KOF Coaching

[torn drift]

Anything specific lol

She can get through fireballs, I suck at it but your Rugal is very spammy and you repeat motions a lot be careful

A better angel will punish you for that

@mild parcel also angel can only 1 starter in the uc 2 mids at most and like 5 Enders

None of her Enders need to be respected as blockstrings

66k is punishable in block so us 66a 66c is the unblockable you need to roll or interrupt it and the grab is a hit grab or a jumping BM style grab also interruptible

The grab will whiff on block

[mild parcel]

Whiff how?

If i jump?

[torn drift]

Ok let’s break down a basic angel bnb and go over the parts if that’s cool with you.

Before that to answer your question if you block her combo and she tries going for 236c ender which is her grab it will just whiff there and then no action needed from you I’m pretty sure it’s a hit grab

[mild parcel]

I remember being grabbed on block allthe time? Cherry would do that a lot after ORA

[torn drift]

Lol I think it just whiffs after block my bad

So it’s a grab however if you block like 2a or something even the smallest blocked attack will make it whiff lol my bad

However if she moves in on you somehow and gets in range it will grab you even on block

That makes sense??

[mild parcel]

[torn drift]

So basically it’s a 1F grab point blank period however all of her moves on block have too much push Back and make it whiff so it’s not something your really need to look for in her blockstrings

[mild parcel]

ORA tho

[torn drift]

Idk voice lines

[mild parcel]

[torn drift]

What’s ORA

[mild parcel]

I dont know her move names

[torn drift]

What does she do

[mild parcel]

Its just a,little jump kick before doing the grab

[torn drift]

Low hitting?

[mild parcel]

Overhead I think

(It doesn't look like one)

[torn drift]

Oh

Sobat?

[mild parcel]

Yes

[torn drift]

Idk names either

Shout out to my dream cancels

[mild parcel]

[torn drift]

That’s an overhead kick if you block this she should whiff grab

[torpid quarry]

Flat ass

[mild parcel]

🧢

[torn drift]

If you want to lab it without learning all of angel you can just do

214c 6b 236c

That is a starter into sobat into grab

[mild parcel]

I'm sure it Leaves you
In grab range?

[torn drift]

I believe on block it should have enough pushback to whiff grab and you can fill punish

[mild parcel]

[torn drift]

Try labbing it if not yeah you can jump it ig

I whiff it all the time on blocks but haven’t labbed it too throughly

That little sequence I showed you should be basic enough for you to set the training dummy to do so you can practice that specific scenario

Anything else you specifically have an issue with I can show you a easy route for it as well

[mild parcel]

See @torn drift more reasons I post . We are talking about tech and he comes off nowhere talking about Angels ass. FOO CHILL

[torn drift]

I know

[torpid quarry]

No I meant flat ass Sobat because if not spaced correctly you can die

For it

Get your heads out the gutters

[mild parcel]

🧢

[plush delta]

Wow this image is nsfw lol

[torn drift]

Wym that’s her infame

In game I mean

Her j.c is nsfw though lol

[plush delta]

You can see her naked butt lol

[mild parcel]

"Naked"

[torpid quarry]

@torn drift warning

[torn drift]

Discord said “I’ll allow it”

[torn drift]

https://youtu.be/g6EqMGmPavU

[raven ridge]

this is the one lmaooooooooooo

Where'd you find it

[grizzled heart]

Dom sent us the link after I asked

It’s unlisted so I think that’s why the old link Oliver found didn’t work

[torn drift]

Dom posted it lol

[raven ridge]

OH hahah I thought it wsa buried or you found it in YT

that's clutch

[torn drift]

Yeah i pinned it in main chat as well but figured it’d be more accesible here

[torn drift]

@mild parcel do you mind giving me the notation to the Rugal bnb, the one where you end up with air crossed on block

@sinful herald do you mind giving me the notation to your block string with shun

And same for you @raven ridge that terry one you do where you end with either repuken or overhead kick

If you guys don’t mind of course

[raven ridge]

Uhhh cl.5c, 6a, and either ender

[torn drift]

Literal saint

[plush delta]

Labbing the punishes I see. Love it!

[mild parcel]

Air crossed?

[torn drift]

Hands crossed my bad

[torn drift]

Not yet I’ve been booked this day but first thing imma do is lab

2023 no more HowL now it’s HoWl lol

[mild parcel]

The slow and plus one or the fast and unsafe one?

[torn drift]

Your typical blockstring

So I guess both of its no bother

[mild parcel]

Cr.B > cr. A > / B > A/C

[torn drift]

You’re the bestest

[sinful herald]

5C > 6A > 214A

2B > 2A > 214A (this can also be a frame trap if I 236A or AC)

[torn drift]

Best shun player in this server guaranteed

[sinful herald]

Tha…hey wait a minute!

[sinful herald]

Damn these characters are more similar than I think huh 😹

[raven ridge]

Easy does it 😎

[meager portal]

Just found out Andy can cancel dp into punch super

[obtuse dock]

https://tenor.com/view/mexican-mexicancard-cancelado-gif-23665470

[meager portal]

With 3 bars, it's possible to do 529 off a wakeup dp

Not optimal at all, but it would def catch someone sleepin

[torn drift]

I’m practicing how to beat him

Makes me ultra Mexican

Makes me ||illegal ||

[obtuse dock]

Ok but I'm watching you

[torpid quarry]

I was watching cherry lab awhile back and she was doing punishes for rugal

[torn drift]

Now I feel safe

[torpid quarry]

Exposed his whole shit

[obtuse dock]

Disregard my SFV ping

[torn drift]

J.c over the Rugal

It’s ingrained

[torn drift]

At gym

[obtuse dock]

No longer playing

K

[torn drift]

I’m labbing irl

[sinful herald]

Hey one thing just in case you’re banging your head against the wall. The first string is completely safe on block. The second one is safe-ish on block depending on a couple things. Happy labbing just thought I’d say something in case you were trying to beat it

[torn drift]

Thank you much appreciated

I actually haven’t even updated my game I probably just gonna do it tomorrow

Irl irled me tonight

[sinful herald]

Ah yeah that happens. Was just labbing and thought, “Hang on if he’s trying to beat that he’ll waste a lot of time” and figured it would only be right to say something. If you have something else in mind by all means do you boo boo

[torn drift]

Thanks man

Yeah I just want to learn how to learn

[sinful herald]

Me too bro. Me too

[torn drift]

Never really tried so Imma be looking for gap of interruptions, if punishable at all because I know some moves are “somewhat safe”

Guard cancel windows

Anything like that

I’m pretty sure I can pull you guys aside and just get the answer sheet

The goal is to figure out how to start figuring out ya know?

[sinful herald]

Yeah I know what you mean. Even an invincible DP won’t beat it but GCR might I’ve never tried

[torn drift]

That’s my secret cap

I don’t believe in playing a team with a dp

[sinful herald]

It’s really funny you’re bringing this up because my bro and I ware talking about this last week. Learning how to learn or meta learning

Lol

[torn drift]

Eljay keeps saying “want to learn how to play good neutral, play a team with no invincible reversal option”

But I don’t have reversals and I’m still ass

So I’m questioning how effective his methods are

[sinful herald]

Eljay also doesn’t exactly take that advice himself, at least with 100% of his characters

I went from having 2/3 to 1/3 with that option

Shun kinda has one now but still not really

Also isn’t Mai’s super invincible?

[torpid quarry]

Luong 214 BD

[sinful herald]

Is that invincible now?

[torn drift]

Lol no it’s a server classic meme

[torpid quarry]

No the super is

[sinful herald]

Lol got it

[torpid quarry]

[torn drift]

When I first started I used that as a dp because it gave me full combo but 9/10 I got punished for it

I can win evo and twip would go to the commentary and say “this dude tried to use luong dp “

[sinful herald]

What Eljay prob means is that without an invincible option you are forced to counter poke and AA with normals (something he does really well)

It’s good advice don’t get me wrong. But it’s nice to have that get off me move

[torpid quarry]

HowL counter poke is angel JC

[torn drift]

No I think he’s saying it’s a good way to practice fundies, instead of instantly having An answer in aa, or punishing ya know?

It is really good advice

I’m just memeing because my team has no dp and im still ass

[torn drift]

Aye it works

I whiff punish with j.c lol

[torpid quarry]

It’s fun having a dp because then you can take your turn back

Steal turns I mean

[torn drift]

Nah just steal matches with j.c

That’s the howl way

[torpid quarry]

You spelled your name wrong

[sinful herald]

Kind of but counter poking or AA with a normal doesn’t give a knockdown so it’s not quite the same

[torn drift]

HoWl

[torpid quarry]

It’s HoWoW

[sinful herald]

It’s good to do both basically

[torn drift]

I think that’s why he says that because it makes it harder on you for not having the option

I don’t think he’s implying that dps make you bad, I think he just means without the option you’re forced to improve other ways

[sinful herald]

Well yeah. Not to get all thank you for your service-y, but when I was in the military we trained harder than we had to because it made operating a lot easier in the sense that were prepared for a shit show

[torn drift]

I would say thank you for your services but now your a meta chaser

So we’re neutral

[sinful herald]

You want to thank a vet for their service, here’s what you do. Never say that to a vet ever again. Simple lol

[torn drift]

I thought the easiest way to thank them for their service was to tell them about your uncles sister cousins dogs previous owner that also served

[sinful herald]

Also I earned my team at least that’s what I tell myself

[sinful herald]

Actually u rite 5th hand war stories are the coolest and completely based in reality 😹

Checkmate vets

[torn drift]

There’s a spider in my bathtub

Now I’m homeless

[sinful herald]

Anyway so I’ve been practicing Shuns new link. Y’all better watch out because || imma drop it like it’s hot ||

[torn drift]

Landing combos are for weebs

We’re too cool for that

I drop all my combos at cl.d

[sinful herald]

Maybe I need to watch more anime

[torn drift]

Finally some good takes in this server

[snow beacon]

Lol 100% DP lineup still doesn’t invalidate my suggestion to improve one’s defense though.

