Stop Nerfing Literally Every Freaking Thing In This Game

[uneven schooner]

yep

[cunning bloom]

besides just change where your punch hitbox is and how it looks

[lofty phoenix]

THAT JUST GREAT, ANOTHER POINTLESS NERF!!!

[uneven schooner]

even more worse than punches

[lofty phoenix]

HOW MANY TIMES ARE ABILITIES GOING TO BE NERFED FOR NO REASON!?

[uneven schooner]

oh hey speaking of festive's candy cane there is someone who is complaining about it, type candy cane and you'll see the old suggestion

some ancient book tech type shi

[cunning bloom]

that person got banned from the server

but they were good at festive i heard

[lofty phoenix]

why

[uneven schooner]

so it's a forgetten legacy?

[cunning bloom]

i lowkey forgot why

[lofty phoenix]

So are you aware that nerfs in the game have been happening for no reason lately?

[cunning bloom]

yeah but maybe the devs had a reason we just dont know about

maybe theres some type of justification thatll make ppl less angry

[lofty phoenix]

They had no reason to remove energy drink and coffee yet they did it.

They had no reason to remove gingerbread's R ability but they did it

[cunning bloom]

wait i thought that was because soda was a thing

[lofty phoenix]

It does not matter

[uneven schooner]

top 10 biggest sold in the history.

[lofty phoenix]

There no gain or benfit to remove the other 2 abilitites

[cunning bloom]

true

[lofty phoenix]

And then they nerfed Festive's candy cane for no reason.

[uneven schooner]

removing those 2 are a wastes of time

[lofty phoenix]

A huge waste of time

when they could spend the time making balancing changes

[uneven schooner]

Sadly, i kinda lowkey wanna see that person becoming a legend

[lofty phoenix]

what person?

[uneven schooner]

he was cooking though

[lofty phoenix]

who

[uneven schooner]

the owner of that suggestion i mentioned about

bro cooked and gordan throws his dish away without even tasting it💀

[lofty phoenix]

yeah, what was the point in that?

Overall, this is one of the best suggestions ever.

you know the nerfs are bad

when most of the fanbase agress this suggestion

[cunning bloom]

upon looking at the damage numbers with bounty hunter mastery the candy cane literally does less than a punch (only 1 less)

[lofty phoenix]

There have been many nerfs that no one asks for.

[cunning bloom]

and its slower, with the hitbox directly infront of your character instead of towards the right

[uneven schooner]

I've never seen such big sold like this

diabolical economy sold

[lofty phoenix]

The candy cane does less damage?

[cunning bloom]

yeah only 1

1 less

[lofty phoenix]

Great, not only the candy cane is useless

it weakens the user

[cunning bloom]

oh more knockback it seems

[uneven schooner]

are you seriously looking at that suggestion??

[lofty phoenix]

oh, still nearly useless

[cunning bloom]

no im not im ingame

i can show ss

im testing it

[uneven schooner]

aight bet

[cunning bloom]

its okay actually

less damage but more knockback

(no special abilities though)

[lofty phoenix]

that's boring

[cunning bloom]

hello i am back after both charging my laptop and playing a little more ability wars
after playing a bit with festive ive gotten used to its hitboxes and the sword is pretty good
the sword hitbox is also infront of you but slightly to the right

[lofty phoenix]

So better hitbox too?

[cunning bloom]

well i mean yeah but sometimes your combos get messed up if a star hits cuz stars dont ragdoll

[rugged marten]

superbuff every single ability

https://tenor.com/view/squid-game-squid-game-2-squid-game-thanos-squid-games-one-more-game-gif-16104726115303976188

[lofty phoenix]

Best suggestion

[lofty phoenix]

Squid game is one of my favorite shows.

[hasty breach]

Bring back prenerf festive

[empty stratus]

I hate "nerf"

[lofty phoenix]

Me too

[warm tusk]

[lofty phoenix]

Huh?

[warm tusk]

I'm bumping the suggestion again

[main pebble]

🫩

[hasty breach]

🫩

[lofty phoenix]

Good

[empty stratus]

When there is gonna be new update... Dang

I hope they fix Cosmos Mastery Q Ability Hitbox too

[lofty phoenix]

I hope they don't nerf another ability and ruined it.

[marsh laurel]

wouldent care if it was bg

[lofty phoenix]

you really hate that ability?

[marsh laurel]

who wouldent hate it

[lofty phoenix]

me

[marsh laurel]

bg getting a major nerf would be a good thing

[marsh laurel]

bg either requires a major major nerf

or a full rework that lets you use abilities

that does not force u into a 1v1

[lofty phoenix]

not bad.

[warm tusk]

[lofty phoenix]

what now

[lofty phoenix]

@marsh laurel I notice you dislike this the suggestion. Your telling me you want everything nerfed?

[rustic orchid]

A lot of things need nerfing

[lofty phoenix]

But not everything needs a nerf.

[rustic orchid]

I know that not literally everything needs a nerf

However, things still need nerfs

[lofty phoenix]

But do you agree with this suggestion?

[rustic orchid]

I don't remember seeing the devs nerf "literally everything"

[lofty phoenix]

It's kinda of a exggeration

but the point is that many of the nerfs are pointless

For example

[rustic orchid]

Pulse and vamp?

I agree that those are pointless

[lofty phoenix]

Those are not the worst nerfs.

[rustic orchid]

If the suggestion means "stop unnecessarily nerfing things" then I agree

[lofty phoenix]

For example, Brickbattler kept geting nerfed until it's nearly useless.

[rustic orchid]

Brickbattler is still strong

However, it still has balancing issues, not all items that you pick between are useful

[lofty phoenix]

Even if it's strong like you say, the nerfs are pointless.

[rustic orchid]

Pizza slicer heavily outclasses regen coil

[lofty phoenix]

like how Brickbattler users can't use pack & punch items

[rustic orchid]

Superball before the nerf did 16 damage with a 2 second cooldown, meaning it was an 8 dps midrange attack

[lofty phoenix]

or that their default inventory system got removed, making it unable to hold other items.

