give BTR-82AM/T for motorized RGF faction

[leaden tree]

Do they even need it

Like genuinely why do so many people in game think Russia needs more buffs

[leaden tree]

Will you all not be fucking happy until Russia has tactical nukes?

[calm fiber]

Stop grumble, he just offered new vehicle for variety

Hopefully then 2A28 on BTR82A still be == to 2A28 on BTR82AM/T, unlike 2A42 != 2A42 on BMP-2 and BMP-2M

[leaden tree]

The Russians don't need it though

They're already one of the strongest IFV factions up with China

They've gotten nothing but buffs for the past couple of years

[calm fiber]

Issues with armor balance

[leaden tree]

What fucking issues

What issues bro

[calm fiber]

BMPs and BTRs - not a cardboard vehicles how they should be

[leaden tree]

The only issue they have right now is the fact that the base BMP-2 ATGM is nearly unusable but that also applies to the Iran faction

[leaden tree]

Vehicles that infamously lack armor lacks armor

[calm fiber]

Nah, they've got silently nerfed in past years. They have increased overheating on main guns

[chilly plank]

What do you mean they don’t need it? The vehicle is there, this isn’t something fictional. For example, the BTR-80 and BTR-82A have the exact same armor strength and health, while we have different LAVs with varying armor layouts, thickness, and health.

[leaden tree]

They fucking haven't

God you Russian nationalists are the worst

All you want is more broken shit for the russians

Meanwhile you ignore the fact they have the BMP-2M and BMP-3

[calm fiber]

Did someone said that?

[leaden tree]

Fucking scout drones

[chilly plank]

Why you making it as political statement?.. wheter he is russian or not, the suggestion is valid

[leaden tree]

The BTR-82 is one of the best wheeled IFVs in the game

[leaden tree]

It aint

It fucking isnt

[chilly plank]

You just accused his as russian nationalist

[leaden tree]

They don't need more fucking vehicles

[calm fiber]

I'm going to cry to the mods now)

[chilly plank]

This is stupid we all can agree on. But thus has nothing to do with the thread

[leaden tree]

My point is is that Russia doesn't need anymore content

For now

They've probably gotten the most content out of all factions in the past few years

[chilly plank]

But the devs keep giving them new infantry weapons and so on. While I agree that this is unnecessary, adding armor is justified, as long as it’s not something fictitious.

[leaden tree]

Do they really need it?

[calm fiber]

Why not? China already have something like this

[leaden tree]

Cause Russia is already a good enough faction?

[calm fiber]

Yep it's good already, but you can also change the balance

[leaden tree]

But at that point you'd just be adding a ridiculously powerful vehicle especially the one with the ATGMS to faction that's already strong without it

It'd be like if I suggested giving the US army the Stryker with a javelin

[calm fiber]

OWI simply cannot or do not want to implement them. But why don't you suggest Striker with Bushmaster II (Mark 44 as I remember)?

[leaden tree]

Cause the US army doesn't need it

[chilly plank]

Why not

[chilly plank]

Why not javelin first?

[leaden tree]

I ain't against the idea of a javelin but there needs to be a massive trade off

[chilly plank]

Before javelin. They should added thermal vics sight first for balance

[leaden tree]

It should be done at the same time, cause I'm frankly tired of OWI changing stuff for something they're not gonna add right away

[chilly plank]

And perhaps only for light and support unit

[leaden tree]

TOW nerf

[leaden tree]

Yes it should come at the cost of no MBTs

Which is fair

[chilly plank]

We can talk about other new mechanics, such as thermals, Javelins, mortar vehicles, MANPADS, etc., that require an overhaul of game mechanics. But for now, adding a new vehicle that already fits into existing mechanics, such as the BTR-82AT with add-on armor, is reasonable, especially considering the LAV-6 and Coyote already exist in the same way.

[deep kelp]

It's almost easly fucked by m2 Stryker

[deep kelp]

In Wheeled faction ye?

[leaden tree]

You're bad at the game if your getting beat by the Stryker especially after it's nerf.

