US CA Bay Area

[blazing pine]

anyone can be what they want to beeeee~

https://youtu.be/3Yp-oxOGdHA

[toxic kindle]

Can you draw a diagram, not fully understanding what it would be. And send some links to photos/what it would look like.

[blazing pine]

seems ideal, as long as the node end doesn't fail

no need to have batteries in node either.

I think if Bluetooth update fails, you can just cycle power and it'd go into USB storage mode automagically

[remote vale]

No, it doesn't go to USB auto if BLE bricks it.

[blazing pine]

what does it do then? 👀

[remote vale]

I take that back, I'm unsure

[blazing pine]

I'm pretty sure I tested it once. but 1 is a tiny sample

[remote vale]

I didn't try a power cycle after bricking it.

I'll try tomorrow

[remote vale]

The non-powered are for USB 1.1. Didn't see non-powered for USB 2.0

[blazing pine]

https://a.co/d/3b3cUL2 why even bother with Ethernet, lol

I'd love to have a pi at the powering end to compile all sorts of cool mesh stats 👀

[toxic kindle]

I think we need a concrete design before I send an email

I feel like I’m annoying him with all these design revisions

[remote vale]

Yeah, i understand. Can't give you what I don't have since I've never done it before

[remote vale]

You were right. Thank you.

[blazing pine]

but two is still a tiny sample

[remote vale]

I like the odds

[blazing pine]

I figured out the reset thing too. have capacitor plugged into battery port. have reset normally pulled to ground via resistor, and USB power pulls it up. to go into USB storage mode just interrupt power twice.

(assuming reset is pull-to-ground to trigger)

[toxic kindle]

So if I understand correctly the proposed idea now is USB for both data and power

[blazing pine]

indeed

rak still hasn't shipped my stuff yet

[toxic kindle]

Would rather get it all over with in an hour call but it’s up to him

[blazing pine]

better to assemble some working prototype before continuing 😛

[toxic kindle]

Well that’s at least a month away

I think the plan is to get an OK on a design and then begin a prototype

[blazing pine]

if I had the parts I could assemble something in an hour 👀

hardware can be changed/adjusted easily.

[toxic kindle]

We may be doing a meetup soon…

[blazing pine]

at the very least if you build a prototype you can figure out what doesn't work

[toxic kindle]

Wait what the hell

I looked up David’s call and he lives in Santa Clara too

[blazing pine]

time4visit?

unscheduled one

[remote vale]

I've got the RAK stuff already. Parts to order are more outdoor rated CAT wire, USB extender and two ethernet glands.

@blazing pine , Froggy offered up some RAK stuff.

[blazing pine]

mine are coming though... supposedly

[blazing pine]

you can do all the weird science in my place

[remote vale]

I'm sure it'll be a poor imitation.

[blazing pine]

resistor from reset to ground, 2 more resistors between USB 5v and gnd to make voltage divider to pull up reset...

easy peasy

also a capacitor or two that lets the device run for at least 1-2 seconds

[remote vale]

yup, that'd probably work

[abstract yoke]

I’m now connected to a few nodes in my area. Long Name and Tblue! Maybe they are here?

[blazing pine]

what is a Blue

@sharp mantle you might have a new stalker

what ever happent to portablue

[wide basalt]

picked up node in fremont and rwc from the bay bridge

@abstract yoke I consistently see TBlue in SF too. Where are you located?

[blazing pine]

Long Name used to be Portrero Agent 1

[abstract yoke]

Oakland

I tried to send them a message.

[blazing pine]

better to send @sharp mantle a message, methinks

he has so many nodes i don't even know which one to contact

[blazing pine]

where in oakland?

i just turned off my node this morning so unfortunately no mesh fun today

[abstract yoke]

Downtown.

[blazing pine]

ah, near lake merritt?

er, west of lake merritt*

[abstract yoke]

Correct!

[blazing pine]

you need to climb a tall building lol

i live in lower dimond, right in between two blasted hills

[abstract yoke]

I’m really trying to get one of my friends in one of the new, super tall buildings to host a node

[abstract yoke]

I have a friend out there. I kind of have an idea what that looks like. There's someone in Berkeley that my node can surprisingly see now and then.

[blazing pine]

did you ever see OHR?

[abstract yoke]

I don't think so. Checking to see right now

[blazing pine]

berkeley would be d3bd/KN6PLV

[abstract yoke]

that's right. I need to add my nodes to that map. Which one is it?

[blazing pine]

that's the map of nodes i've received xD

but my node is off until next sunrise

and OHR node is off too, it seems

[blazing pine]

i'm the one right above "24"

on i580

[abstract yoke]

Oh cool!

We aren't that far away. I'll see if I can send you a message on it tomorrow.

[blazing pine]

it will need to bounce off one of the mountain nodes above me

unfortunately i have a very good link only with OHR

i also have a tenuous link with one or two of the agent nodes in SF

[barren socket]

There's no 'for sale' channel here for Meshtastic stuff, right? Didn't see one. Since everyone's got such long lead times, wondering if anyone's got a Wizblock or two locally they'd want to sell. Trying to finish up with the rest of our ARES proof of concept testing before we pull the trigger on a large order.

[timid turret]

Correct. We have had a problem with people being aggressive in using this as a sales platform, so we now no longer allow this being used as a sales platform… but if you find someone with something you need, go for it.

[toxic kindle]

Guys guys

I have an idea 💡

https://store.rokland.com/products/rak-wisblock-earthquake-sensor-solution-kit-rak10703-us-915-mhz-116038?currency=USD&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=google%2Bshopping&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI4qbqwv7ZhAMVAiutBh3-Hwe2EAQYAiABEgLlC_D_BwE

[blazing pine]

I think you mean https://store.rakwireless.com/products/unify-enclosure-ip67-150x100x45mm-with-pre-mounted-m8-5-pin-and-rp-sma-antenna-ip-rated-connectors

[toxic kindle]

No

Earthquake sensor kit

[blazing pine]

earthquake sensor much useless on a tower

[toxic kindle]

Not tower

At people houses

Or special deployment to detect earthquakes

For the Bay Area that would be useful

[blazing pine]

...I think we already have enough of those, especially in California 😆

[toxic kindle]

But it’s cool

Since it’s Meshtastic St ic

[blazing pine]

fun to play with, but probably not very useful

[barren socket]

Ok thanks for confirming.

[blazing pine]

🫠

[finite pilot]

You can remove all the Anair nodes from your map, I moved and am using a Miramar variant for my nodes now-- currently just Miramar & Miramar Mobile.

[blazing pine]

i think i saw the Anair node when going up skyline blvd

[finite pilot]

Recently? Hmm... I did give a couple nodes with the Anair tag to some friends in the east bay, trying to get them involved. Didn't think they actually brought them online though

[blazing pine]

last year

[abstract yoke]

I saw some action on the longfast channel this morning!

[blazing pine]

shid fard coom?

[abstract yoke]

lol, yeah.

[blazing pine]

that was me on the road. I didn't get any acks

[blazing pine]

is your node on?

I have put a waypoint at the approximate location of where I SFC'd

[abstract yoke]

It is.

[blazing pine]

do you see?

Santa Clara Ave and Harrison st

[blazing pine]

nodeinfo changed <t:1709570208:R>

[abstract yoke]

Yes. It looks like you showed up two minutes ago.

[toxic kindle]

@remote vale @blazing pine I still need to work out a response

You guys were talking about USB extenders

[blazing pine]

mine too

[blazing pine]

respond with prototype 😆

[toxic kindle]

Did @remote vale say he had the stuff

[remote vale]

I have a few parts (box, RAK, N-ipex bulkhead). Need to order some other stuff. @sleek wraith offered an N antenna

I think so. It'll go somwhere

[blazing pine]

something something forgiveness something permission?