[rustic orchid]

Post nerf, superball does 16 damage with a 5 second cooldown, meaning that it is a 3.2 dps midranged attack

[lofty phoenix]

outclassed by other abiltiites like plant, plasma, quantum, blood god, and more

[rustic orchid]

That's just superball, they have like 3 other items that can do damage

The sword which does 15 base damage

The rocket launcher which can do up to like 25

Ot 30

[lofty phoenix]

The hitbox is werid

though

[rustic orchid]

And superbomb which can do around 40 damage

[rustic orchid]

It has aoe

Anyways now for the other nerf

Slingshot

Without the ammo system, it's absically unlimited flight

[lofty phoenix]

That got removed

[rustic orchid]

It does that by default

If you are referring to the super explosion

I believe that it did more than 40 damage

[lofty phoenix]

Another pointless nerf is when they removed gingerbread's R ability.

for no reason

[rustic orchid]

Gingerbread's whole rework was a disaster

I even made an entire suggestion

(Which I haven't bumped in a long while)

[lofty phoenix]

You hated the rework?

[rustic orchid]

Not exactly hated

But ginger became overall way weaker without the candy boomerang

And the minions are useless

[lofty phoenix]

I agree with that a lot

[rustic orchid]

The dimension is super large yet so empty

[lofty phoenix]

They are not useless. They are good for damage and as distractions.

[rustic orchid]

Overall it sucks

[rustic orchid]

They get torn apart easily

They are at best a mild inconvenience

Ans to top it all off

It introduced a bug where the people in the dimension don't get teleported out when killing the ginger user

Meaning that going in the dimension is a deathwish

So no one goes there

Overall, it feels like a downgrade

[lofty phoenix]

If the user directly fights their opponent, the opponent does not get a good chance to destroy gingerbread minions.

[lofty phoenix]

You might be right about that.

Also, Blood god got nerfed where the hand ability got turned back into a portal for no reason

Which is bad becuase the hand E ability required more skill since the user needs to aim. The current E ability just summons a portal and the user has too hope someone walks over it.

And then, Soda got nerfed even though no one ask for that

Overall, most of the nerfs feel random and have no thought point into them.

That's the reason why the suggestion says stop nerfing everything. Becuase many of the nerfs feel so random and out of place.

[rustic orchid]

More like buffed

Before, you at least had to aim in their general direction

Now, just get close and use E

No brain required to ruin someone's experience

The pull on that thing is huge

[lofty phoenix]

No, it's a nerf becuase since the e ability just pulls the nearest player, you could accidentally pull the wrong player instead of your opponent.

[lofty phoenix]

Pretty sure the hand e ability has longer range

[rustic orchid]

You can actually miss it

Unlile the current E

[hasty breach]

?

this is a buff

you dont even have to aim it

just mindlessly press whatever the key is and its unavoidable

[lofty phoenix]

Ok that's fine but I personally perfer the hand e ability.

[marsh laurel]

so...? this suggestion is saying to not nerf shit and to instead buff everything else to make it obsolete

however nerfs are needed

in this game

[lofty phoenix]

But not every nerf is needed.

[marsh laurel]

very true but this suggestion

asks instead of nerfing

buff everything else

to whichand if checken does follow exactly what this suggestion says

thennn we are gonna have less fun in this game

[lucid sierra]

No it’s not they removed mini ufos

[fierce hill]

Mini UFOs weren't the main part of the mastery

[lucid sierra]

They weren’t the main part but they were the best part

[fierce hill]

It's still a decent mastery

[lofty phoenix]

#1382093608852656219 message It's focused on nerfing the weak abilitites to make the game fair.

not buff everything

[lofty phoenix]

Yeah, that's another pointless nerf

[lofty phoenix]

If you think the suggestion will make the game would be less fun than how come over 100 players agree with this suggestion? That is because nerfs ruin the game more while buffing abilities make the game more fun.

[hasty breach]

blizzard in a bottle didnt need a nerf right guys

[lofty phoenix]

true

[hasty breach]

are you being satire

[lofty phoenix]

no

why you even ask?

I'm just agreeing with you.

[hasty breach]

your being satire

[lofty phoenix]

Oh, I get it

it's just one of those rage bait comments again

guess what?

your not the first person to try to rage bait others on this server.

[hasty breach]

if you think blizzard in a bottle didnt need a nerf your a lost cause

[lofty phoenix]

you are a lost cause for trying to rage bait

you have no valid arguments, don't you?

[hasty breach]

5 second unavoidable stun is balanced

[lofty phoenix]

It's range it not even big.

[hasty breach]

its unavoidable at close range

[lofty phoenix]

Actually, it's possible to make the user miss like if they get punched right before they throw it.

[hasty breach]

that will never happen

nobody is stupid enough to do that

[lofty phoenix]

Also, are you being satire?

[hasty breach]

no

[lofty phoenix]

your being satire

[hasty breach]

https://tenor.com/view/mustard-str8-lacking-kato-gif-9371728474647510227

[lofty phoenix]

You first say "blizzard in a bottle didnt need a nerf right guys" but then later you say it's unavoidable.

[hasty breach]

@candid charm

This one is very smart

[lofty phoenix]

I can say the same about you

[hasty breach]

it was heh... a joke about how it needed a nerf....

[lofty phoenix]

Like make up your mind, do you want it nerfed or not?

[candid charm]

bro

stop

[heady ice]

hear me out

[hasty breach]

Im sorry

[candid charm]

i thouight it was a update

frifck u bro

[hasty breach]

aw will never update

[heady ice]

make blizzard in a bottle another double jump item

[lofty phoenix]

?

[hasty breach]

I need my unbalanced stun!

[heady ice]

such as cloud in a bottle

[hasty breach]

Buff alchemist

Buff alchemist speed and power potions

[heady ice]

so that way it'll be more like terraira trust

[heady ice]

REAL

[lofty phoenix]

Is this another joke?

[hasty breach]

Buff god punch walkspeed

[heady ice]

MAKE THEM ONE SHOT IF YOU HAVE ONLY HAVE A POWER 1 ONE

[candid charm]

😭

[hasty breach]

Bring back malice before the nerf

[heady ice]

give god punch punch aura

[hasty breach]

Yes

[heady ice]

give dos the ability to fly

at -1 souls and above

[hasty breach]

good idea

[heady ice]

give dos a kill button

trust

[lofty phoenix]

Why do you dislike the suggestion if you want abilities buffed.

[hasty breach]

ur such a robot lmao

[lofty phoenix]

Looks like your a bot for not being able to vome up with valid answers.

[hasty breach]

put 2 and 2 together

[lofty phoenix]

This has nothing to do with the suggestion.