[sinful herald]

Not at all. I even gave you props a post or 2 after writing that because you’ll AA me with a normal, while using a character with an invincible DP lol

It ties into what I said earlier about training hard so the real thing is easier

I think Howl has just given himself a big challenge but if he sticks with it the payoff will likely be huge

[runic rain]

@torn drift I'm looking angel poke pressure, you said u need to get better with it yeah?

None of it is guaranteed because her lights aren't the best but I have multiple routes and shenanigans to keep your OPP thinking and guessing on what to do

[torn drift]

Let me have it

[runic rain]

Stay away from doing 2b, 2a, 2 tue third poke won't hit so to stay connected only so 2a 2a, 2b2a and so on be mindful of poking, the jist is you have up to 6+8 options the average three is hop, CD, run up poke/throw, band sweep. The other options

1. 2a into 6b for a UC start
2. 2a unchain 214a into a poke punish which is 6k in UC
3. 2a, 3b for quick low, 3D to low crush people with short pokes,
4. 2a 2c 6B (this very risky, don't do)
5. 46b(ex)
6. 2A into heavy red sky because it makes you slightly plus
7. 2a command run

@torn drift

[torn drift]

Thank you

[meager portal]

Anyone know some easy rock bnbs I should learn?

[runic rain]

0 bar: 2b2a or any light into 6a 623(ab cancel) 214C

If your not comfortable just so 6a 214c

[plush delta]

Just do the terry jump in combo do jD 5C 6A 214AC 214C 236236BD as a simple one

The more advanced one would be jD 5C 6A 214AC 623BD 623C AB (brake) 214C 236236B/D 236236AC

[meager portal]

Seems easy enough

[plush delta]

Btw mac mostly only does the first one

He just cancels into climax at the end too for huge huge damage

[meager portal]

Sounds about right

[plush delta]

Simple is sometimes all you need

You can learn the light confirms that cherry mentioned later

[meager portal]

Yeah, I'm mostly looking for stuff that combo off 5C

[plush delta]

https://youtu.be/9ZfRhHS9-E8

Doing 214AC which crumples allows you to more easily mentally prepare yourself to do the super in a match when your mind is more mentally stacked. 214AC jnto 214C into super becomes an easier confirm

[meager portal]

I definitely think that once I get good enough, Andy rock and terry are all viable enough to stick anywhere position-wise

[plush delta]

For sure. Mac does the same

[meager portal]

Bogard shotos are just really good anywhere

[plush delta]

They’re very beginner friendly but powerful at the same time

You can combo off ex counter

Do the running dunk when your opponent is crouch blocking

[meager portal]

I noticed it was an overhead

Could be could for closing distance too

[plush delta]

Yeah or you can use the run into sideswitch to fake them out

Don’t forget to use his command grab too even though it got nerfed. Ex version leads to combo as well

The fact that rock’s hard edge 214C hits twice should make it an easier super conform compared to terry’s burn knuckle

You have way more time to do the super cancel input

[meager portal]

Yeah

Now the tricky part is comboing off 5C, since it's only 1 hit instead of 2

[plush delta]

You can also combo off far C if you’re gonna with hit confirms

[plush delta]

Hitconfirming the 5C becomes easier after doing the jump in like jD

[meager portal]

Rock hop D is also pretty good from what I can tell

Its very fast

[plush delta]

Yep

[meager portal]

Might have to start learning to hop now😂

[plush delta]

Lol well it’s good to learn to hop in general

You can easily beat many beginner and intermediate players including me if you learn to do hop pressure

[meager portal]

Yeah

[sinful herald]

@grizzled heart yo why is it that when I press 3BD I seem to get Yuris command normal more consistently than when I just do 3D. Is this all in my head or does it register better?

[grizzled heart]

Inbf plink ?

Not a Yuri player really by any means tho

[sinful herald]

Oh yeah I asked because of Kyo 3D

I’m not sure what’s up but it’s either easier this way or I’m tripping

[grizzled heart]

ohhhh yeah word

You play stick yeah?

DF’s can kinda be a lil finnicky I guess

[sinful herald]

Yeah got a fightstick. After some more messing around it seems like it’s a couple things; there’s more time to hit the link than the animation shows. Like the 5B can be almost done and it still links. Also unless I’m perfect the stick will register 6 or 2 for literally one frame before registering 3 so I have to wait for it to be fully seated. What’s weird is that crouch blocking on a dime isn’t an issue for me but this is lol

[grizzled heart]

For what it’s worth past season combo videos I’d just see people skip yuri’s command normals for her combos

[sinful herald]

True except you need 3D or a heavy to get EX Saiha and I want them low light confirms

[runic rain]

@torn drift hey sweetie, you wanna hit up comms and lab some Angel+other characters you may be interested in together?

[torn drift]

Thank you but I’m not home atm

I’m sorry

[runic rain]

Oh I just mean anytime tonight

I'm not home either

[torn drift]

Oh ok yeah thanks for the offer

I really appreciate it

[runic rain]

just dm me whenever you're available

[meager portal]

Anyone recommend good meterless bm combos?

[torpid quarry]

Where do you have her?

[meager portal]

mid, but i want some meterless bnbs for when i burn it all

or if my point gets murdered before i can buld any meter

im mainly looking for stuff off of 5C bc ive got stuff for light confirms

[torpid quarry]

For anything starting from close 4B, 4,6 D, 236D or 4A, 4,6 D, 236D for meterless

Bout it tbh

[meager portal]

aight, imma figure something out

https://tenor.com/view/blmf25-gif-23957961

[spring relic]

cl.C/D —> 4B —> [4]6D —> 236D
cl.C/D —> 4A —> [4]6B —>623B
cl.C/D —> 6A —> 623D —> 623B/D
2B —> 2A —> 4B —> [4]6D —> 236D
2B —> 2A —> [4]6B —> 623B

Bonus: it’s not a combo, but don’t sleep on 2B —> 2B —> 2A —> 623A/C

[meager portal]

i think i did a weaker version of that earlier by accident

[obtuse dock]

@plush delta I was taking the rust off Ramon this morning, just playing around I came up with this combo, is this the most optimal he can do with 1.5 bar?:
5C 3D 623BD 623b 623b 22a 624624A/C

Damage is around 450-470

Oof nevermind, just found the video you posted and you did around 500 with just 1 bar lol

[plush delta]

Yeah, you do more damage with ex grab into backflip than super

[obtuse dock]

Noted

Also, why can't I follow up backflip into 22a/c?

Does it need to be raw for it to combo into it?

[plush delta]

Yeah you can only hoist after raw backflip not OTG otherwise that means he can do it infinitely

[obtuse dock]

Have you found any good use of his 214 B?

[plush delta]

Not really for the full wall jump but feint has a hitbox and can be comboed into

[obtuse dock]

Interesting

[plush delta]

Might have to be the ex version though

[obtuse dock]

I thought of using feint after 5C 3D if opponent is blocking so i don't get myself open to punish for doing 214A or 236B on block

[obtuse dock]

214 BD 236A looks fun to use

Can see many people not knowing how to react to it

[plush delta]

5C 3D 623B should be a safe block string

I think you can do 5C 3D 214BD AB 214AC 22AC

[obtuse dock]

Also I found myself unable to start combo by 2b 2a/ 2a 2a into 3C

[obtuse dock]

Isn't 214BD AB the "breaks" of the move?

[plush delta]

You can hoist after this as well

[obtuse dock]

Didn't try it

[plush delta]

That’s how he does the feint

[obtuse dock]

Will have to

Ok, by feint I thought you meant the 214D

[torn drift]

@meager portal you still want that advice?

[obtuse dock]

The run feint

[plush delta]

214B by itself is just a run to the wall

You have to press AB to feint

[meager portal]

Yeah

[obtuse dock]

Is AB the backflip feint?

[plush delta]

No 214B/D AB is just him doing a feint after running to the wall

[obtuse dock]

Will have to try it out cause I can't understand how that would combo

[plush delta]

You might be thinking of 214A/C which is the drop kick/feint

[obtuse dock]

No I know 214 B is the wall jumping one followed by a multitude of moves, and 214a/c is the drop kick, being A the kick and C is a feint

But I just can't grasp how it would combo 214BD into AB into 214AC

I want to try it to see for myself

[plush delta]

I haven’t tried it either but I’ve seen the video

[obtuse dock]

Ok

[plush delta]

Let me see if it’s shareable

[obtuse dock]

Thanks

[torn drift]

@meager portal you need to play more neutral, you over rely on your special moves to play neutral for you

[plush delta]

I found the video, it’s actually ex dp k into feint into ex drop kick

[torn drift]

You shoot fireballs and wait till you feel comfortable to get in to use burn knuckle or slicer or elbow

[obtuse dock]

Oof that looks hard to pull off

[torn drift]

Those are great moves in their respective and I’m pretty sure most if not all can be made safe

[obtuse dock]

Like hands must move fast af to cancel it right next to the opponent

[torn drift]

However only using special moves to get in is bad you’ll lose to opponents learning your habits very quickly

[plush delta]

https://vxtwitter.com/SobArts/status/1615366512650362883?t=99wko9duRr24cN0Lz8hg5Q&s=19

[obtuse dock]

One thing's for sure, I'm never pulling that off

[plush delta]

Never say never

[obtuse dock]

Is it optimal or just cool looking?

