Velma

[leaden shell]

I’m like ok need an easy guy to rest my brain

[atomic otter]

Atleast Jake has combos

It’s because people complained about Jake more than Velma

[calm herald]

Fr we barely have any

[atomic otter]

Even tho Velma has it harder

Jake is playable

[calm herald]

Well good for Jake players then I guess

Not like I ever saw any anyway

[atomic otter]

Crazy I never would have thought they buff wonder woman’s lasso

They don’t care about Velma anymore

[muted holly]

no one i faced in tourney went for the evidence tbh, the tricky part with her van is atually getting it on the map

[calm herald]

Yeah honestly I never see anyone go for the evidence

They probably think Velma is an easy kill so theres no reason to go after it since its a distraction basically

[robust siren]

Its so annoying trying to get evidence while someone has the projectile shield perk

[muted holly]

welp get ready for high ranks then, everyone uses it against mages

evidence isnt even worth the missery

[orchid rampart]

no buff for some reason????

[atomic otter]

I think for the van the enemy just has to camp middle and your good to go

[muted holly]

you need to knock them offstage before you can safely go for it

otherwise any reasonable player would punish you hard for it

[muted holly]

first game of ranked, my mouse breaks

i am being griefed

[atomic otter]

Wait I just released the Velma change was a bug fix

So technically its a nerf

😭😭😭 mvs is a joke

[sturdy orbit]

Velma had her time in beta lol

[wooden ginkgo]

You need to return her megaphone scream to the way it was before.

[muted holly]

did they shadow nerf her again?

her mark goes away much quicker it feels like

[robust siren]

new velma emote and it barely even works 😭 she really can’t have anything

[muted holly]

i am officially #1 velma in ranked

nevermind i got surpassed already 🔥

[muted holly]

hard reading a finn multiple times in a row just to get hit by one nair uspecial and dying in 25% is painful

velmas redirected bubbles still target the ufo on townsville, even with hazards off

[calm herald]

I swear no matter how many times I read my opponent im always punished for trying to punish like genuinely WHY did we not get any buffs because I shouldnt be getting punished for punishing my opponent

[muted holly]

like we dont have any 0tds

a punish isnt that bad

let us have atleast that

[calm herald]

Also after playing a few matches I think Velmas speech bubble target has a shorter duration

The third bubble could barely even get to my teammate or enemy

So they nerfed us once again, lovely

I love this game and its choices

Also apparently Taz has an instant death

Cause I just fought a Taz and Joker and Taz did a weird thing where he did the eating move and it killed me instantly twice

[muted holly]

so im not the only one noticing it

[boreal wharf]

@muted holly going for masters?

[muted holly]

yes

both modes

i will sacrifice my sanity for it

probably wont get very high till my new mouse arrives tho

[boreal wharf]

Well good luck and I hope to play against you in 2s

[muted holly]

thanks

put up a good fight if you queue me

atleast if you are from eu

otherwise queueing me will be hard

[boreal wharf]

Damn unfortunate

[muted holly]

i think i am top 3 in 2s rn

on velma

my mouse be broken but im still dominating

[boreal wharf]

Same

[muted holly]

💪

ended the grind for today

ended right before gold #1 velma 2v2 worldwide

[atomic otter]

How yall Velma mains doing in 1v1s 💀

[warm lily]

1v1 exists for Velma?

[leaden shell]

I was top 3 for 20 mins in 1s 🔥

That’s all I play as her it’s tough sometimes

[warm lily]

You’re one of those people huh

[leaden shell]

What’s that supposed to mean

[neon ore]

What's that supposed to mean

[dapper quest]

What's that supposed to mean

[carmine dune]

What’s that supposed to mean

[dry fulcrum]

Whats that supposed to mean

[calm herald]

[muted holly]

[dry fulcrum]

officially claimed my "i was top 100 once" bragging rights i can now retire (joke)

[muted holly]

gonna get my #1 spot back now

[dry fulcrum]

wishing you luck, nervous to queue up rn cuz like 4 of my 6 losses were literally out of my control

[muted holly]

gotta accept defeat sometimes

[dry fulcrum]

yeah fair, but i dont mean in like a john way. i mean literally my connection went out 3 matches and my bluetooth devices all shut off on my computer on the fourth

[muted holly]

oh yea thats uncontrollable

[dry fulcrum]

yeaaa, so been hesitant since then lol

[muted holly]

i mean my mouse broke and i am still queueing so there is no reason not to

[dry fulcrum]

fair enough

[muted holly]

i have learned, jack is another impossible matchup

once aerial you're guaranteed to be dead

either by juggling or by cornerguard

[atomic otter]

Velma top 100 in 1s is all gold and below

[muted holly]

no one plays her

and i get why

[dry fulcrum]

rough time for Jinkie-nation. our usage lower is even lower than Stripe and Jake 😭

[muted holly]

not a single one above gold i think (in 1s)

[leaden shell]

Good for me, easier to get rank 1

[dry fulcrum]

the good thing about playing this character is that like on Ranked almost everyone toasts you lmao

[muted holly]

not even

i had 1 toast me so far and i absolutely wooped him

[dry fulcrum]

i've gotten like 4 toasts i dunno about you

[muted holly]

maybe they dont like clunky 0tds

[dry fulcrum]

i mostly play her around her surprisingly good neutral game. keeping people at bay with flashlight, jab and megaphone. mixing up with book and camera to not be predictable

[muted holly]

my playstyle is also centered around her neutral but whenever i get the chance i try to set up aearly kill confirm

[dry fulcrum]

yeah my main struggle is i dont go for early kills as much as i should, not like i dont. but i'm bad with the true combo timings and mainly use it as a way to bait out reads and panic options

[muted holly]

yeah its all very strict timings and missing them is very punishable

[muted holly]

i just destroyed a streamer in ranked

decided to see what he was up to

he was ranting for 3 minutes straight about how velma is broken 💀

[dry fulcrum]

LMAO

[muted holly]

funny thing, his chat kept saying quit yapping

spoiler: he didnt stop

[dry fulcrum]

if you lose to one of the worst characters in the game and somehow manage to find a way to spin it into them being broken and needing a nerf that is an intense issue of skill

[muted holly]

phahaha queued him again

didnt bother checking his stream this time tho

[cursive tendon]

give me 2-4 business days

[muted holly]

pushing for platinum now

😈

the van is actually unbelievably garbage

cant even bother to use it anymore

[atomic otter]

👀

[muted holly]

havent checked for a while but i think i am back into top 5 1v1 velmas

[calm herald]

Ngl I might not play until we get proper buffs we need and not nerfs that werent necessary

[dry fulcrum]

its minus a billion in terms of animation, i've been killed several times because for some reason you're still vulnerable during the same frames the Mystery Machine has been spawned in, leading to both me and the van getting rung out with the same attacks

[muted holly]

even if you get it down safely, it doesnt do anything

one dodge and its there for nothing

[muted holly]

no, assert dominance

rise and grind

[calm herald]

Genuinely I try but no matter what I do get punished for my punishes, I get outzoned hard and the van bugs out, the speech bubble target sucks now for the third bullet and I just cannot play Velma like I want to and her kit is still fun to me but the current meta just screws us over heavily

[muted holly]

normally you dont use 3 bubbles at once so something is wrong there

[calm herald]

Most times im forced to because my opponent wont get off me with just one when getting back on stage

[muted holly]

bubbles arent an answer to that

if you have like a game or 2 for me to watch then i might be able to find some things to work on in your gameplay

[hot rivet]

Yeah I was playing her in 1s and got her to gold and was like, “I’m tired, this is so draining fighting all these characters murdering her”

[dry fulcrum]

in terms of offstage, for me personally when in an airborne position i charge megaphone to punish charged gimps, and when hanging on the ledge wall jump into up air whenever they get close to make recovering safer

[muted holly]

back to my beloved #1 spot

[hot rivet]

Nice

[dry fulcrum]

obviously it wont always work but when you have an up special that does literally nothing for your recovery game you learn to get crafty, as a former Mac main knowledge carries over

[hot rivet]

Guys I want old van AI. Why does it only jump when someone goes offstage? Like people sit on a platform and they are safe from it cause it won’t jump.