[hasty breach]

you can do it

[lofty phoenix]

So what if i do it

[azure hinge]

this is called "power creep" in games and what this does is that everything eventually keeps becoming more and more op in order to try and balance it gets outta hand

[lofty phoenix]

What are you even talking about? The game has been getting pointless nerfs recently

[azure hinge]

can you atleast read what im saying

[lofty phoenix]

I did but that has nothing to do with Ability Wars

[azure hinge]

he proposed to buff a lot of abilities in the game to maintain balance

are you serious?

you seriously cant relate what i said to the original post

[lofty phoenix]

The suggestion wanted to buff the weak abilities.

[azure hinge]

why buff MULTIPLE weak abilities if you can solve the issue by nerfing ONE ability

[lofty phoenix]

Becuase "ONE abiltiy" is not the problem. The problem is that game has been receiving useless nerfs.

[azure hinge]

useless nerfs?

the abilities were overpowered

[lofty phoenix]

Example of pointless nerf. Removing gingerbread's R ability

Another pointless nerf. Turning magnet from a item ability to a E ability.

[azure hinge]

how is this a nerf

[lofty phoenix]

As a item abiltiy, it's more unique and it's easier to move and control the magnet. With E ability, it's harder to control

[rustic orchid]

More examples of pointless nerfs:

• That one pulse and vampire nerf
• Charging festive's snownall staff physics to make the snowballs way bouncier (not a good thing)

[azure hinge]

pulse and vampire are still considerably really good

and the snowball staff was justified as it was extremely annoying

you could just spam it

and leave if someone gets close

[rustic orchid]

Also, a question
When will midas and unmas ufo be murdered in a dark alleyway (nerfed)

[azure hinge]

i dont know

none of them are a known problem

itll probably get nerfs some time in the future

[rustic orchid]

They are a big, big problem

[azure hinge]

i have literally seen nobody complaining

[rustic orchid]

https://gyazo.com/53362a0a4b5623874eb8c7c994f4a798.gif

[azure hinge]

u can literally just hide under anything if ufo mas chases you

[rustic orchid]

From one corner to the opposite in 6 seconds

[rustic orchid]

Great so either I am forced to remain there or I am fucked

[azure hinge]

is it hard for you to wait a few seconds

[rustic orchid]

Essentially most of the map is cut off because ufo exists

[azure hinge]

or you could go to the little probe and destroy it

[rustic orchid]

Especially if they are targetting you

[rustic orchid]

What if I place it on a tree

[azure hinge]

someone else can get that with a mobility ability

unless ur getting directly targetted by a ufo wherever u go

[rustic orchid]

There are barely any people who actually care enough to snipe the core unless the ufo killed them

[azure hinge]

ar eu srs

be so fr

its literally like an engi build waiting there

[rustic orchid]

Ufo is super fast and has a beam that tears your health apart

[rustic orchid]

From my experience, people don't care u less I killed them

[azure hinge]

u dont get anywhere from describing what it does brutually

you could also just say ufo has a little beam that chips away at your health

is that not true too

[rustic orchid]

Unless you use anything that has some sort of horizontal mobility, getting stuck in the beam is a death sentence

[rustic orchid]

Chip damage is an understatement

It takes one usage of Q to kill a person

It can easily catch up to you

And it has a relatively low cooldown on Q

[azure hinge]

ufo is notoriously known for being difficult to handle while using q

[rustic orchid]

Do you rotate your camera or use WASD

[azure hinge]

wasd

[rustic orchid]

Surprised that you seem to have trouble handling ufo

[azure hinge]

what does that mean

[rustic orchid]

You said ufo is notoriously known for being difficult to handle while using Q

From my expereince, it was very simple

[azure hinge]

ok

[rustic orchid]

Anyways, now midas

Starting strong, aerial E almost completely outclasses grounded E

[azure hinge]

i dont wanna talk anymore

its taking too much time i dont wanna waste

[rustic orchid]

Fair

[fringe valve]

duality

[rustic orchid]

do you have any idea what were the consequenses of removing archer's hitstun btw

[fringe valve]

the archer nerf?

[rustic orchid]

The one that involved removing hitstun

Aka the thing that gives you iframes and makes your M1s not register for like a second after getting hit by certain attacks

Do you have ANY IDEA what that lead to?

[fringe valve]

are you talking about archer spam

[rustic orchid]

I am talking about volley dealing up to 80 damage

[fringe valve]

oh

thats intentional

[rustic orchid]

I'm sorry WHAT

[fringe valve]

well not the 80 damage part

[rustic orchid]

Ok good

Is slicer's enchnated blade upgrade lying to you also intentional?

[fringe valve]

how does it lie to you

[rustic orchid]

It says "enchant your sword, giving it greater attributes"
From testing, it only buffs the knockback, which you do NOT want

[fringe valve]

well the point to upgrade it to an element

[rustic orchid]

Still, enchanted blade feels like a downgrade as it makes locking your enemy in a combo more difficult (especially because slicer can only rely on M1s until one of the penultimate upgrades where it gets an ability)

[fringe valve]

so should it give increased damage instead of kb

[rustic orchid]

Up to you, whatever makes it NOT a downgrade is fine by me

Also, slicer's 1st path ability is super bad

[fringe valve]

rising flames?

[rustic orchid]

Yes, the fire spin ability

It's very bad

[fringe valve]

like its hard to hit or just bad overall

[rustic orchid]

Both

Hard to actually get value and overall bad

Like you're telling me

That this sad excuse of an ability

Is what I have to live with when I pick 1st path?

Anyways, unfortunately, I have to abort this conversation as I have sacrificed way too much sleep time

[fringe valve]

ok

[marsh laurel]

so nerfing shit is the thing that ruins games?

also as timy explained doing as this suggestion asked will cause a power creep

most ppl who uptvoted it either dont get what doing as this suggestion says means

or just want a power creep

if causing a power creep seems ok to you then why dont we make every ability one shot

[marsh laurel]

that would make it all fair dont you think..

not

[glossy canopy]

TP to top

[lofty phoenix]

So you think even buffing weak abilities ruin the game?

[marsh laurel]

ok wait here is an example

lets sayy

plasma

and teleport

plasmas teleport is very good and has 3 charges

teleports teleport sucks atm

so if the devs decide to buff teleport to have lets say 3 charges with the same tp distance

then plasmas mobility is a joke

[marsh laurel]

also buffing multiple weaker abilities

to make a strong one less powerful is not a good option

nerfing the ability that is powerful to be more fair for hte rest is a better option

[hasty breach]

it should make you rise and hover into the air if you hit it 🥹

[rustic orchid]

does he know

[hasty breach]

those who know

[candid charm]

@hasty breach

[hasty breach]

hi

what is it

[candid charm]

[hasty breach]

https://tenor.com/view/mango-cat-dance-ai-dancing-cat-gif-4373280976266621514

[lofty phoenix]

Don't think the dev would go that far. It's never mentioned how strong the buffs are. They don't have to be massive buffs, just small buffs to prevent the weak abilities from being weak.