[remote vale]

Better to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission

[toxic kindle]

Wilcox high school to Cupertino link up

Temporary I must say

But will be up also Friday for Meshtastic demo

[blazing pine]

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/te-connectivity-linx/ANT-916-OC-LG-SMA/2651619 good for 906.875 in unbent position

[toxic kindle]

These antennas have been doing quite well for their size

Would want something small yet good if I were you upgrade it

[blazing pine]

the one i linked is much skinnier than pictured

[barren socket]

My view today during this test from a Cupertino hill (only 600ft up but was plenty) to Wilcox High School with @toxic kindle

[toxic kindle]

Nah I was just asking if it was possible for you to make a small prototype, of the power and data

[remote vale]

It's in process. gonna be a few weeks before all the parts get in

[blazing pine]

i was here. 0 nodes heard

[abstract yoke]

Yeah, my nodes don't go that far. I've done some testing and I get about .7-.8 mi if I'm at the right parts. There's way too many buildings for mine to get through.

[barren socket]

With what kind of device, antenna, and height if any?

[blazing pine]

i'm guessing dinky stock antenna 4 feet above floor indoors

behind concrete and rebar

[abstract yoke]

I have a heltec v3 with one of the bigger antennas I got off amazon and it's about 5 feet off the ground in my apt. In total about 15 ft off ground level.

[blazing pine]

you need to add at least 40ft to that

[abstract yoke]

yeah... that's going to be a challenge...

[toxic kindle]

@hollow inlet @topaz parcel

[topaz parcel]

Sup people! Didn’t know about this thank you @toxic kindle , I’m an Marine Vet in the East Bay & initially got into Meshtastic because I wanted to establish comms for my friends when we go to EDC Las Vegas this year at the Speedway. Lots of people are there over the three day period about half a million or so. So wanted to make sure we had reliable comms incase we get separated. Walkies and phones are unreliable there but I’ve heard others have used LoRa and had great success, very excited to use it

[toxic kindle]

If you are going to go with a group using Meshtastic it would be pretty reliable. Since the messages will have some people to bounce off of.

[timid turret]

@weary narwhal meet @toxic kindle ... @toxic kindle meet @weary narwhal

[weary narwhal]

Hey @toxic kindle , heard you might be interested in some sweet Heltec cases for an exhibition!!

[hollow inlet]

might be feasible to convince neighbors to set up solar-powered in their rooftops for emergency neighborhood communications. . I’d also like to have a portable usb powered when I’m out and about, and maybe neighbors would want to also

[toxic kindle]

Hi

[abstract yoke]

I use a T-Echo when I'm out and about, but I have a few heltecs for that as well. I haven't had to use them with friends yet, but it will be useful enough when we are going to bigger events this summer.

[weary narwhal]

Send me a pm and we can figure this out! @toxic kindle

[toxic kindle]

Sent

[toxic kindle]

Where?

When we had the big storm I had my Ham radio on the whole time

just listening to chatter

[blazing pine]

i have a leak detector (humidity sensor) in mine

[barren socket]

Curious what they look like?

[weary narwhal]

They will be based on my TerraNode case https://layerfabuk.etsy.com/listing/1674360182 but looking at doing some custom colors/ decals

[remote vale]

I was out in the Dublin area today. It was pouring! Stuff on the road started to float away.

[toxic kindle]

Buy a boat at that point

[blazing pine]

logged position packets from my outing today. the one from Lake Merritt was direct reception... wut in the 3-mile rf freak accident...

[barren socket]

Water skiing @remote vale ?

[blazing pine]

https://tenor.com/view/water-gif-6176588

[remote vale]

Don't tempt me!

[blazing pine]

I feel left out

[barren socket]

Is it true that anything bought directly from RAKWireless.com is going to have a 25% customs fee added when the shipment arrives here in the US? Plus shipping costs that stated on the rakwireless.com website.
That's what Rokland's website says. And anyone know how many weeks it really takes to get something from them start to finish?

[blazing pine]

only if you're a business-class big$ spender

as for shipping, it totally depends on the shipping method/$, and holidays

[barren socket]

A $300-$400 order from them wouldn't be charged customs then? Their website says 3 weeks for standard shipping so was wondering if that's what people actually experienced.

Oh I now see that the limit is $800/order

[blazing pine]

did not get my giant solar enclosure yet
it's still in china

solar panel may be a sticker, but it's a high quality sticker 😆

does yours cover the whole lid or only part of it?

I know on the smaller one you have to apply said sticker yourself

I see you've already poked a hole in it

mine will come with top and bottom hole

just a bit, I'm sure

what explosives are you packing into it?

hopefully not overkill LTOs?

#notabomb

where's your battery protection board 👀

those batteries like to die

yes

built-in ones don't work well, methinks

I have more than I need. you want one or two or three? 😆

indeed

overvoltage and undervoltage protection

indeed... I can't find link to 'em, but they're made by @humble valley

[humble valley]

I'll be listing more of them soon. Just need some photos.

Yep

[blazing pine]

I can give you a couple of you're able to pick 'em up 😆

[humble valley]

https://voltaicenclosures.etsy.com

[blazing pine]

mug city 🥲

[humble valley]

Many pouch batteries have built in protection modules (PCM)

[blazing pine]

much basura

[humble valley]

We were just discussing the differences between my PCM and many others on the market.

#solar-power message

[blazing pine]

your PCBs glow in the dark for a few seconds after being exposed to UV light

waterproofing

[toxic kindle]

Can you send a bill of materials for that

Planning on buying a ton of raks

Looks like theres a plug at the bottom

What is that?

[blazing pine]

a 5-pin. 2 for power and 3 for whatever you want

I discovered my cellphone camera sux

wire up usb

and last pin for reset

[toxic kindle]

Could you do power over that and solar?

[blazing pine]

definitely

yes. or microsoldering

[toxic kindle]

Will this fit on?
https://store.rakwireless.com/products/unify-pole-mounting-horizontal-kit-type-b-1

[blazing pine]

yes

I think them dingledongles are overpriced though ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[toxic kindle]

6 bucks

[blazing pine]

bent bit of metal works just as good

[toxic kindle]

I will take their entire stock

My friend @twilit flicker started nerding out with a diagram when I showed him the solar case

Idk what this is

[blazing pine]

the next xkcd

[barren socket]

Did you get the 150x100x45mm solar box directly from RAKWireless.com or elsewhere? I don't think Rokland has it in stock currently.

[blazing pine]

direct. https://store.rakwireless.com/products/unify-enclosure-ip67-150x100x45mm-with-pre-mounted-m8-5-pin-and-rp-sma-antenna-ip-rated-connectors?variant=42861623771334

I ordered Feb 20, it "shipped" Mar 04

[barren socket]

I see, the link is helpful. Why did you guys decide on the larger of the two (150mm vs 100mm one)? I was thinking that the smaller one's smaller solar panel would be enough for here in the sunny part of the bay (south bay area), but maybe there are other reasons??? Planning to install 1 18650, MAYBE two if there's spare space even in the smaller of the two boxes. Thoughts?

@sleek wraith @blazing pine

[barren socket]

BTW: planning to do some more Meshtastic testing tomorrow from the same Cupertino hill, Fri at 4pm for up to an hour. If you see Orange -3d00 online, pls say hi

[blazing pine]

I thought it was enough too... until the rain started

with the smaller enclosure a 18650 would be a very tight fit, if it even fits

San Bruno mountain node up <t:1709865211:R>

no wait maybe he just changed node name in preparation

I think I tried too but 18650 said nope

[toxic kindle]

How long does it last?

[barren socket]

Ok, bummer to hear that the smaller case is too small for even one and glad I asked. Larger one it is then. Thanks for confirming.

And yeah @blazing pine I think Oakland gets more rain/clouds than we do here. My understanding is that the Wisblock sips so little power that a single 18650 should suffice, as long as the panel produces enough power, here in the relatively sunny Valley (not so at higher elevation).

Clouds & fog add additional challenge with elevation.