[muted holly]

because the driver is drunk

[hot rivet]

God damn it Fred….

[dry fulcrum]

the Van is just hilariously bad, you can tell the devs carefully balance around it but its not even like KO Punch where you can set up into it as a good player, there's just some time where you can never safely go for the machine

[hot rivet]

Exactly

[dry fulcrum]

also heads up Lucid, if i ever get anything wrong lmk. even though i have over 600 1v1 wins on the character as you know i have consistency problems so i might be missing some info or tech

[hot rivet]

Like just fix the AI on it and make it to where people can dodge it but don’t gain full immunity if they do dodge it.

Also does anyone know if that dodging thing for immunity was on launch or is a bug? Cause I don’t think that was there on launch but then after a certain patch, people started getting immunity after dodging it once

[muted holly]

no worries

im here to help

[dry fulcrum]

yee, trying fo bump the winrate up, not like i'm completely bad, spiked up to over 70 a few times. its just losing streaks can happen, not even like bad curbstompy lose streaks, just like a bunch of 2-3s in a row

[muted holly]

can happen to the best of us

[dry fulcrum]

eh not much need to sugarcoat, i still have room to learn, most notably i start slipping a lot in disadvantage and struggle to do stock taking combos alot, meaning i usually kill in neutral

[muted holly]

as long as you learn from a loss, it isnt really a loss

[neon ore]

PLEASE NERF VELMA SHES SO BUSTED

[muted holly]

here we go again...

[calm herald]

Sadly I dont have any recordings

[muted holly]

if it helps, i have recordings of a few of my games. maybe you can get something out of that

[lament grail]

Share to all of us!

[muted holly]

might aswell get some newer better recordings then if mor epeople want it

ill try to get something good tomorrow in ranked, might be better then casual games

[lament grail]

Nice! I'll be looking forward!

[boreal wharf]

I should send some of my games here to I’d like feedback fr fr

[muted holly]

found out the hard way, van can target watermelon steven

lost a game due to that

[boreal wharf]

Pretty sure it works like that got agent smith clone also

Like some characters just shouldn’t be small

[muted holly]

finn

[boreal wharf]

Indeed it’s outrageous that I literally have to be on the ground to hit him with camera bro

[muted holly]

its also annoying af that you cant jab2 into utilt him

[boreal wharf]

Does samurai jack side special have more range than Velma speaker?

Love losing a game because the van has them off the map and it just decides to turn around

[muted holly]

It's the same but jack gets priority because home has Invincibility frames when he teleports

Also learned that the hard way

[boreal wharf]

Ok good that makes sense

[desert roost]

Lmao.

So why didn't velma get a buff? I'm confused.

[hot rivet]

Late response but if you do got some recordings please share. I don’t see any other Velma’s so I need to see how my gameplay differs from others

[desert roost]

The way someone just said nerf velma. I just laughed out loud.

[muted holly]

Peak game balancing

[muted holly]

Like I said earlier, I will try to record some ranked games tomorrow

[hot rivet]

Alr

[desert roost]

Because Samurai Jack is broke. Lol. That MU for velma is terrible. She can't even get a decent punish. He has like 0 end lag. I got punished for lading my jab.

The man gets to hold forward with no punish potiental LOL.

[misty dew]

there so many characters in this game that have 8 moves they can do and not actually commit to it's so frustrating

like I just feel my brain melt every time something that I probably wouldn't have been able to punish anyways becomes super unpunishable because they dodged through the middle of it like yayyyy😃😃😐

[desert roost]

No litreally.

[muted holly]

Funny thing I just explained the matchup and how to play it in the Velma discord, let me copy it here to help ya out

Onstage he is pretty tame in the Velma matchup Velma can keep control but if she loses it she takes a lot of damage, offstage is 99-1 in favor of jack
My main gameplan against him is keeping distance and play the zoning game until you can get a mark on him, if you got the mark then you go for a higher damage combo using bubbles or possibly even a quick kill if he isn't careful
Make sure to use Chem spill as much as possible against him as he is very fast
And at all costs, NEVER GO OFFSTAGE
And just so you know, megaphone doesn't counter his sspecial

[desert roost]

Sounds awfull. But I appreciate the tips

[misty dew]

having negative fun getting camped out by all 8 thousand samurai jacks online rn 👍👍👍

[boreal wharf]

I’d be fine with speaker not hitting low if it meant I could freely aim it ngl

Then they could just give her better low options

Velma has been nerfed roughly 37 times since the games release 🔥

[calm herald]

Wait is that true?

Cause if so then wtf

[boreal wharf]

Yeah I counted it

[calm herald]

[boreal wharf]

We love PFG clearly if you can’t balance this character maybe the kit is the problem 🔥

[desert roost]

Lmao no seriously. It’s like he can hold forward and if you punish him he just acts out of the punish. It’s sooo aggravating.

Like I get it you gotta make the on release character op. But god damn. Velma feels so bad because she is at the bottom lol of the actual
1v1 tier list.

Even in 2’s samurai Jack feels bad only because his hit boxes are crazy. His down air is better than Velma’s ever could be. Lol.

His charge attack is the length of Velma’s megaphoneAnd KILLS. Lol.

[misty dew]

it's so demoralizing too because like during a game I'll just notice the amount of work it's taking for me to do something that my opponent does in like one jab

speaking of her jab HOW is she the only character in a game where everyones jab is stupid broken to have one that sucks 😭

*and the only one with actual endlag on her moves

I just really want to know the rationale behind every balancing decision that's been made since the beta

[desert roost]

Extremely demoralizing. You make several reads to have 50 damage. Meanwhile they do like 4 moves and you’re in the blast zone. It’s absurd.

Her jab is legit punishable. Like why can she hit her jab and not follow up after it. But samurai Jack gets to do his jab and gets to follow up for free. It’s so annoying. We do all the work for what exactly? To die and not kill people.

[calm herald]

I already hate Samurai Jack with a burning passion

[hot rivet]

So do I... I want him gone. Jk but wth is going on with him

[calm herald]

So like is jab 1-2 > grounded down special > jab 1-2 into either the third jab or grounded uptilt a true combo? Ive seen this one Velma player use it a lot and it seems pretty good

[muted holly]

could be, havent thought of trying that before

[muted holly]

yalls study content is uploading to yt now

hopefully it is on within an hour because my internet is bad to say the least

[muted holly]

@calm herald @lament grail @hot rivet here you guys go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44Nlaw1W_D0

also @desert roost there are some games against jack in there, might wanna check that out i you are struggling

[lament grail]

Pretty clean Velma!

Seeing you play, you could almost fool anyone into thinking she's not hot garbage. Hahaha

Thank you for sharing!

[muted holly]

np, nice hearing that

[muted holly]

my sanity has been sacrificed, i have not reached masters yet. some things arent checking out here

[boreal wharf]

What are you at right now?

[muted holly]

Almost plat in both modes

Will probably hard focus 1s the next 2 days

[boreal wharf]

You got this lock in fr

Maybe I’ll try to get masters again today

[muted holly]

Go get it chief

[hot rivet]

Thank you for this!

btw @muted holly what perks do you usually run? I see you're using knowledge is power but what others as well?

[muted holly]

knowledge is power, collateral damage, armor killer/pugilist (depends on matchup)

[dry fulcrum]

i've never seen down air into dash attack, neat usage. whenever i use down air its usually with up air to either punish bad DI or force a dodge to enter neutral again, but actively getting more damage while re-establishing neutral seems spicy

[muted holly]

dair dash attack is a 50/50 but you get a better reward then uair

but i recommend only using it if you know how your opponent dodges

[boreal wharf]

I feel like they should revert some of her movement/grey health nerfs

[muted holly]

she just needs general stat buffs on most of her attacks

[hybrid nymph]

I'd like an actual purpose for her air side special

calculator is also pretty questionable

her grab is almost usable but idk if it's ever the correct option considering how punishable you are during it. and in 2s, you're punishable even if it lands because she'll keep running at the edge for a second

[soft harness]

I feel like Studied is under rated no?