[marsh laurel]

it would be far simpler to nerf the ability that is too powerful

[empty stratus]

Yeah true, those nerf is too much

[warm tusk]

[lofty phoenix]

what now

[jaunty plover]

SNLEFTITG 💔

[lofty phoenix]

What is that?

[heady ice]

ngl i feel like this would be better received if it pointed out that nerf creep is a thing

[lofty phoenix]

true

[hasty breach]

Buff hivemind 15 times

[warm tusk]

[warm tusk]

[fossil hawk]

And bring back gingerbread r ability

[lofty phoenix]

YEAH!

[fossil hawk]

If not candy cane make it a Large lollipop gang

I made so many suggestion last Christmas

[warm tusk]

yeah i agree totally

[warm tusk]

Peak

[lofty phoenix]

Blood god got a big nerf sadly

Barrier also got nerfed too

At least they buffed ufo mastery 🙂

[heady ice]

reworked*

[heady ice]

i'm in pain

i decided to main barrier like 5 days ago

and they already nerfed it 😭

[warm tusk]

Rework more like, but a staple of the game is now gone

[heady ice]

blood god wasn't a staple??

it was just annoying

i hated being targeted by salty kids using blood god

and once you die to a kid like that they wont leave you alone about it

[urban shard]

Yeah do this but with Hivemind

Hivemind lost it ALL bro

Infection doesn't matter, they're all about punching

If the devs wanted to nerf hivemind with a flipping meter so badly they could have just made it so they couldn't infect until their meter was at 100%

Which then resets once you infect someone

also 136 likes and 2k comments in under a minute

so peak

[heady ice]

yea they ruined hivemind

[wanton pewter]

I'm glad they removed the forced default 1v1 since most of the time I would get brain dead kids come at me with it, it's annoying since it's not fun playing against a trash player it's way more fun if there actually good

[heady ice]

yep

[untold ruin]

wait nvm, what are you on

[fathom quartz]

Source of the problem: they have big egos

They cant let themselves lose agaisnt someone in a 1v1 cuz they wont have excuses to yap about

[wanton pewter]

I'm kinda meh on the hive mind since it was so strong for what it was before the update but I haven't tried the new one yet

[fathom quartz]

I think its self explanatory since the prereworked hivemind users all they did was run when they were on the last phases so this rework will make them more active in fighting

[wanton pewter]

Ya

[fathom quartz]

Most of the hiceminds i met were just camping and stealing kills

[wanton pewter]

But I think alc mastery can Solo them with slowness potions

[fathom quartz]

Now they will not get much value of it

[fathom quartz]

Yes the most broken mastery

Now

What will happen to the minion abilities

[untold ruin]

ok actually just tested the new hivemind, that's a very minor nerf

[fathom quartz]

If a hivemind kills u will u get converted into a minion?

[untold ruin]

hivemind killing people still converts them

and gives the hivemind a decent amount of meter

[fathom quartz]

Just to make the hiveminds less of a runner

[fathom quartz]

Ye but the higher it is the faster it decreases

[wanton pewter]

Oh didn't know that

[fathom quartz]

U have to constantly punch people if u are on the last phases

I think plasma is lowk the best ability

Better than midas

[wanton pewter]

I mean I'm glad they made it like that since I don't have to deal with a hive mind that runs away

[fathom quartz]

Damage defense and mobility

[fathom quartz]

Thats the main reason i think

[wanton pewter]

Ya probably

So how fast does it drain?

[fathom quartz]

I dont know i saw the decibrics aw upd

U can simply see it by yourself u can see it drains faster

[urban shard]

justice for hivemind

[urban shard]

sorta

[fathom quartz]

Ye ik hivemind is less annoying to play agaisnt but now is very annoying to play with

They should make it so the infection bar lasts longer

U cant be 5 seconds in your final form dawg😭

Plus the whole server is targetting u so if u try to fight everyone is jumping u💔

Atp just use default

[echo snow]

I never understood this suggestion until they nerfed snow

[fathom quartz]

Nerf miner ahh

Literally

🥀

Seems balanced, buff plasma

[wise pelican]

I understood snows nerf

Snow + trophy was

Server destroying

Snow just needs

A complete rework

[echo snow]

That was removed months ago

[wise pelican]

Did it get

Nerfed again or something?

[echo snow]

Yeah

[wise pelican]

Ok then nvm

[echo snow]

Now the small snow balls only hit once

[wise pelican]

Nerf miner ass change

[lofty phoenix]

Hivemind had it worse.

[wise pelican]

Hivemind is gonna probably get buffed anyways

But hivemind was already

Up with dos as strongest ability in the game

And was stronger than dos for a while

But rn it’s kinda bad after the change

[lofty phoenix]

It had been nerfed in this update, the user is forced to keeping punching players or they lose power. That makes it a huge downgrade compare to dos.

[wise pelican]

I think hivemind should need more punches per phase now

But

Once you level up

You can’t go under

[lofty phoenix]

I think that's better

[wise pelican]

Yeah so

You can play defensively as

You won’t be downgrading you’ll just

Get to 0% in your phase

But

Phases are longer

Hivemind gets punished pretty hard for running now it’s

Kinda really bad for the type of ability it is

I think it’s still strong though but

Dos is in another league now

[lofty phoenix]

It's not a top tier ability anymore.

[wise pelican]

Nah it probably still is just

Not ontop

[lofty phoenix]

It's completely outclassed by dos.

[wise pelican]

My SS tier rn is

Dos, Midas

With UFO mastery being

In a SSS tier

Pre update

SS tier was

Hivemind, DoS, Bloodgod, Unmastered ufo, Midas

[lofty phoenix]

After the update, it's probably B tier.

[wise pelican]

Ironic ufo mastery and unmastered ufo

Swapped places on my list

Well I dropped unmastered ufo all the way to C tier I think it’s

That bad now

Biggest ability fall off since telepunch removal and no one’s talking about it

[lofty phoenix]

Hivemind could possibly be C tier due to how reliant it is on punching players.