[plush delta]

Also 214B and doing wall jump is to counter people throwing projectiles

[plush delta]

I think it’s both

[obtuse dock]

Never thought of it

[meager portal]

I'm trying to improve my footsies more, but they always seem to either whiff or trade

[obtuse dock]

Do you know if 3D would go under projectiles?

[plush delta]

Not sure but it looks like it could

[obtuse dock]

I will lab all this tonight hopefully

[plush delta]

Use lights more

[torn drift]

Yeah also don’t be scared to jump in use Terrance’s massive buttons, the only times you jumped in you pressed your buttons hella early to go for air to air don’t be scared to jump in as a combo starter

Just slowly transition from using your specials to using everything else

Special moves are great and specifically your teams are really good and it should be part of you gameplan. However even overrelying on the best move in the game will get you whacked

[meager portal]

Normally, I try to use j.D as a combo starter, but I'm always anti-air'd out of it

[torn drift]

Yeah but you did good all around

[meager portal]

When I didn't get ocv'd by angel, your luong curb stomped me

And then mai burned andy at the stake

[torn drift]

😂

Ok they’re a tough crowd don’t worry

You’ll figure them out

[meager portal]

Yeah it's just something that comes with time ig

I think the main reason Ángel wiped the floor with me was bc I don't fight many angels so I lack le combat experience

Saw so many moves I ain't never seen before. It was scary dawg😂

[obtuse dock]

The short route for that is, learn angel's BNB yourself, record that BNB into the dummy and try to find the multiple gaps in Angel's unchained

[meager portal]

The only way to beat Ángel is to learn Ángel but of course why didn't I think of that

[raven ridge]

Control the space + watch the jump in

[runic rain]

If they don't jump, abuse long and fast recovery normals

Angel's ground game is one of the weakest, force her to play your game

She's only a threat if she has 2 bars to convert but other than that

1. Smother her to death if you can
2. Play very solid neutral and keep away because she struggles in that department
3. Always be on the move, once you see a jump you can run under, back dash, or AA if you're peeping

[meager portal]

I noticed angel hops a lot and that fireballs don't really work

[runic rain]

They do work, you need to be at range C4-8 to make it work

Never be in super jump range which is maximum range 4, so at best stay in the sweet spot if you wanna zone

[spring relic]

Regarding Point #2: why do I find it hard to jab her out of this?

It’s like she just gets to tag and overwrite my poke buttons instead of making the read

[runic rain]

I play neutral with Angel so these are how to beat howl

I'm jk @torn drift ILY also really? She shouldn't be doing that tbh

[torn drift]

Hold up hold hold up

“Weakest ground game, can’t convert unless to bars”?

[torn drift]

This can’t be for angel is it

[runic rain]

SHHHHH

Let me FADE PEOPLE HOWL

😭

[spring relic]

There are a lot of things opponents “shouldn’t” be doing, and yet…

[torn drift]

This just bad advice lol

[runic rain]

I mean

[torn drift]

@meager portal what @raven ridge said is 100 percent correct

Control space
Watch the jump ins

You try playing angel up close you’ll lose

[spring relic]

I’ll check the lies in the lab and get back to you

[raven ridge]

There's gaps in some of Angel's blockstrings but don't worry about that now, just try what me n CB mentioned for neutral n cuz they're the "go-to" how to play against anJello @meager portal

[runic rain]

We have to very different angel's the advice works but it's not a overall

[torn drift]

No no you said she has the weakest ground game

She has the best ground game

She has weak spacing game or long range

That’s different

She actually had a weak air game with her buttons being ok at best in the air

[runic rain]

I gotta say the difference now?!

I thought people knew automatically

[torn drift]

I mean yeah that’s like saying Clark sucks ass on the ground

Oh no I mean at long range

That’s two completely different things lol

[runic rain]

Thank God you're here 😭

[torn drift]

You telling Dyl to keep her on the ground next thing you know his back is in Argentina

Rip dyl

[spring relic]

When in doubt

GC Blowback or Roll

And spend the bar to GTFO

[runic rain]

I mean she can't play on the ground vs someone with solid neutral 🤌 idk we fight different opponents and have different styles of play. I'll keep it simple next time 🌚

[torn drift]

You’ll be fine you’ll learn them all eventually but that’s not the instant secret

Best way is just to keep her away

You have good buttons in Andy and terry

And BM has good reversal options

[spring relic]

Real Counter

[torn drift]

Best advance I can give you is learn to poke her away and play at your pace, and don’t sit there and block when she’s on you

Try rolling away

[raven ridge]

Full Counter

(S/o s1 SDS)

[torn drift]

At first your gonna eat some combos but you will if you just sit there anyways

[raven ridge]

https://tenor.com/view/anime-cool-magic-strong-counter-gif-18387586

[torn drift]

You’ll start learning what you can and cant roll out off

Also yeah you see her lift those big ass boots off the ground roll always

https://tenor.com/view/raccoon-roll-rolling-gif-9052103

[runic rain]

I noticed everyone here rolls on her

[torn drift]

Nothing good comes out of challenging a j.c besides bruised egos and -44%

[runic rain]

I wondered why, now I know

[torn drift]

I’m actually an on the Ánti-Ángel Private Investigation Unit

I’m just here to give angel mains a harder time

[runic rain]

Yeah it's the simple way to deal with Angel

[torn drift]

https://tenor.com/view/raccoon-rolling-roll-funny-dark-souls-gif-25412731

Why think when you can

[runic rain]

I'm over here in Ranked and people are jabbing my J.C

Then I hop on here

Y'all MF ROLLING

[torn drift]

You’re welcome

[runic rain]

I'm use to the hard shit

🤌

[torn drift]

It’s all thanks to the crusade @plush delta started

[raven ridge]

5a is the strangest AA

[torn drift]

We see ángel jumping, we rollinggg

[raven ridge]

Honestly

KOF 5A == GG 6P

[torn drift]

Bro terry got a big ass foot all I’ll say

Y’all know how benis dp makes a lighting bolt completely vertical on the screen

That’s terrys 5d? I thinks visual hitbox

Just fuck you in that general direction lol

[runic rain]

Kroh tho

His CD has extra range, like he backhands you so hard his hotbox extends

[torn drift]

I be taking kros lunch money now lol when they try to dp get fucked lol

[meager portal]

I'm not even mad, good Ángels are fun to watch

I think imma put Andy back on point tbh, my best Andy game is when I'm not fishing for meter combos

Meter is good for him, but its wasted on him😔

[spring relic]

The lab still disputes that, somewhat

In my testing in an offline environment Ángel’s j.C is much more prone to trading

[meager portal]

I forget, it's Terry ex crackshoot an overhead?

[spring relic]

Yes

It used to ground bounce AND be safe on block

But no more

Now it’s unsafe and gives HKD

[runic rain]

With pushback so technically safe

[torn drift]

I agree theres ways to beat it

However the risk reward is just abysmal

I personally wouldn’t roll the dice but you do you

[torn drift]

I wish I was a good Angel

[meager portal]

Half a bar took off 45% you're real good

There's a reason you're on my list

[torn drift]

That would mean more if everyone wasn’t on the list lol

But all love

[meager portal]

Lotta people better than me

[spring relic]

The reward is discouragement

[meager portal]

Gimme like 2 months, and I'll be marking more names off

[spring relic]

If Ángel j.C interactions worked the way I lab them out IE offline

Y’all wouldn’t be abusing it nearly as much because that reward wouldn’t be there nearly as often

[torn drift]

I mean I guess but I’m dense so who knows

I will trade 10 3 percent hits for one 44

[spring relic]

You’re thinking in terms of 1 match

I’m thinking in terms of an FT10

Like sure, get your 44% one time

[torn drift]

Sure, however my timing isn’t always consistent you’re gonna eat more j.cs than it’s worth imo

If you can keep a good mental through it all go for it

[spring relic]

Meanwhile those other 4 times I’ll discourage and shut down your neuch or hell, even get a conversion

But yes, please continue to work with odds not in your favor

[spring relic]

Your button press may not be, but your jump arc is which is the important variable

[torn drift]

I mean I get what you’re saying, rolling out of it is something everyone can do immediately and eliminate the threats

It’s not the optimal way but it works

You want to put in the work and figure out how to beta it

My respects

You should

[spring relic]

Not trying to be rude but, please articulate what I am saying

Just wanna make sure we are on the same page here

[torn drift]

That j.c isn’t omnipotent and you’re working on a way to punish and discourage it, a permanent solution instead of avoidance

Am I in the ball park?