Unless I am bad but getting the van faster especially in 1v1 can add alot of advantage

as long as you dont spawn the van in a vulnerable spot

[muted holly]

Studied is absolutely useless

Van is pretty easy to get against aggressive opponents

But van isn't worth using as a win condition

1 dodge and it's not doing anything anymore

[boreal wharf]

Just got someone in van and they completely disappeared and weren’t able to play the game

[weary delta]

I see a lot of Velmas spamming on that air up special. Why is that?

[calm herald]

So after testing this combo out a bit its true no matter the damage

Mostly because book doesnt launch that far and you can just chain it into jab again for extra damage or finish it with up tilt for a kill confirm depending on how much damage your opponent has

Or you can lead it into a jab 1-2 mix up and do megaphone to callout your opponent or dodge and go from there

[stiff cedar]

Chat is Velma good or nah

She got buffed or nah chat?

Pretty please answer chat 😢

[boreal wharf]

She’s amazing best character in the game

[desert roost]

Is what we tell ourselves everyday. To keep the good fight going!

[boreal wharf]

🫡

[stiff cedar]

Say on skibidi

[sacred cosmos]

its one of her few decent kill options

also if theres a velma server can someone dm it to me? Thanks

[weary delta]

I've seen Velmas just do it well outisde of kill range is the thing.

Does it combo or something?

[sacred cosmos]

its a decent move all around. Breaks armor, does good dmg, can snag kills off the top early

can lead to combos yeah, it can also let her get away if needed

the startup is the only bad thing about it

velma has so little going for her any decent move is gonna be spammed tbh

[dry fulcrum]

same here, i'd love to share the pain with people

[sacred cosmos]

learned alot from watching this

[dry fulcrum]

had to fight through a horde of Jokers, Finns and Jacks but i hit Bronze 1 and am barely outside top 100 rn :3

[hybrid nymph]

There's no Velmas in either top 100s 😔

[muted holly]

give me 3 days and i will change that

[neon ore]

Wow the worst character in the game couldn't make it to the top 100

What a surprise

Anyways nerf Velma :3

[muted holly]

not again...

[boreal wharf]

I was there before unfortunately lost it

[hybrid nymph]

Is there a pattern at all to clues spawning?

Sometimes it seems like I get none and other times I get 3 out of nowhere.

[muted holly]

the randomly spawning ones are at certain times im pretty sure, the ones that come from moves are purely rng

[dry fulcrum]

this character is infecting my body, after that playing session my hands feel weird cuz they want to keep doing Velma neutral game. its literally muscle memory at this point

is this how Amsa feels

[muted holly]

at the rate i am currently climbing at, ill get diamond in 1s today and possibly masters tomorrow

[dry fulcrum]

you can do it man!

[atomic otter]

Jab extra hitstuns
up special follow up
Book cooldown 30 seconds
Side special rework

She will be B tier this way no joke

This should be her buffs

Maybe even scratch the side special rework and keep the rest 3. It will make her B tier

[boreal wharf]

What would you suggest for a side special rework?

[atomic otter]

Tbh since Velma doesn’t fight I don’t even know

[atomic otter]

I can’t think of anything for Velma’s moveset 😭

[boreal wharf]

@atomic otter They aren’t gonna put a lower cooldown on a cooldown reduction ability, they removed her follows ups she had in the beta so I doubt those are coming back and idk if they’d do extra jab hitstuns

[atomic otter]

1 minute is long asf tho

[boreal wharf]

I agree

[atomic otter]

If it removed the cooldowns fully

I would agree

[muted holly]

honestly, i would give up the cooldown reduction if that means we can have a reasonable cooldown

[atomic otter]

Maybe even 1 minute and 30 seconds

[boreal wharf]

I think book should keep the cooldown but you get a 5-10% boost in projectile speed, speed and attack speed or something of the sort etc

[atomic otter]

That would be great ngl

Because after the book there is no backup move

It should give more than making cooldown go faster

[boreal wharf]

Lemme give all my ideas for Velma changes brb

[atomic otter]

I think 10% because realistically you only get a book once after every death

How long does book last?

[boreal wharf]

10 seconds I believe

[atomic otter]

Yea

That’s perfect

10% speed buff for 10 seconds is pretty good

[atomic otter]

And then watch them next patch only buff the knockback for Velma’s dash attack 😭😭

[boreal wharf]

Can we just get some of the combo options we had in the beta back man they wouldn’t even be as crazy since they’ve gutted every movement option Velma had

[muted holly]

main things she needs imo are the following:
bubbles: way better paths, marking bubble should move faster
book: either way lower cooldown at the cost of removing its abillity or slightly lowering the cooldown for a useful abillity
utilt: stacked hitbox, more killing power

and an improved version of chem spil, cant forget that

[atomic otter]

I wouldn’t be surprised if this happens

[boreal wharf]

I kinda wish Velma had some perks that weren’t related to magnifying glass a perk that lets you fully aim speaker at the expense of range or damage would be sick or something of that sort

[muted holly]

i wouldnt be surprised if they straight up shadow nerf her again

[atomic otter]

I don’t even know when to use it tbh

[boreal wharf]

Wouldn’t that be the 3rd time?

[muted holly]

i think so yea

[muted holly]

if there is enough space between you and the opponent then you can throw it out, doesnt really matter where

[boreal wharf]

Is there a single part of Velma’s kit that hasn’t been nerfed lol

[calm herald]

Good question

[atomic otter]

Or they gonna do a useless buff. Like increase damage on book hit.
Ground Side special goes further than normal

[atomic otter]

Did dair get nerfed?

[boreal wharf]

Yeah

[calm herald]

I mean flashlight seems pretty much the same? I cant remember though

[atomic otter]

Crazyyy

[muted holly]

if we are talking about nerfs from beta to full release, everything has been nerfed

[boreal wharf]

Van has gotten nerfed, perks have gotten nerfed, neutral has gotten nerfed, specials have gotten nerfs

[calm herald]

Oh

Ngl I feel like we'd have a fighting chance if we at least had some perks from back in the "beta" (I still dont consider it a beta)

Cause a ton of them got removed

[boreal wharf]

Nah with the other mages we have those perks don’t need to comeback lol

[muted holly]

that projectile perk that stacked ice was insanely good on velma

[calm herald]

Yeah exactly

It would make our zoning better and a threat

Sadly I cant play until sunday since I dont have batteries for my controller

[boreal wharf]

Ice with dead shot and painted target was my setup

[muted holly]

idk what my setup was

[calm herald]

I only remember having ice on my setup

[muted holly]

i think coffeezilla ice and then something

[calm herald]

Cause I knew it was insane

And I think a cooldown perk

[boreal wharf]

Coffeezilla was amazing also

Actually kinda broken ngl

[muted holly]

i think make it rain dog was my third

not entirely sure tho

[calm herald]

Speaking of I wanna learn him eventually since Velma is in a bad situation cause he's also a zoner of sorts

Of course I wont stop playing Velma

[muted holly]

let the velma one trick loose

i know you want it

[boreal wharf]

Gotta love when bruisers have better zone options than Velma 🔥

[muted holly]

shaggy is better on range then velma

like ???