[wise pelican]

Nah it’s

Not that bad

Once it snowballs it’s pretty much good

Also it’s even more

Noob reliant now

Which is good for it

Plus phase 0 hivemind isn’t even that bad

Still a buffed default with lifesteal

[hollow zephyr]

KINDA? THEY MASSACRED HIVEMIND AFTER ASKING NOBODY IF THEY WANTED HIVEMIND TO GET AHNIHILATED.

[warm tusk]

It literally freaking doesn't though

Also why are people only finding out about how op snow is now?

[wise pelican]

Where are these people?

[split socket]

bring bloodgod back to it's former glory

the hivemind was also

uh

not the best rework

not saying revert it but uh

make it better

[solar socket]

im practically a barrier main and I want the passive entirely removed

[heady ice]

why?

[solar socket]

because u do nothing and it blocks 90% of projectiles

so most abilities are default against barrier

[heady ice]

i like it

helps against projectile spamming running nerds

[marsh laurel]

this makes hivemind less of a runner more of an aggression based ability

[marsh laurel]

no

[hollow zephyr]

does aggression mean make yourself back into a puny speck of dust because you didnt punch people enough within the last 20 seconds?

IMAGINE IF DOS GOT THAT TREATMENT

DIDNT KILL ANYONE WITHIN THE LAST 20 SECONDS? BOOM -1 SOUL

THEY ONLY CARE ABOUT TURNING HIVEMIND INTO AN EVEN MORE PATHETIC SHADOW OF DOS

"but think about the punch costs!" you bore me

HIVEMIND BACK THEN COULD BE AS AGGRESSIVE AS IT WANTED

WHY? BECAUSE MAYBE GETTING MELEE KILLS MADE HIVEMIND STRONG ENOUGH TO GET MORE MELEE KILLS

NOW

GETTING MELEE KILLS DOES NOTHING

NOTHING OTHER THAN SPAWNING A BRAINDEAD RESETTING MINION

SPEAKING OF KILLS

THEY KILLED HIVEMIND AS A WHOLE

KEEP IN MIND THAT THIS ENTIRE POST IS ABOUT NOT NERFING EVERYTHING TO THE GROUND

[tribal pasture]

calm down cuh

[urban shard]

As a pre-overhaul, and post-overhaul Hivemind main, you need to calm down

[hollow zephyr]

alright 2 people will convince me

im calm

[warm tusk]

145 best suggestion

[lofty phoenix]

what

[marsh laurel]

hivemind imo was made to be more aggressive then dos

the meter encourages mass aggression

[hollow zephyr]

https://tenor.com/view/joker-jonkler-tooth-teeth-baby-gif-5600005109081482885

[hollow zephyr]

of course you bring up dos

[hollow zephyr]

see this

[marsh laurel]

my point is tho that hivemind is an aggression based ability the meter is encouraging aggression

[hollow zephyr]

read 2 messages below it

[marsh laurel]

if dos got that treatment then that would be just purely absurd imo

since for hivemind it kind of makes sense?

since what if the infection requires you to be a mass killer and puncher at all times

[hollow zephyr]

the infect wasnt about hitting

infection is about getting the last hit

never hitting

(some of) hiveminds previous aggression came from swooping in and infecting low health players

if you want to barge into battles to hit people enough to get stronger

play defender mastery

we dont need 2 phase abilities that rely on the hitting part

[marsh laurel]

i am a hivemind main and i dont mind the infection meter that much

[hollow zephyr]

we need one phase ability that relies on the killing by any circumstances, one by hitting, and one by "killing" via last punch

[marsh laurel]

since one it fits my playstyle

[hollow zephyr]

i do

say let me grab something from another argument i have

@small raft hi

you ok?

[hollow zephyr]

get back here

do you even know why they nerfed hivemind?

sorry ill add a question mark

now it's been made clear i want you to answer me, most recent person ive been arguing with

i will take no answer as an ive (me) been successfully engagement baited

[marsh laurel]

sorry wha was playing fnb

i had to lock in

[hollow zephyr]

oh

[hollow zephyr]

makes sense

[marsh laurel]

maybe its because its too op for 4k punches

any new player can get their hands on it and go berserk with it

[hollow zephyr]

hm

[marsh laurel]

really tho

it takes not too long

pre update

for a new player to get hivemind

[hollow zephyr]

yeah

[marsh laurel]

and then be a menace to the server

[hollow zephyr]

does that mean said new player will be undoubtedly good with hivemind

[marsh laurel]

its practiclly an ability u will 60% will get before getting 4k punches

[marsh laurel]

nope

simply it would be way too good for such a low cost

also this new change encourages new players

to play pretty aggressively

[hollow zephyr]

i can only suppose mystery (since HM appears to not have any abilities) comes with discovery and eventually the new person will get better

[hollow zephyr]

did they change bloodsucker or something

when i play as aggressive as ever i can't even hold on to 5 charges (or die trying to get higher)

just constant shifts between music and no music

[marsh laurel]

prob not

[hollow zephyr]

i had to elaborate

[marsh laurel]

its either me adapting too quickly to the new infection meter or smt else

i have quite alot of hot takes in this game

such as blood gods new E being better

[hollow zephyr]

which e

did it get better from

[marsh laurel]

the e before this update

[hollow zephyr]

im certain it got better than the pit

oh the most previous change

i havent seen that one yet

[marsh laurel]

my only problem is

its really dependent if the opponent is ragdolled

like really dependent

[hollow zephyr]

hold on im gonna see the newest e

[hollow zephyr]

ohhhh

they made bone but consistent

and with climbing walls

[marsh laurel]

ues

yes

[split socket]

yes

[marsh laurel]

why should we bring back old bg

[split socket]

it's literally just better

easy 1v1

it's a test of skill

"oh but bloodgod gets more hp" they could've just made both people spawn at full hp then

[marsh laurel]

1 its annoying to get blood godded every 5 secs when ur tryna do smt
2 no one uses it as an ability its used out of spite
3 new bg is better then old bg

[split socket]

1. skill issue
2. I used it alot
3. that's an opinion

and now even less poeple will usei t

[marsh laurel]

if the core mechanic of bg is to force ppl into a "fair" 1v1 without abilities in a game centered around abilities its not a good core mechanic

[split socket]

seems like a fun gimmick to me, to each their their own tho

[marsh laurel]

if it was truely a fun gimmick 307 ppl last time i checked wouldent have upvoted crits suggestion

[split socket]

it's a good ability for practicing raw combat

[split socket]

could you link that suggestion

[marsh laurel]

no longer exists

[split socket]

I don't know what critical hits have to do with htis

[marsh laurel]

big C

the community mod

u dumbass

[split socket]

well you forgot to add an apostrophe so I had no way of knowing

[lofty phoenix]

1. If you have decent skills, it's not big deal, that's how I defeated countless blood god users in their realms.
2. It's not always the case, sometimes, players use it for playful 1v1s, it's sometimes used to counter teamers, it is sometimes used to counter runners. It is also somtimes used to counter spammers.
3. All they did with the "rework" is turing E ability into a AOE attack and buffing Q ability before calling it a day. The old one is better becuase it's more unique.