[toxic kindle]

Will this one fit 18650?
https://store.rakwireless.com/products/unify-enclosure-ip67-150x100x45mm-with-pre-mounted-m8-5-pin-and-rp-sma-antenna-ip-rated-connectors?variant=42861623738566

[blazing pine]

it should fit at least two, from looking at it

ideally I would want 3 or 4 in it

might have to cut the mounting plate

[toxic kindle]

2 can last a long time

[blazing pine]

plus the panel should be big enough to charge even without needing to point it directly at the sun...

I have lots of batteries though, so why not? ¯_(ツ)_/¯

tip: hot-snot the wires on the solar panel

[toxic kindle]

Is that the bigger one that you have?

Same one I linked?

[toxic kindle]

Could you try seeing if a 18650 could fit?

[blazing pine]

your old laptop has a few

[pallid ice]

Hello guys - We are trying to get the Mesh going in Sacramento so come join the group
https://www.facebook.com/groups/783826653076339

[blazing pine]

possibly. removable battery?

[toxic kindle]

I think making a separate discord for Bay Area is kinda long overdue

https://discord.gg/NFVd8ssT88

[barren socket]

185 still available but going fast: https://store.rokland.com/products/rak-wireless-wisblock-meshtastic-starter-kit

[toxic kindle]

Will probably order from China as I need at least 5

Everyone please join the new discord
https://discord.gg/NFVd8ssT88

[barren socket]

yeah, I might need to place an order from China too for other accessories (antennas, enclosure, etc).

What's the diff with that channel vs this one?

[toxic kindle]

It’s a whole discord server do it enables us to have multiple channels, Voice channels and announcements just for the Bay Area

[toxic kindle]

Its working well for other Meshtastic groups so thought it might be better

[winter anchor]

@slender pelican @pallid ice , it took a while for my T-Beam's to get here, but I'm up and running. Aside from my 2 devices, I'm seeing "EDH Router" and "conode".

[pallid ice]

@winter anchor , that is fantastic. I am still waiting for some connectors to get one device up on a stick.
I am 400 ASL, and the device will be aroud 30 feet above that.
If you are not already a member, then please visit us local guys @ https://www.facebook.com/groups/783826653076339 group where we will try to make more local activities with like Node Maps for our area (not with around-here-GPS-locations) and stuff like that.

[toxic kindle]

I am in the official Meshtastic Facebook and I occasionally look at it to laugh at people asking dumb questions on it.

On Facebook is weird since if I post anything everyone sees my actual face

[blazing pine]

facecrook

[toxic kindle]

Us zoomers are on the cooler version (Instagram)

Your data is still stollen by the same company

[winter anchor]

I joined a bit earlier today. Will be interesting to see how the group takes off.

[placid kite]

went for a drive from Hayward to Dublin today - sadly still yet to find a node other than my own 😦

[barren socket]

Bummer. This is hopefully a sign of the future. Saw a surprisingly high qty of 19 nodes during the past 24hrs from here in cupertino with node just in my 2nd story window.

[toxic kindle]

Is your primary the default encryption?

[finite pilot]

Connected to part of the South bay mesh earlier today from Foster City via default channel! Either a serendipitous anomaly or someone set up a router node somewhere high up

[finite pilot]

What antenna are you using?

[placid kite]

yeah everything's the default for now still

[placid kite]

some SMA adapter to an antenna I got on amazon that probably sucks lol

[toxic kindle]

Try heading to a mountain

[placid kite]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CTXL61LY <- that one

[finite pilot]

Hmm... Hopefully it's at least on par with the stock antenna. I don't think Castro Valley has much of a mesh, and the LOS as you're ascending the hill on the way to Dublin would still be restricted by the nearby ridges. Cruise up 580 and take a drive up Skyline -- you'll get a great view and probably some more pings off nodes in Oakland

[blazing pine]

[finite pilot]

Notably absent: the ENT nodes near Oakland that were there last week

[placid kite]

I'll have to try that this week 🙂

[finite pilot]

You may also want to try a moxon antenna, if you have height but limited horizontal line of sight-- It's a directional antenna. I have used this one for a couple years now with decent results: https://www.amazon.com/FrSky-900MHz-Performance-Antenna-915MHz/dp/B07R1XDQH8/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?crid=36RI24STB325J&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.rQEyx4-_JPXR7GgpZ3sxaX7I4mPFADTUrPBpA4tqAW48XJMiW1Y7kVEoXu13f9gKwya1BT9CfiiXbBPRp1hn_w.6u1hIwn_p4sU6a-wNgktPm_ockHbMGEqIV1Oanygs8M&dib_tag=se&keywords=915+moxon&qid=1710128526&sprefix=915+moxon%2Caps%2C151&sr=8-4

[blazing pine]

and some random misc nodes

I'ma takin' a drive to Richmond tomorrow

[finite pilot]

Do the pins indicate repeater nodes that wouldn't show up on the map otherwise?

[blazing pine]

just random pins

[finite pilot]

😶‍🌫️

[blazing pine]

oh I missed one

[finite pilot]

Somehow I got a ping off that j2 node in the sunset as well as some of the SF nodes, despite no clear LOS and a couple mountains between us. Traceroute didn't show any output

[blazing pine]

probably bouncin' off other nodes

[finite pilot]

Certainly, but unlikely to be the ones that are sharing gps 🙂
I suspect an enterprising person has put one up on San Bruno Mountain

Maybe 9 days ago lmao

[blazing pine]

I don't think there's one on San Bruno Mtn yet

but... soon! hopefully!

[toxic kindle]

Open sauce 2024?

Oh

Those are waypoints

[finite pilot]

KN6CSG San Bruno Mtn must be it. Direct connection from Foster City per traceroute

[remote vale]

Funny, I've got a 6238 just 3.5 miles from me

[blazing pine]

don't you mean kn6plv?

(I don't think that node is actually on the mountain yet)

82c4 may be that hidden node though, if you can see it

[finite pilot]

Direct connection to this node; indirect connection to 82c4. Maybe different sides of the mtn?

[blazing pine]

I haven't seen that node for like 5 hours. definitely not on the mountain

[finite pilot]

🤔

[remote vale]

Something changed big down this way. Whoever has node Meshtastic 0f66 just opened up San Carlos and Northern Fremont

[blazing pine]

kn6csg lives right next to you, lol

[remote vale]

Hi kn6csg

[remote vale]

Not exactly, close......

[toxic kindle]

New repeaters?

[remote vale]

Got a satellite. Nothing more.

thanks to 0f66

[blazing pine]

I got telemetry from 0f66 but no nodeinfo yet. last heard <t:1710133786:R>

[remote vale]

Looks like a solar node. No location data and long dwell on broadcast

[blazing pine]

high hops too. at least 5.

[remote vale]

direct for me

[blazing pine]

how many hops are you seeing? 5?

[remote vale]

No hops. Kind of like my basketball game

[blazing pine]

I meant hops remaining on received packet

[remote vale]

Ah, don't have that level of detail. I'm a bit on the simple side there

[blazing pine]

I see...

you can always take a gander at the debug panel

teeeeeeee beam

[remote vale]

hop limit 6

[remote vale]

Thanks for the education

[blazing pine]

I've been thinking about making a little companion app/script to read the android Meshtastic app database and extract "hidden" info from it

[remote vale]

SNR -10, RSSI -98

[blazing pine]

look for another node with similar RSSI

[blazing pine]

did you get a traceroute through it? 👀

[remote vale]

Through it? No, Direct

[blazing pine]

ooh. fascinating

I had totally expected that to fail, having last heard from that node 5 hours ago

[remote vale]

Can't get a traceroute response though.

[blazing pine]

same here. last heard 27 hours ago

maybe switched to repeater mode ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[remote vale]

Wherever 0f66 is, maybe on a hillside west of San Jose, maybe Cupertino.

[toxic kindle]

Got a Ed fong J Polebup in my window with a node

Getting no one

[blazing pine]

what band(s) is that antenna for?

[toxic kindle]

I think it’s for VhF

It works since I was able to text another node in my house

[blazing pine]

trying to fry your radio?

[remote vale]

You can beat a baseball with a feather too, but doesn't work very well

[toxic kindle]

It’s really low power so I don’t think that would happen

[blazing pine]

I have heard of some unlucky people....

with sad nodes.