Don't mean to be so harsh that's just the truth

[deep kelp]

Whatever, if u afraid btr82 with extra armor (not AT) version, it weird after all

[rough sage]

RGF alredy overpowered

they alredy give RGF and VDV drones

[lean night]

ehh, 20 shots from M2 to turret means if it isnt head-to-head and the AAVP/m1126 gets the jump with good aim/position it can easily win. i did it last night twice. not saying anything about if this should get added tho tbh i think its kinda silly. aint no way owi balance department (lol) reads/listens to any of our squabble

[leaden tree]

The BTR-82 has just been flat out better than the Stryker for a while now

Especially ever since it got its AP buffed so it can pen the Stryker anywhere

The Stryker mostly has to catch a BTR off guard so it can disable its turret before the BTR can engine it and take away the Strykers mobility and sightline

[gritty wing]

• btr has HE rounds

[leaden tree]

That too

Like it's wild to argue that the BTR is not good cause it doesn't have a ton of armor

Genuinely this comes more off as skill issue if anything

[fathom bluff]

This is just WarThunder tier Russian bias you wan't to introduce lol

RGF armor is fine

[deep kelp]

main enemy for btr its lav's type ifv not stryker lol,they had he too

[leaden tree]

You were the one who brought up that the BTR could be easily killed by the stryker

So ofc it developed into a discussion about the Stryker

[turbid chasm]

TBF we do need a better counter to the ZBL

[mossy sable]

What would even warrant the addition of a better BTR for the Russians? Giving additional armor to it's original weakspots will make the Stryker obsolete when going up against it, let alone it's added firepower to fight who knows what, hell give the US motorized this BTR wunderwaffe since they're barely played as much as of late. As it stands the current RGF motorized is perfectly fine, the BTR-82A in game is perfectly fine, there's simply no need for a better BTR unless if yall desire having RGF motorized be rebalanced to shit just like how it was with the Brits and their CTAS

[twin ledge]

@deep kelp I like this idea, Russia deserves equal attention that the other factions get. The Russophobia is very evident.

[fathom bluff]

Russophobia is a codeword to say RGF has probably received the most additions in recent times, and probably doesn't really need more stuff?

Interesting, I'll add that to my vocab

unidentified species says it best imo

[leaden tree]

A certain group of players when you bring up that Russia has received some of the most additions and buffs in the past year or two

(Somehow the BMP-2M, BMP-3, and the BTR getting better armor piercing rounds in not enough)

[fathom bluff]

Meanwhile US Armor got a M7 (towless bradley), CAF, ADF untouched

BAF finally gets given M2 RWS after years

But RGF getting the two new vics and a BTR buff == not enough

[leaden tree]

Also scout drones

[fathom bluff]

Scout drones too

You right

[leaden tree]

But hey Russiophobia right

[fathom bluff]

Russophobia would be getting political about IRL things, not stating the obvious about patch behaviour in a vidya game

[leaden tree]

God Imagine if I said the devs and players were Americaphoic cause I get shat on for suggesting the XM7 US Army or the ACV for the USMC

[fathom bluff]

That's Americaphobic, how dare you not want to allow the Abrams and Styker X in the game

[deep kelp]

Nothing to change, cuz in game vehicles just dumb steel without any hi tech things, mbt even don't had zeroing lol, then difference in squad between ordinary Abrams and A X probably only armor and gun,lol

[deep kelp]

I said something wrong or fun?

[turbid chasm]

It would be a good addition its just squad doesnt really need a power creep problem rn.

[rich wing]

Everyone be like: Russia is buffed to shit.
My face when two BTRs can barely kill an ASLAV upfront point-blank because it has more health (why), and the NATO guns have more penetration (why).

Also, the BMP-2M was good before the ATGM patch (just like the Spandrel), after that it's meh.

[rich wing]

They said, just like with the T-90A, that this thing would be able to do something in the future™.

[rich wing]

Like literally, lmao.

[fathom bluff]

Its just the lack of self awareness

Thats all

[fathom bluff]

Skissue

[fathom bluff]

BMP-2M is still good, ATGMs aren't thr instant win button they used to be but still very effective when you don't have one on some NATO vehicles.

Fire on the move, fire fast, it's great.

[rich wing]

There's no skill issue when two BTRs hit ASLAV upfront, you can see the hits, but it just won't die because balance, so we will make less damage for the 30mm and also will make it overheat (it doesn't work like that).

[fathom bluff]

Overheat is a bs mechanic, will admit that.

Ong

But if two BTRs cant turret and outflank a single Aslav, even with a perceived DPS difference, that's a skill issue

White room analysis is good for white rooms and white rooms only.

[rich wing]

It killed my mate-BTR in a matter of like seconds.

[fathom bluff]

Maybe double pen bug

Heard that's back

[rich wing]

It was so fucking annoying of putting my whole AP belt into it.

