US - Utah

[keen glen]

How are the other nodes on the non-towers set up? Are poles installed, or are they mounted to a tree?

[real cedar]

Guys.. did you know Neighbor Info is no longer shared across the mesh on long_fast.

Meshtastic’s official documentation states that as of version 2.5.13, Neighbor Info can no longer be sent to the default public channels (like LongFast or ShortFast) — meaning it’s not shared across the mesh in those cases

We need a control channel if we want to gather the data. Can we start one and slap it slot 0 and leave longfast slot 1?

[leaden crow]

Haha, maybe that's why our channel util has been pretty good lately.

[real cedar]

Yup I suspect so

I can make one if youd like. I really want to but Im trying to document that

[keen glen]

Would it make sense to set up a separate MQTT broker to report the Neighbor Info to as well?

[real cedar]

then say only stationary outdoor or client, RL and Router nodes... should broadcast it every 14400

[quasi surge]

So a new slot 0 called Freq51 maybe?

[real cedar]

Thats what @vital hemlock and @obsidian storm have. Id love to choose one officially and maybe have it on the official freq51 docs

[real cedar]

thats exactly what im thinking

ill have it in the docs

speaking of docs

ROUTER LATE

[quasi surge]

Public PSK or just AQ==?

[real cedar]

@broken turret

This look good?

This is what I gathered from you so far

[real cedar]

No I would go full 256b

It will contain more sensitive info since people would be able to reveal precise locs

and if they should choose to do that I dont want that on AQ==

Basically the PSK will be shared with users who ask for it in longfast

or in discord

Not publicly on the docs

Im doing the same for DC801 --> Require visit to hackerspace

Puget mesh did this sort of thing to keep control of stuff

[quasi surge]

did you change the keys? cause I'm on the DC801 channels but I've never gotten a message on them

[real cedar]

theres not much talk on there. I can DM you the key. whats your nodes name

[quasi surge]

Mad Cat

[real cedar]

are you on FS20 or FS51

you havent shown up for me

[quasi surge]

LF/51

[real cedar]

Can you see Umbriel

if so ping it

[quasi surge]

No, not in my NodeDB

I can't actually transmit from home at the moment

(but I can recieve)

[real cedar]

balls whos your best router when you go out in the driveway

[quasi surge]

so if you didn't get my nodeinfo when I was out and about, that's why you don't have me

AUR is my best router

[real cedar]

go outside. trace route. Send a message on LongFast

[quasi surge]

Will do later; I'm just catching up on messages while something broils

[real cedar]

no worries. Ill be writing all our documentation to give to bash

[quasi surge]

on another note, anyone got a station g2 they want to sell? 😄

[real cedar]

they went like hot cakes again didnt they

they were available in july

[quasi surge]

mine is in customs hell

[obsidian storm]

position reporting is only on slot 0

[quasi surge]

Yeah, so the idea would be put everything on an encrypted slot 0 I think

so you get neighborinfo, position, nodeinfo, etc. there

LF should still see routers because they'll repeat

[real cedar]

Docs say 0 and 1
Also that wouldnt make sense. You know why. Rufio and I's extra private channel is in slot 2.. and we get regular broadcasts from each other

[quasi surge]

huh, got a link to where it says 1?

[real cedar]

its doesnt directly say 0 and 1. It says Primary and Secondary

im assuming secondary is 1

lol

[quasi surge]

secondary is anything not 0

there is only primary, secondary, and disabled for channel types

[real cedar]

Then it would stand to reason that position can be broadcast on all of those

[obsidian storm]

it can be

[quasi surge]

oh, position?

yes, you can configure position broadcasts per channel

as well as precision, per channel

[real cedar]

its neighborinfo that cannot be on a public slot 0 only a private slot 0 non default

[obsidian storm]

but it's only sent on a schedule to slot 0

[quasi surge]

right, the other channels are only on position request

[real cedar]

yes

[obsidian storm]

so a new user showing up and looking for LAKE, NPR, etc on their maps won't show anything unless we have the public channel on slot 0

[real cedar]

I got ya.. what about putting the neighborinfo onto a private slot 1 control channel

Would that work?

[obsidian storm]

seems great.

[real cedar]

Like making Freq51 Slot 1 for all of us

that would mean needing to add a channel to our routers but almost ALL of them have RA as I understand it

[quasi surge]

I mean

[real cedar]

and that should be easy to do with LOS

[obsidian storm]

just NPR

[quasi surge]

wouldn't it be best to do that cutover if/when ShortFast happens?

[real cedar]

NPR cant have that done to it yet. Its an oldie haha

[quasi surge]

though I guess adding a new slot 1 doesn't actually risk having to make a physical trip

[real cedar]

We are trying to place things before trials

So then its just a matter of switching the preset real quick

then switching our radios

[quasi surge]

mmm yeah

[real cedar]

and hopefully it all works out

[quasi surge]

you'll need multiple connections to make it safe

so try to get maximum high node density first

[real cedar]

Pretty much why I wanted to have the routers placed so we can switch over NPR, Lowe, AUR and POTM and see how people fair

then FPR

and jacob can switch his in the mtns whenever hes available again

then all dagron would have to do is make another trip to wasatch crest on bike

[quasi surge]

it would be nice to keep a spreadsheet of infra nodes, placements, and owners 🤔

[real cedar]

Theres a reason im not putting promontory out yet because it wont really have RA except for remote management of the BBS

[real cedar]

Bash has a phonebook

[prisma saddle]

Hmm ya mil roof node jaf-roof not seing lake either. will not on the map. not a big deal. so not just me.

wow that’s quite a trace.

[umbral ice]

@real cedar when you use the Renogy wanderer for your battery packs (3s) what kind of settings are you using for charging? Default lithium or are you setting custom voltages?

[real cedar]

12.6 max
9V cut off

[real cedar]

It defaults to lifepo4 which will blow up your pack

LOL

[ember torrent]

So what else yall know about this node in Farmington Bay Wildlife Management Area? Looks peculiar.

[real cedar]

It might not be real but up here theres always some random repeater in the middle that doesnt really occur in the southern side of the bowl so its sus

impressive

[ember torrent]

What application you using that alludes to it being real?

[real cedar]

im just going to wait for neighbor info map to fully be a thing tbch

[ember torrent]

On that note, my neighbor info doesn’t work. Been on since nearly day one. FPR would be my neighbor along with one more color named node.

[real cedar]

Thats because you will need the Freq51 Neighborinfo and MQTT channel. DM me for the details. The reason we are locking it behind a DM is so we can inform people that ONLY stationary nodes that are clients, RLs or Routers should have it on and broadcast over lora or mqtt (if an uplink is present)

Neighborinfo is not broadcast on AQ== LongFast

[ember torrent]

Seems silly but whatevs.

What mappin appin you usin?

[real cedar]

its baked into the firmware

We are using the badplace with BP for now

[ember torrent]

Damn ass androids.

[real cedar]

ill get you the settings

[ember torrent]

Android line maps your trace routes?

[quasi surge]

I could use them as well, if you just want to send them over discord

[real cedar]

Once you accept my friend request I can DM you

[pseudo kestrel]

I see it a lot too

[real cedar]

@obsidian storm found an explanation. We are working on sorting out an encrypted ch0

Basically if you dont have the same ch 0 traceroute will report as other node ! ffffffff

[obsidian storm]

--traceroute TRACEROUTE
Traceroute from connected node to a destination. You need pass the destination ID as an argument, and may pass --ch-index to specify a channel. The node you are tracing must have the same channel configured, and only nodes that share the channel will identify themselves within the response. With recent enough firmware, other nodes may be included as !ffffffff but not with their actual ID.

https://meshtastic.org/docs/software/python/cli/#--traceroute-traceroute

[pseudo kestrel]

Oh, I was talking about the node 3805 being really impressive

My map shows ZED1 in the Farmington Bay area though XD

[real cedar]

can we dial back the trace routes for a 10 minute window here

I'm trying to RA AUR

And as beautiful as listening to grimes and seeing the entire valley at night is. Mosquitos sucks 🤣

[obsidian storm]

lolol

[real cedar]

I'm gonna try from my balcony node lol.

[broken turret]

Pretty decent. Worth clarifying simplified priority point #3. RLs behave like a client unless they hear another rebroadcast. If they do, then they move their own transmission to after the end of the client contention window. But they always rebroadcast (provided there are still hops left on the packet).