[toxic kindle]

Thinking of building out a solar node to donate to a Ham that lives right next to my house so he can put it on his vertical antenna

Prolly would also not reach anything

But at least I could talk to someone

[remote vale]

@barren socket , anyone of your group put up a node in the Cupertino Hills?

[remote vale]

I've got at least three people to talk with all the time.

Me, myself, and I 🙂

[remote vale]

Mucho nodes today

[toxic kindle]

You have my nodes on the list?

Oh

thats from mt umunhum

[remote vale]

Those were old hits

[toxic kindle]

Thats some nice coverage you are getting

I dont know whats going on in the Meshtastic bay area space as I am repeaterless

[finite pilot]

Lmao that would explain the great rssi and snr

[finite pilot]

U right, u right

[finite pilot]

Are you stuck in a valley or something?

[barren socket]

I wish, but not me. As of Sunday late afternoon, a node I had borrowed was able to see 19 ACTIVE nodes over a 24 hr period. Prior to then, it was around half of that, so something's happening.

A group of us here in the Cupertino area is about to take delivery of 13 Wisblock start kits soon. So hopefully the node count continues growing fast. Ordered from Rokland Friday morning and they're already here at the San Jose post office by Saturday night...whoa that's faster than what their website said. So hopefully will get into our hands just 1 or 2 business days after ordering!

[barren socket]

I wouldn't leave mine on a VHF antenna for very long. That may work for a while (very compromised too) but the high SWR will likely kill a node eventually.

If you really wanted to, contact Ed F about trimming his dual band j-pole for use at 906 MHz to get low enough of a SWR. He's in S'Vale and I've been to his place a few times, very nice/helpful guy. Don't want to see your gear get toasted.

[toxic kindle]

I disconnected it

I only had it on for like 30 min

[barren socket]

Phew, friends don't let friends fry their gear! Crisis averted. 😁

[toxic kindle]

I will now turn a paperclip into a Meshtastic antenna

[blazing pine]

I once did that for wifi

[toxic kindle]

@barren socket Rob just emailed me asking about Meshtastic devices

[blazing pine]

who is *88b6

oh hfidek richmond

pretty impressive range

also see a Coit Tower from here

no nodeinfo for any of them yet though ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine the San Bruno node right now is inside a building on the mountain

[blazing pine]

I not in Oakland though

oh wait, time to see if remote Meshtastic connection works

[toxic kindle]

Where are you 🤨

[blazing pine]

richmond

[toxic kindle]

@simple hedge

[blazing pine]

remote Meshtastic no worky

BUT can confirm that I don't see the node yet from oakland node

unless it's a new node that I don't have nodeinfo for...

[blazing pine]

i'm back home now. did anyone see any suspicious nodes?

[simple hedge]

Cool! I’m getting mine today

[toxic kindle]

Rob actually took interest

No

That’s another guy

[wide basalt]

does anyone have ham radio connections that could help us access a radio towers like sutro, bernal, or treasure island? or any in the East bay hills?

[toxic kindle]

Already working on setting up a repeater in the soutbay hills on a ham site

[remote vale]

@gish How about this for the mountain site I'm putting together?
https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/te-connectivity-laird/FG9020/2392195

[toxic kindle]

@sleek wraith

[remote vale]

@toxic kindle saw a RAK version that looks ok around 905Mhz

I'm sure someone else here may have some recommendations for a mountain tower site

https://store.rakwireless.com/products/3dbi-fiber-glass-antenna?variant=39723306123462

[barren socket]

A couple options here that seem reasonably priced. And in stock so just a few days. https://store.rokland.com/collections/all-helium-antennnas/products/8-dbi-omni-outdoor-915mhz-fiberglass-antenna-for-lora-halow-application

[remote vale]

Aiming for low db to service lower elevations closer to the mountain site.

Don't want to shoot over the top

[barren socket]

@sleek wraith aren't you Purple and near Reid Hill airport?

Purple always shows up on my nodes list (8 miles away!) so wondering what kind of antenna that has.

[remote vale]

It's a 5db Laird

That's my node

Purple like @blazing pine

[barren socket]

Oh ok, pretty good range

[remote vale]

Can you get a traceroute from it?

0f66 went bye bye sometime this morning 😦 My world got smaller again. Whoever had that up, great spot!

[barren socket]

No, traceroutes usually don't work for me usually. But they have before

[remote vale]

Hopefully with your new stuff that'll change

[barren socket]

Hopefully! 🙂

[finite pilot]

Qq-- when neighbor info is enabled on node n, do n[0] connected nodes see the node list, or do n[*] connected nodes see it?

[wide basalt]

would be great to get something on san bruno mountain to connect the city to the peninsula

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine Do you have mqtt on your home node?

[blazing pine]

[toxic kindle]

Thinking of making a mqtt discord bot type thing

(Not talking about the public mqtt)

[blazing pine]

bay area mesh stats?

[toxic kindle]

Yeah

And so the messages are exposed on the discord

[blazing pine]

hopefully one way only

just to confirm link quality

[abstract yoke]

I was able to test out the range while walking downtown Oakland today. I got about .7 miles from my home node through a lot of buildings.

[blazing pine]

I just noticed something. we can use chutil to see which nodes are in important locations

oooor maybe not

[toxic kindle]

Yep

[toxic kindle]

@sleek wraith how’s the solar box working?

[abstract yoke]

Finally, one of my nodes is on the list!

[blazing pine]

which one?

[abstract yoke]

Canard Echo - CNDE

[blazing pine]

it was direct reception too

... if you're on 3 hops

first heard <t:1709654898:R>, last heard <t:1710257018:R>

[blazing pine]

ah, caught you on the bay bridge

[abstract yoke]

Nice! I try to keep my t-echo with me when I go out and about.

[remote vale]

Someone must have turned on MQTT last night, just after midnight. I've got a bunch of nodes in my list with locations all over the US.

Looks like it's since been turned off

[toxic kindle]

Good

[blazing pine]

I've enabled mqtt uplink on a node. stuff should start appearing on http://meshmap.net after my skyrak boots up tomorrow \o/

[remote vale]

I see it down here. quite noisy

[blazing pine]

having a map is great for figuring out what you're not receiving so you can adjust antennas, etc.

wow, many people running old nodes. I see bugs

mainly things leaking from mqtt out to the air and then back into mqtt

[remote vale]

So you're the culprit

[blazing pine]

my first time with mqtt was just 20 minutes ago

I've enabled it on a node with very old firmware. hopefully nothing explodes

[remote vale]

Some increase in channel utilization, maybe 15% increase

[blazing pine]

I only have uplink enabled, not downlink

plus it's on its own topic

[remote vale]

I can't figure out where it's coming from

[blazing pine]

I don't think I can join any of the modern topics

[blazing pine]

grab yer yagi and go hunting

[remote vale]

They have yagis for MQTT?

[blazing pine]

for the ones that packets leak on air yeh

[remote vale]

Glad meshtastic has Ignore MQTT setting

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine can you enable JSON?

[blazing pine]

i did

[toxic kindle]

Is it on the node that can see everything?

[blazing pine]

it's on my logger node 👀

my skyrak is off until next sunrise

[toxic kindle]

If @remote vale gets mqtt his too I can make a entire Bay Area Meshtastic discord bot

[blazing pine]

ooh i'm not sure if this firmware version even has json mqtt support, LOL

[toxic kindle]

I can filter out duplicate messages

[blazing pine]

my logger node is on 2.1.15

[toxic kindle]

https://tenor.com/view/upgrades-robots-gif-21291099

[blazing pine]

that would mean spending hours unbreaking my logging script

i should start making a list of misbehaving nodes...

e2e590ac
fa9ff9c4
e2e5234c
e33bc510
e2e49390

[blazing pine]

trying to flash my t-beam, but it's not behaving with new firmware & wifi

[remote vale]

What a difference a good antenna makes. Finally got a small antenna for my mobile node. It was like a whole new world opened. Found a bunch of nodes in the Campbell area I've never seen before

[barren socket]

Nice. I hope that's the digikey one you linked me to?

