Max's Two Cents (Programming Layout) | CharaChorder | Page 1

hollow cypress Jan 30, 2023, 6:43 PM

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This layout is intended to do a lot of things better for me and I've undergone a good-enough number of iterations to justify sharing for feedback.

NOTE: This is tuned best for a Mac

Here are some of the things I think are better for me with this layout:

V1 Updates (Pictured below):

Easier and more intuitive access to most symbols, especially those I use more often (check out the fn layer)
Ambi and easier-to-press DUP keys so I can dupe things like the ff in affection without breaking my thumb as well as to more easily use DUP while cording
I never use Delete so I added another Numshift for easier ctrl+2 type hotkeys (see: taking screenshots)
Some arpeggiate modifiers moved to the left arrow key stick
Easier to press ctrl-cmd-x and shift-ctrl-cmd-x hotkeys
Shift on the outside is better for TYPING IN ALL CAPS
Check out the new bracket layout (){}[]<>
All ability to chord and use num layer is intact 🎉

V2 Updates (Pictured here: #1069689384972058645 message)

Introduces a lot more consistency between Fn and Num layers for less juggling of modifiers
Adds all numbers to the Alpha layer
Makes characters I use a lot even closer to my fingertips (see: swapping :and ;)

V3 Updates (Pictured here: #1069689384972058645 message)

Settles a few more symbols I use a lot into the Alpha layer
Puts numbers back into the "easiest to press" stick positions and tries to spread them across fingers rather than bunch them up so they can be typed faster

PLEASE let me know if you have feedback or thoughts on how to improve this!

You can access all three versions here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1N4YdEHU-k82wvZxDakb6JhSrjI4iE-7-
☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️

hollow cypress Jan 30, 2023, 7:02 PM

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I’m waiting to adopt switching the mouse sticks to page down/up, home, and end until I check out the promised features for making the mouse sticks better

celest groveBOT Jan 30, 2023, 7:02 PM

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GG @hollow cypress, you just advanced to level 8!

shadow crow Jan 30, 2023, 7:13 PM

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There are some really interesting ideas here! I love that ypu moved the dup key. I may have to do that myself and relearn the chords using dup.

I also love the idea of replacing delete with something else to make that all easier. I'll have to think about that as well!.

I'd love to hit ctrl, cmd, alt, numshif and a number all on one hand and any combo. Because you're right things like screnshots are rough atm.

Love the thought that went into this!

hollow cypress Jan 30, 2023, 7:15 PM

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Thank you! I’ll also add I’ve done a bit of modding to my sticks with skateboard tape and pads for those curious

shadow crow Jan 30, 2023, 10:44 PM

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How's it working out for you?

hollow cypress Jan 31, 2023, 1:22 AM

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It's a necessity for me to have the tape on my thumb sticks in order to be able to hit all the directions with the different parts of my thumb... not sure if it's my anatomy or what but my fingers slip all around otherwise!

The tape on the "inner" sticks is more for convenience

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I use them like this

warm valve Jan 31, 2023, 2:03 AM

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I like this layout a lot! thanks for sharing!

hollow cypress Jan 31, 2023, 3:09 AM

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Awe thanks!

crystal dune Feb 15, 2023, 10:22 AM

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anychance of getting this shared again? the file access is either denied or doesn't exist anymore!

hollow cypress Feb 15, 2023, 2:03 PM

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@crystal dune I actually have changed my setup a good amount and don't have the original file but I can click here to see the full thing

crystal dune Feb 15, 2023, 2:10 PM

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Thanks but yeah cant

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<?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'?><Error><Code>AccessDenied</Code><Message>Access denied.</Message><Details>Anonymous caller does not have storage.objects.get access to the Google Cloud Storage object. Permission 'storage.objects.get' denied on resource (or it may not exist).</Details></Error>

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File doesn’t work that’s why was asking 🙂

hollow cypress Feb 15, 2023, 2:36 PM

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You clicked “view whole file”? Not “download”?