[marsh laurel]

the new one is better because its actually ok to go up against

[lofty phoenix]

But the old one is better becuase it's more special. It has the ability to 1v1 someone. The new one is just a AOE attack.

[marsh laurel]

just because bg is "special" does not mean its fun to go up against

[lofty phoenix]

Duelist from slap battles has the ability to 1v1 and no one complained about it.

[marsh laurel]

bringing up another games glove/ability not being complained about does not justify bg being an annoying 1v1 ability

[lofty phoenix]

you're right I guess

[lofty phoenix]

In your opinion, for me. Blood god users are fun to fight against

[wise pelican]

Even if you’re good at playing checkers (default fighting) the blood god can just

Run at you immediately and grab you again

And will do it over and over again and

Effectively gatekeep you from

Actually playing the game

Worst part is I wouldn’t even have unmastered ufo in its completely busted state to bully and hard counter them now

Mastered it is

[warm tusk]

😔

[warm tusk]

😔

[leaden hazel]

New bg peak

In my opinion no need to remove now

[lofty phoenix]

Why you think that?

[leaden hazel]

Many reasons not annoying dosent remove your ability less buggy a decent ability with the q buff so it's not all just the domain

[lofty phoenix]

We all know the domain is more unique than a AOE attack.

[lofty phoenix]

If you defeat the blood god user enough times, the blood god user will give up and use another ability.

Almost any ability with a passive like soda, tank mushroom, and reaper can counter the blood god user in their realm

[lofty phoenix]

You only mention my third point but not by first and second point. Also, not everyone dislikes fighting blood god users.

[marsh laurel]

you want my response?

then sure

[marsh laurel]

1 having decent skills does not mean its not a big deal u can be targetted by some jackass for hours on end because u angered them
2 even its still used out of spite

[lofty phoenix]

thanks

[lofty phoenix]

1 Blood god users don't target the same person for so long unless you did something wrong. 2 That's only one use. It has many other uses besides spite.

[marsh laurel]

1 blood god mains are easily annoyed by the slightest thing punch them on accident? kill them once for any purpose whether its dos hivemind or defender levels? then your doomed
2 yes it has other uses but its mostly used out of spite

[wise pelican]

Even if you body a blood god

I don’t know what kind of blood gods you’re fighting but

No they will

Literally be on you for

Over an hour

[lofty phoenix]

1 From my experience, most of the time after I defeat a blood god user once, they just move on to someone else. 2 Does it really make the ability that bad?

[marsh laurel]

1 from most of my expirences the second i do something as small as punching them once warrants a witchhunt for me
2 yes it does

[lofty phoenix]

Most of the time, that does not happen

[lofty phoenix]

1 So you can't just make the blood god user rage quit? 2 Most of the time, it's used for not spite but for 1v1s and to counter teamers, spammers, and runners.

[marsh laurel]

1 i simply dont want to spend ages just to make a single person quit over the fact i hurt the feelings
2 the 1v1 aspect without any abilities and being nerfed was the reason why the domain was removed

if bg was truly seen by most of the community as fun

then e wouldent be reworked

[lofty phoenix]

You know it's wrong to hurt someone's feelings.

[echo blade]

ur on discord....

[untold ruin]

you dont need to hurt someone's feelings to make them ragequit

[lofty phoenix]

I never said that

[lofty phoenix]

So?

[lofty phoenix]

There are suggestions asking to bring back domian.

[lofty phoenix]

Also, why would you hurt someone's feelings in the first place?

[marsh laurel]

yet bringing it back will also bring back the problems

[marsh laurel]

buddy most bg users feelings get hurt the second they get punched

[untold ruin]

i should make a suggestion to not bring back the domain

[marsh laurel]

the only good suggestion that brings back bgs e actually makes it a good 1v1 ability

rather then a targetting tool

[echo blade]

the domain lowk ruins the purpose of aw

[lofty phoenix]

Doesn't that apply to players in general, not just blood god user?

[wise pelican]

Get a higher punch count

And see what happens

Well no anymore cuz it’s gone but

Once you break 1million

People will

Not stop with that

[lofty phoenix]

So you're telling me that any player with over a million punches gets targeted non stop?

[echo blade]

wait @lofty phoenix aren't that one guy that said don't nerf UFO cuz it's fun?

[marsh laurel]

bg users are the most easily angered individuals i seen one in general even wished community members death does that not show what type of ppl use this ability

[marsh laurel]

...

eitherway i cannot argue any longer due to the fact that i must go sleep

[wise pelican]

Not a guarantee but the odds of someone loop targeting you with blood god

Gets WAY higher with more punches

[echo blade]

gn

[lofty phoenix]

Yup

[marsh laurel]

ok so lets buff dos to make it too op because its not fun

does that make sense?

[echo blade]

gng your ideas are shit

[lofty phoenix]

Being toxic does not proof you're right

[echo blade]

it's not toxicism it's the truth

[echo blade]

you'd rather to make every existing ability op cuz it's "fun" huh

balancing a game is important.

and UFO is busted as hell and needs to be nerfed

[lofty phoenix]

150 people agreed with this suggestion, not just me.

[lofty phoenix]

If the game needed nerfs so much, most people would have disagreed

[echo blade]

I'm not saying that this suggestion is wrong

[lofty phoenix]

You just did

[echo blade]

cuz sometimes the devs nerf abilities that don't need a nerf

I'm just saying that the shit you said about UFO is wrong

[lofty phoenix]

Yeah, that happens

[lofty phoenix]

You're forgetting that the suggestion to rebalanced UFO Mastery got a lot of dislikes.

Becuase people like UFO Mastery how it is and does not need more nerfs.

[echo blade]

either way UFO needs a nerf

[lofty phoenix]

either way UFO does not need a nerf.