[spring relic]

You’re missing the most important piece of the premise of my statement

Which is the offline environment

[torn drift]

I can’t guarantee you that the offline is the only variable that’s affecting you but it could be

[plush delta]

You don’t have to actually learn it. Just know that there are gaps in her strings and roll away. Also she is weaker in the air than in the ground

[torn drift]

Regardless when taken online that’s gonna be a lot of frustration

[spring relic]

Yes because of the disparity

IE you train something that works, and will continue to work except for the online environment which creates a mental / muscle memory disconnect

[plush delta]

Lol cherry is straight up lying there

[torn drift]

That’s what I’m saying sure you may be working and already have grounds for the panacea but for now wear a mask and avoid the disease for now

But you can do as you please obviously I trust your judgement

[spring relic]

I’m just asking for acknowledgement of labbing

That’s all

Yes you hit me with cross-up j.C and yeah online probably gonna work more often than not if I press an AA button

Does not change the fact that when the game is working “as intended,” j.C will often trade particularly with vertical cl.Normals cause that’s kinda what they are for…

[torn drift]

And they do mac and Daru we’re doing a good job

Irregardless I don’t think the risk is worth the reward

But you disagree on that

And that’s ok

[torn drift]

Yeah lol mac was on track idk what cherry was saying lol

[plush delta]

One other thing that people always forget against angel is if they try to block the jC and howl messes up the jC, he’ll often connect with a throw instead cause the combo string for Angel starts with close D after the jC connects and mistiming the jC does allow angel to land right next to the opponent allowing the throw to come out. It’s almost like an unintentional OS

[torn drift]

Also not that I can but if you block the j.c 2a frame traps

[plush delta]

Howl, be honest, many of those throws you do with angel after a jump are unintentional right?

[torn drift]

It’s just all around a very bad situation

None

I have not landed a single throw in this game that I knew 100 percent would throw

Even when I have every intention on throwing sometimes I “press” throw and my opponent throws me

[spring relic]

This is why I run-up throw

Just to prove I have the knowledge and can execute

[torn drift]

I have eaten a throw on my run up throw lol

And I think I should’ve tech

But I don’t argue with the game lol

When kof tells me to stfu I say yes ma’am

[spring relic]

I do all the time when I see ping fluctuating like a seismograph

[plush delta]

I think many people’s throws have been unintentional unless it’s a run up or walk up throw or empty jump throw. But throws after scrambling are all unintentional which makes me want SNK to fix throws as it really is too strong

[torn drift]

Everytime I get a throw after a jump in attempt I wanted to go for cl.d and start blockstring

Every single time

[plush delta]

Yeah

[spring relic]

That’s a bad habit of mine as well

Gotta stop holding the direction

But damnit you want that buffer!

[torn drift]

I also never tried to throw as a dp punish

They’re supposed to be cl.d lol

[plush delta]

Yeah happens to me all the time too

Although I used to throw punish when I started the game

But now I try to go for combos but still unintentionally do throws

[torn drift]

Hey but I’m more than a j.c guys

I have depth

[spring relic]

Lesson Learned: just avoid the problem and use a light starter

[torn drift]

Angel sucks with lights

Now she got massive buffs

So she can now do 23 instead of 19

But not no 44

[spring relic]

Another example:

Video game trying to tell me I can’t roll Burn Knuckle on the press; lies!

[torn drift]

Nah burn knuckle op

[spring relic]

sigh always gotta go for the troll

[spring relic]

Why can’t you Ángel mains be honest?

Breaking from the lab: Ángel’s j.C supremacy comes from point blank range

[torn drift]

Huh?

[torn drift]

Ummmm

I’m honest

Cb plays too much

[torn drift]

I’m debating anchor UwU

[runic rain]

My Angel Fire is fuming low 💀

Also oh really?!

Anchor....... She's a great all rounder. With meter and w/o but shines more with

The issue people have with her is pressure and baiting

[torn drift]

I saw her 214 d 214c setplay

And I want to do that

[runic rain]

New ChizUwU need to learn how apply clone press

[torn drift]

I like being sneaky

[runic rain]

Yeah, there's so much too

[torn drift]

Luong has 214b ángel j.c

Mai can’t hang

[runic rain]

2d 6b 236C which you can keep your turn and press

[torn drift]

Ooh

Frame trap?

[runic rain]

Yeah to a degree but they can roll if they catch on!

So do it sparingly

[grizzled heart]

When Terry players throw out burn knuckle… the game lets them do whatever they want haha

[runic rain]

You could also chase em down if need, Chiz has very interesting pressure

[grizzled heart]

I can’t complain really, Leona Grand Saber is the same way

[spring relic]

…I appreciate the humor, but honestly I’m not in the mood for it today

And this is what I mean by “dishonesty”

Derps and meme-ing instead of a more genuine discussion

[grizzled heart]

OMF said [Terry Voice] GET SERIOUS

[torn drift]

Like mai

[torn drift]

Ah got you ok that’s fine if you’re not for the Tom foolery that’s ok

[grizzled heart]

me: why is no one talking about Terry Burn Knuckle? This move is dumb as fuck!!!

[torn drift]

What do you specifically mean by j.c is only good up close

[spring relic]

Meaning that when Ángel is in cl.Normal range and jumps, that’s when her cross-up j.C reigns supreme and can’t be challenged. But if there is distance her ass, assuming the game isn’t lying because of online shenanigans, is getting AA’d or trading.

It’s interesting to me that no Ángel mains here could point out that discrepancy

[runic rain]

Couldn't point out what exactly I'm sorry

[spring relic]

The nuances of Ángel’s j.C priority

[runic rain]

Yeah but what are is the nuance?

[spring relic]

Scroll up a bit. I explained it based on my labbing.

[runic rain]

Is it the trading part?

[spring relic]

OMF: “Why are my outcomes in the lab VS online not the same?”

[torn drift]

Well I mean some of the things that help out angel mains when going for that j.c even at hyper jump ranges is that they’re not gonna let you try to react

[spring relic]

Ángel mains: “Just get out of the way cause hahaha j.Cross-Up supreme.”

OMF: “I get that. But what about my question?”

Ángel mains: “…Idda know. I just do things and it works.”

Getting flashbacks to my Xrd days with my Sol rival

Me: “Mind sharing some pointers from your perspective of the battle?”

Sol Friend: “Idda know man, Sol just do Sol things hahaha.”

Me: “…you couldn’t be bothered to tell me I need to FD in the air to air block?”

[runic rain]

I don't remember this at all 💀 but fr though, the thing about Angel J.C is that it's a jump in and sometimes you won't be able to react to it via roll or jab trading it. You can be the Best AA'er but still get jumped on by a jump up you don't see coming. Can't predict everything

[torn drift]

Ok well
J,c has no invul
No armor
No air to air proprieties
Can be aa’d
Can be dpd
Can be ss
Can be blocked
Can be rolled away from

There’s more optimal ways to beat it than rolling

What does are I don’t know

Why you’re having differences specifically online vs offline I can’t tell you

[spring relic]

Correct. And your initial responses to me labbing this out are part of what has triggered this current discussion.

[torn drift]

My personal advice is to just avoid it when you know it’s coming

[spring relic]

There you go, right there

[torn drift]

Yea

That’s my advice

Anything past that is past my pay grade

[spring relic]

It’s a distance / spacing issue

[torn drift]

Not me actively gatekeeping information from your

I don’t think any option that can be executed consistently is worth the risk and I recommend you avoid it

You disagree

That’s ok

I just can’t personally give you more advice than that at the moment

I apologize

[spring relic]

@torn drift No offense, but I think you’re still misunderstanding a little bit

[torn drift]

Appears so

If I had the answer you were looking for I would give it to you

As for a specific “priority” system I don’t know what that is

[spring relic]

I respect that

The point here is that I found my answer in the lab

[torn drift]

The only game modernly that has that is sfv I think

Where heavies beat mediums and so on but that’s all I know about priority

[spring relic]

And it is ironic that, despite several matches, no Ángel mains here could point out what was going on

[torn drift]

You give angel mains too much credit

At least here we get away with more than we should

[spring relic]

Ángel mains: “Just don’t try it.”

OMF: “But it’s working consistently in the lab so…what gives?”

Ángel mains: “I don’t know man. Just don’t try it.”

[torn drift]

Desync, spacing, situations it could be any of that you said you already found it

As a active lab avoider I personally couldn’t have came to that conclusion

[spring relic]

Well, when you get robbed enough eventually you start implementing a security system

[torn drift]

I just don’t have any valuables for them to take

[snow beacon]

My personal advice is to cross cut dp (if you have a dp) if you know it’s coming.

[torn drift]

On wake up it’s hard to get but yeah if you can lab the timing

[snow beacon]

If the Angel times it where she’s still midair on my wake up, just hold buffer the dp.

[torn drift]

I need you to dp my ángel soon

Pause

[snow beacon]

If the angel times it like a safe jump, then I’m gambling.

[torn drift]

Gambling is always fun

[snow beacon]

I’m always gambling. I try to be a theory fighter, but I also have grappler mentality. Hardo reado

If you a masher, I’m dping you all day everyday… even on YOUR wake up. Idgaf lol

[torn drift]

Oh man I hope sf6 gets you out of your slumber

I need that 360 no scope

[meager portal]

Me and eljay play the same fr fr

Everything I do is based on reads or misreads

[snow beacon]

Lol play by reaction first.