[calm herald]

Gotta love when Black Adam has better zone options

[boreal wharf]

Idk where to see the frame data or whatever I think that would just speak for itself

[calm herald]

And isnt considered a mage

[muted holly]

gotta love when black adam completely disabled your zoning options

[calm herald]

I still find it weird he isnt a mage

He feels like he'd be one

[muted holly]

he is everything there is tbh

[boreal wharf]

I personally think they go the route and make speed/survival Velma’s main thing so they buff grey health, speed then they could buff her more useless moves this way

[muted holly]

he has the best part of every class

[calm herald]

Ngl i'd rather the projectile shield just slow down the projectiles instead

Idk how that'd work for megaphone

[muted holly]

i would like her as a control character

[calm herald]

Give us a megaphone buff/hj

And 5 speech bubbles again lol

[boreal wharf]

They are so scared to buff megaphone it’s always been nerfed twice since release lol

[muted holly]

3 bubbles are fine tbh, just gotta use them properly

[calm herald]

See thing is I dont have good cd management in this game

Thats why a lot of times I start the round with book to get at least some damage in

[muted holly]

you shouldnt ever throw out more then 1 bubble at a time, atleast in 1s. not too sure about 2s

[calm herald]

I think for 2s it should be two bubbles if the target if on your teammate

If not then 1 bubble

[muted holly]

bowie can probably tell you more about 2s as he plays that mode

[calm herald]

I miss healing Velma lol

[boreal wharf]

You can use 2 tbh i just use 2 and then use speaker for zone or push in with flashlight ngl

[muted holly]

in 1s i just hope to land a mark. if it hits, i throw out a bubble and set up a combo that way. if it misses, i continue the zoning game

[boreal wharf]

I kinda think another reason they are scared to give Velma good tools is because she’s just so easy to play

[muted holly]

easy to play, hard to master

[calm herald]

You need good predictions on your opponent and good setups for your combos

Which is why ive been trying to find new combos

Only good one I found was the 1-2 jab into down special into 1-2 jab into utilt or 3rd hit of jab

[boreal wharf]

Just don’t see why we couldn’t at least keep some of the combos lol

[calm herald]

Yeah like the dair into camera into dair into camera

[boreal wharf]

All the other mages just have so much more

[muted holly]

i have something to announce

superman can use his lasers in the middle of my jab combo

like ??????

[boreal wharf]

Can he actually

[calm herald]

Excuse me??

Like even if you mash the jab??

Did they nerf the hitstun on jab??

[muted holly]

happened 3 times in 1 match

[atomic otter]

Yea I should stop going jab finishers and go for the down attack read

[muted holly]

that never lands

and it is very punishable if it misses

[atomic otter]

I didn’t even know you could combo with down special 😬 I need to improve

[atomic otter]

High risk high reward 😎

The reward is that you look flashy

[boreal wharf]

Could lab more if the training range in this game wasn’t so terrible

[dry fulcrum]

i do it sometimes to apply pressure to camping opponents if i know i can handle neutral without them or win the exchange to make it worth it, but yeah generally its worth keeping your bubbles around

[desert roost]

Just joining the conversation here. I would like to know. Does anyone’s partner in 2ms ever feel the “hastened” effect from blurbs interacting with them. I just don’t see it ever. No visual cue for it, no nothing.

[muted holly]

wait what

does something like that exist?

anyways does anyone here know the cause for the van randomly exploding when the opponent isnt nearly strugled out yet?

[calm herald]

Wait speech bubbles make teammates faster?

[muted holly]

i think i just made a wonder woman uninstall the game

managed to chain 7 vans on 1 stock lmao

[spiral summit]

yo thats actually insane

[muted holly]

yea i think i got insanely lucky with evidence drops there

got one almost every uair i did

[desert roost]

Yup! Read the skill. Its supposed to replace the “healing” portion of blurbs. @calm herald

[calm herald]

Healing Velma you will be missed

[muted holly]

🫡

[muted holly]

my new mouse finally has a delivery date

somehow its on my birthday aka agust 1st

maybe i will play a little better like that again

[soft harness]

How does one even combo with Velma

Its quite easy to punish a dair with Velma

everyone always will dodge you just gotta correctly guess where

[muted holly]

@soft harness here you can find some combos and general gameplay tactics n stuff

[soft harness]

Ty

[soft harness]

Is velma's Ground down attack worth using?

[hybrid nymph]

I think the only use of it is jab1>jab2>down attack when the opponent has no meter

It's just kind of a troll "loop" tbh

[muted holly]

down attack should only be used if you perfectly know where you're opponent will land and when they have low dodge meter, most of the time you're better off using jab tho

[soft harness]

Sair is also pretty situational no?

Or is there a property on it that is pretty good

[dry fulcrum]

sair is actually one of your best moves

approach punish, spawns clues, is good in neutral

[soft harness]

Ahh alright

[muted holly]

sair is a good "get tf off of me" tool, relatively quick and does decent knockback and damage. and if you are playing a defencive player, it is a good aproaching tool. also it is a reliable follow up to your bubbles

[sacred cosmos]

Velma lives and dies by reads

Fitting i guess lol

[muted holly]

i am officially the first person to reach diamond with velma in 1s

[sacred cosmos]

Nice. I got into gold last night after alot of suffering.

[muted holly]

my sanity is gone

[desert roost]

Yall are tripping. I will not put myself through that torture. But I shall cheer you all on who choose to do 1’s lol

[muted holly]

i said before ranked releases that i shall represent all the velma mains and assert dominance by getting masters with her in both modes

and i am keeping myself to that

[hybrid nymph]

I think it's actually one of her better moves, you just need to get used to the timing and you can be pretty aggressive with it

you can also get early kills with it if you chase offstage with it, but it takes a read

[desert roost]

Umm can we talk about how people will never freeze if they don't sit in the whole entirety of the toxic goop. I was in training mode like. Hmmm. I wonder what is the requriements to be frozen

[boreal wharf]

Yeah Superman freeze is faster and not on a cooldown btw 🔥

[muted holly]

and that move instantly cancels in an armor move too 🥶

[atomic otter]

Lucid and Bowie top 1 Velma players

The Velma representations

[muted holly]

i will take her into tourney if one happens for eu

[glacial shuttle]

so how does velmas mystery machine work, everytime they just stand inside of it and it wont capture them.

[muted holly]

1 dodge and it wont capture anymore

or 1 thing that counts as dodge (like respawn iframes) break it to

[dry fulcrum]

at the very least for this moment i can call myself a top 50 Velma 1s player in the world, barely at number 50 but it counts

[muted holly]

go get that second place

[dry fulcrum]

i mean i wanna make it to gold if that means anything, just made it to Silver 3 so its for sure obtainable

[boreal wharf]

You mean 1st place

[muted holly]

that one is reserved for me 😈

[boreal wharf]

Until I decide to climb the leaderboards 😴

[muted holly]

go ahead, sacrifice your sanity

[hot rivet]

Y’all trying to go to first while I’m just happy with top 10 😭 probably not top 10 anymore cause I ended last night at #8 and I haven’t gone on at all today

[dry fulcrum]

grinding with this character is genuinely painful lmao. matches last twice as long as everyone else in the cast, and certain matchups like Banana Guard, Finn, and Jack just feel like cointosses rather than a test of skill which feel even worse to lose due to how long mtches take

[muted holly]

thats why my sanity is gone

[muted holly]

oh its not about trying to get first, i am first

[boreal wharf]

lol you got it

[hot rivet]

Ong. Ive gone nearly to time against morty lol

[muted holly]

thats the only way to beat him consistently

[hot rivet]

How to beat Finn?

[muted holly]

its a hard losing matchup but the best way i found to deal with him is going on a wall and poking him with megaphone

maybe try to get a setup here and there

but he can easily erase your projectiles

[hot rivet]

No way lmao

[muted holly]

if you manage to find something better feel free to share

[dry fulcrum]

never went to time but i have gone to one minute left on multiple ocassions in the past

[hot rivet]

I can’t cause I’m always getting 0 - death by them

[muted holly]

thats why you go on the wall

[dry fulcrum]

keeping yourself at a distance and choosing your moments to approach is vital. megaphone is absolutely your best friend in this matchup

[muted holly]

if you have to go onstage for some reason, dash attack can keep them at a distance

[hot rivet]

Alright noted

Also guys look at this clip I got with van

https://x.com/outerpale/status/1816944783379824921?s=46

[dry fulcrum]

Finn at ledge feels surprisingly deflated, all he can do is fish for nair so if you're really patient you could just keep peppering at him and completely punish all his attempts to get in, think of like Melee Jigglypuff if she was terrible

[hot rivet]

Do y’all think any of Velma’s bugs will get fixed…

[muted holly]

I've submitted 3 on the bug report forum, only 1 is getting investigated

[muted holly]

Idk anything about melee just so you know that

I know there is this one yoshi main but that's it

[hot rivet]

I submitted 2 and neither of them are getting investigated

[dry fulcrum]

fair enough, dw was just a small little goof at the end of my post. has no barring on the overall sentiment

[muted holly]

But some minor visual bug on a skin does get investigated like what????