[echo blade]

and maybe a buff to stealth mode cuz is shit

[lofty phoenix]

SO TRUE

It does not do anything helpful

All it does is make it see through and move slower.

[leaden hazel]

Nope sometimes they just feel like ragebaiting

[warm tusk]

People arguing in this suggestion is exactly what I wanted to happrn

150 best suggestion

[lofty phoenix]

What?

[leaden hazel]

Blood gods sometimes target to rage bait sometimes they pick someone and then just hard target them to ragebait

[lofty phoenix]

Impressive

[sinful berry]

To whoever just immediately "x emojied" my now deleted comment, fuck you.

Can't have shit in ability wars

[untold ruin]

❌

[warm tusk]

[glossy canopy]

🇽

[hoary rune]

solution

dont nerf abilities

that dont need nerfs

[lofty phoenix]

What comment?

[lofty phoenix]

True

[warm tusk]

I feel for you twin, like 26 people disliked my suggestion 😔 💔

[heady ice]

i can't dislike this 😭

[echo snow]

Snow :(

[woeful sleet]

swear they nearfed seat a cupple times somehow i main seat and i dont understand it just works worse and worse every update

[warm tusk]

[marsh laurel]

your suggestion is just a power creep suggestion

[lofty phoenix]

What's "power creep"?

[marsh laurel]

. @lofty phoenix

[sinful berry]

Easy to obtain =/= should be weak. Difficult to obtain = should be strong.

[marsh laurel]

nope

[heady ice]

by =/= you mean =~ right?

~=*

[leaden hazel]

How about this

All all equally strong

Harder to obtain are more complex

Easier to obtain are simpler

This is kinda what it already is

[sinful berry]

If that's the symbol for "does not equal" then yeah.

[heady ice]

okay yea

[warm tusk]

[lofty phoenix]

What now?

[warm tusk]

IM BUMPING THE SUGGESTION

[lofty phoenix]

What's your opinion on blood god? now that there's a R ability.

[warm tusk]

Fine

[warm tusk]

[warm tusk]

[young oar]

i wonder what they will do next time

last update ruined bug god this update ruined hoj who's next?

[uneven schooner]

jeff bezos

[young oar]

i am ok to these changes bc i am a dos main keep nerfing everything and let me get first phase much easier

0-15 was harder at the back but since everything nerfed to ground dos is easier

[young oar]

yea nerf jeff bezos he is way to op

[uneven schooner]

the next thing you know was the dos was already gone right after i joined minute later

[young oar]

wdym

[uneven schooner]

It's literally not that hard to take a single kill on one

sure it would take some minutes but that doen't really comparing to what efforts dos have made

[young oar]

yeah game became extremely skill based i can destroy average players with 0-14 souls while they using much better abilities(atleast they need to be better)

skill is way more important than the abilities in a game named ability wars

[uneven schooner]

dos isn't actually much of a threat

it's just our "responsibilities"

to kill it

[young oar]

yes people should teamwork

killing a dos alone should be very hard

[uneven schooner]

here's the thing, I don't want it to be my responsibility

[young oar]

but killing a dos with a few souls should be too easy too i think

but bc every ability is weak or nerfed to ground people cant even kill dosses with a few spuls

[uneven schooner]

It's not like most of the people listens anyways, Right when i turn my head to dos A random user punch my face and disturbing the chase

[young oar]

tbh rather than nerfing dos i think they need to buff everything that are weak

[uneven schooner]

in the worst case was basically they're both teamming

[young oar]

most dos users are 14k operator badge beggers and they mostly not a treat even if they have a friend

[uneven schooner]

trusts me, they're gonna get greedy later

and that's where the part they started killing me

[marsh laurel]

what if we add woman to ability wars

would surely make the game unbalanced

[young oar]

i mostly steal their souls and they ragequit

[uneven schooner]

There was already one

not an ability but a person of "interest"

[marsh laurel]

i was litterally at 0 souls and killed a dos with 35 souls

no alchemist

[young oar]

i stole a 300 with alchemist

[uneven schooner]

https://tenor.com/view/generalgory-waterloo-napoleon-napoleonic-roblox-gif-20732044

[young oar]

people are weird

[young oar]

fr

he couldve use any stone to escape from death

[uneven schooner]

i can't believe a summon minion with the best base stats was soap

[young oar]

good dmg good speed

lol

[uneven schooner]

Fastest minion
Most durable minion
Dealing the highest damages out all minions
Have the ability to flys up
Leaving a trail of soap dealing little damages

[young oar]

buff robot and saber fr

[uneven schooner]

no lie but robot is op

[paper galleon]

Saber yes, but robot is already op enough

[uneven schooner]

getting hit by a wrench is like getting slap into the real world.

[young oar]

robot has a punching mechanic?

[young oar]

frrr

i mean the robot E

[paper galleon]

No, instead, it does kick you and oneshots you

[young oar]

i thought it was using telekinesis mb

[paper galleon]

Dw

[uneven schooner]

robot minions used to get their own speed boosts everytime they get some hits

[rose geyser]

if that gets re-added, i'm going insane

[marsh laurel]

send this without context

[heady ice]

i can't unsupper react this 😭

[lavish bison]

i agree with the idea but not the method

personally i think the devs should be able to nerf things

without making them unplayable like bomb mastery

[tribal pasture]

reason i quit the game

straight up

i loved prime army mastery

spent weeks grinding it out a bit at a time

just for them to butcher it

[rustic orchid]

army had it coming ngl

you just sent your goons after a guy and then had to do nothing

[tribal pasture]

they could have made the marker have limited range and go away after some time

[rustic orchid]

nah, gotta make the players actually PLAY THE GAME

[tribal pasture]

i ended up not playing the game after they nerfed it

ever again'

[rustic orchid]

Not like you were even playing the game in the first place

Just send your goons, sit back and relax while they do all the work

[fossil vine]

nerf the meta abilities to the ground, not smth like deflect

[fossil vine]

army main

rest in piss

[fathom quartz]

It was needed u could literally sit in a corner and send ur minions to target everyone u wanted

[warm tusk]

I agree

They listened ig for this update

[warm tusk]

Real

[warm tusk]

Real

[full nest]

start buffing everything, give brickbattler more weapons, make engi's cars instantly send you to the void, make plasma's laser deal 95-110 damage, make time map-sized again, make mech have a viable punch hitbox, make void's tentacle even harder to dodge, make freeze's E hitbox linger even longer

[fathom quartz]

Balanced ngl

[full nest]

the only serious buff in that message is giving mech a usable punch

seriously bro mech's terrible up close

[lofty phoenix]

That's so true!