[meager portal]

Yeah I don't win a lot

I'm trying to change my ways and learn to play patiently but the intrusive thoughts keep winning

[sinful herald]

Bummed I missed an interesting conversation here so imma revive it hehehe. One other thing I didn’t see mentioned by anyone is how much easier it is to “react” to stuff in the lab when your brain essentially knows it’s coming. A better way to test out this theory would be to record the dummy doing 5 common Angel approaches/things with one or two of them being j.C off different jumps. Because yeah when you set the dummy to j.C like a maniac of course it’s easy to AA. When there’s a real human on the other end varying their timings and trying to be deceptive (the name of the game in KOF where every character can whiff cancel from something) it’s way different

[torn drift]

Yeah exactly how people in different genres of games constantly use average reacting time studies, while these test are literally sitting in front of a computer waiting for a red screen to turn green. This does not take into account the mental stack that actually occurs in game and the fact that you won’t know 100% it’s coming

[normal hound]

Is Antonov beginner friendly?

[torn drift]

I would assume not, he’s very clunky and he’s meter hungry but I don’t know much about him so I wouldn’t take my word

But if you want to learn him I’m sure you’ll do perfectly fine don’t be discouraged

[sinful herald]

And then you have players like iDom who apparently have “slow” reflexes according to those tests, so it really doesn’t matter as much as game sense and experience

[torn drift]

Us Laura players are crayon eaters that’s why

[sinful herald]

Also why “old” people can play fighting games at a high level

[torn drift]

Sadly in fps not the case rip boomers

[torpid quarry]

Daigo sick nasty with it

[sinful herald]

Lol maybe but it seems more likely that being in the shit more often got him where he’s at. It’s the same reason why a non turd shaped 30 or 40 something will beat the brakes off a 20 something. Old man strength is a thing but so is prior experience

[sinful herald]

That or, hear me out, boomers can’t stand the “culture” of FPS games and just bow out

[normal hound]

https://tenor.com/view/old-to-slow-slow-walk-i-got-this-i-can-do-this-gif-16548727

I ain’t as fast as I use to be 😦

[sinful herald]

Reaction times aren’t as important as they’re hyped up to be is my point

[normal hound]

Also I just hate battle royale. I enjoyed FPS back in the day. Last one I played was BF1.

[sinful herald]

Repeated exposure to challenging situations means someone doesn’t have to react fast because their brain already has the answer queued up

[normal hound]

True

https://tenor.com/view/regular-show-mordecai-mordecai-regular-show-hmph-hmph-hmm-gif-25945329

[sinful herald]

Lol is that Rick and Morty?

[torn drift]

Ouch

That’s the regular show

[obtuse dock]

That's regular show

[obtuse dock]

Yeah I enjoyed mw2 for the multiplayer, warzone didn't do it for me

[sinful herald]

I’ll be honest, haven’t watched much TV since last summer

[torpid quarry]

Smoke funny bro

He’s Trollin y’all get fucked

[obtuse dock]

As your lawyer I advice you to stfu

[torpid quarry]

WOW

[sinful herald]

Always talk to cops

[normal hound]

As your other lawyer I advice to SIT IN THE CORNER.

[sinful herald]

That’s my advice 👍

[torpid quarry]

Tru

[normal hound]

I like big spaces but I also like to, you know, respawn.

[plush delta]

Not really in the sense that he’s slow and he has different buttons compared to a regular character. His 2D is an overhead and he has only one low normal. That being said, his combos are relatively easy and he does tons of damage

[normal hound]

Sounds like a Yama to me. I’ll skip him for now.

Thanks Oli

[plush delta]

I’m trying to learn him though cause as an anchor, he usually only needs one touch to kill you. You can learn him with me but yeah he’s not a typical character

[normal hound]

One day. I still want to improve with my current team.

[plush delta]

For sure. Concentrate on your main team

[normal hound]

Next weekend I’ll see if I can join matches again.

[plush delta]

I still push the king-Robert-terry-Kula agenda for beginners 🙂

[normal hound]

I’m Interested in using King again.

[plush delta]

This is a very easy almost ToD combo https://youtu.be/ENOOAJpAVY0

[normal hound]

But not until I learn Joe

Joe has a lot of potential, I just need to learn his attacks and combos. Kyo is coming along nicely. Again, the issue is me (misinputs and panic)

[plush delta]

Yeah definitely pick her up! She has an easy basic BnB that can do a lot of damage and all you need to learn in her neutral is to zone with venom strike. And you do enjoy keepaway with your playstyle so she fits you very well

[normal hound]

So until then, I’ll stick to my main team. (Then I’ll re learn King, and figure out different fighters)

Iori is another I want to master

And maybe Nakoruru

[plush delta]

Nice as long as you have a goal and plan, I’m confident you’ll reach there!

[normal hound]

And maybe I’ll beat trip

[plush delta]

I’m rooting for you to get there!

[snow beacon]

@normal hound As an Anto player, I agree with Oli. He has easy combos and execution, but I believe it’s his neutral and buttons that are kinda lacking. Many are slow. His most reliable aa, imo, is 5A. If you can dp consistently, then that’s a go-to. No sweep. Hard to open up your opponent. Upside…playing him may help you improve your game.

[grizzled heart]

Something worth mentioning too tho…. I can guarantee a good chunk of players are not familiar with the Antonov match up

[rancid marlin]

It’s funny you bring him up I picked him last night on purpose. He’s fun

[plush delta]

As antonov, all you are doing is fishing for that one hit

[grizzled heart]

isn’t that all we’re looking for in life 🛐☀️👆💯‼️

[rancid marlin]

Maxima

[plush delta]

Terry: it’s over

[grizzled heart]

Kyo and Iori: idk whatever tf they say when either of em activate QM

[meager portal]

HERE'S THE BIG ONE

[normal hound]

I have a stupid question: I’m not too familiar with certain terms. What is anchor? I know there is anchor, mid, and I can’t remember the last one.

[torpid quarry]

Anchor means your last character, mid means the middle character and point means your first character I think the proper term for it is shell? I’m not sure I just hear it in dbfz

[normal hound]

Thanks. I had to ask because it was used a lot inEVO last year. The terms makes sense tbf.

I guess Antonov is best used as Anchor?

[plush delta]

Tripp was able to answer your question well!

[plush delta]

Yes Antonov is best at anchor. Same with terry and couple others. Many characters can go in multiple positions

[normal hound]

I see

That explains why others have him last

[plush delta]

It’s because he has easy tod combos and uses meter well. He would struggle at point or first since he has trouble getting hits and at point you need to be able to do multiple hits to kill

[normal hound]

Fair

[torpid quarry]

Eljay beat the shit out of me with antonov as anchor

[plush delta]

Yes, all he needs is one touch. He has done the same against me where he would do a terry style robbery off one good hit

[magic harness]

If I can add something to that, I'd like to say that even tho some chars are better used in some positions than others, depending on your level of experience and how comfortable you feel with that character, it might be worth putting them on anchor.
Shermie is usually put in point or mid, but I anchor her simply because she is the char I play the most, and I feel like having more bars with her is more beneficial to me than actually having a char like Terry, or Yamazaki that are usually good anchors.

Granted, I have a team of 3 characters that are usually point, Angel, Shermie and O. Shermie, so I can choose which one to put where depending on how I'm feeling and depending on my opponent's team.
If I see some Athena, King or Leona, that are usually more defensive and cause my Angel to have problems because of her difficulties of getting in, I probably will put her on anchor and Shermie on point, as she can bypass projectiles easily

Still, what I am trying to say is, it's good to know the best positions for your characters, as it makes them more optimal
But don't get too attached to it, as sometimes other aspects can influence and change where the best position for which char will be.
I also have to advice labbing a lot the different combos they can do on all three positions. Maybe Antonov is never on point for your team, but you should lab his mid position as sometimes, on some fights, your other chars may be best anchors than him

[spring relic]

Most of it comes down to player preference honestly

The majority of the cast is pretty flexible when it comes to position

That said, there are those like an Antonov or Shermie who make the most sense on anchor simply for how they shit damage

[torn drift]

It does come down to preference but ángel is the best battery in the game meaning she builds more meter than she wastes. She also struggles to get in and she also struggles against opponents with meter because they can shatter strike her or guard cancel most of her pressure. Her meter damage also doesn’t scale as well as others for example luong can get like 500-700 of 2 bars angel needs 4-5 to compete. However she can do 40 meterless which not many can. With the new ex tornado kick, her unblockable 214, and now her buffed up counter there’s a real debate on mid ángel however I still think it’s better to use her at point and build meter for your team. Shermie I don’t know much about but she has dummy thicc damage with meter so she might be better mid or anchor

[plush delta]

Definitely. At our level, position doesn’t matter as much

[raven ridge]

I hear what Luna is poppin. I LOVE rock at anchor, I get the access to 3 bars usually, quick confirm into install and I make it back usually + all the benefits of install Rocky is a luxury I am appreciating for the ROCV.

[sinful herald]

Does install Rock keep the buff for the next round(s)?

[lament mirage]

No

[raven ridge]

I wish. But it'd make him hella strong ahah cuz install Rocky is sumn else.

[rancid marlin]

He should be able to keep.