[hot rivet]

Ikr 😭

I submitted one about speech bubbles breaking on ground before reaching certain characters if done far away in a straight line (those characters being banana guard, Jake, Jack, Steven, and Tom and Jerry)

And then I submitted one about the van and dodging it for invulnerability. If that’s not a bug then that is actually really dumb cause I understand dodging it to get away but for it to not attempt to capture again is really dumb

[dry fulcrum]

Velma has had multiple bugs which objectively just make her a worse character for no reason yet they've just taken forever or never been solved, reminder it took until the mid season patch of s1 before they fixed a match ruining grab glitch and the entire clue mechanic being bugged

[hot rivet]

I didn’t even know that was bug until the mid season patch

[muted holly]

Pfg hates Velma I'm convinced

[hot rivet]

Ong

Lucía what bugs did you submit besides the visual bug?

Omg autocorrect

Lol

Lucid*

[muted holly]

I'm Lucia Now ig

[hot rivet]

Lmao

Mb

[muted holly]

Uhh one where bubbles automatically target over the UFO on Townsville after passing trough your ally

And one where projectiles behave weird when mark expires + projectiles crashing into the ground instead of going in a straight line

[hot rivet]

Alr noted about the other two. Seems like we posted the same for it crashing into the ground instead of going in a straight line

[muted holly]

2x the chance that they will see

[tame rover]

Hello Velma mains

[muted holly]

Greetings

[atomic otter]

Btw if someone dodges the first neutral special bubble missile it won’t hit them again

It’s so annoying

[muted holly]

Yup

And the chance of it hitting the first time is already low

[atomic otter]

I didn’t even know you could dodge the van first time

And never get hit by it again

[muted holly]

If you jump it, it usually crashes right into the ground when returning

[atomic otter]

Tbh I don’t even know if this is a bug or intended

Because this was here last patch

How come it didn’t get fixed

But instead they wanna fix a bug that’s so rare to pull off

[muted holly]

The dodge thing or crashing into the ground?

[atomic otter]

Dodge thing

[muted holly]

I mean, I kinda get it but at the same time it's weird

[atomic otter]

Yea it’s probably intentional

[muted holly]

Yea since van has the same thing going on

[atomic otter]

But the van dodge thing has to be a bug

Ain’t no way

[muted holly]

I hope it is a bug otherwise it is a very poor decision from pfg

Not like you can't just force it off the map otherwise

Like the counterplay is so easy and safe

[atomic otter]

Yea exactly

[muted holly]

You work so hard to get your van just to see it do absolutely nothing

And if you somehow manage to capture someone, it won't even drive of the map

Anyways enough late night car talk ima go sleeo

Goodnight

[dry fulcrum]

goood night man

[atomic otter]

Good night

[boreal wharf]

Small characters are just so stupid man like what do I do when half my moves don’t connect lol?

[hot rivet]

pray

all I can say

[hybrid nymph]

gizmo kept walking right under my ground lightbulb

[muted holly]

masters seems impossible in 1s with velma

you need a 90% winrate to climb at a reasonable rate with these rp gain/loss rate

[boreal wharf]

Don’t lose hope you will get there!!!

[muted holly]

i dropped to plat while winning 7/10 matches

like ????

almost back into plat II because i keep queueing batman

[desert roost]

It needs to have a scoop hit box or a hitbox in her body

[muted holly]

stacked hitbox

[dry fulcrum]

hit Silver rank 2 earlier this has been painfullll

[muted holly]

havent been able to get over my peak with these horrible gains

[muted holly]

im calling it, masters with velma in 1s is genuinely impossible

75% winrate isnt doable

and thats the least you need to not drop

[dry fulcrum]

i think Master might be possible later in the season when most of the mid to low range top tier mains currently being filtered down to Gold and early Plat make it up. but as of rn it just seems impossible

[muted holly]

in 2v2 it is doable there you gain more for some reason

will probably get back on the 1s grind when amazon decides to finally deliver my mouse

[dry fulcrum]

wishing you luck when that happens man

i get the frustration of the game expecting perfection out of you to reach top rank. i used to play a Yugioh game where in order to reach max you needed to win 5 games in a row after making it to a rank which requires an extremely solid winrate to even be in

[muted holly]

dont know anything about yugioh but i expect it is balanced better then this

but mvs made me realize how balanced brawlhalla actually is after all

[dry fulcrum]

for the most part yeah. just mentioning my experience from that here because i used to main multiple low tier decks there as well and know exactly what type of annoyance is being experienced lol

[muted holly]

ah i see

in brawl i was also playing bottom tier but it was still playable, just had some tough matchups and requiered alot of good reads

[leaden shell]

What

Why is the system like this

What

[robust siren]

ive been stuck in diamond for so long i gain like 2 rp and then lose 1000

[hot rivet]

Y'all I cant with how velmas speech bubbles work against jack. I just lost a match against jack because it kept targeting below his feet

So dumb that jack, jake, steven, TJ, and banana guard have their targets below their feet instead of their actual hitbox

[ember elm]

Oh yeah I forgot Velma was in the game

[boreal wharf]

It happens with most characters tbh especially if you are jumping it genuinely only works somewhat well when you are on the ground standing still

[hot rivet]

Nah but those are the ones that actually have it

in training go far and use speech bubbles and against those 5 it will crash into the ground

meanwhile all the other characters it lands on them

[boreal wharf]

Lemme test it out

[hot rivet]

https://x.com/OuterPale/status/1816267541234561302

[hot rivet]

I already made a tweet on it so just look at that one

[boreal wharf]

That’s kinda weird for BG and T&J would that be caused because Jerry and spear have a hitbox? I don’t see what it could be tbh

[hot rivet]

idk but does get annoying

especially cause when I actually need to hit them while recovering, the projectile just breaks and then I get punish off again

[tardy flare]

im on if your down to play

[hot rivet]

yeah lets run it @tardy flare

invite me

[muted holly]

gains seem to be a little bit better today

guess i will pop another one of those grinds

[dry fulcrum]

this game made me WORK for gold man. ran into every bad Velma matchup back to back to back. Superman, Black Adam, Samurai Jack, Batman. it even made me do an exact mirror. same skin and all, but mannnn i made it

[muted holly]

i face arya and batmon almost every match

[muted holly]

i actually quit ranked until we receive a buff

im done with winning neutral constantly just to get killed in 60 by nonsense

and even if i win it is for a generous 5 RP!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dry fulcrum]

understandable, as of rn Velma is the only character in the game to have not hit Master in 1s, its clear she's struggling bad

[muted holly]

someone hit masters with velma

after 600+ wins and grinding almost entire days including night

[dry fulcrum]

oh did they? my bad. last bit of data i had was from a day ago

[muted holly]

and they apparently did gain reasonable rp

[dry fulcrum]

yeah this character needs help. even in 2s the format she's balanced around she's still barely above characters like Stripe and Jake. hopefully the near laughable results on ranked is a wake-up call to PFG to actually try fixing her

[muted holly]

honestly, she is also bottom tier in 2s

like under everyone

all her bubble combos dont work there

[dry fulcrum]

do they? again my bad i dont play 2s tbh, mostly observe the metagame

[muted holly]

mark targets your mate and so do the bubbles, after passing trough your mate, the bubbles send the opponent in a horrible direction

which makes it hard to almost impossible to land things like bubble into cam, bubble into sair, bubble into uair

[dry fulcrum]

this character is barely functional man

[muted holly]

thats the result for a lack of playtesting

[boreal wharf]

Unfortunate

Mid season patch gonna come with another Velma movement buff while buffing Jake’s entire kit watch

[peak halo]

is her book reading emote bugged?

[boreal wharf]

Seems to work fine for me

[muted holly]

whats wrong with it?