[broken turret]

Location will only beacon on primary. For secondary channels, it's sent on-request only.

[pseudo kestrel]

I think I have a good time between my traces?

I leave the cache on that one alone for days/weeks

[real cedar]

yeah so we are figuring out

we are going to make an encrypted primary for neighborinfo and stuff

and mqtt

longfast will be on any secondary

[real cedar]

editing now

Mag made a logo

[reef ridge]

Made a logo for the Utah mesh project. I can try making more if we need horizontal syles for docs and stuff.

And of course, suggestions for improvements are welcome.

[real cedar]

I think thats plenty fine

[umbral ice]

So what happens when it's more than Utah? 😛

[real cedar]

It keeps it good for square or round logos

[real cedar]

We add the states around the ring

and maybe add the states to the logo

That would be legit

[reef ridge]

Mountain West Mesh?

[real cedar]

It will keep the bottom name. But we should add the states to the center

Like once idaho is connected

place it in the center some how?

[real cedar]

the conference would have an issue with us

[reef ridge]

Conference of what?

[real cedar]

College football conference with the entire slogan of mountain west copy righted 🙄 .. you know big sports money

[pseudo kestrel]

There's a local non-profit that I used to work for that uses "mountain West" as their key name O_o

[reef ridge]

Clearly a duel for the IP is the only answer.

[real cedar]

LOL

actually yeah why dont you try and add southern idaho mesh to the logo

Its close and soon (tm)

[umbral ice]

soon(tm) lol

[real cedar]

very soon (tm)

inb4 like 50% ch util for an hour when it happens

[umbral ice]

I actually got a femtofox up and running with meshing-around that I'm going to swap out for the amped rak. so i'll need to get together with you to make sure i've got the config right

[pseudo kestrel]

I'm curious to see how the jump into Idaho works out 🙂

[umbral ice]

3s8p 5000mah cells and acasom filter with the 8db rockland

sitting in my back yard for some endurance testing

[real cedar]

Yeah let me get the femtofox at least loaded with everything it needs and we will do the meshing around bbs link as well

[real cedar]

its not just idaho thats going to be connected by promontory router

[reef ridge]

Bet a Ben Lomond Router would make it easy!

Maybe, The ice storms up there can get crazy. 🤔

[pseudo kestrel]

I think someone on Freq20 is sharing data with the Global MeshSense map

[real cedar]

Its OP af

[real cedar]

its not really worth the risk rn

It will get caught way too easy

and anything off peak is really bad

We need to blend it with peak art

I like the solar light idea but would need a way more versatile box that can house an alfa

so it really does just look like a solar lamp

Promontory makes it way easier to reach idaho and connect the entire norther half of utahs populated zones

and it can see mt logan so we could use that to grab logan

[reef ridge]

Yeah, Promontory is really, really good. I'm surprised its got LOS to Mount Logan, I thought Ben Lomond was a must.

[real cedar]

and if we really wanted to get all of cache.. add gunsight peak

Like I could use the help if someone wants to be a champ

i got promontory but someone else getting a well placed on on gunsight would be lit

[reef ridge]

I have a Nebra coming in the mail, seems like a better spot than my roof.

[real cedar]

I would go an economical node

Not the nebra

Something simple but put a filter and a high gain antenna on it

like a rak

or a heltec t116

[reef ridge]

What about firmware updates though?

[real cedar]

No internet at gunsight peak

or promontory

Everything will need to be done via OTA/RA

Id use 2.6.11

[reef ridge]

Rak is good too, I was going to put one in the Nebra. Really, it's hard to get more econmical than the nebra, a case and antenna alone costs more. 🤔

[real cedar]

Black Pine Peak is pretty OP as well for @umbral ice to consider

grabs that dumb stretch of I84

[umbral ice]

I think I MIGHT have verizon tower access in that area

Gotta find the map with all the pins lol

[real cedar]

epic

IF all those got placed.. That would link all of northern utah and idaho into utah prety solidly with a redundant link in case of failure on the main link from promontory.. It has a pretty good shot of getting struck by lightining

Theres a reason the doppler radar is out there too

its got an OP view

[umbral ice]

42°12'32.8"N 113°02'19.5"W
Sweetzer Summit

[real cedar]

I have to filter promontory well. LOL I dont want the 10 dB blasting the radar on some harmonics

the last thing I want is a clear buzz line to its location

showing up on a federal doppler radar LMFAO

2.7 Ghz is exactly 3 harmonics away so it would show up without a filter

[umbral ice]

Eh that isn't as good as Black Pine

[real cedar]

on the WSD88Ds

never mind that it broadcasts 750,000 watts of power too lol

@umbral ice admittedly promontory works for a second purpose. My nevada connection will be in goshute

will be an epic link

[umbral ice]

I was looking at Goshute. I’d like to get Jackpot covered. From the east and from the north.

Goshute looks rough lol

[real cedar]

goshute would be a very very long day

probably start at 3 am on the drive out

5 am start the climb with gear

reach the peak hopefully by 1 .. climb down in the dark with lots of batteries

Firearm probably not a bad idea

the area is littered with meth trailers

[umbral ice]

Oof really?

[real cedar]

yeah I mean it is wendover .. theres also a dispo out there casinos and a decent liquor store

[reef ridge]

Node is going to get stolen for the two grams of copper inside.

[real cedar]

Meth heads arent climbing the peak and if they are they arent looking in the trees for a node LOL.. its a peak full of trees

[umbral ice]

IMO if someone got there, they’d deserve it lmao

[real cedar]

It might be a bat house

to blend with national forest land

[reef ridge]

Bat house? Pretty good idea.

[real cedar]

yeah Ill paint it the bark color.. treat it for bugs.. put an 8.5 dB painted bark color sticking out the top and way up in a tree hahahaha

[reef ridge]

Where would you put a node between Promontory and Goshute? Desert Peak?

[real cedar]

That is my plan yes

Boom Boom Router (its near the air range)

like bombs go off in the valley below it all the time

but its on BLM public land so you can get to it

Theres a router in the grouse creek area

well soon (tm) according to @whole oxide

[reef ridge]

Grouse Creek! I'd figured people would be working on Wyoming before the northwestern corner.

[real cedar]

theres nothing in wyoming that southern idaho couldnt get infra to I think

the tetons gotta be easier to reach through idaho

[reef ridge]

Ah, I was thinking Evanston or something.

[real cedar]

@umbral ice what kind of access to bennet peak do you know of for the mtn home to boise stretch?

[umbral ice]

I'm actually doing Davis Mountain. Gets Fairfield, good coverage north of i84 and has a sliver of sight to Shafer Butte

https://www.heywhatsthat.com/?view=MSWRLHWN

Shafer gives Boise, then I want to put one on Hayden that'll see Boise from the south and then can route back to Twin Falls on a separate path if it needs

[real cedar]

Do you think danskin would be alright. Looks like it has a tower up there

it fills some awesome gaps

Oh shit never mind its some hut

[umbral ice]

Fire look out maybe?

[real cedar]

I think so

Think they would notice a little rak up there

ROFL

That tree looks so perfect

[umbral ice]

There is a mesh user here that is a helo mechanic for a fire crew so might be able to talk to him

[real cedar]

That would be an epic connection. Plus that really fills in that portion of the valley

[umbral ice]

lemme see what all it sees to the south

[real cedar]

davis for one

it grabs all the big peaks around it too

easy drive off 21 tbch

[umbral ice]

yeah. Could do Davis to Danskin easy. Also gets Hayden which would be a nice one

Davis also hits Picabo and then Picabo can hit Baldy. I have tower access for sure on Picabo

With grid power

So a G2 would be niiiice

Also can snag tower access of Sedgwick
https://www.heywhatsthat.com/?view=NHBAX8UC

[manic fractal]

🦟 🦟 🦟 🦟 🦟 🦟

[broken turret]

Then it becomes Area 51 (the area covered by the frequency slot 51 mesh).

[umbral ice]

Not gonna lie, I kind of love that haha

[real cedar]

@umbral ice @obsidian storm we thought we would skip right to including the other areas. Thoughts?

[obsidian storm]

Sure.

[real cedar]

Docs incoming to your DMs

[prisma saddle]

or die trying. lol.

[prisma saddle]

get him go fly to top of some peaks.

[umbral ice]

That looks good. I like the logo.

