mitigate agl exploit

[blazing flower]

somehow my message was deleted ...

I was saying I've seen some people use AGL for indirect fire 2km away with great accuracy and no spotting

I believe they're using a software for that

as demonstrated in this video

Maybe adding some recoil to the AGL, or increasing spread would mitigate a bit

apparently posting videos is forbidden so search "Guide To MK19/AGS-17 INDIRECT FIRE | Squad Tutorial" on youtube/google

[cinder elk]

You need link perms to post a link

[loud dawn]

another "aiming up is an exploit" thread

[split bay]

*Regardless of their weight, AGLs are still highly effective, and the Mark 19 is capable of indirect fire up to 2,200 metres, a role traditionally reserved for mortars. *

So....... no

[split bay]

Actually, i looked at the video you named and yes I agree that's an exploit because another process is used to provide your crosshair

But overall, a AGS should be able to hit targets 2km out so it could be a question of reworking the sights to be usable in-game for that purpose

🤷‍♂️

[loud dawn]

the crosshair isnt necessary to do the indirect fire, people have shared timing charts to range by flight-time. and to my knowledge external crosshairs arent considered exploits or disallowed by owi

aforementioned timing chart:

[proper dagger]

Me remembering all the videos of Ukrainians and Russians doing exactly this to good effect

Me remembering my SSM being part of a proof of concept trial to do this with a GMG on an RWS, which resulted in an ask for an indirect fire mode due to how effective it was.

IMO this isn't an exploit. It's a legitimate use of the weapon. If it's too effective right now, it's entirely due to the lack of meaningful dispersion on these weapons.

A while ago I suggested a dispersion increase on all automatic vehicle weapons and emplacements. Especially HE projectiles which have significantly lower BC than AP rounds. If they bite it would take care of this.

[blazing flower]

setting aside the "it's a cheat" debate, currently ingame people are using it with this kind of software and the accuracy is similar to a mortar at 2k.

which feels really weird when you're on the receiving side

i'm not talking about people bracketing the target with a spotter, which would be 100% fine

i'm talking about a guy who puts his squad marker on a target and consistently lands grenades within a few meters immediately, anywhere within the range

faster than a squadcalc assisted expert mortar user

i doubt the IRL spread of a AGL is that good due to the vibrations

except the RWS version maybe, but people are mainly using the deployable or open top version for this

also regarding the range, most weapons have their range scaled down in squad

real life 81mm mortar will hit up to 5km so that the whole map

tow 3k

real life mk19 can fire at 2k but that doesnt mean it should in squad

[blazing flower]

i fail to see how that would allow you to aim practically ?

[loud dawn]

that's a problem with your own creativity/problem solving

[hard crag]

ilovefarming people with agl!!

[austere herald]

pertty sure it's a customized crosshair, which use the angle of arm as reference to distance.

which should not be count as exploit

[blazing flower]

just add a bit of recoil to the AGL to prevent this, it's not rocket science.

[strange magnet]

the ONLY problem i see here is that if you want to use a grenade launcher the way a grenade launcher was literally designed for, you have to use third party crosshairs. there is literally a ranging table for indirect fire on the top of the ags17 lol

[strange magnet]

it is 100% intentional. the mk19 has an intentionally engineered oscillation that it spreads the rounds so that the limits of the wound radii are just touching, maximizing its lethality

[strange magnet]

thats literally what mortars do? might be faster than squadcalc, but theres literally nothing stopping you from using the range table for mortars and doing the exact same thing.

[blazing flower]

well mortars are designed for indirect fire and have an aiming device ingame

this requires an overlay crosshair, which you may or may not consider is cheating

[loud dawn]

it does not require an overlay crosshair

an overlay crosshair is a convenience not a necessity

[strange magnet]

agls are designed for indirect fire as well, and have an aiming device partially implemented in game. theres a literal table for ranging the ags17 for indirect fire. if OWI maybe added the ability to range in the AGLs, or an ability to measure angle, as is done IRL, it wouldnt be an issue.

do i need to upload the mk19 operator manual?

if you want to nerf the indirect fire calculator bullshit in this game, add wind that affects projectiles. barely affect bullets, but will make rpgs, mortars, and AGLs less precise, although agls will retain more precision than mortars since theyre less affected by wind

[strange magnet]

i've personally downloaded the "exploit" and tested it in the range. in theory, its not cheating. its not reading the games memory, nor looking at your screen. its literally just running basic kinematic equations, and calculates the angular lead required. since you give it an FOV as well as pixel count, it can place a crosshair X amount of pixels down. 🤷‍♂️

[proper dagger]

IRL use of this exact strategy happens as follows.

Place AGL
Put post in ground
Reference the issued firing table
Measure and mark post for ranges
Shoot.

[charred stag]

This calulcator and similar calculators Ive seen will just require OWI deliberation on whether these external tools count as cheats or not

It will boil down to - does drawing reticles on your screen by a third party software count as cheating

[blazing flower]

recoil pretty much fixed the issue for the time being

agl range still needs to be reduced to 800m or something

[gilded stirrup]

Current range is only limited by the projectile lifespan being capped by default at 20s. So it auto-despawn around 4230m, but theorically its 230m/s velocity it should have 5400m range.

if AGL with custom crosshairs is considered a problem, there's several way to handle it :

• Nerfing the projectile lifespan from 20s to 10s. This will keep the same velocity for direct fire, and make max range around 2km.
• Nerfing velocity from 230m/s to 190/200, it will have no impact on range since its projectile lifespan that is capping it right now but will at least make horizontal spread a bit bigger
• Nerfing MOA from 50 to 100 : almost no impact on direct fire but long arch shots will be way more spread

[strange magnet]

moa nerf will help ngl. the splash radius of the agl is massive. nerfing the moa would make it cover a huge area and still be able to kill most things

[gilded stirrup]

Yeah I added it here but honestly increasing MOA might actually be a buff 🫢

[rocky pumice]

Increasing MOA/spread would just buff them. I would recommend a velocity decrease and/or a splash radius decrease.

[gilded stirrup]

thing is we probably only want to target indirect fire, direct fire is fine. Hurting spash/velocity would affect both

[split bay]

Dispersion over time (read: air turbulence)