[raven ridge]

They'd probably keep it 3 bar instead of 2.5*. Or nerf pre-install Rocky so much that he's basically meant for anchor at that point? Idk

[sinful herald]

Yeah seems like it for the cost

[raven ridge]

Either way, much like dragon install Ky, I try for the install a lot more these days after the patch

gimme dat buff

[sinful herald]

But then we’d have Ash players wanting the same thing lol

[rancid marlin]

#buffRok

[sinful herald]

I’m watching a top 8 with Hao in it what has the world come to?

[raven ridge]

I like Rock a lot more at anchor currently with the install "rework". Maybe i'll try him at mid but anchor i'm usually starting at 3 bars anyway

[rancid marlin]

Hao has big boy damage

Off easy combo one touch

That Samsho ish

[sinful herald]

I only play Nebular’s Hao and yeah…he’s mean af with it

[rancid marlin]

You are very meter conservative so why not?

I be just spending meter like a mf

Cause I can

[sinful herald]

Meanwhile I’m like bury me with my riches

[raven ridge]

I try not to be hahah. My characters n how i play though would make sense just to cash out on any touch. Get the big boom but i'm also too aggro not to have a pocket GCroll if i get in a pinch.

[rancid marlin]

That’s some good thinking, I remember you saying something along those lines long ago when I was like, damn you really think about all that? With the meter and whatnot. Obviously there is validity in your reasoning

Terry players got to

[sinful herald]

Bro Shadow X’s K’ is insane

[rancid marlin]

Good

(Idk shadow sorry)

[sinful herald]

He’s a top player on TNS and other streams. Been running K’ Clark Iori since 14

Maybe longer

[rancid marlin]

Lol Clark players.

[sinful herald]

These days I just laugh when my punch bounces off his armor grab

[meager portal]

Clark armor grabbed my andy through ex dp once

[spring relic]

Fun Fact: KOF super armor doesn’t care about number of hits. Only duration.

[meager portal]

Like I did the first 3 hits, and then Clark was like

[spring relic]

You get some really funny interactions with KOD cmd grab because of this

[meager portal]

Didn't get it the second half of my attack before getting my ass thrown on the concrete

[grizzled heart]

Here’s what you do give him an instal in Garou 2 and make him turn into Nightmare Rock

Boom

🫡🫡🫡

I’ll pick my paycheck up at the end of the month SNK

[spring relic]

FYI, @ JuiceBox_FGC just spit some facts over in the main XV server and I thought it would be beneficial for you all:

[rancid marlin]

I agree with this. He summed it all up briefly and efficiently

[magic harness]

About Shermie, she is one of those chars that can go in any position
Because you are right, she does have big damage with meter, but just like Angel, her pressure can be easily broken with guard counters and ex dps. She is a grappler, so she does work very well against opponents without meter.
Also, if you don't wanna get into her big 5 bar combos that are kinda hard to do, her quick max combos in mid or anchor are the same, meaning that she doesn't benefit as much from the increased gauge in Anchor as characters like Yamazaki or O. Shermie, so I like to use her in mid, personally

Specially if my point is Angel, that I usually try not to spend so much bar with, Shermie usually comes in with at least 2.5 bars or so, which is already enough to do quite a lot of damage

[torn drift]

Yeah I like that, like I said if you want to optimize ángel should be point although there is argument for mid angel now. That being said unless you plan on competing or doing hyper competitive sets positioning doesn’t matter. Fastest way to improve is put your best character last, worse first. Point characters get the most play while playing the lowest stake kof. Punishes aren’t as scary and mistakes and drops aren’t as decisive

Typically

Point, who you want to improve overall with
Mid, Improve meter usage
Anchor, practice QMs and max damage combos

[magic harness]

Couldn't agree more

[grizzled heart]

https://twitter.com/chefraptor/status/1620092542149869570?s=46&t=_fm-3w1PjvRZdRJea7XFnw

Very basic short af tutorial on KOF mixups

[sinful herald]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xSw0pjdi1jo&list=PLZbBoZgd9o1mooAX-0W1PeIT0Q_DJ_Pta&index=12

This is an older video but worthwhile as well

[torn drift]

Ooh @magic harness you know what’s something you do that I never do

It’s pretty cool

Corner Fr.Fr.HP into ex qcfkk

I either give corner for set play and more damage or sacrifice damage and keep corner

Sometimes I forget you can have both

[magic harness]

Oh
Yeah, it does work, but I have a problem with it
Maybe because my combo is already too big before the Fr. Fr. HP, but I never found a good follow-up after the Ex hcf K

[torn drift]

Fr.Fr. HP > EX HCF K > Fr.LK U.LP > HCB.LK

[magic harness]

The problem is that I use U.Lp on the main combo before the Fr. Fr. Hp, so it just doesn't connect

[torn drift]

If you can get in the habit of switching between corner and mid screen combos

Hk, Fr.LK > QCB.HP,D.Lk, Fr.Fr.LP > Bk.Fr.HK, U.Hk, Fr.Fr.HP > Ex HCF.K > Fr.LK,U.LP > HCB.LK

[magic harness]

Hey
That is good!
Will try it for sure

[magic harness]

Hey people!
Is there anyone here that play Billy and could maybe help me understand more the character?

I don't quite have a gameplan with him, I just zone as much as possible and go for some bnbs on punishes and jump ins.
I don't really feel confident about the way I play Billy

Also, does he have any good confirms?
Because his Fr. Lk that is needed in almost 90% of his combos is very unsafe on block

I tried searching on YT for anything Billy related, and I guess noone besides ET play him
No tutorials, nor anything other than some replays of ET
Only some combo videos that don't actually help me improve with him

[torn drift]

@spring relic is our billy here

[runic rain]

@lethal shuttle can you shed some light since you play billy sometimes at a comp level

[lethal shuttle]

what exactly is the question

billys pressure is entirely respect based, he has the pullin which is like +3 so if they dont dp or dont have one you can press after

cd into pullin is a great oki setup up close

sweep into 6a is a great gapless option or 2b 2b 6a

As for confirms here are some of the main ones

[runic rain]

One thing to note is that his strings and moves are shitty on whiff so try not to throw out shit in hyper jump range

Wtf

Anyways

[lethal shuttle]

if you need an anti air either use 2c or 214c which is invul

*air invul

[runic rain]

2c is DUMB

[lethal shuttle]

its bad

[runic rain]

Labbed it and omg it's Shermie last patch almost

[lethal shuttle]

its really bad

[runic rain]

It's slow asf

[lethal shuttle]

it trades constantly

[runic rain]

Don't really on it but it has wide box

Unless that just on certain characters that it hits so widely on

[lethal shuttle]

for fun heres a sideswitch combo also

[magic harness]

Hm, I never use the pull, I just burn after the stick. Will lab that a lot

[magic harness]

Thank you so much! Will practice those a lot

[magic harness]

Thank you, will be careful with that

[lethal shuttle]

on that last one in the first vid, make sure to do b flip not d flip

thats the route you should do to keep corner

[magic harness]

Oh! That is cool, will copy that

[magic harness]

Ok!
Thank you!

Will be spending some time on training mode with him rn
🙂

Thank you so much

[grizzled heart]

@primal minnow

https://twitter.com/chefraptor/status/1620452101947285506?s=46&t=BbX2k0i4O2ru_ytWm41MsQ

Pepe Silvia (@ChefRaptor)

Another quick KOF 101 Guide this time for blockstrings
Trying to keep light, quick and fun!
As always I hope everyone enjoys! ❤️‍🔥

Likes

536

Retweets

135

▶ Play video

Twitter · Jan 31, 2023, 4:01 PM

This works for all pressure

https://twitter.com/chefraptor/status/1620092542149869570?s=46&t=BbX2k0i4O2ru_ytWm41MsQ

Pepe Silvia (@ChefRaptor)

Made this basic tutorial for KOF mixups
for people that have a hard time trying to open their opponents

Hope everyone enjoys ❤️‍🔥

Likes

716

Retweets

191

▶ Play video

Twitter · Jan 30, 2023, 4:12 PM

[primal minnow]

Not what I meant 😅

[grizzled heart]

oh do u mean after hard knockdown?

You can do a lot of these

Just play footsies see if they’re going to wake up reversal, if not just go in guns blazing

you can try and cross up

A lot of things

Do an overhead

Meaty

[magic harness]

Hard knockdowns are the ones where your opponent can't quick rise or roll rise

At least...
In SF it is
But I believe Kof too

[primal minnow]

I don’t know how to do that

[magic harness]

Who are your chars?

[grizzled heart]

You were doing it 😂

Vanessa doesn’t have a good one but you were totally false crossup side switching me

Iori you use Taco you did that

I forget what Shermie’s cross up button was but she has (had? If it got Nerfed) an Od one

[primal minnow]

JC

[grizzled heart]

yeah

[primal minnow]

I have no idea how to hit a taco kick tbh

[grizzled heart]

bruh u used it

I blocked because we play the same character

[primal minnow]

It was luck it even collided w block

[grizzled heart]

Don’t get discouraged bro it’ll all come w/ time I still think you’re doing a lot of the stuff you’re supposed to im just blocking, just have to recognize the next option and what to do after that to try and open me up

I was playing pretty unga

[primal minnow]

My pressure never feels good to me people always get out of it and idk how to get the hit if they’re patient

[grizzled heart]

Hop

Your Vanessa pressure is mad solid

[primal minnow]

Cause I have to play unga with Nessa

[grizzled heart]

to a degree sure

[plush delta]

jC

[primal minnow]

And my Nessa pressure not complex it’s easily escapable

[magic harness]

It did get nerfed, but they just expanded the hurt box

It is still very strong

[grizzled heart]

Agree

[magic harness]

I don't quite know how to use Iori's consistently
But I think it's Bk. Lk in the air?
But you have to invert the directions because it's a cross up

[grizzled heart]

yeah

Do it on wake-up or jump over cross them up

[primal minnow]

I know the input but I can’t ever get it to collide I always jump too far or can’t hop over them in the first place

[grizzled heart]

worth practicing in the lab

[magic harness]

Can I ask some REALLY dumb question?
How to do a normal grab?
And why do I keep doing it by mistake?