[real cedar]

@reef ridge can you make that happen

[umbral ice]

Talked to my aunt who used to work for the USFS and the helo mechanic. Consensus is it’s a big maybe leaning toward not on the building, but if I can get out there and use the tree for a trail cam build. Though I’d probably want it amped and filtered.

[real cedar]

Go amped and filtered and make it a bird house with a camera?

Haha

[umbral ice]

Was my thought haha

[real cedar]

Hell yeah. That would be awesome. We can connect my dad up

[reef ridge]

Lmao, 100% neccesary.

[real cedar]

Go for it hahaha

I want to see this lmao

[real cedar]

@reef ridge eta on that? Or I mean send it to bash . I sent him the docs

So the logo can get featured

[reef ridge]

I was working on making a new one, you just want me to incorporate the internal badge from the one you did?

[real cedar]

Just figured you'd add it to the logo I created cuz it should be easy

I'm just not at home atm

[reef ridge]

I can cut up parts of it, but with no path information a lot of things need to be redone manually or it won't come out right. I'm working on it though.

[real cedar]

Cool. Yeah sorry I basically just had inkscape convert it. It just did everything monolithically

Should have asked for your original

[real cedar]

Happy to announce that we have our the initial revision of documentation up thanks to @obsidian storm and myself using mddocs. Everyone go look over it
https://freq51.net/index.html

Give us suggestions and improvements

[reef ridge]

Here we go, it's parametric now so tweaks should be easy.

[real cedar]

Fuck yeah. @obsidian storm how do we integrate that?

[reef ridge]

And the SVG

[real cedar]

Once we have the docs to a point where it's pretty. We can get on the official mesh groups page too

I think that would be great

Some things that are undecided. Are we going to just make a Freq51 discord where we connect both us id and us ut groups together in one?

I didn't put a discord link in cuz I don't have one yet

[reef ridge]

I guess it depends on how far into ID you go. Is there already a Boise ID mesh?

[umbral ice]

There is but they aren’t interested in freq51. They like being on defaults. In my chats with east Idaho there is some mild interest up in Rexburg.

The goal? At least Boise to Twin Falls, Sun Valley, and east Idaho.

Once we get the interconnect up, I think there will be more buy in. Lots of folks are skeptical I think

[reef ridge]

I wonder why, from what I've seen LF20 is always bogged down by randos doing whatever.

[umbral ice]

Inclusion they said. They don’t want to miss new users.

[obsidian storm]

their area doesn't have the same issues slc valley has

significatly less people on LF20

[reef ridge]

Makes sense, I think the same thing but a new user you'd want to have would do the bare minimum research to integrate properly into the local mesh!

But yeah, if the main Idaho mesh group is far out of reach maybe a broad intermountain mesh group would work fine.

[obsidian storm]

tbh, a well designed mesh wouldn't fall apart with people incorrectly doing their settings.

meshtastic will get there sometime.

[reef ridge]

Oh, really? From what people say too many routers pretty much ruins the whole thing. What do you do to make the mesh resilient to bad nodes?

[quasi surge]

bash is talking about evolutions of the protocol/firmware to be more resilient

[obsidian storm]

yup.

wifi does it

with frequency hopping and other things.

I'm sure they can come up with awesome solutions.

[reef ridge]

Oh, future improvements. Fair enough.

This is the badge I was working on before @real cedar made his.

[real cedar]

Dammit they both are so good haha

[reef ridge]

Thanks! I do like how yours is a bit cleaner, but I had to share it anyway. 😎

[dawn rock]

lol

Damn flatlanders

[umbral ice]

Everytime I read it, I can’t help but think “Air sick lowlanders” lmao (Stormlight Archives ref 😉)

[dawn rock]

Is there a utah mesh BBS?

[quasi surge]

@real cedar this could be neat to host at DC801

[real cedar]

It's going to be hosted soon on meshing around

Lake mountain. Should have it soon

DC801 is the other but we haven't gotten a good config going

Promontory Point will be a BBS but completely offline

[umbral ice]

I suppose I should build out the SSL (Twin Falls Hacker space) femtofox so that I can have that info for the BBS linking too

Thinking that I'll put my 3rd and final femtofox on Danskin(even if its in the tree). I can build a G2 with connected raspi zeros for Sun Valley since I (should) have grid power.

[real cedar]

That would be nice. Ours has a 1 watt ebyte and an rpi4 powered node. It has no filter as it's really not needed. It's kind of sitting in a zone where basically it's the only radio besides AUR and BEEF that it sees

It really needs to be taken down for a second and made more robust

It has a lightning arrestor

So that's a plus and a strong ground connection

But I kind of want a real mast haha

@granite carbon any status on that? Or know the state of Kimbers mast?

[obsidian storm]

what are you thinking we could host at lakemtn?

[real cedar]

https://github.com/SpudGunMan/meshing-around

Where did you get its 3dB antenna?

it has a lot of features. I like the emergency response handler

Would be nice to have a dedicated emergency channel

Bulletin Board & Mail is the main feature thats nice but i havent played with it much

[obsidian storm]

It's actually 4dbi

now that I did some digging

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09JNDVYW4

It's the original antenna from the old heltec that was there.

This is it

[real cedar]

Think we could make it an 8 dB rokland LOL

[obsidian storm]

we could test

but read this: #1197577977781821541 message

^ It's exactly what you want to do.

[quasi surge]

higher gain = the radiation/pickup pattern is squashed more pancake like

lower gain = the pattern is more like a sphere

[obsidian storm]

I think a very nice 5dbi alfa would be sick

[real cedar]

Yeah if lake mountain has that unique height probably a bad idea

[quasi surge]

given the elevation challenges, I wouldn't go much higher than 5

yeah

[real cedar]

yeah that would work

[obsidian storm]

here's a view from the peak

[quasi surge]

and tilting a high gain antenna really isn't great

cause then you have polarization issues

also high gain antennas tend to be monopoles so putting them at the end of coax ain't a great idea

[real cedar]

Thats only partially true. Thats true for the main lobe but the side lobes are pretty potent too. and youll only get polarization issues if its not a dipole

most of ours are dipoles

[obsidian storm]

but if we want to make it amazing, a better filter, a very nice 5dbi alfa, and raising the height of the antenna 10 or so ft above the shack would be great.

[quasi surge]

right, but a 10dbi is almost certainly a monopole 😛

[quasi surge]

what filter are you using?

[obsidian storm]

Taoglas DBP.915.V.A.30

not the best filter

but cheap

and better than nothing.

[real cedar]

oh yeah my promontory one will be a monopole 10 haha

[quasi surge]

ah, yeah, solid state bandpass

[real cedar]

not as expensive as cavity or saw

[obsidian storm]

I might grab some of these:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/256953324761?_trksid=p4375194.c101959.m146925

[quasi surge]

does the nebra have an amp?

[obsidian storm]

no

[real cedar]

No its a 1W node

[quasi surge]

well, at least at 1W the IL shouldn't hurt too much

[granite carbon]

I believe the mast has been upgraded to be more stable.

[real cedar]

the antenna gain can be chosen to compensate a bit

[obsidian storm]

This is the radio we put on the Nebras:
Ebyte E22 900M30S Radio

[real cedar]

like the alfa

[real cedar]

Nice. I need to stop by then

oh shit bash

I forgot the images

of all the site surveys hahaha

I wanted to put them under the table on the infra pages

[obsidian storm]

This is the board we put in with the radio and filter:

[prisma saddle]

looks good. found a few areas i’m guessing your still working on. client mute node broadcast.

[real cedar]

oops

ugh

[obsidian storm]

Anyone can edit the pages by editing this:
https://github.com/801labs/freq51
And then a pull request will bring it to the main branch and it'll be automatically live.

[real cedar]

I know im stuck on windows right now and dont have any of my environment on it. its really limiting

stupid amd microcode stuff

[prisma saddle]

cool i’ll fork it and see what i can add to it.

[obsidian storm]

here:
https://central.github.com/deployments/desktop/desktop/latest/win32

fixed

[prisma saddle]

ya that’s what. use. to lazy to learn git cli.

[real cedar]

Well thats lame

[quasi surge]

use WSL2 then?

[real cedar]

probably gonna have to

@obsidian storm you got a file drop?