[muted holly]

they have to buff her before that

[boreal wharf]

You know they love hyping up the mid season patch so I doubt she’d get a good or even somewhat major buff tbh

She also needs like at least 10 bug fixes ngl

[muted holly]

all of them have been reported, only one is being investigated

[peak halo]

it just played her default emote but it works nnow

[muted holly]

👍

[peak halo]

I need some velma tips

I'm going on a ranked journey with her

[muted holly]

in what aspect do you need tips?

[peak halo]

everything, when do I go for a move, when do I run away

what's the most reliable kill move

what are her true combos if she has any

[boreal wharf]

Camera

[boreal wharf]

Jab or jab lightbulb 👍

Pretty sure jab can still get you punished tho iirc

[muted holly]

reliable as in being to hit it, uair/utilt as in killing at reasonable percents: air uspecial

[muted holly]

dtilt > ulight (rarely used)
jab1 (>jab 2) > utilt
bubble > air uspecial/sair/uair/nair

you rely mostly on reads tho in hopes you dont get punished for it

dair > dash attack to the way the opponent dodges is reliable

out of that dash attack book into sair is true in certain di's

[boreal wharf]

I can see flashlight hitbox getting nerfed ngl

[muted holly]

istg if they nerf her again i will uninstall

[boreal wharf]

Yeah but ngl it would fs be a justified nerf after the buffs ofc because you can literally just put it in any direction and be behind someone and it’ll still hit

[muted holly]

i mean every character has a move that hits like that

[boreal wharf]

Yeah but like I think hers is kinda outrageous ngl

I abuse it tho 🤫

[muted holly]

jokers jab hits further back then flashlight

and that thing starts a 37 dmg combo

[boreal wharf]

They just need to throw that whole character away

[muted holly]

fr

idk what they were thinking by nerfing velma far below the ground and then releasing that monstrosity of a character

[peak halo]

I'm going against the same people I went against on my highest ranked characters that's annoying

[muted holly]

ranked is horrible we know that already

[sour linden]

Ranked matchmaking is garbage

I got matched 4 times in a row with bronze and silver players

[boreal wharf]

I know she was op in the beta but man the combos…

[sour linden]

I’m in gold 2

[sour linden]

Doomed to 2s

It sucks man

[muted holly]

velma isnt even good in 2s

[boreal wharf]

Velma is good in 2s until you get a duo and one just dedicates all their time to pressuring you lol

[muted holly]

her combos dont hit nearly as consistent (consistent in velma terms) as in 1s

we need our actual combos back

and not these excuses of combos that requiere perfect bubble usage3

[sour linden]

Velma literally has like 2-3 combos its tragic

It’s like garnet

Give them combos back 😔

[peak halo]

garnet is miles better than velma

[muted holly]

atleast garnet her combos do damage

[sour linden]

I know

[muted holly]

and they hit consistently

and they give you positional advantages

[sour linden]

So many mid-low tiers just don’t get combos

Idk about Jake

[boreal wharf]

I think jake has solid damage and his combos are ok

[muted holly]

jake doesnt depend on his combos tbh

but he has some solid ones

[sour linden]

Oh

Well that’s nice

Still don’t see why his forward air has a hurtbox on his fist

I literally get hit from punching people 😭

[boreal wharf]

He can get some really cheap kills

[muted holly]

yup

[sour linden]

Down special when someone is juggling you is pretty funny

Until their hitbox prioritizes over yours and you still get sent up

But forward air aimed directly down for ledge guarding is funny

[peak halo]

when does her air side special ever hit?

[sour linden]

Velma’s?

I legit think it’s only recovery at this point

I ran a couple 1s with a good Velma I met on YouTube and it’s practically useless

It’s not even a pressure tool who designed her moveset 😭

[muted holly]

never lmao

[sour linden]

Props to yall for sticking with her lmao

[peak halo]

she was my first main in the beta.. I had her on 400 wins and I still do 2 years later 😭

um so does jab up tilt just not work on tnj

[muted holly]

on tom it can work if you are almost stacked with him

but on small characters like finn gizmo etc it will never hit

forgot to mention that

[leaden shell]

I lost an entire rank in one game

…

Probably a bug

But like huh

[dapper quest]

velmas just so bad you go down an entire rank when you loose a game

[calm herald]

Im now back on the Velma grind

[muted holly]

welcome to multiversus where some people climb with a 40% winrate and others drop with an 80% winrate

[warm lily]

Yeah I don’t think that’s supposed to happen. There’s supposed to be a sort or derank protection that caps your lost points to only bring you to the bottom of the rank

And your next loss will demote you

[muted holly]

welcome to multiversus am i right?

[warm lily]

[muted holly]

ranked gotta get fixed and velma gotta get fixed

we cant do anything rn

[warm lily]

Yeah Velma definitely needs more help

Especially in 1v1

She’s so useless there

[muted holly]

i would argue 1s is her better mode since she has more combos there

[warm lily]

You think she’s worse in 2v2?

[muted holly]

kinda similar honestly

she has her weaknesses in both

in 1s you get rushed down, in 2s you dont have combos

[warm lily]

I’ve been thinking of a few ways they could buff her. Lmk what you think.

1. Make the range on uncharged megaphone larger so you don’t need full or nearly full charge to get any sort of meaningful distance
2. Make her jab faster so it more reliably combos into itself and other moves
3. Double the speed of her air side special and make the hitbox larger
4. Make the radius of grounded up special larger
5. Reduce the cooldown from her down special from 1:10 to something more like 0:45
6. Adjust the knockback angle of her dtilt to make it easier to combo out of

[muted holly]

thats not even enough to make her viable

[warm lily]

I feel like that at the minimum would at least make her a real character, but she still wouldn’t be a high or top tier with those changes

[muted holly]

ill give you a list of what she needs to become viable

[warm lily]

And this was just stuff I could think of that were more like “why doesn’t she have this already” kind of changes

[calm herald]

I hate losing to the most mashy players like I dodge their attacks but they just win the interaction apparently

[muted holly]

-side attack: for jab 1 less endlag, slightly more range for jab 2 less endlag, more stun.
-dtilt: less startup and endlag, consistently lead into jab 1
-utilt/uair: less knockback in early percents, more knockback in later percents, slightly reduced endlag and startup, stacked hitbox
-neutral attack/nair: uncharged version more range, max charge range increased, charging slightly faster, less endlag.
-sair: increased hitbox, slightly less endlag
-dair: increased hitbox/more priority, less startup and endlag
-side special: increased base movement speed and distance, way less endlag on hit, slightly less endlag on whiff, cancelable with dodge, more killing power.
-uspecial: wider hitbox, faster applying of ice
-air uspecial: lower hitting hitbox, less startup
-(air) down special: less cooldown (low cooldown at the cost of making educated worse?), count as a heavier projectile
-(air) neutral special: marking bubble: much faster projectile speed, mark duration higher. normal bubbles: slightly increased speed, better paths, slightly more hitstun.
-mystery machine: not counterable witha single dodge, doesnt straight up drive off the map, less set up time.
-knowledge is power perk: 4 grey health instead of 3

[warm lily]

I think the only thing to be a bit touchy about is ensuring that you don’t give Velma jab dtilt loops because honestly no one should have loops in this game imo

But the rest of the changes make sense

[muted holly]

i dont want it to loop, i want dtilt > jab1>2 > ?? true

[warm lily]

Alright that’s fair

[muted holly]

i knew i forgot something there, forgot air uspecial

[warm lily]

I’m gonna hope PFG gives Velma some more buffs next balance patch

[muted holly]

-air uspecial: lower hitting hitbox, less startup

[warm lily]

So I heard that if ground up special is on cooldown, you do air up special in its place

[muted holly]

thats true

[warm lily]

I’m assuming you’d want the startup change to be enough so you could get like jab 1,2 -> ground up special (on cooldown) -> something else

[muted holly]

that would be nice

either that or jab2 > utilt true

because we dont have a kill confirm as of now

[warm lily]

Is that not true currently?