[fathom bluff]

I would be curious to test or see the footage, it doesn't combine with my in game experience

[rich wing]

Unfortunately I played on my weak ass computer and don't have any footage, but I even remember the map we were on.

[lean night]

^ nuance in armor matchup is extremely healthy for the game even if some armor players haven't figured it out.

BTR is not supposed to be as powerful as an ASLAV! it's western equivalent in squad is the coyote!

armor fights should be more complicated than "i started shooting first therefore i win the class-to-class matchup". you SHOULD feel disadvantaged in a BTR vs a LAV! take flanks and engage it appropriately with knowledge of your strengths and their weaknesses, or rely on your team to make up the difference.

also if you want to complain about IFV frontal armor being "overpowered" complain about the FV510 not the LAV. like cmon

[rich wing]

Yeah bro, it's not "overpowered".

It's fucking above logic.

I wonder what happens to a 10mm plate when a 30x165 AP hits it.

Damn, fucking 7.62 B-32 penetrates fucking more, (AS)LAV-25 should be penned by Pecheneg.

[mossy sable]

if 2 btrs cant do the job then thats a different problem

[rich wing]

We did.

It just took us one BTR destroyed, two AP belts and one badly injured BTR.

[mossy sable]

the FV510 needs its armor, otherwise theres nothing remarkable about it (as if its any good now). Besides, the Warrior belongs to the heavier tracked group of IFVs, hence its armor is better than its peers

[mossy sable]

not sure what your btrs were shooting at the aslav, but it did not sound like yall were shooting at the right components, let alone engaging it upfront

[rich wing]

We should not shoot at the right components, it should fucking die if you shoot it in the profile.

It should not have the armor it has.

[mossy sable]

nah lmao, if you dont know where to hit your enemy then thats just unironic skill issue, the aslav has weakspots, turrets in general are weakspots considering how they mess your opponent up with tracking, if youre gonna toss it up to "we hit it in general it should just die" then yall gotta learn to play armor better

especially if you had the numerical advantage, unless if it was the aslav that spotted your armor first

[rich wing]

I'm sorry to not be bothered by this argument of weakspots on a vehicle that's designed to withstand a fucking M43 7.62.

That's just bullshit.

But okay, it's Squad, where T-72B3/T-90A have more armor in the places they have less in real life.

[fathom bluff]

IRL doesn't matter, game mechanics do

As long as you have a way to get the information about the game, it doesn't matter how unrealistic it is, as long as you can work with it

[mossy sable]

well yeah considering how they buffed the reverse speeds for T series tanks and nerfed the rest of the MBTs reverse speeds to all be standardized, its still a game with balancing still being important

[rich wing]

And everyone thinks it was bad.

OWI at this point is just doing what they want.

[mossy sable]

regardless, its all a balancing act, with your issue though its just plain old "the enemy got the better of you"

and that does not justify the need for a more heavily armored and armed btr, unless if powercreep is the end goal

[fathom bluff]

Did the math. BTRs do 30 damage per hit on an ASLAV. In the scenario, each BTR needs to hit the ASLAV 21 times each. The ASLAV needs 25 shots to kill a BTR. The BTRs fire at 1.5x the rate of fire of the ASLAV.

Aka, it's a learning experience

[mossy sable]

tbf the BTR has paper thin armor, so any where the ASLAV hits would do considerable damage, though that depends whether the ASLAV fired first or the BTR fired first, and obviously what components they were shooting at

[lean night]

none of what i said hinged on any "real life" numbers. squad is a game balanced for fun. if it was meant to mimic real life LOTS of things would be different not a handful of details we find convenient. not to say you cant argue the lav should be pen'd by pkp, but the justification cant be "real life" its gotta be that its a beneficial change to the game for some legitimate reason

[rich wing]

I don't know what math you did, but I got 42 vs 25 shots (BTR - 42 to kill an ASLAV, ASLAV - 25 to kill a 82).

[fathom bluff]

21 shots per BTR

Even then, your percieved diff in the ASLAV vs a BTR is a TTK of 7.50 vs 7.51 seconds

[gritty wing]

I like losing braincells reading these posts when ppl dont know where to disable the enemy vic properly

[deep kelp]

Yea,suggestion became from yes or not answer, to nonsense stupid dispute

[turbid chasm]

I wrote that on the wiki lol

[leaden tree]

Loosing 2 BTRs to an ASLAV is a major skill issue

[leaden tree]

They have the same pen as the 25mm but do less damage, but also have a higher fire rate