[primal minnow]

It’s just C or D and forwards or backwards

[grizzled heart]

Here’s some avenues you can try and go down once you get it:

Block ? Do 5A into Command grab/ or command grab straight up, or any pressure sequence u want, I recommend 5A/5C, 6A, 2369 Fireball, or a low confirm

Hit ? Do a combo, tight window

[primal minnow]

The conmand grab thing is helpful but I do basic pokes and stuff like that

[grizzled heart]

Something to work toward

5A/5C 6A into 2369 fireball is as basic as it gets

You can even try this w/ 2B 2A 2369 fireball

Y’all lemme know if I’m saying anything super incorrect ! I’m not really qualified to give advice here anyway

[raven ridge]

You're qualified

[grizzled heart]

nah bro

I’m wack at the game

[plush delta]

Iori expert

[plush delta]

@primal minnow here are your general options to maintain pressure after a hard knockdown. @meager portal @tacit ether and whoever else. You might find these useful as well.

Other experts like @runic rain @snow beacon @torn drift @sinful herald @spring relic and others, feel free to chime in and correct me if I say anything wrong

First off, learn your opponent’s habits. See what they do after a hard knockdown. Do they like to wakeup dp? Mash lights? Roll away? Observe your opponents and make an educated read for your pressure.

Here are your options. It’s also important to mix up all these to keep your opponent on their toes.

Your strongest option is to be able to do hop pressure. Quite simply you can just short hop at them (preferably with a light normal) and do your block/combo string. This is very hard to defend, especially once opponent is at the corner. Once you are comfortable with it, you can vary your hop pressure with hop CDs (huge hitbox) or empty hops into lows or (command) grabs or hop with a light normal then if they block it, land and do a light low (you are plus if they block the hop light). Only way opponent can escape in the corner is if they read right and roll forward before your hop or they spend a meter to GC roll or GC. Blowback during the block string. Midscreen, they can roll away but that’s just putting themselves closer to the corner.

If hopping is something you have difficulty with. Just do the same thing except with jumpins. But know that the opponent can easily read your jumpins and can anti air or reversal you. The solution to that is to know your safe jump options. These are jump ins after a hard knock down where if you do an empty jump, you will land safely before the opponent starts their anti air dp. So they are wide open for huge punish. Learn the safe jumps for your characters and if the opponent likes to wakeup dp, just empty jump and block.

If on midscreen and your opponent likes to stay still and block, do a jump in crossup. Shermie has the jump C and Iori has the taco. This is an easy way to get a huge combo in. You can even mix it up with a same side non crossup jump in to confuse your opponent.

Okay the opponent is at the corner and noticed you always do hop pressure so they counter that by rolling forward on wakeup. Instead of doing hop pressure. Just sit there at hop distance and as they roll forward, just do your light crouch confirm into your combo. Staying at hop distance and doing a standing cd is also a very strong pressure tool and can catch opponent trying to hop or press buttons if they see you standing there. Learn the timing, distance and hitbox of your CDs. Some characters have better CDs than others.

What if the opponent likes to wake up mash. These can jab away or trade against hops. Learn meaties for this. This is not as easy as you need to learn the timing. Basically meaties mean you run in on opponent wakeup and hit a fast hitting button (4f close heavies work) before their buttons come out to start your big combo. Be careful though as opponents can wake up throw you if you mistime your meaties. A counter to opponent doing wakeup throw is to run in and then shimmy before they throw. You can also meaty using low hitting standing normals or just do crouching low lights (2Bs). These will catch your opponent off guard if they try to block your meaties.

How do you practice these?

For hop pressure, just have the dummy guard crouch and try hitting your hop combos.

For safe jumps, set the knock down reversal so the dummy does a 4f dp on wakeup (Ryo ex dp should work).

For meaties, set the reversal to do a throw (just do 6C) on wakeup.

Once you are comfortable with all these, set the dummy so that he will do the following options (1) wakeup dp (2) throw (3) 2As (4) roll forward (5) roll backward and out that on random and practice all your options

You should also practice doing these against the cpu opponent in lab or even against a training partner

@torn drift feel free to pin this

[torn drift]

Yeah I don’t appreciate being call out to fact check, I need to be fact check not the one checking, but yes this is amazingly good advice

[torn drift]

Fizz and everyone here I would read what oli said carefully. You have a million and one things you just learned and want to do, you’re also learning new characters your opponents picks. But you can adapt and you can do it even at your level. First match take a breather and really analyze what’s going on. Use previous experience but don’t let that paralyze you. Learn your options, then look for them in game.

Sometimes you won’t be able to, or you see it but didn’t react. This is why you rewatch your own games. Even if nobody streamed it kof has a replay mode. Watch back your own games even if it’s only on a Saturday night or whatever. But everything oli said was on point

[primal minnow]

Thx so much I’ll definitely reread and look more in depth tomorrow and spend some more time in the lab rn think I’m just pressuring myself a bit too hard to learn a bit too much at once

[plush delta]

Thanks for the additional info!

[plush delta]

You’re not on a clock. I’ve been playing for a year and I’m still learning. It took me 6 months to do a QM combo. And I’m just learning how to hop, 1 year in

[torn drift]

i still dont lol

[plush delta]

Learn and have fun. Don’t compare your progress rate against other people. Learn at your own pace. We’re here for the long haul

[plush delta]

Some options are better for certain characters compared to others. Learn which are beautiful for yours

[primal minnow]

Ahaha I been doing that exact thing…😅

[plush delta]

Vanessa for example has no crossups but she has strong combo pressure

Iori has everything lol

@grizzled heart you prolly know a lot of these but feel free to reread what I wrote above

[torn drift]

i can be super fun and motivating to have rivals and friendly comp, just watch out. Love is closer to hate than anything. Constantly comparing your growth to others can quickly go from your biggest motivator to your biggest point of frustration

as long as you can keep a good mental youll be fine i believein you

[plush delta]

Yep never compare your progress rate against your peers. It’s a no win situation

[primal minnow]

I know, luckily I’m mostly shaking it off but sometimes a losing streak can set me off

[meager portal]

I just look at everything as an opportunity to learn something from it.

Because with fgs the skill ceiling is so high, there is always room for improvement, and if I wanna be the very best like no one ever was, then I need to learn from every loss I have and improve upon good plays and break old habits. It's a simple plan/mindset, but in a year, I should be a high enough level to actually compete if I keep it up.

But thats just me

[plush delta]

What I wrote above is already much better than anything Rooflemonger has come up for his videos

[primal minnow]

True, but roofle taught me a lot of basics and helps me eliminate characters I do and don’t wanna play lol

I can’t say his videos aren’t helpful and by a content standpoint I find them entertaining

[plush delta]

I’m a roofle hater haha

[primal minnow]

Any particular reason?

[meager portal]

Oli doesn't like the non-optimal info he gives to new players😅

Or something like that

[sinful herald]

It’s not the worst thing when pressure ends, it’s just a return to neutral. I get it, I want to go back in too but trying to remember that a round is just the sum of many smaller interactions has helped me out. Maybe try looking at it that way

[plush delta]

He steals/recycles info from other content creators, really pads out low level info just to create videos and sometimes even gives false/wrong info

His videos are very low effort content

[meager portal]

I've seen a few of em and when I was learning the game, the only video I took half-seriously was the one about choosing mains

All the others seemed like they were missing a lot/recycling the same shit I've heard over and over again

And at the end of the day, I chose my team with no regard to playstyle at all, so the video was useless to me

I chose Terry: cuz he's cool and sold me the game
I chose Andy: cuz he's Terry's brother
I chose Mary: cuz she looks pretty

I'm a simple man, I just pick who I like.

[plush delta]

He created a patch notes video where he just read the patch notes then created another visual guide video where he does the moves of the patch notes and says I have no idea what this does as I don’t play this character lol

[sinful herald]

Hey it’s ok to lose, all of us here have lost tons. Of course it’s more fun to win try and do what @torn drift said and look at the tapes and see if you can analyze what happened. Looking forward to getting some lab time in with you whenever 🤘

[plush delta]

Also Mary is Terry’s gf

[primal minnow]

Planning tomorrow most likely unless I suddenly become busy to a concerning level XD

[primal minnow]

I choose Shermie cause she’s really really cool : D

[sinful herald]

Cool! I’ll be free around 4 PST

[plush delta]

Definitely take up smoke’s offer to do online training

He can be your coach

[primal minnow]

You don’t want me😔

[sinful herald]

I’ll show you a couple ways I use the lab to find solutions and also how I practice. All the answers are in there if you know how to use the tools

[sinful herald]

Nah you don’t know that broski

[meager portal]

That too
I centered my team around terry if it wasn't obvious lmao🤣

[primal minnow]

I don’t use the lab enough I’ve gotten better now I use ai recordings now but still

[plush delta]

But now you’re an Andy simp

[meager portal]

Terry is still my main guy, but Andy caters to my shoto loving playstyle

[sinful herald]

Grinding matches is great too, but when there’s an issue that keeps coming up? That’s what the lab is for. Also good to tighten up pressure and figure out how to keep it going

Happy to share what little I know

[primal minnow]

I was gonna have Terry on the team instead of Nessa due to hearing her difficulty but I really wanted a team of hot redheads

[sinful herald]

@primal minnow if you could do both of us a favor, think about (and write down) like 3-5 things you’re trying to deal with. You don’t have to answer rfn just have it ready by tmw. Deal?