Ill just give you a zip with the modified infrastructure file and all the images

and you can just cut paste haha

I forgot I blocked out a lot of microsofts stuff on zen armor and have to figure out whats blocking WSL2 lol

Its bigger than discord likes

or email

[prisma saddle]

eh worked for me.. lol

[real cedar]

🤨

[prisma saddle]

id be happy to "copy/paste" for you if bash is not around

[real cedar]

Ill need a file drop

[prisma saddle]

https://www.dropbox.com/request/bzXWompnVb356bhHesWI

[real cedar]

put those all in the src directory and it should just work

[prisma saddle]

ight i organzed it a bit more. added an images folder

and updated alt images paths

creating PR now

[real cedar]

cool

thanks. I want the builds page to be good but I didnt have the energy to go dig it all out

[prisma saddle]

https://github.com/801labs/freq51/pull/1

[obsidian storm]

can you run the images through: https://tinypng.com/

and maybe drop the resolution?

They're 2.5MB each

[prisma saddle]

sure i can gimp them up...

gimmy a bit

[real cedar]

😂 I did say I took high resolution site surveys

I think its cuz they are png. Jpg will make them way smaller even at 95

[prisma saddle]

i got them smaller 800kb.. just getting res smaller

[real cedar]

They were only like 1600x1600

not even HD haha

[prisma saddle]

what size thinking? 1024x1024? or smaller? @obsidian storm

[obsidian storm]

whatever you think, tbh.

just 2.5MB is a large size

[prisma saddle]

ah ya i got the file sizes smaller already

[obsidian storm]

and will make the page load annoying.

[prisma saddle]

gotcha

[real cedar]

1024x1024 is about 40% smaller

should work

[real cedar]

is it ready for a test load on mobile?

[pseudo kestrel]

pngcrush is another option for *nix-y folks I think

[obsidian storm]

just waiting for the smaller images

[prisma saddle]

sorry few moe min

more

ok done.. that better?

@obsidian storm

let me know if too small. image size.. and i can adjust a bit more

[obsidian storm]

done

@real cedar i'm confused about the LAKE survey

[real cedar]

how come

[obsidian storm]

Why is it not showing all of Orem, Lehi, Spanish Fork, etc as being on the map

https://freq51.net/images/LMR-South.png

[real cedar]

Im not sure. I used your GPS coords

[obsidian storm]

I could literally stand at the site and see the entire east valley.

[real cedar]

we can re run it

give me an exact gps of the hut

[obsidian storm]

https://maps.app.goo.gl/7BczYg51Wz4DYAaN8

40.2829264218578, -111.93672330929594

[real cedar]

elev?

of the antenna

AGL will do

how tall is the hut

[prisma saddle]

looks 9-10 ft to the antenna

based on the door height

[quasi surge]

#1197577977781821541 message 11-12ft maybe

[real cedar]

yeah my guess is 13

[prisma saddle]

• 2-3 ft lol

[real cedar]

lucky 13 haha

[quasi surge]

yeah, my estimate is a door is just under 7' and it looks to be just over half again above the door

[real cedar]

Lake Mountain

actually I got it in one

@prisma saddle can you grab that. Insert it.. PR it and stuff

[prisma saddle]

that is labled lmr-south right?

I mean looks like its all of lake mountain

so maybe its both images right? so change up the layout and remove north/south? and just do that one?

@obsidian storm adjusted

[real cedar]

Nope thats just LMR now

thats all of LMR

huge LOS

[prisma saddle]

ok yup changed it to general lmr

not n/s

err not just north or south

waiting on merge

[real cedar]

im going to regret the decision to add alcohol to dr P tomorrow

[umbral ice]

If you're already in the realm of regret, may as well just full send it

[prisma saddle]

haha yes yse you will

mondays...

[umbral ice]

In for a penny in for a pound I always say 😛

[real cedar]

I have real root beer too

[prisma saddle]

yum!

[prisma saddle]

meh nebra miners not here till wed now.

[real cedar]

What cost are they going for rn

@prisma saddle @obsidian storm did the PR and stuff go through?

[real cedar]

Oh wait. The PR has to be merged huh?

[prisma saddle]

yup

just waiting on that

[prisma saddle]

$49 i think it was

[real cedar]

ooof too much for me

imma grab some renogy pwm chargers off amazon for my nebras

Should charge the packs and regulate the output for the nebra

[prisma saddle]

which ones are they?

[real cedar]

https://www.amazon.com/Renogy-Wanderer-Amp-12V-24V/dp/B07NPDWZJ7/ref=sr_1_3?crid=3SVTM1WD97RIJ&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.I7BmcdDjVvSNQyylNKfRvS9fHTE82PbMte17MwVqDGEIhg6uLPRHKLaF6RQxN5sAJnZYSQUN4DFGzsbgTQxWXxEcJKpGzuAFhekQgfb8OBuheU8uM1dgWzO8pjFg9vh2eo_YgCGIlQFC9IRhL4C5PyPX45b5SEhvzUCN24aGuEvIqYks91BUORz3MquYHYd1EpUkvvL9AeEstmZ58vTv2pXKmUH7r327Wwnmxyjgu2g.VZTBMs6-k9X-ix_3Zn2KB3YZ8iur_9_R5sXsEJJ0ydE&dib_tag=se&keywords=renogy+mppt+10a&qid=1755484896&sprefix=renogy+mppt+10a%2Caps%2C171&sr=8-3

the wanderer is nice and cheap

[prisma saddle]

what panel you doing? eco worhy?

I gess they have their own brand of panels hmm

[real cedar]

25 or 30W ecoworthys

50W renogy for the balcony

I think 25W + That controller + 3S4P lion should be ample for the nebra

[prisma saddle]

dang thats quite the setup

[real cedar]

yeah Basically im going to have an additional powerbox below the nebra. On promontory im going to attach a fake anemometer to it

so it looks like a weather station

[reef ridge]

You doing solar for your home Nebra?

[real cedar]

Im going solar for everything. I want it to be fully backed up when I lose power. Plus I have HA internet. I have LTE as a failover on my opnsense firewall

and thats all backed up so Ill have wifi and internet in an emergency

As well as all of my radios

[reef ridge]

I was just going go the POE route. That's a good idea though, UPS doesn't give me that much time.

[real cedar]

That box is on the ground out there

Huge 4S3P lifepo4 cells

1 week of backup power without solar if just running radios and the pi

Less so with the 500W pure sine wave inverter also attached

Waiting on my machined antenna elements

So project is on hold

[reef ridge]

What's the antenna for?

[real cedar]

It's a discone for wide band searching. This one's elements make it work 0-7.6 GHz

Well 200 khz

The element you don't see is the gigantic top element

The balcony above me is 15 ft above my head at least

So there's your reference

[reef ridge]

Got a wagon wheel on top or something?

[real cedar]

Yeah it has the typical discone look with multiple different sized elements

[reef ridge]

You have a cool setup. what do you use the discone for, like what are you searching for?

[prisma saddle]

https://freq51.com/infrastructure.html

@obsidian storm thanks

[real cedar]

Typically it's to latch onto the lower frequencies more than the higher. I can also xmit on it relatively well and talk on HAM bands. See realistically in an emergency where truly all hell breaks loose. Is someone gonna punish me for finding a clear part of the spectrum and talking to someone temporarily?

Probably not

But it's mostly just to monitor the spectrum with SDRs

sometimes I listen to the airport or have it tuned to salt lake center

[reef ridge]

Lol, no. No one ever bothered me when I was going at it without a license either.

[umbral ice]

I'm running a 3s8p the renogy wanderer and a 25w ecoworthy for the Harrison Femtofox

[real cedar]

Don't threaten me with a good time

😂

[reef ridge]

I considered solar but the mast I want to use is on the northern side of my house, how do you guys mount your huge panels?

I want to put my Nebra up but indefinite power is tempting over POE.

Especially after I lost power for a day after that big fire. 🙄

[real cedar]

Just weld up a mount and paint it. drill custom holes

[reef ridge]

I

ve never welded before, I was considering a percarious amount of U-bolts.

Drilling holes? Very easy.

[real cedar]

No

The panels are fragile

you gotta go slow and be careful

I also use nylock and vibratite

[umbral ice]

Could always used slotted angle iron to cut and bolt together in whatever configuration you want. Not very pretty, but I reckon it’d do the job

Welding is on my list of things to learn this year… the things I do for my nodes lmao

[reef ridge]

That's what I meant by percarious amounts of U-bolts, there's a tripod for a dish sitting up there being useless and I figured I could bolt on electrical conduit for a mast, then bolt together a series of brackets for the node and panel.