[warm tusk]

I KNOW RIGHT

[warm tusk]

Agreed

[brittle python]

nerf everything

[urban shard]

Including Mage?

[brittle python]

in a way i'd like :)

[main cedar]

JESUS

OVER

2800 MESSAGES

GOD DAMN

[urban shard]

I’d say just give it 5 second cooldowns each time an ability is used, to prevent cheap combos

[brittle python]

lemme cook up a Mage nerf

this'll make the ability balanced

[main cedar]

mage mastery

[brittle python]

fuck you

[main cedar]

turns u into

[brittle python]

that kills the ability

[urban shard]

T_T

[main cedar]

white mage from final fantasy

[brittle python]

ok

basically

if you punch a mage

they lose 5 mana

this is definitely a massive nerfg

but can be worked around with skill

[urban shard]

I’d say its still fair

[brittle python]

so it only serves to make Mage more skill based

[main cedar]

m a g e m a s t er y w i t h b l a c k h o l e s p e l l a n d t a x e s s p e l l

[brittle python]

while keeping what makes it good

[urban shard]

Personally, if I HAVE to nerf Hivemind, I’d make it so uh

Straight up revert the meter to pre-this-update

As a Hivemind main, that drain is WAY too slow

Especially considering you already stop draining at musical stages

And it wont be THAT bad as long as you play Hivemind aggressively like intended

[brittle python]

yess

[urban shard]

Honestly I think its for the best😭

Hivemind is TOO op at this point

It’ll be balanced by reverting the drain

[brittle python]

but theres hivemind kids

people complain like SHIT whenever this ability is changed

[urban shard]

Im not even gonna hold you I was one of those kids💔🥀

Not in the sense that im underaged but like

In the sense I complained HARD about Hivemind nerfs n stuff

[brittle python]

hivemind kids 💔

always using hivemind and getting all pissy once its slightly nerfed loll

"hivemind was skill"

[warm tusk]

People talking 🤤

[warm tusk]

No keep talking please boost this suggestion 🙏

[warm tusk]

167

167 best suggestion

[lofty phoenix]

What do you think are the odds of this suggestion being added to ability wars?

[main cedar]

-6789101112131415161718192021222324252662728293031323334353637383940414243444546474849505152535455565758596061626364656667

%

[warm tusk]

Like 0

[fathom quartz]

Practically 0%

[warm tusk]

Yeah

[marsh laurel]

odds are that checken wont add this suggestion or he will add it but fuck it up one way or another

[brittle python]

Please start nerfing everything

Overcharge

Lava

Magnet Mas

Custom

Most importantly Rabbit

Then lastly Mage

[median shore]

Why not Nerf operator quest 10 and make It 100 souls

[mossy bough]

Skill issue

It has already been nerfed last upd

[median shore]

To 200?

[mossy bough]

Yes

[median shore]

Listen tho

The low people servers dont even help and plus there are 6

Theres a 1% they help

[mossy bough]

Then do it without help

200 is easy to get

[median shore]

I am buns

[echo snow]

Nerf sit emote

[untold ruin]

give everyone sit emote 🙂

[split socket]

bump

WHY REMOVED THE VENDIGN MACHINE

WHYYY

[heady ice]

i hate pap

now i can not waste my 1.1mil+ punches on it just to have a some what fair fight :D

[keen sapphire]

Is this like, the new nerf gp suggestion?

we NERF things to balance them

And idk if you knew this

When things are broken, they are unfun to play against

And most nerfs were just anti annoying slthung

[heady ice]

also theres a thing called power creep

and theres a thing called nerf creep

so they can't nerf stuff too much

but they need to nerf stuff too

[keen sapphire]

Power creep is smth that is over said

The best abilities are still the old ass seasonals and plasma

[heady ice]

fair but look at shit battles

they have crazy power creep

but i do think rn we are starting to get to the nerf creep part where everything is so bad that they need to nerf better stuff

[keen sapphire]

But us the ability warriors dont

[heady ice]

yuh

cause we got devs that kinda care about balance

sb takes the community's intake (which is a horrible idea for that kind of a community)

[fierce flame]

hivemind is too op like that other guy said

im not even that good with it and i can consistently reach rebirth unless the server is filled with godsends for hivemind

[brittle python]

Yeah

[heady ice]

the nerf with hivemind is the targeters trust

[urban shard]

Happy Halloween chat

[sleek quail]

They need to nerf hivemind tho i swear that thing has extra reach

[rigid apex]

this thread was active all the time for 4 months 😭

[formal epoch]

Because the reach is relative to the size

[urban shard]

To add onto this—I think Hivemind naturally NEEDS to have more range when first starting so that the range can properly increase according to size.

[keen sapphire]

Along with the other things you have to remember hive is also decently faster making where he is according to you pretty different from where he is according to you (like dos)

[warm tusk]

[warm tusk]

[steady crow]

grapple is one of the abilities that actually needed a nerf
E being hitscan didn't need skill, it was just a free kill if you ledgecamped

learning to use projectiles actually needs skill
learn a lesson from crafter or vampire for once

unless it's a homing/controllable projectile (custom)

[rustic orchid]

Archer for long range

[steady crow]

true

[rustic orchid]

I will not forgive checken for leaving volley unnerfed for 7 months

[steady crow]

i do agree that some weaker things should be buffed instead of somewhat powerful things being nerfed but grapple is an extremely bad example

gingerbread is an example of what should be done with the candy cane boomerang being added back

[echo snow]

My only complain with grapple (overhaul) is that E is still quite buggy

[clever quest]

me when i am forced to play all of the 92/93 (i forgot) abilities

[clever quest]

every non hitscan besides cards takes skill

[woven cloud]

was grapple hitscan before?

[sinful berry]

Hasn't been nerfed hard enough. Ever since it's own nerf, engineer has not been worth 300 souls. I'd honestly even go as far as to say it's only worth 70.

I understand why engineer was nerfed, and I have come to accept it, but the requirements should be reduced to accommodate.

Modern Engineer is only good as a support class. Granted, it's the best support class in the game, but it's still only a support class.

[rustic orchid]

That would be alch mas

Alch mas is the best support

[steady crow]

are you forgetting ufo

specifically the beast that is ufo mastery

base ufo is ass