoying.

[lyric torrent]

I can agree on this its all valid details so ill remove vamp
Because any vamp main here has said its still good

Looking back the game has made a lot of stupid nerfs. (Removed vamp)

[compact cosmos]

Im not like demi-god good at the game but I can see its pretty good, life steal and its extra bite damage, its knives heal too (tho you lose health if you miss/a net loss) and its other move can be a good sneak up and evasive for op stuff like railgun, hollow purple, malice etc

[lyric torrent]

I haven’t used vamp or come across many but I remember using it on release and it was very strong
I haven’t seen to many damage nerfs so id imagine its still strong

[compact cosmos]

It still is big time, i love hitting all knives and practically being back to full hp

[lyric torrent]

Question do you have a way to get to the top im not able to get up for some reason

I need to remove vampire still

[compact cosmos]

Uhh lemmi seee

[compact cosmos]

Top here

[lyric torrent]

Ty

[eager bloom]

20DMG+ instant attacks with good stun and cooldowns.

Shouldn't need more reasons than that.

Bomb Mastery was always good

Never changed.

"biased" as in calling a broken ability, good

Dude, all I did was read ur message

U have BM mas up there, even u admitted it was broken, deserving of a nerf and still strong.

"too harsh" my ass

There, proper reasons.

I thought they were god damn obvious

[lyric torrent]

Damage doesn’t follow delay average damage is higher then 20 welcome to ability wars a poorly balanced game
The damage on bomb is fine
But everything else hell no

[lyric torrent]

I said the old bm was broken

And its still strong but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t over nerfed

[eager bloom]

Gotta repeat my reasons eh? Have you SEEN Binds's current DPS? It's fucking incredible, it's super versatile, deals (obviously) great damage, has good knockback, great stuns, amazing cooldowns and is SUPER easy to use! It was broken, they nerfed it slightly, and it's still good!

[eager bloom]

Yes it does!

If it's still good, then it couldn't have been over nerfed!!!!

[lyric torrent]

If everything hits yes
But count in how easy they are to dodge
The ammo nerf was stupid and lazy

[lyric torrent]

Delay wasn’t necessary

[eager bloom]

Was it now? I think it makes the ability more skill based and has the users use different strategies.

It INCREASED the creativity of Bomb Mastery

I think it was a healthy change in terms of gameplay