[umbral ice]

@real cedar wanna host a welding class for me? Haha I’d schedule a trip down 😛

[real cedar]

No but I can recommend an extremely good and beginner friendly welder to purchase

its really just about plugging in the right settings and learning each metals technique, gas mix, voltage etc. But the welder ill recommend will dial it pretty close with synergic

[umbral ice]

Hit me with it

[real cedar]

https://www.arccaptain.com/products/mig200-200amp-multi-process-synergic-mig-welding-machine

Gas will be whats expensive af especially if going trimix for stainless

[prisma saddle]

i’ve got a lincoln that i have yet to bust out and use. bought it from my bro.

[real cedar]

@umbral ice I can do Idaho now for infra
https://freq51.net/infrastructure.html

Mind DMing me the exact locations of routers or rough locations for a good set of site surveys. I'd like to add y'all to the infra page

At least current deployed stuff

[real cedar]

@obsidian storm this is too cool.. meshing around under the hood basically works like this with bbs-link

There's a beacon and a handshake.. A scheduler job emits a “bbslink … looking for peers” message on a chosen channel (e.g., channel 0 encrypted). Peers that hear it can sync. (The README shows this usage and the scheduler pattern.)

Then there's pulling and replicating.. When a peer is found, the bot pulls any posts it doesn’t have and injects them locally to its own BBS and/or mail queue. Those reposted items originate from the local bot, so hop TTL is fresh on that side. WE CAN TOTALLY BYPASS the 7 hop limit hahaha

There's a good security feature too. .. There’s a whitelist knob so you only link with approved node IDs and avoid spam/loops. The bot can watch multiple radios/interfaces, and there’s a note that running against an MQTT-linked software node works

TLDR: “A updates B, B updates C, each time the origin is the local bot” It’s basically FidoNet-style store-and-forward for Meshtastic.

[umbral ice]

You want current or planned + current? I'll get you Harrison and ISR as current and then Davis, Danskin, and Picabo as planned

[real cedar]

All will be fine. I'll just keep them on the back burner

[quasi surge]

Oh, this is neat, might run a node here in my part of SLC then

[reef ridge]

Im thinking about putting a solar node up here. It's got LOS to FPR and I can finally get coverage to the eastern part of Ogden.

[prisma saddle]

haha nice. work at gas/oil?

[reef ridge]

Lol, no, they're steam condensation towers for heating/sterilization systems.

But the important part is it's the tallest thing I have access to for a few miles!

[real cedar]

Make it a Client. It will do well in that spot

Just make sure the antenna protrudes without any metal tower in its way.

Suggest an alfa

[reef ridge]

Yeah, thinking about placing on the western side to get full coverage without the steam dome blocking to the north, but if there's going to be a node at Promontory maybe placing it on the southern side may be better.

[real cedar]

@reef ridge people in #general love our circular logo a lot

@prisma saddle #general message

Could you get their documentation edited to add us?

Meanwhile I need to find a nice spot for the logo in the docs

[prisma saddle]

sounds good, im on it! @real cedar

[reef ridge]

Looks like that one they just posted is inspired by ours too, we got a bunch of trend setters in Utah connect.

[real cedar]

Lol yeah definitely. Now we just need to get Idaho and Utah connected and an epic map to display it

[umbral ice]

I was looking at the maps again last night and I'm going to be curious if Harrison will see FPR. Like 130 miles, but maybe? lol

[real cedar]

I mean 😆 I know a couple developers have some disagreements with posting nodes up unattended without explicit permission but oh well. They had to know someone would try this 😆

It will with a high gain antenna

Rokland 8 might be really solid

130 is nothing apparently. People can get short fast up to 180

With clear LOS

It will be ideal in some ways. The low SNR should cause FPR to repeat Harrison first at least out here

[prisma saddle]

created pr will see if they accept it https://github.com/meshtastic/meshtastic/pull/1987

fixed my spelling error lol

[vital hemlock]

Whomever owns "SMS Gateway", or knows who it is, drop me a DM?

[prisma saddle]

thats @hallow dagger

#1197577977781821541 message

#1197577977781821541 message

just for ref.

[real cedar]

Some routers are now 4 hops away. Like you won't see 3805 without being 4 hops. At least from where we are. (Our node) --> FPR --> NPR --> 3804 Eagle --> 3805 is usually my trace route

That last one on Router Late will need to be reconfirmed by erayd. He is the RL expert

[umbral ice]

Does nodeinfo follow the same rules of hop limits? It kind of feels like it doesn't.

[real cedar]

We might need to edit that

[real cedar]

It does

But it's also always requested upon seeing a new node

So it's interval need not be frequent

I don't find the extra hops causing congestion on our network as much as the occasional echo and making remote admin more reliable 😆

[broken turret]

@maiden wraith is correct; ROUTER_LATE will always rebroadcast (unless the packet was received with a hop limit of zero).

Good spotting; in both cases your red text is correct, and the original wording is wrong.

[prisma saddle]

done @real cedar https://meshtastic.org/docs/community/local-groups/#utah

[reef ridge]

"The" in front is kinda weird considering none of the other ones has it.

[prisma saddle]

ok i added it cause of this

so i can change that and re-submit - pr

[reef ridge]

Wait, is it called Freq 51-- Intermountain Mesh or is Intermountain Mesh-- Freq 51?

[prisma saddle]

i dunnno.. how should it be? @real cedar

[reef ridge]

It has now crossed my mind that the logo is upside down.

[prisma saddle]

ha ha what?

[reef ridge]

It has Intermountain Mesh on top and Freq 51 on the bottom, but the name of the website is Freq 51 so it should be on top.

[vital hemlock]

Guvwaf knows what's up, so I'll leave that here for posterity.

[prisma saddle]

ah ok im tossing it on the site.. so send it over when/if you decide to change it

[reef ridge]

Yeah, I can do it when I get home. I'll see what everyone says first though.

[obsidian storm]

@prisma saddle your change broke the site. Maybe try it and fix it?

[vital hemlock]

So we are clear, this is for a "control" channel for the routers to share neighbor info, not for every user.

I'm going to break my meshview for a few mins to update it and make some edits

[prisma saddle]

lol great. will do

[obsidian storm]

We're using rust's MDbook for the site:
https://rust-lang.github.io/mdBook/

[prisma saddle]

ok should be fixed. i need to adjust image sizes still

based on the above link on how images work.. ill get on that asap

ok cool. ill Pr that later today

@obsidian storm thanks

[obsidian storm]

Nice. Looks great

[full thorn]

Dang, I wish I would have known about slot 51 when I was up on King's Peak last week.

How do I go about getting the PSK for the Freq51 channel?

[reef ridge]

It's the default LF PSK.

[full thorn]

The site says "KEY UPON REQUEST", so I thought I might have to swear a secret oath or something to get it.

[umbral ice]

Different channels for sure. There is LF default channel, but also a secondary Freq51 channel. I can't speak to that info tho 😛

[obsidian storm]

This is for infrastructure

We'll have to explain that better

In the docs

[reef ridge]

Yeah, the way it's worded might make it seem like a secret cool kid's club, lol.

[vital hemlock]

It's for the worst-kids club, I can tell you because I'm in it. We needed a channel to pass neighbor_info from the routers only. It's not for chatting, zero fun times in there.

[full thorn]

Got it. I'm a bit of an RF nerd (but new to meshtastic) I'm interested in it, but maybe for later.

[prisma saddle]

we are official on meshtastic site too. https://meshtastic.org/docs/community/local-groups/

[vital hemlock]

We all welcome the curiosity. I just refreshed the meshview page: https://mesh.thebadplace.org

Anything sent on Freq51 will be visible there as well

It will show there are messages on the primary LongFast channel, but will not know the payload.

In order to show up on that page you'll need to enable "okay to mqtt" Lora settings on the app

[quasi surge]

bp_rpi is the broker that's posting packets right now, yeah?

[white field]

Shit, I changed solar:4 to client mode after 8 months of uptime and I think it lost its configs

[vital hemlock]

It's the primary, but others may. I've given the creds out to those running routers.

[vital hemlock]

Also, to be clear, the broker runs elsewhere. That is the radio I have uplinking to it.

[quasi surge]

fair, got mixed up on mqtt terminology 😛

it's the gateway, rather

[prisma saddle]

dang does that happen often? like the 38fb?