[remote vale]

Yup

[barren socket]

Excellent bc I just ordered 3 of those an hour ago! 😅

[remote vale]

Ha

[barren socket]

And others are likely to get the same.

[toxic kindle]

The 70$ one?

[barren socket]

Under $10. https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/te-connectivity-linx/ANT-916-OC-LG-SMA/2651619?s=N4IgTCBcDaIIIDkAqBaAnARgGwoPIGEUAZAcRQGUBZOFBAERAF0BfIA

[blazing pine]

those are perfect for default channel when straight

use a 90 degree sma adapter if you must

[toxic kindle]

Does anyone see a Ki6zhd node?

[remote vale]

Thanks again for the recommendation

[remote vale]

Nothing down here

[barren socket]

Maybe someone needs to park in his S Clara neighborhood to chat with him before he thinks MT is dead! 😆 I would if I still had a working portable node. He's running on a single 18650 so unsure how many times he's willing to take it down to recharge his t beam.

[toxic kindle]

Going to be home in about 20 min

[barren socket]

My RAKs are battery and case less. Great @toxic kindle

[toxic kindle]

Use the box they came in 😉

[barren socket]

They came in a plastic pouch, if that's what you're calling a case. Maybe they used to include a box?

[blazing pine]

cardboard boxen

they're a bit flimsy though

the boxes that new cellphones come in are pretty sturdy.

[remote vale]

#enclosures-discussion message
@barren socket

[barren socket]

Yes they are. I can get ghetto but not THAT ghetto. 😂

If nobody connects with him, I'll see what I can hobble together but it can't be till tomorrow or Friday. And it'll involve a 8dbi antenna INSIDE of my car, warming me up,😅 that I just got from @remote vale .

No RF exposure there!

[remote vale]

It won't even make your fillings tingle. Way too low. Just don't think it's a candy cane and put it in your mouth 🙂

[warped charm]

Hey

[toxic kindle]

Hello

[blazing pine]

hallo

what brings you to this area of the bay?

[blazing pine]

my skyrak is back up. now just gotta wait for them nodeinfos to come in

6-9 hours and I should have some nodes up @ https://meshmap.net/

[toxic kindle]

Whats the public mqtt host url

I forgor

[blazing pine]

mqtt.meshtastic.org

meshdev / large4cats

[toxic kindle]

I think I found you

Using protobufs I think

msh/bayarea/2/c/LongFast/!fa74d32c

[blazing pine]

I think you did

[toxic kindle]

When I get time I will make a script to parse it, coudl you make it upload JSON?

[blazing pine]

no. node too old

[toxic kindle]

That may be an issue...

A little too much effort to decode the protobuffs

[blazing pine]

learn2plutoboof

[toxic kindle]

JSON easier

[blazing pine]

actually they're about the same

just that protobuf needs external stuff to decode correctly

[toxic kindle]

I prefer my formats human readable

[blazing pine]

not knowing why my traceroutes don't go through keeps me awake at night

got first SF node on map, yay

[barren socket]

Traceroutes fail 98% of the time for me. Argh. Same for others?

[blazing pine]

sounds like you need more height and/or bigger antenna

er, I mean... most of my traceroutes fail too

[blazing pine]

map updated for new firmware versions.... therefore there be json now! \o/ @toxic kindle

[toxic kindle]

Where in the mqtt is it?

Not seeing it at
msh/bayarea/2/

[blazing pine]

msh/US/bayarea/2/e/somewhere

[toxic kindle]

Getting node info now

In JSON

@blazing pine Try sending a message I want to see what that looks like

[blazing pine]

did you get it

[toxic kindle]

{
"channel": 0,
"from": 4145956836,
"hops_away": 0,
"id": 2183436553,
"payload": {
"text": "you know you want to..."
},
"sender": "!f71e47e4",
"timestamp": 1710435696,
"to": 4294967295,
"type": "text"
}

You know what you want to..

[blazing pine]

JMD

[toxic kindle]

I think I can get a basic message reporting system up but gathering all the node info in one place will require some more code

[blazing pine]

tip: protobufs.

[toxic kindle]

🙅‍♂️

[blazing pine]

it's universal across mqtt, Bluetooth, serial, and network

[blazing pine]

proto much buff

[remote vale]

Still lots of MQTT leakage down here. I took a look at the debug logs and nothing in there indicates the messages or data is coming in via MQTT. Any ideas how to figure out the source?

[toxic kindle]

Send them a meanly worded Letter when you find where it is coming from

[remote vale]

Only thing I can tell is it's at least one hop beyond my site

[blazing pine]

https://meshtastic.org/docs/configuration/radio/lora/#ignore-mqtt

but the ideal way to solve this is to go out hunting with a shotgun

[remote vale]

Yeah, it looks like the MQTT node is running an older firmware

[blazing pine]

what location are you at again?

[remote vale]

Purple, East San Jose

[blazing pine]

and you're seeing nodes from all over the US yeh?

[remote vale]

Yup

[blazing pine]

wow new york

the culprit is most likely 1c66b5d0

a t-beam

bring your shotgun

[remote vale]

Why you think?

[blazing pine]

there are two t-beams and a Heltec V3 at that house. 1 t-beam is connected to mqtt

[remote vale]

There's like 5 nodes around there

[blazing pine]

there are no others close enough that are connected to mqtt

[remote vale]

How tell connected to MQTT?

[blazing pine]

because it's "seen" by itself. or rather, it uploads its own nodeinfo

[remote vale]

Ah! Appreciate the education

[blazing pine]

now go for a drive and educate that t-beam owner on the definition of uplink and downlink

... or maybe just send a direct message to those 3 nodes

I'd do it for you through mqtt, but I lazy

[remote vale]

Already done

[toxic kindle]

Give me the address let me see if its a ham

[blazing pine]

it's right there in the screenshot

4798 Sutcliff ave

[remote vale]

Or maybe 4788 based on other GPS data I'm seeing

[blazing pine]

I assume all 3 nodes belong to same person

[remote vale]

I jumped to the same conclusion

[toxic kindle]

No Hams there

[blazing pine]

where do I get my own ham map? 😆

[toxic kindle]

https://haminfo.tetranz.com/map

[toxic kindle]

Find your local hams and knock om their door to solicit meshatstic

[blazing pine]

I'm scared

[toxic kindle]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-anakin-youngling-evil-plot-twist-gif-4830537

[remote vale]

Looks like MQTT problem is fixed. Thank you to whomever turned it off

[remote vale]

MQTT problem is back 😦

But ,much smaller in number this time

[blazing pine]

same culprit

[remote vale]

Also occurs if the MQTT node has an older firmware. I think below 2.2.19

[remote vale]

I'm thinking, if MQTT connections saturate the default channel, maybe need too start planning for a different channel or shared shared key?

[toxic kindle]

I think we should start creating educational material about Meshtastic for Bay Area Meshtastic users

Like a Mobile node settings setup guide

Or repeater mode settings setup guide

[remote vale]

The one thing you learn about people is you can provide everything needed and all information, but it won't be used.

Real issue here is what to do when a bad actor, intentional or accidental, floods the network and the entire mesh becomes an unintentional participant.