I thought jab 1,2 -> utilt was a kill confirm

But just not a very good one

[muted holly]

it is never true on smaller characters, it is true on medium sized characters when they are near stacked on you, it is always true on big characters

[warm lily]

Oh it’s one of those confirms

I know the feel

Shaggy jab 2 just whiffs against Arya because of her hurt animation which means you can almost never reliably confirm into Shaggy’s strong jab combos and he just doesn’t get any damage as a result due to how integral jab is to his gameplan

[muted holly]

i mean, shaggys jab combos might be a little too strong

[warm lily]

Do you know what it is specifically about small characters that makes it not work?

[muted holly]

utilt doesnt have a stacked hitbox, small characters just go under the bulb

[warm lily]

Nah they removed the jab 1,2 -> reverse utilt -> up special killing at 70, so it’s fine considering he has no counter to projectile characters

[warm lily]

Oh…

That’s really unfortunate

[muted holly]

i know that thats why i want it fixed 😭

and then the worst thing is, air uspecial hits weirdly too on small characters so you dont have any reliable kill options until sair kills

[warm lily]

Oh god and sair doesn’t kill until like 140 at the earliest without an edgeguard

[muted holly]

it kills reasonably weighted characters at 160 from stage

[sour linden]

Is Velma any better in 2s than 1s?

[muted holly]

debatable

she has core weaknesses in both

[sour linden]

I feel like they should rework her entirely

Her moveset doesn’t flow together much at all

[muted holly]

in 2s you dont get rushed down as you have a teammate that protects you but you dont have any combos, in 1s its the opposite

[sour linden]

They just threw a bunch of nonsense and called it a day or something 😔

Or at least it feels like it

[muted holly]

it does flow into eachother, most things are just too slow to combo into eachother

[sour linden]

They just feel kind of random

[muted holly]

like dair > dash attack > book > sair is a cool combo but it isnt true

[sour linden]

Like a bunch of projectiles

[sour linden]

DI based?

[muted holly]

dash attack > book is DI-able i think yea

not entirely sure

[sour linden]

Why in the world is book on a 1 minute and 10 second cooldown

For like a tiny bit of cooldown reduction

[muted holly]

because a 5 damage projectile is broken

isnt that obvious pal

[sour linden]

What do projectiles normally do?

[muted holly]

6

[sour linden]

Doesn’t like Jerry do the same damage or more??

[muted holly]

7

jerry does 8

[sour linden]

Dawg 😭

[muted holly]

i think

[warm lily]

Jerry is easily the best projectile and it’s not close

[sour linden]

Jerry shot beats everything

[muted holly]

yea like why does he have 10 hp

[warm lily]

He out prioritizes everything

[sour linden]

Or at least clashes to save Tom’s hide

[sour linden]

Exactly

And why does he need 3 CORKS

STOP LETTING HIM DEFEND HIMSELF

LET ME KILL THE STUPID RAT

[muted holly]

and why does that reset everytime he gets shot???

[warm lily]

I’d be fine if his HP was reduced to like 7 or 8 but his cooldown is shorter to compensate

[sour linden]

Jerry shot is just so egregious

[muted holly]

tom is supposed to be vulnerable without jerry, his cooldown should stay the same

[sour linden]

Mf that’s a lie

[muted holly]

make tnj players think about the jerry sling for once

[sour linden]

Bro is perfectly fine without Jerry

[muted holly]

i said supposed

[sour linden]

I know

[muted holly]

i didnt say it is like that

[sour linden]

I meant the devs lied not you lol

[muted holly]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[sour linden]

But Velma can only have a 5 damage projectile on a minute and ten seconds cooldown 😔

The fall off is insane

Someone study it

[muted holly]

pfg hates velma im sure about that

[sour linden]

They have to

[warm lily]

Yeah I mean I play T&J on the side I can definitely confirm that it is still a bit easy to stall out the timer for Jerry with dynamite, rocket, and overall large hitboxes with dair, nair, and uair

[sour linden]

Which is weird seeing how much they use her in the trailers

The reveal trailer, the Jason trailer

In general they seem to give her more screen time yet she stinks

Especially in rifts

[muted holly]

like every new character released after evo has something anti projectile, i wonder why

[sour linden]

I’m saying

They saw they made a good, strong 2s character and got scared

[warm lily]

I mean tbf projectile heavy characters are some of the most infuriating to go against if you don’t have a counter

[sour linden]

That they made a character that does what a support should do 😭

[sour linden]

True

But like every single character afterwards was just given anti projectile stuff

[muted holly]

yea it was broken in beta, but this is nerf was beyond unnecessary

[warm lily]

Like Shaggy vs. Marvin is near unwinnable at higher level

[sour linden]

Microphone fall off was insane

[sour linden]

For the shaggy or Marvin?

[warm lily]

Because he has no projectile counter

[sour linden]

Oh

[warm lily]

For Shaggy

[muted holly]

black adam, the most anti projectile character was i think the first character released after evo where velma was dominating, I WONDER WHY

[sour linden]

I’m saying

[warm lily]

And Marvin’s one projectile counts as a grab and beats all rage specials from Shaggy lmao

[sour linden]

Mf has like 4 options to deal with projectiles

[warm lily]

Dude Black Adam is insane rn

He’s so good

[muted holly]

yea and it is annoying tf out of me

[warm lily]

You just explode off of one dodge read

[muted holly]

like i can be so much better then the adam player and still lose because he plays adam

[warm lily]

Yeah

[sour linden]

I do not like fighting Black Adam

At all

And not in a Marvin or T&J way where it’s just incredibly boring

It’s because bro has every large hitbox known to man

[warm lily]

Like it’s annoying for the characters I primarily play. I can’t even imagine Velma

[sour linden]

With no whiff punish

Why does a down air prioritize my sword when it’s his FOOT

[muted holly]

nothing you can do against adam as velma

just pray he doesnt know that he has shield ns tuff

[sour linden]

Literally

[warm lily]

I mean, it could be worse. Morty, Finn, and Iron Giant exist

[muted holly]

velma has no winning matchups thats the fun part

[warm lily]

Not even Jason?

[muted holly]

jason has faster startup on most moves

even after teleport he outspeeds jab

[warm lily]

That’s crazy because he’s so slow

[muted holly]

if you dont get some insane bubble combo of before he starts hitting you, your stock is gone

[sour linden]

Finn is such a horrid matchup for her

[warm lily]

Finn is probably top 3 this patch

[sour linden]

I ran a couple 1s with a top like 40 I think Velma main and didn’t lose once all 5 times

[peak halo]

they need to give all of her moves the same hitbox buff they gave her camera

[sour linden]

Mind you I’m like #250 Finn 😭

[warm lily]

He was untouched and still has easy zero to deaths against the entire cast with more range than almost everyone

[muted holly]

i just adopted the strategy of boring them into sd'ing 3 times

[sour linden]

Decently consistently in the top 300

Haven’t dropped down since the start of ranked

[robust siren]

can they just give him his gem back atp im tired of that combo 😭

[sour linden]

Nah dawg

Trust me that’d be worse

[warm lily]

No no no we don’t need that please god no

[sour linden]

I promise you don’t let us use gem back lmao

Velma would legit have no winning chance if they did

[muted holly]

camera change did nothing btw

[sour linden]

You’re telling me you want the combo and combo extension god to be able to literally teleport from one part of the map to the other??

[robust siren]

Actually now that you mention it, it was broken too lmao

[sour linden]

With this movement speed?