[primal minnow]

3-5 things I’m trying to learn? Can that include things I’m struggling with and characters I struggle beating?

[sinful herald]

Yeah exactly

[primal minnow]

I can definitely do that

[sinful herald]

Specific moves or block strings/setups you want to deal with is a good start. I can’t practice for you but can show you my process

[primal minnow]

Ye

[sinful herald]

Cool

[magic harness]

And you are not wrong to do so
I mean...
I chose Shermie, O. Shermie and Angel for obvious reasons
Leona is still wip, but same reasons
Billy and Geese might not be so obvious, but same reasons as above

In the end, you just have to learn and adapt your playstyle to your character, not the inverse.
I see a lot of people trying to do the inverse and making characters like Guile play aggressively
Which does work sometimes, but I think that if you're planning on playing high level competitively, you should find a middle ground and adapt both your char to you and you to your char

In Kof that is a bit harder, cuz you have 3 characters, but it's surely something that has helped me A LOT everytime I pick a new character

[magic harness]

I laughed at that part
Lmao

[magic harness]

If it makes you better, my win rate was below 50% up until rank 24
I just got it to 51% around last week
And I have been playing since April last year

[magic harness]

Maybe I can try to help with that
Have a coach yet?

I do have to say that I tried helping Cien, but he actually didn't need much help
His Shermie was already very good, so I just pointed some small things out after watching some of his fights

Still
@primal minnow @warped pine @meager portal

I see you three usually play a lot together and you seem to be on the same level
I don't actually play all of your characters, but I do have a bit of knowledge of most of them
So would you mind if I got in the room just to watch you three and maybe try to point some things out?

[meager portal]

If we're on later, sure

[warped pine]

Yeah but I probably won't listen 😅

[torn drift]

@plush delta @mild parcel @rancid marlin any advice from yesterday

[plush delta]

I didn’t watch much of your match unfortunately. But I saw you won over bubbles so you’re doing good

[torn drift]

He doesn’t know how to deal with ángel it wasn’t a fair fight

[plush delta]

Sounds like he kept trying to challenge or defend the jC

[torn drift]

He kept trying to roll it actually

[plush delta]

Isn’t that the correct way to avoid it?

[torn drift]

Yeah

But I gave him free hugs

[plush delta]

Yeah you read the rolls

[torn drift]

I did eat a couple dps but now bubs dos aren’t as scary

Kro no longer leads to 80 percent so I feel more comfortable going for the 50/50

Also I play better after round 1

[sinful herald]

I have no idea what my win rate is except that I’ve lost more than I’ve won and it’s not even close lol

[torn drift]

If angel can survive one round I play a little more reckless, and tbh she benefited from that

[sinful herald]

Does her command grab move her forward, I’m curious how she’s able to recover from her j.C and have time to get a throw in. Also kind of agree with Oli, when I’ve seen you and Bubs play he try’s to contest too much stuff up close on the ground which is like, exactly where she wants to be

[torn drift]

No her command doesn’t move her forward

Also in this specific matchup it wasn’t a whiff j.c into throw

It was just run up throw

After Knock I tend to run up and j.c I was switching it up with run up throw as well

[sinful herald]

Ok thanks wasn’t sure. And well, this sounds like what Oli mentioned about him contesting stuff. Good on ya for mixing it up

[rancid marlin]

Sorry. Just seeing this. But Angel, I was mostly zoning until I got bored, and then just ran up and did whatever. But up close you got me that 1 time when you canceled her low into some other shit it was super fast idk how consistently you could do this. I feel like you should go for hard knockdown more often rather than grab reset as it pushes them so far away. Idk if you can do this on light attack? I am a bit more familiar with Angel stuff as I have fought her a lot and played as her, but I think if you play her the way you did with Bubs, but incorporate kinda strike-throw play style this could help them respect a new mix a bit maybe. Mai, get a QM you're comfortable with. Hop tf around, try not to get hit or trade as much. Zone. Utilize her little shenanigans. There was this Mai I fought last night on ranked that was hella hyper asf. Surprised I won one tbh. I can show you the link gimmie a lil min. Also, try to reduce those missed air to air reads, go vert so you have less a chance of getting punished mid screen when they're not as close. Some characters got them long ass 2Bs that'll sting you right as you land

[spring relic]

https://twitter.com/ChefRaptor/status/1621257375041683462?s=20&t=HbPHpmLXM9pTDXHRiIRHtg

Pepe Silvia (@ChefRaptor)

I noticed that a lot of players have issues doing light combos because of the timing.
So HOPEFULLY this video will help people that are having the same issues, personally this method helped me a lot when I was learning!
Hope everyone enjoys! ❤️‍🔥

Likes

390

Retweets

136

▶ Play video

Twitter · Feb 2, 2023, 9:20 PM

[warped pine]

The intro music

[spring relic]

@magic harness my Billy tips:

He should be played Mid. He can barely do anything without meter, and not strong enough to bet the game on.

As for a game plan? I’d say “pressure and punish.”

His far reaching normals, aside from st.CD, are not great. And so you will lose just by virtue of probability if you focus on space control.

To that end, if you’re gonna go for a punish like an AA, be willing to spend the cash on an EX for conversion if you’re confident

Also, be comfy with his light chains because you need them to test an opponent’s patience and open them up to get tagged with either cl.B or st.A

And do not sleep on 6A; low-key MVP button post-patch

Now that it is a true OH, you can use that to pester opponents and open them up to lows

Also, cr.A is not only a solid poke button to check opponents, but it also has a surprising amount of hitstun making it strong to QM off of

[magic harness]

Ok!!!!!
I will be practicing a lot his light chains and confirms
And yeah, he was supposed to be mid, with Angel as point and Shermie or O. Shermie as anchor

[spring relic]

I’ve been lazy about it, but I wanna make a Billy combo vid

[magic harness]

Ohhhhhhh
Ok!
Will be using it much more often

[spring relic]

I’ve labbed many of them so I might as well put all that grind together into something productive and fun

[magic harness]

Really?
Will be labbing that
I tend to get a lot of those as pokes, maybe I can get a big damage conversion out of it?

[magic harness]

That is great!
I've also labbed mine quite a bit and I did watch some combo videos as these are the only type of Billy tutorials there are
Lol

[spring relic]

Far B chains into cr.A and from max distance you can QM off this

Far B is also a low FYI

[magic harness]

That is very good to know!
Will take notes

Thank you SO MUCH for the tips!!!!!
I'll take that to lab today and practice a lot

[spring relic]

Happy to help

[plush delta]

Here’s my tip. It’s much slower than you think. Press slower and don’t mash

[lament mirage]

Real

[plush delta]

If it’s 2B 2B, you can mash and that’s why characters like Robert and Kula have easy light confirms. But that can also develop bad habits and 2B 2A will be harder to develop muscle memory for

[spring relic]

Anyone got tips for dealing with the salt from Onlies?

[magic harness]

I usually just punch a wall and go to training mode
When I see I am too salty, I get out of ranked and into training mode for like half an hour

Mostly to practice combos
Not because I actually wanna practice or learn something new
But beating up the dummy actually de-stresses me

[spring relic]

For Real, I wanna hear from the killers in this server and their perspective.

[plush delta]

The trick is to not lose

[spring relic]

Cause last I checked, 1F landing lag is a thing yes?

[plush delta]

The other trick if you keep losing is to not play

[spring relic]

This means two things:

1. You cannot press a button before your opponent upon landing.

2. You can’t re-jump for free and without getting checked IE no invincibility frames on a re-jump.

Are any of you proactively taking advantage of this?

Also, in your opinion

P1 runs up to P2 and they both press 2B: who wins?

Do you find disconnect between your labbing and matches IE clean AA normals suddenly being unreliable?

And how do you feel when you see something like a 2B blocked by a standing animation?

[meager portal]

I just walk away from the game and recreate the angry dance forest scene from the movie Hot Rod before going to get food.

[spring relic]

I accept any and all replies of that nature as validation

[torpid quarry]

Just say “this game sucks!” It makes me feel immediately better!

[spring relic]

…

This is gonna be Ángel j.C all over again

[runic rain]

What's up?

@spring relic what

[spring relic]

Scroll up

[runic rain]

Are the 2b's the same frame?

I mean idk I think it's connection issues

Rollback does have price

[spring relic]

I want to know why this general situation isn’t uniform in my EXP

And how you feel on your end

[raven ridge]

We having connection issues online? @spring relic or are we talking those frame tight things? Things like that I kinda leave it. I give myself a buffer. Also I set my connection to 3+, I find great success that way.

I just try to outplay the neutral n set high/low rushes. Couple + frame enders n what have you