[blazing pine]

fcc to the rescue

[remote vale]

Maybe, if they take interest, if they have time, and if there isn't a disaster

[blazing pine]

if there are mqtt-connected nodes sprinkled all around the mesh it should be easy to find bad actors

[toxic kindle]

You reminded me I need to post a moonshot

A block list of nodes that your node will totally ignore and not forward

And this would be easily shared over the mesh and just using qr

So a person who is blocked will not disturb the network because no one will listen to them

[blazing pine]

and admin channel*

[toxic kindle]

What I mean is that there should be a button that says “Request to share block list” and it would send a request

And if it is a approved that node would send all the blocked users over the the node that accepted

[blazing pine]

better to block from the nodes that are 0 hops away from offender

[remote vale]

However, in the case of a node running less than 2.2.19, it doesn't look like the MQTT node sends anything identifying itself, rather only the node ID from MQTT. I'm not looking at raw data from 0 hop, but it looks like this is the case

[simple hedge]

I see Purple from Cupertino

[blazing pine]

are you b5d0

[simple hedge]

E4AF

[remote vale]

I don't see you 😦

[blazing pine]

I thought that was "I don quixote"

[remote vale]

hahah..... No that was, my finger slipped

No windmills involved

[blazing pine]

that's what they all say

https://tenor.com/view/marc-hudson-dragonforce-razorblade-meltdown-windmill-windmill-cancer-gif-15500870

[blazing pine]

what's it say

[blazing pine]

fascinating

384f4687,Pink,Pink,0,-66,5.75,0xfc,,,,,1710149512,1710171104,,,,,1710149512,1710149512

first and last seen <t:1710149512:R> and <t:1710171104:R>

oooh they're not on primary channel

0xfc instead of 0x0 or 0xa (unencrypted)

[remote vale]

That was me. I was out that way

I saw the same

It showed you sent it

1904 hrs

at 1848, that was me sending "Hello Back"

[blazing pine]

are you on any other channels?

I see...

[remote vale]

I take that back. Yes. LongFast is secondary on the node I received it on

[blazing pine]

is that an invitation for me to crack it?

[remote vale]

I'm going to back down a version. I didn't see this before.

Here's an interesting twist. My portable node is complaining about the nodeDB being full. It's erasing oldest entries

Stupid MQTT

[blazing pine]

you can hide gps from selected channels in newer firmwares

[toxic kindle]

How do you crack the encryption?

[blazing pine]

mostly magic. even I don't know [yet]

I still have gigabytes of irc chat logs from 1997+ that I had kept to train my future AI system with

gigabytes after compression.

[toxic kindle]

You may need a quantum computer

[blazing pine]

I may just be able to get one before I croak

I can give you some usb-c breakout boards. they're still coming to me via slow boat

do you have any of them usb-a to usb-c adapter dongle things?

(not the otg ones, but the ones for connecting a usb-c cable to computer or old charger)

plug in and multimeter away xD

indeed

[remote vale]

That's what I ended up doing

I already toasted one board getting in wrong. Too easy to do again by guessing

[blazing pine]

reminds me of the guy who caused a Google maps traffic jam by carting a bunch of phones down a street

[remote vale]

Looks like MQTT finally got turned off

[remote vale]

@sleek wraith Hold off any antenna buy. Looks like might need to get a directional per tower site.

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine Someone made a really nice looking map. Its using node info from mqtt nodes to populate it. So I can see bay area nodes that are not even connected to mqtt
https://meshtastic.liamcottle.net/

[blazing pine]

almost like meshmap.net 😆

[toxic kindle]

yep

but a nicer ui

Just sharing bc your mqtt connection is helping populate it

[blazing pine]

[toxic kindle]

We will be doing some Meshtastic testing across the bay around 1 or 2 pm today. @barren socket has a bit more details in that.

[barren socket]

Thanks @toxic kindle
Time now set for 2pm today. A handful of us here in the south bay will be getting on then for some testing on LongFast. Anyone else can try getting on then?

I'll drive to a small hill (200-300 ft elevation about our valley floor) to see how much of the mesh we can connect. Some of the hams trying to help us get a node on Blk Mtn will also be on LongFast then.

possibly has to be at 1pm instead. Who'd be able to make it at either or both times? 1 or 2pm

[barren socket]

@blazing pine did you by chance see a node called Jim Mobile yesterday? He was in the Oakland area and saw a bunch while there.

[blazing pine]

currently wrestling with Bluetooth trying to connect to my node 🫠

[blazing pine]

nope I no see

[barren socket]

Ok, thanks for checking @blazing pine

jfyi, I change my longname to West Cupertino base (shortname = WCb) for today's hilltop test

[slim vector]

I wonder if this is me you’re seeing. Do you own EDHR?

I’m f2b8. I never got this message.

I’ve only heard back from two nodes. I’m in Pine Grove. I have a view of the valley and can see Mt. Diablo and the surrounding area. So far I’ve heard from 7ed8 in Elk Grove and f6ea (location unknown). But we only got a couple messages through. I see the nodes in edh but haven’t heard from them. Any antenna suggestions on how I can help link everyone up with a repeater?

[toxic kindle]

Heading off to my local park now to launch a Meshtastic drone

[barren socket]

Ok we're active in LongFast

[blazing pine]

who is 82c4? 👀

Welcome Benjamin

[toxic kindle]

That’s me

DRONE IS UP!!!

[barren socket]

I sent welcome Benjamin on longfast channel

[blazing pine]

now you just gotta fly for 15 minutes so i can grab me some nodeinfos lol

[toxic kindle]

You don’t see me lol

[blazing pine]

hops -> 7

just for today, lol

[toxic kindle]

Set hops to 5

@blazing pine you getting it?

[blazing pine]

nope. i in deadzone

but on a positive note, my node has charged to 61% yesterday, and now it's 62%!

maybe one day it'll hit 90%

hopefully before winter comes again

[blazing pine]

trying to find location via photo but failing

[toxic kindle]

Landed

[blazing pine]

i matched up the mountains but can't pinpoint the location photo was taken. derp

[blazing pine]

lol lil stubby

[blazing pine]

WCb

it used up all hops just to get to my skyrak. didn't even make it to my logger/mqtt nodes

[toxic kindle]

This is why the mountain repeater is needed

We can technically reach across the entire bay but it will take too many hops

[blazing pine]

indeed

[turbid viper]

Hi, I’m e96a. Not sure where I ended up reaching, but definitely not to my stationary node

[slim vector]

I don’t know who sent it, but I’m f2b8. And here I thought no one could hear me. Did that persons node show up on your map? Wondering how far I’m reaching from Pine Grove.

[remote vale]

I saw a whole bunch of Cupertino claiming nodes from the Berryessa area today

[remote vale]

Looks like you ended up connecting through MQTT. You showed up in the San Jose area but I didn't get any node info

[turbid viper]

I'm in the Berryessa area and was driving around Campbell today

[remote vale]

@turbid viper Node "JSON" Jason?

[turbid viper]

Yup

[remote vale]

Last saw you in the Berryessa area around 1200 today. Don't see you in ESSJ though

[turbid viper]

Makes sense, I'm only able to broadcast out of a 2nd story window

[remote vale]

Ah. I've been surprised what I can see once I got a good antenna. I can send and receive from the LG Hills, indoors now.

[turbid viper]

I can definitely see nodes all the way in LG, but guess my antenna is too weak to reach my home node when I'm in that area

[remote vale]

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/te-connectivity-linx/ANT-916-OC-LG-SMA/2651619?s=N4IgTCBcDaIIIDkAqBaAnARgGwoPIGEUAZAcRQGUBZOFBAERAF0BfIA

[turbid viper]

I'm using a TX915-JKD-20 from aliexpress

I'm using a private primary, but do have the default as a secondary. Does that limit what nodes I can pass though?

[blazing pine]

yes, but only a little

[barren socket]

That may have been us testing from a 600ft hill and a few of us got on from 1-3pm today. Using the antenna I got from you @remote vale !

And now, it's mounted on its permanent spot on top of my roof! Node name is TK Base.

Initial single report is that the rx/tx RSSI increased by 10 dbs

[toxic kindle]

I was on too

I saw prpl in my list

I think it came through the drone

[remote vale]

Bummer, can't see it down this way

[barren socket]

Yeah @toxic kindle had his drone with a node on it hovering at 400ft!

Next time you might want to try strapping it to the bottom side of the drive so that the stubby is pointing down.

*drone

[toxic kindle]

I want to fly a node across the bay in something like this

[remote vale]

hahaha

[toxic kindle]

Just have to fly near the mountains as most of the bay is a minefield of airports

[barren socket]

I just tried sending Purple a DM and I got an explicit ack. Did you get it? @remote vale

It's never given me an explicit before

[remote vale]

Weird, no.