[real cedar]

So Freq51 private channel is for neighborinfo, mqtt and infrastructure related stuff .. LongFast is the secondary. I have no issue having more than infra nodes on it with the caveat that the node must be stationary, well placed and outdoors.. tldr it needs to be able to contribute to the meaningful data we aim to collect

We have found out through researching the code and docs that we must have this to collect that data. Annoying but it's how the firmware allows us to operate

It's not needed to connect to the entire network

That simply can be LongFast in your primary

Or secondary

[dawn rock]

I do a custom channel in primary for automated precise location updates between my nodes and other channels are secondary

does the freq51 channel rely on the primary automated reported feature?

[quasi surge]

It does

[dawn rock]

It's unfortunate they still chose to do the primary channel only does the scheduled actions and all other channels can get stuffed

[real cedar]

Yes

[real cedar]

It is isn't it?

[quasi surge]

It wouldn't be too hard to evolve the firmware/channel flags to remove the concept of a primary in the first place ^^

Assuming upstream is open to it

[real cedar]

It would be nice if they did a sort of primary, secondary, tertiary but for now this is our only solution

[quasi surge]

There's no need to have that set of concepts IMO

You could instead just maintain a bitfield for which broadcasts happen, per channel

I think there are some other behaviors that are special/significant to PRIMARY, but those could be slowly made more flexible over time

[vital hemlock]

It's a holdover from an earlier time in the project. You used to have the channel in the same slot as well, to communicate

[vital hemlock]

Gah, the new meshview is choking on one of the packet types...

it's killing the database

oooookay, it recovered itself...that was bizzare

And helpful

[obsidian storm]

I created a "phone book" for meshtastic nodes:
http://meshbook.freq51.net/

creds:

un: slcmesh
pw: slcmesh

This pulls from MQTT to keep the nodes up to date and the battery details.

[quasi surge]

oh, this is very neat

[obsidian storm]

Some of the things we can do is we can add owners to a node without showing them publicly. That way, if there's issues with the node, I can help the local community get in contact with the owner

but it's not shown publicly on the site.

[quasi surge]

what/where is 38fb?

also re: claiming ownership, I wonder if it would make sense to have a standard message format for a node to send to update it's phonebook entry?

[leaden crow]

https://maps.app.goo.gl/phyuzYA1jxiNrY2t7

[prisma saddle]

ya how do we claim owner. you can put me under all the jal ones

and lora the explorer.

prob others but they not online.

lol.

oh ce-roof for now.

[obsidian storm]

Oh this is a great idea

I'll implement this tonight

Right now we just claim ownership by telling me and I'll go do it

But I love the idea of sending a message from the node to a bot or something that updates it for you

[prisma saddle]

ya cool idea.

is there a most nodes competition? lol.

[leaden crow]

lol. don't start that. I bet someone has even more than me, and I don't want to see what it'll do to our channel util.

[umbral ice]

I have 9. Like 15 if you count undeployed planned infrastructure nodes that already have hardware and just need to be built lol.

[prisma saddle]

lol how many you have?

[prisma saddle]

ya a box full of them.

[umbral ice]

2 more femtofoxes, 2 undeployed g2s, an undeployed rak19007, my power bank node, t1000, wispocket, a t114 car node, tdeck, tbeam supreme, like 5 heltec v3s in boxes, a deployed g2, and another deployed rak19007 trail cam node.

I think

[prisma saddle]

will the radio/trans from a femtofox work on a nebra miner?

[prisma saddle]

and a partrige in a pair tree

[leaden crow]

3x T1000E
1x T-deck plus
3x rpi hats (built on proto board)
2x Nebra mesh hats
2x RAK4631
5x Xiao nrf
1x Xiao esp

EOL nodes I still have:
sx1276 t3s3
sx1276 t-beam
waveshare hat

[umbral ice]

Oh the Raspi hats. I have a full and a mini too forget about those lmao

[reef ridge]

You have plans for those Nebra hats? I got a Nebra coming in the mail and I wanna slap one in.

[leaden crow]

I probably forgot something or other, but my count should actually shrink. The 5x xiao nrf will be going to family/friend roof nodes soon.

[leaden crow]

Yes unfortunately. I have one Nebra built that I need to find a purpose. The other will replace the proto board hat in my home roof node (proto board hat does not have a filter).

[reef ridge]

Worth a shot. 😅

[leaden crow]

I could rewire some of my proto board hats to work with the nebra (already did this a couple of times for bash and c6), but honestly I think it's better to get a wehooper board. The Taoglas or Murata filter on board is worth it.

[prisma saddle]

reach out to wehopper4 or you can make i one with parts

[leaden crow]

I think there is enough demand, you could order another batch like bash did previously

[reef ridge]

I've been able to dodge learning how to solder, but I guess it might be time.

Oh, is there a waiting list for a group buy or something?

[prisma saddle]

#1197577977781821541 message

[prisma saddle]

he is working out some biz stuff to take payments better. so maybe next week?

or make one yourself.

[leaden crow]

That's the parts list, but wehooper gave away the gerber file, you could just order a bunch of board from JLB

[prisma saddle]

via that list. from @leaden crow

[reef ridge]

Gerber file? Is that the one the defines the PCB layout?

[leaden crow]

I think when bash did it, cost with parts came out to $20-$30/ea

yes

[reef ridge]

Thanks, I'll reach out and check the parts list.

[prisma saddle]

he only had 2w avail for 60 each.

next month will get 1w ordered.

[leaden crow]

I would consider getting a hot plate and solder paste if you don't have any experience with surface mount soldering

Not saying it can't be done, but it's way easier with a hot plate and probably turn out better too. Less likely to ruin anything.

[reef ridge]

That's the one where you drop it on top and capilary action draws all your solder up, right?

[leaden crow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QarizoUnRfk

[reef ridge]

I'd definitely prefer not to instantly ruin my parts via amateur work, so it all sounds good to me.

[obsidian storm]

Okay. I have 5 left.
@prisma saddle has one claimed
@vital hemlock has one claimed

Which leaves three more.

[reef ridge]

Dibs?

[obsidian storm]

Sure. So only two unclaimed

[reef ridge]

Awesome, thanks!

[prisma saddle]

left of what?

[obsidian storm]

Parts for the nebra kit

So I have that many kits left

[prisma saddle]

oh haha thought that was lake. ahh ok.

kits. got ya.

[obsidian storm]

Oh. No just the nebra itself was LAKE.

But the little board that you use to convert the nebra lora miner into a meshtastic node is what I still have left.

[reef ridge]

It's a kit that still needs assembly, right?

[obsidian storm]

Sure. But if you're really concerned, I'll do it for you

It'll only take me about 20 minutes and I'll just do it on a Thursday at the hackerspace

[reef ridge]

Sounds even better.

What's the hackerspace?

[obsidian storm]

https://801labs.org

Once we run out.... Maybe we should come up with a system that's easier to get and maybe cheaper. I do prefer pushing people towards solar setups

But there's something awesome about being able to access the nebra over ethernet.

[prisma saddle]

ya as soon as we can figure out a cookie cutter setup. or something.

here get this or here are the recommended parts. etc.

[obsidian storm]

Solar is nice because then if the power grid goes down our mesh doesn't fall apart

[prisma saddle]

solar nebra. hmm.

lots of power! lol

i plan on making one. will see how it goes.

[reef ridge]

Nebra is pretty thirsty, you'd need a fat battery.

[prisma saddle]

yup.

[reef ridge]

I'm guessing like 100ah LiFePO4 for a decent autonomy reserve. 🤔

My original plan was just to run it to the POE switch but now solar sounds like a fun route to go.

[obsidian storm]

I would not do a nebra if you're going solar...

There's much better options out there

[reef ridge]

Because it would be needlessly expensive?

[obsidian storm]

The solar panel you would need to keep a nebra going would be huge and you need quite a lot of batteries

The nebra pulls at least 4.5w idle

[reef ridge]

Yeah, probably at least a 100 watt panel then with a 100ah battery, Looking at the most expensive Meshtastic node possible, lol.

I already have full solar on my house though, I just don't have a battery backup yet.

[prisma saddle]

only for science. lol. learning.

[reef ridge]

Nothin wrong with sacrificing a bit of practicality for fun.

[quasi surge]

how do you like the xiao nodes?