[peak halo]

no I definitely noticed it

[muted holly]

i mean, it hits slightly more consistent, but it still hits clunky in combos

[robust siren]

i haven’t touched velma in a minute what dif they do to the camera

[peak halo]

add gem remove backpack and half his moves 🙏

[muted holly]

remove finn 🙏

i got 7 minuted enough by him

[warm lily]

I’m bouta pick up Finn just to continue to show PFG that he’s a problem

Mind you I don’t like to ask for nerfs and I think all characters should have sauce. But like some of them have a little too much sauce

[robust siren]

give finn the velma treatment

[warm lily]

No they don’t need to gut him

But like I shouldn’t be dying to a true combo at zero when he hits me with his most disjointed jab in the game

[peak halo]

+1

[muted holly]

honestly, give them the velma treatment for one patch just so they feel our pain

[peak halo]

remove every true combo including jabs

[muted holly]

YES

[peak halo]

make everyone a headless chicken praying sairs hit

[muted holly]

remove his attacks completely actually

[warm lily]

Finn’s sword breaks after too much use

[muted holly]

just allow him to walk

[robust siren]

break all his moves and whenever he uses choose goose it slides off the map

[peak halo]

sword decay

he's left with an apple

[sour linden]

Mf this isn’t brawl 😭

[warm lily]

His sword gets shorter the more moves he whiffs

[sour linden]

Just make his jab not reach from Alaska to Nevada

[warm lily]

Backpack deals less knockback the more money he has

[sour linden]

Like the Fern variant makes his hitboxes so deceiving

[sour linden]

Dawg no

What?

That’s the whole point of getting coins besides the shop 😭

[muted holly]

in all seriousness tho, just give finn more endlag on jab, neutral attack and utilt, especially if held too long

[warm lily]

Actually one I wouldn’t be opposed to is buffs get more expensive the more he buys it

[sour linden]

Accurate

[muted holly]

and remove that annoying 0td while they are at it

[sour linden]

Maybe the longer he runs around the slower he gets?

In return for making it more powerful

And the fact he can move around in the first place

[warm lily]

They should just give those moves the Taz treatment and not allow him to indefinitely charge

[peak halo]

yessss

[robust siren]

Or the same thing but with the more coins he has

[peak halo]

this is it

[sour linden]

Maybe do that for the backpack perk

To give it a downside

[peak halo]

high five miss adds 50 damage to himself

[sour linden]

Cause backpack perk has like no downside besides “loose more coins on hit”

[robust siren]

Yeah he gets more power the more coins but is like slower for charging

[peak halo]

for every jab miss he gets stunned for 3 seconds

[sour linden]

Dawg 😭

[warm lily]

Yeah I’d think that’d make sense

[sour linden]

Currently the backpack perk literally has no downside, “loose more coins” yet he gets like 5-7 just from a single combo

[robust siren]

Everytime he uses backpack he takes 199 damage (not 200 to be balanced)

[warm lily]

More coins means he’s heavier

[sour linden]

So just make him slower the more coins

And then make a perk where he doesn’t lose speed for more coins but backpack is severely weakened

And you loose coins over time just by moving around

So basically make him combo reliant fully

[warm lily]

Yeah honestly I think the issue with Finn’s zero to death is the backpack perk which just lets backpack kill absurdly early after one combo

Like no coin backpack is actually a fair move

It scoops and puts you in a bad position but it doesn’t kill early

[peak halo]

decrease weight just in case he survives in a big stage

[warm lily]

If he bounces on a wall or floor, he takes an additional 50 damage for good measures

[peak halo]

in the topic of adventure time I hate how the only jake players are forced to only look for cheese

like it's not even their fault

[muted holly]

atleast jake is getting buffed

unlike one certain character

[robust siren]

good thing pfg was nice enough to fix our van though!!! thanks pfg!!!!

[muted holly]

they didnt actually fix it, they just fixed an insanely rare issue that nobody cared about!!!!

[robust siren]

💀 And they barely fixed her speech bubbles

[muted holly]

they didnt

they made it worse

and shadownerfed them too

like ????

[robust siren]

damn

[warm lily]

How so?

[peak halo]

we actually have to collectively wait for them to pull a jason with velma and give all of her moves like x2 damage and more knockback

[robust siren]

Pfg is just like a deadbeat dad to velma

[muted holly]

if you didnt know yet, season 2 patch they shortened her mark duration and made the bubbles take even whackier paths then they did before (somehow)

which makes bubbles that should go into a straight line crash into the ground for absolutely no reason at all!!!

[robust siren]

ohhhhh i was wondering why velma was more trash than usual

[muted holly]

thats why

they didnt even put it in the patch notes because they knew it would get insane backlash

[robust siren]

do they even know what to do with velma anymore man

[misty dew]

they know they want her to be bad lmao

[sour linden]

She’s the throwaway character

[robust siren]

its literally her title

[misty dew]

but outside of that she's direction-less

[muted holly]

they wont even investigate velma bugs on the bug forum

[sour linden]

She’s just here cause people want her over Daphne 🤷‍♂️

[robust siren]

someone had to make a whole tweet about velma being trash for her to be buffed when her book cd was like 120/130 seconds

[warm lily]

Someone over at PFG must have a grudge against Velma from beta

[muted holly]

nakat just wants his precious wonder woman to be meta

why else would she get buffed while she is S tier?

[warm lily]

Yeah…

[leaden shell]

I mean yeah but I went down literally a full 150 rp from one loss

[sour linden]

One of the devs crashed out one day 😭

[robust siren]

exactlyyy she has no reason to be buffed everyone knows she’s a good character too there’s no point

[warm lily]

Wonder Woman still takes no damage while she has self applied armor unlike literally every other character

[leaden shell]

Surely that’s not intentional

Love how alive Velma chat is today

[warm lily]

Velma chat has been “x character is insane yet they buff them and not Velma”

[robust siren]

I know ive never seen this many people talking about how crappy velma is

[muted holly]

this chat is mostly for complaining anyways

[warm lily]

Lmao

Yeah unfortunately that’s true of most chats

[misty dew]

they better not be complaining lmao

what they gotta complain about

[robust siren]

lol what else can you really do when your character is very well known as the worst in the game

[muted holly]

if they are tell me which and i will make them shut

[warm lily]

Sometimes you’ll see people looking to push the meta of a character, but most people complain about x character in their chat

There are still people who come into Shaggy chat to complain about kick spam when literally no higher level player would every do that because of how whiff punishable the move is

[sour linden]

This whole server is complaining

It’s literally Complainversus

[warm lily]

True

[sour linden]

Shaggy kick isn’t even that good anymore

Hell up special is better at this point

[warm lily]

It’s not but lower level players don’t know how to dodge

Rage kick is good I’ll give you that

But a good player will never let you charge outside of in between stocks

We don’t have prepatch Hangry Man with a 0.5s charge

[robust siren]

what’s up with shaggy’s legs and being crazy his sair does so much knockback

[warm lily]

It’s like 4s without and 3s with which is still too slow to be useful

[sour linden]

Shaggy is just insanely strong in general

[warm lily]

They just wanted to give him Falcon knee

Which I don’t really like because sair as a combo starter in beta was way cooler

[robust siren]

everything was way cooler in beta

[warm lily]

Sair was a neutral tool in beta. Now it’s just a combo ender

But like he already had up special

[peak halo]

it never was

[warm lily]

And late sair -> dair was sick in beta for edgeguarding

[leaden shell]

Samurai Jack chat complains about him being bad sometimes

It’s unbelievable

[sour linden]

In beta it was pretty good

Cause of no whiff

Endlag*

But to be fair everyone had no endlag

[robust siren]

How ungrateful can you be

[warm lily]

No way bro he’s definitely not top tier but he’s a solid high tier for sure

[sour linden]

Besides maybe like Garnet or something

[sour linden]

Lmao

Jack is one of the most solid characters in the whole game

No shot yall are complaining

[warm lily]

Yeah honestly he’s perfectly fine as is. Weaker combo game, but huge range and easily the best edgeguarding in the game

[robust siren]

His jab is light speed and his range is crazy what more could you want

[misty dew]

they're deluded lol

[sour linden]

Legit just fix his jab

[leaden shell]

I just wish I had more options over the edge against Jack

[sour linden]

That’s it

[leaden shell]

Especially as Velma you got nothing

[sour linden]

Cause his jab 1 is just straight stupid

It’s visible on his righteous warrior skin

His leg is literally longer than his torso at the peak of the jab

[peak halo]

they nerfed it like 15 patches before the game closed

[misty dew]

this game is already inherently anti Velma just in the way it functions and they keep adding characters like agent smith and Jack that just pile on to how not made for this game she currently is