[barren socket]

😔

[remote vale]

Try again

[barren socket]

So close

[remote vale]

ID ends in b1d3?

[blazing pine]

what is a 848ab1d3

[remote vale]

It's a weirdo

[barren socket]

Resent

[blazing pine]

lots of resentment here

[remote vale]

Got it. Sent two replies but got only implicit ACK

[blazing pine]

send me one too!

[remote vale]

I send you good wishes 🙂

[blazing pine]

what's the last 4 of your nodeid again?

[remote vale]

You had it, 848ab1d3

[blazing pine]

i got position and telemetry for that node, but never received nodeinfo 🫠

[remote vale]

Just a little too far...... well, a way too far maybe

[toxic kindle]

The first time I sent that drone up I didn’t get any nodes because I had renamed my primary channel

I didn’t realize the frequency changes

[blazing pine]

i told people to enable neighbor info

https://meshtastic.liamcottle.net/ now there's a few blue lines if you enable the display

[abstract yoke]

Ah, I don't know if I have that turned on or not.

[remote vale]

DOH!

[blazing pine]

NFMT2FAA

[remote vale]

I was able to traceroute those when 0f66 was up

[toxic kindle]

Are we going to catch up?

[barren socket]

No, we'll likely surpass them one day.

[blazing pine]

there are still quite a few not on the map yet

[toxic kindle]

Wow

Your node has amazing los

[blazing pine]

no, my neighbor on the hills has amazing los

[toxic kindle]

Tell him to enable uplink

[blazing pine]

1300ft vs 180ft agl

[toxic kindle]

I think having uplink on a lot of nodes will help visiualize the whole mesh

[blazing pine]

I've told him about discord weeks ago 👀

[barren socket]

What are the pros and cons of enabling uplink?

not sure why he wouldn't have it enabled already

[blazing pine]

con: wifi, battery consumption, heat

oh nice, waypoint support

[ashen wadi]

Android vs Apple? I'm playing with both and the UI is considerably different. What's everybody using?

[blazing pine]

android! web!

Linux!

[ashen wadi]

I much prefer Android but the iPhone app seems much better

[toxic kindle]

Use use the iOS one but I would prefer the android one if you have multiple devices you want to switch between

[barren socket]

Totally agree!

[simple hedge]

The WisBlock one doesn't even have Wifi 🙂

[simple hedge]

Is this just a CSV export of the JSON output from meshtastic --nodes?

[simple hedge]

Better yet, the JSON is from meshtastic --info

[blazing pine]

this be stuff pieced together from the debug output... with a huge chungus bash script

[simple hedge]

how are you getting the debug output? also via the meshtastic CLI?

[blazing pine]

direct physical serial connection

[simple hedge]

ACK.

[blazing pine]

but it's a node with a dinky antenna in the basement, so it depends on rak in the sky to repeat packets to it

[simple hedge]

I think I'm just going to write a short Python script to parse the JSON

and the colored CSV fields? is that some text editor extension? I've mostly been a terminal "animal" 🙂

[blazing pine]

you know cat and tac

this be bat

do not python when bash and jq will do just as well with a fraction of the time and resources

[simple hedge]

de gustibus!

[simple hedge]

There's probably more info in there than in the JSON exported by meshtastic --info. One of them is hoplimit, which is missing in my output

so it's probably wiser to go your way

[blazing pine]

there's also nodes on mystery channels

also, telemetry logging, position logging...

and I started on a feature but never bothered to continue working on it: detecting whether or not a node has a client connected to it

plus packet loss estimates

ideally I would write my own firmware to log and decode raw packets...

but I too computer illiterate

[abstract yoke]

I see my t-echo on there!

[blazing pine]

I find this traceroute interesting, considering OHR is my mesh neighbor...

I have very few neighbors

[simple hedge]

why would that happen? your node doesn't have OHR in the cache?

[blazing pine]

probably collisions

[simple hedge]

... also, which nodes can sent the implicit ACKs? only the ones which have the node in their discovered list, or ANY node that gets the message can send back the ACK?

[blazing pine]

any node that repeats the packet

and is heard by the sending node

[simple hedge]

All this distributed headless architecture is a bit confusing to me

I've been working in IP for many years, and the problem there is solved with dynamic routing, not best-effort "let me try to deliver this to everyone near me"

[blazing pine]

implicit means your node heard its packet get repeated. therefore it has been received by at least 1 other node

derp

[simple hedge]

it would have been nice (but probably too CPU and memory intensive) to have some protocol for dynamic routing 😄

[blazing pine]

that is in the works

[toxic kindle]

Meshtastic 3.0

[blazing pine]

so far that's the only new thing in 3.0. LOL

[simple hedge]

I thought only one node sends the ACK (the router, or the one which is furthest away). Does it mean that everyone is still repeating, or just the one sending the ACK for the first hop in your diagram?

[blazing pine]

there is no ack

[simple hedge]

are there any pointers to some design doc describing how this routing protocol will work?

[blazing pine]

neighborinfo

it works through hopes and prayers, and when that fails it falls back to dumb flood routing

[simple hedge]

it's gotta be more than that 🙂

[blazing pine]

( I too computer illiterate to understand this stuff)

[simple hedge]

if you have any links to where I could read more about the plans for this dynamic protocol in Meshtastic 3.0, please share. Thanks!

[blazing pine]

https://github.com/meshtastic/firmware/pull/2856

[simple hedge]

https://meshtastic.org/docs/overview/mesh-algo/ -> this says that there is an ACK packet (as a response): "This packet is being sent as a reliable message, we would prefer it to arrive at the destination. We would like to receive an ACK packet in response.". Are you saying this is just the same packet repeated back? That wouldn't be very efficient, especially for long messages, when the ACK could be tiny.

[blazing pine]

only for targeted packets, and only if the packet reaches its target

and if source node hears another node repeating its packet, it's an implicit ack

[simple hedge]

thanks! I think that's clearer for me now 🙂

[blazing pine]

big problem in this mesh: the sender node is getting collisions from 3 nearby nodes repeating at the same time and will probably never get an implicit ack

which seems to be exactly what's happening to me at times

[simple hedge]

I thought that the nodes wait a random interval before ACKing, exactly to prevent collisions

[blazing pine]

BUT when I get that slashed cloud icon I know my message has a good chance of being received because it will have retried 2 more times.

[simple hedge]

The description ion this library file is the TL;DR for the NextHopRouter feature: https://github.com/meshtastic/firmware/blob/NextHopRouter/src/mesh/NextHopRouter.h

[blazing pine]

sometimes that interval is not long enough

the interval is only there to prevent collisions with nodes it can hear

[simple hedge]

In similar cases I'd collect as much information as possible and try to document it in a problem report. But my experience here is VERY limited

[blazing pine]

for nodes it cannot hear, I think there's like 90%+ chance of collision

[blazing pine]

it's a known problem

[simple hedge]

isn't it more of a limitation of the technology? lots of nodes with low power and no line of sight having partial reachability to each other

[blazing pine]

therefore sometimes it's easier to get an ack from a node 1 hop away than to get an ack from your neighbor

[simple hedge]

It's the same problem in AX.25 packet radio which is on simplex

[blazing pine]

do you do ham radio?

[simple hedge]

Yes, I'm doing HAM radio and EmComm for Cupertino too.

[blazing pine]

radio nets have controllers. Meshtastic does not.

[simple hedge]

also member of PAARA

the packet radio does not have controllers

[blazing pine]

indeed

[simple hedge]

it's called the "hidden node"

https://www.scc-ares-races.org/operations/simplex-hidden-node.html

[blazing pine]

yep! same name here

[simple hedge]

one more question and I might abuse your kindness: does the ACK from the destination station travel back in the reverse order through the same nodes through the initial message was sent?

or there's nothing like that?

[blazing pine]

different nodes, until 3.0

[simple hedge]

ACK. I am really looking forward to 3.0 then!