[quasi surge]

want to sell a g2? 😛

[obsidian storm]

the xiao nodes are great!

this is how simple they can b e

[umbral ice]

Nah 😛 I have uses for them. I just stocked up lol!

[reef ridge]

To biggypack on that, has anyone tried those prebuilt SenseCAP solar nodes?

[quasi surge]

the price on those is quite attractive... I ended up getting a rak mini router for my rooftop node, however

it was a better fit for the space and is a bit more tried and true (but mostly it blended in to the mounting location much better)

[quasi surge]

the price is very attractive, and they are in stock in the CA warehouse

do they have a solar charging circuit?

[reef ridge]

Yeah, practically speaking they're barely more expensive than rolling your own.

[obsidian storm]

no, I added my own.

This was my math

Per Node Price $41.64

[leaden crow]

I think they are amazing for the money. The only downside is that I haven't had luck with OTA firmware updates. I can get the correct bootloader installed on them, but nrf iOS apps always fail for me.
I have 3 of these built for a friend right now. Basically the same as bash. You need a $1 BMS, $1 charge controller. Some recycled batteries...

heh, I'm on the slow boat tonight. bash basically covered everything.

[reef ridge]

Sweet model m in the background, btw.

[leaden crow]

That's not even my best one. 😀

[umbral ice]

Where are the custom built keyboards?

[leaden crow]

That is close to custom built. It was an ISO keyboard and I cut all the plastic rivets to change it closer to an ANSI layout.
It was my daily driver for years, but unfortunately I think the membrane is failing (started getting double key presses)

[prisma saddle]

looks awesome!

[pseudo kestrel]

Cool idea with the meshbook @obsidian storm

are there other contact methods that we can provide for it?

[quasi surge]

Signal maybe?

[prisma saddle]

@obsidian storm 2 more.. GHST , 404 add to my list too. inactive but will be active eventually again

404NodeFound , LoRaPhantom

lots of old records in there.

and ACE-Node, but thats on 20... so not sure if it matters..

[white field]

my Kinesis Advantage is too ergonomic. I'm tempted to try one out with different switches sometime.

I don't think I could easily switch away.

[umbral ice]

I expected nothing less! haha

[white field]

moving backspace/delete and space/enter to your thumbs is a huge win.

[umbral ice]

Meanwhile I’m over here like…

[white field]

I also did native rebinds on the kinesis so two dedicated thumb buttons for copy/paste

lol my desk is a mess now

that's from like 5 years ago and 3 apartments ago.

[umbral ice]

I live in reality and sparkling clean desks are not my reality lmao

[white field]

Anyone not have one of those jet powered canned air replacements from AMZ yet?

I got one for cleaning and its amazing.

[keen glen]

I love my Corne wireless build. ~2.5 weeks of battery life

[white field]

its like shop air, but battery powered.

[keen glen]

I've been meaning to get one

[white field]

haha, battery life is 3m max, but they are amazing.

I really love it for cleaning my car off when its got 1/2" of dust on the tailgate.

[keen glen]

It's way thinner and lighter than my previous build.

I ordered one of these. Looked like a fun project, and I like having the PI for the hardware.

[leaden crow]

Not sure what the current ebay going rate is, but when I bought them at $30. That is a steal just for the enclosure, rpi, antennas..

[keen glen]

I paid $40

[keen glen]

Still a steal IMO

[leaden crow]

I should try switching to a more ergonomic keyboard. I had to switch to the vertical mouse a couple of years ago. Really really want to avoid carpal tunnel surgery.

[white field]

Kinesis makes some really nice ergo stuff if anyone is in the market.

If I ever go back to an office, I'll be buying a second one for both desks.

[reef ridge]

Ergos? Customs? Over here with the retro keyboard gang.

[leaden crow]

Old Apple keyboards are nice. Used an Extended II for years. We had a whole bunch of the ergonomic hinged ADB keyboards at a place I worked 15-20 years ago. I'm pretty sure they got ewasted, which is sad, I bet they are worth money now.

[prisma saddle]

well just need the nebra lora kits.

@reef ridge

[reef ridge]

Makes me sad how much good stuff goes straight to the trash. I found this one at a thrift store, it's got the swiss alps and everything. Very nice feel, and it's just cool using tech a decade older than me.

[reef ridge]

Speaking of saving stuff from e-waste, very nice! What's your plans for your Nebras?

[prisma saddle]

gonna switch out my roof node rak for one of those.

then not sure about the other. prob up to the cabin.

[reef ridge]

Going to run it power over ethernet?

[prisma saddle]

yuup

[reef ridge]

Cool, and the cabin? You got power there? That's a cool place for a node.

[prisma saddle]

yup. will have to run a wire. but yup

[white field]

Apparently burning man is still 5 days from starting and there’s already 60 nodes on the public mesh.

This shits gonna be wild

[dawn rock]

Is the mesh going to be on mqtt?

it would be cool to watch the messages

[white field]

I think some poeople are using startlink to upload the mesh activitiy.

Most people will be using private channels for group communications.

My friend who is organizing the public mesh infra said that a single group DMed him and randomly asked, "How can we buy 300 nodes?"

They discovered that Digikey had 100 T1000e's in stock and bought all of them.

[umbral ice]

wonder what kind of price they got on those 😮

[white field]

I mean, I presume MSRP

-10% or something

He told me he built a shitton of nodes to gift to people. $17 per all-in.

NRF chips, 18650 batteries so they last a week or two

[umbral ice]

looks good!

[white field]

I heard a lot of stories of people doing duct tape RAKs or RAKs in ziplock bags with batteries. lol

I'm inspired and I'm about to make a few 18650 duct-tape nodes with some of my extras.

[leaden crow]

I'd like to see his $17 BOM. I'm guessing they are Xiao nrf, Gizont, single 18650, ipex cable, filament? Maybe he got some quantity discounts?

If I were giving those away, I'd be tempted to just use the Xiao PCB antenna. I'm guessing with the density of burning man, they would be fine. Plus more compact node.

[white field]

exactly this plus bulk discounts.

he told me he bought the first ever batch of 100x xia nrf modules.

[vital hemlock]

😮

[prisma saddle]

dang that is a lot.

[prisma saddle]

I agree. not even that. just see all the nodes in a map etc.

[quasi surge]

is that a lowmesh-s with external antenna?

[leaden crow]

That's cool. I would be cursing Seeeeed for not putting a battery connector on the Xiao. Soldering a few of them is fine, but having to solder 100 would be tedious.

[real cedar]

say uhhh if you accidently obtain surplus.. that would be useful in the nnooks and crannies here 🤣

Looks good

[leaden warren]

Yup. Pocket-S, you can add an external antenna to it. In the box there is an SMA adapter and a plastic knockout in the case. Its a bit technical to enabled it, 1. Remove the conformal coating on the sma connect area and the 0 ohm jumper, solder the SMA adapter and switch a 0 ohm jumper and you are all set

[prisma saddle]

anyone have a pic of this panel pointed on a pole? https://a.co/d/b3mGuh2

i know there is a few printables mounts. but i want to see them in action.

prob with this mount. https://www.printables.com/model/221500-meshtastic-6w-solar-enclosure-base-station-lora-no.

on a pole.

[reef ridge]

I think these are the same ones, you can see the mount facing up.

[obsidian storm]

That's POTM with the same panel

[reef ridge]

I guess mounting it at 90 degrees is the most convenient option. I'm assuming there's no significant performance hit?

[real cedar]

Dude.. okay guys. Not doing NPR road. Need a trail. There are cameras up NPR road in select spots. No way to sneak by without escort

Alternatively I could go up Butterfield. Ride the Ridgelines across

@obsidian storm thanks for the heads up on NPR's escort requirement. I managed to scout out and see if it was possible and I think it would be dumb

[obsidian storm]

I'm fairly certain that @hallow dagger went up the back of the Oquirrh mtn, from the West side of the mtn range.

My bet is that he started here:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ARNrFWsAvhxAGzWY6

[real cedar]

😂 is it passable on mountain bike

[hallow dagger]

Farnsworth would be even more restricted.

I went the Bates Canyon route. Last time I took my mtb the first 3-1/2 miles and then had to stash it and bushwhack the last mile to the peak. The last mile probably took twice as long as the first 3-/12 miles, at least on the way up.