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That’s odd but I can do it and repost

crystal dune Feb 15, 2023, 2:43 PM

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celest groveBOT Feb 15, 2023, 2:43 PM

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GG @crystal dune, you just advanced to level 1!

crystal dune Feb 15, 2023, 2:43 PM

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yeah even in the preview

hollow cypress Feb 15, 2023, 2:43 PM

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📎 message.txt

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Try that? I think I got it all

crystal dune Feb 15, 2023, 2:44 PM

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awesome thanks!

hollow cypress Feb 15, 2023, 2:44 PM

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Np ❤️

hollow cypress Feb 15, 2023, 7:14 PM

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For those curious here's my V2 that:

Introduces a lot more consistency between Fn and Num layers for less juggling of modifiers
Adds all numbers to the Alpha layer
Makes characters I use a lot even closer to my fingertips (see: swapping : and ;)

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/16-DcZvsdUFffZ_a4xG8mkXSSeYRNiLqs?usp=share_link

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warm valve Mar 11, 2023, 9:34 PM

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I really like this layout! thanks for sharing!

hollow cypress Mar 16, 2023, 2:31 PM

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Here's my V3 that:

Settles a few more symbols I use a lot into the Alpha layer
Puts numbers back into the "easiest to press" stick positions and tries to spread them across fingers rather than bunch them up so they can be typed faster - I realized I hated shifting my hand down to the secondary sticks for numbers, especially when I'm typing numbers and symbols close together

This version so far has resisted further modification by me - I think I'm getting close to a final layout thankfully!

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1yB0l1dwaI7zMkF3314KZtheCTz-GhbOj

grave roost Mar 19, 2023, 11:05 AM

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hollow cypress I’m waiting to adopt switching the mouse sticks to page down/up, home, and end u...

Looks like you ended up dropping the mouse completely in the end?

hollow cypress Mar 19, 2023, 12:36 PM

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Yeah I just don’t use it… the middle sticks aren’t used much though so you could add them back in petty easily!
I’m also probably going to move away from arpeggiate modifiers to compound chords when they become available

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Unless the arpeggiate modifiers become remappable and customizable in which case they’d be like special one-key compound chords that have a lot of sane defaults

naive trench May 6, 2023, 1:12 PM

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I'm new to the CharaCorder, I ordered it yesterday 5/5/23. It's my understanding that an optimized keyboard layout tries to not use the same finger for the next letter: like T and H are not the same finger on Colemak and Dvorak for English, where it's very common to type T then H. But, this is the OPPOSITE for the Characorder, because the concept of ROLLING is very efficient. So we want letters that are often paired to be on the same button.

I wonder if we took large sample sizes of popular programming languages, used some rules like keypairs should be on the same button for rolling and ran them through multiple iterations if we could find an optimal programmer layout/order.

I got this idea from this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOaPb9wrgDY

YouTube

adumb

Using AI to Create the Perfect Keyboard

Try the keyboards for yourself: https://adumb-codes.github.io

Code for all my videos is available on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/adumb_codes

In this video I use a genetic algorithm to create a keyboard layout optimized for decreasing the distance the fingers have to travel when typing.

Resources used:

arXiv.org dataset: https://www.kag...

▶ Play video

hollow cypress May 8, 2023, 12:39 PM

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I’m not sure where the idea that “rolling” is the most efficient way to type came from - I would disagree with that characterization and say instead we want to optimize for two principles:

That our strongest fingers are pressing the most frequently used keys in the “easiest to press” directions - e.g your pointer finger switch traveling south is way easier than your ring finger traveling west

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That letters in most commonly used words should be on separate sticks entirely. No "rolling" with one finger will ever beat using two fingers to rapidly press keys one after the other because the sticks take time to press in a given direction and you can press each finger at nearly the same time in rapid succussion (as opposed to "rolling" where the stick has to travel to position 1 and then position 2 serially). This principle is also super important for being able to create chords with letters commonly used together since you can only chord one letter on each stick

naive trench May 8, 2023, 6:22 PM

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hollow cypress I’m not sure where the idea that “rolling” is the most efficient way to type cam...

Rolling on The One looks very efficient(didn't write MOST).

If it's true that using different fingers is better, than basing the layout on a concept behind Workman/Carpalx/Norman/Colemak could be a good start.

But do we want say the most used 8 letters on 2 joysticks? Or are some directions less effective, and those spots would be better off having less used letters?

hollow cypress Jun 16, 2023, 2:58 PM

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Ah, I finally figured out what to do with my "dead" keys on the second row: I'm mapping them to F13-F20 and using those as super custom hotkeys to switch between applications or do things that normally tie my fingers in a knot

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Definitely not the first person to think of that but I'm just getting onboard

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real zinc Nov 3, 2023, 2:50 AM

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anymore updates? i do more sql and R programming (mainly extracting, data manipulation and data visualisation)

celest groveBOT Nov 3, 2023, 2:50 AM

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GG @real zinc, you just advanced to level 1!

#Max's Two Cents (Programming Layout)