[blazing pine]

or uh, same flood routing

last year I found a gnarly mesh-killing bug... but when that was fixed it actually made the mesh less reliable 🫠

so therefore I made my very first contribution to attempt to underp what I derp'd. derp.

I became computer literate for that one day.

[simple hedge]

do you know how easy it is to build a custom build based on this branch?

[blazing pine]

as easy as opening a pull request and letting the system do all the work, after approval

(no clue)

[simple hedge]

With so many boards that can run Meshtastic, I'd only be interested in modifying and booting a version for my board

[blazing pine]

I think it'll build it all anyways, lol

and spit out a fat load of binaries

[simple hedge]

you're right

trying to build just for my rak4631

the beauty of open source!

[toxic kindle]

@simple hedge you should have stayed after the net as me and rob were talking about Meshtastic devices and antenna selection

[blazing pine]

#help message here have some entertaining reading stuff

[simple hedge]

Missed that

Just built an image for my hardware from the master branch:

Building .pio/build/rak4631_eink/firmware.zip
Zip created at .pio/build/rak4631_eink/firmware.zip
================================================= [SUCCESS] Took 48.74 seconds =================================================

Environment Status Duration

---

rak4631_eink SUCCESS 00:00:48.743
================================================== 1 succeeded in 00:00:48.743 ==================================================

I'll probably dry run the Next Hop-based routing one of these days

[simple hedge]

I dropped after the net ended 😦

[toxic kindle]

I was going to drop but Rob called my name

[blazing pine]

@toxic kindle what ever happent to San Bruno Mtn? 👀

[toxic kindle]

Still going

Switched over to dms with lora short to stop crowding this

[simple hedge]

I checked out the NextHopRouter git branch, but build fails. Rebuilding from the master branch works fine.

[blazing pine]

nexthope 😆

[simple hedge]

I'll put this on the backburner for now, but I'm impressed by how easy it was to built it!

[blazing pine]

still voodoo for me

[simple hedge]

If you are interested in setting this up on your laptop, I can definitely help. Might work on any OS: Linux, Windows, MacOS: https://meshtastic.org/docs/development/firmware/build/

I've installed it on my Mac

[blazing pine]

my laptops are all arm

[simple hedge]

so is mine, but it's the M1 Apple ARM :))

what OS are you running on it?

[blazing pine]

archlinux is all I know

[simple hedge]

cool. it works just fine

[blazing pine]

[simple hedge]

You just need the VS Code editor + some plugins

and the rest is self-contained in VS Code

[blazing pine]

that... sounds bloaty

reminds me of the 1gb mqtt explorer

[simple hedge]

you should be happy that it's so simple to build on your laptop

[blazing pine]

what happened to the days when a 4gb ssd was more than enough

[simple hedge]

I agree it's not just one statically linked binary (GCC) doing the job, but it's a complex toolchain

You can also run this in a VM in the cloud if it's more convenient, but you need to pay for the VM

or you can run it on some raspberry pi 😛

which is probably what you have?

[blazing pine]

the last time I tried that I got charged over $400

I have a 5 x pi4 cluster

[simple hedge]

I got one recently - blazing fast compared to the 10 year old one I had

I gotta go to bed. talk to you latter!

[blazing pine]

oker dokers. gute nacht!

pi cluster was a bit disappointing, but it was educational and at least usable...

main pi runs archlinux, and all the rest network boot off of it

pros: upgrade one, upgrade all!

cons: break one, break all

[toxic kindle]

Can it run doom?

[blazing pine]

k8s itself would already use like 20% of pi4 processing power

overkill nut server

[toxic kindle]

Can it run doom is a meme where you try to get every single thing that has a processor and a screen to run the 1993 doom. For example they made a pregnancy test run doom.

[blazing pine]

I butchered a case for poe and rtc

[toxic kindle]

I actually played doom even though it came 14 years before I was born

Got stuck on the last level

[blazing pine]

I never played doom

[remote vale]

That's Black Mtn. What about the gent who had something on San Bruno?

[remote vale]

Best custom case yet

#enclosures-discussion message

[toxic kindle]

Black mtn lego case?

[toxic kindle]

He said he puts a node inside a building on San Bruno mtn bc he hasn’t been able to climb it yet

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine Where did the mqtt go?

I can only find the status not where the payloads are uploaded

wait I found it msh/US/bayarea/2/json/LongFast/!f71e47e4

[remote vale]

New test node up today, pewter. about 24ft AGL, 9db antenna

[barren socket]

I see it @remote vale here in west cupertino. Slightly stronger RSSI than your purple by a couple of dbs. I sent you a test DM.

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine which node should I pull JSON data from for the bot, f71e or fa74?

[blazing pine]

I assume only 47e4 has json data?

[toxic kindle]

@blazing pine I got my script working and for some reason after leaving it on I only got one node info

A ton of neigbor info

and telem

but almost no node info

[blazing pine]

that's normal, I think

wait 3 more hours

[toxic kindle]

Let me run it again and you send a message

Its running

[blazing pine]

what should I send

[toxic kindle]

{
"channel": 0,
"from": 1042059157,
"id": 3909175689,
"payload": {
"text": "d\u0000\u0000rp"
},
"rssi": -36,
"sender": "!f71e47e4",
"snr": 6.5,
"timestamp": 1710872425,
"to": 4294967295,
"type": "text"
}

Is this correct?

[blazing pine]

dürp

[toxic kindle]

d\u0000\u0000rp

how

[blazing pine]

let me see...

[lost cape]

!3e1c8f95

!ffffffff

[toxic kindle]

hmm

[toxic kindle]

What is Sender?

Is it the one who sent it

or is 3e1c the one who sent?

[blazing pine]

8f95 sent it

[lost cape]

!ffffffff

[blazing pine]

47e4 sent to mqtt I think

[toxic kindle]

Where does it say that?

[toxic kindle]

{
"channel": 0,
"from": 1042059157,
"id": 3909175689,
"payload": {
"text": "d\u0000\u0000rp"
},
"rssi": -36,
"sender": "!f71e47e4",
"snr": 6.5,
"timestamp": 1710872425,
"to": 4294967295,
"type": "text"
}

It says here that "sender": "!f71e47e4",

[blazing pine]

probably sender to mqtt

[toxic kindle]

Yeah

[blazing pine]

look at from line

[toxic kindle]

Cause im following the topic for f71e47e4

Is that your node?

[lost cape]

!3e1c8f95

[toxic kindle]

Oh

I see

[blazing pine]

1042059157 = 0x3E1C8F95

[toxic kindle]

Planning on for now announcing when a message is sent

And also cahcing node info to find out the name of who sent it to display

if there isnt node info prior to the message it will just send the hex

[blazing pine]

make a way to import a nodedb

[toxic kindle]

Can node db be exported?

[blazing pine]

nope

[toxic kindle]

My solution would be to just write to a JSON file that’s saved

In the bot

It would make its own node info

[blazing pine]

here, have mine

you may need to remove one or two bugged lines 😂

0x95 is an interesting one

sort and color be like sort -t, -k 13r -r nodes.csv | bat -lcsv --color=always | less -SR

[toxic kindle]

Looking at making this more universal so json generator it is

So it will be a two in one

DB generator and discord bot

[blazing pine]

Discord Bot generator

[remote vale]

Sounds like a room at a night club

[toxic kindle]

I called it the DiscordMeshLogger

[blazing pine]

let's make a morse code chat app and call it DiscoR2D2

[simple hedge]

I was also able to traceroute to it via TK Base.

And after a few "resend" attempts (after getting implicit ACKs), I got it across - and you also answered just now 🙂

[toxic kindle]

@timid turret you getting a solar roof node?

[timid turret]

Replacing the old one.

[toxic kindle]

Glad to see you will be rejoining the network

[timid turret]

It is the project after I finish the bathroom remodel

[remote vale]

That's a heck of a place to put a solar node 🙂

[timid turret]

It is a part of a bigger project for the community area network I posted