This shows the trail starting at the parking lot just off the pavement, but you can drive the dirt all the way up to the mouth of the canyon where there's a cattle gate blocking vehicles from the canyon itself.
https://www.trailforks.com/trails/bates-canyon-road/

[hallow dagger]

FYI there are cameras at the top of Butterfield at the mine overlook that have a vierw of the ridge, so might be equally as risky.

[real cedar]

Pretty sure the top Ridgeline strip is BLM right?

[hallow dagger]

Yeah afaik the ridgeline is the boundary, at least in most places.

Anybody know the status of the potential permitted Farnsworth node?

[real cedar]

Lmao then I will wild west it on MTB on the back side of the Ridgeline. The mine can go to hell

🤣

[real cedar]

The plan is to be out of sight out of threat out of mind

Along the Western brim below the Ridgeline from the Bingham overlook

Should work. Will not be the funnest ride but from the looks of the forestation I should be able to be under cover of trees for a good portion of time as well

This should get me there without alerting mining operations to my prescence

13.6 miles one way 😂

Woot

I think I'm going to 3d print a gpio labs filter enclosure. Paint it. Glob it with lexel and have an exterior filter mount on the antenna .. it should work just fine assuming someone isn't a butthole and rips it off

[prisma saddle]

well got one of my nebra setup with dietpi.. just need the lora kit eventually

was fun trying to flash dietpi on it.. all my sd card drive things have the sd card in the usb slot..

had to use a laptop with a sd card reader in it.

[obsidian storm]

lol. come get it whenever

[reef ridge]

Why make an enclosure and paint it if you're just going to pot it anyway?

[prisma saddle]

maybe this weekend..

[real cedar]

Rigidity and wind loading

I'm gonna make it aero

We wouldnt want the gusts at the peak to rip out antenna and filter off would we?

@maiden wraith change NPR to unmonitored=false

I think I know why I can't remote in

[reef ridge]

Ah! I thought you were going to pot the entire painted enclosure, that makes more sense, lol.

[real cedar]

No I'm potting the two sides of the 3d printed joint surface to seal it. I'll probably do an inserted lip in crease so it's very water tight

Ip68 likely

I swear if a filter fixed all NPRs problems I will not be putting up lowe

I'll let lake mountain be the meshing around BBS point

@obsidian storm what's the status on all of that and the spaces node? I have class until 6:30 on Tuesday and Thursday so I'm unable to make it earlier enough

[real cedar]

Are you using your app or your cli connected to a node

I requested meta data

Not getting anything

Will give it a while

Who knows. Maybe ill get it when the balcony node is fully operational again

[prisma saddle]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-palpatine-emperor-gif-26569287

[reef ridge]

Nebra came in, operation roof node is a go.

[prisma saddle]

sweet!! document for science:). i’ll be doing same next few weeks as i get parts and so on.

we can add to @obsidian storm notes on the site for tweaks tips. etc.

https://freq51.net/equipment/nebra-miner.html

[reef ridge]

For sure, if I have anything valuable to add. 😃

[real cedar]

I officially have glass reinforced and carbon fiber reinforced nylon down pack. Printing mounts like crazy. Gonna anneal too and remoisturize later then UV paint coating protect it. It should result in an ultra strong solar panel mount

[prisma saddle]

these named wrong? duplicates

[leaden crow]

I replaced the hardware today. The old one is offline and should disappear

[real cedar]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BT2SWTE?psc=1&smid=A16NHKHGIOW7OD&ref_=chk_typ_imgToDp
So I am 3d printing a solution to the VOC and fumes problem. I made a 3d printed 3M 60921 OV/P100 combo cartridge (OV + HEPA-grade P100) air filter for my printer hahah. Cheater way of filtering the air. Cartridges should last a long time at the air flow rates ill deal with

Be gone cancer fumes

With my chamber heater parts here in a day and this. I will be able to print flawless ASA parts all day any day. Can finally switch over from nylon

[real cedar]

@leaden crow https://www.printables.com/model/1317265-acasom-915mhz-cavity-filter-cap/files

gonna print this for the lowe peak node

SHould allow me to mount the femtofox above the filter which will be mounted into the boxes metal

if I make it out of ESD shielding material. It should keep any of the case isolated from the femto and the waveshare

The case will be part of my additional lightning protection

[obsidian storm]

So

I was thinking of contacting BLM and asking about that shack on the top of Lowe Peak.

[real cedar]

The abandoned BYU shack you mean?

[obsidian storm]

yes.

How do you know it's BYUs?

[real cedar]

Previous radio records seem to indicate BYU had a repeater up there for sometime. They then abandoned in favor of other sites

Which if I'm not mistaken they actually have stuff on Nelson Peak lol

I'm pretty sure any structure that is abandoned on BLM land is pretty fair game since I mean it's polluted to all hell with beer cans and other unmentionables

[obsidian storm]

so.

BLM isn't listing the peak as their land

[real cedar]

Oh I wonder who's land it is. I mean it's also a peak lol
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/licensePathsDetail.jsp;JSESSIONID_ULSSEARCH=Cw_fMoQAgGKEi3r66oImQ1cE0TmlJInWm4EfV_fKxu92Ei1STonS!1090604628!-537459113?pageNumToReturn=1&licKey=1029319&keyPath=230631

So Nelson also has a satellite ground station up there. I will want to take a peak 😂

Oh damn nelson peak is part of ARES .. which means some fairly serious HAMs probably frequent it . Anyone got a contact?

[keen glen]

The Lowe peak is private property I believe

[real cedar]

😆 you worried about me being a radio pirate?

[obsidian storm]

it's listed to some random guy in lehi

[real cedar]

Is it a development stake? Haha

[obsidian storm]

I'm looking to see if we could get an official lease 😄

https://www.utahcounty.gov/LandRecords/property.asp?av_serial=580170075

[real cedar]

Hmm is he in the FCC database. I wonder if he was a ham and might want to get involved

😆

That's always the easiest approach

I'm so glad to have my 3d printer operational again. Now I can actually churn meshtastic stuff

[obsidian storm]

I might go knock on his door

and chat.

sounds fun

I'd love to hear the history behind it.

[real cedar]

LMAO let me know how that goes. Ill always have the backup plan

Also I have a cool rf transparent rubberized coating. I think im going to coat the antenna and feed in it as additional discouragement to lightning. It would rather strike the tower than rubber

it was that or I print an ASA sleeve for the entire feed line

which admittedly a radome would do a fantastic job

[real cedar]

say you were a peak bagger. Its a believable opener

https://www.peakbagger.com/peak.aspx?pid=27452

god dammit the owner isnt in the ascent info either

OUCH

This is gonna have to go at the top of the tower

lmao

I was looking at the last average snow depth update

EPIC.. I can snoe shoe and then dig to it. hopefully not cause an avy lmao

would need to look at the AED (Aspect Elevation Diagramn) for the day

It looks fun to ski

Im very tempted

fuckin army owns the cool part there

would have to exit towards ophir.. might do 7/10

[keen glen]

Lowe peak is privately held

[real cedar]

Alnternatively this low node im building can replace NPR?

Its gonna be more high profile unfornately

was thinking one of these
https://store.rokland.com/collections/802-11ah-wi-fi-halow/products/5-8-dbi-n-male-omni-outdoor-915-mhz-antenna-large-profile-32-height-for-helium-rak-miner-2-nebra-indoor-bobcat

[prisma saddle]

Gonna be doing a mesh training next month and am gonna use the site for most of it. what are we wanting to use for intervals now? the site shows the longer update times than what we all changed to a few weeks ago for shorter intervals.

[real cedar]

depends on the nodes purpose but generally I dont care much. We find that 1800S is a happy sensor medium. gps really doesnt get out reliably faster than 300s

thats from my testing in slc on the 999

[prisma saddle]

gonna go over it section by section and see what still needs to be added/adjusted

[keen glen]

40.40034, -112.19405 is slightly lower than Lowe peak, but is on BLM

Also 40.37531, -112.17540

[real cedar]

Man im giving up my only 5.8 dBi.. but that should be really good for a 1 watt node at npr

thats filtered

Femtofox it is

I will make it a bbs relay

we gotta figure that out

[umbral ice]

I’m scheduled to go up to Harrison on Saturday. Meeting at the base at 11a, so need to get the bbs configs sorted. No internet there and it’s closed after October

[real cedar]

Shit. I dont have those atm

[umbral ice]

Gonna go up and test SF to see how well it hits the ground in the magic valley.

[real cedar]

@obsidian storm do we have remote access at the space